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Speaker 1: From the heart where Innovation, money and power Collie in

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Speaker 1: Silicon Valley, NBN.

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Speaker 2: This is Bloomberg Technology with Caroline Hyde.

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Speaker 3: And edlud Love.

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Speaker 4: Live from Bloomberg's World headquarters in New York.

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Speaker 3: I'm Ed Ludlow.

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Speaker 4: Caroline Hyde is off today. This is Bloomberg Technology. Coming

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Speaker 4: up on the program. Open ai kicks off its first

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Speaker 4: ever developers conference, with engineers and entrepreneurs gathering in downtown

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Speaker 4: San Francisco. We'll break down what we expect from the event.

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Speaker 4: Plus we'll push your head to earnings this week and

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Speaker 4: get the macro take on big text results as companies

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Speaker 4: deliver even bigger profits than Wall Street anticipated, will it last?

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Speaker 4: And Apple is in search of a new growth engine

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Speaker 4: after warning on a slower holiday season. Can the vision

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Speaker 4: pro solve that problem we discussed at first? The maker

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Speaker 4: chat Chat GPT sorry is about to still go through

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Speaker 4: a kind of Silicon rally rite of passage. Today is

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Speaker 4: OpenAI's first Developers conference in downtown San Francisco. Hundreds of

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Speaker 4: software engineers and entrepreneurs gathering to hear about the best

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Speaker 4: use of the company's tools and how they can build

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Speaker 4: their own products with the underlying GBT technology. Who have

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Speaker 4: we got on the ground. Bloomberg's Rachel Metz is at

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Speaker 4: the developers conference set the scene for us. What is

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Speaker 4: this event symbolized?

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Speaker 5: Rachel, this event is a really big deal through open ai.

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Speaker 5: It has to have a developer conference before. We've seen

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Speaker 5: so many technology companies that are big and want to

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Speaker 5: be larger create these events to get developers more involved

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Speaker 5: with their products over time, like Apple and Meta and Microsoft, Amazon,

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Speaker 5: and they do these events here after year, and they've

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Speaker 5: in many cases become a really big deal for a

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Speaker 5: company to telegraph what they want to share book with

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Speaker 5: developers and eventually with consumers.

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Speaker 4: We relaunched the Bloomberg Technology Show almost a year ago

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Speaker 4: to the day, and it's almost a year ago to

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Speaker 4: the day that the chat GPT has made public. It's

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Speaker 4: more towards the end of November, but open Eyes just

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Speaker 4: dominated basically the discussion at least around the work in

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Speaker 4: generative AI and the foundation models that power them. How

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Speaker 4: big is that lead right now? Do you think, Rachel,

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Speaker 4: based on all the reporting you've done over the last

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Speaker 4: twelve months.

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Speaker 2: I think it's big.

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Speaker 5: But there are a lot of companies that are really

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Speaker 5: getting in there and creating their own models, coming up

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Speaker 5: with their own tools of open source. There's also from

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Speaker 5: large tech companies. A lot of people are really interested

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Speaker 5: in this space, and it's going to be interesting to

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Speaker 5: see both what open AI brings out so it can

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Speaker 5: stay ahead, and also what happens in the months to come.

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Speaker 4: So the one side of the AI story that we

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Speaker 4: love is there's still a human side. There's who's who

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Speaker 4: in the world of AI. We expect Sam Mountman of

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Speaker 4: course to be on site, right Rachel absolutely.

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Speaker 5: I think well, there's probably bunch of executives here. I

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Speaker 5: haven't had time to wander around too much yet, but

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Speaker 5: Sam's expected to be here.

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Speaker 3: I believe Mira Murradi.

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Speaker 6: Will probably be here.

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Speaker 5: She's also a very important executive at the company, and

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Speaker 5: probably a bunch of other people. I mean that it's

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Speaker 5: a really interesting time for the company. I would guess

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Speaker 5: that if you could be here, you'd probably want to

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Speaker 5: be here.

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Speaker 4: Boombos. Rachel Metz on the ground at the Open AIS

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Speaker 4: Developers conference, and she will be reporting across all Bloindoe

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Speaker 4: platforms throughout the day. Thank you so much. Another story

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Speaker 4: we're watching, Elon Musk revealed his own artificial intelligence spot

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Speaker 4: to challenge chat GPT over the weekend called grock. He

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Speaker 4: claims the prototype is already superior to GPT three point

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Speaker 4: five across several benchmarks. It's the first product of Musk's

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Speaker 4: XAI company that is currently testing with a limited group

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Speaker 4: of users in the US. But interestingly, you have to

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Speaker 4: be an ex the company formerly known as Twitter Premium

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Speaker 4: subscriber to get on that waitlist, something that I signed

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Speaker 4: up for overnight. Let's stick with AI and bring in

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Speaker 4: Mike Mason, he's Chief AI officer of global tech consultancy

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Speaker 4: thought Works, and Mike I wanted to get you on

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Speaker 4: the program because this is a moment where we can say, Wow,

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Speaker 4: what are twelve months it's been? You heard me frame

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Speaker 4: it to Rachel in terms of what open ai did

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Speaker 4: first in November of twenty twenty two, do you see

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Speaker 4: them as having, particularly in the software space right a

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Speaker 4: clear lead in the field of generative AI.

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Speaker 1: I think they certainly do have a lead. They were

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Speaker 1: first out of the gate with GPT three point five,

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Speaker 1: then four point zero, and just a month or so

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Speaker 1: ago they added GPT four V, which is adding vision

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Speaker 1: to their product. They're also scaling very strongly from a

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Speaker 1: revenue perspective, but I think they are not the only

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Speaker 1: game in town. Certainly we're seeing features from Microsoft, Google, Amazon,

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Speaker 1: and all of the cloud players are really adding AI

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Speaker 1: into their platforms. I think AI is going to be

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Speaker 1: the next battleground for those large companies. It is almost

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Speaker 1: a bewildering array of options.

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Speaker 3: So the thought works.

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Speaker 1: As a technology consulting firm, we advise our clients on

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Speaker 1: how they can build technology to solve their biggest challenges,

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Speaker 1: and AI is certainly in that list. We worked with

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Speaker 1: one client where we were helping them with their AI strategy,

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Speaker 1: and before we'd even got started, they showed us two

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Speaker 1: hundred and seventy ideas for how GENAI might improve their

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Speaker 1: business and create value for them. And so you know,

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Speaker 1: clearly having ideas is not the difficult bit. It's figuring

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Speaker 1: out which of those ideas are really going to create

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Speaker 1: business value for you, and then doing a proof of

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Speaker 1: value and then getting that into production. Something that we're

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Speaker 1: seeing a lot happening is that companies are able to

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Speaker 1: do a proof of concept, but they don't really have

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Speaker 1: the machinery in place to take that through into production

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Speaker 1: at scale delivering value. And so that's an area where

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Speaker 1: we can help.

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Speaker 4: Well, a company having two hundred and seventy ideas, I

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Speaker 4: don't know that there are two hundred and seventy large

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Speaker 4: language models on the market to choose from. Maybe there

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Speaker 4: are that many. I think we're talking about those with

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Speaker 4: sort of tens of billions of parameters, you know, from

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Speaker 4: GPT three point five LAMA to the work then thropic inflection.

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Speaker 4: AI are doing things like that. Today is the Open

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Speaker 4: AI dev conference. And when a company holds an event

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Speaker 4: like this, Mike, what is it you want to hear

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Speaker 4: from them?

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Speaker 1: Well, so I would expect to hear more about model features,

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Speaker 1: So new features that they're introducing, maybe more vision, maybe

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Speaker 1: some cogeneration. Maybe also multimodal models, so that's a model

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Speaker 1: that can work across text and speech and image and

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Speaker 1: possibly video, both for input and output, and can kind

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Speaker 1: of fluidly move between those modes of interaction. I'd expect

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Speaker 1: to see greater clarity around costs of using these models.

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Speaker 1: One of the problems with generative AI is that the

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Speaker 1: costs are unpredictable, and that can be a serious barrier

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Speaker 1: to getting these things into production and creating value from them.

