1 00:00:03,000 --> 00:00:04,960 Speaker 1: Welcome Stuff to Blow Your Mind, a production of I 2 00:00:05,000 --> 00:00:13,960 Speaker 1: Heart Radios How Stuff Works. Hey, you welcome to Stuff 3 00:00:14,000 --> 00:00:16,000 Speaker 1: to Blow your Mind. My name is Robert Lamb and 4 00:00:16,040 --> 00:00:18,880 Speaker 1: I'm Joe McCormick, and we're back to talk snakes. It's 5 00:00:18,880 --> 00:00:23,480 Speaker 1: snake talk. That's right. We're continuing this month's movie episode 6 00:00:23,600 --> 00:00:26,560 Speaker 1: and now it's episodes because we you you got to 7 00:00:26,600 --> 00:00:28,720 Speaker 1: pick the movie this time. You pick Conan the Barbarian. 8 00:00:28,880 --> 00:00:30,840 Speaker 1: Hadn't seen it in a while. I was wondering how 9 00:00:30,880 --> 00:00:33,320 Speaker 1: it held up, and you know, it kind of did, 10 00:00:33,400 --> 00:00:36,960 Speaker 1: it kind of didn't. But it's it's definitely worth talking about. 11 00:00:37,120 --> 00:00:39,440 Speaker 1: But one of the key centerpieces in this film is 12 00:00:39,479 --> 00:00:44,159 Speaker 1: the cult of set thulsa dooms religion. I mean, he 13 00:00:44,159 --> 00:00:47,400 Speaker 1: seems into the branding, even in the earlier portions of 14 00:00:47,400 --> 00:00:50,120 Speaker 1: the film when he's just a warrior. Yeah, that's a 15 00:00:50,159 --> 00:00:52,640 Speaker 1: little confusing, because the whole thing is that, like James 16 00:00:52,680 --> 00:00:54,520 Speaker 1: Earl Jones, he was like once I was a young 17 00:00:54,560 --> 00:00:56,680 Speaker 1: man and I was just a war lord running around 18 00:00:56,800 --> 00:00:59,120 Speaker 1: raiding villages. You know, the sorry I killed your parents 19 00:00:59,120 --> 00:01:00,960 Speaker 1: and not that's a yeah. I don't think he ever 20 00:01:00,960 --> 00:01:03,280 Speaker 1: said he was no. He didn't say no. In fact, 21 00:01:03,280 --> 00:01:05,959 Speaker 1: he says, Dakona, and he's like, got Arnold Schwartzendinger on 22 00:01:05,959 --> 00:01:08,800 Speaker 1: the floor. He's like, when when I destroyed your village, 23 00:01:08,840 --> 00:01:14,480 Speaker 1: I made you You're welcome. Yeah, pretty much. Uh. But 24 00:01:14,480 --> 00:01:17,440 Speaker 1: but then later in the film he's he's like, oh, 25 00:01:17,520 --> 00:01:19,480 Speaker 1: I don't do that anymore. Now I'm just a regular 26 00:01:19,480 --> 00:01:23,000 Speaker 1: cult leader. But in both cases he's carrying the symbol 27 00:01:23,040 --> 00:01:25,520 Speaker 1: of his cult even though he's not a cult leader yet. 28 00:01:25,520 --> 00:01:28,360 Speaker 1: In in the earlier part, and the symbol of his cult, 29 00:01:28,600 --> 00:01:31,279 Speaker 1: which is referred to in the movie as the Cult 30 00:01:31,319 --> 00:01:34,039 Speaker 1: of set or the Temple of set Uh. And in 31 00:01:34,080 --> 00:01:37,000 Speaker 1: the last episode we discussed the real ancient Egyptian not 32 00:01:37,160 --> 00:01:39,600 Speaker 1: well maybe not real, but the real mythology of the 33 00:01:39,600 --> 00:01:42,960 Speaker 1: ancient Egyptian god Set or Seth, and how he is 34 00:01:43,120 --> 00:01:46,160 Speaker 1: very different than the set represented in the film. But 35 00:01:46,200 --> 00:01:48,400 Speaker 1: the Cult of set in the film has the symbol 36 00:01:48,400 --> 00:01:51,520 Speaker 1: of the two headed snake with with the two heads 37 00:01:51,560 --> 00:01:54,400 Speaker 1: facing off against each other. Right, I mean, maybe part 38 00:01:54,440 --> 00:01:56,880 Speaker 1: of it is that just even though his approach to 39 00:01:56,960 --> 00:01:59,400 Speaker 1: life changed a little bit, he just always had great branding, 40 00:02:00,000 --> 00:02:02,600 Speaker 1: always loves snakes, or certainly he just maybe just took 41 00:02:02,680 --> 00:02:05,160 Speaker 1: up the the the emblem at some point there was 42 00:02:05,160 --> 00:02:08,040 Speaker 1: a pre existing cult of Set. I mean certainly that 43 00:02:08,080 --> 00:02:11,040 Speaker 1: would if you're creating a cult leader. I mean, some 44 00:02:11,320 --> 00:02:16,480 Speaker 1: cult leaders create their faith wholesale, uh, from from new parts. 45 00:02:16,480 --> 00:02:18,880 Speaker 1: But for the most part, for the most part, they're 46 00:02:18,880 --> 00:02:22,280 Speaker 1: depending on something that came before and just inserting themselves 47 00:02:22,400 --> 00:02:24,760 Speaker 1: into it. That's exactly right. I mean, in fact, I 48 00:02:24,760 --> 00:02:27,760 Speaker 1: can scarcely think of a cult that doesn't draw on 49 00:02:27,919 --> 00:02:32,000 Speaker 1: some existing mythology. I mean, uh, you think about the 50 00:02:32,040 --> 00:02:34,520 Speaker 1: Heaven's Gate cult. I mean that was in a large 51 00:02:34,560 --> 00:02:38,560 Speaker 1: part based on like UFO mythology and existing Christianity. Even 52 00:02:38,600 --> 00:02:41,280 Speaker 1: if you look at like the Raylians and Rileyans, one 53 00:02:41,280 --> 00:02:44,960 Speaker 1: of the the UFO religions, they're the guy who found it, 54 00:02:45,000 --> 00:02:47,160 Speaker 1: has this whole book going through like the books of 55 00:02:47,200 --> 00:02:49,640 Speaker 1: the Bible and all this talking about how it's actually 56 00:02:49,680 --> 00:02:53,120 Speaker 1: all about alien encounters and alien technology. It's basically an 57 00:02:53,120 --> 00:02:57,840 Speaker 1: ancient aliens religion. So the emblem for the Temple of 58 00:02:57,840 --> 00:03:00,600 Speaker 1: Set in this film has this this really cool logo 59 00:03:00,800 --> 00:03:03,880 Speaker 1: actually that it's like there are two different versions of it. 60 00:03:03,919 --> 00:03:05,880 Speaker 1: You kind of see one is like on the like 61 00:03:05,919 --> 00:03:08,360 Speaker 1: the staffs and the armor that they carry, and then 62 00:03:08,360 --> 00:03:13,000 Speaker 1: there's this like simple simplified logo, but it's a snake 63 00:03:13,280 --> 00:03:15,760 Speaker 1: with two heads as a head on each end, like 64 00:03:15,800 --> 00:03:18,280 Speaker 1: a like the head of the snake is a snakehead 65 00:03:18,320 --> 00:03:20,680 Speaker 1: and the tail of the snake is a snakehead, and 66 00:03:20,720 --> 00:03:23,280 Speaker 1: they're they're rising against each other, and in the background 67 00:03:23,360 --> 00:03:25,320 Speaker 1: there is a son And in fact it's a plot 68 00:03:25,360 --> 00:03:28,280 Speaker 1: point in the film because Conan and his friends go 69 00:03:28,320 --> 00:03:31,680 Speaker 1: around looking for Falsa Doom played by James Earl Jones 70 00:03:31,840 --> 00:03:34,200 Speaker 1: by asking about this symbol. It's like, have you seen 71 00:03:34,240 --> 00:03:38,000 Speaker 1: this symbol anywhere? That's how they they initially connect with him. 72 00:03:38,400 --> 00:03:40,640 Speaker 1: So I should kind of surprise, as a surprise to 73 00:03:40,680 --> 00:03:42,800 Speaker 1: nobody that the idea of a snake with a head 74 00:03:42,840 --> 00:03:45,840 Speaker 1: on each end pre dates this film, that you know 75 00:03:45,880 --> 00:03:48,200 Speaker 1: that this this is something that we can go back 76 00:03:48,480 --> 00:03:52,360 Speaker 1: in time and we can find examples of in uh 77 00:03:52,640 --> 00:03:55,520 Speaker 1: in the human use of symbols. Right now, you might 78 00:03:55,560 --> 00:03:57,960 Speaker 1: be thinking about other existing snake symbols that are a 79 00:03:57,960 --> 00:03:59,839 Speaker 1: little bit different. You might be thinking about the orb 80 00:04:00,000 --> 00:04:03,120 Speaker 1: corros where a snake is swallowing its own tail, But 81 00:04:03,200 --> 00:04:07,000 Speaker 1: that's different than two snake heads facing each other, right though, 82 00:04:07,040 --> 00:04:09,480 Speaker 1: I mean in Theora Boruss defense we usually don't see 83 00:04:09,480 --> 00:04:11,160 Speaker 1: the tail because it's in his mouth. Who's to say 84 00:04:11,160 --> 00:04:13,240 Speaker 1: that wasn't a hat on there? But yeah, the the 85 00:04:13,400 --> 00:04:17,359 Speaker 1: or a Borus, the world serpent, the mid guard storm, Um, 86 00:04:17,400 --> 00:04:20,960 Speaker 1: it's uh. It is yet depicted as the snake consuming itself. 87 00:04:21,080 --> 00:04:23,040 Speaker 1: On the other hand, one that is very similar but 88 00:04:23,160 --> 00:04:25,600 Speaker 1: isn't quite the same thing does have snakeheads facing each 89 00:04:25,600 --> 00:04:29,680 Speaker 1: other would be the Caducius. This is this is like 90 00:04:29,720 --> 00:04:33,360 Speaker 1: the staff with the snakes staff of hers. Yeah. Yeah, 91 00:04:33,400 --> 00:04:36,719 Speaker 1: So what we're talking about here is the the amphis 92 00:04:36,720 --> 00:04:40,000 Speaker 1: beina and it's a it's a name that's derived from 93 00:04:40,000 --> 00:04:43,440 Speaker 1: the Greek to go both ways because of the idea 94 00:04:43,520 --> 00:04:45,599 Speaker 1: is that it's a snake that can move forwards or 95 00:04:45,640 --> 00:04:48,039 Speaker 1: backwards with ease. The one thing I've read is that 96 00:04:48,080 --> 00:04:50,840 Speaker 1: snakes that just have one normal head and a normal 97 00:04:50,880 --> 00:04:54,120 Speaker 1: tail can sometimes slither backwards. Like I was reading a 98 00:04:54,120 --> 00:04:57,280 Speaker 1: book about how the author observed that coral snakes seem 99 00:04:57,360 --> 00:05:00,440 Speaker 1: to be able to slither backwards just fine. Right, And 100 00:05:00,920 --> 00:05:02,560 Speaker 1: so I mean, of course, in all of this you're talking, 101 00:05:02,680 --> 00:05:05,320 Speaker 1: we're dealing with something on one level, there's the symbolism 102 00:05:05,400 --> 00:05:08,240 Speaker 1: level of it, right, Like what does the idea of 103 00:05:08,240 --> 00:05:11,320 Speaker 1: a snake with two heads mean, how does it? What 104 00:05:11,440 --> 00:05:14,240 Speaker 1: does it? How does it function in the human mind? 105 00:05:15,040 --> 00:05:16,960 Speaker 1: But then also there is a certain degree of just 106 00:05:17,040 --> 00:05:21,799 Speaker 1: like weird tales about what snakes look like. So, according 107 00:05:21,839 --> 00:05:25,040 Speaker 1: to Carol Rose, the folklorist, his books always come back 108 00:05:25,080 --> 00:05:27,520 Speaker 1: to She she has a nice write up about it 109 00:05:27,760 --> 00:05:30,000 Speaker 1: in one of her monster books, and she points out 110 00:05:30,000 --> 00:05:32,280 Speaker 1: that the Greek writer Lucan described it as a desert 111 00:05:32,320 --> 00:05:36,240 Speaker 1: creature of North Africa. Um and um, and of course 112 00:05:36,279 --> 00:05:38,040 Speaker 1: as well, we'll we'll see plenty of the Elder of 113 00:05:38,040 --> 00:05:42,480 Speaker 1: course also wrote about it. But I also was reading 114 00:05:42,520 --> 00:05:46,960 Speaker 1: from a article Stalking the Emphis Beena by Sydney J. 115 00:05:47,160 --> 00:05:53,640 Speaker 1: Levy from the Journal of Consumer Research. That but yeah, 116 00:05:53,800 --> 00:05:57,919 Speaker 1: but that mentions that the this particular symbol quote was 117 00:05:58,000 --> 00:06:02,359 Speaker 1: probably intended to express the horror and anguish associated with 118 00:06:02,480 --> 00:06:07,680 Speaker 1: ambivalent situations. