1 00:00:02,720 --> 00:00:05,040 Speaker 1: My name is Lily Maddon and I'm a proud Arunda 2 00:00:05,280 --> 00:00:10,040 Speaker 1: Bungelung calcotton woman from Gadighl Country. The Daily oz acknowledges 3 00:00:10,119 --> 00:00:12,320 Speaker 1: that this podcast is recorded on the lands of the 4 00:00:12,320 --> 00:00:15,880 Speaker 1: Gadighl people and pays respect to all Aboriginal and Torres 5 00:00:15,920 --> 00:00:18,799 Speaker 1: Strait Island and nations. We pay our respects to the 6 00:00:18,840 --> 00:00:21,599 Speaker 1: first peoples of these countries, both past and present. 7 00:00:29,560 --> 00:00:32,240 Speaker 2: Good morning and welcome to the Daily os. It's Monday, 8 00:00:32,280 --> 00:00:36,159 Speaker 2: the twenty ninth of January. I'm Zara, I'm Saram. Vapes 9 00:00:36,200 --> 00:00:39,840 Speaker 2: are absolutely everywhere at the beach, they're at the pub, 10 00:00:40,000 --> 00:00:43,280 Speaker 2: the park. They might actually be in your hand right now. 11 00:00:43,840 --> 00:00:46,920 Speaker 2: But when it comes to vaping in Australia, everything is 12 00:00:46,920 --> 00:00:48,800 Speaker 2: about to change, and so we thought it was a 13 00:00:48,840 --> 00:00:51,879 Speaker 2: good time to stop and reflect and to look at 14 00:00:51,920 --> 00:00:54,840 Speaker 2: how we got here and what's happening next with vapes. 15 00:00:55,560 --> 00:00:59,320 Speaker 2: TDA has been working on a three part investigation into 16 00:00:59,400 --> 00:01:02,760 Speaker 2: vaping in in Australia, the laws, the loopholes and what 17 00:01:02,800 --> 00:01:06,120 Speaker 2: they're doing to our munds. In today's episode, we're going 18 00:01:06,200 --> 00:01:09,440 Speaker 2: to go with TDA podcast producer Ninakopple from the local 19 00:01:09,440 --> 00:01:12,360 Speaker 2: Tobacconist to the lab to find out what's actually in 20 00:01:12,480 --> 00:01:15,280 Speaker 2: a vape before we get there, though, Sam what's making 21 00:01:15,319 --> 00:01:16,279 Speaker 2: headlines this morning. 22 00:01:17,600 --> 00:01:21,360 Speaker 3: Over the weekend, Australia joined other nations in pausing funding 23 00:01:21,480 --> 00:01:25,679 Speaker 3: to the UN's Refugee Agency for Palestinians of allegations some 24 00:01:25,840 --> 00:01:28,399 Speaker 3: members of its staff were involved in the seventh of 25 00:01:28,400 --> 00:01:32,360 Speaker 3: October attack by Hamas on Israel. In a statement, Foreign 26 00:01:32,400 --> 00:01:35,640 Speaker 3: Minister Penny Wong said Australia is deeply concerned by the 27 00:01:35,680 --> 00:01:40,120 Speaker 3: allegations and is consulting with international partners. The UN has 28 00:01:40,200 --> 00:01:43,920 Speaker 3: launched an independent investigation into the claims and several workers 29 00:01:44,000 --> 00:01:46,920 Speaker 3: have been fired. In a statement yesterday, the Commissioner General 30 00:01:46,959 --> 00:01:50,400 Speaker 3: of the agency said it would be immensely irresponsible to 31 00:01:50,480 --> 00:01:53,720 Speaker 3: sanction an agency and in an entire community it serves, 32 00:01:54,000 --> 00:01:58,040 Speaker 3: because of allegations of criminal acts against some individuals, especially 33 00:01:58,080 --> 00:02:01,240 Speaker 3: at a time of war, displacement and political crises in 34 00:02:01,280 --> 00:02:01,800 Speaker 3: the region. 35 00:02:03,400 --> 00:02:06,600 Speaker 2: On Friday, the International Court of Justice, which is known 36 00:02:06,600 --> 00:02:10,400 Speaker 2: as the ICJ, handed down a provisional ruling after South 37 00:02:10,440 --> 00:02:14,480 Speaker 2: Africa accused Israel of carrying out a genocide of Palestinians 38 00:02:14,480 --> 00:02:18,360 Speaker 2: in Gaza. The ICJ ordered Israel to take all measures 39 00:02:18,400 --> 00:02:21,079 Speaker 2: to limit deaths in Gaza, but the court did not 40 00:02:21,360 --> 00:02:24,480 Speaker 2: order a cease fire. The South African government welcomed to 41 00:02:24,520 --> 00:02:27,520 Speaker 2: the court's finding and said it expects Israel to accept 42 00:02:27,520 --> 00:02:31,080 Speaker 2: the measures, while the Israeli government called the accusations a 43 00:02:31,160 --> 00:02:34,720 Speaker 2: quote vile attempt to deny a country's fundamental right to 44 00:02:34,720 --> 00:02:38,080 Speaker 2: defend itself. Israel must report back to the court on 45 00:02:38,120 --> 00:02:39,520 Speaker 2: its compliance within a month. 