WEBVTT - Michael McCartin and Will Smith of National Links Trust 0:00:00.120 --> 0:00:03.920 Welcome back to another edition of the Frida Egg Podcast. 0:00:04.240 --> 0:00:07.120 Today's episode is brought to you by our friends over 0:00:07.160 --> 0:00:11.160 at b Draty. They have a great promotion going on 0:00:11.320 --> 0:00:15.200 right now on their amazing apparel now through the end 0:00:15.280 --> 0:00:16.640 of July fourth weekend. 0:00:17.000 --> 0:00:18.880 So this coming weekend. 0:00:18.960 --> 0:00:23.000 Receive a free mystery polo when you spend one hundred 0:00:23.079 --> 0:00:26.560 dollars or more at bdradty dot com. So all you 0:00:26.640 --> 0:00:29.160 have to do to do get this free polo. I mean, 0:00:29.200 --> 0:00:31.880 who doesn't like free polos? And who knows? It might 0:00:31.920 --> 0:00:34.800 be a new style that you might not know. It 0:00:34.840 --> 0:00:37.320 could be your best style. So you get this free 0:00:37.360 --> 0:00:40.120 mystery polo. I think I'm gonna do it. I like surprises. 0:00:40.880 --> 0:00:45.000 Use the promo code draty vault all caps. It's d 0:00:45.200 --> 0:00:48.400 r A D d y v A U l T 0:00:49.240 --> 0:00:53.479 all caps draty vault at checkout and spend over one 0:00:53.520 --> 0:00:56.160 hundred bucks and you get a free polo. So go 0:00:56.200 --> 0:01:00.600 to www dot bdradty dot com to get this promotion 0:01:01.120 --> 0:01:05.200 now through the end of July fourth weekend. Today's episode, 0:01:05.319 --> 0:01:08.280 I am joined by the National Links Trust founders Will 0:01:08.319 --> 0:01:12.720 Smith and Michael McCartin, and we are discussing their huge news. 0:01:13.319 --> 0:01:16.319 They earned the bid to manage the three Washington d 0:01:16.480 --> 0:01:19.880 C municipal courses from the National Park Service last week. 0:01:20.280 --> 0:01:24.240 They are now in the negotiation phase of this process, 0:01:24.280 --> 0:01:28.160 but they will be managing these three golf courses. It 0:01:28.319 --> 0:01:33.360 is an incredible opportunity for municipal golf across the country 0:01:33.400 --> 0:01:37.560 as well as in d C. Obviously, with these three courses, 0:01:37.640 --> 0:01:40.880 they are East Potomac Golf Course, which is an original 0:01:40.959 --> 0:01:45.200 Walter Travis design, Rock Creek which is a William Flynn design, 0:01:45.480 --> 0:01:48.680 and Langston Golf Course, which has historically been the hub 0:01:48.680 --> 0:01:52.880 of African American golf in d C. The projects would 0:01:52.920 --> 0:01:56.840 be undertaken by Tom Doak, Gil Hans and Bo Welling, 0:01:56.880 --> 0:02:00.720 the senior design associate for Tiger Woods Design. The podcast 0:02:00.800 --> 0:02:03.840 leads off with Michael mccarton talking. He was a guest 0:02:04.120 --> 0:02:06.720 on episode one hundred and twelve of the podcast if 0:02:06.720 --> 0:02:09.880 you miss it, we talked in detail about East Potomac 0:02:09.919 --> 0:02:13.800 on that podcast and his thesis on the subject matter. 0:02:14.800 --> 0:02:18.200 If you want more information on the three DC courses, 0:02:18.240 --> 0:02:21.600 obviously that podcast with Michael was a big one, but 0:02:21.680 --> 0:02:25.680 we also have a few articles written on the website 0:02:26.040 --> 0:02:29.919 at www Dotfrida egg dot com, so you can check 0:02:30.040 --> 0:02:34.120 those out there. And now, without further ado, here is 0:02:34.240 --> 0:02:36.160 Michael McCartin and Will Smith. 0:02:36.440 --> 0:02:39.240 I miss the green for example, I'm already upset when 0:02:39.240 --> 0:02:41.360 I find my ball in the bunker, I'm really upset. 0:02:41.440 --> 0:02:42.320 And when I find my. 0:02:42.280 --> 0:02:45.359 Ball in a frid Egg Friday egg, the dreaded Frida egg, 0:02:45.480 --> 0:02:48.520 Frida egg, Frida egg egg fridagg bride egg Lie, I'm 0:02:48.520 --> 0:02:50.079 about ready to run off of the hump. 0:02:50.240 --> 0:03:01.840 Course, what was the oh ship moment? 