1 00:00:00,480 --> 00:00:04,720 Speaker 1: Willen Woody that bite sized Well there, what make it afternoon? Everyone? 2 00:00:04,840 --> 00:00:07,360 Speaker 1: It is will and Woody, hope you're having a wonderful 3 00:00:07,440 --> 00:00:11,760 Speaker 1: drive Homewoods. And next guest is someone that you and 4 00:00:11,800 --> 00:00:15,200 Speaker 1: I have spoken about. This guy's a weapon a lot 5 00:00:16,000 --> 00:00:19,000 Speaker 1: off the airwaves. We haven't spoken about him on the airways, 6 00:00:19,040 --> 00:00:21,960 Speaker 1: but obviously you and I big fans of The Imperfect podcast, 7 00:00:22,079 --> 00:00:25,639 Speaker 1: Hugh van Collenberg's podcast, and this guy got introduced and 8 00:00:25,640 --> 00:00:27,440 Speaker 1: he was you know, Hugh is kind of like a 9 00:00:27,480 --> 00:00:29,680 Speaker 1: guru for us. So for Hugh and Ryan on The 10 00:00:29,680 --> 00:00:33,279 Speaker 1: Imperfect to introduce this guy as their guru, you know, 11 00:00:34,080 --> 00:00:37,760 Speaker 1: it was intense. Yeah, it was intense, so so so sorry. 12 00:00:37,800 --> 00:00:39,120 Speaker 1: He's on our show now. As you can tell, we're 13 00:00:39,120 --> 00:00:41,840 Speaker 1: both a little bit nervous. He's got a brand new app. 14 00:00:41,880 --> 00:00:45,560 Speaker 1: It's called Mojoe Crow. His name is Ben Crow. He's 15 00:00:45,600 --> 00:00:49,479 Speaker 1: responsible for all of the mindset training behind Ash Barty 16 00:00:49,479 --> 00:00:51,680 Speaker 1: and her Win at the Aussie Open on the week 17 00:00:51,720 --> 00:00:54,680 Speaker 1: at weekend. Please welcome Ben Crow. Ben welcome to show. 18 00:00:55,960 --> 00:00:57,840 Speaker 2: Love the intro. Thanks we all, Thanks wood He love 19 00:00:57,880 --> 00:00:58,520 Speaker 2: to be here. 20 00:00:58,360 --> 00:01:01,160 Speaker 3: And that is genuine mate. Seriously, the way you talk 21 00:01:01,200 --> 00:01:06,120 Speaker 3: about purpose and story really is pretty incredible, was I know, 22 00:01:06,200 --> 00:01:08,160 Speaker 3: life changing for both Will and I. But why don't 23 00:01:08,160 --> 00:01:10,400 Speaker 3: we start with a story that people will be familiar 24 00:01:10,480 --> 00:01:13,760 Speaker 3: with and it's obviously very topical today in Ash Barty. 25 00:01:13,280 --> 00:01:15,840 Speaker 3: She's the number one player in the world, She's just 26 00:01:15,880 --> 00:01:18,720 Speaker 3: won the Australian Open. It's all incredible stuff. But you've 27 00:01:18,760 --> 00:01:21,520 Speaker 3: been on a journey with her for quite a while. 28 00:01:21,560 --> 00:01:22,720 Speaker 3: Can you speak to that a little bit? 29 00:01:23,600 --> 00:01:26,200 Speaker 2: Yeah, Ira Ash had a bit of a setback, I 30 00:01:26,200 --> 00:01:29,640 Speaker 2: guess at Wimbledon back in twenty eighteen, and she'd already 31 00:01:29,680 --> 00:01:31,560 Speaker 2: taken a leave of absence from the game and came 32 00:01:31,560 --> 00:01:35,000 Speaker 2: back in twenty fifteen and she goes, I think I 33 00:01:35,000 --> 00:01:37,480 Speaker 2: can't retire again. I'm only twenty one. So she was 34 00:01:37,520 --> 00:01:41,039 Speaker 2: aware of the work I've done with Trent Kotchen and 35 00:01:41,040 --> 00:01:43,880 Speaker 2: Dimmer and Richmond Football Club as a man Tiger fan 36 00:01:43,959 --> 00:01:46,760 Speaker 2: in twenty seventeen, so she reached out to Trent and 37 00:01:46,800 --> 00:01:51,840 Speaker 2: her coach, the amazingly humble and brilliant Craig Gizer, reached 38 00:01:51,880 --> 00:01:54,360 Speaker 2: out to me, as did Nicki, her manager as a 39 00:01:54,360 --> 00:01:56,280 Speaker 2: close friend of mine. So yeah, there's quite a few 40 00:01:56,320 --> 00:02:00,480 Speaker 2: kind of interconnections and yeah, Ash mac woman and she 41 00:02:00,560 --> 00:02:03,400 Speaker 2: flew down for a few days together and they're kind 42 00:02:03,400 --> 00:02:05,480 Speaker 2: of been working together ever since. Yeah. 43 00:02:05,560 --> 00:02:08,320 Speaker 1: Right, And when you say working together, mate, I know 44 00:02:08,360 --> 00:02:10,600 Speaker 1: I've heard you talk about this before, but can we 45 00:02:10,680 --> 00:02:15,480 Speaker 1: just run through sort of like structuring an athlete's mindset 46 00:02:15,880 --> 00:02:19,840 Speaker 1: and how you move the goalposts for them so that 47 00:02:19,840 --> 00:02:22,919 Speaker 1: they're not crippled by the demons which we so often 48 00:02:22,960 --> 00:02:24,880 Speaker 1: see break people down. I know this is I've heard 49 00:02:24,880 --> 00:02:27,359 Speaker 1: you talk about because you worked with Andre Agacy previously, 50 00:02:27,560 --> 00:02:31,320 Speaker 1: you were formerly an executive at Nike, and just sort 51 00:02:31,320 --> 00:02:34,920 Speaker 1: of where you saw the holes in the system and 52 00:02:34,960 --> 00:02:37,280 Speaker 1: how you kind of reworked it for these people. Because 53 00:02:37,400 --> 00:02:43,320 Speaker 1: someone like Ash seems genuinely lighter than anyone, you know, 54 00:02:43,520 --> 00:02:45,639 Speaker 1: who else who you see on a court these days. 55 00:02:45,639 --> 00:02:47,760 Speaker 1: She seems focused, she seems lighter, and I know that 56 00:02:47,760 --> 00:02:49,960 Speaker 1: that's a lot to do with, as I said, how 57 00:02:49,960 --> 00:02:52,960 Speaker 1: you sort of restructured her thinking. Could you just talk 58 00:02:52,960 --> 00:02:54,600 Speaker 1: a little bit about that, because I think for everybody listening, 59 00:02:54,600 --> 00:02:57,400 Speaker 1: whether you are a professional tennis player or sportsman or not, 60 00:02:58,600 --> 00:03:01,120 Speaker 1: this advice is really transformative. 