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Speaker 1: I might also expect to see some words around safety features. Safety,

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Speaker 1: of course, is a huge factor in AI. We put

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Speaker 1: out some consumer research a couple of weeks ago where

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Speaker 1: we interviewed ten thousand consumers about their attitudes towards AI,

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Speaker 1: and we found that more than ninety percent of people

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Speaker 1: had concerns about data privacy, their data usage, and whether

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Speaker 1: companies are being responsible and transparent with AI. And actually,

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Speaker 1: I really think there's something there. You know, taking a

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Speaker 1: privacy forward stance can be a brand enhancing move.

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Speaker 4: We're just showing on the screen, you know that the

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Speaker 4: cloud provider perspective, because ultimately, if you're a company that

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Speaker 4: wants to invest in AI, what we're talking about here

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Speaker 4: is compute and you mentioned the costs associated with that.

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Speaker 4: I've reported that open ai will likely book a billion

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Speaker 4: dollars of revenue this year, but there is a concern

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Speaker 4: about the competitive pricing to bring in customers and then

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Speaker 4: the long term profitability because crunching the data is proving expensive.

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Speaker 4: How closely do you look at that, mic Well, I.

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Speaker 1: Think it's difficult to look at it closely because those

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Speaker 1: figures closely guarded secrets from those companies. But reading the

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Speaker 1: tea leaves I would say that I don't think they

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Speaker 1: really know whether they're pricing is where it needs to

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Speaker 1: be to make the money. You've seen both Google and

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Speaker 1: Microsoft with Duet and Office three six five add GENAI

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Speaker 1: features to their productivity tool suites, and that's kind of

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Speaker 1: in the thirty dollars per person per month zone. I

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Speaker 1: don't think they actually know whether they're going to make

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Speaker 1: money from that. It's something that's going to shake out

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Speaker 1: in the long term. Rumors around chatch EPT five, of course,

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Speaker 1: say the open AI is really focused on efficiency, and

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Speaker 1: efficiency really means bringing down the cost to run that.

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Speaker 1: I think another option that should not be overruled is

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Speaker 1: to look at the open source world. There's amazing progress

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Speaker 1: with models that are less big, smaller. You know, you

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Speaker 1: can run them yourself, you can run them in house,

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Speaker 1: and that's especially useful if you want to keep tight

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Speaker 1: control over your data and not actually use a cloud

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Speaker 1: provider for your AI.

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Speaker 4: Well, the event is underwear in San Francisco in about

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Speaker 4: an hour's time, so whether their rumors or not, we

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Speaker 4: will get some more information later on in Monday's day.

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Speaker 4: Foult Works Chief AI Officer Mike Mason, thank you so

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Speaker 4: much now coming up here on Bloobow Technology. Earnings of

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Speaker 4: the big tech companies are kind of about the way.

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Speaker 4: We're going to take a deeper look at how the

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Speaker 4: group delivered in the past quarter, what that spells for

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Speaker 4: the sets going forward, big emphasis on profit. We're also

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Speaker 4: taking a look at another Elon Musk company, Tesla. Reuter's

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Speaker 4: reporting that Berlin and Gigaberlin will be home to this

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Speaker 4: twenty five thousand euro next generation platform. That's around twenty

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Speaker 4: seven thousand dollars. You know, I was speaking to sources

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Speaker 4: throughout the day. The long term expectation was that it

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Speaker 4: would be Shanghai that went first, but it looks like

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Speaker 4: in the battle for affordable EBS that battleground, at least

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Speaker 4: Tesla's perspective, and according to Reuter's reporting, is going to

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Speaker 4: be done out of Berlin. The stockdown half of percent.

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Speaker 4: Tesla did not respond to requests for comment and a

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Speaker 4: note on programming. Tomorrow, Bloomberg will introduced a new podcast

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Speaker 4: called Elon Inc. It's going to break down the most

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Speaker 4: important stories on Mask all of his companies in his

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Speaker 4: empire across the Bloomberg newsroom. Tune into that. This is

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Speaker 4: Bloomberg Technology okay, time for talking tech. First up, Bumble

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Speaker 4: founder Whitney wolf Heard is stepping down from her role

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Speaker 4: as CEO. Wolf Heard founded the women's centric dating app

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Speaker 4: in twenty fourteen and later took it public in twenty

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Speaker 4: twenty one. She also briefly became one of the world's

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Speaker 4: few women billionaires, who will be succeeded by Slack CEO

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Speaker 4: Lydian Jones in January. And a Chinese startup founded by

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Speaker 4: bench capitalist Kaifu Lee has taken the artificial intelligence space

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Speaker 4: by storm with its one billion dollar valuation just eight

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Speaker 4: months into its existence. I'm talking about zero one AI,

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Speaker 4: which also received funding from the likes of Aali Barber's

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Speaker 4: cloud unit. The startup developed an open source large language

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Speaker 4: model available in both Chinese and English. Plus a flurry

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Speaker 4: of AI related hearings are set to take place on

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Speaker 4: Capitol Hill this week. US lawmakers in both the House

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Speaker 4: and the Senate will gather to discuss possible measures to

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Speaker 4: rain in the technology, especially as campaigning for the twenty

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Speaker 4: twenty four general election heats up. This comes amid President

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Speaker 4: Biden's sweeping executive order, which of course was issued last week.

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Speaker 4: Now earnings for most big tech companies have come out,

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Speaker 4: and while the group deliver better than expected profits, the

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Speaker 4: outlook for those stocks are on shaky ground based on

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Speaker 4: sales joining us from Chicago blooms Bloomberg's Ryan Lostellica. It's

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Speaker 4: so interesting how the story changed. Right we go into

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Speaker 4: it going, oh, that the magnificent five or seven. They're

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Speaker 4: propping up profit estimates for twenty twenty four. We've come

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Speaker 4: out the other side, and now everyone's worried about the

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Speaker 4: sale out the ryme.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, absolutely.

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Speaker 7: I mean the thing about this earning season is really

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Speaker 7: that no matter what narrative you really want to abscribe to,

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Speaker 7: you will find a big tech result that will kind

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Speaker 7: of fit your point of view. So Microsoft, for example,

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Speaker 7: had very strong results. The stock initially did quite well,

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Speaker 7: but given concerns about the macro backdrop and the Fed

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Speaker 7: and treasure yields and things like that, the stock barely

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Speaker 7: ended higher on the day, you know, pretty slight gain. Then,

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Speaker 7: on the other hand, you have something like Alphabet, which

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Speaker 7: was also a pretty strong result except for some weakness

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Speaker 7: in their cloud business, and that stock saying almost ten

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Speaker 7: percent following results, So a pretty outsized reaction, especially for

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Speaker 7: a company that would probably classify as one of the

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Speaker 7: cheaper of the big tech stocks at these traditional evaluation metrics.

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Speaker 7: And then last week we saw Apple come out and

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Speaker 7: they really gave a sort of a discouraging forecast for

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Speaker 7: their holiday season, especially given concerns about the strength of

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Speaker 7: their business in China, which is a major market for

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Speaker 7: them for both supply chain and consumer demand purposes. That stock, however,

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Speaker 7: it fell on the day, but not too much considering

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Speaker 7: because there was a little bit of optimism about FED

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Speaker 7: policy and you know that path going forward there. So

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Speaker 7: again a very mixed thing. There's a lot of focus

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Speaker 7: on the macroeconomic environment. But I'd say overall the big

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Speaker 7: tech earnings have been mixed so far. But it does

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Speaker 7: seem like people, you know, overall have been kind of

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Speaker 7: looking past them and looking to what's the come next.

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Speaker 4: Ran you are a member of the Bloomberg newsroom who's

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Speaker 4: just like zeroed in on the Bloomberg terminal, every headline,

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Speaker 4: every piece of data, and you flagged me before the

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Speaker 4: show this UBS note right, which shows us that not

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Speaker 4: everyone agrees with the fair you know, UBS's perspective is

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Speaker 4: that tech stocks look contractive right now.

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Speaker 6: Yeah.

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Speaker 3: Absolutely.

