Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, Podcasts, radio news. Bloomberg Tech is alive
Speaker 1: from coast to coast with Caroline Hyde in New York
Speaker 1: and vow In sent Francisco.
Speaker 2: This is Bloomberg Tech coming up.
Speaker 3: Concerns keep rising around anthropics new AI model mythos as
Speaker 3: US officials won Wall Street that the tool could usher
Speaker 3: in an era of cyber risk.
Speaker 4: Plus, we speak with Roblox CEO David Zooki as the
Speaker 4: company introduces special accounts for younger children and teens.
Speaker 3: And we recap the historic trip around the Moon and
Speaker 3: back after the Artemis two cruise splashed down safely on
Speaker 3: Friday evening.
Speaker 4: And ed on Friday evening, we were wrapping up a
Speaker 4: week for the stock market that was the best. That's
Speaker 4: November on the NaSTA one hundred, and some of that
Speaker 4: cautious risk on attitude still sits with us on the
Speaker 4: NAST one hundred today. As we see the oil is
Speaker 4: thrusting higher. Why then the optimism in markets when the
Speaker 4: inflatory pressure is clear, and that very sensitive view on
Speaker 4: a CEASFI just clings in the balance. As we understand,
Speaker 4: the US does move to blockade and the straight off
Speaker 4: hor moos I'm looking at oil as we see just
Speaker 4: another five percent on the day.
Speaker 5: Ed.
Speaker 3: Okay, let's get the latest details on Iran and the
Speaker 3: administration Frolomber Washington correspondent Tyler Kendall. Tyler go through the
Speaker 3: content of the president's true Social post that came just
Speaker 3: after ten am Eastern time and give us the latest
Speaker 3: of the situation, particularly with the straight of horror moves
Speaker 3: and with Iran.
Speaker 6: Hey and well at this point, this new threat coming
Speaker 6: from President Trump aren't True Social saying that if any
Speaker 6: of Iran's attack ships come near the US IS blockade,
Speaker 6: then they will be quote immediately eliminated. This comes after
Speaker 6: a flurry of comments from Iranian officials this morning saying
Speaker 6: that the country is preparing to take action if it's
Speaker 6: shipping is threatened, including threatening to hit ports in the
Speaker 6: Persian Gulf. Pair that with a statement last night from
Speaker 6: the IRGC saying that if any US military vessels enter
Speaker 6: into the Strait of Hermus, Iran would view that as
Speaker 6: violation of the ceasefire agreement. Now we have gotten a
Speaker 6: few more details from the administration about this blockade, including
Speaker 6: in a notice scene by Bloomberg News saying that if
Speaker 6: any of Ran. If any ship is left in Iranian waters,
Speaker 6: they could be subject to quote interception, diversion, and capture.
Speaker 6: US Central Command had outlined that this blockade will extend
Speaker 6: to all Iranian ports up and down the coast, including
Speaker 6: to the east of the Strait of Hermus. However, those
Speaker 6: vessels that are not going to or from Iranian ports
Speaker 6: will ultimately not be part of this. However, we should
Speaker 6: mention that they may still be subject for search of
Speaker 6: the presence of contraband cargo. And this comes amid of
Speaker 6: course a massive military build up by the US and
Speaker 6: the region. The US currently has about twenty warships that
Speaker 6: they could deploy for this operation. But as you were
Speaker 6: alluding to at the top of this program, there does
Speaker 6: seem to still be hope that negotiates could be ongoing.
Speaker 6: President Trump did say in an interview yesterday that he
Speaker 6: felt that Roan would come to the negotiating table when
Speaker 6: it comes to the US's top issue of dismantling its
Speaker 6: nuclear program, And we heard from the Pakistani leader earlier
Speaker 6: today saying that those efforts to keep the dialogue up
Speaker 6: are still ongoing.
Speaker 4: Many a headline Tyler Kendall reads through it all for US,
Speaker 4: we so appreciate it. Look, with oil back above one
Speaker 4: hundred dollars, stocks while they've been wavering today still managing
Speaker 4: to cling onto gains. But President Trump is of course
Speaker 4: ordering that blockade of the straight Orf forward moves, and
Speaker 4: we want to give you the macro picture darkening, but
Speaker 4: also focus on some microews. Intel has managed to stage
Speaker 4: a record breaking comeback. For example, renumex Common Rhyinikey is
Speaker 4: here with a detail of what manages to outperform when
Speaker 4: the macrohead wind bloom large Intel extraordinary moves. I mean,
Speaker 4: it's hard to discuss war and conflict to one side
Speaker 4: and individual stocks, but we have to win the show.
Speaker 7: What you see, Yeah, well this stock has had really
Speaker 7: an incredible run. So it's up today for the ninth
Speaker 7: day in a row. This is more than fifty percent
Speaker 7: gain in that time.
Speaker 2: And it's had really.
Speaker 7: A spate of good news that's just gotten investor momentum
Speaker 7: back into shares.
Speaker 6: Here.
Speaker 7: So you had the news that they're buying back half
Speaker 7: of a plan in Ireland from a public global management.
Speaker 7: Then you go into the announcement that they're going to
Speaker 7: be with Terrifab, you know, to develop semiconductors for Tesla
Speaker 7: SpaceX and then they also announced a commitment for Alphabet's
Speaker 7: Google to use future generations of some of their processors
Speaker 7: in data centers. So these are all great things that
Speaker 7: investors are really looking for. They want more coming out
Speaker 7: of this company. They want to see sort of the
Speaker 7: turnaround taking place. And this is interesting because Intel's come
Speaker 7: off of a very choppy few years. It was up
Speaker 7: eighty percent last year, but down sixty percent the year before,
Speaker 7: and there's been just a lot of like an overhang.
Speaker 7: As you know, they got a new CEO and they're
Speaker 7: coming into this turnaround and we're starting to see some
Speaker 7: glimmers of hope there come.
Speaker 3: And it's data that I had to double check on
Speaker 3: the Bloomberg Tunnel, not because.
Speaker 2: I don't believe you. I do.
