Speaker 1: Please put your hands together for the bec do cast
Speaker 1: with your house Caitlin Darante and Jamie loved cast questions
Speaker 1: asked and she's happens? Friends? Do they have individualism the
Speaker 1: patriarchy and best start changing it with the cast? Yeah,
Speaker 1: I'll go to the show that it came to you.
Speaker 1: Oh my name is Jamie. I'm Caitlin. Thank you so
Speaker 1: much for being here the show man. This is the
Speaker 1: first night of our tour. We're so excited to be here.
Speaker 1: We're which where to begin? Well, this is We're in
Speaker 1: my home state of Pennsylvania, Philip. Oh yeah, can we
Speaker 1: say that you can do whatever you want? Jamie? Can
Speaker 1: we say that your family's here? Oh yeah, my mom
Speaker 1: and sister here A tepid response about that there, Well,
Speaker 1: I was thinking our first live episode we ever did
Speaker 1: was in my home state of Massachusetts. Ever heard of it?
Speaker 1: And my mom positively ruined the episode by getting extremely
Speaker 1: horny for our guests. So that was one of my
Speaker 1: favorite episodes. I was permanently traumatized by it. Interesting, my
Speaker 1: mom absolutely and then I don't even know how do
Speaker 1: we can get into it? But like our guest, for
Speaker 1: a brief time, this is over a year ago was
Speaker 1: considering pursuing my mom. It's like, your mom's so nice.
Speaker 1: She im me on Facebook and she has a wild
Speaker 1: view of what should be capitalized and what shouldn't be
Speaker 1: Like he DMed me and it was like, hey, should
Speaker 1: I ask out Jamie's mom? And you said. I said,
Speaker 1: your body, your choice. See, I was hoping you would
Speaker 1: say hard no, But I gave my mom the heads
Speaker 1: up and she was like, well, let's see what he says. Uh. Sorry,
Speaker 1: I have to notice we've got people reading The friend
Speaker 1: Road drinking and a MIC's Hard, got Mike's Hard. Oh
Speaker 1: my god, wait what flavor are you rocking? Sorry, there's
Speaker 1: a mark? Are you kidding me? Oh? Thank you so much? Okay,
Speaker 1: I was waiting for you. Just wow, wow for me. Unbelievable. Guys,
Speaker 1: thank you. Uh, it's been a really long year. We
Speaker 1: all had to, you know. The hardest part of the
Speaker 1: year for everybody, of course, was weathering the MIC's hard
Speaker 1: Lemonide Deadpool two crossover. That was just absolutely difficult for
Speaker 1: us to get through because when you think about it,
Speaker 1: it really is a perfect match. Every person buying a
Speaker 1: MIC's hart Lemonade in Earnest is seeing Deadpool two multiple times. Yeah,
Speaker 1: so anyway, round of applause, who has seen the movie
Speaker 1: we're covering tonight? Waiting to exhale. Oh yeah, we love
Speaker 1: when people do homework out of curiosity. By round of applause,
Speaker 1: who is not seeing the movie? Okay, alright, alright, alright?
Speaker 1: Does anyone here think that they were coming to see
Speaker 1: an episode about Mulholland Drive? Any jazz there, colo co
Speaker 1: col uh? Well, very different episode and we can't wait
Speaker 1: to have the discussion with you. Yeah, we originally had
Speaker 1: on our ticket, Lenk that we were covering Mulholland Drive,
Speaker 1: and then we changed it and mikes are eliminated. I
Speaker 1: think we've said we've I mean, what haven't we said
Speaker 1: about it? But what is our podcast? What is it?
Speaker 1: We talk, as you know, and we talked about the
Speaker 1: portrayal of women in movies and how it's historically very bad,
Speaker 1: and we use the e Bectel test as a jumping
Speaker 1: off point to initiate a larger conversation m about women
Speaker 1: in film. Hey, you guys probably know, but for our
Speaker 1: listeners at home, who maybe this is their first episode
Speaker 1: they're tuning into. Yeah, well, let' see if they can
Speaker 1: say it. Yeah, so ready, ready, Caitlyn. Our friends are stupid.
Speaker 1: They're dumb. I don't know what to do. I thought
Speaker 1: there was smart, but I was wrong. I have a
Speaker 1: feeling that everyone said the exact right thing, but just
Speaker 1: at different paces, so you have a higher faith there.
Speaker 1: So just to recap what you all said very correctly
Speaker 1: in unison figs back to a little test requires that
Speaker 1: a movie has two named female identifying characters who speak
Speaker 1: to each other about something other than a man. Yes,
Speaker 1: for example, really quick, Hey Caitlin, Hey Jamie. I'm having
Speaker 1: a little contest with myself for tour to keep myself entertained,
Speaker 1: which is what is the worst outfit I can come
Speaker 1: up with? Uh? For? I mean, I think I'm starting
Speaker 1: up pretty strong, got period panties on and then a
Speaker 1: sheer Coachella's skirt over it, and then of course rocking
Speaker 1: the team dry Scabs merch of top right before we
Speaker 1: bring out our guests. I just wanted to take a
Speaker 1: quick uh take the temp where Philly is at on
Speaker 1: the Dry Scabs Wet Scabs debate? Are we're all familiar
Speaker 1: with what this is? If you don't know what the
Speaker 1: debate is, if beetlejuice. The character was coming. Is he
Speaker 1: coming wet scabs or is he coming dry scaps? Now,
Speaker 1: I clearly we know where I'm a ds A member,
Speaker 1: I say dry scaps. But just a quick clap it
Speaker 1: up if you're feeling if you're feeling like it's a
Speaker 1: wet scabs situation, oh physically painful, Okay, and dry scalps,
Speaker 1: this is gonna be a great chef. Uh clap, clap
Speaker 1: it up. If you're as disgusted by that conversation as
Speaker 1: I am, Caitlin, you're splitting the vote. This is why
Speaker 1: that's happened. This is why this happened. We're splitting it.
Speaker 1: A friendly Jill Stein over here. God, let's bring out
Speaker 1: our guests. Let's do it. We're so excited to have
Speaker 1: for so excited. She is the Associated Press national writer
Speaker 1: on race and ethnicity, and she's worked at the Washington
Speaker 1: Post in Los Angeles. Times give it up for Aaron
Speaker 1: Haynes Whack. Who welcome Aaron. You know, thanks for having me.
Speaker 1: It's a delight, absolute pleasure. So as we said, that
Speaker 1: movie we're talking about today is waiting to exhale. Um.
Speaker 1: Some of you have seen it, others of you are here,
Speaker 1: so totally my fault. Aitney Houston is not in Mulholland Drive.
Speaker 1: Although what have absolutely something worth considering. Um, what is
Speaker 1: your history with Waiting to Exhal? Aaron? Okay, So Waiting
Speaker 1: to Exhale came out the year that I graduated from
Speaker 1: high school, which I don't mind sharing with you guys,
Speaker 1: because Melanin, Um, yeah, And I mean these women were
Speaker 1: like obviously like total icons of like the culture at
Speaker 1: that time. I mean, Whitney Houston, Angela Bassett, Lauretta Divine, Layla, Rashawn.
Speaker 1: You know, like these were women who you thought were
Speaker 1: like your cool auntie you or like your cooler older cousin.
Speaker 1: So you just immediately loved the movie for that because
Speaker 1: these people felt immediately familiar to you. But also, I mean,
Speaker 1: Terry McMillan was such a big part of black culture
Speaker 1: at that time as an author, so you know, I
Speaker 1: think for a lot of reasons, Uh, this movie kind
Speaker 1: of immediately resonated with like black women of all ages,
Speaker 1: and it was something that rewatching it as a grown woman,
Speaker 1: I definitely have different feelings about but like at that time,
Speaker 1: at that time, story the big cast exactly, no This
Speaker 1: definitely fits into that genre, you know, kind of like, yeah,
Speaker 1: w t of a generation like Caitlin, what's your history?