61 00:03:01,960 --> 00:03:04,880 Speaker 2: Yeah. No, Yeah, So the journey that'sh went on or 62 00:03:04,919 --> 00:03:06,880 Speaker 2: anyone I guess needs to go on. We're all in 63 00:03:06,880 --> 00:03:11,080 Speaker 2: search of confidence and happiness, and in order to get there, 64 00:03:11,120 --> 00:03:12,720 Speaker 2: we kind of need to go on a journey of 65 00:03:12,720 --> 00:03:15,440 Speaker 2: self reflection and introspect. You to kind of the first 66 00:03:15,440 --> 00:03:17,840 Speaker 2: part is really kind of working out who we are 67 00:03:19,160 --> 00:03:21,720 Speaker 2: fundamentally as human then kind of own our story and 68 00:03:21,919 --> 00:03:26,679 Speaker 2: find that unconditional self worth that's not conditional and having 69 00:03:26,680 --> 00:03:28,240 Speaker 2: a win a game of tennis, or what you look 70 00:03:28,360 --> 00:03:29,880 Speaker 2: like or what' school you get on an exam and 71 00:03:29,919 --> 00:03:33,800 Speaker 2: so forth, and you go through that work and kind 72 00:03:33,800 --> 00:03:36,360 Speaker 2: of really get to own your story and separate the 73 00:03:36,440 --> 00:03:39,600 Speaker 2: human being from the human doing, or your self worth 74 00:03:39,600 --> 00:03:41,560 Speaker 2: from your networth or what we call the person from 75 00:03:41,600 --> 00:03:44,680 Speaker 2: the persona. And once you can work out who you are, 76 00:03:45,000 --> 00:03:47,240 Speaker 2: then you can work out what you want in life 77 00:03:48,000 --> 00:03:50,200 Speaker 2: and then find your purpose and your values and your 78 00:03:50,240 --> 00:03:53,000 Speaker 2: goals and your motivations and your need. So the two 79 00:03:53,040 --> 00:03:54,680 Speaker 2: questions we get people to answer, the first one is 80 00:03:54,680 --> 00:03:56,120 Speaker 2: who am I? And the second one is what do 81 00:03:56,200 --> 00:03:58,640 Speaker 2: I want? And you kind of need to answer them 82 00:03:58,640 --> 00:04:00,760 Speaker 2: in that order because you can't look out what you 83 00:04:00,840 --> 00:04:03,680 Speaker 2: want until you work out who you are. And if 84 00:04:03,680 --> 00:04:05,920 Speaker 2: you try to answer the second question first, you'll just 85 00:04:05,960 --> 00:04:10,280 Speaker 2: get distracted by external things, whether it's money or materialism, 86 00:04:10,440 --> 00:04:13,920 Speaker 2: or in a social status or craving recognition. And I 87 00:04:13,920 --> 00:04:16,200 Speaker 2: think that's what the really big distraction is today, because 88 00:04:16,560 --> 00:04:18,160 Speaker 2: if you feel like you have to do something or 89 00:04:18,200 --> 00:04:21,800 Speaker 2: achieve something in order to be someone, then you'll never 90 00:04:21,839 --> 00:04:24,800 Speaker 2: be fulfilled or contend or a peace. So the goal 91 00:04:24,880 --> 00:04:27,720 Speaker 2: is really to of answer that question who am I? 92 00:04:27,760 --> 00:04:31,039 Speaker 2: And find that unconditional sense of self then put these 93 00:04:31,040 --> 00:04:33,320 Speaker 2: goals and dreams out of the universes. Ash has done 94 00:04:33,360 --> 00:04:38,080 Speaker 2: so beautifully, but without any guarantees or expectations of actually 95 00:04:38,120 --> 00:04:41,280 Speaker 2: achieving those goals or dreams. And that's okay because she's 96 00:04:41,360 --> 00:04:45,160 Speaker 2: already worthy and success for Ash, And she said this 97 00:04:45,200 --> 00:04:47,160 Speaker 2: at a press conference a few days ago, asking about 98 00:04:47,200 --> 00:04:49,839 Speaker 2: you know you finally, how do you feel about success 99 00:04:49,880 --> 00:04:51,960 Speaker 2: here and winning the trophy and winning this run open, 100 00:04:52,760 --> 00:04:56,400 Speaker 2: she said, well, that's your definition of success, it's not mine. 101 00:04:56,640 --> 00:05:00,840 Speaker 2: My definition is far more predicated on relationship and experiences 102 00:05:00,880 --> 00:05:03,000 Speaker 2: and memories and getting out of my comfort zone and 103 00:05:03,560 --> 00:05:07,279 Speaker 2: realizing my potential. And they're very intrinsic and they're actually 104 00:05:07,279 --> 00:05:11,120 Speaker 2: things she can control. Yeah, extrinsic motivations how much money 105 00:05:11,160 --> 00:05:13,560 Speaker 2: we make or how famous we are, you know, the 106 00:05:14,240 --> 00:05:17,520 Speaker 2: achieving things. We have less control over those things. 