1 00:00:04,760 --> 00:00:07,720 Speaker 1: Welcome to the Bloomberg P and L Podcast. I'm Pim 2 00:00:07,800 --> 00:00:11,080 Speaker 1: Fox along with my co host Lisa Abramowitz. Each day 3 00:00:11,119 --> 00:00:14,360 Speaker 1: we bring you the most important, noteworthy, and useful interviews 4 00:00:14,400 --> 00:00:16,560 Speaker 1: for you and your money, whether at the grocery store 5 00:00:16,800 --> 00:00:19,960 Speaker 1: or the trading floor. Find the Bloomberg P L Podcast 6 00:00:20,000 --> 00:00:28,960 Speaker 1: on iTunes, SoundCloud and at Bloomberg dot com. Let's now 7 00:00:29,000 --> 00:00:33,240 Speaker 1: turn to our own Supreme Court reporter for Bloomberg, Greg 8 00:00:33,440 --> 00:00:35,640 Speaker 1: Store to give us a little bit of detail about this, 9 00:00:35,720 --> 00:00:38,040 Speaker 1: and Greg, just to bring everyone also up to date. 10 00:00:38,080 --> 00:00:40,640 Speaker 1: The Dow Jones Industrial average a lower. Right now, markets 11 00:00:40,680 --> 00:00:43,400 Speaker 1: are selling off that was down eight tens of a percent. 12 00:00:43,520 --> 00:00:48,320 Speaker 1: The s also lower by about nineteen points. Greg, maybe 13 00:00:48,320 --> 00:00:50,760 Speaker 1: you can give us your thoughts as to the tactics 14 00:00:50,800 --> 00:00:54,080 Speaker 1: of the questioning and whether this will have any effect 15 00:00:54,160 --> 00:00:58,080 Speaker 1: on the outcome of the nomination vote. Look, Democrats are 16 00:00:58,160 --> 00:01:00,760 Speaker 1: doing basically what they averagised they were doing, which is 17 00:01:01,240 --> 00:01:03,360 Speaker 1: first of all, trying to cast him as somebody who 18 00:01:03,480 --> 00:01:07,240 Speaker 1: sides with powerful institutions rather than the little guy. Uh. 19 00:01:07,319 --> 00:01:10,640 Speaker 1: And they're raising questions about the extent of which he 20 00:01:10,680 --> 00:01:16,520 Speaker 1: would rely on or instead overturned storied precedents like Roe v. Wade. Uh, 21 00:01:17,040 --> 00:01:20,120 Speaker 1: you know it, this is probably not changing a lot 22 00:01:20,160 --> 00:01:23,160 Speaker 1: of minds. But there are some Democrats who are still 23 00:01:23,200 --> 00:01:24,920 Speaker 1: on the fence or havn't said what they'll do. And 24 00:01:24,959 --> 00:01:29,200 Speaker 1: I'm sure they're paying close attention. Greg. One particular item 25 00:01:29,280 --> 00:01:31,840 Speaker 1: that caught my attention with the course it's refused to 26 00:01:32,160 --> 00:01:36,720 Speaker 1: preview any possible ruling on President Trump's traveled than is 27 00:01:36,760 --> 00:01:40,120 Speaker 1: this pretty much par for the course that any potential 28 00:01:40,360 --> 00:01:44,440 Speaker 1: Supreme Court nominee would decline from talking about anything specific 29 00:01:44,480 --> 00:01:48,200 Speaker 1: about anything unless it sort of setting stone. Yeah, and 30 00:01:48,320 --> 00:01:51,000 Speaker 1: certainly a case that's in the in the courts right now. 31 00:01:51,080 --> 00:01:52,680 Speaker 1: This is a case that he knows there's an excellent 32 00:01:52,760 --> 00:01:54,520 Speaker 1: chance he will actually have to ruin this in a 33 00:01:54,560 --> 00:01:57,400 Speaker 1: matter of in a matter of a few months. I 34 00:01:57,400 --> 00:01:59,400 Speaker 1: thought it was a fascinating exchange there with him and 35 00:01:59,480 --> 00:02:02,560 Speaker 1: Senator a path lay here democrat from Vermont, where the 36 00:02:02,600 --> 00:02:05,240 Speaker 1: Senator was trying to give him, you know, slight