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Speaker 1: News time for the week that was, and Happy International

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Speaker 1: Women's Day as well. Joining us in the studio this

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Speaker 1: morning for the COLP. We've got Bill Yan. Good morning

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Speaker 1: to you, Bill.

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Speaker 2: Good morning Katie, and good morning to the top end

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Speaker 2: Live exactly.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, in person, it's good to have you in here

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Speaker 1: and well from the ABC this morning. He used to

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Speaker 1: join us as the NT news journalist, but now with

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Speaker 1: the ABC. Tom Morgan, great to have you in the studio.

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Speaker 3: I'm bad happy to have you.

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Speaker 1: What a week to debut, Absolutely it is. It's going

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Speaker 1: to be a busy one and we have indeed got

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Speaker 1: from the Labor Party the Minister for Police Brent Potter.

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Speaker 4: Good morning, morning Katie, and happy International Women's Day.

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Speaker 1: Thank you. Now, I tell you what, I don't think

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Speaker 1: we can start on any of the other issues this

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Speaker 1: morning until we do indeed address the situation that you

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Speaker 1: are in. Brent. I know that you apologized yesterday for

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Speaker 1: highly offensive posts that you shared on social media around

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Speaker 1: a decade ago and say that you won't be stepping

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Speaker 1: down now. You've come under fire with calls from within

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Speaker 1: with the outside. We've had different groups calling for you

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Speaker 1: to resign, but you are standing firm. What makes you

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Speaker 1: think you can survive at this point.

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Speaker 4: Well, I don't think it's up to the media to

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Speaker 4: ultimately dictate whether I stand down.

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Speaker 1: It is up to the public though, and they're utimately

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Speaker 1: holding me to account at the moment.

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Speaker 4: Just about to say it's up to the electorate to

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Speaker 4: vote me in or out in August, then they should

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Speaker 4: have that say, And ultimately it's up to the Chief

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Speaker 4: Minister and who serves in her cabinet. But like I

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Speaker 4: said yesterday, I've owned those mistakes. They were in my twenties.

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Speaker 4: People change, and the experiences that labor have given me

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Speaker 4: a term into and.

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Speaker 1: Today, look, I can't I can't pretend that I've probably

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Speaker 1: never said nor done anything stupid when I was in

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Speaker 1: my twenties. Saying racist things though, and bigoted making, you know,

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Speaker 1: sharing bigoted posts and sharing well inappropriate posts in so

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Speaker 1: many different ways. A lot would argue that if they

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Speaker 1: are your views, they are your views, whether you're in

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Speaker 1: your twenties or your thirties or your fifties.

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Speaker 4: But people change. If we if they're saying that they're

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Speaker 4: the same views I have now, well that's incorrect. I've

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Speaker 4: come out pretty clearly and said that they're not, and

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Speaker 4: I'm ashamed and embarrassed of those posts. And if I

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Speaker 4: could take them back and have the learnings that I

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Speaker 4: have now and tell my twenty year old self those well,

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Speaker 4: then I wouldn't have done that. But people change. That's

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Speaker 4: the whole reason. Really, people through prison, like people changed

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Speaker 4: you well, then getting older, leaving the profession that I

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Speaker 4: was in at the time, going and sitting at a

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Speaker 4: table with people with very different views to me. You know,

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Speaker 4: labor is a very big tree. It has varying different

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Speaker 4: views and sometimes I don't necessarily agree with everything, and

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Speaker 4: the same with other people in my caucus team don't

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Speaker 4: always agree with my point of view on pieces. But

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Speaker 4: you have those experiences, you learn and you grow, I

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Speaker 4: mean having kids, taking on two step daughters, getting married

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Speaker 4: and getting older.

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Speaker 1: Ultimately, I guess the argument with people change is that

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Speaker 1: there's so many you know, there's going to be so

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Speaker 1: many different groups coming out. You're now going, well, if

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Speaker 1: people change, you know, then why are you still attacking

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Speaker 1: the CELP over things that they've done ten years ago?

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Speaker 1: You know why you were attacking and alls who've maybe

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Speaker 1: done something six months ago. There's there's all these sort

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Speaker 1: of ways that that argument can really be poked at.

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Speaker 4: Well. I think some of those things you raised there

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Speaker 4: are very different to what I've posted or been involved in.

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Speaker 4: I think political parties fundamentally hold a position that doesn't

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Speaker 4: necessarily change whether the people in the party are there

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Speaker 4: or not. That's why they're that they're conservative or they're

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Speaker 4: they're non conservative. That doesn't fundamentally change. That's why they're

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Speaker 4: the party. But ultimately, people individually change.

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Speaker 1: Some of your views that you have shared seen more

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Speaker 1: in line with bills, you know, or with the colps

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Speaker 1: maybe than what.

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Speaker 4: Keep coming out and.

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Speaker 1: See. That's they're the ones that I meet, you know,

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Speaker 1: ones where you've had a crack at Dan Andrews, ones

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Speaker 1: where you've you know, there was commentary around sharing the

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Speaker 1: sharing of and Andrew bolt story that then you'd said,

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Speaker 1: I'm just going to leave this here.

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Speaker 4: So what I would say, Katie, I've made I've never

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Speaker 4: hidden it from my constituents, so we talk. I've been

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Speaker 4: essentialist my whole life. I've never grown up in a party.

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Speaker 4: I didn't start off in young labor, a young liberal

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Speaker 4: like many politicians you see across the nation. I got

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Speaker 4: into politics later in life. Never expecting to get into politics.

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Speaker 4: Some of my views are still central, but there are

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Speaker 4: views that I hold that are left and my constituents

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Speaker 4: know that because we will have discussions on the doors.

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Speaker 4: That some people would call me a lefty. That's fine,

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Speaker 4: but I'm not. I'm definitely not aligning myself with the

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Speaker 4: COLP that I would say is more national nationals than

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Speaker 4: they are liberal, and I think that's the problem why

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Speaker 4: they're in the positions out.

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Speaker 5: You say there that you've been a centrist all your life,

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Speaker 5: but some of those posts that you put out there

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Speaker 5: are quite clearly far right. You quoted a Nazi general

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Speaker 5: in one of those posts, or you really shared a

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Speaker 5: post from a Nazi general. So have you been a

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Speaker 5: centrist all your life?

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Speaker 4: So that that particular post needs to be put in

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Speaker 4: context of the time. And your listeners aren't going to

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Speaker 4: understand this because they've not served in the military, they're

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Speaker 4: not a tank of something. But for me, that no,

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Speaker 4: I'm going to explain it because it does need to

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Speaker 4: be brought out the comment that person has made. Put

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Speaker 4: that into business context without any direction, go and find

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Speaker 4: something to fix. Yes, I understand for people looking outside

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Speaker 4: is distasteful, but it is a famous quote that many

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Speaker 4: militaries base themselves off of. So putting it in context,

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Speaker 4: I'm the only one and a few people in defense

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Speaker 4: will understand the context of it. I understand outside of context,

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Speaker 4: it is distasteful for many people.

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Speaker 2: We've got to look at context here in the broader picture. Look, look, Brent,

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Speaker 2: you came out and said that, and particularly when racism

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Speaker 2: was raised in that inquest last week, straightaway out there

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Speaker 2: with the Police Minister calling for an investigation to racism

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Speaker 2: in police and then we've got the Chief minits so

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Speaker 2: saying that racism online is cowardly. And then the next

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Speaker 2: day here we are we're talking about you promoting racism

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Speaker 2: through Facebook, but the Chief minis are saying, well, she's

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Speaker 2: just going to support you, and you're saying that people

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Speaker 2: have taken it out of context. Look, that really does

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Speaker 2: smack up a lot of hypiocracy, because if a police

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Speaker 2: officer did the same thing, they'd be up for discipline reaction.

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Speaker 2: If anyone in a public sector I know this and

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Speaker 2: I've seen it, I'm in the public sector had have

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Speaker 2: done this, they would be facing discipline reaction.

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Speaker 4: And may lose their job.

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Speaker 1: So it's a very good point.

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Speaker 4: So these different rules, and was there a different rule

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Speaker 4: for somebody else.

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Speaker 5: Allegations that go to police and are subject to this

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Speaker 5: review happened ten eleven years ago. So are those officers

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Speaker 5: who are going to be subject to that review who

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Speaker 5: have allegations against them going to just say, well, I'm

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Speaker 5: a changed person now and that's o cash.

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Speaker 4: Just let me answer two pieces. So the first one

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Speaker 4: you raise there is actually incorrect.

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Speaker 1: Bill.

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Speaker 4: I never called for the review. I supported the commissioner.

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Speaker 4: So I know the front page they said I instigated

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Speaker 4: the review. I did not that.

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Speaker 1: I think we're there. I think we're really picking up

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Speaker 1: what I want to see. Because the fact is you

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Speaker 1: do support.

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Speaker 4: That review, and the point from you, I absolutely support

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Speaker 4: him in doing that review. And the same with all

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Speaker 4: of my stuff being there, there will be people that

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Speaker 4: will make decisions on that. The chief ministers had to

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Speaker 4: look at those posts.

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Speaker 1: Besides an internal review that buy the chief minister rather

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Speaker 1: than any sort of anything further in terms of any

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Speaker 1: kind of discipline reaction for you. So the point Bill's

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Speaker 1: making is that the police officers they don't have, you know,

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Speaker 1: they don't have that same luxury that you've got right.

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Speaker 4: Now, if their stuff was made outside of the force

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Speaker 4: when they weren't serving in a uniform, and it was

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Speaker 4: all before they ever joined. That's the point I'm making

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Speaker 4: that you can't hold someone accountable for doing something before

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Speaker 4: they went to an employment and then try and say, well,

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Speaker 4: you've done this before like that would go straight to

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Speaker 4: fair work. Like if that in many instances, if you

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Speaker 4: were to remove someone on the premise beforehand, like that

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Speaker 4: would be contestable.

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Speaker 1: But could the defense now be well, I'm a changed person.

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Speaker 1: You know what's happened to me in the last ten years.

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Speaker 1: I've changed.

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Speaker 4: And I think the stuff that's happened with the commissioner,

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Speaker 4: he's agnowledged that, like he's the stuff that they're talking

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Speaker 4: about happened twenty odd years ago. He's absolutely a different person.

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Speaker 4: And I've said to him before, and I made this

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Speaker 4: point in media yesterday. The discipline system within the police

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Speaker 4: that we're trying to change is not one that is

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Speaker 4: punitive and removes people, but one way we acknowledge our

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Speaker 4: mistakes like I did yesterday, and we offer people the

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Speaker 4: opportunity to be to retraining, change and then continue to serve.

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Speaker 4: Because if we are going to go straight to a

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Speaker 4: punitive measure within the police force. We'll see what happened

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Speaker 4: during the COVID period. People were terminated I think unfairly

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Speaker 4: in many, you know, and they weren't given the opportunity

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Speaker 4: to change, and we lose numbers. So I get people's point.

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Speaker 4: I've gone out there in front of the cameras and

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Speaker 4: answered this answer to the territoriins I will answer it

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Speaker 4: to my electorate. I'm not proud of it. It's not

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Speaker 4: who I am now. I can't change what has happened.

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Speaker 5: I do wonder with the defense that you are running

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Speaker 5: about this about you know, you're a person in the

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Speaker 5: ADF and the culture within the ADF was was sort

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Speaker 5: of guiding me toward these views, whether that does risk

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Speaker 5: marginalizing or angering a lot of the veteran community and

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Speaker 5: the NT because we've had people members of Parliament come

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Speaker 5: out and say that their constituents have been in touch

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Speaker 5: had been quite unhappy.

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Speaker 3: Katie. I know that you've had people reach out and.

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Speaker 5: Luke Gosling, who's a veteran himself, and now that the

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Speaker 5: Labor member for Solomon, which of course covers dah And

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Speaker 5: said in a statement to the ABC last night, that

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Speaker 5: he felt that. He basically said he didn't want people

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Speaker 5: to think that the adf reflected those views at all.

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Speaker 4: I just wonder I didn't say that it was the adfly,

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Speaker 4: but you.

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Speaker 1: Said that you posted that because it was in context,

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Speaker 1: because you were part of.

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Speaker 4: A trying to justify it.

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Speaker 2: If I had have done stuff like that, trying to

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Speaker 2: justify my work with corrections as an excuse for posting

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Speaker 2: stuff like that, I'm sorry, mate.

