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Speaker 1: Now we know it's been another difficult start to the

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Speaker 1: year for residents of Alice Springs. Several reports of stolen

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Speaker 1: cars and break ins over the Christmas period, fighting in

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Speaker 1: the streets, last night, reports of a man with a

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Speaker 1: samurai sword in the CBD. Now joining me on the

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Speaker 1: line to talk more about the situation and give us

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Speaker 1: a bit of an update on things is Robin Lamley,

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Speaker 1: the member for Ara Lewin.

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Speaker 2: Good morning to you, Robin.

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Speaker 3: Good morning Katie. Happy New Year, or I should say

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Speaker 3: Happy Old year. First of February. It's just chugging past

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Speaker 3: pretty quickly, it is.

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Speaker 1: It's going along very quickly, and there's no doubt it's

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Speaker 1: going to be an interesting year, given the fact it's

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Speaker 1: an election year. But Robin, before I ask you about that,

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Speaker 1: do you have much detail about what went on last

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Speaker 1: night with this bloke with a samurai sword in the city.

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Speaker 3: No, Look, I just read the report of it on Facebook.

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Speaker 3: I mean, another day, another a drama in Alice Springs.

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Speaker 3: People in this town are completely worn out, Katie. Yeah.

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Speaker 3: I just caught up with a friend before I started

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Speaker 3: work this morning, and you know, she described people that

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Speaker 3: she talks to just feeling so demoralized and worn out.

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Speaker 3: It's just it's just a continuing crisis in our town

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Speaker 3: and continuing drama and crime, and there's no relief insight well.

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Speaker 1: And the disappointing part of it is Robin. You know

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Speaker 1: last year the Prime Minister flew into town early in

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Speaker 1: the year announced a bucket load of money. Has that

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Speaker 1: money been flowing through It doesn't sound like you're seeing

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Speaker 1: any real tangible differences.

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Speaker 3: No, we're not. The only difference we saw, Katie was

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Speaker 3: within days of Albanezi coming to Alice Springs a year ago,

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Speaker 3: he demanded that the then Chief Minister, Natasha Philes reinstate

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Speaker 3: those alcohol restrictions that caused an enormous amount of problems.

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Speaker 3: We saw domestic violence, incidents of double during that seven

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Speaker 3: month period. It was just an absolute disaster. So he

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Speaker 3: did correct that and all credit to him for doing that.

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Speaker 3: But what we've seen over the last three months, I suppose,

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Speaker 3: is a spike in property crime. Lots of fifth, lots

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Speaker 3: of people reporting that their properties have been done over,

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Speaker 3: lots of vandalism, lots of public displays of crime and

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Speaker 3: anti social behavior. I think assaults are still lower than

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Speaker 3: what they were a year ago. Still high. I mean,

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Speaker 3: we've still got the highest rate of domestic violence in

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Speaker 3: the country, but they've dropped a bit. But yes, the

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Speaker 3: property crime is really just killing us all. I mean,

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Speaker 3: people are just being broken into regularly. I mean, I

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Speaker 3: don't think there would be too many people in Alice

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Speaker 3: Springs now who can say that they haven't been experienced

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Speaker 3: a break in or an attempted break him over the

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Speaker 3: last couple of years into their property. That's crazy, right, yeah,

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Speaker 3: almost complete, that's crazy effective. It is absolutely insane, and yeah,

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Speaker 3: it's really we're really just talking about a small group

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Speaker 3: of people that are perpetrating these horrific crimes.

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Speaker 1: Robert, I'm just looking on the NT news website right now.