46 00:02:41,720 --> 00:02:44,320 Speaker 3: The US state of Alabama has carried out the country's 47 00:02:44,320 --> 00:02:49,160 Speaker 3: first execution using nitrogen gas. Human rights experts had warned 48 00:02:49,200 --> 00:02:53,280 Speaker 3: against the method, which involves slowly depriving an inmate of oxygen. 49 00:02:53,520 --> 00:02:56,680 Speaker 3: Kenneth Eugene Smith was convicted of murder and sentenced to 50 00:02:56,720 --> 00:02:59,800 Speaker 3: death in nineteen ninety six. He had been subject to 51 00:02:59,800 --> 00:03:03,640 Speaker 3: a previous failed execution attempt after prison staff couldn't access 52 00:03:03,680 --> 00:03:07,600 Speaker 3: his veins to administer a lethal injection. The US Supreme 53 00:03:07,639 --> 00:03:11,240 Speaker 3: Court rejected multiple requests to delay or stop his execution 54 00:03:11,480 --> 00:03:15,639 Speaker 3: last week. Smith was pronounced dead on Thursday night local time. 55 00:03:16,680 --> 00:03:19,960 Speaker 2: And Today's Good News. A gustav climped painting, thought to 56 00:03:20,000 --> 00:03:22,240 Speaker 2: have been lost for the last one hundred years, has 57 00:03:22,280 --> 00:03:25,640 Speaker 2: been found in Austria. The portrait is believed to be 58 00:03:25,680 --> 00:03:28,239 Speaker 2: one of the last works climped painted. According to the 59 00:03:28,280 --> 00:03:31,480 Speaker 2: auction house who rediscovered the piece, the painting will be 60 00:03:31,520 --> 00:03:35,120 Speaker 2: exhibited internationally before being auctioned off later this year, where 61 00:03:35,360 --> 00:03:38,440 Speaker 2: it's expected to sell for as much as fifty million euros. 62 00:03:45,280 --> 00:03:51,280 Speaker 4: The legend goes like this, A pharmacist in China, Homlik 63 00:03:51,680 --> 00:03:56,040 Speaker 4: tries to quit smoking. By some accounts, he's smoking up 64 00:03:56,080 --> 00:04:00,200 Speaker 4: to three packs a day, so it isn't easy. One night, 65 00:04:00,400 --> 00:04:02,920 Speaker 4: he falls asleep with a patch on and has a 66 00:04:03,000 --> 00:04:09,800 Speaker 4: nicotine fueled nightmare. He's in the ocean and he's about 67 00:04:09,800 --> 00:04:13,280 Speaker 4: to drown when a wave turns into a giant cloud 68 00:04:13,320 --> 00:04:21,919 Speaker 4: of feed up. Homelick wakes up and sets out to 69 00:04:22,000 --> 00:04:26,120 Speaker 4: invent a device that will help him quit smoking, and 70 00:04:26,160 --> 00:04:29,000 Speaker 4: he goes on to develop the first vape to have 71 00:04:29,120 --> 00:04:30,839 Speaker 4: mass commercial success. 72 00:04:31,680 --> 00:04:33,800 Speaker 1: Bluebery cherry, crumber, it and grit. 73 00:04:33,960 --> 00:04:35,920 Speaker 5: You're going to push it with your tongue and you're 74 00:04:35,960 --> 00:04:36,560 Speaker 5: in a second back. 75 00:04:36,640 --> 00:04:37,599 Speaker 6: Do you have an a vape? 76 00:04:37,640 --> 00:04:38,120 Speaker 7: By chance? 77 00:04:38,400 --> 00:04:38,599 Speaker 5: Yeah? 78 00:04:38,720 --> 00:04:40,880 Speaker 6: How long have you vabed? A good six years? 79 00:04:40,960 --> 00:04:41,800 Speaker 8: Well, give me my beat. 80 00:04:41,880 --> 00:04:45,960 Speaker 2: I remember the first time I vaped, I was fucking gone. 81 00:04:46,520 --> 00:04:50,680 Speaker 4: Vapes are everywhere, but things are about to change. No 82 00:04:50,800 --> 00:04:54,839 Speaker 4: more bubblegum flavors. No more pink unicorns, No more vapes 83 00:04:54,839 --> 00:04:58,200 Speaker 4: deliberately disguised as highlighter pins for kids to be able 84 00:04:58,200 --> 00:05:01,240 Speaker 4: to hide them in their pencil cases. In this series, 85 00:05:01,400 --> 00:05:04,640 Speaker 4: we're gonna look at the forces at play working against 86 00:05:04,680 --> 00:05:06,760 Speaker 4: the government's attempts to regulate vaping. 