1
00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:03,040
Speaker 1: Now it's been revealed that two in three Northern Territory

2
00:00:03,080 --> 00:00:06,880
Speaker 1: Principles were victims of violence. In twenty twenty three, the

3
00:00:06,880 --> 00:00:11,320
Speaker 1: Australian Principal Occupational Health, Safety and well Being Survey revealed

4
00:00:11,400 --> 00:00:15,040
Speaker 1: sixty one point eight percent of the Territory's principle had

5
00:00:15,080 --> 00:00:19,160
Speaker 1: been threatened with violence. Nationally, forty eight point two percent

6
00:00:19,200 --> 00:00:22,920
Speaker 1: of principles had experienced violence and fifty three point nine

7
00:00:22,960 --> 00:00:27,120
Speaker 1: percent had been threatened. Now students followed by parents with

8
00:00:27,200 --> 00:00:30,800
Speaker 1: a primary source of violence and threats across the country.

9
00:00:31,000 --> 00:00:32,640
Speaker 1: And joining me on the line to talk a little

10
00:00:32,640 --> 00:00:35,479
Speaker 1: more about this is the president of the Northern Territory

11
00:00:35,520 --> 00:00:39,360
Speaker 1: Principles Association, Robin Thorpe. Good morning to you, Robin.

12
00:00:40,159 --> 00:00:43,440
Speaker 2: Oh, good morning Katie, and welcome to our listeners as well.

13
00:00:43,560 --> 00:00:46,000
Speaker 1: Lovely to have you on the show. Now, Robin, tell

14
00:00:46,040 --> 00:00:50,280
Speaker 1: me how often are our Northern Territory Principles facing violence?

15
00:00:51,840 --> 00:00:54,720
Speaker 2: Well, Katie, I would have to say that, first of all,

16
00:00:55,200 --> 00:01:00,560
Speaker 2: the number of our principals and school leaders have really

17
00:01:00,720 --> 00:01:06,600
Speaker 2: strong positive relationships with parents and students, but there is

18
00:01:06,600 --> 00:01:09,880
Speaker 2: a small minority and a minority that make the work

19
00:01:09,959 --> 00:01:15,000
Speaker 2: quite challenging and quite complex. We know that statistics are

20
00:01:15,000 --> 00:01:19,000
Speaker 2: not good. We've seen them come out today and we

21
00:01:19,920 --> 00:01:24,520
Speaker 2: also know that those statistics showed that our principles are

22
00:01:24,560 --> 00:01:28,760
Speaker 2: also very resilient, they're very dedicated, and they're very committed.

23
00:01:29,880 --> 00:01:32,240
Speaker 2: And Katie, I'd have to say that probably one of

24
00:01:32,319 --> 00:01:37,399
Speaker 2: the biggest challenges is when some of these problems are

25
00:01:37,440 --> 00:01:42,280
Speaker 2: persistent and they're ongoing and they become a cumulative and

26
00:01:42,319 --> 00:01:47,080
Speaker 2: that's when it really impacts on school leader health and

27
00:01:47,200 --> 00:01:47,880
Speaker 2: well being.

28
00:01:48,920 --> 00:01:51,560
Speaker 1: It must be tough, Like it's such a tough job,

29
00:01:51,600 --> 00:01:53,920
Speaker 1: I think to you know, to be a teacher, but

30
00:01:53,960 --> 00:01:57,080
Speaker 1: then to be a principal running a school and some

31
00:01:57,160 --> 00:02:00,559
Speaker 1: of the different external factors you know, they're they're coming

32
00:02:00,640 --> 00:02:04,680
Speaker 1: to play aside from just educating children, Like, it would

33
00:02:04,720 --> 00:02:09,000
Speaker 1: be incredibly tough. Robin, tell us, you know what are

34
00:02:09,360 --> 00:02:11,360
Speaker 1: some of the you know what are some of the

35
00:02:11,400 --> 00:02:13,840
Speaker 1: incidents that our principles are having to deal with.

36
00:02:15,200 --> 00:02:19,480
Speaker 2: Well, Katie, you know, you're right. Our principles have to

37
00:02:19,560 --> 00:02:24,240
Speaker 2: deal with a lot of issues and complexities that happen

38
00:02:24,280 --> 00:02:27,960
Speaker 2: in communities. They're leaders in their communities. They're often called

39
00:02:28,000 --> 00:02:34,960
Speaker 2: on in times of floods, bushfires, cyclones, food shortages, road closures,

40
00:02:35,120 --> 00:02:39,200
Speaker 2: in our community violence in themselves. So the job is

41
00:02:39,320 --> 00:02:41,880
Speaker 2: really complex, and you're dead right, there's more and more

42
00:02:41,919 --> 00:02:44,360
Speaker 2: work for us to do. We know that there have

