WEBVTT - NINE EXECUTIVE TALKS M.A.F.S GROUND BREAKING SERIES

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<v Speaker 1>It's in the news today, but it was actually on

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<v Speaker 1>TV Reload the podcast last week. They might welcome back

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<v Speaker 1>guys to TV Reload. My name's Benjamin Norris, and on

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<v Speaker 1>this podcast I go behind the scenes with the biggest

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<v Speaker 1>players in television.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, great questions. The show's about the game. There's a

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<v Speaker 2>lot of great television out there in Australia.

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<v Speaker 1>But I've also got to go behind the scenes with writers.

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<v Speaker 1>The truth is, when I started writing it, it wasn't

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<v Speaker 1>had nothing to do with the news and casting agents

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<v Speaker 1>they know from a casting point of view what they need,

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<v Speaker 1>and editors because that's what we do as editors where storytellers.

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<v Speaker 1>Not to forget some incredible executive producers who are making

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<v Speaker 1>some of the best TV in Australia. I have been

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<v Speaker 1>on the program since the beginning and it's kind of

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<v Speaker 1>in my DNA. So thanks for joining me each week

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<v Speaker 1>and I hope the podcast continues to give you real

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<v Speaker 1>insight into the magic of television today. On the podcast,

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<v Speaker 1>I have Adrian Swift, the head of content production and

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<v Speaker 1>Development at Channel nine. I've kept in touch with Adrian

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<v Speaker 1>over the years and what I've always loved about this

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<v Speaker 1>man is his storytelling ability. Not only does he understand

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<v Speaker 1>the fabric of engaging an audience with shows that he makes,

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<v Speaker 1>He's one of those characters that comes into your life

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<v Speaker 1>who draws you in with this infectious warmth, generosity and intelligence.

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<v Speaker 1>I mean I personally could talk to this man all day.

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<v Speaker 1>So who better to unpack and explain the current series

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<v Speaker 1>of marit At First Sight made by Endemol Shine Australia.

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<v Speaker 1>We will have a look at his interpretation of the

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<v Speaker 1>show and of course look back at the history of

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<v Speaker 1>Australia's relationship with this widely popular and a times controversial program.

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<v Speaker 1>We will discuss the importance of both good and bad

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<v Speaker 1>critiques of the series, why the show still rates in

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<v Speaker 1>the current landscape of Freedoware television, and I will ask

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<v Speaker 1>about the future of Love Island, Australia, snack Masters and

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<v Speaker 1>parental guidance. So, without further ado, I'm going to bring Adrian.

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<v Speaker 2>Into the chat.

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<v Speaker 1>I hope you enjoy this episode as I welcome one

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<v Speaker 1>of Australia's leading content creators, Adrian Swift, to TV Reload.

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<v Speaker 2>There should be naysa's, there should be people who question

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<v Speaker 2>it and challenging I guess you get something a little

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<v Speaker 2>bit skeptical about the entire experiment. Every match we make

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<v Speaker 2>with the absolute intention that it should work.

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<v Speaker 3>You might like things one way and I like them

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<v Speaker 3>the other way, but my way has.

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<v Speaker 1>To be the right way.

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<v Speaker 2>The sort of things they're writing about the show are

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<v Speaker 2>starting to hurt the people who work on the show.

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<v Speaker 1>Why would you put yourself up for this knowing that

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<v Speaker 1>you could get your heartbroken.

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<v Speaker 2>We can press time that we certainly never misrepresented you

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<v Speaker 2>or what you said.

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<v Speaker 3>For many men in relationships, that can be a superpower

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<v Speaker 3>showing vulnerability.

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<v Speaker 2>We thought he'd be to self aware. Well, in fact,

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<v Speaker 2>exactly the opposite was true, and he became the biggest

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<v Speaker 2>character in the show.

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<v Speaker 1>Hey Adrian, how are you?

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<v Speaker 2>I'm fabulous, Thank you.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, you must be happy with the numbers for Married

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<v Speaker 1>at first sight. I have to ask you the first question,

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<v Speaker 1>which is what was the feeling at Channel nine this morning?

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<v Speaker 2>Oh? Good, really good. You know. The hardest thing in

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<v Speaker 2>the world at the moment is we've had slightly officially

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<v Speaker 2>inflated numbers over the last two years because of coronavirus

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<v Speaker 2>and lockdowns, So it's kind of skewed the numbers a

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<v Speaker 2>little bit, particularly as the overnights are becoming less important,

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<v Speaker 2>and things like catch Up plus fourteen plus twelve, all

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<v Speaker 2>that kind of malarchy is becoming more important. So last

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<v Speaker 2>night's overnights were really good, particularly given the competitive environment.

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<v Speaker 2>You know, it was really important for us, you know,

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<v Speaker 2>to come out and top with two great franchises, The

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<v Speaker 2>Voice in the Biber and look, it's a show we love,

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<v Speaker 2>it's a show we believe in. It's a show that

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<v Speaker 2>we knew this season would be really great. And that's

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<v Speaker 2>the worst kind of way to go into an evening

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<v Speaker 2>when your show's on air, because if it doesn't rate,

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<v Speaker 2>it'll just kill you. And when it does rate and

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<v Speaker 2>you know, the audience turns up, it makes you feel

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<v Speaker 2>good about the world.

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<v Speaker 1>Why do you think that maths? You know, that's the

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<v Speaker 1>way we abbreviate it. Why do you think it resonates

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<v Speaker 1>with its audience so clearly?

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<v Speaker 2>I think because all life is there. It often gets

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<v Speaker 2>kind of characterized as this sort of drama thing that

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<v Speaker 2>we put people together who don't like each other, and

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<v Speaker 2>you know, watch back and sit back and watch the

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<v Speaker 2>sparks fly. That's not the intention at all the show.

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<v Speaker 2>And we always say this and we reset it at the

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<v Speaker 2>beginning of every season. It's a show about love, and

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<v Speaker 2>to an extent, the love gives you an excuse to

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<v Speaker 2>look at the drama. But every match we make with

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<v Speaker 2>the absolute intention that it should work. That either we

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<v Speaker 2>give people what they say they want, or when the

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<v Speaker 2>experts look at those people and analyze while the relationships

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<v Speaker 2>have gone wrong, we give them someone that is at

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<v Speaker 2>odds with what they normally choose, with a view that

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<v Speaker 2>potentially that's the relationship that can survive and flourish. Now,

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<v Speaker 2>what does that do well? Along the way? That brings

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<v Speaker 2>out every aspect of human emotion and relationships. This year,

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<v Speaker 2>we've got a big storyline about racism, We've got a

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<v Speaker 2>big storyline about male vulnerability, and none of that's ever

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<v Speaker 2>discussed in scientific terms. It's all seen through the lens

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<v Speaker 2>of genuine human relationship. And I reckon, I well, I reckon.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm pretty certain that's the core of the end of

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<v Speaker 2>the show.

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<v Speaker 3>Well.

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<v Speaker 1>I think as long as the people struggle to find love,

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<v Speaker 1>this show has a place on their television Because while

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<v Speaker 1>the situations might be a bit out there, sometimes I

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<v Speaker 1>think that people feel I think people feel seen by

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<v Speaker 1>this show.

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<v Speaker 2>I hope so I hope there's nothing that happened with

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<v Speaker 2>the show that I don't recognize it at some point

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<v Speaker 2>has haven't in my life or order of my friends,

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<v Speaker 2>and it's not. You know, we've got an absolute, ironclad

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<v Speaker 2>rule which often completely messes it up. That is, we

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<v Speaker 2>don't make anything happen, and if something happens that we

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<v Speaker 2>don't want in the show or that we have to

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<v Speaker 2>put it in. So we don't make anything up and

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<v Speaker 2>we don't excize anything. And you know, you remember a

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<v Speaker 2>couple of years back, we had that toothbrush in the

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<v Speaker 2>toilet incident. Wow, David has.

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<v Speaker 1>Used and his toothbrush as a toilet scouer.

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<v Speaker 2>I don't think anyone deserves that, to be honest to

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<v Speaker 2>there as much as I despise Hailey. Now normally we

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<v Speaker 2>as we go, oh no, we can't, that's just not

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<v Speaker 2>but it became so material to what happened between the

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<v Speaker 2>various people in the show, you just couldn't take it out.

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<v Speaker 2>And I think it was just one of those examples

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<v Speaker 2>where you know, some of the affairs, sometimes not some,

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<v Speaker 2>almost all of them. We don't condone any of that stuff.

