WEBVTT - Why Beyoncé called out country music

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<v Speaker 1>Already and this is the Daily ARS. This is the

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<v Speaker 1>Daily OS. Oh now it makes sense.

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<v Speaker 2>Good morning, and welcome to the Daily OS. It's Friday,

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<v Speaker 2>the twenty ninth of March. I'm Emma Gillespie. I'm the

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<v Speaker 2>editor of the Daily OS.

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<v Speaker 1>I'm Lucy Tassel, I'm the fact checker.

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<v Speaker 2>That's right, a different cast today, where the cat's away

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<v Speaker 2>the mice will play. Happy good Friday, A good Friday indeed,

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<v Speaker 2>because we're here to talk about Beyonce's new album dropping today,

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<v Speaker 2>the twenty ninth of March, and Lucy, you're joining me

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<v Speaker 2>to talk all things Beyonce's foray into country music, why

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<v Speaker 2>some country fans aren't as excited as we are about

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<v Speaker 2>the new album and what it all means and where

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<v Speaker 2>it's all come from. Yance has made history again or

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<v Speaker 2>for her new song Texas Hold'em the song his debut

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<v Speaker 2>in the number one spot.

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<v Speaker 3>And I just don't country music, beyoncew afied, I want

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<v Speaker 3>country music to go backwards, not forward.

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<v Speaker 1>That's right. M It's not just a good Friday, it's

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<v Speaker 1>the best Friday. But first, what's making headlines?

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<v Speaker 2>The Australian government has announced an inquiry into the nation's

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<v Speaker 2>live music industry will go ahead. It comes after Splendor

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<v Speaker 2>in the Grass confirmed the festival will not be going

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<v Speaker 2>ahead this year, just a week after tickets went on sale.

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<v Speaker 2>It follows a series of music festival cancelations due to

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<v Speaker 2>high costs and low ticket sales. Chair of the Communications

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<v Speaker 2>and Arts Committee, Brian Mitchell said the industry is facing

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<v Speaker 2>considerable operational challenges, particularly after COVID. The inquiry we'll look

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<v Speaker 2>into what's preventing the industry from growing and the potential

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<v Speaker 2>for more government funding to ensure future festivals can go ahead.

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<v Speaker 1>Many young Australians and low income households are now spending

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<v Speaker 1>around a quarter of their income on groceries, according to

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<v Speaker 1>a survey of over thirteen thousand people conducted by the

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<v Speaker 1>Australian Competition and Consumer Commission, the a Triple C. It

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<v Speaker 1>also found people are opting for frozen food over fresh produce.

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<v Speaker 1>The survey is part of the A Triple C's inquiry

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<v Speaker 1>into supermarkets and will continue to gather data until the

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<v Speaker 1>second of April.

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<v Speaker 2>Jetstar has announced it'll begin flights from Singapore directly to

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<v Speaker 2>Broom in Western Australia in an effort to encourage regional tourism.

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<v Speaker 2>The airline is expected to run two return flights per

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<v Speaker 2>week in a service supported by the WA government's Aviation Fund.

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<v Speaker 2>Flights will run from the twenty fifth of June to

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<v Speaker 2>late October in a seasonal service and will pick up

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<v Speaker 2>again in April twenty twenty five. WA Tourism Minister Rita

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<v Speaker 2>Safiotti said the new route offers an entirely new gateway

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<v Speaker 2>for tourists into the state.

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<v Speaker 1>And in some good news, a sixty four year old

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<v Speaker 1>man has become the first person to swim from Newcastle

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<v Speaker 1>to Sydney unassisted. Dean Summers swam for over thirty one hours,

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<v Speaker 1>enduring stings from swarms of blue bottled jellyfish. Newcastle is

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<v Speaker 1>about one hundred and seventy k's north of Sydney, or

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<v Speaker 1>two and a half hour drive. He said. The swim

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<v Speaker 1>aims to showcase our own coastal largely pristine waters.

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<v Speaker 2>Now any opportunity to talk about pop culture, but stay

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<v Speaker 2>with us. We promise there is a smart take on

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<v Speaker 2>this one today, very smart. Last month, Beyonce dropped to

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<v Speaker 2>pretty country singles during the Super Bowl or shortly after

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<v Speaker 2>the Super Bowl. We got Texas hold him.

