1 00:00:00,440 --> 00:00:03,040 Speaker 1: Before we jump into today's deep dive, just a heads 2 00:00:03,080 --> 00:00:05,680 Speaker 1: up that we'll be discussing a story that includes themes 3 00:00:05,680 --> 00:00:09,480 Speaker 1: of sexual assault and sex trafficking. Please listen with care 4 00:00:10,240 --> 00:00:12,959 Speaker 1: already and this this is the Daily Off. 5 00:00:13,119 --> 00:00:16,560 Speaker 2: This is the Daily OS. Oh, now it makes sense. 6 00:00:24,360 --> 00:00:27,320 Speaker 2: Good morning, and welcome to the Daily OS. It is Wednesday, 7 00:00:27,360 --> 00:00:30,040 Speaker 2: the eighth of October. I'm Billy fit Simon's. 8 00:00:29,640 --> 00:00:30,560 Speaker 1: I'm Sam Kazlowski. 9 00:00:31,000 --> 00:00:34,320 Speaker 2: Last Friday, rapper Sean Diddy Combes was sentenced to just 10 00:00:34,400 --> 00:00:37,880 Speaker 2: over four years in prison following his conviction on prostitution 11 00:00:38,000 --> 00:00:41,319 Speaker 2: related charges earlier this year. The fifty five year old 12 00:00:41,479 --> 00:00:43,960 Speaker 2: music mogul has spent more than a year in New 13 00:00:44,040 --> 00:00:47,280 Speaker 2: York jail after he was arrested in September last year. 14 00:00:47,800 --> 00:00:50,680 Speaker 2: So what happens now to Cones? We know he will 15 00:00:50,680 --> 00:00:53,040 Speaker 2: now be in jail, But what about all the other 16 00:00:53,120 --> 00:00:56,400 Speaker 2: allegations that were leveled against him? What happens to those? 17 00:00:56,760 --> 00:00:58,400 Speaker 2: We will tell you what you need to know on 18 00:00:58,480 --> 00:01:02,280 Speaker 2: today's podcast. 19 00:01:03,120 --> 00:01:05,840 Speaker 1: Billy. Let's start with the main character in this story, 20 00:01:06,240 --> 00:01:10,280 Speaker 1: Sean Combs. We've spoken about him throughout this case. Give 21 00:01:10,360 --> 00:01:11,600 Speaker 1: us a sense of who he is. 22 00:01:12,080 --> 00:01:16,039 Speaker 2: Yeah, So Cones is a very famous rapper and producer. 23 00:01:16,120 --> 00:01:18,960 Speaker 2: I'm sure many of our audience will be very familiar 24 00:01:19,040 --> 00:01:22,320 Speaker 2: with him, but what you might not know is that 25 00:01:22,480 --> 00:01:27,200 Speaker 2: he also built an actual music media empire. So he 26 00:01:27,319 --> 00:01:30,960 Speaker 2: founded the music label bad Boy Records in nineteen ninety three, 27 00:01:31,560 --> 00:01:35,560 Speaker 2: which has represented some of the world's most famous rappers, 28 00:01:35,680 --> 00:01:40,160 Speaker 2: including Notorious Big and he is a three time Grammy 29 00:01:40,160 --> 00:01:43,600 Speaker 2: Award winner who has worked with the likes of Mariah Carey, 30 00:01:43,680 --> 00:01:46,760 Speaker 2: He's worked with Usher, He's worked with Faith Evans, and 31 00:01:46,800 --> 00:01:48,920 Speaker 2: I think all of that is to kind of set 32 00:01:48,960 --> 00:01:52,040 Speaker 2: the scene and give you the context that he is 33 00:01:52,400 --> 00:01:57,040 Speaker 2: a very powerful person in the music industry in the US. 34 00:01:57,240 --> 00:01:59,400 Speaker 2: I also should say that he also went by the 35 00:01:59,480 --> 00:02:02,360 Speaker 2: names of Puff Diddy or just Diddy as well, so 36 00:02:02,440 --> 00:02:06,160 Speaker 2: some people might be more familiar with him via those names. 37 00:02:06,440 --> 00:02:10,320 Speaker 1: A really powerful, influential and wealthy figure, kind of a 38 00:02:10,400 --> 00:02:14,000 Speaker 1: defining figure in music in the early two thousands, and 39 00:02:14,040 --> 00:02:17,200 Speaker 1: all of that came crashing down when these allegations against 40 00:02:17,280 --> 00:02:18,440 Speaker 1: him came out, right. 