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<v Speaker 2>We certainly don't make it happen and a lot of

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<v Speaker 2>the times we wish it. Almost all the time we

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<v Speaker 2>wish it wouldn't happen, But when it does, it's kind

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<v Speaker 2>of what we call a wind up mouse show. You

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<v Speaker 2>wind them mice mouse up and you let it go

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<v Speaker 2>and it goes where it goes. And the skill of

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<v Speaker 2>the people at end, the mal Shinnes strategy who make

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<v Speaker 2>it Tara McWilliams is the ep is that they follow

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<v Speaker 2>those stories and then tell those stories beautifully.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, you know, I think it could be the messiness,

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<v Speaker 1>but I think that it's a combination of the fact

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<v Speaker 1>that the messiness is there, which represents us in real life.

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<v Speaker 1>But I think also this show has heart at the

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<v Speaker 1>end of the day, and that's why people return to it.

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<v Speaker 2>And look, I think it does have heart, and we

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<v Speaker 2>like the people we put in the show, and you know,

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<v Speaker 2>sometimes they get frustrated with us. Particularly is reality televisions

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<v Speaker 2>are an odd beast. And then you'll know this very

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<v Speaker 2>well from your time in the genre. Television holds a

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<v Speaker 2>mirror up to you and you often don't like what

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<v Speaker 2>you see. I'm not suggesting you didn't like what you saw,

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<v Speaker 2>but all of the people don't. And it's quite a

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<v Speaker 2>harsh you know, we all pass the mirror and as

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<v Speaker 2>we go we pull a little bit of a face,

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<v Speaker 2>we suck our stomach in a little bit, we put

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<v Speaker 2>our shoulders back. Television doesn't do that. It shows you

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<v Speaker 2>as you really are. And a lot of people find

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<v Speaker 2>that very difficult, and they keep saying to us, but

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<v Speaker 2>I'm not really like that. You edited me to make

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<v Speaker 2>me look like that, and we go, well, no, we didn't.

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<v Speaker 2>We can press time, but we certainly never misrepresented you

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<v Speaker 2>or what you said, or how you felt or and

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<v Speaker 2>that's where it gets difficult. But we try and do everything,

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<v Speaker 2>as you said, with heart, and we try and do

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<v Speaker 2>everything to genuinely represent the relationships, and the relationships that

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<v Speaker 2>power the show are the ones where where there is love.

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<v Speaker 2>Our perspective Maths is always from the end of the

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<v Speaker 2>table where the people in love are looking down the

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<v Speaker 2>other end of the table at the people bickering.

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<v Speaker 1>Don't you love it when people are telling you that

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<v Speaker 1>they're not something, and they're always demonstrating it while they're

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<v Speaker 1>telling you that they're not And.

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<v Speaker 2>It's hard, and it's hard because you want to kind

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<v Speaker 2>of go. There are times when I know Tara does

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<v Speaker 2>this from time to which he just takes people aside

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<v Speaker 2>and says, I'm not sure you really realize how you're

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<v Speaker 2>coming across. And yeah, I think that's sometimes a very

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<v Speaker 2>helpful lesson because I don't think people understand how. You know,

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<v Speaker 2>they say television puts on ten pounds, Well it does

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<v Speaker 2>that as well, but it also sees you with unerring clarity,

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<v Speaker 2>and often the people who play in this space don't

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<v Speaker 2>like what they see.

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<v Speaker 1>We all want to go on reality television though, to

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<v Speaker 1>show people the best traits that we have, Like we

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<v Speaker 1>want to be loved, we want to be adored.

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<v Speaker 2>You know, we all believe we're fabulous, but we all

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<v Speaker 2>believe we're.

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<v Speaker 1>Some of us are Adrian, And I know I've always.

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<v Speaker 2>Said you're fabulous as well. You know, you know your

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<v Speaker 2>one big brother mate that qualifies you as a fabulous

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<v Speaker 2>that's the thing you put on your CV and say,

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<v Speaker 2>I want to be brother ergo I'm fatulated.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, you know that there's been some naysayers about this show,

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<v Speaker 1>you know, over time, But you know what's really funny

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<v Speaker 1>to me is no matter what rain has fallen, people

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<v Speaker 1>come back to this show. And I think that says

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<v Speaker 1>a lot about the people who make the noise on

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<v Speaker 1>social media that could be negative that they probably don't

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<v Speaker 1>and probably never would have watched the show in the

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<v Speaker 1>first place.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I mean, look, you know, all publicity is good publicity.

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<v Speaker 2>I guess. Look, here's the thing, mate, and I really

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<v Speaker 2>do mean this, and it's not a you'll forgive how

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<v Speaker 2>slightly vomited inducing. What I'm about to say is it's

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<v Speaker 2>a really well made show. It's a really well made show.

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<v Speaker 2>The people who work on it some of the best

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<v Speaker 2>producers in the country. They can tell a story. It's

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<v Speaker 2>made with love and it's made with nuance, and you know,

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<v Speaker 2>the music's all beautifully composed and the camera crews are

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<v Speaker 2>get some of the best shots in Television's why our

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<v Speaker 2>promos is so good. And you know, when we put

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<v Speaker 2>it on in the UK, it was the highest rating

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<v Speaker 2>show outside of Love Ireland on a Well, I Love

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<v Speaker 2>Island's only four to ninety two, but it was the

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<v Speaker 2>highest rating buy on one. So the point is that

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<v Speaker 2>it's not just Australians who love seeing other Australians screeching

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<v Speaker 2>at each other. Actually, when the world sits down to

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<v Speaker 2>watch this show, they love it. And I'm immensely proud

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<v Speaker 2>of it as a bit of telly, and there should

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<v Speaker 2>be naysays, there should be people who question it and

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<v Speaker 2>challenge it. But can I tell it from the inside,

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<v Speaker 2>we love it and we believe in it.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, how do you shut that noise out? Though? Because

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<v Speaker 1>I mean, you yourself are so passionate about television. It's

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<v Speaker 1>the very fiber of while we're having a conversation today

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<v Speaker 1>is because you exube. You know your love and passion

0:10:43.480 --> 0:10:45.080
<v Speaker 1>for this show. And I mean, you wouldn't do what

0:10:45.160 --> 0:10:48.160
<v Speaker 1>you do, working for nine and pushing the show as

0:10:48.200 --> 0:10:49.640
<v Speaker 1>much as you do if you didn't believe in it.

0:10:49.679 --> 0:10:52.080
<v Speaker 1>I know that from my friendship that I have with you.

0:10:52.160 --> 0:10:54.800
<v Speaker 1>But at the same time, we all get hit with

0:10:54.840 --> 0:10:57.160
<v Speaker 1>the noise of things that sometimes can.

0:10:57.040 --> 0:10:59.280
<v Speaker 2>Be you don't shut it out. I just had a

0:10:59.320 --> 0:11:02.120
<v Speaker 2>massive blue with someone at night who shall remain nameless,

0:11:02.320 --> 0:11:06.640
<v Speaker 2>about a journal who shall remain nameless, who just writes

0:11:06.720 --> 0:11:11.120
<v Speaker 2>the worst thing things about the show. And the nine

0:11:11.120 --> 0:11:14.240
<v Speaker 2>person said, no, no, we need to we need we

0:11:14.280 --> 0:11:16.640
<v Speaker 2>want people writing about them, no matter how negative. And

0:11:16.679 --> 0:11:18.360
<v Speaker 2>I said, can I tell you the sort of things

0:11:18.400 --> 0:11:20.480
<v Speaker 2>they're writing about the show are starting to hurt the

0:11:20.480 --> 0:11:22.679
<v Speaker 2>people who work on the show I'm having produces with

0:11:22.840 --> 0:11:25.760
<v Speaker 2>you say, why does he say such terrible things? And

0:11:25.800 --> 0:11:27.040
<v Speaker 2>I've got to talk them down. I've got to talk

0:11:27.080 --> 0:11:28.959
<v Speaker 2>them off the ledge and that so you don't shout

0:11:28.960 --> 0:11:31.080
<v Speaker 2>it out and it really, you know, stuff like that where,

0:11:31.080 --> 0:11:35.480
<v Speaker 2>particularly when it's ill informed, uninformed, it drives your bananas,

0:11:35.520 --> 0:11:37.160
<v Speaker 2>because you know, I sit in ned at sweets with

0:11:37.160 --> 0:11:39.640
<v Speaker 2>these people who make it, and they're worrying about every

0:11:39.679 --> 0:11:41.840
<v Speaker 2>frame and every bit of it, how they've told the

0:11:41.880 --> 0:11:44.560
<v Speaker 2>story and when we put it to our one, we're

0:11:44.559 --> 0:11:46.079
<v Speaker 2>proud of every bit of it. And you know, you

0:11:46.200 --> 0:11:48.319
<v Speaker 2>have people throwing rock. I don't worry less about the

0:11:48.360 --> 0:11:50.840
<v Speaker 2>Twitter verse. It's when people with real sort of political

0:11:50.880 --> 0:11:52.560
<v Speaker 2>agendas have a go that's when I get a little

0:11:52.559 --> 0:11:53.679
<v Speaker 2>bit ropey about the whole thing.