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Speaker 4: It doesn't cut the muster with me. It may not

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Speaker 4: cut the muster with you, Bill, but you're not the

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Speaker 4: voter that I have to go in front in my

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Speaker 4: electric What I would say is that particular post of

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Speaker 4: vermin Irwin Rommel. We can't change the history. He is

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Speaker 4: a famous general that is many times quoted as supporting

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Speaker 4: Australian soldiers and having an admiration for them. I'm not

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Speaker 4: proud of this stuff I shared at the time, but

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Speaker 4: a lot of the theory is without the context.

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Speaker 5: It is just one of the posts though, which had

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Speaker 5: you know, homophobic slurs.

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Speaker 3: They had the.

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Speaker 1: End word that was shared. It was a casual kind

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Speaker 1: of casual.

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Speaker 2: Well, I'm sorry, but it shows, honestly, it shows a

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Speaker 2: pattern of immaturity at some level those posts. If you

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Speaker 2: look at the in the overall scheme of things, and

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Speaker 2: some of those just as recently as two thousand nineties,

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Speaker 2: it's long, not as long as ten years ago. This

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Speaker 2: stuff is reasonably recent.

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Speaker 4: The news articles that have been shared are yes twenty

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Speaker 4: nineteen from news outlets and sources. And I've not made

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Speaker 4: any comments in there that I believe that we're geography

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Speaker 4: to people this stuff, and I've acknowledged the staff that

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Speaker 4: I've shared that has offended people. I can't do anything

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Speaker 4: more than that, and ultimately, I'll be accountable to the

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Speaker 4: constituents on the doors and for the front line. When

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Speaker 4: I go and meet the police officers that I will

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Speaker 4: be doing over the next couple of weeks, I'll be

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Speaker 4: accountable to them.

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Speaker 1: Are you worried about how they're going to actually how

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Speaker 1: they're going to receive you based on some of what

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Speaker 1: you've said and based on the situation that you know

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Speaker 1: that they're in throughout this coronial inquest, which is absolutely

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Speaker 1: fair enough and adequate, But are you worried that they

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Speaker 1: are going to really see this as double standards?

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Speaker 4: Well, I've got to explain that to them. I think

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Speaker 4: some people will see that. I think some people won't.

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Speaker 4: I've had mixed opinions from people. I went out today,

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Speaker 4: did my normal job, I doing a Friday the Lollipop

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Speaker 4: had mixed opinions from people there. And I've had mixed

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Speaker 4: opinions from veterans. Not all veterans necessarily I will agree

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Speaker 4: with me, because that's fair. We're not everyone in every

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Speaker 4: organization is the same of you. But there have been

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Speaker 4: others that have reached out and said, you know, I'm

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Speaker 4: supporting for what you're saying, and I can understand the

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Speaker 4: context of the environment you're talking about. I'm not condoning

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Speaker 4: what they're saying. I'm just saying that's the feedback.

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Speaker 5: So how old were you in twenty thirteen and twenty

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Speaker 5: sixteen when some of these posts were made, Because.

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Speaker 4: I'm thirty six now, so twenty fifteen or twenty three,

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Speaker 4: twenty four, twenty two in some instances, Yeah, I just

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Speaker 4: say that, not making excuses of it. But some people

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Speaker 4: understand this. So I'd come back from eleven months of

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Speaker 4: my tour through Afghanistan and my view of the world

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Speaker 4: was different, not making like I don't have PTSD like

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Speaker 4: many other people have from their service or not that

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Speaker 4: I know of, but it definitely changes you and you

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Speaker 4: have a different view of the world after a period

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Speaker 4: of time from that, and it takes people time to

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Speaker 4: reassimilate back in. That is one of the things that

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Speaker 4: have come out from the Royal Commission that we are

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Speaker 4: not our assimilation process is different to others.

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Speaker 1: So can you tell me who within the Labour Party

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Speaker 1: knew that these posts existed?

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Speaker 4: Like I said yesterday, when I went through the pre

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Speaker 4: selection process, the chiefments of the time had and I

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Speaker 4: had a discussion over our post and some of those

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Speaker 4: posts were only one who knew. There was other members

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Speaker 4: of the now cabinet that had seen some of the

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Speaker 4: posts and when I was discussing it with them, and.

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Speaker 1: What about the actual party, Well that.

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Speaker 4: The vetting posts goes through the party as well, so

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Speaker 4: they did not There is people like not every member

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Speaker 4: knows because not every members involved, well they know they

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Speaker 4: had access to my Facebook. So people there were members

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Speaker 4: that had access to my Facebook. Some of these posts

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Speaker 4: were brought up at the time and I said, there'll

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Speaker 4: be Like I said yesterday, there's probably more posts that

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Speaker 4: this individual has screenshot. What they haven't screenshot though, they've

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Speaker 4: only screenshoted a particular set of posts to portray a

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Speaker 4: particular view. There are other posts on there that would

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Speaker 4: lead me to people to say, well that's a left view,

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Speaker 4: and they've not screenshot those because they don't meet them.

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Speaker 1: Kind of left views. Did you share well?

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Speaker 4: Like I shared with AB, I would have shared ABC

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Speaker 4: and SPS stuff that I can tell you right now.

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Speaker 1: About Tom.

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Speaker 3: Thanks for the free plub.

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Speaker 2: I'm sure I've shared some stuff from Tom, but I

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Speaker 2: supposed to flab and you about this stuff.

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Speaker 4: It goes to the moral compass of Labor.

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Speaker 5: Lord.

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Speaker 4: We've seen so much stuff in the last twelve months,

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Speaker 4: two years which really.

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Speaker 1: Questions the thing I've got to say. The thing that

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Speaker 1: I have to say that I see very often actually

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Speaker 1: from the Labor Party is slinging mud at other people

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Speaker 1: and calling people racists and saying that they don't support

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Speaker 1: race based policy, getting incredibly angered if questions are asked

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Speaker 1: that that may be you know, they deem sexist or

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Speaker 1: that they deem a certain way. So I think the

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Speaker 1: thing is, if you're going to be slinging mud at

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Speaker 1: other people, then they have to be prepared that they

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Speaker 1: need to make sure that you know that everything's clean

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Speaker 1: and that they're not in that situation.

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Speaker 4: To imagine a hum and cry from labor if this

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Speaker 4: was a sealed p MA.

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Speaker 1: That's exactly right.

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Speaker 4: Two points I don't think, and I'm happy to be corrected.

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Speaker 4: I don't think I've ever called and yelled out and

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Speaker 4: called anyone in the CLP in the instance you're talking

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Speaker 4: about as racist, and usually that I said, we are abroad,

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Speaker 4: we are a broad party. We hold very we don't

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Speaker 4: all necessarily ligne to the one view which want to

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Speaker 4: make it clear because I'm I understand I'm in the

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Speaker 4: spotlight and I'm owning that now. But I and they

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Speaker 4: didn't yell across the room and you know, called Joe Hersey.

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Speaker 4: What others may have for what I would share in

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Speaker 4: the Chief ministry. For what I would say is that

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Speaker 4: I'm almost certain that everyone in there will have stuff

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Speaker 4: that they regret in their twenties. And I understand that

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Speaker 4: it's easy, it's a political win right now for the CLP,

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Speaker 4: but I'm also fairing conferdenced.

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Speaker 1: I think it's a bit of an it's an own goal,

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Speaker 1: but hold on.

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Speaker 4: What I would say is I'm sure that I'm not

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Speaker 4: going to be the only person from from my twenties

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Speaker 4: now politicians coming forward that will have a digital footprint.

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Speaker 5: Well, this is just like for the in the broader

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Speaker 5: context of what's coming up with the election, these posts

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Speaker 5: and this revelation really does damage Labour's ability to campaign

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Speaker 5: on some of those issues that you know, we've had

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Speaker 5: people in Labor come out and quite forcefully attack the

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Speaker 5: CLP on and that comes after of course the whole

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Speaker 5: Shares fiasco with Chancey who remains in posts, but also

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Speaker 5: Natasha files and that is transparency and accountability which Michael

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Speaker 5: Gunner famously ran on in twenty sixteen.

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Speaker 3: Those core planks of Labour's.

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Speaker 5: Election campaign for twenty twenty four are now very very

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Speaker 5: very shaky.

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Speaker 4: Wouldn't transparency and accountability be when something like this comes out,

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Speaker 4: you go in front of it, you own it, you

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Speaker 4: make yourself.

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Speaker 1: You only came out because it ended up in The.

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Speaker 5: Minister doesn't come out and talked about this. But Chancey

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Speaker 5: Paker hasn't come out and address the media since that

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Speaker 5: one press conference for you.

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Speaker 1: For the reaction well the Shares, he's not been open.

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Speaker 4: But also the question is do you The question I

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Speaker 4: have though is do we go and any candidate comes up,

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Speaker 4: go here is my Facebook public, Go and have a

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Speaker 4: look at my full Facebook. Is that how we get

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Speaker 4: around this in the future, But give you access to

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Speaker 4: mine tomorrow. Mate. It's pretty well on boring. I know

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Speaker 4: you guys have cleared yours as well, so let's just

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Speaker 4: be really clear on that. But how far do we

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Speaker 4: take this? Because I think at the end of the day,

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Speaker 4: and I'm owning my mistakes, I've come out.

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Speaker 1: I think that's a fair question.

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Speaker 4: I've owned my mistakes. But let's put in context and

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Speaker 4: I'm not slinging mad because you guys will do what

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Speaker 4: you want to do. But it took you six days

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Speaker 4: to get your opposition leader to come out. It took

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Speaker 4: six days for Josh to Rey to pre prepared statement

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Speaker 4: and not answer a question. What I'm saying is we don't.

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Speaker 1: I think it's an iffy time to be if you're

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Speaker 1: two very.

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Speaker 4: Different talking about integrity and accountability. It is coming out

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Speaker 4: when something is all right.

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Speaker 1: What did I want to ask you?

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Speaker 4: What?

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Speaker 1: And look, well, Chancey Pakes made it very clear in

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Speaker 1: the past that he's never going to reveal things that

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Speaker 1: happened in cabinet. But what was the reaction from some

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Speaker 1: of those cabinet members. Were they pretty pissed off with you?

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Speaker 4: Or I can say it from more of a caucus

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Speaker 4: point of view. I'm not going to talk about cabinet discussions.

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Speaker 4: Obviously we go around the table, everyone gets to have

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Speaker 4: their discussion. They're disappointed by the comments, as you would be,

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Speaker 4: as I am. As I'm embarrassed how this has brought

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Speaker 4: my wife and family into it, which I think, you know,

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Speaker 4: anyone would appreciate. She's not in the public limelight, and

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Speaker 4: she shouldn't be in the public limelight. But you know,

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Speaker 4: they all acknowledge that the person they've met since November

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Speaker 4: twenty twenty is not the person that I was in

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Speaker 4: my twenties, and so I think we all people change,

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Speaker 4: and if we can't acknowledge that as a society, I

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Speaker 4: think it's an indictment of where we're going.

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Speaker 1: I mean, what do you say to any of those

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Speaker 1: people that are listening this morning though that are going

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Speaker 1: I just don't buy it, you know, I don't. I

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Speaker 1: don't think you've changed. You know, they don't believe you

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Speaker 1: at this point. What do you say to them?

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Speaker 4: I can't do anything more than say what I've said,

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Speaker 4: and them have to come. And if my door's always open,

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Speaker 4: I'm there every Saturday at the markets. I do lollipop

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Speaker 4: on a Friday, like people can come and see me.

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Speaker 4: I can't, as I said, so I can't change what's

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Speaker 4: been done. And if I knew what I knew now,

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Speaker 4: you'd go back in time and you'd say to yourself,

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Speaker 4: will don't be a dick ed look ultimately, and I

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Speaker 4: know that people go it's a throwaway line, but that's

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Speaker 4: what I was. That was my vice was being stupid

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Speaker 4: on Facebook.

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Speaker 1: All right, we are going to take a quick break

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Speaker 1: because there is a lot to cover off this morning,

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Speaker 1: and there's a lot of issues that are impacting territories

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Speaker 1: every single day. So I'm going to get to those

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Speaker 1: in just a couple of moments. You are listening to

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Speaker 1: Mix one oh four nine. It is the week that was.

