WEBVTT - We Asked 💬 A Period Tracking App To Stop 🤚 Mining Our Data 😠 0:00:01.520 --> 0:00:04.440 Flex and Frooms, Flex and Frooms. This is the Flex 0:00:04.480 --> 0:00:05.960 and Frooms catch up podcast. 0:00:09.480 --> 0:00:11.520 Hear you, welcome back to the show. 0:00:11.640 --> 0:00:13.800 It is Flex and Frooms. I'm currently looking for a 0:00:13.800 --> 0:00:15.600 little bit of chocolate. I every time we come in here. 0:00:15.720 --> 0:00:17.600 Yeah, you like ferociously looking for the chocolate. 0:00:17.640 --> 0:00:19.680 A wow. Just hit me odd because we're talking about 0:00:19.720 --> 0:00:21.920 period trackers. But you said you're one day away from ovulating, 0:00:21.960 --> 0:00:22.439 So I guess I. 0:00:22.520 --> 0:00:24.200 Do what you want, killing it, killing it. 0:00:24.239 --> 0:00:27.080 As always, we don't really have an update from for 0:00:27.240 --> 0:00:29.520 me about the neighbor who left the bin bin juice 0:00:29.520 --> 0:00:32.479 being outside the bar, but there is another apartment update. 0:00:32.640 --> 0:00:35.440 It involves an aggressive noe one that threw me wrote 0:00:35.440 --> 0:00:36.360 you'll find out soon. 0:00:36.440 --> 0:00:37.440 Here's the party. 0:00:38.040 --> 0:00:41.080 You're listening to, Flex and Frooms, m Kata. 0:00:41.200 --> 0:00:43.040 The other day, I was having quite a pieceful morning. 0:00:43.080 --> 0:00:45.000 The birds were chirping et al. 0:00:45.320 --> 0:00:47.400 I trot down my little. 0:00:47.120 --> 0:00:49.880 Hallway to the front door of the fourier of my building. 0:00:50.240 --> 0:00:53.480 Why do I see a note? And instantly a rush 0:00:53.520 --> 0:00:56.600 of panic envelopes my body and I think have I 0:00:56.680 --> 0:00:57.440 done something wrong? 0:00:57.760 --> 0:00:59.320 What was it? Said? 0:01:00.240 --> 0:01:03.480 Unit seven on a four paper? Yeah, babe, it's written. 0:01:04.319 --> 0:01:07.880 It says Unit seven. I'm not Unit seven, thankfully, but 0:01:07.920 --> 0:01:11.119 it is rather close. Some would say, please turn down 0:01:11.160 --> 0:01:14.880 your music next time you have an afters till seven am. 0:01:16.440 --> 0:01:17.280 I said, is that the. 0:01:17.200 --> 0:01:18.000 Extent of the note? 0:01:18.080 --> 0:01:18.479 That's it? 0:01:18.920 --> 0:01:20.400 You said this was an aggressive note? 0:01:20.560 --> 0:01:24.800 That's aggressive? Is it that? Having said got you cap sluck? 0:01:26.160 --> 0:01:27.760 It's ripped out of a page? 0:01:27.880 --> 0:01:28.880 So how else? 0:01:30.080 --> 0:01:32.959 Okay, what would be the appropriate way to get the 0:01:32.959 --> 0:01:33.759 response you need? 0:01:33.800 --> 0:01:37.319 It would be Unit seven, appreciate that you're having an afters. 0:01:37.319 --> 0:01:39.680 It sounded really fun, but next time when it gets 0:01:39.680 --> 0:01:40.919 to seven am, turn it down. 0:01:41.480 --> 0:01:41.840 Please. 0:01:41.959 --> 0:01:44.480 That's not working on me if I'm Unit seven. I 0:01:44.480 --> 0:01:47.040 got near it until seven am, and then I got 0:01:47.080 --> 0:01:50.520 a gentle reminder to turn the music down for next time. 0:01:50.840 --> 0:01:53.200 It's out of my brain as quickly as I read it. 0:01:54.080 --> 0:01:55.600 I think sometimes you need a little bit of fear 0:01:55.600 --> 0:01:57.200 and discomfort to get the job done. 0:01:57.560 --> 0:02:00.640 Well, I've got two questions. Number one, should the person 0:02:00.720 --> 0:02:03.040 who wrote the note sign off? Sign off? 0:02:03.200 --> 0:02:06.280 Because now I feel like we're all bullying Unit seven. 