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Speaker 7: It says that some of the figures surrounding the group

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Speaker 7: are overdone, and the you know, the sector looks pretty

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Speaker 7: well positioned for growth, especially in twenty twenty four. It

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Speaker 7: expects it to be one of the most you know,

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Speaker 7: robustly growing sectors in the economy.

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Speaker 4: So that's obviously a positive.

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Speaker 7: It sees you know, buying opportunity and semiconductors, it sees

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Speaker 7: you know, pretty you know, attractive margin prospects for software companies,

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Speaker 7: and you know, we're talking about pretty widespread optimism there.

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Speaker 7: And I would say that even though there were some

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Speaker 7: disappointments this season and some pronounced selloffs, you know, most

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Speaker 7: analysts remain pretty positive about the group, especially from a

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Speaker 7: longer term perspective as far as their growth potential.

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Speaker 4: So there's what's been and then there's what's to come

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Speaker 4: for me in Vidia. You know, it's been an incredible

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Speaker 4: ride on the stock YEA to date, but now because

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Speaker 4: it's so big, like from an index perspective and a

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Speaker 4: wasting perspective, the market will pay attention, right.

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Speaker 7: Yeah, absolutely, and it's going to get you know, additional

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Speaker 7: focus you know again for you know, one of the

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Speaker 7: several quarters in a row now just because it is

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Speaker 7: so central to the AI thesis right now, chips are

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Speaker 7: really the first stop or anyone who's looking to build

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Speaker 7: out any kind of AI infrastructure. Past two quarters have

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Speaker 7: been extremely strong as far as their forecast goes. Will

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Speaker 7: they go for a hat trick?

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Speaker 4: Will they do it again?

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Speaker 7: I mean, we'll see, And even then if they do,

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Speaker 7: who knows how the stock's going to react? Is because

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Speaker 7: you know, it's a name that you know by many

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Speaker 7: traditional metrics, is you know, kind of looking pricey, especially

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Speaker 7: within a context of you know, potential or higher rate environment.

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Speaker 7: So that's one that people are going to be paying

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Speaker 7: a lot.

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Speaker 4: Of attention to.

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Speaker 7: And if they kind of give any indication that AI

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Speaker 7: demand isn't as strong as maybe some people are hoping for,

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Speaker 7: that could have some broader implications as well.

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Speaker 4: Definitely in the data center contact we focus so much

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Speaker 4: in H one hundred. We have Grace Hopper coming down

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Speaker 4: the pipe as well, thanks of billiam I's Ryan Flaseelica

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Speaker 4: out there.

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Speaker 8: People want to keep flying, families want to go on holidays.

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Speaker 8: They just don't want to pay of turns as outrageous prices.

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Speaker 8: So I think fares that next year, I mean, my

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Speaker 8: operating assumptions fhares will go by a low double digit

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Speaker 8: percentage again through the summer twenty four. It'd be the

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Speaker 8: third year in a row, third summer in a row,

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Speaker 8: we'll see double digit fare increases in Europe.

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Speaker 4: That was Ryan S CEO Michael O'Leary earlier on Bloomberg

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Speaker 4: Television with his outlook for travel demands. Also talked about

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Speaker 4: the fuel prices at the moment and sort of delays

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Speaker 4: in taking new airplanes impacting their ability to meet demand

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Speaker 4: and sticking with travel demand delights to say, we're joined

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Speaker 4: now by Expedy A CEO Peter Kern, and Peter is

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Speaker 4: interesting to hear what Michael leary said there, you know,

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Speaker 4: the challenges alongside meeting what he sees is demand. What

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Speaker 4: kind of demand do you see?

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Speaker 9: Yeah, well we've seen thanks ed for having me first

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Speaker 9: of all, and I enjoyed the clip.

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Speaker 3: What we see is steady demand.

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Speaker 9: I would say, I think what he's talking about is

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Speaker 9: that we are seeing some shifts as customers are looking

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Speaker 9: for lower cost carriers over the main airlines. So he's

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Speaker 9: probably benefiting from that and seeing a little bit of

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Speaker 9: a move in his direction. I think overall air demand

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Speaker 9: in Western Europe and in the North America, et cetera.

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Speaker 9: Is pretty steady, but we're seeing generally priced declines across

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Speaker 9: the markets. So I think what he's discussing as a

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Speaker 9: shift in his favor, but it's not necessarily that that's

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Speaker 9: true for everything across the board.

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Speaker 4: Peter, what fascinates me about Expedire in the portfolio of

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Speaker 4: brands and platforms is the granularity of your data. You know,

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Speaker 4: you can tell me the demographics of people that are

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Speaker 4: not traveling where they're traveling too. Right now, what does

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Speaker 4: gen z look like? I know that's a very specific question,

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Speaker 4: but who's traveling and particularly how have you seen the

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Speaker 4: younger traveler behave in the most recent quarter.

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Speaker 9: Yeah, I think we don't tend to break it that way,

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Speaker 9: but I can tell you that the travelers, you know

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Speaker 9: that Weezer travel has remained strong. Corporate still, you know,

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Speaker 9: still not back to pre COVID levels. You see a

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Speaker 9: lot of differences geography to geography. You know, we still

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Speaker 9: have Asia is still opening up to a certain extent,

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Speaker 9: which has been a tailwind in Asia and Latin America,

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Speaker 9: whereas the West has sort of normalized, I would say,

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Speaker 9: and in general, by and large, you know, people have

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Speaker 9: been waiting for travelers to trade down for cheaper alternatives.

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Speaker 3: We haven't seen that very much. Now.

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Speaker 9: It's true that at the lower end of the market

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Speaker 9: you see it a little bit more. But as you

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Speaker 9: know it, we introduced our new grand loyalty program called

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Speaker 9: one Key, and what we're seeing as people get accustomed

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Speaker 9: to that is they're actually trading up when they have

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Speaker 9: value that they can use to get a better room.

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Speaker 9: Like if they have one key cash, which is our

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Speaker 9: rewards currency, they trade up to a better room or

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Speaker 9: a better experience, or use that for something better.

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Speaker 4: Alongside Sorry to interrupeed, I was gonna say, alongside rewards.

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Speaker 4: You've also focused kind of on content creation and influences

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Speaker 4: on social media. Has that given any sort of tangible

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Speaker 4: boost to your sales?

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Speaker 9: Yeah, well we're you know, we're using all the latest

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Speaker 9: marketing and reach tools we can. I mean, for us,

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Speaker 9: it's an education process when we launch something like one Key,

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Speaker 9: we want people to understand it. When where you have

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Speaker 9: one key now in Verbo, which is the only place

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Speaker 9: you can get rewards and vacation rentals, we want to

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Speaker 9: make sure that people that are interested in vacation rentals

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Speaker 9: understand and appreciate the benefit. So sometimes, you know, old

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Speaker 9: fashioned advertising is the best way, and it's easier to

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Speaker 9: reach people with more information through influencers and such. But

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Speaker 9: you know, you referred to all the data we have

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Speaker 9: on gen z. That's really what's powering our product now

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Speaker 9: as we make the product better and better. The fact

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Speaker 9: that we have all that data is what allows us

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Speaker 9: to now take friction out of the process, use AI

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Speaker 9: and machine learning to make the.

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Speaker 3: Experience better, in the product better. And that's really where

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Speaker 3: we're focused.

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Speaker 4: It's the expedia that the consumer and our audience around

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Speaker 4: the world knows. And then there's the B to B business.

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Speaker 4: When you look at your growth trajectory going forward, what

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Speaker 4: is the splitting contribution of those two.

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Speaker 9: Yeah, well, B to B it's had a very good

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Speaker 9: run for us, and in part, as I mentioned earlier,

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Speaker 9: it has to do with the exposure of the business,

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Speaker 9: which is exposed more to Asia and some of the

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Speaker 9: markets that have come back more recently post COVID. But

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Speaker 9: also we've been building that business, building the technology in

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Speaker 9: that business, expanding our customer base. So that business has

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Speaker 9: seen you know, growth in the twenties for the last

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Speaker 9: several years, twenty percent plus.