Speaker 3: It's unbelievable of itself, right, that level of gain over
Speaker 3: nine sessions, fifty three percent gain. But you make the
Speaker 3: point just building what you just said that actually last
Speaker 3: year was pretty good as well, and so there's a
Speaker 3: broader recovery story with Intel. What is the market saying
Speaker 3: about how they feel on the turnaround?
Speaker 7: Yeah, I mean, I think investors are really voting with
Speaker 7: their dollars here. They're feeling good, they're feeling like there's
Speaker 7: a progress being made, and they're looking really long term
Speaker 7: for this company going forward. I mean, I think it's
Speaker 7: important to point out that it does report results in
Speaker 7: two weeks, but investors are looking even more long term
Speaker 7: for progress in their foundry. They want to see more
Speaker 7: customers there and seeing that, you know, there really could
Speaker 7: be a lot of gains ahead. You know, one analyst
Speaker 7: that I spoke to you said there's more upside here
Speaker 7: potentially than in Vidia, just because we've seen such an
Speaker 7: incredible run for Nvidia. Intel's had an incredible run here,
Speaker 7: but there could be more to come. You know, it's
Speaker 7: still be below dot com era peak, So an interesting
Speaker 7: another milestone that we're watching.
Speaker 4: Isn't it funny that it was Jay Goldberg of Seaport
Speaker 4: who gave you that view, and he's the only cell
Speaker 4: rating really everyone in video, so that sort of supports
Speaker 4: is his bearish take on that company as well as
Speaker 4: bullish on Intel. But the rest of the ANAS community
Speaker 4: are a bit more mixed. So you paint a picture
Speaker 4: of this stock getting expensive.
Speaker 7: They yes, So the evaluation is actually quite high. It's
Speaker 7: trading let me say why I get this right. More
Speaker 7: than ninety times estimated earnings over the next twelve months.
Speaker 7: That's very high, especially when you think about the rest
Speaker 7: of sort of the semi space, and you know in Vidia,
Speaker 7: I think in Video is at about twenty one times
Speaker 7: forward earnings. The thing that I hear though from investors
Speaker 7: in analysts is that maybe it's not the right way
Speaker 7: to be looking at this stock right now. There are
Speaker 7: other things that make more sense if you're looking to
Speaker 7: invest than just this one measure of valuation.
Speaker 2: And for what it's worth.
Speaker 3: Intel up almost three percent in the session, ninth straight
Speaker 3: day of gains, longest streak of gains since September of
Speaker 3: twenty twenty three. Bloombers come and Ryani Key with the
Speaker 3: must read on the Bloomberg terminon dot com. Now coming
Speaker 3: up a conversation with Caris Fragg Hacker one CEO and
Speaker 3: Peter Singlehurst to Bailey Gifford on Anthropics' latest model mythos
Speaker 3: and in part it's soaring valuation that's next.
Speaker 2: This is Bloomberg Tech.
Speaker 3: Wall Street banks including JP Morgan, Goldman, Sachs, and Morgan
Speaker 3: Stanley are part of a small closed group with access
Speaker 3: to anthropics Mythos. They're testing the powerful new AI model
Speaker 3: to identify vulnerabilities and strengthen defenses. After Bloomberg reported the
Speaker 3: US officials warned Wall Street the myphos kudosher in a
Speaker 3: new era of cyber risk. Other global regulators are watching closely.
Speaker 3: Over the weekend, Bloomberg reported the Bank of England is
Speaker 3: preparing for its own talks on the potential dangers.
Speaker 2: Joining us to.
Speaker 3: Discuss is Cars Spragg's CEO of the cybersecurity firm Hacker one.
Speaker 3: And there is a great reason to have you onto
Speaker 3: the program to talk about mythos and the cybersecurity context
Speaker 3: because what Hacker one does, it's the biggest offer of
Speaker 3: bug bounties.
Speaker 8: Right.
Speaker 3: You pair companies all sorts with someone that can identify
Speaker 3: vulnerability and then in some cases suggests how to patch it.
Speaker 3: That's exactly how the banks are supposed to be using methos.
Speaker 3: And I wonder just initially your take on the model
Speaker 3: and what you know about it.
Speaker 9: Well, I think it's very exciting that we are starting
Speaker 9: to see capabilities where we can at scale identify vulnerabilities
Speaker 9: more quickly and use them in a defensive capability to
Speaker 9: eliminate that risk, and so this is a very great
Speaker 9: compliment to what we have in doing for decades, which
Speaker 9: is human driven vulnerability discovery. Where the bottleneck truly is
Speaker 9: though these days is no longer really with the vulnerability discovery,
Speaker 9: but it's much more in the back part of the
Speaker 9: find to fix cycle. It's how quickly can you validate
Speaker 9: that those vulnerabilities are truly exploitable and how quickly can
Speaker 9: you get them remediated?
Speaker 2: Kara.
Speaker 3: Last week I spoke to Mike Krieger, who co leads
Speaker 3: Anthropics Labs, and I tried to get him to just
Speaker 3: be succinct about why mythos is good in a cybersecurity context.
Speaker 2: Listen to what he had to say.
Speaker 10: You can't isolate a capability. I mean you probably could,
Speaker 10: you know, with enough effort, but that's typically these things
Speaker 10: kind of emerge. The fact that it is very good
Speaker 10: at solving general purpose coding problems and debugging and doing
Speaker 10: all the things that you'd want it to do in
Speaker 10: the ordinary course of practice also makes it really good
Speaker 10: for cybersecurity. It's really fascinating to actually watch it in
Speaker 10: practice in a moment like this one where you know
Speaker 10: it's not the revenue optimizing move in the short run,
Speaker 10: but I think it's absolutely the right one.
Speaker 3: If you can't isolate a model single capability in this
Speaker 3: case cyber, why is it so good in that domain?
Speaker 9: Well, I think about it as coding and building is
Speaker 9: one side of a coin and breaking is the other side,
Speaker 9: and they kind of go hand in hand.
Speaker 2: And one of the truly.
Speaker 9: Big advancements that Mythos has is this ability to chain
Speaker 9: together exploits and basically turn what could be multiple vulnerabilities
Speaker 9: into a much more critical or severe issue. And that
Speaker 9: is fundamentally building and putting something together across a number
Speaker 9: of building blocks.
