1 00:00:15,436 --> 00:00:21,436 Speaker 1: Pushkin. I want to let you know that Rick has 2 00:00:21,476 --> 00:00:25,516 Speaker 1: a new podcast called Tetragrammaton. After about four to five 3 00:00:25,596 --> 00:00:28,476 Speaker 1: years of recording Broken Record, Rick decided he wanted to 4 00:00:28,516 --> 00:00:30,876 Speaker 1: talk to him more than just musicians, So on his 5 00:00:30,916 --> 00:00:36,596 Speaker 1: new podcast, he'll be talking to actors, directors, wrestlers, business people, 6 00:00:37,036 --> 00:00:40,676 Speaker 1: anyone that Rick finds interesting. So make sure to subscribe 7 00:00:40,716 --> 00:00:45,876 Speaker 1: to Tetragrammaton wherever you listen to podcasts. George Clinton forever 8 00:00:46,076 --> 00:00:50,396 Speaker 1: changed music with Parliament Funkadelic, whose theatrical sci fi performance 9 00:00:50,516 --> 00:00:54,316 Speaker 1: art has captivated audiences worldwide for over five decades and 10 00:00:54,436 --> 00:00:57,276 Speaker 1: influenced a range of artists from Prince to the Chili 11 00:00:57,316 --> 00:01:01,516 Speaker 1: Peppers to Doctor Dre. P. Funk's blend of psychedelic rock 12 00:01:01,556 --> 00:01:05,116 Speaker 1: and deep, repetitive, unfolding funk grooves helped bridge the R 13 00:01:05,156 --> 00:01:07,556 Speaker 1: and B and rock worlds in the seventies, along with 14 00:01:07,636 --> 00:01:12,196 Speaker 1: acts like Slying the Family Stone, known for multiple characters 15 00:01:12,276 --> 00:01:16,756 Speaker 1: like Doctor Funkenstein, George Clinton orchestrated multiple solo acts under 16 00:01:16,796 --> 00:01:19,516 Speaker 1: the p funk umbrella, and by the eighties was charting 17 00:01:19,516 --> 00:01:22,956 Speaker 1: with solo hits himself like Atomic Dog, all of which 18 00:01:22,996 --> 00:01:25,676 Speaker 1: would lay the groundwork for hip hop's classic g funk 19 00:01:25,756 --> 00:01:29,356 Speaker 1: Era and beyond. On today's episode, Rick Rubin talks to 20 00:01:29,396 --> 00:01:32,236 Speaker 1: George Clinton on Zoom about the origins of the original 21 00:01:32,356 --> 00:01:35,276 Speaker 1: vocal group, the Parliaments, and the time George was on 22 00:01:35,316 --> 00:01:38,516 Speaker 1: a panel with James Brown and dared the godfather of 23 00:01:38,556 --> 00:01:45,756 Speaker 1: funkensole himself to do the splits eighteen times. This is 24 00:01:45,836 --> 00:01:49,636 Speaker 1: broken record liner notes for the digital age. I'm justin Richmond. 25 00:01:50,636 --> 00:01:53,396 Speaker 1: In true George Clinton fashion, he funked up his recording. 26 00:01:53,476 --> 00:01:55,236 Speaker 1: But you know it's all good because we want the 27 00:01:55,316 --> 00:01:59,756 Speaker 1: funk anyway. So here's Rick Rubin with George Clinton. It's 28 00:01:59,756 --> 00:02:03,956 Speaker 1: a pleasure to see you, sir. Been a minute. Say yeah, 29 00:02:03,996 --> 00:02:06,996 Speaker 1: I love your hat. By the way, Oh yeah, I 30 00:02:07,076 --> 00:02:10,156 Speaker 1: have to keep don't know. But there was the hair 31 00:02:10,236 --> 00:02:15,756 Speaker 1: before I got don't occupied at all. I like it. 32 00:02:15,796 --> 00:02:19,836 Speaker 1: I watched a video of you from nineteen either from 33 00:02:19,916 --> 00:02:23,436 Speaker 1: nineteen sixty nine or nineteen seventy, and everybody in the 34 00:02:23,476 --> 00:02:26,956 Speaker 1: group had the best hots. You weren't wearing a hot 35 00:02:26,996 --> 00:02:33,196 Speaker 1: everybody else had a hot. You had a mohawk. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, 36 00:02:33,196 --> 00:02:36,276 Speaker 1: I remember that. I always try to do so weird 37 00:02:36,316 --> 00:02:40,316 Speaker 1: with the hair. You know. I was a barber I 38 00:02:40,356 --> 00:02:42,996 Speaker 1: didn't know that. Tell me about your life before music, 39 00:02:44,116 --> 00:02:50,636 Speaker 1: Oh gay Man, nineteen fifty six, we started the group, okay, 40 00:02:50,756 --> 00:02:54,556 Speaker 1: thirteen years old. We started the group because of you know, 41 00:02:54,676 --> 00:02:58,676 Speaker 1: like Frankie Lyman and the teenages, you know what, the 42 00:02:58,756 --> 00:03:05,156 Speaker 1: foostball and love dwop was the main music. Yeah, dua 43 00:03:05,396 --> 00:03:09,596 Speaker 1: was the music in New Jersey, and so I started 44 00:03:09,596 --> 00:03:11,556 Speaker 1: a group and one of the first things you had 45 00:03:11,596 --> 00:03:14,436 Speaker 1: to do in the group in those days was getta 46 00:03:14,556 --> 00:03:17,556 Speaker 1: do you know you're here with the waves in it. 47 00:03:17,996 --> 00:03:20,436 Speaker 1: We couldn't go to the barbershop, didn't get done because 48 00:03:20,436 --> 00:03:23,076 Speaker 1: it's cost too much. So we learned to do each 49 00:03:23,076 --> 00:03:26,836 Speaker 1: other's head. So while we was learning to sing in 50 00:03:27,156 --> 00:03:31,996 Speaker 1: duop right up in the fifteen nineteen fifty nine, were 51 00:03:32,036 --> 00:03:34,836 Speaker 1: working in the barbershop, singing at the Saint and rehearsing 52 00:03:34,876 --> 00:03:38,516 Speaker 1: in the barbershop the Miracles smoking, the miracles come out, 53 00:03:38,636 --> 00:03:42,036 Speaker 1: you know, the motown thing come out. So that was 54 00:03:42,156 --> 00:03:46,476 Speaker 1: our destination from then on to be on Motown, singing 55 00:03:46,556 --> 00:03:50,116 Speaker 1: duop and doing each other's head looking like the Temptations. 56 00:03:50,796 --> 00:03:55,836 Speaker 1: We did exactly that from fifteen nine to like sixty six. 57 00:03:56,236 --> 00:03:58,236 Speaker 1: When we got our first hit record, I just want 58 00:03:58,276 --> 00:04:03,116 Speaker 1: to Testify incredible in Detroit, you know, after working for Motown, 59 00:04:03,196 --> 00:04:05,556 Speaker 1: you know, Joe Bett most of that time, you know, 60 00:04:05,596 --> 00:04:08,476 Speaker 1: as a writer, we weren't signed to you know, we 61 00:04:08,596 --> 00:04:11,076 Speaker 1: never got a record out on the label. We were 62 00:04:11,116 --> 00:04:13,156 Speaker 1: signed to the label for a minute, but we didn't 63 00:04:13,156 --> 00:04:17,236 Speaker 1: get a record out. But the competition right down the street, 64 00:04:17,276 --> 00:04:20,476 Speaker 1: Golden World from Motown. I got a job there and 65 00:04:20,516 --> 00:04:24,756 Speaker 1: I recorded I Just want to Testify, and that became 66 00:04:25,156 --> 00:04:29,516 Speaker 1: the hit of Detroit, you know, and we were like 67 00:04:29,596 --> 00:04:34,836 Speaker 1: the competition for a minute, but we immediately changed, I 68 00:04:34,836 --> 00:04:37,916 Speaker 1: don't think because it was too late. By then, the 69 00:04:37,916 --> 00:04:41,516 Speaker 1: European invasion was happening, you know, it was, and the 70 00:04:41,676 --> 00:04:45,316 Speaker 1: rollings on Beatles and led Zeppelins and all of that 71 00:04:45,436 --> 00:04:48,636 Speaker 1: was happening. So we realized then because we had a 72 00:04:48,676 --> 00:04:52,236 Speaker 1: real good backup band, which was like our little brothers, 73 00:04:52,796 --> 00:04:58,356 Speaker 1: Eddie Hazel, Billy Nelson, your Tiki Fullwood, Tyle Ross and 74 00:04:58,436 --> 00:05:01,956 Speaker 1: Bernie Warrell. But those were the first ones that we 75 00:05:02,156 --> 00:05:06,756 Speaker 1: did for years they were called Funkadelic, But before Funkadelic, 76 00:05:06,956 --> 00:05:11,436 Speaker 1: it was the Parliament's that star it in New Jersey, right, 77 00:05:11,676 --> 00:05:14,076 Speaker 1: Because I think of you as Detroit, I don't think 78 00:05:14,116 --> 00:05:17,156 Speaker 1: of you as New Jersey. When did you make the move? No, 79 00:05:17,276 --> 00:05:20,436 Speaker 1: it started in New Jersey in the barbershop in New 80 00:05:20,556 --> 00:05:23,316 Speaker 1: Jersey while I was doing these other that's when it started. 81 00:05:23,356 --> 00:05:26,116 Speaker 1: At let's talk more about duop. I never made the 82 00:05:26,156 --> 00:05:28,996 Speaker 1: connection because you said you did each other's hair. It's 83 00:05:29,036 --> 00:05:32,276 Speaker 1: the name duop. Does it come from the dude? Is 84 00:05:32,316 --> 00:05:37,476 Speaker 1: that why it's called duop? No, it was a dude, duop, dude, dude, 85 00:05:38,316 --> 00:05:41,756 Speaker 1: But just so happened the dudes. You know, getting your 86 00:05:41,756 --> 00:05:44,396 Speaker 1: head done was what it was called, getting the dude. 87 00:05:44,996 --> 00:05:48,556 Speaker 1: So it did come close to that, but you related 88 00:05:48,636 --> 00:05:51,196 Speaker 1: it together. That was the style. Remember that King Cole 89 00:05:51,356 --> 00:05:56,796 Speaker 1: and his whole Bobby Sugar, Ray Robinson, those waves. That 90 00:05:56,916 --> 00:06:00,436 Speaker 1: was the current style back in those days. So you 91 00:06:00,636 --> 00:06:02,636 Speaker 1: if you're gonna go into the Apollo, you better have 92 00:06:03,276 --> 00:06:06,636 Speaker 1: had to have a dude. You know, everybody was cool. 93 00:06:07,076 --> 00:06:10,036 Speaker 1: You know on Friday, even you got that dude, your 94 00:06:10,036 --> 00:06:14,196 Speaker 1: head was laid. And that was the style. When we 95 00:06:14,236 --> 00:06:19,076 Speaker 1: think of a barbershop quartet, now you go, that's essentially duop. 96 00:06:19,716 --> 00:06:24,796 Speaker 1: Even the gospel versions of that was basically the background 97 00:06:25,596 --> 00:06:29,076 Speaker 1: singers singing the things that the bass player would play 98 00:06:29,236 --> 00:06:31,956 Speaker 1: with the drummer. You know what I'm saying. They were 99 00:06:31,996 --> 00:06:36,156 Speaker 1: singing the musical parts, who do up? Who