hypothetical 37 00:02:05,320 --> 00:02:09,079 Speaker 1: variations like could you hit it all June Jews from 38 00:02:09,160 --> 00:02:12,080 Speaker 1: entering the country, um, and you know, you know, could 39 00:02:12,080 --> 00:02:14,639 Speaker 1: we have a religious test? And uh, you know, generally 40 00:02:14,680 --> 00:02:17,600 Speaker 1: Judge Gorsch, uh, you know, did try very hard to say. 41 00:02:17,720 --> 00:02:21,320 Speaker 1: I can't commit myself to, uh, you know anything. There 42 00:02:21,360 --> 00:02:24,359 Speaker 1: are these principles in the Constitution. There's equal protection, there's 43 00:02:24,440 --> 00:02:27,639 Speaker 1: due process of law, there's you know, a statute that 44 00:02:27,680 --> 00:02:30,680 Speaker 1: protects religious freedoms. Those all all make a difference. But 45 00:02:30,680 --> 00:02:32,480 Speaker 1: I'm not going to tell you how I might rule 46 00:02:32,680 --> 00:02:36,079 Speaker 1: in a particular case. Greg can you comment on Senator 47 00:02:36,280 --> 00:02:39,680 Speaker 1: arn Hatch, Republican from Utah, and his line of questioning 48 00:02:39,760 --> 00:02:43,720 Speaker 1: in the context of not only this nomination hearing, but 49 00:02:43,960 --> 00:02:49,680 Speaker 1: the lack of any hearing for the previous nominee to 50 00:02:49,720 --> 00:02:54,480 Speaker 1: hold the Supreme Court chair, Merrick Garland, who was nominated 51 00:02:54,520 --> 00:02:59,080 Speaker 1: by former President Barack Obama. Yeah, the I didn't catch 52 00:02:59,120 --> 00:03:02,120 Speaker 1: all the exchange. But Republicans have been been making the 53 00:03:02,240 --> 00:03:05,920 Speaker 1: point that, uh, you know this this was different. This 54 00:03:06,000 --> 00:03:09,440 Speaker 1: was an election year. We put the you know, it 55 00:03:09,520 --> 00:03:11,680 Speaker 1: was basically up to the voters to decide do you 56 00:03:11,680 --> 00:03:13,840 Speaker 1: want Donald Trump silling this seat or do you want 57 00:03:13,880 --> 00:03:17,080 Speaker 1: Hillary Clinton filling the seat. The Republicans have made the 58 00:03:17,120 --> 00:03:20,160 Speaker 1: case that, uh, this was a way to give the 59 00:03:20,160 --> 00:03:22,080 Speaker 1: people a voice and who was going to be on 60 00:03:22,160 --> 00:03:25,960 Speaker 1: the Supreme Court. Judge Gorset did at kind words about 61 00:03:26,520 --> 00:03:30,360 Speaker 1: Mary Garland at this hearing. Um, And I believe at 62 00:03:30,360 --> 00:03:32,960 Speaker 1: one point one of the senators I'm forgetting which one, 63 00:03:33,000 --> 00:03:35,560 Speaker 1: one of the Republican senators, forgot who he was talking 64 00:03:35,560 --> 00:03:38,680 Speaker 1: to and actually referred to him as Judge Garland. Well, 65 00:03:38,720 --> 00:03:40,360 Speaker 1: I guess that you're not the only one that's forgetting 66 00:03:40,760 --> 00:03:43,400 Speaker 1: what's who's talking and who's on first, you know, just 67 00:03:43,440 --> 00:03:46,680 Speaker 1: to put us into perspective, Greg, I mean, in general, 68 00:03:47,160 --> 00:03:49,640 Speaker 1: do we get anything out of these hearings? Are they 69 00:03:49,640 --> 00:03:52,520 Speaker 1: basically just an excuse to throw every single question you 70 00:03:52,520 --> 00:03:57,520 Speaker 1: could possibly imagine at somebody and see if they mess up. Um, 71 00:03:57,560 --> 00:04:01,760 Speaker 1: that is a big part of it. Yes, Um, and uh. 72 00:04:03,000 --> 00:04:05,400 Speaker 1: Of the answers are are fairly predictable, but there are 73 00:04:05,440 --> 00:04:07,520 