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Speaker 1: There's nothing really significant about the name Bernice Borden. Probably

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Speaker 1: most people outside of the realm of maybe true crime

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Speaker 1: nerds would actually know that name. But let me tell

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Speaker 1: you about Bernice Warden. Bernice Warden was a store owner

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Speaker 1: in a little out of the way place in the

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Speaker 1: Upper Midwest and Wisconsin, specifically called Plainfield. You know, the

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Speaker 1: name of that town kind of common in and of itself,

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Speaker 1: Like Bernice's name is not something that would really make

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Speaker 1: you stand up and take notice. But what happened in Plainfield, Wisconsin,

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Speaker 1: back in the fifties rock the world at that moment, Tom,

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Speaker 1: because that's where another person lived by the name of

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Speaker 1: ed Geen. Now, the way Bernice plays into what I'm

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Speaker 1: trying to tell you is that she was actually the

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Speaker 1: last victim of ed Geen, and when she was discovered

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Speaker 1: by the police, she was hanging by her feet and

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Speaker 1: what's referred to as the deershed on ed Gean's property.

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Speaker 1: She had been eviscerated and beheaded. You said, Morgan, why

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Speaker 1: are you talking about this right now? Well, here's the reason.

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Speaker 1: Because in order to suspend Benice Borden's body within a

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Speaker 1: fixed structure, you have to have something called a hard point.

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Speaker 1: And in today's discussion, we're going to talk about some

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Speaker 1: documents that were covered allegedly by the police at the

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Speaker 1: home and within the electronic devices of rex Huremant. And

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Speaker 1: guess what the term hard point is mentioned in those

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Speaker 1: documents as well. I am Joseph Scott Morgan and this

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Speaker 1: is body bags. Well, Dave, here we sit where I

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Speaker 1: don't know how many days ago I guess roughly seven

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Speaker 1: maybe seven days five five seven days ago when these

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Speaker 1: documents were released by the prosecutor's office.

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Speaker 2: Great Tierney, Yeah, journey is all about getting this information

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Speaker 2: out to the boy he is.

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Speaker 1: He wants everybody to hear it. I mean, and look,

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Speaker 1: it's it's been a long time coming. And listen, let

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Speaker 1: me a word of warning here, be very careful out

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Speaker 1: there in the general public for people that want knowledge

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Speaker 1: about this case, be very very careful of what you're

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Speaker 1: asking about this.

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Speaker 2: I think I had combat pay coming after this horrible.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it is horrible when when you think about, you know,

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Speaker 1: the alleged depravity here. And can I go back to

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Speaker 1: that term real quick hard point. I did a little

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Speaker 1: digging in addition to having at least some peripheral experience

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Speaker 1: with field dressing animals, and certainly my experience of working

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Speaker 1: in the morgue. You know, my Papa used to refer

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Speaker 1: to the skinning, the cleaning or field dressing of a

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Speaker 1: deer as trusting a deer up. And that's that's what

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Speaker 1: he would and he trusts hogs up and all that

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Speaker 1: sort of stuff. The fact that there are also practices

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Speaker 1: out there in the world in which we dwell involving

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Speaker 1: certain sexual practices that involve hard points, that is, where

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Speaker 1: people are involved in things like bondage and suspension. And

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Speaker 1: I didn't realize that suspension is it is a complete

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Speaker 1: and total compartmentalized sexual practice, if you will, and it

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Speaker 1: bends toward toward BDSM, torture, simulated torture, those sorts of things.

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Speaker 1: Control is what it comes down to. And we hear

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Speaker 1: that again. Here's that word again. I always use. It's

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Speaker 1: kind of wrote at this point, but yeah, control And

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Speaker 1: the fact that rex Huermann allegedly has annotate that word

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Speaker 1: in these notes. Now keep in mind he's an architect too,

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Speaker 1: but and you would think that he would be familiar

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Speaker 1: with building terms like that, because there are, in fact,

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Speaker 1: if you have a huge vaulted ceiling. Perhaps you have

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Speaker 1: a hard point hard point contact up there you're going

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Speaker 1: to suspend something from like maybe a big chandelier. But Dave,

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Speaker 1: I gotta tell you, I don't think this is in

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Speaker 1: reference to suspension of lighting fixtures in a home.

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Speaker 2: You know, the thing that we deal with with Rex

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Speaker 2: Huerman Joe. And it goes back to why the Suffolk

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Speaker 2: County DA Ray Tierney has been very public with the findings.

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Speaker 2: It's not so much that it's salacious and gets in

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Speaker 2: boats or money or whatever. It's because there is so

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Speaker 2: much And I was thinking about this after we did

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Speaker 2: the the episode last week covering that there have been

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Speaker 2: another search warrant executed and this is what they found

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Speaker 2: because we did a pretty big overview and he was

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Speaker 2: charged with two additional murders. So now it's not the

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Speaker 2: gill Go four, it's the gilg six. And now we

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Speaker 2: have another a dumping ground as well. So what they're doing,

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Speaker 2: the Prosecutor's Office is doing, I believe, disseminating information to

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Speaker 2: the public so that it is not like Nancy Gray

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Speaker 2: says on the show, drinking out of a fire hose,

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Speaker 2: that people can actually get the information and realize what

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Speaker 2: we're dealing with here is a real mentally disturbed, psychological

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Speaker 2: serial murderer that may have been capable of doing all

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Speaker 2: the murders or just the ones he's charged with in

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Speaker 2: terms of Gilgo Beach and beyond.

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Speaker 1: Hey, let me let me ask you a question real quick, David.

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Speaker 1: You know, with my background in forensics and be an

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Speaker 1: investigator and now a professor of forensics at Jacksonville State,

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Speaker 1: do you know that I've been disqualified from jury duty

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Speaker 1: on multiple occasions, and because I'd always get called I'd

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Speaker 1: always get called up on some kind of criminal thing,

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Speaker 1: you know. I always want to serve on a jury.

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Speaker 1: I was like, look, just give me a divorce case.

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Speaker 1: I don't care. I just want to be on a

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Speaker 1: jury to say that I've been on a jury all

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Speaker 1: right now. I know people are grimacing probably out there,

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Speaker 1: but look, I think it's a great It's one of

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Speaker 1: the privileges, okay, that we have as Americans, and I'd

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Speaker 1: always wanted to do it, but you know, fortune hasn't

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Speaker 1: shined on me at this point. However, I want to

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Speaker 1: ask you this question, what what do you think? What

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Speaker 1: do you think about the release of this volume of information,

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Speaker 1: this kind of detailed information. If if in fact you

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Speaker 1: were a resident of that area and you were potentially

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Speaker 1: in that juror pool, that pool of potential jurors, do

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Speaker 1: you do you think you know it was a citizen?

