1 00:00:00,600 --> 00:00:03,720 Speaker 1: Hello, and welcome to Outspoken. You're dose of the hottest 2 00:00:03,720 --> 00:00:07,440 Speaker 1: influencer and pop culture news twice a week. I'm Sophie 3 00:00:07,480 --> 00:00:10,320 Speaker 1: Torbert and I'm joined by my sisters and journalists Kate 4 00:00:10,400 --> 00:00:14,440 Speaker 1: and Amy. On today's show, Abby Chatfield's rant about excessive 5 00:00:14,480 --> 00:00:18,480 Speaker 1: PR packaging has sparked a debate about who is responsible 6 00:00:18,560 --> 00:00:22,279 Speaker 1: for the waste. Y l Darby's radio silence has left 7 00:00:22,280 --> 00:00:26,520 Speaker 1: followers even thirstier for her content and are you obligated 8 00:00:26,520 --> 00:00:30,840 Speaker 1: to engage with influencers? Ads? But first, I was watching 9 00:00:31,000 --> 00:00:34,000 Speaker 1: Mollie May's YouTube video the other day and she has 10 00:00:34,000 --> 00:00:37,159 Speaker 1: these adorable new kittens called Eggy and Bread and they 11 00:00:37,240 --> 00:00:40,080 Speaker 1: remind me very much of Taylor Swift's cats because they 12 00:00:40,159 --> 00:00:44,160 Speaker 1: are Scottish folds anyway, out of nowhere. In this video, 13 00:00:44,600 --> 00:00:47,239 Speaker 1: Molly starts speaking to her cats in what I describe 14 00:00:47,280 --> 00:00:50,680 Speaker 1: as her cat mum voice. Let's listen to the clip. 15 00:00:50,920 --> 00:01:05,040 Speaker 2: Amire malama, hama, buye versions of bye, mine, Gimi kish, 16 00:01:05,240 --> 00:01:06,000 Speaker 2: gimme kiss. 17 00:01:06,680 --> 00:01:09,720 Speaker 1: See. As a cat mum, I can relate to Molly's voice. However, 18 00:01:09,880 --> 00:01:12,280 Speaker 1: I do think hers is next level on the scale 19 00:01:12,319 --> 00:01:14,679 Speaker 1: of crazy cat moms. I actually lost her. I couldn't 20 00:01:14,720 --> 00:01:16,200 Speaker 1: believe that this was a voice. I don't know if 21 00:01:16,240 --> 00:01:18,920 Speaker 1: it was just the accent, but it sounded really funny. 22 00:01:19,400 --> 00:01:21,720 Speaker 1: It makes me laugh that she actually watched the video 23 00:01:21,840 --> 00:01:24,600 Speaker 1: back and didn't edit it out, because I'll catch myself 24 00:01:24,640 --> 00:01:27,319 Speaker 1: doing my dog mum voice in front of other people 25 00:01:27,360 --> 00:01:30,160 Speaker 1: and feel completely ashamed, And if I was to see 26 00:01:30,160 --> 00:01:32,240 Speaker 1: it on a vlog, I would definitely cut it out. 27 00:01:32,520 --> 00:01:34,640 Speaker 1: When I was leaving my house the other day, I 28 00:01:34,720 --> 00:01:36,840 Speaker 1: was saying goodbye to Archie and Brandon, and it was 29 00:01:36,880 --> 00:01:39,280 Speaker 1: really Archie who I saying goodbye to. I said goodbye, 30 00:01:39,440 --> 00:01:42,120 Speaker 1: my soulmate and walked out the door, and then I 31 00:01:42,240 --> 00:01:44,600 Speaker 1: noticed the two guys I live next door to out 32 00:01:44,600 --> 00:01:47,119 Speaker 1: the front and I'm like, it's so embarrassing because they 33 00:01:47,160 --> 00:01:50,240 Speaker 1: probably thought I'm one of those clingy girlfriends speaking to Brannon, 34 00:01:50,280 --> 00:01:52,600 Speaker 1: but I was actually speaking to my dog. How does 35 00:01:52,600 --> 00:01:56,200 Speaker 1: Brandon feel about you calling Archie your soulmate and not him, Well, 36 00:01:56,240 --> 00:01:59,160 Speaker 1: I actually think that Brandon loves Archie more than me. Oh, 37 00:02:00,120 --> 00:02:02,960 Speaker 1: he calls in that all the time. I also recently 38 00:02:03,000 --> 00:02:05,640 Speaker 1: saw that Abby Chatfield has shared the voice that she 39 00:02:05,840 --> 00:02:08,120 Speaker 1: does for her dog Marco, and he has his own 40 00:02:08,160 --> 00:02:11,840 Speaker 1: Instagram account. It's absolutely adorable. I'd highly recommend going and 41 00:02:11,840 --> 00:02:14,639 Speaker 1: following it. But yeah, she shared these full blown videos 42 00:02:14,639 --> 00:02:18,240 Speaker 1: of Marco talking about being an influencer. It's so funny. 43 00:02:18,480 --> 00:02:19,480 Speaker 1: Let's throw to a clip. 44 00:02:19,720 --> 00:02:22,560 Speaker 3: It's mad bag a lake headed mammy and give a 45 00:02:22,639 --> 00:02:24,880 Speaker 3: cadgets for that's half an hour, and then we have 46 00:02:25,400 --> 00:02:29,040 Speaker 3: a whacket. We walk other way to the gym, and 47 00:02:29,080 --> 00:02:33,119 Speaker 3: then I jump up onto Matron that there me bad 48 00:02:33,160 --> 00:02:34,519 Speaker 3: the bad day next time. 49 00:02:34,880 --> 00:02:36,919 Speaker 1: Does anyone else think that the voice sounds a lot 50 00:02:36,960 --> 00:02:40,840 Speaker 1: like Cartman from South Park? Yes, it's it really does. 51 00:02:40,919 --> 00:02:43,200 Speaker 1: And I actually had a lot of relief listening to 52 00:02:43,240 --> 00:02:46,000 Speaker 1: this video because Reese and I are always putting on 53 00:02:46,240 --> 00:02:49,080 Speaker 1: voices for our dogs, Sonny and Shadow, and we're always 54 00:02:49,120 --> 00:02:51,679 Speaker 1: communicating like, ma'am, can you do this? My all time 55 00:02:51,720 --> 00:02:54,880 Speaker 1: favorite thing is when Brandon does Archie's voice, and I'm 56 00:02:54,919 --> 00:02:57,280 Speaker 1: always saying, please do his voice, me, please do it. 57 00:02:57,320 --> 00:02:59,120 Speaker 1: The voice that you both do for art, she sounds 58 00:02:59,200 --> 00:03:00,800 Speaker 1: very similar, So I feel like you need to do it. 59 00:03:00,840 --> 00:03:02,359 Speaker 1: You need to give the listeners a little bit of 60 00:03:02,360 --> 00:03:04,400 Speaker 1: a glimpse into Archie. Now I'm going to stage. 61 00:03:05,240 --> 00:03:05,480 Speaker 3: Do it. 62 00:03:05,680 --> 00:03:08,040 Speaker 1: Do it, Sophie. You constantly ring me and talk to 63 00:03:08,080 --> 00:03:10,239 Speaker 1: me as Archie all the time. Wait, she's going to 64 00:03:10,320 --> 00:03:14,920 Speaker 1: do it? Hello, podcast tact sadly, I don't want to 65 00:03:14,960 --> 00:03:18,720 Speaker 1: do that voice. I don't want to do it. I 66 00:03:18,760 --> 00:03:21,400 Speaker 1: want to know in our Facebook community, does anybody else 67 00:03:21,520 --> 00:03:23,120 Speaker 1: have voices for their dogs? 68 00:03:23,240 --> 00:03:24,600 Speaker 2: And there's one more thing I'm asked. 69 00:03:24,880 --> 00:03:27,040 Speaker 1: I ask one little favor of the principle. Can I 70 00:03:27,080 --> 00:03:28,880 Speaker 1: bring my dog to school and take her to class? 71 00:03:28,919 --> 00:03:30,239 Speaker 1: And I'm flatly refused. 72 00:03:31,040 --> 00:03:33,640 Speaker 3: Just the fact that Selene has to spend all her 73 00:03:33,720 --> 00:03:36,520 Speaker 3: time inside in my office is borderline cruelty. 