WEBVTT - Australia has recognised Palestine. What now?

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<v Speaker 1>Already and this is the Daily This is the Daily OS.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh, now it makes sense.

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<v Speaker 1>Good morning and welcome to the Daily OS. It's Tuesday,

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<v Speaker 1>the twenty third of September.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm Lucy Tassel, I'm Emma Gillespie.

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<v Speaker 1>Early on Monday morning, Australian Prime Minister Anthony Albanesi announced

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<v Speaker 1>the government had recognized the State of Palestine. Albanezi joined

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<v Speaker 1>the heads of Canada and the UK in making the

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<v Speaker 1>announcement ahead of the UN General Assembly in New York

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<v Speaker 1>City this week. Then early this morning, countries met at

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<v Speaker 1>the UN to discuss the future of the two State solution.

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<v Speaker 1>In today's podcast, we'll explain what it means to recognize

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<v Speaker 1>the State of Palestine and how it relates to the

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<v Speaker 1>two state approach.

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<v Speaker 2>We'll get into that right after a quick word from

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<v Speaker 2>today's sponsor Lucy. We have known for a couple of

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<v Speaker 2>months now that Australia was going to recognize the State

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<v Speaker 2>of Palestine at the UN General Assembly this week, but

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<v Speaker 2>we didn't exactly know how it would play out, what

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<v Speaker 2>that would look like. I had kind of assumed up

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<v Speaker 2>until this week that it would be a speech on

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<v Speaker 2>the floor of the UN in front of all the

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<v Speaker 2>world leaders of the General Assembly, but instead, at least

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<v Speaker 2>for Australia's part, it played out in a statement at

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<v Speaker 2>first that was released from New York by the Prime

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<v Speaker 2>Minister over the weekend. There is a lot to unpacking

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<v Speaker 2>today's episode, but I think a good place to start

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<v Speaker 2>is probably with that statement and Australia's kind of pledge here.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, so we've known since July basically that these are

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<v Speaker 1>the government's plans. Back then, the government followed announcements from France,

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<v Speaker 1>the UK and Canada and committing to recognizing the state

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<v Speaker 1>of Palestine in September. It's now September. In July, Albanizi

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<v Speaker 1>said the process was necessary to ensure lasting peace in

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<v Speaker 1>the region, and he echoed those comments with his statement

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<v Speaker 1>on Monday, saying a two state solution with Israeli and

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<v Speaker 1>Palestinian states quote has always been the only path to

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<v Speaker 1>enduring peace and security for the Israeli and the Palestinian peoples.

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<v Speaker 1>And he noted that Australia's recognition came with some what

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<v Speaker 1>he called requirements, so ensuring that Hamas, which Australia lists

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<v Speaker 1>as a terrorist organization, has no role in the state

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<v Speaker 1>and HAMAS has run Gaza since the two thousands.

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<v Speaker 2>Okay.

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<v Speaker 1>He also said he'd received assurances from the Palestinian Authority,

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<v Speaker 1>which governs parts of the West Bank, that it would

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<v Speaker 1>hold democratic elections and carry out reforms.

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<v Speaker 2>So a lot of stakeholders that you've introduced their lucy,

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<v Speaker 2>not just Australia, but also the Palestinian Authority, the West Bank, Gaza.

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<v Speaker 2>Are those the territories that Australia now considers the state

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<v Speaker 2>of Palestine.

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<v Speaker 1>I believe so, although I'll note that none of the

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<v Speaker 1>government's statements have said this explicitly. To find out more,

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<v Speaker 1>I went to the Department of Foreign Affairs and Trades website,

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<v Speaker 1>which until now has had a page for the occupied

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<v Speaker 1>Palestinian territories. If you click on that, it redirects you

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<v Speaker 1>to a page simply titled Palestine.

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<v Speaker 2>So that's new.

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<v Speaker 1>That's new, And then if you follow I confirmed this

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<v Speaker 1>also on the web archive, if you follow a link

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<v Speaker 1>on that page to Smart Traveler, which is defat's travel

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<v Speaker 1>advice website for Australians. It also is titled Palestine, and

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<v Speaker 1>it has a new map that you can view, and

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<v Speaker 1>that map highlights Israel in one color and Palestine in another. Color,

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<v Speaker 1>and it has lines clearly delineating what Australia's government now

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<v Speaker 1>considers to be these two states. And so the Palestine

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<v Speaker 1>part is as of now, the West Bank and Gaza.

