1
00:00:05,840 --> 00:00:09,200
Speaker 1: Today. This is the Happy Families Podcast, Real Parenting Solutions

2
00:00:09,280 --> 00:00:15,920
Speaker 1: every single day. Mum, I'm bored. Dad, this is so boring.

3
00:00:16,400 --> 00:00:19,040
Speaker 1: Do your kids get bored? Is it okay for them

4
00:00:19,079 --> 00:00:21,360
Speaker 1: to be bored? What about those blogs that say that

5
00:00:21,440 --> 00:00:24,360
Speaker 1: children need to be bored? Boredom is an essential part

6
00:00:24,400 --> 00:00:28,560
Speaker 1: of creativity and it's good for their overall brains and

7
00:00:28,560 --> 00:00:31,600
Speaker 1: their health and all those kinds of things. Today a

8
00:00:31,720 --> 00:00:35,320
Speaker 1: doctor's Desk episode where we examine how much boredom is

9
00:00:35,360 --> 00:00:39,040
Speaker 1: too much? Is boredom at all? Okay? Are the blogger

10
00:00:39,080 --> 00:00:41,240
Speaker 1: is right or the mummy bloggers saying that we need

11
00:00:41,280 --> 00:00:44,120
Speaker 1: to help our kids to be bored more? Have we

12
00:00:44,159 --> 00:00:46,919
Speaker 1: gone too far with overstimulation. We'll answer all of those

13
00:00:47,000 --> 00:00:51,240
Speaker 1: questions and more so that we can work out how

14
00:00:51,720 --> 00:00:55,680
Speaker 1: to help our children's brains function best in an overstimulated world.

15
00:00:56,040 --> 00:01:00,680
Speaker 1: It's coming up next. Stay with us. So this is

16
00:01:00,920 --> 00:01:04,080
Speaker 1: the Happy Family's podcast, Repairing Solutions every single day. We

17
00:01:04,120 --> 00:01:07,520
Speaker 1: are justin and Kylie Coulson. Kylie, I'm looking at you

18
00:01:07,600 --> 00:01:09,240
Speaker 1: right now and I can't help but say it. You're

19
00:01:09,240 --> 00:01:12,040
Speaker 1: coloring in your book. You're drawing patterns in designs. I've

20
00:01:12,080 --> 00:01:14,319
Speaker 1: done too long in intro and I get the feeling

21
00:01:14,319 --> 00:01:17,480
Speaker 1: that you're bored. It's a doctor's test, It's a doctor's

22
00:01:17,880 --> 00:01:20,920
Speaker 1: that's right, Okay. For anyone who's new to the podcast,

23
00:01:21,440 --> 00:01:23,679
Speaker 1: every week or they're about sometimes every couple of weeks,

24
00:01:23,840 --> 00:01:25,720
Speaker 1: some new research will come across my desk, or I'll

25
00:01:25,760 --> 00:01:27,720
Speaker 1: just decide that we're going to step into some research

26
00:01:27,880 --> 00:01:29,880
Speaker 1: and we call it the Doctor's Desk. It's where I

27
00:01:29,880 --> 00:01:31,960
Speaker 1: get to geek out about what the latest science is.

28
00:01:32,280 --> 00:01:36,080
Speaker 1: And Kylie's response, I would say in eighty percent of

29
00:01:36,080 --> 00:01:42,880
Speaker 1: our Doctor's Desk episodes is boring. Boring, Which is so

30
00:01:42,920 --> 00:01:44,720
Speaker 1: funny because when I talk to people, when I talk

31
00:01:44,760 --> 00:01:47,319
Speaker 1: to people, when I'm speaking at events and things, they

32
00:01:47,400 --> 00:01:49,320
Speaker 1: just say, oh, we love the Doctor's Desk episode.

33
00:01:49,400 --> 00:01:50,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, they love it because I've make fun of you.

34
00:01:50,960 --> 00:01:53,120
Speaker 1: No, no, actually, nobody ever says that they love the

35
00:01:53,120 --> 00:01:57,960
Speaker 1: Doctor's Tesk episodes. I'm just but you believe me. I

36
00:01:57,960 --> 00:02:01,160
Speaker 1: should have just left it there, all right, So today today,

37
00:02:01,240 --> 00:02:04,040
Speaker 1: a Doctor's Desk episode about being bored. Is it good

38
00:02:04,080 --> 00:02:06,280
Speaker 1: for the kids or not? I cannot count the number

39
00:02:06,280 --> 00:02:08,480
Speaker 1: of mummy blogs and tiktoks that I've read about how

40
00:02:08,480 --> 00:02:10,680
Speaker 1: important is that kids have boredom, and so I figured,

41
00:02:11,000 --> 00:02:13,120
Speaker 1: let's just address this, let's deal with it once and

42
00:02:13,160 --> 00:02:15,000
Speaker 1: for all, because there's a lot of stuff out there

43
00:02:15,000 --> 00:02:17,960
Speaker 1: that's just plain wrong about kids being bored.

