Speaker 1: You never wanted kids. I was to say, I remember
Speaker 1: you saying you wanted kids.
Speaker 2: You never really said what process you're going down?
Speaker 1: Well you are now you're going down the process now.
Speaker 3: I looked into it just before lockdown and that ruined. Well,
Speaker 3: I didn't ruin it stoped divisions and we had had meetings,
Speaker 3: but I was going to go.
Speaker 4: To America for adoptionalrog and it would have been guaranteed.
Speaker 2: With disservice.
Speaker 3: Is the American way of doing it very didn't to
Speaker 3: the UK and Europe, where you're literally you are you've
Speaker 3: got their antal rights straight away and not it's not
Speaker 3: like it's a business, but there are people it is.
Speaker 2: But it sounds quite immersedly when you say like that.
Speaker 3: There are people in America who are quite happy to.
Speaker 2: Be a surrogate. Yeah, and mainly mothers themselves. Some have
Speaker 2: them it multiple times.
Speaker 3: And you get a choice of a grew age range
Speaker 3: of the surrogate.
Speaker 1: Yeah, you're picking them around and you have meetings with
Speaker 1: a database, and you obviously kind a chance to interview.
Speaker 2: That person before we have a meeting.
Speaker 1: Meeting, and right, do you use the ink or do
Speaker 1: you choose an egg?
Speaker 2: Two options you can either use their ink or do.
Speaker 3: MH and depending on the on the kind of type
Speaker 3: of surrogate is what is where that decision would come from.
Speaker 3: And you also get to be involved in all their
Speaker 3: medical checkups and even at the bird you can't be
Speaker 3: there amazed.
Speaker 4: So did you get to meet anyone or you didn't
Speaker 4: get that far?
Speaker 2: We didn't get that far. We would win this clo.
Speaker 3: It was an agency we're going to use and the
Speaker 3: thing X amount and guaranteed child sometimes even twins depending
Speaker 3: on you know, and you get the screening thing you
Speaker 3: were talking.
Speaker 4: Yeahs, I think I have loved twins or triplets mine.
Speaker 2: Because then you get the connection of.
Speaker 3: Going out there meeting them and you pay all the
Speaker 3: upfront and there's not there's nothing more to pay on.
Speaker 4: It's just the process. Yeah.
Speaker 1: No, I had a friend that did it in America.
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, she.
Speaker 1: Should. You think you'll look at it again.
Speaker 3: I think I will look at it again that's excited
Speaker 3: and has had a friend you know some I know
Speaker 3: a friend of mine.
Speaker 2: Married a couple has lesbian throne.
Speaker 4: A friend of you was married a couple and like
Speaker 4: to like jay lesbians and they cope, which.
Speaker 2: They have three kids. Between them and the kids.
Speaker 1: Do they all live together like weekends?
Speaker 2: Yeah? So one week parents all want you in love?
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 2: I mean that's the main thing, isn't it.
Speaker 4: Yeah? Yeah?
Speaker 1: So would you go with donor or would you go
Speaker 1: Do you have a friend or something?
Speaker 2: I did speak to a friend a while ago, and
Speaker 2: then I spoke.
Speaker 3: To a couple of meat meetings, a couple of connections
Speaker 3: with strangers, but they were both in the UK, and
Speaker 3: because didn't know them that well, and one of them
Speaker 3: was very interested in the co caring things.
Speaker 2: Just wanted I wouldn't be adverse if it was the
Speaker 2: right person.
Speaker 1: But I guess you don't know them long enough to
Speaker 1: know that's right.
Speaker 3: That's the life long.
Speaker 4: It's effectively marrying that other couple forever.
Speaker 1: Yeah, what I was I going to say? Would you
Speaker 1: use your sperm or hugh sperm or you don't know yet?
Speaker 2: I don't know yet. I mean I'm very clean to
Speaker 2: use your whatever left and.
Speaker 4: Big Dad you would still yeah, heaps, men's sperm doesn't
Speaker 4: really deteriorate when if they could do it in the
Speaker 4: sense that you could both donate and.
Speaker 1: Draw people.
Speaker 4: I have a friendice of that too, he and is
Speaker 4: they both They like, we don't want to choose so fair.
