1 00:00:08,200 --> 00:00:14,280 Speaker 1: Pushkin. Just a quick note here. You can listen to 2 00:00:14,320 --> 00:00:17,280 Speaker 1: all of the music mentioned in this episode on our playlist, 3 00:00:17,320 --> 00:00:19,400 Speaker 1: which you can find a link to in the show 4 00:00:19,440 --> 00:00:23,119 Speaker 1: notes for licensing reasons, each time a song is referenced 5 00:00:23,160 --> 00:00:28,360 Speaker 1: in this episode, you'll hear this sound effect all right. 6 00:00:29,000 --> 00:00:32,640 Speaker 1: Enjoy the episode. It's been twenty six years since the 7 00:00:32,680 --> 00:00:37,319 Speaker 1: release of Tom Petty's mid career masterpiece Wildflowers. On an 8 00:00:37,320 --> 00:00:41,120 Speaker 1: early episode of Broken Record, Rick Rubin, who produced Wildflowers, 9 00:00:41,520 --> 00:00:44,600 Speaker 1: recalled how Tom recorded more than twenty five songs for 10 00:00:44,680 --> 00:00:47,920 Speaker 1: what was originally meant to be a double album. Those 11 00:00:47,920 --> 00:00:51,720 Speaker 1: extra ten songs had been shelved and definitely until now. 12 00:00:53,960 --> 00:00:57,480 Speaker 1: That's Lee Virginia alone, one of the brilliant newly unearthed 13 00:00:57,480 --> 00:01:00,960 Speaker 1: Petty songs from the box set Wildflowers and all the rest. 14 00:01:01,920 --> 00:01:04,600 Speaker 1: Along with those ten extra tracks, the box it also 15 00:01:04,640 --> 00:01:08,480 Speaker 1: includes dozens of never before her demos and live recordings. 16 00:01:09,440 --> 00:01:13,240 Speaker 1: The comprehensive collection was championed by Tom's daughter, Adria Petty, 17 00:01:13,520 --> 00:01:17,560 Speaker 1: an accomplished director who shot music videos for Beyonce, Coldplay, 18 00:01:17,720 --> 00:01:21,520 Speaker 1: and Regina Spector. Adria was born right around the time 19 00:01:21,600 --> 00:01:25,039 Speaker 1: her dad formed The Heartbreakers, and she remained incredibly close 20 00:01:25,040 --> 00:01:28,800 Speaker 1: to him until his death in twenty seventeen. In today's interview, 21 00:01:28,920 --> 00:01:31,280 Speaker 1: Rick sits down with Adria, who's known for a long 22 00:01:31,400 --> 00:01:34,360 Speaker 1: time together. They listened to some of the demos that 23 00:01:34,360 --> 00:01:37,200 Speaker 1: were found in Tom's closet after he passed, and she 24 00:01:37,200 --> 00:01:45,000 Speaker 1: shares intimate details about her dad's creative process. This is 25 00:01:45,080 --> 00:01:48,800 Speaker 1: broken record Liner notes for the digital Age. I'm justin Richmondton. 26 00:01:53,680 --> 00:01:58,120 Speaker 1: Here's Rick Rubin and Adria Petty. The interesting thing about 27 00:01:58,240 --> 00:02:00,800 Speaker 1: the podcast for me is that for people that I know, 28 00:02:01,720 --> 00:02:04,000 Speaker 1: I get to ask them about stuff that we just 29 00:02:04,040 --> 00:02:07,640 Speaker 1: never comes up in normal life. So like, what was 30 00:02:07,680 --> 00:02:11,960 Speaker 1: it like growing up in the house with Tom and 31 00:02:12,000 --> 00:02:16,000 Speaker 1: your mom? Was that? Like? It was weird? I mean, 32 00:02:16,040 --> 00:02:17,760 Speaker 1: it's been a lot of time to reflect on it. 33 00:02:18,639 --> 00:02:21,880 Speaker 1: At the beginning, it was really exciting because I was 34 00:02:22,160 --> 00:02:25,720 Speaker 1: born right when the Heartbreakers were born. So there were, 35 00:02:25,840 --> 00:02:28,160 Speaker 1: you know, times when we all lived in motels together. 36 00:02:28,320 --> 00:02:31,720 Speaker 1: There were times when we all traveled together, or there 37 00:02:31,720 --> 00:02:34,880 Speaker 1: were group houses that everybody lived in and you know, 38 00:02:34,960 --> 00:02:38,680 Speaker 1: my recollection doesn't quite go back that far, but there 39 00:02:38,760 --> 00:02:44,000 Speaker 1: was definitely an exciting camaraderie and community of people around us, 40 00:02:44,240 --> 00:02:46,919 Speaker 1: and they sort of treated me as an equal from 41 00:02:46,919 --> 00:02:48,840 Speaker 1: the time I was six, so I was just kind 42 00:02:48,840 --> 00:02:52,799 Speaker 1: of like another person in this gang of friends and artists. 43 00:02:53,720 --> 00:02:57,320 Speaker 1: It was always like a lot of music, a lot 44 00:02:57,360 --> 00:03:00,560 Speaker 1: of music playing, a lot of reggae, and a lot 45 00:03:00,560 --> 00:03:04,960 Speaker 1: of like just kind of great energy coming from the 46 00:03:05,000 --> 00:03:08,240 Speaker 1: stereo all the time, or from Dad's acoustic guitar. Can 47 00:03:08,280 --> 00:03:13,280 Speaker 1: you remember when you first realized that everybody's life was 48 00:03:13,360 --> 00:03:16,919 Speaker 1: not the same as that? Yeah, when was that? There 49 00:03:17,080 --> 00:03:21,239 Speaker 1: was a time when I was about seven, when Damn 50 00:03:21,280 --> 00:03:25,360 Speaker 1: the Torpedoes came out, and you know, leading up to that, 51 00:03:25,480 --> 00:03:28,120 Speaker 1: we really kind of lost Dad, like to Jimmy Ivy 52 00:03:28,160 --> 00:03:29,520 Speaker 1: and like that. You can see that in a lot 53 00:03:29,560 --> 00:03:31,400 Speaker 1: of documentaries and stuff where they were literally on the 54 00:03:31,440 --> 00:03:34,400 Speaker 1: phone day and night or in the studio day and 55 00:03:34,480 --> 00:03:37,680 Speaker 1: night trying to perfect that record and bring it somewhere. 56 00:03:38,560 --> 00:03:42,080 Speaker 1: And after that record came out, my father's mother died 57 00:03:42,520 --> 00:03:45,280 Speaker 1: and he didn't go to the funeral, and I remember 58 00:03:45,360 --> 00:03:48,240 Speaker 1: him sitting by the window just looking like just he 59 00:03:48,440 --> 00:03:51,400 Speaker 1: just changed, like something changed in him. And I was like, 60 00:03:51,480 --> 00:03:53,760 Speaker 1: why didn't you go? And he was like, because I'll 61 00:03:53,760 --> 00:03:57,360 Speaker 1: just be a distraction. I can't go, and distraction because 62 00:03:57,720 --> 00:04:01,360 Speaker 1: of music or distraction because of their relationships in the family, 63 00:04:01,480 --> 00:04:05,080 Speaker 1: because he was famous, because it was he would have overshadowed, 64 00:04:05,880 --> 00:04:08,000 Speaker 1: you know, her life as a churchgo or her life 65 00:04:08,000 --> 00:04:11,240 Speaker 1: in her community. Like the world that they had in Gainesville, 66 00:04:11,280 --> 00:04:17,200 Speaker 1: which was very very I mean Kitty, Kitty Avery Petty, 67 00:04:17,400 --> 00:04:22,159 Speaker 1: our grandmother. Kitty was like magical and compassionate and sweet. 68 00:04:22,920 --> 00:04:25,920 Speaker 1: And I got to meet her before she died a 69 00:04:25,920 --> 00:04:29,760 Speaker 1: few times and I remember her, but um, she loved 70 00:04:29,760 --> 00:04:32,120 Speaker 1: my dad, I mean the sunshine out of my dad 71 00:04:32,160 --> 00:04:34,760 Speaker 1: and his brother for her, and she was very loving person. 72 00:04:35,640 --> 00:04:39,960 Speaker 1: But he changed after she died, and damned the torpedoes 73 00:04:39,960 --> 00:04:42,960 Speaker 1: came out and people started like shout shooting our windows 74 00:04:43,000 --> 00:04:46,480 Speaker 1: and stuff like doing weird stuff in the eighties, like 75 00:04:47,080 --> 00:04:50,240 Speaker 1: and we started having a lot more a presence of 76 00:04:50,279 --> 00:04:54,160 Speaker 1: like security, or a presence of handlers or people who 77 00:04:54,200 --> 00:04:56,520 Speaker 1: cleaned our homes or things like that. That just wasn't 78 00:04:56,520 --> 00:04:59,760 Speaker 1: normal at all, and it kind of I think that 79 00:05:00,120 --> 00:05:03,200 Speaker 1: kind of got worse and worse, like does in terms 80 00:05:03,200 --> 00:05:05,440 Speaker 1: of like living in the house with them, you know 81 00:05:05,560 --> 00:05:08,280 Speaker 1: that feeling of like wow, the room is getting further 82 00:05:08,320 --> 00:05:11,640 Speaker 1: and further away, and there's an intercom and there's there's 83 00:05:11,640 --> 00:05:14,479 Speaker 1: all these other people that do basic functions that other 84 00:05:14,480 --> 00:05:17,640 Speaker 1: people can do for themselves. And I think that there's 85 00:05:17,640 --> 00:05:22,279 Speaker 1: this sort of mythology that if you're successful, you're isolated 86 00:05:22,320 --> 00:05:24,880 Speaker 1: from people. You're up a long driveway, and other people 87 00:05:24,960 --> 00:05:26,920 Speaker 1: do all these things that are so annoying to do. 88 00:05:27,560 --> 00:05:30,200 Speaker 1: But when you stop doing those things for yourself, I 89 00:05:30,279 --> 00:05:34,200 Speaker 1: think you get really disconnected and aimless about your own existence. 90 00:05:34,360 --> 00:05:37,719 Speaker 1: Like you don't understand how much mess you're making around 91 00:05:37,760 --> 00:05:40,279 Speaker 1: the house, or you don't understand what groceries you actually 92 00:05:40,320 --> 00:05:42,440 Speaker 1: need as opposed to what this random person goes and 93 00:05:42,480 --> 00:05:45,240 Speaker 1: buys for you, or you know, there's just a sort 94 00:05:45,240 --> 00:05:48,360 Speaker 1: of disconnect that starts to manifest in depression. And the 95 00:05:48,520 --> 00:05:52,760 Speaker 1: successful people that I've grown up around and with, and 96 00:05:53,480 --> 00:05:56,599 Speaker 1: my dad was so down to earth that we would 97 00:05:56,600 --> 00:05:58,839 Speaker 1: go to Florida every year and now have no one 98 00:05:59,240 --> 00:06:02,159 Speaker 1: for a few months and we clean our own house 99 00:06:02,200 --> 00:06:05,520 Speaker 1: and be with my uncle and normal people that they 100 00:06:05,560 --> 00:06:08,600 Speaker 1: grew up with. And he would sort of isolate enough 101 00:06:08,800 --> 00:06:12,479 Speaker 1: with normal people to stay pretty pure, cool guy. Yeah, 102 00:06:12,839 --> 00:06:15,599 Speaker 1: did he enjoy those times. He loved it. Yeah, he 103 00:06:15,720 --> 00:06:18,000 Speaker 1: loved that. And you know, there was a lot of 104 00:06:18,040 --> 00:06:21,600 Speaker 1: songwriting and a lot of inspiration drawn from that time 105 00:06:21,640 --> 00:06:23,760 Speaker 1: at the beach in Florida, and we still have that house, Like, 106 00:06:23,800 --> 00:06:27,400 Speaker 1: that's a really special place. I remember when he got 107 00:06:27,440 --> 00:06:31,920 Speaker 1: it and being really excited about it. Yeah, I mean 108 00:06:32,040 --> 00:06:34,360 Speaker 1: we had been going there renting for years. And like 109 00:06:34,480 --> 00:06:38,000 Speaker 1: you know, he was a very pragmatic guy, my dad. 110 00:06:38,120 --> 00:06:40,400 Speaker 1: You know, he didn't like to live beyond his means. 