Speaker 1: I hadn't seen this movie. I was familiar with the
Speaker 1: gift moment. Does everyone know what I'm talking about? Where
Speaker 1: Angela Bassett's walking away from the burning car and she
Speaker 1: does a and if you if you've ever used that gift? Yeah, exactly, yea,
Speaker 1: exactly tell me you'all alive. The context of the gift
Speaker 1: is way more satisfying. So much more satisfy. Yeah, so
Speaker 1: much more so. I hadn't seen it, but I'm very
Speaker 1: excited to talk about it same I uh, in keeping
Speaker 1: with being myself side this morning. And uh, because I
Speaker 1: have never seen a movie. If you go to her
Speaker 1: iTunes reviews, it's a common complaint. No, I I've seen
Speaker 1: scenes from this movie. You before, i'd seen the gift.
Speaker 1: I'm familiar with the gift. I had used the gift, yes,
Speaker 1: and then now I've now I feel even stronger about
Speaker 1: the gift than I did when I first started using it.
Speaker 1: You have a new appreciation for that gift. I would
Speaker 1: just used search term Angela Carr that'll get you what
Speaker 1: you and that will get you the gift, but it
Speaker 1: will not get you the context. But if you look
Speaker 1: of Angela car, the gift generally comes up. But yeah,
Speaker 1: I saw today. I've seen scenes of it over the years.
Speaker 1: It's one of my aunt's favorite movies. Shout out to
Speaker 1: your auntie, shall I do? The recap of the movie went, oh,
Speaker 1: my goodness. Uh and this will especially be helpful for
Speaker 1: the people who thought we were going to talk about waiting.
Speaker 1: So it's New Year's Eve. U. Yeah, and that's actually
Speaker 1: the beginning Aniot Yeah, circle Like Rent, I believe we're
Speaker 1: in Phoenix, Arizona, where apparently, um, a lot more black
Speaker 1: people live than I thought. That was my first thought
Speaker 1: watching that movie. I was like, whoa, it's a lot
Speaker 1: of black people living in I'm from Atlanta. I did
Speaker 1: not know Phoenix is apparently the Atlanta of the Southwest,
Speaker 1: according to this film. Didn't it was news to me.
Speaker 1: I don't know. Yeah. Absolutely. Uh. So we meet four friends,
Speaker 1: Uh Savannah Jackson, that's Whitney Houston's character, Bernardine Harris is
Speaker 1: Angela Bassett, Robin Stokes is uh Layla Howe, and Gloria
Speaker 1: Matthews is Laretta Divine. They are all holding their breath
Speaker 1: or some might say waiting to exhale. Oh, they lots
Speaker 1: of flourishes in the recap to that. I wrote one
Speaker 1: out just you know. It's in my Dog. There, there's
Speaker 1: color coding, there is always Yes, it's six pages, eight
Speaker 1: point font ye. So they're basically waiting until they find
Speaker 1: the right man, and the story centers around different relationships
Speaker 1: between men that are in their lives. So Savannah, she's
Speaker 1: moving to Whitney Houston. Yes, yes, yeah. I feel like
Speaker 1: we're going to be switching a lot back and forth
Speaker 1: between character names and actors in this one. Definitely. So
Speaker 1: the first guy in her life is Lionel. She meets
Speaker 1: him at a New Year's Eve party, one of many
Speaker 1: slow dance scenes, and she says the title to the
Speaker 1: movie sort of. I was very excited about, but acting
Speaker 1: was not. When she was known for. Can't we say
Speaker 1: that she can sing? She can sing? No, she can sing.
Speaker 1: Though her contribution to the soundtrack, which we will get
Speaker 1: too later was very important. Yes, here's what I'll say
Speaker 1: about Whitney Houston as an actress. She can sing exactly,
Speaker 1: amazing thing. I think she did a pretty good job. Yeah, okay,
Speaker 1: yea so Linel. They have sex in a really funny
Speaker 1: sex scene, but he turns out to be like a cheap,
Speaker 1: like freeloader dude, so she's like, get out of here,
Speaker 1: onto the next one. Meanwhile, we've got Bernard Dean. She
Speaker 1: is married to this guy and John. Yes, yes, So
Speaker 1: she's married to this guy named John and he leaves
Speaker 1: her and her two kids on New Year's Eve. On
Speaker 1: New Year's Eve, gasp, yes, gasp, but it was shocking.
Speaker 1: He comes in the room and she's like not feeling
Speaker 1: going to the New Year's Eve party, and he's like, hey,
Speaker 1: do you want to not go to the party, and
Speaker 1: she's like, oh thank god. He's like, because I'm going
Speaker 1: with the woman I'm leaving you for. I was like,
Speaker 1: oh my god, Happy New Year. It's like they gotta
Speaker 1: sitter in everything. And then he's like, hold on, actually,
Speaker 1: this marriage is over right insane. So then that's followed
Speaker 1: by a sequence where she takes all of his expensive
Speaker 1: things and then burns them into his car. I mean,
Speaker 1: where is her oscar? Folks, where is Angela Bassett's oscar?
Speaker 1: For this? Like, I mean, the nobody does despair and
Speaker 1: rage like Angela Bassett and you know, this needs to
Speaker 1: be Is there like an honorary oscar that can be
Speaker 1: given to her? Now, yeah, retro, we need to go back.
Speaker 1: This needs to be recognized by someone. It's crazy because
Speaker 1: a lesser actress, it would have just sounded like us,
Speaker 1: like spewing exposition, which is what she's doing. She's like
Speaker 1: I went to grad school speaking no, no, no, there
Speaker 1: were there was. I mean like she just she delivered
Speaker 1: just like one of her many like epic lines in
Speaker 1: the movie, like I was your white woman for eleven years,
Speaker 1: and I'm like, yes, burn it all, burn it all.
Speaker 1: It was amazing, It was amazing. I think I think
Speaker 1: that was the first time that I really learned what
Speaker 1: satisfaction really was, what gratification could really feel like. I
Speaker 1: felt it in that moment, even at that young age.
Speaker 1: I recognized the cigarette, Oh my god, and then lights
Speaker 1: the car on fire, and then the gift and you're
Speaker 1: just like, yes, is the best thing ever. I felt
Speaker 1: what she felt in that in that moment. And then
Speaker 1: the fire department comes intos like She's like, yes, trash,
Speaker 1: yeah I was. That fireman was so baffled, but he
Speaker 1: also looked horny like and he knew not to take
Speaker 1: it further as well. He knew. He was like all right, ma'am,
Speaker 1: all right, and he's like, I'm not going to get
Speaker 1: in the line of fire of whatever has happened. He
Speaker 1: has doors already slammed in. Your face is over. You know,
Speaker 1: he's done. Nothing's happening. He got his SAG card. Get
Speaker 1: out of there. You're done. Yes, uh so, yeah, she
Speaker 1: burns all this stuff and then she's like trying to
Speaker 1: get money from him or something. My font is really small,
Speaker 1: so I can't read. Um. Well, there's like a big divorce.
Speaker 1: Like there that yard sale, the yards where stuff for
Speaker 1: a dollar dollar. Seventeen year old meat thought, I mean
Speaker 1: I was really appreciative of the petty of the dollar
Speaker 1: yard sale. Grown asked me, is like, this was not
Speaker 1: a last financial choice. Boot. You didn't know what you
Speaker 1: were going to get in that divorce. Mean while you,
Speaker 1: I mean, you may not have a potopist Like why
Speaker 1: are you selling his stuff for a dollar? I mean
Speaker 1: that car alone, it burns everything and then sells the
Speaker 1: like skis for one dollar. Absolutely no choices. But again,
Speaker 1: this whole, this whole movie, he's about poor judgment. I
Speaker 1: recognize that now you guys, I recognize that the pettiness
Speaker 1: in this movie is very strong, but in a very
Speaker 1: satisfying way. Black Girl tragic is that like that? So
Speaker 1: then she's dealing with like the grief of this divorce
Speaker 1: for the rest of the movie. Uh. And then meanwhile,
Speaker 1: we've got Robin. I feel like she would have been
Speaker 1: an Instagram thought like in like just just based on
Speaker 1: her behavior, some of her choices. I feel like she
Speaker 1: would have been on Instagram who agrees with doing them
Speaker 1: doing the most? Yeah, okay, okay, just wondering. Her first
Speaker 1: guy is Michael, who she works with, and she is
Speaker 1: not attracted to him. She called him him a Sumarne sandwich.
