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Speaker 1: Hey, Hey, Hey, we're back. We're black, We're Brown, and

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Speaker 1: I am writing solo. It's your Girl, Mandy aka Mandy Money,

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Speaker 1: and I am not going to be alone for much longer, y'all.

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Speaker 1: For eight years, my little brother, Alex Woodruff has been

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Speaker 1: petitioning to be a guest on Brown Ambition, and finally

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Speaker 1: he asked at the right time. I have never been

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Speaker 1: more impressed with him as not just a career professional,

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Speaker 1: but also from a financial perspective. What he's managed to

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Speaker 1: do just by the tender age of thirty one. I

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Speaker 1: can't believe he's old, but also that makes me so

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Speaker 1: much older. But anyway, he has paid off a condo,

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Speaker 1: paid off fifty K of student loan debt, built his

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Speaker 1: own beautiful, gigantic home in the heart of our hometown

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Speaker 1: of Atlanta. He has an Airbnb property, and on top

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Speaker 1: of that, he is a badass tech sales rep for

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Speaker 1: multiple companies like IBM and Salesforce. And did I even

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Speaker 1: mention that he has this new, thriving creative endeavor as

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Speaker 1: a filmmaker. So I am inviting my little brother, my

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Speaker 1: little brother Alex, on the show today and I hope

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Speaker 1: that you all enjoy this conversation. All right, so you know,

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Speaker 1: now I have this, I'm well, I don't know, I

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Speaker 1: don't know what to call myself. And people say, like,

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Speaker 1: what do you do now, I'm like, I do a

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Speaker 1: lot of things, but one of the core things is

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Speaker 1: I have the Manny money Maker career coaching community, which

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Speaker 1: I've just started in the last couple of years. And

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Speaker 1: You've always been very supportive of that. Thank you. But

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Speaker 1: it was sort of exciting for me in a sick,

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Speaker 1: kind of weird way. Again, I'm a terrible person. Unlike yourself.

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Speaker 1: You're very pure. But when you got let.

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Speaker 2: Go, when it happened to you, you were few important

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Speaker 2: things like this in public you could have.

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Speaker 3: You never told me that you liked it when I

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Speaker 3: got laid off.

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Speaker 1: Well, and from the sense of like, I love it

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Speaker 1: when anyone comes to me with a real life career

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Speaker 1: conundrum and I'm like, ooh, data and project and I

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Speaker 1: want to watch this story unfold so I can learn

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Speaker 1: to make me a better coach, you know, and yeah,

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Speaker 1: so when you but also there's my therapist asked me,

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Speaker 1: She's like, what is it about you and Alex that

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Speaker 1: you think makes you guys have so much faith in

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Speaker 1: yourself for success or whatever, and I was like, I

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Speaker 1: don't really know what's to put up on my finger

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Speaker 1: on it, but like, I'm not worried about either of us.

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Speaker 1: I'm not worried about you. I'm not worried about There's

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Speaker 1: no real sense of getting let go could derail Alex's success,

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Speaker 1: you know what I mean? The same way for me,

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Speaker 1: Like if tomorrow, god forbid, they take away Brown ambition,

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Speaker 1: I don't know who is in charge of that, no one,

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Speaker 1: because we own it. But whatever, I'll I'll find some way,

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Speaker 1: like I'll be okay. So I feel like when you

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Speaker 1: came to me with, you know, unfortunately being let go.

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Speaker 1: While I was concerned and I wanted to help you,

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Speaker 1: I also like wasn't I was like, oh, like he'll

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Speaker 1: bounce back. He's going to be fine, you know what

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Speaker 1: I mean. So that's why I think I could like

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Speaker 1: take myself out of it and be like ooh project

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Speaker 1: and like it's fun. But I want you to talk

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Speaker 1: about that because I think you're such an incredible example.

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Speaker 1: And I told you this at the time of professional

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Speaker 1: resilience and someone who you know, you were at this

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Speaker 1: place for less than a year or just about a year.

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Speaker 2: It was less than a year. It was around nine

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Speaker 2: ten months.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and you're like me a job hopper, So how

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Speaker 1: many this was like your how many jobs? And I

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Speaker 1: don't know how many jobs did you have up to

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Speaker 1: this point? How many years?