74 00:03:36,720 --> 00:03:39,040 Speaker 1: It has been four months since we last heard from 75 00:03:39,040 --> 00:03:42,920 Speaker 1: disgraced UK influencer el Tarby. The twenty six year old 76 00:03:42,960 --> 00:03:45,680 Speaker 1: announced back in early January that she was taking a 77 00:03:45,680 --> 00:03:50,120 Speaker 1: break from social media after dozens of her old, racist, homophobic, 78 00:03:50,160 --> 00:03:53,920 Speaker 1: and fat phobic tweets were unearthed from twenty eleven. Similar 79 00:03:54,040 --> 00:03:58,160 Speaker 1: racist tweets were also uncovered from her fiance, Connor Swift's account, 80 00:03:58,360 --> 00:04:00,119 Speaker 1: and if you do want to find out more about 81 00:04:00,120 --> 00:04:02,400 Speaker 1: the scandal, we did a whole segment on it back 82 00:04:02,440 --> 00:04:05,480 Speaker 1: in January, which we will include in the show notes now. 83 00:04:05,520 --> 00:04:08,160 Speaker 1: At the time, Elle filmed an apology for YouTube and 84 00:04:08,200 --> 00:04:10,760 Speaker 1: said that she was disgusted with herself for the nature 85 00:04:10,800 --> 00:04:13,480 Speaker 1: of the comments, but said she had grown over those 86 00:04:13,520 --> 00:04:17,000 Speaker 1: ten years and changed as a person. The radio silence 87 00:04:17,000 --> 00:04:19,839 Speaker 1: seems to have actually made her fans and haters even 88 00:04:19,920 --> 00:04:22,960 Speaker 1: thirstier for her content about her life. I've been having 89 00:04:23,000 --> 00:04:24,920 Speaker 1: a look at tatle life, which is a forum where 90 00:04:25,000 --> 00:04:29,000 Speaker 1: users often critique influences, and there are pages and pages 91 00:04:29,040 --> 00:04:32,000 Speaker 1: of speculation about what she's been doing with her life 92 00:04:32,040 --> 00:04:35,159 Speaker 1: since she got canceled, and users often post about sightings 93 00:04:35,160 --> 00:04:36,880 Speaker 1: where they claim to have seen her at the gym 94 00:04:36,960 --> 00:04:39,000 Speaker 1: or walking down the street, or at a cafe or 95 00:04:39,040 --> 00:04:43,080 Speaker 1: holidaying in Florida. So, with no information about their lives 96 00:04:43,120 --> 00:04:46,400 Speaker 1: readily available, the rumor meal has been an overdrive, with 97 00:04:46,480 --> 00:04:50,080 Speaker 1: people speculating that the couple's wedding is off, that Con 98 00:04:50,160 --> 00:04:52,920 Speaker 1: has been cheating on Ell, and that l has bought 99 00:04:53,000 --> 00:04:55,920 Speaker 1: a new bungalow. I just love how specific the rumors are. 100 00:04:56,160 --> 00:04:56,280 Speaker 2: Well. 101 00:04:56,320 --> 00:05:00,640 Speaker 1: They were actually even posting pictures of the proposed bungalow 102 00:05:00,800 --> 00:05:03,279 Speaker 1: in the group, And there was also someone that came 103 00:05:03,320 --> 00:05:06,400 Speaker 1: in the group saying that they had been cheating with Con, 104 00:05:06,440 --> 00:05:10,280 Speaker 1: and it turned out to be just some psycho fan 105 00:05:10,520 --> 00:05:14,320 Speaker 1: really ages it was crazy I feel like some of 106 00:05:14,360 --> 00:05:16,640 Speaker 1: these girls on Tatto should be part of the FBI 107 00:05:16,839 --> 00:05:19,159 Speaker 1: because some of the stuff that they're able to find 108 00:05:19,200 --> 00:05:21,839 Speaker 1: out about these people is next level. Look, I do 109 00:05:21,880 --> 00:05:24,080 Speaker 1: think it's important to point out that all of those 110 00:05:24,240 --> 00:05:27,200 Speaker 1: are rumors. They are not substantiated with any fact at 111 00:05:27,240 --> 00:05:31,120 Speaker 1: the moment. Well, users on TikTok and Instagram keep speculating 112 00:05:31,240 --> 00:05:34,120 Speaker 1: about when Elle is going to make her grand return, 113 00:05:34,400 --> 00:05:37,360 Speaker 1: and I don't think that anyone anticipated that she would 114 00:05:37,400 --> 00:05:40,080 Speaker 1: be gone for this long. It has been four months now, 115 00:05:40,440 --> 00:05:43,880 Speaker 1: and as reported by TikToker Ella may Houghton, the first 116 00:05:43,920 --> 00:05:46,680 Speaker 1: signs of life in the el Derby camp happened on 117 00:05:46,839 --> 00:05:51,560 Speaker 1: March sixteenth, when Elle's brand, Angel Collection released a new 118 00:05:51,680 --> 00:05:54,799 Speaker 1: line of hoodies. Now an email sent out by Angel 119 00:05:54,800 --> 00:05:58,120 Speaker 1: Collection to customers in March has been circulating online and 120 00:05:58,160 --> 00:06:00,880 Speaker 1: it was a really odd email. So it said, as 121 00:06:00,920 --> 00:06:03,520 Speaker 1: you are likely to know, our founders were recently at 122 00:06:03,560 --> 00:06:07,560 Speaker 1: the front of public media criticism for past comments. Much 123 00:06:07,680 --> 00:06:10,000 Speaker 1: like all of you, the team and supportive members of 124 00:06:10,040 --> 00:06:13,760 Speaker 1: our Angels and Swift operations were disappointed and do not 125 00:06:13,800 --> 00:06:16,440 Speaker 1: support the words that were shared. Ell and Connor have 126 00:06:16,520 --> 00:06:19,520 Speaker 1: made their statements or apology and are taking time away 127 00:06:19,560 --> 00:06:22,919 Speaker 1: from social media. Angel and Swift employ and support a 128 00:06:22,920 --> 00:06:25,400 Speaker 1: team of people who continue to be committed to the 129 00:06:25,440 --> 00:06:30,479 Speaker 1: original core values positivity, community and inclusivity. We are grateful 130 00:06:30,480 --> 00:06:33,159 Speaker 1: for your support since the brand started. We are nothing 131 00:06:33,200 --> 00:06:36,400 Speaker 1: without you, the community that joined our journey. We have 132 00:06:36,480 --> 00:06:38,680 Speaker 1: taken the last few months to reflect on how we 133 00:06:38,720 --> 00:06:41,560 Speaker 1: manage our business and understand what we can change, and 134 00:06:41,600 --> 00:06:44,640 Speaker 1: we will be making changes going forward. Now, what do 135 00:06:44,800 --> 00:06:48,320 Speaker 1: you guys think about this statement? It's very bizarre because 136 00:06:48,400 --> 00:06:52,600 Speaker 1: this whole brand has been created by Elle and Connor. 137 00:06:53,040 --> 00:06:55,640 Speaker 1: It seems like a very strange move and I would 138 00:06:55,680 --> 00:06:58,440 Speaker 1: assume I could just imagine con writing this email. I 139 00:06:58,480 --> 00:07:00,560 Speaker 1: don't know who has apparently written it. It's just all 140 00:07:00,640 --> 00:07:02,640 Speaker 1: very odd. Yeah, that's the thing. While a lot of 141 00:07:02,720 --> 00:07:06,080 Speaker 1: influencer brands are very lucrative, a lot of the time 142 00:07:06,120 --> 00:07:09,400 Speaker 1: they are small startup businesses where the founders are very 143 00:07:09,480 --> 00:07:12,160 Speaker 1: hands on in those sort of positions. And it seems 144 00:07:12,200 --> 00:07:15,640 Speaker 1: like the Angels team is almost trying to distance themselves 145 00:07:15,720 --> 00:07:19,320 Speaker 1: from the owners, which is so odd because the owners 146 00:07:19,440 --> 00:07:22,480 Speaker 1: are the brand. Yeah, there's no brand without el Derby, 147 00:07:22,600 --> 00:07:25,160 Speaker 1: is there. People don't buy Angel collection because it's got 148 00:07:25,160 --> 00:07:27,800 Speaker 1: really good hoodies. They buy it because they love El Derby. 