WEBVTT - #154 - Joy Williams on going solo, her band The Civil Wars and touring Adele 0:00:01.520 --> 0:00:05.000 Welcome to Episode one four with Joy Williams. And we 0:00:05.000 --> 0:00:06.920 were talking beforehand. I was like, okay, just hit record 0:00:06.960 --> 0:00:10.360 because I don't know you. That's a good question. We 0:00:10.360 --> 0:00:12.520 were talking. You and I were talking about you said 0:00:12.520 --> 0:00:18.080 you're toward, but you're touring whenever. Right when you have kids? Yeah, 0:00:18.200 --> 0:00:20.159 right when I had Poppy, I did it was I 0:00:20.200 --> 0:00:22.119 did that in the Civil Wars somehow. It was like 0:00:22.160 --> 0:00:24.000 found out I was pregnant and like on a fifty 0:00:24.000 --> 0:00:26.520 city tour like two days in and I was like, cool, 0:00:26.600 --> 0:00:29.200 that sounds fun. So I went on the road and 0:00:29.440 --> 0:00:32.199 played gigs till I was literally nine months pregnant and 0:00:32.200 --> 0:00:34.560 played Bonaroo and then had my son like a week later. 0:00:34.720 --> 0:00:38.000 You played nine months pregnant? Yeah, I sure did. What 0:00:38.159 --> 0:00:39.800 is it like? And this was a question that I 0:00:39.800 --> 0:00:42.800 had for Carrie Underwood was that she was singing her 0:00:42.840 --> 0:00:46.599 brains out eight to nine months pregnant. And I was like, man, 0:00:46.680 --> 0:00:49.199 don doesn't make you have to pee like it makes 0:00:49.200 --> 0:00:50.680 you have to do a whole lot of things, Bobby, 0:00:50.760 --> 0:00:52.960 But and peing is one of them. But and like 0:00:53.000 --> 0:00:55.560 hyperventilating is also one of them, because you as the 0:00:55.600 --> 0:00:58.400 baby grows, it just rests on your like all your 0:00:58.520 --> 0:01:01.040 organs and it's and they moved up coinci your ribs 0:01:01.080 --> 0:01:04.880 actually expand. So it's a weird thing to be um 0:01:04.920 --> 0:01:07.720 singing that pregnant. But I was like we had just 0:01:07.720 --> 0:01:09.920 said a minute ago. Somehow I tend to make people 0:01:10.000 --> 0:01:13.399 and uh and music all the same time, So it 0:01:13.440 --> 0:01:17.559 seems to work out that way. You like having babies, Um, 0:01:17.600 --> 0:01:20.280 I like the people. I don't enjoy the pregnancies. I 0:01:20.319 --> 0:01:22.920 don't have easy ones. No, I have like the twenty 0:01:22.920 --> 0:01:26.520 four hour a day sickness, like like throw up if 0:01:26.520 --> 0:01:28.360 I stand up kind of vibes. And I was doing 0:01:28.360 --> 0:01:30.960 that on on the road with Miles he's now six 0:01:31.000 --> 0:01:33.319 and a half. And then um, I was just like 0:01:33.920 --> 0:01:37.800 laid out with Poppy, she's now five months pregnant. It 0:01:37.920 --> 0:01:41.960 was like it was brutal, but again I was like, well, 0:01:42.120 --> 0:01:44.080 surely I'll get over this at some point in time. 0:01:44.120 --> 0:01:46.440 All this nausea. We ended up going in the studio 0:01:46.480 --> 0:01:48.320 and I was three and a half four months pregnant, 0:01:48.680 --> 0:01:50.920 and I thought, you know what, this all this nausea 0:01:51.080 --> 0:01:54.480 is going to make me really really honest. So how 0:01:54.520 --> 0:01:57.160 I sang. I just sat on a stool and saying 0:01:57.160 --> 0:01:59.560 because I was like, I can't. I literally can't try. 0:01:59.760 --> 0:02:01.800 There's no need to. I just need to show up 0:02:01.840 --> 0:02:04.040 and try and tell the truth was all this music 0:02:04.080 --> 0:02:08.160 and you know, and I I was like, screw trying 0:02:08.160 --> 0:02:11.360 to be perfect, because it doesn't it doesn't really exist anyways. 0:02:11.840 --> 0:02:14.160 So I just sat there and sang and we just 0:02:14.160 --> 0:02:17.239 pressed record and it was like full performances and it 0:02:17.400 --> 0:02:20.320 just felt right that way. I think I used to 0:02:20.360 --> 0:02:21.920 be used to be like, oh, it has to be 0:02:21.960 --> 0:02:24.600 just so, but it doesn't work that way from me anymore. 