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Speaker 2: An unwilling job hopper. I'm I'm searching for long term commitment.

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Speaker 2: I think I found.

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Speaker 1: It, Like we could hear that bill.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I was not trying to like.

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Speaker 2: Job like hop from the next thing to the next thing.

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Speaker 2: It's when you're in the startup world in tech this

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Speaker 2: can happen. It's kind of the risk you take when

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Speaker 2: you go from an IBM or a salesforce, which is

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Speaker 2: where I worked out of college, into the startup world

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Speaker 2: where it's a lot faster, a lot looser, and you

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Speaker 2: don't necessarily know what's going to happen. The flip side

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Speaker 2: of that is that you can have massive earning potentials.

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Speaker 2: You have a lot of autonomy to run yourself and

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Speaker 2: your business like it's your business. And it speaks to

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Speaker 2: me more going back to what we talked about earlier,

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Speaker 2: it speaks to who I am to work at a

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Speaker 2: company that I know, the CEO, I have a relationship

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Speaker 2: with that person, and I know what we stand for

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Speaker 2: and I can reflect that. So yeah, getting laid off

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Speaker 2: is tough. It was very, very startling because I think

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Speaker 2: highly of myself and so while I wasn't shocked because

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Speaker 2: I knew that as a company we weren't performing and

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Speaker 2: as an individual I could have been doing better, but

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Speaker 2: I was definitely surprised. I thought that it wouldn't if

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Speaker 2: it was going to happen, I thought I would have

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Speaker 2: been safe. So there's a couple of things I want

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Speaker 2: to say, Like, definitely I have a chip my shoulder.

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Speaker 2: And when you talk about you always knew I was

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Speaker 2: going to be okay. You're not worried about me, You're

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Speaker 2: not worried about you. Like I'm going to be okay

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Speaker 2: because I'm going to make sure that whoever made that

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Speaker 2: decision regrets it one way or another.

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Speaker 3: And they probably won't.

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Speaker 2: They don't know, so you do have like in my head, Yeah,

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Speaker 2: I want to like make them regret it. I want

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Speaker 2: them to be like saying that dumb shit, Like that's

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Speaker 2: what I want. And so I'm going to force that

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Speaker 2: to happen. And so Fiddler, where I work is getting

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Speaker 2: the hardest working version of me, like possible. It is

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Speaker 2: the I'm on go mode right now because I need

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Speaker 2: to validate not only to myself but to this imaginary

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Speaker 2: hater who I've created in my head, who thinks like

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Speaker 2: I'm going to fail.

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Speaker 3: I'm gonna flyp like that. That is how I operate.

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Speaker 2: But on the other end of it, in terms of

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Speaker 2: like when it happened and the fear that I had

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Speaker 2: two reasons I wasn't really afraid. One is that my

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Speaker 2: girlfriend has my back, like she financially can help us

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Speaker 2: out and get us through a period of lean time.

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Speaker 2: And then the other thing, it's not all that lean

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Speaker 2: over here. I'm doing okay, Like I'm not scraping the bottom.

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Speaker 1: I didn't have a lot of cash in the bank,

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Speaker 1: which you expressed to me, but you didn't have an airbnb.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, Like, what's the worst that can happen?

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Speaker 2: Now my massive house and make a bunch of money

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Speaker 2: off of it, and then by the time I'm done

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Speaker 2: doing that, I have a new job, and.

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Speaker 3: Like you just got to be able to be adaptable, Like.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I wanted this.

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Speaker 2: House, but what if it doesn't work out, that's okay,

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Speaker 2: Like I need what's actually important to me as a

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Speaker 2: human it isn't this house, it's not this neighborhood, it's

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Speaker 2: not the job that I was in at the time.

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Speaker 2: It's like, how do I ensure that I'm not losing

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Speaker 2: sight of what's actually important to me?

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Speaker 3: And so when I got laid off, Yeah, it was.

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Speaker 2: It was scary for a little bit, but once I

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Speaker 2: started thinking about it, and I'm like, I'll be fine.

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Speaker 2: I'm going to handle this and no matter what, nothing's

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Speaker 2: off the table as long as you know, me and

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Speaker 2: the people who I love are protected and we're fine,

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Speaker 2: and maybe we live in a smaller place, maybe we

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Speaker 2: rent for a while. None of those things ended up happening.