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Speaker 1: You've just joined us this morning in the studio. We

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Speaker 1: have got the Minister for Police, Brent Potter, We've got

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Speaker 1: Tom Morgan from the ABC, and we've got Billion from DCLP. Well. Overnight,

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Speaker 1: in some terrible news, a man has died in Alice

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Speaker 1: Springs after a stolen car crashed in the CBD. It's

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Speaker 1: alleged the car was stolen from Ross at about two

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Speaker 1: am I believe, enrolled at three point forty in the

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Speaker 1: morning with one person thrown from that vehicle. The eighteen

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Speaker 1: year old was rushed to hospital but passed away. Police

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Speaker 1: telling the ABC that eight others were in that car

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Speaker 1: who fled the scene, which was captured on CCTV. I

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Speaker 1: think we've all been very much wondering when something terrible

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Speaker 1: like this was going to happen. And it's not the

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Speaker 1: first time, but once again a terrible situation.

439
00:18:42,520 --> 00:18:45,520
Speaker 4: Yeah, it's really tragic and tragic for our town.

440
00:18:45,600 --> 00:18:48,760
Speaker 2: But so many of us have been saying that since

441
00:18:49,359 --> 00:18:52,000
Speaker 2: the fatality on the main insection of town, a stolen

442
00:18:52,040 --> 00:18:54,199
Speaker 2: car with kids in it, run a red lot and

443
00:18:54,320 --> 00:18:56,240
Speaker 2: kill a man on a motorslager. Then we had another

444
00:18:56,280 --> 00:18:58,560
Speaker 2: guy hit in the eye with a rock and he

445
00:18:58,680 --> 00:19:00,919
Speaker 2: was driving a truck and luck that didn't end up

446
00:19:00,920 --> 00:19:01,680
Speaker 2: as a fatality.

447
00:19:02,240 --> 00:19:04,840
Speaker 4: So many of us for so many years now been.

448
00:19:04,720 --> 00:19:09,159
Speaker 2: Saying the mayor, Josh myself, I think even marrying Scrimjaw

449
00:19:09,880 --> 00:19:12,000
Speaker 2: called this out as well some time ago.

450
00:19:12,400 --> 00:19:13,879
Speaker 4: There was only a matter of time and.

451
00:19:16,160 --> 00:19:19,120
Speaker 2: Was this death preventable if we were If we're doing

452
00:19:19,200 --> 00:19:21,520
Speaker 2: what we're supposed to be doing as far as dealing

453
00:19:21,560 --> 00:19:23,720
Speaker 2: with people are out there stealing cars and stuff like that,

454
00:19:24,000 --> 00:19:25,879
Speaker 2: it might have been It's a really like it's a

455
00:19:25,880 --> 00:19:28,160
Speaker 2: bit of a far stretch to call that. But if

456
00:19:28,160 --> 00:19:30,240
Speaker 2: we were dealing with these people are out there stealing

457
00:19:30,240 --> 00:19:32,280
Speaker 2: cars and stopping them from doing it, then this may

458
00:19:32,320 --> 00:19:34,520
Speaker 2: not have happened. So this is a tragedy for this

459
00:19:34,600 --> 00:19:38,080
Speaker 2: young person's family and it's going to have rippling effects

460
00:19:38,200 --> 00:19:41,320
Speaker 2: right across our community now. But we've got to do

461
00:19:41,359 --> 00:19:43,800
Speaker 2: something about We can't. We've been saying this for so

462
00:19:43,840 --> 00:19:45,880
Speaker 2: long unless we do something about it, it was going

463
00:19:45,920 --> 00:19:49,040
Speaker 2: to happen, and sadly it has happened. The government really

464
00:19:49,119 --> 00:19:52,320
Speaker 2: now needs to step up and start taking some positive

465
00:19:52,320 --> 00:19:55,280
Speaker 2: action to stop this from probably happening again, and next

466
00:19:55,359 --> 00:19:57,919
Speaker 2: time it might be another innocent bystander who becomes the

467
00:19:58,400 --> 00:19:58,760
Speaker 2: Can you.

468
00:19:58,680 --> 00:20:00,679
Speaker 1: Paint a bit of a picture for our listeners in

469
00:20:00,800 --> 00:20:03,880
Speaker 1: terms of some of the behavior that does go on

470
00:20:04,200 --> 00:20:07,359
Speaker 1: in our springs overnight, because we see it very often,

471
00:20:07,400 --> 00:20:09,679
Speaker 1: Like you look on pages like action Fraulus or you

472
00:20:09,720 --> 00:20:12,280
Speaker 1: see the reports at different times that it seems very

473
00:20:12,320 --> 00:20:15,520
Speaker 1: often that vehicles are being stolen and driven around in

474
00:20:15,560 --> 00:20:17,879
Speaker 1: a reckless, dangerous manner.

475
00:20:18,560 --> 00:20:21,240
Speaker 4: It's happening. It's happening all too often. Ca just about

476
00:20:21,240 --> 00:20:21,680
Speaker 4: every night.

477
00:20:21,960 --> 00:20:24,480
Speaker 2: I see it on the CCTV out at the front

478
00:20:24,480 --> 00:20:26,600
Speaker 2: of my office. You see people on a round about

479
00:20:26,640 --> 00:20:30,159
Speaker 2: doing crazy stuff. It's a regular occurrence. It was just

480
00:20:30,200 --> 00:20:31,720
Speaker 2: Wednesday night. I was off on my way to a

481
00:20:31,720 --> 00:20:34,159
Speaker 2: meeting or standing in a footpath talking to someone. A

482
00:20:34,200 --> 00:20:37,480
Speaker 2: group of kids like probably ten. One of them come

483
00:20:37,560 --> 00:20:39,600
Speaker 2: up and shoulder charge myself and the guy I was

484
00:20:39,640 --> 00:20:42,240
Speaker 2: talking to you standing on the footpath outside uncle's tabin,

485
00:20:42,359 --> 00:20:43,480
Speaker 2: and then he turned around.

486
00:20:43,200 --> 00:20:44,000
Speaker 4: Wanted to fighters.

487
00:20:44,320 --> 00:20:48,480
Speaker 2: And it's just like, really, I have to go on

488
00:20:49,160 --> 00:20:50,160
Speaker 2: every day.

489
00:20:51,080 --> 00:20:52,640
Speaker 4: It's crazy stuff.

490
00:20:53,720 --> 00:20:56,560
Speaker 5: Like I have family in our springs and they have

491
00:20:57,240 --> 00:20:59,959
Speaker 5: had stuff stolen, they've had break ins. I think maybe

492
00:20:59,840 --> 00:21:03,320
Speaker 5: people in Darwin don't realize how common it is in

493
00:21:03,440 --> 00:21:05,960
Speaker 5: Alice Springs, and maybe that's something that needs to be discussed.

494
00:21:06,000 --> 00:21:09,160
Speaker 5: And I've also had lots of people in the political

495
00:21:09,200 --> 00:21:11,199
Speaker 5: world say the same thing as you there, Bill, that

496
00:21:11,280 --> 00:21:13,679
Speaker 5: you know it was a matter of time they felt

497
00:21:14,160 --> 00:21:16,200
Speaker 5: before something like this happened. And it's a tragedy and

498
00:21:16,240 --> 00:21:18,760
Speaker 5: it's really sad and there will be people who are

499
00:21:19,160 --> 00:21:23,320
Speaker 5: mourning today, and that's a really sad fact about it. So, yeah,

500
00:21:23,320 --> 00:21:26,159
Speaker 5: the police have to do their job and investigate the

501
00:21:26,160 --> 00:21:28,680
Speaker 5: circumstances around this, but it is going to, I think,

502
00:21:28,720 --> 00:21:32,680
Speaker 5: really bring back up that debate around as you're saying that, Bill,

503
00:21:32,760 --> 00:21:34,600
Speaker 5: what needs to be done in this space?

504
00:21:34,680 --> 00:21:36,679
Speaker 4: Why the community start to normalize that? Though? It is

505
00:21:36,680 --> 00:21:38,560
Speaker 4: the big problem. When don't we.

506
00:21:38,600 --> 00:21:41,800
Speaker 2: Start to normalize some of the things we're seeing in town.

507
00:21:42,480 --> 00:21:44,280
Speaker 2: That shows a community that's in a bit of a

508
00:21:44,320 --> 00:21:46,760
Speaker 2: downward spiral because anyone who else comes to our town

509
00:21:46,760 --> 00:21:50,000
Speaker 2: and sees this stuff sees it as not normal and they.

510
00:21:49,840 --> 00:21:51,040
Speaker 4: Are quite confronted by it.

511
00:21:51,320 --> 00:21:53,160
Speaker 2: And the fact that a lot of our community see

512
00:21:53,200 --> 00:21:56,080
Speaker 2: some of this stuff as normal is a major issue

513
00:21:56,160 --> 00:21:58,520
Speaker 2: for us, and that's something that we have to turn around.

514
00:21:59,160 --> 00:22:01,760
Speaker 2: We need to change that NARVD because what we see

515
00:22:01,840 --> 00:22:03,399
Speaker 2: is normal. You go anywhere else it's not.

516
00:22:03,640 --> 00:22:06,120
Speaker 1: It's certainly not normal. I mean, Brent, it.

517
00:22:06,000 --> 00:22:07,800
Speaker 4: Would make it sound like it's very simple to fix.

518
00:22:08,280 --> 00:22:09,879
Speaker 4: Very the opening line you just said there was that

519
00:22:09,880 --> 00:22:11,399
Speaker 4: we need to get on top of this and stop

520
00:22:11,440 --> 00:22:13,480
Speaker 4: these people doing it. Well, I want to know what

521
00:22:13,560 --> 00:22:15,960
Speaker 4: they would do that would resolve the stolen cars. We've

522
00:22:15,960 --> 00:22:18,400
Speaker 4: put more police officers in our springs. We are converting

523
00:22:18,400 --> 00:22:21,679
Speaker 4: palis to constables to give greater constables in our springs.

524
00:22:22,080 --> 00:22:23,520
Speaker 4: We're going to talk to that in a second. Let

525
00:22:23,600 --> 00:22:26,200
Speaker 4: you talk, I let you talk without a single interruption.

526
00:22:26,240 --> 00:22:27,679
Speaker 4: So we're going to do that. We're going to be

527
00:22:27,840 --> 00:22:28,280
Speaker 4: all right.

528
00:22:28,200 --> 00:22:30,360
Speaker 1: Let's not explain to each other, let's just get into

529
00:22:30,400 --> 00:22:30,760
Speaker 1: the issue.

530
00:22:31,080 --> 00:22:34,840
Speaker 4: Ultimately, you can't continue to lock up youth because at

531
00:22:34,840 --> 00:22:36,160
Speaker 4: some point they will get out and if you don't

532
00:22:36,160 --> 00:22:38,479
Speaker 4: rehabilitate them and provide them an opportunity to get off.

533
00:22:38,520 --> 00:22:40,679
Speaker 4: Now I'm a firm believer, there are some youth that

534
00:22:40,720 --> 00:22:42,360
Speaker 4: will have to go to dondale, there are some youth

535
00:22:42,359 --> 00:22:43,760
Speaker 4: that will need to go to work camps, there are

536
00:22:43,760 --> 00:22:45,760
Speaker 4: some youth that need to go to diversion. And in

537
00:22:45,800 --> 00:22:48,800
Speaker 4: many instances it's removing the ring leader, and police are

538
00:22:48,840 --> 00:22:50,960
Speaker 4: really good identifying who the ring leader isn't getting them

539
00:22:50,960 --> 00:22:53,200
Speaker 4: off the street. We have brought in the twenty four

540
00:22:53,200 --> 00:22:55,560
Speaker 4: to seven corresponding model in our springs that was lacking

541
00:22:55,640 --> 00:22:57,800
Speaker 4: like that was something that needed to be implemented earlier,

542
00:22:57,800 --> 00:23:00,240
Speaker 4: and we implemented that from November and it's continuing. We're

543
00:23:00,240 --> 00:23:03,159
Speaker 4: seeing more people put through the system. But ultimately this

544
00:23:03,240 --> 00:23:05,400
Speaker 4: is bigger than just changing laws, than the sale. People

545
00:23:05,560 --> 00:23:06,200
Speaker 4: like people to believe.

546
00:23:06,280 --> 00:23:08,200
Speaker 1: Well, look, I want to say that people have had

547
00:23:08,200 --> 00:23:10,080
Speaker 1: a gutfull. I don't know how many times I've said

548
00:23:10,080 --> 00:23:12,119
Speaker 1: that on this show, but we know that. Earlier in

549
00:23:12,160 --> 00:23:14,879
Speaker 1: the week, of course, Northern Territory police are investigating up

550
00:23:14,880 --> 00:23:18,639
Speaker 1: here on the top end. This was multiple violent incidents.