0:02:24.680 --> 0:02:26.919 Life's handed me my ask too many times, you know 0:02:26.960 --> 0:02:30.320 what I mean. I'm such a big fan and until 0:02:30.360 --> 0:02:32.560 today we hadn't met. We had talked on Instagram a 0:02:32.600 --> 0:02:35.519 little bit. I think the first time that we had one, 0:02:35.560 --> 0:02:37.200 I think I was tagging your music. I'm a big 0:02:37.200 --> 0:02:40.080 fan of your music, um, Civil Wars and in the 0:02:40.080 --> 0:02:43.440 new stuff too, especially, And that was while Dancing with 0:02:43.480 --> 0:02:45.760 the Stars was happening, and we're like in your trailer, 0:02:45.840 --> 0:02:50.600 just like waiting, that's right. That's when the music started 0:02:50.639 --> 0:02:52.519 to recome out again. That's what I associate because I 0:02:52.560 --> 0:02:54.560 would listen to it. I was getting no sleep on 0:02:54.600 --> 0:02:57.760 that show, and bet you and I would play the 0:02:57.800 --> 0:03:01.320 Trouble with Wanting right, And I would play that over 0:03:01.440 --> 0:03:03.400 and over on a loop, just trying to get any 0:03:03.400 --> 0:03:06.000 sleep in my trailer because it would calm me down. 0:03:06.880 --> 0:03:10.200 So my music put you to sleep. I only listen 0:03:10.240 --> 0:03:13.840 to slow music. That's it. That's it, like all my music. 0:03:14.400 --> 0:03:16.960 I think my most played song right now for like 0:03:17.000 --> 0:03:19.800 the last two years is Everybody Hurts from r M. 0:03:19.840 --> 0:03:22.560 I've literally was just talking about that song today, like 0:03:22.639 --> 0:03:25.120 that's my tempo. Yeah, my, that's my speed too. I 0:03:25.120 --> 0:03:27.280 remember the where were you the first time you heard it? 0:03:27.560 --> 0:03:29.720 I remember seeing the video the first time, him walking 0:03:29.760 --> 0:03:32.799 across the top of the cars, and so I had 0:03:32.840 --> 0:03:35.120 to be Mike. If you look at what year that was, 0:03:35.600 --> 0:03:39.200 I'm thirty eight, so I was probably so, yeah, we're 0:03:39.240 --> 0:03:41.080 not too far away from each other age wise. And 0:03:41.120 --> 0:03:44.360 I remember going that's and I remember losing my religion 0:03:44.400 --> 0:03:46.880 and I was a fan, but I was like, this 0:03:46.920 --> 0:03:49.360 is the craziest video I've ever seen. So I remember 0:03:49.400 --> 0:03:51.960 watching it on tell of it. I don't remember where 0:03:51.960 --> 0:03:53.720 I was, but I do remember it seeing it. I 0:03:53.760 --> 0:03:56.960 remember sitting in my um. One of my best friends, 0:03:57.120 --> 0:03:59.320 her older sister, was like an R e M fan, 0:03:59.520 --> 0:04:02.840 just like freak fan and um like play just playing 0:04:02.840 --> 0:04:04.120 it over and over in her room. And I just 0:04:04.160 --> 0:04:07.680 remember laying on this like really terrible beige carpet and 0:04:07.960 --> 0:04:09.800 hearing that song and just being like, oh my god, 0:04:09.840 --> 0:04:11.440 I feel like he wrote that song for me. I 0:04:11.480 --> 0:04:13.400 still feel like that song is written for me. I know. 0:04:13.840 --> 0:04:16.200 That's where music is so good is when it it's 0:04:16.240 --> 0:04:19.520 like it's that um, it's that connective thing. It doesn't 0:04:19.520 --> 0:04:21.159 even matter how old the song is. I mean, there's 0:04:21.160 --> 0:04:23.279 so many great songs like that in the history of music. 0:04:23.360 --> 0:04:27.200 But I just, man, I love that you mentioned it today. 