41 00:02:18,680 --> 00:02:21,800 Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly. It was kind of like a third wave 42 00:02:21,880 --> 00:02:24,800 Speaker 2: of the me Too movement for the music industry. So 43 00:02:24,840 --> 00:02:27,680 Speaker 2: the first allegations to be leveled against coms were in 44 00:02:27,680 --> 00:02:31,799 Speaker 2: twenty twenty three. That was by his former partner, Cassandra Ventura, 45 00:02:31,880 --> 00:02:34,040 Speaker 2: who is an R and B singer who also goes 46 00:02:34,080 --> 00:02:36,480 Speaker 2: by the name of Cassie or who professionally goes by 47 00:02:36,520 --> 00:02:40,200 Speaker 2: the name of Cassie, and she accused him of sexual 48 00:02:40,240 --> 00:02:43,359 Speaker 2: assault some I don't know if you remember the footage 49 00:02:43,400 --> 00:02:47,320 Speaker 2: that came out of Comes kicking and dragging Cassie in 50 00:02:47,400 --> 00:02:52,480 Speaker 2: a hotel hallway in twenty sixteen, extremely distressing footage. It 51 00:02:52,520 --> 00:02:57,040 Speaker 2: was CCTV footage of the hotel. And despite the fact 52 00:02:57,120 --> 00:03:01,520 Speaker 2: that Comes responded to that footage by calling inexcusable behavior, 53 00:03:01,919 --> 00:03:05,720 Speaker 2: he did deny the allegations leveled against him by Cassie. 54 00:03:06,000 --> 00:03:09,560 Speaker 2: There was a civil lawsuit that was filed against him 55 00:03:09,600 --> 00:03:13,520 Speaker 2: by Cassie, but the day after that happened, it was 56 00:03:13,680 --> 00:03:18,000 Speaker 2: settled out of court. So that civil lawsuit is not 57 00:03:18,040 --> 00:03:21,400 Speaker 2: what we're talking about today, although Cassie was involved in 58 00:03:21,440 --> 00:03:23,880 Speaker 2: the one that we are talking about today. But what 59 00:03:24,160 --> 00:03:26,320 Speaker 2: I think you need to know about that context is 60 00:03:26,360 --> 00:03:29,160 Speaker 2: that was the first civil lawsuit and then it kind 61 00:03:29,160 --> 00:03:32,600 Speaker 2: of really snowballed from there, and after that there was 62 00:03:32,800 --> 00:03:37,920 Speaker 2: several people who filed different civil lawsuits against Diddy, claiming 63 00:03:38,200 --> 00:03:39,360 Speaker 2: sexual abuse. 64 00:03:40,080 --> 00:03:43,280 Speaker 1: So there's a really important difference between the civil and 65 00:03:43,320 --> 00:03:47,000 Speaker 1: the criminal processes in the US. We're talking first about 66 00:03:47,000 --> 00:03:50,040 Speaker 1: these civil cases. Those were the ones that started piling up. 67 00:03:50,560 --> 00:03:53,720 Speaker 1: It's different though, when it comes to him being criminally charged. 68 00:03:54,280 --> 00:03:57,560 Speaker 1: Which one of these incidents actually led to the arrest 69 00:03:57,680 --> 00:03:59,960 Speaker 1: and his entry into the criminal justice system. 70 00:04:00,120 --> 00:04:02,920 Speaker 2: Yes, so it was none of those civil ones. It 71 00:04:02,960 --> 00:04:06,800 Speaker 2: was the criminal one, and this was one that was 72 00:04:06,840 --> 00:04:10,480 Speaker 2: brought forward by the federal US prosecutors who charged him 73 00:04:10,480 --> 00:04:16,360 Speaker 2: with sex trafficking, forced labor, kidnapping, arson, bribery, and obstruction 74 00:04:16,560 --> 00:04:21,400 Speaker 2: of justice. Now, we have previously on this podcast covered 75 00:04:21,680 --> 00:04:25,599 Speaker 2: those allegations in this federal