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, I mean that. Um, 119 00:06:07,720 --> 00:06:11,000 Speaker 1: it certainly goes with a kind of classic archetype of 120 00:06:11,000 --> 00:06:14,240 Speaker 1: of psychodynamics, right, the idea that like this might not 121 00:06:14,279 --> 00:06:17,160 Speaker 1: be the most correct way of thinking about the mind. Now, 122 00:06:17,240 --> 00:06:19,680 Speaker 1: but if you go back to Freudian thought, you know, 123 00:06:19,800 --> 00:06:24,320 Speaker 1: he often seemed to emphasize that major problems in the mind. 124 00:06:24,360 --> 00:06:27,680 Speaker 1: The psychoses and things were caused by states of ambivalence 125 00:06:27,680 --> 00:06:31,520 Speaker 1: where you had, you know, conflicting desires or conflicting tendencies 126 00:06:31,560 --> 00:06:34,040 Speaker 1: that couldn't be resolved. Should I stay or should I go? 127 00:06:34,120 --> 00:06:37,000 Speaker 1: I don't know. I'm of two snakes on the man. H. 128 00:06:37,120 --> 00:06:39,640 Speaker 1: So this particular beast also shows up in a lot 129 00:06:39,680 --> 00:06:43,440 Speaker 1: of medieval beast theories with as a winged creature with 130 00:06:43,520 --> 00:06:46,360 Speaker 1: two legs at it as well. Uh, sometimes it's said 131 00:06:46,360 --> 00:06:48,320 Speaker 1: that it can roll like a hoop snake, a hoop 132 00:06:48,360 --> 00:06:50,360 Speaker 1: snake being kind of a form of an aura borous 133 00:06:50,880 --> 00:06:54,000 Speaker 1: that's less, less concerned with what happens if a snake 134 00:06:54,040 --> 00:06:56,960 Speaker 1: consumes itself. How does this house this play out in 135 00:06:56,960 --> 00:07:00,240 Speaker 1: my mind? Versus what if a snake just at its 136 00:07:00,240 --> 00:07:02,320 Speaker 1: own tail and then rolled like a wheel down a 137 00:07:02,440 --> 00:07:04,560 Speaker 1: down a hill. Now this is a mythical creature, no 138 00:07:04,760 --> 00:07:08,120 Speaker 1: real creature, though there is a real wheel spider. Yeah, yeah, 139 00:07:08,160 --> 00:07:11,440 Speaker 1: there are some real rolling creatures, but but not quite 140 00:07:11,520 --> 00:07:15,840 Speaker 1: like a snake. Um Plenty of Here's what Plenty had 141 00:07:15,880 --> 00:07:19,440 Speaker 1: to say about the the amphisbina in the Natural History 142 00:07:19,520 --> 00:07:22,400 Speaker 1: Glad Plenty was on it. The amphisbina has a twin 143 00:07:22,520 --> 00:07:25,120 Speaker 1: head that is one at the tail end as well 144 00:07:25,440 --> 00:07:27,680 Speaker 1: as though it were not enough for poison to be 145 00:07:27,720 --> 00:07:30,960 Speaker 1: poured out of one mount, because that's another aspect of 146 00:07:31,000 --> 00:07:32,760 Speaker 1: it is is that the creature is supposed to be 147 00:07:32,800 --> 00:07:37,040 Speaker 1: like any mythic serpent. It's highly venomous, and so maybe 148 00:07:37,040 --> 00:07:39,120 Speaker 1: the ideas it's just so venomous that one head is 149 00:07:39,160 --> 00:07:42,200 Speaker 1: not enough. It needs two heads for all that venom. Uh. 150 00:07:42,280 --> 00:07:45,120 Speaker 1: Then likewise, there their accounts of how you can use 151 00:07:45,160 --> 00:07:49,360 Speaker 1: its dried skin to say, treat rheumatism. Uh. So there's 152 00:07:49,520 --> 00:07:51,480 Speaker 1: you know, there are all these different stories about it, 153 00:07:51,600 --> 00:07:53,720 Speaker 1: and it reminds me a lot of the of some 154 00:07:53,760 --> 00:07:57,600 Speaker 1: of the things we're discussing about the bassilisk. Now Rose 155 00:07:57,640 --> 00:08:01,679 Speaker 1: writes that while exaggerated, she thinks it was likely based 156 00:08:01,680 --> 00:08:05,240 Speaker 1: on some real venomous reptile in the Libyan desert, perhaps 157 00:08:05,320 --> 00:08:08,600 Speaker 1: one that was capable of slithering in either direction, which, 158 00:08:09,000 --> 00:08:11,960 Speaker 1: as you said, that's some real snakes. Not that impressive. 159 00:08:12,200 --> 00:08:15,000 Speaker 1: But if you didn't know that, it's kind of like 160 00:08:15,000 --> 00:08:16,760 Speaker 1: if you don't know that horses can lay down, and 161 00:08:16,800 --> 00:08:19,559 Speaker 1: then you see one laying down, sleeping and you're like, whoa. 162 00:08:19,800 --> 00:08:22,160 Speaker 1: Then you start reporting you're gonna call it plenty immediately. 163 00:08:22,280 --> 00:08:24,720 Speaker 1: I didn't tell him or the other possibilities that is 164 00:08:24,760 --> 00:08:27,360 Speaker 1: that it's a snake that seemed to raise its tail 165 00:08:27,400 --> 00:08:30,320 Speaker 1: a tail like a head when it was threatened. And 166 00:08:30,360 --> 00:08:32,960 Speaker 1: we'll come back to to that because there are some 167 00:08:33,040 --> 00:08:36,920 Speaker 1: potential examples of that for sure. Then there. You know, 168 00:08:36,960 --> 00:08:40,320 Speaker 1: if we look outside of Western traditions, we also see 169 00:08:40,360 --> 00:08:44,480 Speaker 1: double headed serpents in the Aztec tradition. Yeah, with a 170 00:08:44,960 --> 00:08:47,839 Speaker 1: with a you know, there's a particularly interesting fifteenth or 171 00:08:47,880 --> 00:08:52,240 Speaker 1: sixteenth century turquoise example that I'm sure everyone's seeing photos of. 172 00:08:52,320 --> 00:08:54,920 Speaker 1: There's a particularly a nice example of this in the 173 00:08:54,920 --> 00:09:00,920 Speaker 1: British Museum. Uh. This this turquoise uh serpent creature uh 174 00:09:00,960 --> 00:09:04,240 Speaker 1: with this like almost bear like head on on either end. 175 00:09:04,960 --> 00:09:08,960 Speaker 1: And it's uncertain exactly what it's depicting. So, you know, 176 00:09:09,000 --> 00:09:11,400 Speaker 1: the the idea maybe that this is just representing that 177 00:09:11,480 --> 00:09:14,080 Speaker 1: serpentine rebirth that we've talked about, So this is not 178 00:09:14,200 --> 00:09:17,120 Speaker 1: so much a snake with two heads, but that it's 179 00:09:17,160 --> 00:09:21,000 Speaker 1: a snake emerging from itself from its skin. It also 180 00:09:21,120 --> 00:09:24,880 Speaker 1: may be well be related to quetzal codal, which we 181 00:09:25,160 --> 00:09:28,680 Speaker 1: we did an episode on talking about the importance of 182 00:09:28,720 --> 00:09:35,120 Speaker 1: the plumed serpent in in meso American religion. And uh, 183 00:09:35,120 --> 00:09:37,320 Speaker 1: and we should also point out that that particular god 184 00:09:37,400 --> 00:09:40,400 Speaker 1: like there there's a snake god that is certainly far 185 00:09:40,520 --> 00:09:44,679 Speaker 1: removed from anything Falsa Doom represents no thoroughly nondo me 186 00:09:46,040 --> 00:09:49,120 Speaker 1: And then uh, I also read that it's it's possible 187 00:09:49,120 --> 00:09:52,520 Speaker 1: that this is not like clearly maybe an Aztec creation, 188 00:09:52,600 --> 00:09:54,720 Speaker 1: but maybe it's a creation of the mix the mixed 189 00:09:54,720 --> 00:09:58,040 Speaker 1: tech people. UM, so you're you're ultimately going with with 190 00:09:58,040 --> 00:10:01,640 Speaker 1: perhaps several different degrees of separate between the people who 191 00:10:01,720 --> 00:10:04,800 Speaker 1: originally um dreamed up and created this work of art 192 00:10:04,880 --> 00:10:08,520 Speaker 1: versus those certainly who now possess it. So obviously the 193 00:10:08,600 --> 00:10:13,600 Speaker 1: next question is are there two headed snakes in real life? Oh? Yes, yeah, 194 00:10:13,640 --> 00:10:16,480 Speaker 1: the answer is clearly yes. Two headed snakes of a 195 00:10:16,520 --> 00:10:20,280 Speaker 1: certain kind I will say, absolutely do exist and are 196 00:10:20,320 --> 00:10:24,440 Speaker 1: pretty regularly captured or breading captivity. It seems like maybe 197 00:10:24,720 --> 00:10:27,880 Speaker 1: once every couple of years, herpetologists come across one new 198 00:10:27,880 --> 00:10:30,560 Speaker 1: and interesting case of this that blows up in the media. 199 00:10:30,600 --> 00:10:33,240 Speaker 1: I think they probably get discovered more oftense, just only 200 00:10:33,320 --> 00:10:37,560 Speaker 1: sometimes do they really catch fire on the internet. But yes, 201 00:10:37,640 --> 00:10:41,680 Speaker 1: there are pretty frequently cases of two headed snakes known 202 00:10:41,679 --> 00:10:45,360 Speaker 1: as diecephalic or polycephalic, meaning you know, two heads or 203 00:10:45,400 --> 00:10:49,400 Speaker 1: many heads from species like ladder snakes, copper heads, king 204 00:10:49,520 --> 00:10:52,839 Speaker 1: snakes I've read about in all those species and others, 205 00:10:52,880 --> 00:10:56,800 Speaker 1: and these snakes generally have two heads, both growing from 206 00:10:56,880 --> 00:11:00,440 Speaker 1: the neck end of the body. There is no species 207 00:11:00,480 --> 00:11:03,960 Speaker 1: of snake that is regularly like this. Rather, this is 208 00:11:04,280 --> 00:11:07,440 Speaker 1: like this is not an adaptation or evolutionary change. It's 209 00:11:07,440 --> 00:11:10,880 Speaker 1: a developmental anomaly. It occurs the same way that most 210 00:11:10,960 --> 00:11:14,880 Speaker 1: other conjoined twins do when an embryo in in utero 211 00:11:15,000 --> 00:11:18,040 Speaker 1: splits into twins, but it doesn't split all the way, 212 00:11:18,240 --> 00:11:21,720 Speaker 1: leading to embryos that continue to develop while remaining attached 213 00:11:21,760 --> 00:11:23,880 Speaker 1: in some way. That's right, And if if you want 214 00:11:23,920 --> 00:11:27,880 Speaker 1: some more information on conjoined twins, uh, we we actually 215 00:11:27,920 --> 00:11:31,480 Speaker 1: discussed this in our Halloween episode whatever Halloween episodes last year, 216 00:11:31,520 --> 00:11:34,520 Speaker 1: the Tales from the Crypt episode, because of course there's 217 00:11:34,520 --> 00:11:36,319 Speaker 1: a Tales from the Crypt episode. There's more than one 218 00:11:36,360 --> 00:11:39,640 Speaker 1: actually that involves that in an insensitive manner, but so 219 00:11:40,120 --> 00:11:43,040 Speaker 1: we we we use that episode as an excuse to like, 220 00:11:43,160 --> 00:11:46,920 Speaker 1: all right, let's let's put aside the trash because let's 221 00:11:46,920 --> 00:11:50,199 Speaker 1: face the tales in the crypt is ultimately a trashy show. 222 00:11:50,520 --> 00:11:52,360 Speaker 1: But let's set all that aside and discuss, like, you know, 223 00:11:52,400 --> 00:11:54,600 Speaker 1: what the actual science is. And so we went through 224 00:11:54,600 --> 00:11:58,000 Speaker 1: all the various forms that occur, and so, yeah, this 225 00:11:58,000 --> 00:12:00,400 Speaker 1: this occurs in all kinds of animals and in cases 226 00:12:00,400 --> 00:12:03,319 Speaker 1: I've read about. What happens with snakes is you've got 227 00:12:03,360 --> 00:12:06,600 Speaker 1: two heads that are side by side, both extending from 228 00:12:06,679 --> 00:12:10,080 Speaker 1: the neck at different um. Sometimes there will be different 229 00:12:10,080 --> 00:12:14,559 Speaker 1: amounts of like length of the body that that are separated. 