0:02:06.320 --> 0:02:08.440 I wasn't even there to listen. I quite would have 0:02:08.480 --> 0:02:09.600 enjoyed a little bit of party. 0:02:09.400 --> 0:02:11.160 In the middle. It's been a bit flat lately, it's 0:02:11.200 --> 0:02:13.040 been a bit flat of lately. 0:02:13.600 --> 0:02:16.240 However, I get home, I read the note, I go 0:02:16.320 --> 0:02:17.919 to have a little chill time on the couch. 0:02:18.000 --> 0:02:20.880 Why is it one pm? And there's a man howling 0:02:21.160 --> 0:02:26.840 like a wolf? Interimiately, he goes, oh. 0:02:26.160 --> 0:02:28.200 I'm sitting in my house and go oh, And I'm like, 0:02:28.800 --> 0:02:32.720 if someone having it, like in the building somewhere opposite 0:02:32.840 --> 0:02:33.440 my apartment. 0:02:33.720 --> 0:02:36.679 I hear a man howling and also barking like a dog. 0:02:36.960 --> 0:02:41.359 Okay, kink getting seven am psychosis and we've all. 0:02:41.240 --> 0:02:43.520 Been there, so we just the man go to the 0:02:43.560 --> 0:02:44.880 barking phase of the trip. 0:02:45.760 --> 0:02:49.359 Anyway, all I'll say is I would have loved the 0:02:49.400 --> 0:02:52.959 interconnected drama had they put sign off Unit four. 0:02:53.440 --> 0:02:56.080 No way, you wouldn't. 0:02:56.080 --> 0:03:01.120 Would you never sign off? It's like, yeah, everyone trust 0:03:01.160 --> 0:03:01.560 no one? 0:03:02.480 --> 0:03:02.639 Yes? 0:03:02.720 --> 0:03:04.639 See what I mean now that I think we're all bullying them, 0:03:04.680 --> 0:03:07.200 But I don't know how where was I? 0:03:07.200 --> 0:03:10.640 If you sign off the note, it feels personal, and 0:03:10.680 --> 0:03:12.560 I think the person who wrote the note wanted to 0:03:12.639 --> 0:03:15.959 feel civic, like, this is your responsibility as a person 0:03:16.000 --> 0:03:17.919 who lives in a place where other people live. 0:03:18.400 --> 0:03:19.360 Turn the music down. 0:03:19.800 --> 0:03:21.320 I'd love to know what music they listening to. 0:03:21.520 --> 0:03:23.800 Yeah, send them a note follow up? 0:03:24.400 --> 0:03:26.560 So, hey, you know seven, can I get the track 0:03:26.600 --> 0:03:29.320 ID four IM four twenty am. 0:03:29.520 --> 0:03:33.880 That was a banger. Comprehension is open. We've got a 0:03:33.880 --> 0:03:36.000 big thought for you. A couple of weeks ago before 0:03:36.000 --> 0:03:38.640 we went on break from me and now we're discussing period 0:03:38.800 --> 0:03:41.880 tracking apps. You may or may not know. I'm very 0:03:41.920 --> 0:03:46.520 into my menstrual cycle turn twenty nine. Got bored of 0:03:46.560 --> 0:03:50.440 not knowing that every month, the aggressive diarrhea mood swings 0:03:50.600 --> 0:03:53.360 was a signal that I was going to get my period, 0:03:53.600 --> 0:03:55.880 and so now I'm into cycle sinking and understanding what 0:03:55.920 --> 0:03:57.440 I need to be doing at different parts of my 0:03:57.520 --> 0:04:00.560 cycle to optimize myself. Maybe my best self, be my 0:04:00.640 --> 0:04:01.360 favorite self. 0:04:01.400 --> 0:04:02.120 Okay. 0:04:02.560 --> 0:04:05.440 This interest has caused me to encourage friends of mine 0:04:05.480 --> 0:04:08.400 to download period tracking apps so we can share this 0:04:08.480 --> 0:04:10.680 information so I can be more mindful about where they 0:04:10.720 --> 0:04:12.680 are and what they're feeling. But it's out of this 0:04:12.680 --> 0:04:15.320 conversation about what things in our life should be payballed. 