551
00:23:18,680 --> 00:23:21,120
Speaker 1: So at about ten thirty in the morning on Monday,

552
00:23:21,480 --> 00:23:24,119
Speaker 1: there was reports of a group of youths harassing members

553
00:23:24,160 --> 00:23:26,360
Speaker 1: of the public at Are shopping center on Trail Road. Now,

554
00:23:26,680 --> 00:23:29,920
Speaker 1: an eighty one year old woman was allegedly robbed by

555
00:23:30,000 --> 00:23:33,040
Speaker 1: three youths, one of those youths threatening her with the

556
00:23:33,119 --> 00:23:37,040
Speaker 1: knife before that group fled with her handback. One of

557
00:23:37,040 --> 00:23:39,680
Speaker 1: those kids was seven years old, right, one of those

558
00:23:39,760 --> 00:23:42,720
Speaker 1: kids seven years old. Now, I told this story on

559
00:23:42,800 --> 00:23:45,720
Speaker 1: Tuesday as well myself, and I'd messaged you about it, Brent.

560
00:23:46,000 --> 00:23:48,760
Speaker 1: I was here up the road at Harriet Place waiting

561
00:23:48,800 --> 00:23:50,800
Speaker 1: to get some lunch while I was crooked on Monday

562
00:23:51,920 --> 00:23:53,640
Speaker 1: off I got an off air, went to get something

563
00:23:53,680 --> 00:23:55,639
Speaker 1: to eat. I had a group of kids walked towards me.

564
00:23:55,720 --> 00:23:58,320
Speaker 1: I thought, oh, what's going to happen here. Next minute,

565
00:23:58,359 --> 00:24:00,320
Speaker 1: this kid that looked like he was about ten, looked

566
00:24:00,320 --> 00:24:02,639
Speaker 1: like he was my son's age, started yelling at me,

567
00:24:02,760 --> 00:24:04,840
Speaker 1: I'm an f and gangster. Then the other one tried

568
00:24:04,880 --> 00:24:06,920
Speaker 1: to steal my phone off me. He didn't get away

569
00:24:06,920 --> 00:24:10,160
Speaker 1: with it. Then it turns out that group has ended

570
00:24:10,240 --> 00:24:15,280
Speaker 1: up involved in aggravated robberies across Darwin CBD, including two

571
00:24:15,320 --> 00:24:19,800
Speaker 1: service stations. Thirteen and fourteen year old were later charged

572
00:24:19,840 --> 00:24:23,280
Speaker 1: with property and weapons offenses. Three eleven year olds conveyed

573
00:24:23,359 --> 00:24:25,600
Speaker 1: into the care of a responsible adult. So that's one

574
00:24:25,600 --> 00:24:27,000
Speaker 1: of the other incidents from this week.

575
00:24:27,400 --> 00:24:27,560
Speaker 4: Now.

576
00:24:27,640 --> 00:24:29,760
Speaker 1: I also got a phone call from one of our

577
00:24:29,800 --> 00:24:33,720
Speaker 1: listeners yesterday. She had said that she lives in Fanny Bay, Brench.

578
00:24:33,760 --> 00:24:36,240
Speaker 1: I believe you've spoken to her as well. She had

579
00:24:36,280 --> 00:24:41,160
Speaker 1: somebody inside her house on Saturday night. I also yesterday.

580
00:24:41,280 --> 00:24:43,439
Speaker 1: I'm not ashamed to say that I ended up in

581
00:24:43,520 --> 00:24:46,840
Speaker 1: absolute tears on a yesterday after hearing that long term

582
00:24:46,920 --> 00:24:49,560
Speaker 1: territory in Stem and Jackie Edwards had had their home

583
00:24:49,600 --> 00:24:54,080
Speaker 1: invaded last week while Stem was at home incredibly sick

584
00:24:54,280 --> 00:24:57,600
Speaker 1: in bed, unable to move. They've gone through. They have

585
00:24:57,880 --> 00:25:02,560
Speaker 1: absolutely ransacked the home. Now, these are the kinds of

586
00:25:02,560 --> 00:25:06,240
Speaker 1: things that are happening on what feels like a daily basis, right,

587
00:25:06,359 --> 00:25:08,760
Speaker 1: But then we've got a situation where the government's going, well,

588
00:25:08,760 --> 00:25:10,720
Speaker 1: these are the measures that we've got and that's what

589
00:25:10,760 --> 00:25:13,880
Speaker 1: we're doing. That's it. So can you understand why people

590
00:25:13,920 --> 00:25:16,000
Speaker 1: have had an absolute gutfull They're going, hang on a

591
00:25:16,000 --> 00:25:18,840
Speaker 1: sec my way of life has totally changed. You've got

592
00:25:18,880 --> 00:25:21,199
Speaker 1: seven year olds who aren't at school, and then the

593
00:25:21,320 --> 00:25:23,560
Speaker 1: education minister stands up and said, well, these kids have

594
00:25:23,600 --> 00:25:25,359
Speaker 1: got to go to school. Damn straight, they've got to

595
00:25:25,400 --> 00:25:27,720
Speaker 1: go to school. But how do we just all make

596
00:25:27,760 --> 00:25:30,639
Speaker 1: these motherhood statements and nothing changes or nothing gets better.

597
00:25:31,119 --> 00:25:34,520
Speaker 2: There's a worrying shift here too, Katie, is that we're

598
00:25:34,520 --> 00:25:38,520
Speaker 2: having groups and gangs of young kids specifically targeting elderly

599
00:25:38,640 --> 00:25:41,280
Speaker 2: people and elderly people in their homes. It's happening quite

600
00:25:41,280 --> 00:25:43,919
Speaker 2: a lot in Alice Springs. I've heard of five or

601
00:25:43,920 --> 00:25:47,000
Speaker 2: six incidents in the last two weeks where they're specifically

602
00:25:47,040 --> 00:25:50,640
Speaker 2: attacking elderly people seeing elderly people in their homes, and

603
00:25:50,840 --> 00:25:53,199
Speaker 2: not just once, but they come back again and again

604
00:25:53,320 --> 00:25:59,080
Speaker 2: and again and again targeting those these people are living

605
00:25:59,080 --> 00:26:02,919
Speaker 2: in absolute error and it shouldn't be happening. But we

606
00:26:03,000 --> 00:26:05,880
Speaker 2: said our police and now are so stretched, particularly at night,

607
00:26:06,040 --> 00:26:07,800
Speaker 2: because that's where most of the incidents are.

608
00:26:08,080 --> 00:26:08,760
Speaker 4: They can't get there.

609
00:26:09,000 --> 00:26:11,000
Speaker 1: That's the thing. There's no dispute right that the police

610
00:26:11,000 --> 00:26:13,320
Speaker 1: are doing their jobs. Everybody understands the police are doing

611
00:26:13,400 --> 00:26:17,520
Speaker 1: their jobs, but some weird things are breaking down incredibly badly.

612
00:26:17,960 --> 00:26:19,960
Speaker 5: And there was the promise when the age of criminal

613
00:26:20,040 --> 00:26:23,800
Speaker 5: responsibility was raised. Well before the age of criminal responsibility

614
00:26:23,840 --> 00:26:25,879
Speaker 5: was raised and the debate was on when it should

615
00:26:25,920 --> 00:26:28,840
Speaker 5: be raised, the government was saying we will need lots

616
00:26:28,840 --> 00:26:31,960
Speaker 5: of support services in the background that will be able

617
00:26:32,000 --> 00:26:35,359
Speaker 5: to deal with this issue. The cop and LEA have

618
00:26:35,400 --> 00:26:37,200
Speaker 5: been out talking a lot about well where are they

619
00:26:37,320 --> 00:26:39,639
Speaker 5: and what are they doing? And I think that is

620
00:26:39,640 --> 00:26:41,760
Speaker 5: a key question. A lot of people are sort of asking, well,

621
00:26:41,760 --> 00:26:42,920
Speaker 5: where are these programs for you?

622
00:26:42,960 --> 00:26:45,520
Speaker 2: Also in the firm commitment when we've done those questions

623
00:26:45,560 --> 00:26:47,520
Speaker 2: of detail, that that there would be programs in.

624
00:26:47,480 --> 00:26:49,760
Speaker 1: Place before we tell us what they are. Which programs

625
00:26:49,760 --> 00:26:51,200
Speaker 1: are The overall.

626
00:26:50,920 --> 00:26:52,880
Speaker 4: Arching program is on the right track and that has

627
00:26:52,960 --> 00:26:56,080
Speaker 4: multiple components that are run by different providers. So some

628
00:26:56,200 --> 00:26:57,840
Speaker 4: maybe a one or two day course, some may be

629
00:26:57,920 --> 00:26:59,879
Speaker 4: a week, some may be actually being sent off to

630
00:27:00,119 --> 00:27:02,600
Speaker 4: seven EM News. As an example, we've identified the game.

631
00:27:02,680 --> 00:27:04,840
Speaker 1: Jerry Wood said to me earlier in the week that

632
00:27:04,880 --> 00:27:07,000
Speaker 1: seven E News is only opened for a certain period

633
00:27:07,080 --> 00:27:08,919
Speaker 1: of the year because of the wet season. It's not

634
00:27:09,200 --> 00:27:09,800
Speaker 1: I actually.

635
00:27:09,560 --> 00:27:10,560
Speaker 4: Said that to you as well when I was on

636
00:27:10,680 --> 00:27:12,560
Speaker 4: a Monday, that it's only open for a period of time.

637
00:27:12,560 --> 00:27:14,920
Speaker 4: And that's why we've identified the need for three camps,

638
00:27:14,960 --> 00:27:17,520
Speaker 4: which we've announced that we'll do this year and get

639
00:27:17,520 --> 00:27:18,600
Speaker 4: those up for those youth.

640
00:27:18,440 --> 00:27:20,960
Speaker 1: Because as I said on Monday, we're seven years in.

641
00:27:21,400 --> 00:27:22,000
Speaker 4: I can only talk.

642
00:27:22,080 --> 00:27:24,919
Speaker 1: I think to me, it's bullshit. We are seven years

643
00:27:24,920 --> 00:27:26,480
Speaker 1: in now, and I know that you've only been the

644
00:27:26,520 --> 00:27:28,760
Speaker 1: police Minister for a short period of time, so not

645
00:27:28,800 --> 00:27:31,000
Speaker 1: having a crack at unit. But the whole government, like

646
00:27:31,080 --> 00:27:34,840
Speaker 1: dead said, we're this far in and now okay, we've

647
00:27:34,880 --> 00:27:36,760
Speaker 1: got these boot camps that are going to come online.

648
00:27:36,800 --> 00:27:38,679
Speaker 1: Will how fast?

649
00:27:39,040 --> 00:27:41,320
Speaker 4: Just people what of now in terms of the three

650
00:27:41,400 --> 00:27:43,320
Speaker 4: will run them with government? I think the lesson has

651
00:27:43,359 --> 00:27:44,840
Speaker 4: been learned and I think a lot of people can

652
00:27:44,880 --> 00:27:48,160
Speaker 4: probably appreciate this. Getting access to land and working through

653
00:27:48,240 --> 00:27:50,919
Speaker 4: those negotiations with TOS has been difficult getting it to

654
00:27:51,000 --> 00:27:53,879
Speaker 4: be cost effective for organizations to want to run these camps.

655
00:27:54,119 --> 00:27:56,199
Speaker 4: They do. It doesn't actually stuck up for many of them,

656
00:27:56,200 --> 00:27:57,879
Speaker 4: and hence wh it's taken so long to get the

657
00:27:57,880 --> 00:27:59,760
Speaker 4: ones that we do have. I agree they should have

658
00:27:59,760 --> 00:28:01,720
Speaker 4: been up earlier. That's why when I came in, we've

659
00:28:01,720 --> 00:28:03,399
Speaker 4: done a whole bunch of stuff around police and that

660
00:28:03,520 --> 00:28:06,399
Speaker 4: being correspond to model and from there we've realized, well,

661
00:28:06,600 --> 00:28:09,159
Speaker 4: once they've done twenty four hours in our out of

662
00:28:09,160 --> 00:28:11,760
Speaker 4: home care or our safe play sleeping, where's the next

663
00:28:11,760 --> 00:28:13,600
Speaker 4: place that we send them to? And that's why the

664
00:28:13,600 --> 00:28:15,119
Speaker 4: camps have come online and we'll get them up.