230 00:12:14,840 --> 00:12:17,240 Speaker 1: Sometimes the heads are very close to each other. Sometimes 231 00:12:17,320 --> 00:12:21,000 Speaker 1: they've got significant amounts of of separate neck, but they 232 00:12:21,040 --> 00:12:25,400 Speaker 1: share connections, usually to the top of the elementary canal. Um. 233 00:12:25,440 --> 00:12:28,160 Speaker 1: But the question would be here, what about a snake 234 00:12:28,200 --> 00:12:30,840 Speaker 1: with a head on both ends of the length of 235 00:12:30,880 --> 00:12:33,800 Speaker 1: the body, like in Thulsa Dooms standard for the cult 236 00:12:33,840 --> 00:12:36,400 Speaker 1: of set Could there be a snake that's got a 237 00:12:36,480 --> 00:12:39,720 Speaker 1: head for a tail? Well, we already mentioned that plenty 238 00:12:39,720 --> 00:12:43,720 Speaker 1: of the elder Um discussed one, and uh, you know, 239 00:12:43,760 --> 00:12:45,880 Speaker 1: we don't have plenty with us any any longer, but 240 00:12:45,960 --> 00:12:49,400 Speaker 1: we do have the Daily mail, and uh, and so 241 00:12:49,600 --> 00:12:51,640 Speaker 1: I was I was looking around, you know, for doing 242 00:12:51,679 --> 00:12:54,440 Speaker 1: various searches for two headed snakes, and I found an 243 00:12:54,520 --> 00:12:58,880 Speaker 1: article from September twenty third, two thousand twelve by Daily 244 00:12:58,920 --> 00:13:02,760 Speaker 1: Mail reporter titled they Both Seemed to Control It. Family 245 00:13:02,800 --> 00:13:05,480 Speaker 1: finds snake with two heads, one on each end of 246 00:13:05,520 --> 00:13:09,000 Speaker 1: its body. And so this all seemed to have happened 247 00:13:09,000 --> 00:13:12,480 Speaker 1: in South Carolina, and it was originally reported by Fox 248 00:13:12,520 --> 00:13:18,400 Speaker 1: Carolina presumably It's Fantastic Beasts news Beat newsdesk, and it 249 00:13:18,480 --> 00:13:21,160 Speaker 1: was it was identified by the local high school's biology 250 00:13:21,160 --> 00:13:24,960 Speaker 1: department as a rough earth snake. Uh. And you look 251 00:13:24,960 --> 00:13:28,840 Speaker 1: at these pictures, they're not, you know, super clear. Um, 252 00:13:28,880 --> 00:13:31,720 Speaker 1: but there was video. There was video at some point, 253 00:13:31,760 --> 00:13:35,960 Speaker 1: but the video I couldn't find actually alright good because 254 00:13:35,960 --> 00:13:38,600 Speaker 1: the video footage I found had been removed, as as 255 00:13:38,640 --> 00:13:40,680 Speaker 1: had the like I was getting a four or four 256 00:13:40,679 --> 00:13:45,719 Speaker 1: on the original Fox reporting. But uh, the article was 257 00:13:45,720 --> 00:13:48,600 Speaker 1: was pretty fun. My favorite line from it was quote, 258 00:13:48,960 --> 00:13:52,160 Speaker 1: but while the snake pulls itself in opposite directions, young 259 00:13:52,240 --> 00:13:55,640 Speaker 1: Savannah and Preston are also pulled in different directions on 260 00:13:55,720 --> 00:13:58,360 Speaker 1: what to name the snake. That's right. One of them 261 00:13:58,400 --> 00:14:00,480 Speaker 1: wanted to name it Billy Bob and the other said 262 00:14:00,520 --> 00:14:06,280 Speaker 1: Oreo right, um, uh yeah. I was looking for more 263 00:14:06,320 --> 00:14:09,040 Speaker 1: on this story to see to try to dig underneath 264 00:14:09,160 --> 00:14:12,040 Speaker 1: like the the Daily Mail article, and I couldn't. I 265 00:14:12,040 --> 00:14:14,560 Speaker 1: couldn't get under it. I don't understand why there wasn't 266 00:14:14,559 --> 00:14:16,600 Speaker 1: more follow up. I mean, I suspect it's because the 267 00:14:16,640 --> 00:14:19,240 Speaker 1: snake died and everyone was like, oh no, I'm sad 268 00:14:19,280 --> 00:14:21,960 Speaker 1: and let's move on with it. But or because the 269 00:14:21,960 --> 00:14:24,880 Speaker 1: original reporting might have been mistaken. That's the other. Yeah, 270 00:14:24,960 --> 00:14:28,080 Speaker 1: we just don't We don't know ultimately. Yeah. So even 271 00:14:28,080 --> 00:14:30,720 Speaker 1: though there's video, I mean I did watch video, and 272 00:14:30,760 --> 00:14:32,800 Speaker 1: it's a small snake, but they've got it in like 273 00:14:32,880 --> 00:14:36,160 Speaker 1: a little igloo cooler and it's slithering around and it 274 00:14:36,240 --> 00:14:38,960 Speaker 1: has some kind of it wasn't super high definition, but 275 00:14:39,000 --> 00:14:41,800 Speaker 1: it's got something on its tail. It looks sort of 276 00:14:41,840 --> 00:14:45,320 Speaker 1: head shaped. Even though I saw some video, I'm still 277 00:14:45,360 --> 00:14:49,640 Speaker 1: a little bit skeptical. I wonder if what's being interpreted 278 00:14:49,680 --> 00:14:52,320 Speaker 1: as a head on the tail end of the snake 279 00:14:52,480 --> 00:14:55,440 Speaker 1: is not really ahead. Yeah, I mean that's that's a 280 00:14:55,520 --> 00:15:00,160 Speaker 1: huge possibility. Uh yeah. So just to as as back 281 00:15:00,240 --> 00:15:02,880 Speaker 1: up for that as that being a possibility, I was 282 00:15:02,920 --> 00:15:04,920 Speaker 1: looking at a book from J h U Press two 283 00:15:04,960 --> 00:15:08,520 Speaker 1: thousand eighteen called American Snakes by Sean P. Graham. Uh. 284 00:15:08,520 --> 00:15:10,440 Speaker 1: And just as a side note before we get to 285 00:15:10,440 --> 00:15:12,920 Speaker 1: the thing that I went to this book for. As 286 00:15:12,960 --> 00:15:15,320 Speaker 1: a side note, there's a part I found where the 287 00:15:15,360 --> 00:15:20,200 Speaker 1: author is describing strange defense strategies that snakes employ. Uh. 288 00:15:20,240 --> 00:15:24,320 Speaker 1: And this unrelated one is called cloacle popping. Oh okay, 289 00:15:24,400 --> 00:15:26,960 Speaker 1: So sometimes have you read about this? No, I mean, 290 00:15:27,000 --> 00:15:29,320 Speaker 1: if you tell, if you'd asked me what cloacle popping was, 291 00:15:29,440 --> 00:15:32,760 Speaker 1: I would assume it's like the hottest new dance number 292 00:15:32,880 --> 00:15:36,640 Speaker 1: that I'm not familiar with. So sometimes when threatened, Uh, 293 00:15:36,720 --> 00:15:40,480 Speaker 1: some types of snakes will rapidly turn their cloaca inside out. 294 00:15:40,960 --> 00:15:44,200 Speaker 1: The cloaca is the common hole at the rear of 295 00:15:44,240 --> 00:15:49,120 Speaker 1: the body that's used for urinary tract, digestive tract, and 296 00:15:49,240 --> 00:15:52,480 Speaker 1: reproductive tract. So it's it's a common sort of hole 297 00:15:52,640 --> 00:15:55,520 Speaker 1: back there that takes care of all the cummings and 298 00:15:55,520 --> 00:15:58,520 Speaker 1: goings at the back side of the body. So when 299 00:15:58,560 --> 00:16:01,800 Speaker 1: these snakes get captured or handled or encounter some kind 300 00:16:01,800 --> 00:16:06,240 Speaker 1: of menace, they will sort of suddenly vigorously poop out 301 00:16:06,320 --> 00:16:09,400 Speaker 1: part of their own rectum. Basically, it's not a rectum. 302 00:16:09,400 --> 00:16:14,120 Speaker 1: It's cloaca, which produces these popping or squishing sounds which 303 00:16:14,120 --> 00:16:17,280 Speaker 1: are vaguely audible to us. Uh. It's not known what 304 00:16:17,440 --> 00:16:20,480 Speaker 1: adaptive purpose, if any of this has. But there's your 305 00:16:20,520 --> 00:16:24,320 Speaker 1: fact of the day, chloecal pot there, Okay. But also 306 00:16:24,560 --> 00:16:27,560 Speaker 1: the reason I was reading about this is that I 307 00:16:27,640 --> 00:16:29,840 Speaker 1: was looking for examples, and this is absolutely true that 308 00:16:29,920 --> 00:16:34,920 Speaker 1: some snake species have a defensive strategy that's known as automimicry, 309 00:16:35,000 --> 00:16:39,240 Speaker 1: which involves having a tail that looks like a second head. 310 00:16:39,840 --> 00:16:43,040 Speaker 1: And examples of this include the rubber boa, which can 311 00:16:43,160 --> 00:16:46,160 Speaker 1: use its tail as a decoy head if it's attacked. 312 00:16:46,200 --> 00:16:48,840 Speaker 1: Like if this snake is attacked, if you've seen pictures 313 00:16:48,840 --> 00:16:50,920 Speaker 1: of the rubber boa, you might have seen it not 314 00:16:51,080 --> 00:16:53,880 Speaker 1: just coiled, but sort of tied up in itself like 315 00:16:53,920 --> 00:16:57,280 Speaker 1: a not it'll you know, be a jumble, and while 316 00:16:57,320 --> 00:17:00,200 Speaker 1: it's in this tangle, it will raise its tail all 317 00:17:00,400 --> 00:17:02,920 Speaker 1: up as if it were raising its head up, and 318 00:17:02,960 --> 00:17:06,680 Speaker 1: allow whatever is attacking it to attack its tail, while 319 00:17:07,000 --> 00:17:09,480 Speaker 1: you know, the real head is defended under the coiled 320 00:17:09,520 --> 00:17:12,800 Speaker 1: body and perhaps searching for an escape route. Right. And 321 00:17:12,800 --> 00:17:15,119 Speaker 1: so in this it has a lot in common with 322 00:17:15,200 --> 00:17:17,680 Speaker 1: various other animals where the ideas of a predator is 323 00:17:17,720 --> 00:17:21,439 Speaker 1: going to attack, you draw their attack away from them. 324 00:17:22,000 --> 00:17:25,040 Speaker 1: The more sensitive parts of your anatomy draw them away 325 00:17:25,080 --> 00:17:27,400 Speaker 1: from them from like your brain or your Torso get 326 00:17:27,400 --> 00:17:29,960 Speaker 1: them towards the tail. There are some creatures that even 327 00:17:30,000 --> 00:17:33,240 Speaker 1: practice something that's known as autotomy, where they will like 328 00:17:33,400 --> 00:17:36,199 Speaker 1: release their tail sort of as a distraction or a 329 00:17:36,240 --> 00:17:39,600 Speaker 1: gift to the predator while the rest of them can escape. Yeah. 330 00:17:39,840 --> 00:17:42,800 Speaker 1: I encountered this on a nature path over the weekend. 331 00:17:43,280 --> 00:17:46,560 Speaker 1: I was walking with my son and lo and behold, 332 00:17:46,600 --> 00:17:48,919 Speaker 1: there in the path is we see a little lizard 333 00:17:48,920 --> 00:17:53,080 Speaker 1: tail still moving, still flopping back and forth, no sign 334 00:17:53,160 --> 00:17:55,480 Speaker 1: of the of its former owner. And so we were 335 00:17:55,560 --> 00:17:58,960 Speaker 1: trying to decide, well, what happened here? Did did the 336 00:17:59,520 --> 00:18:03,240 Speaker 1: lizard you know, an attempt to prevent predation and it 337 00:18:03,240 --> 00:18:06,479 Speaker 1: didn't work? Or did it work? And it's ever all 338 00:18:06,480 --> 00:18:09,000 Speaker 1: the parties have gone their separate ways. Uh. Yeah, it's 339 00:18:09,000 --> 00:18:12,920 Speaker 1: a fascinating survival adaptation. And there I believe there is 340 00:18:12,920 --> 00:18:14,720 Speaker 1: an episode of stuff to blow your mind in the 341 00:18:14,800 --> 00:18:17,720 Speaker 1: vault about it. Yeah. I think we did a two 342 00:18:17,720 --> 00:18:23,000 Speaker 1: parter about tails. Long We talked about the scorpion scorpion autonomy, Yeah, 343 00:18:23,080 --> 00:18:25,360 Speaker 1: where its tail will come off, But then it can't 344 00:18:25,400 --> 00:18:28,120 Speaker 1: live much longer after that because it can't poop. That's right, 345 00:18:28,160 --> 00:18:31,199 Speaker 1: the tail or, one of the lost segments of the 346 00:18:31,200 --> 00:18:35,720 Speaker 1: tail contained the scorpion anus, and therefore it can never 347 00:18:35,760 --> 00:18:40,479 Speaker 1: poop again. Which I mean, as far as scorpion timelines get, 348 00:18:40,520 --> 00:18:43,159 Speaker 1: it's probably not that bad. But that's the world of scorpions. 