1 00:00:01,240 --> 00:00:06,080 Speaker 1: Something strange is going on. Who is killing Russian billionaires? 2 00:00:06,400 --> 00:00:08,600 Speaker 2: Another Russian oligarch has been found dead. 3 00:00:08,800 --> 00:00:11,840 Speaker 1: Reports suggests that he hanged himself, fell out of a window, 4 00:00:12,000 --> 00:00:15,520 Speaker 1: slashed his wrists, was poisoned, murdered his whole family. 5 00:00:16,960 --> 00:00:19,840 Speaker 2: Last year, more than a dozen Russian oligarchs died in 6 00:00:19,880 --> 00:00:23,239 Speaker 2: the space of nine months. Many of the deaths are 7 00:00:23,320 --> 00:00:28,120 Speaker 2: suspicious with links to the Kremlin. This is sad Oligach, 8 00:00:28,440 --> 00:00:30,160 Speaker 2: an investigation into. 9 00:00:29,920 --> 00:00:32,320 Speaker 1: These recently dead Russian billionaires. 10 00:00:32,840 --> 00:00:37,080 Speaker 2: It's created by me Jake Hanrahan and my colleague Sergey Slipchenkov. 11 00:00:38,240 --> 00:00:41,800 Speaker 2: Sad Oligarch is a H eleven production for Kulsomidia and 12 00:00:41,840 --> 00:00:53,199 Speaker 2: iHeart Radio. In the space of a year, more than 13 00:00:53,240 --> 00:00:56,800 Speaker 2: a dozen rich Russian businessmen have died in either brutal 14 00:00:56,960 --> 00:01:02,720 Speaker 2: or mysterious circumstances. Fell out of windows, some had heart attacks, 15 00:01:03,120 --> 00:01:08,160 Speaker 2: and a few even killed their whole families before committing suicide. 16 00:01:08,240 --> 00:01:11,160 Speaker 2: The official line from the Russian authorities is that most 17 00:01:11,200 --> 00:01:16,240 Speaker 2: of these deaths were accidents or violent consequences of mental illness, 18 00:01:16,760 --> 00:01:20,319 Speaker 2: and maybe that's true. But considering the majority of these 19 00:01:20,480 --> 00:01:24,800 Speaker 2: dead rich Russians are either outright oligarchs or have other 20 00:01:24,840 --> 00:01:28,640 Speaker 2: links to the Kremlin. It's possible that something much dark 21 00:01:28,680 --> 00:01:32,959 Speaker 2: it is taking place. These deaths have all occurred within 22 00:01:33,000 --> 00:01:37,039 Speaker 2: the backdrop of the Ukraine War, a brutal invasion that 23 00:01:37,080 --> 00:01:40,840 Speaker 2: has shown the whole world that Russia's President Putin is 24 00:01:40,920 --> 00:01:45,600 Speaker 2: both ruthless and brazen. Maybe the Kremlin has been tying 25 00:01:45,680 --> 00:01:49,120 Speaker 2: up loose ends or making examples of those who go 26 00:01:49,280 --> 00:01:54,040 Speaker 2: against them, as several of these dead oligarchs have for 27 00:01:54,200 --> 00:01:59,080 Speaker 2: some war can actually be bad for business. In this project, 28 00:01:59,280 --> 00:02:04,000 Speaker 2: Sad Oligarch, I'll be investigating the numerous strange deaths of 29 00:02:04,040 --> 00:02:07,720 Speaker 2: these rich Russian businessmen. I'll be doing this with my 30 00:02:07,920 --> 00:02:13,000 Speaker 2: friend and colleague, journalist Sergei Slipchenko. We believe that to 31 00:02:13,080 --> 00:02:17,520 Speaker 2: understand how these businessmen died is to understand more realistically 32 00:02:17,840 --> 00:02:21,880 Speaker 2: how the Kremlin truly operates. Now, of course, we're not 33 00:02:21,919 --> 00:02:24,960 Speaker 2: the only reporters to have done this. We're relying on 34 00:02:25,000 --> 00:02:28,520 Speaker 2: the work of many other sources and people who are 35 00:02:28,560 --> 00:02:36,280 Speaker 2: helping us, some of them can't be named. To appreciate 36 00:02:36,360 --> 00:02:39,160 Speaker 2: the relevance of these deaths, I think it's best to 37 00:02:39,360 --> 00:02:44,160 Speaker 2: first understand the role of the oligarch within Russia. Now 38 00:02:44,480 --> 00:02:47,480 Speaker 2: side note, we do have oligarchy in the West as well, 39 00:02:48,040 --> 00:02:50,720 Speaker 2: we just tend to refer to it by different terms, 40 00:02:50,760 --> 00:02:54,960 Speaker 2: such as lobbying. Anyway, for this series, we'll be focusing 41 00:02:55,040 --> 00:02:55,840 Speaker 2: on Russia. 42 00:02:56,440 --> 00:02:56,680 Speaker 1: Now. 43 00:02:56,720 --> 00:02:59,720 Speaker 2: Admittedly, not all of the dead Russians in this series 44 00:02:59,760 --> 00:03:04,200 Speaker 2: are necessarily starred up oligachs. They've often been branded as 45 00:03:04,280 --> 00:03:08,480 Speaker 2: such by Western media, but it doesn't always apply. The 46 00:03:08,520 --> 00:03:12,040 Speaker 2: lines are blurry. We're using the term loosely to help 47 00:03:12,160 --> 00:03:17,639 Speaker 2: understand a complicated situation. Ultimately, though, all the dead businessmen 48 00:03:17,760 --> 00:03:22,880 Speaker 2: were wealthy via employment in Kremlin linked business or otherwise 49 00:03:23,000 --> 00:03:27,480 Speaker 2: had connections to the Russian government, oligach branding or not. 50 00:03:28,200 --> 00:03:33,639 Speaker 2: But what actually is an oligach? An oligach put simply 51 00:03:33,840 --> 00:03:38,800 Speaker 2: is a wealthy businessman with deep political power and connections 52 00:03:38,800 --> 00:03:39,720 Speaker 2: to government. 53 00:03:40,720 --> 00:03:41,960 Speaker 1: Whilst Russia has. 54 00:03:41,840 --> 00:03:45,600 Speaker 2: A specifically recent history of oligachs since the fall of 55 00:03:45,640 --> 00:03:48,880 Speaker 2: the Soviet Union, the oligarch is by no means a 56 00:03:48,960 --> 00:03:53,760 Speaker 2: Russian concept only. However, in Russia oligarchs are often very 57 00:03:53,840 --> 00:03:57,320 Speaker 2: useful for the government when they're trying to dodge sanctions. 58 00:03:57,760 --> 00:04:00,760 Speaker 2: This is usually due to the complicated rupture of their 59 00:04:00,840 --> 00:04:04,920 Speaker 2: firms and shareholdings. We'll go into this in detail in 60 00:04:05,000 --> 00:04:08,960 Speaker 2: a later episode, As you'll see, many of the dead 61 00:04:09,080 --> 00:04:13,720 Speaker 2: Russian businessmen of the last twelve months shares several characteristics 62 00:04:13,760 --> 00:04:21,360 Speaker 2: with the tried and tested Oligachs. One of the first 63 00:04:21,480 --> 00:04:25,120 Speaker 2: murders we're looking into occurred just one month after the 64 00:04:25,200 --> 00:04:30,680 Speaker 2: Russian invasion of Ukraine. This is what happened to Vasily Melnikov. 