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Speaker 1: They've got some distressing footage of standoff out the front

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Speaker 1: of and Alice Springs Supermarket Now. The footage is understood

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Speaker 1: to have been taken at eleven am on Tuesday and

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Speaker 1: shows two groups confronting each other outside Coal's shopping center

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Speaker 1: at Railway Terrace. The scenes escalated when a number of

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Speaker 1: those involved with traditional weapons and hammers face off with

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Speaker 1: raised weapons. More footage, then taken by dash can shows

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Speaker 1: the moment that some of the women violently grapple on

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Speaker 1: the pavement, bringing that car park traffic to a halt.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, so I just missed that. I remember reading that

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Speaker 3: on Tuesday, thinking I was probably just a few minutes

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Speaker 3: away from experiencing that. But at my office backs onto

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Speaker 3: the cold car park here in Allen Springs, so it's

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Speaker 3: not unusual for me to see or hear these things happening.

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Speaker 3: And I guess what we're seeing at the moment is

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Speaker 3: a regular, regular displays like this.

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Speaker 1: You know.

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Speaker 3: The problem we have, Katie, is that all this is

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Speaker 3: becoming normalized. And I've heard that talked about quite often

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Speaker 3: in different circles that I've moved in and people I've

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Speaker 3: spoken to. You know, once, once this becomes normal, then

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Speaker 3: the government's basically got away with not addressing it, and

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Speaker 3: we have to change our behavior again to protect ourselves.

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Speaker 3: I mean, we don't go anywhere or do anything much,

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Speaker 3: most of us now. Anyway. Once you and you're experiencing

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Speaker 3: it up in Darwen, now, I think just hitting you guys,

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Speaker 3: the fact that you just can't live the life that

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Speaker 3: you used to a year or two ago because there

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Speaker 3: is that high risk of being assaulted or having your

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Speaker 3: property stolen or damaged we in our springs experience more

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Speaker 3: incidents of crime, far more. I think it's almost double

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Speaker 3: of what you do in the Darwin area. So you

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Speaker 3: can imagine almost double the crime in a place like

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Speaker 3: Alice Springs twenty five thousand. You're getting half the crime

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Speaker 3: we're getting in a much bigger population, in a bigger

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Speaker 3: graphical area geographical areas, so you know, when you compare it,

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Speaker 3: this is just a war zone down here. And I

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Speaker 3: hate saying it, and you know, the tourism operators probably

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Speaker 3: cringe when they hear the likes of Robin Lanley talk

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Speaker 3: like this, but this is honestly what's going on.

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Speaker 1: Robin, tell me have the additional police over that Christmas period?

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Speaker 2: Did it make much of a difference.

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Speaker 3: Well, I couldn't really even try, you, Katie. I mean,

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Speaker 3: I'm always very wary if these police figures being thrown around.

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Speaker 3: It's hard to know what's what's the truth. I mean,

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Speaker 3: I'm not saying that people lie about it. But you know,

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Speaker 3: on any given shift, people are on taking leave, sickly,

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Speaker 3: stress leaves, holiday leave, you know, it's and the police

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Speaker 3: are responding to incidents all over town. So if there's

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Speaker 3: a major incident out at Larapinta, which is sort of

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Speaker 3: to the west of town. Then they're not necessarily around

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Speaker 3: in the CBD if something's going on. So I don't

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Speaker 3: know the answer to that question is, Katie, I really

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Speaker 3: don't know if there's been more police and whether it's

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Speaker 3: been more effective. I think the police are fairly happy

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Speaker 3: with how things are going, but you know they're also

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Speaker 3: handstrung by Robert the public servants.

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Speaker 1: I mean to get really serious about these and as

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Speaker 1: we head into an election year, and you and I

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Speaker 1: have spoken about this so many times, and as you said,

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Speaker 1: we're almost all becoming quite desensitized to it.

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Speaker 2: But I'm determined for that not to.

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Speaker 1: Happen because I don't think that we should allow this

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Speaker 1: kind of behavior to become normalized. You know, we have

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Speaker 1: always been a better place than that, and we need

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Speaker 1: to continue to try and push for things to get

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Speaker 1: back to the way that they used to be.

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Speaker 2: But Robin, what do you reckon?

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Speaker 1: Really needs to happen throughout this year to try to

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Speaker 1: make some serious change in this space, particularly for you

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Speaker 1: guys in Alice.