349 00:18:43,240 --> 00:18:45,080 Speaker 1: Let's get back to the world. How do you know 350 00:18:45,119 --> 00:18:49,879 Speaker 1: how bad it is I speak for the scorpions, Well, 351 00:18:49,920 --> 00:18:52,680 Speaker 1: I mean never having to poop again. I can just imagine, Yeah, 352 00:18:52,720 --> 00:18:55,560 Speaker 1: there's gonna be there's gonna be some huge downsides to that, 353 00:18:55,640 --> 00:18:58,480 Speaker 1: but then there are certain upsides, namely not having to 354 00:18:58,480 --> 00:19:00,840 Speaker 1: poop again. Okay, so I want to be clear. I 355 00:19:01,119 --> 00:19:03,760 Speaker 1: want to try to be humble about what's going on 356 00:19:04,440 --> 00:19:08,240 Speaker 1: with the with the supposed two headed, you know, head 357 00:19:08,280 --> 00:19:11,080 Speaker 1: on the tail snake here. I don't know that what's 358 00:19:11,080 --> 00:19:14,000 Speaker 1: going on here is like a mistaken case of automimicry. 359 00:19:14,440 --> 00:19:17,600 Speaker 1: I I just will say that I'm not yet convinced 360 00:19:17,720 --> 00:19:19,600 Speaker 1: that this is really a snake with a head on 361 00:19:19,680 --> 00:19:22,240 Speaker 1: both ends. It seems a little hard for me to 362 00:19:22,280 --> 00:19:26,400 Speaker 1: imagine exactly how that happens, Like, where is the cloaca 363 00:19:26,560 --> 00:19:29,440 Speaker 1: for one thing, Is it in the middle of the snake? Well, 364 00:19:29,480 --> 00:19:32,440 Speaker 1: the two heads go out from each side. All the snakes, 365 00:19:32,640 --> 00:19:36,040 Speaker 1: all the snakes where we have confirmed accounts that, like 366 00:19:36,080 --> 00:19:38,960 Speaker 1: a really well documented that I could find are where 367 00:19:39,000 --> 00:19:43,080 Speaker 1: the heads appear at the same end. And so I'm yeah, 368 00:19:43,119 --> 00:19:46,120 Speaker 1: I'm I'm skeptical about this. I am not yet convinced 369 00:19:46,119 --> 00:19:49,840 Speaker 1: that this is for real. Yeah, I definitely would love 370 00:19:49,880 --> 00:19:53,560 Speaker 1: to see more evidence. Um, be it just visual evidence 371 00:19:53,600 --> 00:19:56,359 Speaker 1: of this particular snake or just more people saying oh yeah, 372 00:19:56,359 --> 00:19:58,000 Speaker 1: Like I would love to hear from the the actual 373 00:19:58,680 --> 00:20:01,680 Speaker 1: uh science teacher who resumably weigh in on this. Oh yeah, 374 00:20:01,720 --> 00:20:03,840 Speaker 1: if you've seen this thing up close and you're listening 375 00:20:03,920 --> 00:20:07,159 Speaker 1: now get in touch. Yeah. And likewise, I feel like 376 00:20:07,200 --> 00:20:09,879 Speaker 1: the town that this occurred in, like this should be 377 00:20:09,920 --> 00:20:12,320 Speaker 1: if this was real, this snake should be like the 378 00:20:12,600 --> 00:20:16,800 Speaker 1: mascot for the city at this point. Um, so yeah, 379 00:20:16,840 --> 00:20:21,680 Speaker 1: talking pulling itself into uh. But but anyway, just to 380 00:20:21,960 --> 00:20:26,000 Speaker 1: get back to the broader subject of polycephaly or having 381 00:20:26,000 --> 00:20:30,639 Speaker 1: two heads in the serpent world, Um, it's rare, but 382 00:20:30,720 --> 00:20:34,080 Speaker 1: it does seem to occur. It seems to occur more 383 00:20:34,080 --> 00:20:36,240 Speaker 1: in the snake world, but it's really hard to say 384 00:20:36,240 --> 00:20:39,679 Speaker 1: for sure because such specimens they tend to die fast 385 00:20:39,840 --> 00:20:42,800 Speaker 1: in the wild. Yeah, I've seen it speculated, but not 386 00:20:42,880 --> 00:20:45,520 Speaker 1: known for sure that it happens more often in snakes 387 00:20:45,520 --> 00:20:48,639 Speaker 1: in captivity than it does in wild snakes. But we 388 00:20:49,040 --> 00:20:50,960 Speaker 1: that's not something that's know and it's just kind of 389 00:20:50,960 --> 00:20:54,119 Speaker 1: a possibility. I found a two thousand twelve paper in 390 00:20:54,160 --> 00:20:58,600 Speaker 1: the Bulletin of the Chicago or Herpetological Society titled two 391 00:20:58,640 --> 00:21:01,959 Speaker 1: headed Snakes Make high Mate It's Pets by Van Walock, 392 00:21:02,520 --> 00:21:05,000 Speaker 1: and the author points out that there was a nineteen 393 00:21:05,080 --> 00:21:07,920 Speaker 1: thirty seven book by an individual by the name of 394 00:21:07,960 --> 00:21:11,120 Speaker 1: Cunningham on the subject of two headed snakes, and that 395 00:21:11,160 --> 00:21:14,800 Speaker 1: book catalog nine and fifty cases in one d and 396 00:21:14,840 --> 00:21:19,280 Speaker 1: sixty nine species from ninety four genera and um. The 397 00:21:19,320 --> 00:21:23,520 Speaker 1: author here writes that currently, and this is two thousand twelve, currently, uh, 398 00:21:23,560 --> 00:21:27,560 Speaker 1: there were one thousand fifty known cases one species in 399 00:21:27,560 --> 00:21:30,280 Speaker 1: a hundred and three genera, and Van Wallack drove home 400 00:21:30,359 --> 00:21:32,520 Speaker 1: that most of them end up just drowning in the egg, 401 00:21:32,640 --> 00:21:35,280 Speaker 1: or they're still born, or they die shortly after birth. 402 00:21:35,960 --> 00:21:39,240 Speaker 1: But if they if they do survive, one of the 403 00:21:39,280 --> 00:21:40,960 Speaker 1: things is, and this is the key to the title 404 00:21:40,960 --> 00:21:44,040 Speaker 1: of the paper, they're difficult to care for. They require 405 00:21:44,160 --> 00:21:48,119 Speaker 1: extra assistance in in uh, you know, in eating, they 406 00:21:48,160 --> 00:21:51,159 Speaker 1: need extra systence even when they shed their skin. But 407 00:21:51,240 --> 00:21:54,679 Speaker 1: they can survive in captivity in some cases. Yeah, but 408 00:21:54,760 --> 00:21:57,439 Speaker 1: they do encounter all kinds of problems to survival. I mean, 409 00:21:57,440 --> 00:22:00,320 Speaker 1: they're good reasons you don't usually come across them alive 410 00:22:00,359 --> 00:22:03,040 Speaker 1: in the wild. For one thing, with two heads, movement 411 00:22:03,160 --> 00:22:04,880 Speaker 1: is a lot more difficult. You know, you've got two 412 00:22:04,920 --> 00:22:08,480 Speaker 1: brains that can struggle for control of the body. Feeding 413 00:22:08,520 --> 00:22:11,400 Speaker 1: can be more difficult as the two heads sometimes fight 414 00:22:11,440 --> 00:22:14,760 Speaker 1: each other over access to the food. Also, in some 415 00:22:14,800 --> 00:22:17,960 Speaker 1: cases after, of course, predation can be more difficult. And 416 00:22:18,000 --> 00:22:20,639 Speaker 1: then in some cases after feeding, I was reading that 417 00:22:21,119 --> 00:22:25,240 Speaker 1: if one of the snake's heads smells like prey because 418 00:22:25,240 --> 00:22:28,720 Speaker 1: it just eight, the other head may sometimes mistake that 419 00:22:28,800 --> 00:22:31,480 Speaker 1: head for prey and try to attack it, and then 420 00:22:31,480 --> 00:22:34,680 Speaker 1: we're potentially back in oral Boras country at that point. Yeah. 421 00:22:34,880 --> 00:22:37,400 Speaker 1: And another thing that I thought was kind of morbidly 422 00:22:37,440 --> 00:22:40,320 Speaker 1: interesting in the in the van Wallaka piece that that 423 00:22:40,400 --> 00:22:43,360 Speaker 1: you just mentioned, there is a risk. For example, if 424 00:22:43,359 --> 00:22:45,760 Speaker 1: you've got a snake in a two headed snake in 425 00:22:45,760 --> 00:22:50,399 Speaker 1: a tank, a risk of the snake crawling into apertures 426 00:22:50,560 --> 00:22:53,639 Speaker 1: or past obstacles, because of course, snakes very often like 427 00:22:53,720 --> 00:22:56,439 Speaker 1: to hide inside holes and enclosures. But if they have 428 00:22:56,560 --> 00:22:59,880 Speaker 1: two heads bifurcated at the neck, you can run into 429 00:22:59,920 --> 00:23:02,800 Speaker 1: a situation where one head is trying to pass by 430 00:23:02,800 --> 00:23:06,680 Speaker 1: an obstacle or go into a hole. That's essentially like 431 00:23:06,680 --> 00:23:10,879 Speaker 1: like smashing the other head against that aperture or that 432 00:23:10,960 --> 00:23:13,359 Speaker 1: obstacle trying to get past it, and could end up 433 00:23:13,400 --> 00:23:16,119 Speaker 1: sort of peeling the other head off as it struggles 434 00:23:16,160 --> 00:23:19,880 Speaker 1: to go forward. That's not good. That's not good for anybody. 435 00:23:19,960 --> 00:23:22,879 Speaker 1: And uh, and the snakes are not I mean, they 436 00:23:22,920 --> 00:23:26,400 Speaker 1: don't have a lot of complex cognition. They can't usually think, oh, 437 00:23:26,440 --> 00:23:29,240 Speaker 1: I should back up, you know, it just doesn't seem 438 00:23:29,320 --> 00:23:31,840 Speaker 1: to occur to them. Now, outside of the world of snakes, 439 00:23:31,880 --> 00:23:35,360 Speaker 1: we should also know that real life worm lizards are 440 00:23:35,400 --> 00:23:39,720 Speaker 1: also known as Emphis pina um, but they of course 441 00:23:39,760 --> 00:23:42,600 Speaker 1: only have one head, but their tail does trunkate in 442 00:23:42,640 --> 00:23:45,879 Speaker 1: a way that kind of resembles a head. So is 443 00:23:45,920 --> 00:23:48,520 Speaker 1: it a form of automimicry. They think, I'm not entirely 444 00:23:48,520 --> 00:23:51,480 Speaker 1: sure on that if it actually functions as a as 445 00:23:51,640 --> 00:23:54,560 Speaker 1: as a mimic a mimic head, or it's just one 446 00:23:54,600 --> 00:23:57,560 Speaker 1: of these things where where we look at and we say, oh, well, 447 00:23:57,560 --> 00:23:59,600 Speaker 1: the end kind of looks like a head, and then 448 00:23:59,800 --> 00:24:02,679 Speaker 1: they decided to bestow this name upon them. Okay, I 449 00:24:02,680 --> 00:24:04,120 Speaker 1: think we got to take a break, but we will 450 00:24:04,160 --> 00:24:10,399 Speaker 1: be right back with more. Alright, we're back. Okay, So 451 00:24:10,440 --> 00:24:13,920 Speaker 1: we're thinking about Fulsa doom in the Conan the Barbarian movie. 452 00:24:14,040 --> 00:24:17,440 Speaker 1: One thing that the great Fulsa doom Uh does. One 453 00:24:17,440 --> 00:24:21,440 Speaker 1: trick he's got up his sleeve is the snake arrow. Yes, 454 00:24:21,720 --> 00:24:24,600 Speaker 1: so this is one of my my favorite snake tricks 455 00:24:24,680 --> 00:24:28,480 Speaker 1: from the film. And there are there's at least there 456 00:24:28,520 --> 00:24:30,440 Speaker 1: are a couple of scenes where he employs this one 457 00:24:30,480 --> 00:24:35,800 Speaker 1: extremely dramatically, where he'll he'll draw a venomous snake and 458 00:24:35,840 --> 00:24:38,399 Speaker 1: then he'll he'll stretch it out and he'll make it 459 00:24:38,520 --> 00:24:41,359 Speaker 1: rigid like an arrow. And then he will take the 460 00:24:42,119 --> 00:24:44,440 Speaker 1: rigid snake and he will put it in a bow 461 00:24:44,520 --> 00:24:47,160 Speaker 1: and then he will fire it as an arrow at 462 00:24:47,200 --> 00:24:49,880 Speaker 1: one of his enemies. And so he like he takes 463 00:24:49,880 --> 00:24:53,440 Speaker 1: a venomous snake and uses it as a venomous arrow. Yeah, 464 00:24:53,440 --> 00:24:57,280 Speaker 1: this is how he kills Conan's beloved the thief area. Yes, 465 00:24:57,720 --> 00:25:02,080 Speaker 1: so if you're watching this, maybe you're not asking questions, 466 00:25:02,119 --> 00:25:04,240 Speaker 1: but I can't help it. But wonder where does this 467 00:25:04,320 --> 00:25:06,919 Speaker 1: come from? Like they had to have been inspired by this, 468 00:25:07,000 --> 00:25:10,000 Speaker 1: And even if they weren't inspired by a particular detail 469 00:25:10,119 --> 00:25:13,520 Speaker 1: from from history and mythology, uh, then clearly they weren't 470 00:25:13,520 --> 00:25:15,280 Speaker 1: the ones to think of it first. Somebody else came 471 00:25:15,359 --> 00:25:18,720 Speaker 1: up with this cool idea earlier. Uh. And indeed we 472 00:25:18,760 --> 00:25:23,119 Speaker 1: do see some form of this in the Hindu epic 473 00:25:23,640 --> 00:25:28,320 Speaker 1: the Ramayana. So there are mentions in uh in the 474 00:25:28,400 --> 00:25:33,160 Speaker 1: Ramayana of serpent arrows or sharpa vanna. And then there's 475 00:25:33,200 --> 00:25:37,880 Speaker 1: also the Naga Pasha powerful snake turned arrow created created 476 00:25:37,880 --> 00:25:41,840 Speaker 1: by Brahma. So one particular character, we have the Prince 477 00:25:41,880 --> 00:25:44,880 Speaker 1: of Lanka, and this is the son of the tin 478 00:25:45,000 --> 00:25:49,720 Speaker 1: headed Ravana Ravana being. Yeah, he's like the demon king 479 00:25:50,200 --> 00:25:54,640 Speaker 1: principal antagonist in in in this particular Hindu epic. Um. 480 00:25:55,080 --> 00:26:00,320 Speaker 1: And anyway, the Prince of Lanka is named Indrajit and 481 00:26:00,400 --> 00:26:04,879 Speaker 1: he employs a host of wondrous weapons, including serpent arrows. 