665
00:28:15,160 --> 00:28:17,280
Speaker 3: Do you have any timeline for when those camps?

666
00:28:18,400 --> 00:28:21,040
Speaker 4: Yeah, no, Listen, we'll have before the middle of the year.

667
00:28:21,040 --> 00:28:22,399
Speaker 4: There will be announcement. You'll be able to go and

668
00:28:22,400 --> 00:28:24,160
Speaker 4: see one. It'll be an operation. Then the other two

669
00:28:24,200 --> 00:28:26,440
Speaker 4: will be done this year, so this year you'll see

670
00:28:26,440 --> 00:28:29,240
Speaker 4: three up. One is very close. It's not my portfolio

671
00:28:29,760 --> 00:28:32,840
Speaker 4: to be talking about those announcements and locations, but they'll

672
00:28:32,880 --> 00:28:34,280
Speaker 4: be needs based, so you can see one in the

673
00:28:34,320 --> 00:28:36,720
Speaker 4: central Barkley region and then the next one will be

674
00:28:36,720 --> 00:28:37,000
Speaker 4: done with.

675
00:28:37,040 --> 00:28:39,560
Speaker 1: And so as far as the public is concerned, for

676
00:28:39,720 --> 00:28:42,400
Speaker 1: when Parliament sits next week, there is not going to

677
00:28:42,440 --> 00:28:45,680
Speaker 1: be any kind of urgent legislative changes or anything like

678
00:28:45,720 --> 00:28:49,800
Speaker 1: that that the opposition sort of called for to try

679
00:28:49,800 --> 00:28:51,040
Speaker 1: and have an impact in this space.

680
00:28:51,080 --> 00:28:53,760
Speaker 4: So the opposition will always call for bar reform. They

681
00:28:53,880 --> 00:28:57,360
Speaker 4: want bar reformers the golden goose to fixing this problem. Unfortunately, though,

682
00:28:57,360 --> 00:28:59,360
Speaker 4: as I said to you on the showk last Monday,

683
00:28:59,600 --> 00:29:02,080
Speaker 4: once it's the judiciary, the jujitsuy still has the ability,

684
00:29:02,120 --> 00:29:04,920
Speaker 4: regardless of a presumption against bail, to still grant bail.

685
00:29:04,960 --> 00:29:08,320
Speaker 4: A murderer can still get access to bail. Now generally speaking,

686
00:29:08,360 --> 00:29:10,920
Speaker 4: they don't get bail in great numbers, but we.

687
00:29:10,920 --> 00:29:14,160
Speaker 1: Have the legislation the minimum sentencing well.

688
00:29:13,960 --> 00:29:16,720
Speaker 4: But regardless of some of them are sitting in remand

689
00:29:16,920 --> 00:29:19,120
Speaker 4: longer than their actual sentence would have been. So that

690
00:29:19,200 --> 00:29:22,200
Speaker 4: to me is a resourcing issue. I've come on clearly before.

691
00:29:21,920 --> 00:29:25,040
Speaker 5: It then that the justice system, Attorney General justice is

692
00:29:25,120 --> 00:29:26,880
Speaker 5: overwhelmed with the amount of work that has to do

693
00:29:26,920 --> 00:29:27,160
Speaker 5: and it.

694
00:29:27,120 --> 00:29:29,160
Speaker 4: Needs and it needs funny and we did put more

695
00:29:29,160 --> 00:29:31,280
Speaker 4: funding into the last budget for them, and I know

696
00:29:31,320 --> 00:29:33,160
Speaker 4: that We've just gone through budget cabinet. I'm sure that

697
00:29:33,200 --> 00:29:36,000
Speaker 4: there's a budget us in there for judiciary to get

698
00:29:36,080 --> 00:29:40,160
Speaker 4: and process more. But ultimately, we don't want youth going

699
00:29:40,200 --> 00:29:41,840
Speaker 4: in and out of prison. We want them going out

700
00:29:41,840 --> 00:29:43,880
Speaker 4: to camps, rehabilitated and back into a job or back

701
00:29:43,920 --> 00:29:46,840
Speaker 4: into the education system. And I can appreciate the frustration.

702
00:29:47,080 --> 00:29:48,560
Speaker 4: You know, I went and saw my I see all

703
00:29:48,600 --> 00:29:51,080
Speaker 4: my constituents that are victims of crime. I've called some

704
00:29:51,120 --> 00:29:53,320
Speaker 4: of yours you know that have been victims of crime.

705
00:29:53,360 --> 00:29:56,280
Speaker 4: Because regardless of what side of the political spectrum you

706
00:29:56,280 --> 00:29:58,400
Speaker 4: sit on, there is a level of compassion that you

707
00:29:58,480 --> 00:30:02,000
Speaker 4: have to undertake out because they're angry. They are rightfully angry,

708
00:30:02,040 --> 00:30:03,720
Speaker 4: and I'm to be honest, I'm angry with them. I

709
00:30:03,720 --> 00:30:05,880
Speaker 4: get frustrated when I talk to police and they deal

710
00:30:05,880 --> 00:30:08,400
Speaker 4: with the case and then see that youth again. You know,

711
00:30:09,160 --> 00:30:09,800
Speaker 4: changing the word.

712
00:30:09,720 --> 00:30:13,200
Speaker 1: In terms of raising the age of criminal responsibility. I mean,

713
00:30:13,240 --> 00:30:15,200
Speaker 1: we now have evidence sort of in black and white

714
00:30:15,240 --> 00:30:16,520
Speaker 1: in front of us. You know, you've got a seven

715
00:30:16,560 --> 00:30:20,360
Speaker 1: year old that's involved in the theft of a handbag

716
00:30:20,400 --> 00:30:22,760
Speaker 1: from an eighty one year old woman on Monday. You've

717
00:30:22,760 --> 00:30:24,880
Speaker 1: got eleven year olds that are involved in a crime

718
00:30:24,920 --> 00:30:28,280
Speaker 1: series throughout the week, that's just from this week. Do

719
00:30:28,320 --> 00:30:32,000
Speaker 1: you regret that raising of the criminal age. Now, I'm

720
00:30:32,000 --> 00:30:34,400
Speaker 1: not saying that children that young need to go to jail.

721
00:30:34,440 --> 00:30:37,080
Speaker 1: That is absolutely not what I'm saying. But there is

722
00:30:37,200 --> 00:30:40,160
Speaker 1: literally like there's no program. There is nothing, by the

723
00:30:40,200 --> 00:30:42,960
Speaker 1: sounds of it, for those young children to do. I

724
00:30:43,000 --> 00:30:44,880
Speaker 1: know you've said there's the back on Track program, but

725
00:30:44,920 --> 00:30:49,160
Speaker 1: give us a tangible idea of what one of those

726
00:30:49,160 --> 00:30:51,720
Speaker 1: eleven year olds not you know, let's not name names

727
00:30:51,800 --> 00:30:54,960
Speaker 1: or anything, but what is a tangible outcome that one

728
00:30:54,960 --> 00:30:58,560
Speaker 1: of those kids that's allegedly held somebody up with a knife,

729
00:30:59,040 --> 00:31:01,160
Speaker 1: is it involved in Listen, Katie.

730
00:31:00,960 --> 00:31:03,080
Speaker 4: I wish I could give you the standalone name of

731
00:31:03,120 --> 00:31:05,440
Speaker 4: the individual program in name one. The best person to

732
00:31:05,480 --> 00:31:07,840
Speaker 4: do that is Nari I. Obviously, all my programs for

733
00:31:07,920 --> 00:31:10,840
Speaker 4: police all I understand, for example.

734
00:31:11,920 --> 00:31:13,880
Speaker 1: The outcome. You're not sure what the pols want to be.

735
00:31:14,000 --> 00:31:16,680
Speaker 4: Well, there's punishment and outcome are two different things. The

736
00:31:16,720 --> 00:31:19,960
Speaker 4: way the consequence you're talking about is the rehabilitation piece.

737
00:31:19,960 --> 00:31:21,640
Speaker 4: So some of those can be the victims of crime

738
00:31:22,080 --> 00:31:24,600
Speaker 4: engagement where they go back if both parties agree to it.

739
00:31:24,600 --> 00:31:26,760
Speaker 1: So it's not even compulsory. That's the point that I'm

740
00:31:26,760 --> 00:31:29,240
Speaker 1: getting at, Right, So, for these kids have done that.

741
00:31:29,040 --> 00:31:31,320
Speaker 4: That piece isn't compulsive because sometimes the victims don't also

742
00:31:31,360 --> 00:31:31,880
Speaker 4: want to sit down.

743
00:31:32,200 --> 00:31:35,400
Speaker 1: That's fair enough. But let's be like, let's make no

744
00:31:35,480 --> 00:31:38,160
Speaker 1: bones about it. The offenders don't have to do it

745
00:31:38,240 --> 00:31:39,200
Speaker 1: if they don't want to.

746
00:31:39,640 --> 00:31:41,720
Speaker 4: I agree on the face of it, it sounds bad, But

747
00:31:41,760 --> 00:31:43,080
Speaker 4: why would you put it? Why would you put an

748
00:31:43,080 --> 00:31:44,880
Speaker 4: offender in the room with the victim where they don't

749
00:31:44,880 --> 00:31:45,920
Speaker 4: want to be there and it could cause me.

750
00:31:45,960 --> 00:31:48,160
Speaker 1: No, you're twisting my words around. That's not what I'm

751
00:31:48,200 --> 00:31:52,400
Speaker 1: saying to you. Is that an offender. It's voluntary for

752
00:31:52,480 --> 00:31:54,920
Speaker 1: an offender to do that program.

753
00:31:54,800 --> 00:31:57,000
Speaker 4: For that piece the victim conferencing, yes, No for.

754
00:31:57,000 --> 00:31:59,040
Speaker 1: What other programs though? Are they forced to do other

755
00:31:59,040 --> 00:32:00,000
Speaker 1: programs or is that all?

756
00:32:00,040 --> 00:32:01,960
Speaker 4: Also, the eleven year olds are sent to the back

757
00:32:02,000 --> 00:32:06,920
Speaker 4: on Track program because it's not voluntary. It is uncause

758
00:32:07,000 --> 00:32:09,600
Speaker 4: not criminal. But how do you fee So this is.

759
00:32:09,520 --> 00:32:11,920
Speaker 1: The point people are making, like you're trying to twist

760
00:32:11,960 --> 00:32:15,000
Speaker 1: my words there, But be honest with people, it's voluntary.

761
00:32:15,120 --> 00:32:18,200
Speaker 1: So you raise the age of criminal responsibility and then

762
00:32:18,240 --> 00:32:21,440
Speaker 1: they're not actually having to do a program. It's voluntary

763
00:32:21,800 --> 00:32:24,840
Speaker 1: for them to do a rehabilitation program. Can you see

764
00:32:24,840 --> 00:32:26,160
Speaker 1: how that's piercing people off?

765
00:32:26,200 --> 00:32:28,080
Speaker 4: Put the next bit to it though, the Core ordered

766
00:32:28,080 --> 00:32:30,600
Speaker 4: family Responsibility agreements. That's how we hold the parents to

767
00:32:30,600 --> 00:32:32,200
Speaker 4: get the kids to go the programs. They may not

768
00:32:32,240 --> 00:32:34,000
Speaker 4: complete the first program, they may not choose to do

769
00:32:34,040 --> 00:32:36,840
Speaker 4: that program, but they'll be offered multiple opportunities to do it.

770
00:32:36,840 --> 00:32:39,640
Speaker 4: It isn't just the youth in this issue. For eleven

771
00:32:39,720 --> 00:32:41,920
Speaker 4: year old the parents need to be involved in its resolutely.

772
00:32:41,960 --> 00:32:43,520
Speaker 1: They need to be involved in it. But if you're

773
00:32:43,560 --> 00:32:46,680
Speaker 1: at that point right where this is happening, we were told,

774
00:32:46,720 --> 00:32:49,600
Speaker 1: the public was told that the age of criminal responsibility

775
00:32:49,640 --> 00:32:52,880
Speaker 1: would not be raised until those programs were in place

776
00:32:52,880 --> 00:32:55,400
Speaker 1: and until everything was there ready to go. Now you're

777
00:32:55,400 --> 00:32:59,440
Speaker 1: not actually like, we're not hearing actual tangible outcomes of

778
00:32:59,480 --> 00:33:01,680
Speaker 1: some of those programs that are underway. You said you

779
00:33:01,680 --> 00:33:05,400
Speaker 1: can't name all of those, that's up to the Minister forfolio.