0:03:02.040 --> 0:03:04.920 We this? This is a this is a lot of 0:03:04.919 --> 0:03:07.320 work to get this done. I mean, you guys are 0:03:07.360 --> 0:03:10.840 are novices, newbies at this and uh, this was kind 0:03:10.840 --> 0:03:16.200 of your first first crack at public entering, the public 0:03:16.240 --> 0:03:18.639 domain and RFP process. 0:03:20.400 --> 0:03:23.040 I guess the question is are you referring to the 0:03:23.120 --> 0:03:26.960 oh ship moment that happened while we were putting the 0:03:27.040 --> 0:03:30.160 RFP together or after we want it? 0:03:30.400 --> 0:03:36.000 Because we had either or maybe both of them. 0:03:36.080 --> 0:03:40.080 I think there's a moment in this where, you know, 0:03:40.640 --> 0:03:43.360 on the front end, when you have a great idea, 0:03:43.640 --> 0:03:46.080 you know, Will and I and a lot of people 0:03:46.720 --> 0:03:49.520 had come together to say we really believe in this 0:03:49.560 --> 0:03:50.920 and we want to be a part of it. Going 0:03:51.000 --> 0:03:55.560 forward and that that's you know, the easy part. And 0:03:55.600 --> 0:03:59.040 then when we looked at the RFP and everything that 0:03:59.160 --> 0:04:01.520 was going to be involved in, all the elements we 0:04:01.560 --> 0:04:06.000 had to bring together in a short timeframe, that was 0:04:06.040 --> 0:04:09.240 definitely an O Ship moment and and it definitely proved 0:04:09.240 --> 0:04:12.480 out to be as much worker more than we could 0:04:12.520 --> 0:04:15.120 have envisioned at that time. I mean, it was it 0:04:15.160 --> 0:04:20.719 was an intense period of time after winning the or 0:04:21.040 --> 0:04:24.039 you know, winning the right to negotiate the lease recently, 0:04:25.440 --> 0:04:27.240 the OH Ship moment was a little bit different. It 0:04:27.279 --> 0:04:29.560 was a little more tied into a motion of how 0:04:29.640 --> 0:04:31.920 much effort we have put into it and how crazy 0:04:31.960 --> 0:04:35.400 it is that we you know won, we won, and 0:04:35.440 --> 0:04:37.960 we're gonna, you know, hopefully have the opportunity to do this. 0:04:39.720 --> 0:04:42.320 But this OH Ship moment's on a much different scale. 0:04:42.400 --> 0:04:45.880 I mean, it's it's many years long and and there 0:04:45.960 --> 0:04:48.159 really is a lot of work. And this is not 0:04:48.320 --> 0:04:50.599 just putting it on paper, it's actually making it happen. 0:04:52.080 --> 0:04:55.440 Uh talk to was there a feeling that you were 0:04:55.480 --> 0:04:57.880 going to get it or did this did the you 0:04:57.880 --> 0:05:00.520 know them calling you in a war like you know, 0:05:00.520 --> 0:05:02.960 I assume that called you or emailed you and awarded 0:05:03.000 --> 0:05:03.599 you the bid. 0:05:04.080 --> 0:05:06.600 Was that just kind of uh surprised. 0:05:08.240 --> 0:05:12.479 I think we were confident in the team that we 0:05:12.560 --> 0:05:17.720 put together and the vision behind what we're trying to accomplish. 0:05:17.800 --> 0:05:21.400 But we've never been a part of a government process 0:05:21.560 --> 0:05:24.719 like this, and you never know what the priorities are 0:05:24.960 --> 0:05:29.920 or the influence influences are in the background, and I 0:05:31.000 --> 0:05:34.120 was surprised. We had no idea what to expect. And 0:05:35.400 --> 0:05:37.560 when you don't have that kind of experience, I think 0:05:38.000 --> 0:05:41.240 you tend to believe that other factors, beyond what you 0:05:41.279 --> 0:05:43.960 can control are the things that will drive the process. 