482 00:26:05,320 --> 00:26:07,320 Speaker 1: And I could have this wrong, but it seems like 483 00:26:07,359 --> 00:26:10,800 Speaker 1: the descriptions vary as to whether these are snakes transformed 484 00:26:10,800 --> 00:26:15,359 Speaker 1: into arrows or snakes fired as arrows. Again, I don't know, 485 00:26:15,359 --> 00:26:17,560 Speaker 1: you know at what point you draw a line between 486 00:26:17,600 --> 00:26:21,280 Speaker 1: these two things. Also, I'm left wondering if they're venomous 487 00:26:21,320 --> 00:26:24,520 Speaker 1: like those of the Fulsa doom uses, or do they 488 00:26:24,600 --> 00:26:27,680 Speaker 1: coil around the victim? Now this is the later would 489 00:26:27,680 --> 00:26:29,639 Speaker 1: seem to be the case, based on some of the 490 00:26:29,640 --> 00:26:35,000 Speaker 1: depictions I've seen of Hanuman, the monkey bound up by 491 00:26:35,040 --> 00:26:37,960 Speaker 1: such an arrow, and so it would almost be something 492 00:26:38,000 --> 00:26:40,760 Speaker 1: more like a bolus or something like it, Like it 493 00:26:40,840 --> 00:26:42,879 Speaker 1: binds the enemy, you shoot it at them, and it 494 00:26:42,920 --> 00:26:45,440 Speaker 1: wraps them up. Yeah, that definitely seems to be what's 495 00:26:45,480 --> 00:26:47,480 Speaker 1: taking place in some of these illustrations. I was looking 496 00:26:47,520 --> 00:26:49,040 Speaker 1: at like you've been shot by a snake and now 497 00:26:49,080 --> 00:26:51,720 Speaker 1: you're wrapped up in the snake. Now, of course that's 498 00:26:51,800 --> 00:26:57,600 Speaker 1: again we've gone from um Hollywood film to Hindu mythology. 499 00:26:57,640 --> 00:27:01,280 Speaker 1: But let's bring it back to history. Okay, So what 500 00:27:01,400 --> 00:27:03,920 Speaker 1: about just snake venom arrows, not a snake, Like we're 501 00:27:03,920 --> 00:27:06,359 Speaker 1: not even explore we're not gonna even attempt to mythbust 502 00:27:06,359 --> 00:27:09,679 Speaker 1: the idea that you could that you could string a 503 00:27:09,760 --> 00:27:12,200 Speaker 1: snake in a bow and arrow and fire it at somebody. 504 00:27:12,359 --> 00:27:14,720 Speaker 1: That's not gonna work. I don't think that would work. 505 00:27:14,880 --> 00:27:16,640 Speaker 1: I don't think you could get the snake to stay 506 00:27:16,720 --> 00:27:18,679 Speaker 1: rigid for that. But I do think there have been 507 00:27:18,720 --> 00:27:21,680 Speaker 1: cases where snakes have been used, uh, you know, in 508 00:27:21,680 --> 00:27:25,520 Speaker 1: intact as bioweapons, you know, just sort of like seeding 509 00:27:25,640 --> 00:27:29,520 Speaker 1: enemy territory with poisonous snakes. And certainly the idea of 510 00:27:30,000 --> 00:27:33,920 Speaker 1: using snake venom on an arrow, Uh, this does seem 511 00:27:33,960 --> 00:27:37,080 Speaker 1: to be a thing. I was looking uh at a 512 00:27:37,119 --> 00:27:41,240 Speaker 1: paper titled Chemical and Biological Warfare and Antiquity from by 513 00:27:41,280 --> 00:27:46,399 Speaker 1: Stanford's Adrian Mayor of the Geomethology episode, and this was 514 00:27:46,440 --> 00:27:50,800 Speaker 1: in History of Toxicology and Environmental health. So, um, some 515 00:27:50,880 --> 00:27:54,160 Speaker 1: of the points that Mayor makes. First of all, snake 516 00:27:54,240 --> 00:27:57,560 Speaker 1: venom is digestible, so it's actually suitable for killing game. 517 00:27:58,040 --> 00:28:00,760 Speaker 1: Oh that's interesting. So like you can eat it without 518 00:28:00,760 --> 00:28:03,280 Speaker 1: it necessarily harming you, right, yeah, or you don't have 519 00:28:03,320 --> 00:28:07,000 Speaker 1: to worry about Yeah, I've I've I've felled a deer 520 00:28:07,080 --> 00:28:09,840 Speaker 1: and now I could potentially eat this deer. I haven't liked, 521 00:28:10,000 --> 00:28:13,760 Speaker 1: you know, ruined the deer. Another point they make is 522 00:28:13,800 --> 00:28:17,720 Speaker 1: that in warfare UH, the venom can produce agonizing pain 523 00:28:18,280 --> 00:28:22,399 Speaker 1: and or a never healing wound. And then there are 524 00:28:22,480 --> 00:28:26,600 Speaker 1: numerous venomous snakes in the Mediterranean and UH and in 525 00:28:26,680 --> 00:28:30,560 Speaker 1: Africa and Asia that one could turn to. And the 526 00:28:30,760 --> 00:28:33,560 Speaker 1: Greeks and Romans recorded numerous groups that were known to 527 00:28:33,680 --> 00:28:38,880 Speaker 1: utilize their venom on arrows. Greek geographer Strabo, she writes, 528 00:28:39,320 --> 00:28:43,080 Speaker 1: wrote of Ethiopian arrows dipped in quote the gall of serpents, 529 00:28:43,720 --> 00:28:46,320 Speaker 1: and that the so ends of the Caucusus used arrow 530 00:28:46,720 --> 00:28:49,960 Speaker 1: poison so noxious that the smell alone was supposed to 531 00:28:50,000 --> 00:28:55,760 Speaker 1: injure you. And then poisonous arrows, though perhaps not snake based, 532 00:28:55,920 --> 00:28:58,080 Speaker 1: pop up in ancient China and South America as well. 533 00:28:58,120 --> 00:29:00,720 Speaker 1: We'll come back to China in a second. Um, oh, 534 00:29:00,800 --> 00:29:03,560 Speaker 1: this is a big one. Snake venom crystallizes so it 535 00:29:03,600 --> 00:29:06,960 Speaker 1: can cling and remain viable on a wooden bone and 536 00:29:07,080 --> 00:29:09,680 Speaker 1: metal points. Okay, so it wouldn't just be like dipping 537 00:29:09,720 --> 00:29:12,000 Speaker 1: it in water that would run off right, yeah, and 538 00:29:12,040 --> 00:29:14,320 Speaker 1: fly off as you send the arrow sailing like it 539 00:29:14,360 --> 00:29:18,560 Speaker 1: would have some sticking potential there um. Also, the Greeks 540 00:29:18,560 --> 00:29:22,320 Speaker 1: wrote of the deadly arrows of the Scythians coated in scythocon, 541 00:29:22,800 --> 00:29:25,440 Speaker 1: which was said to be a combination of venom in 542 00:29:25,600 --> 00:29:29,680 Speaker 1: various other infectious agents like dung and human blood. Yeah, 543 00:29:29,800 --> 00:29:32,040 Speaker 1: this comes back to something we'll see in the Chinese 544 00:29:32,040 --> 00:29:35,320 Speaker 1: example of like people potentially just taking a bunch of 545 00:29:35,320 --> 00:29:38,600 Speaker 1: things that were known or suspected to be nasty and 546 00:29:38,640 --> 00:29:42,280 Speaker 1: infectious and combining them together and then using that as 547 00:29:42,320 --> 00:29:45,520 Speaker 1: a coding for a weapon. Yeah. So the the it 548 00:29:45,640 --> 00:29:49,320 Speaker 1: might be that there were some vague concepts about biowarfare 549 00:29:49,400 --> 00:29:52,520 Speaker 1: in the ancient world or you know, before we had 550 00:29:52,520 --> 00:29:56,000 Speaker 1: a germ theory of disease, say, or modern modern theories 551 00:29:56,000 --> 00:29:59,680 Speaker 1: of toxicology and biology and chemistry. But still they would 552 00:29:59,720 --> 00:30:01,800 Speaker 1: have some vague ideas that there's a bunch of stuff 553 00:30:01,800 --> 00:30:05,120 Speaker 1: you just group under poison and those things that will 554 00:30:05,440 --> 00:30:08,560 Speaker 1: will poison you in the direct chemical sense or cause 555 00:30:08,600 --> 00:30:14,120 Speaker 1: infections exactly. Uh. Mayor also points out that several venomous 556 00:30:14,120 --> 00:30:17,080 Speaker 1: snakes would have been at the disposal of the Scythians, 557 00:30:17,600 --> 00:30:21,640 Speaker 1: so the Caucus viper, the European adder, and the sand viper, 558 00:30:22,240 --> 00:30:26,080 Speaker 1: Alexander the Great, according to his campaign historians encountered snake 559 00:30:26,160 --> 00:30:30,560 Speaker 1: venom weapons in the conquest of India. Uh, specifically in 560 00:30:31,200 --> 00:30:35,720 Speaker 1: Harmatilia in modern day Pakistan. Quote, any man who suffered 561 00:30:35,760 --> 00:30:39,520 Speaker 1: even a slight wound felt immediately numb and experienced stabbing, 562 00:30:39,560 --> 00:30:43,360 Speaker 1: pains and convulsions. The victim's skin became pale and cold, 563 00:30:43,400 --> 00:30:47,600 Speaker 1: and he vomited bile. Soon a black froth exuded from 564 00:30:47,600 --> 00:30:52,240 Speaker 1: the wound. Purplish green gang green spread rapidly, followed by death. 565 00:30:53,080 --> 00:30:56,440 Speaker 1: So the idea was what perhaps this was cobra venom, 566 00:30:56,680 --> 00:30:59,520 Speaker 1: but uh and that was long the theory, she points out, 567 00:30:59,720 --> 00:31:02,240 Speaker 1: but that the counter to that is the cobra venom 568 00:31:02,280 --> 00:31:07,320 Speaker 1: brings on a largely painless death due to respiratory paralysis, 569 00:31:07,360 --> 00:31:10,040 Speaker 1: so it's likely that it was another species of venomous 570 00:31:10,040 --> 00:31:13,479 Speaker 1: snake that was utilized there. Now. On the subject of 571 00:31:13,720 --> 00:31:16,800 Speaker 1: snake venom and Chinese weapons, Christian and I did an 572 00:31:16,840 --> 00:31:19,719 Speaker 1: episode of Stuff to Blow Your Mind years ago titled 573 00:31:19,760 --> 00:31:24,000 Speaker 1: Six Deadly Venoms, where we discussed various venoms from history 574 00:31:24,000 --> 00:31:27,440 Speaker 1: and what their biological component was, and we discussed the 575 00:31:27,520 --> 00:31:31,600 Speaker 1: Chinese poison goo and what it might have actually been 576 00:31:32,080 --> 00:31:35,760 Speaker 1: with all of the folklore and superstition removed the idea 577 00:31:35,800 --> 00:31:38,000 Speaker 1: of being that this was goog was supposed to be 578 00:31:38,040 --> 00:31:42,160 Speaker 1: a poison that was used by by um um Uh 579 00:31:42,360 --> 00:31:48,280 Speaker 1: sort of rival ethnic groups on the border, and so 580 00:31:48,840 --> 00:31:51,200 Speaker 1: it doesn't it doesn't. The the idea of goo also 581 00:31:51,240 --> 00:31:55,280 Speaker 1: has connotations of like decay or something. You know, well, 582 00:31:55,560 --> 00:31:58,320 Speaker 1: they're they're kind of two different there's it's kind of 583 00:31:58,320 --> 00:32:00,920 Speaker 1: becomes a complex topic because it's you can sort of 584 00:32:00,960 --> 00:32:04,520 Speaker 1: view it as being a poison that was utilized by 585 00:32:04,640 --> 00:32:08,160 Speaker 1: a foreign adversary, or it's kind of like an aspect 586 00:32:08,360 --> 00:32:11,680 Speaker 1: of their foreignness. It gets kind of complicated, and we 587 00:32:11,920 --> 00:32:14,960 Speaker 1: certainly give it more of a robust treatment in that episode. 