0:11:53.800 --> 0:11:55.440
<v Speaker 1>But I have to say to you, like, I've worked

0:11:55.440 --> 0:11:59.880
<v Speaker 1>with people who are TV commentators, and I found that

0:12:00.200 --> 0:12:04.720
<v Speaker 1>the core of a journalist who is continuously writing something

0:12:04.800 --> 0:12:08.640
<v Speaker 1>negative that says something more about them than it necessarily

0:12:08.679 --> 0:12:11.600
<v Speaker 1>does about the show. And the closer I got to it,

0:12:11.679 --> 0:12:15.360
<v Speaker 1>the more I realized that it came from jealousy of

0:12:15.440 --> 0:12:17.480
<v Speaker 1>wishing that they could be a part of a universe

0:12:17.600 --> 0:12:21.560
<v Speaker 1>like this, so in reverse it can be a backwards compliment.

0:12:21.559 --> 0:12:23.920
<v Speaker 1>I don't know if that helps you when producers come

0:12:23.960 --> 0:12:24.520
<v Speaker 1>to you like that.

0:12:24.640 --> 0:12:27.560
<v Speaker 2>But now it's interesting you say that the best example

0:12:27.559 --> 0:12:30.120
<v Speaker 2>of that actually is Michael Dato from The Age and

0:12:30.160 --> 0:12:34.320
<v Speaker 2>The City Morning Herald, who is both probably the best

0:12:34.400 --> 0:12:37.240
<v Speaker 2>television commentator in Australia lives in la at the moment,

0:12:37.480 --> 0:12:42.080
<v Speaker 2>but also was fundamentally behind the relaunch of Wentworth, so

0:12:42.280 --> 0:12:44.920
<v Speaker 2>never had any of those jealousies. So it was both actually,

0:12:44.960 --> 0:12:47.240
<v Speaker 2>in the terms you just described, was both a creator

0:12:47.679 --> 0:12:50.720
<v Speaker 2>and an observer, and that's probably wise. Observation is so good.

0:12:50.840 --> 0:12:53.760
<v Speaker 1>Well, there really isn't any other free to a show

0:12:53.800 --> 0:12:56.640
<v Speaker 1>that draws the numbers like this. Do you think that

0:12:57.080 --> 0:13:00.520
<v Speaker 1>other shows maybe have lost out on the numbers because

0:13:00.960 --> 0:13:03.959
<v Speaker 1>over time we've overthought it, or we've overcooked it, or

0:13:04.120 --> 0:13:06.320
<v Speaker 1>maybe it's a little too manufactured.

0:13:07.120 --> 0:13:09.600
<v Speaker 2>The too manufactured thing is that is the great bugbear

0:13:09.679 --> 0:13:11.679
<v Speaker 2>of all of us. You know, there's always that very

0:13:11.679 --> 0:13:15.160
<v Speaker 2>fine line between and some things that are absolutely real

0:13:15.480 --> 0:13:18.800
<v Speaker 2>look manufactured, and some things that are manufactured look absolutely real,

0:13:18.840 --> 0:13:20.880
<v Speaker 2>and you've got to excite them because they're manufactured. So

0:13:21.240 --> 0:13:25.040
<v Speaker 2>it's really difficult it's a difficult line to warp. Yeah,

0:13:25.120 --> 0:13:27.720
<v Speaker 2>I think I think you've got to be incredibly nuanced

0:13:27.720 --> 0:13:29.280
<v Speaker 2>about it. I think you've got to be and you've

0:13:29.280 --> 0:13:31.360
<v Speaker 2>got to love the show, and you've got to understand

0:13:31.400 --> 0:13:33.319
<v Speaker 2>what the show is trying to say, and I think

0:13:33.360 --> 0:13:35.080
<v Speaker 2>you've got to be I think I think what people

0:13:35.080 --> 0:13:36.680
<v Speaker 2>get a little bit lost in some of these shows

0:13:36.760 --> 0:13:40.120
<v Speaker 2>is particularly when you're remaking formats from other territories. But

0:13:40.160 --> 0:13:42.320
<v Speaker 2>I quite understand the DNA of the show. The great

0:13:42.360 --> 0:13:46.520
<v Speaker 2>thing about Married is we co developed it with Animal Shine,

0:13:46.720 --> 0:13:51.160
<v Speaker 2>and we both understand. It's a really really close working relationship.

0:13:51.360 --> 0:13:54.600
<v Speaker 2>And I think we both we both understand the DNA

0:13:54.679 --> 0:13:57.040
<v Speaker 2>of the show, and that's what I think really helps

0:13:57.120 --> 0:13:59.480
<v Speaker 2>us to kind of keep it authentic and keep and

0:13:59.600 --> 0:14:01.640
<v Speaker 2>change it from season season, move it along a little

0:14:01.679 --> 0:14:03.400
<v Speaker 2>bit so that every season you're not seeing the same

0:14:03.400 --> 0:14:04.720
<v Speaker 2>old tropes in the same old way.

0:14:05.200 --> 0:14:07.040
<v Speaker 1>I think that that's a really good thing to say,

0:14:07.120 --> 0:14:09.880
<v Speaker 1>though it is because how do you stop remaking the

0:14:09.920 --> 0:14:11.640
<v Speaker 1>same thing? I mean, this show has been on television,

0:14:11.640 --> 0:14:14.400
<v Speaker 1>this is its ninth season. How do you avoid casting

0:14:14.440 --> 0:14:16.679
<v Speaker 1>people that are just trying to recreate something they've already

0:14:16.760 --> 0:14:18.920
<v Speaker 1>seen on the show, like, how do you keep it

0:14:19.000 --> 0:14:22.120
<v Speaker 1>fresh and avoid finding people who just want to recreate

0:14:22.200 --> 0:14:22.600
<v Speaker 1>a moment?

0:14:22.840 --> 0:14:24.360
<v Speaker 2>Well, and you've got to find people who just don't

0:14:24.360 --> 0:14:26.920
<v Speaker 2>want to don't want to be on television. You know,

0:14:27.000 --> 0:14:31.160
<v Speaker 2>there's got to be some genuine desire to play in

0:14:31.200 --> 0:14:33.440
<v Speaker 2>this space. You know, the best thing that ever happened

0:14:33.440 --> 0:14:36.200
<v Speaker 2>to Maps was Tinder, because everyone on Tinder, they just

0:14:36.240 --> 0:14:40.440
<v Speaker 2>hate it, and it's so commoditized dating and relationships that,

0:14:40.560 --> 0:14:42.760
<v Speaker 2>you know, the single most common phrase utter in an

0:14:42.760 --> 0:14:45.640
<v Speaker 2>audition for Maps is I've been on Tinder. I've gone

0:14:45.640 --> 0:14:49.120
<v Speaker 2>on a thousand dates and all of that implies and

0:14:50.640 --> 0:14:54.080
<v Speaker 2>I've found nothing. Even if I don't understand this, even

0:14:54.120 --> 0:14:56.760
<v Speaker 2>if I'm terrified of the consequences of being on television,

0:14:56.880 --> 0:14:58.040
<v Speaker 2>it's got to be better than that.

0:15:00.960 --> 0:15:02.880
<v Speaker 1>Do you go out on dates, Yeah, you do.

0:15:03.320 --> 0:15:10.960
<v Speaker 3>I'm definitely an active single woman. But the constant disappointment,

0:15:12.920 --> 0:15:15.640
<v Speaker 3>it's been hard.

0:15:19.360 --> 0:15:21.960
<v Speaker 2>And look, you know, we get it wrong all the time.

0:15:22.000 --> 0:15:23.920
<v Speaker 2>You know, we get people on who we thought were

0:15:23.960 --> 0:15:26.240
<v Speaker 2>one thing and turn out to be something completely different.

0:15:26.440 --> 0:15:28.960
<v Speaker 2>Often that's a good thing. Often the ones, you know,

0:15:28.960 --> 0:15:30.800
<v Speaker 2>some of the biggest characters on Maps where people we

0:15:30.800 --> 0:15:33.520
<v Speaker 2>thought were kind of be characters, and basically we're on

0:15:33.560 --> 0:15:36.240
<v Speaker 2>because they've matched perfectly with someone who we liked. But

0:15:36.240 --> 0:15:37.920
<v Speaker 2>they are you know, we didn't think they'd be They

0:15:37.960 --> 0:15:40.360
<v Speaker 2>didn't we thought they'd make average television, but they were

0:15:40.360 --> 0:15:42.840
<v Speaker 2>such a good match that it didn't matter, and they

0:15:42.840 --> 0:15:44.520
<v Speaker 2>turned out to be the best characters we've ever had.

