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Speaker 1: Jersey and Amanda jam nation Well.

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Speaker 2: Sunday's Pride March shut down the Sydney Harbor Bridge as

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Speaker 2: the rainbow hued crowd made its way from Milton's Point

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Speaker 2: to the Domain and Hyde Park. Among the vast crowd

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Speaker 2: of fifty thousand people who made their way across the

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Speaker 2: harbor Bridge was our next guest, who was greeted with

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Speaker 2: cheers as she joined the crowd to march. She's the

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Speaker 2: Australian Foreign Minister and she was the first openly gay

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Speaker 2: woman in Parliament. It is, of course, Penny Wong.

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Speaker 1: Hello, Penny, Good morning Tibo.

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Speaker 3: Thank you Penny. It's great to have you on the show.

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Speaker 3: I wish I walked across the bridge. I was, you know,

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Speaker 3: I had to do a bunch of chores yesterday, so

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Speaker 3: I feel bad.

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Speaker 2: So the chores came first.

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Speaker 3: No, I was just doing the chores.

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Speaker 2: Your commitment to me.

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Speaker 3: But every time a bridgewalk comes and I go, oh damn,

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Speaker 3: why didn't I do that bridgewalk?

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Speaker 2: This one must have been incredible, Penny.

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Speaker 1: Look it actually was. You know, it was really moving,

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Speaker 1: and I was lucky enough to be like in one

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Speaker 1: of the first groups, so you know, you got up

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Speaker 1: early and you saw the sunrise and walking across the

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Speaker 1: bridge and that sort of sea of color in the morning.

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Speaker 1: It was really beautiful and such a wonderful celebration and

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Speaker 1: such an iconic image of Australia, isn't it everyone on

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Speaker 1: the Sydney Harbor Bridge.

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Speaker 2: But also how great Australians must feel to see you

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Speaker 2: and our prime minister marching and supporting the lgb tw

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Speaker 2: q I A plus community. It hasn't always felt like that.

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Speaker 1: No, it hasn't. And you know, equality and inclusion, accepting

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Speaker 1: people for who they are, that they always need work,

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Speaker 1: don't they. You've got to keep You've got to keep

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Speaker 1: working at otherwise you go backwards. But I was really

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Speaker 1: proud to walk alongside Albou and I was proud that

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Speaker 1: he walked in Marti Gras as the first Australian Prime

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Speaker 1: minister to do that. And he's something about our country

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Speaker 1: I reckon. So it's great.

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Speaker 3: And Anthony he's been doing that for a long time,

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Speaker 3: hasn't been. It's not the first time he's walked in

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Speaker 3: the march. He's walked in since the eighties.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yes, and he's very proud of that. Actually, you know,

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Speaker 1: I think it means a lot to him that he

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Speaker 1: walked before it was popular. Yeah, but you know he

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Speaker 1: also understands as I do. I think as the whole

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Speaker 1: community does, and what a prime minister does and says

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Speaker 1: means something to people. And I always think about, you know,

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Speaker 1: a young kid who's struggling with who they are, what

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Speaker 1: that says to them when they see a march like that,

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Speaker 1: and leaders and people out there saying, you know, you

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Speaker 1: belong to be proud of who you are. It's a

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Speaker 1: wonderful thing.

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Speaker 2: The thing that's frightening is that none of this is

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Speaker 2: said in Stone. I've been looking at what's happening in America.

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Speaker 2: You know, anti gay bills are rapidly escalating and becoming law.

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Speaker 2: Tennessee is making it illegal to perform drag in public places.

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Speaker 2: Oklahoma is passing a bill that would effectively ban gender

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Speaker 2: affirming care for miners and adults. So we can't assume, well,

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Speaker 2: can we assume that in Australia our rights are sacred?

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Speaker 1: It sort of goes back to one of the things

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Speaker 1: I said earlier, which is you can never Equality is

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Speaker 1: an ongoing project, isn't it. I often think of like

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Speaker 1: a car on a hill. You know, if you don't,

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Speaker 1: if you don't keep your foot on the accelerator, you

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Speaker 1: go backwards. And unfortunately, there are a lot of places

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Speaker 1: around the world with laws different to ours, a lot

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Speaker 1: of places around the world, country states who don't share

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Speaker 1: our approach. But you know, I believe every human being

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Speaker 1: has a right to be free from discrimination, has a

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Speaker 1: right to be who they are, and we need to

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Speaker 1: keep engaging within our community for the you know, to

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Speaker 1: make sure those values are protected, but also internationally.

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Speaker 2: When you first started your relationship with your partner, Sophie,

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Speaker 2: did you picture there'd be a day where you could

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Speaker 2: work hand in hand in front of television cameras like that.

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Speaker 1: Nobly I didn't think Probably didn't think about that, actually,

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Speaker 1: but look, it was really can answer this though. It

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Speaker 1: was very moving for me because Sofi is pretty private

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Speaker 1: and doesn't she doesn't do a lot of public it

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Speaker 1: doesn't do a lot of public events with me. But

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Speaker 1: she really wanted to do this, so it was lovely

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Speaker 1: to be there with her and be there with the

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Speaker 1: to the NB, there with Albou and Jody. It was

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Speaker 1: a lovely morning. It meant a lot to me.

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Speaker 3: And also being out is very hard for a lot

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Speaker 3: of people, Like, it's not something that people just go

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Speaker 3: people just presume, I think in the straight world. And

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Speaker 3: I noticed because my sister is she's gay, she's been

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Speaker 3: married for a long time and I've got nephews. But

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Speaker 3: I remember when she came out when she was eighteen.

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Speaker 3: I remember at the time there was that was a

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Speaker 3: long time ago, but it was a real struggle for

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Speaker 3: that acceptance. You know, coming from a straight family, this

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Speaker 3: was a bit of a bombshell. Now to me, it's

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Speaker 3: as natural as anything. It's part of accept.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, and probably that's how I should have answered

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Speaker 1: Amanda's question actually to talk about when I first went

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Speaker 1: into parliament, was it was still something many people felt

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Speaker 1: ashamed about. It's still something I found it a little

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Speaker 1: hard to talk about because I reasonably profit human being

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Speaker 1: believed or not. And so I think that that shift

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Speaker 1: over the last twenty years, which has been because of

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Speaker 1: many many activists, many people in the community working for change,

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Speaker 1: but also many allies. I mean, one of the things

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Speaker 1: that I was always very moved about in the marriage

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Speaker 1: equality debate was how many people said, look, I'm not gay,

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Speaker 1: but you know, why not?

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Speaker 3: Why that's right?

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Speaker 1: And I thought, Yeah, Australians are a decent people. We're

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Speaker 1: a country that where the fairgo does matter and basic

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Speaker 1: decency does matter, and ultimately that's what equality is.

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Speaker 3: About, and that's what makes us great in this country.

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Speaker 3: The words fair enough. Someone says something like you could

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Speaker 3: get someone to come into a room and go, I'm

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Speaker 3: going to address as a tea bag today and the

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Speaker 3: adsy way would be fair enough.

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Speaker 2: Away from fair enough.

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Speaker 3: It's almost like Brian Brown's talking you fair enough. You

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Speaker 3: do that, mate, You'll be all right, Penny. It's great

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Speaker 3: to talk to you. Thank you for joining us.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it's really loved to be with you.

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Speaker 3: Thanks Handy A. Wong, the Australian Foreign Minister. There