0:05:44.040 --> 0:05:47.920 So to see that the Park Service, you know, also 0:05:48.080 --> 0:05:51.560 values the things that we put into our proposal, was 0:05:52.600 --> 0:05:54.800 really gratifying. I don't know, how did you feel? Well? 0:05:55.520 --> 0:05:57.960 Yeah, I mean, you know, as someone who grew up 0:05:58.000 --> 0:06:01.960 in DC and have seen has seen a lot through 0:06:02.000 --> 0:06:04.320 politics and that and that sort of thing over the 0:06:04.440 --> 0:06:07.680 last forty five years, you just never know how these 0:06:07.680 --> 0:06:10.039 things are going to play out. And as Mike said, 0:06:10.080 --> 0:06:12.120 we were confident in our vision, We were confident in 0:06:12.160 --> 0:06:15.400 the team we put together. We knew that there was 0:06:15.440 --> 0:06:18.400 at least one other competitor that was going to be responding, 0:06:18.440 --> 0:06:21.560 and you know, we knew they were they had worked 0:06:21.560 --> 0:06:24.520 hard on this, and that they had put a lot 0:06:24.520 --> 0:06:28.640 of effort and time into it, and that they were 0:06:29.440 --> 0:06:33.440 a bunch of big hitters in the DC scene. It 0:06:33.560 --> 0:06:36.240 was probably helpful that we really didn't dive into who 0:06:36.600 --> 0:06:40.800 was on the on on their board until I think 0:06:40.800 --> 0:06:42.920 it was the last day that I had to pull 0:06:43.000 --> 0:06:46.159 up their website and read through it, and that that 0:06:46.279 --> 0:06:49.120 was definitely an O ship moment because it's it's quite 0:06:49.120 --> 0:06:53.159 an impressive list, and you know, uh, you know, so 0:06:53.200 --> 0:06:55.560 we just didn't know how much sort of back room 0:06:55.680 --> 0:06:58.680 politicking was going to come come into play rather than 0:06:58.800 --> 0:07:01.520 sort of the merits of of the proposal, because we 0:07:01.560 --> 0:07:03.960 felt we felt confident on that we really did. 0:07:04.760 --> 0:07:10.240 What from your guys's proposal, what angle did you feel 0:07:11.480 --> 0:07:14.760 resonated most with with the National Park Service? 0:07:16.600 --> 0:07:19.480 I don't know what you think, well, but what I 0:07:19.520 --> 0:07:23.480 was most impressed with in the process was how aligned 0:07:23.560 --> 0:07:27.480 the Park Service was with the things that we valued 0:07:27.520 --> 0:07:31.680 and wanted to accomplish with this project. And they're not 0:07:32.600 --> 0:07:36.360 unique to us, but you know, the Park Service really 0:07:36.360 --> 0:07:39.080 wanted to respect the histories of the properties and to 0:07:39.120 --> 0:07:44.200 go back to whether it's the original golf architecture or 0:07:44.320 --> 0:07:48.080 preserve the golf culture that's developed at each of the courses. 0:07:48.840 --> 0:07:52.440 The Park Service was extremely explicit about saying that's what 0:07:52.520 --> 0:07:56.679 the prioritized, and on top of that, they did a 0:07:56.760 --> 0:08:01.040 ridiculously good job of documenting the histories of the courses 0:08:01.280 --> 0:08:05.720 and what eras of their history that they would like 0:08:05.760 --> 0:08:08.040 to see the courses go back to. So it's really 0:08:08.120 --> 0:08:10.640 kind of like a historic preservation project in a lot 0:08:10.640 --> 0:08:14.360 of ways, and that's what the Park Service is really 0:08:14.360 --> 0:08:18.120 good at, and it happened to be the exact thing 0:08:18.240 --> 0:08:20.760 that when Will and I first got together to talk about, 0:08:20.800 --> 0:08:25.000 this was the part of the potential project that we 0:08:25.040 --> 0:08:27.400 wanted to emphasize and get the word out about. So 0:08:27.640 --> 0:08:31.720 there's just really great alignment there between what the Park 0:08:31.760 --> 0:08:34.480 Service was asking for and what we were putting into 0:08:34.520 --> 0:08:39.080 our proposal. So I'm assuming that that aspect of our 0:08:39.080 --> 0:08:42.439 proposal was one of the things that probably most stood 0:08:42.440 --> 0:08:42.960 out to them. 0:08:43.600 --> 0:08:45.000 So you guys both have. 0:08:46.720 --> 0:08:50.439 You know, experience and part of your career was in 0:08:50.720 --> 0:08:55.560 golf course