111 00:06:40,440 --> 00:06:43,080 Speaker 1: He didn't extend credit, he didn't take mortgages. He just 112 00:06:43,200 --> 00:06:46,560 Speaker 1: he liked to keep things simple. But things got less 113 00:06:46,600 --> 00:06:49,560 Speaker 1: simple after he became famous. How much time do you 114 00:06:49,600 --> 00:06:52,000 Speaker 1: spend on tour when you really live all the time, 115 00:06:52,240 --> 00:06:54,560 Speaker 1: all the time, all the time. Did you ever go 116 00:06:55,680 --> 00:06:58,200 Speaker 1: We didn't have enough money to take the families with 117 00:06:58,320 --> 00:07:01,960 Speaker 1: us until the late eighties when my house burned down 118 00:07:02,680 --> 00:07:06,400 Speaker 1: and we went on the Dylan Petty tour. And that's 119 00:07:06,440 --> 00:07:08,880 Speaker 1: actually when me and Jacob met was on that tour 120 00:07:08,960 --> 00:07:11,280 Speaker 1: and we traveled the world together for most of the year, 121 00:07:11,400 --> 00:07:15,280 Speaker 1: and we went to Egypt and Israel. Together. It was wild. Yeah, 122 00:07:15,320 --> 00:07:18,720 Speaker 1: I mean being a Carni folk or whatever it is 123 00:07:18,760 --> 00:07:21,840 Speaker 1: that you know, the child of a musician becomes, you 124 00:07:22,040 --> 00:07:26,400 Speaker 1: learned how to deal with transitional lifestyle like living out 125 00:07:26,440 --> 00:07:28,360 Speaker 1: of a suitcase, having her bag packed every day and 126 00:07:28,440 --> 00:07:32,680 Speaker 1: unpacking it every night, or so different from being the military, 127 00:07:32,880 --> 00:07:36,320 Speaker 1: like you know, just being it's not and there's a 128 00:07:36,320 --> 00:07:38,960 Speaker 1: camaraderie and there's a bro code, and there's a sort 129 00:07:38,960 --> 00:07:43,640 Speaker 1: of you know what do we call it road etiquette, 130 00:07:44,200 --> 00:07:46,400 Speaker 1: so where they used to us as kids, like you know, 131 00:07:46,480 --> 00:07:48,840 Speaker 1: you don't walk certain places on stage, you don't trip 132 00:07:48,840 --> 00:07:52,040 Speaker 1: over wires, you don't get people's way if you can help, 133 00:07:52,080 --> 00:07:55,640 Speaker 1: you help. You know, there's a certain road etiquette to 134 00:07:55,720 --> 00:07:58,800 Speaker 1: watching a road crew work. And my dad's road crew, 135 00:07:58,840 --> 00:08:01,520 Speaker 1: you know, he famously had multigenerations of people that would 136 00:08:01,520 --> 00:08:03,560 Speaker 1: just like replace themselves with their sons, and it was 137 00:08:03,600 --> 00:08:07,400 Speaker 1: like forty years of taken care of those people. So 138 00:08:07,560 --> 00:08:11,000 Speaker 1: once we started going on the road, that road etiquette 139 00:08:11,040 --> 00:08:14,120 Speaker 1: and that sort of ability to be able to transition 140 00:08:14,160 --> 00:08:17,840 Speaker 1: into any situation. I think for me and some of 141 00:08:17,880 --> 00:08:21,080 Speaker 1: my friends that have grown up similarly, that has not changed, 142 00:08:21,120 --> 00:08:23,280 Speaker 1: Like we always want to be on a plane, or 143 00:08:23,480 --> 00:08:25,240 Speaker 1: like I became a director so I could shoot all 144 00:08:25,240 --> 00:08:27,760 Speaker 1: over the world and have these little stints and I 145 00:08:27,760 --> 00:08:29,760 Speaker 1: would be living in a hotel and here I am again, 146 00:08:30,160 --> 00:08:35,120 Speaker 1: Like it's a different it's a different sense of feeling settled. 147 00:08:35,160 --> 00:08:37,600 Speaker 1: But you can kind of feel settled anywhere, which is 148 00:08:37,679 --> 00:08:41,200 Speaker 1: kind of nice. Gift, really nice. That sounds great. Do 149 00:08:41,240 --> 00:08:44,239 Speaker 1: we know how the house that your dad wrote Wildflowers 150 00:08:44,240 --> 00:08:47,520 Speaker 1: in burned? Do we know the story of that? It's 151 00:08:47,520 --> 00:08:51,680 Speaker 1: a crazy story telling the story. I wish I could. 152 00:08:53,040 --> 00:08:56,199 Speaker 1: I wish I could. The answer is, I have suspicions, 153 00:08:56,240 --> 00:09:01,840 Speaker 1: but I can't. I can't publicly say them. I'm curious 154 00:09:01,840 --> 00:09:06,120 Speaker 1: that I always wondered, like, yeah, I mean it was 155 00:09:06,640 --> 00:09:09,800 Speaker 1: Losing a house like you did is a super emotional thing, 156 00:09:10,000 --> 00:09:13,400 Speaker 1: and I know a number of men in particular who 157 00:09:14,080 --> 00:09:16,400 Speaker 1: really took it hard when they lost their family home 158 00:09:16,520 --> 00:09:19,920 Speaker 1: where they had their children, etc. Because I think it 159 00:09:20,040 --> 00:09:22,320 Speaker 1: just is a symbol of something. It's a symbol of 160 00:09:22,480 --> 00:09:25,400 Speaker 1: really being able to take care of your family. And 161 00:09:25,559 --> 00:09:29,960 Speaker 1: I think it's it's a sacred wound. It feels really, 162 00:09:29,960 --> 00:09:31,920 Speaker 1: even if you weren't that attached to the house or whatever, 163 00:09:31,920 --> 00:09:34,880 Speaker 1: you know, it just feels like really have the rug 164 00:09:34,920 --> 00:09:38,360 Speaker 1: pulled out from underneath you. In our case, it became 165 00:09:38,600 --> 00:09:43,120 Speaker 1: a very important nexus of the journey of my father's 166 00:09:43,200 --> 00:09:46,720 Speaker 1: career and his life. And without it, I don't believe 167 00:09:46,720 --> 00:09:48,920 Speaker 1: he would have said he would be a backing band 168 00:09:48,960 --> 00:09:52,720 Speaker 1: for anyone. I think the necessity of just let's get 169 00:09:52,760 --> 00:09:55,840 Speaker 1: us on a bus and we'll figure this out. He 170 00:09:55,960 --> 00:09:58,800 Speaker 1: was at a really interesting point in his career and 171 00:09:58,840 --> 00:10:00,400 Speaker 1: I don't want to get the dates ru but it's 172 00:10:00,400 --> 00:10:03,920 Speaker 1: like post Southern accents, and they'd gotten really sober. They'd 173 00:10:03,920 --> 00:10:06,760 Speaker 1: have been trouble with the drugs and sobriety before that, 174 00:10:07,440 --> 00:10:10,160 Speaker 1: and he was sort of reinventing himself and had this 175 00:10:10,200 --> 00:10:13,080 Speaker 1: opportunity to go out with Bob and have the band 176 00:10:13,120 --> 00:10:15,920 Speaker 1: really put through its paces in a cool way. And 177 00:10:15,960 --> 00:10:18,400 Speaker 1: that was the birth of meeting George and the Wilberries 178 00:10:18,480 --> 00:10:22,319 Speaker 1: coming together and sort of elevating not just the music 179 00:10:22,360 --> 00:10:25,240 Speaker 1: but the consciousness and just feeling a certain amount of 180 00:10:25,280 --> 00:10:28,080 Speaker 1: like you're not the only one dealing with this man. 181 00:10:28,160 --> 00:10:30,960 Speaker 1: It's really hard to be a rock star. It's really confusing, 182 00:10:31,000 --> 00:10:34,000 Speaker 1: and actually rock and roll has sort of been something 183 00:10:34,200 --> 00:10:36,920 Speaker 1: on the fringes since the seventies, and this is like 184 00:10:37,880 --> 00:10:40,199 Speaker 1: he found he found his soul mates through being thrown 185 00:10:40,200 --> 00:10:43,520 Speaker 1: out into the world and not just staying home. And 186 00:10:43,600 --> 00:10:49,640 Speaker 1: that was for us. That fire was regenerative. It was 187 00:10:49,720 --> 00:10:53,440 Speaker 1: definitely it elevated him to the next level as opposed 188 00:10:53,480 --> 00:10:56,640 Speaker 1: to knocking him down. Yeah. Do you think that those 189 00:10:56,679 --> 00:11:02,480 Speaker 1: relationships with George and Bob and Jeff were the first 190 00:11:02,520 --> 00:11:04,920 Speaker 1: time he had that sense of community beyond just the 191 00:11:04,960 --> 00:11:09,520 Speaker 1: guys in the band. I definitely feel like he had 192 00:11:09,559 --> 00:11:12,000 Speaker 1: it with certain people, like there were there were certain 193 00:11:12,160 --> 00:11:15,400 Speaker 1: magical people to my dad, like Del Shannon or Roger 194 00:11:15,480 --> 00:11:20,040 Speaker 1: mcgwin that he had really deep connections with musically, but 195 00:11:20,080 --> 00:11:22,560 Speaker 1: he was sort of reverential to, like he didn't feel 196 00:11:22,559 --> 00:11:25,040 Speaker 1: he was on the same footing with I mean, they 197 00:11:25,040 --> 00:11:28,600 Speaker 1: were his heroes and and he didn't feel that way 198 00:11:28,600 --> 00:11:32,280 Speaker 1: about Georgia, Bob or Jeff either. I mean he thought 199 00:11:32,320 --> 00:11:35,160 Speaker 1: the world of them. He was in all of them, 200 00:11:35,360 --> 00:11:40,400 Speaker 1: probably until he died, you know. But he he felt 201 00:11:40,440 --> 00:11:43,479 Speaker 1: like he was responsible for the band and their families 202 00:11:43,600 --> 00:11:46,440 Speaker 1: and the crew and keeping the Tom Petty and the 203 00:11:46,480 --> 00:11:51,800 Speaker 1: Heartbreakers organization running and seeing that other people handled that 204 00:11:51,920 --> 00:11:56,439 Speaker 1: different ways and that they had already gone two decades 205 00:11:56,520 --> 00:12:00,600 Speaker 1: deep into this experience, or him trying to fathom what 206 00:12:00,640 --> 00:12:03,520 Speaker 1: it was to be a Beatle or to live with 207 00:12:03,600 --> 00:12:06,439 Speaker 1: that sort of scrutiny that Bob had lived with for 208 00:12:06,480 --> 00:12:09,160 Speaker 1: so long, and the intensity I mean, we saw a 209 00:12:09,240 --> 00:12:11,720 Speaker 1: lot of crazy people on those tours with Bob, and 210 00:12:11,760 --> 00:12:14,800 Speaker 1: there were bomb threats, and there were crazy fans that 211 00:12:14,880 --> 00:12:16,760 Speaker 1: had changed our last name to Dylan and have like 212 00:12:16,800 --> 00:12:18,840 Speaker 1: figured out how to pull their idea out and sneak 213 00:12:18,840 --> 00:12:21,320 Speaker 1: into hotels, and like there were there were sort of 214 00:12:21,360 --> 00:12:26,199 Speaker 1: like really really weird people around on that made our 215 00:12:26,240 --> 00:12:31,239 Speaker 1: life look like so uneventful. I think it definitely changed perspective. Yeah, 216 00:12:31,280 --> 00:12:33,320 Speaker 1: and I think he liked not being the frontman for 217 00:12:33,320 --> 00:12:36,160 Speaker 1: a second. It gave him a perspective on what a 218 00:12:36,200 --> 00:12:39,480 Speaker 1: good frontman he was in certain ways. And also like 219 00:12:39,720 --> 00:12:43,280 Speaker 1: just sort of like digging off of, you know, Bob's 220 00:12:43,360 --> 00:12:46,440 Speaker 1: energy that that tour. I mean, I still think as 221 00:12:46,480 --> 00:12:49,960 Speaker 1: a fan and Jacob too, I think I think we 222 00:12:50,080 --> 00:12:53,840 Speaker 1: all feel that that music it was really important that 223 00:12:53,840 --> 00:12:56,520 Speaker 1: they made during that tour. In my dad before he died, 224 00:12:56,600 --> 00:12:57,920 Speaker 1: one of the last things he took me in the 225 00:12:57,920 --> 00:12:59,679 Speaker 1: studio and played, because he would always get giddy and 226 00:12:59,720 --> 00:13:04,360 Speaker 1: take me stadium play stuff was Dylan petty stuff and 227 00:13:04,600 --> 00:13:07,480 Speaker 1: then playing with Roger mcgwinn and some things that were 228 00:13:07,480 --> 00:13:09,520 Speaker 1: special from that tour that he had in his archive. 229 00:13:10,600 --> 00:13:14,760 Speaker 1: But yeah, he definitely changed after that. He saw a bigger, 230 00:13:14,840 --> 00:13:18,840 Speaker 1: brighter picture, a simpler picture, and I think that that 231 00:13:19,080 --> 00:13:21,640 Speaker 1: got him to Wildflowers. I mean that got him to 232 00:13:21,679 --> 00:13:25,160 Speaker 1: the point of wanting true independence. And there were different 233 00:13:25,200 --> 00:13:27,360 Speaker 1: stages in that. There was fulm and fever as the 234 00:13:27,400 --> 00:13:30,080 Speaker 1: first step of going, hey, I really am not stuck 235 00:13:30,080 --> 00:13:35,079 Speaker 1: in this swamp rock world at all. I'm a songwriter 236 00:13:35,240 --> 00:13:37,160 Speaker 1: and I'm in the car with my kids listening to 237 00:13:37,240 --> 00:13:40,520 Speaker 1: Top forty and I my dad always listened to everything. 