780
00:33:05,440 --> 00:33:07,600
Speaker 1: But the other part of it is that they're not compulsory.

781
00:33:07,680 --> 00:33:09,800
Speaker 1: So to a lot of people listening this morning, they're

782
00:33:09,840 --> 00:33:12,240
Speaker 1: going to be thinking, so you can you know you

783
00:33:12,360 --> 00:33:15,280
Speaker 1: can offend, you can be involved in a weapons offense

784
00:33:15,880 --> 00:33:19,320
Speaker 1: and not actually have to engage then in any kind

785
00:33:19,360 --> 00:33:22,440
Speaker 1: of rehabilitation program to try and get you back on track.

786
00:33:22,480 --> 00:33:26,400
Speaker 1: And I get what you're saying about.

787
00:33:27,120 --> 00:33:29,360
Speaker 4: I'll get it. I'll give you another example, because there

788
00:33:29,400 --> 00:33:31,440
Speaker 4: is there is a consequence, but it's not necessarily through

789
00:33:31,440 --> 00:33:34,240
Speaker 4: the back on track program. For some youth who continue

790
00:33:34,280 --> 00:33:37,560
Speaker 4: to commit serious offending but are not of the criminal age,

791
00:33:37,720 --> 00:33:39,920
Speaker 4: we have a we have secure facilities that they get

792
00:33:39,920 --> 00:33:42,120
Speaker 4: taken into the care of territory families and that is

793
00:33:42,160 --> 00:33:46,320
Speaker 4: a secure facility that is like for example, remand or detention,

794
00:33:46,560 --> 00:33:48,920
Speaker 4: but it's not in Dondale. So there are youth that

795
00:33:48,960 --> 00:33:52,080
Speaker 4: commits serious offenses that are incapable of being with their

796
00:33:52,120 --> 00:33:55,600
Speaker 4: family that cannot go and conduct these diversion programs that

797
00:33:55,640 --> 00:33:57,520
Speaker 4: are taken into and one of those, for example, is

798
00:33:57,520 --> 00:33:59,880
Speaker 4: out near the Salt Bush Facility. It is an adjacent

799
00:34:00,080 --> 00:34:03,479
Speaker 4: it's a retrofitted old mental institution. There is a secure

800
00:34:03,480 --> 00:34:05,920
Speaker 4: facility for very high complex needs of youth that do

801
00:34:06,000 --> 00:34:08,600
Speaker 4: those offending. So that is the consequence for those that

802
00:34:08,640 --> 00:34:10,560
Speaker 4: should you know, that roll around with a knife and

803
00:34:10,560 --> 00:34:13,239
Speaker 4: commit those aggravated assaults could fail to get involved in

804
00:34:13,280 --> 00:34:15,839
Speaker 4: the programs, the parents won't support them. Territory families can

805
00:34:15,840 --> 00:34:17,239
Speaker 4: take them into their care and they've done that with

806
00:34:17,320 --> 00:34:19,360
Speaker 4: some youth and put them in this facility. And is

807
00:34:19,360 --> 00:34:22,160
Speaker 4: it happening well that that particular How many kids in

808
00:34:22,239 --> 00:34:24,160
Speaker 4: there now? I don't know that isn't my portfolio. I'm

809
00:34:24,160 --> 00:34:25,400
Speaker 4: happy to get you those details.

810
00:34:25,440 --> 00:34:28,200
Speaker 5: And how much demand versus how much space is in

811
00:34:28,239 --> 00:34:29,640
Speaker 5: that facility is the field question.

812
00:34:29,840 --> 00:34:32,000
Speaker 4: Well, I can tell you that that facility, from what

813
00:34:32,000 --> 00:34:34,000
Speaker 4: I've seen out there and when I've gone through, there's

814
00:34:34,080 --> 00:34:35,640
Speaker 4: enough for about ten off the top of my head.

815
00:34:35,680 --> 00:34:37,759
Speaker 4: Remember walking down the halls and looking at the like

816
00:34:38,000 --> 00:34:40,239
Speaker 4: they're not sales but their rooms. You know, there's enough

817
00:34:40,280 --> 00:34:42,400
Speaker 4: there for probably the complex needs of those youth that

818
00:34:42,440 --> 00:34:44,319
Speaker 4: we have in Darwin. I'm not unsure what is in

819
00:34:44,360 --> 00:34:45,600
Speaker 4: Allison Tenner Creek stuff.

820
00:34:46,239 --> 00:34:48,480
Speaker 2: For years and years and years now and we're six

821
00:34:48,520 --> 00:34:50,839
Speaker 2: months out from an election. We now find the seeing

822
00:34:50,840 --> 00:34:53,880
Speaker 2: an announcement from the Chief Minister about these youth camps

823
00:34:53,920 --> 00:34:56,800
Speaker 2: that government are going and run and people are asking

824
00:34:56,800 --> 00:34:59,040
Speaker 2: why didn't I do this six years ago when the

825
00:34:59,080 --> 00:35:01,759
Speaker 2: problem was there six years ago, five years ago, four

826
00:35:01,800 --> 00:35:02,160
Speaker 2: years ago.

827
00:35:02,160 --> 00:35:03,440
Speaker 4: We've been crying out.

828
00:35:03,360 --> 00:35:06,080
Speaker 2: For support in Central Australia for so long it's not funny,

829
00:35:06,520 --> 00:35:08,840
Speaker 2: and all of a sudden, only just recently in the

830
00:35:08,920 --> 00:35:12,719
Speaker 2: last week we're going to see are some camps and

831
00:35:12,840 --> 00:35:15,879
Speaker 2: facilities run by the government. It's too little, too late,

832
00:35:16,040 --> 00:35:19,200
Speaker 2: and it's again people see through it six months from

833
00:35:19,200 --> 00:35:19,560
Speaker 2: an election.

834
00:35:19,600 --> 00:35:22,720
Speaker 5: What would you We've also had the replacement for Dundale,

835
00:35:22,760 --> 00:35:26,480
Speaker 5: which is a wholly unsuitable facility. That replacement facility has

836
00:35:26,520 --> 00:35:28,879
Speaker 5: been delayed and delayed and delayed, and it is still

837
00:35:28,880 --> 00:35:32,360
Speaker 5: into construction and there's no firm date for it opening.

838
00:35:32,560 --> 00:35:36,839
Speaker 5: So territories might be asking the question, these camps going

839
00:35:36,840 --> 00:35:38,239
Speaker 5: to open the middle of the year or is.

840
00:35:38,200 --> 00:35:41,319
Speaker 4: It I'm not going to give you the official opening

841
00:35:41,400 --> 00:35:43,120
Speaker 4: date because that's for the minuteter, but it will be

842
00:35:44,200 --> 00:35:46,040
Speaker 4: before the middle of the year for the new facility

843
00:35:46,080 --> 00:35:49,440
Speaker 4: I can't remember what they're calling the new Youth romand facility.

844
00:35:49,640 --> 00:35:53,319
Speaker 4: And then don Dale will be demolished. But ultimately, Bill,

845
00:35:53,520 --> 00:35:54,840
Speaker 4: I would love to know what you will do in

846
00:35:54,840 --> 00:35:56,920
Speaker 4: the first twelve months that will make a huge impact

847
00:35:56,960 --> 00:35:59,040
Speaker 4: for territories right now because some of the issues we've

848
00:35:59,040 --> 00:36:02,200
Speaker 4: had have been around getting agreement on land access to

849
00:36:02,200 --> 00:36:05,000
Speaker 4: build these facilities, and that takes time. So please tell

850
00:36:05,040 --> 00:36:06,279
Speaker 4: me what you're going to do right now. It's going

851
00:36:06,320 --> 00:36:06,719
Speaker 4: to change it.

852
00:36:07,160 --> 00:36:10,799
Speaker 2: This is about labor election. You guys have been in

853
00:36:10,880 --> 00:36:14,040
Speaker 2: power and you guys have overseen the phais and that

854
00:36:14,560 --> 00:36:17,000
Speaker 2: I suppose, at the end of the day, the crumbling

855
00:36:17,040 --> 00:36:19,719
Speaker 2: of our social fabric in some of our communities, and

856
00:36:19,760 --> 00:36:21,879
Speaker 2: you've sat back and watched it happen for six years

857
00:36:21,880 --> 00:36:23,919
Speaker 2: and all of a sudden, six months out from an election,

858
00:36:24,000 --> 00:36:25,239
Speaker 2: are we going to do something about it.

859
00:36:25,840 --> 00:36:27,759
Speaker 3: You're an alternative government, though, which you have to have

860
00:36:27,760 --> 00:36:28,920
Speaker 3: some idea of what.

861
00:36:28,920 --> 00:36:29,439
Speaker 4: Well I said.

862
00:36:29,440 --> 00:36:31,440
Speaker 2: We've always been upfront about what we want to do

863
00:36:31,480 --> 00:36:34,720
Speaker 2: with sentence to a skill, which is that bridging point

864
00:36:34,760 --> 00:36:38,840
Speaker 2: between what would be lower level programs and of course

865
00:36:39,200 --> 00:36:42,360
Speaker 2: detention in our youth detention facility, and that's about getting

866
00:36:42,360 --> 00:36:44,719
Speaker 2: young people who fit in the middle layer to go

867
00:36:44,840 --> 00:36:49,040
Speaker 2: and engage in vocational educational activities, work with elders, do

868
00:36:49,200 --> 00:36:52,480
Speaker 2: normal education stuff and do that preparation to get back

869
00:36:52,520 --> 00:36:56,040
Speaker 2: into the community and be a purposeful member of that community.

870
00:36:56,200 --> 00:36:58,400
Speaker 4: That's been a policy position of our since two thousand.

871
00:36:58,400 --> 00:37:00,960
Speaker 4: So basically the parmesan skill set that we announced where

872
00:37:01,040 --> 00:37:03,239
Speaker 4: youth can go for diversion and then go from that

873
00:37:03,400 --> 00:37:05,320
Speaker 4: location into a job, which.

874
00:37:05,160 --> 00:37:08,040
Speaker 2: You guys announced after we put out our position into

875
00:37:07,880 --> 00:37:09,319
Speaker 2: so it's exactly the same.

876
00:37:09,400 --> 00:37:12,520
Speaker 1: Okay, I thought you were also going to change the legislation.

877
00:37:13,080 --> 00:37:15,279
Speaker 2: Oh, look, there has to be some legislative change to

878
00:37:15,320 --> 00:37:16,520
Speaker 2: make all this sort of stuff happen.

879
00:37:16,600 --> 00:37:19,319
Speaker 4: Katie. We've said from day one that will walk back

880
00:37:20,080 --> 00:37:22,560
Speaker 4: the age of criminal responsibility. And it's not about it

881
00:37:22,560 --> 00:37:25,320
Speaker 4: and everyone's it's about the sealp throum kids into detentionent. No,

882
00:37:25,400 --> 00:37:25,719
Speaker 4: it's not.

883
00:37:25,960 --> 00:37:28,759
Speaker 2: It's about being able then the courts having the ability

884
00:37:29,000 --> 00:37:33,080
Speaker 2: to get kids to compulsory engage in programs and activities

885
00:37:33,160 --> 00:37:36,560
Speaker 2: rather than having to be voluntary engaged, so to send

886
00:37:36,640 --> 00:37:40,080
Speaker 2: kids to diversions and to go and do activities so

887
00:37:40,239 --> 00:37:42,359
Speaker 2: that we can try and break that cycle of a thing.

888
00:37:42,480 --> 00:37:44,000
Speaker 1: We are going to have to take a really quick break.

889
00:37:44,040 --> 00:37:45,680
Speaker 1: There is a lot to cover off. You're listening to

890
00:37:45,719 --> 00:37:47,920
Speaker 1: Mix one O four nine's three sixty. It is the

891
00:37:47,960 --> 00:37:51,320
Speaker 1: week that was well, it has been an incredibly busy hour.