0:15:44.600 --> 0:15:47.560
<v Speaker 1>You know, you put people into real environments and allow

0:15:47.640 --> 0:15:51.040
<v Speaker 1>them to be real, and sometimes they will surprise you.

0:15:51.200 --> 0:15:53.680
<v Speaker 1>But that is that is life, my friend, you know.

0:15:54.080 --> 0:15:56.240
<v Speaker 2>Oh, and it's it's what makes the show great. The

0:15:56.280 --> 0:15:58.800
<v Speaker 2>best maps where people did things we never expected, and

0:15:59.520 --> 0:16:02.480
<v Speaker 2>personality is grew and changed, and we cast them as

0:16:02.480 --> 0:16:04.680
<v Speaker 2>one thing. You know. They came into the show because

0:16:04.680 --> 0:16:08.480
<v Speaker 2>we thought, okay, they're they're you know, they're lonely and

0:16:08.520 --> 0:16:11.440
<v Speaker 2>they're this, and they probably need this sort of person

0:16:11.440 --> 0:16:14.200
<v Speaker 2>and they cut and they turn into something completely different

0:16:14.280 --> 0:16:16.640
<v Speaker 2>during the course of the show, and oftentimes it's their

0:16:16.680 --> 0:16:19.440
<v Speaker 2>partner that brings that out in them. So HI, look

0:16:19.480 --> 0:16:22.760
<v Speaker 2>at it. Don't ever think people obviously it's brilliantly you know,

0:16:22.800 --> 0:16:27.160
<v Speaker 2>you masterful. No, we put people in the front end

0:16:27.520 --> 0:16:29.960
<v Speaker 2>and we stand back and we've got the best cameramen

0:16:30.000 --> 0:16:32.440
<v Speaker 2>and the best editors and the best storytellers, and we

0:16:32.560 --> 0:16:35.240
<v Speaker 2>just let it happen and every year it surprises us.

0:16:35.440 --> 0:16:35.640
<v Speaker 2>You know.

0:16:35.680 --> 0:16:38.800
<v Speaker 1>Before I sat down with you to have this chat today,

0:16:39.160 --> 0:16:40.760
<v Speaker 1>I did a lot of research about, like what are

0:16:40.760 --> 0:16:43.160
<v Speaker 1>people saying about reality television at the moment? I found

0:16:43.200 --> 0:16:45.760
<v Speaker 1>this one question in the industry that just kept coming up,

0:16:45.880 --> 0:16:49.200
<v Speaker 1>and that was how much longer can strippt reality last

0:16:49.600 --> 0:16:53.360
<v Speaker 1>on freeedoware television? I mean, nowadays, five hundred thousand is

0:16:53.520 --> 0:16:56.240
<v Speaker 1>a fantastic number. You know, will we be saying two

0:16:56.320 --> 0:17:00.000
<v Speaker 1>hundred thousand is a great number? Or do you think

0:17:00.120 --> 0:17:02.320
<v Speaker 1>that something is going to have to change in the

0:17:02.440 --> 0:17:04.800
<v Speaker 1>landscape of stripped reality?

0:17:05.000 --> 0:17:08.040
<v Speaker 2>But that's a professional TV question. That is a typical

0:17:08.160 --> 0:17:12.560
<v Speaker 2>professional TV question. I would argue that writers in Hollywood,

0:17:12.680 --> 0:17:15.320
<v Speaker 2>three or four years into the advent of television, I

0:17:15.400 --> 0:17:18.720
<v Speaker 2>Love Lucy, the Honeymooners, f Troop, We're going, when's the

0:17:18.760 --> 0:17:21.440
<v Speaker 2>sitcom bubble going to burst? Well, the answer to that

0:17:21.480 --> 0:17:23.760
<v Speaker 2>would have been forty five years later, you know, kind

0:17:23.760 --> 0:17:26.159
<v Speaker 2>of you know, at the end of Friends and Seinfeld,

0:17:26.400 --> 0:17:28.520
<v Speaker 2>the truth of these things is that you know it's

0:17:28.560 --> 0:17:31.920
<v Speaker 2>not and you quoted those numbers. The reality is by

0:17:31.960 --> 0:17:33.360
<v Speaker 2>the time you look at it. I was just doing

0:17:33.400 --> 0:17:34.920
<v Speaker 2>a bit of analysis on the block the other day.

0:17:35.119 --> 0:17:38.359
<v Speaker 2>By the time you roll in the overnights plus seven

0:17:38.400 --> 0:17:43.639
<v Speaker 2>plus fourteen live and b VOD Live, bvod and be

0:17:43.960 --> 0:17:46.280
<v Speaker 2>proper catch up bevot, you're kind of back at one

0:17:46.280 --> 0:17:47.920
<v Speaker 2>point three to one point four that we were out

0:17:47.960 --> 0:17:51.199
<v Speaker 2>five years ago. So yeah, the difficult for us is

0:17:51.240 --> 0:17:53.680
<v Speaker 2>monetizing it over all WS platforms, But that's the story

0:17:53.920 --> 0:17:57.040
<v Speaker 2>question for another day. So I'm not worried about total audience.

0:17:57.280 --> 0:17:59.600
<v Speaker 2>So that's you know, the audiences are there for these things.

0:18:00.080 --> 0:18:03.440
<v Speaker 2>True reality is great for commercial networks because it's really

0:18:03.520 --> 0:18:05.600
<v Speaker 2>easy to make and contain and you know, because I

0:18:05.640 --> 0:18:06.920
<v Speaker 2>mean I used to get a content of the ABC.

0:18:07.160 --> 0:18:08.920
<v Speaker 2>We had a different chine of Real Night Jesus. That's

0:18:08.920 --> 0:18:12.240
<v Speaker 2>hard to manage and hard to promo. But by the

0:18:12.240 --> 0:18:14.639
<v Speaker 2>same turkele, we try and break that paradigm, you know,

0:18:14.720 --> 0:18:17.000
<v Speaker 2>we in the past at nine we've often tried to

0:18:17.200 --> 0:18:19.440
<v Speaker 2>move away fromship reality, and the audience have told us

0:18:19.760 --> 0:18:23.800
<v Speaker 2>completely unequivocally that they want shows that can carry them

0:18:23.840 --> 0:18:25.800
<v Speaker 2>over to or three nights a week. And who am

0:18:25.840 --> 0:18:27.080
<v Speaker 2>I to tell you? What does that card have?

0:18:27.480 --> 0:18:30.640
<v Speaker 1>Also really interesting is there's a real drawback I think

0:18:30.640 --> 0:18:32.359
<v Speaker 1>to Free to wear. When Maths and the Block is

0:18:32.359 --> 0:18:34.720
<v Speaker 1>on television. You are in a competitive market where the

0:18:34.720 --> 0:18:37.560
<v Speaker 1>streaming services are taking up eyes and ears, but Channel

0:18:37.640 --> 0:18:41.880
<v Speaker 1>nine has ownership over to very must watched and compelling

0:18:41.960 --> 0:18:45.040
<v Speaker 1>programs of the year that people have to come back

0:18:45.480 --> 0:18:48.480
<v Speaker 1>because that content isn't being seen. You know, is that

0:18:48.600 --> 0:18:51.280
<v Speaker 1>something that's consciously in your mind that you have to

0:18:51.320 --> 0:18:54.800
<v Speaker 1>create something these days to make compelling viewing to stop

0:18:54.840 --> 0:18:57.600
<v Speaker 1>people from going back to these or starting up at

0:18:57.600 --> 0:18:58.399
<v Speaker 1>a streaming service.

0:18:58.520 --> 0:19:01.040
<v Speaker 2>Well completely, But look what's happening with the Netflix share

0:19:01.040 --> 0:19:02.880
<v Speaker 2>price at the moment. You know, there's a there's been

0:19:02.960 --> 0:19:05.800
<v Speaker 2>four or five articles the last week about the streaming

0:19:05.840 --> 0:19:08.600
<v Speaker 2>bubbles first, and that's not true. The stream bubble hasn't

0:19:08.600 --> 0:19:11.080
<v Speaker 2>burst at all. And Stands going great guns and you

0:19:11.119 --> 0:19:13.840
<v Speaker 2>know you was in Gold just released and just been

0:19:14.200 --> 0:19:18.320
<v Speaker 2>They've got so much good content and they're moving. Netflix,

0:19:18.400 --> 0:19:21.480
<v Speaker 2>Paramount plus Stand are all moving into the kind of

0:19:21.520 --> 0:19:25.080
<v Speaker 2>areas where we are, you know, into in versions of

0:19:25.080 --> 0:19:27.080
<v Speaker 2>strip reality. They're doing it once a week.