238 00:13:40,720 --> 00:13:43,040 Speaker 1: People would not have believed with the kind of influences 239 00:13:43,080 --> 00:13:46,080 Speaker 1: he had. But I mean, we had an eight track 240 00:13:46,120 --> 00:13:48,520 Speaker 1: of Yello, for example. I remember when we were poor, 241 00:13:48,760 --> 00:13:51,640 Speaker 1: like really poor before down the Torpedoes in the seventies, 242 00:13:52,240 --> 00:13:55,760 Speaker 1: and you know, I remember that ll eight track going 243 00:13:55,800 --> 00:13:58,400 Speaker 1: in and snapping into that deck and listening to that 244 00:13:58,520 --> 00:14:03,200 Speaker 1: until it broke. The thing you mentioned about him liking 245 00:14:04,080 --> 00:14:06,000 Speaker 1: not being the frontman for a minute, I got to 246 00:14:06,000 --> 00:14:08,560 Speaker 1: see the same thing when we did the album with 247 00:14:08,760 --> 00:14:14,440 Speaker 1: Johnny Cash, where he loved being in the band and 248 00:14:14,600 --> 00:14:16,640 Speaker 1: not having to be the bandleader and not having to 249 00:14:16,679 --> 00:14:18,920 Speaker 1: sing the songs, but just get to make music and 250 00:14:19,320 --> 00:14:22,640 Speaker 1: play different instruments on different songs and just be in 251 00:14:22,680 --> 00:14:26,160 Speaker 1: the creative experience with no sense of pressure. You know, 252 00:14:26,440 --> 00:14:30,240 Speaker 1: there was no pressure on him in this because his 253 00:14:30,360 --> 00:14:33,000 Speaker 1: face wasn't on the cover of that album, and he 254 00:14:33,120 --> 00:14:34,880 Speaker 1: just felt like he was free to just play and 255 00:14:34,960 --> 00:14:38,400 Speaker 1: he loved it. He loved that projects so much. I mean, 256 00:14:38,400 --> 00:14:41,120 Speaker 1: he loved John. John and June were always around. There 257 00:14:41,200 --> 00:14:44,840 Speaker 1: were fixtures at shows and would show up and he 258 00:14:45,040 --> 00:14:47,880 Speaker 1: just loved John so much. And you know, they're such 259 00:14:47,880 --> 00:14:51,920 Speaker 1: a special family and such kind people. But I know 260 00:14:52,000 --> 00:14:53,560 Speaker 1: that when my dad could be a bass player, he 261 00:14:53,600 --> 00:14:57,480 Speaker 1: would come in from like those unchanged stations or whatever 262 00:14:57,520 --> 00:14:59,440 Speaker 1: and like bounce in the room like I got to 263 00:14:59,480 --> 00:15:01,920 Speaker 1: be the bass, Claire, I'm just playing bass, like you'd 264 00:15:01,960 --> 00:15:05,400 Speaker 1: tell you multiple times, and he would be so proud that, like, hey, 265 00:15:05,440 --> 00:15:07,520 Speaker 1: I'm free and free. They just tell me when to 266 00:15:07,560 --> 00:15:09,840 Speaker 1: do things and I do them, you know. And I 267 00:15:09,880 --> 00:15:11,240 Speaker 1: think he felt like that when he worked with the 268 00:15:11,280 --> 00:15:13,800 Speaker 1: Shelters and mentored them. I think he felt like that 269 00:15:14,560 --> 00:15:17,640 Speaker 1: whenever he got to just sort of like be a 270 00:15:17,680 --> 00:15:20,560 Speaker 1: part of something groovy like that. But it wasn't often 271 00:15:20,680 --> 00:15:23,400 Speaker 1: he would let go of the rains, as you know. Yeah, 272 00:15:23,800 --> 00:15:29,000 Speaker 1: from the outside, most people think of the rock star 273 00:15:29,120 --> 00:15:34,800 Speaker 1: lifestyle as one of excess in terms of parties and 274 00:15:35,000 --> 00:15:40,280 Speaker 1: people and being out all night and my experience of him, 275 00:15:40,320 --> 00:15:43,600 Speaker 1: and I want to ask if this is correct or accurate, 276 00:15:44,160 --> 00:15:47,280 Speaker 1: but he would watch TV and read and be home 277 00:15:47,480 --> 00:15:50,280 Speaker 1: and other than that he was either on tour or 278 00:15:50,360 --> 00:15:54,800 Speaker 1: writing music. Yeah, pretty much. I mean he wasn't doing 279 00:15:54,800 --> 00:15:58,680 Speaker 1: any normal stuff. He wasn't doing any social stuff. No, 280 00:15:58,720 --> 00:16:03,360 Speaker 1: I've been here. I mean friends, there were eras of 281 00:16:04,080 --> 00:16:08,080 Speaker 1: you know, being social. I think you know, in the 282 00:16:08,720 --> 00:16:12,560 Speaker 1: early eighties, the band still all hung out together, all 283 00:16:12,600 --> 00:16:15,480 Speaker 1: their families would come over. There was still this sort 284 00:16:15,520 --> 00:16:18,520 Speaker 1: of like camaraderie around us that was very social, but 285 00:16:18,600 --> 00:16:20,880 Speaker 1: it was still just within you guys. It was a 286 00:16:20,960 --> 00:16:24,040 Speaker 1: very heavily vetted group. I mean, my dad was married 287 00:16:24,080 --> 00:16:27,400 Speaker 1: really young, he had kids really young, he had responsibilities. 288 00:16:27,440 --> 00:16:29,120 Speaker 1: A lot of the other guys didn't have My cad 289 00:16:29,320 --> 00:16:32,320 Speaker 1: a daughter year after him, so you know, he was 290 00:16:32,400 --> 00:16:36,480 Speaker 1: in a similar groove. But you know, Jane and Tom 291 00:16:36,560 --> 00:16:39,800 Speaker 1: did not have normal childhoods where they had sort of 292 00:16:39,840 --> 00:16:44,240 Speaker 1: a reference for what a normal life would be. So, 293 00:16:44,400 --> 00:16:45,920 Speaker 1: you know, he had a room that he would go 294 00:16:45,960 --> 00:16:48,200 Speaker 1: in and he would write, and that was like when 295 00:16:48,200 --> 00:16:50,920 Speaker 1: I was like five years old on roblar near Owner 296 00:16:51,000 --> 00:16:53,760 Speaker 1: Valley Vista where we lived when my dad was probably 297 00:16:53,800 --> 00:16:57,320 Speaker 1: writing like Breakdown and all those songs or whatever. You know, 298 00:16:57,400 --> 00:16:59,560 Speaker 1: even in those times and they didn't have any money, 299 00:16:59,560 --> 00:17:03,000 Speaker 1: they would make sure they had a little scrappy room 300 00:17:03,040 --> 00:17:07,119 Speaker 1: and that discipline was his. That was his sort of practice, 301 00:17:07,320 --> 00:17:10,920 Speaker 1: like that was his existence. Was every day, no matter what, 302 00:17:11,000 --> 00:17:12,720 Speaker 1: I pour my coffee, I go in this room, I 303 00:17:12,840 --> 00:17:16,040 Speaker 1: drummed this guitar. And would he usually be right when 304 00:17:16,080 --> 00:17:19,040 Speaker 1: he woke up, like coffee it was first thing after coffee. 305 00:17:19,119 --> 00:17:21,600 Speaker 1: I think it would be like in the afternoon when 306 00:17:21,640 --> 00:17:24,760 Speaker 1: he was like very awake and very like much like 307 00:17:24,880 --> 00:17:28,840 Speaker 1: through with whatever first impressions of the day. And then 308 00:17:29,000 --> 00:17:30,919 Speaker 1: he would be in the room by himself with the 309 00:17:30,920 --> 00:17:34,360 Speaker 1: door clothes. Oh yeah, yeah, it's a private process. And 310 00:17:34,680 --> 00:17:37,439 Speaker 1: even now hours would you say that would typically be 311 00:17:38,640 --> 00:17:41,000 Speaker 1: It would vary. Sometimes he'd go in for a little 312 00:17:41,000 --> 00:17:43,560 Speaker 1: bit and sometimes he'd go in for weeks, like you 313 00:17:43,760 --> 00:17:46,040 Speaker 1: just did not even see him. I remember one time 314 00:17:46,080 --> 00:17:48,840 Speaker 1: he got really stuck on All or Nothing, which is 315 00:17:48,880 --> 00:17:51,439 Speaker 1: a song on Into the Great Wide Open. It's a 316 00:17:51,440 --> 00:17:54,840 Speaker 1: really cool song that has a great wailing guitar on it, 317 00:17:55,560 --> 00:17:58,840 Speaker 1: and I was just like, God, he's got to solve 318 00:17:58,880 --> 00:18:01,159 Speaker 1: this one. We had hearn this song for like months, 319 00:18:01,280 --> 00:18:04,320 Speaker 1: is like, and it was it was like he was 320 00:18:04,440 --> 00:18:06,800 Speaker 1: haunted by it. And it was one of the few 321 00:18:06,800 --> 00:18:09,080 Speaker 1: where I just saw him like going, I can't figure 322 00:18:09,119 --> 00:18:12,000 Speaker 1: this out. But he ended up obviously making it into 323 00:18:12,040 --> 00:18:15,359 Speaker 1: a really beautiful song. But I think that these things 324 00:18:15,760 --> 00:18:17,800 Speaker 1: they seemed to come easy to him, and he liked 325 00:18:17,800 --> 00:18:20,720 Speaker 1: them to seem simplistic and like they came easy to him, 326 00:18:21,480 --> 00:18:24,680 Speaker 1: but they were so kind of crafted and cared about 327 00:18:24,720 --> 00:18:28,280 Speaker 1: and instinctive and by wrote, and he would listen and 328 00:18:28,359 --> 00:18:31,040 Speaker 1: listen and listen and play until he would get this 329 00:18:31,200 --> 00:18:34,320 Speaker 1: really sort of essence of something and the soul of something, 330 00:18:34,359 --> 00:18:35,720 Speaker 1: and then he'd laid it down and know that it 331 00:18:35,800 --> 00:18:40,119 Speaker 1: was good enough. And I think, you know, his discipline 332 00:18:40,119 --> 00:18:43,240 Speaker 1: in reading was like amazing. He read all the time. 333 00:18:43,320 --> 00:18:47,040 Speaker 1: He watched every film, he watched every classic film, every 334 00:18:47,080 --> 00:18:50,960 Speaker 1: new film. He was a great lover of art and 335 00:18:52,000 --> 00:18:55,199 Speaker 1: had a diverse knowledge of anything he was interested in. 336 00:18:55,320 --> 00:18:57,359 Speaker 1: And he would go and like get every book on 337 00:18:57,400 --> 00:19:01,280 Speaker 1: all of every book on JFKs fascination, every book on 338 00:19:01,520 --> 00:19:03,520 Speaker 1: you know, you know, he never really got to like 339 00:19:03,640 --> 00:19:05,880 Speaker 1: Google like he kind of was like, Google's a little 340 00:19:05,880 --> 00:19:08,760 Speaker 1: too much for me. But he loved to sit down 341 00:19:08,800 --> 00:19:12,600 Speaker 1: and just read three hundred pages on anything that vaguely 342 00:19:12,640 --> 00:19:16,040 Speaker 1: interested him. No, he didn't hit. In the Wilbury years, 343 00:19:16,080 --> 00:19:18,679 Speaker 1: they socialized a lot, they went out a lot. Yeah, 344 00:19:18,800 --> 00:19:22,200 Speaker 1: they pushed boundaries that tried new things. Yeah. That also 345 00:19:22,280 --> 00:19:24,440 Speaker 1: might have been Jeff's influence, because I think Jeff liked 346 00:19:24,680 --> 00:19:30,080 Speaker 1: to be out more. Not Jeff George, Joe George. Yeah, 347 00:19:30,200 --> 00:19:33,119 Speaker 1: Jeff's like that. Jeff was like just wants to be 348 00:19:33,119 --> 00:19:36,159 Speaker 1: either in the studio or just chilling, you know. I 349 00:19:36,200 --> 00:19:37,800 Speaker 1: think I thought it was more of a pub a 350 00:19:37,880 --> 00:19:39,800 Speaker 1: pub guy. He might be. I don't know, I've never 351 00:19:39,920 --> 00:19:42,120 Speaker 1: been down the pub with Jeff, but I'd take him 352 00:19:42,119 --> 00:19:47,920 Speaker 1: as a pretty serious, disciplined creator of music absolutely, you know, absolutely, 353 00:19:47,920 --> 00:19:50,159 Speaker 1: and it keeps his head in those clouds. That's one 354 00:19:50,200 --> 00:19:54,240 Speaker 1: of the things that I think really benefited our experience 355 00:19:54,240 --> 00:19:56,639 Speaker 1: together working on Wildflowers was the fact that he had 356 00:19:56,680 --> 00:19:59,679 Speaker 1: just worked with Jeff for two albums. Right, Because Jeff 357 00:19:59,840 --> 00:20:06,280 Speaker 1: was it seemed to be a real song disciplinarian and 358 00:20:07,160 --> 00:20:15,840 Speaker 1: got your dad into really good, simple, super well crafted songs. 359 00:20:15,840 --> 00:20:18,119 Speaker 1: Not that your dad didn't always have that ability. He 360 00:20:18,160 --> 00:20:20,439 Speaker 1: always had that ability and would do it sometimes, but 361 00:20:20,520 --> 00:20:22,600 Speaker 1: with Jeff it was like it was always that or 362 00:20:22,640 --> 00:20:26,119 Speaker 1: it was nothing. And there was a side to your 363 00:20:26,160 --> 00:20:29,920 Speaker 1: dad's music that was more blues based. That like, if 364 00:20:29,920 --> 00:20:31,600 Speaker 1: you think of what it was like going to the 365 00:20:31,600 --> 00:20:36,080 Speaker 1: film war shows, it might not be as song song 366 00:20:36,240 --> 00:20:40,000 Speaker 1: song based, but more on great musicianship and playing great 367 00:20:40,000 --> 00:20:42,400 Speaker 1: songs and great grooves and great vibes. And your dad 368 00:20:42,440 --> 00:20:46,560 Speaker 1: resonated on that stuff too, But Jeff really hammered home 369 00:20:46,720 --> 00:20:52,080 Speaker 1: the power of the melody and the concise songwriting. And 370 00:20:53,560 --> 00:20:58,240 Speaker 1: I think the strength of Wildflowers is having that kind 371 00:20:58,280 --> 00:21:03,360 Speaker 1: of rigor in the songwriting influenced by Jeff, and then 372 00:21:03,640 --> 00:21:07,480 Speaker 1: taking off the shackles of that kind of production that 373 00:21:07,560 --> 00:21:12,360 Speaker 1: Jeff does, which I also love, but it's much more perfect, 374 00:21:12,680 --> 00:21:17,120 Speaker 1: it's less organic. He's a recording artist, he's someone who 375 00:21:17,240 --> 00:21:20,960 Speaker 1: really his music is based in studio. Yeah, it's not 376 00:21:21,240 --> 00:21:24,560 Speaker 1: based in the room. Yeah. But the difference between you 377 00:21:24,640 --> 00:21:27,399 Speaker 1: and Jeff and the evolution of coming from Jeff to you, 378 00:21:27,520 --> 00:21:30,199 Speaker 1: which I think is a really interesting part of me 379 00:21:30,359 --> 00:21:34,000 Speaker 1: discovering Wildflowers and going back through all this stuff, is 380 00:21:34,080 --> 00:21:37,200 Speaker 1: that my dad always kind of hid in the Heartbreakers. 