107 00:05:17,800 --> 00:05:19,560 Speaker 1: And I think, I think if I can, if I 108 00:05:19,560 --> 00:05:20,960 Speaker 1: can start that, we're going to go to a song 109 00:05:21,000 --> 00:05:23,120 Speaker 1: because I really want to drill down on this spit here, 110 00:05:23,160 --> 00:05:24,960 Speaker 1: because this is the really interesting part for me, because 111 00:05:24,960 --> 00:05:26,280 Speaker 1: you said, the first question is who I am, the 112 00:05:26,320 --> 00:05:29,120 Speaker 1: second question is what do I want? And I think 113 00:05:29,120 --> 00:05:31,000 Speaker 1: for a lot of people then they naturally set a 114 00:05:31,040 --> 00:05:33,240 Speaker 1: goal for the what do I want things? And as 115 00:05:33,240 --> 00:05:35,880 Speaker 1: you said, an extrinsic goal. We're so used to saying, well, 116 00:05:35,920 --> 00:05:40,560 Speaker 1: what do I want, I want this job, all those exactly, 117 00:05:40,680 --> 00:05:43,520 Speaker 1: so you set something which is which can have a 118 00:05:43,640 --> 00:05:47,320 Speaker 1: value placed on it, which in a traditional sense of value, 119 00:05:47,320 --> 00:05:49,640 Speaker 1: but you're talking about when you say what do I want, 120 00:05:49,920 --> 00:05:51,719 Speaker 1: that actually connects to your purpose. And I think this 121 00:05:51,800 --> 00:05:54,200 Speaker 1: is honestly one of the best things I've personally ever 122 00:05:54,240 --> 00:05:57,000 Speaker 1: heard anywhere, is that there is a big difference between 123 00:05:57,000 --> 00:06:01,719 Speaker 1: a purpose, a person's purpose, and a person's goal. And Ben, 124 00:06:01,720 --> 00:06:03,200 Speaker 1: if you're going to ask that question for us right 125 00:06:03,200 --> 00:06:04,520 Speaker 1: next to on, Will and wood you stay with us. 126 00:06:04,880 --> 00:06:07,200 Speaker 1: Good afternoon, everyone, It is Will and Woody. I hope 127 00:06:07,200 --> 00:06:09,719 Speaker 1: you're having a wonderful drive home. Ash Barty obviously fresh 128 00:06:09,720 --> 00:06:13,360 Speaker 1: off winning the Aussie Open on the weekend, and the 129 00:06:13,360 --> 00:06:16,800 Speaker 1: brains behind her entire operation is a bloke called Ben Crowe, 130 00:06:16,880 --> 00:06:19,080 Speaker 1: so responsible for helping out and Dragas. He's a former 131 00:06:19,120 --> 00:06:22,000 Speaker 1: executive Night. If you haven't heard him on the Imperfect podcast, 132 00:06:22,320 --> 00:06:25,120 Speaker 1: you're missing out. He's got a brand new mindset coaching 133 00:06:25,160 --> 00:06:28,560 Speaker 1: app called Mojo Crow. This guy is a guru, he's 134 00:06:28,560 --> 00:06:30,400 Speaker 1: a wizard, and he's on Will and Woody right now 135 00:06:30,440 --> 00:06:31,960 Speaker 1: and he's trying to and this is what he's in 136 00:06:31,960 --> 00:06:34,000 Speaker 1: the middle of explaining everyone, if you're just joining us, 137 00:06:34,560 --> 00:06:36,520 Speaker 1: he's talking about this question what do I want? And 138 00:06:36,560 --> 00:06:39,560 Speaker 1: traditionally you know that you've got what we all think 139 00:06:39,600 --> 00:06:42,000 Speaker 1: from there as goals, We've got things that we're aiming towards. 140 00:06:42,080 --> 00:06:44,640 Speaker 1: You set yourself a goal, But Ben, you think there's 141 00:06:44,640 --> 00:06:47,160 Speaker 1: a big difference between setting a goal for yourself and 142 00:06:47,200 --> 00:06:48,600 Speaker 1: having a purpose for yourself. 143 00:06:49,520 --> 00:06:52,880 Speaker 2: Yeah, for me, a goal is far more specific. It's 144 00:06:52,880 --> 00:06:56,760 Speaker 2: more time bound, actionable and kind of measurable. And we 145 00:06:56,760 --> 00:06:59,120 Speaker 2: should all have them, by the way, we should all 146 00:06:59,160 --> 00:07:02,000 Speaker 2: have goals and dreams and dream big because it takes 147 00:07:02,000 --> 00:07:04,120 Speaker 2: the same elemental capacity to dream big as it does 148 00:07:04,160 --> 00:07:06,919 Speaker 2: to dream small. Right, so why would you limit yourself 149 00:07:07,080 --> 00:07:09,800 Speaker 2: with these small goals and dreams? So your dream big. 150 00:07:09,800 --> 00:07:11,440 Speaker 2: You set these big goals and you put them out 151 00:07:11,440 --> 00:07:14,080 Speaker 2: in the universe and then you go after them as 152 00:07:14,120 --> 00:07:16,680 Speaker 2: hard as you can and that's just called living. Yeah. 153 00:07:16,960 --> 00:07:21,480 Speaker 2: Whereas the purpose is something far more higher order. You'll 154 00:07:21,520 --> 00:07:23,760 Speaker 2: never get there, there's no finish line to it, but 155 00:07:23,800 --> 00:07:25,760 Speaker 2: it's what gets you out of bed, and it's more 156 00:07:25,800 --> 00:07:27,800 Speaker 2: focused on your why. Your goals are more your what 157 00:07:27,960 --> 00:07:30,840 Speaker 2: and how, But the why is very much connected to 158 00:07:30,840 --> 00:07:33,320 Speaker 2: that sense of purpose and meaning and kind of contribution 159 00:07:33,480 --> 00:07:36,280 Speaker 2: and fulfillment beyond ourselves, you know, to be part of 160 00:07:36,280 --> 00:07:38,440 Speaker 2: someone else. And that's kind of where we find our bliss. 