65 00:04:32,320 --> 00:04:36,840 Speaker 2: On March twenty third, twenty twenty two, affluent Russian businessman 66 00:04:37,080 --> 00:04:42,240 Speaker 2: Vasily Melnikov, forty one, was found dead alongside his family 67 00:04:42,640 --> 00:04:46,800 Speaker 2: in their upscale Moscow apartment in the Nisney Novgorod area. 68 00:04:47,600 --> 00:04:52,200 Speaker 2: The family nanny discovered them. They'd all been stabbed to death, Vasily, 69 00:04:52,680 --> 00:04:56,799 Speaker 2: his wife, and their two sons, aged four and ten 70 00:04:57,000 --> 00:05:03,720 Speaker 2: years old. The killings were brutal and tragic. Straight away, 71 00:05:04,000 --> 00:05:07,840 Speaker 2: some European media outlets speculated that it could be a 72 00:05:07,880 --> 00:05:12,760 Speaker 2: contract killing an assassination. According to the police in Moscow, 73 00:05:12,800 --> 00:05:16,680 Speaker 2: though it was a murder suicide. They state that Vasily 74 00:05:16,760 --> 00:05:20,880 Speaker 2: stabbed his own family to death before killing himself, also 75 00:05:21,040 --> 00:05:26,960 Speaker 2: with a knife. Case closed. There's currently no verified indication 76 00:05:27,160 --> 00:05:31,520 Speaker 2: as to why this atrocity happened. Outwardly, things seemed to 77 00:05:31,520 --> 00:05:34,599 Speaker 2: be going well for Vasily Melnikov, him and his family 78 00:05:34,680 --> 00:05:37,960 Speaker 2: had just returned from a luxury holiday in the Maldives. 79 00:05:38,360 --> 00:05:42,880 Speaker 2: Vasily's company, Medstom, had just secured a lucrative three point 80 00:05:43,000 --> 00:05:48,320 Speaker 2: five million dollar contract. However, despite this success, and unnamed 81 00:05:48,520 --> 00:05:53,240 Speaker 2: source told Russian media that Vasily was apparently suicidal and 82 00:05:53,360 --> 00:05:57,520 Speaker 2: had confided this to his wife. There's no indication though, 83 00:05:57,600 --> 00:06:01,120 Speaker 2: as to why he would so callously take Kisshole family 84 00:06:01,320 --> 00:06:05,720 Speaker 2: with him. 85 00:06:05,839 --> 00:06:06,080 Speaker 1: Now. 86 00:06:06,120 --> 00:06:08,120 Speaker 2: On the face of it, this could just be a 87 00:06:08,160 --> 00:06:11,839 Speaker 2: case of a rich guy who went berserk and killed 88 00:06:11,839 --> 00:06:16,520 Speaker 2: his whole family before committing suicide. Maybe it really is 89 00:06:16,640 --> 00:06:21,159 Speaker 2: an open and shut case. It's possible. Sadly, things like 90 00:06:21,200 --> 00:06:25,080 Speaker 2: that do happen. However, when me and Sergey started looking 91 00:06:25,120 --> 00:06:30,480 Speaker 2: into the Melnikov murder suicide, we noticed a few unusual details. 92 00:06:30,839 --> 00:06:34,000 Speaker 2: What specifically caught our eye was one of the knives 93 00:06:34,160 --> 00:06:37,360 Speaker 2: used in the killings. In one of the crime scene photos, 94 00:06:37,680 --> 00:06:41,640 Speaker 2: the murder weapon, a tactical style knife, was seen resting 95 00:06:41,680 --> 00:06:44,280 Speaker 2: on a kitchen unit with blood on the end of 96 00:06:44,320 --> 00:06:48,240 Speaker 2: the blade. Molded into the handle was the insignia of 97 00:06:48,360 --> 00:06:54,000 Speaker 2: Russia's Special Rapid Response Team. They used the acronym SOBR, 98 00:06:54,520 --> 00:06:57,240 Speaker 2: which was also visible in the handle of the knife. 99 00:06:57,760 --> 00:07:01,960 Speaker 2: The SOBR or Sobber is an elite force in Russia 100 00:07:02,040 --> 00:07:05,320 Speaker 2: which was originally formed to deal with domestic anti terrorism 101 00:07:05,400 --> 00:07:10,480 Speaker 2: situations and high level organized crime. They even fought against 102 00:07:10,640 --> 00:07:14,440 Speaker 2: rebels in the Chechen and Dagistani wars. The knife at 103 00:07:14,440 --> 00:07:17,120 Speaker 2: the crime scene appears to belong to the SOB. 104 00:07:17,680 --> 00:07:21,840 Speaker 3: R Surgery explains the knife was like part of the evidence. 105 00:07:21,880 --> 00:07:26,360 Speaker 3: The Sober knife. Sober is Russian basically swat. It's like 106 00:07:26,400 --> 00:07:29,800 Speaker 3: a special forces unit in the police. They were disbanded 107 00:07:30,120 --> 00:07:32,480 Speaker 3: after like the early two thousands, but at that time 108 00:07:32,520 --> 00:07:36,040 Speaker 3: they were like the elite kind of police, like counter 109 00:07:36,160 --> 00:07:40,080 Speaker 3: terrorist organization. I think I think the West also has 110 00:07:40,120 --> 00:07:42,480 Speaker 3: this where when you join like one of these groups, 111 00:07:42,480 --> 00:07:45,880 Speaker 3: you get like a knife kind of like I guess 112 00:07:45,920 --> 00:07:47,160 Speaker 3: they're like badge of honor. 113 00:07:47,520 --> 00:07:52,800 Speaker 2: As Sergei mentioned, the SOB was at one point dissolved. 114 00:07:53,000 --> 00:07:56,920 Speaker 2: This was in two thousand and two. It was reclassified 115 00:07:57,000 --> 00:08:00,560 Speaker 2: and given a new name later though, in twenty twelve 116 00:08:01,040 --> 00:08:04,200 Speaker 2: and a volved version of these units was rearranged more 117 00:08:04,240 --> 00:08:08,040 Speaker 2: broadly as special forces and given the old name of 118 00:08:08,160 --> 00:08:13,640 Speaker 2: the SOBR. Whilst under different branches of control, the new 119 00:08:13,840 --> 00:08:18,080 Speaker 2: SOBR is in many ways the same as the original. 120 00:08:18,440 --> 00:08:22,440 Speaker 2: In twenty twenty two, SOBR units took part in Russia's 121 00:08:22,480 --> 00:08:26,320 Speaker 2: invasion of Ukraine. It seems that the idea was that 122 00:08:26,400 --> 00:08:29,520 Speaker 2: they'd be put in place to crush riots in Kiev 123 00:08:29,880 --> 00:08:33,280 Speaker 2: once the Russian military had taken the city. The Kremlin 124 00:08:33,320 --> 00:08:37,840 Speaker 2: believed this would happen quickly. They were wrong. Ukrainian military 125 00:08:38,000 --> 00:08:41,959 Speaker 2: and armed volunteers defended the capitol over a year later. 