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Speaker 3: Top line growth last quarter.

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Speaker 9: Was closer to twenty six twenty seven, but we expect

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Speaker 9: that to continue. It is a smaller part of our

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Speaker 9: overall business, and as you know, we've done a lot

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Speaker 9: of work in the last couple of years on our

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Speaker 9: core consumer business with one key with the launch of

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Speaker 9: new products and capabilities. So we expect our bigger business

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Speaker 9: to accelerate now, but the B to B business probably

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Speaker 9: has slightly more you know, tailwinds still for a bit.

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Speaker 4: Peter, very very quick. Friday, your stock took off like

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Speaker 4: a rocket, biggest jump since November twenty twenty. You must

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Speaker 4: be happy about that.

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Speaker 3: I was.

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Speaker 9: I don't pretend to understand the markets, but we've just

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Speaker 9: been shipping away at it, and I think the market's

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Speaker 9: starting to understand that all the work we've done has

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Speaker 9: set us up in a better way to go forward

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Speaker 9: than most of our competitors, and that's what we're really

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Speaker 9: excited about.

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Speaker 3: The market recognize it.

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Speaker 4: Expedia ceopiece, can Goods catch up? Have you here on

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Speaker 4: Bloomberg Technology. Welcome back to Bloomberg Technology ed here in

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Speaker 4: New York City this week. I want to get a

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Speaker 4: quick check in on bitcoin and it's been interesting to

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Speaker 4: track this, honestly, it's kind of been up and down.

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Speaker 4: It's trades twenty four to seven, of course, but there's

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Speaker 4: a debate whether any movement that we've seen to the

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Speaker 4: upside as we are around thirty five thousand US dollars

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Speaker 4: per token, has anything at all to do with the

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Speaker 4: outcome of the FTX trial and Sam Bankman Freed, who

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Speaker 4: was found guilty on multiple counts of fraud, securities fraud,

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Speaker 4: and conspiracy. Let's get to Sam Bankman Freed's guilty verdict.

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Speaker 4: The thirty one year old MIT graduate has been charged

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Speaker 4: on seven counts of wire fraud, securities fraud, and money

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Speaker 4: laundering and now faces the possibility of decades in prison

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Speaker 4: when he is sentenced, which we think will happen in March.

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Speaker 4: Joining us for more reaction on that trial, but its

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Speaker 4: impact on the cryptosphirit large is Jilak Joban Putra, founder

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Speaker 4: and managing partner of Future Perfect Ventures, an early stage

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Speaker 4: VC firm that focuses on blockchain technology, crypto assets, AI,

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Speaker 4: and human computer interaction. Your reaction to the outcome of

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Speaker 4: the truck, Well.

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Speaker 10: It's great to be with you. I think this is

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Speaker 10: a huge sigh of relief for the crypto industry. We've

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Speaker 10: moved on from this FTX trial or the news for

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Speaker 10: the last year. But at the end of the day,

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Speaker 10: fraud is fraud is fraud, and it doesn't matter what industry.

439
00:22:20,119 --> 00:22:22,879
Speaker 10: It's good to see that justice is served and we

440
00:22:22,920 --> 00:22:26,440
Speaker 10: can go back to backing and talking about the builders

441
00:22:26,480 --> 00:22:29,880
Speaker 10: that are in it to create a better world using

442
00:22:29,880 --> 00:22:30,879
Speaker 10: this new technology.

443
00:22:30,960 --> 00:22:33,280
Speaker 4: That is sentiment I think echoed by a number of

444
00:22:33,280 --> 00:22:36,760
Speaker 4: our guests on the show. There are those that acknowledge, however,

445
00:22:36,840 --> 00:22:40,359
Speaker 4: that it had an impact right up until the jury

446
00:22:40,400 --> 00:22:44,320
Speaker 4: gave its verdict because of what it represented from a

447
00:22:44,359 --> 00:22:46,879
Speaker 4: sort of high to low collapse of the industry. As

448
00:22:46,920 --> 00:22:49,120
Speaker 4: a venture capitalist, have you been able to go out

449
00:22:49,160 --> 00:22:52,280
Speaker 4: and write checks with confidence over the last twelve months

450
00:22:52,320 --> 00:22:54,840
Speaker 4: into startups that are working on the underlying technology or

451
00:22:54,880 --> 00:22:57,200
Speaker 4: even backing a token of their.

452
00:22:57,119 --> 00:23:00,919
Speaker 10: Own Absolutely, I mean we were long term investors. We

453
00:23:01,000 --> 00:23:03,400
Speaker 10: have a ten year fund. I've been in the industry,

454
00:23:04,119 --> 00:23:06,880
Speaker 10: in the venture industry since nineteen ninety nine, so I've

455
00:23:06,920 --> 00:23:10,080
Speaker 10: certainly seen many cycles, and even within crypto for the

456
00:23:10,119 --> 00:23:14,520
Speaker 10: last ten years, there have been many cycles. So look,

457
00:23:14,560 --> 00:23:18,480
Speaker 10: I'm not going to lie FTX and what happened there

458
00:23:18,640 --> 00:23:21,960
Speaker 10: was such a magnitude that it did impact and have

459
00:23:22,000 --> 00:23:27,080
Speaker 10: an effect on all entrepreneurs, large companies and smaller companies

460
00:23:27,440 --> 00:23:33,000
Speaker 10: in the sector. But what the jury showed is four

461
00:23:33,080 --> 00:23:36,320
Speaker 10: hours to come to decision shows that the evidence was

462
00:23:36,320 --> 00:23:38,960
Speaker 10: so compelling that people are not going to get away

463
00:23:39,200 --> 00:23:41,800
Speaker 10: with this type of fraud in the industry. And I

464
00:23:41,800 --> 00:23:45,800
Speaker 10: think entrepreneurs can rest easy there and people who are

465
00:23:45,840 --> 00:23:49,640
Speaker 10: passionate about the sector continue to build and have continued

466
00:23:49,680 --> 00:23:54,199
Speaker 10: to build. Downturns are notorious for giving birth to some

467
00:23:54,280 --> 00:23:57,840
Speaker 10: of the most impactful companies throughout history.

468
00:23:58,040 --> 00:24:00,880
Speaker 4: Nick Kotta was on the show and Friday Costwhile Adventures

469
00:24:00,920 --> 00:24:03,600
Speaker 4: and he said that they were offer the opportunity twice

470
00:24:03,640 --> 00:24:06,400
Speaker 4: to invest in FDx, but they didn't feel right about

471
00:24:06,400 --> 00:24:09,480
Speaker 4: it and so they didn't. Just for sheer transparency of

472
00:24:09,480 --> 00:24:12,160
Speaker 4: our audience, did you ever have the opportunity to back

473
00:24:12,280 --> 00:24:15,880
Speaker 4: FDx or an associated group and did you? Yeah, I'll do.

474
00:24:15,880 --> 00:24:18,400
Speaker 10: Nick one better on that. We had an opportunity three

475
00:24:18,480 --> 00:24:22,920
Speaker 10: times to invest in FTX and did not. So we

476
00:24:23,160 --> 00:24:26,880
Speaker 10: are early stage investors. We like to see governance even

477
00:24:26,880 --> 00:24:32,280
Speaker 10: from the earliest stages in companies. Look crypto regulations very

478
00:24:32,320 --> 00:24:35,200
Speaker 10: uncertain around the world is getting more and more clarity

479
00:24:35,240 --> 00:24:38,680
Speaker 10: as we move on over the years. But that lack

480
00:24:38,720 --> 00:24:42,439
Speaker 10: of regulatory clarity actually creates more need for diligence on

481
00:24:42,480 --> 00:24:46,000
Speaker 10: the part of investors because we don't have regulators overseeing

482
00:24:46,080 --> 00:24:50,000
Speaker 10: these companies. So it's really important to know that, you know,

483
00:24:50,080 --> 00:24:53,600
Speaker 10: other co investors have the same it's kind of the

484
00:24:53,600 --> 00:24:57,280
Speaker 10: same incentives we do. That we trust the entrepreneur in

485
00:24:57,320 --> 00:25:00,440
Speaker 10: a sector that that's new, and there's lots of capital

486
00:25:00,480 --> 00:25:04,640
Speaker 10: floating around even right now in a downturn.