Speaker 1: some nuances and for people who are really watching the 74 00:04:07,560 --> 00:04:11,240 Speaker 1: courts closely, Um, you know there's some good substance in 75 00:04:11,280 --> 00:04:14,000 Speaker 1: the nitty gritty of of what they say. And in addition, 76 00:04:14,200 --> 00:04:15,920 Speaker 1: I think you know people who might not agree with 77 00:04:16,240 --> 00:04:18,560 Speaker 1: a nominee about some things. Do you think there is 78 00:04:18,600 --> 00:04:22,080 Speaker 1: some value in having Neil Gorsage say Roe v. Wade 79 00:04:22,400 --> 00:04:24,680 Speaker 1: is a precedent of the court and it's entitled to respect. 80 00:04:25,200 --> 00:04:28,240 Speaker 1: Um and uh, you know every nominee who has who 81 00:04:28,240 --> 00:04:31,279 Speaker 1: has come before the Court, are come before the Judiciary 82 00:04:31,279 --> 00:04:34,480 Speaker 1: Committee that I can recall has said something along those lines, 83 00:04:34,480 --> 00:04:36,960 Speaker 1: and that there is some value in just having the 84 00:04:37,000 --> 00:04:38,960 Speaker 1: person say say out loud that I'm not going to 85 00:04:39,000 --> 00:04:43,440 Speaker 1: immediately move to overturn precedents. I wonder if you could 86 00:04:43,440 --> 00:04:45,560 Speaker 1: tell us a little bit about cases that are going 87 00:04:45,600 --> 00:04:48,640 Speaker 1: to be coming before the Supreme Court and which ones 88 00:04:48,720 --> 00:04:52,080 Speaker 1: you believe are going to have the most effect on business, 89 00:04:52,080 --> 00:04:55,960 Speaker 1: but also on the legal issues that presented by President 90 00:04:55,960 --> 00:04:58,960 Speaker 1: Donald Trump. Well, the travel band that we've already talked about, 91 00:04:58,960 --> 00:05:00,680 Speaker 1: of course, is a big one that's hanging out there, 92 00:05:00,680 --> 00:05:02,760 Speaker 1: and there's an excellent chance that gets to the Supreme 93 00:05:02,800 --> 00:05:06,320 Speaker 1: Court one way or another. Uh one. Uh. You know, 94 00:05:06,360 --> 00:05:08,400 Speaker 1: we're going to see that the Court has been a 95 00:05:08,440 --> 00:05:11,680 Speaker 1: little slow in taking cases while it's shorthanded. But if 96 00:05:12,000 --> 00:05:15,040 Speaker 1: Judge Gorstch gets confirmed, I think you can imagine very 97 00:05:15,120 --> 00:05:17,839 Speaker 1: quickly you'll start to see more cases about class action 98 00:05:18,360 --> 00:05:22,159 Speaker 1: litigation and efforts to curb that. We may see a 99 00:05:22,200 --> 00:05:26,640 Speaker 1: new case involving mandatory fees to unions, if you recall 100 00:05:26,680 --> 00:05:30,599 Speaker 1: the Supreme Court deadlocked on that right after Justice Scalia 101 00:05:30,720 --> 00:05:35,680 Speaker 1: died um and we'll probably have issues about arbitration. Um, 102 00:05:35,880 --> 00:05:38,520 Speaker 1: certainly we'll have more patent cases. You know, there's gonna 103 00:05:38,520 --> 00:05:40,560 Speaker 1: be a lot of big business cases that Neil Gorcach 104 00:05:40,640 --> 00:05:43,000 Speaker 1: is gonna have a chance to rule on. Greg Start, 105 00:05:43,080 --> 00:05:45,080 Speaker 1: we really appreciate you joining us. I'm sure that it's 106 00:05:45,080 --> 00:05:47,240 Speaker 1: going to be a busy couple of days for you, 107 00:05:47,600 --> 00:05:49,640 Speaker 1: and frankly a couple of weeks. Great story, Supreme Court 108 00:05:49,680 --> 00:05:53,280 Speaker 1: reporter for Bloomberg talking about, uh, the Neil Gorcerge confirmation 109 00:05:53,320 --> 00:05:55,839 Speaker 1: hearings that we were listening into. He is testifying in 110 00:05:55,839 --> 00:05:59,440 Speaker 1: front of the Senate about his views and anything under 111 00:05:59,480 --> 00:06:03,479 Speaker 1: the sun in his path to go to the Supreme Court. 