126 00:08:42,400 --> 00:08:46,840 Speaker 2: The nearest Russian position is around five hundred kilometers away 127 00:08:47,040 --> 00:08:51,280 Speaker 2: from Kiev. During the initial attacks on Kiev and February 128 00:08:51,280 --> 00:08:54,599 Speaker 2: twenty twenty two, there are reports the whole unit of 129 00:08:54,640 --> 00:08:58,760 Speaker 2: the SOBR was killed on the outskirts of the city. 130 00:09:00,080 --> 00:09:04,959 Speaker 2: The SOOBR a knife of theirs is clearly not your 131 00:09:05,000 --> 00:09:09,320 Speaker 2: average homewhere item. Yet this was the hand allegedly for 132 00:09:09,520 --> 00:09:14,120 Speaker 2: Vasily Melnikov when he killed his whole family and then himself. 133 00:09:14,600 --> 00:09:16,920 Speaker 3: What they found out the scene was a sober knife. 134 00:09:18,400 --> 00:09:18,600 Speaker 1: Yeah. 135 00:09:18,640 --> 00:09:20,599 Speaker 3: Here it says they were multiple. I know it's but 136 00:09:20,720 --> 00:09:23,600 Speaker 3: this one was specifically photographed and it caught my attention 137 00:09:23,640 --> 00:09:26,400 Speaker 3: because like you could see the insignia on it, whereas 138 00:09:26,400 --> 00:09:29,720 Speaker 3: the other knives are just kind of plain, and you know, 139 00:09:29,880 --> 00:09:32,800 Speaker 3: this could be a replica. It could be something he 140 00:09:32,880 --> 00:09:35,679 Speaker 3: was gifted, But it's just interesting that he has this 141 00:09:35,920 --> 00:09:41,199 Speaker 3: potentially memorabilia, potentially an actual knife from the group. From 142 00:09:41,200 --> 00:09:43,000 Speaker 3: what I can tell, he wasn't a part of anything. 143 00:09:43,000 --> 00:09:46,079 Speaker 3: He wasn't a part of like any police units, any 144 00:09:46,080 --> 00:09:48,840 Speaker 3: of these special forces. But I mean technically that is 145 00:09:48,880 --> 00:09:51,160 Speaker 3: the only way you get one like a legitimate one, right, 146 00:09:51,480 --> 00:09:52,600 Speaker 3: But again, who. 147 00:09:52,440 --> 00:09:56,240 Speaker 2: Knows where this knife is actually from is important If 148 00:09:56,240 --> 00:09:59,680 Speaker 2: it's genuine. At the very least, it shows a Vasily 149 00:09:59,760 --> 00:10:03,760 Speaker 2: meli Kov had some connection to someone who was once 150 00:10:03,840 --> 00:10:07,640 Speaker 2: a member of the soob Ah, even if he just 151 00:10:07,760 --> 00:10:10,840 Speaker 2: bought it from them as a collectible or was gifted it. 152 00:10:10,920 --> 00:10:33,120 Speaker 2: And if it wasn't Vasili's knife, whose was it. Over 153 00:10:33,160 --> 00:10:37,000 Speaker 2: the last decade of my career as a journalist, I've 154 00:10:37,040 --> 00:10:40,400 Speaker 2: covered dozens of wards on the ground all over the world, 155 00:10:40,920 --> 00:10:44,240 Speaker 2: from the trenches of East Ukraine to the barricades of 156 00:10:44,480 --> 00:10:49,120 Speaker 2: East Jerusalem. I've never actually seen any fighters put that 157 00:10:49,280 --> 00:10:52,560 Speaker 2: much value into a combat knife other than it being 158 00:10:52,640 --> 00:10:56,280 Speaker 2: a useful tool. I've seen people cut rope with them 159 00:10:56,400 --> 00:10:59,720 Speaker 2: or open it kind of food, but otherwise it's hardly 160 00:10:59,840 --> 00:11:03,080 Speaker 2: used as a weapon on the front lines. If anything, 161 00:11:03,280 --> 00:11:05,840 Speaker 2: I've seen them passed around a few times as a 162 00:11:05,880 --> 00:11:09,800 Speaker 2: sort of collectible or war trophy, but generally, in my 163 00:11:09,960 --> 00:11:12,240 Speaker 2: experience at least, it's something. 164 00:11:12,000 --> 00:11:13,400 Speaker 1: Fighters will have at war. 165 00:11:13,559 --> 00:11:17,400 Speaker 2: But again, it's just more of a tool than anything else. 166 00:11:18,400 --> 00:11:23,760 Speaker 2: So perhaps Vasily Melnikov fought somewhere and picked this knife 167 00:11:23,800 --> 00:11:26,520 Speaker 2: up along the way and kept it as a sort 168 00:11:26,679 --> 00:11:31,440 Speaker 2: of souvenir. It's possible, but neither Sergery or myself could 169 00:11:31,520 --> 00:11:37,480 Speaker 2: find any information on Vasily Melnikov fighting in any wars, 170 00:11:37,520 --> 00:11:40,880 Speaker 2: not one that the sobre units fought in. No old 171 00:11:40,920 --> 00:11:46,320 Speaker 2: photos on his social media, no mention of previous service, nothing. 172 00:11:46,480 --> 00:11:50,959 Speaker 2: It's likely he didn't fight. Still, though, this sob Our 173 00:11:51,040 --> 00:11:54,040 Speaker 2: knife was found in his apartment and was used in 174 00:11:54,080 --> 00:11:58,240 Speaker 2: the murder of his family. Due to its specific connection 175 00:11:58,360 --> 00:12:02,680 Speaker 2: to the Russian government and its numerous and forces, we 176 00:12:02,880 --> 00:12:07,840 Speaker 2: of course want to find out where it's from. So 177 00:12:08,200 --> 00:12:12,559 Speaker 2: I reached out to several different knife collectors and experts 178 00:12:12,840 --> 00:12:16,359 Speaker 2: to see if they could shed any light on the knife. 179 00:12:16,480 --> 00:12:19,880 Speaker 2: A few of them who really know their stuff associated 180 00:12:20,120 --> 00:12:25,000 Speaker 2: with the conflict journalism collective the irun Popular Front. At 181 00:12:25,040 --> 00:12:28,480 Speaker 2: Popular Front, we have a network all over the world 182 00:12:28,800 --> 00:12:32,880 Speaker 2: where people with very niche esoteric knowledge on war and 183 00:12:33,080 --> 00:12:37,319 Speaker 2: conflict come together, and so some of our people happen 184 00:12:37,400 --> 00:12:42,199 Speaker 2: to know a lot about combat knives, both collectible and practical. 185 00:12:42,559 --> 00:12:46,520 Speaker 2: Speaking to these people, it became clear that the SOBR 186 00:12:46,600 --> 00:12:50,400 Speaker 2: knife pictured in the crime scene photos is an NAR 187 00:12:50,559 --> 00:12:55,679 Speaker 2: forty three knife, a relatively inexpensive scout knife first created 188 00:12:55,760 --> 00:13:00,120 Speaker 2: in nineteen forty three and issued to Russian Special Forces. 