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Speaker 1: Do you with that Inflo? Are you going? I mean,

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Speaker 1: if you live up there, I would assume you're going

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Speaker 1: to go to your new source and and look at this?

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Speaker 1: Is it hard? I mean we've heard this, not just

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Speaker 1: with this, but you know, Idaho has been talked about

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Speaker 1: extensively relatively how many.

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Speaker 2: Big crimes are coming out of that area of the

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Speaker 2: country right now? Joe, think about it. I didn't even

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Speaker 2: know where Moscow, Idaho is. I didn't know where Washington

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Speaker 2: State was in Poland. I mean, I didn't know this.

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Speaker 2: And now we've got right now, we've got a student

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Speaker 2: at Washington State that was going through Moscow and the

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Speaker 2: pullman that they took off with the child. You know,

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Speaker 2: we've got a you know, we've there are all kinds

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Speaker 2: of crazy crimes taking place in that in that area

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Speaker 2: right now, right right and before that, you know, what

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Speaker 2: do we have? We had Ballo and Davel But as

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Speaker 2: you mentioned with this one with Rex Huerman, I wonder

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Speaker 2: what value it has to release so much information all

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Speaker 2: this early on in the investigative process, because if you're

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Speaker 2: a potential jury, if you're going to be seated, is

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Speaker 2: it a warning salvo of all of the stuff you're

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Speaker 2: going to deal with?

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Speaker 1: Or Wow, I hadn't thought about that, but you know,

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Speaker 1: because you know, when you were first speaking in our

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Speaker 1: in kind of our open there, you had mentioned kind

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Speaker 1: of letting this out, you know, use the the you

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Speaker 1: know the comment they always you know, drinking of a

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Speaker 1: fire hose, Dave dripp, slow down, You're just this this

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Speaker 1: is essentially drip grip. Yeah. It really makes me wonder

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Speaker 1: because there's other people that have also wondered this. How

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Speaker 1: many more? Yeah? And I think that that, Oh my lord,

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Speaker 1: you and I.

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Speaker 2: Had many others that we have relationships with in this

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Speaker 2: world of crime news reporting, and you even on a

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Speaker 2: different level from an investigation standpoint, Joe, there is no

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Speaker 2: way this man killed for a brief period of time

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Speaker 2: and dumped in that one. And they're proving it now.

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Speaker 2: They're absolutely laying it out there. He didn't just kill

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Speaker 2: between twenty ten and twenty thirteen and the bodies of

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Speaker 2: found ten years later or or you know, just that

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Speaker 2: thea that he has been out at ten years later,

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Speaker 2: we now were going back to the early nineties, and

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Speaker 2: I think they're laying this out there so people can

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Speaker 2: start to absorb the fact that this guy was killing

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Speaker 2: for decades, and I think they might have the look

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Speaker 2: we're looking. Well, we'll break it down in a minute,

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Speaker 2: but right right, Joe, let me ask you this because

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Speaker 2: you sent this to me after we did the last show.

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Speaker 2: You and Kim were talking about it, and you had

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Speaker 2: three major things and I got to ask you about

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Speaker 2: this because number one, what compelled the police to go

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Speaker 2: back to the scene. It's not like they didn't already

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Speaker 2: go through rex Hueman's house and we saw because remember

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Speaker 2: the attorney's posted pictures of the damage left behind by

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Speaker 2: the police. And I'm thinking that that really ticked me

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Speaker 2: off because I'm thinking, what about the families who have

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Speaker 2: missing loved ones that this guy was the last person

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Speaker 2: known to be with them, And you're worried about your

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Speaker 2: sink being torn up. They're looking for my loved ones,

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Speaker 2: part of her tooth. Okay, that's what they're trying to

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Speaker 2: find in your home right now. But anyway, this is

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Speaker 2: a home that his wife. His children still occupy. The

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Speaker 2: adult children, one I think is special needs, but they

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Speaker 2: have a daughter that's not special needs. Two adult children,

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Speaker 2: and they're in this home that you described as quite

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Speaker 2: a bit of a dump compared to the other houses

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Speaker 2: in the neighborhood.

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Speaker 1: Oh my lord. Yeah. And it's not a this is

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Speaker 1: not just so that people, you know, because standing there

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Speaker 1: in like real time, deserving this place. It's a it's

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Speaker 1: just kind of a standard ranch, you know, like a

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Speaker 1: sixty style ranch home. And you know, when you begin

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Speaker 1: to discuss or consider the police going back out there, right,

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Speaker 1: what other whatether the locations are you sifting through out there?

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Speaker 1: And also, this is another thing that I've wondered, Dave.

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Speaker 1: And the other day we were on one episode, forgive me,

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Speaker 1: I can't remember which one, but we were actually discussing

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Speaker 1: I don't know if it was with you, No, I

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Speaker 1: can't recall they it piles up after a while, but

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Speaker 1: we were talking about getting warrants to search locations because

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Speaker 1: even if they're even if you've got a dead body

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Speaker 1: in the house, once you've established a person is dead,

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Speaker 1: you have to back out of the house, wait for

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Speaker 1: a warrant, and then come back, Dave, do you think

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Speaker 1: do you think they got in there? Initially began and

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Speaker 1: in their warrant it did not include certain areas or

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Speaker 1: certain things in that house. And they went back to

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Speaker 1: a magistrate or someone and said, you know what, we

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Speaker 1: need to detail this out a little more and perhaps

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Speaker 1: make this warrant a bit a bit more robust. And

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Speaker 1: that was just the initial thought that I had. Are

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Speaker 1: they still working on the initial warrant where they had

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Speaker 1: listed all of these things that places that were going

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Speaker 1: to search, things that were going to search for. And

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Speaker 1: the thing about things you're going to search for in

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Speaker 1: a warrant, you never know what you're going to find,

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Speaker 1: you know, ergo, that's the purpose of a warrant. You know,

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Speaker 1: you suspect that things are going to be there.

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Speaker 2: Most of you listening are crime sophisticated. You followed crimes

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Speaker 2: and you know how they roll out. But a lot

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Speaker 2: of people don't realize until recently from shows like ours,

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Speaker 2: what a search warrant does, what it tells people like

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Speaker 2: you and me, because when they become public, we can

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Speaker 2: look at what the police what they're thinking is what

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Speaker 2: the investigators have found that leads them to believe other

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Speaker 2: evidence will be found in this location, which is what

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Speaker 2: you're making the point of what did they find that

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Speaker 2: they couldn't do anything with last time, Because as you say,

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Speaker 2: it's that fruit of the poison tree. If while they're

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Speaker 2: in there they see something in the corner that they

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Speaker 2: didn't expect to see, didn't know was there, they cannot

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Speaker 2: remove it. They've got to leave it sitting there and

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Speaker 2: pray that they can get a warrant to go back

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Speaker 2: and hope that the people living in this house don't

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Speaker 2: find it and remove it. Remove it first. There's a

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Speaker 2: lot of gamesmanship that goes into this.