112 00:06:14,600 --> 00:06:17,920 Speaker 1: In addition to hearings at the Senate Judiciary Committee on 113 00:06:17,960 --> 00:06:21,040 Speaker 1: the nomination of Judge Neil Gorsuch to take a place 114 00:06:21,080 --> 00:06:23,960 Speaker 1: on the Supreme Court. There was a meeting today between 115 00:06:24,000 --> 00:06:27,760 Speaker 1: President Donald Trump and Republican leaders of the House to 116 00:06:27,839 --> 00:06:32,120 Speaker 1: talk about repeal and replace the American the Affordable Care 117 00:06:32,160 --> 00:06:36,159 Speaker 1: Act for Me, sometimes known as Obamacare. Anna Edney is 118 00:06:36,200 --> 00:06:39,680 Speaker 1: our Bloomberg healthcare reporter and uh, and I'm wondering if 119 00:06:39,720 --> 00:06:42,680 Speaker 1: you could describe for us exactly what did we learn 120 00:06:42,880 --> 00:06:48,400 Speaker 1: from that meeting. Well, what we heard that President Trump 121 00:06:48,560 --> 00:06:54,480 Speaker 1: said was if this healthcare bill doesn't pass, the Republicans 122 00:06:54,480 --> 00:06:57,479 Speaker 1: are going to lose their seats in the elections. So 123 00:06:57,880 --> 00:07:01,480 Speaker 1: he basically said, do this or you know, bad things 124 00:07:01,520 --> 00:07:06,400 Speaker 1: could happen. And there were Republicans who are against this, UM, 125 00:07:06,600 --> 00:07:09,039 Speaker 1: who don't want to vote yes for it, and they 126 00:07:09,080 --> 00:07:12,200 Speaker 1: still feel that way. They don't. I don't think that UM, 127 00:07:12,240 --> 00:07:14,760 Speaker 1: his please kind of changed that at all. I think 128 00:07:14,800 --> 00:07:17,120 Speaker 1: they are actually afraid of the opposite if if they 129 00:07:17,160 --> 00:07:19,520 Speaker 1: do vote for it, that the Republicans are going to 130 00:07:19,560 --> 00:07:22,600 Speaker 1: lose their majority. So can you put this into perspective 131 00:07:22,640 --> 00:07:25,360 Speaker 1: as far as what the main issues are that some 132 00:07:25,480 --> 00:07:29,720 Speaker 1: of the Republican representatives are fighting back on. Well, the 133 00:07:29,720 --> 00:07:32,480 Speaker 1: ones who are still against it right now, a lot 134 00:07:32,560 --> 00:07:35,720 Speaker 1: of them are in a very conservative group of about 135 00:07:35,800 --> 00:07:39,920 Speaker 1: forty members. They're called the Freedom Caucus, and their biggest 136 00:07:39,960 --> 00:07:44,560 Speaker 1: issue is they just want a complete repeal of Obamacare UM, 137 00:07:44,560 --> 00:07:47,440 Speaker 1: and a lot of that isn't in this legislation because 138 00:07:47,520 --> 00:07:50,040 Speaker 1: of the way that it has to be done to 139 00:07:50,160 --> 00:07:52,760 Speaker 1: get through the Senate. They're using this sort of complicated 140 00:07:52,800 --> 00:07:57,000 Speaker 1: process called reconciliation, and so they're not able to deal 141 00:07:57,160 --> 00:08:00,560 Speaker 1: with a lot of them, for example, the regular Leasians 142 00:08:00,640 --> 00:08:03,320 Speaker 1: on insurance companies. UM. That kind of tells them what 143 00:08:03,440 --> 00:08:07,200 Speaker 1: sort of things they have to cover and things like that, UM, 144 00:08:07,280 --> 00:08:11,080 Speaker 1: and those won't be repealed in this this piece of 145 00:08:11,240 --> 00:08:14,239 