0:04:27.240 --> 0:04:29.880 When was it for you that you heard a song 0:04:30.040 --> 0:04:32.880 or an artist and you went, oh, they're actually speaking 0:04:33.680 --> 0:04:37.039 for me, because John Mayer was the first one to 0:04:37.040 --> 0:04:38.680 do it for me. I was going to ask you 0:04:38.720 --> 0:04:40.640 that that's what John Mary would be for you. Yeah, 0:04:40.960 --> 0:04:47.000 when I heard, um, what's the there's three or four 0:04:47.080 --> 0:04:50.880 songs from Continuum, what's the song I have downstairs? Now? 0:04:50.960 --> 0:04:55.120 My mind my mind is slept, and I have written downstairs. Yeah, 0:04:55.120 --> 0:04:57.880 stop this training. Thank you? Aren't you glad you have him? Know? 0:04:58.360 --> 0:05:00.800 What would you do without it? I have? And because 0:05:00.880 --> 0:05:04.920 John Mary's about our age and the lyric is, I'm 0:05:04.960 --> 0:05:07.320 so scared of getting older. I'm only good at being young. 0:05:07.600 --> 0:05:09.279 And the first time I heard, I was like, oh 0:05:09.320 --> 0:05:12.240 my god, that's how I feel. Like, like everything that 0:05:12.279 --> 0:05:14.520 I was doing, I was ahead of the curve doing it. 0:05:14.520 --> 0:05:16.520 But I thought, when I'm normal age, I'm not gonna 0:05:16.520 --> 0:05:18.839 be good at this anymore. I'm only good at it 0:05:18.880 --> 0:05:21.440 because I'm young. Do you think that's why you're such 0:05:21.440 --> 0:05:23.720 a like? It seems like everything you do you go 0:05:24.000 --> 0:05:26.720 so full on. It's amazing to me, like how much 0:05:26.760 --> 0:05:29.520 you're able to accomplish, and like what you are able 0:05:29.560 --> 0:05:33.119 to do, and like, have you always been wired that way? 0:05:33.240 --> 0:05:35.200 That's kind of you to say joy, but I don't. 0:05:35.279 --> 0:05:37.000 I'm not kissing your ass. I'm just saying, like you, 0:05:37.040 --> 0:05:39.400 I don't even know how you sleep, like you've actually 0:05:39.560 --> 0:05:42.120 known a lot. But I think it comes from having 0:05:42.279 --> 0:05:44.600 to survive as a kid. You know, I didn't have 0:05:44.640 --> 0:05:46.280 a mom. I have a dad. My mom was a 0:05:46.320 --> 0:05:49.040 drug addict and so I'm really young, right, yeah, and 0:05:49.360 --> 0:05:52.960 really young and she died in her forties. But I 0:05:52.960 --> 0:05:57.560 had to you know, work to eat at Yes, your hustle, 0:05:57.720 --> 0:06:00.960 that hustles like in your veins, normal and people be like, 0:06:01.000 --> 0:06:02.280 how do you do it? And I'm like, well, it's 0:06:02.560 --> 0:06:04.040 how do I not do it? Is maybe more of 0:06:04.080 --> 0:06:05.760 your question. And we were talking before you came in. 0:06:05.800 --> 0:06:07.200 You were like, man, when you're gonna slow it? And 0:06:07.200 --> 0:06:09.760 I'm like, I don't know how. Yeah, and I have 0:06:09.839 --> 0:06:12.120 to because I have a girlfriend. I'm not married. I like, 0:06:12.320 --> 0:06:16.000 I get quite lonely. That's why I listened to listen 0:06:16.040 --> 0:06:17.800 to That's why I listen to some songs that keep 0:06:17.839 --> 0:06:20.760 you company and so but I think that's what it is. Yeah, 0:06:20.800 --> 0:06:22.359 but okay, what about you? You can't talk to? The 0:06:22.400 --> 0:06:25.919 question when was the first the first either song or 0:06:26.920 --> 0:06:28.880 artists that you heard, and you went, oh, not only 0:06:28.880 --> 0:06:31.039 do I like the music, but like that actually is 0:06:31.040 --> 0:06:35.320 my voice? God? I mean I was. I grew up 0:06:35.320 --> 0:06:37.760 in a really really conservative household, so like what I 0:06:37.800 --> 0:06:41.080 was able to listen to is really really regulated, which 0:06:41.120 --> 0:06:44.880 is why when I got my driver's license, I was like, hell, yes, um, 0:06:44.920 --> 0:06:48.560 But I would say that I remember this might sound odd, 0:06:48.600 --> 0:06:50.800 but I remember it hearing Billie Holiday saying for the 0:06:50.839 --> 0:06:53.840 first time and being like, oh my god, this, this 0:06:53.960 --> 0:06:58.880 amazing soul is coming out of my speakers, Like where 0:06:58.880 --> 0:07:01.120 did this person come from, Like what is her story? 