1
00:00:01,160 --> 00:00:01,920
Speaker 1: Podcasting.

2
00:00:02,279 --> 00:00:06,280
Speaker 2: Now we are doing chats all throughout November to help

3
00:00:06,320 --> 00:00:09,760
Speaker 2: people talk about what they're going through with their mental health.

4
00:00:09,840 --> 00:00:13,560
Speaker 2: It's obviously the most important mode you will ever grow

5
00:00:13,760 --> 00:00:16,680
Speaker 2: this November. It's all about helping a bro and you

6
00:00:16,680 --> 00:00:19,680
Speaker 2: can do that. Headle onto November dot com a if

7
00:00:19,720 --> 00:00:21,840
Speaker 2: you like to help them out. Right now, though, we've

8
00:00:21,840 --> 00:00:24,599
Speaker 2: got a person who's very willing to come on and

9
00:00:24,600 --> 00:00:25,279
Speaker 2: talk to us about this.

10
00:00:25,320 --> 00:00:26,119
Speaker 3: It's great that he is.

11
00:00:26,120 --> 00:00:28,960
Speaker 2: He only recently spoke about on SAS Australia, the depression

12
00:00:28,960 --> 00:00:30,880
Speaker 2: that he's been carrying with him. He said, since he's

13
00:00:30,880 --> 00:00:33,640
Speaker 2: a teenager, phenomenal that he's coming on to talk about it.

14
00:00:33,800 --> 00:00:41,800
Speaker 2: We've got Mitch Johnson on for motor Oil and Wadies. Sure, Mitch,

15
00:00:41,840 --> 00:00:42,560
Speaker 2: thanks coming back.

16
00:00:42,479 --> 00:00:43,080
Speaker 3: On the show Man.

17
00:00:44,200 --> 00:00:45,320
Speaker 1: Yeah, thanks for having me again.

18
00:00:46,080 --> 00:00:47,479
Speaker 3: You're back on for the Rosie topics.

19
00:00:47,479 --> 00:00:49,240
Speaker 2: We get you on just for the cheerful gear, which

20
00:00:49,280 --> 00:00:52,199
Speaker 2: is huge.

21
00:00:52,960 --> 00:00:57,120
Speaker 1: How to grow up, that's all the producers told you.

22
00:00:57,200 --> 00:01:01,960
Speaker 3: But now we've got you here. It's a actually.

23
00:01:01,760 --> 00:01:05,240
Speaker 2: Speaking of Mitch going the old mode you are. You

24
00:01:05,280 --> 00:01:07,640
Speaker 2: were I remember when November was just kicking off. You

25
00:01:07,640 --> 00:01:11,679
Speaker 2: were really one of the flagship ambassadors for November that

26
00:01:11,800 --> 00:01:15,319
Speaker 2: this wasn't something that you'd spoken about publicly then. Was

27
00:01:15,360 --> 00:01:18,280
Speaker 2: that hard for you, you know, knowing that you had

28
00:01:18,280 --> 00:01:20,440
Speaker 2: this sort of under your lid, you hadn't spoken about

29
00:01:20,440 --> 00:01:23,039
Speaker 2: it publicly yet. How many people did know that you

30
00:01:23,080 --> 00:01:25,440
Speaker 2: were going through tricky times or was it something that

31
00:01:25,480 --> 00:01:28,520
Speaker 2: you felt like you hadn't even yourself kind of dealt

32
00:01:28,520 --> 00:01:28,959
Speaker 2: with yet.