43
00:02:44,480 --> 00:02:48,680
Speaker 2: been additional workload pressures and they have come from principles

44
00:02:48,680 --> 00:02:56,240
Speaker 2: having to manage hr issues, infrastructure issues, housing issues, finance issues,

45
00:02:56,280 --> 00:02:58,960
Speaker 2: the list goes on and on, and what they really

46
00:02:59,000 --> 00:03:00,800
Speaker 2: want to do is to be able to focus on

47
00:03:00,840 --> 00:03:04,720
Speaker 2: the kids and teaching and learning and supporting their staff

48
00:03:05,240 --> 00:03:08,799
Speaker 2: to help kids achieve their best. So there are some

49
00:03:09,080 --> 00:03:12,919
Speaker 2: examples too in our communities where our principles are having

50
00:03:12,960 --> 00:03:18,720
Speaker 2: to clean schools and clean toilets and mow lawns and

51
00:03:18,800 --> 00:03:22,240
Speaker 2: all sorts of things. So it is really complex and

52
00:03:22,360 --> 00:03:23,120
Speaker 2: challenging work.

53
00:03:23,639 --> 00:03:28,160
Speaker 1: It certainly is, Robin, I mean looking at these just

54
00:03:28,240 --> 00:03:31,119
Speaker 1: looking for a moment at at this survey, I mean,

55
00:03:31,240 --> 00:03:35,440
Speaker 1: sixty one point eight percent of territory principles being threatened

56
00:03:35,640 --> 00:03:42,880
Speaker 1: with violence. They are, they're very strong numbers.

57
00:03:43,480 --> 00:03:46,400
Speaker 2: And looks sadly. I think the violence that happens in

58
00:03:46,440 --> 00:03:50,640
Speaker 2: our schools is a reflection of the violence that happens

59
00:03:50,680 --> 00:03:55,120
Speaker 2: in our communities. And we know that education can't solve

60
00:03:55,120 --> 00:03:58,160
Speaker 2: this by itself. It really does have to be a

61
00:03:58,240 --> 00:04:02,200
Speaker 2: whole of government initiatives, and we need to look at

62
00:04:02,320 --> 00:04:08,960
Speaker 2: what's behind behaviors or violent behaviors, and at times it's

63
00:04:09,200 --> 00:04:13,360
Speaker 2: parents or community members who are under the influence of

64
00:04:13,440 --> 00:04:17,880
Speaker 2: drugs or alcohol or have mental health issues. That's really hard,

65
00:04:17,920 --> 00:04:22,400
Speaker 2: that's really complex. When it comes to children and students

66
00:04:22,400 --> 00:04:26,200
Speaker 2: and young people, we know our job is assisting in

67
00:04:26,279 --> 00:04:32,240
Speaker 2: supporting them to disregulate or to regulate their behaviors and

68
00:04:32,320 --> 00:04:35,360
Speaker 2: to regulate their emotions. And there's a whole loa of

69
00:04:35,400 --> 00:04:39,360
Speaker 2: work that goes in providing wraparound support for kids who

70
00:04:39,400 --> 00:04:44,160
Speaker 2: are like that. Probably one of the biggest challenges for us, Katie,

71
00:04:44,200 --> 00:04:46,920
Speaker 2: is that we haven't been resourced. We haven't been funded

72
00:04:47,440 --> 00:04:50,560
Speaker 2: in the Northern Territory for a long time, so we

73
00:04:50,640 --> 00:04:53,240
Speaker 2: haven't been able to put in the right supports and

74
00:04:53,279 --> 00:04:56,760
Speaker 2: that's what this additional funding will do. It will mean

75
00:04:56,839 --> 00:05:01,360
Speaker 2: that can we get the right support for those kids

76
00:05:01,520 --> 00:05:04,080
Speaker 2: that require additional intervention.

77
00:05:05,240 --> 00:05:07,640
Speaker 1: So what needs to happen It does sound as though

78
00:05:07,640 --> 00:05:10,440
Speaker 1: there is more funding required, But Robin, from your perspective,

79
00:05:10,480 --> 00:05:12,000
Speaker 1: what needs to happen right now?