0:04:15.360 --> 0:04:18.360 As you know, everything is a subscription model. These days, 0:04:18.600 --> 0:04:21.279 we're going to own nothing and be happy. I took 0:04:21.320 --> 0:04:24.080 the question to the internet and said, okay, given that 0:04:24.120 --> 0:04:26.479 things are going to cost us, and we seem to 0:04:26.480 --> 0:04:28.800 be in a bit of a dispute about what things 0:04:28.800 --> 0:04:32.760 should be paywalled. Let's talk about it today. The answers 0:04:32.920 --> 0:04:36.800 will confuse you and concern you. But here's what I 0:04:36.920 --> 0:04:41.240 discovered overall, based on the people in my dms on Instagram, 0:04:41.720 --> 0:04:45.360 they said, the things that should be paywalled include, but 0:04:45.480 --> 0:04:49.760 are not limited to, anything being informed by an expert 0:04:49.880 --> 0:04:50.680 in their field. 0:04:50.839 --> 0:04:52.880 Well where. 0:04:55.120 --> 0:04:59.000 They said Jim progress pics. I have a friend he 0:04:59.120 --> 0:05:01.600 only posts his g updates on the close friends little 0:05:01.640 --> 0:05:03.200 treat for us like that, it's good to see it's 0:05:03.240 --> 0:05:09.039 going well. Adult content, adult sexual content, cultural education specifically, 0:05:09.080 --> 0:05:12.680 anything that's like inherently quite traumatic. People shouldn't be retraumatized 0:05:12.680 --> 0:05:15.960 for freeze the logic behind that if anything that costs 0:05:16.000 --> 0:05:19.120 the person or they had to put a particularly egregious 0:05:19.160 --> 0:05:22.279 amount of effort into producing anything that requires labor and 0:05:22.360 --> 0:05:26.400 has a strategy behind it. Now, this feels like two 0:05:26.560 --> 0:05:29.680 very extreme ends of spectrums, from adult sexual content to 0:05:29.760 --> 0:05:33.440 gym progress pictures. But somebody sent us a really really 0:05:33.520 --> 0:05:36.280 amazing voice memo on their opinion, and I think we 0:05:36.320 --> 0:05:37.960 should all listen to it right now. 0:05:38.120 --> 0:05:42.400 Place hello on what in our lives should be paywared. 0:05:44.040 --> 0:05:47.640 I'm thinking, is it a fair model to be like 0:05:48.760 --> 0:05:54.400 any dynamic where me, the consumer the audience wants to 0:05:54.480 --> 0:05:59.760 know a detailed information about you that I would otherwise 0:06:00.160 --> 0:06:07.479 need to have invested time, vulnerability, discomfort, conversations, conflict to 0:06:07.839 --> 0:06:10.320 have gotten to know about you in like a one 0:06:10.360 --> 0:06:15.000 to one interpersonal direct relationship with you. If I'm asking 0:06:15.080 --> 0:06:19.200 to know that about you with that I call that 0:06:19.200 --> 0:06:23.839 other stuff, then money is what needs to be invested. 0:06:25.080 --> 0:06:28.240 That could be anything as like do you have siblings? 0:06:29.480 --> 0:06:33.279 I love living under a flight path? Or do that 0:06:33.320 --> 0:06:33.680 to yah? 0:06:33.800 --> 0:06:37.800 Won't it give me marri feel? But there's something to that. 0:06:38.040 --> 0:06:39.960 And you know, when we talk about paywalling, could be 0:06:39.960 --> 0:06:43.200 anything from subscriptions to mood tickets. Let's not go to detailed. 0:06:43.520 --> 0:06:45.320 This person in particular is talking about content and this 0:06:45.400 --> 0:06:48.360 idea that people want increasing levels of intimacy for free 0:06:48.400 --> 0:06:50.599 and for free and for free. If you weren't going 0:06:50.680 --> 0:06:52.599 to get this information from me, had we not have 0:06:52.680 --> 0:06:56.280 had some kind of vulnerable conversation, emotional conversation, there was 0:06:56.320 --> 0:07:00.280 some conflict involved or whatever, or this mutual exchange, maybe 0:07:00.320 --> 0:07:02.520 you should pay for access. Maybe I don't know we're 0:07:02.560 --> 0:07:05.520 still we're workshopping. It's early days. I love this flex. 0:07:05.560 --> 0:07:08.080 Thank you for that voice note whoever sent that, appreciate you. 0:07:08.160 --> 0:07:13.680 Shout out recently everybody, I got interested in my cycle 0:07:14.080 --> 0:07:19.160 twin my period cycle, mynstral cycle, the time of the month, 0:07:19.720 --> 0:07:22.520 and I recently learned if you get your period, your 0:07:22.720 --> 0:07:24.960 hormone cycle is across. 