33
00:01:30,400 --> 00:01:33,680
Speaker 1: Yeah. Look, I think through my cricket career it always

34
00:01:33,680 --> 00:01:37,240
Speaker 1: popped up in conversation with my wife and my manager

35
00:01:37,280 --> 00:01:40,200
Speaker 1: at the time. Yeah, it was pretty pretty private. I

36
00:01:40,280 --> 00:01:43,280
Speaker 1: definitely thought there was something going on, but I noticed

37
00:01:43,280 --> 00:01:46,160
Speaker 1: it so much more when I was away on tour

38
00:01:46,680 --> 00:01:49,800
Speaker 1: and you know, spending time in my room, I'd often

39
00:01:49,840 --> 00:01:52,960
Speaker 1: get to the point of not wanting to go and

40
00:01:52,960 --> 00:01:56,080
Speaker 1: have a coffee with the boys and just I'd rather

41
00:01:56,160 --> 00:01:58,360
Speaker 1: spend that time in my room. Yeah, because I was

42
00:01:58,440 --> 00:02:02,040
Speaker 1: just so down. I guess that was clear signs to

43
00:02:02,080 --> 00:02:04,960
Speaker 1: me and just wasn't really ready to admit it till

44
00:02:05,000 --> 00:02:06,000
Speaker 1: I've got some help.

45
00:02:07,160 --> 00:02:10,080
Speaker 4: Hey, Mitch, can I ask why back then, when you

46
00:02:10,120 --> 00:02:13,280
Speaker 4: were on tour, why you didn't feel comfortable to pull

47
00:02:13,320 --> 00:02:15,720
Speaker 4: another player aside and open up to them. And the

48
00:02:15,760 --> 00:02:17,560
Speaker 4: reason I say this is Will and I, I mean,

49
00:02:17,600 --> 00:02:19,960
Speaker 4: when Will came to me about his depression or when

50
00:02:19,960 --> 00:02:21,720
Speaker 4: we first spoke about it, was probably forced on us,

51
00:02:21,760 --> 00:02:22,440
Speaker 4: wasn't it, Will.

52
00:02:22,960 --> 00:02:26,000
Speaker 3: Yeah, because we're in the radio studio and yeah, exactly,

53
00:02:26,080 --> 00:02:29,320
Speaker 3: you'd be rolling out your best gear and yeah, unbelievable,

54
00:02:29,360 --> 00:02:33,440
Speaker 3: and I wouldn't laugh checking the jokes. I'm going like,

55
00:02:33,480 --> 00:02:34,360
Speaker 3: I'm sure that's good year.

56
00:02:35,760 --> 00:02:37,639
Speaker 2: So yeah, that was that was That was apparent really

57
00:02:37,720 --> 00:02:40,240
Speaker 2: quickly because I we couldn't avoid that.

58
00:02:40,400 --> 00:02:42,720
Speaker 4: But so I imagine for you, Mitch, when, especially when

59
00:02:42,720 --> 00:02:44,800
Speaker 4: you're Onto and you're spending so much time with the boys,

60
00:02:44,800 --> 00:02:47,840
Speaker 4: you're training with them, you're playing with them. Firstly, how

61
00:02:47,880 --> 00:02:50,160
Speaker 4: did you keep it from and then secondly, why did

62
00:02:50,160 --> 00:02:52,560
Speaker 4: you not feel comfortable to say something to one of them?

63
00:02:54,080 --> 00:02:55,920
Speaker 1: I don't know. I guess for me, I had this

64
00:02:55,960 --> 00:03:01,560
Speaker 1: persona being angry. I think that's one thing I've realized

65
00:03:01,720 --> 00:03:04,480
Speaker 1: actually doing the Sas show is that I don't have

66
00:03:04,560 --> 00:03:08,919
Speaker 1: to play that character that's not me, And I think, yeah,

67
00:03:08,960 --> 00:03:10,760
Speaker 1: you see the real meat come out in that in

68
00:03:10,840 --> 00:03:13,680
Speaker 1: that show. But yeah, it was just nice to be

69
00:03:13,680 --> 00:03:16,440
Speaker 1: able to actually talk about it, and guys are very

70
00:03:16,480 --> 00:03:17,160
Speaker 1: open about it.