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Speaker 1: Oh there is, there is, and there's there's so many

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Speaker 1: court cases that are out there day we go from

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Speaker 1: every semester in my class is relative to evidence, and

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Speaker 1: you know that. Here's the thing is that when you

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Speaker 1: you can, you have to have a plan before you

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Speaker 1: walk through that door. Because you mentioned this idea of

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Speaker 1: the fruit of the poison tree, and there's a number

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Speaker 1: of ways that can be interpreted. But I love the

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Speaker 1: term hidden spaces. So if if you get into a

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Speaker 1: location and a hidden particular space is not accounted for,

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Speaker 1: like maybe something that's behind a retaining wall that was

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Speaker 1: hidden a burial space, a rat hole and rat holes

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Speaker 1: of general line term that we used many times to

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Speaker 1: talk about people that we will store things away, particularly

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Speaker 1: when it comes to serial perpetrators, so they can go

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Speaker 1: back and relive these events vividly. They're holding on to

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Speaker 1: these items, and there might be an indication that he

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Speaker 1: was a collector in a sense, but the thoroughness of

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Speaker 1: his list that he created, and I know it sound

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Speaker 1: like I'm bouncing all over the board, but I got

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Speaker 1: to tell you this kind of drawing the curtain down

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Speaker 1: on the segment. I was on air two nights ago

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Speaker 1: with doctor Gary Briccado. And I don't know if you

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Speaker 1: know Gary or not, Dave, but he's he is a

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Speaker 1: forensic psychiatrist or a psychologist and very bright dude. I've

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Speaker 1: been on with him a lot on Core TV. And

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Speaker 1: you know, he said something really striking. He was like

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Speaker 1: in a segment before me and I was sitting there

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Speaker 1: and you sit there in front of the monitor, you

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Speaker 1: got your earpiece and you're just waiting, you know, you're

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Speaker 1: waiting for your turn. And I was sitting there listening

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Speaker 1: to Gary talk and Gary said that he said, you know,

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Speaker 1: Hureman a paraphrasing Hureman is almost something from the past.

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Speaker 1: He said, when he started allegedly all those years ago,

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Speaker 1: there wasn't there weren't phones, there was no surveillance. There,

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Speaker 1: there was very little CCTV, and if you did have it,

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Speaker 1: it didn't work and you had to go to very

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Speaker 1: specific locations for that. He started allegedly in that world,

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Speaker 1: and he kind of straddled time here where we were

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Speaker 1: at the end with all of those infamous serial killers

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Speaker 1: that came out of the seventies and the eighties that

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Speaker 1: were in not so technologically sophisticated times, and all of

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Speaker 1: a sudden he breached over into the modern era. And

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Speaker 1: it did interesting the tools that we now possess might

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Speaker 1: lead to a conviction of a case that occurred decades

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Speaker 1: and decades ago. I watch all of these things that

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Speaker 1: you see in Instagram, these little reels I think they're called,

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Speaker 1: where they'll have these, you know, these kind of life

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Speaker 1: advice things. There's always things like what the stoics said

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Speaker 1: about life, and then there's things if you want to

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Speaker 1: be successful, do these following steps. And one of the

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Speaker 1: things that you consistently see in there is making a

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Speaker 1: list of the things you're going to do that day,

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Speaker 1: and you check them off as you go through it,

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Speaker 1: and it keeps you focus on a task, It keeps

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Speaker 1: you orient it to the direction that you want to go,

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Speaker 1: which is success hopefully, and it holds you accountable throughout

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Speaker 1: the day. I got ten points that I'm going to

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Speaker 1: accomplish today. I'm getting this one, this one, this one,

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Speaker 1: this one, this one, this one knocked out. You know,

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Speaker 1: for every positive image, there's a negative image. You think

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Speaker 1: about this list that they have acquired, Dave to the

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Speaker 1: negative here when it comes to Hureman. I wonder how

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Speaker 1: long they've been in possession of this thing, because Dave,

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Speaker 1: I don't know if you're if you like pirate movies.

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Speaker 1: My friend the history guy that I watch his stuff

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Speaker 1: on YouTube all the time. He says, he says, all

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Speaker 1: great stories involve historical pirates.

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Speaker 2: And.

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Speaker 1: This is like a pirate map. It's almost like a trail,

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Speaker 1: you know, where you can follow what he's doing. And

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Speaker 1: it is. It's the stuff that of nightmares. It certainly is.

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Speaker 1: And I wonder how long they've had it.

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Speaker 2: I wonder how long how long they were putting this

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Speaker 2: case together, Joe, because I mentioned earlier you and I've

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Speaker 2: covered this a lot over the last several years. This

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Speaker 2: story was because of a couple of things we had.

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Speaker 2: Now you mentioned how Huberman kind of crossed over a

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Speaker 2: time when we didn't here they have cell phones, and

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Speaker 2: we certainly didn't have security at our house, like ring doorbells.

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Speaker 2: And now if you drive down my street, chances are

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Speaker 2: somebody we're gonna be able to track you from the

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Speaker 2: top of the hill down to the bottom and know

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Speaker 2: which house you went into it and what time you left,

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Speaker 2: even if it's in the middle of the night and

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Speaker 2: nobody's awake. But when he started, it was just like

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Speaker 2: when we were kids, you know, and the lights go

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Speaker 2: out and the kids go home. And so I'm curious

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Speaker 2: with regard to the police and how they were able

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Speaker 2: to pull it all together, because we have had out

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Speaker 2: there at Ylgo Beach. The They've applied a couple of

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Speaker 2: different names to that, the Long Island serial killer, the

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Speaker 2: Gilgo Beach killer, because it didn't appear to be one person.

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Speaker 2: It appeared that there was more than one person using

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Speaker 2: this area.

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Speaker 1: I'm the defense of them, David. I got to say,

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Speaker 1: I don't think that anybody, anybody in the right mind

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Speaker 1: would think we've had this much butchery going on over

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Speaker 1: this period of time, and it's at the hand of

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Speaker 1: a singular person, right, I mean, you know who, you know.

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Speaker 1: You think that there's like a hit squad that's out there,

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Speaker 1: you know, But but who's going to go out? And

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Speaker 1: I think every single and this is a key that

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Speaker 1: was found on the list, Dave. I think it was

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Speaker 1: the term small or petite, and he makes reference this

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Speaker 1: is good, right, and I'm paraphrasing that, but I'm just

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Speaker 1: kind of talking about this off the top of my

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Speaker 1: head that what's being implied here is that the smaller

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Speaker 1: the victim, the better it is for him in order

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Speaker 1: to manage them. And that sort of thing where he's

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Speaker 1: identified this.