189 00:13:00,240 --> 00:13:03,560 Speaker 2: Either that or it's a replica. Still, the design matches 190 00:13:03,720 --> 00:13:08,640 Speaker 2: exactly with the Russian Special Forces scout knives. Whilst the 191 00:13:08,679 --> 00:13:11,120 Speaker 2: crime scene photo of the knife is a bit out 192 00:13:11,120 --> 00:13:14,560 Speaker 2: of focus, a specific logo can be seen on the 193 00:13:14,600 --> 00:13:17,960 Speaker 2: blade of the knife. The logo looks like the infinity 194 00:13:18,000 --> 00:13:22,840 Speaker 2: symbol or the number eight. It's the logo of Aiars Latooste, 195 00:13:23,040 --> 00:13:26,640 Speaker 2: a large Russian knife manufacturer. They make decent knives that 196 00:13:26,679 --> 00:13:29,800 Speaker 2: are generally pretty accessible. You can buy a brand new 197 00:13:29,920 --> 00:13:33,880 Speaker 2: NR forty three knife, for example, from Latoost in Europe 198 00:13:33,960 --> 00:13:37,800 Speaker 2: for around one hundred euros. So the knife was manufactured 199 00:13:37,800 --> 00:13:41,520 Speaker 2: by Aiar's latoost However, there isn't a single one of 200 00:13:41,640 --> 00:13:45,360 Speaker 2: their NAR forty three knife for sale anywhere that has 201 00:13:45,440 --> 00:13:49,880 Speaker 2: the SOB medallion molded into the handle. The same way 202 00:13:50,280 --> 00:13:54,880 Speaker 2: as the Melnikov murder weapon. There aren't currently any commercially 203 00:13:54,920 --> 00:13:59,200 Speaker 2: available NAR forty three knives like that, so where did 204 00:13:59,320 --> 00:14:04,320 Speaker 2: it come from? We thought maybe theoretically, at some point, 205 00:14:04,559 --> 00:14:08,240 Speaker 2: a specific SOBR unit could have commissioned a batch of 206 00:14:08,600 --> 00:14:12,760 Speaker 2: spoke knives from ai As Latouste to award to some 207 00:14:13,000 --> 00:14:14,119 Speaker 2: of its fighters. 208 00:14:14,200 --> 00:14:15,640 Speaker 1: It's quite possible. Now. 209 00:14:15,760 --> 00:14:18,280 Speaker 2: This company is obviously not going to tell us the 210 00:14:18,320 --> 00:14:23,920 Speaker 2: specific details of another customer's purchases, especially if it actually 211 00:14:24,080 --> 00:14:27,400 Speaker 2: was so OBR. But we wanted to know if we 212 00:14:27,440 --> 00:14:30,800 Speaker 2: could order the same bespoke knife that would tell us 213 00:14:30,840 --> 00:14:34,640 Speaker 2: something at least. We reached out to Aiis Latoos to 214 00:14:34,680 --> 00:14:38,600 Speaker 2: see if this was possible, essentially acting as a customer. 215 00:14:39,400 --> 00:14:42,600 Speaker 2: They said, quote, yes, such an order with such an 216 00:14:42,600 --> 00:14:46,840 Speaker 2: emblem can be completed ends quote. Later they sent us 217 00:14:46,880 --> 00:14:49,640 Speaker 2: a mock up of what it would look like. Instead 218 00:14:49,680 --> 00:14:52,960 Speaker 2: of the knife with the SOB medallion molded into the 219 00:14:52,960 --> 00:14:55,960 Speaker 2: plastic of the handle, they sent us a version that 220 00:14:56,040 --> 00:15:00,320 Speaker 2: would have the SOBRE insignia laser engraved on to the 221 00:15:00,400 --> 00:15:04,200 Speaker 2: hilt of the blade. Whilst that's not the same knife 222 00:15:04,240 --> 00:15:07,520 Speaker 2: as what Vasily Melnikov apparently killed himself and his whole 223 00:15:07,560 --> 00:15:11,960 Speaker 2: family with it's pretty close. My point being, it's definitely 224 00:15:12,000 --> 00:15:15,680 Speaker 2: possible that this knife could have been produced by someone 225 00:15:16,080 --> 00:15:21,560 Speaker 2: unrelated to the SOBR, But still, why did Vasily Melnikov 226 00:15:21,640 --> 00:15:24,760 Speaker 2: have it if it was just a random replica. He 227 00:15:24,960 --> 00:15:28,120 Speaker 2: was a multi millionaire and the quality of the knife 228 00:15:28,200 --> 00:15:32,640 Speaker 2: is largely unremarkable. Is what our knife collector associate had 229 00:15:32,640 --> 00:15:34,080 Speaker 2: to say about the blade. 230 00:15:34,240 --> 00:15:38,760 Speaker 4: It didn't really strike me as anything particularly special, just 231 00:15:38,800 --> 00:15:42,240 Speaker 4: your typical combat type knife that you'd see for sale 232 00:15:42,480 --> 00:15:46,840 Speaker 4: anywhere from some sort of a gas station or junk 233 00:15:46,880 --> 00:15:52,720 Speaker 4: shop all the way through maybe an outdoors tactical or 234 00:15:52,800 --> 00:15:55,520 Speaker 4: a surplus type shop. As far as construction goes, it's 235 00:15:55,560 --> 00:16:00,240 Speaker 4: not anything particularly high end. It's definitely not custom, just 236 00:16:00,280 --> 00:16:04,720 Speaker 4: your typical machine made, mass produced item. 237 00:16:05,280 --> 00:16:09,720 Speaker 2: So if the blade doesn't appear to be particularly special superficially, 238 00:16:10,440 --> 00:16:14,720 Speaker 2: maybe it had some sentimental value for Vasily Melnikov, or, 239 00:16:14,880 --> 00:16:19,880 Speaker 2: as others seem to believe, maybe it wasn't his at all. 240 00:16:21,120 --> 00:16:26,080 Speaker 2: Online in Russia, there are various theories and rumors going 241 00:16:26,120 --> 00:16:30,720 Speaker 2: around about Vasily Melnikov and the slaughter of his family. 242 00:16:31,480 --> 00:16:35,240 Speaker 2: Many believe he was killed on behalf of the Russian government. 243 00:16:36,080 --> 00:16:38,680 Speaker 2: In fact, so many Russian oligarchs have died in the 244 00:16:38,760 --> 00:16:43,200 Speaker 2: last year that it's become somewhat of a running joke. 245 00:16:43,720 --> 00:16:45,720 Speaker 1: Vasily was just another one. 246 00:16:46,840 --> 00:16:50,480 Speaker 2: Even pro Russian telegram channels linked to Russian units fighting 247 00:16:50,560 --> 00:16:54,160 Speaker 2: in Ukraine joke about the likelihood of being bumped off 248 00:16:54,200 --> 00:16:58,600 Speaker 2: by their own government. For example, the operator of the 249 00:16:58,720 --> 00:17:02,880 Speaker 2: Russian propaganda tell channel gray Zone, with more than four 250 00:17:02,960 --> 00:17:07,600 Speaker 2: hundred thousand members, wrote recently saying, quote, once I was 251 00:17:07,640 --> 00:17:09,720 Speaker 2: having a cup of tea with a comrade from the 252 00:17:09,880 --> 00:17:13,840 Speaker 2: General Staff of the Armed Forces of Russia, talking about 253 00:17:13,880 --> 00:17:18,040 Speaker 2: the various risks and consequences of saying certain things in 254 00:17:18,200 --> 00:17:21,840 Speaker 2: this channel on telegram, I jokingly said that one day 255 00:17:22,000 --> 00:17:24,800 Speaker 2: I might fall out of a window, to which my 256 00:17:24,920 --> 00:17:28,520 Speaker 2: comrade replied, bro, if the generals want to eliminate you 257 00:17:28,600 --> 00:17:31,640 Speaker 2: by throwing you from a window, they'll most likely throw 258 00:17:31,680 --> 00:17:32,240 Speaker 2: you from. 259 00:17:32,080 --> 00:17:34,640 Speaker 1: The first floor. End quote. 