87 00:05:07,160 --> 00:05:09,440 Speaker 8: I'll keep fighting. I'll fight every tooth in that way. 88 00:05:09,480 --> 00:05:09,840 Speaker 4: I can't. 89 00:05:09,920 --> 00:05:11,720 Speaker 9: They can smell out a little pole and they push 90 00:05:11,720 --> 00:05:13,359 Speaker 9: it open and make it into a door that they 91 00:05:13,400 --> 00:05:14,320 Speaker 9: can walz right through. 92 00:05:14,400 --> 00:05:17,840 Speaker 4: But before you can understand what this regulation is and 93 00:05:17,960 --> 00:05:20,760 Speaker 4: what it'll mean, you have to understand what a vape 94 00:05:20,800 --> 00:05:24,640 Speaker 4: actually is and what vapes do to our health. From 95 00:05:24,680 --> 00:05:28,200 Speaker 4: the Daily Odds, this is Understanding Vapes, Episode one. 96 00:05:28,440 --> 00:05:39,120 Speaker 6: What's in a vape? I? Do you have a vapeless Yeah? 97 00:05:39,160 --> 00:05:40,880 Speaker 8: I do, but I don't have many beeps. 98 00:05:40,720 --> 00:05:44,520 Speaker 4: Like okay al and that a random tobacconist on a 99 00:05:44,560 --> 00:05:45,320 Speaker 4: Tuesday morning? 100 00:05:45,560 --> 00:05:46,240 Speaker 6: Which ones you. 101 00:05:46,200 --> 00:05:49,800 Speaker 8: Have black blue res. 102 00:05:51,520 --> 00:05:51,920 Speaker 4: In Kent? 103 00:05:52,960 --> 00:05:59,240 Speaker 6: Oh? Maybe cinnamon? Please yo, pa, thank you. 104 00:05:59,720 --> 00:06:02,960 Speaker 4: It's been illegal to buy a nicotine vape in Australia 105 00:06:03,160 --> 00:06:06,720 Speaker 4: without a prescription for years, but the one I buy 106 00:06:07,040 --> 00:06:10,120 Speaker 4: doesn't actually say it has nicotine in it, Thanks so much. 107 00:06:10,200 --> 00:06:11,880 Speaker 4: The only way to know for sure what's in a 108 00:06:11,960 --> 00:06:13,880 Speaker 4: vape is to get it tested in a lab. 109 00:06:14,960 --> 00:06:17,200 Speaker 7: Hello, Hias, thanks so much for having me. 110 00:06:17,320 --> 00:06:20,080 Speaker 6: I've actually brought a vape that I was hoping. 111 00:06:20,360 --> 00:06:23,440 Speaker 7: Today testing full long chemical analysis who we normally do. 112 00:06:23,520 --> 00:06:24,919 Speaker 4: Yeah, I want to know what's in it? Like, is 113 00:06:24,920 --> 00:06:26,640 Speaker 4: that nicotine in it? Is there anything else we need 114 00:06:26,720 --> 00:06:27,279 Speaker 4: to be worried about? 115 00:06:27,320 --> 00:06:27,640 Speaker 6: All right? 116 00:06:27,680 --> 00:06:29,279 Speaker 7: Sure, So the first thing we need to do is 117 00:06:29,480 --> 00:06:30,640 Speaker 7: uben the device. 118 00:06:30,839 --> 00:06:34,520 Speaker 4: The University of Woollongong lab has these big piles of 119 00:06:34,600 --> 00:06:37,840 Speaker 4: colorful vapes in an assortment of flavors, and as they 120 00:06:37,880 --> 00:06:41,440 Speaker 4: break vapes apart, you get wafts of these sense diffusing 121 00:06:41,480 --> 00:06:42,160 Speaker 4: across the room. 122 00:06:42,200 --> 00:06:43,200 Speaker 6: I think I can smell it. 123 00:06:43,360 --> 00:06:45,080 Speaker 7: Yes, that's the cinnamon. 124 00:06:45,520 --> 00:06:49,240 Speaker 4: Doctor Selinkkelso is doing our analysis for us. Once she 125 00:06:49,320 --> 00:06:51,719 Speaker 4: extracts the liquid from the vape, she puts it in 126 00:06:51,760 --> 00:06:52,720 Speaker 4: a machine for testing. 127 00:06:53,960 --> 00:06:56,200 Speaker 7: So let's put dis sample on and then start the analysis. 128 00:06:56,600 --> 00:06:58,960 Speaker 4: When we have the results, her colleague talks us through 129 00:06:59,000 --> 00:06:59,839 Speaker 4: what they found. 130 00:07:00,080 --> 00:07:02,080 Speaker 6: With a cinnamon, like, what kind of level is that? 131 00:07:02,320 --> 00:07:04,600 Speaker 8: Yeah, so that's obviously reasonably low concentration. 132 00:07:04,800 --> 00:07:07,599 Speaker 4: This is doctor Jodie Moler, Senior lecturer in the School 133 00:07:07,600 --> 00:07:09,840 Speaker 4: of Chemistry and Molecular Bioscience. 