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Speaker 1: It's the Happy Families podcast.

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Speaker 2: It's the podcast for the time poor parent who just

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Speaker 2: answers now. Hello. This is doctor Justin Coilson, the founder

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Speaker 2: of Happy Families dot com dotu and the author of

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Speaker 2: six books about raising a happier family. Today a real treat.

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Speaker 2: I'm super excited to talk to you about. Well. Well,

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Speaker 2: it's a topic that really worries a lot of parents,

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Speaker 2: and for good reason. We're going to talk about vaping.

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Speaker 2: Although tobacco smoking has fallen out of favor among the

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Speaker 2: Australian youth in recent years, the vaping alternative has skyrocketed

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Speaker 2: in terms of popularity. Last year, the Australian Lung Foundation

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Speaker 2: reported that e cigarette use by Australian's fourteen year older

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Speaker 2: has more than doubled in the period from twenty sixteen

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Speaker 2: to twenty nineteen, and the likelihood is it's probably more

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Speaker 2: than that by now. Doctor Lisa Demore is a psychologist

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Speaker 2: and an expert on teenagers. She's written for The New

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Speaker 2: York Times for a number of years. She's had to

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Speaker 2: New York Times best sellers, and of all of the

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Speaker 2: parenting experts in the world that are out there, I

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Speaker 2: don't know that there's any that I respect as much

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Speaker 2: as Lisa. She's just an absolute superstar and understands the

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Speaker 2: psychology of adolescents like no one else. I just love

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Speaker 2: what she has to say. I recently had a conversation

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Speaker 2: with her about vaping as part of Our Happy Family's

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Speaker 2: Instagram Live series, where we sporadically and on an ad

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Speaker 2: hoc basis talk to experts about really important topics like vaping.

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Speaker 2: If you have teenagers, this is a must listen conversation.

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Speaker 2: I'm going to replay it from Instagram, but as a

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Speaker 2: sort of an intro. When we began the discussion, I

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Speaker 2: asked Lisa to fill everyone in on her career and

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Speaker 2: the key areas that she focuses on in her work.

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Speaker 3: So I'm a psychologist. I'm in the United States. My

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Speaker 3: specialty area is adolescence. I spent a lot of my

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Speaker 3: work teenagers. My long form work, my books are about girls,

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Speaker 3: but I do a lot of work around kids of

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Speaker 3: all ages and also all genders.

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Speaker 4: So I write regularly for The New York Times.

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Speaker 3: That work is entirely co ed, and I haven't asked

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Speaker 3: Lisa podcast, which comes out every week where my fantastic

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Speaker 3: co host Riena and nine and I answer questions about

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Speaker 3: kids of all ages, kids of all genders.

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Speaker 4: So I'm just kind of an all around developmental clitical psychologist.

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Speaker 2: So, like you said, important conversations today, why don't you

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Speaker 2: introduce the topic, and well we'll start chatting about it.

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Speaker 4: Sure, So we're going to talk about faving, and I will.

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Speaker 3: Tell you justin I'm actually glad in some ways to

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Speaker 3: be able to talk about much more normative developmental stuff.

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Speaker 4: Not that this is normal developmental, but I would say

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Speaker 4: the last few years has been so heavily focused on.

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Speaker 3: Getting kids and families through the pandemic that there's something

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Speaker 3: to me important about being able to return to the

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Speaker 3: risk factors that kids are engaging, the forces the kids.

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Speaker 4: Are up against through adolescens tween teen life.

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Speaker 3: So we're going to talk through vaping, and you and

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Speaker 3: I sort of thought through some questions that we thought

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Speaker 3: would be type of mind for the people who are

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Speaker 3: joining us, and so we hope we kind of work

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Speaker 3: our way through this, and then we'd love people to

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Speaker 3: ask us questions, to put them right in the chat,

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Speaker 3: and we'll try to get to.