487
00:25:04,400 --> 00:25:06,760
Speaker 4: So where does the capital go, particularly in the context

488
00:25:06,840 --> 00:25:10,600
Speaker 4: of the underlying blockchain right you know, on this show

489
00:25:10,640 --> 00:25:13,280
Speaker 4: most recently we increasingly talk about it in the context

490
00:25:13,280 --> 00:25:18,320
Speaker 4: of gaming as opposed to crypto, where right now excites

491
00:25:18,359 --> 00:25:20,240
Speaker 4: you most well.

492
00:25:20,280 --> 00:25:24,040
Speaker 10: Our thesis from our inception feature of Perfect Ventures in

493
00:25:24,040 --> 00:25:29,440
Speaker 10: twenty fourteen is that crypto which is part of Web three.

494
00:25:29,600 --> 00:25:36,280
Speaker 10: So this intersection of crypto, AI, machine learning, Internet of things,

495
00:25:36,400 --> 00:25:42,000
Speaker 10: this collection and analnalytics of data as well as a

496
00:25:42,000 --> 00:25:44,800
Speaker 10: distribution of data is going to be the next Internet.

497
00:25:44,880 --> 00:25:48,520
Speaker 10: And so just like the Internet has impacted every industry,

498
00:25:48,840 --> 00:25:53,520
Speaker 10: the media, industry, financial services, we believe that Web three

499
00:25:53,640 --> 00:25:56,800
Speaker 10: crypto being a part of that will impact every industry,

500
00:25:56,840 --> 00:25:59,880
Speaker 10: so gaming is certainly one. I wrote a blog post

501
00:26:00,040 --> 00:26:03,719
Speaker 10: recently about what we're seeing around deep fakes in the media.

502
00:26:04,119 --> 00:26:08,960
Speaker 10: So one of the really great elements of crypto and

503
00:26:09,119 --> 00:26:12,480
Speaker 10: blockchain is the fact that you can track data prominence.

504
00:26:12,720 --> 00:26:16,000
Speaker 10: And that's why FTX is a little ironic because the

505
00:26:16,080 --> 00:26:19,359
Speaker 10: industry is supposed to be all about transparency, not about

506
00:26:19,359 --> 00:26:25,840
Speaker 10: cover ups, and so this provenance tracking of data. We

507
00:26:26,400 --> 00:26:29,800
Speaker 10: know if we're seeing a clip whether or not that

508
00:26:29,960 --> 00:26:33,720
Speaker 10: is authentic data. What we need now is the intersection

509
00:26:34,040 --> 00:26:37,679
Speaker 10: of machine learning where we can collect and analyze this

510
00:26:37,800 --> 00:26:43,080
Speaker 10: data in real time. So WhatsApp has forty million messages

511
00:26:43,160 --> 00:26:46,720
Speaker 10: that get posted per minute worldwide. Now there's no way

512
00:26:46,960 --> 00:26:50,919
Speaker 10: to quickly analyze all of those messages right now in

513
00:26:51,000 --> 00:26:53,919
Speaker 10: real time, but we are getting there, and when we

514
00:26:54,119 --> 00:26:57,439
Speaker 10: get there, we'll know that our data is authentic, or

515
00:26:57,440 --> 00:26:59,520
Speaker 10: it'll at least be water marked in a way where

516
00:26:59,520 --> 00:27:01,600
Speaker 10: we know what we're consuming is authentic.

517
00:27:02,520 --> 00:27:06,200
Speaker 4: Galacto Van Puncher, founder and managing partner of Future Perfect Ventures.

518
00:27:06,280 --> 00:27:09,760
Speaker 4: Great wide, broad ranging conversation, Thank you very much. Now

519
00:27:09,760 --> 00:27:11,000
Speaker 4: coming up here on the show, we're going to talk

520
00:27:11,040 --> 00:27:14,040
Speaker 4: about the state of investing in Europe's tech sector, and

521
00:27:14,119 --> 00:27:18,520
Speaker 4: celebrate an anniversary with Shnali Dereika of AXL That coming

522
00:27:18,600 --> 00:27:31,680
Speaker 4: up next from London, This is Bloomberg Technology. Some news

523
00:27:31,680 --> 00:27:34,960
Speaker 4: out of Europe. Artificial intelligence startup alif Alfa has raised

524
00:27:34,960 --> 00:27:37,840
Speaker 4: more than five hundred million dollars from a consortium of

525
00:27:37,920 --> 00:27:41,399
Speaker 4: industrial giants and financial investors as it tries to build

526
00:27:41,440 --> 00:27:44,639
Speaker 4: a European rival to the large language models created by

527
00:27:44,720 --> 00:27:47,520
Speaker 4: Open Ai and Google. Schwartz Group and the venture arm

528
00:27:47,560 --> 00:27:49,560
Speaker 4: of Robert Bosch joined a group of seven other new

529
00:27:49,600 --> 00:27:54,200
Speaker 4: investors in the financing round, which included SAP and HPE.

530
00:27:54,920 --> 00:27:57,120
Speaker 4: Right sticking with tech in Europe, It's time for today's

531
00:27:57,240 --> 00:28:00,359
Speaker 4: VC Spotlight. And joining us today is Sonali Deria, a

532
00:28:00,400 --> 00:28:03,440
Speaker 4: partner at Excel, where she focuses on the consumer next

533
00:28:03,520 --> 00:28:08,680
Speaker 4: generation financial services and software companies. Excel is also celebrating

534
00:28:08,760 --> 00:28:13,840
Speaker 4: this week four decades of operating in Europe. Shanali, welcome

535
00:28:13,880 --> 00:28:19,280
Speaker 4: to the program. Forty years of venture activity globally and

536
00:28:19,359 --> 00:28:21,760
Speaker 4: in Europe. How did the firm do it?

537
00:28:23,680 --> 00:28:25,720
Speaker 11: Thank you for having me here. Ed It's great to

538
00:28:25,720 --> 00:28:28,040
Speaker 11: see you, even if I'm in London and you're in

539
00:28:28,080 --> 00:28:32,359
Speaker 11: New York. You know, forty years it's a big milestone

540
00:28:32,359 --> 00:28:35,719
Speaker 11: and it's a really important time to be reflective. And

541
00:28:35,760 --> 00:28:38,880
Speaker 11: what I'll say is that we've always had the DNA

542
00:28:38,920 --> 00:28:43,200
Speaker 11: at Excel to find to build a relationship and to

543
00:28:43,320 --> 00:28:47,920
Speaker 11: invest in founders, exceptional founders really regardless of where they are,

544
00:28:48,280 --> 00:28:51,680
Speaker 11: and typically that's been in really far fun places. And

545
00:28:51,760 --> 00:28:54,960
Speaker 11: it's this philosophy that made us open up our London

546
00:28:55,000 --> 00:28:58,960
Speaker 11: office twenty three years ago, opened up India fifteen years

547
00:28:59,040 --> 00:29:01,840
Speaker 11: later in two thousand and fifteen, and it's really been

548
00:29:01,880 --> 00:29:04,080
Speaker 11: a core part of our success and why we were

549
00:29:04,120 --> 00:29:08,480
Speaker 11: able to invest in companies like Qualtrics in Utah, a

550
00:29:08,560 --> 00:29:13,120
Speaker 11: Classian in Australia, in Romania and Bucharest UiPath, one of

551
00:29:13,160 --> 00:29:16,720
Speaker 11: the most iconic companies to come out of Europe, companies

552
00:29:16,800 --> 00:29:22,000
Speaker 11: like fresh Works in Chennai in India, and to construct

553
00:29:22,040 --> 00:29:24,880
Speaker 11: a firm that things.

554
00:29:24,520 --> 00:29:25,640
Speaker 2: Global from the get go.