149 00:07:28,320 --> 00:07:30,400 Speaker 1: She's the face of it, and so is Con with 150 00:07:30,440 --> 00:07:33,120 Speaker 1: his own brand Swift. They constantly model for it, and 151 00:07:33,440 --> 00:07:36,800 Speaker 1: there's a reason why they've gone quiet because people associate 152 00:07:36,840 --> 00:07:39,560 Speaker 1: the brand with them. Therefore no one's going to be 153 00:07:39,560 --> 00:07:41,680 Speaker 1: buying it. So it seems like they're going to have 154 00:07:41,720 --> 00:07:43,640 Speaker 1: to do a lot of work in order to make 155 00:07:43,680 --> 00:07:46,880 Speaker 1: this business lucrative again. I'd also be really interested to 156 00:07:46,960 --> 00:07:49,960 Speaker 1: know how many employees they actually have, because I feel 157 00:07:50,040 --> 00:07:53,080 Speaker 1: like the email was almost saying, hey, there's all these 158 00:07:53,120 --> 00:07:55,560 Speaker 1: people working here that still need to be paid. But 159 00:07:56,080 --> 00:07:58,000 Speaker 1: they're kind of trying to act as if Con and 160 00:07:58,040 --> 00:08:00,480 Speaker 1: El aren't going to make money from this whole exchange. 161 00:08:00,480 --> 00:08:02,840 Speaker 1: They're the ones whose pockets are being filled when you 162 00:08:02,920 --> 00:08:05,440 Speaker 1: do buy from their collection. Do you notice that the 163 00:08:05,480 --> 00:08:09,160 Speaker 1: email didn't actually say what the comments were about. It's like, oh, 164 00:08:09,200 --> 00:08:11,800 Speaker 1: they made past comments and then they touched on that 165 00:08:11,840 --> 00:08:16,200 Speaker 1: one of their core values is inclusivity, but clearly, you know, 166 00:08:16,320 --> 00:08:19,160 Speaker 1: it doesn't seem to be one of Con or ELL's 167 00:08:19,280 --> 00:08:22,000 Speaker 1: values that they hold to their heart. Now there has 168 00:08:22,080 --> 00:08:24,480 Speaker 1: been a second sign of life from the Derby camp, 169 00:08:24,480 --> 00:08:26,840 Speaker 1: and that is when Elle turned her comments back on. 170 00:08:27,200 --> 00:08:29,880 Speaker 1: She did turn them off when the scandal happened, and 171 00:08:29,920 --> 00:08:34,600 Speaker 1: it's quite interesting because the comments are overwhelmingly positive now. 172 00:08:34,600 --> 00:08:37,080 Speaker 1: It's not clear if that's because they're being filtered or 173 00:08:37,120 --> 00:08:40,160 Speaker 1: moderated by L, but many fans are saying that they 174 00:08:40,200 --> 00:08:42,559 Speaker 1: miss her and that people should be allowed the right 175 00:08:42,640 --> 00:08:46,680 Speaker 1: to change over ten years. So I'm quite fascinated that 176 00:08:46,760 --> 00:08:49,480 Speaker 1: so many people seem really supportive of her. I don't 177 00:08:49,520 --> 00:08:53,360 Speaker 1: think I've actually seen an influencer go quiet for this long, 178 00:08:53,640 --> 00:08:55,960 Speaker 1: and judging by the comments, as you said, so if 179 00:08:55,960 --> 00:08:58,960 Speaker 1: they might be moderated, but I do feel like when 180 00:08:59,120 --> 00:09:02,240 Speaker 1: Conn and L come back onto their social media channels, 181 00:09:02,720 --> 00:09:05,200 Speaker 1: they will be forgiven by the majority, because it seems 182 00:09:05,240 --> 00:09:09,440 Speaker 1: like people actually do want their content and do enjoy it, 183 00:09:09,600 --> 00:09:11,920 Speaker 1: and they're happy to forgive them in order to then 184 00:09:11,960 --> 00:09:14,480 Speaker 1: receive it again. That's where this whole notion of being 185 00:09:14,559 --> 00:09:17,560 Speaker 1: canceled is really fascinating, because I don't think we've seen 186 00:09:17,559 --> 00:09:19,920 Speaker 1: it play out like this before. I don't think people 187 00:09:19,920 --> 00:09:23,000 Speaker 1: have taken this larger break off social media, and I 188 00:09:23,040 --> 00:09:25,400 Speaker 1: think that El has well and truly been punished for 189 00:09:25,440 --> 00:09:29,120 Speaker 1: her past actions. She has lost a whopping one hundred 190 00:09:29,160 --> 00:09:32,640 Speaker 1: and twenty eight thousand followers since the tweets were unearthed, 191 00:09:32,640 --> 00:09:35,040 Speaker 1: and she's also been dropped by her management team and 192 00:09:35,080 --> 00:09:39,080 Speaker 1: has had countless brand deals canceled. Now, after reading numerous 193 00:09:39,120 --> 00:09:42,240 Speaker 1: threads in tattle Life since Elle's silence, a lot of 194 00:09:42,280 --> 00:09:45,720 Speaker 1: the users seem genuinely upset that she's not posting because 195 00:09:46,080 --> 00:09:49,520 Speaker 1: I think that their favorite pastime is critiquing her, and 196 00:09:49,559 --> 00:09:52,080 Speaker 1: she's not drip feeding them the content anymore, so they've 197 00:09:52,080 --> 00:09:54,600 Speaker 1: had to go out and seek the information out for themselves. 198 00:09:54,600 --> 00:09:57,080 Speaker 1: That's how desperate they are. They all come together and 199 00:09:57,120 --> 00:10:00,360 Speaker 1: build this community based on disliking the person. But I 200 00:10:00,360 --> 00:10:04,079 Speaker 1: do feel like it is such a weird relationship because 201 00:10:04,440 --> 00:10:07,600 Speaker 1: they need her to be doing annoying shit in order 202 00:10:07,640 --> 00:10:10,160 Speaker 1: for them to bond over how stupid it is and 203 00:10:10,280 --> 00:10:13,160 Speaker 1: to create that community. Is it wrong that I kind 204 00:10:13,200 --> 00:10:17,040 Speaker 1: of understand it though, because it's sort of like I 205 00:10:17,080 --> 00:10:20,040 Speaker 1: think a lot of these people originally started out following her, 206 00:10:20,240 --> 00:10:22,000 Speaker 1: and it's sort of like you have a friend and 207 00:10:22,080 --> 00:10:24,120 Speaker 1: then you have a friendship breakdown, and even though you 208 00:10:24,200 --> 00:10:26,439 Speaker 1: dis like the person, you still want to keep up 209 00:10:26,440 --> 00:10:28,720 Speaker 1: with their day to day life and sort of you know, 210 00:10:28,840 --> 00:10:30,880 Speaker 1: roll your eyes at what they're up to. It kind 211 00:10:30,880 --> 00:10:33,400 Speaker 1: of reminds me of a friendship breakdown. It's hate following. 212 00:10:33,480 --> 00:10:35,240 Speaker 1: But I also think that a lot of people have 213 00:10:35,360 --> 00:10:38,080 Speaker 1: friends like that that they keep around just to keep 214 00:10:38,200 --> 00:10:40,599 Speaker 1: up to date with their lives, but they don't necessarily 215 00:10:40,679 --> 00:10:45,160 Speaker 1: actually align with their values anymore. Maybe it's more like that. Now, 216 00:10:45,240 --> 00:10:47,560 Speaker 1: when do you guys think that they will be back 217 00:10:47,559 --> 00:10:50,600 Speaker 1: online and how do you think that they will return. 218 00:10:51,040 --> 00:10:53,040 Speaker 1: I think that they will go back to their roots 219 00:10:53,040 --> 00:10:56,959 Speaker 1: and produce a very family friendly video. I think Saint 220 00:10:57,000 --> 00:10:59,719 Speaker 1: seven Swift will be at the center of it. That's there. 221 00:10:59,720 --> 00:11:02,280 Speaker 1: I think one year old son, and I think that 222 00:11:02,400 --> 00:11:06,280 Speaker 1: they will not acknowledge what they've done again because they've 223 00:11:06,280 --> 00:11:08,720 Speaker 1: already put their apologies out. They'll try and move forward, 224 00:11:09,240 --> 00:11:11,960 Speaker 1: but you know, go back to their McDonald's drive through is, 225 00:11:12,040 --> 00:11:15,320 Speaker 1: go back to their very mundane life and being a 226 00:11:15,320 --> 00:11:18,200 Speaker 1: little bit more relatable. Maybe go back to entertaining all 227 00:11:18,240 --> 00:11:22,080 Speaker 1: those tatle lifers. Some people are speculating that they're going 228 00:11:22,120 --> 00:11:24,880 Speaker 1: to announce that they're married and have something positive to 229 00:11:24,960 --> 00:11:27,360 Speaker 1: focus on, and yeah, as you say, Kate, I definitely 230 00:11:27,360 --> 00:11:29,800 Speaker 1: think triple s which is what they seem to refer 231 00:11:29,840 --> 00:11:32,160 Speaker 1: to him in the Tatle Life Forum is going to 232 00:11:32,200 --> 00:11:33,920 Speaker 1: be a big part of their comeback. 