Speaker 4: Can you, Kara just push back against pats some cynicism
Speaker 4: that's been building into the market about the power of Mythos,
Speaker 4: some saying look at benefits anthropic to make out that
Speaker 4: it's quite so powerful and actually it's not doing all
Speaker 4: that much new than was already out there, or indeed
Speaker 4: it's just more compute issue than actual shared terror. As
Speaker 4: to why they put it into the hands of a
Speaker 4: small amount of players articulate just how powerful this is.
Speaker 9: Well, I think the capabilities that are explained in the
Speaker 9: Mythos release are are quite good, and they're definitely in
Speaker 9: an advancement. The frontiers is certainly moving, and yes, some
Speaker 9: of those capabilities can be achieved with other models out there,
Speaker 9: perhaps through a more complicated workflow. But what we're seeing
Speaker 9: here is a general advancement and the ability of AI
Speaker 9: to really play a powerful force in the cyber security space.
Speaker 9: And so I would put less emphasis specifically on this
Speaker 9: release of Mythos, but really acknowledge that the frontier is moving,
Speaker 9: and it's moving much more quickly than security teams are
Speaker 9: able to keep.
Speaker 4: Up, and that frontier is being moved by other players
Speaker 4: as well, and we know the opening. I's been trying
Speaker 4: to work with a cyber community as well. Just we
Speaker 4: had Fortealiss join the show last week and their idea is, look,
Speaker 4: smaller companies should be able to have access to Methos
Speaker 4: to be able to drive forward this vision to make
Speaker 4: sure we're safe. Is that something hacker one wants? Would
Speaker 4: you like to be on this small amount of group
Speaker 4: through without their testing vulnerabilities?
Speaker 9: Well, certainly we would like to have access to this.
Speaker 2: Now.
Speaker 9: I recognize the risk equation that the Anthropic has taken
Speaker 9: here in terms of a smaller release to a limited
Speaker 9: number of organizations, but look at Hacker one, for example,
Speaker 9: last week alone, we automatically validated four thousand vulnerabilities that
Speaker 9: came in through our various vulnerability discovery programs. And that
Speaker 9: kind of capability and Mythos that would help us supercharge
Speaker 9: our validation capabilities would be greatly appreciated.
Speaker 3: The access to Mythos is clearly being closely controlled. It
Speaker 3: seems strange to not bring up the war in Iran
Speaker 3: and the competence that Iran has in as a cyber
Speaker 3: bad actor. You know, put two and two together. What
Speaker 3: is the likelihood that the malicious actor from Iran or
Speaker 3: elsewhere would have access to that level of technology and
Speaker 3: pose a threat.
Speaker 9: Therefore, I'll put it this way, ed, I think this year,
Speaker 9: in twenty twenty six, civilians, businesses, and organizations are markedly
Speaker 9: less safe than we were just even last year. From
Speaker 9: a cybersecurity perspective.
Speaker 2: We now have much more.
Speaker 9: Capable AI models. Those models are rapidly proliferating, even if
Speaker 9: Mythos itself is still within limited release, and we now
Speaker 9: have a number of sophisticated thread actors that can put
Speaker 9: those capabilities to use, and we're seeing an increasing number
Speaker 9: of breaches and supply chain issues across the open source
Speaker 9: ecosystem and across corporations.
Speaker 4: Kara, it's been great having your expertise today. Thank you, Krstig,
Speaker 4: CEO of Hackle One. Now let's stick with Anthropic It's
Speaker 4: power and also as investors way the powerful private market
Speaker 4: valuations across all of AI. Let's bring in Peter Singlehurst's
Speaker 4: head of private companies at Bailey Gifford, and you have,
Speaker 4: of course an investment in Anthropic. Just the moon music
Speaker 4: around Anthropic, the power that it has, the use of claud,
Speaker 4: the enterprise adoption, it all seems to be very strong
Speaker 4: right now, Peter, are there any concerns that you have?
Speaker 11: I think when you own a business and when you're
Speaker 11: investor in any company, you always have concerns around companies.
Speaker 11: It's hard job to worry about the holdings that we have.
Speaker 11: But I think that what we're seeing at Anthropic at
Speaker 11: the moment is unprecedented. In fifteen years of investing, I've
Speaker 11: never seen a company of this scale grow this quickly,
Speaker 11: And I think what we're seeing is a company that
Speaker 11: is really pushing the edges of the boundaries of where
Speaker 11: AI can be brought to bear in real world applications,
Speaker 11: initially encoding, which really broke out last year, and with
Speaker 11: the Mythos models, we're starting to see how it can
Speaker 11: really impact cybersecurity as well.
Speaker 4: What has been notable apart from Mythos has been the
Speaker 4: adoption the arr that they're managing to post thirty billion
Speaker 4: dollars and the amount of enterprises that are now using it,
Speaker 4: even in the face of concern that they are well
Speaker 4: sewing the government because of the current blacklisting single out
Speaker 4: by the Pentagon. How is that narrative driving what you
Speaker 4: think about Anthropic at the moment.
Speaker 11: When we invested in Anthropic, one of the reasons we
Speaker 11: liked the business was the principal approach they took to
Speaker 11: safety now that I think has informed how they're approaching
Speaker 11: the Mythos models, and it's informed the approach that they've
Speaker 11: had with the Department of War.
Speaker 8: So whilst we would of course rather not.
Speaker 11: See them in this disagreement with the Department of War,
Speaker 11: I think and the company have said that there's more
Speaker 11: that unites them than divides them with the Department of War,
Speaker 11: and I think it's important to us to see a
Speaker 11: company standing by the underlying principles which enables them to
Speaker 11: flourish and enables them to attract and retain key talent.
Speaker 3: What has been so interesting about the headline generation from
Speaker 3: Mythos is that people are looking at the model itself.