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Speaker 3: Well, I think the whole business of allowing children to

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Speaker 3: commit crimes and there's no consequence for their behavior is hideous.

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Speaker 3: It just doesn't work. I think it's been a trial,

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Speaker 3: and I think that it's been an absolute failure. I mean,

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Speaker 3: I spoke to someone recently who had a bunch of children,

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Speaker 3: they guess between the ages of eight and twelve, rummage

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Speaker 3: through their house, still their things while they are asleep,

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Speaker 3: and those children would have just been taken home with

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Speaker 3: no consequences. That does not work. Even though it's a

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Speaker 3: nice thing to do, and all the experts claim that

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Speaker 3: this is the best way to go, it doesn't work.

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Speaker 3: It just makes things worse. So that has to be

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Speaker 3: addressed in an honest, frank way. It's going to piss

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Speaker 3: off or annoy the lefties things that this whole thing

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Speaker 3: is increasing the age of criminal responsibility is a good thing.

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Speaker 3: It's not a good thing. It's not good for the kids,

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Speaker 3: and it's not good for the rest of it. So

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Speaker 3: that has to we have to have some frank conversations

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Speaker 3: around that. We also need to put a stop, draw

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Speaker 3: a line in the sand when it comes to this lawlessness,

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Speaker 3: and I think the only way to do it in

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Speaker 3: a place like Alice Springs is to shut the place

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Speaker 3: down temporarily. There will be a cost and economical or

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Speaker 3: financial cost of businesses, but the cost of crime is

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Speaker 3: also astronomical. Force businesses and the community to how do you.

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Speaker 2: Shut the place down? Robin, what do you mean, how

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Speaker 2: would you do that?

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Speaker 3: Well? I use the example of what happened during COVID.

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Speaker 3: It was extraordinary. We had a shutdown or lockdown curfew

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Speaker 3: in place for the best part of three weeks and

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Speaker 3: crime all but stopped. I think if you think laterally,

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Speaker 3: you can do anything. I think the problem with the

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Speaker 3: government at the moment they are Darwin based, They're darin centric,

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Speaker 3: and what they do down here is not really it's

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Speaker 3: not concentrated. There's not an absolute and enduring commitment to

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Speaker 3: addressing the problems, and I think that's what we need

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Speaker 3: to We need to have a minister down here. We

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Speaker 3: do have a minister down here, Chancey Paik, who's also

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Speaker 3: the Deputy Chief Minister, but I could probably count on

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Speaker 3: one hand how many times he's actually volunteered to talk

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Speaker 3: about Lauren or the issues in Central Australia. Isn't during

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Speaker 3: the time that he has been a minister. We need

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Speaker 3: leadership down here and we need some really agile and

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Speaker 3: creative thinking around what we can do. There are only

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Speaker 3: a few people involved in perpetrating these crimes. A lot

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Speaker 3: of them are young people. And if you can't manage

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Speaker 3: a group of kids and stop them in a small

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Speaker 3: town like Alice Springs, and there's something wrong, and there

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Speaker 3: is something wrong, Katie.

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Speaker 1: Robin, well, that's and enough enough. We've been saying that

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Speaker 1: for so long. But it cannot continue to go on

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Speaker 1: like this. It's crippling the town and it's starting to

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Speaker 1: cripple the whole of the Northern Territory and people have

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Speaker 1: had a gutful of it. Robin Lea Fanocciiro suggested on

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Speaker 1: the show earlier in the week that you know, I'd

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Speaker 1: asked her whether the COLP would implement or introduce mandatory

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Speaker 1: sentencing again. She said, they're looking at policies around prescribed

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Speaker 1: sentences for different offenses. I mean, would something like that

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Speaker 1: make a difference.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, possibly. I think we've just got to go back

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Speaker 3: over everything. We've got to go back over mandatory sentencing.

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Speaker 3: We've got to look at Dolly Incapax. I mean, you know,

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Speaker 3: the emphasis at the moment is on the police determining

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Speaker 3: whether or not a child knew what they were doing.