do up? 100 00:06:36,316 --> 00:06:39,796 Speaker 1: They would do the harmonies and singing the instrument parts, 101 00:06:40,396 --> 00:06:43,516 Speaker 1: and that was basically duop. You know, you had a 102 00:06:43,516 --> 00:06:46,556 Speaker 1: lot of acapellas that didn't even use music at all. 103 00:06:47,276 --> 00:06:50,396 Speaker 1: You know, like if you ever remember Take six, Yeah, 104 00:06:51,156 --> 00:06:54,596 Speaker 1: remember there was like experts on singing all the party, 105 00:06:54,956 --> 00:06:59,196 Speaker 1: Bobby mcphern, that's basically I mean, you take the essence 106 00:06:59,236 --> 00:07:01,676 Speaker 1: of du wop and making it all the way into jazz. 107 00:07:02,076 --> 00:07:05,636 Speaker 1: But yeah, that's what duop basically was. We were singing 108 00:07:05,796 --> 00:07:09,516 Speaker 1: in the barber shop. That's when we rehearsed that. In 109 00:07:09,636 --> 00:07:13,916 Speaker 1: New Jersey. Was it always four or five in the 110 00:07:14,036 --> 00:07:16,756 Speaker 1: duop group or it didn't have to be that, It 111 00:07:16,916 --> 00:07:19,316 Speaker 1: didn't have to be that. But if five was basically 112 00:07:20,076 --> 00:07:23,876 Speaker 1: saying that, then you got like the impressions they went. 113 00:07:23,956 --> 00:07:26,956 Speaker 1: They took it to the three. You know, you had 114 00:07:26,956 --> 00:07:30,796 Speaker 1: Gladys Knight and the Pips, who was four, but the 115 00:07:30,796 --> 00:07:34,676 Speaker 1: three background was like a group by themselves, even though 116 00:07:34,676 --> 00:07:37,276 Speaker 1: that he was backing her up, they were like another 117 00:07:37,316 --> 00:07:41,236 Speaker 1: whole group. Did they come out of duop? Gladys Night, Yes, 118 00:07:41,436 --> 00:07:45,676 Speaker 1: oh they then first things would have been like it 119 00:07:45,876 --> 00:07:49,116 Speaker 1: was on Fury Records, would have been like it's in 120 00:07:49,196 --> 00:07:54,116 Speaker 1: that sixty Yeah. So in the duop it was still happening. Yes, 121 00:07:54,636 --> 00:07:57,556 Speaker 1: you know, Motown just slicked it up a little bit. 122 00:07:57,996 --> 00:08:00,796 Speaker 1: It was still duop, you know, the tempts and all that, 123 00:08:00,996 --> 00:08:02,836 Speaker 1: but they just slicked it up, you know, with the 124 00:08:02,916 --> 00:08:08,276 Speaker 1: strings in the instrumentation. Motown took due up to the 125 00:08:08,396 --> 00:08:12,676 Speaker 1: next level. What was the first duop do we know? No, 126 00:08:12,836 --> 00:08:16,356 Speaker 1: that would have been in the forties. That would have 127 00:08:16,356 --> 00:08:21,796 Speaker 1: been in the forties, I mean the ink spots, you know. 128 00:08:21,916 --> 00:08:25,436 Speaker 1: Lewis Jordan would have been one of my favorite of 129 00:08:25,516 --> 00:08:30,316 Speaker 1: that era that his was like du wop big band 130 00:08:30,356 --> 00:08:34,156 Speaker 1: like count basically in Duke Ellington all that. Lewis Jordan 131 00:08:34,276 --> 00:08:37,436 Speaker 1: was like the funk band of that era and they 132 00:08:37,476 --> 00:08:41,116 Speaker 1: did a lot of duop type stuff. But do but dup. 133 00:08:41,236 --> 00:08:43,636 Speaker 1: I think of duop as a vocal group. I don't 134 00:08:43,716 --> 00:08:46,156 Speaker 1: think of the band as part of duop, Like the 135 00:08:46,196 --> 00:08:51,476 Speaker 1: band is a backing band and the group are the singers. Yeah, 136 00:08:51,516 --> 00:08:53,956 Speaker 1: but they kind of like did both of that. Lewis 137 00:08:54,036 --> 00:08:58,916 Speaker 1: Jordan kind of like did like we did in Parliament Funkadelic. Yeah, 138 00:08:58,956 --> 00:09:02,956 Speaker 1: they had the singing and the big the band part 139 00:09:03,276 --> 00:09:08,076 Speaker 1: like U Ta. Sun Rock did duop. Most people don't 140 00:09:08,156 --> 00:09:11,356 Speaker 1: know it he did before he went out of space. 141 00:09:11,556 --> 00:09:14,956 Speaker 1: I didn't know that. There's a collection of Sunrone records 142 00:09:14,956 --> 00:09:19,916 Speaker 1: out of Chicago where he was doing basic duop groups. 143 00:09:20,036 --> 00:09:24,596 Speaker 1: You know when the Deals first started. Yeah, they were. 144 00:09:24,636 --> 00:09:28,796 Speaker 1: They were like big in fifty four, the DALs over 145 00:09:28,916 --> 00:09:33,476 Speaker 1: the Night and that stuff. They redid it in the seventies, 146 00:09:34,156 --> 00:09:37,596 Speaker 1: but they were like one of the groups around when 147 00:09:37,636 --> 00:09:41,996 Speaker 1: we was still around seventies that we compared our stuffs too, 148 00:09:42,036 --> 00:09:47,036 Speaker 1: because we had both been there a long time. Let's 149 00:09:47,036 --> 00:09:50,636 Speaker 1: talk about what a big doop group was, because now 150 00:09:50,956 --> 00:09:53,076 Speaker 1: when we think of what a big group is in music, 151 00:09:53,236 --> 00:09:55,516 Speaker 1: it's different today than it was then. What would be 152 00:09:55,516 --> 00:09:58,196 Speaker 1: a big doop group? How many people would they get 153 00:09:58,236 --> 00:10:00,676 Speaker 1: to play too? What would that be like? Tell me 154 00:10:01,436 --> 00:10:09,236 Speaker 1: okay your eyes aspirations. Basically it was Cocavanna or the Vegas. 155 00:10:09,316 --> 00:10:12,716 Speaker 1: That's all they thought about at that point, and you 156 00:10:12,756 --> 00:10:21,436 Speaker 1: would have gotten like the Platters, Flamingos, Moolows I mean, 157 00:10:21,836 --> 00:10:25,196 Speaker 1: Franky Lamon and teenagers. They they went away to like 158 00:10:25,796 --> 00:10:29,316 Speaker 1: Michael Jackson. They got to that level international and they 159 00:10:29,316 --> 00:10:34,196 Speaker 1: were a group. They didn't even have festivals then, so 160 00:10:34,236 --> 00:10:36,636 Speaker 1: it was big. It was a big club. Basically, it 161 00:10:36,756 --> 00:10:39,876 Speaker 1: was as big as it god and that was cool. 162 00:10:40,996 --> 00:10:46,116 Speaker 1: We were probably ourselves in slash Stones, probably the first 163 00:10:46,116 --> 00:10:49,916 Speaker 1: one that started playing to you know, black bands. They 164 00:10:49,996 --> 00:10:55,436 Speaker 1: started playing to the arenas like the Soldiers Field and things, 165 00:10:56,036 --> 00:10:58,516 Speaker 1: you know, and that would have been over into the seventies, 166 00:10:58,676 --> 00:11:02,556 Speaker 1: but we started in the sixties along with the Ted Nude, 167 00:11:02,876 --> 00:11:07,236 Speaker 1: Amboy Dudes, iggy Pop. We all was from Detroit with 168 00:11:07,916 --> 00:11:11,436 Speaker 1: the same agent. So we played festivals in anne Arbor 169 00:11:12,116 --> 00:11:15,356 Speaker 1: in Toronto, in places like that, you know, of the 170 00:11:15,436 --> 00:11:18,676 Speaker 1: rock and roll side, you know. We was called the 171 00:11:18,716 --> 00:11:21,676 Speaker 1: Bad Boys of anne Arbor at one time Funkadelic when 172 00:11:21,676 --> 00:11:24,356 Speaker 1: we put out Free Your Mind and ass would follow up. 173 00:11:25,036 --> 00:11:29,036 Speaker 1: Mama went in Maggot Brain. Basically when Maggot Brain came out, 174 00:11:29,556 --> 00:11:33,396 Speaker 1: we played all the rock festivals. Why did you move 175 00:11:33,476 --> 00:11:38,436 Speaker 1: to Detroit Motown? I see. The thing was was to 176 00:11:38,476 --> 00:11:41,756 Speaker 1: get out there to record with the Motown sound you 177 00:11:41,796 --> 00:11:44,836 Speaker 1: know musicians, And we went out there and I started 178 00:11:44,876 --> 00:11:49,836 Speaker 1: writing with one of the competitive companies, which Motown bought out. Later, 179 00:11:50,316 --> 00:11:52,756 Speaker 1: I started writing for them, and they did the Edwin 180 00:11:52,956 --> 00:11:58,636 Speaker 1: Stars and you know, Dall Banks, stuff like that in parliaments, 181 00:11:59,236 --> 00:12:03,796 Speaker 1: the parliaments still, you know, we did first records with them, 182 00:12:03,836 --> 00:12:06,076 Speaker 1: and that's where we got our first hit. But that 183 00:12:06,316 --> 00:12:09,316 Speaker 1: the time we got to Detroit, you moved out to 184 00:12:09,876 --> 00:12:16,276 Speaker 1: want to join Motown. Yes, become part of that situation, 185 00:12:16,436 --> 00:12:21,076 Speaker 1: which I see the same way people see hip hop today. 186 00:12:21,516 --> 00:12:25,636 Speaker 1: That's the way it was to be at Motown. I 187 00:12:25,756 --> 00:12:28,956 Speaker 1: tell you what, I'm going back and forth to Detroit. 188 00:12:29,876 --> 00:12:33,036 Speaker 1: You know. I go to Detroit, do the week Monday 189 00:12:33,076 --> 00:12:35,476 Speaker 1: to Friday. I go back to New Jersey and I'm 190 00:12:35,516 --> 00:12:39,636 Speaker 1: working to barbershop Friday, Saturday and Sunday, and I'm and 191 00:12:39,716 --> 00:12:43,316 Speaker 1: I go back to Detroit, you know, to write and 192 00:12:43,356 --> 00:12:46,516 Speaker 1: stuff with Motown. I do that for a year and 193 00:12:46,556 --> 00:12:49,876 Speaker 1: a half a thing, and then we get a hip record. 