161 00:07:39,160 --> 00:07:41,040 Speaker 2: And it's kind of something that will but you'll never 162 00:07:41,080 --> 00:07:43,960 Speaker 2: actually achieve it. Whereas goals is something a bit more 163 00:07:44,000 --> 00:07:45,400 Speaker 2: specific that you can go after. 164 00:07:45,480 --> 00:07:47,760 Speaker 1: I we work with it with a tangible example here Ben, 165 00:07:47,880 --> 00:07:49,720 Speaker 1: just just to try and for people that are grasphing, 166 00:07:49,760 --> 00:07:52,240 Speaker 1: you're so goot ash body. So her goal, let's say, 167 00:07:52,400 --> 00:07:53,920 Speaker 1: is to win the Australian Open. I don't know if 168 00:07:53,960 --> 00:07:56,080 Speaker 1: that is actually her goal, but that's that's that's a goal. 169 00:07:56,160 --> 00:07:59,400 Speaker 1: You can put a label on that. What's what's Ash's purpose. 170 00:08:00,240 --> 00:08:03,520 Speaker 2: Ash's purpose is far more around inspiring people to go 171 00:08:03,560 --> 00:08:06,160 Speaker 2: after have the confidence and the courage to go after 172 00:08:06,200 --> 00:08:07,160 Speaker 2: their goals and groups. 173 00:08:07,320 --> 00:08:09,600 Speaker 1: And so she doesn't necessarily have to win the Australian 174 00:08:09,640 --> 00:08:11,720 Speaker 1: Open in order to achieve her purpose. 175 00:08:11,840 --> 00:08:14,000 Speaker 2: Correct the way she talks in a press conference, the 176 00:08:14,040 --> 00:08:16,440 Speaker 2: way she talks to young kids, the work she does 177 00:08:16,480 --> 00:08:18,920 Speaker 2: off away from tennis. And so I thought, there's so 178 00:08:19,040 --> 00:08:23,080 Speaker 2: many different ways she can bring her purpose to life. 179 00:08:23,120 --> 00:08:25,280 Speaker 2: There where your goals are far more specific and actionable 180 00:08:25,320 --> 00:08:27,880 Speaker 2: and kind of time bound. Her purposes will be with 181 00:08:27,960 --> 00:08:29,480 Speaker 2: her for the rest of her life. And she just 182 00:08:29,800 --> 00:08:32,200 Speaker 2: has this curiosity to say, Okay, how can I bring 183 00:08:32,240 --> 00:08:34,520 Speaker 2: my purpose to life today? How can I be the 184 00:08:34,520 --> 00:08:37,240 Speaker 2: best part of someone else's day today? 185 00:08:37,760 --> 00:08:37,880 Speaker 1: Right? 186 00:08:37,960 --> 00:08:39,760 Speaker 2: And obviously she can do that with her tennis, but 187 00:08:39,760 --> 00:08:42,160 Speaker 2: there's so many other ways, multi dimensional ways that Ash 188 00:08:42,200 --> 00:08:44,320 Speaker 2: Party can bring that purpose to life. 189 00:08:44,400 --> 00:08:47,320 Speaker 1: Because then she's not limited to playing great tennis. Then 190 00:08:47,360 --> 00:08:50,360 Speaker 1: that's not the metric by which she judges herself, because 191 00:08:50,400 --> 00:08:52,840 Speaker 1: she can achieve her purpose in so many other ways. 192 00:08:53,200 --> 00:08:56,000 Speaker 3: And as you say, Ben, and playing great tennis is 193 00:08:56,040 --> 00:08:58,400 Speaker 3: to an extent out of her control a little bit. 194 00:08:58,800 --> 00:09:01,520 Speaker 3: And I know you talk a lot been around just 195 00:09:01,559 --> 00:09:04,200 Speaker 3: concerning yourself with the things you can control. 196 00:09:05,200 --> 00:09:07,959 Speaker 2: Yeah, absolutely, especially in the performance then, And that's the 197 00:09:08,000 --> 00:09:10,800 Speaker 2: difference between goals and expectations. And I think that's where 198 00:09:10,840 --> 00:09:13,240 Speaker 2: a lot of us get distracted with the two. But 199 00:09:13,360 --> 00:09:15,600 Speaker 2: she's been able to identify her goals in terms and 200 00:09:15,600 --> 00:09:18,839 Speaker 2: put them out there, but there's no expectations that she'll 201 00:09:18,880 --> 00:09:21,559 Speaker 2: actually achieve those goals. And I think that's one of 202 00:09:21,600 --> 00:09:24,040 Speaker 2: the biggest distractions today, know me for athletes, but for 203 00:09:24,120 --> 00:09:28,000 Speaker 2: all of it is expectations of outcome. You know, we 204 00:09:28,040 --> 00:09:30,000 Speaker 2: can't control because we can't control the future, we can't 205 00:09:30,040 --> 00:09:32,800 Speaker 2: control pandemics, we can't control because on the other side 206 00:09:32,800 --> 00:09:35,920 Speaker 2: of the tennis court and expectations of others. That for 207 00:09:36,080 --> 00:09:38,000 Speaker 2: me is one of the biggest distractions. So while the 208 00:09:38,040 --> 00:09:41,280 Speaker 2: whole country wanted her to win this ray and open 209 00:09:41,400 --> 00:09:43,920 Speaker 2: and for our own sense of identity and so forth, 210 00:09:44,800 --> 00:09:47,240 Speaker 2: she had no interest in paying attention to that narrative 211 00:09:47,240 --> 00:09:50,079 Speaker 2: because she couldn't control it. Right, So the only expectation 212 00:09:50,120 --> 00:09:53,040 Speaker 2: of ash is to focus on the things she can control, 213 00:09:53,200 --> 00:09:55,320 Speaker 2: and there's not many things you can control. There's her 214 00:09:55,360 --> 00:10:00,320 Speaker 2: intents or intention, her