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Speaker 2: He wrote these things down just like a shopping list,

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Speaker 2: you know, of what you need to if you were

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Speaker 2: describing what am I going to coach the kids today

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Speaker 2: in a little league at football?

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Speaker 1: What have you? Soccer?

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Speaker 2: And we need to learn defensive offense, we need to

342
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Speaker 2: learn certain plays. That's how his mind worked. Only his

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Speaker 2: game was death. His game was destruction of a human

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Speaker 2: body and getting his jollys in any way he felt

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Speaker 2: like he could. It was a mesmerizing thing. But take

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Speaker 2: a look at this some of the items recovered from

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Speaker 2: Yureman's home. Fifteen different types of cameras, twenty seven computers.

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Speaker 2: I want to point out, Joe, these were items recovered

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Speaker 2: from his home, not his office. When I first looked

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Speaker 2: at this list, I thought this was the accumulative list

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Speaker 2: of all the things they had found, because he does

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Speaker 2: have an office in Manhattan. He's got an architect's office,

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Speaker 2: so uh, this is from his The man had twenty

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Speaker 2: seven computers in his home, Joe, he had over thirty

355
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Speaker 2: hard drives, forty six cell phones, nine routers, seventeen tablets

356
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Speaker 2: to forty two USB drives, eight laptops again, twenty seven computers,

357
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Speaker 2: eight laptops, seventeen tablets. These are all things that get online.

358
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Speaker 2: Not to mention the for the forty six cell phones,

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Speaker 2: you've got fifteen hotel cards for GPS, thirty six SIM cards,

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Speaker 2: and six one hundred and forty CD floppy discs and tapes.

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Speaker 1: I like how you put floppy disc in question all caps, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: question mark, question mark, exclamation port.

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Speaker 2: What the heck? Six hundred and forty Yeah, I don't

364
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Speaker 2: think I've ever owned that many in my life.

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Speaker 1: No, Well, in particular focus on floppy discs for a second.

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Speaker 1: You're in the wayback machine, now, yeah, yeah, exactly. You know,

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Speaker 1: when you're still using a cartridge like that. Uh and

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Speaker 1: I know that a computer person will get me on that,

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Speaker 1: but you know a disc that you're having to insert,

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Speaker 1: and he had there's data contained on there how far back?

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Speaker 1: And you know, and then you begin to think about,

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Speaker 1: you know, what's contained in all this and with with

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Speaker 1: the serial perpetrators like this, it's not just a matter

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Speaker 1: of butchering these women, which he did, and we can

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Speaker 1: get into that allegedly you know where he's taking them

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Speaker 1: apart in order, you would think, seemingly to dispose the bodies.

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Speaker 1: We've talked about this before in our in our long

378
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Speaker 1: in our in our long continuing conversation regarding dismemberments in

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Speaker 1: our country. You begin to think about, well, was he

380
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Speaker 1: dismembering them to facilitate easy disposal or was it something else?

381
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Speaker 1: And we'll come back to that in a moment. But

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Speaker 1: just I can't I don't know that I can begin

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Speaker 1: to try to appreciate what's contained on just those drives

384
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Speaker 1: where he's saving these things, which is amazing to me,

385
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Speaker 1: and There's one more thing that's really troubling that I

386
00:24:23,160 --> 00:24:26,400
Speaker 1: think that it's really foolish for him to have retained

387
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Speaker 1: if he is involved in all of this, the hotel cards.

388
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Speaker 1: For years, they've told us, once you get a hotel card,

389
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Speaker 1: don't give it back to the desk. Take it, cut

390
00:24:39,200 --> 00:24:42,640
Speaker 1: it up, you know, take it apart, because that thing

391
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Speaker 1: has information on there relative to you and your stay there.

392
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Speaker 1: So and I wonder, well, I don't really know a

393
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Speaker 1: lot about computer forensics or digital forensics, but I'm really

394
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Speaker 1: wondering could he have held on to those and that

395
00:24:56,800 --> 00:24:59,480
Speaker 1: would put him in a specific location, even if he's

396
00:24:59,600 --> 00:25:04,240
Speaker 1: under unassumed name, where he's trying to ghost somebody out

397
00:25:04,240 --> 00:25:09,960
Speaker 1: there and bringing in one of these women to that location,

398
00:25:10,200 --> 00:25:14,840
Speaker 1: maybe approximating at the same time they disappeared. Those cards

399
00:25:14,880 --> 00:25:16,520
Speaker 1: in and of themselves, I think are going to have

400
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Speaker 1: some level of value to them.

401
00:25:18,200 --> 00:25:20,439
Speaker 2: I'm freaking out now, Joe, because it never occurred to

402
00:25:20,440 --> 00:25:25,160
Speaker 2: me about the car. I kind of just thought, why

403
00:25:25,160 --> 00:25:27,440
Speaker 2: does he have those? But I didn't think about it

404
00:25:27,720 --> 00:25:30,520
Speaker 2: that when we were just at crime con. Yeah, and

405
00:25:31,080 --> 00:25:34,639
Speaker 2: all the information that was taken him by my card,

406
00:25:35,160 --> 00:25:39,040
Speaker 2: I didn't realize I need to go find what I

407
00:25:39,080 --> 00:25:42,280
Speaker 2: did with those and cut him up. Yeah, all right,

408
00:25:42,320 --> 00:25:44,520
Speaker 2: but getting back to this really quickly, there was something.

409
00:25:45,280 --> 00:25:48,800
Speaker 2: Every time we peeled this onion, it's getting bigger, not smallways.

410
00:25:49,160 --> 00:25:52,800
Speaker 2: Every layer opens up ten more. Now, one of the

411
00:25:52,800 --> 00:25:55,639
Speaker 2: things that we mentioned briefly because we had been told

412
00:25:55,800 --> 00:25:59,919
Speaker 2: it was there, and it's a document that was just

413
00:26:00,040 --> 00:26:03,560
Speaker 2: covered on a laptop, and it's a word document that

414
00:26:03,720 --> 00:26:08,480
Speaker 2: goes back to two thousand, the year two thousand, nearly

415
00:26:08,560 --> 00:26:12,560
Speaker 2: a quarter of a century ago. Now think about this

416
00:26:12,640 --> 00:26:16,840
Speaker 2: for just a minute. In two thousand, what were you doing,

417
00:26:16,920 --> 00:26:19,120
Speaker 2: where were you working, who were you involved with? How

418
00:26:19,119 --> 00:26:24,760
Speaker 2: old were your children? Because at that time rex Huerman

419
00:26:27,200 --> 00:26:33,560
Speaker 2: was writing his planning document and by the way, he

420
00:26:33,680 --> 00:26:36,359
Speaker 2: not only began it in two thousand, but he overwrote

421
00:26:36,400 --> 00:26:39,200
Speaker 2: the same document multiple times, which, by the way, they

422
00:26:39,240 --> 00:26:43,000
Speaker 2: are now methodically breaking down this is where, yeah, they're

423
00:26:43,000 --> 00:26:47,359
Speaker 2: pulling it apart because it actually plans his kills. It

424
00:26:47,560 --> 00:26:52,960
Speaker 2: plans from the acquisition of the individual to their until

425
00:26:52,960 --> 00:26:53,960
Speaker 2: their demise.

