1 00:00:00,160 --> 00:00:05,080 Speaker 1: Now. Yesterday, Universities Australia released its National Student Safety Survey, 2 00:00:05,519 --> 00:00:08,280 Speaker 1: which reports on the scale and nature of university student 3 00:00:08,400 --> 00:00:13,160 Speaker 1: experiences of sexual assault and sexual harassment. More than nine 4 00:00:13,280 --> 00:00:17,319 Speaker 1: hundred and seventy Charles Dawen University students participated in the 5 00:00:17,360 --> 00:00:21,960 Speaker 1: October twenty twenty one survey and findings unfortunately showing twelve 6 00:00:21,960 --> 00:00:25,640 Speaker 1: point four percent of students at Charles Dalen University who 7 00:00:25,680 --> 00:00:31,080 Speaker 1: participated had experienced sexual harassment since starting at the university. 8 00:00:31,360 --> 00:00:33,280 Speaker 1: Now joining me on the line to tell us a 9 00:00:33,360 --> 00:00:36,440 Speaker 1: little bit more about the situation and really what work 10 00:00:36,600 --> 00:00:38,879 Speaker 1: is going to get under way hopefully to try and 11 00:00:38,960 --> 00:00:42,360 Speaker 1: sort this issue. It is the Charles Dalen University Vice 12 00:00:42,440 --> 00:00:45,280 Speaker 1: Chancellor Scott Bowman. Good morning to you, Scott. 13 00:00:45,920 --> 00:00:47,519 Speaker 2: Hi KD Scott. 14 00:00:47,680 --> 00:00:51,120 Speaker 1: Have these findings shocked the university and how concerning are 15 00:00:51,120 --> 00:00:51,959 Speaker 1: some of the stats? 16 00:00:53,400 --> 00:00:56,640 Speaker 2: Look, they've kind of shopped us, and they haven't shopped us. 17 00:00:56,680 --> 00:01:01,960 Speaker 2: They've shopped us the people having to endure this stuff 18 00:01:02,040 --> 00:01:06,039 Speaker 2: in the university. But we know that this is a 19 00:01:06,080 --> 00:01:11,080 Speaker 2: massive problem in society. We've tried really hard to make 20 00:01:11,280 --> 00:01:14,760 Speaker 2: university a haven where people can come and not have 21 00:01:14,959 --> 00:01:18,160 Speaker 2: to put up with these behaviors. So we shocked to 22 00:01:18,200 --> 00:01:22,600 Speaker 2: see that even in the university people are being arrassed. 23 00:01:23,720 --> 00:01:26,640 Speaker 2: So yeah, not a good report. 24 00:01:27,000 --> 00:01:30,959 Speaker 1: No, I mean, are there programs in place or had 25 00:01:31,000 --> 00:01:34,160 Speaker 1: there already been programs in place that address issues of 26 00:01:34,200 --> 00:01:36,880 Speaker 1: harassment at the union And are we going to see 27 00:01:36,880 --> 00:01:39,120 Speaker 1: some changes as a result of these statistics? 28 00:01:40,680 --> 00:01:44,040 Speaker 2: Well yes and yes. So we did a similar survey 29 00:01:44,319 --> 00:01:48,760 Speaker 2: around about five years ago, respect now all ways, and 30 00:01:50,680 --> 00:01:53,640 Speaker 2: I think the figures were worse back then, but really 31 00:01:53,680 --> 00:01:55,680 Speaker 2: not a lot worse. And we've put a lot of 32 00:01:55,800 --> 00:01:59,480 Speaker 2: effort in, you know, put in training in for people, 33 00:02:00,840 --> 00:02:05,080 Speaker 2: really making people aware of what services that are available, 34 00:02:05,280 --> 00:02:08,480 Speaker 2: and they haven't had a massive impact. So I met 35 00:02:08,560 --> 00:02:11,680 Speaker 2: with the chair of the Student Council yesterday and we 36 00:02:11,680 --> 00:02:14,640 Speaker 2: were kind of discussing that, were do we go now, 37 00:02:14,840 --> 00:02:17,880 Speaker 2: what can we do next? And we've got some ideas 38 00:02:17,919 --> 00:02:23,359 Speaker 2: around that. So yeah, look at it is a continuous 39 00:02:23,680 --> 00:02:27,600 Speaker 2: problem for the university, I think, and for all universities. 40 00:02:27,800 --> 00:02:30,320 Speaker 1: Yeah. And look, I guess it's a hard one as 41 00:02:30,360 --> 00:02:32,680 Speaker 1: a parent, and I know that there'll be other parents listening, 42 00:02:33,160 --> 00:02:36,520 Speaker 1: maybe thinking is CDU a safe place you know, for 43 00:02:36,560 --> 00:02:39,160 Speaker 1: my child to go when they get to that age. 44 00:02:40,320 --> 00:02:42,799 Speaker 2: Well, look, I don't want to say there's anything good 45 00:02:42,840 --> 00:02:47,440 Speaker 2: about this report, because if one student has been harassed 46 00:02:47,520 --> 00:02:50,520 Speaker 2: on campus, this is not a good report. But if 47 00:02:50,560 --> 00:02:53,600 Speaker 2: you compare us with the rest of the sector, we 48 00:02:53,720 --> 00:03:00,000 Speaker 2: have much lower incidents than the average of universities in Australia. 