44
00:02:17,800 --> 00:02:19,520
Speaker 2: It's not very often you sit on the fence. So

45
00:02:19,639 --> 00:02:21,800
Speaker 2: I've got to ask, is it good or bad?

46
00:02:22,160 --> 00:02:24,880
Speaker 1: I love the way that you said that. So the

47
00:02:24,919 --> 00:02:27,720
Speaker 1: answer is yes, yes to what, Yes, it is good

48
00:02:27,800 --> 00:02:30,160
Speaker 1: or bad depending it just it depends. And this is

49
00:02:30,200 --> 00:02:33,040
Speaker 1: a standard psychology answer. I know I was about to say,

50
00:02:33,240 --> 00:02:35,359
Speaker 1: but it's not a cop out. There really is nuance here.

51
00:02:35,400 --> 00:02:37,080
Speaker 1: And this is why I get so irritated when I

52
00:02:37,120 --> 00:02:40,440
Speaker 1: read these blogs or see these tiktoks or reels about boredom,

53
00:02:40,639 --> 00:02:44,120
Speaker 1: because the answer is genuinely, it depends. Let me ask

54
00:02:44,160 --> 00:02:47,000
Speaker 1: you this question, what would you see as an argument

55
00:02:47,080 --> 00:02:50,440
Speaker 1: for boredom? Like when have you seen boredom being good

56
00:02:50,480 --> 00:02:52,519
Speaker 1: for our children? We've got a daughter who's homeschooled, and

57
00:02:52,560 --> 00:02:55,720
Speaker 1: there are times where she is legitimately there's nothing for

58
00:02:55,760 --> 00:02:57,799
Speaker 1: her to do. She's done all of her homeschool, she's

59
00:02:57,800 --> 00:03:00,720
Speaker 1: spent time with her friends, she's done her music stuff

60
00:03:01,240 --> 00:03:03,600
Speaker 1: like we're tapping out and she wants to be on

61
00:03:03,639 --> 00:03:05,640
Speaker 1: a screen and we're saying no, no, no, no, You've only got

62
00:03:05,680 --> 00:03:08,400
Speaker 1: an amount of time on a screen. So she's bored.

63
00:03:08,440 --> 00:03:11,400
Speaker 1: So what are the benefits to her being bored in

64
00:03:11,440 --> 00:03:13,639
Speaker 1: those circumstances? Because it drives us up the.

65
00:03:13,560 --> 00:03:22,280
Speaker 2: Wall, because it encourages her to tap into her interests. Okay,

66
00:03:22,840 --> 00:03:26,600
Speaker 2: because we live in a world that just everything set

67
00:03:26,600 --> 00:03:28,880
Speaker 2: our fingertips, we don't have to think, we don't have

68
00:03:28,919 --> 00:03:31,960
Speaker 2: to look very far at all to find something to

69
00:03:32,160 --> 00:03:35,640
Speaker 2: fill time. And yet when we allow our kids to

70
00:03:35,680 --> 00:03:40,360
Speaker 2: be bored, it actually helps them remember the things that

71
00:03:40,720 --> 00:03:42,200
Speaker 2: bring them the most joy.

72
00:03:42,640 --> 00:03:45,120
Speaker 1: Yeah. Okay, so I mean you've just used that idea.

73
00:03:45,280 --> 00:03:47,400
Speaker 1: Bored him allows your time to think. Henry Ford said,

74
00:03:47,520 --> 00:03:49,840
Speaker 1: thinking is one of the hardest things there is to do,

75
00:03:49,880 --> 00:03:51,760
Speaker 1: which is why so few people engage in it. He's

76
00:03:51,760 --> 00:03:55,440
Speaker 1: obviously putting the entire population down when he says that,

77
00:03:56,000 --> 00:03:58,880
Speaker 1: but we actually don't like thinking very much. He is right,

78
00:03:59,040 --> 00:04:01,840
Speaker 1: and with access all of our screens, for example, that

79
00:04:02,080 --> 00:04:04,040
Speaker 1: that's a perfect opportunity for us to not have to think.

80
00:04:04,680 --> 00:04:07,920
Speaker 1: So boredom does do that. However, when boredom is occasional,

81
00:04:07,960 --> 00:04:11,040
Speaker 1: and when boredom occurs in a an enriching environment, an

82
00:04:11,080 --> 00:04:15,120
Speaker 1: environment where there are opportunities for children to do good things,

83
00:04:15,520 --> 00:04:18,240
Speaker 1: that's when it's good. But if they're in an impoverished

84
00:04:18,320 --> 00:04:22,039
Speaker 1: environment where there are no activities, there's no opportunity. They're

85
00:04:22,080 --> 00:04:25,560
Speaker 1: literally just bored and there are no toys, there are

86
00:04:25,560 --> 00:04:27,440
Speaker 1: no puzzles, there are no games, there are no trees