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Speaker 3: It should be the other way around. It should be

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Speaker 3: their defense proving that not the police. The police, you're

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Speaker 3: too busy dragging these criminals off the streets. You know,

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Speaker 3: they shouldn't have that ownus, that responsibility. All these things

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Speaker 3: need to be looked at, because what we're doing now

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Speaker 3: everyone knows whether you're in Darwin or Tenant Creek, Catherine

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Speaker 3: Nolan boy Alice Springs is not working. So everything needs

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Speaker 3: to be looked at. I think Leaf Nokiaro, she becomes

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Speaker 3: chief Minister in seven months time, she needs to go

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Speaker 3: back over everything and start again.

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Speaker 1: Robin, before I let you go this morning, there has

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Speaker 1: been the Police Association. Earlier this week, they released the

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Speaker 1: results of their annual survey, which showed that morale is

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Speaker 1: still low within the force. It also showed, I mean,

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Speaker 1: you've got a situation where ninety eight point zero four

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Speaker 1: percent of respondents don't believe there are enough of them

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Speaker 1: to do what's being asked. They also say that they

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Speaker 1: don't feel supported by the Northern Territory government. Ninety one

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Speaker 1: percent say that not as many respondents took part in

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Speaker 1: this year's survey, only a bit over seven hundred comparatively

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Speaker 1: to around twelve hundred last time round. But what do

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Speaker 1: you make of those survey results?

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Speaker 3: Ah, not surprising. I mean it must be completely demoralizing

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Speaker 3: and the disillusion that you would feel as a police

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Speaker 3: officer in the Northern Territory would be almost indescribable. I

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Speaker 3: would imagine as soon as they catch the culprits, they're

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Speaker 3: back on the street. I mean, how does that feel?

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Speaker 3: How does that make you feel? Chasing your tail day in,

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Speaker 3: day out, and the consequences even though the jarles are full.

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Speaker 3: It's been this government that's opened the door to crime,

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Speaker 3: that's had this permissive attitude that there really are little consequences. Look,

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Speaker 3: I don't find any that surprising. I think that the

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Speaker 3: fact that they are so short staffed, the police just

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Speaker 3: had so much pressure to the ones that are working,

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Speaker 3: and you know, the story goes on and on. Look, Katie,

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Speaker 3: our justice system is a mess. We don't have lawyers

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Speaker 3: down here to defend criminals alleged criminals that we don't

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Speaker 3: have enough police officers across the Northern Territory. I think

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Speaker 3: the Attorney General has a lot to answer for. You know,

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Speaker 3: he's very happy to open our galleries and exhibitions and

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Speaker 3: do all the nice stuff, But when it comes to

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Speaker 3: actually getting his hands dirty and addressing these problems that

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Speaker 3: we have, he seems to be good at the Disappearing Act.

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Speaker 3: There's just so much work that needs to be done.

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Speaker 3: The police need to be listened to and taken seriously.

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Speaker 3: I mean, it's not going to be an easy fix.

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Speaker 3: As we all know, we're shortage across all jurisdictions. But

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Speaker 3: you know, we rely so heavily on these individuals to

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Speaker 3: help us to keep us safe. And if they're not

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Speaker 3: feeling supported ninety one percent of them saying that they

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Speaker 3: don't feel supported by the government, then really, gosh, we

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Speaker 3: are yeahious trouble.

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Speaker 1: I agree, we've got to make sure that our police

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Speaker 1: feel supported. They are, you know, they're out there on

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Speaker 1: the front line trying to keep the community safe.

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Speaker 2: Day in and day out.

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Speaker 1: Robin, we are going to have to leave it there. Unfortunately.

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Speaker 1: We'll catch up with you again soon. I really appreciate

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Speaker 1: you coming on the show time in twenty twenty four.

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Speaker 2: We'll see you again soon.

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Speaker 3: Absolutely, Thanks so much, Katie, Thank you