194 00:12:50,316 --> 00:12:53,476 Speaker 1: I do the last record that I do for the 195 00:12:53,516 --> 00:12:56,636 Speaker 1: Golden World. This guy's getting ready to sell the company 196 00:12:56,676 --> 00:13:00,636 Speaker 1: to Motown. I do the last record for them, and 197 00:13:00,756 --> 00:13:03,516 Speaker 1: I leave and go back to the barber shop. I'm 198 00:13:03,596 --> 00:13:10,116 Speaker 1: there two weeks before the record comes out on the 199 00:13:10,116 --> 00:13:14,236 Speaker 1: biggest station in the country, which was ckl W and 200 00:13:14,516 --> 00:13:17,556 Speaker 1: w ABC in New York and I had no idea 201 00:13:17,556 --> 00:13:20,516 Speaker 1: it was coming out. And when everybody started hearing on 202 00:13:20,636 --> 00:13:25,116 Speaker 1: radio saying your record is out, and that was the 203 00:13:25,476 --> 00:13:30,676 Speaker 1: I want to testify, which became the smashup that you know, 204 00:13:30,876 --> 00:13:36,756 Speaker 1: sixty seven along with Beetles, um Geergeant, Jimmy Hendrix, the 205 00:13:36,876 --> 00:13:41,356 Speaker 1: Cream and those was one imprinted in my brain from 206 00:13:41,396 --> 00:13:43,796 Speaker 1: then on when that became a hit, and those were 207 00:13:43,956 --> 00:13:46,836 Speaker 1: the records that came out with it, you know. And 208 00:13:47,076 --> 00:13:51,636 Speaker 1: right after that, sly Stone came out. Before we left Plainfield, 209 00:13:52,196 --> 00:13:55,996 Speaker 1: his manager got to Dave Kaepolick, that was his manager, 210 00:13:56,676 --> 00:13:58,996 Speaker 1: told us that, you know, we were good, but he 211 00:13:59,036 --> 00:14:01,956 Speaker 1: had a group called Sliding the family. Stone was blah 212 00:14:02,036 --> 00:14:05,716 Speaker 1: blah blah blah, and I had to brighten up because 213 00:14:05,756 --> 00:14:10,196 Speaker 1: we were too dark, you know, in our concepts, and 214 00:14:10,236 --> 00:14:13,116 Speaker 1: he was actually I managed for a minute. We was 215 00:14:13,156 --> 00:14:18,676 Speaker 1: on Stone Records with Dave Catholick managed for a minute 216 00:14:19,156 --> 00:14:23,196 Speaker 1: and then Slat broke big. We went to Detroit. We 217 00:14:23,356 --> 00:14:26,036 Speaker 1: had when we had that the hit single out, but 218 00:14:27,156 --> 00:14:31,156 Speaker 1: we went separate ways for a minute because years get 219 00:14:31,196 --> 00:14:33,876 Speaker 1: to that later. So I want to ask you about 220 00:14:33,916 --> 00:14:37,796 Speaker 1: the commuting between New Jersey and Detroit for getting Motown 221 00:14:37,876 --> 00:14:43,116 Speaker 1: for a minute. How different was just your experience of 222 00:14:43,236 --> 00:14:45,996 Speaker 1: life in those two places or was it the same? 223 00:14:46,076 --> 00:14:51,156 Speaker 1: And how would you say they were different worlds? Like this, 224 00:14:51,276 --> 00:14:54,356 Speaker 1: I work in the barbershop in New Jersey, so you're 225 00:14:54,396 --> 00:14:58,116 Speaker 1: dealing with New Harlem and they're like the first one 226 00:14:58,196 --> 00:15:01,116 Speaker 1: that was doing those processes. Not the first, but the 227 00:15:01,116 --> 00:15:03,796 Speaker 1: one that what we call elevated to where we were 228 00:15:03,876 --> 00:15:09,316 Speaker 1: looking smooth and soft and natural and really fly as 229 00:15:09,356 --> 00:15:13,276 Speaker 1: opposed to it's still being done and being hard and 230 00:15:13,676 --> 00:15:16,076 Speaker 1: you know, glue to your head. So that was my 231 00:15:16,156 --> 00:15:18,556 Speaker 1: only way of looking at it. There was lots of 232 00:15:18,596 --> 00:15:22,436 Speaker 1: what they called players in Detroit, Cleveland. They was like 233 00:15:22,796 --> 00:15:28,036 Speaker 1: preoccupied with that former lifestyle New York, New Jersey though 234 00:15:28,516 --> 00:15:32,476 Speaker 1: we thought we was cooler with that lifestyle, same lifestyle, 235 00:15:32,516 --> 00:15:35,596 Speaker 1: but just thought you was cooler in it. So I 236 00:15:35,636 --> 00:15:38,876 Speaker 1: had to analyze going back and forth to you know, 237 00:15:39,796 --> 00:15:44,516 Speaker 1: the players in Detroit and the players in the barbish 238 00:15:44,596 --> 00:15:48,276 Speaker 1: chops around New Jersey who subdued it a little bit, 239 00:15:48,676 --> 00:15:51,956 Speaker 1: and um you did to deal with what's called it 240 00:15:51,996 --> 00:15:56,556 Speaker 1: abducing a quarter being the desired car as opposed to 241 00:15:56,876 --> 00:16:01,196 Speaker 1: um El Dorado or Mercedes. You know what I'm saying 242 00:16:01,636 --> 00:16:05,316 Speaker 1: being the car of choice. But Motown was there, which 243 00:16:05,396 --> 00:16:08,276 Speaker 1: made the difference. You know, everything at Motown in my 244 00:16:08,396 --> 00:16:11,356 Speaker 1: head was the who is in the world. No matter what, 245 00:16:11,516 --> 00:16:14,916 Speaker 1: we just we just had to change their hairstyles. Yes, 246 00:16:15,276 --> 00:16:18,196 Speaker 1: could Motown have happened to anywhere else? Or do you 247 00:16:18,276 --> 00:16:21,596 Speaker 1: think that the nature of Detroit had something to do 248 00:16:22,156 --> 00:16:27,356 Speaker 1: with Motown blossoming? I think it has something to do, 249 00:16:27,396 --> 00:16:31,596 Speaker 1: you know, with the city in that whole factory car 250 00:16:31,756 --> 00:16:36,156 Speaker 1: company thing, you know, and it's just been that place. 251 00:16:36,836 --> 00:16:40,876 Speaker 1: When Chicago started like that, they just didn't get one 252 00:16:40,876 --> 00:16:45,196 Speaker 1: place to zone in like Motown did. Like a lot 253 00:16:45,236 --> 00:16:48,196 Speaker 1: of the records came out of Chicago, but they were 254 00:16:48,236 --> 00:16:50,956 Speaker 1: different labels, And the same thing could have happened in 255 00:16:51,036 --> 00:16:55,836 Speaker 1: Minneapolis when prison all of them were together. It's always 256 00:16:55,836 --> 00:16:58,396 Speaker 1: been how do you keep it together? Because the industry 257 00:16:58,436 --> 00:17:00,916 Speaker 1: aint going to let you keep it together. You know, 258 00:17:01,116 --> 00:17:02,716 Speaker 1: the main thing is to break it up and get 259 00:17:02,956 --> 00:17:05,876 Speaker 1: whoever's big, and everybody want to be big, so it's 260 00:17:05,916 --> 00:17:08,236 Speaker 1: you know, kind of easier to get the good people 261 00:17:08,276 --> 00:17:10,396 Speaker 1: and giving them some money and they lead before you 262 00:17:10,516 --> 00:17:14,756 Speaker 1: get to a Motown guy. Motown was magic. It was 263 00:17:14,836 --> 00:17:18,716 Speaker 1: like so magic. The particular band, you think of it 264 00:17:18,836 --> 00:17:22,596 Speaker 1: like all the musicians, the one that played on it 265 00:17:22,676 --> 00:17:25,196 Speaker 1: was unbelievable because then all those singers was like one 266 00:17:25,276 --> 00:17:29,716 Speaker 1: big fan. That was like the first Motown the review 267 00:17:30,396 --> 00:17:34,956 Speaker 1: were all those superstars was on the same buses. It's like, 268 00:17:35,196 --> 00:17:38,396 Speaker 1: I don't know. It was like college. Yeah, everybody sharing 269 00:17:38,476 --> 00:17:42,516 Speaker 1: information back and forth. And yeah, I mean and at 270 00:17:42,556 --> 00:17:46,556 Speaker 1: that particular time, which was the sixties, school was happening, 271 00:17:46,916 --> 00:17:50,276 Speaker 1: College was happening. A lot of kids in college was 272 00:17:50,356 --> 00:17:54,276 Speaker 1: sharing knowledge all over the planet. We have to pause 273 00:17:54,316 --> 00:17:56,196 Speaker 1: for a quick break here, but then we'll be back 274 00:17:56,196 --> 00:18:03,036 Speaker 1: with more from Rick Rubin and George Clinton. We're back 275 00:18:03,076 --> 00:18:06,996 Speaker 1: with Rick Rubin's conversation with George Clinton. It's interesting that 276 00:18:07,036 --> 00:18:09,836 Speaker 1: your first song was Testify. Testify as is a word 277 00:18:09,836 --> 00:18:14,076 Speaker 1: that I associate with church. Was there a spiritual component 278 00:18:14,276 --> 00:18:17,276 Speaker 1: for music for you? From the beginning, I was around 279 00:18:17,356 --> 00:18:22,716 Speaker 1: um barbershop a group called the Gospel Clefts. They rehearsed 280 00:18:22,716 --> 00:18:26,316 Speaker 1: there and to see the show in the vibe that 281 00:18:26,476 --> 00:18:30,716 Speaker 1: they would put on was unbelievable. It was like the 282 00:18:31,236 --> 00:18:35,956 Speaker 1: coasters in church, and that that always let me know 283 00:18:36,116 --> 00:18:39,236 Speaker 1: that that was the root of all the music, no 284 00:18:39,276 --> 00:18:42,596 Speaker 1: matter what the tone was that was the root. So 285 00:18:42,676 --> 00:18:45,956 Speaker 1: that vibe you know rap from to get to God 286 00:18:46,196 --> 00:18:50,196 Speaker 1: Up was always the vibe of you know, church like 287 00:18:50,316 --> 00:18:54,956 Speaker 1: I can remember the Staple singers or Mahellia Jackson that 288 00:18:55,156 --> 00:18:58,756 Speaker 1: stuff when you know, waking up the breakfast too, and 289 00:18:58,836 --> 00:19:02,596 Speaker 1: it sounds like hit records to this day when I 290 00:19:02,636 --> 00:19:05,756 Speaker 1: go to Texas, all the all the bands, all the 291 00:19:05,796 --> 00:19:09,436 Speaker 1: funk bands is in Texas and church. Yeah, all the 292 00:19:09,436 --> 00:19:13,836 Speaker 1: best players, all the best musicians, absolutely, yeah, the best. 293 00:19:15,076 --> 00:19:19,036 Speaker 1: So in the Detroit scene, how was the Motown world 294 00:19:19,836 --> 00:19:23,636 Speaker 1: and the Detroit rock world part of the same thing 295 00:19:23,836 --> 00:19:25,396 Speaker 1: when you were there, did you feel like it was 296 00:19:25,476 --> 00:19:27,596 Speaker 1: all part of one thing or did it feel like 297 00:19:27,636 --> 00:19:31,156 Speaker 1: the Motown thing is really separate from like the Ted 298 00:19:31,276 --> 00:19:34,556 Speaker 1: Nugents and the and the Iggy's. When we got that 299 00:19:34,716 --> 00:19:39,636 Speaker 1: funk and Testifi was out, we bridged that one instantly 300 00:19:40,276 --> 00:19:44,396 Speaker 1: because Motown was already like a Motown played with those 301 00:19:44,676 --> 00:19:47,716 Speaker 1: groups on shoulder with