Speaker 1: Yeah I do that, or you could have two kids
Speaker 1: and use one of me.
Speaker 3: Do but I mean, we're this close. They had meeting.
Speaker 3: It was all over zoom at that point. Yeah, you
Speaker 3: know in America. And then the representative of the agency
Speaker 3: came to London and I met up with them, had
Speaker 3: a really good productive chat and what and it was
Speaker 3: a lot of money.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 3: One thing that Clink Ships knew was that it was
Speaker 3: guaranteed multiple trials if it doesn't succeed. Okay, yeah, yes,
Speaker 3: so you felt like yeah, to avoid disappointment. And also
Speaker 3: at the end of the term, you go make the
Speaker 3: arrangements and they also arrange the birth certificate and.
Speaker 4: Then you just fly over there for the birth and.
Speaker 3: So there probably a few weeks before the birth and
Speaker 3: then a few weeks afterwards you take your baby down
Speaker 3: and the baby's got dual nationality straight away.
Speaker 1: Amazing.
Speaker 2: Yeah, UK and America.
Speaker 1: That's cool. Oh, I hope that works out for you.
Speaker 4: I I think that's the tricky think about like IVA
Speaker 4: is that it's not always guaranteed, so so much upfront
Speaker 4: costs and you can end up process you can go
Speaker 4: again and again and again and again, and you can
Speaker 4: get to the engines. Well even that's just what I
Speaker 4: did for mine, like fifteen grand weeks of injections, and
Speaker 4: I walked over nothing.
Speaker 1: I was like, wow, it's really tough.
Speaker 4: I was like, yes, we just start again. Find someone
Speaker 4: my me, she has been in here. Have you been
Speaker 4: thinking about it in here listening to everyone talks about.
Speaker 1: Their kids, because it's it's.
Speaker 4: Like when everyone's talking about it, Oh my god, it
Speaker 4: sounds amazing.
Speaker 2: It sounds amazing. I really missed that.
Speaker 3: And I said, I think I said it before that
Speaker 3: that when you talk about Felix.
Speaker 2: I mean, I don't know if you're aware of this,
Speaker 2: your your eyes just get a little bit.
Speaker 1: Yeah, you're obsessed.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean that.
Speaker 3: My friends said to me, you've probably heard it as well.
Speaker 3: That instant love you have for this human.
Speaker 4: Being like that you never experienced, you never experienced, you know,
Speaker 4: it's amazing.
Speaker 2: I want that. I want to feel that, and I
Speaker 2: want to.
Speaker 3: I was going to I said before, I don't think
Speaker 3: my life an complete.
Speaker 2: I didn't have that, you know, not.
Speaker 3: That religious, but the moss the meaning of life, what's
Speaker 3: the purpose if we're not going to pass on what
Speaker 3: we know and our knowledge to this person who hopefully
Speaker 3: is going.
Speaker 1: To change the world be an amazing human being.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I think it's also I don't know about you,
Speaker 4: but a big part of its two is because I've
Speaker 4: always been on the fence, and then when I met
Speaker 4: Ben's I look at him and I'd be like, you
Speaker 4: would be wasted, not as like I want to see
Speaker 4: him as a dad, whereas I haven't really felt that before,
Speaker 4: and I'm like, I would hate for you to not
Speaker 4: have that opportunity.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm not big decision.
Speaker 2: It's a big decision. My friends have all that adoption.
Speaker 3: That all good and if you want to go down, great,
Speaker 3: And for me, it's such an eternal drive.
Speaker 4: Yeah, you want one of your own, and I have
Speaker 4: no doubt if you adopted, you would love it just
Speaker 4: as much. But I understand why you would want one
Speaker 4: of your bloods.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 2: I also love.
Speaker 4: The idea that you can be at all of the
Speaker 4: medical appointments.
Speaker 1: They're so exciting, and then the birth is.
Speaker 3: So can you imagine and you're there and the people
Speaker 3: I was talking to this, I look, we researched it,
Speaker 3: I've got advice from friends, we spoke to three or
Speaker 3: four agencies, varying in prized from one to nearly two.