Speaker 3: You know, Caroline's absolutely right, the revenue run rate, all
Speaker 3: those kind of classic measures for late stage startups, but
Speaker 3: just your sort of response to the model's capability. Anthropics
Speaker 3: place in a group of five or six frontier labs
Speaker 3: that are trying to do exactly that very big model
Speaker 3: with great capability.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 11: I mean, what we've seen with these lms is that
Speaker 11: the capabilities of the leading edge models will quickly become
Speaker 11: available to the trailing edge models. And then what separates
Speaker 11: the likes of Anthropic or open AI is their ability
Speaker 11: to continuously stay at the leading edge. And so, as
Speaker 11: you know, as a citizen, it does concern me that
Speaker 11: there will be these capabilities which today are in the
Speaker 11: hands of Anthropic who who will we trust? But I
Speaker 11: think it is inevitable that these tools, whether in the
Speaker 11: Mythos model or developed by other foundational models, will become
Speaker 11: more widely available. And I think that leads a lot
Speaker 11: of enterprises, a lot of governments, a lot of economic
Speaker 11: systems vulnerable to attacks.
Speaker 3: A lot of focus in the United States on anthropic
Speaker 3: There was a headline this morning that open AI, which
Speaker 3: you are not an investor in, is open a a
Speaker 3: permanent London office having wound down the Stargate project in
Speaker 3: the UK. I ask you all that basically to push
Speaker 3: on whether people outside of the United States see that
Speaker 3: same level of battle that's going on between the frontier labs,
Speaker 3: and whether the release of a model like Netho's impacts
Speaker 3: everyday people in the United Kingdom or in Europe.
Speaker 11: I think in the very short term, the everyday person
Speaker 11: on the street is not impacted this week or next week.
Speaker 11: But are these models going to impact all of our
Speaker 11: lives in the months and years to come? Like yes, absolutely.
Speaker 11: I think that here in the UK, those that are
Speaker 11: in the industry, those that follow this are just as
Speaker 11: outware and on top of what's going on as his
Speaker 11: in the US. But I think that within the UK
Speaker 11: there isn't such a sort of cultural resonance of developments
Speaker 11: in technology as perhaps there is in the US by
Speaker 11: virtue of the fact that it's such a large and
Speaker 11: important part of the US economy, and in the UK
Speaker 11: sadly it is not such a dominant part of our economy.
Speaker 4: I mean, Peter, what hasn't been notable is while we're
Speaker 4: all spell bound by AI, the whole world has been
Speaker 4: spell bound by space over the course of the weekend.
Speaker 4: And I'm interested, therefore in your exposure to SpaceX and
Speaker 4: exposure to XAI in many ways, how are you thinking
Speaker 4: about this moment that everyone's world changes if they get
Speaker 4: access to some of these big companies not just being private,
Speaker 4: but potential to be public as well.
Speaker 11: I think it's important that every day investors are able
Speaker 11: to access these kinds of companies, and so I think
Speaker 11: these companies coming to the public markets is overall a
Speaker 11: good thing. I think what is in many ways a
Speaker 11: shame for the everyday investor is that there is so
Speaker 11: much growth that has already happened before these companies come
Speaker 11: to the public markets. And it's not just anthropic. It's
Speaker 11: not just SpaceX. You could look at Byte Dance, for instance,
Speaker 11: in China. The owner of TikTok Byte Dance today is
Speaker 11: forty to fifty times larger in revenue and profit then
Speaker 11: Facebook was when it listed. That's a leg of growth,
Speaker 11: an enormous amount of growth, which is a crue to
Speaker 11: private market investors which is foregone by public markets investors.
Speaker 11: And so this is why we invest in these companies.
Speaker 11: It's to be able to give our clients access to
Speaker 11: this growth that's happening privately. Historically that happen in the
Speaker 11: public markets. But where you can only really do growth
Speaker 11: investing properly today if you're doing it in both the
Speaker 11: private and the public markets.
Speaker 3: Peter, I know we've had the opportunity to speak to
Speaker 3: you a lot recently, just very quickly. At this point,
Speaker 3: does the market understand the economics of orbital data center
Speaker 3: ahead of this space X ipo.
Speaker 11: No, I don't think the market does understand the economics
Speaker 11: of orbital data centers. I think that this is a
Speaker 11: very nascent idea in Nason technology, and where that value
Speaker 11: can potentially accrue I think is through the vertical integration
Speaker 11: with the models. If we get to this place where
Speaker 11: power for computing AI models is existential pinch point for
Speaker 11: these businesses. So in short, no, I think it's not
Speaker 11: yet well understood. It doesn't in a sense exist yet.
Speaker 11: But I think what is well understood at SpaceX is
Speaker 11: the incredible launch business they have and the incredible economics
Speaker 11: of Starlink.
Speaker 3: Peter Singlehurst of Bailey Gifford, thank you very much. Now
Speaker 3: coming up, a Trump family crypto venture. It's facing some
Speaker 3: investor backlash. We got more on that next, this is
Speaker 3: Bloomberg Tech.
Speaker 4: It's time now for Talking Tech and first up, World
Speaker 4: Liberty Financial. It's a Trump family crypto venture and it's
Speaker 4: facing an investor revolt that includes billionaire backer Justin's Sun,
Speaker 4: who says the project is secretly building controls that len insiders,
Speaker 4: freeze tokenholders funds and extract cash before a wave of
Speaker 4: tokens are then unlocked.
Speaker 2: Look.
Speaker 4: World Liberty has roundly rejected the criticism the token trays.
Speaker 4: They're a record low, according to Quinn Gecko. Plus, the
Speaker 4: federal government is movie to settle in case over Amazon's
Speaker 4: treatment of a group of contract delivery drivers, and the
Speaker 4: National Labor Real Nations Board argued Amazon was the driver's
Speaker 4: joint employer was therefore liable for their treatment, but the
Speaker 4: proposed settlement would provide two weeks paid dozens of workers
Speaker 4: without finding Amazon leavel and many college graduates are working
Speaker 4: jobs that high schoolers could land, with almost forty three
Speaker 4: percent of US graduates age twenty two to twenty some
Speaker 4: underemployed as of December twenty twenty five, the worst rate
Speaker 4: since the pandemic. Why many are blaming the rise of
Speaker 4: AI as well as an imbalance in supply and demand
Speaker 4: ed this is a question of AI washing. How much
Speaker 4: is this to do with AI and companies slowing hiring
Speaker 4: or firing. How much is it actually just that too
Speaker 4: many people are getting degrees now for the amount of jobs.