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<v Speaker 2>Okay, Lucy, I know this is a complicated question, but

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<v Speaker 2>to help our audience understand a little bit more about

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<v Speaker 2>the context behind all of this, how did these areas,

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<v Speaker 2>so Gaza and the West Bank come to be known

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<v Speaker 2>as the occupy Palestinian territory while Israel is a nation.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, where to begin? I have to pick somewhere to begin.

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<v Speaker 1>And something that we've talked about a lot over the

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<v Speaker 1>last couple of months in the office is sort of

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<v Speaker 1>this idea that you could write a book about how

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<v Speaker 1>this happened and still not cover every detail. But I'll

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<v Speaker 1>start somewhere, and that somewhere is World War One. So

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<v Speaker 1>during World War One, Britain and France believed that the

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<v Speaker 1>Ottoman Empire, which then existed and controlled much of the

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<v Speaker 1>modern Middle East and was opposed to them in the war,

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<v Speaker 1>would crumble. So they believed that this was an eventuality

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<v Speaker 1>that was going to happen. They signed a secret agreement

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<v Speaker 1>to divide up the Ottoman Empire and at the same time,

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<v Speaker 1>Britain promised independence to Arab communities that fought with it

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<v Speaker 1>during the war, and around that time, Britain made a

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<v Speaker 1>commitment to create quote a national home for the Jewish

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<v Speaker 1>people in Palestine. So we've got these kind of like

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<v Speaker 1>side by side promises.

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<v Speaker 2>Okay, side by side promises that would ultimately be conflicting

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<v Speaker 2>led by Britain and France at the fall of the

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<v Speaker 2>Ottoman Empire.

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<v Speaker 1>Yes after the war, there was the creation of the

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<v Speaker 1>League of Nations, which is the precursor to the UN.

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<v Speaker 1>It agreed that Britain would carry out its previous commitment

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<v Speaker 1>to create this quote home in Palestine, and it also

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<v Speaker 1>required Britain to commit to avoiding anything which quote might

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<v Speaker 1>prejudice the civil and religious rights of existing non Jewish

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<v Speaker 1>communities in Palestine. After World War Two and the Holocaust,

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<v Speaker 1>when the United Nations was created, Britain brought what it

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<v Speaker 1>was now calling the Palestinian Question to the UN, which

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<v Speaker 1>was that there were these different commitments that it had

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<v Speaker 1>made over the same piece of land. The new organization

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<v Speaker 1>voted to end British rule and split Palestine into a

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<v Speaker 1>Jewish state and an Arab state. Israel then declared its

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<v Speaker 1>independence in nineteen forty eight. There has been ongoing violence

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<v Speaker 1>and war in the region was before and it continues,

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<v Speaker 1>causing the mass displacement of Palestinians. Attempts to negotiate a

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<v Speaker 1>two state solution in line with what the UN voted

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<v Speaker 1>on have failed. Israel has since violently taken control of

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<v Speaker 1>the West Bank and East Jerusalem. Under international law, these

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<v Speaker 1>are known as the occupied Palestinian territories.

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<v Speaker 2>Now that is a very brief, broad snapshot of the

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<v Speaker 2>last say, seventy years. What about the status quo today

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<v Speaker 2>in terms of those territories, in terms of the West

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<v Speaker 2>Bank and Gaza.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, so today the Palestinian authority governs some of the

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<v Speaker 1>West Bank, while Hamas runs Gaza. The Israeli government recently

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<v Speaker 1>approved plans to expand their settlements in the West Bank, which,

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<v Speaker 1>as I said, are considered illegal under international law. UN

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<v Speaker 1>spokesperson Stefan Dujeriq said this would be quote an existential

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<v Speaker 1>threat to the two state solution.

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<v Speaker 2>Okay, Now, the two state solution is something that you

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<v Speaker 2>have mentioned a couple of times already. It's an idea

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<v Speaker 2>that we hear about a lot in the coverage of

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<v Speaker 2>this conflict. In this region. But what does that actually mean?

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<v Speaker 2>What is a two state solution?

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<v Speaker 1>So this has been interpreted as meaning what the UN

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<v Speaker 1>originally voted for, which is a Jewish and a Palestinian

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<v Speaker 1>state side by side in that territory. For many years,

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<v Speaker 1>the US and its allies, including until now Australia, only

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<v Speaker 1>planned to recognize the second of those two states after

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<v Speaker 1>it reached a negotiated agreement with Israel. That has changed

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<v Speaker 1>recently in light of Israel's ongoing campaign in Gaza, which

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<v Speaker 1>a UN Human Rights committee found last week is a

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<v Speaker 1>genocide against Palestinians.