260 00:17:35,640 --> 00:17:39,400 Speaker 2: As we'll find out later in this series, falling out 261 00:17:39,480 --> 00:17:43,120 Speaker 2: of the window is something many Russian oligarchs have recently 262 00:17:43,160 --> 00:17:48,119 Speaker 2: had in common. Plenty of people online in Russia have 263 00:17:48,200 --> 00:17:53,000 Speaker 2: found the whole situation suspicious. Now I don't speak Russian, 264 00:17:53,119 --> 00:17:56,920 Speaker 2: but Sergey does. He found numerous comments relating to the 265 00:17:57,000 --> 00:17:58,800 Speaker 2: Vasili Melnikov murders. 266 00:17:58,960 --> 00:18:00,960 Speaker 3: There's a lot of speculator. You know, a lot of 267 00:18:01,040 --> 00:18:03,520 Speaker 3: them say like, oh, look at them cleaning cleaning out, 268 00:18:03,680 --> 00:18:06,399 Speaker 3: you know, referring to like whoever's higher up kind of 269 00:18:06,440 --> 00:18:09,720 Speaker 3: maybe cutting closing loose ends or getting rid of like 270 00:18:10,119 --> 00:18:12,320 Speaker 3: people who might know some like have dirt on them. 271 00:18:12,320 --> 00:18:13,640 Speaker 3: You know, it's all over the place. 272 00:18:13,680 --> 00:18:13,840 Speaker 5: You know. 273 00:18:14,920 --> 00:18:18,840 Speaker 3: Mostly you see this on Contactya, like their VK, like 274 00:18:18,920 --> 00:18:22,639 Speaker 3: Facebook kind of counterpart you see this on the actual 275 00:18:22,720 --> 00:18:25,639 Speaker 3: articles because you know, you can post anonymously, so a 276 00:18:25,640 --> 00:18:29,119 Speaker 3: lot of people will say like, oh, smell suspicious, or like, oh. 277 00:18:29,040 --> 00:18:30,480 Speaker 1: Is this do you really want us to believe? 278 00:18:30,520 --> 00:18:33,959 Speaker 3: This doesn't go like anywhere from that, but you know, 279 00:18:34,000 --> 00:18:36,119 Speaker 3: it's it's interesting to see that a lot of people 280 00:18:36,200 --> 00:18:39,320 Speaker 3: are voicing the fact that, like this sounds like bullshit. 281 00:18:39,440 --> 00:18:40,679 Speaker 1: It's almost seems like they're used to it. 282 00:18:40,680 --> 00:18:43,040 Speaker 3: They're kind of like, oh, there goes another one. It's 283 00:18:43,040 --> 00:18:44,399 Speaker 3: nothing new to them. 284 00:18:44,800 --> 00:18:49,320 Speaker 2: That said, Rumors and theories on the internet, just rumors 285 00:18:49,320 --> 00:18:51,880 Speaker 2: and theories on the internet. We don't know if they 286 00:18:51,920 --> 00:18:57,520 Speaker 2: hold any white often they don't. What we do know, though, 287 00:18:57,720 --> 00:18:59,960 Speaker 2: is that the police in Russia say that we're silly 288 00:19:00,119 --> 00:19:04,920 Speaker 2: Melnikov killed his whole family, a brutal act beyond most 289 00:19:04,920 --> 00:19:09,360 Speaker 2: people's imagination. This crime is so awful that it even 290 00:19:09,440 --> 00:19:14,440 Speaker 2: has its own terminology. It's often referred to as familicide 291 00:19:14,880 --> 00:19:37,879 Speaker 2: and the perpetrators as family annihilators. To get a better 292 00:19:37,960 --> 00:19:42,680 Speaker 2: understanding of this horror, I spoke to Professor Elizabeth Yadley. 293 00:19:43,200 --> 00:19:47,520 Speaker 2: She's a professor of criminology at Birmingham University in the UK. 294 00:19:48,320 --> 00:19:52,520 Speaker 2: She's studied family annihilation at length and has authored several 295 00:19:52,520 --> 00:19:53,199 Speaker 2: papers on it. 296 00:19:53,440 --> 00:19:56,520 Speaker 5: When this individual hills their family and so that is 297 00:19:56,560 --> 00:19:59,960 Speaker 5: often their wife or female partner and their biological children, 298 00:20:00,080 --> 00:20:03,720 Speaker 5: and in some cases they then kill themselves as well 299 00:20:03,800 --> 00:20:06,399 Speaker 5: and in other cases they know. So it is the 300 00:20:06,440 --> 00:20:10,040 Speaker 5: wiping out essentially of the entire nuclear family units in 301 00:20:10,400 --> 00:20:11,399 Speaker 5: one particular event. 302 00:20:11,720 --> 00:20:13,760 Speaker 2: Right, And you've done a lot of research on this. 303 00:20:13,840 --> 00:20:16,560 Speaker 2: Obviously it's a case by case basis. But is there 304 00:20:16,560 --> 00:20:20,520 Speaker 2: any kind of idea that's shared by people as to 305 00:20:20,720 --> 00:20:25,720 Speaker 2: why people do this? Because it's extremely violent. It's just 306 00:20:25,920 --> 00:20:29,639 Speaker 2: unbelievable to anyone that's saying that someone would kill their 307 00:20:29,720 --> 00:20:32,080 Speaker 2: or own family. Is there any kind of consensus on 308 00:20:32,160 --> 00:20:33,199 Speaker 2: why this might happen? 309 00:20:33,560 --> 00:20:36,360 Speaker 5: Yeah, I think For me, the two key words are 310 00:20:36,800 --> 00:20:41,000 Speaker 5: control and possession. When I look at cases of family annihilation, 311 00:20:41,640 --> 00:20:45,320 Speaker 5: the family members who are murdered, very often they're not 312 00:20:45,440 --> 00:20:49,000 Speaker 5: seen as living, breathing human beings with their own hopes 313 00:20:49,040 --> 00:20:52,600 Speaker 5: and dreams and freedoms and choices. They're seen as objects 314 00:20:52,640 --> 00:20:57,399 Speaker 5: that are possessed by the perpetrator. They are things that 315 00:20:57,440 --> 00:21:01,000 Speaker 5: the perpetrator owns, and therefore the perpetrator can do, you know, 316 00:21:01,080 --> 00:21:04,359 Speaker 5: what he wants with them. And these cases are really 317 00:21:04,400 --> 00:21:07,600 Speaker 5: interesting because a lot of the coverage of the cases 318 00:21:07,880 --> 00:21:12,479 Speaker 5: will present these as cases where somebody's snapped, somebody's lost it, 319 00:21:12,800 --> 00:21:16,720 Speaker 5: They've gone overnight from you know, a loving, caring father 320 00:21:16,760 --> 00:21:21,080 Speaker 5: figure to a homicidal maniac, and that just doesn't happen. 