134 00:07:09,880 --> 00:07:12,080 Speaker 8: But cinematot is band so it's not allowed to be 135 00:07:12,080 --> 00:07:13,320 Speaker 8: there in any concentration. 136 00:07:13,560 --> 00:07:13,760 Speaker 6: Right. 137 00:07:14,000 --> 00:07:18,000 Speaker 4: Cinemelde Hyde, the chemical substance that makes up the cinnamon flavor, 138 00:07:18,400 --> 00:07:21,360 Speaker 4: has been banned from vapes because we have evidence that 139 00:07:21,440 --> 00:07:23,400 Speaker 4: inhaling it can cause health issues. 140 00:07:23,480 --> 00:07:24,680 Speaker 6: What else are you noticing from this? 141 00:07:24,920 --> 00:07:28,679 Speaker 8: Obviously, the really high concentration of nicotine is obviously a standout. 142 00:07:28,680 --> 00:07:31,520 Speaker 8: So fifty milligrams per mile, huge peak. 143 00:07:31,760 --> 00:07:35,000 Speaker 4: That's the equivalent of consuming the nicotine in about twenty 144 00:07:35,040 --> 00:07:38,720 Speaker 4: five to fifty cigarettes. And remember this vape didn't actually 145 00:07:38,760 --> 00:07:41,480 Speaker 4: say it has nicotine on the packaging. 146 00:07:41,000 --> 00:07:43,679 Speaker 8: So people are you know, if they're regularly vaping these, 147 00:07:44,000 --> 00:07:45,920 Speaker 8: they're going to be very likely to develop a dependence 148 00:07:45,920 --> 00:07:46,600 Speaker 8: on nicotine. 149 00:07:46,680 --> 00:07:46,880 Speaker 6: Right. 150 00:07:47,000 --> 00:07:49,000 Speaker 8: The other one I would say is the WS twenty three, 151 00:07:49,080 --> 00:07:51,600 Speaker 8: which is our other ginormous peak. So the WS twenty 152 00:07:51,600 --> 00:07:52,720 Speaker 8: three is our cooling agent. 153 00:07:53,000 --> 00:07:56,280 Speaker 4: Lots of disposable vapes have some form of cooling agent. 154 00:07:56,880 --> 00:07:59,640 Speaker 4: This can be added to address the throat irritation that 155 00:07:59,720 --> 00:08:04,200 Speaker 4: can from inhaling high quantities of nicotine, But coolants themselves 156 00:08:04,240 --> 00:08:05,640 Speaker 4: can also cause irritation. 157 00:08:05,960 --> 00:08:08,800 Speaker 8: In some of our samples. Recently, we found ethylene glacol, 158 00:08:09,120 --> 00:08:11,840 Speaker 8: which is the main component in antifreeze, and we found 159 00:08:11,880 --> 00:08:15,600 Speaker 8: it at reasonably high concentrations. So the highest concentration was 160 00:08:15,640 --> 00:08:20,040 Speaker 8: about eighty times higher than the concentration that is predicted 161 00:08:20,080 --> 00:08:23,360 Speaker 8: to cause unbearable respiratory discomfort. And that was in a 162 00:08:23,400 --> 00:08:25,840 Speaker 8: sample that was taken off a school kid. So we 163 00:08:25,960 --> 00:08:29,640 Speaker 8: don't know how that school child was even tolerating vaping 164 00:08:29,720 --> 00:08:34,880 Speaker 8: that particular sample. When the concentrations of a hugely irritating 165 00:08:34,880 --> 00:08:35,400 Speaker 8: compound with. 166 00:08:35,440 --> 00:08:39,760 Speaker 4: That high anti freezers like what used for Fridgers air conditioning. 167 00:08:39,360 --> 00:08:43,040 Speaker 8: Yeah, exactly right, and we know that bioral ingestion anti 168 00:08:43,040 --> 00:08:44,679 Speaker 8: freeze is extremely toxic. 169 00:08:46,559 --> 00:08:48,560 Speaker 4: Right, So we've got the nicotine and the cinnamon flavoring 170 00:08:48,600 --> 00:08:50,680 Speaker 4: are the ones that would be not allowed. And then 171 00:08:50,840 --> 00:08:52,720 Speaker 4: we've got that coolut, which he said at that level 172 00:08:52,760 --> 00:08:55,240 Speaker 4: could be potentially dangerous, be absolutely concerning. 173 00:08:55,360 --> 00:08:57,480 Speaker 8: Yeah, that's correct. And then obviously there's the things we 174 00:08:57,520 --> 00:09:00,000 Speaker 8: can't see here because he were on the analyzing the liquid. 175 00:09:00,280 --> 00:09:02,680 Speaker 8: We didn't actually generate a vapor and analyze. 176 00:09:02,360 --> 00:09:04,880 Speaker 6: The vapor, right, So there's potential dangers in the vapor. 177 00:09:05,000 --> 00:09:08,480 Speaker 4: There's also that coil metal exactly what you're telling me about. 