0:07:01.240 --> 0:07:04.320 How do I like? I mean, I would I would 0:07:04.320 --> 0:07:06.960 spend hours trying to emulate how she's saying, which it's 0:07:07.000 --> 0:07:10.520 almost impossible to do. And like the lilt and the 0:07:10.880 --> 0:07:13.400 like the squeak and the cracks and the breaks, was 0:07:13.440 --> 0:07:17.640 like how she sang everything. Um, it just arrested me. 0:07:17.880 --> 0:07:19.880 And I know that that's not like a super cool 0:07:20.960 --> 0:07:24.360 I mean, I I think she's cool. I think she's amazing, 0:07:24.440 --> 0:07:27.280 but like it wasn't like an age appropriate, you know 0:07:27.320 --> 0:07:29.920 what I mean. I was sixte or seventeen. It's not cool. 0:07:29.920 --> 0:07:32.600 It's really cool to be yeah, I mean, and I 0:07:32.680 --> 0:07:34.720 was like sucked into the vortex of boy bands, just 0:07:34.760 --> 0:07:37.160 like any other high school kid was too. But but 0:07:37.400 --> 0:07:39.360 like when I was home by myself, like I would 0:07:39.360 --> 0:07:41.680 put on Billie Holiday, I just felt like the ache 0:07:42.200 --> 0:07:44.200 of what she was singing, no matter if it was 0:07:44.200 --> 0:07:46.280 happy or sad, it was just like it always had 0:07:46.280 --> 0:07:49.080 this tinge of sadness and I just felt, I don't 0:07:49.120 --> 0:07:52.720 know somehow that that melancholy and telling the truth and 0:07:52.760 --> 0:07:57.320 it being like all kinds of like dysfunctional, and I 0:07:57.320 --> 0:08:00.720 mean the the like the song she's saying, they weren't Um, 0:08:00.760 --> 0:08:02.840 they weren't like always walks in the park, like she 0:08:02.920 --> 0:08:07.200 talked about really really terrible relationships and she I don't know, 0:08:07.280 --> 0:08:11.080 I just loved how ballsy she was, and then being 0:08:11.120 --> 0:08:15.600 so rebellious to sing something like strange Fruit was pretty 0:08:15.720 --> 0:08:19.760 life altering when I realized what that song was about. So, um, 0:08:19.880 --> 0:08:22.520 I don't know. I love ferocity, I love quiet rebellion, 0:08:22.680 --> 0:08:25.600 and I think that that's that's probably where where that 0:08:25.680 --> 0:08:27.680 first like hit me the first time with Billie Holiday? 0:08:27.880 --> 0:08:33.760 Where did your em come from? Where's my emo? Uh? 0:08:33.960 --> 0:08:37.400 I've kind of always been that way, but I think Okay, 0:08:37.400 --> 0:08:41.600 a black sheep of the family, um Blake, I would say, 0:08:41.760 --> 0:08:45.199 be like on the on the sort of like um 0:08:45.360 --> 0:08:48.840 astrological signs, etcetera, etcetera. If you're into that kind of stuff, 0:08:49.600 --> 0:08:52.120 I'm I am. I am, like, I'm halfway into that 0:08:52.120 --> 0:08:56.199 stuff can be halfway in I am. So I guess 0:08:57.200 --> 0:08:59.559 I think I think it's really fascinating. I'll just say that. 0:09:00.360 --> 0:09:04.080 And I'm a triple Scorpio, so like in multiple houses 0:09:04.200 --> 0:09:06.400 like my son Moon and all that stuff, I'm Scorpio. 0:09:06.520 --> 0:09:10.200 And so I guess apparently we're always we're always like 0:09:10.760 --> 0:09:13.240 going around in the dark and like lifting up every 0:09:13.480 --> 0:09:15.679 like what's underneath this rock and what's underneath this rock? 0:09:15.760 --> 0:09:17.839 So I've always kind of been that way. I don't 0:09:17.840 --> 0:09:20.800 know if it's the stars or if it's just um 0:09:20.920 --> 0:09:23.960 the way I was raised to I always I was 0:09:23.960 --> 0:09:25.679 always the kid that was like kind of taking the 0:09:25.720 --> 0:09:29.240 emotional temperature of everybody in my family. So I don't know. 0:09:29.520 --> 0:09:33.040 How about you. I don't know that I'm emo. I 0:09:33.080 --> 0:09:36.040 don't think you. I mean, I'm not terribly emo, how 0:09:36.200 --> 0:09:38.199 she says while she's wearing all black, I should take 0:09:38.240 --> 0:09:40.800 it back, Oh my god. And again, I'm so drawn 0:09:40.840 --> 0:09:46.160 to your music because it does feel very emo, at 0:09:46.240 --> 0:09:50.200 least to me. Emo in what way though? Emo? And 0:09:50.320 --> 0:09:54.920 there's always just an emotion to your voice and your lyric. 