80
00:05:13,720 --> 00:05:17,720
Speaker 2: Well, I think we need to enact the no tolerance

81
00:05:17,800 --> 00:05:23,720
Speaker 2: to violence policies for those extreme behaviors. For example, Victoria

82
00:05:23,839 --> 00:05:27,240
Speaker 2: has what they call community orders that was written up

83
00:05:27,279 --> 00:05:30,039
Speaker 2: in the report has been quite a positive way of

84
00:05:30,120 --> 00:05:35,599
Speaker 2: addressing from quite extreme violent behaviors. And that's a short term,

85
00:05:35,720 --> 00:05:40,800
Speaker 2: you know, exclusion for whoever has committed to violent behavior

86
00:05:41,360 --> 00:05:45,559
Speaker 2: against the school leader or the teacher or sometimes sadly

87
00:05:46,320 --> 00:05:51,279
Speaker 2: towards students as well. I think the other thing is,

88
00:05:52,640 --> 00:05:58,080
Speaker 2: as a member of the National Associations, we've been advocating

89
00:05:58,200 --> 00:06:02,479
Speaker 2: for the National Teach Your Workforce Action Plan to have

90
00:06:02,600 --> 00:06:06,200
Speaker 2: a sixth priority, and what we would like to see

91
00:06:06,200 --> 00:06:10,400
Speaker 2: in that sixth priority is that we focus on how

92
00:06:10,400 --> 00:06:13,680
Speaker 2: do we retain and sustain our principles, what are the

93
00:06:13,720 --> 00:06:19,240
Speaker 2: factors that are contributing to poor principal health and wellbeing outcomes?

94
00:06:19,760 --> 00:06:22,600
Speaker 2: And then how do we address them nationally because this

95
00:06:22,680 --> 00:06:25,760
Speaker 2: is not just the problem in the Northern Gurtory, it's

96
00:06:25,920 --> 00:06:28,000
Speaker 2: right across Australia.

97
00:06:28,040 --> 00:06:29,720
Speaker 1: Hey, I want to ask you as well, Robin, while

98
00:06:29,760 --> 00:06:31,800
Speaker 1: I've got you on the line this morning. There's obviously

99
00:06:32,240 --> 00:06:35,240
Speaker 1: it's been reported that vaping regulations are on the horizon

100
00:06:35,440 --> 00:06:38,200
Speaker 1: and in an effort to curb the health crisis that

101
00:06:38,240 --> 00:06:44,599
Speaker 1: we know is affecting sixteen percent of the nation's high schoolers, Robin.

102
00:06:44,640 --> 00:06:48,159
Speaker 1: How big an issue is vaping in Northern Territory schools

103
00:06:48,520 --> 00:06:51,560
Speaker 1: from your perspective, Lo Katie.

104
00:06:51,640 --> 00:06:56,400
Speaker 2: A couple of years ago, when vaping became very popular

105
00:06:56,760 --> 00:07:01,000
Speaker 2: with young people, it was a huge issue and certainly

106
00:07:01,040 --> 00:07:04,839
Speaker 2: our association was keeping that on the agenda with our

107
00:07:05,240 --> 00:07:11,160
Speaker 2: ministers and department. We have seen a slight reduction in

108
00:07:11,840 --> 00:07:15,840
Speaker 2: the number of cases that we do have with kids

109
00:07:15,920 --> 00:07:19,360
Speaker 2: using e cigarettes. Some of that has been brought around

110
00:07:19,560 --> 00:07:25,120
Speaker 2: by having fake detectors in toilets. That's made a difference,

111
00:07:26,240 --> 00:07:30,720
Speaker 2: but it certainly has to be education, and not just

112
00:07:31,000 --> 00:07:35,520
Speaker 2: education for our kids, but for the public as well,

113
00:07:36,160 --> 00:07:38,880
Speaker 2: because I don't think we've had the data and the

114
00:07:38,960 --> 00:07:42,280
Speaker 2: research to put it really out there to say what

115
00:07:42,320 --> 00:07:48,280
Speaker 2: are the dangers of e cigarettes. So we're really pleased

116
00:07:48,440 --> 00:07:52,080
Speaker 2: to see that a first step has been taken to

117
00:07:52,120 --> 00:07:55,800
Speaker 2: help regulate bates. We'd probably like to go further at once,

118
00:07:57,040 --> 00:08:01,960
Speaker 2: because we really really needs to be a rest with

119
00:08:02,320 --> 00:08:05,720
Speaker 2: regulation but also with strong education.

120
00:08:06,280 --> 00:08:08,000
Speaker 1: I agree, you know, I do think that it is

121
00:08:08,040 --> 00:08:10,960
Speaker 1: such an educational thing in terms of parents telling, you know,

122
00:08:11,040 --> 00:08:15,280
Speaker 1: like speaking to their children about the health impacts of vaping. Robin,

123
00:08:15,840 --> 00:08:17,880
Speaker 1: is it just an issue in high schools or is

124
00:08:17,920 --> 00:08:19,960
Speaker 1: this something that we're seeing in primary schools in the

125
00:08:19,960 --> 00:08:23,360
Speaker 1: Northern territory as well, because I've certainly heard anecdotally that

126
00:08:23,440 --> 00:08:25,760
Speaker 1: it is an issue in primary school too.