87
00:04:27,480 --> 00:04:29,920
Speaker 1: to climb, there are no scooters to ride or bikes

88
00:04:29,920 --> 00:04:31,599
Speaker 1: to play like. They've got nothing to do. There's no

89
00:04:31,640 --> 00:04:35,080
Speaker 1: park to play at. That is terribly bad for them,

90
00:04:35,160 --> 00:04:37,080
Speaker 1: especially if it's for a long period of time. So

91
00:04:37,240 --> 00:04:41,440
Speaker 1: enduring boredom bad associated with depression, associated with delinquency. Like

92
00:04:41,440 --> 00:04:43,080
Speaker 1: when I was a teenager and I was bored and

93
00:04:43,120 --> 00:04:46,039
Speaker 1: I didn't really look effectively at what else was in

94
00:04:46,040 --> 00:04:47,920
Speaker 1: my environment that I could do. I just went and

95
00:04:47,960 --> 00:04:50,080
Speaker 1: did things that I should not have done and said,

96
00:04:50,200 --> 00:04:54,800
Speaker 1: got my let's not talk about it was in my bedroom, Okay,

97
00:04:54,880 --> 00:04:57,360
Speaker 1: in case someone thinks that I was lighting fires down

98
00:04:57,400 --> 00:05:00,200
Speaker 1: in the local public park or anything in my.

99
00:05:00,080 --> 00:05:02,800
Speaker 2: Bedroom, closing cats between screens.

100
00:05:03,160 --> 00:05:06,040
Speaker 1: I don't talk about that. I only did it once.

101
00:05:06,800 --> 00:05:10,280
Speaker 1: It once. Gosh, we all do things that we regret.

102
00:05:10,720 --> 00:05:13,600
Speaker 1: Thank you for bringing that up, did you anyway? So yes,

103
00:05:13,640 --> 00:05:16,080
Speaker 1: boredom can be good so long as it's occasional, so

104
00:05:16,120 --> 00:05:19,760
Speaker 1: long as it's reasonably short lived ish, and so long

105
00:05:19,760 --> 00:05:25,240
Speaker 1: as the environment offers in richmond and activity possibilities.

106
00:05:25,320 --> 00:05:28,480
Speaker 2: So I think that that's key. It's about primers. So

107
00:05:29,240 --> 00:05:34,359
Speaker 2: emily being bored only works because I've worked out that

108
00:05:34,560 --> 00:05:37,279
Speaker 2: instead of having everything behind closed doors, because I like

109
00:05:37,320 --> 00:05:41,200
Speaker 2: things neat and tidy, I actually have gifted her my

110
00:05:41,320 --> 00:05:42,200
Speaker 2: outdoor space.

111
00:05:42,279 --> 00:05:44,120
Speaker 1: Our back deck looks I don't even know what. I

112
00:05:44,160 --> 00:05:46,000
Speaker 1: don't even know how to describe what it looks like.

113
00:05:46,279 --> 00:05:49,760
Speaker 1: It looks like an art expose her part. It's her

114
00:05:49,800 --> 00:05:52,440
Speaker 1: paige shed. Yeah, it's not a shed. We can't close

115
00:05:52,440 --> 00:05:54,560
Speaker 1: the doors, and we can't use the back deck because

116
00:05:55,680 --> 00:05:58,679
Speaker 1: but she cuts out cardboard. She's making our cardboard dragons.

117
00:05:58,680 --> 00:06:03,279
Speaker 1: She's doing some art, and she's so creative out there.

118
00:06:03,400 --> 00:06:05,560
Speaker 2: And she'll usually have a bit of a tantrum because

119
00:06:05,600 --> 00:06:07,000
Speaker 2: she's asked me to be on a screen and I've

120
00:06:07,000 --> 00:06:11,440
Speaker 2: said no. Within seconds of her realizing that I'm not

121
00:06:11,480 --> 00:06:14,039
Speaker 2: actually going to give in, she walks out that back

122
00:06:14,080 --> 00:06:16,680
Speaker 2: door because she can see the table through the window,

123
00:06:17,720 --> 00:06:20,640
Speaker 2: and she walks out there and she just starts creating and.

124
00:06:20,600 --> 00:06:24,320
Speaker 1: There are days where she'll she'll be occupied for two

125
00:06:24,360 --> 00:06:28,440
Speaker 1: or three hours because that creativity kicks in and then

126
00:06:28,480 --> 00:06:30,839
Speaker 1: we can't get her away from that. I mean, it's beautiful.

127
00:06:30,960 --> 00:06:33,040
Speaker 1: That's the kind of bottom. That's good because it leads

128
00:06:33,080 --> 00:06:34,320
Speaker 1: to positive outcomes.