Speaker 1: She fat shames him, she really did. Yeah, it's it's
Speaker 1: not okay, she came down heart in him. But also
Speaker 1: we know that she I mean, she makes it very
Speaker 1: clear she is physically repulsed by when she did. And
Speaker 1: then he undermines her work, so she fires him. So
Speaker 1: good for her. I guess what if you're bad sex,
Speaker 1: you're fired right right, But this time women are doing it.
Speaker 1: And then we meet Gloria. She is a single mother
Speaker 1: of a teenage Donald face on Hello, Shout Out to
Speaker 1: You scrubs clueless anyone. Josie and the Pussy can prebraces too,
Speaker 1: And you can hear it in the line reads true,
Speaker 1: bless his heart had a bad haircut, all of it.
Speaker 1: All that, it's a very convincing teenager. But wow, his
Speaker 1: mom was a hairdresser, Like why why did he have
Speaker 1: a bad haircut? I don't know. I'm just questions that
Speaker 1: I'm asking now. I did not He's just a rebel.
Speaker 1: He's like, my hair is gonna look like ship, I guess.
Speaker 1: And then her whole thing is she hasn't had sex
Speaker 1: in a long time, so she's extremely horny. Uh. Then
Speaker 1: a moment of silence from I'm loving I'm loving your
Speaker 1: your takeaways, your synopsies are these characters. This is hilarious.
Speaker 1: That was a very strange moment. I think it was
Speaker 1: my fault, but I don't know. So then we lost.
Speaker 1: It's time for more. Savannah's men troubles. A lot of
Speaker 1: bad wigs, a lot of bad wigs. Her next also
Speaker 1: noticed that in retrospect of bad wigs, we just want
Speaker 1: to put that out there, didn't have some good wigs.
Speaker 1: But she could sing. She kids saying. The one thing
Speaker 1: in this movie she does not do so Whendy Houston
Speaker 1: starts seeing Kenneth, who I call Mr all State because
Speaker 1: you can't you cannot look at him now without thinking
Speaker 1: about that. So true. She was not in good hands,
Speaker 1: all right, because he is married and he has a
Speaker 1: sub child and I used to date but then he
Speaker 1: got married and then an't you married when they were
Speaker 1: dating the first time? I don't know? And I thought, so, right, Yeah,
Speaker 1: that was why they couldn't work out before, because you know,
Speaker 1: the little matter of his wife and child. Uh, you
Speaker 1: know that was complicating things. Not that that bothered her
Speaker 1: a Savannah's mother in the least. Yeah, She's like, you
Speaker 1: need a man, all women. I don't want you to
Speaker 1: be alone because I can't take care of you. Yes,
Speaker 1: And that storyline concludes with her dumping him and being
Speaker 1: like I'm too good for you bye forever, and then
Speaker 1: and then calling her mom and being like, stopped telling
Speaker 1: me to get married. Click also stopped you co signing
Speaker 1: my side chick behavior like I'm gonna I'm a reform
Speaker 1: side chick now I'm leaving that life. It's like, okay, girls. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that was supposed to be one of the many moments
Speaker 1: where you're like yes, but I'm just really like it's
Speaker 1: about damn time. Like I was. I was much more
Speaker 1: disgusted with her. I was much more disgusted with this
Speaker 1: movie in general, actually rewatching it um than I was before,
Speaker 1: because I was like, oh yeah, girl, yes dumb. It's like, no,
Speaker 1: you you really should not even be in the picture.
Speaker 1: Ye get here here, Hey, Jamie, what you say? We
Speaker 1: take a real quick break and then we'll come back
Speaker 1: for more. Sounds good to me, right. Every Something rare
Speaker 1: about this movie that we don't get with movies with
Speaker 1: women and them ever, is we know what everyone's job is,
Speaker 1: which is great. However, the way they show people doing
Speaker 1: their jobs is very like, you know, it's sort of
Speaker 1: like in a sign. It's a movie where they're like
Speaker 1: chemicals right there, we see we know that Whitney Houston
Speaker 1: is a TV producer because she stands in front of screen.
Speaker 1: You don't get to actually see her producing right that.
Speaker 1: It's like, oh, well, she she is there? Uh se
Speaker 1: is that her office looking usance? It's probably probably probably
Speaker 1: she stands in front of a chart at one point
Speaker 1: and we're like, oh okay, yeah, right, could have been
Speaker 1: she could have been doing anything she could have been.
Speaker 1: And then Gloria's doing hair and we see her doing
Speaker 1: her job and we know she's good at it. Everyone
Speaker 1: else is sort of just like a, yeah, she's there,
Speaker 1: so probably it's fine. But I will say, I mean
Speaker 1: even a little bit that they did show, like to
Speaker 1: me as as a young woman, like that telegraph to
Speaker 1: me like that these west successful professional black women, right,
Speaker 1: and so like this is kind of what I envisioned
Speaker 1: like women and their Black women in their thirties being
Speaker 1: like right, except for the like not getting married part,
Speaker 1: because like I didn't really see that for my future,
Speaker 1: but like I did see, yes, these women have jobs,
Speaker 1: like they have their ship together, like they are independent whatever,
Speaker 1: you know, and so I'm thinking, yes, this is this
Speaker 1: is what this is supposed to be. Absolutely yeah, and
Speaker 1: it's like it it is so genuinely hard to find
Speaker 1: movies where you see women doing their jobs at all.
Speaker 1: Uh So this movie goes above and beyond in that
Speaker 1: regard to say, sadly, even even these crumbs, we've we've
Speaker 1: we've got a chart, We've got a chart, and that
Speaker 1: is progress that Yeah, And then Bernadine has an NBA
Speaker 1: and again speaking of grad school, didn't get to get
Speaker 1: it in the first time, but I do have a
Speaker 1: master's green screen running from Boston University. I hate to
Speaker 1: bring it up. Yes, yes, you're using that right now. Yeah,
Speaker 1: thank you. Okay, So Bernardine is the rest of I'll
Speaker 1: go through this really quickly. Her next guy is Herbert,
Speaker 1: who she like spends one night with. He's another married
Speaker 1: guy she's sleeping in. Dead to me is okay in
Speaker 1: this movie. And she's the one who burned all of
Speaker 1: her ex husband stuff for correct, so it's a little
Speaker 1: it sends mixed messages, burn and then her. The final
Speaker 1: guy is James played by Wesley Snipe. No, don't clap
Speaker 1: for him, no, because again, looking back, he was supposed
Speaker 1: to be like the one good guy in this movie
Speaker 1: you got well and that's not true. Gregory Hans too,
Speaker 1: but like he was supposed to be the good guy
Speaker 1: in the movie after like so many of these trash
Speaker 1: men and like, but he's not. He's totally not right.
Speaker 1: Like he's hitting on you and you gotta die, wife
Speaker 1: of the crib. He that was bad, No, And you're
Speaker 1: like but no, no, no, no, reject that impulse. This
Speaker 1: man is hitting on her with like feel bad for
Speaker 1: the for the dime spouse, don't feel bad for Wesley
Speaker 1: Snipes for so for context for for the Wesley Snips character.
Speaker 1: He shows up at a you know, out of nowhere,
Speaker 1: which is how all men in this movie show up.