127
00:08:26,800 --> 00:08:29,840
Speaker 2: Yeah. Look sadly, Katie, it is in primary schools. It's

128
00:08:29,880 --> 00:08:33,920
Speaker 2: not just the secondary school issue. You know, once upon

129
00:08:33,920 --> 00:08:36,040
Speaker 2: a time we had to deal with kids in cigarettes,

130
00:08:36,040 --> 00:08:38,080
Speaker 2: but we don't deal with that anymore. We deal with

131
00:08:38,160 --> 00:08:42,000
Speaker 2: e cigarettes. Yeah, and you know, sometimes little kids grab

132
00:08:42,040 --> 00:08:44,240
Speaker 2: hold of you know, other people, or they get it

133
00:08:44,280 --> 00:08:50,360
Speaker 2: from older kids. And the sad part is that kids

134
00:08:50,400 --> 00:08:54,560
Speaker 2: think it's school, it's trendy. You know, the whole marketing

135
00:08:54,640 --> 00:08:58,520
Speaker 2: has been towards kids. You know, you look at the

136
00:08:58,559 --> 00:09:01,720
Speaker 2: product label and you look at the flavors, it's all

137
00:09:01,800 --> 00:09:03,200
Speaker 2: targeted towards gigs.

138
00:09:03,360 --> 00:09:07,559
Speaker 1: Yeah, Robin, Crystal, my producer and I've had conversations about

139
00:09:07,559 --> 00:09:10,000
Speaker 1: this before. You know, it's meant to be quite difficult

140
00:09:10,040 --> 00:09:12,720
Speaker 1: to get your hands on vapes, Like how are school

141
00:09:12,720 --> 00:09:16,600
Speaker 1: students even getting their hands on vapes? From what you know?

142
00:09:18,280 --> 00:09:20,600
Speaker 2: From what we know and what kids have told us,

143
00:09:20,880 --> 00:09:25,640
Speaker 2: is that there's a market on social media. You know,

144
00:09:25,880 --> 00:09:28,880
Speaker 2: people put up ads on where you can go, where

145
00:09:28,880 --> 00:09:32,360
Speaker 2: you can beat up to buy vapes, and we also

146
00:09:32,440 --> 00:09:35,400
Speaker 2: know sadurdly at times that they are being sold over

147
00:09:35,440 --> 00:09:40,960
Speaker 2: the counter two people, two young people, young teenagers, who

148
00:09:41,000 --> 00:09:45,679
Speaker 2: then use it and then of course very entrepreneurial and

149
00:09:45,880 --> 00:09:51,640
Speaker 2: sell on. So you know, light cigarettes, it's become our

150
00:09:51,720 --> 00:09:53,120
Speaker 2: next big problem.

151
00:09:54,200 --> 00:09:57,120
Speaker 1: Yeah, it is a worry, it truly is. And the

152
00:09:57,160 --> 00:09:59,760
Speaker 1: health impact, you know, we really don't know just how

153
00:09:59,800 --> 00:10:01,319
Speaker 1: bad it's going to be. And I guess that we're

154
00:10:01,320 --> 00:10:03,000
Speaker 1: going to start to see some of those as the

155
00:10:03,080 --> 00:10:06,319
Speaker 1: years progress, and it's our young people that are unfortunately

156
00:10:06,360 --> 00:10:11,000
Speaker 1: going to be impacted. Robin thought, yeah, sorry on that.

157
00:10:11,480 --> 00:10:14,600
Speaker 2: I just want to say that we have seen the

158
00:10:14,640 --> 00:10:19,160
Speaker 2: effects of nicotine addiction from vaping. That's of course impacting

159
00:10:19,200 --> 00:10:23,000
Speaker 2: on kids' mental health and well being, but also impacting

160
00:10:23,120 --> 00:10:24,640
Speaker 2: on their attendance at school.

161
00:10:24,880 --> 00:10:27,960
Speaker 1: They're right, so they're not turning up to school then.

162
00:10:29,120 --> 00:10:32,640
Speaker 3: Well, well once you get to a point of it

163
00:10:32,720 --> 00:10:36,319
Speaker 3: being an addiction and you know you can't vapor at school,

164
00:10:36,960 --> 00:10:38,959
Speaker 3: then it's hard for them to come and spend a

165
00:10:39,000 --> 00:10:40,320
Speaker 3: full six hours at school.

166
00:10:42,040 --> 00:10:44,800
Speaker 1: Well, Robin, I really appreciate your time this morning. Thank

167
00:10:44,840 --> 00:10:47,160
Speaker 1: you so very much. For joining us, and no doubt

168
00:10:47,200 --> 00:10:51,160
Speaker 1: we'll talk to you again soon. No worries, thanks, thank you,

169
00:10:51,320 --> 00:10:52,040
Speaker 1: thanks so much,