129
00:06:34,360 --> 00:06:36,880
Speaker 2: But the only way it works is because there's primers. Yes,

130
00:06:38,040 --> 00:06:40,520
Speaker 2: you talk about the enriching environment. There has to be

131
00:06:40,600 --> 00:06:42,880
Speaker 2: books on hand. There has to, like you said, puzzles

132
00:06:42,960 --> 00:06:44,839
Speaker 2: like the lego. They've actually got to be out and

133
00:06:44,880 --> 00:06:45,800
Speaker 2: about they can see.

134
00:06:45,960 --> 00:06:48,640
Speaker 1: Yeah, yep, that's right. So that's that's the answer. Boorttom

135
00:06:48,680 --> 00:06:50,680
Speaker 1: is good and it's bad. It just depends. It depends

136
00:06:50,680 --> 00:06:52,360
Speaker 1: on what we're doing in the environment, how long it's

137
00:06:52,400 --> 00:06:58,840
Speaker 1: going for, and that kind of stuff.

138
00:07:01,760 --> 00:07:04,200
Speaker 2: So it wouldn't be the doctor's desk without you geeking

139
00:07:04,200 --> 00:07:09,800
Speaker 2: out on some neuroscience stuff. So can you break it

140
00:07:09,840 --> 00:07:13,240
Speaker 2: down for us mums and dads who don't have a

141
00:07:13,280 --> 00:07:18,240
Speaker 2: psychology degree in a way that makes sense. What's actually

142
00:07:18,440 --> 00:07:21,640
Speaker 2: happening in the brain when our kids are bored?

143
00:07:21,680 --> 00:07:25,000
Speaker 1: Okay, So I'm going to make this really brief because.

144
00:07:24,600 --> 00:07:27,080
Speaker 2: Also it's not really just about kids, right, No, it's just.

145
00:07:27,160 --> 00:07:30,040
Speaker 1: As well when we're bored as I actually kind of

146
00:07:30,040 --> 00:07:32,040
Speaker 1: get bored with brain stuff because it's not practical. It's

147
00:07:32,040 --> 00:07:33,360
Speaker 1: happening in the brain, but whether we or know it's

148
00:07:33,360 --> 00:07:35,000
Speaker 1: happening or not, it doesn't really change a lot of

149
00:07:35,000 --> 00:07:37,800
Speaker 1: what we do. I mean, anyway, there's an argument one

150
00:07:37,800 --> 00:07:41,600
Speaker 1: way or another. But basically, inside the brain there's what's

151
00:07:41,640 --> 00:07:44,640
Speaker 1: loosely called the attention network. So the attention network includes

152
00:07:44,640 --> 00:07:47,800
Speaker 1: executive control. It's that prefrontal cortex you zero on and

153
00:07:47,840 --> 00:07:49,640
Speaker 1: something you start to pay attention to it, you start

154
00:07:49,640 --> 00:07:51,240
Speaker 1: to think about it, you start to engage with it,

155
00:07:51,440 --> 00:07:53,880
Speaker 1: Your fronto parietal lobe kicks in, your speech and language

156
00:07:53,880 --> 00:07:56,040
Speaker 1: centers in your temporal lobe, and your paradal lobe also

157
00:07:56,120 --> 00:07:56,480
Speaker 1: kick in.

158
00:07:56,640 --> 00:07:58,480
Speaker 2: So which part of my brain's shutting off right now?

159
00:07:59,360 --> 00:08:02,200
Speaker 1: Right now? Yeah, the parts of the brain that I'm

160
00:08:02,280 --> 00:08:04,640
Speaker 1: talking about are the parts of the brain that are

161
00:08:04,640 --> 00:08:08,680
Speaker 1: shutting off because your attention network is starting to dip.

162
00:08:08,800 --> 00:08:11,280
Speaker 1: As like you asked the question and then you fell asleep.

163
00:08:12,480 --> 00:08:13,360
Speaker 2: Okay, carry on.

164
00:08:13,880 --> 00:08:16,800
Speaker 1: So when our attention is high, those parts of the

165
00:08:16,800 --> 00:08:21,280
Speaker 1: brain are really really active. But when our attention is low,

166
00:08:22,240 --> 00:08:24,280
Speaker 1: there's another part of the brain that takes over. So

167
00:08:24,880 --> 00:08:28,880
Speaker 1: let's say I am droning on about neurochemistry and neuroanatomy,

168
00:08:29,240 --> 00:08:32,400
Speaker 1: and your frontal lobe and your parietal lobe and your

169
00:08:32,440 --> 00:08:35,400
Speaker 1: temporal lobe, they all start to dim. They all start

170
00:08:35,440 --> 00:08:37,160
Speaker 1: to go, oh, yeah, this is boring. And so the

171
00:08:38,200 --> 00:08:41,480
Speaker 1: blood flow and the oxygenation in your brain, it all

172
00:08:41,520 --> 00:08:42,640
Speaker 1: starts to flow elsewhere.

173
00:08:43,160 --> 00:08:48,440
Speaker 2: But I also feel deenergized, yeah, because it's putting that

174
00:08:48,480 --> 00:08:49,560
Speaker 2: part of your brain to sleep.

