1 00:00:02,840 --> 00:00:06,480 Speaker 1: Welcome to Zero. I am Akshatrati and I'm oscar BOYD. 2 00:00:07,040 --> 00:00:09,119 Speaker 1: Actually I wanted to pull a step from an article 3 00:00:09,119 --> 00:00:11,799 Speaker 1: that you recently wrote with your colleague Fassica Toed Essay, 4 00:00:11,840 --> 00:00:15,520 Speaker 1: who's based in Addis Ababa, Ethiopia, and the start is 5 00:00:15,760 --> 00:00:18,960 Speaker 1: even by the standards of low income countries, Ethiopia has 6 00:00:19,000 --> 00:00:22,760 Speaker 1: among the lowest car ownership rates, at thirteen vehicles per 7 00:00:22,800 --> 00:00:25,799 Speaker 1: thousand people. It's a fraction of the African average of 8 00:00:25,800 --> 00:00:28,800 Speaker 1: seventy three vehicles per thousand people. And yet despite this, 9 00:00:28,960 --> 00:00:32,800 Speaker 1: you've just published a long read article into Ethiopia's car market. 10 00:00:33,240 --> 00:00:36,440 Speaker 1: Why well, sometimes you have to look in odd corners 11 00:00:36,440 --> 00:00:40,400 Speaker 1: for good stories, and Ethiopia has a pretty amazing story 12 00:00:40,440 --> 00:00:43,440 Speaker 1: to tell. So of course, its income is only about 13 00:00:43,440 --> 00:00:47,159 Speaker 1: thousand dollars per capita, which means you expect there to 14 00:00:47,159 --> 00:00:50,520 Speaker 1: be low car ownership. But even by that standards, it's 15 00:00:50,560 --> 00:00:54,040 Speaker 1: so much lower because the country has had historically very 16 00:00:54,120 --> 00:00:57,240 Speaker 1: high tariffs on all car imports, and then two years 17 00:00:57,280 --> 00:01:00,320 Speaker 1: ago the country brought in a ban on all fossil 18 00:01:00,360 --> 00:01:04,880 Speaker 1: fuel car imports and then drastically slashed tariffs on electric cars, 19 00:01:05,080 --> 00:01:08,160 Speaker 1: making them much more affordable than they ever were in 20 00:01:08,200 --> 00:01:12,320 Speaker 1: the history of just buying cars in Ethiopia. The result 21 00:01:12,680 --> 00:01:15,679 Speaker 1: has been a surge in ev sales. I mean, the 22 00:01:15,760 --> 00:01:20,039 Speaker 1: pace is spectacular. Today about six percent of all vehicles 23 00:01:20,040 --> 00:01:23,560 Speaker 1: in Ethiopia are electric. That's higher than the global average 24 00:01:23,560 --> 00:01:27,280 Speaker 1: of four percent. And even countries like Norway, very rich, 25 00:01:27,680 --> 00:01:30,600 Speaker 1: wanting to get electric cars in the streets, just couldn't 26 00:01:30,600 --> 00:01:33,959 Speaker 1: achieve that pace of adoption that quickly. 27 00:01:34,280 --> 00:01:37,479 Speaker 2: Banning combustion cars is something that a lot of countries 28 00:01:37,560 --> 00:01:39,600 Speaker 2: are wanting to do. The UK has a target to 29 00:01:39,720 --> 00:01:41,920 Speaker 2: end fossil fuel car sales in twenty thirty five, so 30 00:01:42,319 --> 00:01:44,399 Speaker 2: a little less than ten years from now. Europe did 31 00:01:44,440 --> 00:01:46,360 Speaker 2: have a twenty thirty five target, but this has now 32 00:01:46,400 --> 00:01:50,960 Speaker 2: been watered down. How has Ethiopia managed to ban combustion cars? 33 00:01:50,960 --> 00:01:53,080 Speaker 2: How come they had the kind of political ability to 34 00:01:53,120 --> 00:01:53,360 Speaker 2: do this. 35 00:01:53,680 --> 00:01:55,360 Speaker 1: Yeah, this was the thing that shocked me the most, 36 00:01:55,400 --> 00:01:58,080 Speaker 1: which is that one of the world's poorest countries has 37 00:01:58,120 --> 00:02:01,440 Speaker 1: been