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Speaker 1: And he uses and he's gone to great links to

427
00:26:56,480 --> 00:27:03,440
Speaker 1: use like little abbreviations like I think TA perhaps for target.

428
00:27:03,680 --> 00:27:08,399
Speaker 1: He's got DS oh my gosh, which is they believe

429
00:27:08,600 --> 00:27:13,159
Speaker 1: use as an abbreviation for dump site. Just think about

430
00:27:13,200 --> 00:27:16,320
Speaker 1: just the planning that goes into to that. I don't know,

431
00:27:16,720 --> 00:27:18,960
Speaker 1: but you know, just like I was saying a minute

432
00:27:18,960 --> 00:27:21,800
Speaker 1: ago that every you know that there's a positive and

433
00:27:21,800 --> 00:27:24,720
Speaker 1: a negative to decide. You know what, You know what

434
00:27:24,760 --> 00:27:30,359
Speaker 1: this is kind of it's kind of mirroring the activity

435
00:27:30,960 --> 00:27:33,359
Speaker 1: that I would do on scene as an investigator, only

436
00:27:33,840 --> 00:27:37,520
Speaker 1: only in the reverse where he's planning this thing out.

437
00:27:37,600 --> 00:27:40,520
Speaker 1: If you're a really good investigator. And I'm not saying

438
00:27:40,560 --> 00:27:42,840
Speaker 1: I was ever the best, I'm not, but I know

439
00:27:42,960 --> 00:27:45,600
Speaker 1: that what kept me on the straight and earraw or list,

440
00:27:46,320 --> 00:27:48,840
Speaker 1: we did have checklists. Now, I wrote narrative reports and

441
00:27:48,880 --> 00:27:50,960
Speaker 1: all this sort of thing, but there were certain things,

442
00:27:51,240 --> 00:27:55,320
Speaker 1: tasks that I had to accomplish because if I failed

443
00:27:55,359 --> 00:27:59,800
Speaker 1: one of those tasks, there was a dependent upon the

444
00:27:59,800 --> 00:28:02,560
Speaker 1: way given to that individual task that I had to do,

445
00:28:03,600 --> 00:28:08,200
Speaker 1: there was some probability that I could destroy the entire case. Well,

446
00:28:08,200 --> 00:28:10,639
Speaker 1: think about him, what he's doing with all of this

447
00:28:10,840 --> 00:28:15,640
Speaker 1: detailed listing of everything. He's thinking, well, my end goal

448
00:28:15,760 --> 00:28:18,280
Speaker 1: is to do this and not get caught at it.

449
00:28:19,119 --> 00:28:21,480
Speaker 1: And he even goes into some length about what he

450
00:28:21,560 --> 00:28:24,120
Speaker 1: has to dispose of when when you're thinking about well,

451
00:28:24,119 --> 00:28:27,840
Speaker 1: first off, he mentions gloves and also the burning of

452
00:28:27,840 --> 00:28:30,080
Speaker 1: the gloves. So he's got to get rid of this.

453
00:28:30,720 --> 00:28:33,480
Speaker 1: He's got to get rid of the file. What does

454
00:28:33,520 --> 00:28:36,400
Speaker 1: that mean? So is he keeping an individual file on

455
00:28:36,480 --> 00:28:38,840
Speaker 1: eat a heart, like a hard file on each one

456
00:28:38,880 --> 00:28:41,480
Speaker 1: of these individuals, and he's talking about getting rid of it.

457
00:28:42,240 --> 00:28:44,080
Speaker 1: And there's a number of other things like this. So

458
00:28:44,120 --> 00:28:47,240
Speaker 1: when you begin, this guy is far from disorganized in

459
00:28:47,280 --> 00:28:51,400
Speaker 1: his behavior. I think that you would you would agree

460
00:28:51,760 --> 00:28:54,360
Speaker 1: this is not like some guy that's running down the

461
00:28:54,360 --> 00:28:57,240
Speaker 1: street with an axe in his hand and just randomly

462
00:28:57,280 --> 00:29:00,680
Speaker 1: striking people. No, this is a guy that is actually

463
00:29:00,720 --> 00:29:03,320
Speaker 1: planning this out over a protracted period of time. And

464
00:29:03,360 --> 00:29:06,880
Speaker 1: that's kind of obvious to say. But you know, this

465
00:29:07,160 --> 00:29:09,960
Speaker 1: document that we have been provided with, not only is

466
00:29:10,000 --> 00:29:13,040
Speaker 1: it a roadmap but as to how he might have

467
00:29:13,160 --> 00:29:17,080
Speaker 1: gone about these things, maybe geographically, but it also it

468
00:29:17,120 --> 00:29:21,880
Speaker 1: gives you insight, you know, into his mind, which I

469
00:29:21,880 --> 00:29:25,200
Speaker 1: think is horrific for everybody involved. Dave Well.

470
00:29:26,200 --> 00:29:35,600
Speaker 2: According to court documents, Joe this person rex Huerman, had

471
00:29:36,480 --> 00:29:44,240
Speaker 2: a significant collection of violent bondage, torture pornography dating back

472
00:29:44,280 --> 00:29:49,440
Speaker 2: to the early nineties, dating back to nineteen ninety four, Joe, Right,

473
00:29:49,480 --> 00:29:53,600
Speaker 2: we're talking three decades ago. Yeah, thirty years ago, this

474
00:29:53,720 --> 00:30:00,800
Speaker 2: man already had devolved into a guy that is consumed

475
00:30:01,680 --> 00:30:06,400
Speaker 2: with violent sexual torture. And we know there are some

476
00:30:07,040 --> 00:30:13,920
Speaker 2: unidentified murder victims dating back to this time. Is it possible,

477
00:30:14,000 --> 00:30:17,600
Speaker 2: Joseph Scott Morgan that not only did they find a

478
00:30:17,640 --> 00:30:20,720
Speaker 2: man that could have committed the murders of the women

479
00:30:20,800 --> 00:30:25,320
Speaker 2: found at Gilgo, that now they have found somebody that

480
00:30:25,360 --> 00:30:28,600
Speaker 2: could have been killing for thirty years and didn't stop.