233 00:11:34,280 --> 00:11:36,520 Speaker 3: Some of you are going to go entitle influencer complains 234 00:11:36,520 --> 00:11:39,040 Speaker 3: about getting free things. It's all about the fact that 235 00:11:39,080 --> 00:11:40,640 Speaker 3: it's free things. It's about the fact that it's so 236 00:11:40,679 --> 00:11:42,959 Speaker 3: harmful to the environment and it makes you feel. 237 00:11:42,679 --> 00:11:43,840 Speaker 1: Fucking sick like. 238 00:11:44,320 --> 00:11:46,920 Speaker 3: And the main issue is the amount of packaging. 239 00:11:47,600 --> 00:11:50,320 Speaker 1: Abby Chatfield has vowed to boycott brands that show a 240 00:11:50,360 --> 00:11:54,559 Speaker 1: blatant disregard for the environment. The former Bachelor contestant labeled 241 00:11:54,559 --> 00:11:59,120 Speaker 1: brands that send products in excessive packaging as revolting and wasteful. Now, 242 00:11:59,160 --> 00:12:02,280 Speaker 1: despite removing her name from PR lists, Abby says she 243 00:12:02,360 --> 00:12:05,920 Speaker 1: receives fifteen unsolicited packages a day and has to deal 244 00:12:05,960 --> 00:12:08,439 Speaker 1: with the burden of getting rid of the waste sustainably. 245 00:12:08,960 --> 00:12:12,320 Speaker 1: Abby's passionate rant sparked a debate online about who is 246 00:12:12,360 --> 00:12:14,959 Speaker 1: responsible for the waste. Is it the brands who send 247 00:12:15,000 --> 00:12:17,120 Speaker 1: the products or is it just the downside of the 248 00:12:17,200 --> 00:12:20,120 Speaker 1: job of an influencer. Now, so, if you and Amy 249 00:12:20,200 --> 00:12:22,440 Speaker 1: run a PR company and have been part of sending 250 00:12:22,480 --> 00:12:25,560 Speaker 1: PR packages before, can you give us a little bit 251 00:12:25,559 --> 00:12:29,520 Speaker 1: of a background about the practice. Will often brands send 252 00:12:29,600 --> 00:12:33,240 Speaker 1: influencers unsolicited packages in the hope that their gift will 253 00:12:33,280 --> 00:12:36,920 Speaker 1: receive a glowing review online and this is considered a 254 00:12:36,960 --> 00:12:39,800 Speaker 1: contra deal. So a contra deal is when a free 255 00:12:39,840 --> 00:12:43,360 Speaker 1: product is provided in exchange for a service, and in 256 00:12:43,400 --> 00:12:46,160 Speaker 1: this case, brands are wanting a shout out or a 257 00:12:46,200 --> 00:12:50,600 Speaker 1: review from an influencer. So influencers aren't obligated to post 258 00:12:50,679 --> 00:12:53,600 Speaker 1: anything about the product they receive if there isn't some 259 00:12:53,640 --> 00:12:57,760 Speaker 1: sort of established relationship or deal there prior. Therefore, it 260 00:12:57,800 --> 00:13:00,440 Speaker 1: can be a really risky thing for brands to do, 261 00:13:00,760 --> 00:13:05,480 Speaker 1: especially small businesses, as there's no guarantee on return for them. Well, 262 00:13:05,480 --> 00:13:08,079 Speaker 1: when you look back at the influencer marketing industry when 263 00:13:08,120 --> 00:13:11,240 Speaker 1: it was in its infancy, the process was followed often 264 00:13:11,320 --> 00:13:15,160 Speaker 1: with great success. PR hall and unboxing videos used to 265 00:13:15,160 --> 00:13:18,880 Speaker 1: be extremely popular on YouTube and pretty easy content for 266 00:13:19,000 --> 00:13:22,800 Speaker 1: influencers to create. So when you search pr hole on YouTube, 267 00:13:23,000 --> 00:13:25,640 Speaker 1: millions of video results come up and many of the 268 00:13:25,720 --> 00:13:29,320 Speaker 1: videos have hundreds of thousands, if not millions of views. 269 00:13:29,760 --> 00:13:32,160 Speaker 1: So I think due to the popularity, more and more 270 00:13:32,200 --> 00:13:35,120 Speaker 1: brands have jumped on the practice, and that's when things 271 00:13:35,120 --> 00:13:37,760 Speaker 1: started getting out of hand. Yeah, because if you think 272 00:13:37,840 --> 00:13:41,680 Speaker 1: about it, the packaging needed to really attract attention and 273 00:13:41,800 --> 00:13:44,720 Speaker 1: offer further benefits to the influencers to get them to 274 00:13:44,800 --> 00:13:47,840 Speaker 1: just notice it and talk about their products. And that 275 00:13:48,000 --> 00:13:52,160 Speaker 1: is really where this problem of excessive packaging started. And 276 00:13:52,640 --> 00:13:55,000 Speaker 1: I mean I used to love watching this style of 277 00:13:55,080 --> 00:13:57,720 Speaker 1: video because there used to be something really pervy about 278 00:13:57,760 --> 00:14:01,000 Speaker 1: seeing all this free stuff the influence luance as we're getting, 279 00:14:01,480 --> 00:14:04,560 Speaker 1: and you kind of got this second hand excitement that 280 00:14:04,720 --> 00:14:08,439 Speaker 1: reminded you of opening gifts on your birthday or at Christmas. 281 00:14:08,640 --> 00:14:10,640 Speaker 1: And I think it's the same feeling that you get 282 00:14:10,679 --> 00:14:12,959 Speaker 1: when you watch a mukbung or you watch a ten 283 00:14:13,040 --> 00:14:16,560 Speaker 1: thousand calorie challenge, Like there's something fulfilling about watching these 284 00:14:16,559 --> 00:14:19,040 Speaker 1: styles of videos, even though you're not getting the food 285 00:14:19,200 --> 00:14:23,040 Speaker 1: or the gifts. It was really around twenty nineteen when 286 00:14:23,080 --> 00:14:27,320 Speaker 1: influencers started speaking about the vast number of PR packages 287 00:14:27,400 --> 00:14:31,160 Speaker 1: they were receiving and also the excessive waste that was involved. 288 00:14:31,200 --> 00:14:35,760 Speaker 1: And then the pandemic hit and attitudes towards influences started changing. 289 00:14:35,760 --> 00:14:39,440 Speaker 1: So it was this really interesting evolution and during hardship, 290 00:14:39,760 --> 00:14:42,680 Speaker 1: people really started to see influences in a new light. 