strategies, and tactics, which I think 215 00:10:00,400 --> 00:10:02,360 Speaker 2: between her and her coach Craig ties are they're the 216 00:10:02,400 --> 00:10:04,959 Speaker 2: best in the world. And her coach does not get 217 00:10:05,080 --> 00:10:07,959 Speaker 2: enough credit for the brilliant work he does in problems 218 00:10:07,960 --> 00:10:10,160 Speaker 2: solving with Ash in terms of you know how to 219 00:10:10,160 --> 00:10:13,120 Speaker 2: break down the strengths and weaknesses and competitors. And the 220 00:10:13,120 --> 00:10:15,560 Speaker 2: other thing Ash can control is her mindset, and then 221 00:10:16,000 --> 00:10:17,880 Speaker 2: he just goes back to find the words or the 222 00:10:17,920 --> 00:10:20,440 Speaker 2: mantras of the affirmations that reminds her of who she 223 00:10:20,600 --> 00:10:23,280 Speaker 2: is at her best, and she just tries to stay 224 00:10:23,320 --> 00:10:25,520 Speaker 2: there as long as she can, as long as she can, 225 00:10:25,600 --> 00:10:29,240 Speaker 2: and that creates that sense of clarity or presence or 226 00:10:29,280 --> 00:10:32,480 Speaker 2: calmness where the rest of us are super stressed and 227 00:10:32,520 --> 00:10:34,640 Speaker 2: anxious about the outcome. She could just stay in the 228 00:10:34,920 --> 00:10:35,480 Speaker 2: present moment. 229 00:10:35,720 --> 00:10:38,680 Speaker 3: Had been another guy who's bloody impressive, and I know 230 00:10:38,679 --> 00:10:40,440 Speaker 3: you don't work directly with this guy, but his name 231 00:10:40,520 --> 00:10:43,600 Speaker 3: is Rafael Nadal and last night he secured the most 232 00:10:43,600 --> 00:10:46,880 Speaker 3: Grand slams ever won by any player ever, and we 233 00:10:46,960 --> 00:10:50,480 Speaker 3: actually spoke. I know he's quite robotic cormos with a 234 00:10:50,480 --> 00:10:52,080 Speaker 3: few things he needs to do. It doesn't step on lines. 235 00:10:52,120 --> 00:10:53,840 Speaker 3: He make sure he drink bottles in the right position 236 00:10:53,880 --> 00:10:57,520 Speaker 3: every time. Would you make the assumption or would you 237 00:10:57,559 --> 00:10:59,920 Speaker 3: think that he's doing those things because those are things 238 00:10:59,920 --> 00:11:03,160 Speaker 3: he can control and that helps him when he's playing. 239 00:11:03,640 --> 00:11:06,080 Speaker 2: Yeah, absolutely, Yeah. Yeah. The one thing that Raffa and 240 00:11:06,120 --> 00:11:08,760 Speaker 2: Ash both taught the world on the weekend, he's two 241 00:11:08,760 --> 00:11:11,240 Speaker 2: sets to love down. Yeah, Ashes five, one down, and 242 00:11:11,280 --> 00:11:13,760 Speaker 2: the second set is to never first and foremost, to 243 00:11:13,880 --> 00:11:16,640 Speaker 2: never ever ever give up. Yeah, because it doesn't take 244 00:11:16,720 --> 00:11:19,120 Speaker 2: much to change, for everything to change in our lives 245 00:11:19,360 --> 00:11:22,280 Speaker 2: and if we can continue it. He's very similar to 246 00:11:22,320 --> 00:11:25,520 Speaker 2: Ash and says he knows that it's his decisions, not 247 00:11:25,679 --> 00:11:28,480 Speaker 2: the conditions, that determines his mindset and his attitude. So 248 00:11:28,480 --> 00:11:30,880 Speaker 2: he's two sets to love down. He just never ever 249 00:11:30,920 --> 00:11:34,079 Speaker 2: gives up as regards to his rituals that he does 250 00:11:34,120 --> 00:11:36,679 Speaker 2: around the tennis court. To your point, yeah, absolutely, that 251 00:11:36,840 --> 00:11:38,679 Speaker 2: just gives you a sense of certainty and the things 252 00:11:38,679 --> 00:11:41,720 Speaker 2: that he can control on the tennis court. You've still 253 00:11:41,720 --> 00:11:43,640 Speaker 2: got to be mindful that in times in life we 254 00:11:43,679 --> 00:11:46,520 Speaker 2: have to adapt so things don't go away and you 255 00:11:46,559 --> 00:11:49,200 Speaker 2: can't follow a certain ritual because it's outside of your control. 256 00:11:49,600 --> 00:11:54,920 Speaker 2: We still be able to embrace uncertainty and vulnerability, and 257 00:11:54,960 --> 00:11:56,480 Speaker 2: I think raf has done a very good job of that. 258 00:11:56,559 --> 00:11:58,240 Speaker 2: So a lot of people might laugh at some of 259 00:11:58,280 --> 00:12:02,559 Speaker 2: the rituals that actually creates this consistency of controllables that 260 00:12:02,760 --> 00:12:04,480 Speaker 2: just creates an element of confidence for right. 261 00:12:04,800 --> 00:12:06,920 Speaker 1: Yeah, I think that's a one offul message Ben and 262 00:12:06,960 --> 00:12:09,319 Speaker 1: you guys can get more of this on Ben's app 263 00:12:09,360 --> 00:12:11,600 Speaker 1: called Mojo Crow, which is available on the app stores, 264 00:12:11,920 --> 00:12:15,600 Speaker 1: which is this idea of embracing uncertainty. And you said 265 00:12:15,679 --> 00:12:17,600 Speaker 1: that just then about Raffa as well, about the fact 266 00:12:17,640 --> 00:12:20,600 Speaker 1: that like anything can happen at any time, and often 267 00:12:20,640 --> 00:12:22,400 Speaker 1: you know when things are really crap and things are 268 00:12:22,440 --> 00:12:24,679 Speaker 1: going awfully for you, if you just kind of like 269 00:12:25,040 --> 00:12:26,959 Speaker 1: if you just try and hold on to whatever you're doing. 