381 00:21:37,600 --> 00:21:41,000 Speaker 1: He was always in this sort of like full octane 382 00:21:41,480 --> 00:21:44,720 Speaker 1: rock band, Let's rock, you know, and they just kind 383 00:21:44,720 --> 00:21:48,200 Speaker 1: of wear this incredible sound, and they had this incredible shorthand, 384 00:21:48,200 --> 00:21:50,480 Speaker 1: and they all came from the same place and they 385 00:21:50,520 --> 00:21:52,640 Speaker 1: had this thing. And then when he went with Jeff, 386 00:21:52,680 --> 00:21:55,280 Speaker 1: it was all sort of stripped down, and all that 387 00:21:55,440 --> 00:21:58,919 Speaker 1: technique and all that ability was compartmentalized, almost like it 388 00:21:58,960 --> 00:22:01,760 Speaker 1: was into a computer, right like it was. It was 389 00:22:01,960 --> 00:22:05,359 Speaker 1: organized through a board, through this like little stems, and 390 00:22:05,560 --> 00:22:09,280 Speaker 1: the process of creating much more automated, and this sort 391 00:22:09,320 --> 00:22:12,400 Speaker 1: of yeah, you needed a machine in order to execute 392 00:22:12,440 --> 00:22:17,440 Speaker 1: this vision and this sort of duplicating voices and all 393 00:22:17,480 --> 00:22:20,240 Speaker 1: of the stuff that makes those big free fall in 394 00:22:20,359 --> 00:22:24,320 Speaker 1: and I won't back down sounds with the beautiful jangle 395 00:22:24,400 --> 00:22:27,320 Speaker 1: that Dad could do. But when you look at Wildflowers, 396 00:22:27,320 --> 00:22:29,280 Speaker 1: and this is what's so cool about this box set, 397 00:22:30,160 --> 00:22:33,280 Speaker 1: it seems like the journeying boys for him to trust 398 00:22:33,359 --> 00:22:38,520 Speaker 1: you to bring him back to himself, and the poetry 399 00:22:38,560 --> 00:22:42,160 Speaker 1: of Wildflowers and the song Wildflowers, I believe is that 400 00:22:42,720 --> 00:22:46,879 Speaker 1: sometimes what's deep inside of us is just allowing ourselves 401 00:22:46,880 --> 00:22:51,200 Speaker 1: to be free and respect ourselves, not to feel shame, 402 00:22:51,640 --> 00:22:54,920 Speaker 1: to know that our first instincts are the best instincts, 403 00:22:55,000 --> 00:23:00,280 Speaker 1: and to prioritize ourselves, prioritize how you feel. No one 404 00:23:00,280 --> 00:23:02,880 Speaker 1: else is going to do it. And when you're someone 405 00:23:02,920 --> 00:23:04,800 Speaker 1: who takes care of a lot of people and you 406 00:23:04,840 --> 00:23:07,480 Speaker 1: have a lot of people depending on you, and sometimes 407 00:23:07,520 --> 00:23:09,280 Speaker 1: you have the hard decision to say, you know what, 408 00:23:09,359 --> 00:23:11,120 Speaker 1: you can't work for me anymore. And you know that's 409 00:23:11,119 --> 00:23:14,040 Speaker 1: going to really hurt people or make them, you know, 410 00:23:14,119 --> 00:23:16,560 Speaker 1: not have an income that year or whatever, and they 411 00:23:16,560 --> 00:23:18,920 Speaker 1: feel like they're part of your tribe. It's really hard 412 00:23:18,920 --> 00:23:21,600 Speaker 1: to permit yourself to let go of them and do 413 00:23:21,720 --> 00:23:25,280 Speaker 1: something as honest and pure as he did in the 414 00:23:25,280 --> 00:23:29,040 Speaker 1: studio with you. And I think looking at it from 415 00:23:29,080 --> 00:23:32,480 Speaker 1: my perspective, which you know is only one perspective, and 416 00:23:32,520 --> 00:23:35,040 Speaker 1: his wives might have a different perspective, or somebody else might. 417 00:23:35,320 --> 00:23:39,040 Speaker 1: We had a pretty close relationship and it was like, 418 00:23:39,119 --> 00:23:41,320 Speaker 1: you know, me talking about the Beastie Boys to like 419 00:23:41,359 --> 00:23:43,480 Speaker 1: a year later, he's sitting in a room with you, 420 00:23:44,520 --> 00:23:49,280 Speaker 1: and you know, we didn't hear Wellflowers along the way much. 421 00:23:49,640 --> 00:23:53,200 Speaker 1: And he brought me and my sister to the studio 422 00:23:53,240 --> 00:23:55,760 Speaker 1: that day for the string recording, and you could tell 423 00:23:55,800 --> 00:23:58,520 Speaker 1: he was just so proud to show us the mirror 424 00:23:58,640 --> 00:24:03,960 Speaker 1: of himself. Here, this is really me, you know. And 425 00:24:04,000 --> 00:24:06,479 Speaker 1: it was like, oh, wow, this is really you. This 426 00:24:06,560 --> 00:24:10,120 Speaker 1: is you without the heart prickers. It was just him 427 00:24:10,359 --> 00:24:13,760 Speaker 1: and what he came up with his guitar, just a 428 00:24:13,800 --> 00:24:19,040 Speaker 1: little bit plussed, and he figured out in that process personally, 429 00:24:20,200 --> 00:24:22,240 Speaker 1: I'm not going to leave a few things behind here. 430 00:24:22,440 --> 00:24:24,880 Speaker 1: I'm going to change the personnel in this band. I'm 431 00:24:24,920 --> 00:24:27,880 Speaker 1: no longer going to be with my childhood sweetheart from 432 00:24:27,960 --> 00:24:30,360 Speaker 1: high school. I'm going to move on and allow myself 433 00:24:30,960 --> 00:24:34,679 Speaker 1: a little bit more agency over my own life, because 434 00:24:34,680 --> 00:24:39,200 Speaker 1: I've been saddled with crippling responsibility since I was twenty one, 435 00:24:39,560 --> 00:24:41,879 Speaker 1: you know, and at that point I was off at college. 436 00:24:41,920 --> 00:24:44,160 Speaker 1: My sister was older, you know, and like he could 437 00:24:44,200 --> 00:24:46,520 Speaker 1: do that, there was there was a room to be 438 00:24:46,560 --> 00:24:49,600 Speaker 1: able to say and it wasn't easy, and there was 439 00:24:49,720 --> 00:24:54,080 Speaker 1: no snap of the finger, but the songs conveyed the 440 00:24:54,119 --> 00:24:58,879 Speaker 1: purity of where he wanted to go and where the 441 00:24:58,960 --> 00:25:01,399 Speaker 1: destination was going to be. And it was the future, 442 00:25:01,440 --> 00:25:03,640 Speaker 1: and it was magic, and it was falling in love 443 00:25:03,720 --> 00:25:07,440 Speaker 1: and it was it was I'm going to just put 444 00:25:07,480 --> 00:25:12,040 Speaker 1: some acceptance into this journey and go. And I think 445 00:25:12,080 --> 00:25:15,840 Speaker 1: that's been you know, listening to this music. Kind of 446 00:25:15,840 --> 00:25:19,600 Speaker 1: the magic behind it, kind of the bottled sunshine. Is 447 00:25:19,640 --> 00:25:23,959 Speaker 1: that that's real, that's really from him. We'll be right 448 00:25:24,000 --> 00:25:27,000 Speaker 1: back with Rick and Adria Petty after a quick break. 449 00:25:31,320 --> 00:25:34,880 Speaker 1: We're back with Rick Rubin and Adria Petty. I never 450 00:25:34,920 --> 00:25:37,879 Speaker 1: asked him about this, but do you hear anything in 451 00:25:37,920 --> 00:25:43,040 Speaker 1: the lyrics that from being there you saw coming from 452 00:25:43,080 --> 00:25:46,840 Speaker 1: a self reflective place, like, where are there any of 453 00:25:46,880 --> 00:25:49,080 Speaker 1: the story of what was going on in his life? 454 00:25:49,480 --> 00:25:54,160 Speaker 1: Impactful on the lyrics? There were. There was one song 455 00:25:54,960 --> 00:25:57,200 Speaker 1: that I thought was so much cooler and demo formed 456 00:25:57,200 --> 00:26:02,520 Speaker 1: than what ended up being recorded multiple times, which was California. 457 00:26:02,800 --> 00:26:08,160 Speaker 1: And the demo is so shit hot. It's so amazing 458 00:26:08,560 --> 00:26:13,520 Speaker 1: and it's so much less pop than the final I 459 00:26:13,560 --> 00:26:16,720 Speaker 1: love that song too, and I love this super uplifting 460 00:26:16,880 --> 00:26:20,199 Speaker 1: like beauty and simplicity of that song. But there's an 461 00:26:20,280 --> 00:26:22,440 Speaker 1: edge to it in the demo, it has an extra 462 00:26:22,520 --> 00:26:25,719 Speaker 1: verse and it says, I forgive my past, I forgive 463 00:26:25,800 --> 00:26:29,399 Speaker 1: my enemy. I don't know if this will last. Guess 464 00:26:29,400 --> 00:26:33,439 Speaker 1: I'll just wait and see and it was a level 465 00:26:33,480 --> 00:26:37,920 Speaker 1: of acceptance going, I'm in this really difficult situation, but 466 00:26:38,080 --> 00:26:40,240 Speaker 1: my eyes have been opened to the fact that things 467 00:26:40,280 --> 00:26:45,480 Speaker 1: aren't always just conflict for conflict's sake. Sometimes you can 468 00:26:45,560 --> 00:26:48,399 Speaker 1: be the bigger person and walk away and go I'm 469 00:26:48,440 --> 00:26:50,320 Speaker 1: going to reap the bounty of just being able to 470 00:26:50,400 --> 00:26:54,000 Speaker 1: let this roll off of me. And him and Jane 471 00:26:54,040 --> 00:26:57,760 Speaker 1: fought a lot when we were kids, only were kids themselves, 472 00:26:58,160 --> 00:27:01,960 Speaker 1: and I think that he had gotten no place. Knowing 473 00:27:02,000 --> 00:27:04,320 Speaker 1: George and getting to know Yogananda and starting to do 474 00:27:04,359 --> 00:27:09,640 Speaker 1: transidental meditation, starting a whole different perspective on life came 475 00:27:09,640 --> 00:27:13,320 Speaker 1: with George in our lives, and he was such an 476 00:27:13,680 --> 00:27:17,400 Speaker 1: angel as we're his wife and child who are just 477 00:27:17,560 --> 00:27:23,480 Speaker 1: angelic and beautiful, magical people too, and that sort of hey, hey, 478 00:27:23,560 --> 00:27:26,679 Speaker 1: we don't fight like that, like, hey, does not you 479 00:27:26,720 --> 00:27:29,760 Speaker 1: don't go there, You don't go to that really early 480 00:27:29,880 --> 00:27:33,280 Speaker 1: dark place even if you're right. Just let's make a 481 00:27:33,359 --> 00:27:36,040 Speaker 1: left turn here and look for forgiveness. Let's look for 482 00:27:36,080 --> 00:27:40,080 Speaker 1: a redemption and forgiving people and being an acceptance of 483 00:27:40,119 --> 00:27:42,800 Speaker 1: the fact that yes, sometimes things are super messed up 484 00:27:43,640 --> 00:27:47,280 Speaker 1: and they're not changeable for us, or it's not worth 485 00:27:47,320 --> 00:27:49,919 Speaker 1: it for us to abandon all our responsibilities to invest 486 00:27:49,960 --> 00:27:52,840 Speaker 1: in this super messed up thing, which I think we've 487 00:27:52,840 --> 00:27:55,320 Speaker 1: all been through at one point in our lives or another. 488 00:27:55,400 --> 00:27:59,360 Speaker 1: I mean, and when you are dealing with fame, you're 489 00:27:59,400 --> 00:28:02,719 Speaker 1: dealing with green you're dealing with envy, You're dealing with 490 00:28:02,760 --> 00:28:05,080 Speaker 1: people thinking that there might be an opportunity for them 491 00:28:05,080 --> 00:28:08,800 Speaker 1: to grift something. They're also dealing with drugs, and you're 492 00:28:08,840 --> 00:28:12,280 Speaker 1: dealing with mental illness sometimes too. There's all kinds of 493 00:28:12,320 --> 00:28:17,520 Speaker 1: factors that come into creative communities and fame, and there's 494 00:28:17,560 --> 00:28:21,600 Speaker 1: this isolation we discussed earlier, and they are a perfect 495 00:28:21,600 --> 00:28:27,119 Speaker 1: cocktail for powerful people to feel really lost and really 496 00:28:27,200 --> 00:28:30,720 Speaker 1: unable to have any control over their lives. They may 497 00:28:30,800 --> 00:28:34,040 Speaker 1: seem powerful, they may have a big bank balance, they 498 00:28:34,080 --> 00:28:36,080 Speaker 1: may own a lot of stuff, they may be the 499 00:28:36,080 --> 00:28:38,640 Speaker 1: boss of a lot of stuff. But they can't just say, 500 00:28:38,720 --> 00:28:40,360 Speaker 1: you know what, I'm turning my phone off for three 501 00:28:40,400 --> 00:28:43,480 Speaker 1: months or I'm going to the park with my kid now. 502 00:28:44,120 --> 00:28:46,320 Speaker 1: They can't do that. They don't have the ability to 503 00:28:46,360 --> 00:28:48,880 Speaker 1: do that. And I think my dad got to the 504 00:28:48,880 --> 00:28:51,240 Speaker 1: point where he was like, I want true freedom, like 505 00:28:51,280 --> 00:28:53,719 Speaker 1: I want freedom from I don't want to have to 506 00:28:53,720 --> 00:28:55,840 Speaker 1: make a Heartbreakers record. I don't want to have to 507 00:28:55,880 --> 00:28:57,560 Speaker 1: take care of all these people. I don't want to 508 00:28:57,560 --> 00:29:00,320 Speaker 1: have to live with someone I'm fighting with all the time. 509 00:29:00,960 --> 00:29:02,800 Speaker 1: I don't want to have to do that that would 510 00:29:02,840 --> 00:29:05,160 Speaker 1: actually be success to me. And I think this record 511 00:29:05,840 --> 00:29:09,000 Speaker 1: is such a beautiful reflection on making that life decision. 