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Speaker 1: We know that our Northern Territory Police doing a phenomenal

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Speaker 1: jab under really difficult circumstances. I think you'd have to

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Speaker 1: say at this point in time, right across the Northern Territory.

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Speaker 1: I mean when you go across and read that story

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Speaker 1: in the Australian newspaper today and read about the fact

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Speaker 1: that these two teenage boys allegedly broke into the home

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Speaker 1: in Alice and what they did, but the fact that

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Speaker 1: they've got almost three hundred they've collectively been charged with

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Speaker 1: almost three hundred other offenses prior and bailed thirty five times.

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Speaker 1: It's got a lot of us seriously scratching our heads going,

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Speaker 1: how on earth are we in this situation? Now joining

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Speaker 1: me in the studio right now as the President of

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Speaker 1: the Northern Territory Police Association, Nathan Finn, Good morning, Finny.

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Speaker 2: Good morning, Katie, Good morning to your listeners.

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Speaker 1: First off, Phinnie, how are the Northern Territory Police in

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Speaker 1: Alae Springs at the moment?

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Speaker 2: Northern Territory Police are quite understandably frustrated. This We've seen

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Speaker 2: this time and time again. They're doing the best possible

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Speaker 2: job they can do with the best possible number of resource.

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Speaker 2: They've had for quite some time down Alice Springs. They

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Speaker 2: are trying the best possible thing to do. But this

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Speaker 2: conjecture about adf other police coming in the police are

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Speaker 2: doing their job, and quite rightfully, the community are outraged.

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Speaker 2: Outrage the people's significant criminal history, they continue to commit

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Speaker 2: further criminal crimes and the same nature. One criticism we

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Speaker 2: constantly hear is why haven't you locked them up? Well,

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Speaker 2: we have often more than one time, twice, three times,

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Speaker 2: ten times, and time and time again by the Northern

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Speaker 2: Territory Police putting back before the courts. This is not

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Speaker 2: a policing issue, Katie, Unfortunately, because the police bring them

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Speaker 2: to the court, then the court determines whether they get bail,

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Speaker 2: whether they continued on bail, or whether they're held in custody. Okay,

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Speaker 2: we've seen this on this occasion where this person is

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Speaker 2: committed nearly three hundred criminal offenses combined, the two of

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Speaker 2: them combined, They've had plenty of opportunities to rehabilitate their behavior.

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Speaker 2: It's clear that they're not and they're a dangerous to

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Speaker 2: the community. So why, and this is a question we

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Speaker 2: should be asking the judicial is why are they in

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Speaker 2: that situation? Whether they're on parole or they're on bail,

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Speaker 2: and they're in the community causing these types of offenses continuing.

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Speaker 1: Finny, are Northern Territory Police and I guess we've got

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Speaker 1: to be I'm assuming we've got to be slightly careful

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Speaker 1: what we say here, But are Northern Territory Police feeling

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Speaker 1: let down by the judicial system?

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Speaker 2: Guaranteed, Katie guaranteed, and the judicial system is letting this

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Speaker 2: situation down. We are constantly putting these people before the

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Speaker 2: courts as a constant cycle going through and putting them

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Speaker 2: before the court. They're getting released from the court, you're

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Speaker 2: getting at least from corrections, they're committing further offenses, and

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Speaker 2: we're putting them back before the court, sometimes the next day,

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Speaker 2: sometimes two days later, sometimes a week later. Sometimes it

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Speaker 2: takes a little bit longer from to reoffend. But they're reoffending.

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Speaker 2: So we need to ask the question why they are reoffending,

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Speaker 2: what rehabilitation they are receiving, if they are receiving any

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Speaker 2: real of rehabilitation, And clearly in this example, this person.

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Speaker 1: Has not PHINNI is that do you believe that that

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Speaker 1: is where things are breaking down at the moment. I

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Speaker 1: mean it's clear that there needs to be early intervention.

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Speaker 1: There needs to be some changes in this, you know,

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Speaker 1: in this whole situation. But right now, you know, with

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Speaker 1: some of the violent offending that we're seeing in Alice Springs.

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Speaker 1: You know, even the fact that this that this man

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Speaker 1: who allegedly then broke into a woman's home while she

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Speaker 1: slept and allegedly raped her. You know, we are being

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Speaker 1: we are reading now in the Australian that that man

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Speaker 1: was on a good behavior bond at the time.

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Speaker 2: Is this is that acceptable? Katie accept and the people

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Speaker 2: are outraged because they can put themselves in the same

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Speaker 2: situation as this lady with her baby. The community is

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Speaker 2: quite rightfully outraged that this is occurring. But we're calling

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Speaker 2: for a curfew an offense that occurred at two thirty

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Speaker 2: in the afternoon in a suburban street in Alice Springs.