criminal case quite extensively, and 76 00:04:25,600 --> 00:04:27,920 Speaker 2: we also covered the trial, so I'll put a link 77 00:04:27,960 --> 00:04:30,920 Speaker 2: to that in the show notes. But for the purposes 78 00:04:30,960 --> 00:04:33,640 Speaker 2: of today's conversation, what you need to know is that 79 00:04:33,760 --> 00:04:36,520 Speaker 2: a jury acquitted Cones, which means that they found him 80 00:04:36,560 --> 00:04:41,440 Speaker 2: not guilty of the most serious charges of sex trafficking 81 00:04:41,600 --> 00:04:45,760 Speaker 2: and racketeering, which carried potential life sentences. 82 00:04:46,120 --> 00:04:47,919 Speaker 1: So he was found not guilty of those, but he 83 00:04:48,080 --> 00:04:50,520 Speaker 1: was still convicted on other charges. 84 00:04:50,080 --> 00:04:55,960 Speaker 2: He was so he was convicted on two prostitution related charges. Specifically, 85 00:04:55,960 --> 00:04:59,040 Speaker 2: he was found guilty of two counts of transportation to 86 00:04:59,120 --> 00:05:02,960 Speaker 2: engage in institution. So the jury heard that Combs flew 87 00:05:03,040 --> 00:05:06,440 Speaker 2: his girlfriends and some male sex workers around the US 88 00:05:06,480 --> 00:05:11,799 Speaker 2: to engage in drug fueled sexual encounters. Now, those charges 89 00:05:11,960 --> 00:05:16,400 Speaker 2: both carry maximum sentences of ten years each, so if 90 00:05:16,440 --> 00:05:19,800 Speaker 2: he was to get the maximum sentences for those, that 91 00:05:19,800 --> 00:05:23,000 Speaker 2: would mean twenty years in prison. But as we found 92 00:05:23,040 --> 00:05:24,599 Speaker 2: out in the last few days, which is why we 93 00:05:24,640 --> 00:05:27,240 Speaker 2: are talking about it today, he did not get that. 94 00:05:27,800 --> 00:05:29,800 Speaker 1: So what did he get? I mean, the sentence has 95 00:05:29,839 --> 00:05:33,080 Speaker 1: been handed down. How long is he facing in prison? 96 00:05:33,279 --> 00:05:35,640 Speaker 2: He is facing fifty months in prison? 97 00:05:35,720 --> 00:05:38,600 Speaker 1: Fifteen months, So we're talking then for four years and 98 00:05:38,640 --> 00:05:39,640 Speaker 1: two months. 99 00:05:39,320 --> 00:05:43,200 Speaker 2: Just great mass, just over four years. And that was 100 00:05:43,440 --> 00:05:47,000 Speaker 2: longer than as you can imagine, what his lawyers argued for, 101 00:05:47,080 --> 00:05:49,680 Speaker 2: So they said that he should receive no more than 102 00:05:49,720 --> 00:05:53,960 Speaker 2: fourteen months. The government, on the other hand, again reminded 103 00:05:53,960 --> 00:05:56,559 Speaker 2: that it was federal authorities who brought forward this case. 104 00:05:56,839 --> 00:06:01,000 Speaker 2: They argued that he should get eleven years. Judge decided 105 00:06:01,160 --> 00:06:03,159 Speaker 2: on four, like we said, and he said in his 106 00:06:03,279 --> 00:06:06,640 Speaker 2: judgment that the four years was necessary to and this 107 00:06:06,680 --> 00:06:09,640 Speaker 2: is a direct quote to send a message to abuses 108 00:06:09,680 --> 00:06:13,680 Speaker 2: and victims alike that exploitation and violence against women is 109 00:06:13,800 --> 00:06:18,080 Speaker 2: met with real accountability. He was also fined five hundred 110 00:06:18,160 --> 00:06:22,800 Speaker 2: thousand US dollars, which was the maximum fine possible for 111 00:06:22,880 --> 00:06:23,560 Speaker 2: these charges. 