49 00:03:00,600 --> 00:03:05,200 Speaker 2: So compared with other universities, you know, this is CDU 50 00:03:05,360 --> 00:03:09,959 Speaker 2: is not exceptionally In fact, it does better. So yeah, 51 00:03:10,040 --> 00:03:12,640 Speaker 2: so I'd say that first of all, but I say again, 52 00:03:12,680 --> 00:03:16,000 Speaker 2: if there's one person being harassed, then we need to 53 00:03:16,000 --> 00:03:21,079 Speaker 2: do something about it. And you know, the harassment comes 54 00:03:21,320 --> 00:03:25,320 Speaker 2: from students a student, So we have students harassing students 55 00:03:25,480 --> 00:03:29,560 Speaker 2: and we have staff to students as well, and we've 56 00:03:29,600 --> 00:03:33,000 Speaker 2: got to really look at how we address both of 57 00:03:33,040 --> 00:03:38,920 Speaker 2: those groups, make people aware of what is acceptable and 58 00:03:38,960 --> 00:03:43,160 Speaker 2: what isn't. I think we also, I've been thinking a 59 00:03:43,160 --> 00:03:47,800 Speaker 2: lot about this KD and you know, we kind of 60 00:03:47,840 --> 00:03:52,640 Speaker 2: think that harassment, the harassment is them. It's those people 61 00:03:52,680 --> 00:03:57,960 Speaker 2: over there, these squeazy, dirty old men that are arrassing 62 00:03:58,680 --> 00:04:04,160 Speaker 2: our students, how young, let's face it, female students. And yes, 63 00:04:04,720 --> 00:04:07,360 Speaker 2: there are some people like that, and I think in 64 00:04:07,440 --> 00:04:09,800 Speaker 2: some ways they're the easy ones to deal with. They're 65 00:04:09,800 --> 00:04:13,080 Speaker 2: the ones that we can deal with and get rid 66 00:04:13,120 --> 00:04:15,920 Speaker 2: of from the university and say there's no place for there. 67 00:04:16,400 --> 00:04:18,400 Speaker 2: But the more I'm thinking about this, this is a 68 00:04:18,440 --> 00:04:23,080 Speaker 2: continuum and although it's very uncomfortable to say, I think 69 00:04:23,120 --> 00:04:26,080 Speaker 2: we're all on that continuum somewhere, you know, and we've 70 00:04:26,080 --> 00:04:29,440 Speaker 2: got to get you know, people thinking. You know, have 71 00:04:29,520 --> 00:04:33,440 Speaker 2: you glanced at a student for a bit too long 72 00:04:33,560 --> 00:04:38,320 Speaker 2: which has made them feel uncomfortable? That's harassment. You know that, 73 00:04:38,480 --> 00:04:42,080 Speaker 2: you know that is harassment if you're making and you 74 00:04:42,080 --> 00:04:44,599 Speaker 2: know there were men that reported being harassed, but this 75 00:04:44,760 --> 00:04:48,040 Speaker 2: is mainly men for women. But let's not beat around 76 00:04:48,040 --> 00:04:51,080 Speaker 2: the bush. Let's look at all of our behaviors. You know, 77 00:04:51,320 --> 00:04:57,240 Speaker 2: have we made a joke which has made women feel uncomfortable? 78 00:04:57,600 --> 00:05:01,400 Speaker 2: Have we made a comment that makes people uncomfortable? Have 79 00:05:01,440 --> 00:05:04,040 Speaker 2: we used language? Have we been swearing which has made 80 00:05:04,120 --> 00:05:07,120 Speaker 2: women feel uncomfortable? So, you know, one of the things 81 00:05:07,200 --> 00:05:09,559 Speaker 2: I want to talk about in the university, this isn't 82 00:05:09,640 --> 00:05:13,880 Speaker 2: a problem of them, it's a problem of all of us. 83 00:05:14,160 --> 00:05:17,000 Speaker 1: And so Scott, to anybody out there listening this morning, 84 00:05:17,040 --> 00:05:19,120 Speaker 1: who is thinking, what is the you know, what's the 85 00:05:19,240 --> 00:05:23,080 Speaker 1: university going to do about this? It does sound as 86 00:05:23,080 --> 00:05:25,920 Speaker 1: though this is top of mind for you. Are there 87 00:05:25,960 --> 00:05:27,680 Speaker 1: going to be some changes or are they going to 88 00:05:27,720 --> 00:05:31,320 Speaker 1: be some measures implemented sooner rather than later. 89 00:05:32,560 --> 00:05:34,880 Speaker 2: Yep. Sure. So, Look, we've all we've done a lot 90 00:05:34,880 --> 00:05:36,520 Speaker 2: of training on this. But one of the things if I 91 00:05:36,680 --> 00:05:40,520 Speaker 2: was talking to the students a council about yesterday, was 92 00:05:41,040 --> 00:05:44,520 Speaker 2: most of that training has been online. And you know 93 00:05:44,760 --> 00:05:47,480 Speaker 2: the training you have to do a lot of training 94 00:05:47,480 --> 00:05:50,359 Speaker 2: when you come and work at the university, and you 95 00:05:50,400 --> 00:05:54,320 Speaker 2: know students have to do some online training about academic integrity. 