555
00:29:26,720 --> 00:29:28,600
Speaker 11: We sort of walk our walk and talk our talk,

556
00:29:28,640 --> 00:29:30,760
Speaker 11: if you will, and help our companies and help our

557
00:29:30,800 --> 00:29:34,920
Speaker 11: founders to become these category leaders. Wasn't easy, but I

558
00:29:34,920 --> 00:29:37,840
Speaker 11: think it's really been quite unique and it's been core

559
00:29:38,080 --> 00:29:39,800
Speaker 11: to everything we've achieved so far.

560
00:29:40,320 --> 00:29:44,560
Speaker 4: The rapid pace of companies being founded and funds being

561
00:29:44,640 --> 00:29:47,000
Speaker 4: raised in the AI context kind of set up this

562
00:29:47,200 --> 00:29:51,920
Speaker 4: nice USA versus Europe discussion, Right, is there going to

563
00:29:51,960 --> 00:29:55,920
Speaker 4: be a viable European maker builder of lms to take

564
00:29:55,960 --> 00:29:58,400
Speaker 4: on the likes of open AI. You heard me mention

565
00:29:58,480 --> 00:30:01,600
Speaker 4: alf Alfha now seeing a five hundred million dollar raise

566
00:30:01,640 --> 00:30:05,800
Speaker 4: this morning. What do you see as being potential for

567
00:30:06,440 --> 00:30:08,040
Speaker 4: European AI builders?

568
00:30:08,800 --> 00:30:10,120
Speaker 2: Yeah, I know, it's a great question.

569
00:30:10,400 --> 00:30:13,600
Speaker 11: What I'd say is that if you just take a

570
00:30:13,680 --> 00:30:17,040
Speaker 11: pause and think back around AI, because AI is really,

571
00:30:17,520 --> 00:30:20,200
Speaker 11: you know, the overnight revolution that's actually been going for decades.

572
00:30:20,240 --> 00:30:22,880
Speaker 11: It's more generative AREI that's probably less than a year old.

573
00:30:23,440 --> 00:30:27,480
Speaker 11: And when it comes to research, when it comes to citations,

574
00:30:28,080 --> 00:30:30,960
Speaker 11: Europe's probably had sort of fifty percent more in terms

575
00:30:31,000 --> 00:30:33,719
Speaker 11: of publications than the US. I mean, if you're going

576
00:30:33,720 --> 00:30:36,760
Speaker 11: to do the US versus Europe. That said, I think

577
00:30:36,760 --> 00:30:40,520
Speaker 11: a lot of the funding activity and a lot of

578
00:30:40,520 --> 00:30:44,000
Speaker 11: the startup activity and even the incombing activity has been

579
00:30:44,040 --> 00:30:46,800
Speaker 11: more in the US. But we're seeing a lot of

580
00:30:46,840 --> 00:30:52,480
Speaker 11: promising companies and entrepreneurs over here, and the majority of

581
00:30:52,480 --> 00:30:56,000
Speaker 11: the activity so far has been more in the infrastructure.

582
00:30:56,400 --> 00:31:01,240
Speaker 11: The large language model space, if you will. But the

583
00:31:01,320 --> 00:31:04,280
Speaker 11: Denovo the native applications if you will, that'll come in

584
00:31:04,360 --> 00:31:07,800
Speaker 11: and really native to AI, it's really still early innings.

585
00:31:07,920 --> 00:31:10,360
Speaker 11: So I think we're very much a little bit like

586
00:31:10,400 --> 00:31:13,160
Speaker 11: what mobile was and if you think six or seven

587
00:31:13,200 --> 00:31:17,800
Speaker 11: o eight when iOS and Android came out, but it

588
00:31:17,840 --> 00:31:21,240
Speaker 11: took a while for the Denovo apps on mobile to

589
00:31:21,320 --> 00:31:24,080
Speaker 11: really become big. And I think we'll see Europe play

590
00:31:24,160 --> 00:31:26,600
Speaker 11: probably a bigger role in some of the more vertical AI.

591
00:31:26,440 --> 00:31:30,200
Speaker 4: Applications Sonali As an aside, did you look at alif

592
00:31:30,280 --> 00:31:33,000
Speaker 4: Alfa or even a Mistral, you know that made a

593
00:31:33,040 --> 00:31:35,640
Speaker 4: debut with such a giant round earlier in the summer.

594
00:31:37,160 --> 00:31:37,360
Speaker 2: Yeah.

595
00:31:37,480 --> 00:31:40,720
Speaker 11: See, it's our job to, as you can imagine, to

596
00:31:41,000 --> 00:31:42,920
Speaker 11: meet with all the great founders, and we tend to

597
00:31:42,920 --> 00:31:46,000
Speaker 11: do this even when the founders haven't even started to

598
00:31:46,040 --> 00:31:48,880
Speaker 11: become founders themselves. We sort of track the builders, if

599
00:31:48,920 --> 00:31:51,880
Speaker 11: you will, as you called it. So, yes, I think,

600
00:31:52,000 --> 00:31:54,120
Speaker 11: you know, we've spent time with all of the interesting

601
00:31:54,120 --> 00:31:56,640
Speaker 11: companies in the AI space, and I think what I'd

602
00:31:56,680 --> 00:32:00,400
Speaker 11: say is that generally there's so many flavors of how

603
00:32:00,440 --> 00:32:03,840
Speaker 11: to think about these large language models. This infrastructure part

604
00:32:03,880 --> 00:32:09,160
Speaker 11: of the stack, from data, sovereignty, from privacy, from language,

605
00:32:09,240 --> 00:32:12,000
Speaker 11: from security. That there are a number of companies that

606
00:32:12,040 --> 00:32:15,240
Speaker 11: are sort of trying to figure out which part open source,

607
00:32:15,240 --> 00:32:18,440
Speaker 11: close source, which part of the box, if you will,

608
00:32:18,520 --> 00:32:20,640
Speaker 11: or the part of the market that they own. So

609
00:32:20,680 --> 00:32:23,600
Speaker 11: there's a number of these companies, and yeah, we spend

610
00:32:23,680 --> 00:32:24,600
Speaker 11: time with all of them.

611
00:32:25,040 --> 00:32:26,760
Speaker 4: The last time that I was in New York City

612
00:32:27,160 --> 00:32:30,600
Speaker 4: was in that September period of the IPO windows suddenly

613
00:32:30,640 --> 00:32:33,920
Speaker 4: opening up, and I was looking at your current portfolio

614
00:32:34,320 --> 00:32:38,280
Speaker 4: and then the historic Excel portfolio. So many successes you

615
00:32:38,280 --> 00:32:41,160
Speaker 4: know of companies that went public and built a legacy.

616
00:32:41,760 --> 00:32:44,240
Speaker 4: What's next in the IPO market? What is the next

617
00:32:44,320 --> 00:32:46,640
Speaker 4: name to your mind, particularly out of Europe to tap

618
00:32:46,680 --> 00:32:47,640
Speaker 4: the public markets.

619
00:32:49,200 --> 00:32:50,240
Speaker 2: Oh and I wish I knew.

620
00:32:50,240 --> 00:32:52,560
Speaker 11: I don't have a crystal ball to figure out what

621
00:32:53,000 --> 00:32:55,200
Speaker 11: is going to be nice, I will say, you know,

622
00:32:55,280 --> 00:32:58,400
Speaker 11: from an investor, from an entrepreneur perspective, it is a

623
00:32:58,400 --> 00:33:00,200
Speaker 11: bit of a confounding time time.

624
00:33:00,680 --> 00:33:01,960
Speaker 2: There is this deglobalization.

625
00:33:02,200 --> 00:33:04,720
Speaker 11: Everyone's trying to figure out what the next move is

626
00:33:04,720 --> 00:33:08,640
Speaker 11: from the central banks. We have some serious geopolitical issues

627
00:33:08,640 --> 00:33:12,520
Speaker 11: to wars, and so really thinking about what's going to

628
00:33:12,600 --> 00:33:16,080
Speaker 11: make the IPO window, which feels standardive right now truly

629
00:33:16,160 --> 00:33:19,440
Speaker 11: open isn't clear to anybody. I think the obvious answer

630
00:33:19,480 --> 00:33:23,480
Speaker 11: would be a real bell Weather stock to go public. So,

631
00:33:23,920 --> 00:33:25,840
Speaker 11: but time will tell. I think nobody's in a hurry.