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Speaker 2: A curfew is not going to fix this problem. That

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Speaker 2: we need strong action to be taken place where the

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Speaker 2: police actually provide that force back to the community to

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Speaker 2: enforce the laws that we need to enforce, such as

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Speaker 2: stolen motor vehicles being able to ram, these stolen motor

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Speaker 2: vehicles being able to take the amount of action before

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Speaker 2: they cause any further harm, to use non lethal ammunition

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Speaker 2: to target these people that continually show in the community

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Speaker 2: their disrespect for the community and disrespect for the people

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Speaker 2: within the community. If they can't be in the community

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Speaker 2: and behave in a proper manner, why are they in

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Speaker 2: the community? We ask that to the judicial system and

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Speaker 2: what are they doing about it to put these people

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Speaker 2: behind bars and protect our community.

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Speaker 1: I mean, do you think that part of their argument

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Speaker 1: might be that there's nowhere to put them. You know,

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Speaker 1: the jails are overflowing.

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Speaker 2: We will find place to put these people, Katie. If

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Speaker 2: the judicial system wants to put them in custody where

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Speaker 2: they belong. If they're going to continue these types offenses

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Speaker 2: towards our community members, they need to be incarcerated. And

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Speaker 2: there's no questions asked there.

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Speaker 1: Finny, yesterday morning, you know, I started to ask the question.

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Speaker 1: I know that other members of the community started to

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Speaker 1: ask the question. And it's in no way, shape or

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Speaker 1: form of criticism of the police, but whether the ADFF

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Speaker 1: defense do need to be in Alice Springs to help

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Speaker 1: you know, it's a bit of a stopgap to have

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Speaker 1: that presence on the streets to support our Northern Territory

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Speaker 1: Police by the sounds of it, you don't feel that

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Speaker 1: is the case.

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Speaker 2: Not currently, Katie, No, definitely not at the moment. The

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Speaker 2: Northern Territory Police has got this under control. Bringing in

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Speaker 2: the ADF again, what are the powers of the ADF.

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Speaker 2: What can they do in a civil undrest situation? Not

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Speaker 2: very much at all, but provide security and comfort to

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Speaker 2: the people of our springs that they've got some sort

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Speaker 2: of security mechanism in place. Again, as center Price we're

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Speaker 2: speaking about before, with the development, policing in the Northern

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Speaker 2: Territory is very different to any other jurisdiction right across Australia.

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Speaker 2: They need to be culturally sensitive to what's going on

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Speaker 2: and how we actually police in the Northern Territory. It's

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Speaker 2: a totally different ballgame to other states. But I agree

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Speaker 2: that there should be some training in that and we

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Speaker 2: should be able to call in some reserves as need

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Speaker 2: be on a case by case basis if we can't

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Speaker 2: get this under control. But we're doing everything we possibly

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Speaker 2: can and the government is supporting us. And to show

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Speaker 2: the disrespect like some people did in the community yesterday

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Speaker 2: and other springs towards the Chief Minister and not showing

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Speaker 2: that respect. They are doing everything they possibly can from

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Speaker 2: an inherited, broken US system that has let them down

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Speaker 2: and let the Northern Territory community down.

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Speaker 1: Finny, some people this morning might be asking have the

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Speaker 1: police got it under control? When we've seen what's unfolded

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Speaker 1: in the last week or so, over the last couple

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Speaker 1: of weeks, and you know, even the situation where that

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Speaker 1: poor officer has got a car load of you know

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Speaker 1: whoever stolen that vehicle driving at him while he's trying

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Speaker 1: to lay out tired tired deflation device. You know, what

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Speaker 1: do you say to those listening that feel like the

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Speaker 1: police don't have it under control?

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Speaker 2: We need better tools to actually deal with these situation.

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Speaker 2: It shouldn't be just returning to a lethal option for us.

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Speaker 2: There should be other options where we can actually target

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Speaker 2: this vehicle, have a Pittman never as they do in America,

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Speaker 2: they do it in Australia as well. We're train some

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Speaker 2: of our members are trained to undertake these dangerous actions. Again,

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Speaker 2: we need to have these options available to our members

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Speaker 2: and continue we see this. We're placed in a position

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Speaker 2: where we're on the back foot and these people are

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Speaker 2: showing a total disregard for the laws that we have

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Speaker 2: in place and for the police that actually protecting us

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Speaker 2: and obviously apprehending them for breaking the laws.

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Speaker 1: Finny, where to next? You know, from your perspective in

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Speaker 1: Alice Springs, do you feel as though what was announced yesterday?

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Speaker 1: Do the police that are on the ground feel as

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Speaker 1: though what was announced yesterday is enough?

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Speaker 2: I spoke to the Chief Minister in both the Commissioner

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Speaker 2: yesterday after their announcement, before their media announcement. Again they're

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Speaker 2: asking for extra police from Darwin. I had some concerns

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Speaker 2: with the police from Darwin, given that we're coming into

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Speaker 2: a Christmas period. A number of people come into these

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Speaker 2: major centers throughout the Northern Territory, not just Alice Springs.