0:09:55.559 --> 0:09:57.520 It doesn't always have to be I'm going to lock 0:09:57.600 --> 0:10:00.400 myself in my closet. But nope, I haven't written that 0:10:00.440 --> 0:10:03.640 song either. Yeah, yeah, that doesn't have to be the 0:10:03.640 --> 0:10:06.719 emo side of it. But your music, I don't ever 0:10:06.880 --> 0:10:08.920 listen to your music and go in your music now 0:10:09.000 --> 0:10:12.840 or your music with Civil Wars and go oh well, 0:10:12.960 --> 0:10:14.800 that's just just just a fun song for the time 0:10:14.800 --> 0:10:17.439 to pass by. That's never happened to me. But the 0:10:17.559 --> 0:10:21.360 single one of you guys, and you know even Front Porch, 0:10:21.480 --> 0:10:24.960 which is is that the last one that you put out. Yeah, 0:10:24.960 --> 0:10:26.720 it's not even out yet. It comes out, it comes 0:10:26.720 --> 0:10:31.360 out there, it's out. The song is out. Yeah, yeah, yeah, 0:10:31.679 --> 0:10:33.839 sorry I was. I was like, she's lying, and I 0:10:34.000 --> 0:10:35.880 know it's out because I love to do it all 0:10:35.920 --> 0:10:38.880 the people like Honey that is on Spotify. Yeah, no, no, no, 0:10:39.000 --> 0:10:40.880 the record. Sorry when you say front Porch, I think 0:10:40.880 --> 0:10:42.800 because it's the title track to the album. Yeah, the 0:10:42.880 --> 0:10:45.080 song front Porch is also out. Play a little bit 0:10:45.080 --> 0:10:49.200 of this and so when I hear this, there's an 0:10:49.240 --> 0:10:51.080 emotion to everything that you do. That's why I ask. 0:10:51.160 --> 0:10:53.559 I don't again, I don't ever there's not a chumba 0:10:53.559 --> 0:10:57.080 womba in the mix of your songs. I think there 0:10:57.080 --> 0:11:00.559 should just only ever be one chumbawamba. Okay enough, but 0:11:01.160 --> 0:11:04.600 U but yeah, I don't know. I mean, I love 0:11:04.960 --> 0:11:10.200 I love the art of conversation. I love sitting across 0:11:10.280 --> 0:11:12.800 the table like this and hearing stories. And I think 0:11:12.880 --> 0:11:15.240 that's what makes music so special to me, is that 0:11:15.400 --> 0:11:17.400 you get the chance to tell a story and you 0:11:17.480 --> 0:11:20.040 have to be really, really concise you know, have you 0:11:20.080 --> 0:11:22.360 put the video out for that yet? It's so good. 0:11:22.920 --> 0:11:25.520 It's like, I know I've seen it. Yeah, I I 0:11:25.600 --> 0:11:27.360 messaged you because I don't ever watch anything early. But 0:11:27.400 --> 0:11:29.280 I'm such a big fan, dude, I said, we sent it. 0:11:29.600 --> 0:11:33.360 We sent it. I'm so glad you like it. It's 0:11:33.480 --> 0:11:35.520 so good. And I don't give a crap out video. 0:11:36.920 --> 0:11:38.480 I tell my friends and like, don't waste some money 0:11:38.480 --> 0:11:40.800 on a video that's amazing. Well, this was not a waste. 0:11:40.840 --> 0:11:43.360 I'm so I'm seriously so stoked about this music video 0:11:43.400 --> 0:11:44.719 coming up. When does it come out? Because by the 0:11:44.760 --> 0:11:46.880 time people hear this and maybe out, well it's not 0:11:47.040 --> 0:11:48.880 going to be out by the time. Maybe it's it's 0:11:48.920 --> 0:11:52.439 going to be right around the time. Well people listen 0:11:52.559 --> 0:11:54.160 for years, don't Yeah, I don't know. If I tell you, 0:11:54.240 --> 0:11:56.480 we have to kill you. But February it's going to 0:11:56.520 --> 0:11:59.680 be coming out in the spring. Yeah, okay, yeah, so listen. 