175
00:08:49,840 --> 00:08:52,560
Speaker 1: And what kicks in instead is this thing called the DMN.

176
00:08:53,080 --> 00:08:55,000
Speaker 1: I love talking about the DMN. This might be my

177
00:08:55,040 --> 00:08:57,240
Speaker 1: favorite brain region to talk about, especially when we're talking

178
00:08:57,240 --> 00:09:00,839
Speaker 1: about raising children. The DMN is at hand for or

179
00:09:00,880 --> 00:09:05,199
Speaker 1: abbreviated form of the default mode network. So if I'm

180
00:09:05,200 --> 00:09:09,520
Speaker 1: talking about neurochemistry and neurinatomy and you start falling asleep,

181
00:09:10,160 --> 00:09:13,360
Speaker 1: what's going on is your attention network becomes deactivated and

182
00:09:13,400 --> 00:09:17,560
Speaker 1: this internal network, this default your brain goes into default mode.

183
00:09:17,679 --> 00:09:20,679
Speaker 1: That's why it's called the default mode network or the DMN.

184
00:09:21,080 --> 00:09:23,080
Speaker 1: And when your brain is in default mode and the

185
00:09:23,240 --> 00:09:26,160
Speaker 1: DMN is active, the default mode network kicks in. You're

186
00:09:26,160 --> 00:09:28,120
Speaker 1: not really even aware your brain's going, but you know

187
00:09:28,200 --> 00:09:30,280
Speaker 1: that you know when you do have time to just

188
00:09:30,640 --> 00:09:33,520
Speaker 1: let your brain be and you start thinking about stuff.

189
00:09:33,600 --> 00:09:35,080
Speaker 1: I mean, you might be thinking about the washing wats

190
00:09:35,120 --> 00:09:37,120
Speaker 1: for dinner tonight, but you also might be thinking about

191
00:09:37,160 --> 00:09:38,640
Speaker 1: that conversation that you had with a friend a few

192
00:09:38,720 --> 00:09:41,080
Speaker 1: days ago that you haven't followed up on. Or you

193
00:09:41,160 --> 00:09:43,480
Speaker 1: start to do all the internal work. You're literally the

194
00:09:43,559 --> 00:09:46,480
Speaker 1: inner work, the identity building work, the values work, the

195
00:09:46,960 --> 00:09:51,079
Speaker 1: thinking about things that matter work. There's the technical term

196
00:09:51,120 --> 00:09:56,000
Speaker 1: for it is interroception, so you know approprioception. An occupational

197
00:09:56,040 --> 00:09:58,400
Speaker 1: therapist or somebody like that will talk to you about

198
00:09:58,720 --> 00:10:01,480
Speaker 1: how children need to have good understanding of where their

199
00:10:01,480 --> 00:10:04,280
Speaker 1: body is in space. That's appropriate reception, so that's looking

200
00:10:04,280 --> 00:10:07,240
Speaker 1: at where your body is and then looking outwards into space.

201
00:10:07,760 --> 00:10:11,839
Speaker 1: But interception, that's where your body is internal, like where

202
00:10:11,840 --> 00:10:15,600
Speaker 1: your mind is internally. That's stepping into this internal state.

203
00:10:16,040 --> 00:10:21,120
Speaker 1: And so boredom basically means that the DMN kicks off

204
00:10:21,600 --> 00:10:24,160
Speaker 1: and you start to think about stuff. This actually ties

205
00:10:24,160 --> 00:10:26,240
Speaker 1: in with your question about whether boredom is good or bad,

206
00:10:27,280 --> 00:10:32,439
Speaker 1: because when boredom is good, you go internally, So you

207
00:10:32,559 --> 00:10:36,960
Speaker 1: activation network, your tension network switches off, your DMN switches on,

208
00:10:37,400 --> 00:10:39,520
Speaker 1: and you go internally and you start thinking about stuff,

209
00:10:39,520 --> 00:10:43,160
Speaker 1: and maybe you do some journaling, or you resolve a problem,

210
00:10:43,200 --> 00:10:47,400
Speaker 1: a conflict and difficulty, you think about who you are.

211
00:10:47,760 --> 00:10:53,720
Speaker 1: That's really productive. But enduring, ongoing, sustained boredom leads to

212
00:10:53,760 --> 00:10:56,720
Speaker 1: the DMN network firing up in unhelpful ways, and it

213
00:10:56,760 --> 00:10:59,760
Speaker 1: can become overactive and we start to ruminate. We start

214
00:10:59,760 --> 00:11:02,839
Speaker 1: to get into anxiety and depression. That's why people who

215
00:11:02,840 --> 00:11:05,760
Speaker 1: are really struggling when they go to bed, the DM

216
00:11:05,800 --> 00:11:08,680
Speaker 1: men kicks in. That aft mode network kicks in, and

217
00:11:08,679 --> 00:11:10,320
Speaker 1: that's why they start to get scared or they start

218
00:11:10,360 --> 00:11:12,720
Speaker 1: to get anxious at bedtime because their brain is finally

219
00:11:12,760 --> 00:11:15,679
Speaker 1: getting an opportunity to go quiet and the DM men

220
00:11:15,920 --> 00:11:18,520
Speaker 1: kicks on. So that's the brain stuff, Kylie, I know

221
00:11:19,480 --> 00:11:21,160
Speaker 1: meant to be a quick answer. Thanks for staying awake.