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<v Speaker 1>Saints Texas hold them as are cut down, Down Down Now.

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<v Speaker 2>And sixteen carriages.

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<v Speaker 3>Sixteen characters driving away dreams.

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<v Speaker 1>Or two great songs. We loved them. But fast forward

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<v Speaker 1>a couple of weeks and Beyonce ended up saying she

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<v Speaker 1>hopes that quote years from now, the mention of an

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<v Speaker 1>artist's race as it relates to releasing genres of music

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<v Speaker 1>will be irrelevant. So pretty interesting comment to make as

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<v Speaker 1>you're beginning to make country music. Where could this have

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<v Speaker 1>come from? So lucy.

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<v Speaker 2>We're going to get into how we got to a

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<v Speaker 2>place where Beyonce was making a statement of that nature,

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<v Speaker 2>But first I wanted to touch on this relationship between

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<v Speaker 2>politics and country music. It's not the first time we've

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<v Speaker 2>seen an artist kind of caught up in a political

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<v Speaker 2>debate about the genre, but interestingly, that's tended to happen

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<v Speaker 2>in the opposite direction when an artist who is known

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<v Speaker 2>as a country musician leaves the genre and transitions into

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<v Speaker 2>making different kinds of music exactly.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, we've seen Miss Taylor Swift move towards pop around

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<v Speaker 1>the same time as she took her first political stances

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<v Speaker 1>in the mid twenty tens, and actually just last year,

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<v Speaker 1>Maren Morris, who's a huge country star, recently said she

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<v Speaker 1>was actually moving away from country music. She wanted to

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<v Speaker 1>leave the quote toxic parts of the industry behind her,

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<v Speaker 1>and she's someone who is quite political.

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<v Speaker 2>But back to Beyonce Lucy, who, as you mentioned, has

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<v Speaker 2>made this shift towards country music, a move that's managed

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<v Speaker 2>to really stir up controversy about the genre and what

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<v Speaker 2>it means in its identity. The title of this new album,

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<v Speaker 2>Cowboy Carter reference of course, to Beyonce's marriage name yea

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<v Speaker 2>about what you would call it, her marital surname, her

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<v Speaker 2>married name Sean Carter, akaj Z, Queen Bee, Beyonce Knowles,

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<v Speaker 2>whoever she is to you, the undisputed FACTSA. She reigns

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<v Speaker 2>from Houston, Texas, a state in America's South where country

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<v Speaker 2>music has thrived for decades. So it shouldn't really be

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<v Speaker 2>that surprising that this is an artist who wanted to

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<v Speaker 2>make music that sounded like the music she grew up with.

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<v Speaker 1>Right and yet people were surprised.

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<v Speaker 3>Only eight of the one hundred and fifty stations that

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<v Speaker 3>report to Billboard's Country Airplay chart reported having play Texas

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<v Speaker 3>hold them in its first day, and none said they

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<v Speaker 3>had put her other single sixteen carriages on the air.

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<v Speaker 1>The lefties in the entertainment industry just won't leave any

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<v Speaker 1>area alone, right, They just have to seize control over

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<v Speaker 1>every aspect, don't they.

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<v Speaker 2>I think a few of us probably saw at least

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<v Speaker 2>one of those grubs on our Instagram feeds some viral

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<v Speaker 2>conservative news moments that maybe took us by surprise, but

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<v Speaker 2>it's opened up a bigger conversation about this political identity

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<v Speaker 2>that is associated with country music. Then there was this

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<v Speaker 2>backlash to that backlash, people talking about how black people

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<v Speaker 2>are really integral to the history of the Jean of

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<v Speaker 2>country music. What do they mean? Can you explain a

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<v Speaker 2>bit of the history to us?

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<v Speaker 1>Well, you wouldn't necessarily know that this is true were

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<v Speaker 1>you to look at a country chart. You know, if

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<v Speaker 1>we list country music stars all day, we're going to

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<v Speaker 1>be here for hours before we name a non white person.

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<v Speaker 3>Right.

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<v Speaker 1>There's one really amazing black country artist that I can

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<v Speaker 1>think of off the top of my head. Her name's

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<v Speaker 1>Mickey Geiton, and she's had to really fight for legitimacy.

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<v Speaker 1>When you think of country music, what kind of instruments

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<v Speaker 1>do you think of?