0:12:00.000 --> 0:12:01.800 I can't tell you that weird people will listen to 0:12:01.880 --> 0:12:04.160 this thing for years and years. These podcasts are evergreen, 0:12:04.559 --> 0:12:08.840 So so no pressure, Bobby, I'm up. You know who 0:12:08.920 --> 0:12:11.360 messaged me about that's because I I don't put a 0:12:11.400 --> 0:12:14.360 lot of songs on my Instagram maybe a couple of 0:12:14.400 --> 0:12:17.480 weeks and I put that up I think last week, 0:12:18.320 --> 0:12:23.160 UM in a clip and Buzzby message me yeah, and 0:12:23.280 --> 0:12:24.960 he was like, I love this song. And I guess 0:12:25.000 --> 0:12:28.559 Emily Shackleton, yes, who writes for him. I wrote it 0:12:28.640 --> 0:12:31.000 with you, Yeah, and Liz Rose too. We sat we 0:12:31.120 --> 0:12:33.920 literally sat in UM at Lizz's house and it's like, 0:12:33.960 --> 0:12:36.800 there's like this mov there's mob room in her house 0:12:36.880 --> 0:12:39.360 with a big window. And it was nighttime and we 0:12:39.400 --> 0:12:41.959 showed up when we drank red wine and I was 0:12:42.800 --> 0:12:44.880 I was talking to her about you know, I come 0:12:44.920 --> 0:12:48.000 back from Venice Beach after making the record Venus, which 0:12:48.040 --> 0:12:49.640 is the one before this, and it was totally like 0:12:49.720 --> 0:12:52.280 a sonic experiment for me. I just had to get 0:12:52.280 --> 0:12:55.240 out of Nashville, had to get a way to clear 0:12:55.320 --> 0:12:57.520 my head and get out of town after the Civil 0:12:57.559 --> 0:13:00.480 Wars imploded and um, and plus my dad was passing 0:13:00.520 --> 0:13:02.400 away from cancer and at the time, and so I 0:13:02.440 --> 0:13:04.959 wanted to be closer on the West coast where he was. 0:13:05.240 --> 0:13:06.679 So I was like, well, move to l A and 0:13:06.760 --> 0:13:10.480 do that. UM. But after my dad passed away, it 0:13:10.559 --> 0:13:11.880 was kind of and I made the record. I was 0:13:11.960 --> 0:13:13.480 kind of like, I just want to go home, and 0:13:13.559 --> 0:13:15.960 it was weird. I'd never talked about Nashville as if 0:13:16.000 --> 0:13:18.040 it was home. That had always just been like I 0:13:18.120 --> 0:13:21.480 grew up here in California. But something changed when my 0:13:21.559 --> 0:13:23.240 dad passed, and I just was like I miss my 0:13:23.320 --> 0:13:24.959 I missed my people, and I missed my house. And 0:13:25.760 --> 0:13:29.080 so we came back and I started writing slowly but surely, 0:13:29.360 --> 0:13:33.600 you know, And when Liz and Emily were available to write, 0:13:33.760 --> 0:13:35.360 we sat in that room and I just said, you know, 0:13:35.440 --> 0:13:36.800 what I feel like in my life right now, what 0:13:36.880 --> 0:13:40.840 I'm what I've been going through is that, um, I'm 0:13:40.880 --> 0:13:43.959 really starting to understand that the simple things in life 0:13:44.000 --> 0:13:46.559 are sometimes the most beautiful ones. And I've spent so 0:13:46.720 --> 0:13:48.679 much of my life like looking ahead to whatever was 0:13:48.760 --> 0:13:50.520 next and then what's after that and what's after that? 0:13:51.040 --> 0:13:53.600 And I said, I really feel like what I'm learning 0:13:53.760 --> 0:13:57.880 is to like enjoy just simply where I am. And 0:13:58.880 --> 0:14:00.760 and that's like a bub in the you know, in 0:14:00.840 --> 0:14:02.880 the SuDS while I'm doing the dishes that has a 0:14:03.000 --> 0:14:05.920 rainbow in it, or like you know, like the the 0:14:06.280 --> 0:14:08.640 like hurricane that my house looks like because my kids 0:14:08.679 --> 0:14:11.840 have been playing and stuff like that, and and I said, 0:14:11.880 --> 0:14:14.080 so I think there's a simplification that I really feel 0:14:14.080 --> 0:14:15.880 like it's happening not only for me in my life, 0:14:15.920 --> 0:14:17.599 but I want I want to go back to a 0:14:17.679 --> 0:14:20.760 simpler sound than I did Venus. And I said, and 0:14:20.840 --> 0:14:22.480 I've been, you know, been talking about like, if I 0:14:22.560 --> 0:14:24.200 can't play it on the front porch, it's probably not 0:14:24.360 --> 0:14:27.400 for me. And Liz in her like salty voice, was 0:14:27.480 --> 0:14:29.640 just like, well, have you've written a song called front Porch? 