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Speaker 2: As many as we can perfect before we get to

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Speaker 2: those questions Lisa, let's just highlight I think it's really

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Speaker 2: important we do this. You and I have psychology backgrounds,

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Speaker 2: we're not medical practitioners. We're not physicians, we're not professors

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Speaker 2: of biology or chemistry or anything like that. So the

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Speaker 2: conversation that we're having about vaping, we need to acknowledge

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Speaker 2: at the outset that there's still a lot that we

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Speaker 2: don't know about e cigarettes vaping generally. But what we

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Speaker 2: do know is, even at this early stage, it's harmful

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Speaker 2: and it's not in our children's best interest to be

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Speaker 2: doing it. I think that it would be a conservative

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Speaker 2: approach here would be to say that it's not safe,

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Speaker 2: it's not healthy, and it's not wise, and we don't

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Speaker 2: want our kids to be doing it, and that's probably

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Speaker 2: the best foundation before we step into the pairing. Is

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Speaker 2: everything you'd add to that or should we dive in?

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Speaker 4: I think that's right, and I think it is true.

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Speaker 4: I think the data are still coming in.

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Speaker 3: We don't know a whole lot about the impact of

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Speaker 3: negotine on the young Breen, because you know, for better

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Speaker 3: for us, this is not than something we've been in

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Speaker 3: a position to study before.

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Speaker 4: But I know that with our question not beeping is

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Speaker 4: better than beeping.

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Speaker 2: I must have said a kid.

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Speaker 4: If you're a kid, not fee thing is better than beeping.

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Speaker 2: Right. Of course, when we say that to our kids,

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Speaker 2: they may roll their eyes and go, well, what would

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Speaker 2: you know? You never vape, you don't know what it is.

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Speaker 2: In fact, just when I did a quick Facebook live

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Speaker 2: a few minutes ago to let people know that we

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Speaker 2: were going to be doing this and to bring them

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Speaker 2: into our Instagram feed, here Loretta said, and I quote,

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Speaker 2: my eleven and twelve year old have already seen kids

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Speaker 2: their age doing it. And these kids doing it just

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Speaker 2: think it tastes you. They don't think about the chemicals

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Speaker 2: they're breathing in. It seems innocent, just like smoking probably

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Speaker 2: in the fifties. And I love I love the use

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Speaker 2: of her word innocent. There's just that sense that it's

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Speaker 2: no big deal. Mom stops stressing out Dad. It just

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Speaker 2: tastes good, and everyone's doing it. What's the big deal?

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Speaker 2: So let's start off by talking about why kids start vaping.

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Speaker 2: We've both got a few different ideas on this, and

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Speaker 2: they'll probably compliment one another really nicely. I hadn't thought

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Speaker 2: of that particular issue release so that it tastes you.

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Speaker 2: I mean my number one was kids, especially in their

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Speaker 2: adolescent years, they crave experience. Their brains are wired for

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Speaker 2: reward and everyone else is doing it. They want belonging

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Speaker 2: and acceptance, and this is the way that they get

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Speaker 2: to signal to everyone, Hey, I'm cool and I want

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Speaker 2: to be like you and you want to be like me.

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Speaker 2: So it's a really it's just a belonging acceptance kind

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Speaker 2: of thing. And like I said that, the idea that

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Speaker 2: I can do something new, I've got the autonomy, I've

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Speaker 2: got the power to choose to do something, and if

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Speaker 2: my parents won't like it, now I've got some power

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Speaker 2: in my life as well. So that was a big three.

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Speaker 2: I mean, I'm doing that in thirty seconds or less,

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Speaker 2: and we can unpack it work if you walk, do

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Speaker 2: you want to talk more about that or do you

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Speaker 2: want to extend on that with some of your audience?

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Speaker 4: Well, so I think yes to all of that.

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Speaker 3: And you know the nature of the adolescent bring is

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Speaker 3: that it's sensation seeking. It's looking for novelty, and like,

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Speaker 3: what's more novel than a gummy bared flavored E cigarette? Right,

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Speaker 3: I Mean, that's that's novel of anything? But I think

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Speaker 3: the way that I like to walk up to this

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Speaker 3: and I actually like to talk with kids about it,

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Speaker 3: is they are very much the victims of a quite

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Speaker 3: sophisticated marketing scheme, right, And when I talk with kids

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Speaker 3: about vaping, I say, here's the thing. Vaping was not

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Speaker 3: a bad idea to start. Vaping was designed to get

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Speaker 3: people who were addicted to tobacco cigarettes off of the

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Speaker 3: cursed cancer causing properties of tobacco without having to give

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Speaker 3: up nicotine.