them, but we were immediately a 302 00:19:47,796 --> 00:19:54,076 Speaker 1: funk psychedelic band, So it changed immediately at first. By 303 00:19:54,116 --> 00:19:59,436 Speaker 1: the time Ted Nugent in Iggy Pop MC five, yeah, 304 00:20:00,556 --> 00:20:04,356 Speaker 1: you know, it was merging right there. Would everyone play 305 00:20:04,396 --> 00:20:07,316 Speaker 1: at the same clubs like with someone on Motown and 306 00:20:07,796 --> 00:20:11,796 Speaker 1: MC five play at the same venue we did. We 307 00:20:11,956 --> 00:20:15,836 Speaker 1: played with MC five and all of them, and they 308 00:20:15,916 --> 00:20:20,316 Speaker 1: were separate R and B venues. Oh yeah, except for 309 00:20:20,476 --> 00:20:24,076 Speaker 1: like the Rooster, tell you that's where pop and R 310 00:20:24,116 --> 00:20:27,716 Speaker 1: and B played, The Fox, Pop in RB played. You know, 311 00:20:27,796 --> 00:20:30,916 Speaker 1: most of those kind of places. The theater is everybody 312 00:20:30,996 --> 00:20:34,356 Speaker 1: played there. What would you call the first funk record 313 00:20:34,716 --> 00:20:39,396 Speaker 1: from anybody? Oh god, it would be, but it would 314 00:20:39,396 --> 00:20:43,516 Speaker 1: have to be one of those blues things that you 315 00:20:43,556 --> 00:20:48,356 Speaker 1: know it's in forties. Those are basically punk records, most 316 00:20:48,396 --> 00:20:51,956 Speaker 1: of them. I look at, uh, you know the New 317 00:20:52,076 --> 00:20:58,356 Speaker 1: Orleans stuff, you know, the Motown early records, James Jamison, 318 00:20:58,676 --> 00:21:04,996 Speaker 1: those basslines, everything. They just had so much string on 319 00:21:05,076 --> 00:21:08,676 Speaker 1: top that it was music for young America. That was 320 00:21:08,716 --> 00:21:12,236 Speaker 1: the name. That was their theme. Their music, if you 321 00:21:12,436 --> 00:21:16,396 Speaker 1: the basic rhythm tracks, was the funkiest thing that there was. 322 00:21:16,516 --> 00:21:19,916 Speaker 1: That's what made us. That's who called us the Funk Brothers. 323 00:21:19,916 --> 00:21:22,876 Speaker 1: They called us the Young Funk Brothers. You know, I'm 324 00:21:23,156 --> 00:21:26,276 Speaker 1: backup band, and that's why we named it funka Deli. 325 00:21:26,716 --> 00:21:29,836 Speaker 1: They had a New Orleans vibe on it, but Motown 326 00:21:29,916 --> 00:21:34,276 Speaker 1: had its own chord changes with it. But basically everything 327 00:21:34,356 --> 00:21:40,556 Speaker 1: they did, you know, was seriously funky pop. Nobody identified 328 00:21:40,596 --> 00:21:44,356 Speaker 1: it with funk because we came along. We did it. Basically, 329 00:21:44,356 --> 00:21:48,436 Speaker 1: we went to real raw funk, the simple lines, chants 330 00:21:48,836 --> 00:21:52,996 Speaker 1: and extremely you know slow. What's the first time you 331 00:21:52,996 --> 00:21:57,676 Speaker 1: were ever aware of James Brown? Please please and try 332 00:21:57,756 --> 00:22:01,236 Speaker 1: me those two. I mean, as you know, they were 333 00:22:01,276 --> 00:22:04,836 Speaker 1: like blues songs, but you see, you can feel the 334 00:22:04,956 --> 00:22:07,276 Speaker 1: vibe in it that it was dead. But when he 335 00:22:07,356 --> 00:22:11,596 Speaker 1: started doing Papa Gotta Ran New Bag, from that point 336 00:22:11,756 --> 00:22:15,916 Speaker 1: on it was something else. You know, That's when you 337 00:22:15,956 --> 00:22:19,756 Speaker 1: start seeing bands pop up that imitate him. You know, 338 00:22:20,236 --> 00:22:23,116 Speaker 1: once they got to that point, he was like he 339 00:22:23,236 --> 00:22:26,876 Speaker 1: was like a TikTok artist. Every city you go to, 340 00:22:26,996 --> 00:22:29,756 Speaker 1: you can find a band that could perfect his show 341 00:22:29,836 --> 00:22:34,396 Speaker 1: so good that they could actually substitute us. I mean, 342 00:22:35,396 --> 00:22:37,276 Speaker 1: you know, I mean, I mean I knew some band 343 00:22:37,836 --> 00:22:41,156 Speaker 1: it was more James Brown than James Brown. But the 344 00:22:41,316 --> 00:22:43,276 Speaker 1: work that they had to put in to get those 345 00:22:43,356 --> 00:22:46,956 Speaker 1: horn precision. I mean, you watch May She'll do it 346 00:22:46,996 --> 00:22:49,316 Speaker 1: with us, You watch him do it with Prince Fred 347 00:22:49,396 --> 00:22:53,156 Speaker 1: did the same thing. But the account basic they all bootsy, 348 00:22:53,956 --> 00:22:57,356 Speaker 1: I mean, came our whole style. You know, from the 349 00:22:57,596 --> 00:23:01,436 Speaker 1: Funk Funkadelic, like we were doing Funk first to the 350 00:23:01,476 --> 00:23:05,556 Speaker 1: Parliament new stuff when we did Chocolate City up for 351 00:23:05,636 --> 00:23:08,876 Speaker 1: the downstroke than Mothership and all of that, and it 352 00:23:08,996 --> 00:23:12,876 Speaker 1: was still he brought the hornie horns, you know. Then 353 00:23:12,996 --> 00:23:18,316 Speaker 1: with me and Bernie Warrell being a classically trained keyboardist, 354 00:23:18,876 --> 00:23:23,276 Speaker 1: was able to have them played horn parts but with 355 00:23:23,396 --> 00:23:26,556 Speaker 1: that same kind of precision. So it was like we 356 00:23:26,596 --> 00:23:30,316 Speaker 1: had two or three generations of styles, you know, the 357 00:23:30,476 --> 00:23:34,756 Speaker 1: Jimmy Hendricks, the James Brown, the Motown in Parliament funk 358 00:23:34,956 --> 00:23:37,716 Speaker 1: up all at one time, you know, And that's what 359 00:23:37,876 --> 00:23:41,716 Speaker 1: we were having, like ten albums out at one in 360 00:23:41,836 --> 00:23:46,356 Speaker 1: a year with all the of the same people. Yeah, 361 00:23:46,516 --> 00:23:49,716 Speaker 1: I always wanted to know about why, why the different 362 00:23:50,676 --> 00:23:54,036 Speaker 1: band names and why the different labels, How did that happen? 363 00:23:54,076 --> 00:23:56,956 Speaker 1: And was it on purpose? And tell me about it. 364 00:23:57,836 --> 00:24:00,236 Speaker 1: It was the only way to get everybody, says about 365 00:24:00,236 --> 00:24:04,156 Speaker 1: everybody wanted to be upfront start, So whoever was the 366 00:24:04,596 --> 00:24:07,116 Speaker 1: gotta hit, that's who we all become. We was a 367 00:24:07,156 --> 00:24:10,876 Speaker 1: backup band for the ads and you know, saying it 368 00:24:10,916 --> 00:24:13,276 Speaker 1: didn't matter at the time, we realized that it was 369 00:24:13,316 --> 00:24:16,956 Speaker 1: hard from one act to survive after you know, seeing 370 00:24:17,156 --> 00:24:20,916 Speaker 1: you know, Motown get to its peak, we realized we 371 00:24:20,956 --> 00:24:24,556 Speaker 1: had to have them on different labels and know that 372 00:24:24,636 --> 00:24:26,836 Speaker 1: where you could accommodate all the new acts that was 373 00:24:26,876 --> 00:24:29,516 Speaker 1: coming up behind us that we had, We had loads 374 00:24:29,596 --> 00:24:33,836 Speaker 1: more in a way. You did what basically how the 375 00:24:33,876 --> 00:24:39,676 Speaker 1: Funk Brothers was the root of all of the Motown. 376 00:24:40,356 --> 00:24:42,676 Speaker 1: You did your own version of that, but instead of 377 00:24:42,956 --> 00:24:48,516 Speaker 1: building a label, you had artists at all the different labels. Yeah, 378 00:24:48,916 --> 00:24:52,636 Speaker 1: you know like Wotan did it right after us. Yes, 379 00:24:52,876 --> 00:24:56,116 Speaker 1: and they stayed together as a group and was all 380 00:24:56,596 --> 00:24:59,716 Speaker 1: on the thing. That was what we would you know, 381 00:24:59,836 --> 00:25:03,956 Speaker 1: telling do had anyone done that before? You? Not? Not 382 00:25:04,116 --> 00:25:10,236 Speaker 1: that many, I tell you, Phil Specter did. Remember he 383 00:25:10,316 --> 00:25:14,636 Speaker 1: had that Darlene love song on everybody's record, and they 384 00:25:14,676 --> 00:25:18,676 Speaker 1: had all the groups, the Crystals, you know, all the 385 00:25:18,756 --> 00:25:22,916 Speaker 1: Royal raw teams and and Ike and Tina did it 386 00:25:22,996 --> 00:25:28,716 Speaker 1: a little bit, remember that I gets in Ike and Tina. Yeah, 387 00:25:28,756 --> 00:25:32,556 Speaker 1: they didn't, but we just spreaded it out a lot 388 00:25:32,716 --> 00:25:36,476 Speaker 1: further because that's you them was was starred themselves as 389 00:25:36,876 --> 00:25:39,956 Speaker 1: you know as the Jabs. We named him the Horny Horns, 390 00:25:40,516 --> 00:25:42,756 Speaker 1: and they were already their own stars. So it was 391 00:25:42,796 --> 00:25:47,156 Speaker 1: easy and Bootsy was Bootsy, so we made him into Bootzilla. 