architecture and from the restoration at a standpoint 0:08:55.600 --> 0:08:59.000 of if you were going to a club and restoring it, 0:08:59.320 --> 0:09:02.120 people look at at hey this is the era that 0:09:02.160 --> 0:09:05.320 we want to bring it back to, or a lot 0:09:05.360 --> 0:09:08.560 of times it's identifying when the best self of the 0:09:08.640 --> 0:09:11.720 course was what what are the different eras that you 0:09:11.960 --> 0:09:16.520 and the nps UH sat, you know, kind of landed 0:09:16.559 --> 0:09:21.840 on at each course, at at Langston, at Rock Creek, 0:09:21.960 --> 0:09:24.360 and at East Potomac well. 0:09:24.480 --> 0:09:26.760 Rock Creek, there was the there was a nine hole 0:09:27.000 --> 0:09:32.000 original routing that Flint did, and then soon thereafter he 0:09:32.040 --> 0:09:34.400 came in and expanded it to eighteen and kind of 0:09:34.559 --> 0:09:36.960 chopped up most of the first nine. There was only 0:09:37.000 --> 0:09:40.360 one hole that was that carried through in both in 0:09:40.400 --> 0:09:43.480 both routings, which was the eleventh in. 0:09:43.440 --> 0:09:48.000 The current current order of play. And you know, we 0:09:48.120 --> 0:09:49.400 knew very early on at. 0:09:49.320 --> 0:09:52.040 Rock Creek that we wanted to do some some some 0:09:52.080 --> 0:09:56.400 different stuff that from a business standpoint and for an 0:09:56.400 --> 0:09:59.319 engagement with youth, that we needed to add a driving 0:09:59.400 --> 0:10:03.439 range and actually a part three course. And so very 0:10:03.440 --> 0:10:05.840 early on we realized that we were more going for 0:10:06.120 --> 0:10:09.239 in the style of Flynn than necessarily a strict restoration 0:10:09.360 --> 0:10:13.440 and gil uh you thought that was that was a 0:10:13.480 --> 0:10:16.480 great idea and came in and took a look and 0:10:16.920 --> 0:10:21.280 reworked a lot of the corridors basically that that Flynn 0:10:21.360 --> 0:10:25.320 used to create a nine hole sort of regulation length 0:10:25.440 --> 0:10:28.000 golf course, and then we use some of the quarters 0:10:28.000 --> 0:10:32.840 and green sites from the eighteen hole Flinn for for 0:10:32.920 --> 0:10:35.000 the nine hole part three, and then we were able 0:10:35.080 --> 0:10:37.319 to slot a driving range in close to the current 0:10:37.480 --> 0:10:40.640 current clubhouse. So it wasn't necessarily like we're going to 0:10:40.720 --> 0:10:43.680 go back to this year at Rock Creek. It was 0:10:43.720 --> 0:10:46.160 more of, Okay, let's let's use Flynn as an inspiration 0:10:46.200 --> 0:10:49.040 and use the corridors and green sites as much as possible. 0:10:49.000 --> 0:10:51.440 Like how many how many of the original flint holes 0:10:51.480 --> 0:10:54.160 can we get into a nine hole routing? And we 0:10:54.240 --> 0:10:57.320 got I think we have about seven corridors and green 0:10:57.400 --> 0:11:01.840 sites used in the nine hole routing that we're we're 0:11:01.920 --> 0:11:04.480 using as a working plant right now. Yeah. 0:11:04.520 --> 0:11:07.280 And for people that don't know about Rock Creek, it's 0:11:07.360 --> 0:11:12.439 obviously it's a huge park system within d C. 0:11:12.840 --> 0:11:15.480 It's one of the most beautiful places in d C. 0:11:15.760 --> 0:11:18.320 But one of the things with the existing golf course 0:11:18.360 --> 0:11:21.440 having been out there is that it you know, the 0:11:21.480 --> 0:11:24.120 site might be a little small for a modern eighteen 0:11:24.160 --> 0:11:27.920 hole golf course. So the feasibility of having eighteen holes 0:11:27.960 --> 0:11:31.360 there that are good golf holes is very low. So 0:11:31.960 --> 0:11:36.360 coming up with a non traditional or you know, new 0:11:36.559 --> 0:11:39.080 idea that would seem to be the place that fit 0:11:39.200 --> 0:11:44.560 the most as one that adapted kind of to modern times. Yeah. 0:11:44.600 --> 0:11:45.160 Absolutely. 