512 00:29:09,520 --> 00:29:11,920 Speaker 1: I don't even know if I ever heard the California 513 00:29:12,000 --> 00:29:16,120 Speaker 1: Let's hear the California demo, Let's hear that? So beautiful, 514 00:29:16,360 --> 00:29:18,400 Speaker 1: so beautiful, I don't even know if I've ever heard 515 00:29:18,440 --> 00:29:21,560 Speaker 1: that before. I'd never heard it before. And just the 516 00:29:21,600 --> 00:29:25,000 Speaker 1: idea that he's saying, sometimes you got to save yourself. Yeah, 517 00:29:25,040 --> 00:29:28,080 Speaker 1: it plays right into everything we're talking about. Yeah, because 518 00:29:28,120 --> 00:29:32,520 Speaker 1: that's really where it was. Yeah. You know, it's interesting 519 00:29:32,560 --> 00:29:36,160 Speaker 1: because sometimes he would be very attached to a demo 520 00:29:36,280 --> 00:29:37,760 Speaker 1: and he would bring the demo and he's like, okay, 521 00:29:37,840 --> 00:29:40,560 Speaker 1: let's learn the demo. And other times it would be 522 00:29:41,840 --> 00:29:44,360 Speaker 1: he would have a demo, but he would never bring 523 00:29:44,360 --> 00:29:46,600 Speaker 1: it up, never talk about it, never, and he would 524 00:29:46,600 --> 00:29:48,160 Speaker 1: just sort of play the guitar, play the song on 525 00:29:48,160 --> 00:29:49,960 Speaker 1: the guitar for the for the guys, like okay, this 526 00:29:50,080 --> 00:29:53,360 Speaker 1: is how those and That was one that I don't 527 00:29:53,400 --> 00:29:58,080 Speaker 1: remember ever hearing that version before. So beautiful. It's really special, 528 00:29:58,240 --> 00:30:00,480 Speaker 1: and I feel like it's like the it's the first 529 00:30:00,520 --> 00:30:03,080 Speaker 1: I always felt was missing, Like I always liked that song, 530 00:30:03,160 --> 00:30:05,680 Speaker 1: but it always just like what a goofy song, you know, 531 00:30:06,240 --> 00:30:09,240 Speaker 1: And then when you hear it complete, it's really to 532 00:30:09,400 --> 00:30:13,959 Speaker 1: me much deeper. Because Californias where he reinvented himself. It's 533 00:30:14,000 --> 00:30:16,720 Speaker 1: where he left an abusive father behind. It's where he 534 00:30:16,800 --> 00:30:19,760 Speaker 1: started his own family, surrounded by friends. It's where he 535 00:30:19,840 --> 00:30:23,360 Speaker 1: had wild success on him and my mom were tenacious 536 00:30:23,400 --> 00:30:27,840 Speaker 1: and crazy enough to be successful here and make it work. 537 00:30:28,000 --> 00:30:30,800 Speaker 1: And I think he had a lot of appreciation for 538 00:30:30,880 --> 00:30:34,160 Speaker 1: being a resident here, Like he felt very lucky that 539 00:30:34,360 --> 00:30:38,400 Speaker 1: Los Angeles existed, and yet, like you said, he never 540 00:30:38,440 --> 00:30:41,200 Speaker 1: went out or hung out with anybody. He just really 541 00:30:41,240 --> 00:30:43,240 Speaker 1: liked like being on his little plot of land and 542 00:30:43,320 --> 00:30:45,840 Speaker 1: making his art and having the whole machine here to 543 00:30:45,880 --> 00:30:47,880 Speaker 1: be able to make a living doing what he was 544 00:30:47,920 --> 00:30:51,040 Speaker 1: good at, you know. And he would reference, you know, 545 00:30:51,440 --> 00:30:55,600 Speaker 1: living in Recita and like there were always local references 546 00:30:55,760 --> 00:31:00,480 Speaker 1: you were real. Yeah, Yeah, Ventura Boulevard, Yeah, we lived 547 00:31:00,520 --> 00:31:03,720 Speaker 1: out there. Yeah, do you know where these were found 548 00:31:03,720 --> 00:31:05,960 Speaker 1: because I remember for a long time the demos were missing. 549 00:31:06,440 --> 00:31:09,920 Speaker 1: They were in his closet. It's amazing they were there 550 00:31:09,920 --> 00:31:13,480 Speaker 1: in his closet. Yeah, we pretty much found everything, amazing 551 00:31:13,520 --> 00:31:16,719 Speaker 1: because I can remember even when he was around, nobody 552 00:31:16,720 --> 00:31:21,640 Speaker 1: could find these. Yeah, what's the other demo you suggested 553 00:31:21,720 --> 00:31:23,920 Speaker 1: we listened to. Oh, I think There Goes Angela would 554 00:31:23,920 --> 00:31:26,680 Speaker 1: be an interesting one, just because you guys never attract it, okay, 555 00:31:26,680 --> 00:31:32,360 Speaker 1: and he might find it interesting. Yeah, beautiful, crazy right, Yeah, 556 00:31:32,600 --> 00:31:35,720 Speaker 1: never tracked it. Yeah, that's no memory of it. It's 557 00:31:35,760 --> 00:31:39,400 Speaker 1: his eight tracked demo mixed on the demos. Did he 558 00:31:39,440 --> 00:31:44,080 Speaker 1: have dates on things or no? Sometime? Are you kidding me? 559 00:31:45,600 --> 00:31:47,880 Speaker 1: Just like demo on it or something. You know. It's 560 00:31:47,920 --> 00:31:51,200 Speaker 1: like he was just wondering when like the order of events. 561 00:31:51,400 --> 00:31:53,480 Speaker 1: As disciplined as my dad was, he was still a 562 00:31:53,480 --> 00:31:56,160 Speaker 1: stoner that didn't label his tapes at times. But I 563 00:31:56,200 --> 00:31:59,400 Speaker 1: think that song so cool. I think he probably didn't 564 00:31:59,440 --> 00:32:01,200 Speaker 1: do it because it's let your Heart Be Free, and 565 00:32:01,200 --> 00:32:06,840 Speaker 1: it's so similar to the lyric than Wildflowers or the other. Yeah, 566 00:32:06,920 --> 00:32:09,960 Speaker 1: it's like it was kind of a competing sentiment or something. 567 00:32:10,320 --> 00:32:12,320 Speaker 1: I'm so glad that people finally get to hear it. 568 00:32:12,480 --> 00:32:16,400 Speaker 1: Me too, me too. I mean, one thing was interesting 569 00:32:17,080 --> 00:32:19,200 Speaker 1: was talking to one of the rock writers that was 570 00:32:19,240 --> 00:32:24,000 Speaker 1: contributing to our liner notes, Jan Hulinsky, and she was saying, 571 00:32:24,120 --> 00:32:27,960 Speaker 1: he finally gives these girls names. You know, there goes 572 00:32:28,000 --> 00:32:31,960 Speaker 1: Angela or whatever. It's likely she was an American girl 573 00:32:32,000 --> 00:32:35,600 Speaker 1: raised on promises. What was her name, girl? She loves 574 00:32:35,600 --> 00:32:39,200 Speaker 1: her Mama. Really interesting. Mary Jane had a name kind 575 00:32:39,240 --> 00:32:41,800 Speaker 1: of but it's a double on toonder, right, yeah, because 576 00:32:41,880 --> 00:32:44,040 Speaker 1: we don't know if it's just some kind bud or 577 00:32:44,360 --> 00:32:49,240 Speaker 1: a lady. But essentially the second half of all the 578 00:32:49,320 --> 00:32:52,400 Speaker 1: rest coming out and the demos, he started to find 579 00:32:52,520 --> 00:32:55,920 Speaker 1: names for these girls, like Somewhere under Heaven, which something 580 00:32:55,920 --> 00:32:59,040 Speaker 1: here recorded a little later. It is talking about Jenny 581 00:32:59,160 --> 00:33:02,440 Speaker 1: dancing in the rain. I mean, he so rarely gave 582 00:33:02,680 --> 00:33:07,560 Speaker 1: his characters actual names. Yeah, and I guarantee it was 583 00:33:07,720 --> 00:33:14,520 Speaker 1: an unconscious change. Yeah. Absolutely, Yeah, we just re released that. 584 00:33:14,560 --> 00:33:18,080 Speaker 1: You don't know how it feels with the line from 585 00:33:18,920 --> 00:33:22,239 Speaker 1: h crawling back to you and it has that I'm 586 00:33:22,320 --> 00:33:25,120 Speaker 1: so tired of being tired of line in the original demo. 587 00:33:25,320 --> 00:33:26,880 Speaker 1: He had kind of pulled it out. That was the 588 00:33:26,920 --> 00:33:31,880 Speaker 1: first song we recorded for Wildflowers, and we recorded it 589 00:33:31,960 --> 00:33:35,680 Speaker 1: that the take that's on the album was Steve Ferroni's 590 00:33:35,760 --> 00:33:38,960 Speaker 1: tryout to see if Tom wanted to play with him. 591 00:33:39,240 --> 00:33:45,440 Speaker 1: Oh wow, yeah, from that, from that, from that first take, 592 00:33:45,960 --> 00:33:50,479 Speaker 1: from that performance, like, oh, this is the guy, and 593 00:33:50,560 --> 00:33:53,640 Speaker 1: he ended up being the guy until forever. You guys 594 00:33:53,640 --> 00:33:56,720 Speaker 1: were like great perfumery, like a nose or something. You 595 00:33:56,720 --> 00:33:59,440 Speaker 1: guys were like sniffing out, like the perfect vibe, the 596 00:33:59,520 --> 00:34:04,240 Speaker 1: perfect drummer, the perfect everything. I mean, I often wonder 597 00:34:04,320 --> 00:34:06,719 Speaker 1: what it was like for you because at that time, 598 00:34:07,400 --> 00:34:09,799 Speaker 1: I mean, for some reason, you've always seemed like a 599 00:34:09,840 --> 00:34:12,160 Speaker 1: grown up to me. I was like eighteen when I 600 00:34:12,440 --> 00:34:15,080 Speaker 1: think I first met you, but you were really young, 601 00:34:15,280 --> 00:34:19,120 Speaker 1: you know, and you had a lot of responsibility thrust 602 00:34:19,160 --> 00:34:23,319 Speaker 1: on you really early, and that I always I'll tell 603 00:34:23,320 --> 00:34:26,399 Speaker 1: you that the beauty of working with your dad was 604 00:34:27,360 --> 00:34:32,600 Speaker 1: he was such an expert that in some ways he 605 00:34:32,680 --> 00:34:36,680 Speaker 1: was the producer, you know, Like honestly, it's like I 606 00:34:36,880 --> 00:34:43,040 Speaker 1: definitely helped support him in being his best self and 607 00:34:43,239 --> 00:34:48,319 Speaker 1: doing what I believe his best work, but so much 608 00:34:48,360 --> 00:34:50,920 Speaker 1: of it, like the things like you guys picked the drummer, 609 00:34:51,080 --> 00:34:54,759 Speaker 1: he picked the drummer. He almost all of the good 610 00:34:54,840 --> 00:34:58,320 Speaker 1: decisions that were made were made by him. I guess 611 00:34:58,400 --> 00:35:03,920 Speaker 1: I allow you allowed the space for him to be 612 00:35:04,040 --> 00:35:07,640 Speaker 1: his best self without getting in the way and if 613 00:35:07,680 --> 00:35:11,840 Speaker 1: anything supporting him, and you know, there were there were. 614 00:35:11,960 --> 00:35:18,880 Speaker 1: It was rare that we even had a disagreement about something. Yeah, 615 00:35:18,920 --> 00:35:20,719 Speaker 1: you know, I can remember one time we had a 616 00:35:20,760 --> 00:35:23,799 Speaker 1: disagreement about a line in the song and I told him, 617 00:35:24,120 --> 00:35:26,280 Speaker 1: you know, I thought that this line in this chorus 618 00:35:26,400 --> 00:35:29,160 Speaker 1: was a little weak, and he's like, you're crazy, that's 619 00:35:29,160 --> 00:35:31,080 Speaker 1: the best line in the song. It's got to stay. 620 00:35:31,320 --> 00:35:34,160 Speaker 1: It's like, okay, But that that was the only time 621 00:35:34,200 --> 00:35:38,239 Speaker 1: I can remember this song. It was You Wreck Me 622 00:35:38,520 --> 00:35:40,880 Speaker 1: and it was the line, the last line that the 623 00:35:40,920 --> 00:35:44,680 Speaker 1: tagline is yes you do right, And I thought it's 624 00:35:44,800 --> 00:35:46,960 Speaker 1: kind of a throwaway. It's like you have four lines 625 00:35:47,680 --> 00:35:51,120 Speaker 1: to say everything you want to say. Yes you do 626 00:35:51,320 --> 00:35:55,920 Speaker 1: is like h you're not There's no content there. So 627 00:35:55,960 --> 00:35:57,880 Speaker 1: I thought it was like a waste of real estate. 