392 00:25:47,516 --> 00:25:50,676 Speaker 1: We made him an instant star right from the get go. 393 00:25:51,436 --> 00:25:53,796 Speaker 1: You know in Parliament Funk that we had built our 394 00:25:53,876 --> 00:25:58,516 Speaker 1: reputation as the psychedelic band. So it was when the 395 00:25:58,556 --> 00:26:00,276 Speaker 1: mother Ship happened. It was like we had a ship 396 00:26:00,316 --> 00:26:04,196 Speaker 1: with all these acts on the The backup girls would 397 00:26:04,236 --> 00:26:09,076 Speaker 1: become the Parletts and the brides. Was there a particular 398 00:26:09,156 --> 00:26:14,676 Speaker 1: their inspiration for going psychedelic or was it more the 399 00:26:14,676 --> 00:26:17,956 Speaker 1: whole movement or were there any like key artists were like, 400 00:26:18,196 --> 00:26:21,796 Speaker 1: we need to do something more like this. We had 401 00:26:22,076 --> 00:26:26,556 Speaker 1: a friend that worked with us, Jimmy Miller. He was 402 00:26:26,596 --> 00:26:30,756 Speaker 1: the producer the Rolling Stones. Eventually we used to practice 403 00:26:30,796 --> 00:26:33,476 Speaker 1: out Due our thing and we recorded some records with 404 00:26:33,636 --> 00:26:37,756 Speaker 1: him and a guy named Jimmy Fallon, And just as 405 00:26:37,756 --> 00:26:41,396 Speaker 1: we got our first record together, we gave it to 406 00:26:41,556 --> 00:26:45,476 Speaker 1: New to Brunswick Records. They released the demo We Game 407 00:26:45,636 --> 00:26:49,996 Speaker 1: on Jackie Wilson. He went on to do a group 408 00:26:49,996 --> 00:26:54,036 Speaker 1: called Spencer Davis give Me Some Loving even on the 409 00:26:54,156 --> 00:26:59,396 Speaker 1: Due Traffic. Stevie. Now this was like my partner. We 410 00:26:59,436 --> 00:27:03,956 Speaker 1: wrote together and I saw what they had did with 411 00:27:03,956 --> 00:27:08,956 Speaker 1: with Spencer Davis, give me some loving and I'm a man, 412 00:27:09,116 --> 00:27:12,556 Speaker 1: and I realized that's where it was going, that that, 413 00:27:13,516 --> 00:27:16,716 Speaker 1: you know, rock and roll European type of thing. Then 414 00:27:16,836 --> 00:27:21,236 Speaker 1: Jimmy's records came out. You know, we knew Jimmy Jamie 415 00:27:21,236 --> 00:27:24,396 Speaker 1: in the Flames, you know, with King Curtis, and you 416 00:27:24,436 --> 00:27:26,156 Speaker 1: know you knew him as a gut top where that 417 00:27:26,236 --> 00:27:30,636 Speaker 1: did tricks play. He came out with all you experience 418 00:27:31,556 --> 00:27:34,156 Speaker 1: that wouldn't let me know we had to do something 419 00:27:34,916 --> 00:27:39,596 Speaker 1: like that. And the edit was about fifteen years old 420 00:27:40,036 --> 00:27:42,916 Speaker 1: and he was experimented with to get to be just 421 00:27:43,396 --> 00:27:45,596 Speaker 1: He could play blues to death, so it was easy 422 00:27:45,676 --> 00:27:48,716 Speaker 1: for him to get the gadgets and do it. Were 423 00:27:48,756 --> 00:27:52,836 Speaker 1: you ever aware of Arthur Lee and Love at any point? Yep? 424 00:27:53,436 --> 00:27:58,556 Speaker 1: That was Slides heroes really, yeah, that was his heroes, 425 00:27:58,716 --> 00:28:02,716 Speaker 1: the Love Family. Yeah, yeah, that was Slide. He put 426 00:28:02,756 --> 00:28:05,036 Speaker 1: me onto them. What's the first time you got to 427 00:28:05,076 --> 00:28:09,036 Speaker 1: meet and see Slide? The first time? Like I told 428 00:28:09,756 --> 00:28:13,396 Speaker 1: the manager, David Kaeperlick was his manager and our manager. 429 00:28:14,156 --> 00:28:17,956 Speaker 1: He invited me to see Slide in the East Village 430 00:28:18,556 --> 00:28:22,396 Speaker 1: and how was it? It was through that place away? 431 00:28:22,676 --> 00:28:25,076 Speaker 1: Plus of all you know, at that time, you know, 432 00:28:25,116 --> 00:28:29,156 Speaker 1: you tripping your ass off. You know, he played that 433 00:28:29,396 --> 00:28:33,036 Speaker 1: and told that place down, and I'm trying to think 434 00:28:33,036 --> 00:28:39,676 Speaker 1: he played another club that same weekend and it was unbelievable. 435 00:28:40,356 --> 00:28:46,236 Speaker 1: He told that place up. That sounds great. I mean, 436 00:28:46,276 --> 00:28:48,556 Speaker 1: that's I think he had. It was a dance to 437 00:28:48,596 --> 00:28:53,116 Speaker 1: the music out that was, you know, and that simple song. 438 00:28:53,156 --> 00:28:56,156 Speaker 1: When that came out, it was all over. For all 439 00:28:56,196 --> 00:28:59,516 Speaker 1: the different scenes that you've seen. So you've you've witnessed 440 00:28:59,556 --> 00:29:03,196 Speaker 1: the dwop scene, you witnessed the birth of the funk scene, 441 00:29:03,596 --> 00:29:07,116 Speaker 1: You've witnessed the birth of g funk. He've witnessed the 442 00:29:07,156 --> 00:29:10,996 Speaker 1: birth of hip hop before. For that, would you say 443 00:29:10,996 --> 00:29:14,716 Speaker 1: that there's a similarity between these things that happen or 444 00:29:14,996 --> 00:29:18,716 Speaker 1: is each one of them really different? It's a similarity. 445 00:29:18,716 --> 00:29:22,316 Speaker 1: It's a similarity. You know. It gets to that point 446 00:29:22,396 --> 00:29:27,156 Speaker 1: where it peaqus and it's people. Somebody started changing it 447 00:29:27,916 --> 00:29:31,476 Speaker 1: and you don't think it's the music at first, but 448 00:29:31,516 --> 00:29:34,876 Speaker 1: then sudden it takes over. It becomes the new music, 449 00:29:35,396 --> 00:29:39,756 Speaker 1: and it works, it becomes the thing, and a new 450 00:29:39,796 --> 00:29:45,636 Speaker 1: one comes along. Whenever I hear something like PA, you 451 00:29:45,676 --> 00:29:48,436 Speaker 1: know that was a do out play and when you 452 00:29:48,516 --> 00:29:52,676 Speaker 1: hear people explaining about what that ain't music but you're 453 00:29:52,716 --> 00:29:55,756 Speaker 1: talking about And then then you get to a few 454 00:29:55,796 --> 00:30:03,556 Speaker 1: years later it's the same thing. Yeah, it all gets 455 00:30:03,556 --> 00:30:07,636 Speaker 1: to a point of sophistication that the kids have to 456 00:30:07,676 --> 00:30:11,356 Speaker 1: take over again and bring it back to elementary so 457 00:30:11,436 --> 00:30:14,076 Speaker 1: you can go somewhere else. You know, it gets to 458 00:30:14,116 --> 00:30:18,796 Speaker 1: that peak and everybody gets sophisticated and get jazzy or 459 00:30:19,116 --> 00:30:23,116 Speaker 1: whatever the off our guard thing is. And then some 460 00:30:23,316 --> 00:30:25,876 Speaker 1: kids will come along and do something so dumb, get 461 00:30:26,116 --> 00:30:29,276 Speaker 1: get on your nerve, but it becomes the new ship 462 00:30:29,876 --> 00:30:32,516 Speaker 1: that you if you want to stay around, you better 463 00:30:32,556 --> 00:30:34,436 Speaker 1: pick them on how they're doing it. It makes it 464 00:30:34,476 --> 00:30:38,036 Speaker 1: fun again. It's like it gets fun again. It makes 465 00:30:38,036 --> 00:30:41,636 Speaker 1: it fun again. You know, whenever I hear somebody that, 466 00:30:41,796 --> 00:30:44,156 Speaker 1: like I said, you know, my nerve for whatever reason, 467 00:30:44,756 --> 00:30:47,516 Speaker 1: if it get on the good enough, I know it's 468 00:30:47,516 --> 00:30:50,196 Speaker 1: for the good. I know I need to pay attention. 469 00:30:50,636 --> 00:30:54,516 Speaker 1: Did you ever get into go Go DC go go? 470 00:30:54,076 --> 00:30:56,676 Speaker 1: Oh my god, yeah, I give a good so on. 471 00:30:57,196 --> 00:31:00,276 Speaker 1: One of the first things chuck them Chuck Browning and 472 00:31:00,276 --> 00:31:04,516 Speaker 1: the soul searches. One of the first things they did 473 00:31:05,596 --> 00:31:08,916 Speaker 1: was I don't care about the cold baby, when You're hot, 474 00:31:09,276 --> 00:31:12,836 Speaker 1: You're too much, when you hut, You're hut. That was 475 00:31:13,076 --> 00:31:16,196 Speaker 1: from one of our songs called Up for the Downstream. Yeah, 476 00:31:16,276 --> 00:31:18,756 Speaker 1: I know that record. I used to DJ that record 477 00:31:18,796 --> 00:31:22,436 Speaker 1: all the time. That was the That was the birth 478 00:31:22,516 --> 00:31:25,636 Speaker 1: of their version of the Go Go. Then they used 479 00:31:25,676 --> 00:31:29,716 Speaker 1: to vamp on that part and our drummer, Ticky Food, 480 00:31:29,756 --> 00:31:31,836 Speaker 1: we used to play with them and nothing I can 481 00:31:31,876 --> 00:31:35,276 Speaker 1: said it was. It was the Soul Searchers, you know, 482 00:31:35,316 --> 00:31:40,116 Speaker 1: at that time, and they did that group with everything 483 00:31:40,316 --> 00:31:43,916 Speaker 1: after that. Yeah, they did everything with that beat after 484 00:31:43,956 --> 00:31:46,556 Speaker 1: that worked so thoroughly they could do. We used to 485 00:31:46,556 --> 00:31:50,316 Speaker 1: do the same thing with the group Mama with the 486 00:31:50,316 --> 00:31:56,116 Speaker 1: Whoa Hi, Hey, whoa Hi. We did that for the 487 00:31:56,436 --> 00:32:01,756 Speaker 1: entire show, like doing the early seventies. All our songs 488 00:32:01,796 --> 00:32:04,876 Speaker 1: would be in that beat and we just changed the 489 00:32:04,916 --> 00:32:08,796 Speaker 1: melody of the lyrics and the beat of the lick, 490 00:32:09,316 --> 00:32:12,316 Speaker 1: but the pocket would stayed the same. We did that 491 00:32:12,396 --> 00:32:14,436 Speaker 1: and it sound like we did one song all night 492 00:32:14,796 --> 00:32:17,876 Speaker 1: with different themes than it. It sounds great though, because 493 00:32:17,876 --> 00:32:22,396 Speaker 1: it creates this like hypnosis you get. The pocket just 494 00:32:22,476 --> 00:32:26,516 Speaker 1: keeps getting deeper and deeper and it turns into something else, 495 00:32:26,636 --> 00:32:29,236 Speaker 1: you know, even without changing, it turns into something else 496 00:32:30,116 --> 00:32:35,196 Speaker 1: without changing. Well, James Brown could do that forever. But 497 00:32:35,636 --> 00:32:40,116 Speaker 1: one of the best was Failor Couter see Failer from Nigeria. 498 00:32:41,236 --> 00:32:45,876 Speaker 1: They play in the morning to the evening and it'd 499 00:32:45,876 --> 00:32:49,836 Speaker 1: be that same pose all day. But you know, I 500 00:32:49,996 --> 00:32:52,716 Speaker 1: know there was something that was changing, but it was 501 00:32:52,916 --> 00:32:56,916 Speaker 1: always that groove. Yeah. Instead of one nation undergroove, it's 502 00:32:56,956 --> 00:33:02,596 Speaker 1: one groove over the nation, really over the planet. Now 503 00:33:05,196 --> 00:33:07,276 Speaker 1: we have to take another quick break and then we'll 504 00:33:07,316 --> 00:33:14,236 Speaker 1: be back with more from George Clinton. We're back with 505 00:33:14,276 --> 00:33:18,836 Speaker 1: the rest of Rick Rubin's conversation with the legend George Clinton. Yeah, 506 00:33:18,836 --> 00:33:22,836 Speaker 1: it's amazing the power of a groove. I think that's 507 00:33:23,196 --> 00:33:26,916 Speaker 1: for me. That's the thing that separates funk from the 508 00:33:27,036 --> 00:33:29,476 Speaker 1: music that came before it is that the music that 509 00:33:29,516 --> 00:33:35,316 Speaker 1: came before it relied on the melody, relied on the words. 