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<v Speaker 2>I'm thinking banjos, fiddles, maybe even a violin, strings, stomping barns.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, the banjo was actually developed by enslaved people in

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<v Speaker 1>America who'd been brought over, generally from West Africa during

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<v Speaker 1>the hundreds of years of the Atlantic slave trade. So

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<v Speaker 1>per the Smithsonian Museum, from the earliest references in the

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<v Speaker 1>seventeenth century and throughout the eighteen thirties, the banjo was

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<v Speaker 1>exclusively known as an African American tradition with a African heritage.

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<v Speaker 2>I thought it was Irish. I think, you know, maybe

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<v Speaker 2>that's because of like Mumford and Sons, who are British.

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<v Speaker 1>Wow, well, there's still a European influence, right, because it's

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<v Speaker 1>kind of melding traditional West African instruments with European instruments

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<v Speaker 1>like guitars that had been developed specifically in Europe. The

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<v Speaker 1>banjo is kind of a physical representation of the country genre, right,

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<v Speaker 1>Like it's this melting pot. It comes out of all

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<v Speaker 1>these different strands and influences over these hundreds of years.

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<v Speaker 1>Really reflects the nature of American history in the South.

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<v Speaker 1>You've got enslaved people forced to come to America, you

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<v Speaker 1>have people coming from Europe seeking a better life. You

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<v Speaker 1>have people already established from that first wave of colonization.

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<v Speaker 1>All of these people have their own musical traditions and

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<v Speaker 1>their own musical instruments, and their own stories that kind

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<v Speaker 1>of come together in this mixed up genre of country.

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<v Speaker 2>How do we get from the idea of country music

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<v Speaker 2>being so richly diverse to being a place where today

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<v Speaker 2>we know it's a genre dominated by white artists, a

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<v Speaker 2>place where a global superstar like Beyonce exploring their country

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<v Speaker 2>heritage becomes this huge political issue.

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<v Speaker 1>I want to shout out an article I read. It's

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<v Speaker 1>by a musician and self described armchair historian called Rhiannon Giddons,

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<v Speaker 1>who is the one who actually plays the banjo on

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<v Speaker 1>Texas Hold'em Wow So good trivia, great trivia, great person.

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<v Speaker 1>So she draws this connection in this article between the

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<v Speaker 1>beginning of music being recorded and the selling of those

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<v Speaker 1>recordings and the disenfranchisement of non white people from country.

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<v Speaker 1>So in the nineteen twenties, that's when recorded music and

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<v Speaker 1>the sale of recorded music becomes like a viable economic proposition.

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<v Speaker 1>That is a time when there are many many places

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<v Speaker 1>that black people in America are barred from legally or

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<v Speaker 1>otherwise just not welcome. So music became incredibly segregated, and

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<v Speaker 1>country music ends up being a genre that is more

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<v Speaker 1>dominated by white artists just at an inflection point in

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<v Speaker 1>music recording history.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm thinking about the history and the story of someone

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<v Speaker 2>like Elvis in this who very famously he was a

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<v Speaker 2>very palatable white artist of the day.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah. I mean the story of rock and roll is

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<v Speaker 1>like a hyper condensed version of the story of country

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<v Speaker 1>where it's like very explicitly black and white. Literally of

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<v Speaker 1>like this was an art form by one group of

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<v Speaker 1>people and then another group of people just skimmed off

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<v Speaker 1>the top and made money off that basically, So.

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<v Speaker 2>Jumping forward to the twenty first century, I want to

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<v Speaker 2>talk about how that history of segregation has kind of

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<v Speaker 2>impacted the country world that we see today. I have

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<v Speaker 2>one specific event in mind, and it's back when Beyonce

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<v Speaker 2>actually first dipped her toe into country music. Song Daddy

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<v Speaker 2>Lessons of the absolutely iconic album Lemonade.

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<v Speaker 1>Great album, so Daddy Lessons really really country song. Lemonade

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<v Speaker 1>is probably her most political album. I think she's responding

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<v Speaker 1>to the first wave of Black Lives Matter protests. It's

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<v Speaker 1>coming out in twenty sixteen, in the lead up to

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<v Speaker 1>Trump's election. Music videos to accompany that album really had

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<v Speaker 1>some very strong political statements and the response to it, which,

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<v Speaker 1>in my opinion, it's an incredibly country song. But a

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<v Speaker 1>source told the Associated Press at the time that the Grammys,

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<v Speaker 1>so the music industry awards, didn't consider that song country

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<v Speaker 1>enough to be nominated in country categories.