Speaker 1: They are just suddenly in frame and taking control of
Speaker 1: the scene. It's very exciting. But he he shows up
Speaker 1: and he's talking to Angela Bassett and he is like, yeah,
Speaker 1: so crazy. My wife is dying. And she's like, oh,
Speaker 1: do you want to have sex? And he's like yeah,
Speaker 1: and then they go upstairs and he's like, just so
Speaker 1: you know, I love my dying wife. PS. She's white, right,
Speaker 1: It's like, but she's still dying. It's like, I think
Speaker 1: the more important party here is that she's dying. She's
Speaker 1: dying right now. Possibly, I don't know, and I don't
Speaker 1: care because I'm up in here, in this wholesale room
Speaker 1: with you. Let's make tonight beautiful. And so Angela Bassa
Speaker 1: and then Angela Bassa is like, Okay, so she's dying,
Speaker 1: let's but the difference in spoon while close now she
Speaker 1: will see like what do you want to do? That
Speaker 1: is true. She was gonna go along. She was gonna
Speaker 1: go go with that if he had been like all right,
Speaker 1: but then yeah, they end up spooning with all their
Speaker 1: like yeah, and we're supposed to be like, I can't
Speaker 1: while they're spooning, Oh girl is back home dying. We've
Speaker 1: got I've got a lady in Chemo and he's spooning
Speaker 1: Angela Bassett. Everyone's worse fear Romanic, and then her story ends.
Speaker 1: The divorce proceedings go through. She wins a ship ton
Speaker 1: of money and property and property, a lot of stuff.
Speaker 1: Yeah forget. Then we've got robbing her. One of her
Speaker 1: guys is Michael the Submarine Submarine my County Williamson. You know,
Speaker 1: he is an unsung hero this movie. I mean those
Speaker 1: of you who have seen it know how hilarious he
Speaker 1: was and starting to feeding because I mean, she was
Speaker 1: really trying to make that work, because that's not anybody
Speaker 1: that you want to be your boyfriend for real, Like,
Speaker 1: but she was at that point, you know, she's getting over.
Speaker 1: Michael Troy comes into the picture and it's like couldn't
Speaker 1: get worse? Yes, crack, but like let's talk about that,
Speaker 1: because let's talk about this. I mean, like she rolls
Speaker 1: up on him doing a line, and then and then,
Speaker 1: and then Robbin is on the phone with Savannah a
Speaker 1: k a. Whitney Houston having a conversation about somebody being
Speaker 1: a crackhead. Whitney Houston is trying to a girl he's
Speaker 1: a crackhead. It's like, well you would now, I mean, wow, wow, again,
Speaker 1: I totally missed that the first time around. But like,
Speaker 1: time was not kind to that Whitney Houston. It's like,
Speaker 1: crack is wag basically to Robbin, and I'm like, yes,
Speaker 1: it's hilarious. It is hilarious. She knew all the crack behavior. Girl,
Speaker 1: he saw your wallet like she knew. She was speaking
Speaker 1: from experience and we she I wonder how she was
Speaker 1: really handling those scenes, like looking back, because that that
Speaker 1: was hilarious. That was hilarious. But that wasn't even the
Speaker 1: funniest part. The funniest part was you know when he
Speaker 1: shows up drunk, but Barbara Fruit drows fruit at Layla Pishan,
Speaker 1: who throws it back with perfect aim. By the way,
Speaker 1: I wish, I wish that that had not been out
Speaker 1: of frame because I would have loved to see him
Speaker 1: get hit in the back of the hid in the orange.
Speaker 1: But leather wearing in the summertime. I mean, that was
Speaker 1: a classic scene because why did he have on that
Speaker 1: leather vest in Phoenix? Why do you even own leather
Speaker 1: in Phoenix? Like, I just I don't know. And he
Speaker 1: was picking he in theory, was picking her up because
Speaker 1: he decided he didn't ask her. He's like, you're gonna
Speaker 1: meet my mom and my sister today. I'm showing up.
Speaker 1: I'm drunk and on crack maybe possibly probably, and I'm
Speaker 1: wearing a leather vest. Get outside, just like, no, I'm good.
Speaker 1: I'm gonna stay right here on this porch. Thanks. And
Speaker 1: that is like kind of the closest we get for
Speaker 1: that character of like standing up for herself. But it's like,
Speaker 1: but that sort of just seems like a given. She
Speaker 1: stands up for herself later, but we'll get to that. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and yeah, because her story ends with her old boyfriend
Speaker 1: Russell comes back into the picture and he's all like,
Speaker 1: I don't want to leave my wife either. They're all
Speaker 1: these men are married to someone else because they're going
Speaker 1: to leave, but it's just not the right time. It's
Speaker 1: never the right time. My kid's birthday of those totally
Speaker 1: the right time for me. To come over, slide through
Speaker 1: on the late night but it's not the right time
Speaker 1: for me to leave. And then she dumps him once
Speaker 1: and for all. But she's pregnant with his baby. And
Speaker 1: again you want to cheer this moment. She's standing up
Speaker 1: for herself. He's like coming over. She's like, no, you
Speaker 1: can't come in. He's like, what you reading, Oh, childhood choices?
Speaker 1: What's that? He's like backing out the war and she's like, yeah,
Speaker 1: it's yours and I'm keeping it. Again, we can't root
Speaker 1: for the Sade chick people. We cannot root for her.
Speaker 1: Good for you, you're having a baby. You're not going
Speaker 1: to get another abortion like whatever, But like, yeah, you
Speaker 1: you were, you were the mistress. Yeah, this is not
Speaker 1: this is not I mean, yeah, I'm not feeling it.
Speaker 1: I'm not feeling a happy ending here for you. There's
Speaker 1: a lot of I mean, it just seems like sort
Speaker 1: of the movie aims to do this flip of like
Speaker 1: the three women at the beginning of the movie who
Speaker 1: were like I need a man end up not with
Speaker 1: a man. And then the one woman, Gloria who's like
Speaker 1: I'm raising my son and I'm giving to everyone, ends
Speaker 1: up with a man, So they just sort of like
Speaker 1: flipped the original intention. But in cases like that, it's like,
Speaker 1: but they're not thinking too hard about it. Angela Basset
Speaker 1: is gonna get a man just as soon as white
Speaker 1: women breast cancer there, right, because man is on the way.
Speaker 1: She has a really sinister, like big sports clock in
Speaker 1: her kitchen and I'm like, countdown to death again. There's right,
Speaker 1: because after you said that letter was like, yeah, keep
Speaker 1: me posted. Yeah, She's like, you know, I'll just here's
Speaker 1: my email, just invite me to the funeral. I'm sort
Speaker 1: of a oh my god a sub tweet too when
Speaker 1: I can. It's it's bruttle, It's brut right. And Jamie,
Speaker 1: as you mentioned, Gloria, she's the only one who ends
Speaker 1: up with the man, her neighbor Marvin, although before that
Speaker 1: she has a brief interaction with h Jon's dad, David
Speaker 1: uh who was like I used to be by but
Speaker 1: now I'm gay, which he said he changed his mind,
Speaker 1: Like oh my god. Right. But you know what though,
Speaker 1: that part was interesting too because again, like um, thinking
Speaker 1: back to like that era, you have like a lot
Speaker 1: of conversation in black culture about like the download phenomenon
Speaker 1: of black men, and so I was like, oh, this
Speaker 1: dude is supposed to like, you know, be not typical
Speaker 1: but like an exemplary of of of this phenomenon. Like
Speaker 1: she she didn't have any idea. And then like he
Speaker 1: ends up coming out to her, you know, because she's
Speaker 1: trying to keep something going, and he's like, oh, actually
Speaker 1: I should let you know this is where I'm at now,
Speaker 1: and it's like okay, and then like at the well
Speaker 1: we haven't gotten to the birthday party yet, but like
Speaker 1: you know, they're like lamenting that. Then you know the
Speaker 1: good men are gay you know, or you know unavailable.
Speaker 1: Right there, that whole scene plays very weird where but
Speaker 1: the birthday scene, well, the birthday the the weird coming
Speaker 1: out that whole scene, You're just like, I see what
Speaker 1: you're going for and I respect it. However, everything is
Speaker 1: weird there, like don't want you. They even do like
Speaker 1: he's wearing ear rings like they're sub tweeting the funk
Speaker 1: out of you, and this seen he also wig but
Speaker 1: I mean actually that's probably like his real hair, but
Speaker 1: it was cut like but it's like all this stuff
Speaker 1: and then he comes out to her in a very
Speaker 1: white guy adaptation of a story way, and he's like,
Speaker 1: I was by I changed my mind. Sorry, and she is.