321 00:21:21,320 --> 00:21:24,280 Speaker 5: Snapping isn't actually a thing. And when you look in 322 00:21:24,359 --> 00:21:27,600 Speaker 5: detail at these cases, when you find out the details 323 00:21:27,600 --> 00:21:30,199 Speaker 5: about these families and their lives, what you often come 324 00:21:30,240 --> 00:21:35,159 Speaker 5: across is quite significant histories of domestic abuse, of coercive 325 00:21:35,160 --> 00:21:38,679 Speaker 5: and controlling behavior, a very kind of domineering head of 326 00:21:38,680 --> 00:21:42,680 Speaker 5: the household type figures. So it does make sense when 327 00:21:42,720 --> 00:21:45,520 Speaker 5: you look at it in that broader context. And I 328 00:21:45,560 --> 00:21:47,840 Speaker 5: don't think I've come across a single case where somebody 329 00:21:47,840 --> 00:21:50,440 Speaker 5: has just you know, snapped and lost it in an 330 00:21:50,440 --> 00:21:52,359 Speaker 5: instant that doesn't tend to happen. 331 00:21:52,680 --> 00:21:55,840 Speaker 2: Do you think that it's a case of someone over 332 00:21:55,880 --> 00:21:58,919 Speaker 2: the years or over a certain amount of time of 333 00:21:58,920 --> 00:22:02,159 Speaker 2: fermenting these ideas, isn't getting more angry, or do you 334 00:22:02,200 --> 00:22:04,800 Speaker 2: think this is something that someone potentially kind of always 335 00:22:04,800 --> 00:22:05,280 Speaker 2: had in them. 336 00:22:05,760 --> 00:22:07,920 Speaker 5: I think it's something that they've always had in them, 337 00:22:08,040 --> 00:22:10,520 Speaker 5: because the way that they think about their family, the 338 00:22:10,560 --> 00:22:13,520 Speaker 5: way they think about other people, that is an element 339 00:22:13,560 --> 00:22:16,760 Speaker 5: of their personality that's very much part and parcel of them. 340 00:22:17,080 --> 00:22:20,480 Speaker 5: To be controlling is normal for them. To be possessive, 341 00:22:20,640 --> 00:22:23,520 Speaker 5: is normal for them. To be abusive, it's normal for them. 342 00:22:23,920 --> 00:22:26,240 Speaker 5: So this is the key thing about all of the 343 00:22:26,280 --> 00:22:30,600 Speaker 5: family annihilations that I've covered, Like it's more about continuity 344 00:22:30,760 --> 00:22:34,880 Speaker 5: than it is about change. And very often these individuals 345 00:22:34,920 --> 00:22:38,680 Speaker 5: are quite good at maintaining like a facade of normality 346 00:22:39,119 --> 00:22:42,720 Speaker 5: and respectability. And this is vania which most people don't 347 00:22:42,720 --> 00:22:46,440 Speaker 5: really get to see behind. So it is really shocking 348 00:22:46,560 --> 00:22:49,359 Speaker 5: when this kind of thing happens. But very often you 349 00:22:49,400 --> 00:22:52,040 Speaker 5: speak to people who are kind of known intimately to 350 00:22:52,080 --> 00:22:55,200 Speaker 5: those involved in a crime, like this, and they're like, yeah, yeah, 351 00:22:55,480 --> 00:22:57,600 Speaker 5: he was an awful person. You know, he was just 352 00:22:57,720 --> 00:22:59,359 Speaker 5: very good at claiming that he wasn't. 353 00:22:59,440 --> 00:23:02,000 Speaker 2: This case that I'm looking at with this guy in Russia, 354 00:23:02,040 --> 00:23:04,560 Speaker 2: this Melnikov guy. The thing with him is though he 355 00:23:05,320 --> 00:23:09,399 Speaker 2: just come off of a very luxurious holiday with his 356 00:23:09,440 --> 00:23:12,320 Speaker 2: two children and his wife in the Maldives. He just 357 00:23:12,840 --> 00:23:15,560 Speaker 2: made a deal on a three point five million dollar 358 00:23:16,280 --> 00:23:20,040 Speaker 2: business contract, and he had a really nice flat in 359 00:23:20,080 --> 00:23:26,160 Speaker 2: an upmarket part of Moscow. On the outside, like everything 360 00:23:26,280 --> 00:23:29,600 Speaker 2: was going good for him. Now, allegedly he told his 361 00:23:29,640 --> 00:23:31,920 Speaker 2: wife he was depressed, but the source for that is 362 00:23:32,000 --> 00:23:35,680 Speaker 2: kind of like anonymous person that told a Russian government 363 00:23:35,720 --> 00:23:38,880 Speaker 2: media channel, so it's not exactly reliable. But he seemed 364 00:23:38,880 --> 00:23:43,520 Speaker 2: to have everything going for him. Yet he apparently, according 365 00:23:43,520 --> 00:23:47,520 Speaker 2: to the Russian police, killed his whole family using a 366 00:23:47,600 --> 00:23:48,960 Speaker 2: series of different knives. 367 00:23:49,480 --> 00:23:50,960 Speaker 1: Also then killed himself. 368 00:23:51,520 --> 00:23:54,960 Speaker 2: He seemed to kind of have everything going for him. 369 00:23:55,200 --> 00:23:56,800 Speaker 2: Do you see that kind of stuff happen as well? 370 00:23:56,800 --> 00:23:59,639 Speaker 2: All the people do this, even if you know everything 371 00:23:59,680 --> 00:24:02,080 Speaker 2: find Angela is okay, and you know, I mean, who 372 00:24:02,160 --> 00:24:03,640 Speaker 2: knows what is going through someone's head? 373 00:24:03,640 --> 00:24:05,359 Speaker 1: But I don't know. This guy didn't seem to be 374 00:24:05,359 --> 00:24:07,000 Speaker 1: losing things. It was quite the opposite. 375 00:24:07,600 --> 00:24:11,000 Speaker 5: No, that doesn't really ring truth for me. If he's 376 00:24:11,200 --> 00:24:15,040 Speaker 5: if he's seeing a particular level of success and like 377 00:24:15,040 --> 00:24:18,120 Speaker 5: you said, he's got this this big multi million contract 378 00:24:18,160 --> 00:24:21,520 Speaker 5: in the offering, and if he's you know, quite well 379 00:24:21,560 --> 00:24:24,080 Speaker 5: healed and things are going well, that's not the time 380 00:24:24,119 --> 00:24:26,920 Speaker 5: when this sort of thing tends to happen. Then you've 381 00:24:26,960 --> 00:24:30,400 Speaker 5: got situations where you know, large amounts of money are involved. 