0:19:27.400 --> 0:19:27.639
<v Speaker 3>You know.

0:19:28.040 --> 0:19:30.320
<v Speaker 2>RuPaul on Stand is a good example of that, is

0:19:30.400 --> 0:19:32.840
<v Speaker 2>ru Paul strip Reality. Yeah, it is it's knockout competition,

0:19:32.920 --> 0:19:35.840
<v Speaker 2>it's it's classics, stript reality. So the streamers are moving there.

0:19:36.480 --> 0:19:39.920
<v Speaker 2>I think, let me offer this. I might be completely wrong,

0:19:40.000 --> 0:19:43.560
<v Speaker 2>but this is certainly how I have observed it. People

0:19:43.960 --> 0:19:46.800
<v Speaker 2>at those junction points, So call it seven seven thirty week.

0:19:46.840 --> 0:19:50.000
<v Speaker 2>They're coming out of news, which frequently in Australia is

0:19:50.040 --> 0:19:53.720
<v Speaker 2>a massive national obsession as opposed to other countries where

0:19:53.720 --> 0:19:55.760
<v Speaker 2>it isn't so much. And then they move into our

0:19:55.800 --> 0:19:58.360
<v Speaker 2>seven thirty shows, which they tend to stay with over

0:19:58.400 --> 0:20:00.679
<v Speaker 2>the week, and then you know, the quarter to nine

0:20:00.680 --> 0:20:02.720
<v Speaker 2>and they then go to the streamers, at which point

0:20:02.720 --> 0:20:04.560
<v Speaker 2>they spend half an hour looking at the EPG and

0:20:04.560 --> 0:20:09.480
<v Speaker 2>then go to bed. So I think streaming to this

0:20:09.560 --> 0:20:11.920
<v Speaker 2>point anyway, streaming has been a very different consumption model.

0:20:12.040 --> 0:20:14.399
<v Speaker 2>I think if you go to streaming, you commit to

0:20:14.440 --> 0:20:17.800
<v Speaker 2>something and you watch something. I think with something like maths,

0:20:17.840 --> 0:20:19.920
<v Speaker 2>it's something where you can be sitting on the couch

0:20:19.920 --> 0:20:21.600
<v Speaker 2>watching it with your partner and one of your kids

0:20:21.640 --> 0:20:24.119
<v Speaker 2>can come past and be absorbed by fifteen minutes and

0:20:24.240 --> 0:20:27.159
<v Speaker 2>keep going, and you guys can talk about the relationship

0:20:27.160 --> 0:20:31.080
<v Speaker 2>and what's happening without missing some tiny nuance of a

0:20:31.160 --> 0:20:36.040
<v Speaker 2>morally ambiguous character in a streamed Netflix drama. So it's

0:20:36.040 --> 0:20:38.080
<v Speaker 2>a different I think Free Toware is still a different

0:20:38.119 --> 0:20:41.119
<v Speaker 2>consumption model. And we'll all find our place. It's a

0:20:41.119 --> 0:20:42.919
<v Speaker 2>matter of where that place is. You know, we've got

0:20:42.960 --> 0:20:45.280
<v Speaker 2>a couple of couple we've got we've got radio stations

0:20:45.280 --> 0:20:48.320
<v Speaker 2>and newspapers and you know newspapers the finn the City

0:20:48.320 --> 0:20:50.800
<v Speaker 2>Warning here or of the Age. They've absolutely found their

0:20:50.840 --> 0:20:55.880
<v Speaker 2>place in the media consumption environment. Three ow two GB

0:20:56.040 --> 0:20:59.800
<v Speaker 2>absolutely found their place, and Free Towear and the streamers

0:21:00.200 --> 0:21:02.720
<v Speaker 2>will also find their place. I reckon the hard thing

0:21:02.800 --> 0:21:05.240
<v Speaker 2>is if you're if you're just a TV network, that's

0:21:05.280 --> 0:21:06.600
<v Speaker 2>the I reckon, that's going to be one of the

0:21:06.600 --> 0:21:07.480
<v Speaker 2>hardest things in the world.

0:21:07.680 --> 0:21:09.960
<v Speaker 1>Oh absolutely, And just sort of to play back on

0:21:10.000 --> 0:21:12.879
<v Speaker 1>something you said. They're an observation from my behalf is

0:21:12.960 --> 0:21:16.160
<v Speaker 1>the nostalgia of wanting to watch something on the night

0:21:16.359 --> 0:21:19.000
<v Speaker 1>like Sunday night viewing. I mean, the block and maps

0:21:19.000 --> 0:21:23.280
<v Speaker 1>do so well and there's something very Australian family being

0:21:23.320 --> 0:21:26.479
<v Speaker 1>able to sit down and chew the fat over a

0:21:26.520 --> 0:21:29.600
<v Speaker 1>well made, glossy show on a Sunday night, and I

0:21:29.600 --> 0:21:33.440
<v Speaker 1>think that's something nine does better. Than I think anyone.

0:21:33.480 --> 0:21:35.200
<v Speaker 1>And I'm not just saying that because you're sitting there.

0:21:35.400 --> 0:21:37.920
<v Speaker 1>I know that because that's what people tell me, and

0:21:37.960 --> 0:21:38.720
<v Speaker 1>that's how I feel.

0:21:39.119 --> 0:21:41.720
<v Speaker 2>Thank you God, look at what Look I'll never tire

0:21:41.760 --> 0:21:44.160
<v Speaker 2>of hearing it. We do think that those shared experiences

0:21:44.200 --> 0:21:46.440
<v Speaker 2>are important and we all have them. Big Brother was

0:21:46.480 --> 0:21:48.200
<v Speaker 2>a great example of that. On a celebrity on Channel

0:21:48.240 --> 0:21:50.520
<v Speaker 2>ten is a great example of that. You know, the Voice,

0:21:50.600 --> 0:21:52.760
<v Speaker 2>not this last one that's just gone out, but the

0:21:53.200 --> 0:21:55.239
<v Speaker 2>voice of the Voice proper was a good example of that.

0:21:55.480 --> 0:21:58.800
<v Speaker 2>Those big things that happen live or as live that

0:21:58.840 --> 0:22:01.840
<v Speaker 2>everyone can talk about. And you know, when you create

0:22:01.880 --> 0:22:05.320
<v Speaker 2>those moments when you know everyone's talking about about mass

0:22:05.440 --> 0:22:09.000
<v Speaker 2>or you know everyone's talking about the block, it's just

0:22:09.119 --> 0:22:10.920
<v Speaker 2>as you know, for the people who work in television,

0:22:11.000 --> 0:22:12.479
<v Speaker 2>that's just that's what you want to achieve.

0:22:12.960 --> 0:22:15.720
<v Speaker 1>Last question for Maths for you was what were the

0:22:15.800 --> 0:22:19.080
<v Speaker 1>notes coming out of last season? Was there anything that

0:22:19.119 --> 0:22:21.000
<v Speaker 1>you guys wanted to do differently?

0:22:21.440 --> 0:22:24.000
<v Speaker 2>I think here, I think last year we saw we

0:22:24.040 --> 0:22:28.760
<v Speaker 2>saw the problems created. We've got one really polarizing character.

0:22:29.200 --> 0:22:33.080
<v Speaker 2>So we had bryceon Melissa, who the world saw them

0:22:33.080 --> 0:22:34.560
<v Speaker 2>as one thing and they didn't see them as that

0:22:34.600 --> 0:22:36.120
<v Speaker 2>at all, and we didn't see them as that at all,

0:22:36.320 --> 0:22:38.200
<v Speaker 2>and the world sort of saw him as gas lighting

0:22:38.280 --> 0:22:41.600
<v Speaker 2>or and mistreating or actually on the inside, what we

0:22:41.640 --> 0:22:44.320
<v Speaker 2>saw and what they felt, and you'll note that you

0:22:44.359 --> 0:22:46.840
<v Speaker 2>know they've got twins and are getting married, what they

0:22:46.920 --> 0:22:50.439
<v Speaker 2>felt on the inside was a rated It was very

0:22:50.480 --> 0:22:54.359
<v Speaker 2>much founded on genuine love and respect. But it became

0:22:54.640 --> 0:22:57.520
<v Speaker 2>so polarizing in the show that it sort of sucked

0:22:57.520 --> 0:22:59.000
<v Speaker 2>a lot of the energy out of the other things,

0:22:59.000 --> 0:23:01.639
<v Speaker 2>the other issues in the show. And every show should

0:23:01.640 --> 0:23:05.520
<v Speaker 2>be layered, you know, it should multiple issues, multiple characters

0:23:05.560 --> 0:23:07.879
<v Speaker 2>you like, multiple characters you dislike. But in the end,

0:23:07.920 --> 0:23:11.440
<v Speaker 2>it all kind of coalesced around around Bryce, and that

0:23:11.480 --> 0:23:13.239
<v Speaker 2>was particularly wasn't good for the show. It wasn't good

0:23:13.240 --> 0:23:14.280
<v Speaker 2>for him and Melissa.