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<v Speaker 2>She actually performed that song Daddy Lessons at the Country

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<v Speaker 2>Music Awards with the Chicks then the Dixie Chicks, very

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<v Speaker 2>iconic country music group. What happened at that performance.

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<v Speaker 1>That's a lightning rod moment, you know, for those who

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<v Speaker 1>don't know, the Chicks basically had to disappear off the

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<v Speaker 1>face of the earth for a couple of years in

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<v Speaker 1>the early two thousands. I mean, it's hard to overstate

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<v Speaker 1>how big of a deal this was. So lead singer

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<v Speaker 1>Natalie Mains on stage said the group were unhappy with

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<v Speaker 1>America's upcoming war in Iraq. This is two thousand and three,

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<v Speaker 1>and she also said that she was not proud that

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<v Speaker 1>then President George W. Bush was from Texas like she is,

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<v Speaker 1>like Beyonce is.

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<v Speaker 2>So she basically came out and said, I'm not proud

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<v Speaker 2>that our president is from the place I call home.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm not proud of what our country is doing, and

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<v Speaker 2>I disagree with this conflict in Iraq. It was a

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<v Speaker 2>really really big deal. Like if you've ever heard the

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<v Speaker 2>bridge to this song and wondered why so angry or upset,

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<v Speaker 2>this is what that was talking about. So the Chicks

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<v Speaker 2>got death threats, people burning their CDs, country radio stations

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<v Speaker 2>refused to play their songs. This is a version of

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<v Speaker 2>kind of when Taylor Swift began to upset country music

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<v Speaker 2>by talking about politics or kind of becoming more of

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<v Speaker 2>a publicly facing ally. This reaction to the Chicks was

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<v Speaker 2>in tense. Basically, a lot of people never forgave them.

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<v Speaker 2>So for Beyonce to say, not only am I coming

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<v Speaker 2>to your awards show, I'm going to perform with your

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<v Speaker 2>most controversial act, that was pretty major.

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<v Speaker 1>So interestingly, last week, in a post promoting Cowboy Carter,

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<v Speaker 1>Beyonce said, quote, this album has been over five years

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<v Speaker 1>in the making. It was born out of an experience

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<v Speaker 1>I had years ago where I did not feel welcomed

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<v Speaker 1>and it was very clear that I wasn't. But because

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<v Speaker 1>of that experience, I did a deeper dive into the

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<v Speaker 1>history of country music and studied our rich musical archive.

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<v Speaker 1>So people have read this. Certainly, I read this as

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<v Speaker 1>referring to that performance at the CMAS, and I think

0:14:06.400 --> 0:14:09.079
<v Speaker 1>it's interesting that at the end of that post she says,

0:14:09.240 --> 0:14:12.559
<v Speaker 1>this ain't a country album, this is a Beyonce album,

0:14:12.840 --> 0:14:15.240
<v Speaker 1>and that almost feels like she's trying to get ahead

0:14:15.280 --> 0:14:18.480
<v Speaker 1>of the idea that she's trying to court country music's approval.

0:14:18.559 --> 0:14:20.920
<v Speaker 1>She's just like, this is what I'm doing, and Beyonce,

0:14:20.960 --> 0:14:22.240
<v Speaker 1>I can do what I want, and I want to

0:14:22.280 --> 0:14:24.400
<v Speaker 1>dive into the country music archive.

0:14:24.240 --> 0:14:28.200
<v Speaker 2>Which I think art is subjective and art is fluid,

0:14:28.240 --> 0:14:31.200
<v Speaker 2>and whether you're a musician or any other kind of artist,

0:14:31.760 --> 0:14:36.600
<v Speaker 2>I think to say that your music transcends one genre

0:14:36.840 --> 0:14:41.440
<v Speaker 2>makes perfect sense. So we've got this context for the controversy,

0:14:41.920 --> 0:14:46.840
<v Speaker 2>the inspiration maybe for Cowboy Carter, Beyonce as the country

0:14:46.960 --> 0:14:49.600
<v Speaker 2>artist and all that that means. But in terms of

0:14:49.640 --> 0:14:52.680
<v Speaker 2>the success of these new releases, it's not as though