382 00:24:30,640 --> 00:24:34,120 Speaker 5: It's normally when there's the threat of losing that money, right, 383 00:24:34,119 --> 00:24:37,400 Speaker 5: and that's like a real thing. And the murders are 384 00:24:37,480 --> 00:24:41,679 Speaker 5: essentially away of sort of regaining control essentially, because for 385 00:24:41,720 --> 00:24:45,040 Speaker 5: a lot of these guys, the family is is a 386 00:24:45,080 --> 00:24:49,480 Speaker 5: way of kind of displaying success, their indicator to the 387 00:24:49,520 --> 00:24:53,080 Speaker 5: world that they've made it. You know that they're economically successful, 388 00:24:53,080 --> 00:24:56,199 Speaker 5: they've got money, and if you think of you know 389 00:24:56,240 --> 00:24:58,560 Speaker 5: that the vast expense that comes from having a family 390 00:24:58,720 --> 00:25:02,520 Speaker 5: at the family home and and very often some expensive 391 00:25:02,640 --> 00:25:04,960 Speaker 5: leisure purshoots and hobbies and that kind of thing, and 392 00:25:05,040 --> 00:25:08,119 Speaker 5: these grand holidays in the Moldies. That's basically announcing to 393 00:25:08,119 --> 00:25:09,920 Speaker 5: the rest of the world, I've made it, and look, 394 00:25:09,960 --> 00:25:11,080 Speaker 5: my family are helping me. 395 00:25:11,119 --> 00:25:13,639 Speaker 1: Perform my success to the rest of the world. 396 00:25:13,840 --> 00:25:16,119 Speaker 5: When there's the threat of that money kind of going away, 397 00:25:16,920 --> 00:25:20,119 Speaker 5: the family doesn't serve a function anymore, because for these guys, 398 00:25:20,119 --> 00:25:22,560 Speaker 5: the family is a way of performing success. There isn't 399 00:25:22,600 --> 00:25:26,480 Speaker 5: any real sort of genuine emotion or kind of attachment 400 00:25:26,560 --> 00:25:29,000 Speaker 5: to the people in the family. They're simply props. And 401 00:25:29,440 --> 00:25:31,960 Speaker 5: when the fuel essentially runs out, the money runs out, 402 00:25:32,000 --> 00:25:35,320 Speaker 5: it's like, oh, well, you know that they're not serving 403 00:25:35,359 --> 00:25:37,879 Speaker 5: their purpose anymore. I'm kind of finished with them, and 404 00:25:38,000 --> 00:25:39,639 Speaker 5: I'm done with this and I'm going to take it 405 00:25:39,680 --> 00:25:42,120 Speaker 5: all down in the final kind of act of control. 406 00:25:42,400 --> 00:25:44,840 Speaker 2: Some of his neighbors were saying that he'd recently hired 407 00:25:44,840 --> 00:25:47,919 Speaker 2: a bodyguard to kind of take his kids to school, 408 00:25:48,320 --> 00:25:50,679 Speaker 2: which I mean, I don't know, but that doesn't scream 409 00:25:50,680 --> 00:25:52,720 Speaker 2: to me a guy that is, you know, quite happily 410 00:25:52,760 --> 00:25:54,600 Speaker 2: ready to just kill his family if you want to 411 00:25:54,600 --> 00:25:55,439 Speaker 2: protect his kids. 412 00:25:55,600 --> 00:25:59,080 Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, it really doesn't resonate with me in terms 413 00:25:59,119 --> 00:26:03,600 Speaker 5: of that kind family annihilator, because they will do this, 414 00:26:03,720 --> 00:26:05,720 Speaker 5: they will carry out these murders and then their own 415 00:26:05,760 --> 00:26:10,800 Speaker 5: lives before everything goes horribly wrong. Yeah, it doesn't really 416 00:26:10,800 --> 00:26:11,520 Speaker 5: stack up for me. 417 00:26:11,800 --> 00:26:13,159 Speaker 1: What is also interesting to me. 418 00:26:13,240 --> 00:26:16,120 Speaker 2: So in this research that we're doing, we have found 419 00:26:17,160 --> 00:26:19,560 Speaker 2: people that are, you know, in some ways connected in 420 00:26:19,600 --> 00:26:22,520 Speaker 2: the way that they're Russian millionaires and billionaires, and they 421 00:26:22,520 --> 00:26:24,360 Speaker 2: have some connections to the state. I mean, they don't 422 00:26:24,400 --> 00:26:25,960 Speaker 2: know each other. I'm sure they knew of each other, 423 00:26:26,000 --> 00:26:28,720 Speaker 2: some of them, but in some way they're connected. And 424 00:26:28,840 --> 00:26:31,359 Speaker 2: there's over a dozen of these so called oligarchs that 425 00:26:31,400 --> 00:26:35,120 Speaker 2: are dead and two, at least two, maybe we think 426 00:26:35,240 --> 00:26:38,120 Speaker 2: three did this family annihilation. 427 00:26:38,400 --> 00:26:41,359 Speaker 5: It is an incredibly rare phenomenon. Having a clustering of 428 00:26:41,400 --> 00:26:46,480 Speaker 5: them like this is relatively unusual, especially within similar circles, 429 00:26:46,680 --> 00:26:51,119 Speaker 5: within the same nation, within a particular time period. It 430 00:26:51,680 --> 00:26:53,560 Speaker 5: would seem quite anomalist to me. 431 00:26:54,520 --> 00:26:57,040 Speaker 2: Yeah, and at least two of them, So the two 432 00:26:57,080 --> 00:27:00,320 Speaker 2: that we know for certain annihilated the whole families. There's 433 00:27:00,320 --> 00:27:02,320 Speaker 2: two children that survived that you know, they were older, 434 00:27:02,320 --> 00:27:04,440 Speaker 2: they weren't in the house. Both of them have said 435 00:27:04,440 --> 00:27:06,640 Speaker 2: that there's just no way, like there is no way 436 00:27:06,680 --> 00:27:09,480 Speaker 2: that they did this. But again, I mean, I guess 437 00:27:09,480 --> 00:27:12,280 Speaker 2: we have heard that before. Do you think that's like 438 00:27:12,359 --> 00:27:14,240 Speaker 2: a I don't know, do you do you think that's 439 00:27:14,280 --> 00:27:15,960 Speaker 2: worth listening to. I mean, these are members of this 440 00:27:16,000 --> 00:27:18,679 Speaker 2: guy's family, like literally there are other children, but I 441 00:27:18,680 --> 00:27:20,600 Speaker 2: guess their children would say that, I don't know, what 442 00:27:20,640 --> 00:27:21,160 Speaker 2: do you think? 