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Speaker 1: The opposition leader, Lea Finocchiaro joins me in the studio.

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Speaker 2: Good boarding to you, Leah, Good morning Katie and your listeners.

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Speaker 1: Now, after twenty years of celebrating Territory Day at Mindle Beach,

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Speaker 1: the Territory Day fireworks celebrations are going to move locations

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Speaker 1: this year.

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Speaker 3: As I'm sure you've heard.

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Speaker 1: The change got listeners fired up yesterday to say the least,

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Speaker 1: especially Mindle Beach stallholders for expecting this year well to

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Speaker 1: have a busy.

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Speaker 3: Night on that night. Firstly, what do you make of

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Speaker 3: these changes?

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Speaker 2: I think it's ridiculous, Katie.

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Speaker 4: And what we've seen is the government doing the blame game,

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Speaker 4: Evil Loola, Brent Potter.

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Speaker 2: They're blaming everyone but themselves.

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Speaker 4: They should just stand up and do what leaders are

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Speaker 4: required to do, and that's make a decision. If that

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Speaker 4: was me, Katie, I would be saying fireworks are happening

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Speaker 4: at Mindle Beach like they have done for twenty plus years.

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Speaker 4: The reality is thousands of Territorians are going to head

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Speaker 4: down there anyway because they might not know about this

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Speaker 4: or hear about it, and the government is just going

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Speaker 4: to have an absolute disaster on its hands to manage

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Speaker 4: because of course people are going to be expecting a

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Speaker 4: celebration that's not going to be there. There's going to

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Speaker 4: be personal use of fireworks then in an unrestricted environment,

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Speaker 4: which isn't normally the case. It's just again, this government

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Speaker 4: can't even do the basics.

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Speaker 1: Clea, Do you think at this point in time that

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Speaker 1: the government should change it back?

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Speaker 3: They should back to Mendel.

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Speaker 4: Absolutely, they should put their hand up and say we

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Speaker 4: made this decision, we got the decision wrong. We've heard

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Speaker 4: the community loud and clear that Mendle Beach is the

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Speaker 4: best place to continue to celebrate Territory Day, public fireworks

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Speaker 4: and just.

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Speaker 2: Make the decision and move on. But they're blaming each other.

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Speaker 1: We're too far in now in terms of it happening

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Speaker 1: down at the Fort Hill lawns there and at the waterfront,

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Speaker 1: like we're.

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Speaker 3: Too far in. Can we change it back?

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Speaker 1: I mean there was discussion about whether it was the

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Speaker 1: change was due to there being a sacred site down there,

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Speaker 1: which we all understand, but other major events are still

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Speaker 1: continuing to happen.

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Speaker 3: I mean, based on the grass was exactly just a

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Speaker 3: few weeks ago. I know that it wasn't on the

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Speaker 3: actual beach but if there is area that is.

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Speaker 1: Of great concern, couldn't you petition that area? Off?

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Speaker 2: Of course you could, Katie. That's why this is ridiculous.

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Speaker 4: You've got Darwin City Council, You've got Mindle Beach Markets

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Speaker 4: operating there. You've had Aboriginal Areas Protection come out and

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Speaker 4: explain that the site is.

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Speaker 2: Very well known.

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Speaker 4: So the government could have taken the appropriate risk mitigation.

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Speaker 2: Sorry excuse me, Katie.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, So while I let you get your breath back,

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Speaker 1: I mean, do you think that we are in a

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Speaker 1: situation here though We're like, I mean, is it just

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Speaker 1: political point scoring on your part to say move it back?

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Speaker 3: Wouldn't that be easier said than done?

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Speaker 4: That this decision should never have been made in the

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Speaker 4: first place. I mean, it's just astonishing that after twenty

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Speaker 4: plus years, all of a sudden there's an issue with

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Speaker 4: a sacred site at that beach. Now the government could

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Speaker 4: have gotten the permit, or they could have decided to

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Speaker 4: go ahead without the permit like they have done for

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Speaker 4: twenty four years, and put in place risk mitigation, and

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Speaker 4: instead they've chosen to shut it down. It's just an

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Speaker 4: a salute joke. People are furious. They don't understand it.

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Speaker 4: Everyone's playing the blame game. The government should stand up,

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Speaker 4: take responsibility for the decision, say it's moving back and

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Speaker 4: just move on.