96 00:05:55,440 --> 00:05:57,359 Speaker 2: I think that for this we need to go a 97 00:05:57,360 --> 00:06:00,720 Speaker 2: lot deeper. I'm not sure that just online training is enough. 98 00:06:00,880 --> 00:06:03,800 Speaker 2: We need to get people in a room. We may 99 00:06:04,240 --> 00:06:07,839 Speaker 2: be have to appeal to get some of our really 100 00:06:07,880 --> 00:06:11,800 Speaker 2: strong women that have been subjected to this to come 101 00:06:11,800 --> 00:06:16,120 Speaker 2: into that room and say this is what's not acceptable. 102 00:06:16,360 --> 00:06:19,200 Speaker 2: You know, you might think this is acceptable, but this isn't. 103 00:06:19,279 --> 00:06:21,680 Speaker 2: Let's discuss that, and I think you need to do 104 00:06:21,720 --> 00:06:24,360 Speaker 2: that in a face to face context, not just a 105 00:06:24,520 --> 00:06:29,320 Speaker 2: sort of superficial online kind of training. So I definitely 106 00:06:29,440 --> 00:06:33,960 Speaker 2: am looking to introduce that for staff, for students. I 107 00:06:34,000 --> 00:06:36,120 Speaker 2: know that it's been reported in the press that one 108 00:06:36,240 --> 00:06:41,160 Speaker 2: University down South has got absolutely terrible results in this survey. 109 00:06:41,839 --> 00:06:46,400 Speaker 2: They are going to start consent training for all their students, 110 00:06:46,400 --> 00:06:48,720 Speaker 2: so you won't be able to enroll in that university 111 00:06:49,160 --> 00:06:53,159 Speaker 2: unless you've done consent training. Our figures are much better 112 00:06:53,320 --> 00:06:55,760 Speaker 2: than that, but I still think that's something we could 113 00:06:55,760 --> 00:06:57,400 Speaker 2: look at and I'm going to reach out to that 114 00:06:57,520 --> 00:06:59,600 Speaker 2: union and say, well, if you've got some materials you're 115 00:06:59,600 --> 00:07:02,040 Speaker 2: going to use who maybe we could use them as well. 116 00:07:02,320 --> 00:07:04,520 Speaker 1: So we could end up in a situation at CDU 117 00:07:04,640 --> 00:07:07,719 Speaker 1: where every student has to do consent training before they 118 00:07:07,880 --> 00:07:10,240 Speaker 1: begin their degree or before they begin their studies. 119 00:07:11,480 --> 00:07:13,920 Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly right. I mean to our students have come 120 00:07:14,000 --> 00:07:16,880 Speaker 2: in from many different cultures, and I'm not talking just 121 00:07:16,920 --> 00:07:20,600 Speaker 2: about international cultures but that's an issue, but you know, 122 00:07:20,680 --> 00:07:24,600 Speaker 2: different cultures from within Australia where you know, maybe some 123 00:07:24,760 --> 00:07:29,200 Speaker 2: of the behaviors which I won't say acceptable but are 124 00:07:29,880 --> 00:07:32,920 Speaker 2: kind of there in those cultures are just not acceptable 125 00:07:32,960 --> 00:07:36,000 Speaker 2: in a university. We need to start exploring that and 126 00:07:36,000 --> 00:07:39,320 Speaker 2: getting people to understand that. And I think, you know, 127 00:07:39,440 --> 00:07:42,640 Speaker 2: putting somethink in where we say all students have to 128 00:07:42,680 --> 00:07:47,040 Speaker 2: do academic integrity training as part of their enrollment, you're 129 00:07:47,040 --> 00:07:50,680 Speaker 2: not going to achieve well, maybe we need to say 130 00:07:51,680 --> 00:07:54,320 Speaker 2: you're going to have to do this consent training because 131 00:07:54,360 --> 00:07:57,280 Speaker 2: you are not going to arrest once you're in the university. 132 00:07:57,960 --> 00:08:01,360 Speaker 1: Well c dou Vice Chancellor Scott Bowman, I appreciate your 133 00:08:01,360 --> 00:08:03,960 Speaker 1: time this morning. Unfortunately we've run out of time, but 134 00:08:04,000 --> 00:08:05,840 Speaker 1: I appreciate you having a chat with us, and please 135 00:08:05,920 --> 00:08:08,920 Speaker 1: keep us up to date, let us know what decision 136 00:08:09,040 --> 00:08:10,160 Speaker 1: is made in that space. 137 00:08:11,560 --> 00:08:13,920 Speaker 2: Great talking to UKD and next time it's going to 138 00:08:13,920 --> 00:08:14,560 Speaker 2: be good news. 139 00:08:14,920 --> 00:08:17,239 Speaker 1: Thank you, Thank you very much for your time this morning.