112 00:06:23,800 --> 00:06:26,440 Speaker 1: So four and a bit years a five hundred thousand 113 00:06:26,440 --> 00:06:29,320 Speaker 1: dollars US fine. That puts it about seven hundred, seven 114 00:06:29,400 --> 00:06:32,440 Speaker 1: hundred and fifty thousand Australian But that also includes the 115 00:06:32,480 --> 00:06:34,960 Speaker 1: time he's already spent in jail, right. 116 00:06:34,960 --> 00:06:37,640 Speaker 2: Yes, So what it means is that he will now 117 00:06:37,720 --> 00:06:41,640 Speaker 2: be in jail until twenty twenty eight, because, like you said, 118 00:06:41,720 --> 00:06:44,800 Speaker 2: he has already spent that one year in jail and 119 00:06:44,880 --> 00:06:48,760 Speaker 2: he was denied bail. That's why sometimes you might not 120 00:06:48,800 --> 00:06:51,600 Speaker 2: be in jail yet. Sure, he was denied bail. One 121 00:06:51,640 --> 00:06:54,240 Speaker 2: thing to note, though, is that his lawyers have said 122 00:06:54,240 --> 00:06:55,960 Speaker 2: that he will appeal the judgment. 123 00:06:56,080 --> 00:06:56,279 Speaker 1: Right. 124 00:06:56,560 --> 00:06:59,920 Speaker 2: One thing I know about the law system, the legal system, 125 00:07:00,120 --> 00:07:02,080 Speaker 2: is that appeals can take a long time. So I 126 00:07:02,080 --> 00:07:03,560 Speaker 2: think it's fair to say that he will be in 127 00:07:03,640 --> 00:07:05,480 Speaker 2: jail for the foreseeable future. 128 00:07:05,640 --> 00:07:09,440 Speaker 1: So he'll stay in jail while those appeals play out. 129 00:07:09,560 --> 00:07:12,640 Speaker 1: But you're right, those appeals can take months, if not years, 130 00:07:13,280 --> 00:07:16,280 Speaker 1: So what about the other cases against him. There are 131 00:07:16,320 --> 00:07:19,600 Speaker 1: some cases. Then if we jump over to the civil system, yes, 132 00:07:19,920 --> 00:07:22,960 Speaker 1: there are some lawsuits he's facing that haven't been settled yet. 133 00:07:23,240 --> 00:07:26,120 Speaker 2: Yes, well there are many. There are actually more than fifty, 134 00:07:26,480 --> 00:07:29,520 Speaker 2: which is crazy. That's a large number of civil lawsuits 135 00:07:29,560 --> 00:07:31,480 Speaker 2: that he is still facing. 136 00:07:31,160 --> 00:07:33,440 Speaker 1: And so he still faces them, right even though he's 137 00:07:33,480 --> 00:07:35,840 Speaker 1: in jail on that one criminal case. 138 00:07:36,040 --> 00:07:38,600 Speaker 2: Yes, I think that we should explain the difference between 139 00:07:38,640 --> 00:07:41,560 Speaker 2: civil and criminal because they've kind of said it here 140 00:07:41,600 --> 00:07:43,360 Speaker 2: and there, but I think we need a proper explainer. 141 00:07:43,720 --> 00:07:46,440 Speaker 2: You are our in house lawyer thanks to your four 142 00:07:46,520 --> 00:07:49,120 Speaker 2: year law degree, by the way, I think that you 143 00:07:49,360 --> 00:07:51,960 Speaker 2: are best places to explain the difference between those two. 144 00:07:52,200 --> 00:07:54,320 Speaker 1: So the way to think about it then in this 145 00:07:54,360 --> 00:07:59,000 Speaker 1: context of Diddy would be that federal prosecutors who represent 146 00:07:59,040 --> 00:08:02,080 Speaker 1: the interests of the American people. That's why if you 147 00:08:02,080 --> 00:08:04,080 Speaker 1: think about like the OJ Simpson case, it was the 148 00:08:04,080 --> 00:08:08,120 Speaker 1: people versus OJ Simpson, this would be the people versus Sean. 149 00:08:07,880 --> 00:08:10,800 Speaker 2: Combs, the people meaning the government. 