Speaker 2: That are out there.
Speaker 3: It's very specific data, but it speaks to one clear thing,
Speaker 3: which is AI is shrinking the market for white collar
Speaker 3: entry level jobs. Data input, basic coding are the graduate
Speaker 3: level jobs that.
Speaker 2: You would bank on.
Speaker 3: Now those people that have degrees can't get them. So
Speaker 3: they're going into restaurant, retail service industries to find employment.
Speaker 4: Yeah, even babysitting. Look basically, they've got to make the money,
Speaker 4: still work for them, But what is the job of
Speaker 4: the future. And there's a lot of anxiety in those
Speaker 4: that are still at university. I speaking with the NYU
Speaker 4: Stern professor Run Sundarajan just last week and him saying
Speaker 4: the amount of anxiety among his current tuition folks.
Speaker 2: But they're also all.
Speaker 4: Getting more entrepreneurial. Everyone's spinning up a business set right and.
Speaker 3: At the same time college applications going like that.
Speaker 2: In Congress, we're coming up.
Speaker 3: We're going to speak with the Roblock CEO Dave Bazuki
Speaker 3: as the company announces new age based accounts and experiented
Speaker 3: parental controls. This is Bloomberg Tech. Welcome back to Bloomberg Tech.
Speaker 3: It's still the war in Iran and the situation in
Speaker 3: the Middle East that the big driver in markets.
Speaker 2: At the index.
Speaker 3: Technology stocks modestly higher basically flat er up two tens
Speaker 3: fve percent and then as that one hundred. But within
Speaker 3: that index the outperformances in software names. Remember last week
Speaker 3: we saw some pressure on software names that all kind
Speaker 3: of related to displacement from AI. But the other big
Speaker 3: factories also oil Brent the global benchmark for oil. You're
Speaker 3: above one hundred dollars a barrel again on Brent, and
Speaker 3: the situation is a blockade in the straightfor moves who
Speaker 3: went through it earlier.
Speaker 2: In the program.
Speaker 3: There isn't a lot of newsflow outside of that carrier
Speaker 3: that's impacting the index level for tech, but there is
Speaker 3: other news that's driving single names.
Speaker 4: There is and let's check in on Roadblocks, which are
Speaker 4: significantly in the green today the online gaming platform introducing
Speaker 4: new age based accounts, expanded parental controls for users under sixteen,
Speaker 4: and it's of course the latest effort by the company
Speaker 4: to really enhanced safety for its younger audience. The update
Speaker 4: comes as a company prepares to roll out also a
Speaker 4: new subscription plan later this month. Got a lot to
Speaker 4: talk about with the Roadblock CEO David Zouki. It is
Speaker 4: wonderful to be joined by you, Dave, and there is
Speaker 4: a lot to digest here, and a lot about age verification,
Speaker 4: a lot about verifying the developers of the games too. Dave,
Speaker 4: just talk us through what changes you make.
Speaker 5: Hey, thanks for having me on.
Speaker 12: And you know, when we've talked in the past, we've
Speaker 12: shared our commitment to setting what we believe is the
Speaker 12: global gold standard for healthy, safe, age appropriate digital engagement.
Speaker 5: We've been innovating on this for years and years.
Speaker 12: We started with age check in January for communication.
Speaker 5: What we're rolling out today is the next phase.
Speaker 12: In that implementation of that global gold standard. That of
Speaker 12: course includes all the other things we've done in the past,
Speaker 12: including innovating on text filtering and non sharing of images.
Speaker 12: So today we're announcing kids accounts and select accounts. We
Speaker 12: use age estimation to automatically assign people to the right
Speaker 12: account and we connect them with appropriate content. For kids' accounts,
Speaker 12: they get mild content, things like grow a garden.
Speaker 5: For our older users.
Speaker 12: In select accounts, they get moderate content as well, things
Speaker 12: like emergency response. And users who are over sixteen of
Speaker 12: course get regular roadblocks accounts. So this for us is
Speaker 12: just a continuous evolution in our commitment to this establishment
Speaker 12: of a global gold standard for safety and healthy digital engagement.
Speaker 4: Let's talk about the underlying technology and as you literate,
Speaker 4: it gets better and better. But age verification is very tough.
Speaker 2: How good has it been?
Speaker 4: How many people's age is it getting right? How many
Speaker 4: people push back or try to dispute.
Speaker 12: Yeah, we started experimenting with facial age estimation middle of
Speaker 12: last year laid of last year. We saw that it
Speaker 12: was more than good enough to estimate age, and in
Speaker 12: addition to that we use additional signals. We're constantly incorporating
Speaker 12: other signals in addition to facial age estimation to put
Speaker 12: people in the right categories. It's enabled us to do
Speaker 12: a lot of future things that not really many other
Speaker 12: social networking or social media apps are doing, and that
Speaker 12: includes connecting people with people of the right age, not
Speaker 12: connecting older people with younger people when they're chatting, and
Speaker 12: with this new innovation today, of course doubling down on
Speaker 12: connecting people with the right content.
Speaker 3: Dave, the balance is between sort of codifying, taking action
Speaker 3: on age verification, which you've done, and then the impact
Speaker 3: on engagement daily active users. What have you and the
Speaker 3: team modeled for on how you see daily active use
Speaker 3: as an engagement responding to this new set of rules.
Speaker 12: Yeah, yeah, thank you for highlighting this, and I do
Speaker 12: want to highlight as we run this company, we're always
Speaker 12: leaning in on doing what we believe is the right
Speaker 12: thing for our huge community almost one hundred and fifty
Speaker 12: million daily active users, and respecting that community and building
Speaker 12: an innovative product with safety built in by default. We've
Speaker 12: seen sixty five percent of our US daily users now
Speaker 12: age check. That number continues to grow and we're optimistic
Speaker 12: about it.
Speaker 5: So we have modeled this in.
Speaker 12: We have a lot of other things coming throughout the
Speaker 12: year as well, and we continue to focus on doing
Speaker 12: the right thing for our community.