0:14:29.800 --> 0:14:32.640 I was like no, And then it just flowed out. 0:14:32.840 --> 0:14:35.880 It was so easy to write. And those are like 0:14:36.440 --> 0:14:38.560 that you sometimes you have to wrestle the bear, but 0:14:38.800 --> 0:14:41.200 that one, it was just it just kind of flowed 0:14:41.280 --> 0:14:46.720 right out. Yeah, play a little bit more of that fun, 0:14:47.680 --> 0:14:53.640 come on back to the portch this new project. If 0:14:53.720 --> 0:14:57.560 three songs out, yes, I'll play one more. This is Canary. 0:15:01.200 --> 0:15:03.520 I mean these songs. I've played these songs so many times. 0:15:03.880 --> 0:15:08.160 I how do you kidding they're are? Because I keep 0:15:08.160 --> 0:15:12.000 about fifteen songs on my current playlist and I'll rotate 0:15:12.080 --> 0:15:14.080 them in an outlet, all three of these. But it's 0:15:14.160 --> 0:15:17.240 just like you you are my style of music. Well, thanks, 0:15:17.520 --> 0:15:21.520 like sing it slow, It's good well, it's like I 0:15:21.600 --> 0:15:23.600 think it's fun too. It's it's like it's like the 0:15:23.680 --> 0:15:26.200 French way, you know, it's like how do you how 0:15:26.240 --> 0:15:28.960 do you take a few things and like and really 0:15:29.040 --> 0:15:32.080 make it sing? And you know, I'm not I like 0:15:32.200 --> 0:15:34.200 listening to music that has like a ton of elements 0:15:34.240 --> 0:15:36.720 to it, but that's just the more the more stuff 0:15:36.800 --> 0:15:38.960 I add to the music I'm making, I feel like 0:15:39.000 --> 0:15:42.680 the less it means something at least to me where 0:15:42.760 --> 0:15:45.840 my voice somehow it just changes. So I don't know, 0:15:45.960 --> 0:15:47.520 it was I was just kind of like, all right, 0:15:47.640 --> 0:15:51.920 what happens if I just remove almost everything except like 0:15:52.120 --> 0:15:54.760 really really what's necessary and what's there? So it's it's 0:15:54.800 --> 0:15:57.440 like it's it's not just a singer songwriter record and 0:15:57.480 --> 0:15:59.600 that it's like just a guitar and vocal. You know, 0:15:59.760 --> 0:16:02.640 we have a lot of instrumentation, but the whole process 0:16:02.680 --> 0:16:04.600 in the in the time in studio with Kenneth Patt 0:16:04.640 --> 0:16:07.760 and Gale who produced it with me, Um, you know, 0:16:07.920 --> 0:16:10.960 I was, I was like, my requirement for all these 0:16:10.960 --> 0:16:14.200 players is that they be empathetic players, because like I 0:16:14.360 --> 0:16:16.640 just needs to be like smatterings. It doesn't need to 0:16:16.680 --> 0:16:19.800 be like just blazing up a track, and it was 0:16:19.920 --> 0:16:23.640 really fun in studio making the music. It was like 0:16:23.760 --> 0:16:26.440 I've never laughed harder. And we recorded fifteen songs in 0:16:26.520 --> 0:16:29.359 five days and it was like the most effortless experience, 0:16:29.800 --> 0:16:31.480 and it was it was just it was just so 0:16:31.600 --> 0:16:34.240 much fun. I'm talking a lot. I must you know 0:16:34.320 --> 0:16:36.320 what this is? What this is for? Oh? Yeah, right, 0:16:36.560 --> 0:16:38.680 this is this is what you get paid to do. 0:16:38.960 --> 0:16:41.200 You you mentioned your dad. Was he a pastor? He 0:16:41.440 --> 0:16:45.720 was what what denomination was it? He well, it's kind 0:16:45.720 --> 0:16:48.440 of an interesting thing, like he'd probably have been like 0:16:48.720 --> 0:16:53.600 under the moniker of like Presbyterian, but he he was ordained, 0:16:53.720 --> 0:16:56.560 so he would joke that he could marry and bury people. Um. 0:16:56.920 --> 0:16:58.960 But what he did was he actually he worked on 0:16:59.040 --> 0:17:01.960 Capitol Hill and then worked for IBM, and then got 0:17:02.080 --> 0:17:09.400 really disenchanted like with everything about all of that. Yeah. Yeah, 0:17:09.720 --> 0:17:12.200 he was a good human, Yeah, and he was just 0:17:12.320 --> 0:17:14.000 like I don't I don't want to do this anymore. 