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<v Speaker 2>So that all sort of brings us to the present

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<v Speaker 2>with Australia recognizing Palestine after many years of saying that

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<v Speaker 2>it would not recognize Palestine until it reached a negotiation

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<v Speaker 2>and agreement with Israel for that two state solution. But

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<v Speaker 2>we have moved past that on the world stage as

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<v Speaker 2>this conflict has escalated. What will happen next, I suppose

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<v Speaker 2>for Australia specifically, what really kind of materially changes, if anything,

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<v Speaker 2>now that Albanesi has declared that recognition right now?

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<v Speaker 1>Not a lot. As I mentioned earlier, Australia says it

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<v Speaker 1>has requirements for the Palestinian authority once those are in place.

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<v Speaker 1>Albanesi's statements said, Australia will think about establishing a diplomatic

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<v Speaker 1>relationship with this state that it's now recognized, and possibly

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<v Speaker 1>open an embassy. The Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade

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<v Speaker 1>has previously had an office in the West Bank.

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<v Speaker 2>Okay, So when we say diplomatic relationship, that kind of

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<v Speaker 2>opens up the doors for yeah, things like embassies, consulates,

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<v Speaker 2>more negotiations, maybe trade and other kind of partnerships.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, exactly. And early this morning more countries have taken

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<v Speaker 1>those steps towards recognition, including France.

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<v Speaker 2>What has the reaction been, you know, we've known that

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<v Speaker 2>this list of countries were going to make these declarations

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<v Speaker 2>and announcements at the General Assembly this week, but now

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<v Speaker 2>that it's actually happened, how has the world responded?

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<v Speaker 1>From Israel, the Foreign Ministry said it quote categorically rejects

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<v Speaker 1>the country's announcements, and Israeli authorities have said before that

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<v Speaker 1>they consider recognizing Palestine to be rewarding humas. The Palestinian

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<v Speaker 1>authority has welcomed the move, calling it a courageous decision

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<v Speaker 1>in line with international law over here in Australia. Both

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<v Speaker 1>the Australia Palestine Advocacy Network and the Executive Council of

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<v Speaker 1>Australian Jury expressed displeasure with the announcement, although for different reasons.

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<v Speaker 1>APAM said the decision quote remains well short of Australia's

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<v Speaker 1>international moral and legal obligations to stop Israel's genocide. They're

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<v Speaker 1>referring there to the UN Commission of Inquiry findings yep,

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<v Speaker 1>which we also talked about on the pod last week.

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<v Speaker 2>YEP. What about The Council of.

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<v Speaker 1>Jury ECAJ criticized the announcement as and said it fails

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<v Speaker 1>to make clear what will happen if the authority doesn't

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<v Speaker 1>make the changes that Australia requires, or quote, if Hamas

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<v Speaker 1>continues to control Palestinian territory. And from the Coalition, we've

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<v Speaker 1>got a joint statement from Opposition Leader Susan Lee and

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<v Speaker 1>Shadow Foreign Minister Mikhalia Cash saying the government had proceeded

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<v Speaker 1>with recognition without what they called quote crucial conditions because

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<v Speaker 1>they said Hamas is still in power in Gasa.

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<v Speaker 2>Lucy, thank you so much for explaining that. I think

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<v Speaker 2>there was a little bit of confusion maybe when you

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<v Speaker 2>know Albanesi released that statement on Sunday ahead of the meeting.

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<v Speaker 2>But I suppose we've got two kind of separate announcements

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<v Speaker 2>here really. One is you know, how the Australian government

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<v Speaker 2>will move forward in its relationship with Palestine. And then

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<v Speaker 2>also this global collective of world leaders coming together on

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<v Speaker 2>the floor of the UN to declare statehood, you know,

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<v Speaker 2>at that level, this kind of global diplomacy moment. As

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<v Speaker 2>we know, this story is ongoing, unfolding rapidly every week,

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<v Speaker 2>and we will continue to keep you up to date

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<v Speaker 2>here on the podcast. Thank you so much for listening

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<v Speaker 2>to today's episode. That is all we have time for,

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<v Speaker 2>but we'll be back a little later on with your

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<v Speaker 2>evening news headlines. Until then, have a great day.

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<v Speaker 1>My name is Lily Maddon and I'm a proud Arunda

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<v Speaker 1>Bungelung Caalcuttin woman from Gadighl country. The Daily oz acknowledges

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<v Speaker 1>Gadighl people and pays respect to all Aboriginal and Torres

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<v Speaker 1>first peoples of these countries, both past and present,