270 00:12:27,400 --> 00:12:30,240 Speaker 1: But at the same time, there's a really interesting balance. 271 00:12:30,679 --> 00:12:33,520 Speaker 1: I think they're in terms of like surrendering to the 272 00:12:33,640 --> 00:12:37,320 Speaker 1: uncertainty lets you focus more, and that's like it's such 273 00:12:37,320 --> 00:12:40,920 Speaker 1: a paradox. But I know that I personally have got 274 00:12:40,920 --> 00:12:43,360 Speaker 1: a a lot of that through meditation, in terms of 275 00:12:43,400 --> 00:12:45,200 Speaker 1: like assume as actually just surrendered to the fact that 276 00:12:45,200 --> 00:12:47,679 Speaker 1: I'm actually not doing anything and I'm not controlling anything. 277 00:12:48,200 --> 00:12:52,400 Speaker 1: Everything becomes a lot easier for you. Which is the 278 00:12:52,440 --> 00:12:54,360 Speaker 1: great irony and the great paradox in all of this 279 00:12:54,440 --> 00:12:56,000 Speaker 1: and some of the stuff that I think that you're 280 00:12:56,040 --> 00:12:58,960 Speaker 1: threading beautifully with the app because in all of this 281 00:12:59,080 --> 00:13:01,840 Speaker 1: there's this great ten in between things that you're pushing towards, 282 00:13:01,840 --> 00:13:04,160 Speaker 1: things that you're aiming for, things that you're that you're 283 00:13:04,200 --> 00:13:07,560 Speaker 1: wanting but then not, but then also accepting that there's 284 00:13:07,559 --> 00:13:09,840 Speaker 1: a whole bunch of stuff within that that you can't control, 285 00:13:10,280 --> 00:13:13,520 Speaker 1: and learning that letting go. Finding the balance between letting 286 00:13:13,520 --> 00:13:16,280 Speaker 1: go and also aspiring, is that that's where the happiness 287 00:13:16,320 --> 00:13:18,480 Speaker 1: is somewhere in the middle there. But it is very 288 00:13:18,600 --> 00:13:19,600 Speaker 1: hard needle to threats. 289 00:13:20,440 --> 00:13:24,400 Speaker 2: Yes, spot on, and you're right. Unfortunately, these principles are counterintuitive. 290 00:13:24,760 --> 00:13:27,120 Speaker 2: And what you're just discussing is are just surrendering to 291 00:13:27,200 --> 00:13:30,000 Speaker 2: the now and letting go? No, No, what do you mean. 292 00:13:30,000 --> 00:13:31,800 Speaker 2: I want to control things to make being certain. I 293 00:13:31,840 --> 00:13:34,320 Speaker 2: want to be able to understand and follow it, and 294 00:13:34,400 --> 00:13:36,199 Speaker 2: you just can't. When you think about it. It's probably 295 00:13:36,200 --> 00:13:39,440 Speaker 2: the biggest our half of the pandemic that life itself 296 00:13:39,520 --> 00:13:43,720 Speaker 2: is uncertain, unpredictable, vulnerable, and you either accept that or 297 00:13:43,760 --> 00:13:47,760 Speaker 2: you suffer. So the power of acceptance you know, especially 298 00:13:47,800 --> 00:13:51,560 Speaker 2: accepting uncontrollables, but also accepting yourself, having a bit more 299 00:13:51,559 --> 00:13:53,640 Speaker 2: self compassion and not being so hard on yourself and 300 00:13:54,440 --> 00:13:58,480 Speaker 2: celebrate your imperfections rather than beerate them. And I think 301 00:13:58,559 --> 00:14:02,440 Speaker 2: what you're talking about in that surrendering is absolutely we 302 00:14:02,520 --> 00:14:05,480 Speaker 2: call it acceptance and it's almost to be frank, it's 303 00:14:05,480 --> 00:14:08,120 Speaker 2: just this serenity, prayer and accept the things you can't change, 304 00:14:08,120 --> 00:14:10,560 Speaker 2: so the courage to change the things you can, and 305 00:14:10,600 --> 00:14:12,600 Speaker 2: then just to have the wisdom to know the difference 306 00:14:13,040 --> 00:14:15,640 Speaker 2: and you can get that balance right of acceptance and 307 00:14:15,679 --> 00:14:19,120 Speaker 2: self compassion. Then the work that Hugh van Colomber does 308 00:14:19,160 --> 00:14:21,480 Speaker 2: so brilliantly, as you guys know about anyone, is just 309 00:14:21,880 --> 00:14:25,280 Speaker 2: having that sense of gratitude and appreciation for what you've 310 00:14:25,280 --> 00:14:27,640 Speaker 2: got rather than bitching and moaning for what you haven't got. 311 00:14:27,680 --> 00:14:31,760 Speaker 2: And I think Ash demonstrates so well on the tennis 312 00:14:31,800 --> 00:14:36,360 Speaker 2: cord the power of surrendering and accepting. So if she's 313 00:14:36,640 --> 00:14:38,400 Speaker 2: you know, five love up in the first set, it's 314 00:14:38,400 --> 00:14:40,200 Speaker 2: neither good nor bad. It just kind of is what 315 00:14:40,280 --> 00:14:42,320 Speaker 2: it is. And similarly, if she's five to one down 316 00:14:42,360 --> 00:14:45,040 Speaker 2: in the second set, it's neither good noo about either. 