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Speaker 2: It's Darwin, it's Catherine, it's Tannet Creek. They come in

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Speaker 2: to do their shopping and everything else. And the trouble

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Speaker 2: that issues from that alone, it's not a solution long

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Speaker 2: term that we need. We need additional backup numbers and

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Speaker 2: sustainable numbers in our springs. Actually, we can't just keep

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Speaker 2: putting your members down and taking them from Darwin where

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Speaker 2: we need the resource as well.

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Speaker 1: And look, I guess that's where that discussion comes, you know,

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Speaker 1: in terms of whether the Federal Police or someone else

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Speaker 1: can help, or even South Australian Police or someone else

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Speaker 1: can help.

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Speaker 2: I'd love to say that our other jurisdictions are interstate

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Speaker 2: and across the country could help, but they're in a

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Speaker 2: very similar situation Catie. And this is not unknown just

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Speaker 2: to the Northern Territory, New South Wales police are down

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Speaker 2: nearly three thousand police when we're talking about that in

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Speaker 2: alone in itself, when we've got a police force of

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Speaker 2: ourselves of seventeen hundred and fifty currently at the moment,

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Speaker 2: we're seeing the highest number of police in the Northern Territory.

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Speaker 2: We have the highest number of police per population in Australia.

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Speaker 2: We have the highest crime rate in Australia as well,

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Speaker 2: and that's indicative of why we've got the policing numbers.

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Speaker 1: I mean even overnight finning early this morning in Catherine.

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Speaker 1: Then there's a situation where there's been another terrible, bloody

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Speaker 1: home invasion where two blokes have allegedly been stabbed, you know, like.

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Speaker 2: It's just it's graceful, yeah, And the amount of time

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Speaker 2: that this is going to revert into someone actually dying

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Speaker 2: because of this behavior. And I hope it's not the

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Speaker 2: victim in this matter that actually passes away because of

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Speaker 2: this behavior. It's actually one of these offenders that actually

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Speaker 2: get them.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, do you worry about you know, what might happen

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Speaker 1: in terms of, you know, how like if someone breaks

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Speaker 1: into someone's house, how you know the victim may react

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Speaker 1: and what that might sort of lead to. Because I

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Speaker 1: feel like, you know, we almost need to be calling

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Speaker 1: for calm at the moment in some ways, because people

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Speaker 1: are getting like that anger is boiling, and even from me,

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Speaker 1: you know, like I can feel it myself that I'm

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Speaker 1: getting really angry about some of the absolute bs that

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Speaker 1: we're seeing.

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Speaker 2: O Katie, that's reported right across the community that they

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Speaker 2: are frustrated. And if I was the father of that

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Speaker 2: young child that God and Allie springs, I'd be absolutely devastated.

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Speaker 2: And I can guarantee you these offenders wouldn't be leaving

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Speaker 2: my house. And that's where we're getting to. And unfortunately

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Speaker 2: the police can't be in every street or every house

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Speaker 2: to stop this from happening. We can do the best

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Speaker 2: we possibly can with the re sources we've currently got,

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Speaker 2: and they are, Katie, I can honestly say with hand

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Speaker 2: on heart that our police officers are the best in

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Speaker 2: the country, will continue to do the best possible job

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Speaker 2: they can to protect their community, and they always will.

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Speaker 2: They'll put their life on the line every single day.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I know, I know they will, and I mean

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Speaker 1: they are at the moment like they literally are in

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Speaker 1: some cases. You know, even earlier in the week, like

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Speaker 1: you and I had spoken about having a car driven

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Speaker 1: at one of those officers. Is appalling, Finny, just a

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Speaker 1: quick one. Somebody's just emailed through or messaged through and said,

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Speaker 1: do we have enough officers in Catherine? Following on from

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Speaker 1: you know, those incidents or that one incident that I'd

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Speaker 1: spoken to about, but also there was others by the

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Speaker 1: sounds of things, I.

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Speaker 2: Can answer, honestly, Katie, No, we don't have enough officers

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Speaker 2: in Catherine. This has been raised early in the week

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Speaker 2: with the Commission as well. I've been looking at emergency

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Speaker 2: rostering provisions to fill their roster. They haven't got enough

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Speaker 2: resources in Catherine to do the job they need to do.

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Speaker 1: Unfortunately, goodness May it is like it's a bloody difficult situation.

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Speaker 2: Right gets lots of attention. It's right across the Northern Territory, Katy,

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Speaker 2: who were seeing this type of behavior and continually dealing

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Speaker 2: with people that have no real consequences for their behavior.

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Speaker 1: Yep.

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Speaker 2: We're asking the judicial system to step up impose this

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Speaker 2: serious consequences for their behavior, and we can't do that

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Speaker 2: without their support. We can continually put them before the court,

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Speaker 2: but they need to deal with them and deal with

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Speaker 2: them appropriately.

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Speaker 1: Nathan Finn, President of the Northern Territory Police Association, always

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Speaker 1: appreciate your time.

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Speaker 2: Thank you, Katie, and thank you to the men and

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Speaker 2: women in blue out there that continue to put their

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Speaker 2: lives online and we truly appreciate that the Northern Territory

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Speaker 2: community appreciates that as well.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, Finny, thank you. We'll talk to you again very soon.