0:11:45.400 --> 0:11:48.840 You know, it's one hundred acres and very forested and 0:11:48.840 --> 0:11:51.920 there are some steep slopes, so it'd been really tough 0:11:51.960 --> 0:11:55.160 to get a sort of modern eighteen hole golf course 0:11:55.200 --> 0:11:57.679 back in there, even you know, until you know, the 0:11:57.920 --> 0:12:00.440 back nine has been closed the last few years because 0:12:00.440 --> 0:12:03.680 it's basically been overgrown and too hard to maintain. But 0:12:03.760 --> 0:12:07.000 even when the full eighteen was open, I think it 0:12:07.080 --> 0:12:11.680 was you know, a par sixty four fifty five thousand yards. 0:12:11.760 --> 0:12:16.559 I mean it has it was never a quote unquote championship. 0:12:16.600 --> 0:12:18.240 I hate using that term, but it was never a 0:12:18.320 --> 0:12:23.000 championship a golf course even when it opened back in 0:12:23.040 --> 0:12:23.960 the twenty Yeah. 0:12:24.000 --> 0:12:26.120 And then there is a road that was constructed through 0:12:26.120 --> 0:12:28.520 the property which chopped off two holes, so it got 0:12:28.520 --> 0:12:29.040 even small. 0:12:30.400 --> 0:12:31.040 I imagined. 0:12:31.440 --> 0:12:34.400 That's got to be an exciting one just for how 0:12:34.480 --> 0:12:38.959 much other recreation is going on around the golf course 0:12:39.360 --> 0:12:40.520 in the Rock Creek Park. 0:12:41.360 --> 0:12:43.840 Yeah. One of the things that we've been really focusing 0:12:43.880 --> 0:12:47.400 on again prompted by the Park Service, but also something 0:12:47.440 --> 0:12:49.880 that I think we both believe in is how to 0:12:49.920 --> 0:12:52.840 bring non golfers into the site in a way that 0:12:52.920 --> 0:12:55.680 makes sense. And Rock Creek's a really cool example of 0:12:55.679 --> 0:12:58.960 what's possible there because and again all this stuff is 0:12:59.760 --> 0:13:02.120 put caveat in front of everything we're talking about that 0:13:02.320 --> 0:13:04.199 it all has to be approved by the Park Service, 0:13:05.280 --> 0:13:07.600 but I think there's a great opportunity there to connect 0:13:07.640 --> 0:13:11.040 into the trail system that exists around the course and 0:13:11.080 --> 0:13:14.520 bring people into the clubhouse, give them an opportunity to 0:13:14.520 --> 0:13:17.520 stop for a beer or lunch, and just kind of 0:13:17.520 --> 0:13:20.440 get a sense of the scale of the place, which 0:13:20.480 --> 0:13:23.760 is out in an old open farm field and in 0:13:23.800 --> 0:13:26.560 the middle of a city, but you can't see anything 0:13:26.600 --> 0:13:28.520 associated with the city there. So it's got a really 0:13:28.520 --> 0:13:32.760 great feel. And right now it's generally only used by 0:13:32.960 --> 0:13:37.559 golfers when there's so many people using the surrounding park, 0:13:37.840 --> 0:13:40.760 and it'd be great to mix those uses more than 0:13:40.760 --> 0:13:41.559 they are currently. 0:13:41.960 --> 0:13:44.640 Yeah, it's remarkable how many people, both golfers and non 0:13:44.640 --> 0:13:48.040 golfers alike, just don't know it's there, because while Rock 0:13:48.080 --> 0:13:51.360 Creek is a heavily used portion of the city. 0:13:52.120 --> 0:13:55.920 It just it just doesn't. It doesn't people. 0:13:55.920 --> 0:13:58.840 It's tucked away, so it's you don't drive by it 0:13:58.880 --> 0:14:00.760 and see it and say, oh, there's that. I want 0:14:00.800 --> 0:14:02.160 to go check it out. And that's going to be 0:14:02.200 --> 0:14:04.480 part of our challenges is to get people there. And 0:14:04.800 --> 0:14:07.439 I think it's such a beautiful spot and I think 0:14:07.480 --> 0:14:09.280 we can really open people's eyes to what in a 0:14:09.320 --> 0:14:11.199 minute it is can be for the old city. 0:14:11.840 --> 0:14:14.440 It kind of the potential reminds me a little bit 0:14:14.480 --> 0:14:17.080 of Audubon Park down in New Orleans, which I think 0:14:17.120 --> 0:14:19.880 is one of the coolest places because you've got this giant, 0:14:19.920 --> 0:14:23.200 beautiful park and you're walking along the path, like I 0:14:23.240 --> 0:14:25.760 went for a walk with my wife, who's not a golfer, 0:14:26.000 --> 0:14:28.320 and Audubon Park, and then all of a sudden you 0:14:28.360 --> 0:14:31.400 see golf holes and it's just neat to see people 0:14:31.440 --> 0:14:32.600 in golf intertwined. 