892
00:37:51,400 --> 00:37:53,200
Speaker 1: Still plenty to cover off on this morning and in

893
00:37:53,200 --> 00:37:55,120
Speaker 1: the studio with us, if you've just joined us. We've

894
00:37:55,120 --> 00:37:57,239
Speaker 1: got the Minister for Police, Brent Potter, We've got Tom

895
00:37:57,239 --> 00:37:59,879
Speaker 1: Morgan from the ABC, and we have also got Bill

896
00:38:00,280 --> 00:38:03,720
Speaker 1: from the COLP. Now there has been calls from Tourism

897
00:38:03,800 --> 00:38:06,239
Speaker 1: Central Australia to take a look at a relaxation of

898
00:38:06,320 --> 00:38:09,279
Speaker 1: alcohol restrictions. They seem as are they not going to

899
00:38:09,320 --> 00:38:13,040
Speaker 1: go ahead? If well, if I could be wrong, but

900
00:38:13,120 --> 00:38:14,920
Speaker 1: the Police Commissioner had said to us earlier in the

901
00:38:14,920 --> 00:38:17,719
Speaker 1: week that he doesn't really he doesn't support a relaxation

902
00:38:17,800 --> 00:38:21,600
Speaker 1: of those restrictions. I think it's a really tough one, right.

903
00:38:22,000 --> 00:38:24,560
Speaker 5: I don't think any government would want to repeat of

904
00:38:24,600 --> 00:38:27,799
Speaker 5: what happens in January twenty twenty three, well that I

905
00:38:27,800 --> 00:38:32,520
Speaker 5: can't remember when, yeah, that surge. I think that any government,

906
00:38:32,520 --> 00:38:35,120
Speaker 5: particularly ahead of an election, would be very careful about

907
00:38:35,120 --> 00:38:38,200
Speaker 5: doing that. I think that it's a very contentious issue.

908
00:38:38,600 --> 00:38:41,279
Speaker 5: You know, the government is coming out and saying that

909
00:38:41,320 --> 00:38:44,560
Speaker 5: those two extra days of no takeaway liquor in Central

910
00:38:44,600 --> 00:38:46,400
Speaker 5: Australian Billy might be able to talk to that as

911
00:38:46,440 --> 00:38:50,279
Speaker 5: well have have had an impact on the amount of

912
00:38:50,320 --> 00:38:54,280
Speaker 5: alcohol related incidents in Central Australia.

913
00:38:55,080 --> 00:38:59,959
Speaker 2: Certainly has, But again it's about taking things into context

914
00:39:00,080 --> 00:39:02,960
Speaker 2: where tourism Central Australia are coming from coming too a

915
00:39:03,040 --> 00:39:06,680
Speaker 2: tourist season. We've had some horrible tourist seasons, like last

916
00:39:06,760 --> 00:39:09,880
Speaker 2: year was really bad and we're hoping to see a turnaround.

917
00:39:10,320 --> 00:39:13,440
Speaker 2: Our reputation due to those crime and anti social issues

918
00:39:13,480 --> 00:39:17,440
Speaker 2: at home is horrendous and has affected our tourism. I

919
00:39:17,520 --> 00:39:21,839
Speaker 2: get why TCA want to bring wind those restrictions back

920
00:39:21,920 --> 00:39:25,120
Speaker 2: during the tourist season. I get that, and I look

921
00:39:25,120 --> 00:39:27,440
Speaker 2: at what happened. I said, when stronger futures lapsed with

922
00:39:27,640 --> 00:39:30,279
Speaker 2: nothing to come in behind it, our springs blew up

923
00:39:30,280 --> 00:39:33,600
Speaker 2: and burnt. And then we see the restrictions came back,

924
00:39:33,600 --> 00:39:36,320
Speaker 2: and how harsher than the restrictions we had in June

925
00:39:36,320 --> 00:39:41,400
Speaker 2: twenty twenty two, which were reintroduced in January twenty twenty three.

926
00:39:41,960 --> 00:39:45,839
Speaker 2: The crime stats, funnily enough, are still higher now than

927
00:39:45,880 --> 00:39:50,279
Speaker 2: what they were back in June. Whilst restrictions have helped somewhat,

928
00:39:50,600 --> 00:39:55,279
Speaker 2: we're still seeing increases in crime. Alcohol restrictions haven't been

929
00:39:55,520 --> 00:39:58,279
Speaker 2: the bill and end all fixed to everything. I get

930
00:39:58,280 --> 00:40:02,120
Speaker 2: the police too at least light the restrictions because at

931
00:40:02,120 --> 00:40:03,960
Speaker 2: the end of the day, it makes a rostering a

932
00:40:03,960 --> 00:40:06,000
Speaker 2: little bit easier when they're tied on numbers, because all

933
00:40:06,040 --> 00:40:07,479
Speaker 2: of a sudden there's a couple of days a week

934
00:40:07,719 --> 00:40:09,719
Speaker 2: where they don't have to man the bottle os and

935
00:40:10,520 --> 00:40:11,239
Speaker 2: the hours.

936
00:40:11,280 --> 00:40:12,320
Speaker 1: Makes a massive impact.

937
00:40:12,360 --> 00:40:15,759
Speaker 5: You would think a question as well about whether the

938
00:40:15,800 --> 00:40:18,759
Speaker 5: depth in last year's tourism numbers was necessarily because of

939
00:40:18,760 --> 00:40:21,839
Speaker 5: what happened a year ago in January, or if it

940
00:40:22,040 --> 00:40:24,120
Speaker 5: was also there's an element of the borders and our

941
00:40:24,160 --> 00:40:26,840
Speaker 5: open everyone's traveling overseas and domestic travel.

942
00:40:26,920 --> 00:40:28,880
Speaker 3: Domestic tourism might be taking a bit about it.

943
00:40:28,880 --> 00:40:31,719
Speaker 2: Look, cost of living is definitely affecting tourism numbers in

944
00:40:31,760 --> 00:40:34,239
Speaker 2: this I think it's a combination of things that are

945
00:40:34,239 --> 00:40:36,279
Speaker 2: really affecting tourism. If you only look at their thick

946
00:40:36,360 --> 00:40:39,000
Speaker 2: numbers this year for bikes, they're way down. Normally they

947
00:40:39,000 --> 00:40:41,879
Speaker 2: fill up instantly over six hundred BikeE riders, we're down

948
00:40:41,920 --> 00:40:44,239
Speaker 2: to three hundred, three hundred and fifty. Again, that's a

949
00:40:44,239 --> 00:40:47,680
Speaker 2: combination of things. So but yes, our reputation is one

950
00:40:47,680 --> 00:40:49,960
Speaker 2: of those things. But cost living now for us I

951
00:40:50,000 --> 00:40:51,560
Speaker 2: need to stay is certainly playing apparent.

952
00:40:51,760 --> 00:40:54,040
Speaker 1: Is it something that the government's even considering at this

953
00:40:54,120 --> 00:40:54,719
Speaker 1: point in time?

954
00:40:55,280 --> 00:40:57,920
Speaker 4: We won't be doing it this year, and we won't be.

955
00:40:58,440 --> 00:41:01,520
Speaker 4: What I have committed to TCA and the others is

956
00:41:01,520 --> 00:41:04,840
Speaker 4: to review it post August, whatever that looks like, and

957
00:41:05,440 --> 00:41:07,799
Speaker 4: the opposition can do the same. I think that it's

958
00:41:07,840 --> 00:41:10,759
Speaker 4: incumbent and the commitment given to other retailers is to

959
00:41:10,840 --> 00:41:12,759
Speaker 4: continue that at least for that period of time while

960
00:41:13,320 --> 00:41:15,960
Speaker 4: we're in government. But I have said to all of

961
00:41:16,080 --> 00:41:19,560
Speaker 4: those concerned stakeholders that from my perspective around alcohol policy,

962
00:41:19,840 --> 00:41:22,680
Speaker 4: everything has to be reviewed, like everything has to be reviewed,

963
00:41:23,000 --> 00:41:24,719
Speaker 4: and then that's what we use the Commission to do

964
00:41:24,840 --> 00:41:27,080
Speaker 4: a lot of that reviewing going forward, because I think

965
00:41:27,480 --> 00:41:29,400
Speaker 4: we have to get back to a point where we

966
00:41:29,600 --> 00:41:31,800
Speaker 4: learn where people can learn to live with alcohol so

967
00:41:31,920 --> 00:41:34,839
Speaker 4: other people aren't punished by not opening on certain days.

968
00:41:35,200 --> 00:41:36,920
Speaker 4: We have brought in the Pali conversion. I know that

969
00:41:36,960 --> 00:41:40,400
Speaker 4: has been contentious for some people, but the reality is

970
00:41:40,440 --> 00:41:42,279
Speaker 4: there are are officers that want to do more than

971
00:41:42,320 --> 00:41:45,520
Speaker 4: what they're currently doing that we have really real difficulty

972
00:41:45,640 --> 00:41:48,480
Speaker 4: replacing and recruiting to those positions. And I'm cognizant and

973
00:41:48,560 --> 00:41:52,200
Speaker 4: so's the commissioner that will lose those palies to other jobs.

974
00:41:52,239 --> 00:41:54,600
Speaker 4: So that what we've decided to do is convert them.

975
00:41:54,960 --> 00:41:57,160
Speaker 4: They will go back onto the bottle shops, they will

976
00:41:57,239 --> 00:42:00,239
Speaker 4: go back onto the locations that they've come from, will

977
00:42:00,280 --> 00:42:03,120
Speaker 4: do social order, so tip out high visibility policing, foot

978
00:42:03,160 --> 00:42:06,320
Speaker 4: patrols before and after the bottle shops are open and close.

979
00:42:06,640 --> 00:42:09,040
Speaker 4: Whereas previously the palis we were paying for them and

980
00:42:09,239 --> 00:42:11,399
Speaker 4: they could only work the hours of the bottle shop

981
00:42:11,800 --> 00:42:13,879
Speaker 4: and then they were off the bottle shop. They want

982
00:42:13,920 --> 00:42:16,000
Speaker 4: to do more so we can use this resource way

983
00:42:16,080 --> 00:42:17,680
Speaker 4: better and that's what we're committed to. And it will

984
00:42:17,719 --> 00:42:19,479
Speaker 4: be a difficult time. There's no doubt there are people

985
00:42:19,520 --> 00:42:21,960
Speaker 4: concerned for the sixteen weeks, but I can say between

986
00:42:22,040 --> 00:42:25,000
Speaker 4: Licensing and the other constables and the remaining palies, we

987
00:42:25,080 --> 00:42:28,040
Speaker 4: will cover down and find a program that best meets

988
00:42:28,080 --> 00:42:30,440
Speaker 4: the effect that we're trying to achieve, which is reduction

989
00:42:30,520 --> 00:42:31,040
Speaker 4: in purchasing.

990
00:42:31,560 --> 00:42:34,040
Speaker 5: I do think there is a note that someone raised

991
00:42:34,080 --> 00:42:36,040
Speaker 5: with me the other week about this issue, is that

992
00:42:36,280 --> 00:42:38,160
Speaker 5: you know, the bottle shops, the bottle ooes aren't the

993
00:42:38,200 --> 00:42:39,719
Speaker 5: be all and end all of alcohol, and you can

994
00:42:39,880 --> 00:42:40,160
Speaker 5: go to.

995
00:42:40,360 --> 00:42:43,760
Speaker 3: Help clubs, pubs take away exactly.

996
00:42:44,040 --> 00:42:46,480
Speaker 5: And so I think maybe that is a point that

997
00:42:46,560 --> 00:42:49,160
Speaker 5: maybe could be stressed in some of the tourism messaging

998
00:42:49,280 --> 00:42:51,800
Speaker 5: is yes, so there are these restrictions on takeaway alcohol,

999
00:42:52,000 --> 00:42:53,960
Speaker 5: but if you're a tourist you can still go and

1000
00:42:54,080 --> 00:42:54,920
Speaker 5: enjoy a drink out.

1001
00:42:55,440 --> 00:42:58,239
Speaker 2: But he is a thing for hours and people when

1002
00:42:58,280 --> 00:43:00,560
Speaker 2: I speak to people in el Springs about our restrictions

1003
00:43:00,600 --> 00:43:04,399
Speaker 2: and they said there's forced against everyone says the same thing. Well,

1004
00:43:04,680 --> 00:43:07,480
Speaker 2: Darwin got restrictions over Christmas and they didn't last for

1005
00:43:07,800 --> 00:43:10,840
Speaker 2: very very long. They removed those fairly fairly quick and

1006
00:43:10,920 --> 00:43:13,400
Speaker 2: there was a review done of Darlaen. Why hasn't there

1007
00:43:13,480 --> 00:43:15,839
Speaker 2: been anything done for our springs. So it's again it's

1008
00:43:15,840 --> 00:43:18,600
Speaker 2: those double standards that the people in outside of darl

1009
00:43:18,640 --> 00:43:21,040
Speaker 2: And Sea, whether it's Catherine Tenant or asked and we've

1010
00:43:21,040 --> 00:43:23,040
Speaker 2: got the harsh Alis has got the harshest.