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Speaker 1: Is it the government though, or is it in team

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Speaker 1: major Events doing their risk mitigation and going well, hang

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Speaker 1: on a second, the risk is potentially too high here.

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Speaker 2: Well, you had.

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Speaker 4: Brent Potter, the Minister and radio on your show yesterday

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Speaker 4: saying that, and Tim came to him. I mean, at

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Speaker 4: the end of the day, he's the minister, even while

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Speaker 4: as the Chief Minister, even if they didn't know about it,

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Speaker 4: they could still change the decision. It's just ridiculous blame

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Speaker 4: shifting that we're seeing a government that lacks accountability. They're

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Speaker 4: totally out of touch with the community and it.

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Speaker 2: Should never have happened, Katie.

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Speaker 4: If that was me in that seat, I would have said,

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Speaker 4: we're going ahead with mindel and I can guarantee listeners

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Speaker 4: and under a COLP government that's where it will be.

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Speaker 1: What if there was any kind of legal challenge after

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Speaker 1: the fact, if there was some kind of damage to

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Speaker 1: those San junees in and you wound up with you know,

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Speaker 1: with traditional owners saying well hang on a sick you

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Speaker 1: have still forged ahead with this event. Now there is

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Speaker 1: damage to a sacred sash.

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Speaker 4: Well. I think there's a number of issues. One is

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Speaker 4: that why wasn't the permit obtained? Two, even if the

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Speaker 4: you know was everyone pulled together to see if they

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Speaker 4: could fast track the permit, it sounds to me like

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Speaker 4: the government just gave up.

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Speaker 2: Now, there are a number of things you can do.

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Speaker 4: Besides the fact, you could have worked with Aboriginal Areas

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Speaker 4: Protection and said where is the site, what can we do?

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Speaker 2: You could have barricaded it.

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Speaker 4: There's a number of things that could have been done

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Speaker 4: and it just hasn't been done.

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Speaker 2: It just has not been done.

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Speaker 4: Tens of thousands of people go down there, Katie, as

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Speaker 4: you know. And what about the markets, Now, there's always

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Speaker 4: a special mindor beach markets that happens on that night.

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Speaker 4: You've got retailers experiencing really low levels of trade. ABS

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Speaker 4: data just came out that showed that retail trade is flatlining.

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Speaker 2: And even I saw a lady on the news.

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Speaker 4: Who's the storeholders say that everyone's feeling it across Darwin.

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Speaker 4: So now they're missing an opportunity to trade, which is

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Speaker 4: less money moving through our economy. Let's food on the

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Speaker 4: table for those stallholds.

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Speaker 1: Look, we are going to be catching up as well

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Speaker 1: after ten o'clock this morning with one of those stallholders

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Speaker 1: to get their take on things. But look, it's hard

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Speaker 1: for me not to agree with you on this. I

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Speaker 1: actually think we do need to change this back. I

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Speaker 1: don't think that it's too late. I think there is

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Speaker 1: still the opportunity for this to go back. If you've

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Speaker 1: got the Aboriginal Areas Protection Authorities saying that you know

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Speaker 1: that there there wasn't an application filed and that it's

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Speaker 1: not essential for the event to go forward. I think

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Speaker 1: if there is able to be that risk mitigation, if

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Speaker 1: there is an area that we're.

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Speaker 3: Concerned about, well let's try and petition it off.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and then at least every effort has been made

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Speaker 1: by NT major events to make sure that the area

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Speaker 1: is safe and that sacred sites are not damaged in

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Speaker 1: any way. But it doesn't sound you know, the more

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Speaker 1: that we question here, the more that I ask, it

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Speaker 1: doesn't sound as though there has been a complaint made.

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Speaker 1: So that's where I can't understand why the change is happening.

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Speaker 1: And look, you know, we are more than happy if

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Speaker 1: there is a Larakia owner out there who disagrees and

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Speaker 1: who does not.

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Speaker 3: Want it to happen.

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Speaker 1: On mindle Beach, We are really happy to have you

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Speaker 1: on the show and hear the reasons why we did

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Speaker 1: seek to get that clarification yesterday and have not been

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Speaker 1: able to so.

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Speaker 3: Look, I think that it needs to change back.

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Speaker 4: It does need to change back, There's no question about it, Katie.

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Speaker 4: And again this is just a failure of this Layla

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Speaker 4: Labor government to do the very basics and now they

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Speaker 4: can't even make a decision in the wake of a mistake.