150 00:08:11,320 --> 00:08:14,520 Speaker 1: Well, yes, the government who then represent the public. Yes, 151 00:08:14,680 --> 00:08:17,720 Speaker 1: you and I if we were Americans, And so they 152 00:08:17,720 --> 00:08:22,400 Speaker 1: have the jail system at their disposal and the police 153 00:08:22,440 --> 00:08:27,440 Speaker 1: to use and handcuffs and arrests. That's different to the 154 00:08:27,480 --> 00:08:33,040 Speaker 1: civil system, which is individuals bringing actions against other individuals, 155 00:08:33,280 --> 00:08:35,839 Speaker 1: and you can't go to jail for that, so there 156 00:08:35,840 --> 00:08:39,320 Speaker 1: can still be a remedy, and remedies are normally things 157 00:08:39,360 --> 00:08:41,760 Speaker 1: like money, but they could also be a public apology. 158 00:08:41,840 --> 00:08:44,599 Speaker 1: It could be, you know, an avo that lasts a 159 00:08:44,600 --> 00:08:46,559 Speaker 1: certain amount of time, or some sort of restriction on 160 00:08:47,000 --> 00:08:51,040 Speaker 1: movement sometimes, but mostly it's money. And there's different burdens 161 00:08:51,040 --> 00:08:53,560 Speaker 1: of proof. I don't want to go too legal system 162 00:08:53,600 --> 00:08:56,320 Speaker 1: on you, but in the criminal system, it has to 163 00:08:56,320 --> 00:08:59,640 Speaker 1: be beyond a reasonable doubt. So the people or the 164 00:08:59,679 --> 00:09:02,280 Speaker 1: government or the federal prosecutors had to prove that Shawn 165 00:09:02,320 --> 00:09:06,640 Speaker 1: Combs did traffic sex workers beyond the reasonable doubt if 166 00:09:06,679 --> 00:09:09,000 Speaker 1: he was sued. In the civil system, it has to 167 00:09:09,000 --> 00:09:11,760 Speaker 1: be on the balance of probabilities, So a fifty one 168 00:09:11,840 --> 00:09:15,280 Speaker 1: percent chance that that happened. So very different systems, but 169 00:09:15,600 --> 00:09:19,400 Speaker 1: ultimately what it leads to is you'd imagine with fifty 170 00:09:19,440 --> 00:09:23,360 Speaker 1: civil cases, it's likely that somebody, even with the money 171 00:09:23,440 --> 00:09:26,160 Speaker 1: of Shawn Combs would probably file for bankruptcy at a 172 00:09:26,200 --> 00:09:26,880 Speaker 1: certain stage. 173 00:09:27,000 --> 00:09:30,760 Speaker 2: Yeah, and so like I said, he is still facing 174 00:09:30,840 --> 00:09:35,080 Speaker 2: more than fifty civil lawsuits which are all accusing him 175 00:09:35,200 --> 00:09:36,800 Speaker 2: of sexual abuse pretty much. 176 00:09:36,840 --> 00:09:40,600 Speaker 1: So these would be individuals who are saying Shawn Combs 177 00:09:40,760 --> 00:09:44,600 Speaker 1: owes me x number of dollars for the loss of 178 00:09:44,640 --> 00:09:47,439 Speaker 1: income or the mental distress or the other sort of 179 00:09:47,480 --> 00:09:50,160 Speaker 1: impact from his behavior exactly. 180 00:09:50,720 --> 00:09:53,800 Speaker 2: And most of these charges are based in New York, 181 00:09:53,880 --> 00:09:57,360 Speaker 2: as the criminal one was also, and according to the 182 00:09:57,400 --> 00:10:00,240 Speaker 2: New York Times, the allegations date as far back as 183 00:10:00,280 --> 00:10:04,320 Speaker 2: to the nineteen nineties, and the alleged victims are both 184 00:10:04,440 --> 00:10:07,640 Speaker 2: men and women. To give you an idea of the 185 00:10:07,800 --> 00:10:11,120 Speaker 2: kind of allegations we're talking about in these civil lawsuits, 186 00:10:11,360 --> 00:10:15,800 Speaker 2: they involve alleged gang rapes, and there are also a 187 00:10:15,800 --> 00:10:22,520 Speaker 2: lot of allegations of drugging people before then allegedly raping them. Horrific, Yeah, 188 00:10:22,559 --> 00:10:26,640 Speaker 2: and I think the number of allegations is what just 189 00:10:26,679 --> 00:10:29,440 Speaker 2: adds to how horrific it is. There are also at 190 00:10:29,520 --> 00:10:31,840 Speaker 2: least a dozen of the plaintiffs who say that they 191 00:10:31,880 --> 00:10:35,600 Speaker 2: were miners at the time of the alleged assaults, and 192 00:10:35,880 --> 00:10:38,880 Speaker 2: many of the lawsuits were also filed anonymously. 