222
00:11:21,200 --> 00:11:25,360
Speaker 1: Are you awake? Hello? Oh my goodness, so sorry. I

223
00:11:25,559 --> 00:11:27,280
Speaker 1: believe you just did that.

224
00:11:28,120 --> 00:11:32,439
Speaker 2: So tell me. Then. We had a conversation earlier about

225
00:11:33,040 --> 00:11:37,960
Speaker 2: screens are you and I yes, not being a useful

226
00:11:38,000 --> 00:11:41,440
Speaker 2: way to utilize your time to help shut your brain down,

227
00:11:42,840 --> 00:11:43,840
Speaker 2: and we diffit.

228
00:11:44,160 --> 00:11:46,840
Speaker 1: Yes, So how does screens.

229
00:11:46,440 --> 00:11:47,280
Speaker 2: And boredom work?

230
00:11:47,559 --> 00:11:50,960
Speaker 1: Okay, So basically, screens are fast paced, they're stimulatory, so

231
00:11:51,360 --> 00:11:54,320
Speaker 1: they're really grab your attention. They fire up the cortex,

232
00:11:54,400 --> 00:11:57,000
Speaker 1: especially the prefront of cortex, and that pardal and the

233
00:11:57,000 --> 00:11:59,439
Speaker 1: temporal lobes, all those things that grab your attention and

234
00:11:59,520 --> 00:12:03,280
Speaker 1: keep you active and activated. That's what screens do. They're

235
00:12:03,360 --> 00:12:06,840
Speaker 1: masterfully created by the best brains in the business to

236
00:12:07,160 --> 00:12:11,320
Speaker 1: leverage every single psychological weakness. We have to keep us there.

237
00:12:11,440 --> 00:12:11,719
Speaker 1: That's me.

238
00:12:11,880 --> 00:12:14,160
Speaker 2: But I don't have to do anything. I don't have

239
00:12:14,240 --> 00:12:16,720
Speaker 2: to I don't have to solve a problem. I don't

240
00:12:16,760 --> 00:12:19,320
Speaker 2: have to work out where I have to be from

241
00:12:19,320 --> 00:12:20,080
Speaker 2: a to be like.

242
00:12:20,240 --> 00:12:23,640
Speaker 1: But it's the attention. So it's costly for your nervous

243
00:12:23,640 --> 00:12:27,760
Speaker 1: system because it's sucking you in and it's absorbing your attention.

244
00:12:28,320 --> 00:12:31,240
Speaker 1: But it's not productive, it's not helpful. There's no nothing.

245
00:12:31,280 --> 00:12:32,640
Speaker 2: But I don't want to be productive.

246
00:12:33,160 --> 00:12:35,480
Speaker 1: I'm not talking about productive as in getting more things,

247
00:12:35,679 --> 00:12:38,320
Speaker 1: not talking about getting more things done, like let's let's

248
00:12:38,320 --> 00:12:40,200
Speaker 1: go and wipe down the kitchen benches and pick up

249
00:12:40,240 --> 00:12:42,160
Speaker 1: the towels. And that's not what I'm talking about here.

250
00:12:42,440 --> 00:12:44,640
Speaker 1: I'm talking about the brain actually having an opportunity to

251
00:12:44,679 --> 00:12:47,960
Speaker 1: reset that is productive. And you may feel like your

252
00:12:47,960 --> 00:12:50,600
Speaker 1: brain is resetting because you're watching a movie or vegging

253
00:12:50,600 --> 00:12:51,760
Speaker 1: out to some Instagram reels.

254
00:12:51,880 --> 00:12:54,080
Speaker 2: No, but that's not what I Why I watch a screen.

255
00:12:54,400 --> 00:12:56,760
Speaker 2: I literally watch a screen, so I don't have to think.

256
00:12:57,640 --> 00:13:00,720
Speaker 1: Whether you want to be thinking or not. You are thinking,

257
00:13:00,920 --> 00:13:02,319
Speaker 1: your brain is going in store.

258
00:13:02,240 --> 00:13:04,400
Speaker 2: But I'm not thinking about anything that I have to do.

259
00:13:04,520 --> 00:13:07,640
Speaker 1: It's still taxing on your brain. So this is the issue.

260
00:13:07,640 --> 00:13:11,000
Speaker 1: It's still taxing your brain. It's called alostatic overload. And

261
00:13:11,120 --> 00:13:12,400
Speaker 1: alostatic overload.