0:07:25.280 --> 0:07:26.080 Twenty eight days. 0:07:26.120 --> 0:07:30.000 If you have an average hormone cycle, please, if you've 0:07:30.040 --> 0:07:32.040 got PCOS. 0:07:31.400 --> 0:07:33.160 Zone, come for the girls please. 0:07:33.320 --> 0:07:38.400 Whereas if you assist man, it's twenty four hours. Do 0:07:38.480 --> 0:07:39.760 with that information what you will. 0:07:40.320 --> 0:07:43.160 I'm still get to go more into what it means 0:07:43.160 --> 0:07:45.640 for assists man to have twenty four hours. 0:07:45.720 --> 0:07:49.000 Side start with understanding yours as a priority. We'll get 0:07:49.000 --> 0:07:49.320 to that letter. 0:07:49.400 --> 0:07:50.600 We'll get to that, but I would like to get 0:07:50.640 --> 0:07:51.120 to that as something. 0:07:51.120 --> 0:07:52.520 Oh, we're definitely gonna get We need we need a 0:07:52.520 --> 0:07:55.320 man on the show, but we don't. 0:07:55.720 --> 0:07:59.400 We don't, but no, I think it would be nice. 0:08:00.400 --> 0:08:01.000 No man. 0:08:01.640 --> 0:08:03.560 Producer Mickey is convinced that we can't have a man 0:08:03.600 --> 0:08:04.840 on the show because they would hate us. Think we 0:08:04.960 --> 0:08:07.360 create quite a safe space for this man to flourish. 0:08:07.520 --> 0:08:09.800 But you've been downloading period tracker apps and have been 0:08:10.240 --> 0:08:12.320 distressed at what you've uncovered? 0:08:12.440 --> 0:08:15.840 Absolutely so here I am plotting along every single day, diligent, 0:08:16.040 --> 0:08:18.960 diligently extra bloats today. 0:08:18.960 --> 0:08:23.080 What's your mood? Headache? Sex drive? Have you done anything naughty? 0:08:23.960 --> 0:08:24.800 Not naughty? 0:08:24.960 --> 0:08:26.360 Naughty? Playing but not? 0:08:26.440 --> 0:08:27.080 Can you plan? 0:08:27.160 --> 0:08:29.880 Plank? Have you plate? Have you pleaded with yourself. 0:08:29.560 --> 0:08:33.240 With a partner, with a partner? Not you blushing? Grow up? 0:08:34.960 --> 0:08:35.560 Stop it? 0:08:35.800 --> 0:08:38.880 So run through anyway here I am tracking all of 0:08:38.880 --> 0:08:41.880 my stuff, being so excited. Then I see an article 0:08:41.880 --> 0:08:45.760 on pedestrian TV and it says that certain period trackers. 0:08:45.440 --> 0:08:46.640 Are selling your data. 0:08:46.880 --> 0:08:49.240 The data is not safe and they can be used 0:08:49.520 --> 0:08:53.360 perhaps to up your insurance premiums or do all sorts 0:08:53.360 --> 0:08:53.680 of unto. 0:08:53.880 --> 0:08:57.800 I mean, let's read the headline concerning unsafe and unfair 0:08:57.920 --> 0:09:01.439 expert slam. Popular period track apps are being dodgy ap 0:09:01.880 --> 0:09:04.880 And here's the thing. As someone who believes that privacy 0:09:04.960 --> 0:09:07.480 is a myth, even though I'm anti doc sing, it 0:09:07.480 --> 0:09:10.240 doesn't surprise me that this data is being used. As 0:09:10.240 --> 0:09:12.559 we have said before and many have said before us, 0:09:12.880 --> 0:09:15.880 if the app is free, you are the product. But 0:09:16.000 --> 0:09:18.040 in this case, if you're paying for the app. You 0:09:18.120 --> 0:09:20.480 also might be the product when they sell your data. 0:09:20.720 --> 0:09:23.200 Unfortunately, guys, I got very up in arms about this 0:09:23.320 --> 0:09:26.120 article instantly message the. 0:09:26.040 --> 0:09:28.880 App the app in question question Karen is not just 0:09:28.880 --> 0:09:31.199 a meme for for me, it's a way of life. 0:09:31.400 --> 0:09:36.760 I said, Hello, I recently downloaded redacted app using the 0:09:36.800 --> 0:09:37.559 paid subscription. 