178 00:09:08,559 --> 00:09:09,120 Speaker 6: Yeah, that's right. 179 00:09:09,120 --> 00:09:10,760 Speaker 8: So we also get to see what these things look 180 00:09:10,880 --> 00:09:12,440 Speaker 8: like inside after they've been. 181 00:09:12,440 --> 00:09:14,040 Speaker 6: Used, and what do they look like in side. 182 00:09:14,240 --> 00:09:16,160 Speaker 8: So what we tend to see is a large amount 183 00:09:16,200 --> 00:09:17,440 Speaker 8: of scorching. 184 00:09:17,000 --> 00:09:17,720 Speaker 6: On the coil. 185 00:09:19,480 --> 00:09:22,400 Speaker 4: The coils a bit of metal wire that works to 186 00:09:22,480 --> 00:09:24,840 Speaker 4: heat up the liquid in your vape and turn it 187 00:09:24,920 --> 00:09:28,400 Speaker 4: into vapor. When a disposable vape is brand new, like 188 00:09:28,480 --> 00:09:30,880 Speaker 4: the one I brought to Wollongong, it's just a piece 189 00:09:30,920 --> 00:09:34,320 Speaker 4: of clean metal wrapped around some material which is soaked 190 00:09:34,360 --> 00:09:37,120 Speaker 4: in the vape juice. But after some time things can 191 00:09:37,200 --> 00:09:38,120 Speaker 4: look a bit different. 192 00:09:38,200 --> 00:09:39,959 Speaker 8: So when we open them up, we get quite a 193 00:09:40,000 --> 00:09:42,600 Speaker 8: lot of blackening of the material. 194 00:09:43,200 --> 00:09:46,400 Speaker 4: If you think about this, it makes sense. Disposable vapes 195 00:09:46,400 --> 00:09:48,880 Speaker 4: are only supposed to be good for a certain number 196 00:09:48,880 --> 00:09:51,760 Speaker 4: of puffs, but if you have limited funds, you might 197 00:09:51,800 --> 00:09:53,680 Speaker 4: try to make it last longer so you don't have 198 00:09:53,760 --> 00:09:54,480 Speaker 4: to buy another one. 199 00:09:54,559 --> 00:09:56,880 Speaker 8: Sometimes we actually see the coil is starting to degrade. 200 00:09:57,080 --> 00:09:57,840 Speaker 6: Is that dangerous? 201 00:09:58,120 --> 00:10:00,200 Speaker 8: Absolutely? So we know that there's some heavy metal and 202 00:10:00,240 --> 00:10:02,440 Speaker 8: some other substances that make up the constitution of these 203 00:10:02,480 --> 00:10:04,640 Speaker 8: coils and we don't want to see people inhaling those. 204 00:10:05,000 --> 00:10:08,160 Speaker 4: It's worth mentioning here that in reusable vapes this is 205 00:10:08,240 --> 00:10:11,120 Speaker 4: less of a concern because people would be replacing their 206 00:10:11,160 --> 00:10:15,000 Speaker 4: coils more regularly. But the Labin Woongong concentrates on these 207 00:10:15,040 --> 00:10:19,760 Speaker 4: disposable vapes because they're the popular ones, especially in Australian schools. 208 00:10:20,120 --> 00:10:22,520 Speaker 4: The question is what are these vapes and all the 209 00:10:22,600 --> 00:10:26,839 Speaker 4: chemicals and potential metals actually doing to young people's health. 210 00:10:28,280 --> 00:10:30,840 Speaker 4: You may have come across videos like this on TikTok. 211 00:10:31,120 --> 00:10:34,800 Speaker 1: I am literally chilling in a hospital. 212 00:10:35,480 --> 00:10:39,080 Speaker 2: Because I have a vping. 213 00:10:38,880 --> 00:10:40,040 Speaker 1: Related lung intery. 214 00:10:41,120 --> 00:10:47,600 Speaker 5: Vaping put me in the hospital, like not breathing. 215 00:10:46,880 --> 00:10:50,320 Speaker 4: It's really scary. 216 00:10:51,240 --> 00:10:54,520 Speaker 10: My heart is a lot smaller than the average twenty 217 00:10:54,520 --> 00:10:57,280 Speaker 10: one year old and it's because of vaping. 218 00:10:58,559 --> 00:11:02,080 Speaker 4: I want to understand how commonly people are being hospitalized 219 00:11:02,080 --> 00:11:04,800 Speaker 4: for health issues related to vaping in Australia. 220 00:11:05,480 --> 00:11:08,880 Speaker 10: So we put in freedom of information requests for Queensland, 221 00:11:09,000 --> 00:11:10,280 Speaker 10: Victoria and New South Wales. 