1 00:00:00,760 --> 00:00:05,320 Speaker 1: I have some bad news. No matter what you're working on, 2 00:00:05,920 --> 00:00:10,520 Speaker 1: you're going to procrastinate at some point, even if it's 3 00:00:10,560 --> 00:00:15,000 Speaker 1: a passion project. Nobody can work without breaks forever. So 4 00:00:16,000 --> 00:00:22,880 Speaker 1: why not build procrastination into the process right from the start. Singer, 5 00:00:23,040 --> 00:00:26,640 Speaker 1: songwriter and actor Eddie Perfect has been writing for more 6 00:00:26,640 --> 00:00:31,160 Speaker 1: than two decades now, and over the years, he's discovered 7 00:00:31,320 --> 00:00:33,920 Speaker 1: the wisdom behind an odd little tip from one of 8 00:00:34,040 --> 00:00:39,239 Speaker 1: musical theaters True Titans, Stephen Sondheim, the importance of writing 9 00:00:39,440 --> 00:00:47,960 Speaker 1: with a soft lead pencil. My name is doctor amanthe Immer. 10 00:00:48,320 --> 00:00:51,760 Speaker 1: I'm an organizational psychologist and the founder of behavioral science 11 00:00:51,800 --> 00:00:56,000 Speaker 1: consultancy Inventium. And this is How I Work, a show 12 00:00:56,120 --> 00:00:59,400 Speaker 1: about how to help you do your best work. On 13 00:00:59,560 --> 00:01:02,200 Speaker 1: today's It's my Favorite Tip episode, we go back to 14 00:01:02,280 --> 00:01:04,399 Speaker 1: an interview from the past and I pick out my 15 00:01:04,480 --> 00:01:08,720 Speaker 1: favorite tip from the interview. So before every How I 16 00:01:08,760 --> 00:01:12,280 Speaker 1: Work interview, my producer Liam does a pre interview with 17 00:01:12,520 --> 00:01:17,680 Speaker 1: my guest, and for this particular chat with Eddie, Liam 18 00:01:17,840 --> 00:01:21,759 Speaker 1: gave me the advice ask Eddie about the soft led 19 00:01:21,840 --> 00:01:24,959 Speaker 1: pencil reference from the late Stevens. Sometime. 20 00:01:26,319 --> 00:01:31,559 Speaker 2: Yeah, that's so, Stephen. Sometime on one of his many 21 00:01:31,600 --> 00:01:35,080 Speaker 2: tips about how to write lyrics. One of them was 22 00:01:35,120 --> 00:01:38,160 Speaker 2: always used like a soft lead pencil because they wear 23 00:01:38,200 --> 00:01:40,399 Speaker 2: out quicker and it means you have to sharpen them more. 24 00:01:41,520 --> 00:01:43,840 Speaker 2: And I love that bit of writing advice because what 25 00:01:43,959 --> 00:01:49,520 Speaker 2: that's basically saying is build procrastination into the process. Also, interestingly, 26 00:01:50,520 --> 00:01:54,640 Speaker 2: Sometime didn't sit at the piano and write lyrics. Once 27 00:01:54,640 --> 00:01:57,240 Speaker 2: he knew what his musical structure was. He would sit 28 00:01:57,320 --> 00:01:59,280 Speaker 2: on I think he had like a kind of a 29 00:01:59,320 --> 00:02:01,360 Speaker 2: couch that it was line on it with a board 30 00:02:01,440 --> 00:02:04,480 Speaker 2: that he put his piece of paper and he wrote 31 00:02:04,560 --> 00:02:08,000 Speaker 2: lyrics that way with a bit pencil and taking lots 32 00:02:08,000 --> 00:02:10,639 Speaker 2: of pauses to sharpen it, which is because the kind 33 00:02:10,639 --> 00:02:14,440 Speaker 2: of the breaks that are actually vitally important with writing. 34 00:02:14,480 --> 00:02:17,680 Speaker 2: You know, you can go on the most focused human 35 00:02:17,680 --> 00:02:19,560 Speaker 2: being in the world and I'm not going to I'm 36 00:02:19,560 --> 00:02:22,040 Speaker 2: not going to My attention is a steel trap that 37 00:02:22,080 --> 00:02:23,720 Speaker 2: I'm never going to turn off. I'm just going to 38 00:02:24,280 --> 00:02:28,200 Speaker 2: lock in on this thing. And that's great, but you 39 00:02:28,840 --> 00:02:32,080 Speaker 2: you know, you can't just be shooting at the bullseye 40 00:02:32,080 --> 00:02:33,960 Speaker 2: all the time. Sometimes you've got to walk away from 41 00:02:33,960 --> 00:02:36,560 Speaker 2: the target. And then and then these ideas just sort 42 00:02:36,560 --> 00:02:39,720 Speaker 2: of slip in walking, you know, without listening to music, 43 00:02:40,080 --> 00:02:43,760 Speaker 2: jogging without listening to music, you know, just not tackling 44 00:02:43,840 --> 00:02:47,080 Speaker 2: the problem, just the letting it sort of like just 45 00:02:47,160 --> 00:02:49,480 Speaker 2: letting the yeast rise a bit in your brain. That's 46 00:02:49,520 --> 00:02:54,800 Speaker 2: really important. And I do like separating out of all 47 00:02:54,840 --> 00:02:56,960 Speaker 2: this because you know, I write music and lyrics, and 48 00:02:57,280 --> 00:03:00,280 Speaker 2: often those jobs are done by