262
00:13:12,600 --> 00:13:14,040
Speaker 2: Sorry, I'm going to get tired again.

263
00:13:14,320 --> 00:13:19,720
Speaker 1: Is increased is associated with increased neurological arousal and increased

264
00:13:19,720 --> 00:13:24,040
Speaker 1: neurological and it literally makes you more anxious. Apart from that,

265
00:13:24,080 --> 00:13:27,000
Speaker 1: here's something really fascinating. If you go in the opposite direction,

266
00:13:27,000 --> 00:13:28,960
Speaker 1: which can happen when you're on a screen. Okay, so

267
00:13:29,040 --> 00:13:32,040
Speaker 1: and you may be going there rather than the screen

268
00:13:32,120 --> 00:13:34,280
Speaker 1: stimulating you, it's actually.

269
00:13:33,920 --> 00:13:36,800
Speaker 2: Not how often have you put the TV on a

270
00:13:36,880 --> 00:13:37,360
Speaker 2: I fall.

271
00:13:37,240 --> 00:13:40,880
Speaker 1: Assleep, it's still not actually resetting your system. And this

272
00:13:40,960 --> 00:13:44,160
Speaker 1: is why, because you don't get to go into DMN activation.

273
00:13:45,440 --> 00:13:46,720
Speaker 1: There was a study that we talked about on the

274
00:13:46,720 --> 00:13:49,560
Speaker 1: Doctor's Desk a few months ago that showed that spending

275
00:13:49,559 --> 00:13:53,000
Speaker 1: more time on screens is associated with greater boredom, and

276
00:13:53,120 --> 00:13:55,880
Speaker 1: that I think is really talking about what you're highlighting here.

277
00:13:56,080 --> 00:14:00,000
Speaker 1: It's still not good for you. It's not recreating you.

278
00:13:59,520 --> 00:14:03,480
Speaker 1: I beg of you, my dear wife. Don't use the

279
00:14:03,480 --> 00:14:06,200
Speaker 1: screen as a I don't want to think about stuff thing.

280
00:14:06,520 --> 00:14:08,080
Speaker 1: Go out and lay on the grass, Go and touch

281
00:14:08,120 --> 00:14:10,319
Speaker 1: the grass, Go for a walk, lay on the bed

282
00:14:10,360 --> 00:14:12,920
Speaker 1: and do nothing. Pick up a book analog and just read.

283
00:14:12,960 --> 00:14:14,000
Speaker 2: Do you know who I'm married to?

284
00:14:16,520 --> 00:14:18,319
Speaker 1: I'm having an identity crisis all of a sudden. Is

285
00:14:18,360 --> 00:14:20,360
Speaker 1: that what's going on? All right? We need to wrap

286
00:14:20,360 --> 00:14:22,040
Speaker 1: this up. This is the doctor's desk is supposed to

287
00:14:22,080 --> 00:14:24,600
Speaker 1: be short and sweet, and we have overshot it. So

288
00:14:24,640 --> 00:14:26,120
Speaker 1: is there anything else you want to know before we

289
00:14:26,440 --> 00:14:28,000
Speaker 1: finish our conversation about boredom?

290
00:14:28,120 --> 00:14:30,160
Speaker 2: Well, it would be nice if we kind of had

291
00:14:30,200 --> 00:14:34,640
Speaker 2: some take homes. Okay, So if we recognize that there's

292
00:14:35,040 --> 00:14:37,560
Speaker 2: goodness that comes from our kids being brought and from

293
00:14:37,640 --> 00:14:41,240
Speaker 2: us being bored.

294
00:14:39,440 --> 00:14:41,400
Speaker 1: All the right way, not bored on a screen.

295
00:14:41,280 --> 00:14:44,160
Speaker 2: How do we deal with it? Because the last thing

296
00:14:44,200 --> 00:14:47,440
Speaker 2: we want I know I'm speaking for every month on

297
00:14:47,480 --> 00:14:52,000
Speaker 2: the planet, is I'm bored I'm bored. I don't want that.

298
00:14:52,320 --> 00:14:54,880
Speaker 1: Yeah, okay, so this is the thing that I've really

299
00:14:54,880 --> 00:14:57,880
Speaker 1: got to emphasize here. The data shows that boredom is

300
00:14:57,920 --> 00:15:01,960
Speaker 1: associated with improvements and creativity. It does develop independence in thinking,

301
00:15:02,440 --> 00:15:06,880
Speaker 1: and it supports self esteem and emotional regulation. Like this

302
00:15:06,920 --> 00:15:09,160
Speaker 1: is really important because that unstructured time can help us

303
00:15:09,160 --> 00:15:10,840
Speaker 1: to sit with our feelings. That's important for us to

304
00:15:10,920 --> 00:15:14,400
Speaker 1: manage anxiety. If we're doing it right, we're not using