0:23:14.480 --> 0:23:16.359
<v Speaker 1>Well, I think that's good notes going into it. So

0:23:16.520 --> 0:23:17.960
<v Speaker 1>you know, you just make sure that you cast a

0:23:18.000 --> 0:23:21.520
<v Speaker 1>thousand Bryce's or you know, how do you what.

0:23:21.440 --> 0:23:23.320
<v Speaker 2>Are you going to do? Well, No, you don't know

0:23:23.320 --> 0:23:25.199
<v Speaker 2>if that's going to happen, don't We never knew that

0:23:25.280 --> 0:23:27.080
<v Speaker 2>was going to happen. We didn't. Well, in fact, we

0:23:27.400 --> 0:23:28.840
<v Speaker 2>never thought that was going to happen. Bryce was one

0:23:28.880 --> 0:23:31.400
<v Speaker 2>of the laugh again, a great example of someone one

0:23:31.400 --> 0:23:34.880
<v Speaker 2>of the last people we cast. We thought Melissa was fantastic.

0:23:35.160 --> 0:23:37.560
<v Speaker 2>Bryce and Melissa were a great match, so we kind

0:23:37.560 --> 0:23:40.240
<v Speaker 2>of went okay. Bryce was a radio guy actually, and

0:23:40.640 --> 0:23:42.280
<v Speaker 2>and you know, we tend to avoid people in the

0:23:42.320 --> 0:23:45.600
<v Speaker 2>media because they're too trained and they're too well, boy,

0:23:45.640 --> 0:23:47.360
<v Speaker 2>do we get that wrong. We thought he'd be too

0:23:47.600 --> 0:23:50.360
<v Speaker 2>he'd be too aware to self aware. Well, in fact,

0:23:50.400 --> 0:23:52.119
<v Speaker 2>exactly the opposite was true when he became the biggest

0:23:52.160 --> 0:23:54.440
<v Speaker 2>character in the show. So you can't you can't plan

0:23:54.560 --> 0:23:56.159
<v Speaker 2>for that. So that's the note that came out of it.

0:23:56.359 --> 0:23:58.560
<v Speaker 2>How do we action that note? We cannot action that

0:23:58.600 --> 0:24:01.920
<v Speaker 2>note because God knows, I mean, I know this season

0:24:01.920 --> 0:24:04.920
<v Speaker 2>because we've you know, we've filmed it. So now we're

0:24:04.920 --> 0:24:06.720
<v Speaker 2>cutting it, now I'm seeing it. I'm probably up to

0:24:06.760 --> 0:24:10.000
<v Speaker 2>it fourteen or fifteen. We can't plan for that, and

0:24:10.040 --> 0:24:11.880
<v Speaker 2>that's the joy of the show has discussed earlier.

0:24:12.160 --> 0:24:14.800
<v Speaker 1>Well, I can tell you that I worked with Bryce

0:24:14.800 --> 0:24:17.439
<v Speaker 1>back in the day in radio a couple of times.

0:24:18.000 --> 0:24:20.119
<v Speaker 1>And if you called me and told me while you

0:24:20.160 --> 0:24:22.359
<v Speaker 1>were casting him, I could have pre warned you that

0:24:22.400 --> 0:24:24.119
<v Speaker 1>the show was going to blow up. But that is

0:24:24.160 --> 0:24:27.680
<v Speaker 1>a completely different story, and I will sidestep my way

0:24:27.680 --> 0:24:30.119
<v Speaker 1>around it because I don't think that my podcast is

0:24:30.119 --> 0:24:32.679
<v Speaker 1>about saying anything bad about someone who doesn't have a

0:24:32.720 --> 0:24:37.240
<v Speaker 1>place on the podcast to defend themselves. So instead, you know, instead,

0:24:37.240 --> 0:24:39.639
<v Speaker 1>I'll move on to my two quick questions about Channel

0:24:39.680 --> 0:24:42.280
<v Speaker 1>nine for the rest of the year. I absolutely loved

0:24:42.720 --> 0:24:45.360
<v Speaker 1>and always do love love Ireland. You know, I thought

0:24:45.440 --> 0:24:48.480
<v Speaker 1>last year was great, but I hope COVID permits us

0:24:48.520 --> 0:24:52.000
<v Speaker 1>being able to get back to a more exotic location.

0:24:52.359 --> 0:24:53.760
<v Speaker 1>I think that was the one.

0:24:53.560 --> 0:24:55.840
<v Speaker 2>Thing for me. And I also.

0:24:57.800 --> 0:24:59.840
<v Speaker 1>Look, I thought that the setting was beautiful and it

0:25:00.119 --> 0:25:04.239
<v Speaker 1>times it really worked. But there's something about you know,

0:25:04.359 --> 0:25:08.879
<v Speaker 1>Spain that really resonated on that show. It made Cassidy

0:25:09.240 --> 0:25:12.880
<v Speaker 1>crazy on that show and fun and palpable and relatable.

0:25:13.320 --> 0:25:13.480
<v Speaker 2>You know.

0:25:13.560 --> 0:25:18.280
<v Speaker 1>I think taking Australians completely into this really foreign territory worked.

0:25:18.560 --> 0:25:20.080
<v Speaker 2>And I also thought the twenty three.

0:25:20.280 --> 0:25:22.840
<v Speaker 1>And I think the twenty four hour turnaround was more

0:25:23.000 --> 0:25:25.880
<v Speaker 1>prevalent the last season to me, as much as I'm

0:25:25.880 --> 0:25:28.240
<v Speaker 1>sure Mavdikus and other people will tell me, they turned

0:25:28.240 --> 0:25:30.960
<v Speaker 1>it around as fast as they would do on real time,

0:25:31.040 --> 0:25:33.720
<v Speaker 1>et cetera. To me, I felt like the twenty four

0:25:33.600 --> 0:25:36.760
<v Speaker 1>our turnaround not being there is a bit of a punish.

0:25:36.880 --> 0:25:39.720
<v Speaker 2>So Big Brother.

0:25:41.280 --> 0:25:43.000
<v Speaker 1>The purest, a purest.

0:25:43.040 --> 0:25:47.359
<v Speaker 2>A purest of yours. I hear you. That's all I'm saying.

0:25:47.480 --> 0:25:50.880
<v Speaker 1>I hear you well because it's a loaded question, because there's.

0:25:50.680 --> 0:25:53.440
<v Speaker 2>A lot too. There is some wisdom in what you say.

0:25:53.960 --> 0:25:57.680
<v Speaker 1>I'll take it. And then Snack Masters and Parental Guidance.

0:25:58.040 --> 0:26:01.159
<v Speaker 1>Both of these shows to me was surprises because I

0:26:01.320 --> 0:26:04.000
<v Speaker 1>thoroughly enjoyed both of them and we don't know were

0:26:04.000 --> 0:26:05.840
<v Speaker 1>they going to be a part of Channel Lines lineup

0:26:05.880 --> 0:26:09.000
<v Speaker 1>in the back end of the year. What are your thoughts?

0:26:09.240 --> 0:26:10.600
<v Speaker 1>Can you tell me on a podcast?

0:26:10.680 --> 0:26:13.199
<v Speaker 2>We love both. We've loved both of them with our

0:26:13.240 --> 0:26:15.480
<v Speaker 2>great chase. You know, Stack Masses was made under the

0:26:15.520 --> 0:26:19.120
<v Speaker 2>most extraordinary conditions, like literally things being shut down around

0:26:19.200 --> 0:26:21.359
<v Speaker 2>us as we were making the show, like, you know,

0:26:21.400 --> 0:26:23.840
<v Speaker 2>police turning up trying to shut the set down, you know,

0:26:23.840 --> 0:26:27.679
<v Speaker 2>because of the whole COVID disaster. You know. The extraordinary

0:26:27.680 --> 0:26:31.520
<v Speaker 2>circumstances under which we got that show out was amazing.

0:26:31.600 --> 0:26:35.520
<v Speaker 2>Warner Brothers did an absolutely fabulous job on that. My

0:26:35.600 --> 0:26:37.359
<v Speaker 2>wife was the executive producers, so I would say that

0:26:37.400 --> 0:26:38.080
<v Speaker 2>wouldn't I But.