able to achieve what even the richest countries haven't 38 00:02:01,480 --> 00:02:04,280 Speaker 1: been able to. And so we were curious what happened, 39 00:02:04,480 --> 00:02:08,440 Speaker 1: and the reason it turns out is really economics. So 40 00:02:08,520 --> 00:02:11,720 Speaker 1: Ethiopia was going through a financial crisis as many other 41 00:02:11,800 --> 00:02:14,880 Speaker 1: developing countries were going post pandemic because interest rates had 42 00:02:14,919 --> 00:02:17,360 Speaker 1: gone up. The amund they had borrowed was too much, 43 00:02:17,440 --> 00:02:21,320 Speaker 1: their experiments were rising, and they didn't have much foreign exchange. 44 00:02:22,280 --> 00:02:26,040 Speaker 1: Also true is that most of developing countries import fossil 45 00:02:26,040 --> 00:02:28,880 Speaker 1: fuels because they don't have much of their own. So 46 00:02:28,919 --> 00:02:33,000 Speaker 1: Ethiopia was importing about four billion dollars worth of gasoline 47 00:02:33,360 --> 00:02:37,240 Speaker 1: diesel every year, and it was importing all these fossil 48 00:02:37,240 --> 00:02:41,160 Speaker 1: fuel burning cars, and it was going through this financial crisis. 49 00:02:41,200 --> 00:02:43,919 Speaker 1: So the government just said, well, why import both things. 50 00:02:44,000 --> 00:02:48,400 Speaker 1: Let's just import one, which is get electric cars. Why 51 00:02:48,440 --> 00:02:51,400 Speaker 1: because they have plentiful electricity at home. 52 00:02:51,560 --> 00:02:53,400 Speaker 2: Where does all this electricity come from? 53 00:02:53,600 --> 00:02:56,600 Speaker 1: So for the past ten years or so, Ethiopia has 54 00:02:56,639 --> 00:02:59,920 Speaker 1: been building one of the world's largest dams on the Nile, 55 00:03:00,680 --> 00:03:03,640 Speaker 1: and as of twenty twenty five, it now has five 56 00:03:03,680 --> 00:03:07,359 Speaker 1: point one five gigawarts of power coming from hydropower from 57 00:03:07,400 --> 00:03:12,639 Speaker 1: this one dam. And suddenly the country has excess electricity 58 00:03:12,680 --> 00:03:14,920 Speaker 1: so much so that it is selling it to Tanzania 59 00:03:14,960 --> 00:03:19,720 Speaker 1: and Djibouti and Kenya. And that electricity is really cheap, 60 00:03:19,960 --> 00:03:23,120 Speaker 1: how cheap like ten cents perculo watar, which is at 61 00:03:23,160 --> 00:03:26,840 Speaker 1: the cost of generating and sending that electricity to consumers, 62 00:03:27,280 --> 00:03:30,880 Speaker 1: and if you compare that to its neighbors which charged 63 00:03:30,919 --> 00:03:34,560 Speaker 1: twice that much, or to America, which is about eighteen 64 00:03:34,639 --> 00:03:38,120 Speaker 1: cents parculo watar on average last year, or here in 65 00:03:38,160 --> 00:03:40,600 Speaker 1: the UK, which you know, you and I pay thirty 66 00:03:40,720 --> 00:03:43,760 Speaker 1: four cents perculo watar, And of course we have some 67 00:03:43,800 --> 00:03:47,680 Speaker 1: of the world's most expensive electricity. So having that really 68 00:03:47,760 --> 00:03:53,560 Speaker 1: cheap electricity plentiful was one clear signal for the government 69 00:03:53,600 --> 00:03:56,720 Speaker 1: to go electric cars just makes sense. 70 00:03:57,240 --> 00:03:59,520 Speaker 2: And obviously it has benefits for the people using those 71 00:03:59,560 --> 00:04:02,640 Speaker 2: electric cars as well. They have lower lifetime costs of 72 00:04:02,640 --> 00:04:05,200 Speaker 2: ownership right because the running costs are so much lower. 