222 00:11:10,400 --> 00:11:12,640 Speaker 4: And I was just asking the government to release whatever 223 00:11:12,679 --> 00:11:13,880 Speaker 4: information they have to us. 224 00:11:14,040 --> 00:11:14,839 Speaker 8: That's correct. Yes. 225 00:11:15,000 --> 00:11:17,720 Speaker 4: Daniel Lesto is a journalist at The Daily Os and 226 00:11:17,760 --> 00:11:19,559 Speaker 4: he often does stories on vaping. 227 00:11:19,320 --> 00:11:22,079 Speaker 10: In Queensland has been seventy nine total hospitalizations over the 228 00:11:22,160 --> 00:11:24,840 Speaker 10: last four years. So in Victoria there's been forty five 229 00:11:24,960 --> 00:11:27,240 Speaker 10: total hospitalizations. 230 00:11:26,440 --> 00:11:27,960 Speaker 6: So that's a bit lower than Queensland. 231 00:11:28,120 --> 00:11:29,480 Speaker 10: It is a bit lower, yes, and one of the 232 00:11:29,480 --> 00:11:31,600 Speaker 10: reasons for that was because in one of the years 233 00:11:31,640 --> 00:11:33,520 Speaker 10: there was an adminera which is totally out of her hands, 234 00:11:33,760 --> 00:11:36,079 Speaker 10: and it just resulted in there being no actual specific 235 00:11:36,160 --> 00:11:38,920 Speaker 10: data for vaping hospitalizations in Victoria, right. 236 00:11:39,120 --> 00:11:40,679 Speaker 6: Did you hear back from any other states? 237 00:11:40,840 --> 00:11:43,199 Speaker 10: Yes, So I spoke to New South Wales and they 238 00:11:43,200 --> 00:11:44,840 Speaker 10: actually don't have any vaping data at all. 239 00:11:44,800 --> 00:11:46,520 Speaker 6: Right, so they haven't been tracking in not at all. 240 00:11:46,720 --> 00:11:49,000 Speaker 4: So that's not a lot to go on, although we 241 00:11:49,080 --> 00:11:52,240 Speaker 4: do know that vape related hospitalizations are recurring. 242 00:11:52,760 --> 00:11:55,200 Speaker 5: What we're seeing is that if you have too much 243 00:11:55,280 --> 00:11:59,120 Speaker 5: nicotine on board, suddenly there are toxic effects. 244 00:11:59,200 --> 00:12:01,920 Speaker 4: This is Professor Emily Banks, a leading expert in the 245 00:12:01,960 --> 00:12:05,480 Speaker 4: health impacts of vaps at the Australian National University, and 246 00:12:05,559 --> 00:12:07,920 Speaker 4: I wanted to ask her about someone we spoke to 247 00:12:08,160 --> 00:12:10,400 Speaker 4: who told us they had a seizure after vaping. 248 00:12:10,679 --> 00:12:13,600 Speaker 5: There's a continuum, so people can just feel nauseous, they 249 00:12:13,679 --> 00:12:17,599 Speaker 5: can vomit, and then there are effects where people lose consciousness, 250 00:12:18,080 --> 00:12:21,960 Speaker 5: and then having a seizure can be part of losing consciousness. 251 00:12:22,320 --> 00:12:25,480 Speaker 5: So it's part of that overall picture of just too 252 00:12:25,559 --> 00:12:27,040 Speaker 5: much nicotine too quickly. 253 00:12:27,360 --> 00:12:29,880 Speaker 4: We heard from a thirty year old who was vaping 254 00:12:29,920 --> 00:12:32,520 Speaker 4: and then was hospitalized and was found to have a 255 00:12:32,559 --> 00:12:35,120 Speaker 4: three point two millimeter puncture in his lung and. 256 00:12:35,160 --> 00:12:37,280 Speaker 6: Was then diagnosed with neumothorax. 257 00:12:37,480 --> 00:12:38,880 Speaker 4: Can you tell me a bit about that and how 258 00:12:38,920 --> 00:12:40,440 Speaker 4: that's presenting in the research. 259 00:12:41,240 --> 00:12:43,920 Speaker 5: We have heard reports of people who have been vaping 260 00:12:44,080 --> 00:12:47,559 Speaker 5: and then have developed a spontaneous new methorics, So so 261 00:12:47,559 --> 00:12:48,959 Speaker 5: long as you can get it if you've actually been 262 00:12:48,960 --> 00:12:52,160 Speaker 5: stabbed or something, that's a traumatic new METHORICX, but a 263 00:12:52,200 --> 00:12:54,880 Speaker 5: spontaneous new methorics where you suddenly get a burst of 264 00:12:54,880 --> 00:12:56,720 Speaker 5: that bubble in your lung and then you get air 265 00:12:57,760 --> 00:12:59,560 Speaker 5: going into the lining of your lung. 266 00:13:00,640 --> 00:13:04,600 Speaker 4: But it's not just these hospitalizations that Emily's concerned about. 