0:26:38.880 --> 0:26:40.520
<v Speaker 1>Is she in the background? By the way of doing

0:26:40.680 --> 0:26:41.000
<v Speaker 1>like I.

0:26:40.960 --> 0:26:44.360
<v Speaker 2>Said, I'm not saying anything. But it's a fabulous show.

0:26:45.880 --> 0:26:49.200
<v Speaker 2>There is no Believe me. I know that. I've hitched

0:26:49.240 --> 0:26:51.680
<v Speaker 2>my wagon too. That Rising Star. No, that was good.

0:26:51.720 --> 0:26:55.280
<v Speaker 2>And the chemistry between Poe and Scott Pickett, you know

0:26:55.440 --> 0:26:57.440
<v Speaker 2>you can't create that that again, that's one of those

0:26:57.440 --> 0:27:00.480
<v Speaker 2>things that you know, Post gotch is fabuls and Scott's

0:27:00.520 --> 0:27:03.720
<v Speaker 2>fabulous too. So and We've got a whole lot more

0:27:03.760 --> 0:27:07.880
<v Speaker 2>brilliant Australian snacks to get through, so you know, I'm

0:27:07.960 --> 0:27:12.080
<v Speaker 2>hoping we'll go again. But watch this space. It's a

0:27:12.119 --> 0:27:14.080
<v Speaker 2>great show. It's a great show, and it's one of

0:27:14.160 --> 0:27:16.919
<v Speaker 2>the very few examples of not having success in the

0:27:16.920 --> 0:27:18.760
<v Speaker 2>food genre. But it's a great show.

0:27:19.080 --> 0:27:21.919
<v Speaker 1>One of the things I liked about it was the

0:27:22.080 --> 0:27:26.040
<v Speaker 1>true channel line styling of a show. It felt really

0:27:26.520 --> 0:27:30.119
<v Speaker 1>beautiful to watch and I thoroughly enjoyed, especially in the

0:27:30.119 --> 0:27:33.280
<v Speaker 1>first episode with Hungry Jacks, just dipping back into our

0:27:33.359 --> 0:27:36.720
<v Speaker 1>Australian relationship with the product and the brand, just seeing

0:27:36.720 --> 0:27:39.840
<v Speaker 1>the terry tale shorts and people running around eating Hungry

0:27:39.920 --> 0:27:42.119
<v Speaker 1>Jacks back in the day and finding out about the

0:27:42.160 --> 0:27:44.679
<v Speaker 1>man himself behind it, you know, all in the history

0:27:44.720 --> 0:27:46.040
<v Speaker 1>I thought was really interesting.

0:27:46.520 --> 0:27:48.520
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I loved that. I loved all that retro stuff.

0:27:48.560 --> 0:27:50.720
<v Speaker 2>It was fantastic, you know, the old hungry Jacks ads

0:27:50.720 --> 0:27:55.320
<v Speaker 2>and oh got the misogyny and the haircuts and Brental Gardens,

0:27:55.720 --> 0:27:56.960
<v Speaker 2>which took a really big risk with that. That was

0:27:56.960 --> 0:27:59.840
<v Speaker 2>an internally developed format made by Melissa MacLean, who was

0:27:59.880 --> 0:28:03.800
<v Speaker 2>the e and we're really thrilled with it. We really

0:28:03.800 --> 0:28:08.720
<v Speaker 2>wanted to make something that kind of was really insightful

0:28:08.800 --> 0:28:13.200
<v Speaker 2>and really dealt with parenting in a really insightful way,

0:28:13.200 --> 0:28:16.680
<v Speaker 2>but where you saw real people doing it that wasn't

0:28:16.880 --> 0:28:21.320
<v Speaker 2>lectury or preachy or too sort of instructional. And that's

0:28:21.359 --> 0:28:23.080
<v Speaker 2>kind of where we That's the format we came up

0:28:23.119 --> 0:28:25.920
<v Speaker 2>with because you know, everyone judges everyone else's parenting style

0:28:26.280 --> 0:28:28.439
<v Speaker 2>and and we thought if we could we could find

0:28:28.880 --> 0:28:31.560
<v Speaker 2>the archetypes of each parenting style, but people who really

0:28:31.600 --> 0:28:34.960
<v Speaker 2>believed in their style, and then put them up against

0:28:35.000 --> 0:28:37.080
<v Speaker 2>each other, we'd get something really really interesting out of that.

0:28:37.400 --> 0:28:39.240
<v Speaker 2>And what Fast and I said to all of them

0:28:39.560 --> 0:28:41.360
<v Speaker 2>are as soon as they get on camera, they're just

0:28:41.360 --> 0:28:42.640
<v Speaker 2>going to do whatever they think is going to look

0:28:42.640 --> 0:28:45.680
<v Speaker 2>best on camera. How wrong I was. They stuck to

0:28:45.760 --> 0:28:48.520
<v Speaker 2>their parenting style guns from start to finish, and they

0:28:48.560 --> 0:28:51.720
<v Speaker 2>were absolutely true believe as a great parent IM and

0:28:51.760 --> 0:28:54.760
<v Speaker 2>they were absolutely true believers all the way through. And

0:28:55.160 --> 0:28:58.600
<v Speaker 2>the numbers were really good for it, and we're absolutely thrilled.

0:28:58.800 --> 0:29:00.640
<v Speaker 1>There was an entry point as well for like myself

0:29:00.640 --> 0:29:03.240
<v Speaker 1>who don't have children, which I thought was great because.

0:29:03.000 --> 0:29:04.800
<v Speaker 2>We've all been children. Then that was the theory.

0:29:05.160 --> 0:29:07.720
<v Speaker 1>I was going to say that you yeah, well, I'm

0:29:07.760 --> 0:29:09.400
<v Speaker 1>an adult child, I'm a man child.

0:29:09.680 --> 0:29:12.320
<v Speaker 2>I speak, you're even when you're a child. I was.

0:29:12.440 --> 0:29:14.760
<v Speaker 1>I was as a child, people said that I was

0:29:14.800 --> 0:29:17.040
<v Speaker 1>an old soul, you know. People were like, oh, that kid's,

0:29:17.080 --> 0:29:18.360
<v Speaker 1>you know, like an old soul. You can talk to

0:29:18.400 --> 0:29:20.880
<v Speaker 1>the adults. And then now that I'm an adult, people like, oh,

0:29:20.880 --> 0:29:24.600
<v Speaker 1>that guy's like a child. So I think it's if

0:29:24.600 --> 0:29:27.880
<v Speaker 1>I can maintain child curiosity, I think that's a good thing.

0:29:28.040 --> 0:29:29.640
<v Speaker 2>You're the Benjamin Button of your generation.

0:29:30.360 --> 0:29:33.080
<v Speaker 1>I'm raging in reverse. My last question to ask you,

0:29:33.240 --> 0:29:36.040
<v Speaker 1>which is something I ask everyone on the podcast, is

0:29:36.360 --> 0:29:38.400
<v Speaker 1>what is something from behind the scenes that were as

0:29:38.440 --> 0:29:41.360
<v Speaker 1>an audience did not see but would love to know

0:29:41.760 --> 0:29:44.800
<v Speaker 1>or appreciate from the behind the scenes of making this

0:29:44.840 --> 0:29:47.840
<v Speaker 1>season of Married at First Sight that we're currently watching.

0:29:47.600 --> 0:29:50.200
<v Speaker 2>Right, what will Tara let me tell you?

0:29:51.960 --> 0:29:54.600
<v Speaker 1>We won't tell her.

0:29:56.360 --> 0:29:59.040
<v Speaker 2>How do I put this? Okay? I offer you this

0:30:00.360 --> 0:30:03.800
<v Speaker 2>as men and women, not as TV producers, but as

0:30:03.840 --> 0:30:08.640
<v Speaker 2>men and women watching the show. Were very surprised. And

0:30:08.680 --> 0:30:11.360
<v Speaker 2>this is not just this season, but it was particular,

0:30:11.600 --> 0:30:14.720
<v Speaker 2>particularly the case of the season, how little there was

0:30:15.160 --> 0:30:19.320
<v Speaker 2>a sisterhood, how little the sisterhood was respected, and the

0:30:19.360 --> 0:30:22.840
<v Speaker 2>extent to which it was every woman for themselves. I

0:30:22.920 --> 0:30:24.760
<v Speaker 2>think that rather surprised us a little bit.

0:30:25.440 --> 0:30:27.680
<v Speaker 1>Is that a true representation though, of people like I

0:30:27.680 --> 0:30:28.520
<v Speaker 1>think it's really funny.