632
00:33:26,320 --> 00:33:29,280
Speaker 11: A lot of these companies have a lot of cash

633
00:33:29,320 --> 00:33:31,560
Speaker 11: on their balance sheet, so everybody wants to make sure

634
00:33:31,600 --> 00:33:35,480
Speaker 11: they have time to execute and really have that be successful,

635
00:33:35,520 --> 00:33:36,640
Speaker 11: and so time will tell.

636
00:33:37,400 --> 00:33:40,760
Speaker 4: One portfolio company currently is Monzo, and I think Bloomberg's

637
00:33:40,760 --> 00:33:43,920
Speaker 4: listed Monso at least is a candidate for IPO at

638
00:33:43,920 --> 00:33:47,400
Speaker 4: some point. What happens next for them?

639
00:33:47,960 --> 00:33:51,040
Speaker 11: Mcmonzo is it's a special company. I mean from a

640
00:33:51,040 --> 00:33:53,760
Speaker 11: standing start, it's what is it the seventh largest bank

641
00:33:54,120 --> 00:33:55,920
Speaker 11: already in the UK. I think eight and a half

642
00:33:55,960 --> 00:34:02,240
Speaker 11: million customers. I think one one in every three six

643
00:34:02,280 --> 00:34:04,960
Speaker 11: people sorry in the UK have a Monso bank account,

644
00:34:05,400 --> 00:34:09,719
Speaker 11: and most of those customers find Monso pretty organically, so

645
00:34:09,800 --> 00:34:12,680
Speaker 11: it's got to a sizeable position. And I think, you know,

646
00:34:13,080 --> 00:34:15,360
Speaker 11: there was a point that a lot of the fintech

647
00:34:15,360 --> 00:34:17,600
Speaker 11: companies were out of favor, and I think Monzo really

648
00:34:17,600 --> 00:34:21,480
Speaker 11: prevailed because why of their promise to really deliver a

649
00:34:21,480 --> 00:34:25,200
Speaker 11: fabulous product with trust and safety to the consumers. So

650
00:34:25,640 --> 00:34:28,600
Speaker 11: I think companies like that really have a lot of

651
00:34:28,640 --> 00:34:30,480
Speaker 11: options open to them, and I think that will be

652
00:34:30,560 --> 00:34:32,759
Speaker 11: the name of the game, where companies really want to

653
00:34:32,760 --> 00:34:35,560
Speaker 11: control their own destiny. And that's the way we you know,

654
00:34:35,600 --> 00:34:38,719
Speaker 11: that's really our language with our founders and on the

655
00:34:38,760 --> 00:34:40,920
Speaker 11: bords is make sure you can control your own destiny

656
00:34:40,920 --> 00:34:41,880
Speaker 11: to the extent possible.

657
00:34:42,400 --> 00:34:44,800
Speaker 4: Sinari, I want to reflect on the next forty years

658
00:34:44,840 --> 00:34:48,040
Speaker 4: hopefully for Excel and maybe the role that London will

659
00:34:48,040 --> 00:34:50,160
Speaker 4: play in that. You know, that's city where I was born,

660
00:34:50,200 --> 00:34:53,000
Speaker 4: It is my home for most of my life. Caroline

661
00:34:53,000 --> 00:34:56,760
Speaker 4: as well. We're talking about London more and more outside

662
00:34:56,760 --> 00:34:59,279
Speaker 4: of a more narrow scope of fintech. But as you

663
00:34:59,320 --> 00:35:02,000
Speaker 4: look at the firm future, what role do you see

664
00:35:02,000 --> 00:35:05,960
Speaker 4: that city playing in your portfolio strategy and where you're

665
00:35:05,960 --> 00:35:07,040
Speaker 4: writing checks.

666
00:35:07,719 --> 00:35:10,000
Speaker 11: Yeah, you know we're based in London, but we really

667
00:35:10,040 --> 00:35:13,600
Speaker 11: cover a very vast footprint from the London office. I

668
00:35:13,640 --> 00:35:17,480
Speaker 11: think at last COUMP we've invested in over sixty eight cities,

669
00:35:17,520 --> 00:35:20,480
Speaker 11: more than twenty countries just in Europe and Monumn counting

670
00:35:20,520 --> 00:35:22,040
Speaker 11: sort of outside of the European market.

671
00:35:22,160 --> 00:35:24,000
Speaker 2: So London is an important base.

672
00:35:24,080 --> 00:35:27,520
Speaker 11: I think it's probably the second most exciting place when

673
00:35:27,560 --> 00:35:30,600
Speaker 11: it comes to deep tech AI talent, and there's spades

674
00:35:30,640 --> 00:35:33,759
Speaker 11: of it and I count sort of Greater London in

675
00:35:33,800 --> 00:35:37,120
Speaker 11: that too, and our ability to really spend time with

676
00:35:37,160 --> 00:35:40,760
Speaker 11: the right founders in the region from the London office

677
00:35:41,040 --> 00:35:43,239
Speaker 11: is going to be very important, and so that's how

678
00:35:43,280 --> 00:35:44,839
Speaker 11: we really view it. In the UK is of course

679
00:35:44,840 --> 00:35:47,880
Speaker 11: a big part of the venture capital scene. But as

680
00:35:48,320 --> 00:35:52,800
Speaker 11: the principles and rewards of entrepreneurship really become even better understood,

681
00:35:52,840 --> 00:35:55,840
Speaker 11: and as technology becomes pervasive, there are really going to

682
00:35:55,880 --> 00:35:58,360
Speaker 11: be great founders coming from everywhere and this is the

683
00:35:58,360 --> 00:36:00,800
Speaker 11: best place for us to be in order to travel

684
00:36:00,840 --> 00:36:02,000
Speaker 11: and see them and spend.

685
00:36:01,719 --> 00:36:02,480
Speaker 2: Time with them.

686
00:36:02,640 --> 00:36:07,160
Speaker 4: Snarali de Riiker of Excel. Congratulations on forty years of

687
00:36:07,160 --> 00:36:10,200
Speaker 4: a bench capital in Europe and beyond, and stick with

688
00:36:10,280 --> 00:36:20,120
Speaker 4: us in the next forty Thank you very much. Okay.

689
00:36:20,160 --> 00:36:22,440
Speaker 4: So Apple has not managed to snap out of a

690
00:36:22,520 --> 00:36:24,719
Speaker 4: year long sales slump, and on a conference call with

691
00:36:24,719 --> 00:36:27,880
Speaker 4: analyst last week, the company hitted at a holiday period

692
00:36:27,920 --> 00:36:31,680
Speaker 4: that would not be stellar, maybe a little sluggish, It

693
00:36:31,680 --> 00:36:35,719
Speaker 4: would mark potentially it's fifth straight quarter of sales declines

694
00:36:35,760 --> 00:36:38,560
Speaker 4: in a row. So now Apple's in need of a

695
00:36:38,640 --> 00:36:42,440
Speaker 4: new growth engine. Can the vision pro mixed reality headset

696
00:36:42,480 --> 00:36:45,479
Speaker 4: for Phil batt Let's bring in Bloomberg's chief correspondent Mark German,

697
00:36:45,480 --> 00:36:47,759
Speaker 4: who's been writing about this idea and power on. It

698
00:36:47,840 --> 00:36:50,080
Speaker 4: was interesting on the call, right that the analysts ask

699
00:36:50,200 --> 00:36:53,759
Speaker 4: questions about vision pro in how it's been received with developers,

700
00:36:54,280 --> 00:36:57,240
Speaker 4: the early signs that they'll get when they start shipping it.

701
00:36:57,280 --> 00:36:59,759
Speaker 4: But you've got a pretty clear thesis outlined in today's news.

702
00:36:59,840 --> 00:36:59,920
Speaker 3: That.