0:09:37.720 --> 0:09:40.040 However, have just read some alarming. 0:09:39.640 --> 0:09:44.120 News about your app and what a refund and for 0:09:44.200 --> 0:09:44.520 all my. 0:09:44.520 --> 0:09:46.800 Data to be deleted? Please please let me know how best. 0:09:46.880 --> 0:09:49.160 Please, I'm back. 0:09:51.440 --> 0:09:53.199 And now you know now I don't want to delete 0:09:53.200 --> 0:09:54.920 the app. Huh? 0:09:54.960 --> 0:09:57.040 Then then we would we would messing on WhatsApp and 0:09:57.040 --> 0:09:58.920 Plex says, oh, don't worry about this, and I'm oh god, 0:09:58.920 --> 0:10:01.920 okay sent that email on Hi Lucinda, thank you for 0:10:02.040 --> 0:10:03.400 using this app and contacting us. 0:10:03.440 --> 0:10:06.120 We're sorry to hear that you experienced difficulties with subscription 0:10:06.240 --> 0:10:08.800 cancelation and we're here to help you. Then they proceed 0:10:08.840 --> 0:10:12.680 to give through me instructions on how to unsubscribe and 0:10:12.760 --> 0:10:16.839 request a refund, and did not give any information on 0:10:16.920 --> 0:10:17.400 how to. 0:10:18.120 --> 0:10:21.360 Remove all your data from the app. 0:10:22.000 --> 0:10:24.440 This feels like a stock, standard copy and paste moment. 0:10:24.559 --> 0:10:29.280 This doesn't feel sincere or custom. It's definitely not bespoke 0:10:29.640 --> 0:10:32.640 and it's not one of one. You can't trust any 0:10:32.679 --> 0:10:36.119 of these apps because they're not going to be truthful 0:10:36.160 --> 0:10:38.320 about what they're using it or how they're using it. 0:10:38.360 --> 0:10:42.440 And like you said, the levels of exploitation are exponential. 0:10:42.520 --> 0:10:45.079 Yeah, because I do. Why did you create this app? 0:10:45.480 --> 0:10:45.760 Yeah? 0:10:46.160 --> 0:10:48.240 Because you care about people knowing when their periods are 0:10:49.720 --> 0:10:55.319 remiss to not share that the app in question if 0:10:55.320 --> 0:10:57.359 you want to do a bit of research for yourself. 0:10:57.440 --> 0:11:00.360 We have done our legal training kind of know that 0:11:00.400 --> 0:11:03.000 defamation is something that we're not comfortable with. But this 0:11:03.040 --> 0:11:06.960 is a popular period tracking app that also came under 0:11:06.960 --> 0:11:09.960 fire during Roe v. Wade about how they were using 0:11:10.000 --> 0:11:14.960 this information to dos people who were receiving illegal abortions. 0:11:16.000 --> 0:11:18.800 It's very important information to know whether you do or 0:11:18.840 --> 0:11:21.800 do not have a period. I think it's very fascinating 0:11:21.840 --> 0:11:24.040 that a big part of the population is going through 0:11:24.080 --> 0:11:26.560 something that is just which. 0:11:26.440 --> 0:11:28.520 Is really amazing to know, like we're all having such 0:11:28.559 --> 0:11:31.199 a shared experience. We all feel so separate. No, babes, 0:11:31.440 --> 0:11:34.760 if you're ovulating, I know exactly what you're going through. Yeah, 0:11:34.840 --> 0:11:35.800 I know exactly. 