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Speaker 4: They can't own the mistake. There continue to be out

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Speaker 4: of touch with community sentiment on this issue. It makes

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Speaker 4: no sense to anyone apparently except for them.

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Speaker 3: Leah. Let's move along.

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Speaker 1: Questions were asked yesterday yesterday during the estimates process about

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Speaker 1: travel of the former Chief Minister Michael Gunner and the

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Speaker 1: trips that he took to remote communities during caretaker mode

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Speaker 1: in the leading to the last election. The Chief Minister's

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Speaker 1: ruling out paying that money back. Do you think that

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Speaker 1: that money should be paid back?

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Speaker 4: Yes, and we have been firmly on the record over

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Speaker 4: the last three years saying that money should be paid back.

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Speaker 4: But of course, again you've got a Chief Minister, Evia Laula,

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Speaker 4: tone deaf and out of touch with the community sentiment.

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Speaker 4: This didn't pass the pub test in twenty twenty, it

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Speaker 4: doesn't pass the pub test now, even though the IKAK

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Speaker 4: reports has been tabled and ultimately people expect better from

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Speaker 4: their leaders and we haven't seen that under Labor. So yesterday,

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Speaker 4: in estimates, was an important time to question the Chief

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Speaker 4: Minister and we had the Deputy IKAC or sorry, the

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Speaker 4: acting IKAC Commissioner was there as well.

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Speaker 1: Yesterday, Leah, how will you do things differently when it

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Speaker 1: comes to travel if you become the chief minister, because

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Speaker 1: you know, even this morning, like I've got somebody messaging

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Speaker 1: through saying I'm a CLP supporter, but I'm finding it

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Speaker 1: frustrating that Lea is very negative towards the Labor Party

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Speaker 1: all the time. I want to hear what she can do.

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Speaker 1: So what will you do differently when it comes to

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Speaker 1: that travel?

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Speaker 4: Well, you don't travel during caretaker, you don't travel to

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Speaker 4: polling boots on taxpayers money, you don't campaign on the

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Speaker 4: taxpayers perse. It's all very basic stuff. But again we've

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Speaker 4: seen this government plagued by scandal and integrity crisis, whether

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Speaker 4: it's shares scandals that eventually took down Natasha Files or

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Speaker 4: Chancey Paik around owning shares in an alcohol company during

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Speaker 4: stronger futures, this government at every turn has faced scandal

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Speaker 4: and integrity crisis and that continues on and so the

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Speaker 4: SEALP has been very clear. For example, we have a

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Speaker 4: new measure if people want to talk about new policies

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Speaker 4: and points of difference. Besides just being good people doing

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Speaker 4: the right thing includes having a lobby register, a public

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Speaker 4: lobby register so that people can see the meetings that

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Speaker 4: government ministers have, so that that breathes transparency into the process.

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Speaker 1: Exactly the register, so it's published like in real time.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I believe.

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Speaker 4: So I think there's different models around the country and

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Speaker 4: we'll obviously have a look at the best ones and

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Speaker 4: he can pick from the ones that currently exist. But yeah,

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Speaker 4: it's basically an updated register of who's meeting with who,

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Speaker 4: so that people can you see is are you meeting

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Speaker 4: with developers? Are you meeting with people from the mining

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Speaker 4: industry for example. So that's just one in a number

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Speaker 4: of ways in which we can create stronger, more robust

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Speaker 4: systems of government and most importantly give territories a confidence

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Speaker 4: that their leadership is doing the right thing.

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Speaker 1: Just on the government travel and on the situation where

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Speaker 1: we had that IKAQ report come out into the former

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Speaker 1: chief minister's travel, we are expecting a second report to

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Speaker 1: come out. However, we now know that obviously the Ikak inspector,

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Speaker 1: he has completed his report into the allegations the KAC

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Speaker 1: Commissioner paid his former partner twenty thousand dollars to suppress

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Speaker 1: a domestic violence allegation. Now that has has found that

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Speaker 1: inspector's report has found that, you know that the Akak

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Speaker 1: Commissioner had not done anything wrong the look of it.

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Speaker 1: We know that there is still work or there is

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Speaker 1: still there was parts of it that he could not

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Speaker 1: you know that he could not investigate fully i e.

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Speaker 1: The domestic violence allegation. But what it has also shown,

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Speaker 1: or what that report is also released and said, is

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Speaker 1: that the k Commissioner requires some time off. So we've

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Speaker 1: now got a situation where the deputy k Commissioner has

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Speaker 1: stepped up, yes, and is filling that role. But what

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Speaker 1: happens to that second report that we were expecting into

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Speaker 1: this travel situation.