0:14:32.640 --> 0:14:33.440 And I think it. 0:14:33.680 --> 0:14:36.040 You know, in Chicago we have it with Marivitz and 0:14:36.400 --> 0:14:38.960 we have the running trail that's right along it along 0:14:39.000 --> 0:14:43.440 the lake, and that is a neat aspect, even for runners. 0:14:43.240 --> 0:14:46.000 It's probably a nice break and scenery. 0:14:46.080 --> 0:14:48.440 I know I used to run by it, but I 0:14:48.480 --> 0:14:50.720 was a golfer, So I always had my you know, 0:14:50.840 --> 0:14:55.200 rubber necking out to the golf course. But so let's 0:14:55.240 --> 0:14:57.800 talk a little bit about each of the other properties. 0:14:59.000 --> 0:15:02.520 What with Langston, I know it's the it's probably the 0:15:02.560 --> 0:15:06.320 most functional golf course right now as it stands. 0:15:06.840 --> 0:15:08.840 What do you plan on, you know. 0:15:08.800 --> 0:15:13.400 From the aspect of improvements and then also what you're 0:15:13.400 --> 0:15:16.600 trying to highlight at Langston and bring to the forefront. 0:15:17.280 --> 0:15:23.680 Yeah, so Langston I think the our focus is on 0:15:24.560 --> 0:15:27.080 from a so there's two aspects of the Langston project. 0:15:27.160 --> 0:15:29.880 One is golf course focus, the other is community focused. 0:15:29.960 --> 0:15:35.240 So we're just talking golf course. You're right, the land 0:15:35.360 --> 0:15:38.520 at Langston kind of lends itself best as it currently, 0:15:39.640 --> 0:15:43.960 you know, sits to uh not a lot of changes 0:15:44.000 --> 0:15:46.800 to the course. I mean, what we're focusing on is infrastructure. 0:15:47.280 --> 0:15:50.160 There's a ton of deferred maintenance out there as well 0:15:50.200 --> 0:15:53.960 as just generally connecting the course to the river setting. 0:15:54.120 --> 0:15:57.080 It's the entire back well. A big chunk of the 0:15:57.080 --> 0:16:02.400 back nine is on an island in the Anacostia River 0:16:03.800 --> 0:16:06.200 and you wouldn't know it. You can't see out the 0:16:06.320 --> 0:16:09.720 sides of the property to the river, which is twenty 0:16:09.760 --> 0:16:12.720 yards away from where you are. So we've partnered with 0:16:12.760 --> 0:16:18.000 the Anacostia Watershed Society to do some work along the 0:16:18.120 --> 0:16:20.560 edges of the river to open up views. And it 0:16:20.640 --> 0:16:24.360 just so happens that all of the vegetation that's in 0:16:24.440 --> 0:16:27.000 the way of those views is, you know, or at 0:16:27.080 --> 0:16:30.640 least the vast majority is invasive plant material, and so 0:16:30.800 --> 0:16:34.320 there's a really good alignment from an ecological perspective to 0:16:34.360 --> 0:16:38.280 get rid of that vegetation and replant with something that's 0:16:38.440 --> 0:16:43.680 more native to the area, which both functions better for 0:16:44.120 --> 0:16:47.760 the environment and provides a visual connection to the river. 0:16:49.160 --> 0:16:53.000 So there's that aspect of just kind of emphasizing the setting. 0:16:53.360 --> 0:16:57.240 Then you know, obviously there's a whole bunch of deferred 0:16:57.280 --> 0:16:59.960 maintenance to the golf course itself, where we'll be doing 0:17:00.080 --> 0:17:03.760 work on greens and teas and bunkers. There's not as 0:17:03.880 --> 0:17:07.399 much work at Langston in terms of messing with the routing. 