703
00:37:01,960 --> 00:37:05,680
Speaker 6: Yeah, it was interesting because going into the call, Wall

704
00:37:05,719 --> 00:37:08,520
Speaker 6: Street and the breadth of vandalysts we cite were pretty

705
00:37:08,520 --> 00:37:11,000
Speaker 6: adamant that Apple would grow about five percent in the

706
00:37:11,000 --> 00:37:13,400
Speaker 6: holiday period, right, but then look on my instry of

707
00:37:13,400 --> 00:37:17,200
Speaker 6: the company's CFO, he dropped this figurative, you know, this

708
00:37:17,200 --> 00:37:19,920
Speaker 6: this big announcement saying that it would be similar. Right,

709
00:37:19,920 --> 00:37:21,960
Speaker 6: the holiday quarter would come in similar to last year,

710
00:37:22,160 --> 00:37:26,360
Speaker 6: which means, like you there a decline or no growth,

711
00:37:26,400 --> 00:37:29,200
Speaker 6: so flat for the fifth quarter in a row. And

712
00:37:29,239 --> 00:37:31,920
Speaker 6: so this is a pretty you know, interesting situation for

713
00:37:31,920 --> 00:37:34,200
Speaker 6: Apple where they are making a ton of money, but

714
00:37:34,239 --> 00:37:35,800
Speaker 6: they're not growing like they used to.

715
00:37:36,000 --> 00:37:37,480
Speaker 3: And so Wall Street.

716
00:37:37,160 --> 00:37:40,280
Speaker 6: And analysts and investors. They're looking for a new growth engine,

717
00:37:40,400 --> 00:37:42,960
Speaker 6: and there's this strong potential for the Apple Vision Pro,

718
00:37:43,160 --> 00:37:47,280
Speaker 6: this mixture that's to one day be that growth engine

719
00:37:47,320 --> 00:37:48,120
Speaker 6: for the company.

720
00:37:48,239 --> 00:37:49,320
Speaker 3: Right, it's a new.

721
00:37:49,160 --> 00:37:52,040
Speaker 6: Category, but it's still very nascent, and at the get go,

722
00:37:52,080 --> 00:37:54,360
Speaker 6: it's going to be very expensive. And when they're putting

723
00:37:54,360 --> 00:37:56,440
Speaker 6: it on sale in their Apple retail source, it's going

724
00:37:56,480 --> 00:37:59,960
Speaker 6: to be a very curative experience that requires appointments, it's

725
00:38:00,080 --> 00:38:03,200
Speaker 6: going to require tryals sizing, and it's not, like kin

726
00:38:03,239 --> 00:38:06,799
Speaker 6: Cook said, going to be a graund like experience, which

727
00:38:06,840 --> 00:38:08,560
Speaker 6: means it's going to take a long time for them

728
00:38:08,600 --> 00:38:11,920
Speaker 6: to gather numbers gather revenue on this device. So combined

729
00:38:11,960 --> 00:38:14,520
Speaker 6: with that retail approach, combined with the price, this is

730
00:38:14,560 --> 00:38:16,920
Speaker 6: going to start out very slow, and eventually I think

731
00:38:16,960 --> 00:38:18,600
Speaker 6: they're going to need to switch more to an Apple

732
00:38:18,640 --> 00:38:21,400
Speaker 6: Watch model where they're moving from a curated experience with

733
00:38:21,440 --> 00:38:23,640
Speaker 6: appointments to something that is a bit more grab and go,

734
00:38:23,920 --> 00:38:25,320
Speaker 6: let's say like a mac ipowder.

735
00:38:25,400 --> 00:38:27,800
Speaker 4: I film even, well, it's interesting how they plan to

736
00:38:27,840 --> 00:38:29,840
Speaker 4: sell it, but also what it is. Right, I remember

737
00:38:29,880 --> 00:38:32,840
Speaker 4: being in Koubatino for the unveil Vision Pro You've written

738
00:38:32,880 --> 00:38:36,200
Speaker 4: so much about this. It's a thirty five hundred dollars product,

739
00:38:36,600 --> 00:38:40,000
Speaker 4: high end, but it's almost designed for developers, not a

740
00:38:40,040 --> 00:38:43,080
Speaker 4: mass market. So what is the plan with Apple for

741
00:38:43,120 --> 00:38:48,160
Speaker 4: a sort of more approachable, mainstream headset for a broader audience.

742
00:38:50,000 --> 00:38:51,839
Speaker 6: Yeah, the first iteration of the product, like you said,

743
00:38:52,040 --> 00:38:54,920
Speaker 6: is essentially a development device, right, This is a device

744
00:38:54,960 --> 00:38:57,880
Speaker 6: that developers are going to build mixed reality vision os

745
00:38:57,920 --> 00:39:00,799
Speaker 6: apps for and then eventually hope and pray that they

746
00:39:00,800 --> 00:39:03,520
Speaker 6: come out with a down market version, something maybe in

747
00:39:03,560 --> 00:39:06,880
Speaker 6: the one to two thousand dollars range that eventually, eventually,

748
00:39:06,920 --> 00:39:11,839
Speaker 6: I say, maybe ten years from now, be a computer replacement.

749
00:39:12,080 --> 00:39:14,320
Speaker 6: And the goal is to have that app ecosystem ready

750
00:39:14,480 --> 00:39:16,879
Speaker 6: for when that day comes. And then the ultimate holy

751
00:39:16,960 --> 00:39:19,440
Speaker 6: grail in this space, in the future of computing space

752
00:39:19,440 --> 00:39:23,040
Speaker 6: with wearables, are lightweight augmented reality glasses. Now, if Apples

753
00:39:23,040 --> 00:39:25,280
Speaker 6: are able to come out with well priced augmented reality

754
00:39:25,280 --> 00:39:27,400
Speaker 6: glasses in five to ten years from now with a

755
00:39:27,440 --> 00:39:32,080
Speaker 6: full blown app ecosystem, going to have a huge hit

756
00:39:32,120 --> 00:39:35,480
Speaker 6: on their hands, potentially something that rivals the iPhone. But

757
00:39:35,560 --> 00:39:38,600
Speaker 6: the only way to launch with that type of success,

758
00:39:38,719 --> 00:39:40,840
Speaker 6: that type of interest in that type of market is

759
00:39:40,920 --> 00:39:44,160
Speaker 6: consumer education and to build an app ecosystem. So the

760
00:39:44,239 --> 00:39:46,120
Speaker 6: vision pro for at least the next few years is

761
00:39:46,120 --> 00:39:50,560
Speaker 6: going to be about educating consumers about this mixed reality technology,

762
00:39:51,560 --> 00:39:54,240
Speaker 6: how these applications work, and to get developers on board

763
00:39:54,480 --> 00:39:56,440
Speaker 6: because of course, many of the apps written for this

764
00:39:56,480 --> 00:39:59,120
Speaker 6: device will of course one day be compatible with other

765
00:39:59,200 --> 00:40:00,920
Speaker 6: augmented reality had it sets from Apple.

766
00:40:01,320 --> 00:40:04,520
Speaker 4: All right, Bloombog's chief correspondent for all things devices Apple, Markum,

767
00:40:04,560 --> 00:40:07,239
Speaker 4: and I really recommend our audience world, why do subscribe

768
00:40:07,440 --> 00:40:09,720
Speaker 4: to power on because it has all of the detail

769
00:40:09,760 --> 00:40:13,359
Speaker 4: about present and future products coming out of Apple. Well,

770
00:40:13,640 --> 00:40:16,480
Speaker 4: that does it for this edition of Bloomberg Technology. Thanks

771
00:40:16,520 --> 00:40:19,200
Speaker 4: so much to everyone out there that's reading the news

772
00:40:19,280 --> 00:40:21,960
Speaker 4: but also listening to the podcast wherever you get your podcasts,

773
00:40:22,040 --> 00:40:24,120
Speaker 4: all of the Bloomberg platforms, but we're also putting it

774
00:40:24,200 --> 00:40:27,919
Speaker 4: up on Apple, Spotify, and iHeart from New York City

775
00:40:28,000 --> 00:40:31,520
Speaker 4: this week, all week long, this is Bloomberg Technology