628 00:35:58,360 --> 00:36:02,279 Speaker 1: And he was like, no, that's the whole His dialect 629 00:36:02,520 --> 00:36:05,560 Speaker 1: is so interesting to me because he's you know, the 630 00:36:05,640 --> 00:36:08,239 Speaker 1: ants and the oh yes you do or the oh 631 00:36:08,239 --> 00:36:11,719 Speaker 1: hell yes, or the you know the way he would 632 00:36:11,840 --> 00:36:18,120 Speaker 1: use words and dialect was very um exciting and very 633 00:36:18,200 --> 00:36:21,279 Speaker 1: interesting and very pure to him and very much influenced 634 00:36:21,280 --> 00:36:24,000 Speaker 1: by the way that he grew up, and it's influenced 635 00:36:24,000 --> 00:36:26,560 Speaker 1: by black culture in the South, because his dad had 636 00:36:26,600 --> 00:36:31,920 Speaker 1: a supermarket in the black neighborhood in Gainesville and dry goods, 637 00:36:31,960 --> 00:36:33,640 Speaker 1: and they would be there all day. They're just playing 638 00:36:33,640 --> 00:36:36,920 Speaker 1: with other kids that worked in that he worked and 639 00:36:36,960 --> 00:36:40,719 Speaker 1: lived in that neighborhood. But he you know, like, oh, 640 00:36:40,800 --> 00:36:44,920 Speaker 1: yes you do. It's like it's kind of the throwaway. 641 00:36:44,960 --> 00:36:48,440 Speaker 1: It's the it's the sort of special sauce. It's the 642 00:36:48,440 --> 00:36:51,640 Speaker 1: herbs and spices that he would bring to something. As 643 00:36:52,320 --> 00:36:55,080 Speaker 1: I didn't know that that originally was you Rock Me Baby, either, 644 00:36:55,080 --> 00:36:58,040 Speaker 1: because I remember he was reading about it in the 645 00:36:58,080 --> 00:37:01,040 Speaker 1: track by track he was struggling with trying to find 646 00:37:01,080 --> 00:37:04,239 Speaker 1: that chorus for a really long time. Apparently I don't 647 00:37:04,239 --> 00:37:06,719 Speaker 1: remember that. Yeah, I think I think it was just 648 00:37:06,760 --> 00:37:09,759 Speaker 1: called Mike's song for a really long time, you know. 649 00:37:09,840 --> 00:37:13,520 Speaker 1: And I remember he was really excited about it, really 650 00:37:13,520 --> 00:37:16,239 Speaker 1: excited about it's like this is and he always said 651 00:37:16,239 --> 00:37:20,560 Speaker 1: he's like Mike always brings in a couple of really 652 00:37:21,200 --> 00:37:24,319 Speaker 1: good ones. Really good ones. And he's like really good 653 00:37:24,360 --> 00:37:26,600 Speaker 1: ones that I would not have written otherwise, you know, 654 00:37:26,600 --> 00:37:29,719 Speaker 1: I would not have done. Yeah, Mike, Mike is a 655 00:37:29,880 --> 00:37:35,400 Speaker 1: very underrecognized, super mega magical songwriter. Yeah. And his guitar 656 00:37:35,440 --> 00:37:40,279 Speaker 1: playing is as good as it gets. Yeah, he's he's 657 00:37:40,280 --> 00:37:43,279 Speaker 1: a magical being. We'll be right back with Rick and 658 00:37:43,400 --> 00:37:50,960 Speaker 1: Adria Petty after a quick break. We're back with more 659 00:37:51,080 --> 00:37:56,680 Speaker 1: from Adria Petty. When Wildflower was originally recorded, we were 660 00:37:57,080 --> 00:37:59,440 Speaker 1: in our minds we were making a double album and 661 00:37:59,560 --> 00:38:03,440 Speaker 1: we were ordered all the songs with the same belief 662 00:38:03,800 --> 00:38:07,160 Speaker 1: that these are all this is all the A material, 663 00:38:07,239 --> 00:38:08,680 Speaker 1: and this is all coming out and this is one 664 00:38:08,760 --> 00:38:14,719 Speaker 1: big batch. And I remember your dad. This was your 665 00:38:14,800 --> 00:38:20,080 Speaker 1: dad's first album for Warner Brothers Records after being unhappily 666 00:38:20,320 --> 00:38:24,280 Speaker 1: at MCA for a long time, and he had battled 667 00:38:24,320 --> 00:38:27,000 Speaker 1: with them in the past. Remember, they wanted to raise 668 00:38:27,080 --> 00:38:29,760 Speaker 1: the price of the list price of one of his records, 669 00:38:29,840 --> 00:38:32,320 Speaker 1: and he refused, and then he didn't record for years 670 00:38:32,440 --> 00:38:35,759 Speaker 1: because or refused to refuse to release an album for 671 00:38:35,800 --> 00:38:38,600 Speaker 1: a couple of years because of the pricing. He was 672 00:38:38,719 --> 00:38:45,400 Speaker 1: always really wanted to give good value to the audience. 673 00:38:45,719 --> 00:38:48,560 Speaker 1: He cared about his fans. He didn't want to price 674 00:38:48,680 --> 00:38:52,800 Speaker 1: his material out of anyone's reach. Same with ticket prices. 675 00:38:52,840 --> 00:38:57,160 Speaker 1: He always wanted to make make it accessible because I 676 00:38:57,280 --> 00:38:59,640 Speaker 1: think he thought of himself as the person in the audience, 677 00:38:59,680 --> 00:39:02,520 Speaker 1: because he was for so much of his life until 678 00:39:02,560 --> 00:39:04,840 Speaker 1: he started doing it, until he died. He was the 679 00:39:04,960 --> 00:39:07,680 Speaker 1: fan until he died. He always saw himself as the 680 00:39:07,760 --> 00:39:11,120 Speaker 1: kid at the record store buying the records. And our 681 00:39:11,239 --> 00:39:16,399 Speaker 1: responsibility now with carrying on his business, which without him 682 00:39:16,480 --> 00:39:20,080 Speaker 1: making music and making live music, is to really protect 683 00:39:20,200 --> 00:39:25,040 Speaker 1: the fan experience. It's weird. That's something that you almost 684 00:39:25,120 --> 00:39:28,400 Speaker 1: can't explain to someone now, right when they're like, oh, 685 00:39:28,440 --> 00:39:29,960 Speaker 1: we want to capture these emails, I want to do 686 00:39:30,040 --> 00:39:32,720 Speaker 1: this one, and it's like, hey, you know, one reason 687 00:39:32,840 --> 00:39:37,120 Speaker 1: people really liked him and really like, you know, transacting 688 00:39:37,160 --> 00:39:40,120 Speaker 1: with him as an artist was because he wasn't constantly 689 00:39:40,200 --> 00:39:43,839 Speaker 1: stealing from his fans, and he wasn't sort of devaluing 690 00:39:44,120 --> 00:39:48,279 Speaker 1: or debasing the songs and commercials or making them unspecial 691 00:39:49,000 --> 00:39:51,239 Speaker 1: to line his own pockets. He wanted to keep them 692 00:39:51,280 --> 00:39:54,839 Speaker 1: in this really special place. And you know he did 693 00:39:54,920 --> 00:39:56,520 Speaker 1: that right down to the very end. He left a 694 00:39:56,600 --> 00:39:59,360 Speaker 1: lot of money on the table all the time, to 695 00:39:59,560 --> 00:40:03,520 Speaker 1: not be part of this fabric of consumerism, to make 696 00:40:03,640 --> 00:40:07,680 Speaker 1: rock and roll a sacred place, and we revere that music. 697 00:40:07,760 --> 00:40:12,120 Speaker 1: We protect that music. And when you start, you know, 698 00:40:12,280 --> 00:40:15,160 Speaker 1: making that about hot pants and pepsi and whatever, you know, 699 00:40:15,640 --> 00:40:18,719 Speaker 1: it ruins everything. You know, to him, it was never 700 00:40:18,840 --> 00:40:22,120 Speaker 1: really like it was his business. But he never had 701 00:40:22,200 --> 00:40:26,160 Speaker 1: this like lust for business success, Like he just wanted 702 00:40:26,320 --> 00:40:30,320 Speaker 1: enough enough to be able to do fun stuff and whatever. 703 00:40:30,480 --> 00:40:32,680 Speaker 1: But I mean, we weren't like private jet people. We 704 00:40:32,760 --> 00:40:35,520 Speaker 1: weren't you know, done any of that stuff. He didn't 705 00:40:35,560 --> 00:40:38,640 Speaker 1: need that. And that actually is going to play interestingly 706 00:40:38,800 --> 00:40:43,239 Speaker 1: into it's giving me possible insight into a decision that 707 00:40:43,400 --> 00:40:46,080 Speaker 1: always confused me that he made, which was when we 708 00:40:46,200 --> 00:40:50,759 Speaker 1: played all of the material of Wildflowers for his new 709 00:40:50,840 --> 00:40:56,160 Speaker 1: record company. Who are my friends? And new I knew. 710 00:40:56,640 --> 00:40:59,480 Speaker 1: I knew them before I knew your dad. Actually, Austin 711 00:40:59,560 --> 00:41:02,000 Speaker 1: was the one who introduced me to your dad. I 712 00:41:02,160 --> 00:41:05,400 Speaker 1: believe Lenny Warnaker, who was the president of Warner Brothers, said, 713 00:41:06,480 --> 00:41:08,560 Speaker 1: you know, Tom would be better to do a single 714 00:41:08,600 --> 00:41:12,839 Speaker 1: album than a double album, and that double albums don't 715 00:41:12,920 --> 00:41:17,000 Speaker 1: sell as well, and that this is your first album 716 00:41:17,840 --> 00:41:22,000 Speaker 1: in this new environment, and let's do everything we can 717 00:41:22,280 --> 00:41:25,040 Speaker 1: for it to do. It's the best that it can do. 718 00:41:25,400 --> 00:41:30,480 Speaker 1: And would I would have guessed, knowing how obstinate your 719 00:41:30,560 --> 00:41:33,520 Speaker 1: dad was about creative choices, because this was a creative choice, 720 00:41:34,000 --> 00:41:36,279 Speaker 1: I would have assumed he would have said, no, I've 721 00:41:36,360 --> 00:41:38,360 Speaker 1: made a double album. I'm putting out a double album. 722 00:41:39,120 --> 00:41:41,600 Speaker 1: But instead he said, okay, let's do the single album. 723 00:41:41,719 --> 00:41:45,200 Speaker 1: And maybe also part of that, and relates to what 724 00:41:45,239 --> 00:41:48,719 Speaker 1: we were just saying, is that for the fans it's 725 00:41:48,760 --> 00:41:51,080 Speaker 1: half as expensive. You know, It's like it's it's a 726 00:41:51,320 --> 00:41:53,920 Speaker 1: more realistic and that's the reason double albums don't sell 727 00:41:53,920 --> 00:41:56,040 Speaker 1: as well as because they're more expensive. That would have 728 00:41:56,239 --> 00:41:59,040 Speaker 1: resonated with him, for sure. First, I've never made that 729 00:41:59,120 --> 00:42:02,600 Speaker 1: connection before, just now having this conversation. Yeah, neither. It 730 00:42:02,719 --> 00:42:06,400 Speaker 1: always seemed like that's not like him to fight for 731 00:42:06,480 --> 00:42:12,200 Speaker 1: the creative right right along with anything right. Sometimes he would, 732 00:42:12,400 --> 00:42:15,080 Speaker 1: but I mean he you know, he was obstinate about 733 00:42:15,120 --> 00:42:18,759 Speaker 1: the art, and you guys this I still wish if 734 00:42:18,800 --> 00:42:20,400 Speaker 1: we go in a time machine, I sit down and 735 00:42:20,440 --> 00:42:22,520 Speaker 1: beg him to put the double album out, because I 736 00:42:22,600 --> 00:42:26,040 Speaker 1: still can't find that original double album sequence. I've found versions, 737 00:42:26,160 --> 00:42:28,719 Speaker 1: but I can't find the one he played for me 738 00:42:28,840 --> 00:42:30,520 Speaker 1: and my uncle and then I had in my car 739 00:42:30,600 --> 00:42:33,080 Speaker 1: at college. Never, I will tell you, honestly, it was 740 00:42:33,280 --> 00:42:39,840 Speaker 1: never firmly established of these are the songs and this 741 00:42:40,040 --> 00:42:43,000 Speaker 1: is the double album. It never got that far because 742 00:42:43,040 --> 00:42:46,000 Speaker 1: the choice to make it a single app and album 743 00:42:46,160 --> 00:42:50,839 Speaker 1: happened before we really got to sequencing. So there may 744 00:42:50,920 --> 00:42:53,400 Speaker 1: have been, and there was probably there were probably multiple 745 00:42:54,800 --> 00:42:58,000 Speaker 1: sequences that we were listening to as possible ways to go. 746 00:42:59,520 --> 00:43:02,600 Speaker 1: He had, you know how, my dad had his notebook, 747 00:43:03,040 --> 00:43:04,920 Speaker 1: Like he'd start a record and he'd do all the 748 00:43:05,040 --> 00:43:07,680 Speaker 1: songs in that same notebook, and then he'd have like 749 00:43:07,760 --> 00:43:10,560 Speaker 1: a legal path that he'd started. He'd write down everything 750 00:43:11,320 --> 00:43:14,000 Speaker 1: to remember things like dumb things. It would always be 751 00:43:14,000 --> 00:43:16,319 Speaker 1: like a coffee ring and like gross stuff all over 752 00:43:16,400 --> 00:43:19,040 Speaker 1: it on the front page, and then like go through it. 753 00:43:19,160 --> 00:43:21,759 Speaker 1: And he had a sequence. He had a sequence for 754 00:43:21,800 --> 00:43:24,520 Speaker 1: the double album, and he had these gold discs made, 755 00:43:24,520 --> 00:43:26,320 Speaker 1: and he had sent them back east to me and 756 00:43:26,520 --> 00:43:29,080 Speaker 1: to my uncle, and we had them. And what I 757 00:43:29,080 --> 00:43:30,680 Speaker 1: would give to have not thrown that on the floor 758 00:43:30,760 --> 00:43:33,640 Speaker 1: of my car as a eighteen year old, But I 759 00:43:35,560 --> 00:43:37,279 Speaker 1: I listened to it all the time, and it was 760 00:43:37,400 --> 00:43:40,800 Speaker 1: half you know, hung up and overdue and songs that 761 00:43:41,080 --> 00:43:43,640 Speaker 1: had ended up on She's the One, But really a 762 00:43:43,760 --> 00:43:46,080 Speaker 1: lot of it was all the rest which we're putting 763 00:43:46,120 --> 00:43:49,600 Speaker 1: out now. And it ended with girl and LST. That's 764 00:43:49,600 --> 00:43:52,000 Speaker 1: all I remember. We both remember that was the last track. 