0:11:35.960 --> 0:11:36.880 I think I am right now. 0:11:37.120 --> 0:11:41.760 Just show so jealous would it would I'm currently mentuating, 0:11:41.800 --> 0:11:43.960 but you know it's neither here nor They'll get through it. 0:11:44.080 --> 0:11:46.360 Thank you, thank you, thank you for listening, and we 0:11:46.400 --> 0:11:48.199 will continue to talk about this. If you feel like 0:11:48.200 --> 0:11:51.200 it's gone over your head, don't stress. Life is like 0:11:51.240 --> 0:11:52.000 a recorder. 0:11:52.480 --> 0:11:55.360 It never stops. 0:11:55.360 --> 0:11:59.760 Frumno through me, boo, Mommy likes mom. 0:12:01.480 --> 0:12:04.120 You're listening to flex and Rooms on. 0:12:04.320 --> 0:12:07.720 Cater Fear not everyone. We're not talking about athleticism. We're 0:12:07.760 --> 0:12:11.280 talking about philosophy and psychology in a way that you'll enjoy, 0:12:11.360 --> 0:12:12.480 I promise. 0:12:12.080 --> 0:12:13.120 You from me. 0:12:13.200 --> 0:12:15.080 You have you heard of the swimmers fallacy? Absolutely not 0:12:15.280 --> 0:12:19.320 swimmers fallacy. It's also called the swimmer's body illusion. It's 0:12:19.360 --> 0:12:23.000 a cognitive bias. It's basically a system error in your 0:12:23.040 --> 0:12:26.520 brain that makes you view the world slightly different to 0:12:26.559 --> 0:12:26.960 the way. 0:12:26.840 --> 0:12:27.920 The world actually is. 0:12:28.360 --> 0:12:33.400 We all experience cognitive biases, right, So this one is 0:12:33.559 --> 0:12:38.040 basically where you attribute a trait, a physical trait, a 0:12:38.120 --> 0:12:43.360 character trait to a certain activity and not the way. 0:12:43.240 --> 0:12:44.240 Somebody actually is. 0:12:44.320 --> 0:12:46.120 So you know how people look at the bodies of 0:12:46.160 --> 0:12:48.600 swimmers and they say, if I want to have broad 0:12:48.679 --> 0:12:52.000 shoulders and a lean body and be tall, I need 0:12:52.040 --> 0:12:53.959 to start swimming more, right, And if I want to 0:12:54.000 --> 0:12:57.000 be really proficient at swimming, I need to swim a lot. 0:12:57.040 --> 0:12:57.520 Get that body. 0:12:57.559 --> 0:13:00.600 I'll be better, not considering that maybe all the competitive 0:13:00.640 --> 0:13:03.560 swimmers that you're looking at are competitive swimmers because their 0:13:03.600 --> 0:13:07.000 bodies are made in a way that makes it easier. 0:13:06.520 --> 0:13:08.439 For them to be good at that activity. 0:13:08.720 --> 0:13:08.920 Right. 0:13:09.160 --> 0:13:12.400 And so what happens is that we as a people, 0:13:12.920 --> 0:13:15.560 especially when it comes to not just sport, but the 0:13:15.559 --> 0:13:17.680 way we viewed success and the way that we view 0:13:18.040 --> 0:13:20.559 optimized people. People who are really good at what they do, 0:13:21.000 --> 0:13:25.320 we assume that they get good and then they do right. 0:13:25.440 --> 0:13:28.400 So that person got good at public speaking because they 0:13:28.440 --> 0:13:30.040 work in social media, or. 0:13:30.640 --> 0:13:31.960 They work in social media. 0:13:31.880 --> 0:13:33.480 Because they're good at public speaking. 0:13:33.640 --> 0:13:35.040 They're getting up right. 0:13:35.600 --> 0:13:38.480 That person must have gotten their social skills from working 0:13:38.559 --> 0:13:42.280 in bartending, or they were drawn to the industry because 0:13:42.320 --> 0:13:45.720 they're social. And the tricky thing about it is, you know, 0:13:46.080 --> 0:13:48.800 of course, everything is on an individual basis. You can't 0:13:48.840 --> 0:13:50.640 really know the ins and out of why someone is 0:13:50.640 --> 0:13:52.840 good or what we can attribute their success to. But 0:13:52.920 --> 0:13:55.000 I think it's a really simple way to like snap 0:13:55.040 --> 0:13:57.960 yourself out of this idea that the reason