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Speaker 4: Like that was not a bad idea at all. It

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Speaker 4: actually remains a good idea.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, And then I say them, but then the people

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Speaker 3: who made those said, he check it out. We have

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Speaker 3: this highly addictive substance. We could get a whole new

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Speaker 3: market of middle school kids engaged with this if we

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Speaker 3: put it in really cool, slick packaging, if we make

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Speaker 3: it seem kind of electronic and neat to look like

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Speaker 3: chargers that are sort of exciting, and then truly, if.

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Speaker 4: We make strawberry bubblegum flavor.

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Speaker 3: And like all of these wild you know, melon jazz flavors, and.

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Speaker 4: That's what happened.

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Speaker 3: And so I think it's really helpful for us to

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Speaker 3: appreciate that the people making these products know exactly what

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Speaker 3: they are doing and to really appreciate that they are

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Speaker 3: trojan horsing an addiction to kids, and our kids are

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Speaker 3: largely naive to that and nicotine. We should just have

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Speaker 3: to say it is wildly addictive.

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Speaker 2: So if you really thinkngrateful, I mean we it's you know,

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Speaker 2: it's certainly we are not.

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Speaker 4: It's we don't really know how it affects the developing rain.

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Speaker 4: But as I said to.

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Speaker 3: My own kids, do you want to find out? No,

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Speaker 3: you probably don't want to find out, like why would

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Speaker 3: you make yourself a guinea pig? But it's a quite

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Speaker 3: remarkable thing to think about in terms of what has

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Speaker 3: been pulled off by the vaping manufacturers by way of

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Speaker 3: making an entire market for themselves that then has to

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Speaker 3: come back for more because they're addicted. So when we

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Speaker 3: think about why kids might do it, we really want

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Speaker 3: to appreciate they are very much ponds in a larger

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Speaker 3: and targeted and highly sophisticated marketing scheme.

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Speaker 2: What the what the manufacturers have done here as well,

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Speaker 2: is they've they've disposed of all of the I'm going

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Speaker 2: to use the word grottiness of smoking, you know, the

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Speaker 2: stained fingers and the and the stench. I mean, I

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Speaker 2: know some people really do lock the smell of nicotine

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Speaker 2: and tobaccout, but there's a general trend away from that,

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Speaker 2: especially with young people. And they've created when you pick

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Speaker 2: up an iPhone or you pick up a well designed tablet,

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Speaker 2: these things feel nice, they feel luxurious to hold, and

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Speaker 2: the designers of these products have made them appealing. That

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Speaker 2: made them feel nicely weighted, and they feel silky smooth,

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Speaker 2: and the smell of the e cigarette product it's delightful.

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Speaker 2: I have no desire to smoke an e cigarette none whatsoever.

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Speaker 2: I never have, never will. But I'll tell you what,

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Speaker 2: when I walk past somebody who's smoking one, I can't

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Speaker 2: help it just go, oh, that's not really good.

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Speaker 3: Absolutely absolutely, And I think you know that word innocence

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Speaker 3: that you're brought up kids really don't get it. That's

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Speaker 3: something that is gummy bird flavored and pink and looks

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Speaker 3: like a USB drive is a dangerous thing. And that's

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Speaker 3: not an accident that it doesn't seem dangerous. If you

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Speaker 3: make a gummy bird in pink, you can make it

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Speaker 3: look a lot safer than it is.

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Speaker 4: So in terms of why kids start. I think that's

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Speaker 4: a key reason, and then all of the reasons that you.

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Speaker 2: Mentioned, So let's just tap into I know that people

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Speaker 2: get really excited about neurostuff, brain science. I tend to

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Speaker 2: think that knowing neurobiology neuroscience doesn't actually do much in

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Speaker 2: a practical sense. It doesn't necessarily help people, but it's

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Speaker 2: still curs it's still really interesting to me. There's this

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Speaker 2: whole thing that people are talking about for years now

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Speaker 2: that the adolescent brain isn't fully developed until the mid

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Speaker 2: twenties and all that kind of thing. But one thing

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Speaker 2: that some really clever researchers have found in the last

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Speaker 2: few years is you mentioned the sensation seeking. But even

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Speaker 2: if we pull back from sensation seeking, because smoking an

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Speaker 2: e cigarette probably isn't going to give you a wild sensation,

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Speaker 2: but there is something rewarding. There's something socially rewarding about this.