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Speaker 2: I got a new job in like three weeks.

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Speaker 1: But like, yes, so let's talk about that. Yeah, first

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Speaker 1: of all, your first your first correct step was to

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Speaker 1: call me.

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Speaker 2: I called you almost immediately, right, I don't know.

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Speaker 1: It's extremely pregnant and you know, about to pop any.

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Speaker 3: You were like any moment.

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Speaker 1: Now, I'm like, hey, wait, we're kind of putting a

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Speaker 1: date on it. And if we do that, do you

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Speaker 1: think that matters? You've been pregnant twice, Oh, you're right, Well,

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Speaker 1: you know pro life, I've been pregnant.

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Speaker 3: Sleuthing that hard, I'm fine with.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, you're right, Okay, Okay, yeah, so of course you

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Speaker 1: called me right away, and I just pro life, I've

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Speaker 1: been pregnant three times.

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Speaker 2: Okay, Yeah, I'm sorry.

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Speaker 3: I just I just I caught up with you.

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Speaker 1: Stick around, kid, you'll learn some stuff today. All right.

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Speaker 1: So you called me up. We talked about it, and

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Speaker 1: like immediately I feel like you were it was your

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Speaker 1: full time job to be looking for work, and like

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Speaker 1: quickly talk about a few things that you did that

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Speaker 1: you feel like three weeks later you had an incredible

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Speaker 1: Not only did you have an incredible job, because we

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Speaker 1: got to the negotiation, which is also so fun for

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Speaker 1: me to like have a backseat to watching you negotiate

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Speaker 1: because I love seeing it happen in real time. But

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Speaker 1: you had options in three weeks. It wasn't just like

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Speaker 1: I got a break, It was you had two or

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Speaker 1: three potential opportunities. So I think it's really crucial for

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Speaker 1: people to understand how that came to be.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. So, I mean it's just like when you brought

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Speaker 2: up how I lost hope in college. It was the

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Speaker 2: same exact scenario.

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Speaker 1: Like I got hope scholarship, not hope in his life.

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Speaker 2: Oh, you're right, I forget people aren't fromantic.

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Speaker 3: I lost the Hope scholarship.

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Speaker 2: I'm not hope as a person. Yeah, I lost a

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Speaker 2: scholarship that I had going to college and that was

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Speaker 2: that was a big wake up call. It reminded me

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Speaker 2: to keep the main thing the main thing, and understand

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Speaker 2: what my floor is and for me, in order to

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Speaker 2: do everything I love and everything that's important to me,

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Speaker 2: I need to be a highly functional software or sales executive.

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Speaker 2: And if the place I was at I wasn't able

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Speaker 2: to do that or deliver, I need to go and

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Speaker 2: fix that first. If I don't, everything else is now

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Speaker 2: under threat. I can't invest in my movies, I can't

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Speaker 2: have a lifestyle I want to live. I can't you know,

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Speaker 2: put into my retirement, et cetera. So it was extremely important,

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Speaker 2: I put to your point, I was like my full

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Speaker 2: time job for that three weeks was to find a job.

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Speaker 3: In terms of how I got the options I have developed.

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Speaker 2: Over the course of my career, A good reputation, and

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Speaker 2: several really important mentors, people who have vouched for me,

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Speaker 2: people who have supported me along my process. One of

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Speaker 2: them is Seth Dobrin, who at the time was the

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Speaker 2: president of the Responsible AI Institute, which I'm a board

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Speaker 2: advisor for, and he connected me with a few people

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Speaker 2: immediately as.

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Speaker 1: Well as Exponsible AI, the Responsible AI Institute. Okay, gotcha.

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Speaker 3: He connected with me with people.

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Speaker 2: I was on LinkedIn, you know, doing what I do

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Speaker 2: from a state sales perspective, but now looking for a

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Speaker 2: job and I'm the product.

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Speaker 3: So it was very it felt natural.

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Speaker 2: It was scary for the first few days, but then

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Speaker 2: I started getting interviews and then you start then I'm

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Speaker 2: in the mode, right, I'm I'm Max.