71
00:03:17,360 --> 00:03:19,560
Speaker 2: Yeah, But I think it's really worth saying as well,

72
00:03:19,639 --> 00:03:22,880
Speaker 2: Like I feel like, you know, this word depression is

73
00:03:23,200 --> 00:03:25,320
Speaker 2: something that we throw around like a dead cat these days,

74
00:03:25,360 --> 00:03:26,880
Speaker 2: you know, you just say like, oh, you know, and

75
00:03:27,000 --> 00:03:28,799
Speaker 2: I think that a lot of people are almost worried

76
00:03:28,800 --> 00:03:31,840
Speaker 2: that they don't reach the quota. Am I depressed enough

77
00:03:31,919 --> 00:03:34,960
Speaker 2: that we can call this depressed? And yeah, I just

78
00:03:35,280 --> 00:03:38,080
Speaker 2: I think that's bullshit because I think that the word

79
00:03:38,080 --> 00:03:41,240
Speaker 2: depression is just a very big word to explain the

80
00:03:41,240 --> 00:03:43,960
Speaker 2: fact that somebody's been flat for a consistent period of time.

81
00:03:44,360 --> 00:03:46,280
Speaker 3: You can have a month at work where you're feeling

82
00:03:46,320 --> 00:03:49,320
Speaker 3: stressed and you can be depressed as a result.

83
00:03:49,840 --> 00:03:51,720
Speaker 2: And I just don't think it's a good idea that

84
00:03:51,800 --> 00:03:54,120
Speaker 2: anybody actually says, oh, you know, because even if you

85
00:03:54,120 --> 00:03:56,080
Speaker 2: think about those guys as you were saying, Mitchell, the

86
00:03:56,120 --> 00:03:59,760
Speaker 2: other blokes in the room on tour, like, you know,

87
00:04:00,320 --> 00:04:02,320
Speaker 2: there's probably loads of them that would look at you

88
00:04:02,400 --> 00:04:04,320
Speaker 2: now and go, oh geez. I probably had a lot

89
00:04:04,360 --> 00:04:06,160
Speaker 2: of times where I was sitting in my room crying

90
00:04:06,200 --> 00:04:07,720
Speaker 2: by myself and didn't want to get a coffee with

91
00:04:07,760 --> 00:04:10,880
Speaker 2: the boys. But I didn't think that it was enough

92
00:04:11,480 --> 00:04:13,200
Speaker 2: to be able to say that I was depressed, and

93
00:04:13,200 --> 00:04:16,839
Speaker 2: then you tied in with that shocking concept of masculinity

94
00:04:16,839 --> 00:04:19,400
Speaker 2: where you're not good enough or you know, you're a silk.

95
00:04:20,040 --> 00:04:21,719
Speaker 2: If you are claiming that you're depressed, then you've got

96
00:04:21,760 --> 00:04:24,680
Speaker 2: a bit of a perfect storm because no matter how

97
00:04:25,200 --> 00:04:27,920
Speaker 2: small it is, it's big for you and that's kind

98
00:04:27,920 --> 00:04:28,479
Speaker 2: of all that matters.

99
00:04:28,560 --> 00:04:31,039
Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, I was really glad that I was able

100
00:04:31,040 --> 00:04:34,159
Speaker 1: to sort of do that. I still couldn't admit it

101
00:04:34,200 --> 00:04:37,560
Speaker 1: to myself at the time. Yeah, yeah, yeah, fress, but

102
00:04:38,440 --> 00:04:40,400
Speaker 1: it was still nice to be able to have those

103
00:04:40,440 --> 00:04:44,760
Speaker 1: conversations and hopefully, you know, me coming out and saying

104
00:04:45,240 --> 00:04:47,440
Speaker 1: that I have depression, that you know, we can keep

105
00:04:47,480 --> 00:04:48,880
Speaker 1: the conversation moving forward.

106
00:04:49,120 --> 00:04:50,040
Speaker 3: Yeah, And to be.