two entirely different people 49 00:03:00,280 --> 00:03:04,320 Speaker 2: collaborating together. So I, you know, I have to find 50 00:03:04,360 --> 00:03:08,640 Speaker 2: ways to collaborate with myself. And sometimes that means I 51 00:03:08,760 --> 00:03:11,880 Speaker 2: just get my skateboard and my lyric book and I 52 00:03:11,919 --> 00:03:14,600 Speaker 2: go to a park bench and I just write. I 53 00:03:14,680 --> 00:03:16,560 Speaker 2: write lyrics, and I don't have any piano in front 54 00:03:16,600 --> 00:03:18,840 Speaker 2: of me, And so the music I hear is a 55 00:03:18,840 --> 00:03:22,080 Speaker 2: lot better because I'm musically, I'm a lot better in 56 00:03:22,120 --> 00:03:25,160 Speaker 2: my brain than I am in my actual real world. 57 00:03:25,800 --> 00:03:28,679 Speaker 2: My fingers when you go to play. When I go 58 00:03:28,760 --> 00:03:31,040 Speaker 2: to play a piano, i'd imagine that most people when 59 00:03:31,040 --> 00:03:34,160 Speaker 2: they go to play an instrument, you end up first. 60 00:03:35,120 --> 00:03:37,280 Speaker 2: The first things that happen are your habits. You know, 61 00:03:38,200 --> 00:03:40,040 Speaker 2: where do your hands go when you first play the piano? 62 00:03:40,040 --> 00:03:41,840 Speaker 2: Where do your hands go your first play guitar? Is 63 00:03:41,880 --> 00:03:44,600 Speaker 2: it a certain chord or a song that you know, 64 00:03:44,800 --> 00:03:46,880 Speaker 2: or a progression that you know that you like, and 65 00:03:46,920 --> 00:03:50,200 Speaker 2: then you know. So you're sitting right in your habit, 66 00:03:52,000 --> 00:03:54,160 Speaker 2: and so it takes a long time to play through 67 00:03:54,160 --> 00:03:57,760 Speaker 2: that and to find some original musical language that fits. 68 00:03:57,800 --> 00:03:59,840 Speaker 2: But there is no way of getting around it. You 69 00:04:00,080 --> 00:04:02,720 Speaker 2: have to go through that process. But if I'm just 70 00:04:02,760 --> 00:04:06,360 Speaker 2: writing lyrics and I just hear stuff, I can write 71 00:04:06,440 --> 00:04:07,920 Speaker 2: lyrics to what I hear in my head, and then 72 00:04:07,920 --> 00:04:11,080 Speaker 2: I can sing into my voice memo. And you know, 73 00:04:11,160 --> 00:04:13,760 Speaker 2: the music is complex and it's not there is no 74 00:04:14,400 --> 00:04:16,360 Speaker 2: habit to kind of get through. And then when I 75 00:04:16,400 --> 00:04:19,160 Speaker 2: get back to the piano, I try and honor that 76 00:04:19,920 --> 00:04:22,560 Speaker 2: musical inspiration and go straight for that. 77 00:04:23,400 --> 00:04:26,920 Speaker 1: If you enjoyed this excerpt from my chat with Eddie Perfect, 78 00:04:27,360 --> 00:04:30,119 Speaker 1: hop into the show notes and click on the link 79 00:04:30,200 --> 00:04:33,640 Speaker 1: to listen to the full interview. If you're looking for 80 00:04:33,800 --> 00:04:36,640 Speaker 1: more tips to improve the way that you work, I 81 00:04:36,680 --> 00:04:40,280 Speaker 1: write a short fortnightly newsletter that contains three cool things 82 00:04:40,320 --> 00:04:43,520 Speaker 1: that I've discovered that helped me work better, ranging from 83 00:04:43,800 --> 00:04:47,800 Speaker 1: software and gadgets that I'm loving through the interesting research findings. 84 00:04:48,120 --> 00:04:50,920 Speaker 1: You can sign up for that at Howiwork dot com, 85 00:04:51,279 --> 00:04:54,960 Speaker 1: That's how I Work dot co. Thank you for sharing 86 00:04:55,000 --> 00:04:57,159 Speaker 1: part of your day with me by listening to How 87 00:04:57,200 --> 00:04:59,839 Speaker 1: I Work. If you're keen for more tips on how 88 00:04:59,920 --> 00:05:03,960 Speaker 1: to work better, connect with me via LinkedIn or Instagram. 89 00:05:04,000 --> 00:05:07,520 Speaker 1: I'm very easy to find. Just search for Amantha Imba. 90 00:05:08,520 --> 00:05:11,760 Speaker 1: How I Work was recorded on the traditional land of 91 00:05:11,800 --> 00:05:15,240 Speaker 1: the Warrangery people, part of the Koln Nation. I am 92 00:05:15,279 --> 00:05:18,000 Speaker 1: so grateful for being able to work and live on 93 00:05:18,040 --> 00:05:20,960 Speaker 1: this beautiful land, and I want to pay my respects 94 00:05:21,000 --> 00:05:24,919 Speaker 1: to elders, past, present and emerging. How I Work is 95 00:05:25,000 --> 00:05:28,280 Speaker 1: produced by Inventium with production support from Dead Set Studios, 96 00:05:28,640 --> 00:05:30,679 Speaker 1: and thank you to Martin Nimba who did the audio 97 00:05:30,680 --> 00:05:34,000 Speaker 1: mix and makes everything sound better than it would have otherwise.