291 00:14:42,760 --> 00:14:46,640 Speaker 1: And they began to question their privilege and really expect 292 00:14:46,840 --> 00:14:49,960 Speaker 1: more from them. And I think it's this point of 293 00:14:50,000 --> 00:14:53,080 Speaker 1: privilege that is a really important one to focus on, 294 00:14:53,160 --> 00:14:55,800 Speaker 1: because many people are arguing that it is such a 295 00:14:55,920 --> 00:14:59,520 Speaker 1: privilege for influencers to receive free products from brands and 296 00:14:59,560 --> 00:15:01,800 Speaker 1: that it's up to them to work out a way 297 00:15:01,840 --> 00:15:05,200 Speaker 1: to recycle the waste. Do you guys think it's simply 298 00:15:05,360 --> 00:15:08,520 Speaker 1: part of an influencer's job to manage the PR packages 299 00:15:08,560 --> 00:15:11,680 Speaker 1: they receive. Well, if you think about it, every job 300 00:15:11,760 --> 00:15:14,320 Speaker 1: has aspects that you don't enjoy. For instance, I hate 301 00:15:14,360 --> 00:15:16,880 Speaker 1: getting back to emails all the time, but because it's 302 00:15:16,920 --> 00:15:19,080 Speaker 1: your job, you just have to deal with it. And 303 00:15:19,440 --> 00:15:23,520 Speaker 1: many influencers also talk about having pas or staff, and 304 00:15:23,880 --> 00:15:26,880 Speaker 1: surely they could deal with the PR packaging as part 305 00:15:26,960 --> 00:15:30,240 Speaker 1: of their role, whether it's removing the influencer from the 306 00:15:30,280 --> 00:15:35,040 Speaker 1: PR list, or contacting brands that are sending this unsolicited products, 307 00:15:35,360 --> 00:15:38,800 Speaker 1: or even simply recycling or giving away the products. I mean, 308 00:15:38,800 --> 00:15:40,680 Speaker 1: I don't think it has to just be up to 309 00:15:40,760 --> 00:15:43,160 Speaker 1: the influencer to get rid of the stuff. They do 310 00:15:43,240 --> 00:15:46,200 Speaker 1: have people around them. But what if it's, as Abby said, 311 00:15:46,360 --> 00:15:49,560 Speaker 1: unsolicited stuff, so she's tried to get off the list 312 00:15:49,920 --> 00:15:52,400 Speaker 1: for these pr packages, but it's still being sent. Because 313 00:15:52,760 --> 00:15:55,320 Speaker 1: it makes me think of a YouTube video I saw 314 00:15:55,360 --> 00:15:58,960 Speaker 1: with Anastasia kings North and her mum was complaining about 315 00:15:59,000 --> 00:16:01,960 Speaker 1: the amount of boxes that she had to deal with. 316 00:16:02,320 --> 00:16:04,520 Speaker 1: It's next level. It's not just one or two, it's 317 00:16:04,640 --> 00:16:07,960 Speaker 1: so many boxes. Yeah, But I think the way influencers 318 00:16:07,960 --> 00:16:11,400 Speaker 1: have aligned themselves with the fast fashion industry, it makes 319 00:16:11,440 --> 00:16:14,720 Speaker 1: me feel like they are part of the overall problem. 320 00:16:14,960 --> 00:16:17,840 Speaker 1: So it's really hard when you see influencers preaching about 321 00:16:17,880 --> 00:16:21,160 Speaker 1: being sustainable and excess packaging, but then they're happy to 322 00:16:21,160 --> 00:16:23,480 Speaker 1: promote or wear fast fashion brands that are doing a 323 00:16:23,480 --> 00:16:27,320 Speaker 1: lot of damage to the environment. And I do think 324 00:16:27,360 --> 00:16:31,480 Speaker 1: it gets murky when you see influencers profiting off selling 325 00:16:31,640 --> 00:16:35,119 Speaker 1: the free products they receive. I think this really aggravates 326 00:16:35,200 --> 00:16:37,480 Speaker 1: the general public, who already deem the job of an 327 00:16:37,480 --> 00:16:41,040 Speaker 1: influencer easy in comparison to other jobs. In saying that 328 00:16:41,200 --> 00:16:45,320 Speaker 1: though reselling the items means that people who buy them 329 00:16:45,560 --> 00:16:48,840 Speaker 1: will actually use them, but then again for how long 330 00:16:48,920 --> 00:16:52,440 Speaker 1: Because a lot of these fast fashion items are either 331 00:16:52,480 --> 00:16:56,920 Speaker 1: poorly made and don't have any longevity, or their statement 332 00:16:56,960 --> 00:16:59,680 Speaker 1: pieces that quickly go out of fashion and they will 333 00:16:59,680 --> 00:17:03,360 Speaker 1: alter all end up in landfill. Yeah, as you're saying, 334 00:17:03,960 --> 00:17:07,720 Speaker 1: influencers can remove themselves off PR lists and recycle packaging 335 00:17:07,760 --> 00:17:11,440 Speaker 1: and donate products, but it doesn't actually fix the underlying issue. 336 00:17:11,760 --> 00:17:14,720 Speaker 1: In Happy Stories, she explained that she has removed herself 337 00:17:14,760 --> 00:17:17,360 Speaker 1: off these PR lists and does not list her addressed 338 00:17:17,600 --> 00:17:20,600 Speaker 1: but she still receives packages that she doesn't ask for. 339 00:17:21,000 --> 00:17:23,479 Speaker 1: And it's important to note that these aren't just big brands. 340 00:17:23,520 --> 00:17:26,000 Speaker 1: There are a lot of unknown, small brands out there 341 00:17:26,000 --> 00:17:29,040 Speaker 1: that don't have enough money to pay for influencer marketing, 342 00:17:29,320 --> 00:17:32,119 Speaker 1: so instead they send the influencer a product in the 343 00:17:32,160 --> 00:17:34,240 Speaker 1: hope that they will post about it for free. And 344 00:17:34,280 --> 00:17:37,560 Speaker 1: that being said, the brand isn't just sending the influencer 345 00:17:37,640 --> 00:17:40,280 Speaker 1: the product out of the goodness of their hearts. They're 346 00:17:40,320 --> 00:17:42,800 Speaker 1: doing it because they want to generate business out of 347 00:17:42,800 --> 00:17:44,960 Speaker 1: their posts. And that's what I think a lot of 348 00:17:44,960 --> 00:17:47,480 Speaker 1: people lose sight of a lot of the time, and 349 00:17:47,880 --> 00:17:50,600 Speaker 1: they're actually not going through the correct channels because the 350 00:17:50,680 --> 00:17:55,520 Speaker 1: influencer industry has become incredibly sophisticated over the past couple 351 00:17:55,520 --> 00:17:58,119 Speaker 1: of years, and most people know that in order to 352 00:17:58,119 --> 00:18:01,159 Speaker 1: get posted, you have to pay money do yah, And 353 00:18:01,200 --> 00:18:03,240 Speaker 1: I think it's important not to lose sight that it 354 00:18:03,440 --> 00:18:07,240 Speaker 1: is the brand that is creating and producing this excess waste, 355 00:18:07,240 --> 00:18:10,320 Speaker 1: and they are therefore the ones responsible for it. And 356 00:18:10,400 --> 00:18:12,920 Speaker 1: I think it's great that these brands are being called out. 357 00:18:12,960 --> 00:18:15,879 Speaker 1: And I think Abby should actually be commended for using 358 00:18:15,880 --> 00:18:19,240 Speaker 1: her platform to put pressure on businesses to reduce their packaging, 359 00:18:19,280 --> 00:18:21,439 Speaker 1: because it's a lot easier to opt out of the 360 00:18:21,480 --> 00:18:26,920 Speaker 1: conversation and stay quiet rather than drawing attention to the issue. Well, 361 00:18:26,920 --> 00:18:29,640 Speaker 1: as you said earlier, it's also not the first time 362 00:18:29,720 --> 00:18:33,640 Speaker 1: influencers have called out brands for excessive packaging, and since then, 363 00:18:33,720 --> 00:18:36,439 Speaker 1: I think we really have seen some positive strides in 364 00:18:36,520 --> 00:18:40,760 Speaker 1: packaging made I think brands who don't start implementing sustainable 365 00:18:40,760 --> 00:18:44,120 Speaker 1: packaging will be left behind. Yeah, because we've got all 366 00:18:44,160 --> 00:18:47,760 Speaker 1: this scary and depressing news going around about climate change, 367 00:18:48,000 --> 00:18:51,520 Speaker 1: and there is a big pressure on everyone to be sustainable. 