588 00:32:15,000 --> 00:32:16,880 Speaker 1: But one of the main sources we turned to it 589 00:32:16,960 --> 00:32:21,680 Speaker 1: on that was the Meal and Poison Interactions on China's 590 00:32:21,680 --> 00:32:28,360 Speaker 1: Southwest Frontier by Norma Diamond publishing a edition of Ethnology 591 00:32:28,440 --> 00:32:30,120 Speaker 1: and um this was yeah, this was said to be 592 00:32:30,160 --> 00:32:32,920 Speaker 1: a poison used by the male people, one of Chinese 593 00:32:33,120 --> 00:32:35,880 Speaker 1: China's fifty five ethnic groups, mostly in the mountains of 594 00:32:35,920 --> 00:32:40,440 Speaker 1: southern China, and um the Google folklore of the Tang 595 00:32:40,520 --> 00:32:44,280 Speaker 1: dynasty from around six eighteen CE onward took a couple 596 00:32:44,320 --> 00:32:46,960 Speaker 1: of different forms. Uh. One was that it was just 597 00:32:47,000 --> 00:32:51,440 Speaker 1: a quasi magical poison created by sealing five different poisonous 598 00:32:51,440 --> 00:32:54,120 Speaker 1: creatures together in a jar and keeping it in a 599 00:32:54,240 --> 00:32:56,160 Speaker 1: dark place for a year. So you're throwing a snake, 600 00:32:56,200 --> 00:33:00,080 Speaker 1: a sinipede, the toad, the scorpion, and the lizard and 601 00:33:00,160 --> 00:33:01,720 Speaker 1: you just let them duke get out in there until 602 00:33:01,720 --> 00:33:04,760 Speaker 1: there's only one survivor, and then that survivor dies and 603 00:33:04,760 --> 00:33:07,440 Speaker 1: then when you open up the jar, bam, you've got 604 00:33:07,440 --> 00:33:12,280 Speaker 1: some poison. It's like the Doomsday of poison. Yeah. Um, 605 00:33:12,440 --> 00:33:16,080 Speaker 1: But in terms of figuring out what the actual poison 606 00:33:16,200 --> 00:33:18,600 Speaker 1: might be like, if if there's a real poison that 607 00:33:18,680 --> 00:33:22,120 Speaker 1: was utilized by by this group of people, you have 608 00:33:22,120 --> 00:33:23,840 Speaker 1: to ask, well, what what was it really? What were 609 00:33:23,880 --> 00:33:26,760 Speaker 1: they getting it where they weren't really creating a magical poison. 610 00:33:27,200 --> 00:33:30,440 Speaker 1: But if we set aside all these supernatural ideas, um, 611 00:33:30,480 --> 00:33:32,960 Speaker 1: you know, there are various theories that arise, but one 612 00:33:33,000 --> 00:33:36,040 Speaker 1: of them is that there were poisons. Uh, they were 613 00:33:36,120 --> 00:33:39,400 Speaker 1: used in hunting by the male. There is the you know, 614 00:33:39,440 --> 00:33:43,640 Speaker 1: the sap of a particular tree, but also sometimes they 615 00:33:43,640 --> 00:33:46,680 Speaker 1: would mix this sap with the snake venom and it 616 00:33:46,760 --> 00:33:50,080 Speaker 1: was widely traded in the area around n Nie. So 617 00:33:50,120 --> 00:33:53,320 Speaker 1: this is a case where it doesn't sound like they 618 00:33:53,360 --> 00:33:56,520 Speaker 1: definitely depended on snake venom, but snake venom might have 619 00:33:56,560 --> 00:33:59,640 Speaker 1: been part of the cocktail, and then we of course 620 00:33:59,680 --> 00:34:01,240 Speaker 1: have to or like to to what extent it was 621 00:34:01,280 --> 00:34:03,160 Speaker 1: an active part of the cocktail. If it was really 622 00:34:03,200 --> 00:34:07,360 Speaker 1: more about the the the herbal ingredients and the you know, 623 00:34:07,400 --> 00:34:09,680 Speaker 1: like that the tree sap that was utilized as opposed 624 00:34:09,719 --> 00:34:12,839 Speaker 1: to the strength of the the snake venom, this would 625 00:34:12,840 --> 00:34:14,680 Speaker 1: be an interesting topic to come back to because of 626 00:34:14,680 --> 00:34:19,160 Speaker 1: course one's reminded of to branch over into the amphibian 627 00:34:19,200 --> 00:34:22,600 Speaker 1: world the various poisoned dart frogs uh and and they 628 00:34:22,640 --> 00:34:26,400 Speaker 1: are high toxicity. But of course, the fact of the 629 00:34:26,440 --> 00:34:30,120 Speaker 1: matter with with with these species is that if you 630 00:34:30,160 --> 00:34:32,680 Speaker 1: go and see them like your local um, you know, 631 00:34:32,800 --> 00:34:36,200 Speaker 1: botanical garden or zoo, they're not actually gonna be poisonous 632 00:34:36,200 --> 00:34:39,520 Speaker 1: there because they don't have access to, uh, the the 633 00:34:39,600 --> 00:34:43,040 Speaker 1: vegetation that they consume to give them, uh that that 634 00:34:43,120 --> 00:34:45,359 Speaker 1: high degree of toxicity. Oh yeah, I mean a lot 635 00:34:45,400 --> 00:34:50,520 Speaker 1: of extremely poisonous or extremely venomous animals get their potency 636 00:34:50,680 --> 00:34:53,200 Speaker 1: from something in their natural ecology, often from like a 637 00:34:53,200 --> 00:34:57,319 Speaker 1: bacterium or something it's from from their their microbiome or 638 00:34:57,360 --> 00:34:59,800 Speaker 1: something else that they consume. But anyway to bring it 639 00:34:59,840 --> 00:35:05,440 Speaker 1: all act told thulsa doom venomous arrows. Uh, definitely a thing. 640 00:35:06,239 --> 00:35:10,000 Speaker 1: Shooting actual snakes at people. Uh, not a thing unless 641 00:35:10,080 --> 00:35:12,919 Speaker 1: you are a mythological figure. You know, there are many 642 00:35:12,960 --> 00:35:17,160 Speaker 1: animals mentioned in the Bible that actually we don't know 643 00:35:17,239 --> 00:35:20,239 Speaker 1: exactly how to translate them, Like modern scholars aren't sure 644 00:35:20,360 --> 00:35:23,319 Speaker 1: what this name of an animal refers to. And one 645 00:35:23,360 --> 00:35:25,680 Speaker 1: of them that's often been kind of confusing is this 646 00:35:25,760 --> 00:35:29,600 Speaker 1: animal that's mentioned called the arrow snake. Uh, so that's 647 00:35:29,600 --> 00:35:32,480 Speaker 1: how the name of it is translated, but I never 648 00:35:32,520 --> 00:35:36,120 Speaker 1: made the connection. I don't know if that means that 649 00:35:36,440 --> 00:35:38,759 Speaker 1: there's some suggestion that it's a snake that would have 650 00:35:38,760 --> 00:35:41,560 Speaker 1: had venom used in arrows. I kind of doubt it, 651 00:35:41,640 --> 00:35:44,520 Speaker 1: but that's possibility. I mean, you're also left with just 652 00:35:44,600 --> 00:35:48,120 Speaker 1: the the undeniable comparison between an arrow, which is a 653 00:35:48,239 --> 00:35:52,760 Speaker 1: very old bit of human technology, and then naturally occurring snake. 654 00:35:53,080 --> 00:35:55,000 Speaker 1: Like the snake can be stretched out and it looks 655 00:35:55,040 --> 00:35:58,640 Speaker 1: kind of like an arrow. The comparison is unavoidable, both 656 00:35:58,680 --> 00:36:01,960 Speaker 1: in understanding what it arrow is and understanding what a 657 00:36:02,000 --> 00:36:05,640 Speaker 1: snake is. They're both considered deadly, yes, even though most 658 00:36:05,640 --> 00:36:08,280 Speaker 1: snakes not deadly. We don't want to contribute to snake 659 00:36:08,320 --> 00:36:11,439 Speaker 1: panic on here. Snakes are great. You want snakes living 660 00:36:11,440 --> 00:36:13,840 Speaker 1: around your house, You want them, And in fact, I 661 00:36:13,880 --> 00:36:15,719 Speaker 1: would love to come back to that. I've already sort 662 00:36:15,719 --> 00:36:18,120 Speaker 1: of planted the seeds. We'll see, but I'm I'm thinking 663 00:36:18,120 --> 00:36:21,600 Speaker 1: about having a guest come back on the show and 664 00:36:21,680 --> 00:36:25,640 Speaker 1: discuss the importance of snakes in our our local habitats. 665 00:36:26,040 --> 00:36:27,680 Speaker 1: I am so on board for that. I want to 666 00:36:27,719 --> 00:36:31,000 Speaker 1: do whatever we can to fight reptile hate. Al Right, Well, 667 00:36:31,000 --> 00:36:32,640 Speaker 1: on that note, we're gonna take one more break, and 668 00:36:32,640 --> 00:36:36,880 Speaker 1: when we come back, we will discuss one more aspect 669 00:36:37,040 --> 00:36:41,200 Speaker 1: of Falsa Doom's cult and how it compares to the 670 00:36:41,280 --> 00:36:48,320 Speaker 1: natural world. Thank alright, we're back. So clearly, the best 671 00:36:48,400 --> 00:36:51,000 Speaker 1: thing about the Cone of the Barbarian movie, as we've 672 00:36:51,040 --> 00:36:53,680 Speaker 1: discussed before, is James Earl Jones and the role of 673 00:36:53,719 --> 00:36:56,440 Speaker 1: Fulsa Doom. But but he does one thing in the 674 00:36:56,480 --> 00:36:58,759 Speaker 1: movie that we haven't gotten to yet. I don't think 675 00:36:58,800 --> 00:37:01,040 Speaker 1: we've mentioned, which is that he turn himself into a 676 00:37:01,040 --> 00:37:04,200 Speaker 1: giant snake. Oh, yes, he does this. He changes into 677 00:37:04,200 --> 00:37:08,399 Speaker 1: a giant snake in order to escape the vengeance of Conan. Yeah, 678 00:37:08,440 --> 00:37:11,080 Speaker 1: there's also a part where Conan just goes into a 679 00:37:11,160 --> 00:37:13,680 Speaker 1: tower and kills a giant snake for no good reason 680 00:37:13,680 --> 00:37:16,600 Speaker 1: except I guess he wanted to steal and the snake 681 00:37:16,680 --> 00:37:18,759 Speaker 1: woke up while he was stealing. Well, the snake was 682 00:37:18,800 --> 00:37:23,000 Speaker 1: a pet, that was it was it Rex or had right? 683 00:37:23,120 --> 00:37:28,480 Speaker 1: Which one? Was it by spinel a Thora secundus from 684 00:37:28,480 --> 00:37:31,880 Speaker 1: a practis guardian of the universe. Yes, so he had 685 00:37:31,960 --> 00:37:34,040 Speaker 1: raised this snake from a child he lived in the temple. 