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Speaker 2: I mean, one of my kids said to me the

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Speaker 2: other day. She's in grade nine, and she came to

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Speaker 2: me and she said, Dad, they're all doing it, and

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Speaker 2: I'm actually starting to feel like I'm a bit of

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Speaker 2: a weirdo because I'm not. I'm starting to feel like

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Speaker 2: I don't belong I'm a bit different, and they're looking

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Speaker 2: at me like I think I'm better than them because

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Speaker 2: I won't do it, so I think in fact, Jesse

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Speaker 2: is hopeful has just jumped in city. If you don't

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Speaker 2: want to drink coss my pot, you still feel like

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Speaker 2: you're doing something cool. And this is what a lot

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Speaker 2: of kids are grapping with. They recognize that they may

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Speaker 2: be ramifications in association with health, but popularity, the pull

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Speaker 2: of just having people around you who loved you, somewhere

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Speaker 2: you belong. This can actually interfere with our capacity to

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Speaker 2: feel like we belong. And the conversation that I had

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Speaker 2: with my daughter around this was really it's complex. It's

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Speaker 2: hard as a parent to sort of to look at

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Speaker 2: the kids and say, it's really hard to be unpopular,

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Speaker 2: isn't it. Where are you going to land with this?

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Speaker 2: Because when you're fourteen, your friends are your oxygen absolutely well.

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Speaker 3: And it's interesting because I was looking at some data

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Speaker 3: before we have done and one thing that.

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Speaker 4: Is true, and I think this is true in the US.

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Speaker 4: They didn't look at the Australian data.

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Speaker 3: Eleven of high schoolers are vafing and two percent of

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Speaker 3: middle schoolers are vaping. But they're very high profile. They

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Speaker 3: kids are very aware of what they're doing it. They're

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Speaker 3: letting kids know they do it. There's a lot of

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Speaker 3: discussion about it, there's a lot of awareness of it.

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Speaker 3: And one of the things we have found to be

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Speaker 3: very very helpful when we do research studies on harm

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Speaker 3: prevention of any kind, addiction prevention, is to actually give

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Speaker 3: kids real statistics about how many kids are doing it.

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Speaker 4: And same with drinking, drugs, other things too.

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Speaker 3: Most kids don't Most kids, the majority of kids are

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Speaker 3: actually steering clear of it. And one thing that has

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Speaker 3: helped kids to stay away from that is that reassurance that, yeah,

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Speaker 3: it may seem like everyone's doing it, or people may

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Speaker 3: be very aware of who's doing it, but they're actually

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Speaker 3: in the minority and most kids and this is how

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Speaker 3: I would start to bend the conversation. Most kids are

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Speaker 3: doing a much better job of taking care of themselves

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Speaker 3: and not getting engaged. And this is my like the

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Speaker 3: drum I bang on anything risk related. I always frame

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Speaker 3: it up with kids in terms of them taking good

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Speaker 3: care of themselves, and that's why we don't want them

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Speaker 3: to smoke or drink, or do drugs or drive when drunk.

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Speaker 3: Or any of those things because they're not taking good

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Speaker 3: care of themselves.

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Speaker 2: How do we get the conversation started. You've got a child,

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Speaker 2: you don't know if they're bathing or not, but you

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Speaker 2: know that if they're in anything from I'm gonna say,

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Speaker 2: in Australia, grade six or above, we need to have

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Speaker 2: this conversation. What great would you say? In America would

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Speaker 2: be the time I think you want to.

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Speaker 3: Start it by middle school, so that you know, probably

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Speaker 3: sixth grade is when you want to start it.

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Speaker 4: And here's the thing though.

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Speaker 3: I would not make a plan to say have the like, Okay,

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Speaker 3: my kids in sixth grade, we're going to talk about bathing, right,

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Speaker 3: I would I would not have that be how to

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Speaker 3: attack it.

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Speaker 4: What I would do is, I would.

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Speaker 2: Like you turn on the fire hose. They're like, whoa,

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Speaker 2: what did I do wrong?

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Speaker 4: Yeah?

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Speaker 3: What I would do is I would listen for it

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Speaker 3: to come because it will often come up that they'll mention, oh,

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Speaker 3: you know so and so I had an ease something.

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Speaker 4: I mean, they'll mention it.

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Speaker 3: Or I would look for something in the environment, you know,

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Speaker 3: like I was reading an article and it came up.

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Speaker 3: But I would then say, have you heard about this,

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Speaker 3: What do you know about this? What's the word on

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Speaker 3: the street about this? Your kids are going to be

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Speaker 3: in a huge range of the data they have on vaping.