0:14:52.720 --> 0:14:56.760
<v Speaker 2>any of this controversy has slowed her down. Beyonce became

0:14:56.800 --> 0:14:59.440
<v Speaker 2>the first black woman to have a number one song

0:14:59.520 --> 0:15:02.800
<v Speaker 2>on the country charts with Texas Hold Them. So, like

0:15:02.840 --> 0:15:05.200
<v Speaker 2>I said, it hasn't slowed her down, Lucy, does that

0:15:05.320 --> 0:15:08.200
<v Speaker 2>tell us anything about the genre. Do you think that

0:15:08.320 --> 0:15:13.120
<v Speaker 2>maybe country music has welcomed her more than these headlines suggest.

0:15:14.120 --> 0:15:16.920
<v Speaker 1>I wish I could say that, but I just don't

0:15:17.040 --> 0:15:20.120
<v Speaker 1>think so. And the reason why is about how the

0:15:20.200 --> 0:15:24.280
<v Speaker 1>charts work. So for about ten years give or take,

0:15:24.800 --> 0:15:27.239
<v Speaker 1>the Billboard Charts in the US, so that's the organization

0:15:27.320 --> 0:15:33.400
<v Speaker 1>that manages the music charts has included streaming and YouTube plays.

0:15:33.800 --> 0:15:38.120
<v Speaker 1>So that to me says more about the fact that

0:15:38.280 --> 0:15:41.960
<v Speaker 1>the hive, the Beyonce fans are you know, pressing plays.

0:15:41.960 --> 0:15:44.880
<v Speaker 1>Certainly Texas hold them has been on very high rotation

0:15:45.200 --> 0:15:48.240
<v Speaker 1>in the TDA office. Oh yeah, all of those Spotify

0:15:48.320 --> 0:15:51.200
<v Speaker 1>streams are adding up to boost her up the charts.

0:15:51.440 --> 0:15:54.440
<v Speaker 1>I don't necessarily think that it means that country music

0:15:54.560 --> 0:15:58.000
<v Speaker 1>radio stations are like, oh my god, amazing, so excited

0:15:58.000 --> 0:16:01.600
<v Speaker 1>for this established artist to jump into our precious genre.

0:16:01.760 --> 0:16:03.880
<v Speaker 1>I think probably it has more to do. I mean,

0:16:03.920 --> 0:16:08.000
<v Speaker 1>it can't solely be streams, because streams and YouTube plays

0:16:08.000 --> 0:16:11.720
<v Speaker 1>only make up us certain percentage of the chart calculations.

0:16:12.400 --> 0:16:15.880
<v Speaker 1>But I just don't know that that necessarily says country

0:16:16.000 --> 0:16:19.520
<v Speaker 1>music has welcomed Beyonce with open arms. And you know,

0:16:19.600 --> 0:16:23.320
<v Speaker 1>the charts historically have not been very kind to black

0:16:23.360 --> 0:16:27.320
<v Speaker 1>female country artists, and in fact, interestingly, that's something that

0:16:27.360 --> 0:16:31.560
<v Speaker 1>Beyonce seems to be referencing on this album. So one

0:16:31.640 --> 0:16:34.800
<v Speaker 1>of the tracks on this album is called the Linda

0:16:34.800 --> 0:16:37.880
<v Speaker 1>Martel Show. Do you know who Linda Martel is? I didn't.

0:16:37.880 --> 0:16:38.600
<v Speaker 1>I had to look her up.

0:16:38.680 --> 0:16:40.360
<v Speaker 2>Okay, I'm relieved that you said that.

0:16:40.840 --> 0:16:44.360
<v Speaker 1>Who is she? Well? I discovered she was the first

0:16:44.400 --> 0:16:47.840
<v Speaker 1>black country pop star. So Linda Martel broke out in

0:16:47.880 --> 0:16:51.240
<v Speaker 1>the late sixties and she had a moderately successful album

0:16:51.280 --> 0:16:54.720
<v Speaker 1>called Color Me Country, but it never charted as high

0:16:54.760 --> 0:16:57.640
<v Speaker 1>as Beyonce, you know, not even number ten, not even

0:16:57.720 --> 0:17:01.600
<v Speaker 1>number twenty. And her career was really cut short by racism.