107
00:04:49,960 --> 00:04:52,159
Speaker 2: Honest, I reckon, it's really great that you're being so

108
00:04:52,200 --> 00:04:54,360
Speaker 2: open about all this. You're a key cog and one

109
00:04:54,360 --> 00:04:56,400
Speaker 2: of those people that are talking about exactly what they're

110
00:04:56,400 --> 00:04:58,320
Speaker 2: going through. It's awesome stuff. Stick around because there is

111
00:04:58,360 --> 00:04:59,920
Speaker 2: way more Mitchell Johnson right.

112
00:04:59,800 --> 00:05:02,600
Speaker 3: Up podcasting now.

113
00:05:02,839 --> 00:05:06,520
Speaker 2: All this November, we're doing important talks with influential, famous people,

114
00:05:06,600 --> 00:05:09,040
Speaker 2: people that are prepared to talk about what they're going

115
00:05:09,040 --> 00:05:11,479
Speaker 2: through with their mental health. And today we are joined

116
00:05:11,480 --> 00:05:15,359
Speaker 2: by cricketing legend Mitchell Johnson, who recently opened up about

117
00:05:15,360 --> 00:05:17,719
Speaker 2: his depression on sas well.

118
00:05:17,800 --> 00:05:21,680
Speaker 5: And what is more, don't I guess it's not too

119
00:05:21,720 --> 00:05:24,040
Speaker 5: late to sign up for November November dot com. If

120
00:05:24,040 --> 00:05:25,600
Speaker 5: you want to get involved, you can get involved in

121
00:05:25,600 --> 00:05:27,760
Speaker 5: all sorts of ways. It could be the most important

122
00:05:27,760 --> 00:05:30,679
Speaker 5: mo you will ever grow in. Every mow you grow

123
00:05:31,080 --> 00:05:34,760
Speaker 5: could save a bro. Now, Mitch, you were obviously incredibly

124
00:05:34,960 --> 00:05:38,119
Speaker 5: successful throughout your cricketing career. Can you just talk about

125
00:05:38,120 --> 00:05:40,440
Speaker 5: the relationship between because I think this, I think this

126
00:05:40,480 --> 00:05:41,320
Speaker 5: is going to be the case with you.

127
00:05:41,360 --> 00:05:42,320
Speaker 3: Please tell me if it's wrong.

128
00:05:42,720 --> 00:05:45,920
Speaker 2: But your high expectations are probably the reason why you succeeded, right,

129
00:05:46,880 --> 00:05:50,120
Speaker 2: But at the same time, your high expectations are probably

130
00:05:50,160 --> 00:05:51,320
Speaker 2: the reason for your undoing.

131
00:05:52,279 --> 00:05:54,120
Speaker 1: That's why I fail as well on thinking a lot

132
00:05:54,120 --> 00:05:57,920
Speaker 1: of things because the expectations they I've got that perfectionist

133
00:05:58,440 --> 00:06:01,680
Speaker 1: or I work extremely with my training. I did with

134
00:06:01,760 --> 00:06:07,359
Speaker 1: this six months of hard training, two sessions a day.

135
00:06:07,720 --> 00:06:12,360
Speaker 1: So yeah, the expectations of succeeding. I had my goals

136
00:06:12,400 --> 00:06:16,440
Speaker 1: set out. So yeah, when you do fail or think

137
00:06:16,440 --> 00:06:19,719
Speaker 1: that you fail, it hits you a lot harder. So

138
00:06:20,440 --> 00:06:23,480
Speaker 1: I really had nothing to prove. And I actually sat

139
00:06:23,520 --> 00:06:25,960
Speaker 1: down and spoke to my good friend at the MIL

140
00:06:26,040 --> 00:06:31,000
Speaker 1: Jim Nick, who's XSASX commander, who actually helped with the program,

141
00:06:31,080 --> 00:06:34,320
Speaker 1: and he sat down with me and he said he

142
00:06:34,360 --> 00:06:36,279
Speaker 1: was really proud of me for going on it because

143
00:06:36,560 --> 00:06:38,320
Speaker 1: he said, you didn't have to You didn't have to

144
00:06:38,320 --> 00:06:42,040
Speaker 1: go out there to prove anything. You've had an awesome career,

145
00:06:42,240 --> 00:06:44,760
Speaker 1: you've left on top, you've done this, you've done that.