267 00:13:04,920 --> 00:13:07,240 Speaker 5: So if you look at people are who are really 268 00:13:07,280 --> 00:13:10,480 Speaker 5: addicted to nicotine, they will only feel normal when they've 269 00:13:10,559 --> 00:13:13,040 Speaker 5: had a vape, and after that they'll start to go 270 00:13:13,080 --> 00:13:17,160 Speaker 5: into a kind of withdrawal and because nicotine gets excreted 271 00:13:17,160 --> 00:13:19,640 Speaker 5: from the body quite quickly, people can go through that 272 00:13:19,720 --> 00:13:22,640 Speaker 5: quite rapidly. So they might be having difficulty sitting through 273 00:13:22,679 --> 00:13:25,559 Speaker 5: a lesson without having a vape, having difficulty sitting through 274 00:13:25,960 --> 00:13:28,080 Speaker 5: a meal with their friends or family, And there are 275 00:13:28,120 --> 00:13:30,439 Speaker 5: people with a vape under their pillow, vaping in the 276 00:13:30,480 --> 00:13:34,080 Speaker 5: middle of the night because they have that urge. When 277 00:13:34,080 --> 00:13:36,040 Speaker 5: I talk to young people about what they want in 278 00:13:36,080 --> 00:13:40,479 Speaker 5: their lives, most will say that they want an independent 279 00:13:40,640 --> 00:13:44,920 Speaker 5: future that they determine, and I think that addiction can 280 00:13:44,960 --> 00:13:48,840 Speaker 5: really undermine that independence. I mean, it essentially is dependence. 281 00:13:50,120 --> 00:13:52,960 Speaker 4: If you cast your mind into the future an eighteen 282 00:13:53,000 --> 00:13:56,840 Speaker 4: year olds who's vaping, now, what concerns do you have 283 00:13:57,040 --> 00:13:59,960 Speaker 4: about their health forty fifty years into the future. 284 00:14:00,080 --> 00:14:02,280 Speaker 5: It could be that they'd be fine, or it could 285 00:14:02,280 --> 00:14:04,920 Speaker 5: be that they would have, for example, long term lung 286 00:14:04,960 --> 00:14:08,120 Speaker 5: diseased caused by inflammation. They would definitely have the issues 287 00:14:08,160 --> 00:14:11,000 Speaker 5: related to nicotine addiction, and then I would also be 288 00:14:11,040 --> 00:14:14,640 Speaker 5: concerned for their cardiovascular health. So we know that nicotine 289 00:14:14,679 --> 00:14:17,280 Speaker 5: increases your blood pressure and increases. 290 00:14:16,800 --> 00:14:17,560 Speaker 6: Your heart rate. 291 00:14:18,040 --> 00:14:21,280 Speaker 5: So that's one area where we're concerned about nicotine effects. 292 00:14:22,000 --> 00:14:24,360 Speaker 5: The other thing where we're concerned about nicotine effects is 293 00:14:24,400 --> 00:14:28,160 Speaker 5: reproductive health. So if that was an eighteen year old 294 00:14:28,200 --> 00:14:31,880 Speaker 5: woman who was going to have children, then you would 295 00:14:31,920 --> 00:14:34,680 Speaker 5: also be concerned about what would happen while she was 296 00:14:34,720 --> 00:14:36,200 Speaker 5: pregnant and what would happen. 297 00:14:36,080 --> 00:14:38,680 Speaker 6: To them baby. 298 00:14:39,400 --> 00:14:42,440 Speaker 4: But there could also be health consequences from veping we 299 00:14:42,520 --> 00:14:43,840 Speaker 4: don't even know about yet. 300 00:14:44,360 --> 00:14:47,200 Speaker 5: There's a lot of unknowns, and I think we have 301 00:14:47,280 --> 00:14:50,400 Speaker 5: to be really clear that not knowing about something is 302 00:14:50,440 --> 00:14:51,400 Speaker 5: a risk in itself. 303 00:14:51,840 --> 00:14:54,920 Speaker 4: Cigarettes as we now know them were first mass produced 304 00:14:54,960 --> 00:14:57,960 Speaker 4: in the eighteen hundreds. It was one hundred odd years 305 00:14:58,040 --> 00:15:02,600 Speaker 4: later that researches began in verstigating the connection between cigarettes 306 00:15:02,640 --> 00:15:05,880 Speaker 4: and lung cancer. Vapes as we know them have only 307 00:15:05,920 --> 00:15:09,280 Speaker 4: been on the market around sixteen years. At the end 308 00:15:09,320 --> 00:15:11,400 Speaker 4: of the day, what is worse for your health a 309 00:15:11,480 --> 00:15:12,800 Speaker 4: cigarette or a vape? 310 00:15:13,160 --> 00:15:16,960 Speaker 5: I have to say smoking is so unbelievably harmful. There 311 00:15:17,000 --> 00:15:20,760 Speaker 5: are very few other exposures that are as harmful as smoking. 