Speaker 3: But the one that really read, they're not they're based
Speaker 3: playing in Pittsburgh. Just hands on and you could see no,
Speaker 3: I mean you could do it also in like Eastern Europe.
Speaker 4: Well, a lot of the American ones aren't from Eastern
Speaker 4: Europe as well.
Speaker 1: A lot of the American ones, Well, the surrogates have
Speaker 1: come from Europe to America and that's what they're that's
Speaker 1: what they're doing a lot of Ukrainians.
Speaker 4: Yeah, but yes, it's even I just had a friend,
Speaker 4: Oh my god, in Australia.
Speaker 1: She just before the war Russia Ukraine had she had
Speaker 1: bought tried four prints, easy easy, and she's in a forty.
Speaker 1: So they went for Saragac. They flew their embryo over
Speaker 1: to Ukraine.
Speaker 4: Then war broke out and she was already their sorry,
Speaker 4: was pregnant in Ukraine and then for the birth they
Speaker 4: flew there to get it and we're in a war zone.
Speaker 4: They were in a bunker with their newborn baby. It
Speaker 4: was this is only they only brought it home six
Speaker 4: months ago.
Speaker 1: Wild were they stuck over there?
Speaker 4: They were stuck there for a couple of weeks and
Speaker 4: then the embassies helped get them out that they had
Speaker 4: to they you wouldn't just get out because they had
Speaker 4: to try and organize these birth certificates and transports, like
Speaker 4: they're not stealing it.
Speaker 1: It was the worst time. I mean, there's no good
Speaker 1: time in for war. But like she was like, what
Speaker 1: do you do? Like, that's my child now you know
Speaker 1: that I have put in a war zone.
Speaker 4: Crazy, But they got everyone was safe, the mom where
Speaker 4: they looked after them a lot, like yeah, you know
Speaker 4: the family, the surrogates family. But what do you do?
Speaker 1: You can't not Everyone's like you're crazy, you can't go
Speaker 1: into a war zone.
Speaker 4: And she's like, my child is now in there, Like
Speaker 4: could you imagine that predicament?
Speaker 1: I should speak to her on the podcast.
Speaker 4: Actually, I imagine the stress that she would have felt
Speaker 4: stake if she couldn't get.
Speaker 2: Over there and then home.
Speaker 1: Well, then the husband had to leave her in the bunker.
Speaker 4: With a baby to try and go to the embassy
Speaker 4: on his own to like imagine leaving your partner in
Speaker 4: newborn and he's like just don't move and came back
Speaker 4: like four days later or something because he had to travel.
Speaker 1: Yeah, pretty crazy. I think it takes a really long
Speaker 1: time passport.
Speaker 2: Was that the first sect?
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think I I might have talked about it
Speaker 3: on the radio or something, because somebody got in touch
Speaker 3: with me on social media and she was like, I
Speaker 3: might think I look crazy if I'm in a relationship
Speaker 3: with my girlfriend go acting marriage?
Speaker 2: Would we think you're funny? Would resinkly be the perfect
Speaker 2: dad to do? And I feel like you yeah, yeah,
Speaker 2: because I didn't know his mom's back. It's just so weird,
Speaker 2: and I was back paranoid. Is it oppressed, sting?
Speaker 1: Is it all of those kind of where she was
Speaker 1: probably just being nice.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 3: And then about three years they turn, she got in
Speaker 3: touch on me again and they found someone admitted to you.
Speaker 1: Wow, I'm sure they send.
Speaker 4: You the fight.
Speaker 1: I said, their two year old girl that you weren't
Speaker 1: to know.
Speaker 2: So yeah, if you ask your friends, maybe go.
Speaker 1: Down the scene.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 4: Yeah. She had.
Speaker 1: Exactly beout not that lucky at the start. A few goes,
Speaker 1: and I think there was a miss pay and then.
Speaker 4: When they were just about getting ready to go again,
Speaker 4: she had to have an operation, an abdominant operation.
Speaker 1: Something went wrong.
Speaker 4: So after like a year to eighteen months of trying
Speaker 4: with one.
Speaker 1: They had to find a new. Sorry yet so she's
Speaker 1: spent a long time trying to get her trial. But
Speaker 1: I got there in the end.