368 00:18:51,960 --> 00:18:54,359 Speaker 1: And it's really no longer call for influencers to show 369 00:18:54,400 --> 00:18:56,960 Speaker 1: off all the free gifts that they're receiving and which 370 00:18:57,000 --> 00:19:00,000 Speaker 1: are covered in excess packaging. It's cool to be sustainable, 371 00:19:00,600 --> 00:19:04,160 Speaker 1: and even if influencers are virtually signaling I don't care 372 00:19:04,280 --> 00:19:06,840 Speaker 1: because we actually need this to happen. We need to 373 00:19:06,840 --> 00:19:09,399 Speaker 1: stop this ridiculous amount of waste, and I hope brands 374 00:19:09,400 --> 00:19:11,840 Speaker 1: are going to catch up. That's the thing. Sadly, I 375 00:19:11,880 --> 00:19:14,600 Speaker 1: think that people are just so keen to dislike or 376 00:19:14,640 --> 00:19:19,120 Speaker 1: tear down influences that when they actually platform an important cause, 377 00:19:19,440 --> 00:19:23,000 Speaker 1: they get personally attacked. And Abby isn't the first influencer 378 00:19:23,080 --> 00:19:26,520 Speaker 1: to call out brands for their excessive packaging, and just 379 00:19:26,640 --> 00:19:30,760 Speaker 1: like those before her, she did cut personal criticism. Yeah, 380 00:19:30,800 --> 00:19:33,760 Speaker 1: the general discussion seemed to be that people agreed with her, 381 00:19:33,880 --> 00:19:35,760 Speaker 1: but were saying that they didn't like the way she 382 00:19:35,840 --> 00:19:38,960 Speaker 1: went about it, and some even accused her of using 383 00:19:38,960 --> 00:19:42,000 Speaker 1: it as an opportunity to flex about the endless free 384 00:19:42,040 --> 00:19:45,520 Speaker 1: products she was receiving, rather than her actually doing it 385 00:19:45,520 --> 00:19:48,240 Speaker 1: for the greater good, while others thought it was tone 386 00:19:48,280 --> 00:19:51,280 Speaker 1: deaf to complain about receiving so many free products when 387 00:19:51,280 --> 00:19:53,400 Speaker 1: there are people out there that can't afford to buy 388 00:19:53,480 --> 00:19:56,760 Speaker 1: necessities for themselves. I hate to say it, but I 389 00:19:56,920 --> 00:19:59,879 Speaker 1: genuinely feel like a lot of the criticism is coming 390 00:20:00,080 --> 00:20:03,480 Speaker 1: from jealousy. And I know jealousy is an ugly word 391 00:20:03,640 --> 00:20:07,000 Speaker 1: and has negative connotations. But if we're honest with ourselves, 392 00:20:07,080 --> 00:20:09,359 Speaker 1: we all feel it at times, especially when we're on 393 00:20:09,400 --> 00:20:11,879 Speaker 1: social media, and when you do jump online and you 394 00:20:11,920 --> 00:20:15,840 Speaker 1: see these influencers receiving all of these lavish gifts, you think, 395 00:20:15,880 --> 00:20:18,960 Speaker 1: what the hell are you complaining about. I think with Abby, 396 00:20:19,040 --> 00:20:20,919 Speaker 1: it was the tone of it. I think that's what 397 00:20:21,040 --> 00:20:23,600 Speaker 1: people had an issue with because it seemed like she 398 00:20:23,920 --> 00:20:27,800 Speaker 1: was complaining about receiving free gifts. It's almost like people 399 00:20:27,840 --> 00:20:30,240 Speaker 1: turn their ears off when she was actually talking about 400 00:20:30,760 --> 00:20:33,719 Speaker 1: why it's a problem. Yeah, they only honed into what 401 00:20:33,800 --> 00:20:36,760 Speaker 1: they wanted to hear. Yeah, But what we've got to understand, 402 00:20:36,760 --> 00:20:39,320 Speaker 1: and I think people seem to overlook the reality is 403 00:20:39,359 --> 00:20:42,359 Speaker 1: that in order for Abby to stay relevant, she needs 404 00:20:42,400 --> 00:20:45,199 Speaker 1: to create discussions and debate and she has always been 405 00:20:45,240 --> 00:20:47,680 Speaker 1: a polarizing figure and that's why she has managed to 406 00:20:47,680 --> 00:20:50,280 Speaker 1: stay relevant and make a successful career off the back 407 00:20:50,359 --> 00:20:53,200 Speaker 1: of the Bachelor. And she's very well known for speaking 408 00:20:53,240 --> 00:20:55,520 Speaker 1: her mind, not giving a shit about what others think 409 00:20:55,560 --> 00:20:58,600 Speaker 1: of her. And I think her rant about pr packaging 410 00:20:59,119 --> 00:21:01,160 Speaker 1: was what we've come to ex and you can say 411 00:21:01,160 --> 00:21:03,959 Speaker 1: what you like about the delivery, but it's created a 412 00:21:04,080 --> 00:21:06,480 Speaker 1: very good debate online that has shone the light on 413 00:21:06,520 --> 00:21:09,520 Speaker 1: this very important issue, so I commend her now, just 414 00:21:09,560 --> 00:21:11,919 Speaker 1: to wrap things up, I did notice that The Daily 415 00:21:11,960 --> 00:21:15,359 Speaker 1: Mail published an article on Monday entitled it Pays to 416 00:21:15,400 --> 00:21:18,679 Speaker 1: be an Influencer. Abby Chatfield carries a huge hole of 417 00:21:18,720 --> 00:21:21,600 Speaker 1: freebies as she walks back into a one point seventy 418 00:21:21,600 --> 00:21:25,080 Speaker 1: five million dollar apartment in Sydney. Now, in the article, 419 00:21:25,240 --> 00:21:28,440 Speaker 1: they have a link to domain where Abby's house is listed, 420 00:21:28,720 --> 00:21:30,879 Speaker 1: as well as the online features of the home, and 421 00:21:30,920 --> 00:21:33,800 Speaker 1: they also reference that Abby purchased a cottage in the 422 00:21:33,800 --> 00:21:37,320 Speaker 1: Byron hinterland in October for one point four million dollars. 423 00:21:37,640 --> 00:21:40,000 Speaker 1: Now it's quite clear what they're trying to do here. 424 00:21:40,119 --> 00:21:43,440 Speaker 1: They are positioning Abby's wealth with the fact that she 425 00:21:43,600 --> 00:21:46,840 Speaker 1: is also spoilt by receiving free products. So it's no 426 00:21:46,960 --> 00:21:49,639 Speaker 1: wonder people are starting to get their backs up about 427 00:21:49,640 --> 00:21:52,240 Speaker 1: it because it's already out there in our psyche. We're 428 00:21:52,280 --> 00:21:55,879 Speaker 1: already reading about how her lavish home and she's picking 429 00:21:55,960 --> 00:21:59,480 Speaker 1: up items. I heard Hamish Blake on Carl and Jackie 430 00:21:59,520 --> 00:22:01,879 Speaker 1: O and he talking about how the Daily Mail just 431 00:22:01,880 --> 00:22:04,679 Speaker 1: frame everything for people to hate you, and it's so 432 00:22:04,880 --> 00:22:06,680 Speaker 1: true instead of like, oh, it's kind of and they 433 00:22:06,680 --> 00:22:08,680 Speaker 1: frame as in, isn't it so great that she's got 434 00:22:08,720 --> 00:22:11,240 Speaker 1: that million dollar house? But they're not actually saying that 435 00:22:11,240 --> 00:22:13,320 Speaker 1: it's so true. One of the comments is so bloody 436 00:22:13,320 --> 00:22:15,520 Speaker 1: cruel on the Daily Lail, some of. 437 00:22:15,480 --> 00:22:18,359 Speaker 2: You people haven't called your grandparents in months. 438 00:22:18,800 --> 00:22:19,639 Speaker 1: Put your arm the internet. 439 00:22:19,720 --> 00:22:22,920 Speaker 2: Read about my week. You look stupid? 440 00:22:22,920 --> 00:22:23,960 Speaker 1: They call your fucking graum. 441 00:22:24,040 --> 00:22:24,679 Speaker 2: Are your loser? 