0:17:07.520 --> 0:17:11.360 The routing is pretty good, so it's really about improving 0:17:11.359 --> 0:17:16.520 the details of the course and infrastructure. And then the 0:17:16.680 --> 0:17:20.120 major component outside of the golf course for Langston is 0:17:20.840 --> 0:17:25.360 helping to invest in the the clubhouse and and other 0:17:25.440 --> 0:17:31.480 facilities to make the you know, the site an even 0:17:31.560 --> 0:17:34.760 better host to the community than it you know, currently is. 0:17:35.080 --> 0:17:40.160 In its past, Langston's functioned as a community center when 0:17:40.160 --> 0:17:41.840 it's been at its best, and we want to kind 0:17:41.840 --> 0:17:46.119 of emphasize those elements of you know, its relationship to 0:17:46.280 --> 0:17:51.240 the neighborhood and the city by providing you know, excellent 0:17:52.200 --> 0:17:58.240 facilities for for those for those types of functions. 0:17:57.800 --> 0:18:01.480 And maybe in in a pro post COVID world, not 0:18:01.720 --> 0:18:03.399 as simple, but you know, one of the things we 0:18:03.480 --> 0:18:05.520 might look at very from the very start would be 0:18:05.560 --> 0:18:08.280 to add sort of outdoor seating because so much of 0:18:08.320 --> 0:18:12.520 the community gathering point right now is inside and so 0:18:12.720 --> 0:18:16.919 you know what we're we're we're sort of assessing, assessing everything, 0:18:16.960 --> 0:18:19.120 and but our idea. 0:18:18.800 --> 0:18:20.560 Is to really focus on. 0:18:20.520 --> 0:18:25.440 Engaging the community and and polishing up the golf course 0:18:25.520 --> 0:18:27.440 rather than wholesale changes to the golf course. 0:18:27.520 --> 0:18:30.800 Yeah, and more than a lot of golf courses, and 0:18:31.080 --> 0:18:34.320 certainly it's kind it's unique in my experience with golf 0:18:34.520 --> 0:18:37.720 is that Langston has this as a you know, large 0:18:37.760 --> 0:18:40.840 number of people who go to the course every day 0:18:41.680 --> 0:18:45.040 and don't play golf, just hanging out around the clubhouse 0:18:45.080 --> 0:18:48.040 and being with their friends and people that they see 0:18:48.480 --> 0:18:51.359 on a regular basis, and that community is what we 0:18:51.440 --> 0:18:54.960 want to you know, foster and you know, it's something 0:18:55.040 --> 0:18:57.080 like we just talked about, it doesn't really exist or 0:18:57.080 --> 0:18:59.879 our Creek people don't come from around the area to 0:19:00.080 --> 0:19:02.560 Rock Creek. We'd like to make that happen, but that 0:19:02.760 --> 0:19:05.480 actually is already happening at lengths and we just want 0:19:05.480 --> 0:19:08.679 to you know, kind of preserve and improve that. 0:19:09.520 --> 0:19:13.280 Speaking of of that and the community and the social 0:19:13.800 --> 0:19:17.520 aspect of golf and and kind of we've touched on 0:19:17.600 --> 0:19:19.800 it briefly twice. Do you do you guys feel that 0:19:19.840 --> 0:19:23.159 golf could be a part of a larger effort for 0:19:23.440 --> 0:19:25.240 social reform in DC. 0:19:28.359 --> 0:19:33.560 Certainly. I think connecting there's a there's a real opportunity 0:19:33.600 --> 0:19:39.320 to do things that benefit you know, provide. I know 0:19:39.359 --> 0:19:41.440 it's kind of the buzzword now, but I think it's 0:19:41.560 --> 0:19:46.960 it's true, just you know, kind of looking at equity 0:19:47.000 --> 0:19:51.240 in the city and providing opportunities, you know, to people 0:19:51.280 --> 0:19:53.760 who need them. I think the golf courses can be 0:19:55.000 --> 0:19:59.560 real catalysts for you know, providing some of that for 0:20:00.040 --> 0:20:03.879 sample at you know, we we've been talking about caddy 0:20:03.960 --> 0:20:09.320 programs and things that you know, might be appropriate, and 0:20:09.359 --> 0:20:13.480 we've had some discussions with the Western Golf Association Evan 0:20:13.520 --> 0:20:17.360 scholars