193 00:10:39,440 --> 00:10:41,360 Speaker 1: And so give me a sense of the strategy of 194 00:10:41,440 --> 00:10:43,640 Speaker 1: Kames as legal team. Here so they're fighting these civil 195 00:10:43,720 --> 00:10:47,040 Speaker 1: charges at the same time as moving through the criminal case. 196 00:10:47,120 --> 00:10:50,439 Speaker 2: Right, yes, So whilst this very public criminal case has 197 00:10:50,520 --> 00:10:55,360 Speaker 2: been ongoing, they have also been fighting these civil lawsuits 198 00:10:55,440 --> 00:10:57,040 Speaker 2: I guess behind the scenes, or they just haven't been 199 00:10:57,080 --> 00:10:59,680 Speaker 2: getting as much media attention as the criminal one. Sure, 200 00:11:00,040 --> 00:11:02,720 Speaker 2: and in July this year, one of his lawyers said 201 00:11:02,760 --> 00:11:04,880 Speaker 2: to the New York Times this is a quote again, 202 00:11:05,080 --> 00:11:07,640 Speaker 2: mister Holmes will not back down. We will fight each 203 00:11:07,679 --> 00:11:10,200 Speaker 2: and every civil case for as long as necessary to 204 00:11:10,280 --> 00:11:15,160 Speaker 2: win his full vindication. So again they have denied all 205 00:11:15,240 --> 00:11:17,040 Speaker 2: of the allegations against him. 206 00:11:17,360 --> 00:11:19,920 Speaker 1: I'd say that whilst there's now a resolution in the 207 00:11:20,000 --> 00:11:23,240 Speaker 1: criminal case here, the sheer number of cases that still 208 00:11:23,280 --> 00:11:25,720 Speaker 1: are floating through the civil system means that this story 209 00:11:25,800 --> 00:11:27,959 Speaker 1: won't get out of the headlines for a while now. 210 00:11:28,200 --> 00:11:30,640 Speaker 1: We did talk about some really difficult things on today's podcast, 211 00:11:30,640 --> 00:11:32,400 Speaker 1: So I just want to remind everybody that you can 212 00:11:32,440 --> 00:11:35,800 Speaker 1: reach out to one eight hundred respects anytime on one 213 00:11:35,800 --> 00:11:39,240 Speaker 1: eight hundred seven three seven seven three to two. Billy. 214 00:11:39,360 --> 00:11:41,600 Speaker 1: Thank you for taking us through that. Thank you, and 215 00:11:41,640 --> 00:11:43,800 Speaker 1: we're going to be back this afternoon with the headlines. 216 00:11:43,800 --> 00:11:45,640 Speaker 1: Please take care. I'll give you that number one more time. 217 00:11:45,679 --> 00:11:48,760 Speaker 1: It's one eight hundred seven three seven seven three to two. 218 00:11:48,840 --> 00:11:51,040 Speaker 1: We'll chat to you in the afternoon. Until then, have 219 00:11:51,160 --> 00:11:54,960 Speaker 1: a great day. 220 00:11:56,200 --> 00:11:58,480 Speaker 2: My name is Lily Maddon and I'm a proud Arunda 221 00:11:58,720 --> 00:12:03,520 Speaker 2: Bunjelung Calcottin woman from Gadigol Country. The Daily oz acknowledges 222 00:12:03,600 --> 00:12:05,719 Speaker 2: that this podcast is recorded on the lands of the 223 00:12:05,760 --> 00:12:09,560 Speaker 2: Gadigol people and pays respect to all Aboriginal and Torrestrate 224 00:12:09,600 --> 00:12:12,559 Speaker 2: island and nations. We pay our respects to the first 225 00:12:12,559 --> 00:12:15,079 Speaker 2: peoples of these countries, both past and present.