481
00:30:29,400 --> 00:30:32,040
Speaker 1: My lord, my lord, Yeah, you're right. I mean that

482
00:30:32,440 --> 00:30:36,440
Speaker 1: could very well be the case. And again, this is

483
00:30:36,480 --> 00:30:41,240
Speaker 1: almost like a cookbook for him, where he's moving through

484
00:30:41,280 --> 00:30:45,800
Speaker 1: this very methodically, and he's you know, there's two there's

485
00:30:45,800 --> 00:30:47,800
Speaker 1: two schools of thought on this. The longer you do it,

486
00:30:47,840 --> 00:30:50,360
Speaker 1: the better you get at it. And then the flip

487
00:30:50,400 --> 00:30:51,880
Speaker 1: side of that is, the longer you do it, the

488
00:30:51,880 --> 00:30:54,800
Speaker 1: more sloppy you get because you get used to doing it,

489
00:30:54,880 --> 00:30:58,080
Speaker 1: you don't think about the little things anymore. It seems

490
00:30:58,120 --> 00:31:00,480
Speaker 1: like maybe he had an awareness of that because he's

491
00:31:00,520 --> 00:31:08,560
Speaker 1: trying to anticipate things what he could not have anticipated, though, Dave,

492
00:31:09,480 --> 00:31:13,480
Speaker 1: is a bit of a shocker here in this document.

493
00:31:15,000 --> 00:31:19,840
Speaker 1: There is a witness that is identified only as Witness

494
00:31:19,920 --> 00:31:26,520
Speaker 1: number three, as far as a contributor of hair, which

495
00:31:26,640 --> 00:31:28,680
Speaker 1: is going to be a tie back that's found on

496
00:31:28,680 --> 00:31:31,680
Speaker 1: one of the victims. And here's the thing about it, Dave,

497
00:31:32,600 --> 00:31:40,080
Speaker 1: when we're talking about time, this individual, Witness number three,

498
00:31:40,480 --> 00:31:45,120
Speaker 1: is apparently not in a member of his current family.

499
00:31:45,520 --> 00:31:52,160
Speaker 1: This person, this hair may have originated from his ex

500
00:31:52,240 --> 00:31:58,959
Speaker 1: wife that had also been domiciled there. And we're talking

501
00:31:59,120 --> 00:32:03,280
Speaker 1: years and year, years and years ago. The tale will

502
00:32:03,280 --> 00:32:08,400
Speaker 1: still be told. But the fact that you find this

503
00:32:09,280 --> 00:32:15,080
Speaker 1: one strand of hair associated with one of these poor

504
00:32:15,120 --> 00:32:20,200
Speaker 1: women that was butchered really gives you an idea in

505
00:32:20,280 --> 00:32:40,320
Speaker 1: a sense of time. David, this is a this is

506
00:32:40,400 --> 00:32:47,720
Speaker 1: kind of an interesting little observation on my part. Did

507
00:32:47,720 --> 00:32:56,560
Speaker 1: you know that I think maybe during my career I

508
00:32:56,600 --> 00:32:59,440
Speaker 1: may have been summoned to a scene where someone found

509
00:33:00,560 --> 00:33:03,640
Speaker 1: a skeletal remnant and it turned out to be human.

510
00:33:05,320 --> 00:33:07,800
Speaker 1: And I'm talking about the average citizen just out in

511
00:33:07,800 --> 00:33:12,360
Speaker 1: their yard. That may have happened where it was legitimately

512
00:33:12,400 --> 00:33:18,760
Speaker 1: a human remain maybe a total of three times twenty

513
00:33:18,800 --> 00:33:23,080
Speaker 1: plus years. Because you get calls from bones all the time,

514
00:33:23,520 --> 00:33:25,880
Speaker 1: and the police don't know what to do other than

515
00:33:25,880 --> 00:33:27,960
Speaker 1: to call the medical examiner. So we'll come out to

516
00:33:28,000 --> 00:33:30,680
Speaker 1: the scene. The line shares of the time when we

517
00:33:30,720 --> 00:33:35,840
Speaker 1: get out there, that representative of a mortal remain a

518
00:33:35,880 --> 00:33:39,600
Speaker 1: bone most of the time, particularly down here in the South.

519
00:33:39,640 --> 00:33:41,800
Speaker 1: It turned out to be a hogbone because somebody had

520
00:33:41,800 --> 00:33:44,600
Speaker 1: been barbecuing and they discarded it in the yard, and

521
00:33:44,600 --> 00:33:48,160
Speaker 1: you could go on you could see the spiral spiral

522
00:33:48,160 --> 00:33:50,320
Speaker 1: markings on it where the spiral saw had cut it,

523
00:33:50,400 --> 00:33:53,200
Speaker 1: and they had been butchered, and they're stumpy. But you know,

524
00:33:53,280 --> 00:33:58,880
Speaker 1: to the average person. But to the average person when

525
00:33:58,880 --> 00:34:01,520
Speaker 1: they come across a bone, and their default position many

526
00:34:01,520 --> 00:34:06,000
Speaker 1: times is oh lord, well yeah, they're thinking. And what

527
00:34:06,040 --> 00:34:09,400
Speaker 1: they're thinking is if this is in fact the human

528
00:34:09,440 --> 00:34:11,440
Speaker 1: remain I want somebody to know about it, and I

529
00:34:11,480 --> 00:34:14,720
Speaker 1: don't know anything about the bones. And bone anatomy is hard.

530
00:34:15,120 --> 00:34:17,880
Speaker 1: It's really hard, particularly when you're doing comparative bone anatomy.

531
00:34:17,920 --> 00:34:20,520
Speaker 1: You know you're talking about a cow, a pig versus

532
00:34:20,560 --> 00:34:23,359
Speaker 1: a human. It can get very very confusing. I still

533
00:34:23,400 --> 00:34:25,760
Speaker 1: have a hard time with it, even after all these years.