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Speaker 3: Some of them may know nothing, some of them.

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Speaker 4: May be very familiar and aware. Some of them may

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Speaker 4: know things that are completely untrue.

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Speaker 3: So before you start with whatever your spiel's going to

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Speaker 3: be about vaping, you need to know what your kid knows,

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Speaker 3: what your kid thinks, how familiar they are, because that

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Speaker 3: will do so much to orient you about where to

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Speaker 3: even start the conversation.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, there's a phrase that I use all the time.

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Speaker 2: In fact, there are three phrases that I integrate together,

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Speaker 2: and I'll just have this thing full the rhyme or alliteration.

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Speaker 2: So I suggest that parents get curious, not furious, because

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Speaker 2: as parents, our initial reaction is protection, and protection often

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Speaker 2: leads to us being what I'll call a puff fish parent.

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Speaker 2: You know, puffer fish when it feels threatened, it blows

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Speaker 2: itself up really big to eliminate the threat. So when

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Speaker 2: we see a child one about children.

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Speaker 1: What about dear little angels, about precious precious cherubs doing

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Speaker 1: something that we think is harmful, we kind of get

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Speaker 1: this sense that if I make myself as big as

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Speaker 1: I can, as strong and forceful as I can, I'm

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Speaker 1: going to put the fear of God into them, and

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Speaker 1: they're going to run from whatever I'm threatening them over.

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Speaker 2: So what, as you and I would both tell parents

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Speaker 2: all the time, what that usually does is you kind

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Speaker 2: of hinted at it before. Don't you ever let me

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Speaker 2: catch you doing that. That often comes across as don't

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Speaker 2: worry you are. I'm going to be real sneaky now

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Speaker 2: I know how you feel about it. I'll never get caught,

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Speaker 2: So get cureurious, not furious, Understand, don't reprimand explore, don't explode.

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Speaker 2: These are the phrases I use all the time, so

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Speaker 2: essentially say, if we can explore their world with genuine curiosity. Hey,

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Speaker 2: do you know what, I'm in my forties, I'm in

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Speaker 2: my fifties, however old you are as a parent raising

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Speaker 2: these teenagers. And I was watching this Instagram before with

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Speaker 2: these two experts who were talking about vaping. How serious

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Speaker 2: is vaping at your school? You just and I asked

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Speaker 2: you to start really really wide, like what's happening at

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Speaker 2: the school, what are you seeing online? What's happening in

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Speaker 2: your group of friends. You can bring it all the

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Speaker 2: way into the personal eventually, but you want to start

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Speaker 2: nice and whites and the I'm not feeling threatened and

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Speaker 2: defensive and what do you think about it? What are

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Speaker 2: people saying about it? How's it affecting people? Is there

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Speaker 2: anything is there anything going on that you want to

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Speaker 2: talk about? Do you have any questions? Like the more

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Speaker 2: curious you get, like you said, I mean that this

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Speaker 2: whole conversation is about how do you open this discussion

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Speaker 2: with them? Do you open a discussion with questions with

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Speaker 2: like kids?

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Speaker 4: Absolutely? Absolutely?

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Speaker 3: And then what I was saying earlier about helping kids

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Speaker 3: understand the marketing behind it, there's some really nice research

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Speaker 3: that shows that when kids know they're being played, they

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Speaker 3: become much more cautious about engaging with things. That one

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Speaker 3: of the beautiful things about teenagers is they do not

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Speaker 3: like to be manipulated by adults. And so when I

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Speaker 3: talk with middle and high schoolers about bathing, I'm like, look,

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Speaker 3: you know, there's.

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Speaker 4: A lot of money in this for someone if.

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Speaker 3: They can get you hooked on this, And they design

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Speaker 3: this to make it very attractive to people your age,

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Speaker 3: and they put a highly addictive chemical in it, and

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Speaker 3: there's two things that you don't want to happen.

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Speaker 4: One you do not.