0:17:02.080 --> 0:17:05.200
<v Speaker 1>So in twenty twenty, she told magazine Rolling Stone that

0:17:05.280 --> 0:17:08.080
<v Speaker 1>when she played one of her first shows, she started

0:17:08.119 --> 0:17:11.960
<v Speaker 1>singing and quote, they'd shout out names. You felt pretty awful.

0:17:12.760 --> 0:17:15.880
<v Speaker 1>After her first album came out, her label basically stopped

0:17:15.880 --> 0:17:19.040
<v Speaker 1>promoting her in favor of their white artists. If you

0:17:19.040 --> 0:17:21.040
<v Speaker 1>feel like listening to any of her songs, I would

0:17:21.040 --> 0:17:23.840
<v Speaker 1>say San Francisco is a lonely town or the wedding

0:17:23.920 --> 0:17:25.400
<v Speaker 1>Cake were the ones that I liked.

0:17:25.840 --> 0:17:29.240
<v Speaker 2>The track listers you mentioned Beyonce dropped in advance of

0:17:29.359 --> 0:17:33.840
<v Speaker 2>Cowboy Carter. There are a lot of tracks on this album,

0:17:34.040 --> 0:17:36.160
<v Speaker 2>whether or not all of those will be full tracks

0:17:36.280 --> 0:17:41.399
<v Speaker 2>or interludes. I'm sure there is another track that caught

0:17:41.480 --> 0:17:43.639
<v Speaker 2>your eye. I think I can guess.

0:17:44.440 --> 0:17:47.080
<v Speaker 1>Well, yes, I mean there was a track called Joline,

0:17:47.119 --> 0:17:50.520
<v Speaker 1>and obviously I freaked out, like so Dolly Till We

0:17:50.560 --> 0:17:55.280
<v Speaker 1>Die Dolly Parton actually a couple of weeks ago said

0:17:55.440 --> 0:17:58.680
<v Speaker 1>that Beyonce had recorded a cover of her song Joline.

0:17:59.119 --> 0:18:02.760
<v Speaker 1>So frankly, if one of country music's greatest ever songwriters

0:18:02.760 --> 0:18:05.560
<v Speaker 1>and performers gave Beyonce the go ahead to cover her

0:18:05.880 --> 0:18:11.280
<v Speaker 1>most iconic song, who cares what anyone else thinks? Okay,

0:18:11.400 --> 0:18:13.879
<v Speaker 1>she has a jolly button steal of approval. That's all

0:18:13.920 --> 0:18:14.720
<v Speaker 1>that matters to me.

0:18:15.359 --> 0:18:19.800
<v Speaker 2>Well, Lucy, I'm sure the listeners are unclear about how

0:18:19.840 --> 0:18:24.359
<v Speaker 2>you feel about Beyonce. Lucy, thank you so much for

0:18:24.400 --> 0:18:27.560
<v Speaker 2>breaking all of that down for us today a fascinating

0:18:27.920 --> 0:18:31.400
<v Speaker 2>introduction to the history of country music. If you learn

0:18:31.440 --> 0:18:34.520
<v Speaker 2>something from today's episode, please feel free to send it

0:18:34.560 --> 0:18:37.000
<v Speaker 2>on to someone who you think might enjoy it or

0:18:37.160 --> 0:18:39.479
<v Speaker 2>leave us a review and make sure you are following

0:18:39.520 --> 0:18:41.840
<v Speaker 2>The Daily os so there's an episode waiting for you

0:18:41.920 --> 0:18:44.960
<v Speaker 2>every weekday mornings. We'll be back on Monday, but until then,

0:18:45.160 --> 0:18:46.440
<v Speaker 2>have a fabulous Easter.

0:18:49.600 --> 0:18:51.880
<v Speaker 1>My name is Lily Maddon and I'm a proud Adunda

0:18:52.119 --> 0:18:56.280
<v Speaker 1>bunge Lung Chalcotin woman from Gadigl Country. The Daily oz

0:18:56.359 --> 0:18:59.119
<v Speaker 1>acknowledges that this podcast is recorded on the lands of

0:18:59.119 --> 0:19:02.439
<v Speaker 1>the Gadighl people and pays respect to all Aboriginal and

0:19:02.480 --> 0:19:05.679
<v Speaker 1>Torrestrate island and nations. We pay our respects to the

0:19:05.680 --> 0:19:08.479
<v Speaker 1>first peoples of these countries, both past and present,