510 00:33:36,476 --> 00:33:41,116 Speaker 1: But once once we got to the groove being the 511 00:33:41,276 --> 00:33:46,476 Speaker 1: dominant element of the music where it didn't even matter 512 00:33:46,516 --> 00:33:48,836 Speaker 1: if if it was a song on top, because a lot, 513 00:33:48,876 --> 00:33:51,636 Speaker 1: I mean for a lot of James Brown songs, they're interchangeable. 514 00:33:52,116 --> 00:33:56,196 Speaker 1: It's just the groove. Yeah, Yeah, James, James could switch 515 00:33:56,276 --> 00:34:00,196 Speaker 1: from one groove to the other one so precise that 516 00:34:00,396 --> 00:34:03,916 Speaker 1: you forgot about the first groove instantly. Yeah, I know. 517 00:34:03,996 --> 00:34:07,636 Speaker 1: They can change timpoles and things and in one and 518 00:34:07,836 --> 00:34:11,156 Speaker 1: start another one when a scene in it, but a 519 00:34:11,156 --> 00:34:15,276 Speaker 1: complete different field. It was almost like a drum machine. Yeah. 520 00:34:16,076 --> 00:34:20,636 Speaker 1: Matter of fact, the drum machine enhanced the grooves a lot. 521 00:34:20,796 --> 00:34:23,876 Speaker 1: Once um one thing he was able to lock in 522 00:34:23,996 --> 00:34:27,876 Speaker 1: on the clock. With the drum machine, you could group 523 00:34:27,996 --> 00:34:31,756 Speaker 1: yours because you knew that wasn't gonna change, and you 524 00:34:31,756 --> 00:34:35,196 Speaker 1: can just write everything around it, which is uh had 525 00:34:35,236 --> 00:34:36,996 Speaker 1: a lot to do with a lot of what hip 526 00:34:37,036 --> 00:34:39,876 Speaker 1: hop was doing. Once they was able to do that 527 00:34:40,116 --> 00:34:44,556 Speaker 1: lock in those samples with those beats and you know what, 528 00:34:44,676 --> 00:34:47,316 Speaker 1: it was gonna stay. But the beats per minuted and 529 00:34:47,396 --> 00:34:50,196 Speaker 1: all of that. You could just do any kind of 530 00:34:50,356 --> 00:34:52,636 Speaker 1: pocket over top of that, and if you got a 531 00:34:52,716 --> 00:34:56,116 Speaker 1: good you know, rhythm in your voice and like somebody 532 00:34:56,116 --> 00:34:59,356 Speaker 1: like say rock him, I mean he was the smooth 533 00:34:59,396 --> 00:35:03,316 Speaker 1: as I know against the beats that that they lock into. 534 00:35:04,956 --> 00:35:08,996 Speaker 1: Did you ever get to meet James? Oh yeah, yeah, 535 00:35:09,236 --> 00:35:11,796 Speaker 1: what was he like? I never got to meet him. 536 00:35:11,916 --> 00:35:14,676 Speaker 1: It was funny when I first met the Chili Peppers, 537 00:35:15,876 --> 00:35:21,916 Speaker 1: James myself. Madonna was on a pound together for silverman 538 00:35:22,756 --> 00:35:27,596 Speaker 1: Um New Music Seminar Music Seminar, right, and that's where 539 00:35:27,916 --> 00:35:30,156 Speaker 1: the Chili Peppers said. James and I was on the 540 00:35:30,156 --> 00:35:34,196 Speaker 1: panels together, and I tried to be cocky and you know, 541 00:35:34,316 --> 00:35:37,116 Speaker 1: say something funny. So I say, James Brown, give me 542 00:35:37,636 --> 00:35:44,556 Speaker 1: eighteen splits, and Mama goat up and did eighteen splits. Wow, 543 00:35:44,916 --> 00:35:49,436 Speaker 1: and then said George Clinton, give me two. I got 544 00:35:49,436 --> 00:35:53,036 Speaker 1: one of them. I couldn't get up on my nuts 545 00:35:55,876 --> 00:35:59,556 Speaker 1: now that the first time, you know, Flee and Anthony 546 00:35:59,596 --> 00:36:02,396 Speaker 1: and him asked me what I do a record with him? 547 00:36:02,636 --> 00:36:05,116 Speaker 1: Was that a fun experience for you? Working with those guys? 548 00:36:06,356 --> 00:36:10,116 Speaker 1: Oh my god, it was fun. You know. They came 549 00:36:10,116 --> 00:36:13,236 Speaker 1: out to the farm and they were like really kids, 550 00:36:14,036 --> 00:36:15,796 Speaker 1: you know, and I forgot what it was like to 551 00:36:15,876 --> 00:36:19,796 Speaker 1: be really kids. And at the time, you know, I 552 00:36:19,796 --> 00:36:21,756 Speaker 1: guess they had they a little fan club. People knew 553 00:36:21,796 --> 00:36:25,116 Speaker 1: him about then already, and so I had to get 554 00:36:25,156 --> 00:36:28,276 Speaker 1: them into talenting for the weekend and let him out 555 00:36:28,276 --> 00:36:31,556 Speaker 1: of the weekend do our recording and let him out 556 00:36:31,556 --> 00:36:35,476 Speaker 1: and then they go party in Detroit. That's great, but 557 00:36:35,636 --> 00:36:39,436 Speaker 1: we had lots of fun. I think it was fleeing out, 558 00:36:39,836 --> 00:36:44,116 Speaker 1: went to see a Wreatha. Wow, you know, friend of 559 00:36:44,196 --> 00:36:50,716 Speaker 1: mine took us in his white roses pimp player and 560 00:36:50,756 --> 00:36:53,196 Speaker 1: they they were just having the fun of their life 561 00:36:53,236 --> 00:36:57,116 Speaker 1: and took us and took him to meet a Wreatha 562 00:36:57,156 --> 00:37:01,476 Speaker 1: and a sister at ball And was it a concert 563 00:37:01,556 --> 00:37:03,276 Speaker 1: or was it more like a regular thing where she 564 00:37:03,316 --> 00:37:06,116 Speaker 1: would just get up sometimes? No? No, this was this 565 00:37:06,236 --> 00:37:09,516 Speaker 1: was a contrt because she was really being and hunt 566 00:37:09,596 --> 00:37:14,316 Speaker 1: at that time. In a matter of fact, her and 567 00:37:14,316 --> 00:37:18,276 Speaker 1: Annie Lennox did a record during that same period of 568 00:37:19,276 --> 00:37:23,556 Speaker 1: sisters doing it for themselves or something. Yeah, they did 569 00:37:23,636 --> 00:37:26,556 Speaker 1: that record, matter of fact, in the same studio at 570 00:37:26,556 --> 00:37:29,436 Speaker 1: the same time we were there. There was some crossover 571 00:37:29,516 --> 00:37:32,676 Speaker 1: between musicians between James's band and your band. How did that? 572 00:37:32,916 --> 00:37:37,916 Speaker 1: How did those things come about? Um? Boots Boots. He 573 00:37:37,956 --> 00:37:42,156 Speaker 1: had been with James and they was called the house 574 00:37:42,196 --> 00:37:45,076 Speaker 1: guests when we ran into him, and that was the 575 00:37:45,196 --> 00:37:47,476 Speaker 1: rhythm sector, him and his brother in the rhythm section. 576 00:37:47,996 --> 00:37:52,156 Speaker 1: And I guess they just left James about six months 577 00:37:52,276 --> 00:37:57,316 Speaker 1: or so, and they the girls, Mallian Franklin said, just 578 00:37:57,396 --> 00:38:00,396 Speaker 1: got bootsy. He looked like a funka Delhi And so 579 00:38:00,676 --> 00:38:04,196 Speaker 1: she brought him around him we've met, and Danny looked 580 00:38:04,196 --> 00:38:07,076 Speaker 1: definitely looked like a funka Delhi, And then we played 581 00:38:07,076 --> 00:38:11,396 Speaker 1: a show and he came around hung out, and then 582 00:38:11,796 --> 00:38:14,156 Speaker 1: we just got together and did a couple of that 583 00:38:14,356 --> 00:38:17,196 Speaker 1: up for the Downstake album. We did some songs for that, 584 00:38:17,796 --> 00:38:19,916 Speaker 1: and by the next time we get rid of to 585 00:38:19,956 --> 00:38:23,756 Speaker 1: the next record, you say, Mason and Fred, Michelle and 586 00:38:23,796 --> 00:38:26,956 Speaker 1: Fred had left until he called him and to do 587 00:38:27,076 --> 00:38:31,636 Speaker 1: the session. They all had left. James by the time that, um, 588 00:38:31,796 --> 00:38:34,596 Speaker 1: they came around. There wasn't never There wasn't no thing 589 00:38:34,716 --> 00:38:37,876 Speaker 1: between me and James about that. A lot of people 590 00:38:37,876 --> 00:38:40,596 Speaker 1: thought that there was some words or something. Now we 591 00:38:40,636 --> 00:38:47,196 Speaker 1: actually recorded together him, Boots and myself and Gary Cooper afterwards, 592 00:38:47,956 --> 00:38:51,036 Speaker 1: you know, after that came out on the Family series. 593 00:38:51,396 --> 00:38:55,596 Speaker 1: But yeah, no, we never had any He's funny dude, 594 00:38:55,636 --> 00:38:59,436 Speaker 1: but he was. He was mister Brown. Did you call 595 00:38:59,516 --> 00:39:03,596 Speaker 1: him mister Brown? No, I'm not called him James. He 596 00:39:03,676 --> 00:39:08,036 Speaker 1: was kind of scary. He thought I was crazy. Michelle 597 00:39:08,076 --> 00:39:12,396 Speaker 1: told him, Joe, he think you're crazy, skinner, use it. 598 00:39:12,636 --> 00:39:15,756 Speaker 1: Don't let him out the hook man. So I always 599 00:39:16,076 --> 00:39:20,676 Speaker 1: always played crazy around him, you know, like a Slide 600 00:39:20,716 --> 00:39:23,796 Speaker 1: would wear him out. Though Slide would pick you know, 601 00:39:23,836 --> 00:39:26,076 Speaker 1: we pick out him, you know, just the hell of it. 602 00:39:27,156 --> 00:39:31,116 Speaker 1: You know, I think Roger and Boots, what's calling the 603 00:39:31,196 --> 00:39:36,596 Speaker 1: mister Brown? And Slide would be like, ain't called him, no, 604 00:39:36,676 --> 00:39:41,796 Speaker 1: mister Brown. Let call you Henna call you mister Brown. 605 00:39:42,236 --> 00:39:49,356 Speaker 1: They gonna call me mister Oh. He was a clown. 606 00:39:50,516 --> 00:39:54,076 Speaker 1: That's so funny. I'm gonna tell you a funny story. 