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Speaker 3: Want to be their toy, and two you don't want

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Speaker 3: to have nicotine running the show for you. And I

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Speaker 3: think that idea of not being autonomous anymore, not getting

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Speaker 3: to choose, you know, where one does things, how one

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Speaker 3: does things, because you're thinking about nicotine and thinking about

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Speaker 3: how to get more nicotine, that I think is a

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Speaker 3: way to structure really suggest if you want to maintain

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Speaker 3: the itonomy that is narrow deep important to teenagers, you're

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Speaker 3: going to want to stay away from this because someone

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00:18:09,760 --> 00:18:11,960
Speaker 3: else is running you if you become addicted to these

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Speaker 3: things and that you know, I think keeps it neutral,

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Speaker 3: keeps it honest, and actually pleas to what teenagers care about,

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Speaker 3: which is actually being independent.

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Speaker 2: We've used up our timely so, but we also want

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Speaker 2: to answer some questions. So what am I doing? Gosh,

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Speaker 2: we could talk for hours about this, right, I mean,

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00:18:29,840 --> 00:18:32,200
Speaker 2: we've just skimmed the surface. This has not been comprehensive

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Speaker 2: at all. Let me go through a couple of the

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Speaker 2: comments that have come through and let's respond accordingly. So

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Speaker 2: first off, doctor Lexi Frye has shown as the Royal

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Speaker 2: Children's Health Pole, the RCCH Pole, which comes out pretty

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Speaker 2: regularly here in Australia talking about e cigarettes, bathing and

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Speaker 2: teens to parents know the dangers. There is some data

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Speaker 2: that has come through here that suggests that in Australia

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Speaker 2: the numbers could be I've just lost it. Sorry. For

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Speaker 2: all twelve to seventeen year old students, around fourteen percent

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Speaker 2: indicated that they had ever used an e cigarette at

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Speaker 2: least once, and thirty two percent of these had used

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Speaker 2: one in the past month in a secondary school survey.

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Speaker 2: So our Rossie numbers are fairly high compared to what

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Speaker 2: you've mentioned from from the US drama Queens seventy five says,

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Speaker 2: where do they get them? They buy in Bolk after

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Speaker 2: making connection on Instagram. Then they on sell. So I've

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Speaker 2: got a couple of things to mention abou where they're

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Speaker 2: getting them. But before I do, have you got anything

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Speaker 2: that you would add to that?

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Speaker 3: No?

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Speaker 4: I think keep going, keep going.

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Speaker 2: Okay, So a lot of there's a guy here in

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Speaker 2: Australia who talks about this all the time. People are

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Speaker 2: using Instagram and Snapchat to buy drugs and during the

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Speaker 2: pandemic it absolutely went bonkers. And your kids. They can

390
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Speaker 2: literally pick up Instagram or Snapchat or TikTok, and they

391
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Speaker 2: can have drugs delivered to the door within thirty minutes.

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Speaker 2: And there may be all kinds of laws around their access,

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Speaker 2: but those laws have never really been particularly particularly effective.

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Speaker 2: What else have we got here? Uh? Black market? Eye opening?

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00:20:09,720 --> 00:20:11,520
Speaker 2: The kids even know about the black market, but let

396
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Speaker 2: me tell you little forest photography they do.

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Speaker 4: I thought this was fascinating. What if your team, what

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Speaker 4: if your team wants to keep faking because they say, well,

399
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Speaker 4: we're all going to die anyway.

400
00:20:20,160 --> 00:20:22,760
Speaker 2: I just found that one. I was about to read it. Yeah, yeah, yeah,

401
00:20:22,880 --> 00:20:24,639
Speaker 2: such a teenage response, right.

402
00:20:24,520 --> 00:20:27,359
Speaker 4: That's perfect, That's imperfect. And the nice thing is like,

403
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Speaker 4: that's the kind of thing a teenager says that. Like

404
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Speaker 4: for me, I think humor is the only answer. I think, like,

405
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Speaker 4: I think it's such a it's such a you.

406
00:20:34,720 --> 00:20:37,879
Speaker 3: Know, kind of wonderfully kind of existential crisis teenager. Anything

407
00:20:37,920 --> 00:20:39,280
Speaker 3: to say that, I think, to engage it on this

408
00:20:39,440 --> 00:20:42,439
Speaker 3: level is probably not that useful. But I think I

409
00:20:42,480 --> 00:20:44,919
Speaker 3: think to say something that is basically like, well, this

410
00:20:45,080 --> 00:20:47,000
Speaker 3: is true, we are all going to eventually die. But

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Speaker 3: I have a lot of important things I want you

412
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Speaker 3: to do in your life. I think there's a lot

413
00:20:50,400 --> 00:20:52,400
Speaker 3: of value in your life between now and that point.