Speaker 3: How much does weather A game is addictive or not
Speaker 3: factor into this, Dave, And as you know, the broader
Speaker 3: question is whether games gaming platform should be talked about
Speaker 3: in the same conversation as what we're seeing in social
Speaker 3: media bands around the world and the conversation on social
Speaker 3: media addiction.
Speaker 12: I want to speak out for the gaming industry as
Speaker 12: a whole relative to social networking and social media. There's
Speaker 12: something really important about multiplayer gaming and experience. It's a
Speaker 12: connection activity rather than a being alone activity. It's an
Speaker 12: activity that typically involves creation and imagination rather than raw consumption.
Speaker 12: So we see gaming very differently than social media and
Speaker 12: social networking, and in many respects, gaming is the is
Speaker 12: the future extension of what I used to do on
Speaker 12: a rainy day, which is call my friends on the
Speaker 12: phone and connect with them that way. So we're optimistic
Speaker 12: going forward. Gaming is very much in a different category.
Speaker 12: We build a platform so people can have fun and
Speaker 12: connect more than what you're mentioning.
Speaker 4: With a safer environment not only comes well, parents and
Speaker 4: children more willing to use, probably advertisers even more willing
Speaker 4: to come on. And that's an area that you've been developing,
Speaker 4: and particularly a revenue share with ads that are going
Speaker 4: to be based within developers' games. How is that being
Speaker 4: taken on by the developer that you work with, and
Speaker 4: how you think about the revenue share? What sort of
Speaker 4: amount to me thinking, yeah.
Speaker 12: Yeah, I want to highlight once again, we always put
Speaker 12: building a healthy, safe and age appropriate environment first amongst
Speaker 12: everything and once again respecting that community.
Speaker 5: But as you.
Speaker 12: Correctly mentioned, in immersive three D environments, if I go
Speaker 12: to a NASCAR race, for example, I may see some
Speaker 12: interesting products on the cars or on the billboards, and
Speaker 12: those are typically things that are appropriate for people of
Speaker 12: all ages. So we continue to build out that advertising
Speaker 12: opportunity on roadblocks. In addition to those immersive types of ads,
Speaker 12: more and more of our creators are actually buying ads
Speaker 12: to help people recognize that they have a new creation.
Speaker 5: So we're still early in.
Speaker 12: The advertising opportunity, but we believe it's very large.
Speaker 4: How large could the revenue split feed? Have you got
Speaker 4: an idea of where that percentage WI ledge out on
Speaker 4: particular developers.
Speaker 12: Well, we do have kind of internal models and we're
Speaker 12: very optimistic that. You know, for creators building games and
Speaker 12: experiences on roadblocks, they primarily monetize right now with virtual currency,
Speaker 12: with our Robucks system. There are millions and you know
Speaker 12: creators on our platform, and a portion of them actually
Speaker 12: build creations that monetize. And we've shared how this vibrant
Speaker 12: community is really building a new place for people to
Speaker 12: work and to build small studios and beyond advertising is
Speaker 12: another compliment for how they may monetize.
Speaker 8: Dave.
Speaker 3: I'm looking at your company shares up almost five percent
Speaker 3: in the session. I'm trying to work out what the
Speaker 3: market's really responding to here and Friday Night, Roadblocks launched.
Speaker 3: This new subscription plan goes live April thirtieth, I think,
Speaker 3: but it basically replaces the premium tier. There seems to
Speaker 3: be a lot of good vibes around that. What was
Speaker 3: the rational and how do you see it playing out?
Speaker 12: More and more we see two types of subscriptions on
Speaker 12: our platform. A large number of parents, you know, the
Speaker 12: future of what we see happening on Roadblocks. When I
Speaker 12: was younger, I got an allowance to go buy comic
Speaker 12: books at the local drug store. Today, a lot of
Speaker 12: young people are learning about digital finance by getting a
Speaker 12: Roebucks allowance from their parents. So we do have a
Speaker 12: subscription for Roebucks so parents can give their kids recurring
Speaker 12: roebucks and they can learn about digital finance. In addition,
Speaker 12: we announced Roadblocks Plus, which is for those highly engaged
Speaker 12: users that want a discount on the roebucks that they're spending,
Speaker 12: want free digital servers, and a few other things like that.
Speaker 12: It's a compliment to the allowance, but more and more.
Speaker 12: Roadblocks is a place where young people are learning about
Speaker 12: digital finance.
Speaker 3: Dave a zookie of Roadblocks, important pieces, several piece of
Speaker 3: news out of the company, Thank you very much. There's
Speaker 3: some interesting market activity that's going on. Look at shares
Speaker 3: of Dell and HP Inc. Both of them moved very
Speaker 3: quickly to session highs after a report from semi Accurate,
Speaker 3: a website which basically said that Nvidia has been in
Speaker 3: negotiations for every year to buy a large company quote
Speaker 3: that will reshape the PC landscape, without naming the specifics
Speaker 3: of it.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 3: We note in a BFW on the terminal that semi
Speaker 3: Accurate has been reporting on this kind of ongoing story
Speaker 3: since twenty twenty four. Late twenty four, but the stocks
Speaker 3: both moved higher. Dell's up four and a half percent
Speaker 3: as it stands, HPN cup two percent. Bloomberg News is
Speaker 3: out to comment for all three of those companies and
Speaker 3: yet to hear Backgary.
Speaker 4: Keep an eye on it. Meanwhile, coming up that record
Speaker 4: rating Artemis two crew back on Earth, NASA and its
Speaker 4: partners turned their attention now. Of course, they're landing humans
Speaker 4: on the Moon as soon as twenty twenty eight. We'll
Speaker 4: discuss that next as bloom meb tech.
Speaker 3: After blasting off from Earth the historic trip around the
Speaker 3: Moon and back, the Artemis crew splashed down safely on
Speaker 3: Friday evening in the Lockheed Martin built Oryan capsule. The
Speaker 3: roughly thirteen minutes plunge back to Earth was expected to
Speaker 3: be a nail bitter, not just because of the twenty
Speaker 3: five thousand miles per hour speed o Ryan re entered
Speaker 3: the atmosphere at but also because of concerns about the
Speaker 3: heat shield meant to protect the crew from temperatures of
Speaker 3: up to nearly five thousand degrees fahrenheit.