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Speaker 1: So you reach out to seth, you reach out to

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Speaker 1: the mentors, like via LinkedIn or email or whatever, let

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Speaker 1: them know. Do you tell them? Because I get this

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Speaker 1: question sometimes, should I tell people I've been let go?

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Speaker 3: What you need to think about? What was your p

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Speaker 3: That's a fair question, I think.

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Speaker 1: And you had a lot of concern about reputational risk too,

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Speaker 1: until the stigma warranted and valid.

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Speaker 2: Reputational risk because it wasn't my first time leaving a startup.

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Speaker 2: Right in the prior year, I had left a company

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Speaker 2: and went to a startup and then that startup folded.

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Speaker 2: I didn't get let go, but I had to get

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Speaker 2: out because it was under a lot of pressure. So

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Speaker 2: I left for another startup, and then that startup laid

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Speaker 2: me off. So like, for me, my reputation as a

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Speaker 2: job hopper is not something that I think is valuable

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Speaker 2: in my career. I don't want that reputation. I want

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Speaker 2: the best opportunity for me. Don't get me wrong, but

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Speaker 2: I don't want to be looked at as a job hopper.

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Speaker 2: I want to go somewhere and deliver and be looked

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Speaker 2: at as Wow, I'm glad that person was here.

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Speaker 3: So I was worried, yeah, about who I reached out to.

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Speaker 2: And I think for anyone listening, it's important to think

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Speaker 2: about what your reputation is with somebody before you reach

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Speaker 2: out to them and tell him you were let go,

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Speaker 2: Because if they don't think that highly of you, and

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Speaker 2: you were reaching out to them and letting them know

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Speaker 2: bad news about you and asking them for help, like

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Speaker 2: maybe you should find someone else.

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Speaker 1: Their reputation could be at stake as well. You know,

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Speaker 1: they have to really well like if they will, because

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Speaker 1: they may decide not to vouch for you just for

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Speaker 1: fear that if they do, like they don't really trust

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Speaker 1: that it'll reflect, you know, well on them. But if

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Speaker 1: someone knows you, they're like, oh, Alex was Alex ended

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Speaker 1: up here? Not because he's not great, but because you

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Speaker 1: know some thing's happened to Alex. I'm still going to

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Speaker 1: vouch for Alex as the product, you.

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Speaker 3: Know, absolutely, and you don't want to.

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Speaker 2: It's always you're always trying to build the best reputation

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Speaker 2: for yourself with everyone in your network that you possibly can.

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Speaker 2: So if somebody already doesn't think that highly of me

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Speaker 2: or is not a huge fan of mine, I'm not

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Speaker 2: bringing them bad news.

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Speaker 3: That's not a valuable investment on my end.

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Speaker 2: I'm going to wait to pull up on them after

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Speaker 2: I have some good news so that I can improve

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Speaker 2: that impression that they have with me. So I'm going

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Speaker 2: to the people to your point who already think highly

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Speaker 2: of me, who know that if I was let go.

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Speaker 2: You know, it's like when you have a breakup, you

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Speaker 2: go to that friend who's going to be like, man,

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Speaker 2: they were bugging, Like that's who you want to go

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Speaker 2: to in this environment. You want to go to somebody

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Speaker 2: who supports.

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Speaker 1: You, yeah, and then would vouch for you. So that

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Speaker 1: led you to a couple of not just interviews, but

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Speaker 1: like because you're niching into and people who want to

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Speaker 1: break into tech, I feel like listen up because like

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Speaker 1: you targeting were you specifically targeting startups? Because I feel

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Speaker 1: like that because it's such a smaller sort of I

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Speaker 1: don't know, like companies small fewer people in between you

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Speaker 1: and leadership, You're able to get that FaceTime with leadership

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Speaker 1: pretty quick, you know, versus like applying to Meta or

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Speaker 1: Google and you know, going into this huge stratosphere that's

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Speaker 1: just like it's hard to break into.

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Speaker 2: You need to understand what your leverage is. So for

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Speaker 2: me and the skill set I have and the track

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Speaker 2: record I have, I have the ability to go to

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Speaker 2: a startup who needs the job that I do, which

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Speaker 2: is sales, and say you should consider me. Right, But

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Speaker 2: if you're brand new and trying to break into the

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Speaker 2: tech space and you're trying to get a job like

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Speaker 2: the one I have right now, it might be more

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Speaker 2: beneficial for you to go to a bigger company who

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Speaker 2: is hiring more people at once, who has a training

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Speaker 2: program like what I did when I joined IBM. Right,

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Speaker 2: that would be maybe a good use of your time.