to put in a caddy program at the three 0:20:17.400 --> 0:20:21.920 courses and that leads directly to college scholarships as well as, 0:20:22.000 --> 0:20:26.000 you know, an income for kids in middle school and 0:20:26.080 --> 0:20:29.240 high school. And definitely think that that is, you know, 0:20:29.320 --> 0:20:31.760 just one aspect of something that we can do to 0:20:32.520 --> 0:20:36.119 both expose people to golf but also to you know, 0:20:36.160 --> 0:20:41.960 provide opportunities that wouldn't have existed otherwise. Yeah, I think, 0:20:42.119 --> 0:20:42.399 you know, I. 0:20:42.359 --> 0:20:44.439 Think one of the things you asked you asked earlier 0:20:44.640 --> 0:20:48.520 what we thought that of our plan resonated with the 0:20:48.600 --> 0:20:51.280 National Park Service, and I think our commitment to affordability 0:20:51.320 --> 0:20:52.199 and accessibility and. 0:20:54.200 --> 0:20:55.600 What was one of those things. 0:20:55.720 --> 0:21:01.200 And I think by keeping these places affordable and accessible, 0:21:01.920 --> 0:21:05.640 they will continue to be diverse places and melting pots 0:21:06.320 --> 0:21:10.080 where people come together over a common bond of golf 0:21:10.160 --> 0:21:12.399 or maybe just a common bond of being outside and 0:21:12.520 --> 0:21:16.359 enjoying a beautiful, beautiful space. So it's a challenge and 0:21:16.359 --> 0:21:18.840 we're excited by it, and it's going to be something 0:21:18.840 --> 0:21:21.120 we're going to be working on for decades. 0:21:21.720 --> 0:21:25.240 Yeah, talk a little bit about the affordability and accessibility 0:21:25.720 --> 0:21:30.160 plans obviously investing a large amount of capital into improving 0:21:30.359 --> 0:21:34.679 these these properties, you know, keeping it affordable. Is it 0:21:34.720 --> 0:21:39.840 going to be something that is centered around local affordability 0:21:39.880 --> 0:21:42.280 with you know, a little bit more premium of a 0:21:42.480 --> 0:21:43.600 out of town rate or. 0:21:44.080 --> 0:21:45.960 Well, when it comes down to it, the courses are 0:21:46.040 --> 0:21:50.719 national parks, so they really are for everyone, even if 0:21:50.760 --> 0:21:53.240 they're going to be most heavily used by locals. So 0:21:54.119 --> 0:21:58.840 I don't I don't see a tiered pricing system in 0:21:58.880 --> 0:22:02.879 the future for these core is that that's not the way. 0:22:03.320 --> 0:22:06.919 You know, just if you take places that do that 0:22:07.600 --> 0:22:09.800 and do it successfully, and it's sort of it's all 0:22:10.440 --> 0:22:13.680 really great, you know where it's done. But if you 0:22:13.760 --> 0:22:16.520 take Tory Pines for example, and there are people coming 0:22:16.560 --> 0:22:20.040 from long distance, is a way to play the course 0:22:20.080 --> 0:22:24.080 at three hundred dollars a pop. You you have to 0:22:24.160 --> 0:22:26.880 cater to the person who's paying three hundred dollars, even 0:22:26.920 --> 0:22:32.760 if it is relatively affordable for locals. And I wouldn't 0:22:32.760 --> 0:22:35.480 really characterize Tory Pines as kind of the place where 0:22:35.520 --> 0:22:39.320 people learn golf, you know, it's not that kind of place. 0:22:39.400 --> 0:22:44.320 But the traditional role of the three DC courses has been, 0:22:45.000 --> 0:22:48.000 you know, as a gateway to golf for so many people. 0:22:48.080 --> 0:22:49.760 I mean, I can't tell you how many stories we've 0:22:49.760 --> 0:22:53.080 heard of people reaching out to say congratulations about this. 0:22:53.400 --> 0:22:55.800 You know, I learned to play golf at the Langston 0:22:55.920 --> 0:22:59.960 Driving Range and or the East Potomac Range and then 0:23:00.000 --> 0:23:02.760 graduated to the Red, White, and Blue courses there and 0:23:02.880 --> 0:23:05.440 just kind of work their way into golf. It's it's 0:23:05.480 --> 0:23:09.679