686 00:37:34,080 --> 00:37:36,160 Speaker 1: It was the pet of Thusa Doom. So, but it's 687 00:37:36,200 --> 00:37:40,560 Speaker 1: also like the security device and Conan and his compatriots 688 00:37:40,560 --> 00:37:43,719 Speaker 1: had broken into the temple to steal things. It's just 689 00:37:43,840 --> 00:37:46,360 Speaker 1: one of the many examples in the movie where you 690 00:37:46,400 --> 00:37:50,759 Speaker 1: see Conan, like uh enacting brutal violence on something where 691 00:37:50,760 --> 00:37:53,160 Speaker 1: you kind of take the other things side. It's like, 692 00:37:53,440 --> 00:37:56,000 Speaker 1: I'd kind of like to see the snake win here. Yeah, 693 00:37:56,200 --> 00:37:59,040 Speaker 1: Conan is just chopping its head off. I'm trying to 694 00:37:59,080 --> 00:38:02,480 Speaker 1: steal a gym. Wou't you leave me alone? Yeah? And 695 00:38:02,520 --> 00:38:07,360 Speaker 1: certainly Conan does succeed in mass occurring this giant, beautiful 696 00:38:07,360 --> 00:38:11,200 Speaker 1: reptile um, but also James Earl Jones can turn himself 697 00:38:11,200 --> 00:38:13,440 Speaker 1: into a massive giant snake, which appears is not the 698 00:38:13,480 --> 00:38:16,360 Speaker 1: same as the earlier snake. There's just multiple giant snakes 699 00:38:16,360 --> 00:38:17,799 Speaker 1: in the movie. Yeah, I mean that's one of the 700 00:38:18,280 --> 00:38:20,560 Speaker 1: authentically this is one of the aspects of like old 701 00:38:20,880 --> 00:38:23,279 Speaker 1: pulpe wizards is you don't know what they're capable of. 702 00:38:23,640 --> 00:38:28,880 Speaker 1: They can pull off any any number of of dark sorceries. Uh, 703 00:38:28,920 --> 00:38:30,520 Speaker 1: they have a pet snake, they can turn into a 704 00:38:30,560 --> 00:38:32,919 Speaker 1: pet snake. There they can make snakes and arrows. There's 705 00:38:32,920 --> 00:38:37,000 Speaker 1: no limit. But it leads to the the unavoidable question 706 00:38:37,520 --> 00:38:41,840 Speaker 1: like how big due terrestrial snakes get? How big have 707 00:38:41,920 --> 00:38:44,360 Speaker 1: they gotten in the past? Is there anything in the 708 00:38:44,400 --> 00:38:46,880 Speaker 1: world today as big as the snake we see in 709 00:38:46,920 --> 00:38:49,919 Speaker 1: the Temple of set And if not, was there ever 710 00:38:50,000 --> 00:38:54,080 Speaker 1: anything that big? So let's start with the present and 711 00:38:54,120 --> 00:38:57,680 Speaker 1: work our way back. So this is a topic I've 712 00:38:57,719 --> 00:39:01,480 Speaker 1: I've looked into previously, actually ended up writing an article 713 00:39:01,480 --> 00:39:04,560 Speaker 1: about this for How Stuff Works a few years back. 714 00:39:05,280 --> 00:39:08,840 Speaker 1: And when we look when we discuss the biggest snakes, 715 00:39:10,280 --> 00:39:12,520 Speaker 1: there are a couple of species that we turned to, 716 00:39:12,960 --> 00:39:14,880 Speaker 1: and in both cases we turned to the females because 717 00:39:14,880 --> 00:39:19,960 Speaker 1: they run larger. So we have the Asian reticulated python 718 00:39:20,760 --> 00:39:24,760 Speaker 1: or python reticulattice. And these tend to be the longest 719 00:39:24,800 --> 00:39:27,760 Speaker 1: snakes that you find in the natural world. The most 720 00:39:27,920 --> 00:39:32,160 Speaker 1: uh reputable record lengths are around twenty five ft or 721 00:39:32,200 --> 00:39:37,600 Speaker 1: seven point six meters. Field measurements in a survey averaged 722 00:39:37,880 --> 00:39:40,200 Speaker 1: a little under twelve feet or three point two meters 723 00:39:40,640 --> 00:39:43,799 Speaker 1: in the jungles of southern Sumatra, maxing out at just 724 00:39:43,960 --> 00:39:48,280 Speaker 1: shy of twenty ft or six point one ms um 725 00:39:48,360 --> 00:39:53,600 Speaker 1: and uh. Then in South America we have the green anaconda. Okay, 726 00:39:53,680 --> 00:39:56,840 Speaker 1: this would be of the movie Anaconda. To bring in 727 00:39:56,880 --> 00:40:01,360 Speaker 1: another another giant snake movie, another great cheesy, cheesy action movie, 728 00:40:01,520 --> 00:40:04,640 Speaker 1: the one that it ends up eating John Voyd for 729 00:40:04,719 --> 00:40:08,439 Speaker 1: a while for a while. Speaking of films I loved 730 00:40:08,440 --> 00:40:10,920 Speaker 1: when I was younger and recently went back and revisited, 731 00:40:10,920 --> 00:40:13,839 Speaker 1: Anaconda is another one. Yeah, I I love that when 732 00:40:13,840 --> 00:40:15,920 Speaker 1: I was a kid. I went back and watched it 733 00:40:15,960 --> 00:40:17,919 Speaker 1: within the past couple of years, and that is a 734 00:40:18,000 --> 00:40:21,480 Speaker 1: great cheesy creature flick. It is worth a watch now 735 00:40:21,600 --> 00:40:24,080 Speaker 1: is the creature in question the giant snake or John 736 00:40:24,120 --> 00:40:27,600 Speaker 1: Voyd because he's the villain. But John Voyd in it 737 00:40:27,760 --> 00:40:32,360 Speaker 1: is also speaking of like like actors who go whole 738 00:40:32,440 --> 00:40:37,040 Speaker 1: hog just like go over the horizon with their villain performances. Uh, 739 00:40:37,160 --> 00:40:39,440 Speaker 1: John Void's doing it in this movie. He's got this 740 00:40:39,600 --> 00:40:42,759 Speaker 1: accent that who knows what it's supposed to sound like. 741 00:40:43,120 --> 00:40:46,680 Speaker 1: He's like a he's playing like a South American Dracula 742 00:40:46,840 --> 00:40:50,080 Speaker 1: who hunts snakes. It's just amazing. I need to see 743 00:40:50,080 --> 00:40:52,680 Speaker 1: that one again. So yes, if you go to South America, 744 00:40:52,800 --> 00:40:55,239 Speaker 1: you'll get the green anaconda. And these tend to be 745 00:40:55,320 --> 00:40:59,320 Speaker 1: the more massive of the two species here. Larger females 746 00:40:59,360 --> 00:41:02,319 Speaker 1: typical rate typically reach lengths of nine ft two point 747 00:41:02,400 --> 00:41:04,480 Speaker 1: seven meters, and they way upward of two hundred pounds 748 00:41:04,560 --> 00:41:07,680 Speaker 1: or nine point seven krams. Up to twenty nine and 749 00:41:07,719 --> 00:41:12,280 Speaker 1: thirty thirty two ft lengths have been considered possible by experts. 750 00:41:12,320 --> 00:41:15,000 Speaker 1: So this tends to be when you get into arguments 751 00:41:15,000 --> 00:41:17,839 Speaker 1: about what's the largest living snake. Uh, you know you're 752 00:41:17,880 --> 00:41:20,440 Speaker 1: gonna have people that are on team articulated python. You're 753 00:41:20,440 --> 00:41:23,399 Speaker 1: gonna have people that are on team green anaconda. If 754 00:41:23,400 --> 00:41:26,279 Speaker 1: you go to a zoo or a reptile house and 755 00:41:26,320 --> 00:41:31,600 Speaker 1: you happen to see um specimens of both species, you 756 00:41:31,640 --> 00:41:33,640 Speaker 1: could probably make a case for either depending on how 757 00:41:33,760 --> 00:41:38,399 Speaker 1: large the individual is. And also in either case, they're 758 00:41:38,400 --> 00:41:42,480 Speaker 1: also wilder stories and even some photo evidence of skins 759 00:41:43,160 --> 00:41:46,640 Speaker 1: UH that suggest larger creatures. So it might be just 760 00:41:46,719 --> 00:41:50,560 Speaker 1: a reported sighting or someone said, look, here's a picture 761 00:41:50,640 --> 00:41:53,640 Speaker 1: of the skin we got from the snake. The problem 762 00:41:53,719 --> 00:41:56,759 Speaker 1: in these situations is that snake skins, once they've been 763 00:41:56,840 --> 00:41:59,399 Speaker 1: removed from the snake, may be stretched out a bit. 764 00:41:59,800 --> 00:42:02,000 Speaker 1: So not only you can stretch your story, and you 765 00:42:02,000 --> 00:42:05,719 Speaker 1: can stretch your physical evidence and it becomes harder to 766 00:42:05,840 --> 00:42:09,560 Speaker 1: lean on it um. But to just give an idea 767 00:42:09,560 --> 00:42:13,640 Speaker 1: about the about some of the crazier sightings UH. In 768 00:42:13,760 --> 00:42:19,080 Speaker 1: ninety three, Fritz w Uptograph reported seeing a fifty to 769 00:42:19,239 --> 00:42:23,040 Speaker 1: sixty ft or fifteen to eighteen meter green anaconda. And 770 00:42:23,160 --> 00:42:25,399 Speaker 1: that's one that I've seen the experts do. They really 771 00:42:25,480 --> 00:42:28,320 Speaker 1: kind of rolled their eyes at that one. But that's 772 00:42:28,360 --> 00:42:31,680 Speaker 1: so that both of these are cases where those giant snakes, 773 00:42:31,760 --> 00:42:34,000 Speaker 1: those are impressive creatures if you get to see them 774 00:42:34,360 --> 00:42:36,400 Speaker 1: at any kind of a reptile house or certainly if 775 00:42:36,400 --> 00:42:37,960 Speaker 1: you ever get to see one in the wild, like 776 00:42:38,040 --> 00:42:41,520 Speaker 1: that's that's impressive. But they're not as big as the 777 00:42:41,680 --> 00:42:43,640 Speaker 1: as the giant snake we see in Cone in the 778 00:42:43,640 --> 00:42:46,600 Speaker 1: Barbarian To find something that big, we have to go 779 00:42:46,640 --> 00:42:49,919 Speaker 1: back in time, uh, you know, not to the Hyborian age, 780 00:42:49,960 --> 00:42:51,480 Speaker 1: you know, we have we have to go well past 781 00:42:51,560 --> 00:42:53,959 Speaker 1: the time of my adventure. We have to go back 782 00:42:54,080 --> 00:42:58,400 Speaker 1: sixty million years. Uh. Specifically have to go to what 783 00:42:58,600 --> 00:43:01,600 Speaker 1: is now known as because the country of Colombia, and 784 00:43:01,640 --> 00:43:05,479 Speaker 1: we have to go to the Sera John rainforest, and 785 00:43:05,760 --> 00:43:10,960 Speaker 1: that is where we will find the Titana Boa. Titana Boa, yes, uh, 786 00:43:11,000 --> 00:43:13,960 Speaker 1: and this is uh, this is a creature that's received 787 00:43:14,000 --> 00:43:15,960 Speaker 1: a lot of press. Uh. There's been a lot of 788 00:43:16,000 --> 00:43:18,719 Speaker 1: there's some cool artwork that was created with to go 789 00:43:18,719 --> 00:43:21,360 Speaker 1: along with the studies about the Titana Boa and the 790 00:43:21,400 --> 00:43:25,719 Speaker 1: fossil evidence that that informs us about its size. But 791 00:43:26,239 --> 00:43:29,960 Speaker 1: this was an impressive serpent. This was this is kind 792 00:43:30,000 --> 00:43:33,160 Speaker 1: of a very like a hot box jungle environment. And 793 00:43:33,200 --> 00:43:36,319 Speaker 1: that's one of the reasons that, uh, this serpent could 794 00:43:36,360 --> 00:43:39,239 Speaker 1: reach such a size sixty million years ago. Uh. The 795 00:43:39,239 --> 00:43:43,680 Speaker 1: temperatures there uh probably an average yearly temperature of eighty 796 00:43:43,719 --> 00:43:46,240 Speaker 1: six to ninety three degrees fahrenheit or thirty to thirty 797 00:43:46,239 --> 00:43:50,680 Speaker 1: four degrees celsius, far hotter than modern tropical rainforest temperatures. 798 00:43:50,960 --> 00:43:55,120 Speaker 1: And and the size of this creature was impressive. University 799 00:43:55,120 --> 00:43:58,719 Speaker 1: of Florida paleontologists estimate its tip to tail link that 800 00:43:58,719 --> 00:44:02,440 Speaker 1: a whopping forty two eight or thirteen meters, and it 801 00:44:02,480 --> 00:44:04,080 Speaker 1: would have had a crushing it would have had a 802 00:44:04,080 --> 00:44:08,280 Speaker 1: crushing weight of more than a ton. Wow. So this 803 00:44:09,080 --> 00:44:14,400 Speaker 1: particular species, titanaboa, would definitely be able to stand in 804 00:44:14,520 --> 00:44:17,040 Speaker 1: for that giant snake we see in ConA, the Barbarian. 805 00:44:17,280 --> 00:44:19,560 Speaker 1: And don't you lay a finger on it? Conan, don't 806 00:44:19,600 --> 00:44:22,240 Speaker 1: you hurt the snake. It is a holy, blameless creature. 807 00:44:23,120 --> 00:44:25,600 Speaker 1: It is uh. You know, whatever your feelings are about 808 00:44:25,600 --> 00:44:28,759 Speaker 1: Fulsa Doom and his awful death cult um which grant 809 00:44:28,800 --> 00:44:31,200 Speaker 1: it is an awful death cult. You know, we can't 810 00:44:31,200 --> 00:44:35,040 Speaker 1: blame that on the snake. Why don't they look I 811 00:44:35,080 --> 00:44:39,359 Speaker 1: have a question about snake size and uh and are 812 00:44:39,360 --> 00:44:41,560 Speaker 1: supposed instincts. Now. We talked a little bit in the 813 00:44:41,640 --> 00:44:45,480 Speaker 1: last episode about the idea that there's there's an ongoing 814 00:44:45,520 --> 00:44:49,560 Speaker 1: debate about the extent to which are the common fear 815 00:44:49,719 --> 00:44:52,800 Speaker 1: of certain types of animal forms, particularly things like snakes 816 00:44:52,840 --> 00:44:57,920 Speaker 1: and spiders. Is is hardwired into human brains, it's the 817 00:44:57,960 --> 00:45:00,560 Speaker 1: thing that you're born being afraid of with out even 818 00:45:00,640 --> 00:45:04,040 Speaker 1: having having been told it exists. Or is it a 819 00:45:04,040 --> 00:45:08,160 Speaker 1: culturally conditioned fear and something we learn about from fiction 820 00:45:08,239 --> 00:45:10,319 Speaker 1: and from people around us that we're supposed to be 821 00:45:10,360 --> 00:45:14,239 Speaker 1: afraid of. And there's obviously going to be some cultural conditioning. 