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Speaker 2: Because if you go to a startup. They're expecting you

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Speaker 2: to be ready made. They want you to have gone

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Speaker 2: through training already. They want you to be ready to

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Speaker 2: literally join and Fiddler, I was having meetings with customers

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Speaker 2: like a week after I joined, because I.

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Speaker 3: Already knew the space.

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Speaker 2: I was already you know, enough of it expert to

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Speaker 2: be able.

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Speaker 1: To They don't have time to train.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, they didn't need to.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, they didn't want to have to train anyone. So

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Speaker 2: that's the leverage I had coming in. If I were

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Speaker 2: brand new and I were trying to get into a

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Speaker 2: sales job, I would go somewhere with a training program

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Speaker 2: that allows me to generate more skills and a track

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Speaker 2: record of success. And then if I decide eventually I

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Speaker 2: want to be in startups, which is how my career

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Speaker 2: you know, uh went, then I can do that. And

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Speaker 2: now a startup is a lot more likely to look

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Speaker 2: at me because I have a track record of success

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Speaker 2: and I've been trained already, you know, a valuable program.

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Speaker 1: Okay, all right, that's really helpful. I think that that's

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Speaker 1: really good to note as well. Like, and I bring

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Speaker 1: up IBM because I've got some clients who work for IBM,

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Speaker 1: and I'm like, shout out to the big companies who

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Speaker 1: give people a foundation of experience. Yeah, so there's no

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Speaker 1: shade to going to a big old company. But I

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Speaker 1: think what's great is that you weren't afraid to change

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Speaker 1: your mind and you weren't afraid to go in a

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Speaker 1: different direction. And I recently heard a statistic that was

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Speaker 1: like the highest and this is a basketball reference. Okay,

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Speaker 1: so obviously I don't know what I'm talking about, but

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Speaker 1: this stat was like the top five highest scoring players

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Speaker 1: were also the top five highest missed basket players. What

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Speaker 1: do you call that brick?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, so like they had the bricks.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, you do conference field goals missed, so they probably

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Speaker 2: had the most.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, because they're shooting a lot o basketball.

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Speaker 1: That's not a field goal, is it.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it's called a field goal. It's confusing. This is

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Speaker 2: a tough what it is?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, the thing that Shaq can't do. That's a field goal.

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Speaker 2: That's a free throw?

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Speaker 1: Oh feel a free okay anyway, Yeah, but my point

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Speaker 1: is like in order to get the wins, get the house,

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Speaker 1: get the airbnb, you know, get the debt paid off,

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Speaker 1: you had to make like a lot of like take

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Speaker 1: some risks, like go for it, you know, and the

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Speaker 1: layoff being one of the times that it didn't that

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Speaker 1: you could perceive it as like, oh, took that shot,

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Speaker 1: it didn't pay off. But look at all the things that,

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Speaker 1: you know, all the chances you did take that did

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Speaker 1: pay off. And I feel like a lot of people

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Speaker 1: that I work with and even who listen to the

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Speaker 1: show just are like love coming back because it's like

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Speaker 1: giving you permission, helping you feel safer, you know, taking

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Speaker 1: that shot, because failing is yeah, failing is scary. I

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Speaker 1: have failed. I will fail, you know in the future

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Speaker 1: with some projects that I pursue. But I'm also going

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Speaker 1: to really succeed because I'm going to keep doing stuff.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, That's why I loved when you first

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Speaker 2: started the show, Like I'm a I'm an artist, so

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Speaker 2: I vibe with concepts and name and even brands and logos.

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Speaker 2: Thanks to wearing ours again. By the way, follow us

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Speaker 2: at Pineapple cut Pictures on Instagram, or you can follow

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Speaker 2: me at alex J Woodriff. I may not be on

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Speaker 2: in a few months.