Speaker 1: Her original reaction to that is, oh, if you're not
Speaker 1: attracted to me, like just tell me, and like she
Speaker 1: she was taking it personally and thought that he was
Speaker 1: just trying to get out of the situation. He's like, no,
Speaker 1: I'm gay and I'm leaving, and then he leaves in
Speaker 1: that sort of it, and then Donald Fazon's reaction to
Speaker 1: that is even, we can get into that in a moment,
Speaker 1: but it's not that. To be clear, we recognize that
Speaker 1: sexuality is fluid and maybe, but yeah, the way it's
Speaker 1: handled in this movie is like, oh, that's that's not
Speaker 1: your intention. But that's like not, that's not what you
Speaker 1: were trying. It's just it's just a mess. It was
Speaker 1: in a treat sexuality in this movie. But then she
Speaker 1: ends up with Marvin, who seems really nice. He did
Speaker 1: seem nice, I mean Gregory Hunts. He did not seem
Speaker 1: like the type of person that should have been, you know,
Speaker 1: messing over one of these ladies. And his wife is dead.
Speaker 1: His wife is definitely dead. So he's available, right, She's
Speaker 1: got and Gloria made sure she got for one one
Speaker 1: on him like right away, yeah, and then plaid him
Speaker 1: with soul food and sandwiches, you know, and tell him
Speaker 1: because women be making food, women be nurturing this. Uh.
Speaker 1: And you may have noticed that the way I framed
Speaker 1: all of these storylines was around the men, because the
Speaker 1: women do not end up on screen together that much.
Speaker 1: They're four best friends, but I think they're only on
Speaker 1: screen together for like twenty ish minutes total. That may
Speaker 1: be true. Actually, I mean they're at the club together
Speaker 1: and they're having the birthday party. Yeah, there's like that
Speaker 1: one random Gratio would have seen in them coming out
Speaker 1: of church together. That's about a ten seconds. Either. Two
Speaker 1: of them are at a carnival at one point talking
Speaker 1: about abortion. You were on a ferris wheel talking about it.
Speaker 1: That was two carnival things. About the other one where
Speaker 1: they were like drunk at that park or wherever they were,
Speaker 1: I don't know. I'm like, there is a ferris wheel scene. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's that's fun. The other one they're at an Ostrich Race.
Speaker 1: Yeah they're well, I mean again they're in Phoenix, like
Speaker 1: what are they doing? But they're at They're at an
Speaker 1: Ostrich Race. And then Angela Bassett opens the scene by
Speaker 1: saying this is boring, and then she's like, by the way,
Speaker 1: I help someone cheat on their wife last night, how
Speaker 1: do you feel about it? Such a weird scene. The
Speaker 1: most jarring part of that scene for me is saying,
Speaker 1: Austrich racing is boring because like, you been given a gift.
Speaker 1: What do you So that's pretty much the story of
Speaker 1: the movie. At the very end, it's New Year's Eve
Speaker 1: again and presumably the following year, but who knows how
Speaker 1: much time has passed? And too much it's six years
Speaker 1: later now she's pregnant. It was likely, it's true. Yeah,
Speaker 1: they're like, oh, we don't need men, and then we've
Speaker 1: got a car and friends. First of all, no again,
Speaker 1: watching this, watching this now? My first thought in that
Speaker 1: last scene, why then aren't they at Angela Bassett's house
Speaker 1: in Acapulco? Right, okay, if I'm gonna be spending New
Speaker 1: Year's with you, but it's I want to be in
Speaker 1: Acapolca because where are they there? In a lot, They're
Speaker 1: still in Phoenix. Still in Phoenix is where they are? Ps.
Speaker 1: Gloria's got a man now, I'm shocked that she ditched
Speaker 1: Marvin to be with these chicks. Donald fazas in Spain.
Speaker 1: That's a whole definitely gone the fase ons like why
Speaker 1: can't I go to Spain? And I love saying like
Speaker 1: homophobic slurs. That's his whole character. Oh and also at
Speaker 1: one point Gloria busting on him getting his dick sucked
Speaker 1: very jarring. No one Donald's phase on pre braces getting
Speaker 1: sucked off is not something anyone's ready for. It's just
Speaker 1: not I wasn't I I was. I wasn't know. I
Speaker 1: was like, I was a shocked as Gloria. It was
Speaker 1: I was like, get out of her, out of his shed?
Speaker 1: Where does he having in the I was like in
Speaker 1: the pool house? I guess. I was like, that's a
Speaker 1: very nice shed that he's getting sucked off. And I
Speaker 1: guess I don't know, as one does God, what does
Speaker 1: Phoenix like? Like? Thanks so so, Aaron. You have said
Speaker 1: that you know you grew up with this movie. Was
Speaker 1: you know, an iconic movie for you, But now, as
Speaker 1: in a all are be watching this in today's era.
Speaker 1: Tell us about how it's different for you or how
Speaker 1: just your thoughts on how black women are represented. I mean,
Speaker 1: I think it speaks to the fact that just the
Speaker 1: under representation you do, you still don't see you know,
Speaker 1: these kind of relationships really portrayed in this way on
Speaker 1: the big screen. I mean, like think about how excited
Speaker 1: people were about Girls Trip, you know, I mean, and
Speaker 1: that movie you know is coming, you know, thirty years later,
Speaker 1: so people recognize that, you know, because we don't really
Speaker 1: get this, like any kind of representation like this, and
Speaker 1: especially because these women were the stars that they were
Speaker 1: at the time, Like you really were so excited for
Speaker 1: this movie. But like in retrospect, yeah, these are not
Speaker 1: people that I really want to root for, I mean,
Speaker 1: except for Gloria. Like I did not feel myself rooting
Speaker 1: for any of them and their storylines this time around.
Speaker 1: It was just kind of like I literally am looking
Speaker 1: at each one of them like girl, get it together,
Speaker 1: like way up? No, Like like yeah, I was literally
Speaker 1: really just like yelling at the screen at multiple points
Speaker 1: because I was just like I wanted them to be
Speaker 1: making better choices. And also just I was not as
Speaker 1: willing to put as much blame on some of these
Speaker 1: men as as I would have been like when I
Speaker 1: was young, thinking oh, these are great women, like you know,
Speaker 1: what is you know, what is wrong with these men?
Speaker 1: It's like no, actually they are making poor choices, like
Speaker 1: these are not people. Yeah, you shouldn't be with with
Speaker 1: any of these dudes, but also like why do you
Speaker 1: keep picking these trash people? Right? Well, the big thing
Speaker 1: for me about this movie is I was coming and
Speaker 1: expecting it to be a movie about black female friendship,
Speaker 1: and I was like, I can't wait to like just
Speaker 1: like see them interact on screen, and then the whole
Speaker 1: movie was is totally framed. They're totally defined by like
Speaker 1: the men who they're with or who they want to
Speaker 1: be with. Every storyline is about the men in their lives,
Speaker 1: and I was like boring, right, And that's like the
Speaker 1: most frustrating thing about I mean seeing like a movie
Speaker 1: that's built around female friendship up being sort of thrown
Speaker 1: away and like this really lazy writing kind of way
Speaker 1: of like, well, they're female friends, so we can use
Speaker 1: that as a conduit to talk about how they consider
Speaker 1: the men in their lives to be like what to
Speaker 1: find absolutely like by the time you get to the birthday,
Speaker 1: like the living room birthday, seeing like that, you wish
Speaker 1: that that could have been like most of the movie
Speaker 1: because like you have like every friend that you need
Speaker 1: is in that room, right, like somebody that's gonna talk
Speaker 1: you down from bad choices, somebody that's actually maybe if
Speaker 1: you're gonna make bad choices, ready to go along with
Speaker 1: that ship, like let's go, you know, when Bernadine is
Speaker 1: drunk and ready to call and cuss John out, you
Speaker 1: know right there right now, that number, you know, and
Speaker 1: like you know that one friend that's kind of like
Speaker 1: neutral and just kind of hanging back to kind of
Speaker 1: see what happens like that is and they go through
Speaker 1: like the range of emotions like in that one night,
Speaker 1: as as girls do when they get together and open
Speaker 1: them away. Okay, I mean they're they're having a good time,
Speaker 1: they're crying, you know, they're talk it about me, but
Speaker 1: they're also just kind of talking about their lives. And
Speaker 1: it's like, yes, more of this plea And it's more
Speaker 1: fun to watch than the nine hundred scenes of one
Speaker 1: of the characters deciding to be a side check to
Speaker 1: someone else's marriage, because that is what most of the
Speaker 1: movie is, or having bassics with somebody who is single.