442 00:22:25,080 --> 00:22:28,080 Speaker 1: This week, Alisha mccarvill spark debate when she asked her 443 00:22:28,119 --> 00:22:31,080 Speaker 1: six hundred and fifty one thousand followers to engage with 444 00:22:31,119 --> 00:22:34,280 Speaker 1: her ads on Instagram. The body positive influencer said she'd 445 00:22:34,320 --> 00:22:36,600 Speaker 1: put a lot of work into creating ad content and 446 00:22:36,680 --> 00:22:39,240 Speaker 1: needs her audience to support it so she can strengthen 447 00:22:39,280 --> 00:22:42,239 Speaker 1: her relationship with brands. Now, is this a case of 448 00:22:42,320 --> 00:22:46,439 Speaker 1: influencers passing the buck about the inadequate content or should 449 00:22:46,440 --> 00:22:51,199 Speaker 1: followers be expected to provide support that helps influencers bottom lines? Now, 450 00:22:51,280 --> 00:22:53,639 Speaker 1: before we get into the debate, Amy, can you tell 451 00:22:53,720 --> 00:22:57,479 Speaker 1: us a little bit more about who Alisha mccarvill is. Yeah, well, 452 00:22:57,520 --> 00:23:00,440 Speaker 1: I actually hadn't heard of Elisha until I was made 453 00:23:00,440 --> 00:23:04,080 Speaker 1: aware of her Instagram story. So she's a Canadian who's 454 00:23:04,119 --> 00:23:06,879 Speaker 1: made it big on TikTok after uploading a video of 455 00:23:06,920 --> 00:23:09,600 Speaker 1: her and her husband as part of my boyfriend is 456 00:23:09,760 --> 00:23:12,600 Speaker 1: ten times hotter than meat trend. I never heard about 457 00:23:12,640 --> 00:23:16,879 Speaker 1: this trend. This particularly cruel. Well, in the two days 458 00:23:16,880 --> 00:23:19,879 Speaker 1: that her video was up, she amassed two million views 459 00:23:19,920 --> 00:23:24,280 Speaker 1: and she scored herself fifty six thousand new followers. So initially, 460 00:23:24,320 --> 00:23:27,840 Speaker 1: Alisha was trolled about the disparity in appearance between her 461 00:23:27,880 --> 00:23:31,520 Speaker 1: and her husband. However, Alisha took it all in her stride. 462 00:23:31,760 --> 00:23:33,560 Speaker 1: In an interview, she said she used it as an 463 00:23:33,600 --> 00:23:36,439 Speaker 1: opportunity to show the world how confident she is in 464 00:23:36,480 --> 00:23:40,920 Speaker 1: herself and her relationship, and it really has worked for Alisha. 465 00:23:41,000 --> 00:23:44,480 Speaker 1: She now has four point five million followers on TikTok so. 466 00:23:44,600 --> 00:23:48,119 Speaker 1: Alisha's videos range from workout routines to dance videos, as 467 00:23:48,160 --> 00:23:51,439 Speaker 1: well as cute moments with her husband, and generally the 468 00:23:51,440 --> 00:23:54,760 Speaker 1: theme of her content centers around self love. It's pretty 469 00:23:54,800 --> 00:23:56,760 Speaker 1: brave to put out there that you think your husband 470 00:23:56,840 --> 00:23:59,480 Speaker 1: is hotter than you. One if you do generate a 471 00:23:59,520 --> 00:24:02,960 Speaker 1: huge following from there, because I'd be worried about hot 472 00:24:03,000 --> 00:24:06,120 Speaker 1: girls sliding into his dms, you know what I mean. 473 00:24:06,200 --> 00:24:08,679 Speaker 1: She's obviously very confident. I mean, you have to be 474 00:24:08,680 --> 00:24:11,199 Speaker 1: a confident person to admit that your husband is ten 475 00:24:11,280 --> 00:24:12,320 Speaker 1: times better looking than you. 476 00:24:12,760 --> 00:24:12,840 Speaker 2: Like. 477 00:24:13,119 --> 00:24:15,760 Speaker 1: It's very I suppose it's very self deprecating. Look, I 478 00:24:15,760 --> 00:24:18,760 Speaker 1: think we need to get into the controversy because Alicia 479 00:24:18,880 --> 00:24:22,280 Speaker 1: shared a story that has generated a lot of discussions. 480 00:24:22,359 --> 00:24:25,679 Speaker 1: So she wrote, I've been feeling pretty disappointed lately with 481 00:24:25,760 --> 00:24:28,480 Speaker 1: the engagement with my AD content. I know it's not 482 00:24:28,560 --> 00:24:30,880 Speaker 1: the content you're here for, but it is the content 483 00:24:30,920 --> 00:24:33,159 Speaker 1: that pays my bills and allows me to create for 484 00:24:33,240 --> 00:24:35,639 Speaker 1: free for you all. I put a lot of work 485 00:24:35,680 --> 00:24:40,120 Speaker 1: into recording, researching, scripting, editing, re editing, and captioning them. 486 00:24:40,440 --> 00:24:43,440 Speaker 1: If you have the capacity, please view comment on my ads, 487 00:24:43,560 --> 00:24:46,360 Speaker 1: click the links and purchase and then in brackets only 488 00:24:46,400 --> 00:24:49,160 Speaker 1: when you can and the product aligns with you. Ninety 489 00:24:49,200 --> 00:24:51,240 Speaker 1: nine percent of the ways to support me are free 490 00:24:51,320 --> 00:24:53,920 Speaker 1: and only take a few seconds. I need this type 491 00:24:53,920 --> 00:24:56,880 Speaker 1: of support to grow and build solid relationships with brands. 492 00:24:57,080 --> 00:24:59,760 Speaker 1: Thanks to everyone who takes the time to click, like, share, 493 00:24:59,800 --> 00:25:04,040 Speaker 1: and comment on my ad content too, I appreciate you. Now, 494 00:25:04,520 --> 00:25:08,000 Speaker 1: this story was swiftly deleted. I'm assuming for receiving a 495 00:25:08,000 --> 00:25:10,720 Speaker 1: lot of backlash. What did you guys think about it. Well. 496 00:25:10,840 --> 00:25:13,879 Speaker 1: I think there's been a lot of strong opinions around 497 00:25:13,880 --> 00:25:17,000 Speaker 1: Alicia's post because it was just so direct. I mean, 498 00:25:17,320 --> 00:25:21,480 Speaker 1: influencers asking their followers for support isn't something new, but 499 00:25:21,560 --> 00:25:23,760 Speaker 1: it is one of the first times we've seen an 500 00:25:23,800 --> 00:25:29,320 Speaker 1: influencer almost begging about AD revenue. And normally influencers ask 501 00:25:29,440 --> 00:25:33,000 Speaker 1: followers to subscribe or to engage with their content in general, 502 00:25:33,400 --> 00:25:36,520 Speaker 1: but not specifically AD content. And I think we're also 503 00:25:36,720 --> 00:25:39,600 Speaker 1: so used to hearing things like lots of you have 504 00:25:39,640 --> 00:25:41,840 Speaker 1: been asking me about how you can support me, when 505 00:25:41,880 --> 00:25:44,560 Speaker 1: no one really has been asking that question. And I 506 00:25:44,640 --> 00:25:47,320 Speaker 1: just thought it came across as quite desperate, and there's 507 00:25:47,359 --> 00:25:50,600 Speaker 1: almost this tone that it's her follower's fault that they're 508 00:25:50,640 --> 00:25:54,800 Speaker 1: not getting engagement, rather than something that she's potentially doing wrong. Yeah. 509 00:25:54,840 --> 00:25:57,359 Speaker 1: I tend to agree because to me, it almost felt 510 00:25:57,359 --> 00:26:00,720 Speaker 1: like she was blaming her followers for the lack of engagement. 511 00:26:00,760 --> 00:26:04,400 Speaker 1: And the reality is influencers are their own marketing managers, 512 00:26:04,400 --> 00:26:07,240 Speaker 1: and if ads aren't performing, it is up to them 513 00:26:07,320 --> 00:26:09,600 Speaker 1: to change the ad. I mean, it could be that 514 00:26:09,680 --> 00:26:12,800 Speaker 1: the balance between ads and organic content isn't right on 515 00:26:12,840 --> 00:26:16,280 Speaker 1: her Instagram account or maybe in some cases it could 516 00:26:16,320 --> 00:26:18,840 Speaker 1: be that influencers are sharing too many ads and not 517 00:26:19,080 --> 00:26:22,280 Speaker 1: enough organic content, so they don't seem genuine. And maybe 518 00:26:22,280 --> 00:26:24,320 Speaker 1: it is they're choosing the wrong brands to work with 519 00:26:24,359 --> 00:26:27,199 Speaker 1: that don't actually align with them or their audience. And 520 00:26:27,240 --> 00:26:30,560 Speaker 1: I suppose that's when that disconnect happens between the influencer 521 00:26:30,640 --> 00:26:33,240 Speaker 1: and the audience. We did have a big discussion a 522 00:26:33,280 --> 00:26:36,679 Speaker 1: few weeks ago about platforms like Sunroom that allow users 523 00:26:36,720 --> 00:26:39,919 Speaker 1: to charge for content, and the fact that Alice is 524 00:26:39,960 --> 00:26:44,520 Speaker 1: struggling for engagement on her ads actually strengthens the case 525 00:26:44,560 --> 00:26:48,399 Speaker 1: that the current influencer marketing model is becoming outdated because 526 00:26:48,400 --> 00:26:52,560 Speaker 1: in the last few years, regulations around influencer advertising have 527 00:26:52,680 --> 00:26:56,280 Speaker 1: been introduced, and these rules essentially mean that influencers have 528 00:26:56,359 --> 00:26:59,240 Speaker 1: to be a lot more transparent about their brand deals. 