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Speaker 2: That's right, Katie.

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Speaker 4: So I asked this yesterday of the Acting k Commissioner

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Speaker 4: and she said, she said, basically she needs to get

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Speaker 4: on the ground. She's been away for a period of

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Speaker 4: time and that there's no time frame now for that

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Speaker 4: second report.

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Speaker 1: Okay, so we don't actually know now when that second

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Speaker 1: report's going to come out. It was it was something

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Speaker 1: that wasn't going to be made public, even.

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Speaker 2: Laula said she would not make it public.

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Speaker 4: But now we don't even have a timeframe on when

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Speaker 4: that will be completed, and we don't know the impact

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Speaker 4: on all ongoing investigations to the IK.

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Speaker 1: All right, moving along, One last thing that I'm keen

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Speaker 1: to get your take on is there are renewed calls

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Speaker 1: for the board of Australia's largest Indigenous legal service to

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Speaker 1: be sacked following allegations that had appointed a known domestic

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Speaker 1: violence offender as its chair. Now, this story broke in

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Speaker 1: The Australian yesterday that Hugh Woodbury was appointed chair of

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Speaker 1: the North Australian Aboriginal Justice Agency in March, almost four

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Speaker 1: years after he pleaded guilty to serious domestic violence offenses

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Speaker 1: in Alice Springs. Now the Sky News is reporting that

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Speaker 1: Darwin Barrister John Lawrence, sc a former Principal solicitor for

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Speaker 1: NAGA and former head of the Anti Criminal Lawyers Association,

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Speaker 1: has told Sky News that the board needs to be removed.

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Speaker 3: What is your take on this.

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Speaker 4: I think what we're seeing with Niger is obviously an

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Speaker 4: enormous period of disruption and upheaval, and so it's really

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Speaker 4: important going forward that people have confidence in that organization.

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Speaker 4: Now it's very clear that there's still a lot of

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Speaker 4: water to go under that bridge. It raises huge concerns

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Speaker 4: of course to the community. But again we haven't heard

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Speaker 4: from the Attorney General Chancy Paig on this issue. Here

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Speaker 4: is the Attorney General of the Northern Territory. This is

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Speaker 4: a legal service provider and it's very important that NAGA

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Speaker 4: is working effectively because otherwise what you have is people

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Speaker 4: appearing in court unrepresented, and when you have an unrepresented

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Speaker 4: person in court, that protracts the court process. It means

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Speaker 4: things are not running as smoothly and that limits people's

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Speaker 4: access to justice. So this is one for government to

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Speaker 4: get to the bottom of and resolve because we need

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Speaker 4: a strong NAGA in the Northern Territory and what we've

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Speaker 4: seen is a significant period of uncertainty and destabilization.

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Speaker 1: And if this isn't resolved before the August election, what

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Speaker 1: are you going to do if you're elected as the

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Speaker 1: Chief benstry.

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Speaker 4: We have to resolve it. We have to get to

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Speaker 4: the bottom of this now. For whatever reason, Chancey Paig

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Speaker 4: has and said a boo about it, but it's got

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Speaker 4: to be done. Legal services are very important parts of

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Speaker 4: our justice system and they need to be working well

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Speaker 4: and there needs to be confidence in those systems, and

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Speaker 4: so they labor can a review. Yes, it absolutely needs

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Speaker 4: to be looked at. It needs to be strengthened and resolved.

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Speaker 4: There's significant funding goes to NAGA and they need to

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Speaker 4: be a strong organization in the territory.

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Speaker 1: And so if you are elected as the Chief Minister,

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Speaker 1: you'll commit to reviewing NAJA or what are you going

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Speaker 1: to do exactly?

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Speaker 4: Well, I guess we'd have to understand what's actually on foot,

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Speaker 4: you know from opposition we just don't get that level

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Speaker 4: of detail. So I imagine there is some sort of oversight

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Speaker 4: or something happening at the moment.

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Speaker 2: If there's not, we'll commence it.

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Speaker 4: If there is, we'll look at whether what this government's

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Speaker 4: done is enough, but clearly it's not all right.

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Speaker 1: Lea Finochio, opposition leader, always appreciate your time, Thanks very

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Speaker 1: much for joining us this morning.

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Speaker 2: Thank you, Take care everyone,