73 00:04:05,440 --> 00:04:07,360 Speaker 2: But that does bring me on to the question, which 74 00:04:07,400 --> 00:04:11,520 Speaker 2: is I think when we imagine getting rid of fossil 75 00:04:11,520 --> 00:04:13,360 Speaker 2: fuel car sales in the UK, one of the big 76 00:04:13,360 --> 00:04:15,840 Speaker 2: issues that comes up constantly is well, how am I 77 00:04:15,840 --> 00:04:17,919 Speaker 2: going to charge my car? And there are definitely difficulties 78 00:04:17,960 --> 00:04:20,760 Speaker 2: around that in certain places. But there is this superb 79 00:04:20,839 --> 00:04:23,640 Speaker 2: quote in the article that you wrote from the Minister 80 00:04:23,839 --> 00:04:27,640 Speaker 2: Barrio Hassen, who is the State Minister for Transport and Logistics, 81 00:04:28,040 --> 00:04:30,800 Speaker 2: and that quote reads. We receive strong criticism when we 82 00:04:30,839 --> 00:04:33,800 Speaker 2: announced the ban on ice automobiles, as many pointed out 83 00:04:33,800 --> 00:04:36,440 Speaker 2: that the country has zero charging stations at this time. 84 00:04:36,960 --> 00:04:39,839 Speaker 2: That's just an amazing thing to say at the point 85 00:04:39,839 --> 00:04:42,840 Speaker 2: that you've just banned internal combustion engines and you're now 86 00:04:42,920 --> 00:04:45,680 Speaker 2: assuming everyone's going to go to electric cars, So how 87 00:04:45,720 --> 00:04:47,080 Speaker 2: are people managing to charge? 88 00:04:47,240 --> 00:04:50,120 Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean it's a bit funny, but the context 89 00:04:50,160 --> 00:04:52,640 Speaker 1: is a you can do electric car charging at home 90 00:04:52,800 --> 00:04:55,359 Speaker 1: and so installing them is easy. But yes, they didn't 91 00:04:55,400 --> 00:04:58,640 Speaker 1: have any fast chargers at the time, which from a 92 00:04:58,720 --> 00:05:02,200 Speaker 1: Western perspective sound shocking. You know, the way we think 93 00:05:02,200 --> 00:05:06,800 Speaker 1: about policy is there's planning, there is public consultation, there 94 00:05:06,880 --> 00:05:12,040 Speaker 1: is a transition. Sometimes though, you just need to do it, 95 00:05:12,160 --> 00:05:16,120 Speaker 1: and that's what Ethiopia did in this instance. It was 96 00:05:16,279 --> 00:05:19,520 Speaker 1: going through a crisis of its own and it needed 97 00:05:19,760 --> 00:05:22,320 Speaker 1: to find ways to deal with it, and this seemed 98 00:05:22,360 --> 00:05:27,440 Speaker 1: like a policy that sure may struggle at first, but 99 00:05:27,720 --> 00:05:31,400 Speaker 1: is likely to give them financial runway that the government 100 00:05:31,560 --> 00:05:35,400 Speaker 1: desperately needed. And now two years on we can see 101 00:05:35,640 --> 00:05:39,200 Speaker 1: it's working. So according to the minister, now there are 102 00:05:39,200 --> 00:05:42,599 Speaker 1: about five hundred fast chargers around the country and The 103 00:05:42,680 --> 00:05:45,920 Speaker 1: way they managed to get them was to put regulations 104 00:05:46,000 --> 00:05:49,640 Speaker 1: on all gas stations to have charging ports, for all 105 00:05:49,960 --> 00:05:52,960 Speaker 1: EV sellers to have charging ports, and now they've brought 106 00:05:52,960 --> 00:05:57,160 Speaker 1: in regulations that all new housing developments parks will need 107 00:05:57,200 --> 00:05:59,799 Speaker 1: to have charging ports as well. So it's a combination 108 00:05:59,839 --> 00:06:03,720 Speaker 1: of regulations that followed the first policy change that has 109 00:06:03,760 --> 