0:17:14.119 --> 0:17:16.280 And so what he ended up doing was he'd already 0:17:16.320 --> 0:17:18.680 had his ordination like a long time ago. So what 0:17:18.800 --> 0:17:21.200 he wind up doing was being the executive director of 0:17:21.240 --> 0:17:25.159 like a bunch of Christian retreat centers. So it was 0:17:25.400 --> 0:17:27.679 it was an interesting thing like grow I grew up 0:17:27.720 --> 0:17:30.320 in Santa Cruz, I was. I lived a couple other places, 0:17:30.440 --> 0:17:32.399 like in the Midwest and the East Coast and then 0:17:33.000 --> 0:17:35.280 but out to Santa Cruz before I was ten, And 0:17:35.880 --> 0:17:38.600 it is always like the weirdest paradox. I grew up 0:17:38.640 --> 0:17:43.240 in this like like faith based kind of retreat center, 0:17:43.520 --> 0:17:45.639 like in the middle of Santa Cruz County, which is 0:17:45.720 --> 0:17:49.240 just like like fly that freak flag, like like the 0:17:49.359 --> 0:17:52.280 smell of weed permeating every part, like tied all over 0:17:52.359 --> 0:17:54.159 the place. And I don't know, I feel like that 0:17:54.320 --> 0:17:57.480 was a really um fun way to grow up, but 0:17:57.560 --> 0:18:00.320 it was also kind of confusing at times. But um, 0:18:00.800 --> 0:18:04.119 but yeah, so my dad was my dad, Like uh, 0:18:04.680 --> 0:18:06.359 I didn't have a church that he was like the 0:18:06.400 --> 0:18:08.480 head of, but he he was in charge of like 0:18:08.960 --> 0:18:12.800 a hundred plus employees like at this conference and retreat center. 0:18:12.960 --> 0:18:15.200 Did you feel like a pastor of kid A thousand 0:18:15.359 --> 0:18:20.320 percent A thousand percent kid, Yeah, there's a pressure. And 0:18:20.320 --> 0:18:22.359 I had friends that were the preacher's daughters, your sons. 0:18:22.440 --> 0:18:25.520 Was that did you feel that? Yeah, I'm nodding on 0:18:25.600 --> 0:18:28.720 a podcast, Joy say yes, Um, yeah, I totally did. 0:18:29.080 --> 0:18:31.600 I mean it was it was sort of like, hey, 0:18:31.680 --> 0:18:36.000 everybody's watching, like like, don't suck this up, you know. 0:18:36.200 --> 0:18:39.119 And and I I think for a long time I 0:18:39.200 --> 0:18:41.199 kind of went by that whole like gold Star Moniker 0:18:41.320 --> 0:18:43.040 of like I will show you how great I can be. 0:18:43.320 --> 0:18:47.080 And you know, I think life has a funny way 0:18:47.320 --> 0:18:50.240 of of making you like check that at the door 0:18:50.880 --> 0:18:53.000 and um, and I think the Civil Wars was one 0:18:53.040 --> 0:18:55.560 of those one of those moments um for me too 0:18:55.680 --> 0:18:58.239 of just like, well, that didn't go nearly the way 0:18:58.320 --> 0:19:01.399 that I thought it was going to. But um, but 0:19:01.520 --> 0:19:03.399 you know what, I don't know, the more I go 0:19:03.560 --> 0:19:05.840 in life, the more I go, you know what, you 0:19:05.880 --> 0:19:08.840 can get hard and bitter about all that stuff. Um, 0:19:09.000 --> 0:19:10.840 when things don't go your way or when you lose, 0:19:11.520 --> 0:19:13.920 but or you can it can make you kinder. And 0:19:14.240 --> 0:19:17.520 that's that's what I'm that's at least what I want 0:19:17.600 --> 0:19:20.080 to hope that I can become more like no matter 0:19:20.119 --> 0:19:23.120 what happens to me, I feel like in the same 0:19:24.000 --> 0:19:25.480 you know kind of world that you speak of. It 0:19:25.760 --> 0:19:29.960