414
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Speaker 3: So like, let's not rush it along, you know, like

415
00:20:55,000 --> 00:20:58,399
Speaker 3: I would. I would just be playful with that.

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Speaker 2: How would you like to die if you could choose?

417
00:21:01,560 --> 00:21:04,119
Speaker 2: What would you like to buy? With nicotine poisoning and

418
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Speaker 2: cancer associated?

419
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Speaker 4: I mean you want to go out?

420
00:21:07,080 --> 00:21:09,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, let's let's let's play with this little and

421
00:21:09,240 --> 00:21:10,600
Speaker 2: not the way trying to mind like a lot of

422
00:21:10,680 --> 00:21:13,399
Speaker 2: something that really is tragic, but with your teenage just

423
00:21:13,400 --> 00:21:16,160
Speaker 2: sometimes that's the way you've got to go do it.

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Speaker 3: There's another one here that I think is such an

425
00:21:18,320 --> 00:21:20,520
Speaker 3: important point, and it may be a really good one

426
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Speaker 3: for us to wrap up on about on the spectrum

427
00:21:23,200 --> 00:21:26,840
Speaker 3: harm e cigarettes are low, this is true, and just

428
00:21:26,920 --> 00:21:29,159
Speaker 3: keep the lines of communication open, checking every now and

429
00:21:29,160 --> 00:21:31,199
Speaker 3: then about the constant financial impact. And I think this

430
00:21:31,320 --> 00:21:33,320
Speaker 3: is true, and I think it gets to a really

431
00:21:33,359 --> 00:21:36,119
Speaker 3: central point in talking with teens about risk. If we

432
00:21:36,240 --> 00:21:41,320
Speaker 3: talk about everything like it is as dangerous as everything else,

433
00:21:41,920 --> 00:21:45,320
Speaker 3: they also stop taking us seriously. And so when I

434
00:21:45,480 --> 00:21:49,720
Speaker 3: talk with kids about substances, I will say, Okay, there

435
00:21:49,920 --> 00:21:53,440
Speaker 3: is heroin and cocaine and like I will like put

436
00:21:53,480 --> 00:21:57,840
Speaker 3: the I'm like these like dead on site, like you

437
00:21:58,240 --> 00:22:00,720
Speaker 3: want no part of any of these, and then I

438
00:22:00,760 --> 00:22:03,720
Speaker 3: will move. I don't say, Okay, here's marijuana. Here's how

439
00:22:03,840 --> 00:22:07,440
Speaker 3: marijuana will harm your developing brain. Okay, here's cigarettes. Here's

440
00:22:07,480 --> 00:22:10,080
Speaker 3: why you don't really want to get yourself involved with cigarettes. Okay,

441
00:22:10,160 --> 00:22:12,520
Speaker 3: here's the deal on vaping. Here are the harms that

442
00:22:12,560 --> 00:22:15,919
Speaker 3: come with aaping. But I really am very deliberate and

443
00:22:16,040 --> 00:22:19,320
Speaker 3: about not talking about these cigarettes as if.

444
00:22:19,200 --> 00:22:22,320
Speaker 4: I'm talking about heroin. And the reason for that is

445
00:22:22,359 --> 00:22:25,679
Speaker 4: that kids will just tune you out. Yeah, and so

446
00:22:25,840 --> 00:22:28,520
Speaker 4: if it's always on, you know, like everything's on the.

447
00:22:28,480 --> 00:22:31,520
Speaker 3: Ceiling, they're like, then nothing's on the ceiling. And so

448
00:22:31,640 --> 00:22:34,520
Speaker 3: to say, here are the harms. I love you. You

449
00:22:34,560 --> 00:22:36,800
Speaker 3: have one body, you have one brain, You have one

450
00:22:36,800 --> 00:22:38,159
Speaker 3: set of lungs that are supposed to get you through

451
00:22:38,160 --> 00:22:38,720
Speaker 3: the rest.

452
00:22:38,480 --> 00:22:39,119
Speaker 4: Of your life.

453
00:22:39,520 --> 00:22:41,680
Speaker 3: My advice to you is you take really good care

454
00:22:41,760 --> 00:22:44,399
Speaker 3: of them, because none of these are easily replaced.

455
00:22:45,000 --> 00:22:46,800
Speaker 4: And just to really keep it on that.