Speaker 1: But those scenes are really funny though. Sex scenes those
Speaker 1: are and those are like female gay scenes where like
Speaker 1: there's that scene with Michael or you see the fucking
Speaker 1: prop flop sweat on his he's character acting the ship.
Speaker 1: He's like, uh, I love sex, and you're like, oh
Speaker 1: my god, he's just he's so much I matter how
Speaker 1: things worked out for him after probably yeah, I bet
Speaker 1: he was in like he ends up at the club
Speaker 1: with another woman, a real life let's look him up, right,
Speaker 1: I feel like he has two hundred movie credit. But
Speaker 1: also I don't. I mean, that sex scene was pretty
Speaker 1: terrible too Windy Houston's face, and that is because he's
Speaker 1: making like yeah, and she's like, she's like I don't
Speaker 1: want to go to the zoo or something. She's like,
Speaker 1: I guess I'm the zookie friend. Yeah. Yeah, I do
Speaker 1: appreciate how like sex positive this movie is though. That's
Speaker 1: a line from the movie. Yeah, very sex positive because
Speaker 1: they're like at some point every character is like I'm
Speaker 1: so horny, and the other women are like yeah, and
Speaker 1: go get some like they are very supportive, never like
Speaker 1: slut shamie anything like that. Yeah. Well, with that, let's
Speaker 1: take a quick break, shall we. Let's shall I'll be
Speaker 1: right back. There's there's that scene with Gloria and the neighbor.
Speaker 1: The scene where she meets the neighbor is such a horny,
Speaker 1: so crazy, there's looking at him like a sandwich. I
Speaker 1: knew this was an adapted work, but there are some
Speaker 1: scenes where you can very much feel it because they're
Speaker 1: like having loud monologues to themselves in front of the
Speaker 1: other character. You're like, he is right there where she's
Speaker 1: walking away, and it's like after it, there's a vibe,
Speaker 1: and then she's going back home and then she's like,
Speaker 1: I hope he's not watching me walk away, and then
Speaker 1: turns around. It's like he's like he's four ft away
Speaker 1: from you, right right, sas off across lonologue. Can we
Speaker 1: talk about Bernardine's monologue as she's like throwing away and
Speaker 1: burning all of John's stuff, Yes, because she's touching on
Speaker 1: stuff like the man like his expectations of me is
Speaker 1: that I was gonna like be the background to his foreground.
Speaker 1: I mean she's talking about that. She's talking about how
Speaker 1: he didn't want the kids to go to a certain
Speaker 1: school because he didn't want the improper influence. She's talking
Speaker 1: about how she wanted to start a business but he
Speaker 1: told her. I mean yeah, she's just I mean yeah,
Speaker 1: she was airing a lot of s on her way
Speaker 1: to that garage, like with those back and forth trips,
Speaker 1: it's fully earned. Yeah, or she even like you see
Speaker 1: his organized closet, You're like, oh no, yes, things are
Speaker 1: about to be mismatched. And just how how quickly it
Speaker 1: happened too, though, I mean, because like it starts off
Speaker 1: like she's in the bed right, she's miserable, she's crying,
Speaker 1: gets up, makes a pot of coffee and hits that closet,
Speaker 1: and fifteen puts the kids on the bus in fifteen
Speaker 1: minutes later, that's it's a bonfire baby in the driveway,
Speaker 1: and you're just like and then she's on the couch
Speaker 1: watching cartoon. And then later on there's the scene where
Speaker 1: her husband has just had the kids for a weekend
Speaker 1: and he brings them back, and they got her facial
Speaker 1: expression again, Nobody does rage like Angela Bassett, Like the
Speaker 1: death stare that she has given this dude when he
Speaker 1: is dropping those kids off, and how she just immediately,
Speaker 1: just on a dime, goes from that to like being
Speaker 1: loving mom to these kids as they're coming home, and
Speaker 1: clearly they're like siding with her and love her so much,
Speaker 1: and they're just like dad is trash, all right, then
Speaker 1: I'm back, but like yeah that. But also another Angela
Speaker 1: Basset classic is when she busts up in that office
Speaker 1: when he clears out because she comes in, she's like yelling,
Speaker 1: and then the first thing she does is slap Kathleen,
Speaker 1: his mistress across I was. I felt rewarded in that moment.
Speaker 1: It was very rewarding. Where is that gift like that
Speaker 1: should be that is underused? If that is a gift
Speaker 1: that is out there, and if not, if anybody in
Speaker 1: here has those kind of skills or capabilities, please go
Speaker 1: ahead and get that going on Twitter so that I
Speaker 1: can get to see. I found that moment a little
Speaker 1: troubling because I think we talked about this on I
Speaker 1: Have as a white woman or for some other reason.
Speaker 1: That's why that's why no race completely aside. We talked
Speaker 1: about this on our Cruel Intentions episode where women who
Speaker 1: get wronged by a man by you know, them cheating them.
Speaker 1: There's a tendency because women are so generally pitted against
Speaker 1: each other in society, for the one who has cheated
Speaker 1: on to blame the other woman, and then a lot
Speaker 1: of the men kind of like get off scott free
Speaker 1: or not, they're not held as accountable. So I mean,
Speaker 1: I understand her anger and frustration, and I thought that
Speaker 1: that like went up in my head as well. But
Speaker 1: then it's like she's just as mad, if not angry
Speaker 1: at And also, I mean, this woman was she was
Speaker 1: in between her and the husband, and it seems that
Speaker 1: she has stepped out of the way. We may not
Speaker 1: even have been there. She should have just stepped to
Speaker 1: the right. I mean, like, if we're being honest, like
Speaker 1: if it had been if it would not have been me,
Speaker 1: but had it been me, I would have just I
Speaker 1: don't know, because I mean, you see the tornado coming
Speaker 1: and you just are sitting and you stand up and
Speaker 1: start to speak absolutely no, yeah, absolutely not. And then
Speaker 1: this but when she I mean god, when she finally
Speaker 1: does light into him and she doesn't hit him, but
Speaker 1: I mean her unleashing on him when he's tunging. Oh yeah,
Speaker 1: by the way, I'm thinking about coming to pick up
Speaker 1: my kids, and she's like, oh god, you guys, you
Speaker 1: guys know what she says. She's like, if you have
Speaker 1: them anywhere near that tramp bitch, and she leans into
Speaker 1: that with everything that she has. Again, wears her oscar.
Speaker 1: It was so good. It's it seems like her rage
Speaker 1: is sort of distributed equally for everyone who's wronging her.
Speaker 1: And let me be clear. Let me be clear, there
Speaker 1: are many white women who should be slapped by black women,
Speaker 1: any woman who voted for Trump. Basically, it's tricky, I mean.
Speaker 1: And that comes up again later in the Wesley Snipes
Speaker 1: scene where it's like a reveal to Angela Bassett that
Speaker 1: because he says, it's it's just like, I don't know,
Speaker 1: I'm interested in how you because it's all over the place.
Speaker 1: If he's like, I'm a civil rights slayer and it's
Speaker 1: a boy the way his catint for like a professional
Speaker 1: black women. You throw that out there and it's like,
Speaker 1: I'm sorry, I love you, I'm sorry. What what? But
Speaker 1: then they go upstairs and he's like, remember that dying
Speaker 1: wife I've told you about. She's white. And then and
Speaker 1: then Angela Bassett's like, yeah, it's it's it's weird the
Speaker 1: way they and I read that in the book. That
Speaker 1: is not how that scene goes, and that's not how
Speaker 1: that story goes in the book. The Wesley Snipes character
Speaker 1: wants to divorce his wife, who his wife and his
Speaker 1: wife he wants to dive force his dying white wife
Speaker 1: and like it wasn't working before she got sick, and
Speaker 1: then she got sick, and then he's like, well, I've gotta,
Speaker 1: for lack of a better phrase, ride this out, and
Speaker 1: so in the in the I'm so sorry, and and
Speaker 1: that's sort of I think is a more effective story
Speaker 1: choice to be like, the marriage is over, and it
Speaker 1: was over, but in this version he's like, I love
Speaker 1: her deeply and then Angela, which makes Angela Bassett's choice
Speaker 1: seem bizarre or like her being like, let's funk anyways.