765 00:43:52,120 --> 00:43:54,400 Speaker 1: That was the sort of like joke at the end 766 00:43:54,480 --> 00:43:57,319 Speaker 1: of the odyssey, you know, to lighten up, wake up 767 00:43:57,400 --> 00:44:01,000 Speaker 1: time or whatever. But I wish it had been a 768 00:44:01,040 --> 00:44:03,320 Speaker 1: double album that he had sequence because he was so 769 00:44:03,440 --> 00:44:05,600 Speaker 1: good at sequencing and he cared so much about telling 770 00:44:05,640 --> 00:44:11,040 Speaker 1: a full story and balancing a beautiful album side spent 771 00:44:11,160 --> 00:44:14,480 Speaker 1: a lot of time on the timing between songs and 772 00:44:15,800 --> 00:44:20,760 Speaker 1: you know, in mastering the way each song level wise 773 00:44:20,960 --> 00:44:24,600 Speaker 1: came after the song before it. There was a lot 774 00:44:24,680 --> 00:44:28,560 Speaker 1: of detail going into that final phase of crafting the 775 00:44:29,280 --> 00:44:32,239 Speaker 1: sequenced album. Yeah, and the keys that the last song 776 00:44:32,480 --> 00:44:34,840 Speaker 1: ended in and the key that the next song's beginning in. 777 00:44:34,960 --> 00:44:37,080 Speaker 1: Him and Micer Mike's always like, just go to the 778 00:44:37,120 --> 00:44:38,800 Speaker 1: back end in the front end and let me hear that, 779 00:44:39,120 --> 00:44:41,160 Speaker 1: you know, But I think we would do both. We 780 00:44:41,200 --> 00:44:43,200 Speaker 1: would do that. It was called the Tops and Tails, 781 00:44:43,400 --> 00:44:45,360 Speaker 1: and we would make it on tape on you know, 782 00:44:46,280 --> 00:44:49,000 Speaker 1: at that point it was half inch tape, and they 783 00:44:49,040 --> 00:44:52,120 Speaker 1: would be the last thirty seconds of a song, and 784 00:44:52,200 --> 00:44:54,520 Speaker 1: then the first thirty seconds of the next song, yea 785 00:44:54,640 --> 00:44:57,719 Speaker 1: of the whole album. Yeah, they had a toolbox. They 786 00:44:57,760 --> 00:45:00,960 Speaker 1: had learned. I think, I really think making Damn the 787 00:45:01,040 --> 00:45:05,640 Speaker 1: Torpedoes was such a huge learning experience for Jimmy, for Dad, 788 00:45:05,760 --> 00:45:09,480 Speaker 1: from Mike, for Stanley, for all of those guys. It 789 00:45:09,680 --> 00:45:11,880 Speaker 1: was like, no, this is real now. This is not 790 00:45:12,080 --> 00:45:14,880 Speaker 1: just like you're at the whiskey and you're cool as 791 00:45:14,920 --> 00:45:17,320 Speaker 1: hell and young as hell, and it was like, this 792 00:45:17,560 --> 00:45:20,800 Speaker 1: is real discipline times is recording process for you and 793 00:45:20,880 --> 00:45:25,040 Speaker 1: the pre jeff Right. They're all learning what are the 794 00:45:25,120 --> 00:45:29,439 Speaker 1: criteria for what we think is actually really good, really 795 00:45:29,480 --> 00:45:33,040 Speaker 1: good recording of our playing really relevant really of the moment, 796 00:45:33,239 --> 00:45:35,080 Speaker 1: and how do we tell this story? And there were 797 00:45:35,200 --> 00:45:38,239 Speaker 1: you know, there's just the normal noises in here. You 798 00:45:38,360 --> 00:45:40,520 Speaker 1: hear Marcy Campbell in the shower, or you could hear 799 00:45:40,640 --> 00:45:43,959 Speaker 1: like tape speeding up and slowing down, and that sort 800 00:45:44,000 --> 00:45:48,480 Speaker 1: of Beatles influence, which later you brought back in actually 801 00:45:48,960 --> 00:45:52,959 Speaker 1: by bringing in the off white demos to Dad. Before 802 00:45:53,000 --> 00:45:56,520 Speaker 1: you started wildflowers. But like that sense of going on 803 00:45:56,640 --> 00:45:58,360 Speaker 1: the ride with the record. You turn on the record, 804 00:45:58,480 --> 00:46:00,040 Speaker 1: you want to listen to the whole damn thing. I 805 00:46:00,400 --> 00:46:03,200 Speaker 1: want to be on that ride with my dad, likely 806 00:46:03,320 --> 00:46:06,120 Speaker 1: in your car, you know, and just kind of hear 807 00:46:06,239 --> 00:46:08,120 Speaker 1: the whole thing from beginning to end and trust him 808 00:46:08,200 --> 00:46:09,959 Speaker 1: even if there is a little long or a little 809 00:46:10,000 --> 00:46:12,680 Speaker 1: songs the album in the car, because we would work 810 00:46:12,760 --> 00:46:14,640 Speaker 1: on the mix in the studio and then we would 811 00:46:14,680 --> 00:46:17,800 Speaker 1: go out and it was Richard Dodd had rented a 812 00:46:18,120 --> 00:46:24,920 Speaker 1: little Toyota, tiny little Toyota, and that became the reference 813 00:46:25,280 --> 00:46:29,560 Speaker 1: sound system for this album. And we would sit in 814 00:46:29,640 --> 00:46:32,400 Speaker 1: the car and if it didn't sound good in the Toyota, 815 00:46:33,280 --> 00:46:36,040 Speaker 1: the mix was not done yet, and we'd be running 816 00:46:36,080 --> 00:46:40,200 Speaker 1: in and out all day, just car test, cartest cartest 817 00:46:40,320 --> 00:46:43,400 Speaker 1: over and over again. Yeah, it was never work. It 818 00:46:43,600 --> 00:46:45,719 Speaker 1: wasn't a job. I mean it was a job, and 819 00:46:45,800 --> 00:46:47,839 Speaker 1: that he had to show up at a concert when 820 00:46:47,880 --> 00:46:52,120 Speaker 1: it was booked. But it was always the creative process, 821 00:46:52,400 --> 00:46:56,239 Speaker 1: always stimulated him, and it seemed like it was the 822 00:46:56,280 --> 00:46:58,239 Speaker 1: most important thing in his life. It was, and so 823 00:46:58,400 --> 00:47:01,400 Speaker 1: were those shows. Yeah, he practically died on stage. I 824 00:47:01,480 --> 00:47:05,880 Speaker 1: mean he wanted to be there communing with people and 825 00:47:06,000 --> 00:47:08,879 Speaker 1: connecting with them and lifting the vibration. And he knew 826 00:47:09,520 --> 00:47:12,000 Speaker 1: my dad was more perfect person by any means, but 827 00:47:12,680 --> 00:47:14,759 Speaker 1: he knew he had this power. Like you could walk 828 00:47:14,840 --> 00:47:16,759 Speaker 1: up to my dad and if he would smile at you, 829 00:47:17,200 --> 00:47:19,279 Speaker 1: there was no way you were having a bad day. 830 00:47:19,560 --> 00:47:23,000 Speaker 1: There was just no way, Like he could light you 831 00:47:23,200 --> 00:47:27,080 Speaker 1: up with a look, you know. And he wasn't the 832 00:47:27,160 --> 00:47:29,840 Speaker 1: most attractive man on the planet. He wasn't the most 833 00:47:29,960 --> 00:47:32,440 Speaker 1: this or that or the other, but he had a 834 00:47:32,520 --> 00:47:35,080 Speaker 1: lot of soul, Like he had this really dynamic soul, 835 00:47:35,719 --> 00:47:39,239 Speaker 1: and he protected things that allowed for soul. He was 836 00:47:39,320 --> 00:47:42,480 Speaker 1: just so awesome. It's so hard to have to sit 837 00:47:42,600 --> 00:47:44,560 Speaker 1: here and speak about what he may or may not 838 00:47:44,960 --> 00:47:48,080 Speaker 1: have done or thought or whatever, because I don't really know. 839 00:47:48,400 --> 00:47:52,120 Speaker 1: But really what he put into me as a father 840 00:47:52,840 --> 00:47:57,560 Speaker 1: was be on time, be prepared, be creative, feed your brain, 841 00:47:58,160 --> 00:48:01,160 Speaker 1: always look for more art. And he got to point 842 00:48:01,200 --> 00:48:03,080 Speaker 1: after the internet came, you know where he was just 843 00:48:03,239 --> 00:48:06,279 Speaker 1: like you know what, adra like, I really just want 844 00:48:06,320 --> 00:48:09,200 Speaker 1: to watch to turn in classic movies, and I want 845 00:48:09,239 --> 00:48:11,439 Speaker 1: to listen to the radio and do my radio show. 846 00:48:11,520 --> 00:48:15,440 Speaker 1: And now I'm rediscovering new and old bands and new 847 00:48:15,560 --> 00:48:18,959 Speaker 1: bands that I'm really turned on by. And he would 848 00:48:19,120 --> 00:48:23,200 Speaker 1: feed the well with only this really really good information 849 00:48:23,719 --> 00:48:26,200 Speaker 1: and take all of the rest away. I mean, he 850 00:48:27,320 --> 00:48:30,520 Speaker 1: didn't really take a lot of negativity and noise into 851 00:48:30,760 --> 00:48:34,520 Speaker 1: his diet anything. He could avoid it at the point 852 00:48:35,120 --> 00:48:38,000 Speaker 1: real early in his career so that he could keep 853 00:48:38,280 --> 00:48:42,200 Speaker 1: communing with that soul. Yeah, you know, so which other 854 00:48:42,280 --> 00:48:46,600 Speaker 1: songs we're going to listen to? We should talk about 855 00:48:47,120 --> 00:48:51,040 Speaker 1: something could happen? Maybe? Okay, would that be cool? Yeah, 856 00:48:51,120 --> 00:48:52,919 Speaker 1: let's hear a little bit of it at least. Okay, 857 00:48:53,000 --> 00:48:57,880 Speaker 1: here's something could happen? So cool? What does it bring 858 00:48:58,000 --> 00:49:02,080 Speaker 1: up for you? It's something it happened. I mean, it's 859 00:49:02,080 --> 00:49:07,040 Speaker 1: such a great like look at the contradictions and my dad, like, 860 00:49:07,920 --> 00:49:11,560 Speaker 1: the artist side of all of us is full of contradictions, 861 00:49:11,920 --> 00:49:15,160 Speaker 1: and it's full of messiness, and it's full of all 862 00:49:15,239 --> 00:49:19,920 Speaker 1: these subconscious thoughts and things influences on us coming out 863 00:49:20,000 --> 00:49:23,040 Speaker 1: on the page or into the instrument of your choice. 864 00:49:24,120 --> 00:49:26,600 Speaker 1: And you know, I'm sure of who I am unless 865 00:49:26,640 --> 00:49:30,719 Speaker 1: I feel like somebody else. You know, it's I'm not 866 00:49:30,840 --> 00:49:33,880 Speaker 1: easy to know. You know. It's like it's hard for 867 00:49:33,960 --> 00:49:36,480 Speaker 1: him to get to know himself. Yeah, it just it 868 00:49:36,600 --> 00:49:39,800 Speaker 1: plays more into these themes of this self discovery. And 869 00:49:39,920 --> 00:49:42,600 Speaker 1: it's like, I mean like I was torn in two 870 00:49:43,040 --> 00:49:47,120 Speaker 1: is a is a brutal line and it sung so 871 00:49:47,360 --> 00:49:50,919 Speaker 1: beautifully that that that you don't you know that that's 872 00:49:51,080 --> 00:49:54,719 Speaker 1: that's a really heavy thing to say I was torn 873 00:49:54,800 --> 00:49:57,480 Speaker 1: in two. But I actually know I'm going to heal. 874 00:49:57,760 --> 00:50:01,440 Speaker 1: I actually feel this sense of hope, actually feel this possibility. 