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Speaker 1: I might have to leave, you should have said at

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Speaker 1: the beginning of the show, as I will. That's what

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Speaker 1: most listenership is. You know what I'm saying.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, like the Brown ambition, the name it speaks

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Speaker 2: to everything you just said. It's like you have to

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Speaker 2: have that be your affirmation. Be ambitious, be audacious when

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Speaker 2: you have the ability to, Like, those are things that

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Speaker 2: have served me very well. Is when I know that

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Speaker 2: I understand what it is I'm doing, I'm good. Those

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Speaker 2: are the times to be audacious. Those are the times

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Speaker 2: to try to go a step further than maybe where

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Speaker 2: you'd be comfortable, and that's how you're going to For example,

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Speaker 2: I built the house after I first bought a condo.

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Speaker 2: That was pretty audacious, but I did have a little

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Speaker 2: bit of a foundation because I had renovated my condo.

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Speaker 2: So those things, you know, are important to try. And

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Speaker 2: now whatever I do next, who knows, right, but it's

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Speaker 2: going to be something that's audacious because that's just part

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Speaker 2: of my DNA.

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Speaker 1: I mean direct writing and directing your first features sary

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Speaker 1: short yeah, short film, Yeah, I've learned that from Project

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Speaker 1: green Light. It's a short, but still it's really freaking amazing.

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Speaker 1: I wish I could be there in person to see it.

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Speaker 1: But I want to end on that note, just like

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Speaker 1: talking about the audacity of Brown ambition and how you

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Speaker 1: persona by that, and I'm just so damn proud of you, baby.

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Speaker 2: Bro, thank you so much, and the feeling is way mutual.

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Speaker 3: I'm so happy. I wish TIF could be here. I

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Speaker 3: tell her too.

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Speaker 1: But y'all, maybe you'll come back on the show.

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Speaker 2: I want to be back.

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Speaker 3: I mean, you know, you know if you're watching the

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Speaker 3: reviews on this one, like the I want to get

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Speaker 3: the I want to get.

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Speaker 1: The listening, well, I don't know, you're gonna have to

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Speaker 1: be on i G because like that's where the BA

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Speaker 1: fan is on IG interacting with our clips. Also, you

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Speaker 1: can listen to this on or watch on YouTube if

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Speaker 1: you want to see how much Alex may Or may

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Speaker 1: not look like me, y'all me, I am the original doppelganger,

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Speaker 1: not Drake. Yes, people, then no one used to say

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Speaker 1: you look like Drake when.

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Speaker 3: His hair goes down. Yeah, it's pretty uncanny.

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Speaker 1: How much we look like m Yeah, but you know

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Speaker 1: you'll always be number one, all right, Alex James Mischief.

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Speaker 3: Thank wow.

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Speaker 2: I love it.

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Speaker 1: It was either it was either the Pineapple cut shirt

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Speaker 1: or the Harry Potter Sorcerer's Stone T shirt that you

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Speaker 1: gave me. That I couldn't find.

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Speaker 3: Oh, that's the shirt I brought you. Okay, I knew

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Speaker 3: i'd brought you a shirt.

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Speaker 1: That's what, and I knew it wasn't Pineapple Cut, But

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Speaker 1: you know what, I just moved on from that, but

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Speaker 1: you came around, all right. Thank you Alex for joining

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Speaker 1: Brown Ambition. You guys please run to go follow Pineapple

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Speaker 1: Cut Pictures on ig where you can stay abreast of

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00:19:28,880 --> 00:19:32,040
Speaker 1: all the news you've got. Your your shorts are entering

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Speaker 1: film festivals, and I hope people get a chance to

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Speaker 1: see My Sore Magic, which is just so cute, so

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Speaker 1: sweet and adorable and heart you know, heartwarming and beautifully shot,

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Speaker 1: just gorgeous the colors, I mean, so much of it.

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Speaker 1: And also Forgive Us is one of the films that

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Speaker 1: really whoa very different than My Sore Magic, but another

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Speaker 1: short that you all have done. And good luck this

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Speaker 1: weekend making your first film.

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Speaker 2: Thank you.

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Speaker 1: I won't try to call our text you don't worry,

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Speaker 1: but I will. You won't answer.

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Speaker 3: That's good.

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Speaker 1: Focus on the art.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I will be very very busy.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, but it's so dope. All right. Bye,