305
00:15:14,400 --> 00:15:17,480
Speaker 1: a screen, then we're having this. We're breaking this loop

306
00:15:17,480 --> 00:15:20,800
Speaker 1: of instant gratification that contributes to the compulsive device use

307
00:15:20,840 --> 00:15:23,400
Speaker 1: that we go for because we're bored, and it rebalances

308
00:15:23,400 --> 00:15:27,120
Speaker 1: our nervous system. So it helps us again to be

309
00:15:27,320 --> 00:15:29,200
Speaker 1: a lot less anxious. What do we do. I'm going

310
00:15:29,240 --> 00:15:31,440
Speaker 1: to share three ideas with you. You can tell me

311
00:15:31,440 --> 00:15:33,600
Speaker 1: whether you like them or not. First one, you don't

312
00:15:33,600 --> 00:15:35,480
Speaker 1: have to entertain your kids. You just need to make

313
00:15:35,480 --> 00:15:37,360
Speaker 1: sure that they're in an environment where being bored is

314
00:15:37,400 --> 00:15:41,280
Speaker 1: not going to be counterproductive. Okay, so get risk screens,

315
00:15:41,320 --> 00:15:42,520
Speaker 1: but make sure there are other things that the kids

316
00:15:42,560 --> 00:15:44,200
Speaker 1: can do. And then just say hey, if you're bored,

317
00:15:44,680 --> 00:15:47,680
Speaker 1: boring people get bored a little bit of tough love here.

318
00:15:47,920 --> 00:15:50,080
Speaker 1: I love you like crazy, but right now this is

319
00:15:50,280 --> 00:15:52,360
Speaker 1: boring time. So you can choose whatever you want to do,

320
00:15:52,400 --> 00:15:53,640
Speaker 1: but you're going to have to figure this one out

321
00:15:53,640 --> 00:15:55,720
Speaker 1: for yourself. You can journal, you can play Lego, you

322
00:15:55,760 --> 00:15:57,360
Speaker 1: can build the puzzle, you can play a game, you

323
00:15:57,360 --> 00:15:59,080
Speaker 1: can ride a bike, you can do any of these things,

324
00:15:59,360 --> 00:16:02,040
Speaker 1: but it's boredo time. So actually being okay with that

325
00:16:02,160 --> 00:16:04,880
Speaker 1: second thing, I think what we really want to do

326
00:16:04,960 --> 00:16:07,560
Speaker 1: is make sure that and I've kind of answered in

327
00:16:07,640 --> 00:16:09,760
Speaker 1: the first one anyway, is make sure that the children

328
00:16:09,800 --> 00:16:14,920
Speaker 1: do have solid environmental enrichment opportunities. So number one, it's

329
00:16:14,960 --> 00:16:17,480
Speaker 1: not your job. Number two to keep them attained all

330
00:16:17,480 --> 00:16:19,040
Speaker 1: the time. Number two, make sure that there is stuff

331
00:16:19,040 --> 00:16:21,680
Speaker 1: in the environment so that they can entertain themselves. And

332
00:16:21,760 --> 00:16:24,920
Speaker 1: number three, I just think, embrace it, connect with other people,

333
00:16:25,040 --> 00:16:28,840
Speaker 1: get analog, and let boredom do what it's supposed to do,

334
00:16:28,880 --> 00:16:32,120
Speaker 1: which is to reset your nervous system, reduce that allostatic overload,

335
00:16:32,400 --> 00:16:34,760
Speaker 1: break you out of that constant feedback loop where you're

336
00:16:34,760 --> 00:16:40,080
Speaker 1: constantly receiving that instant gratification and breathe, just breathe.

337
00:16:41,120 --> 00:16:42,880
Speaker 2: I feel a family meeting coming on.

338
00:16:43,720 --> 00:16:45,720
Speaker 1: Let's do it. Let's talk about bored them on Sunday.

339
00:16:46,360 --> 00:16:48,680
Speaker 1: Let's tell the kids are going to get bored. We

340
00:16:48,760 --> 00:16:50,640
Speaker 1: need to wrap this up. Thanks so much for listening

341
00:16:50,640 --> 00:16:53,360
Speaker 1: to the Doctor's Desk episode. We hope that it's answered

342
00:16:53,360 --> 00:16:55,880
Speaker 1: a few questions giving you some inspo. The Happy Family's

343
00:16:55,880 --> 00:16:59,240
Speaker 1: podcast is produced by Justin Rulan from Bridge Media and

344
00:16:59,280 --> 00:17:02,480
Speaker 1: Mimhammon's Traditional Research have me and other support. If you

345
00:17:02,480 --> 00:17:05,199
Speaker 1: would like to make your family happier, visit us for

346
00:17:05,320 --> 00:17:08,840
Speaker 1: more resources at happy families dot com dot au. We'll

347
00:17:08,880 --> 00:17:09,479
Speaker 1: see you tomorrow