Speaker 1: what Republicans plan to do. And those who are against 146 00:08:14,240 --> 00:08:16,760 Speaker 1: it want that done. They don't feel like they have 147 00:08:16,800 --> 00:08:19,400 Speaker 1: assurances that it will get done down the line. They 148 00:08:19,440 --> 00:08:23,200 Speaker 1: don't know that they can um, exactly trust the Desk 149 00:08:23,240 --> 00:08:26,360 Speaker 1: Secretary to do that on his own through regulation and 150 00:08:26,400 --> 00:08:30,400 Speaker 1: that something like that would stand up in court. Does 151 00:08:30,480 --> 00:08:33,800 Speaker 1: the President need these members of which it described the 152 00:08:33,840 --> 00:08:37,760 Speaker 1: Republican the Freedom Caucus, such as Congressman Mark Meadows in 153 00:08:37,760 --> 00:08:40,040 Speaker 1: North Carolina? Does he need their votes in order to 154 00:08:40,080 --> 00:08:42,960 Speaker 1: get this to the Senate? He needs at least some 155 00:08:43,040 --> 00:08:46,520 Speaker 1: of their votes. UM. You know, they can't lose any 156 00:08:46,559 --> 00:08:50,280 Speaker 1: more than twenty one members and so you've got they 157 00:08:50,280 --> 00:08:53,000 Speaker 1: need to get to to sixteen. UM. And so he 158 00:08:53,040 --> 00:08:56,240 Speaker 1: does need to flip some of those in, even in 159 00:08:56,280 --> 00:08:59,040 Speaker 1: the Freedom Caucus. And you know, right now we don't 160 00:08:59,160 --> 00:09:02,720 Speaker 1: know they are opposed to it as a block, but 161 00:09:02,800 --> 00:09:05,000 Speaker 1: we know that UM, a lot of them are opposed 162 00:09:05,080 --> 00:09:07,800 Speaker 1: to it, and that the chairman who you mentioned Mark 163 00:09:07,800 --> 00:09:11,000 Speaker 1: Meadows has said, you know, we have enough to block 164 00:09:11,080 --> 00:09:15,160 Speaker 1: this bill right now, and so somewhere along the line 165 00:09:15,200 --> 00:09:18,040 Speaker 1: between that one Thursday, Um, you know, Paul Ryan and 166 00:09:18,320 --> 00:09:20,920 Speaker 1: Donald Trump are going to have to flip some of them. Well, 167 00:09:20,920 --> 00:09:23,320 Speaker 1: and you know, talking about Thursday, can you walk us 168 00:09:23,320 --> 00:09:27,160 Speaker 1: through what happens if President Trump and how Speaker Ryan 169 00:09:27,240 --> 00:09:30,840 Speaker 1: do not get sufficient votes to get this through on Thursday? 170 00:09:30,880 --> 00:09:35,000 Speaker 1: What happens next if they don't have enough votes, they're 171 00:09:35,080 --> 00:09:37,240 Speaker 1: basically just going to have to go back to the 172 00:09:37,320 --> 00:09:40,920 Speaker 1: drawing board. And you know, but but they have time 173 00:09:40,960 --> 00:09:42,960 Speaker 1: to do that. I mean, given that what's going on 174 00:09:43,040 --> 00:09:46,360 Speaker 1: with with Obamacare and getting the insurance companies queued up 175 00:09:46,440 --> 00:09:49,959 Speaker 1: for any potential changes, there's not a lot of time 176 00:09:50,200 --> 00:09:54,320 Speaker 1: to do it at all. Um. But the process I 177 00:09:54,360 --> 00:09:56,720 Speaker 1: mentioned earlier that they need to get it through the Senate, 178 00:09:56,800 --> 00:09:58,840 Speaker 1: this thing has to start in the House. So there's 179 00:09:58,880 --> 00:10:02,840 Speaker 1: really they've to find out what they can give to them, 180 00:10:03,320 --> 00:10:07,240 Speaker 1: the insurers or I'm sorry to the conservative Republicans to 181 00:10:07,280 --> 00:10:09,559 Speaker 1: be able to get this through. That might be something 182 00:10:09,640 --> 00:10:13,120 Speaker 1: like moving a little quicker on those regulations to undo 183 00:10:13,200 --> 00:10:16,680 Speaker 1: some of the um the limits on insurers that Tom 184 00:10:16,720 --> 00:10:19,080 Speaker 1: Prices said he would do, it might be bringing most 185 00:10:19,120 --> 00:10:21,880 Speaker 1: to light because we haven't seen those yet, and that 186 00:10:22,000 --> 00:10:24,800 Speaker 1: might give them some sort of assurance that this piece 187 00:10:24,840 --> 00:10:27,600 Speaker 1: of the puzzle that they've been promised is going to happen. 188 00:10:28,360 --> 00:10:31,480 Speaker 1: There any ideas to who would be most affected, meaning 189 00:10:31,480 --> 00:10:35,120 Speaker 1: the company's most affected, if indeed the plan as it 190 00:10:35,240 --> 00:10:39,080 Speaker 1: stands is actually passed by the Senate right now, that 191 00:10:39,160 --> 00:10:43,800 Speaker 1: would be hospitals. They stand to lose, you know, a 192 00:10:43,880 --> 00:10:47,400 Speaker 1: lot of money because of uncompensated care, which kind of 193 00:10:47,520 --> 00:10:51,640 Speaker 1: was the case before Obamacare, and Obamacare has been able 194 00:10:51,679 --> 00:10:55,000 Speaker 1: to decrease that because a lot more people had coverage, 195 00:10:55,320 --> 00:10:58,520 Speaker 1: a lot more people were able to qualify for Medicaid, 196 00:10:58,960 --> 00:11:01,600 Speaker 1: and so hospitals we're getting paid when people went to 197 00:11:01,960 --> 00:11:08,160 Speaker 1: the emergency room. And under this plan, um in, they'll 198 00:11:08,200 --> 00:11:13,240 Speaker 1: be twenty four million more people without insurance um than 199 00:11:13,360 --> 00:11:16,440 Speaker 1: would have been if Obamacare had stayed the law. And 200 00:11:16,480 --> 00:11:18,679 Speaker 1: so that's a lot of money for hospitals, and they're 201 00:11:18,720 --> 00:11:21,800 Speaker 1: already stretched very thin and and sort of closing in 202 00:11:21,840 --> 00:11:25,520 Speaker 1: record numbers. Anna Edney, we really appreciate you taking the 203 00:11:25,559 --> 00:11:28,160 Speaker 1: time to speak with us. Anna Edney as Bloomberg Healthcare reporter, 204 00:11:28,640 --> 00:11:32,640 Speaker 1: talking about the GOP's plan to replace Obamacare and what 205 00:11:32,760 --> 00:11:36,400 Speaker 1: has to happen on Thursday for this to proceed. Right now, 206 00:11:36,440 --> 00:11:39,160 Speaker 1: just to cut you up with markets, as Greg Jarrett 207 00:11:39,200 --> 00:11:41,920 Speaker 1: was saying, you did have a stock sell off that 208 00:11:42,240 --> 00:11:44,280 Speaker 1: is more significant than we've seen over the past couple 209 00:11:44,280 --> 00:11:46,120 Speaker 1: of days. Also in the bond market, you could see 210 00:11:46,120 --> 00:11:49,480 Speaker 1: the sixth day rally in thirty year treasuries is the 211 00:11:49,520 --> 00:12:00,360 Speaker 1: biggest since September. So definitely a risk off sentiment. Thanks 212 00:12:00,400 --> 00:12:03,160 Speaker 1: for listening to the Bloomberg pen L podcast. You can 213 00:12:03,200 --> 00:12:07,600 Speaker 1: subscribe and listen to interviews at iTunes, SoundCloud, or whatever 214 00:12:07,920 --> 00:12:11,400 Speaker 1: podcast platform you prefer. I'm Pim Fox. I'm out there 215 00:12:11,440 --> 00:12:14,480 Speaker 1: on Twitter at pim Fox. I'm out there on Twitter 216 00:12:14,600 --> 00:12:17,560 Speaker 1: at Lisa Abramo. It's one before the podcast. You can 217 00:12:17,559 --> 00:12:20,079 Speaker 1: always catch us worldwide on Bloomberg Radio.