why you 0:13:58.000 --> 0:14:01.840 don't have this thing that you desire, is because you're 0:14:02.440 --> 0:14:05.080 not capable or you don't have the makeup. It's like 0:14:05.559 --> 0:14:08.080 sometimes it's just the reality of the situation. And I 0:14:08.120 --> 0:14:11.960 feel like I'm on my journey of trying to not 0:14:12.000 --> 0:14:15.680 oversimplify things but just like simplify it and think, oh, 0:14:15.720 --> 0:14:18.559 my goodness, perhaps that person is good at that. 0:14:18.520 --> 0:14:20.160 Because like they're just built that way. 0:14:20.680 --> 0:14:23.240 Yeah, And I think it's a real human error to 0:14:23.320 --> 0:14:26.000 see something just because we can see it, we can 0:14:26.040 --> 0:14:28.040 be it. I think, like I've heard that quote, if 0:14:28.080 --> 0:14:31.320 you can see it, can achieve it in some ways. Yeah, definitely, 0:14:31.360 --> 0:14:34.320 but to the level of excellence that you're observing, maybe 0:14:34.360 --> 0:14:35.280 just not built that way. 0:14:35.800 --> 0:14:37.320 And that's also, okay. 0:14:37.880 --> 0:14:40.960 A soothing to me, right, Okay, to know like what 0:14:41.120 --> 0:14:42.280 is within your bounds. 0:14:42.520 --> 0:14:45.440 Yes, And also you can turn it on yourself, like 0:14:45.480 --> 0:14:48.480 you know how. For me, when people ask me a 0:14:48.520 --> 0:14:50.800 lot about career success, right, I always say, now, like 0:14:50.840 --> 0:14:55.160 I don't like to do hard work. That will work hard, 0:14:55.480 --> 0:14:57.480 but I don't like to do hard work. And like 0:14:57.480 --> 0:14:59.640 I'm very specific about the work that I do. Now 0:14:59.640 --> 0:15:02.560 it's like not pushing myself outside of my comfort zone. 0:15:02.880 --> 0:15:04.960 I'm not going to learn some random jarg and to 0:15:05.000 --> 0:15:07.440 go do some random hosting gig. It's just not what 0:15:07.480 --> 0:15:09.680 I want to do because I'm well aware of what 0:15:09.760 --> 0:15:11.920 I'm good at, and I'll just double down on that, 0:15:12.040 --> 0:15:14.040 as opposed to being like, because I'm so good at 0:15:14.200 --> 0:15:16.120 plenty of things, I'll just learn another skill. 0:15:16.400 --> 0:15:18.720 Not today, please, I want to be comfortable. 0:15:19.200 --> 0:15:22.280 So you want to do some extra googling the swimmers fallacy, 0:15:22.560 --> 0:15:26.000 the swimmer's body illusion, or just google any cognitive bias, 0:15:26.040 --> 0:15:28.440 and I swear it'll make your life easier. 0:15:28.960 --> 0:15:31.200 We all fall for it. Crazy. It's a myth. 0:15:33.080 --> 0:15:36.120 We often get little tiny voice notes or perhaps little 0:15:36.120 --> 0:15:39.840 paragraphs on our Instagram page. It's flex and frooms. The 0:15:39.920 --> 0:15:45.160 moderator is Mickeyani how much beloved and not benign? 0:15:45.720 --> 0:15:46.200 Whoa? 0:15:47.280 --> 0:15:47.640 WHOA? 0:15:48.120 --> 0:15:48.520 Malign? 0:15:48.640 --> 0:15:49.240 Malignant? 0:15:49.440 --> 0:15:55.000 Whoa worse? She's not a tumor, she's not a tumor 0:15:55.840 --> 0:15:56.840 much What are. 0:15:56.760 --> 0:15:57.840 You trying to say? 0:15:58.240 --> 0:16:01.320 I just wanted to use the word that would look good. Beloved, 0:16:01.800 --> 0:16:06.080 the much beloved? What's it called when someone is hard 0:16:06.160 --> 0:16:07.240 done by? 0:16:07.840 --> 0:16:08.760 Mickey? Hard done by? 0:16:09.080 --> 0:16:12.160 I'm feeling it were an attack. 0:16:12.640 --> 0:16:16.320 This is an in real time assessment. So Mickey read 0:16:16.360 --> 0:16:17.640 a DM that was sent to us. I'm going to 0:16:17.680 --> 0:16:19.960 read it out again. Flex and frooms on Instagram if 0:16:19.960 --> 0:16:24.600 you want to send a similar note, Frumiolo and Flexerini. 