00:06:07,640 Speaker 1: now given them some semblance of a charging network. But 110 00:06:07,680 --> 00:06:08,800 Speaker 1: there's still a long way to go. 111 00:06:09,080 --> 00:06:11,279 Speaker 2: And what kind of cars are people actually buying? Is 112 00:06:11,320 --> 00:06:14,560 Speaker 2: it all cheaper models of electric vehicles from China or 113 00:06:14,600 --> 00:06:16,680 Speaker 2: are we seeing Western brands in there or Japanese brands 114 00:06:16,720 --> 00:06:17,479 Speaker 2: in there or so. 115 00:06:17,839 --> 00:06:21,400 Speaker 1: A useful context in developing countries, especially low income countries, 116 00:06:21,680 --> 00:06:25,880 Speaker 1: is that most of them have cars that are essentially secondhand. 117 00:06:26,040 --> 00:06:28,880 Speaker 1: So even when they were buying fossil fuel cars, these 118 00:06:28,920 --> 00:06:33,280 Speaker 1: were typically fossil fuel cars coming from European or American 119 00:06:33,360 --> 00:06:36,800 Speaker 1: markets that had been used once and then they were 120 00:06:37,560 --> 00:06:40,880 Speaker 1: essentially living out a second life. Sometimes these are really 121 00:06:40,920 --> 00:06:42,880 Speaker 1: old cars as well. They've been running on for ten 122 00:06:42,960 --> 00:06:45,080 Speaker 1: years and you're going to run them on for ten 123 00:06:45,120 --> 00:06:49,120 Speaker 1: more years, and so a they have very high running 124 00:06:49,160 --> 00:06:52,200 Speaker 1: costs because you have to constantly repair them. They're also 125 00:06:52,279 --> 00:06:57,280 Speaker 1: inefficient because clearly Western standards for fuel efficiency keep going up, 126 00:06:57,800 --> 00:07:01,040 Speaker 1: whereas these are lower efficiency cars, that means they're fuel 127 00:07:01,240 --> 00:07:04,400 Speaker 1: running costs is very high. So when it came to 128 00:07:04,560 --> 00:07:08,120 Speaker 1: electric cars, a couple of things made a big difference. One, 129 00:07:08,839 --> 00:07:11,800 Speaker 1: they had to be new cars. There isn't really yet 130 00:07:11,880 --> 00:07:15,920 Speaker 1: a big market for secondhand electric vehicles. Also, moving second 131 00:07:15,960 --> 00:07:19,120 Speaker 1: hand electric vehicles is kind of difficult, and so when 132 00:07:19,120 --> 00:07:22,600 Speaker 1: you're thinking of new electric vehicles, well, the cheaper ones 133 00:07:22,720 --> 00:07:26,800 Speaker 1: are the favorites in the market. So Fasska went to 134 00:07:27,520 --> 00:07:31,440 Speaker 1: a few dealerships. I also had a source at the 135 00:07:31,480 --> 00:07:36,000 Speaker 1: International Energy Agency who was traveling in Ethiopia in December, 136 00:07:36,480 --> 00:07:39,080 Speaker 1: and they basically saw cars of all kinds. So yes, 137 00:07:39,120 --> 00:07:43,440 Speaker 1: they're European cars, they are Japanese cars, but the electric 138 00:07:43,480 --> 00:07:47,600 Speaker 1: car that people like the most are Chinese cars. For 139 00:07:47,920 --> 00:07:53,080 Speaker 1: taxi drivers, Chang'an is the popular brand because it's cheaper, 140 00:07:53,280 --> 00:07:58,440 Speaker 1: even among cheaper Chinese cars and among individuals it's bid. 141 00:07:58,840 --> 00:08:01,800 Speaker 2: And any of these cars being built or assembled in 142 00:08:01,800 --> 00:08:05,040 Speaker 2: Ethiopia or are they all kind of pure imports constructed 143 00:08:05,080 --> 00:08:08,400 Speaker 2: finished car coming from China or other markets to Ethiopia. 