Speaker 1: But I mean, clearly she was already cool with one
Speaker 1: offs with Mary Dudes. I mean we saw that, which
Speaker 1: is crazy because she's so mad at like her husband
Speaker 1: and that white woman is crazy liked her. I don't know,
Speaker 1: it's confusing, and a lot of this is I mean,
Speaker 1: I would hazard to guess adaptation issues from the book
Speaker 1: to the movie. Maybe maybe somebody whoever I'm forgetting who
Speaker 1: wrote this race. Yeah, it was the author of the book, Terry,
Speaker 1: but a guy but also a white guy, a white guy.
Speaker 1: What they ended up coming up with for the movie, though,
Speaker 1: like in some people's minds and making him more endearing
Speaker 1: because at the time, like I said, I mean, I
Speaker 1: was like, oh, this is so sad, like you know,
Speaker 1: if only they'd met, you know, in another lifetime or whatever.
Speaker 1: It's like, no, they're meeting in this lifetime and she's
Speaker 1: dying and and so step out of the Why are
Speaker 1: you even sitting down next to her order in Hennessy right,
Speaker 1: Why are you hitting on this woman as your wife
Speaker 1: actively passes away? I don't know there, but there is
Speaker 1: there is like a bell Hooks piece written just a
Speaker 1: few movies after this movie came out, and bell Hooks
Speaker 1: does not like this movie. And she she knew very much. Yeah,
Speaker 1: she but like you were saying, Aaron, before we came out,
Speaker 1: like she was a full grown you know she was.
Speaker 1: She wasn't seventeen when this And that's when, like we
Speaker 1: talked about all the time, Like the movies you see
Speaker 1: while your brain is still squishy and you're trying to
Speaker 1: understand the world using the media around you, it shapes
Speaker 1: your view of the world. Bell Hooks was formed by
Speaker 1: the time she saw that she was not having it.
Speaker 1: She was not having it, and she writes about in
Speaker 1: her piece that there was a white guy screenwriter actively
Speaker 1: involved in giving recommendations on how this should be adapted,
Speaker 1: and so stuff like the stuff that changes markedly from
Speaker 1: the book, like the Wesley Snipe stuff is like at
Speaker 1: the suggestion and push of some rando like Hollywood white
Speaker 1: guy imagine you know. Yeah, so adaptation, it's adaptations are fucked.
Speaker 1: Show me a good adaptation. Doubt doubt that's true, but
Speaker 1: doubt it was. I mean, John, but they just let
Speaker 1: John Patrick Shanley go for it. Check out John Patrick
Speaker 1: Shanley's Twitter. It's fucking weird. He posted the selfie before
Speaker 1: he goes to bed. He's like, good night. I don't know. Anyways, Anyways,
Speaker 1: this movie was a box office success. It opened a
Speaker 1: number one. Again, black women were they were ready for.
Speaker 1: This movie was a critical like mixed review. So because
Speaker 1: Angelo Bassett, but also Whitney Houston. She can sing other
Speaker 1: final thoughts or there was the other stuff you wanted
Speaker 1: to I mean, like I said, the only thing that
Speaker 1: was better than this movie for me at that time
Speaker 1: was the soundtrack, which Frankly Steel holds up right. I mean,
Speaker 1: baby Face, you know, the King of arm nineties R
Speaker 1: and B. You know, he produced it. But all of
Speaker 1: the songs were by black women, and so I mean
Speaker 1: I'm talking about obviously Whitney gets to be on the soundtrack,
Speaker 1: but I mean you had Brandy, you had a Wretha
Speaker 1: Shaka Khan TLC. I mean like and Mary J. Blige. Yes,
Speaker 1: I mean it was a soundtrack for the Ages, like
Speaker 1: for real. And I'm not going to start singing along
Speaker 1: here right now. We can if you want to, but
Speaker 1: I mean, like seriously, like not not exactly if I've done,
Speaker 1: not gonna cry karaoke before. It's a lot, it's emotional.
Speaker 1: The one thing that we didn't quite hit on was
Speaker 1: Donald Fazon's reaction to finding out his father is gay.
Speaker 1: Like it it is a weird, it is not good. Yeah, Basically,
Speaker 1: what happens is Gloria accidentally out David and she realizes
Speaker 1: that she's made a mistake. To be fair, she's shocked
Speaker 1: because she just saw Donald Fazon getting sucked off in
Speaker 1: a shed pool house. So you're right, you're right. And
Speaker 1: then his reaction is extremely bizarre because he uses a
Speaker 1: series of homophobic slurs and then says it's all the
Speaker 1: same thing, right, he doesn't totally minimize it, And then
Speaker 1: it's like, well Lisa didn't running the family. Remember when
Speaker 1: you saw me getting sucked up? Mom? I was like,
Speaker 1: why is this the way this goes? Yeah? So and
Speaker 1: then that never gets cleaned up or resolved or whatever
Speaker 1: I mean, because like that's just it. Never he just
Speaker 1: gets to go to Spain. Like that's how that ends.
Speaker 1: So the I mean, the way this movie deals with
Speaker 1: queerness is tooth thumbs down is not good. And I
Speaker 1: would argue that there's a stylist character in Gloria's salon
Speaker 1: who has queer coded because gay men can only be stylists,
Speaker 1: as we see in every movie ever. But I will
Speaker 1: I mean, like the gay black beaut you know, man
Speaker 1: who's doing hair is very real and shout out to
Speaker 1: all the ones that I've had in my life that
Speaker 1: have kept me late. Um, I appreciate them now. I mean,
Speaker 1: was he was he over the top of dramatic? Maybe?
Speaker 1: But also do I know some black man doing hair
Speaker 1: who are like absolutely absolutely so maybe I don't know
Speaker 1: if they appreciated being seen in this film or not.
Speaker 1: Obviously he's not representative all of all gay black men,
Speaker 1: you know what I mean. So it's weird because it's
Speaker 1: like seeing queer characters in this movie. Seeing queer characters
Speaker 1: in movies in a way that isn't like they're a
Speaker 1: punchline is something. It's something in the right direction, but
Speaker 1: it just doesn't quite it doesn't go there, and it
Speaker 1: doesn't fully realize this because he is like messy and
Speaker 1: he's the one who like tells Bernardine's business to like
Speaker 1: the rest of the girls. And you know, it's like
Speaker 1: it's imagined. A movie is just not perfect. Right. My
Speaker 1: last thing was I like this scene. This is just
Speaker 1: a straight thought. I like the scene where Bernadine gets
Speaker 1: mad and cuts her own hair because Gloria won't do it,
Speaker 1: baldest woman in charge. That was yes, charge holds trip. Yeah,
Speaker 1: you know when when a woman chops her hair off
Speaker 1: watch out? Yeah, I mean, and get out of the way.
Speaker 1: Get ready, she's going to war, right, yeah? No for real? Yeah,
Speaker 1: all right, I think that it does this movie pass
Speaker 1: the Bechdel test. A couple of very brief, like two
Speaker 1: line exchanges. Yeah, seventeen year old Aaron would have sit
Speaker 1: absolutely yeah, grown ass Errand says, I don't know. Well,
Speaker 1: let me let me make a case for it. Savannah
Speaker 1: at one point says nice house Bernadine. Bernadine says, you
Speaker 1: know what, you know what, Kaitlin, you are really reaching
Speaker 1: right now, you are really reaching. Okay, she responds at
Speaker 1: five dollars, you can have it. Then they talk about
Speaker 1: John for a few minutes, right, because this is a
Speaker 1: conversation that's happening as her home video footage just playing
Speaker 1: in the background. Yes, so that negates that. Next true,
Speaker 1: Robin and Gloria have a brief conversation about manicures and
Speaker 1: Robin's job because she because she's like blowing off work
Speaker 1: to maybe get a manicure to please a man. Probably
Speaker 1: Gloria was also going to charge her by the finger
Speaker 1: for that polish. So I feel like that one passes.