312 00:15:21,000 --> 00:15:22,120 Speaker 6: It's so dangerous. 313 00:15:22,360 --> 00:15:25,160 Speaker 5: You know, up to two thirds of all people who 314 00:15:25,240 --> 00:15:28,040 Speaker 5: are long term smokers will die from their habit if 315 00:15:28,080 --> 00:15:30,200 Speaker 5: they don't quit. So, if someone held a gun to 316 00:15:30,280 --> 00:15:33,440 Speaker 5: your head and said, right, your choice, is to either 317 00:15:33,560 --> 00:15:36,800 Speaker 5: smoke or to vape, then probably vaping is better. But 318 00:15:36,880 --> 00:15:39,960 Speaker 5: I would say that the safest thing is to avoid 319 00:15:40,000 --> 00:15:41,880 Speaker 5: smoking and to avoid e cigarette use. 320 00:15:45,800 --> 00:15:48,520 Speaker 4: I started off this episode wanting to know what's in 321 00:15:48,560 --> 00:15:50,840 Speaker 4: a vap and what vepes are doing to our health, 322 00:15:51,480 --> 00:15:53,960 Speaker 4: But I've ended up with more questions than when I started. 323 00:15:54,720 --> 00:15:58,280 Speaker 4: If cigarettes are so bad, why is the government focusing 324 00:15:58,360 --> 00:16:01,120 Speaker 4: on cracking down on vapes? And if the sale of 325 00:16:01,160 --> 00:16:05,920 Speaker 4: disposable nicotine beeps is illegal, how come they're so readily available. 326 00:16:06,440 --> 00:16:08,440 Speaker 4: Next episode, I'm going to find out. 327 00:16:08,720 --> 00:16:11,840 Speaker 9: So industry they can smell out a little poor and 328 00:16:11,880 --> 00:16:13,760 Speaker 9: they push it open and make it into a door 329 00:16:13,760 --> 00:16:14,880 Speaker 9: that they can loss right through. 330 00:16:14,960 --> 00:16:18,400 Speaker 8: So they're deliberately trying to manipulate the market to get 331 00:16:18,440 --> 00:16:19,240 Speaker 8: these into Australia. 332 00:16:19,280 --> 00:16:21,480 Speaker 6: Are you expecting a fight on these regulations? Yeah, we 333 00:16:21,520 --> 00:16:24,160 Speaker 6: always prepare for a fight. I'll keep thought, I'll fight 334 00:16:24,200 --> 00:16:25,600 Speaker 6: every tooth in a way I can. 335 00:16:26,400 --> 00:16:29,880 Speaker 4: I'm nicople I wrote and edited this podcast. Billy Fitzimons 336 00:16:30,000 --> 00:16:33,160 Speaker 4: was our executive producer, Lucy Tassel was our fact checker, 337 00:16:33,360 --> 00:16:36,440 Speaker 4: and Joe Kylie produced this series not just for audio, 338 00:16:36,480 --> 00:16:38,640 Speaker 4: but also the video version of the series. 339 00:16:38,680 --> 00:16:39,480 Speaker 6: That we're doing as well. 340 00:16:39,600 --> 00:16:43,560 Speaker 11: Yes, it's been intense. We've traveled across the country. We've 341 00:16:43,560 --> 00:16:46,160 Speaker 11: been into Parliament House, we've spoken to vapors and we 342 00:16:46,280 --> 00:16:47,960 Speaker 11: forced the one person in the office who vapes to 343 00:16:48,080 --> 00:16:50,800 Speaker 11: continuously blow smoke in front of the camera for. 344 00:16:50,760 --> 00:16:52,480 Speaker 6: B roots and vaping into lenses. 345 00:16:52,600 --> 00:16:54,560 Speaker 11: It's been such a journey and I've learnt so much 346 00:16:54,600 --> 00:16:56,080 Speaker 11: and I really want to get this into the ears 347 00:16:56,120 --> 00:16:58,200 Speaker 11: of as many young Australians as possible. So if you've 348 00:16:58,200 --> 00:17:00,520 Speaker 11: made it this far and you're enjoying what you're listening to, 349 00:17:00,560 --> 00:17:03,040 Speaker 11: do us a favor. Share it on Instagram, put it 350 00:17:03,040 --> 00:17:05,520 Speaker 11: in your stories. It's two buttons exactly, and I can't 351 00:17:05,520 --> 00:17:07,520 Speaker 11: wait for you to hear episode two and three. 352 00:17:07,560 --> 00:17:09,320 Speaker 6: Thanks Joe, bye already. 353 00:17:09,440 --> 00:17:12,119 Speaker 1: And this is this is the daily, This is the 354 00:17:12,200 --> 00:17:15,240 Speaker 1: daily os Oh, now it makes sense.