822 00:45:14,320 --> 00:45:17,600 Speaker 1: The question is is there something that's there before that is? 823 00:45:17,600 --> 00:45:20,200 Speaker 1: Is it there in the brain before the culture gets 824 00:45:20,280 --> 00:45:23,040 Speaker 1: to you. And there's some evidence I think that, you know, 825 00:45:23,160 --> 00:45:26,280 Speaker 1: even like babies looking at pictures of snakes get people 826 00:45:26,320 --> 00:45:28,600 Speaker 1: dilation when when they see an image of a snake. 827 00:45:29,200 --> 00:45:32,839 Speaker 1: But my question would be does that scale like does 828 00:45:32,880 --> 00:45:35,440 Speaker 1: the I mean like, once you get to a snake 829 00:45:35,480 --> 00:45:38,759 Speaker 1: of this size, it's so big it's not even really 830 00:45:38,800 --> 00:45:41,440 Speaker 1: recognizable as a snake in the way you would normally 831 00:45:41,480 --> 00:45:46,160 Speaker 1: perceive snake threats. It becomes a dragon, it becomes some 832 00:45:46,280 --> 00:45:48,719 Speaker 1: kind of completely other thing. I mean, the kind of 833 00:45:48,719 --> 00:45:50,880 Speaker 1: snakes that would be any sort of normal threat that 834 00:45:50,920 --> 00:45:54,480 Speaker 1: you might have biological conditioning to avoid would be relatively 835 00:45:54,520 --> 00:45:56,960 Speaker 1: small snakes. Their threat would be in their venom, not 836 00:45:57,080 --> 00:46:00,319 Speaker 1: in their size. But you're you're saying, like, if we 837 00:46:00,320 --> 00:46:03,520 Speaker 1: were to encounter a titana boa in the wild, would 838 00:46:03,560 --> 00:46:06,960 Speaker 1: it even register as a snake to us? Well, I 839 00:46:07,000 --> 00:46:09,920 Speaker 1: think on on one level, you know, yeah, it wouldn't 840 00:46:10,000 --> 00:46:13,759 Speaker 1: have to. Like, I think there is something, there's that 841 00:46:13,840 --> 00:46:17,920 Speaker 1: kind of magical moment, like a darkly magical moment, whenever 842 00:46:18,080 --> 00:46:22,760 Speaker 1: you perceive a predator in the wild, like like, not 843 00:46:22,760 --> 00:46:26,200 Speaker 1: not not just any predator, but a creature that that 844 00:46:26,800 --> 00:46:30,920 Speaker 1: could conceivably prey upon a human um at least, you know, 845 00:46:30,920 --> 00:46:34,520 Speaker 1: a weakened human. Uh, it seems to it feels like 846 00:46:34,520 --> 00:46:37,160 Speaker 1: it sets off different alarms in your brain, you know, 847 00:46:37,480 --> 00:46:39,600 Speaker 1: like when you lock eyes with that lion when you're 848 00:46:39,719 --> 00:46:41,799 Speaker 1: I've certainly been in this situation when you're the first 849 00:46:41,840 --> 00:46:46,640 Speaker 1: person to the zoo and and the lion sees you, 850 00:46:47,080 --> 00:46:49,200 Speaker 1: and you lock eyes with a lion, or perhaps the 851 00:46:49,239 --> 00:46:53,120 Speaker 1: lion looks at the small child that's traveling with you, um, 852 00:46:53,160 --> 00:46:55,560 Speaker 1: and you realize, oh, I would you know if if 853 00:46:55,719 --> 00:46:58,680 Speaker 1: if not for this glass wall, if not for for 854 00:46:58,800 --> 00:47:02,560 Speaker 1: the artificial as acts of this encounter, Um, I would 855 00:47:02,560 --> 00:47:04,839 Speaker 1: be the one fleeing. Now, I would be the one, 856 00:47:05,080 --> 00:47:07,760 Speaker 1: you know, at least backing away, if not running in tearror. 857 00:47:08,560 --> 00:47:11,839 Speaker 1: Uh So I feel like that would certainly kick in 858 00:47:12,320 --> 00:47:14,440 Speaker 1: if you were to encounter the Titana bo. Yeah. I 859 00:47:14,480 --> 00:47:17,120 Speaker 1: guess I'm not saying people wouldn't be afraid of it 860 00:47:17,440 --> 00:47:19,839 Speaker 1: with good reason. I would. I think they wouldn't say 861 00:47:19,840 --> 00:47:22,399 Speaker 1: eke is the is the difference. They wouldn't say, eke 862 00:47:22,440 --> 00:47:25,560 Speaker 1: a snake. They would say, oh my god, a snake. 863 00:47:27,520 --> 00:47:29,920 Speaker 1: But I guess humans in the Titana bow never existed 864 00:47:29,960 --> 00:47:31,920 Speaker 1: at the same time, so there'll be no reason to 865 00:47:31,960 --> 00:47:34,880 Speaker 1: have this kind of conditioned fear. Yeah. I mean the 866 00:47:34,920 --> 00:47:37,640 Speaker 1: closest would be, you know, any degree of conditioning that 867 00:47:37,760 --> 00:47:40,560 Speaker 1: might come from being around um. You know green anicon 868 00:47:40,680 --> 00:47:43,319 Speaker 1: is in reticulated pythons. But that's a different that's a 869 00:47:43,320 --> 00:47:46,800 Speaker 1: different level of It's totally not the same thing as 870 00:47:46,840 --> 00:47:50,520 Speaker 1: the danger of a venomous snake, where I could conceivably accidentally, 871 00:47:51,040 --> 00:47:55,040 Speaker 1: um wind up bitten by the snake. But I think 872 00:47:55,080 --> 00:47:57,240 Speaker 1: also a lot of the danger there with the venomous 873 00:47:57,239 --> 00:48:00,680 Speaker 1: snakes that it has been hypothesized if we have some 874 00:48:00,760 --> 00:48:04,640 Speaker 1: kind of hardwired instinctual reaction to snakes. It was mainly 875 00:48:04,680 --> 00:48:07,960 Speaker 1: about children, right, that there would be small children would 876 00:48:08,000 --> 00:48:09,960 Speaker 1: be vulnerable to them, right, And of course that's going 877 00:48:10,000 --> 00:48:13,320 Speaker 1: to be the case with a lot of predators in general. 878 00:48:13,680 --> 00:48:16,400 Speaker 1: You know, the the wild cat that is not a 879 00:48:16,520 --> 00:48:18,880 Speaker 1: danger to an adult human could be a danger to 880 00:48:19,320 --> 00:48:21,719 Speaker 1: a small child. I mean, definitely that's the case, even 881 00:48:21,760 --> 00:48:25,960 Speaker 1: with modern day crocodilians. Oh but they're also they're definitely 882 00:48:26,000 --> 00:48:29,520 Speaker 1: crocodilians that are a danger to adults. Yes, yes, but 883 00:48:29,520 --> 00:48:31,480 Speaker 1: but but even you know, more so so to a 884 00:48:31,840 --> 00:48:34,680 Speaker 1: diminutive human. Yeah. Well, I'd just like to wrap up 885 00:48:34,719 --> 00:48:37,319 Speaker 1: today by saying I'm on thulsa doom side. I would 886 00:48:37,400 --> 00:48:40,280 Speaker 1: join his cult. I would take his side against Conan 887 00:48:40,360 --> 00:48:43,920 Speaker 1: and his evil friends. And uh yeah, there's where my 888 00:48:43,960 --> 00:48:46,680 Speaker 1: loyalty is. Okay, even even though, just to be clear, 889 00:48:46,760 --> 00:48:51,040 Speaker 1: they do practice cannibalism. It's firmly established, you know, big 890 00:48:51,160 --> 00:48:55,080 Speaker 1: cannib annibalism here and there. To hang out with spin 891 00:48:55,120 --> 00:48:58,440 Speaker 1: only thorson, you know, yeah, they don't seem to be 892 00:48:58,440 --> 00:49:00,640 Speaker 1: a certain amount of just hanging out and chill. Uh. 893 00:49:00,680 --> 00:49:04,680 Speaker 1: In the temple set flesh is stronger than steel. That's right, 894 00:49:04,719 --> 00:49:07,520 Speaker 1: that's what he tells us. All right, So there you 895 00:49:07,560 --> 00:49:10,320 Speaker 1: have it. Um Again, we set out to do one episode. 896 00:49:10,320 --> 00:49:12,200 Speaker 1: We had to break this one into two. But I 897 00:49:12,200 --> 00:49:14,680 Speaker 1: think it was worthwhile because we got to explore a 898 00:49:14,719 --> 00:49:17,120 Speaker 1: few things that I don't think we would have necessarily 899 00:49:17,360 --> 00:49:19,480 Speaker 1: have recovered on the show had we not been prompted 900 00:49:19,480 --> 00:49:23,000 Speaker 1: by Fulsa Doom's teachings. Likewise, we get to highlight some 901 00:49:23,080 --> 00:49:25,200 Speaker 1: areas we might come back to in the future. Uh, 902 00:49:25,560 --> 00:49:30,080 Speaker 1: were related to the study of of serpents. Yeah, totally. 903 00:49:30,120 --> 00:49:33,359 Speaker 1: I'm not done. This is not this is not just 904 00:49:33,400 --> 00:49:36,160 Speaker 1: another snake cult. We will be the snake religion by 905 00:49:36,160 --> 00:49:40,520 Speaker 1: the time we're finished. All right. Well, Uh. In the meantime, 906 00:49:40,560 --> 00:49:42,120 Speaker 1: if you want to check out other episodes of Stuff 907 00:49:42,120 --> 00:49:43,640 Speaker 1: to Blow your Mind, you want to check out those 908 00:49:43,680 --> 00:49:46,720 Speaker 1: past movie episodes that we've done Highlander two, two thousand 909 00:49:46,719 --> 00:49:49,359 Speaker 1: and one, of Space Odyssey, The Dark Crystal. You can 910 00:49:49,360 --> 00:49:52,280 Speaker 1: find them all. It's Stuff to Blow your Mind dot com. 911 00:49:52,360 --> 00:49:54,279 Speaker 1: And if you want to support the show, the best 912 00:49:54,280 --> 00:49:56,280 Speaker 1: thing you can do is rate and review us wherever 913 00:49:56,360 --> 00:49:58,840 Speaker 1: you have the power to do so. Um, you know, 914 00:49:58,880 --> 00:50:01,120 Speaker 1: wherever you get this podcast asked give us some stars 915 00:50:01,360 --> 00:50:04,120 Speaker 1: leave a nice comment that helps us out. Also, if 916 00:50:04,120 --> 00:50:06,719 Speaker 1: you haven't checked out Invention, check out Invention. It's the 917 00:50:06,760 --> 00:50:09,480 Speaker 1: other podcast that we do. It is an invention by 918 00:50:09,520 --> 00:50:13,480 Speaker 1: invention exploration of human techno history. We've been looking at 919 00:50:13,400 --> 00:50:16,440 Speaker 1: a lot of photography and motion picture. So you know, 920 00:50:16,600 --> 00:50:19,080 Speaker 1: if you perhaps you check this episode out because you're 921 00:50:19,080 --> 00:50:21,560 Speaker 1: into films and you're like, what kind of science are 922 00:50:21,560 --> 00:50:24,560 Speaker 1: they going to squeeze out of this? Uh, this puppy well, uh, 923 00:50:24,600 --> 00:50:27,759 Speaker 1: then go check out Invention and learn about where the 924 00:50:28,239 --> 00:50:31,680 Speaker 1: technology of films came from. Huge thanks as always to 925 00:50:31,719 --> 00:50:35,680 Speaker 1: our excellent audio producers Alex Williams and Tory Harrison. If 926 00:50:35,719 --> 00:50:37,160 Speaker 1: you would like to get in touch with us with 927 00:50:37,239 --> 00:50:39,759 Speaker 1: feedback on this episode or any other to suggest a 928 00:50:39,840 --> 00:50:41,879 Speaker 1: topic for the future, just to say oh, you can 929 00:50:41,960 --> 00:50:45,160 Speaker 1: email us at contact at stuff to Blow your Mind 930 00:50:45,320 --> 00:50:56,360 Speaker 1: dot com. Stuff to Blow Your Mind is a production 931 00:50:56,400 --> 00:50:58,920 Speaker 1: of iHeart Radio's How Stuff Works. For more podcasts from 932 00:50:58,920 --> 00:51:01,880 Speaker 1: my Heart Radio, the Art radio app, Apple Podcasts, or 933 00:51:01,880 --> 00:51:03,480 Speaker 1: wherever you listen to your favorite shows.