607 00:39:54,356 --> 00:39:58,756 Speaker 1: This is probably I don't know. I'm gonna say eighteen 608 00:39:58,916 --> 00:40:01,956 Speaker 1: or so years ago, a friend of mine came to 609 00:40:02,036 --> 00:40:03,836 Speaker 1: my house and he said, I want to show you 610 00:40:03,876 --> 00:40:06,636 Speaker 1: this new thing and it was YouTube. I'd never heard 611 00:40:06,636 --> 00:40:10,116 Speaker 1: of YouTube. It was just in its infant see and 612 00:40:10,156 --> 00:40:11,916 Speaker 1: he said, I want to show you this thing. And 613 00:40:11,956 --> 00:40:18,116 Speaker 1: then the first video he showed me was Funkadelic from 614 00:40:18,836 --> 00:40:21,956 Speaker 1: it seemed like even older than the thing that I said, 615 00:40:21,956 --> 00:40:24,236 Speaker 1: with the hots like it was in a like a 616 00:40:24,356 --> 00:40:31,596 Speaker 1: local TV station maybe in Detroit, Cleveland, Cleveland. It was unbelievable. 617 00:40:31,676 --> 00:40:35,196 Speaker 1: And that was my introduction to YouTube, was that video. 618 00:40:35,876 --> 00:40:39,156 Speaker 1: And it made me love YouTube like it was. It 619 00:40:39,236 --> 00:40:41,956 Speaker 1: wasn't that YouTube was great. It was that I got 620 00:40:41,956 --> 00:40:47,236 Speaker 1: to see this funkadelic thing that I didn't never knew existed. Yeah, 621 00:40:47,276 --> 00:40:51,036 Speaker 1: that's when I was crawling around on the floor. Yeah yeah, yeah. 622 00:40:51,156 --> 00:40:55,676 Speaker 1: That was in Boston. That's a Brothers or something like that. 623 00:40:55,916 --> 00:41:00,876 Speaker 1: But the other one, just like that, is Upbeat in Cleveland, Ohio. 624 00:41:01,116 --> 00:41:04,116 Speaker 1: It looked like it was on a TV set, but 625 00:41:04,276 --> 00:41:08,196 Speaker 1: we was playing live. Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah. It was incredible. 626 00:41:09,356 --> 00:41:12,396 Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, that was that was we actually did those 627 00:41:12,476 --> 00:41:17,956 Speaker 1: kind of shows live on on regular TVs because you know, 628 00:41:17,996 --> 00:41:21,876 Speaker 1: its psychedelic. You can actually get away with that, you know. 629 00:41:22,396 --> 00:41:24,756 Speaker 1: And then there's another video that they came that came 630 00:41:24,756 --> 00:41:28,436 Speaker 1: out years later. It was a cosmic slot. We was 631 00:41:28,476 --> 00:41:32,276 Speaker 1: in Central Park, running through the tunnels in the city. 632 00:41:32,836 --> 00:41:35,996 Speaker 1: You know. It was that was like we were tripping 633 00:41:35,996 --> 00:41:39,916 Speaker 1: the I ass off and that they never came out 634 00:41:39,956 --> 00:41:42,636 Speaker 1: to years later to you know, years after that record 635 00:41:42,716 --> 00:41:44,876 Speaker 1: was out, but it's one of the first things you 636 00:41:44,956 --> 00:41:49,116 Speaker 1: see on as Funkadelic when you look up on YouTube. Now, 637 00:41:49,796 --> 00:41:54,516 Speaker 1: has it always been fun making music for you? Oh yeah, 638 00:41:54,676 --> 00:41:59,316 Speaker 1: I mean even now dealing with my grandkids and figuring 639 00:41:59,356 --> 00:42:02,916 Speaker 1: out how they do that, the new things and being 640 00:42:02,956 --> 00:42:05,956 Speaker 1: a part of that with Oh yeah, that's the fun 641 00:42:06,036 --> 00:42:08,916 Speaker 1: part of it. Trying to come up with some different 642 00:42:09,236 --> 00:42:13,556 Speaker 1: being being involved. How did the idea for changing the 643 00:42:13,636 --> 00:42:17,436 Speaker 1: song structures, because like, coming from duop, song structures were 644 00:42:17,516 --> 00:42:21,556 Speaker 1: more traditional. And then when when you moved into funk, 645 00:42:21,876 --> 00:42:25,716 Speaker 1: it broke free. Tell me about that, Well that was it, 646 00:42:25,836 --> 00:42:30,076 Speaker 1: you know, coming from all those songwriting days of the fifties. 647 00:42:30,116 --> 00:42:32,516 Speaker 1: You know, you had to write a structured song, two 648 00:42:32,716 --> 00:42:37,716 Speaker 1: verses of bridge and another version out. That started changing 649 00:42:38,316 --> 00:42:42,436 Speaker 1: when they started becoming having your own band, especially if 650 00:42:42,436 --> 00:42:46,716 Speaker 1: you've around when Jimmy was playing, or Grateful Dead or 651 00:42:47,436 --> 00:42:49,836 Speaker 1: all those groups. Was just rock and roll into the 652 00:42:50,356 --> 00:42:52,676 Speaker 1: you trip it out, need to wake up and go 653 00:42:52,716 --> 00:42:55,116 Speaker 1: to sleep with music playing and wake up at the 654 00:42:55,156 --> 00:42:58,596 Speaker 1: same song playing. That was the whole thing of the 655 00:42:58,756 --> 00:43:02,876 Speaker 1: rock and roll grooved. And then when we got back 656 00:43:02,956 --> 00:43:07,716 Speaker 1: into funk from the James Brown point, you know, only 657 00:43:07,836 --> 00:43:11,996 Speaker 1: one and that was back into the you know, the 658 00:43:12,276 --> 00:43:15,636 Speaker 1: long pockets and Boost had a lot of changes in 659 00:43:15,716 --> 00:43:18,756 Speaker 1: the songs that I would take out you don't have 660 00:43:18,836 --> 00:43:22,396 Speaker 1: to record. He liked a lot of breaks, you know, 661 00:43:22,716 --> 00:43:26,996 Speaker 1: but that pocket I fell in love with, and then 662 00:43:27,596 --> 00:43:30,636 Speaker 1: that just became the thing, just trying to make it 663 00:43:31,076 --> 00:43:34,756 Speaker 1: loop by itself, you know, get into a loop and then, 664 00:43:34,836 --> 00:43:37,596 Speaker 1: like I said, when the hip hop came and could 665 00:43:37,676 --> 00:43:40,476 Speaker 1: only focus on the one, you know everything, the example 666 00:43:40,676 --> 00:43:43,916 Speaker 1: was in you Know one too, you know even time 667 00:43:43,956 --> 00:43:48,756 Speaker 1: and no beat breaks, and so that made you really 668 00:43:48,836 --> 00:43:52,316 Speaker 1: lock into the one. But you know, by the time 669 00:43:52,356 --> 00:43:55,756 Speaker 1: we did something like Atomic Dog, we could go crazy 670 00:43:55,836 --> 00:43:58,756 Speaker 1: around the track. Even though it was backwards, we could 671 00:43:58,796 --> 00:44:02,316 Speaker 1: still It's still that group. That's like one of the 672 00:44:02,396 --> 00:44:05,876 Speaker 1: hardest groups that we have, you know, it's the Atomic Dog. 673 00:44:07,276 --> 00:44:10,396 Speaker 1: We just did another version on the que Dog version 674 00:44:11,036 --> 00:44:14,396 Speaker 1: of Tommy Dog. It is phenomenal. Way to you see 675 00:44:14,396 --> 00:44:19,036 Speaker 1: this thing, I can't wait video is crazy in some ways. Also, 676 00:44:19,676 --> 00:44:25,516 Speaker 1: disco was another movement that really unified the pocket. It 677 00:44:25,596 --> 00:44:29,396 Speaker 1: was the whole movement was about the pocket. The same pocket, 678 00:44:30,196 --> 00:44:34,516 Speaker 1: danceable pocket again. That's where it like that like a 679 00:44:34,636 --> 00:44:39,996 Speaker 1: drum machine came in and locked it one he wants 680 00:44:40,036 --> 00:44:43,796 Speaker 1: to That was, you know, all of the trump music 681 00:44:43,996 --> 00:44:47,276 Speaker 1: like that came in with a pocket. After that, you mean, 682 00:44:47,756 --> 00:44:51,556 Speaker 1: like the disco I should like a remember Fly Robin Fly, Yeah, 683 00:44:51,916 --> 00:44:58,076 Speaker 1: sil Silvil conventions that stuff like Blew Me Away, Yeah, 684 00:44:58,236 --> 00:45:01,996 Speaker 1: I Feel Love, Donna Summer, Donna Summers. I mean, you know, 685 00:45:02,036 --> 00:45:04,836 Speaker 1: we just with Neil at that time. So we had 686 00:45:04,836 --> 00:45:10,676 Speaker 1: a thing going with with Neil, Donna, Summer's Kiss and Ourselves. Wow. 687 00:45:10,876 --> 00:45:13,316 Speaker 1: You know, that was his new label. That's when he 688 00:45:13,356 --> 00:45:15,636 Speaker 1: had just thought his new label, you know. And I 689 00:45:15,676 --> 00:45:19,836 Speaker 1: had been knowing him since his Buddha days, so we 690 00:45:19,956 --> 00:45:23,116 Speaker 1: knew we had the thing captured with him because he 691 00:45:23,156 --> 00:45:26,316 Speaker 1: had the promotion and we had a spaceship and we 692 00:45:26,356 --> 00:45:30,116 Speaker 1: had that pocket. Talk about how important radio was back then, 693 00:45:30,796 --> 00:45:33,716 Speaker 1: well it was every radio was everything. You know, you 694 00:45:33,756 --> 00:45:35,796 Speaker 1: had to go from the R and B and to cross. 