Speaker 1: I don't I don't know that. It's one of those
Speaker 1: movies though that, like however many things we break down,
Speaker 1: Like the subtext of the whole movie is men. So
Speaker 1: it's like it just gets harder as the longer we
Speaker 1: do this podcast, we're just like the subtext of every
Speaker 1: of the world is men. Apparently, so special passes, damn
Speaker 1: test Yeah, because yeah, I mean I was even thinking about,
Speaker 1: like remember when Savannah Coss her mom and like her
Speaker 1: mom is talking about her like financial situation. Yeah, I'm reaching.
Speaker 1: It's I mean, I think name the mom's name, first name.
Speaker 1: I don't think maybe that one. I don't think I
Speaker 1: didn't care like moms. I think it all pass on
Speaker 1: the bectal test. Mom, I don't know. I just Bernadine
Speaker 1: and her daughter, who is named Nika talk about the words. Yes,
Speaker 1: they do the word freakfically I think. I mean, I
Speaker 1: think this movie does pass the vectial test a couple
Speaker 1: of times, but I mean it's one of those things
Speaker 1: where it's like, given the fact that the marketing of
Speaker 1: this of this movie was like for women, like for
Speaker 1: black women, and this is their friendship, it should pass
Speaker 1: way more than it does. Yeah, so I mean it passes,
Speaker 1: but not as much as it or any movie with
Speaker 1: four female leads should shall be raid on our nipple scale,
Speaker 1: let's do it. So in terms of like, I love
Speaker 1: that there's a movie that's representative of four strong black
Speaker 1: women who yes, do have many lapses and judgment throughout
Speaker 1: the film, But because the movie isn't really the core
Speaker 1: of the movie isn't so much about their friendship. It's
Speaker 1: more about how these women are relating to men and
Speaker 1: having relationships with men, and even when the women are together,
Speaker 1: they're almost exclusively talking about men. So that is disappointing.
Speaker 1: And there are like kind of those brief moments of
Speaker 1: feminism where you know, Bernadine's like, I'm tired of like
Speaker 1: not being able to pursue my own thing. I have
Speaker 1: an MBA, damn it, Like I want to open a
Speaker 1: catering business. But then she spends the rest of the
Speaker 1: movie trying to have sex with married men, kind of
Speaker 1: show her focusing on her caterer. That's where I thought
Speaker 1: the story was going with her, but like that doesn't
Speaker 1: even come up because his wife is dying, Like you're
Speaker 1: shaking him down for alimony when you could be making
Speaker 1: that cater in business. Hopefully she invests that one point
Speaker 1: five million dollars in that business, so one can hope.
Speaker 1: But yeah, so representation wise, because there are so few
Speaker 1: movies with an all black cast like this. Uh, the
Speaker 1: fact that it was financially successful that people got to
Speaker 1: go see it is great. But the stories and while
Speaker 1: the characters are like distinguishable, and you know, we see
Speaker 1: representation of successful black women, which is unfortunately a rare
Speaker 1: thing in mainstream movies. They are entirely framed around the
Speaker 1: men in their lives and should have been more about
Speaker 1: their friendship. I think, yeah, that success was limited because
Speaker 1: they hadn't found love. Right. Yeah, So I'm gonna give it.
Speaker 1: I'll give it a three nips. Well, right, I'm wrong, right, two? Okay,
Speaker 1: I can crowdsource your opinion. Y'all see it, y'all see
Speaker 1: it now. Look I've easily influenced. Uh. So what I
Speaker 1: meant to say, I'm going to give it two and
Speaker 1: a half nipples. This is my own thinking everyone's uh,
Speaker 1: and I will give one to Angela Bassett, one to
Speaker 1: Whitney Houston's singing voice and the soundtrack. Uh, and my
Speaker 1: half nipple will go to Gloria and Robin there in
Speaker 1: their friendship that we barely see you eron, what do
Speaker 1: you say? M hmm. Yeah, I'm gonna go with two nipples.
Speaker 1: One for Angela Bassett because I mean, she was just
Speaker 1: everything in this movie, probably the best thing to meet
Speaker 1: about this movie. And then one for Gloria because again
Speaker 1: she's the only one that seems to have like a
Speaker 1: positive you know, outcome by the end. So yeah, that
Speaker 1: that's all the nipples I have for this movie. I'll go,
Speaker 1: I'll go two and a half and just to tying
Speaker 1: onto what everyone is saying, movies that are supposed to
Speaker 1: be about female friendship that secretly aren't about female friendship
Speaker 1: and are about the men and how they define their
Speaker 1: lives are insidious and evil and don't do that. Come on, uh,
Speaker 1: send given one to Angela, one to Gloria, and half
Speaker 1: to that guy's dying wife. Give her a fucking break. Uh.
Speaker 1: All right, Aaron, thank you so much for being here.
Speaker 1: We are so thank you. Guys. Where can we find
Speaker 1: you online? Can we find your work? So? I am
Speaker 1: on Twitter very easy at e marvelous, and I am
Speaker 1: on all my stories are on ap news dot com. Alright,
Speaker 1: and you can find us on beckdel Cast across all
Speaker 1: your platforms. Get t shirts, blah blah blah. There's a
Speaker 1: show coming in. We love you so much. Give it
Speaker 1: up for Kate Bamford and everyone, and give it up
Speaker 1: for yours elve Hey everyone, it's Caitlin on behalf of
Speaker 1: Jamie and I. We just wanted to give another shout
Speaker 1: out to Kate Bamford and everyone at the Good Good
Speaker 1: Comedy Theater. Thank you so much for having us there
Speaker 1: and for letting us do our live show. We had
Speaker 1: so much fun and to listeners, if you're ever in Philadelphia,
Speaker 1: go and check that theater out. It's a great comedy
Speaker 1: venue with a lot of great shows. Thank you against
Speaker 1: so much to our guest, Aaron Haynes Whack. She was
Speaker 1: so awesome and we had so much fun talking to her.
Speaker 1: And then just the usual stuff. Quick reminder about our
Speaker 1: West Coast tour. We still have tickets for our San
Speaker 1: Francisco show. On January we are covering the Breakfast Club.
Speaker 1: We have tickets to our show in Portland on January
Speaker 1: we are covering Fight Club for that show, and then
Speaker 1: on January in Seattle, Jamie and I are going to
Speaker 1: be doing a stand up show and tickets to all
Speaker 1: of those shows are on our website. So if you
Speaker 1: go to back toelcast dot com and click on the
Speaker 1: live appearances tub, you'll be able to find all the
Speaker 1: links to get tickets to those shows. And then also
Speaker 1: on our website is the link to our merch store,
Speaker 1: or you could just go to t public dot com
Speaker 1: slash the backtel Cast and that's where you'll find all
Speaker 1: of our t shirts are sweatshirts are stickers and phone cases, mugs,
Speaker 1: we've got pillows even whatever your little heart desires. Uh.
Speaker 1: And then be on the lookout for some new designs
Speaker 1: in the new year. Wow. And then, as always, you
Speaker 1: can um follow us on social media at spectrol Cast.
Speaker 1: Please rate and review us on iTunes and give us
Speaker 1: a little five star or a five nipple rating because
Speaker 1: that helps us out a lot. And then we just
Speaker 1: wanted to say, from both of us, thank you so
Speaker 1: much to you our listeners, for your ongoing support. It's
Speaker 1: been a wild year, but you know we've really enjoyed
Speaker 1: communicating with you online and hearing your suggestions for episodes
Speaker 1: and everything like that. So thanks again and a happy
Speaker 1: new year, and may all your new year's wishes come true.
Speaker 1: All right bye,