146
00:06:45,320 --> 00:06:49,279
Speaker 1: You actually put yourself in a position where you could fail.

147
00:06:49,800 --> 00:06:53,200
Speaker 1: I guess in a lot of ways, And yeah, I

148
00:06:53,200 --> 00:06:57,279
Speaker 1: think it is. I've definitely struggled with that, especially early

149
00:06:57,320 --> 00:06:59,919
Speaker 1: on in my career with cricket was the perfection.

150
00:07:00,640 --> 00:07:03,160
Speaker 3: Yes, the only thing you've got. It's the only thing

151
00:07:03,200 --> 00:07:04,920
Speaker 3: that you know how to be happy as well.

152
00:07:05,000 --> 00:07:07,040
Speaker 2: So if you're not, if you're not reaching the expectation,

153
00:07:07,240 --> 00:07:09,520
Speaker 2: you missed the expectation, and then you've got no other

154
00:07:09,640 --> 00:07:12,280
Speaker 2: means of happiness that you're like, oh but I don't

155
00:07:12,280 --> 00:07:14,400
Speaker 2: get that. Then you've planned that. You haven't got a

156
00:07:14,400 --> 00:07:16,080
Speaker 2: plan B. Lots of guys haven't got a plan B.

157
00:07:16,240 --> 00:07:18,840
Speaker 2: They missed their self expectation and they go, well, shit,

158
00:07:18,960 --> 00:07:21,040
Speaker 2: that was it, and now.

159
00:07:22,040 --> 00:07:24,520
Speaker 1: Yeah, you're exactly right with what you're saying.

160
00:07:24,720 --> 00:07:27,000
Speaker 3: Yeah, you speak to a psychologist, now, don't you.

161
00:07:27,800 --> 00:07:28,040
Speaker 1: Yeah.

162
00:07:28,200 --> 00:07:31,760
Speaker 2: Okay, So, because this, I think is the number one

163
00:07:31,840 --> 00:07:35,840
Speaker 2: step which is just impossible for nearly every guy is

164
00:07:36,240 --> 00:07:38,920
Speaker 2: actually talking about, you know, admitting that you're failing and

165
00:07:38,960 --> 00:07:41,520
Speaker 2: you're not doing well and being vulnerable is walking into

166
00:07:41,520 --> 00:07:43,640
Speaker 2: a GP and actually saying to them, hey, look, I

167
00:07:43,760 --> 00:07:45,760
Speaker 2: can't handle this by myself. I need somebody else to

168
00:07:45,800 --> 00:07:49,040
Speaker 2: help me. Can you talk about how valuable that's been

169
00:07:49,080 --> 00:07:49,280
Speaker 2: for you?

170
00:07:50,320 --> 00:07:55,000
Speaker 1: Yeah, Look, it's been a massive process. And actually Jess

171
00:07:55,040 --> 00:07:57,400
Speaker 1: sort of suggested it to me. She could tell something

172
00:07:57,480 --> 00:08:00,160
Speaker 1: was going on and wasn't quite right, and so went

173
00:08:00,200 --> 00:08:03,960
Speaker 1: to the GP and went from there to a psychologist

174
00:08:04,000 --> 00:08:08,560
Speaker 1: and medication as well. I've been on that, but the

175
00:08:08,680 --> 00:08:11,800
Speaker 1: psychologist being able to sit down and find the right

176
00:08:11,840 --> 00:08:14,320
Speaker 1: person to talk to in the right environment is really

177
00:08:14,400 --> 00:08:17,560
Speaker 1: really important because we don't feel comfortable. I was actually

178
00:08:17,560 --> 00:08:20,720
Speaker 1: reading one of the directing staff from the SAS so

179
00:08:20,880 --> 00:08:25,280
Speaker 1: Foxy about his PDSD. He talks about that going through