456
00:22:47,760 --> 00:22:51,040
Speaker 2: The story that comes to mind, Lasers say that is

457
00:22:51,119 --> 00:22:53,359
Speaker 2: the conversation that a lot of parents have with the

458
00:22:54,359 --> 00:22:59,240
Speaker 2: teenagers about if you drink here's what's gonna happen drinking alcohol. Now,

459
00:22:59,520 --> 00:23:03,520
Speaker 2: alcohol is a horrendously dangerous substance, but like you said

460
00:23:03,520 --> 00:23:07,240
Speaker 2: on the continuum, it's not the worst one. And when

461
00:23:07,280 --> 00:23:11,919
Speaker 2: we and we should be discouraging our children from drinking, absolutely,

462
00:23:13,080 --> 00:23:15,120
Speaker 2: but when we said to them, if you drink, you're

463
00:23:15,119 --> 00:23:18,679
Speaker 2: going to end up having issues around violence and sexual

464
00:23:18,720 --> 00:23:20,680
Speaker 2: assault and you might have a car crash or get

465
00:23:20,680 --> 00:23:22,639
Speaker 2: in a fight and all those kinds of things, and

466
00:23:22,680 --> 00:23:25,240
Speaker 2: your teenagers looking at you, going yeah, But on Friday

467
00:23:25,320 --> 00:23:26,800
Speaker 2: night at that party that you didn't know that I

468
00:23:26,840 --> 00:23:29,840
Speaker 2: went to, everyone was completely plastered, everyone was drunk, and

469
00:23:29,920 --> 00:23:31,760
Speaker 2: nothing happened. Then they just had a great time. Like

470
00:23:31,960 --> 00:23:35,560
Speaker 2: what's the big deal? So maintaining that credibility, I just

471
00:23:35,960 --> 00:23:37,960
Speaker 2: I love. Just a couple of things as we wrap

472
00:23:38,000 --> 00:23:42,639
Speaker 2: this up, Ali has said that his son Vabes and

473
00:23:42,680 --> 00:23:45,160
Speaker 2: recently came home from Skill having vomited because of it.

474
00:23:45,440 --> 00:23:48,400
Speaker 2: He told me he got Nick sick. And I've never

475
00:23:48,440 --> 00:23:51,679
Speaker 2: heard of that. And Ali says, how would you respond?

476
00:23:51,680 --> 00:23:53,560
Speaker 2: I think that our whole conversation is how you would

477
00:23:53,600 --> 00:23:58,960
Speaker 2: respond to that. And Miguel Mike Gal or MiG Gal says,

478
00:23:59,119 --> 00:24:02,640
Speaker 2: many Vabes are not the cannabis, which obviously another discussion about.

479
00:24:04,600 --> 00:24:09,240
Speaker 3: Absolutely, and these are two things.

480
00:24:09,080 --> 00:24:14,119
Speaker 4: Absolutely justin thank you so much for doing this. This

481
00:24:14,240 --> 00:24:15,040
Speaker 4: was really fun.

482
00:24:19,800 --> 00:24:21,600
Speaker 2: Well. I hope that you found that conversation with doctor

483
00:24:21,640 --> 00:24:24,320
Speaker 2: Lisa de Moore and myself helpful. By the way, as

484
00:24:24,359 --> 00:24:26,359
Speaker 2: I mentioned, Lisa has written not one, but two New

485
00:24:26,400 --> 00:24:29,520
Speaker 2: York Times bestsellers, Untangled and under Pressure. You can find

486
00:24:29,520 --> 00:24:32,120
Speaker 2: them online wherever you buy your books. We'll put links

487
00:24:32,160 --> 00:24:34,159
Speaker 2: to Lisa's website in the show notes as well, and

488
00:24:34,200 --> 00:24:36,359
Speaker 2: you might want to check out her podcast, Ask Lisa,

489
00:24:36,359 --> 00:24:39,399
Speaker 2: It's an absolute ripper. The Happy Families podcast is produced

490
00:24:39,400 --> 00:24:42,080
Speaker 2: by Justin Rouland from Bridge Media. Craig Bruce is our

491
00:24:42,200 --> 00:24:45,320
Speaker 2: executive producer, and for more and about making your family happier,

492
00:24:45,359 --> 00:24:47,520
Speaker 2: please visit Happy Families dot com dot au