Speaker 2: NASA administrator Jared.
Speaker 3: Eisaman posting that the discolouration scene in pictures after Orion
Speaker 3: was recovered was not parts of the heat shield that
Speaker 3: have come loose or unexpected behavior in the materials as
Speaker 3: it happened in Artemis one. NASA is now doing a
Speaker 3: full data review of the systems along with his partners,
Speaker 3: including Lockheed Martin, the company's head of human space exploration,
Speaker 3: and the URON program manager. Kerk Shiman joins us now
Speaker 3: here on Bloomberg Tech. Let's start with that point. I
Speaker 3: think that the administrator was compelled to post on X
Speaker 3: because people looked at at integrity of the Orion spacecraft
Speaker 3: as it was hoisted out of the water and onto
Speaker 3: the naval vessel. But what does the early data show
Speaker 3: you about how the heat shield performed and basically end
Speaker 3: to end mission success.
Speaker 13: Absolutely, the vehicle performed exceptionally well, we're very, very pleased
Speaker 13: with how it performed. The heat shield did exactly what
Speaker 13: it was supposed to do. It protected the crew and
Speaker 13: the vehicle from those very high temperatures that you mentioned.
Speaker 8: I actually got to see some pictures that.
Speaker 13: The divers, the Navy divers took from underwater, and they
Speaker 13: looked all exceptionally Well. You know, when you come in
Speaker 13: and you have that high heating and then the atmosphere,
Speaker 13: the wind and so on, you expect to have some
Speaker 13: discolouration from that experience. But all in all, the vehicle
Speaker 13: performed the heat shield and the tiles on the top
Speaker 13: of the vehicle performed exceptionally.
Speaker 8: Well, we're very, very pleased.
Speaker 13: We're looking forward to getting more detailed photographs right as
Speaker 13: we have the vehicle back in San Diego and on
Speaker 13: to Euston.
Speaker 3: Hey, Kirk, that's just good old fashioned rocket science for
Speaker 3: a flat bottom capsule, right, how do you slow it
Speaker 3: down on the re entry interface?
Speaker 2: Bang it into a wall of air?
Speaker 3: I mean, on this program we talked about how to
Speaker 3: fix Atomis one to Automus two.
Speaker 2: Is actually the angle of.
Speaker 3: Re entry rather than some kind of fundamental change to
Speaker 3: the materials of design.
Speaker 2: But with Automis three.
Speaker 3: There will be some tweaks, right, what can you tell
Speaker 3: us about that?
Speaker 5: Sure?
Speaker 13: On Arms three we use the same shape of av
Speaker 13: coat tiles, but the formulation of av code is slightly different,
Speaker 13: and so we're looking forward to different performance, actually better performance,
Speaker 13: and we can basically skip out of the atmosphere shortly
Speaker 13: and extend our downrange, which is really important for our
Speaker 13: operational constraints. So looking forward to a more operationally friendly
Speaker 13: heats shield on Artists three and subsequent vehicles.
Speaker 4: I mean, Kirk, there must have been lots you're looking
Speaker 4: forward to and getting your hands on it back in Houston,
Speaker 4: and I'm interested in the early day and more broadly
Speaker 4: the crude feedback. What is the most important things that
Speaker 4: you've learned from integrity?
Speaker 8: Well, of course everyone.
Speaker 13: You can imagine how we engineers are interested in every
Speaker 13: little detail that we learned along the way.
Speaker 8: I think the beautiful thing about.
Speaker 13: Having the crew back and talking about it is kind
Speaker 13: of what we've learned about our planet and where we
Speaker 13: sit in the universe. To me, it was so exciting
Speaker 13: to hear them talk and basically see the Moon and
Speaker 13: ultimately our Earth through their eyes.
Speaker 8: It was just fantastic.
Speaker 13: Hopefully you've had a chance to hear that, and if not,
Speaker 13: you will over the coming days.
Speaker 4: It's a joy to see so many almost get philosophical
Speaker 4: in these moments when it comes to planetary exploration and
Speaker 4: the moon and just how we sit within this universe,
Speaker 4: and you too. But when you are thinking about how
Speaker 4: the engineers get nitty gritty and some of the key
Speaker 4: things that you're looking to confirm before Ryan flies again,
Speaker 4: what do you think is the most detail oriented focus
Speaker 4: you're going to have.
Speaker 13: Sure, I think everything that didn't perform exactly as expected
Speaker 13: on this flight, or where we'll really dig in. Lockheed
Speaker 13: and NASA spend all their time or ninety percent of
Speaker 13: their time looking at the things that didn't go right
Speaker 13: as opposed to all the things that did.
Speaker 4: They was one thing that you're writing about one other
Speaker 4: things that perhaps didn't form exactly as you anticipated, even
Speaker 4: if not badly.
Speaker 13: Sure, we had a valve that didn't work right relative
Speaker 13: to the water, the drinkable water, the potable water system.
Speaker 13: We had a system that does introduces helium into the
Speaker 13: propellant tanks as we deplete propellant that didn't work exactly
Speaker 13: as expected.
Speaker 8: So we'll definitely dive into those issues.
Speaker 13: And then a few little features with telemetry that we'll
Speaker 13: have to fully understand. We think that's probably aware issue,
Speaker 13: but we'll understand it and correct it for future flights.
Speaker 3: Christina Kirk mission specialist turned astro plumber.
Speaker 2: I don't know how you would describe that.
Speaker 3: You know, I appreciate the answer of the things that
Speaker 3: didn't quite go right, and you know there's a data process,
Speaker 3: a review process, right, but what exceeded expectations. You know,
Speaker 3: everyone makes a lot of the idea that integrity or
Speaker 3: ryan is a spacecraft is the size of a small bus,
Speaker 3: a Campa van three.
Speaker 2: Hundred and thirty cubic feet, right, you know.
Speaker 3: But it got them two hundred and fifty thousand miles
Speaker 3: plus from Earth, around the Moon and back, and by
Speaker 3: all accounts, they had a great time.