180
00:08:25,640 --> 00:08:30,920
Speaker 1: different psychologists and trying to find the right one. What

181
00:08:31,040 --> 00:08:34,000
Speaker 1: worked exactly, and what worked for him was going for

182
00:08:34,120 --> 00:08:38,000
Speaker 1: long walks with his psychologists. They go for an hour

183
00:08:38,080 --> 00:08:41,000
Speaker 1: walk and just talking. It was him being outside in

184
00:08:41,040 --> 00:08:44,160
Speaker 1: the fresh air made him feel comfortable. So it's finding

185
00:08:44,200 --> 00:08:47,920
Speaker 1: the right right person, the right environment I think is

186
00:08:48,760 --> 00:08:51,800
Speaker 1: so important. But yeah, it feels so much better every

187
00:08:51,880 --> 00:08:55,640
Speaker 1: time I've gone in and spoken about my feelings and

188
00:08:55,679 --> 00:08:58,240
Speaker 1: how I'm going And if you can be as honest

189
00:08:58,240 --> 00:09:01,200
Speaker 1: as possible, it's the best that you can do.

190
00:09:01,480 --> 00:09:03,079
Speaker 3: And it's funny you were talking about that.

191
00:09:03,440 --> 00:09:06,080
Speaker 2: We were talking before about shoulder to shoulder exercises with

192
00:09:06,160 --> 00:09:09,160
Speaker 2: guys and that bloke working through PTSD. A lot of

193
00:09:09,160 --> 00:09:11,080
Speaker 2: guys struggle to look somebody in the face and tell

194
00:09:11,120 --> 00:09:13,319
Speaker 2: them how they're feeling. So if you've got a film

195
00:09:13,360 --> 00:09:15,560
Speaker 2: who you think struggling, Yeah, go for a walk, go

196
00:09:15,640 --> 00:09:18,200
Speaker 2: for a ride, go for a surf. You know, you

197
00:09:18,200 --> 00:09:19,440
Speaker 2: don't have to look them in the face to be

198
00:09:19,440 --> 00:09:21,720
Speaker 2: talking to them. And guys are weird like that. Often

199
00:09:21,760 --> 00:09:24,480
Speaker 2: we prefer to be not looking at someone to talk

200
00:09:24,520 --> 00:09:24,880
Speaker 2: to them.

201
00:09:25,559 --> 00:09:26,719
Speaker 3: But that's the way to go about it.

202
00:09:27,120 --> 00:09:30,680
Speaker 2: Mate, Thank you so much, invaluable, Like, honestly, I really

203
00:09:30,679 --> 00:09:32,559
Speaker 2: appreciate you coming on motalk and obviously one of the

204
00:09:32,600 --> 00:09:35,679
Speaker 2: best modes of all time. Oh yeah, It's a huge,

205
00:09:35,880 --> 00:09:36,600
Speaker 2: huge pass man.

206
00:09:36,679 --> 00:09:37,920
Speaker 4: I'm trying to grow on but it just was like

207
00:09:37,960 --> 00:09:41,719
Speaker 4: bum fluff now, Mitch, sorry mate, before you go. I'm

208
00:09:41,720 --> 00:09:43,760
Speaker 4: not sure if people know this, but we once starred

209
00:09:43,800 --> 00:09:48,199
Speaker 4: in a VB commercial together. It's where this fruit for

210
00:09:48,320 --> 00:09:53,360
Speaker 4: relationship started. Mitch, I do have a question for you.

211
00:09:53,679 --> 00:09:56,040
Speaker 4: Are you open to filming the sequel?

212
00:09:59,000 --> 00:10:02,120
Speaker 1: I goll but you still another beer on me? Yeah?

213
00:10:02,240 --> 00:10:04,000
Speaker 3: Yeah, I'll just pull a second beer. That's the sequel.

214
00:10:06,559 --> 00:10:07,480
Speaker 3: See what you're hearing.

215
00:10:07,640 --> 00:10:10,880
Speaker 5: Find us on Instagram and Facebook search Will and Woody