1011
00:43:22,840 --> 00:43:26,400
Speaker 4: Restrictions in the country now, and people ask those questions.

1012
00:43:26,480 --> 00:43:28,239
Speaker 5: There is a discrepancy there are in the crime rates

1013
00:43:28,239 --> 00:43:31,839
Speaker 5: between Darwin and Alice Springs and Tenant those places see

1014
00:43:31,960 --> 00:43:35,440
Speaker 5: much higher rates. So would you not argue that the

1015
00:43:35,520 --> 00:43:36,680
Speaker 5: restrictions should reflect that.

1016
00:43:37,360 --> 00:43:41,240
Speaker 2: Oh no, But people saying you're reviewed, You bought restrictions

1017
00:43:41,239 --> 00:43:44,359
Speaker 2: into Darwin and then reviewed them pretty quickly and removed them.

1018
00:43:44,360 --> 00:43:45,920
Speaker 2: But we're now saying we're not going to see a

1019
00:43:45,920 --> 00:43:49,200
Speaker 2: review on Alice Springs till after an election, So why

1020
00:43:49,280 --> 00:43:53,200
Speaker 2: can't it happen now? He said that the people that

1021
00:43:53,440 --> 00:43:56,680
Speaker 2: springs is not me asking the question of people asking

1022
00:43:56,719 --> 00:43:59,080
Speaker 2: that question, what's what's good for them?

1023
00:43:59,200 --> 00:44:01,799
Speaker 4: Why isn't that good for Why can't we have the review?

1024
00:44:02,160 --> 00:44:04,040
Speaker 4: Let me ask you the question, Bill, if you would

1025
00:44:04,080 --> 00:44:05,759
Speaker 4: you remove the restrictions now, if you were in.

1026
00:44:05,800 --> 00:44:08,600
Speaker 2: Government, I'd certainly be having a look at those restrictions

1027
00:44:08,640 --> 00:44:09,399
Speaker 2: and see how they work.

1028
00:44:09,480 --> 00:44:11,640
Speaker 4: So you're doing it. You're doing basically exactly what I've

1029
00:44:11,640 --> 00:44:14,000
Speaker 4: committed to you. But they're doing it right now.

1030
00:44:14,040 --> 00:44:15,760
Speaker 2: If I was in government, I'd be doing that, reviewing

1031
00:44:15,840 --> 00:44:18,120
Speaker 2: it right now and asking people about what they wanted.

1032
00:44:18,200 --> 00:44:20,480
Speaker 4: I wouldn't be waiting until afternoon election. Money. We do

1033
00:44:21,080 --> 00:44:23,840
Speaker 4: the review every month. We get all the data and

1034
00:44:24,040 --> 00:44:25,759
Speaker 4: the commitment that was made and agreed to with all

1035
00:44:25,800 --> 00:44:27,400
Speaker 4: of the stakeholders what we'd run it through the rest

1036
00:44:27,440 --> 00:44:29,160
Speaker 4: of the year. So we're committed to the commitment we

1037
00:44:29,239 --> 00:44:31,000
Speaker 4: made to stakeholders that asked for it. And as secondly,

1038
00:44:31,440 --> 00:44:33,120
Speaker 4: we have brought in the seven day Band drink or

1039
00:44:33,239 --> 00:44:35,640
Speaker 4: order across the territory that is having an effect. And

1040
00:44:35,680 --> 00:44:39,120
Speaker 4: I've said we'll do BDR reform around suspicious transactions, which

1041
00:44:39,160 --> 00:44:42,920
Speaker 4: Alice Springs already has, and I understand that people want

1042
00:44:42,960 --> 00:44:44,800
Speaker 4: the same rules across the territory, and I've made that

1043
00:44:44,840 --> 00:44:46,879
Speaker 4: commitment that once we do those reviews will get there.

1044
00:44:47,239 --> 00:44:49,480
Speaker 4: But what I what I ultimately would say, and you

1045
00:44:49,520 --> 00:44:52,560
Speaker 4: talk about crime statistics, It is true properly defending is high, Alice,

1046
00:44:53,040 --> 00:44:56,000
Speaker 4: but alcohol field assaults is down. So to try and

1047
00:44:56,120 --> 00:44:58,960
Speaker 4: link and say that alcohol field assaults is still increasing

1048
00:44:59,040 --> 00:45:02,600
Speaker 4: because of the olcohol restrictions regardless is incorrect and it's misleading.

1049
00:45:03,080 --> 00:45:06,000
Speaker 4: Alcohol fuel adviolence is down, properly offending is high. Go

1050
00:45:06,080 --> 00:45:09,719
Speaker 4: on stand Hyde Street and see what this start. The

1051
00:45:09,760 --> 00:45:12,240
Speaker 4: stats are a little bit later. I agree that propery

1052
00:45:12,239 --> 00:45:15,879
Speaker 4: defending is still too high, but the alcohol is having good, alcohol.

1053
00:45:15,560 --> 00:45:17,200
Speaker 1: Restrictions are having any We are going to have to

1054
00:45:17,239 --> 00:45:19,359
Speaker 1: take a really quick break. You are listening to Mix

1055
00:45:19,400 --> 00:45:21,319
Speaker 1: one OW four nine's three sixty. It is the week

1056
00:45:21,360 --> 00:45:23,560
Speaker 1: that was, well, we are just about ready to wrap

1057
00:45:23,680 --> 00:45:26,040
Speaker 1: up for the morning. However, we can't wrap up the

1058
00:45:26,080 --> 00:45:28,399
Speaker 1: week that was this morning without touching on the fact

1059
00:45:28,440 --> 00:45:31,360
Speaker 1: that well Saint Vincent de Paul they are looking to

1060
00:45:31,520 --> 00:45:34,040
Speaker 1: change their location. They've been in Stuart Park with their

1061
00:45:34,080 --> 00:45:38,320
Speaker 1: homelessness services for quite some time and Coconut Grove is

1062
00:45:38,400 --> 00:45:41,000
Speaker 1: the location that they're looking at transitioning to, as I

1063
00:45:41,120 --> 00:45:44,680
Speaker 1: understand it, on a temporary basis, but for a while,

1064
00:45:45,840 --> 00:45:48,520
Speaker 1: and it is all about still providing those services to

1065
00:45:48,680 --> 00:45:51,680
Speaker 1: the homeless. A lot of people pretty unhappy about this.

1066
00:45:51,960 --> 00:45:54,799
Speaker 1: I mean the member for Nightcliff, Natasha Files, had come

1067
00:45:54,880 --> 00:45:56,800
Speaker 1: on earlier in the week, as had you, Brent, and

1068
00:45:56,960 --> 00:46:01,600
Speaker 1: spoken about those plans to relocate some finneas today's the

1069
00:46:01,680 --> 00:46:03,240
Speaker 1: day I think that you've got to have your.

1070
00:46:03,760 --> 00:46:06,839
Speaker 4: Submission to the DCL closes today and close a business house.

1071
00:46:07,840 --> 00:46:10,200
Speaker 3: Is it in the industrial part of Coconut Grove or

1072
00:46:10,320 --> 00:46:10,719
Speaker 3: is it in the.

1073
00:46:11,120 --> 00:46:14,240
Speaker 4: It's both, so it's opposite the industrial park of Coconut

1074
00:46:14,280 --> 00:46:15,719
Speaker 4: Grove and they're backing on the Orchard Road.

1075
00:46:16,200 --> 00:46:19,239
Speaker 2: But this is an election promise from twenty twenty to

1076
00:46:19,640 --> 00:46:21,760
Speaker 2: move some Vinnie's from their current location.

1077
00:46:21,920 --> 00:46:24,600
Speaker 1: Yeah, which is fair enough. I don't know that Coconut

1078
00:46:24,680 --> 00:46:25,759
Speaker 1: Grows the place to go.

1079
00:46:26,280 --> 00:46:29,280
Speaker 4: And again that the people Coconut Graves has been seems

1080
00:46:29,280 --> 00:46:29,880
Speaker 4: to be a lack.

1081
00:46:29,760 --> 00:46:32,920
Speaker 2: Of consultation with them there that apparently, Okay, this is

1082
00:46:33,000 --> 00:46:35,360
Speaker 2: coming and this is where it's going to be on

1083
00:46:35,400 --> 00:46:38,840
Speaker 2: a temporary basis. So three and a half years that

1084
00:46:38,960 --> 00:46:40,960
Speaker 2: the promise was back in twenty twenty and all of

1085
00:46:40,960 --> 00:46:43,840
Speaker 2: a sudden, we're now going okaying with this.

1086
00:46:45,480 --> 00:46:48,440
Speaker 4: Listen, I'm gonna appreciate what I can appreciate what Bill's

1087
00:46:48,440 --> 00:46:50,279
Speaker 4: trying to do here and say this is government doing.

1088
00:46:50,360 --> 00:46:52,840
Speaker 4: Let me really really clear, said.

1089
00:46:55,080 --> 00:46:59,040
Speaker 1: Right, it goes from impacting one Electrodie Stuart Park, Gorfong

1090
00:46:59,120 --> 00:47:03,120
Speaker 1: Limb potentially impacting three like it encompasses part of it,

1091
00:47:03,239 --> 00:47:05,440
Speaker 1: say part of it for File's part of it for

1092
00:47:05,520 --> 00:47:07,319
Speaker 1: Joel a bout it the service need.

1093
00:47:07,480 --> 00:47:09,680
Speaker 4: This is a very important service and it needs to

1094
00:47:09,719 --> 00:47:11,840
Speaker 4: obviously be expanded and we can go there are different

1095
00:47:11,840 --> 00:47:14,600
Speaker 4: options to outreach. As an example, there are other locations

1096
00:47:14,640 --> 00:47:16,640
Speaker 4: and we'll continue to work with NAGE to find a solution.

1097
00:47:17,120 --> 00:47:19,200
Speaker 4: It needs to move from Stuart Park. You are correct,

1098
00:47:19,200 --> 00:47:21,880
Speaker 4: and that is long overdue. This is their land. They

1099
00:47:22,000 --> 00:47:23,920
Speaker 4: decide to go there without you know that they can

1100
00:47:24,000 --> 00:47:27,680
Speaker 4: go there without government intervention. Like ultimately it goes through

1101
00:47:27,680 --> 00:47:30,600
Speaker 4: the DCA. I don't think it's the best location neither

1102
00:47:30,680 --> 00:47:32,520
Speaker 4: of the residents. I think we can find something that

1103
00:47:32,680 --> 00:47:34,960
Speaker 4: is better for all parties and still deliver a very

1104
00:47:35,040 --> 00:47:38,960
Speaker 4: much needed service to vulnerable territories. Bundla Beach well, I

1105
00:47:38,960 --> 00:47:40,719
Speaker 4: don't think you can develop in Bundlea Beach because of

1106
00:47:40,719 --> 00:47:41,680
Speaker 4: the zoning that they have there.

1107
00:47:42,280 --> 00:47:44,160
Speaker 1: It's going to be interesting. We'll wait and see exactly

1108
00:47:44,239 --> 00:47:47,400
Speaker 1: what happens and what kind of feedback the DCA does receive,

1109
00:47:47,520 --> 00:47:48,879
Speaker 1: but look, we're going to have to leave it there.

1110
00:47:49,160 --> 00:47:51,200
Speaker 1: Thank you all so very much for your time. Bill Yan,

1111
00:47:51,520 --> 00:47:54,600
Speaker 1: thanks Katie to be here in person for once good stuff.

1112
00:47:54,680 --> 00:47:57,759
Speaker 1: And Thomas Morgan from the ABC, thank you so much

1113
00:47:57,800 --> 00:47:59,919
Speaker 1: for your time this morning, like I never left. Katie

1114
00:48:01,400 --> 00:48:03,400
Speaker 1: Brank Patter, thank you for your time this morning, and

1115
00:48:03,480 --> 00:48:06,879
Speaker 1: thanks thank you. You are all listening to Mix ONEO

1116
00:48:06,920 --> 00:48:09,560
Speaker 1: fort nine's three sixty That was the Week, That was