875 00:50:01,920 --> 00:50:05,320 Speaker 1: It's interesting to me, you know, just sitting here with 876 00:50:05,400 --> 00:50:08,160 Speaker 1: you and thinking about the undecedent to this record being Echo, 877 00:50:08,760 --> 00:50:10,880 Speaker 1: where it was like, Okay, I'm not going to make it. 878 00:50:11,040 --> 00:50:13,920 Speaker 1: This is just too much to bear. This change has 879 00:50:13,960 --> 00:50:16,919 Speaker 1: been too much upheaval for me. And I'm a sensitive soul, 880 00:50:17,200 --> 00:50:21,080 Speaker 1: you know, And there's there's just the next Echo wasn't next. 881 00:50:21,400 --> 00:50:25,480 Speaker 1: It feels like a world apart. There were completely different 882 00:50:25,640 --> 00:50:27,920 Speaker 1: universes that he was living in at that time, and 883 00:50:28,640 --> 00:50:32,480 Speaker 1: Echo was a very isolating post divorced moment for him. 884 00:50:33,840 --> 00:50:36,880 Speaker 1: But I remember also he was going through some personal 885 00:50:37,040 --> 00:50:41,160 Speaker 1: dark stuff apart from all that. Yeah, yeah, he was 886 00:50:41,239 --> 00:50:45,120 Speaker 1: definitely using drugs at that time, yeah, and alone and struggling. 887 00:50:45,280 --> 00:50:49,680 Speaker 1: He often didn't seem like himself like he seemed like 888 00:50:50,360 --> 00:50:54,200 Speaker 1: a different character arriving. No, he wasn't himself. There was 889 00:50:54,320 --> 00:50:57,640 Speaker 1: no he was walking with a cane and wearing dark glasses. 890 00:50:57,760 --> 00:51:00,560 Speaker 1: It was a very unusual time. He is not He 891 00:51:00,760 --> 00:51:02,680 Speaker 1: was not a good place, and I think he has 892 00:51:02,800 --> 00:51:06,680 Speaker 1: so many, I mean regrets about that era of his life. 893 00:51:06,760 --> 00:51:09,040 Speaker 1: He had just descended into such a dark place. But 894 00:51:09,880 --> 00:51:12,960 Speaker 1: you can see he could see it could go that way. 895 00:51:13,239 --> 00:51:14,960 Speaker 1: He didn't look at this song. He was like, hey, 896 00:51:15,120 --> 00:51:18,200 Speaker 1: things could get really weird or maybe they'll just be great, 897 00:51:18,600 --> 00:51:21,319 Speaker 1: you know. But they did. They got weird, and then 898 00:51:21,360 --> 00:51:25,000 Speaker 1: they got much better, much much better, thanks to many 899 00:51:25,040 --> 00:51:28,799 Speaker 1: good friends like you and other people. But one thing 900 00:51:28,840 --> 00:51:31,279 Speaker 1: I can't I should know, but I can't remember what 901 00:51:31,440 --> 00:51:33,440 Speaker 1: we decided to put in the lyric sheets. But I 902 00:51:34,040 --> 00:51:36,239 Speaker 1: think he says, I walked the mall, come home, and 903 00:51:36,360 --> 00:51:38,719 Speaker 1: fall down, like like a guy that goes to the mall. 904 00:51:39,120 --> 00:51:43,080 Speaker 1: Do you know what I mean. They were sort of 905 00:51:43,160 --> 00:51:45,719 Speaker 1: arguing with me back in at the ranch, saying, oh, 906 00:51:45,800 --> 00:51:49,080 Speaker 1: it's walk them all like I walk all the streets 907 00:51:49,200 --> 00:51:50,920 Speaker 1: or something like that. But I think he's saying I 908 00:51:51,000 --> 00:51:54,640 Speaker 1: walk them all, go home and fall down. For him 909 00:51:54,680 --> 00:51:57,719 Speaker 1: would be kind of like normal because he thinks of 910 00:51:57,840 --> 00:52:02,040 Speaker 1: that is the normal American experience, you know, like I'm 911 00:52:02,080 --> 00:52:04,080 Speaker 1: just what would a normal guy that's not Tom Petty, 912 00:52:04,120 --> 00:52:06,080 Speaker 1: that actually gets in his car when he's bummed out 913 00:52:06,080 --> 00:52:11,360 Speaker 1: and go and do or whatever writing exactly, which is 914 00:52:11,400 --> 00:52:14,040 Speaker 1: why I had them draw like a little guy in 915 00:52:14,120 --> 00:52:19,239 Speaker 1: an astronaut's outfit walking through a shopping mall. Um, you know, 916 00:52:19,520 --> 00:52:21,360 Speaker 1: with the with the words I'm not easy to know, 917 00:52:21,560 --> 00:52:24,480 Speaker 1: because I thought that was so like him. You know, 918 00:52:24,560 --> 00:52:26,440 Speaker 1: he would have been like the I stick out like 919 00:52:26,480 --> 00:52:28,279 Speaker 1: a sore thumb here. I've never been to a mall 920 00:52:28,320 --> 00:52:31,799 Speaker 1: excepted in my music video. You know. Okay, how unrealistic, 921 00:52:32,080 --> 00:52:35,560 Speaker 1: you know. But um, he was so proud of the song, 922 00:52:35,880 --> 00:52:39,719 Speaker 1: like when he found these tapes and rediscovered um all 923 00:52:39,800 --> 00:52:41,880 Speaker 1: the Rest and wanted to put the outs you know, 924 00:52:42,040 --> 00:52:44,720 Speaker 1: first Wildflowers too. Then he talked to you and decided 925 00:52:44,760 --> 00:52:48,120 Speaker 1: to call it All the Rest. Um. This was the 926 00:52:48,239 --> 00:52:50,520 Speaker 1: song that was sort of like that Christmas that he 927 00:52:50,600 --> 00:52:53,279 Speaker 1: dragged my uncle into the studio to listen to, And 928 00:52:53,440 --> 00:52:55,960 Speaker 1: this was the song that he really thought was an 929 00:52:56,080 --> 00:53:01,880 Speaker 1: undiscovered piece of magic for him. It's so interesting that 930 00:53:02,040 --> 00:53:06,680 Speaker 1: we had the second half of this amazing album, and 931 00:53:08,000 --> 00:53:10,480 Speaker 1: because we just moved forward making this stuff, we just 932 00:53:10,560 --> 00:53:14,800 Speaker 1: sort of forgot that. It's almost like we forgot it existed. 933 00:53:16,040 --> 00:53:19,239 Speaker 1: It's amazing. I think you guys were so focused at 934 00:53:19,239 --> 00:53:21,640 Speaker 1: the time, based on going back and talking everybody, that 935 00:53:21,719 --> 00:53:23,600 Speaker 1: you were so in the moment of creating at the 936 00:53:23,760 --> 00:53:27,200 Speaker 1: highest level on each track you were finishing for Wildflowers, 937 00:53:27,560 --> 00:53:30,439 Speaker 1: including these tracks, which you obviously got to a finished place. 938 00:53:31,880 --> 00:53:38,560 Speaker 1: You know, It's amazing how when you're like, I've experienced 939 00:53:38,600 --> 00:53:40,600 Speaker 1: this on a very low level as a director, when 940 00:53:40,640 --> 00:53:43,399 Speaker 1: you have this great crew around you and you all 941 00:53:43,600 --> 00:53:46,160 Speaker 1: are aiming at the same thing and everyone on the 942 00:53:46,280 --> 00:53:50,200 Speaker 1: crew is elevating it. There. He had the perfect environment. 943 00:53:50,320 --> 00:53:53,319 Speaker 1: He was accepted, He had a younger producer that respected him, 944 00:53:53,320 --> 00:53:55,480 Speaker 1: but he had respect for you because he didn't know 945 00:53:55,560 --> 00:53:58,720 Speaker 1: your world, and he knew you were of the current world, 946 00:53:59,360 --> 00:54:01,640 Speaker 1: and you were his ambassador to the current world, and 947 00:54:01,719 --> 00:54:04,200 Speaker 1: you give him permission to be himself. This is the 948 00:54:04,360 --> 00:54:07,480 Speaker 1: beauty of this stuff to me, is that you two 949 00:54:07,600 --> 00:54:11,640 Speaker 1: had that connection and you know, I've known you for 950 00:54:11,800 --> 00:54:14,120 Speaker 1: years and I know how he's spoken about you, and 951 00:54:14,160 --> 00:54:16,279 Speaker 1: it's not like you guys were like, tell me all 952 00:54:16,320 --> 00:54:19,480 Speaker 1: your deepest, darkest like secrets, or you were like the 953 00:54:19,680 --> 00:54:22,799 Speaker 1: closest friends of all time that know everything about each 954 00:54:22,840 --> 00:54:26,520 Speaker 1: other and each other's families. It was a real deep 955 00:54:26,680 --> 00:54:32,919 Speaker 1: mutual respect in a dialogue of yes, trust yourself here, 956 00:54:33,040 --> 00:54:35,799 Speaker 1: let's think about it. You know, you were this really 957 00:54:35,920 --> 00:54:40,160 Speaker 1: magical barometer for him. He really enjoyed it. I knew 958 00:54:40,280 --> 00:54:42,960 Speaker 1: the whole time he was with you, he just enjoyed 959 00:54:43,000 --> 00:54:45,560 Speaker 1: it so much. He had fun. We had fun, and 960 00:54:45,680 --> 00:54:49,279 Speaker 1: it was again it was like and I'll say, while 961 00:54:49,360 --> 00:54:53,520 Speaker 1: it was hard and long, because while Wildflowers sounds like 962 00:54:53,560 --> 00:54:56,479 Speaker 1: it was recorded in a weekend, it was two years. 963 00:54:56,560 --> 00:54:59,919 Speaker 1: I think of grueling labor trying to make it sound 964 00:55:00,160 --> 00:55:03,440 Speaker 1: like we weren't trying so hard. Rick, It does not 965 00:55:03,560 --> 00:55:05,960 Speaker 1: sound like it was recorded in a weekend. It sounds 966 00:55:06,040 --> 00:55:11,319 Speaker 1: pretty masterful and has a casual sense about it. It's 967 00:55:12,120 --> 00:55:16,360 Speaker 1: casual if being casual as being absolutely perfect, you know, 968 00:55:17,160 --> 00:55:20,080 Speaker 1: but it's not perfect like Jeff's records, like Jefs records 969 00:55:20,120 --> 00:55:23,480 Speaker 1: are really perfect. It's different. It's a different thing. It's 970 00:55:23,520 --> 00:55:27,160 Speaker 1: more oxygen in the room, oxygen in the room. It 971 00:55:27,600 --> 00:55:32,759 Speaker 1: feels born of the miking, the live recording, and really 972 00:55:32,880 --> 00:55:36,879 Speaker 1: selectively overdubbing, but really kind of you were able to go, Man, 973 00:55:36,960 --> 00:55:38,840 Speaker 1: I've got players, I don't need to overdub, so I 974 00:55:38,920 --> 00:55:41,640 Speaker 1: can do live recordings. I mean, And it really was 975 00:55:41,719 --> 00:55:45,279 Speaker 1: about taking the time to get the performances and the 976 00:55:45,520 --> 00:55:50,600 Speaker 1: starkness and the truth in those performances. That's everything was 977 00:55:50,719 --> 00:55:54,439 Speaker 1: rooted in that. Yeah, a pleasure speaking to you, Such 978 00:55:54,440 --> 00:55:58,239 Speaker 1: a pleasure for me. Thank you so much again. Thank 979 00:55:58,320 --> 00:56:03,160 Speaker 1: you for protecting this art and sharing it with the 980 00:56:03,239 --> 00:56:07,440 Speaker 1: world in a new way and expanding people's experience of 981 00:56:07,520 --> 00:56:11,799 Speaker 1: this beautiful music. Oh, it's time, magic time in my life. 982 00:56:12,480 --> 00:56:15,080 Speaker 1: It was a magic time to be on the very 983 00:56:15,160 --> 00:56:17,560 Speaker 1: far periphery of it. And it is just such an 984 00:56:17,600 --> 00:56:20,440 Speaker 1: honor and a privilege to be an ambassador for you 985 00:56:20,760 --> 00:56:24,000 Speaker 1: and for Dad and for the band. And I'm so 986 00:56:24,680 --> 00:56:27,000 Speaker 1: overjoyed to bring it to people at a time when 987 00:56:27,040 --> 00:56:29,719 Speaker 1: I think they really need it. And there's a lot 988 00:56:29,760 --> 00:56:32,279 Speaker 1: of love and understanding and beauty in this music that 989 00:56:32,360 --> 00:56:35,239 Speaker 1: will carry people and uplift people, and I think that 990 00:56:35,360 --> 00:56:41,880 Speaker 1: that's the most exciting part for us. Thanks to Adrian 991 00:56:41,880 --> 00:56:44,560 Speaker 1: Petty for sharing memories of her dad with us. You 992 00:56:44,640 --> 00:56:46,719 Speaker 1: can hear Wildflowers and all the rest along with our 993 00:56:46,719 --> 00:56:49,240 Speaker 1: favorite Tom Petty and the Heartbreaker songs on a playlist 994 00:56:49,280 --> 00:56:52,520 Speaker 1: at broken record podcast dot com. Be sure to subscribe 995 00:56:52,520 --> 00:56:55,120 Speaker 1: to our YouTube channel at YouTube dot com slash broken 996 00:56:55,200 --> 00:56:58,000 Speaker 1: record Podcast. There you can find extended cuts of past 997 00:56:58,040 --> 00:57:01,440 Speaker 1: episodes along with new ones. Broken Record is produced with 998 00:57:01,520 --> 00:57:05,760 Speaker 1: help from Leah Rose, Jason Gambrel, Martin Gonzalez, Eric Sandler 999 00:57:06,080 --> 00:57:09,680 Speaker 1: and his executive produced by Mia LaBelle. Our theme music 1000 00:57:09,800 --> 00:57:12,719 Speaker 1: is by Kenny Beats. Broken Record is a production of 1001 00:57:12,840 --> 00:57:16,080 Speaker 1: Pushkin Industries and if you like Broken Record, please remember 1002 00:57:16,160 --> 00:57:18,840 Speaker 1: to share, rate, and review our show on your podcast 1003 00:57:18,920 --> 00:57:20,800 Speaker 1: to appen. I'm justin Richmond.