443 00:27:21,800 --> 00:27:25,840 Speaker 5: Well, the very fact that biological children of the alleged 444 00:27:25,880 --> 00:27:28,760 Speaker 5: perpetrator have survived tells me that this is very different 445 00:27:28,800 --> 00:27:31,800 Speaker 5: from any family annihilation I've come across before, because when 446 00:27:31,840 --> 00:27:34,800 Speaker 5: the perpetrator takes their family out, they take everybody out. 447 00:27:35,160 --> 00:27:37,040 Speaker 5: They make sure that those children are home for the 448 00:27:37,040 --> 00:27:39,840 Speaker 5: weekend or that they're all together as a family. They 449 00:27:39,880 --> 00:27:43,680 Speaker 5: don't leave anybody behind. All the members of that particular 450 00:27:43,760 --> 00:27:47,159 Speaker 5: nutliar family unit, the perpetrator takes them all out, they 451 00:27:47,200 --> 00:27:51,359 Speaker 5: won't leave somebody behind. It's yeah, that's quite odd. 452 00:27:51,560 --> 00:27:56,480 Speaker 2: Have you seen cases before where they've committed family side 453 00:27:56,640 --> 00:27:58,640 Speaker 2: or whatever you call it. They've killed their whole family, 454 00:27:59,359 --> 00:28:01,920 Speaker 2: And you've seen situations where they've made sure, like they've 455 00:28:01,920 --> 00:28:04,040 Speaker 2: made sure that everyone was there, They've called someone in, 456 00:28:04,119 --> 00:28:05,920 Speaker 2: they made sure it's a family weekend or a dinner 457 00:28:06,000 --> 00:28:06,720 Speaker 2: or something like that. 458 00:28:07,320 --> 00:28:10,760 Speaker 5: Yeah, and several of these cases that we came across 459 00:28:10,840 --> 00:28:13,840 Speaker 5: happened on the family holiday, the one time when they're 460 00:28:13,840 --> 00:28:17,240 Speaker 5: all together, you know, without any sort of outside influence. 461 00:28:17,280 --> 00:28:20,439 Speaker 5: That there might be in a different country, but no, 462 00:28:20,560 --> 00:28:24,520 Speaker 5: there's a very deliberate attempt to make sure that nobody 463 00:28:24,560 --> 00:28:27,679 Speaker 5: can get away essentially, and that everybody's contained within the 464 00:28:27,720 --> 00:28:33,119 Speaker 5: same space. So yeah, to have people surviving who are 465 00:28:33,160 --> 00:28:36,880 Speaker 5: part of that nuclear family unit is really quite strange 466 00:28:36,920 --> 00:28:39,280 Speaker 5: to me. I mean, it might be that we've discovered 467 00:28:39,280 --> 00:28:41,720 Speaker 5: a whole new type of family annihilator here, right, you know, 468 00:28:42,720 --> 00:28:45,600 Speaker 5: but this doesn't fit with anything I've ever seen before. 469 00:28:45,640 --> 00:28:48,240 Speaker 5: To be honest, I think if you were to develop 470 00:28:48,240 --> 00:28:52,480 Speaker 5: a checklist for you know, characteristics associated with family annihilation, 471 00:28:52,920 --> 00:28:55,560 Speaker 5: like this would not be off that checklist. 472 00:28:56,440 --> 00:28:56,640 Speaker 1: Now. 473 00:28:56,880 --> 00:29:00,160 Speaker 2: That's all not to say that Vasilly Melnikov didn't do it, 474 00:29:00,440 --> 00:29:03,280 Speaker 2: but it clearly doesn't quite fit the pattern of behavior 475 00:29:03,720 --> 00:29:08,720 Speaker 2: of other family annihilators, not according to Professor Yadley, someone 476 00:29:08,760 --> 00:29:12,320 Speaker 2: who knows a lot about this. Something else that seems 477 00:29:12,360 --> 00:29:15,520 Speaker 2: a bit off, as I mentioned, is the claim that 478 00:29:15,600 --> 00:29:19,560 Speaker 2: Vasily Melnikov hired a bodyguard for his kids, at least 479 00:29:19,560 --> 00:29:23,440 Speaker 2: according to his neighbors. Why if he was planning to 480 00:29:23,520 --> 00:29:27,400 Speaker 2: kill his family would he hire someone to protect them. 481 00:29:27,520 --> 00:29:30,120 Speaker 2: The neighbors said that seen the bodyguard taking the children 482 00:29:30,160 --> 00:29:34,240 Speaker 2: to school, The children who would sadly be murdered later on. 483 00:29:35,160 --> 00:29:38,880 Speaker 2: There are also rumors, again from the neighbors, the Vasily 484 00:29:38,920 --> 00:29:43,200 Speaker 2: had a murky past, possibly involved with criminal networks in 485 00:29:43,360 --> 00:29:48,480 Speaker 2: other cities. Still, these are just rumors. What isn't rumor, though, 486 00:29:48,640 --> 00:29:53,840 Speaker 2: is Vasily Melnikov's autopsy report. According to that, Vasily had 487 00:29:53,880 --> 00:29:57,760 Speaker 2: a stab wound in his foot. So, if we take 488 00:29:57,840 --> 00:30:02,200 Speaker 2: the official story as true, Vasily stabbed his family to 489 00:30:02,320 --> 00:30:06,240 Speaker 2: death with at least two different knives and then stabbed 490 00:30:06,280 --> 00:30:11,800 Speaker 2: himself in the foot before killing himself outright. Maybe or 491 00:30:11,840 --> 00:30:14,640 Speaker 2: maybe the stab to the foot was a defense wound, 492 00:30:14,800 --> 00:30:18,720 Speaker 2: and maybe, as some people speculate, the two different knives 493 00:30:18,880 --> 00:30:23,080 Speaker 2: were held by two different people. Maybe Vasily had upset 494 00:30:23,120 --> 00:30:26,719 Speaker 2: some people. Maybe those people killed Vasily Melnikov and his 495 00:30:26,840 --> 00:30:30,440 Speaker 2: family as a punishment and a warning to other oligarchs 496 00:30:30,440 --> 00:30:31,840 Speaker 2: who don't play ball. 497 00:30:32,800 --> 00:30:35,040 Speaker 1: We don't know. It's just a theory. 498 00:30:35,960 --> 00:30:40,720 Speaker 2: Unfortunately in this series you won't get definitive answers. Real 499 00:30:40,760 --> 00:30:44,040 Speaker 2: life doesn't always get tied up in a bow, especially 500 00:30:44,080 --> 00:30:47,840 Speaker 2: not when looking into the deaths of the Russian elite. 501 00:30:47,880 --> 00:30:50,920 Speaker 2: We don't exactly know what happened to Vasily Melnikov or 502 00:30:50,920 --> 00:30:53,960 Speaker 2: many of the other oligarchs will cover. What we do 503 00:30:54,080 --> 00:30:57,520 Speaker 2: know is that a suspicious pattern emerges the closer you 504 00:30:57,560 --> 00:31:13,400 Speaker 2: look into the deaths of these rich Russi businessmen. Sad 505 00:31:13,400 --> 00:31:16,720 Speaker 2: Oligach is a H eleven production for Cool Zone Media 506 00:31:16,800 --> 00:31:23,520 Speaker 2: and iHeartRadio. Hosted, produced, researched and edited by me Jake 507 00:31:23,600 --> 00:31:29,600 Speaker 2: Hanrahan and Sergei Slipchenko. Co produced by Sophie Lichtman. Music 508 00:31:29,760 --> 00:31:35,640 Speaker 2: by Sam Black, artwork by Adam Doyle, soundmix by Splicing Block. 509 00:31:36,000 --> 00:31:39,240 Speaker 2: Goes to Jakehanrahan dot com for more information.