317 00:14:45,080 --> 00:14:46,400 Speaker 2: It just is what it is. But the rest of 318 00:14:46,480 --> 00:14:48,000 Speaker 2: us might be thinking, she's okay, we'll get ready for 319 00:14:48,080 --> 00:14:50,640 Speaker 2: the third set. She's going, She's just focused on no 320 00:14:50,720 --> 00:14:53,440 Speaker 2: one point is more important than the next. So I'm 321 00:14:53,440 --> 00:14:55,560 Speaker 2: going to reset and keep going and keep going and 322 00:14:55,640 --> 00:14:58,320 Speaker 2: keep going and find a way. And then you know, 323 00:14:58,320 --> 00:15:01,320 Speaker 2: it starts to put pressure on the other, the other 324 00:15:01,360 --> 00:15:03,400 Speaker 2: athlete in terms the scoreboard pressure, and all of a sudden, 325 00:15:03,560 --> 00:15:06,560 Speaker 2: it's extraordinary. If you're not in control of your emotions, 326 00:15:06,600 --> 00:15:10,200 Speaker 2: you'll let the conditions determine your mindset. Whereas Ash it's 327 00:15:10,240 --> 00:15:13,120 Speaker 2: her decisions, not the conditions that determine their mindset. And 328 00:15:13,320 --> 00:15:16,000 Speaker 2: it's a skill, and to her credit, she's done an 329 00:15:16,200 --> 00:15:19,960 Speaker 2: enormous amount of work. It does, and most of us 330 00:15:20,000 --> 00:15:21,440 Speaker 2: don't want to do that. We put the mask on, 331 00:15:21,480 --> 00:15:25,080 Speaker 2: we put the armor on for self preservation purposes, focusing 332 00:15:25,120 --> 00:15:29,080 Speaker 2: on achievement and recognition. And that's probably the biggest travesty 333 00:15:29,120 --> 00:15:32,880 Speaker 2: today is obsession with you know, being famous or being rich, 334 00:15:33,720 --> 00:15:36,080 Speaker 2: you know, which is basically saying, well, someone please acknowledge 335 00:15:36,120 --> 00:15:39,120 Speaker 2: me or you know, identify with me, as opposed to 336 00:15:39,480 --> 00:15:41,880 Speaker 2: acknowledging ourselves and being able to ask to look at 337 00:15:41,880 --> 00:15:44,080 Speaker 2: herself in the meriting and kind of say, look, I 338 00:15:44,120 --> 00:15:45,880 Speaker 2: don't give a shit what anyone thinks about me, but 339 00:15:45,960 --> 00:15:48,720 Speaker 2: I care about them, And she focuses more on what 340 00:15:48,760 --> 00:15:51,720 Speaker 2: she thinks about herself, you know what she says to herself. 341 00:15:51,760 --> 00:15:53,160 Speaker 2: And I think if we can spend more time with 342 00:15:53,200 --> 00:15:57,680 Speaker 2: that self compassion and self acceptance, that ironically and exactly 343 00:15:57,680 --> 00:16:01,240 Speaker 2: what you said, counterintuitively gives us the confidence to put 344 00:16:01,320 --> 00:16:03,920 Speaker 2: these goals and greens out of the universe without any 345 00:16:04,040 --> 00:16:08,000 Speaker 2: expectations or guarantees that will actually achieve them. And then 346 00:16:08,040 --> 00:16:13,840 Speaker 2: from that place, life just becomes this beautiful adventure or 347 00:16:13,880 --> 00:16:16,600 Speaker 2: experiment or work in progress where you're allowed to be imperfect, 348 00:16:16,680 --> 00:16:19,120 Speaker 2: you know, to screw it up and that's okay, and 349 00:16:19,960 --> 00:16:21,640 Speaker 2: have as much fun as you can along the way. 350 00:16:22,000 --> 00:16:23,400 Speaker 1: Yeah as well, and it flows. 351 00:16:23,880 --> 00:16:25,160 Speaker 3: Hell, I can talk to you all day. 352 00:16:25,200 --> 00:16:28,760 Speaker 1: It's the difference between the aspiring and the expecting. It's 353 00:16:28,760 --> 00:16:30,640 Speaker 1: funny what you said before, you were talking about the 354 00:16:30,680 --> 00:16:33,560 Speaker 1: thoughts and applying them to things, and like you know 355 00:16:33,640 --> 00:16:35,960 Speaker 1: that whether she's five love down or whether she's one 356 00:16:36,040 --> 00:16:38,320 Speaker 1: five up, or whether well in the inverse about where 357 00:16:38,320 --> 00:16:40,960 Speaker 1: she's one five down or five love up, and whether 358 00:16:41,000 --> 00:16:43,120 Speaker 1: she thinks that's bad. I thinks that's good. I think 359 00:16:43,680 --> 00:16:46,320 Speaker 1: Shakespeare a long time ago got us there. There's a 360 00:16:46,360 --> 00:16:48,720 Speaker 1: quote where it's like nothing's good or bad, that thinking 361 00:16:48,760 --> 00:16:53,680 Speaker 1: makes it so. And that's exactly the thing that's hard 362 00:16:53,680 --> 00:16:55,120 Speaker 1: to wrap your head around it because we're so used 363 00:16:55,160 --> 00:16:57,160 Speaker 1: to applying a judgment or a brand or a label 364 00:16:57,160 --> 00:16:59,000 Speaker 1: to something that's happening to us, as opposed to just 365 00:16:59,040 --> 00:17:00,440 Speaker 1: appreciating it for what it is. 366 00:17:01,120 --> 00:17:04,160 Speaker 2: And that's one of the biggest distractions today is this 367 00:17:04,880 --> 00:17:09,959 Speaker 2: ridiculous interference and everyone's got these opinions and these judgments 368 00:17:10,000 --> 00:17:13,240 Speaker 2: and comparing ourselves against each other and having a pre 369 00:17:13,280 --> 00:17:16,119 Speaker 2: predicated on negativity that you know, this is bad or 370 00:17:16,119 --> 00:17:18,240 Speaker 2: she's bad, or he's bad, and when you think about it, 371 00:17:18,240 --> 00:17:21,440 Speaker 2: nothing is ever that good or that bad. Yeah, Shakespeare said, 372 00:17:21,440 --> 00:17:23,240 Speaker 2: thinking makes it so. So if you can just accept 373 00:17:23,280 --> 00:17:26,520 Speaker 2: it and then just continue on your path of the 374 00:17:26,560 --> 00:17:30,000 Speaker 2: goals and dreams and tell your story from I guess 375 00:17:30,000 --> 00:17:32,280 Speaker 2: a more positive affirmation base from me in a fan 376 00:17:32,440 --> 00:17:35,840 Speaker 2: rather than you in a critic, and just identify what 377 00:17:35,880 --> 00:17:39,240 Speaker 2: our flavors of distraction are. But at the moment today 378 00:17:39,320 --> 00:17:43,920 Speaker 2: we're living in that ridiculous judgment comparing society. That's bringing 379 00:17:43,960 --> 00:17:46,560 Speaker 2: a lot of people down and distracting them. And you know, 380 00:17:47,200 --> 00:17:49,239 Speaker 2: attaching ourself worth whether we win and lose a game 381 00:17:49,280 --> 00:17:51,000 Speaker 2: of tennis is one of those things as well. I 382 00:17:51,080 --> 00:17:54,040 Speaker 2: think Ash and Rappa and others are doing a beautiful 383 00:17:54,080 --> 00:17:57,240 Speaker 2: job of trying to communicate there's a better way, a 384 00:17:57,320 --> 00:18:00,800 Speaker 2: simple way that and they're still not gonna have confidence 385 00:18:00,800 --> 00:18:03,000 Speaker 2: on the field, but confidence in yourself and kind of 386 00:18:03,040 --> 00:18:05,200 Speaker 2: get that balance between achievement and fulfillment. 387 00:18:05,760 --> 00:18:08,680 Speaker 3: Bloody well. Then Shakespeare also said you should have a 388 00:18:08,760 --> 00:18:11,359 Speaker 3: number of beers after winning the Australian Open. Are your 389 00:18:11,400 --> 00:18:12,440 Speaker 3: nursing to hangover today? 390 00:18:12,520 --> 00:18:13,040 Speaker 1: Mate? 391 00:18:13,800 --> 00:18:16,320 Speaker 2: I didn't know. I didn't know. Shakespeare said that it's a. 392 00:18:16,280 --> 00:18:18,720 Speaker 3: Little it's a little note, but she was in a Hamlet. 393 00:18:20,119 --> 00:18:22,639 Speaker 2: As many books as he did. A Yeah, we started 394 00:18:22,680 --> 00:18:27,920 Speaker 2: Thursday night unfortunately after Dylan's Dylant Dylan Orcott who doesn't 395 00:18:27,920 --> 00:18:28,600 Speaker 2: need any help and. 396 00:18:30,320 --> 00:18:34,240 Speaker 1: He enjoys himself to catch up with Dylan, he doesn't 397 00:18:34,240 --> 00:18:36,440 Speaker 1: need any help on that front. 398 00:18:36,560 --> 00:18:39,160 Speaker 2: And then obviously Saturday night was a very very late 399 00:18:39,280 --> 00:18:41,240 Speaker 2: night as well because I had to do a whole 400 00:18:41,240 --> 00:18:44,560 Speaker 2: lot of media called afterwards. So yeah, we definitely. We 401 00:18:44,680 --> 00:18:48,680 Speaker 2: definitely celebrated pretty well. So I had a brocket panned 402 00:18:48,720 --> 00:18:52,359 Speaker 2: old sandwich for breakfast this morning, early to bed tonight. 403 00:18:52,520 --> 00:18:54,600 Speaker 1: Sounds good, mate, Well, look sounds like about it. Even 404 00:18:55,000 --> 00:18:56,720 Speaker 1: your buddy deserved it. Mate. It's been a hell of 405 00:18:56,720 --> 00:18:59,920 Speaker 1: a tournament. I think all of Australia deserved an Aussie winner, 406 00:19:00,240 --> 00:19:04,080 Speaker 1: let alone one as gracious as Ash Barty. What a champion. 407 00:19:04,240 --> 00:19:07,080 Speaker 1: Congratulations and all your work with her. Congratulations on all 408 00:19:07,119 --> 00:19:07,840 Speaker 1: your work full stop. 409 00:19:07,840 --> 00:19:08,000 Speaker 2: Mate. 410 00:19:08,040 --> 00:19:10,200 Speaker 1: Sounds like you're doing some wonderful things, really shaking things 411 00:19:10,240 --> 00:19:13,720 Speaker 1: up in that space. It's honestly really fulfilling to listen to. 412 00:19:13,800 --> 00:19:16,560 Speaker 1: I know me personally, just just listening to your talks 413 00:19:16,560 --> 00:19:18,840 Speaker 1: really changed the way I think about myself. So thank 414 00:19:18,880 --> 00:19:20,720 Speaker 1: you for that. If you want to get more of Ben, 415 00:19:20,800 --> 00:19:26,160 Speaker 1: he's got a mindset coaching app called Mojo Crow Crow Crowe. 416 00:19:26,800 --> 00:19:29,200 Speaker 1: Go and check it out as it been a pleasure. Ben. 417 00:19:29,240 --> 00:19:31,000 Speaker 1: Thank you so much for coming on the show, mate. 418 00:19:31,320 --> 00:19:33,600 Speaker 2: Yeah, thanks guys, and keep doing amazing whork you're doing 419 00:19:33,600 --> 00:19:37,160 Speaker 2: this space as well. It's really really important and by God, 420 00:19:37,160 --> 00:19:38,919 Speaker 2: the world needs it, so yeah, keep going with your 421 00:19:38,960 --> 00:19:39,840 Speaker 2: journey as well. 422 00:19:39,840 --> 00:19:40,879 Speaker 1: Thanks, thanks so much. 423 00:19:40,920 --> 00:19:41,320 Speaker 2: For coming on. 424 00:19:41,359 --> 00:19:42,960 Speaker 1: Ben really appreciate it much. Here more of 425 00:19:43,000 --> 00:19:46,320 Speaker 3: The boys on the full podcast, just scroll up.