534
00:34:27,160 --> 00:34:30,520
Speaker 1: But Dave I got to tell you, man, you could

535
00:34:30,520 --> 00:34:32,400
Speaker 1: have knocked me off my chair the other day with

536
00:34:32,480 --> 00:34:35,880
Speaker 1: a feather when I found out that the second visit

537
00:34:36,800 --> 00:34:41,239
Speaker 1: involved personnel from the Medical Examiner's office. And you'd ask

538
00:34:41,320 --> 00:34:43,879
Speaker 1: me about this, and I, you know, and I think

539
00:34:43,920 --> 00:34:48,879
Speaker 1: I flatly told you. First off, the cops they don't

540
00:34:48,920 --> 00:34:51,480
Speaker 1: want us in a way most of the time, you

541
00:34:51,520 --> 00:34:54,040
Speaker 1: know they don't. I mean, if they're working a scene,

542
00:34:54,400 --> 00:34:56,319
Speaker 1: and I understand that they want their space in order

543
00:34:56,440 --> 00:34:59,960
Speaker 1: to document everything. They got to have a reason to

544
00:35:00,080 --> 00:35:03,800
Speaker 1: call us out there. They have to. And the fact

545
00:35:03,840 --> 00:35:07,680
Speaker 1: that the showed up out there, I think is kind

546
00:35:07,680 --> 00:35:10,560
Speaker 1: of a tell on my end. I just don't know

547
00:35:10,600 --> 00:35:11,600
Speaker 1: what they've recovered.

548
00:35:11,840 --> 00:35:15,480
Speaker 2: Incredibly. I hate using terms like this when we're talking

549
00:35:15,480 --> 00:35:20,320
Speaker 2: about human beings who have been massacred by this alleged person.

550
00:35:20,360 --> 00:35:24,120
Speaker 2: But it's a fascinating tell that the Emmy was out there.

551
00:35:24,520 --> 00:35:26,640
Speaker 2: You mentioned to me, you know they remember they did

552
00:35:26,640 --> 00:35:29,200
Speaker 2: have the Emmy show up at the story heat. Yeah,

553
00:35:29,239 --> 00:35:30,919
Speaker 2: And I remember you and I were on the phone

554
00:35:30,920 --> 00:35:33,400
Speaker 2: that day going, hey, did you know, And it was like,

555
00:35:33,440 --> 00:35:35,760
Speaker 2: holy mug, because they had they brought out the blackout

556
00:35:35,760 --> 00:35:37,919
Speaker 2: sheets for that one. So no tell what they were doing,

557
00:35:38,480 --> 00:35:41,440
Speaker 2: and we didn't know about this search until after it

558
00:35:41,480 --> 00:35:43,600
Speaker 2: had been done, and it was a couple of weeks

559
00:35:43,640 --> 00:35:46,520
Speaker 2: after the fact before we even knew that they'd been there.

560
00:35:46,880 --> 00:35:48,600
Speaker 1: Oh, by the way, if you're holding your breath for

561
00:35:48,640 --> 00:35:52,120
Speaker 1: the Emmy to tell you something, it's not going to happen.

562
00:35:53,320 --> 00:35:56,960
Speaker 1: They're inside the investigative bubble and they're not going to

563
00:35:57,000 --> 00:36:00,359
Speaker 1: say peep. I would be very surprised, very so, you know.

564
00:36:01,000 --> 00:36:03,520
Speaker 2: And that's why, you know, when you and I were

565
00:36:03,520 --> 00:36:06,919
Speaker 2: talking about this, there had to be a well, hey,

566
00:36:07,000 --> 00:36:08,560
Speaker 2: they had to have a reason to go back in

567
00:36:09,080 --> 00:36:13,319
Speaker 2: because they had gone through this house, they had been

568
00:36:13,400 --> 00:36:17,120
Speaker 2: all through it, and now to go back again. You

569
00:36:17,160 --> 00:36:18,879
Speaker 2: have to remember that we do have a thing called

570
00:36:18,880 --> 00:36:22,560
Speaker 2: the Constitution. We also have a right to privacy. We

571
00:36:22,680 --> 00:36:25,799
Speaker 2: have certain rights that they're not allowed to just come

572
00:36:25,840 --> 00:36:26,400
Speaker 2: in and start.

573
00:36:26,280 --> 00:36:28,839
Speaker 1: Looking a reduction against unlawful surgencies.

574
00:36:29,239 --> 00:36:31,120
Speaker 2: They can't walk down the street and say I don't

575
00:36:31,200 --> 00:36:33,440
Speaker 2: like Dave, I don't like I'm going in. I'm going

576
00:36:33,520 --> 00:36:36,680
Speaker 2: to find something. They can't do that. And even when

577
00:36:36,760 --> 00:36:40,360
Speaker 2: you've got a person that is being held based on

578
00:36:40,440 --> 00:36:42,760
Speaker 2: the evidence they've collected so far, he's still not guilty,

579
00:36:43,040 --> 00:36:45,680
Speaker 2: but hey, we got enough to hold this guy. You

580
00:36:45,760 --> 00:36:47,680
Speaker 2: still have to prove why you're going back into a

581
00:36:47,719 --> 00:36:49,680
Speaker 2: house that's being lived in by three other people who

582
00:36:49,680 --> 00:36:52,360
Speaker 2: are not accused of any wrongdoing none.

583
00:36:52,800 --> 00:36:55,960
Speaker 1: Yeah, they're not. And isn't it weird how you know

584
00:36:56,000 --> 00:37:01,160
Speaker 1: that those those bits of human remnant, if you will,

585
00:37:02,080 --> 00:37:06,400
Speaker 1: that is the hair of his wife, possibly his daughter, himself,

586
00:37:07,080 --> 00:37:10,360
Speaker 1: this unknown other person that they are saying might be

587
00:37:10,440 --> 00:37:15,719
Speaker 1: his ex wife. That is a tell because it's an approximation, right,

588
00:37:15,880 --> 00:37:18,440
Speaker 1: you know, and listen for every one of those hairs

589
00:37:18,480 --> 00:37:21,160
Speaker 1: that you get, you got to do the math. That's

590
00:37:21,200 --> 00:37:28,879
Speaker 1: exponential math. What's the probability that those groups, that group

591
00:37:28,920 --> 00:37:32,440
Speaker 1: of people that were domiciled at that address, what are

592
00:37:32,520 --> 00:37:35,640
Speaker 1: the chances that their hair is going to randomly find

593
00:37:35,719 --> 00:37:39,160
Speaker 1: up be found on the body of an individual that

594
00:37:39,280 --> 00:37:44,360
Speaker 1: has been mutilated and butchered and discarded, you know, a

595
00:37:44,400 --> 00:37:47,120
Speaker 1: few miles from the home. And it's not just happening

596
00:37:47,200 --> 00:37:53,080
Speaker 1: once Dave, Okay, So, and again, the bigger that number gets,

597
00:37:53,360 --> 00:37:55,879
Speaker 1: the less likelihood that it's going to be some kind

598
00:37:55,880 --> 00:37:58,600
Speaker 1: of randomized thing. Now, the defense is going to argue

599
00:37:58,600 --> 00:37:59,879
Speaker 1: in the opposite of that, But.