0:16:25.640 --> 0:16:28.080 Given your love for debating and spilling real tea on 0:16:28.160 --> 0:16:31.400 real ty amazing, I think you need to expand your 0:16:31.440 --> 0:16:34.560 horizons beyond Gavin Rubinstein and Simon Cohen, your hubbies. So 0:16:34.640 --> 0:16:39.400 just reverence everyone Lux Listing stars, Gavin Rubinstein and Simon Cohen, 0:16:39.680 --> 0:16:40.640 we are big fans of you. 0:16:40.680 --> 0:16:42.600 At the show, they'd be listening. 0:16:42.600 --> 0:16:44.320 I mean they've got they've got car, often in the 0:16:44.480 --> 0:16:46.320 car going to listings N. 0:16:46.360 --> 0:16:47.720 Six point one. Switch it on, boys. 0:16:48.920 --> 0:16:51.640 May I introduce you to the real hero of Lux Listings, 0:16:51.760 --> 0:16:55.400 the property market and the world at large, Michael Pallier. 0:16:55.920 --> 0:16:58.720 Michael is a background character of sorts on Lux Listings, 0:16:58.880 --> 0:17:00.680 but I think he warrants a deep on the potty, 0:17:01.080 --> 0:17:04.320 captured by his happy, humble disposition amongst the ego fest 0:17:04.400 --> 0:17:07.119 Doggie dog world of Lust Listings. I stumbled upon his 0:17:07.200 --> 0:17:10.280 day in the life on YouTube. Dyk, did you know 0:17:10.400 --> 0:17:13.439 Michael is actually the one responsive for the sale of 0:17:13.440 --> 0:17:16.440 Sydney's most expensive house? 0:17:16.640 --> 0:17:18.240 Why is he a background character? 0:17:18.280 --> 0:17:19.240 Then zooming out. 0:17:19.760 --> 0:17:22.119 I believe Michael can teach us a lot about life. 0:17:22.640 --> 0:17:25.320 Lead with kindness, always, don't be afraid to go against 0:17:25.320 --> 0:17:28.520 the grain, and you can be a boss successful while 0:17:28.560 --> 0:17:31.440 also being soft and sensitive. Yeah, also that not all 0:17:31.480 --> 0:17:33.400 real estate agents are vibe terrorists. 0:17:33.960 --> 0:17:36.600 Watch this video, Mickey has got a grab. Play the tape. 0:17:38.560 --> 0:17:42.880 This is our office and we'll bring the clients in here. 0:17:43.160 --> 0:17:44.800 A lot of meetings in this office. 0:17:45.119 --> 0:17:47.520 And it works really well. Andrew has just had a 0:17:47.520 --> 0:17:47.880 good week. 0:17:47.880 --> 0:17:53.159 He sold a house for confidentially around thirty million dollars. 0:17:53.640 --> 0:17:55.600 Winners of grinners. 0:17:56.200 --> 0:17:58.879 I started left school and started at the start of 0:17:59.000 --> 0:17:59.920 nineteen eighty four. 0:18:00.040 --> 0:18:03.160 That's an apprentice with roll for Royston to me and. 0:18:03.720 --> 0:18:05.880 The sweety Piet And you know what, I do agree 0:18:05.920 --> 0:18:09.680 there is something about someone with a gentle disposition that 0:18:09.880 --> 0:18:10.920 I don't know if we. 0:18:10.840 --> 0:18:12.240 Can learn winners. 0:18:12.600 --> 0:18:14.480 Some of us just have an abrasive vibe. 0:18:14.520 --> 0:18:18.080 I would say, I don't so the job brought out 0:18:18.080 --> 0:18:20.920 of me that was definitely more of a Michael type. 0:18:21.040 --> 0:18:24.760 Well when you were five, Actually I should tear all 0:18:24.760 --> 0:18:26.000 my clothes off and run around the house. 0:18:27.280 --> 0:18:30.640 I just I think we can grow into a Michael 0:18:30.680 --> 0:18:34.840 Pallier disposition and I would like to, but I'm surprised. 0:18:34.880 --> 0:18:36.640 He started off as a car dealer and he's like that, 0:18:36.640 --> 0:18:38.840 that is that is the real dog eat dog world. 0:18:38.920 --> 0:18:39.360