Speaker 2: What exceeded your expectations, Kirk?
Speaker 13: Sure, Ryan has twelve million, five hundred thousand parts, so
Speaker 13: most of those parts did exactly what they were supposed
Speaker 13: to do. I think the big surprise, or not a surprise,
Speaker 13: but exceedance.
Speaker 8: Of expectation, was the systems that keep.
Speaker 13: The crew alive and happy, that the scrub carbon dioxide
Speaker 13: out of the atmosphere, that introduced auction in the atmosphere.
Speaker 13: That basically all those systems that keep the crew alive
Speaker 13: and healthy and then interfaced with the crew to the
Speaker 13: vehicle performed flawlessly.
Speaker 8: It was just exceptional. And that was all new for
Speaker 8: this flight.
Speaker 13: So we were expecting to learn things, but by and
Speaker 13: large those exceeded our expectations.
Speaker 2: Cok.
Speaker 3: This was a great feat for NASA and for America.
Speaker 3: But we should be kind to your European colleagues, the
Speaker 3: European Space Agency and the companies involved in the service.
Speaker 3: Module absolutely critical for life support and other critical systems.
Speaker 3: How did the service module perform, To the best of
Speaker 3: Lockheed's knowledge.
Speaker 8: It performed exceptionally well.
Speaker 13: We have a great relationship with Airbus, which is the
Speaker 13: industry partner in Europe that built the service module, and
Speaker 13: the European Space Agency. They were there in the Michigan
Speaker 13: control room sitting right next to us during the entire mission,
Speaker 13: including splash down, and again they were extremely thrilled by
Speaker 13: the performance of service.
Speaker 8: Modules, as were we.
Speaker 13: Of course, there were one or two things that didn't
Speaker 13: work exactly as planned, and we'll get to the bottom
Speaker 13: of those with Buy and Large. It performed better than
Speaker 13: we better than we expected it to form.
Speaker 8: It was exceptional well.
Speaker 4: I think the rest of the world was highly pleased.
Speaker 4: It went so well as well. KERK Shaman, thanks for
Speaker 4: giving us your time. VP of Human Space Exploration and
Speaker 4: oryan program manager for Lockie Martin. There now coming up.
Speaker 2: Apple moves to.
Speaker 4: Decentralize its AI leadership as it is is it's next
Speaker 4: hardware hit on that next this is Blue Medtech.
Speaker 3: Apple's hitting a major inflection point in its AI journey.
Speaker 3: Apple's AI head is officially departing this week, while a
Speaker 3: new product roadmap is coming into focus. It's all detailed
Speaker 3: in the late this power on by Bloomberg Smart gunman
Speaker 3: who joins us now display free smart glasses.
Speaker 2: What do we know? Give us a little bit of
Speaker 2: the history and really.
Speaker 14: Yes, really smart glasses. That is Apple's next big thing.
Speaker 14: They've grown in popularity right. Tons of people are wearing them,
Speaker 14: not only in Silicon Valley but in all parts of
Speaker 14: the world. Meta has done a great job with their
Speaker 14: smart glasses. Here, I'll put them on for you. These
Speaker 14: are the Meta ray Ban display glasses. So these have
Speaker 14: a little heads up display in them. Apples won't, like
Speaker 14: you said, display free. The idea is that this is
Speaker 14: the eyes and ears for AI and the cloud for
Speaker 14: Siri and Apple Intelligence. These will rely heavily on the
Speaker 14: new SERI coming in iOS twenty seven later this year.
Speaker 14: These will probably go on sale next year. Apple's going
Speaker 14: to be differentiating here a little bit because they're not
Speaker 14: going to be working with an outside fashion part partner.
Speaker 14: As far as we know, They're going to bring in
Speaker 14: their own designs in house. For the most part, they're
Speaker 14: working on four major designs. I've been told two rectangles
Speaker 14: and two circular stocked ovals, one on each size, So
Speaker 14: they're trying to make something for everyone, similar to when
Speaker 14: they launched the Apple Watch back in twenty fifteen, how
Speaker 14: they had several different colors bands and also of course
Speaker 14: two sizes initially for men and women, but now they
Speaker 14: have multiple sizes as well a third size with the
Speaker 14: Apple Watch Ultra. So definitely taking a look at what
Speaker 14: looks best for different people. This is going to be
Speaker 14: pretty exciting, I think, and I think Apple has the
Speaker 14: ingredients to be a serious winner in the smart glasses arena.
Speaker 4: Maybe we'll all look a bit more like Tim Cook
Speaker 4: as you say, one of the slimmer rectangular designs is
Speaker 4: sort of based on what he wears.
Speaker 10: Mark.
Speaker 4: But the age old idea is that Apple comes later
Speaker 4: but wins. How much do they need to win? How
Speaker 4: much does that need to be integrated with the new
Speaker 4: leadership in AI quickly?
Speaker 14: Yeah, well, smart glasses story for Apple is going to
Speaker 14: be strong. I think the big leg up Apple has
Speaker 14: is this thing. The metaglasses don't pair as nicely as
Speaker 14: Meta would like with the iPhone. Any third parties for
Speaker 14: our classes don't pair as nicely with the iPhone as
Speaker 14: Apple in house Glass as well, and so given them
Speaker 14: a number of iPhones in use, the attachment rate I
Speaker 14: think will be material for the company. So I think
Speaker 14: they're very much looking forward to getting these out the
Speaker 14: door next year.
Speaker 4: Mark German as always with the power on over the weekend,
Speaker 4: which remains one of the most read stories we can
Speaker 4: week out. We appreciate it.
Speaker 2: Now, that does it.
Speaker 4: For the edition of Bloomberg Tech Ed, we did a
Speaker 4: lot of AI, a lot of space, a lot to digest.
Speaker 3: Yeah, maybe not as many breaking US headlines technology stories,
Speaker 3: but a lot of deeper conversation about things have been
Speaker 3: going a while now. Check out the podcast to recap
Speaker 3: all of that. You can find it on the terminal
Speaker 3: as well as online on Apple, Spotify, and iHeart This
Speaker 3: is boombag Tech