695 00:45:35,876 --> 00:45:39,036 Speaker 1: So when too, we were lucky. If you was in Detroit, 696 00:45:39,676 --> 00:45:42,796 Speaker 1: there had been a good relationship between you know, a 697 00:45:42,836 --> 00:45:47,116 Speaker 1: lot of R and B records in this label station KLW, 698 00:45:47,596 --> 00:45:51,076 Speaker 1: which was in the Windsor. You know, if you got 699 00:45:51,076 --> 00:45:53,076 Speaker 1: a good record in Detroit, you could get on Windsor 700 00:45:53,356 --> 00:45:55,436 Speaker 1: and you had a good shot to get half of 701 00:45:55,436 --> 00:45:59,476 Speaker 1: the country. Wow. So that's what Motown was doing. Everyone 702 00:45:59,556 --> 00:46:01,476 Speaker 1: they put a record out and they got it going, 703 00:46:01,556 --> 00:46:04,836 Speaker 1: They get it on k l W, and they was 704 00:46:04,916 --> 00:46:07,636 Speaker 1: on the charts all over the country. We had a 705 00:46:07,636 --> 00:46:11,636 Speaker 1: good relationship with stations myself because I went to the 706 00:46:11,636 --> 00:46:14,756 Speaker 1: station with the distributor every time he took a record 707 00:46:14,796 --> 00:46:18,316 Speaker 1: to to the legislation. I would go as a you know, 708 00:46:18,436 --> 00:46:22,356 Speaker 1: guest artist and talked to the DJ and so I 709 00:46:22,356 --> 00:46:24,836 Speaker 1: had a pretty good relation with them. So by the 710 00:46:24,836 --> 00:46:27,596 Speaker 1: time we got back when Neil, what I want to 711 00:46:27,636 --> 00:46:30,636 Speaker 1: say is when he come up with this label called 712 00:46:30,636 --> 00:46:35,036 Speaker 1: Castle Blanca, we signed with him, Donna's signed with him, 713 00:46:35,116 --> 00:46:38,276 Speaker 1: and Kiss. We all signed at the same time. And 714 00:46:38,916 --> 00:46:42,516 Speaker 1: the first time he put out Donna's Kissed, it didn't 715 00:46:42,516 --> 00:46:45,956 Speaker 1: work at first, but then we put out Chocolate City 716 00:46:45,956 --> 00:46:51,516 Speaker 1: and Mothership it worked, and then Donna's worked, then Kiss 717 00:46:51,556 --> 00:46:55,236 Speaker 1: the fan club. Things start working, you know, and the 718 00:46:55,436 --> 00:46:59,796 Speaker 1: label was phenomenal. They're doing a movie of that right now, 719 00:47:00,316 --> 00:47:04,636 Speaker 1: and which Collegia's playing myself. Oh great, that'll be great. 720 00:47:05,036 --> 00:47:07,756 Speaker 1: My grandkids are in the movie. My kids are in 721 00:47:07,756 --> 00:47:12,556 Speaker 1: the movie. They're playing Parliament Funkadelic. So cool. I can't 722 00:47:12,556 --> 00:47:16,276 Speaker 1: wait to check that out. Yes next month. How did 723 00:47:16,316 --> 00:47:19,676 Speaker 1: the concept for the Mothership come? What do you remember 724 00:47:19,716 --> 00:47:24,916 Speaker 1: about that Pink Floyd? You know, I had watched them, 725 00:47:25,356 --> 00:47:29,116 Speaker 1: you know, become so big with their production of their show, 726 00:47:30,516 --> 00:47:34,276 Speaker 1: you know, and how long there was on the charts forever, 727 00:47:35,556 --> 00:47:39,196 Speaker 1: you know, and I wanted to do something like that. 728 00:47:39,236 --> 00:47:42,836 Speaker 1: Because Friends of Ours was in Remember to play here, 729 00:47:44,716 --> 00:47:47,556 Speaker 1: Prince Bower was in the place. So I realized that 730 00:47:48,156 --> 00:47:49,556 Speaker 1: we had to be more than a group. We had 731 00:47:49,556 --> 00:47:53,236 Speaker 1: to be like a Broadway play or big production or 732 00:47:53,276 --> 00:47:57,676 Speaker 1: something to elevate past the concept of being a band 733 00:47:57,876 --> 00:48:01,436 Speaker 1: or group. And so I said, I wanted to get 734 00:48:01,516 --> 00:48:06,276 Speaker 1: a prop that was bigger than did anything anybody had done. 735 00:48:06,596 --> 00:48:10,116 Speaker 1: You know, Broadway was the when they found most of 736 00:48:10,116 --> 00:48:13,076 Speaker 1: the props that So we got a guy, Jules Fisher, 737 00:48:13,236 --> 00:48:16,556 Speaker 1: off a Broadway that was doing Broadway plays, to dud 738 00:48:16,676 --> 00:48:19,316 Speaker 1: build the Mothership. And that's after I went to Neil 739 00:48:19,836 --> 00:48:24,436 Speaker 1: No One. Neil was a promotion and promotion free and 740 00:48:24,436 --> 00:48:27,556 Speaker 1: and you know, and we have a hit record already. 741 00:48:27,796 --> 00:48:30,716 Speaker 1: The Mothership was a hit record, and we knew that, 742 00:48:31,156 --> 00:48:34,916 Speaker 1: and we said, you get me a spaceship. I'll be 743 00:48:34,956 --> 00:48:38,276 Speaker 1: able to bring the next two or three albums, you know, 744 00:48:38,396 --> 00:48:41,196 Speaker 1: with the promotion of the spaceship. You know, he ain't 745 00:48:41,196 --> 00:48:44,836 Speaker 1: gonlasted just one album, and he knew, he knew what 746 00:48:44,876 --> 00:48:47,076 Speaker 1: I was saying, and he got hooked me over the bank, 747 00:48:47,636 --> 00:48:50,596 Speaker 1: got me a collateral loan, and we got to the 748 00:48:50,716 --> 00:48:56,116 Speaker 1: Spaceship and all the costuming was the explicit part of it, 749 00:48:56,156 --> 00:49:00,916 Speaker 1: those leather costumes. We vote, was Sunrit inspirational at all? 750 00:49:01,036 --> 00:49:06,036 Speaker 1: Or no? Oh yeah, definitely he was inspirational and the concept. 751 00:49:06,116 --> 00:49:09,596 Speaker 1: But I was in the Star Trek already. I was 752 00:49:09,636 --> 00:49:14,996 Speaker 1: a Star Trek freak for days. So it was about that. 753 00:49:15,196 --> 00:49:18,076 Speaker 1: And then do the play. I knew it had to 754 00:49:18,116 --> 00:49:20,436 Speaker 1: have a theme behind it. So the theme was to 755 00:49:20,516 --> 00:49:23,636 Speaker 1: travel to bring the flunk to the planet, you know, 756 00:49:24,276 --> 00:49:27,436 Speaker 1: and Sunri was doing that. A lot of jazz musicians 757 00:49:27,996 --> 00:49:33,036 Speaker 1: was doing that, you know, intergalactic concept. And tell me 758 00:49:33,076 --> 00:49:38,676 Speaker 1: about when did you first meet Bambada? Wow? You know 759 00:49:38,756 --> 00:49:41,956 Speaker 1: he had to be he had to be about fourteen 760 00:49:43,036 --> 00:49:47,236 Speaker 1: something like that, and that ever have been since seventy 761 00:49:48,156 --> 00:49:54,756 Speaker 1: seven seventy six, wow, something like that. And I just 762 00:49:54,956 --> 00:49:59,196 Speaker 1: know by the time we got the album about Uncle Jam. 763 00:49:59,996 --> 00:50:02,236 Speaker 1: If you look on the back of Uncle Jam's album, 764 00:50:03,196 --> 00:50:05,796 Speaker 1: we have the names about fans on that, you know, 765 00:50:05,836 --> 00:50:09,196 Speaker 1: because we had a fan club for each city. And 766 00:50:09,636 --> 00:50:13,676 Speaker 1: after about it is a b his name is first 767 00:50:15,516 --> 00:50:19,636 Speaker 1: New York. Amazing years later when he thought when he 768 00:50:19,716 --> 00:50:23,836 Speaker 1: thought without music, you know, we always connected like through 769 00:50:23,836 --> 00:50:27,996 Speaker 1: the fan club thing. Already, I didn't know what the 770 00:50:28,636 --> 00:50:31,276 Speaker 1: electronic go to hip hop thing they was doing yet 771 00:50:31,596 --> 00:50:34,716 Speaker 1: I was just getting familiar with it, you know. It 772 00:50:34,796 --> 00:50:38,596 Speaker 1: was like part electronic, part rap, part hip hop. I 773 00:50:38,676 --> 00:50:41,956 Speaker 1: didn't know what they were calling it yet. Yeah, but yeah, 774 00:50:41,516 --> 00:50:46,996 Speaker 1: we stayed in even when they got the Zulu Nation. Yeah. 775 00:50:47,036 --> 00:50:50,756 Speaker 1: And the Soul Sonic Force was very much inspired by 776 00:50:51,076 --> 00:50:54,996 Speaker 1: by the Mothership very much. Yeah. They looked like they 777 00:50:54,996 --> 00:50:58,076 Speaker 1: could have been in the band, in your band, yeah, 778 00:50:58,196 --> 00:51:01,916 Speaker 1: I mean yeah, Yeah. Isn't it amazing how like you're 779 00:51:01,956 --> 00:51:04,476 Speaker 1: a fan of something that it inspires you, and then 780 00:51:04,516 --> 00:51:06,756 Speaker 1: you make something new, and then when the new thing 781 00:51:06,756 --> 00:51:09,076 Speaker 1: comes out, people think it's this new thing. There's never 782 00:51:09,236 --> 00:51:12,156 Speaker 1: been anything like it. But all of the roots, like 783 00:51:12,236 --> 00:51:14,276 Speaker 1: in all the things you've done, the roots of the 784 00:51:14,276 --> 00:51:16,996 Speaker 1: things that are in it from before, whether it be 785 00:51:17,076 --> 00:51:19,156 Speaker 1: Pink Floyd, which I never would have guessed in a 786 00:51:19,236 --> 00:51:22,716 Speaker 1: million years, or Sunride, which I would have guessed because 787 00:51:22,956 --> 00:51:27,996 Speaker 1: of space is the place. It's just amazing how through 788 00:51:28,276 --> 00:51:32,716 Speaker 1: our love of these things we make something new. Now 789 00:51:32,796 --> 00:51:35,156 Speaker 1: I'll tell you something else. You know, I've been doing 790 00:51:35,196 --> 00:51:38,756 Speaker 1: paint lately, you know, fine art paint. Didn't know we're 791 00:51:38,796 --> 00:51:43,076 Speaker 1: gonna be at the Mint with Blon Osley. She check 792 00:51:43,116 --> 00:51:47,236 Speaker 1: her out. She's a new artist. Her theme is on 793 00:51:47,316 --> 00:51:51,796 Speaker 1: the metaphor of the funk. You know, the pyramids with 794 00:51:52,636 --> 00:51:57,636 Speaker 1: trumbipulated noses. It's gonna be at the Midas. Check it out. 795 00:51:57,956 --> 00:52:02,276 Speaker 1: I definitely will. Beautiful cool Man. Well, it's a pleasure 796 00:52:02,276 --> 00:52:06,396 Speaker 1: talking to you as always. Thanks Man, take care, I 797 00:52:06,516 --> 00:52:12,116 Speaker 1: love you. I'll see you soon, see little Way. Thanks 798 00:52:12,116 --> 00:52:14,996 Speaker 1: again to the one and only George Clinton for hopping 799 00:52:15,036 --> 00:52:17,036 Speaker 1: on zoom with Rick. You can hear all of our 800 00:52:17,036 --> 00:52:20,476 Speaker 1: favorite parliament Funkadelic and pe funk adjacent songs on the 801 00:52:20,516 --> 00:52:24,676 Speaker 1: playlist at broken Record podcast dot com. You can subscribe 802 00:52:24,716 --> 00:52:27,716 Speaker 1: to our YouTube channel at YouTube dot com slash Broken 803 00:52:27,756 --> 00:52:30,596 Speaker 1: Record Podcast, where can find all of our new episodes. 804 00:52:31,316 --> 00:52:34,916 Speaker 1: You can follow us on Twitter at broken Record. Broken 805 00:52:34,916 --> 00:52:38,796 Speaker 1: Record is produced with Helpful Lea Rose, Jason Gambrell, Bentaladay, 806 00:52:38,956 --> 00:52:43,476 Speaker 1: and Eric Sandler. Our editor is Sophie Crane. Broken Record 807 00:52:43,556 --> 00:52:46,116 Speaker 1: is a production of Pushkin Industries. 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