600
00:38:00,600 --> 00:38:02,400
Speaker 2: I would I would say, you know what, Joe, if

601
00:38:02,400 --> 00:38:04,799
Speaker 2: you walked through my house and you and Kim come

602
00:38:04,840 --> 00:38:07,960
Speaker 2: over for dinner, when you go back home, you're gonna

603
00:38:08,000 --> 00:38:11,600
Speaker 2: have hair for me, my wife, my kids, my grandkids,

604
00:38:11,640 --> 00:38:14,520
Speaker 2: my dogs, you know. And if you go out and

605
00:38:14,520 --> 00:38:17,000
Speaker 2: commit a crime, they're gonna say, Dave mac came through

606
00:38:17,040 --> 00:38:19,160
Speaker 2: here with his whole family and did this, you know.

607
00:38:19,160 --> 00:38:22,880
Speaker 1: Right, Yeah, lacrt's principle. Man, every contact leaves a trace,

608
00:38:22,920 --> 00:38:24,840
Speaker 1: and we come back to that all the time.

609
00:38:25,680 --> 00:38:28,319
Speaker 2: You went apply to Hreman, then Joe I would apply

610
00:38:28,440 --> 00:38:29,680
Speaker 2: it to him and his family.

611
00:38:30,280 --> 00:38:34,279
Speaker 1: Oh oh, it's it's beautifully there's a beautiful symmetry to it,

612
00:38:34,360 --> 00:38:37,719
Speaker 1: I think when it comes to the card, because you

613
00:38:37,760 --> 00:38:42,640
Speaker 1: know that what that would mean is that these victims

614
00:38:42,880 --> 00:38:47,920
Speaker 1: would have had to have been in a specific structure

615
00:38:48,040 --> 00:38:52,799
Speaker 1: or vehicle that would have contained those particular samples that

616
00:38:53,200 --> 00:38:59,920
Speaker 1: are specifically biologically identifiable and they don't belong to the victim. Okay,

617
00:39:00,200 --> 00:39:05,120
Speaker 1: so what are those locations? Well, car house, all right,

618
00:39:05,680 --> 00:39:12,759
Speaker 1: and you maybe maybe the office potentially. I don't you know,

619
00:39:12,880 --> 00:39:15,879
Speaker 1: I don't know if if these women would have ever

620
00:39:16,000 --> 00:39:20,280
Speaker 1: walked into an architectural firm in Manhattan. I have no idea. However,

621
00:39:21,040 --> 00:39:24,080
Speaker 1: I guess a sharp defense attorney could say, well, you know,

622
00:39:24,160 --> 00:39:27,440
Speaker 1: we have to consider all things. Maybe that's the case,

623
00:39:27,719 --> 00:39:32,480
Speaker 1: but the biological evidence here is going to be so overwhelming,

624
00:39:32,600 --> 00:39:35,840
Speaker 1: and it sounds as though they're dealing with matochondrial DNA.

625
00:39:36,040 --> 00:39:38,680
Speaker 1: But that's that Again, that's the beauty of science, Dave,

626
00:39:38,719 --> 00:39:41,640
Speaker 1: Because yeah, it would be great to have like nuclear

627
00:39:42,520 --> 00:39:44,839
Speaker 1: nuclear DNA, where you know, you had the root ball

628
00:39:44,920 --> 00:39:47,040
Speaker 1: and all these sorts of things from here. But this

629
00:39:47,080 --> 00:39:50,160
Speaker 1: is the beauty of it. That hair can tell I mean,

630
00:39:50,239 --> 00:39:53,440
Speaker 1: that mitochondrial DNA that can be teased out of that

631
00:39:53,880 --> 00:39:57,800
Speaker 1: hair shaft. Dave, that that thing is like it's sitting

632
00:39:58,080 --> 00:40:02,759
Speaker 1: in a steel briefcase for all these it hasn't degraded.

633
00:40:04,040 --> 00:40:10,440
Speaker 1: What's fascinating, Dave, is that Jessica Taylor, her remains were

634
00:40:11,000 --> 00:40:17,279
Speaker 1: discarded one of these hairs that is associated with individuals

635
00:40:17,320 --> 00:40:22,480
Speaker 1: that are domiciled at the Hueerman Home. That hair is

636
00:40:22,520 --> 00:40:25,080
Speaker 1: associated with that group of people. It's found on her

637
00:40:25,120 --> 00:40:28,080
Speaker 1: and guess where it's found They It's found on her

638
00:40:28,239 --> 00:40:35,399
Speaker 1: back overlying she is lying on a surgical drape. Now, Dave,

639
00:40:35,560 --> 00:40:39,239
Speaker 1: let me tell you something, brother, I've been around I've

640
00:40:39,280 --> 00:40:42,439
Speaker 1: been around I've been around medicine for a long long

641
00:40:42,520 --> 00:40:45,920
Speaker 1: time now, and there are certain reasons that medical drapes

642
00:40:45,920 --> 00:40:51,000
Speaker 1: are used. Well, first off, if they're sterile, they're they

643
00:40:51,040 --> 00:40:55,280
Speaker 1: further enhance the sterile environment. Right, there's a certain level

644
00:40:55,520 --> 00:41:01,840
Speaker 1: of absorption that comes with this thing. Well would what

645
00:41:01,880 --> 00:41:03,840
Speaker 1: in the world would they be absorbing? I don't know.

646
00:41:03,920 --> 00:41:06,800
Speaker 1: Let's put two and two together. You've got a drape,

647
00:41:06,960 --> 00:41:10,479
Speaker 1: it's absorbent, and you're doing surgery. You're opening a body.

648
00:41:10,520 --> 00:41:13,840
Speaker 1: What happens when the body bleeds, It goes everywhere you

649
00:41:13,880 --> 00:41:18,720
Speaker 1: want to absorb it. You have to keep the area clean. Okay,

650
00:41:19,040 --> 00:41:23,600
Speaker 1: Amazon wasn't around in nineteen ninety four, ninety six, you know,

651
00:41:23,880 --> 00:41:26,200
Speaker 1: in a robust man, you know the way we have

652
00:41:26,280 --> 00:41:29,759
Speaker 1: it now where you can just order something. It was

653
00:41:29,880 --> 00:41:36,240
Speaker 1: not easy acquiring surgical drapes. So if you have that,

654
00:41:36,239 --> 00:41:40,239
Speaker 1: that gives me the idea that perhaps if they have

655
00:41:40,320 --> 00:41:44,239
Speaker 1: found something in that basement and it was a dare

656
00:41:44,239 --> 00:41:48,400
Speaker 1: I say, a torture chamber, you're going to have biological elements,

657
00:41:48,960 --> 00:41:53,719
Speaker 1: human elements associated with bodies. Is that why they call

658
00:41:53,719 --> 00:41:57,520
Speaker 1: the medical examiner out there? I'm Joseph Scott Morgan and

659
00:41:57,719 --> 00:42:01,399
Speaker 1: this is body backs SWO