529 00:26:59,680 --> 00:27:03,760 Speaker 1: So these rules have coincided with the general public having 530 00:27:03,800 --> 00:27:07,320 Speaker 1: an attitude switch about influencers, which appears to have been 531 00:27:07,400 --> 00:27:09,879 Speaker 1: spurred on by the pandemic, and most people feel like 532 00:27:09,920 --> 00:27:13,040 Speaker 1: influencers get enough handed to them on a platter without 533 00:27:13,080 --> 00:27:16,320 Speaker 1: them feeling indebted to engage with their paid ad content, 534 00:27:16,520 --> 00:27:18,879 Speaker 1: and audiences are also a lot more savvy about what 535 00:27:19,040 --> 00:27:20,960 Speaker 1: is an ad, so I think we will start to 536 00:27:21,000 --> 00:27:24,159 Speaker 1: see a lot of influencers being forced to adopt the 537 00:27:24,200 --> 00:27:27,919 Speaker 1: pay per subscriber model rather than the current brand deal model. 538 00:27:28,119 --> 00:27:31,560 Speaker 1: The thing is, Alisha is so popular with her followers 539 00:27:31,600 --> 00:27:35,080 Speaker 1: because she is real and relatable, and she's well known 540 00:27:35,119 --> 00:27:38,040 Speaker 1: for being authentic and body positive and someone who does 541 00:27:38,200 --> 00:27:41,280 Speaker 1: share the realities of life, not just the filtered parts. 542 00:27:41,600 --> 00:27:43,680 Speaker 1: So it is on brand for her to be open 543 00:27:43,720 --> 00:27:46,720 Speaker 1: and honest with her followers and to say, hey, can 544 00:27:46,760 --> 00:27:49,680 Speaker 1: you start liking my ads? And what's interesting is, over 545 00:27:49,720 --> 00:27:53,560 Speaker 1: the years, influencers have begun to be rewarded for being authentic, 546 00:27:54,000 --> 00:27:56,959 Speaker 1: so I think she genuinely thought she was educating her 547 00:27:57,000 --> 00:27:59,919 Speaker 1: followers about how they could assist her. It really has 548 00:28:00,240 --> 00:28:03,720 Speaker 1: backfired for her, though. I'm really surprised by her inability 549 00:28:03,800 --> 00:28:06,280 Speaker 1: to read the room, seeing as she only just has 550 00:28:06,320 --> 00:28:09,760 Speaker 1: become an influencer herself. Because asking your followers to buy 551 00:28:09,800 --> 00:28:13,280 Speaker 1: a product you promote in order to financially help you 552 00:28:13,840 --> 00:28:17,639 Speaker 1: is so off when you consider the current global financial situation, 553 00:28:17,840 --> 00:28:20,960 Speaker 1: and we are living through a pandemic where money is 554 00:28:21,040 --> 00:28:24,320 Speaker 1: tight is the highest cost of living we are experiencing 555 00:28:24,359 --> 00:28:26,560 Speaker 1: at the moment, paired that with the fact that people's 556 00:28:26,600 --> 00:28:30,720 Speaker 1: attitudes have changed towards influences, and there is this stigma 557 00:28:30,760 --> 00:28:33,040 Speaker 1: that they get paid a lot of money for doing 558 00:28:33,200 --> 00:28:36,520 Speaker 1: very little, and this is a recipe for disaster. And 559 00:28:36,560 --> 00:28:39,560 Speaker 1: it is so difficult when you see someone online who 560 00:28:39,680 --> 00:28:42,720 Speaker 1: is making a full time living of doing something which 561 00:28:42,760 --> 00:28:45,240 Speaker 1: a lot of people envy, and then the next minute 562 00:28:45,320 --> 00:28:48,120 Speaker 1: they're seen to be complaining to their followers that they're 563 00:28:48,120 --> 00:28:50,920 Speaker 1: not supporting them enough. I just wonder how the brands 564 00:28:50,960 --> 00:28:53,520 Speaker 1: that she works with feel about her asking for engagement 565 00:28:53,560 --> 00:28:56,680 Speaker 1: on her sponsor content, because it's really not a great 566 00:28:56,680 --> 00:29:00,760 Speaker 1: look for everybody involved. Isn't somewhat fraudulent as well, because 567 00:29:00,800 --> 00:29:04,520 Speaker 1: you're getting link clicks, but that don't actually mean anything 568 00:29:04,600 --> 00:29:07,000 Speaker 1: because they're only clicking on it to support you. They're 569 00:29:07,000 --> 00:29:09,360 Speaker 1: not clicking on it to buy anything. It's redundant for 570 00:29:09,400 --> 00:29:11,560 Speaker 1: the brand. Yeah, why would a brand want to then 571 00:29:11,640 --> 00:29:13,640 Speaker 1: work with her. It's definitely going to have a very 572 00:29:13,640 --> 00:29:18,440 Speaker 1: negative impact upon Alicia's relationships with brands moving forward. And 573 00:29:18,480 --> 00:29:20,880 Speaker 1: I'm sure the brands that she's currently working for aren't 574 00:29:20,920 --> 00:29:24,120 Speaker 1: thrill that she's overtly asking people to click on her ads. 575 00:29:24,400 --> 00:29:27,400 Speaker 1: And this whole concept of influencer marketing was built on 576 00:29:27,480 --> 00:29:31,800 Speaker 1: the authentic relationships influencers had with their followers because initially 577 00:29:31,880 --> 00:29:35,680 Speaker 1: influencers were genuinely in a position to provide recommendations to 578 00:29:35,720 --> 00:29:39,080 Speaker 1: followers because there was this level of trust. And I 579 00:29:39,120 --> 00:29:43,240 Speaker 1: think as the influencer industry has become saturated with brand deals, 580 00:29:43,520 --> 00:29:46,680 Speaker 1: the general public are more clued in and cynical about 581 00:29:46,840 --> 00:29:50,560 Speaker 1: influencers ads, so it's so much harder to make ads 582 00:29:50,560 --> 00:29:54,200 Speaker 1: look authentic, particularly with guidelines coming in about having to 583 00:29:54,240 --> 00:29:57,320 Speaker 1: acknowledge that something is a paid partnership. I think that's 584 00:29:57,320 --> 00:29:59,280 Speaker 1: all we have time for today. Thank you so much 585 00:29:59,280 --> 00:30:02,040 Speaker 1: for joining us today's episode. If you have enjoyed it, 586 00:30:02,080 --> 00:30:05,200 Speaker 1: could you please make sure you are subscribed on Spotify 587 00:30:05,320 --> 00:30:07,560 Speaker 1: and also Apple Podcasts, and if you want to join 588 00:30:07,600 --> 00:30:09,520 Speaker 1: in on the conversation, you can find us in our 589 00:30:09,520 --> 00:30:13,000 Speaker 1: Facebook community, which is Outspoken of the Podcast Community. We're 590 00:30:13,040 --> 00:30:16,080 Speaker 1: also on Instagram and TikTok with the hand or Outspoken 591 00:30:16,200 --> 00:30:17,960 Speaker 1: Underscore the Underscore podcast