0:30:28.640 --> 0:30:32.200
<v Speaker 2>I don't know, it's extraordinary circumstances. You've got people with

0:30:32.280 --> 0:30:35.840
<v Speaker 2>cameras standing in your bedroom, so let's acknowledge it's television.

0:30:35.880 --> 0:30:38.600
<v Speaker 1>It's probably a deeper conversation to have. But I wonder

0:30:38.960 --> 0:30:41.360
<v Speaker 1>whether or not the lack of sisterhood that we see

0:30:41.360 --> 0:30:44.720
<v Speaker 1>these days between women has to do with the genders

0:30:44.840 --> 0:30:47.960
<v Speaker 1>and where we are in today's society.

0:30:48.200 --> 0:30:51.000
<v Speaker 2>I think men are yearning to be vulnerable and it's

0:30:51.040 --> 0:30:52.080
<v Speaker 2>not going very well for.

0:30:52.080 --> 0:30:55.160
<v Speaker 1>Them, But also I think women are wanting to not

0:30:55.240 --> 0:30:58.200
<v Speaker 1>be seen as being vulnerable, which as well as we

0:30:58.320 --> 0:31:00.360
<v Speaker 1>find our feet with that, as we want to find

0:31:00.360 --> 0:31:02.240
<v Speaker 1>our feet, not me, I'm speaking on behalf of all women,

0:31:02.360 --> 0:31:03.880
<v Speaker 1>which is a terrible thing to do and I'll probably

0:31:03.880 --> 0:31:06.920
<v Speaker 1>get canceled, but I think, you know, as women want

0:31:07.000 --> 0:31:10.440
<v Speaker 1>to be seen as more assertive and in control, it

0:31:10.480 --> 0:31:13.320
<v Speaker 1>can sometimes be misconstrued as being.

0:31:13.200 --> 0:31:15.040
<v Speaker 2>This and that's, and that's and that's, and you've got

0:31:15.080 --> 0:31:17.680
<v Speaker 2>to be very careful with that because I think they've

0:31:17.680 --> 0:31:19.360
<v Speaker 2>every right to be as certain of an in control

0:31:19.440 --> 0:31:21.840
<v Speaker 2>and actually I'm not and let me be clear, I'm

0:31:21.880 --> 0:31:26.240
<v Speaker 2>not saying that's in any way an issue here. You know.

0:31:26.480 --> 0:31:27.880
<v Speaker 2>The great thing about maths is one of the things

0:31:27.920 --> 0:31:31.160
<v Speaker 2>we've always been very clear on because you know, Tara

0:31:31.200 --> 0:31:33.320
<v Speaker 2>has been absolutely adamant about this, but it's it's it's

0:31:33.360 --> 0:31:36.040
<v Speaker 2>the fundamental part of the show. The people we cast

0:31:36.160 --> 0:31:38.440
<v Speaker 2>or a cross section of Australia, but we do look

0:31:38.520 --> 0:31:42.800
<v Speaker 2>for strong, strong and there's such appliche do you know

0:31:42.840 --> 0:31:45.000
<v Speaker 2>what I mean, Women who can thrive and stand up

0:31:45.000 --> 0:31:48.160
<v Speaker 2>for themselves in this environment and and you know, represent

0:31:48.800 --> 0:31:51.680
<v Speaker 2>what they bring to the show, their age, their ethnicity,

0:31:51.960 --> 0:31:56.120
<v Speaker 2>their background, their experience in a way that people like

0:31:56.200 --> 0:31:58.080
<v Speaker 2>and that that you know will work in the context

0:31:58.080 --> 0:31:58.640
<v Speaker 2>of television.

0:31:58.800 --> 0:32:00.880
<v Speaker 1>Well, I think it's a much broader conversation that we'd

0:32:00.920 --> 0:32:01.800
<v Speaker 1>need a lot more wine.

0:32:01.880 --> 0:32:05.440
<v Speaker 2>Sorry, yes, you want to a sourcy little anecdote, and instead

0:32:05.680 --> 0:32:08.000
<v Speaker 2>I gave you a great existential question. Sorry about that.

0:32:08.160 --> 0:32:10.160
<v Speaker 1>To be honest, that's more on brand for me than

0:32:10.200 --> 0:32:13.000
<v Speaker 1>probably getting something salacious out of you. But I will

0:32:13.040 --> 0:32:14.680
<v Speaker 1>say this to you just to finish off, and that

0:32:14.840 --> 0:32:17.520
<v Speaker 1>is you know, I had such a great time working

0:32:17.520 --> 0:32:20.280
<v Speaker 1>with Channel nine back in the day, so I want

0:32:20.280 --> 0:32:21.800
<v Speaker 1>to say thank you for that, and I for all

0:32:21.800 --> 0:32:24.480
<v Speaker 1>those people out there that think reality TV contestants probably

0:32:24.480 --> 0:32:27.680
<v Speaker 1>get chucked to the side. For me, I never felt that.

0:32:27.840 --> 0:32:31.040
<v Speaker 2>I'm pleased. And look, you know there are some people

0:32:31.040 --> 0:32:33.400
<v Speaker 2>you've maintained contact with others that you don't. It's never

0:32:33.440 --> 0:32:36.760
<v Speaker 2>a uniform experience for everyone. But you know, we're not

0:32:36.800 --> 0:32:39.000
<v Speaker 2>in the business of chewing people up and spitting them out.

0:32:39.240 --> 0:32:40.720
<v Speaker 2>You know, we want people to have a good experience,

0:32:40.720 --> 0:32:43.160
<v Speaker 2>and you know we want there's a lot of aftercare

0:32:43.200 --> 0:32:45.520
<v Speaker 2>that goes into our shows, but particularly when people like

0:32:45.560 --> 0:32:47.240
<v Speaker 2>you Ben, who had a talent in the show but

0:32:47.280 --> 0:32:49.120
<v Speaker 2>a talent, the transcend of the show. You know, I

0:32:49.200 --> 0:32:52.040
<v Speaker 2>have quite a few ongoing friendships from the shows we

0:32:52.120 --> 0:32:55.160
<v Speaker 2>make because as you can tell, and as if you said,

0:32:55.200 --> 0:32:56.960
<v Speaker 2>you've said a couple of times, we love the shows

0:32:57.080 --> 0:32:58.800
<v Speaker 2>and we love the people who participated in them. And

0:32:59.400 --> 0:33:00.880
<v Speaker 2>you know, it's a joy. It was a joy to

0:33:00.920 --> 0:33:03.560
<v Speaker 2>see your journey how you kind of came alive, and

0:33:03.680 --> 0:33:06.160
<v Speaker 2>you know how they showed commentated your proposal and everything.

0:33:06.160 --> 0:33:09.600
<v Speaker 2>But you know, to watch someone blossom in an environment

0:33:09.640 --> 0:33:12.040
<v Speaker 2>like television, that's also a great pleasure for us. But yes,

0:33:12.200 --> 0:33:14.840
<v Speaker 2>thank you ever saying that that that genuinely means a lot.

0:33:14.920 --> 0:33:17.560
<v Speaker 2>Thank you. We've had a good working relationship while we

0:33:17.560 --> 0:33:19.600
<v Speaker 2>were while we were on the show and in the

0:33:19.960 --> 0:33:23.000
<v Speaker 2>because you say, my god, the ten years since.

0:33:23.600 --> 0:33:24.320
<v Speaker 1>I can't believe it.

0:33:24.360 --> 0:33:26.160
<v Speaker 2>And congratulations on your career.

0:33:27.840 --> 0:33:31.960
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, well you know it's a work in progress. But

0:33:32.040 --> 0:33:33.840
<v Speaker 1>thank you so much. I mean, this was worse. It's

0:33:33.880 --> 0:33:34.800
<v Speaker 1>waiting gold for me.

0:33:35.120 --> 0:33:36.760
<v Speaker 2>Happy to help it. Always nice to see you.

0:33:37.440 --> 0:33:40.480
<v Speaker 1>Say hello to Caroline, tell her good luck with Celebrity

0:33:40.520 --> 0:33:42.560
<v Speaker 1>Apprentice this year. Loved it last year.

0:33:43.200 --> 0:33:45.200
<v Speaker 2>I'll be in the front, I say, on behalf of

0:33:45.200 --> 0:33:47.560
<v Speaker 2>my lovely wife who may or may not be hearing this.

0:33:47.640 --> 0:33:49.520
<v Speaker 2>It's a very very very good series.

0:33:49.760 --> 0:33:51.680
<v Speaker 1>Well, that is the best teas we've done through the

0:33:51.720 --> 0:33:55.320
<v Speaker 1>whole podcast, so we'll leave it there right Thanks Ben.