144 00:08:08,720 --> 00:08:11,840 Speaker 1: So Ethiopia only gets about seven percent of its economic 145 00:08:11,880 --> 00:08:15,560 Speaker 1: output from manufacturing, which isn't yet a big sector, and 146 00:08:15,880 --> 00:08:18,400 Speaker 1: the government certainly wants it to be a bigger sector. 147 00:08:19,000 --> 00:08:24,480 Speaker 1: So there never was a fully fledged parts to final 148 00:08:25,080 --> 00:08:29,920 Speaker 1: car making manufacturing line in Ethiopia. Even when fossil fuel 149 00:08:29,960 --> 00:08:33,440 Speaker 1: cars were the cars that got sold, it was mostly 150 00:08:34,160 --> 00:08:37,200 Speaker 1: assembled car, so you got all the parts, you imported them, 151 00:08:37,559 --> 00:08:40,280 Speaker 1: and then you did the labor and value add of 152 00:08:40,320 --> 00:08:43,719 Speaker 1: actually putting it all together. So that's what they're doing 153 00:08:43,720 --> 00:08:47,240 Speaker 1: with electric cars. They're getting all these parts from China 154 00:08:47,880 --> 00:08:50,880 Speaker 1: and then assembling them in the seventeen plants that exist, 155 00:08:50,960 --> 00:08:53,840 Speaker 1: and the government wants them to be sixty plants doing 156 00:08:53,840 --> 00:08:57,040 Speaker 1: this by twenty thirty. So the way the government puts 157 00:08:57,080 --> 00:09:00,439 Speaker 1: tariffs on these vehicles makes it clear. So fully assembled 158 00:09:00,520 --> 00:09:04,440 Speaker 1: vehicle will come at fifteen percent tariff, a semi assembled 159 00:09:04,520 --> 00:09:08,600 Speaker 1: vehicle will come at five percent tariff, and a fully 160 00:09:08,760 --> 00:09:13,800 Speaker 1: knocked down all parts car is essentially no tariff, okay. 161 00:09:13,840 --> 00:09:16,079 Speaker 2: So they are trying to encourage the growth of local 162 00:09:16,120 --> 00:09:18,720 Speaker 2: car manufacturing within Ethiopia. 163 00:09:18,280 --> 00:09:22,520 Speaker 1: At least at the assembly level, maybe eventually at making parts. 164 00:09:22,720 --> 00:09:26,760 Speaker 2: And I obviously the story of Ethiopian mobility is not 165 00:09:26,920 --> 00:09:29,520 Speaker 2: really focused on cars, and we're going to come onto 166 00:09:29,520 --> 00:09:31,800 Speaker 2: an interview that you had with a local entrepreneur there 167 00:09:31,880 --> 00:09:34,400 Speaker 2: later in the show. But when we think of cars, 168 00:09:34,800 --> 00:09:36,960 Speaker 2: is it accurate to describe this as a leapfrog story? 169 00:09:37,000 --> 00:09:39,480 Speaker 2: You know, they've got very very low penetration of cars 170 00:09:39,480 --> 00:09:42,720 Speaker 2: in the population so far, but from here on out, 171 00:09:42,960 --> 00:09:46,120 Speaker 2: they're going to skip straight past the fossil fuel version 172 00:09:46,240 --> 00:09:48,720 Speaker 2: and go straight to electric vehicles. Is that what we're saying? 173 00:09:48,840 --> 00:09:51,200 Speaker 1: That's right. I mean, if we were to think about 174 00:09:51,240 --> 00:09:53,680 Speaker 1: it from like the climate movement side, there's a whole 175 00:09:53,800 --> 00:09:56,719 Speaker 1: class of people who say, like cars are the evil thing. 176 00:09:56,840 --> 00:10:00,960 Speaker 1: They are making lives and cities really bad. You know, 177 00:10:01,120 --> 00:10:03,640 Speaker 1: accidents increase as the number of cars increase. We know 178 00:10:03,720 --> 00:10:08,840 Speaker 1: that's true, and that really we should just focus on 179 00:10:09,360 --> 00:10:13,720 Speaker 1: personal mobility through bicycles or public transport through buses or trains. 180 00:10:14,840 --> 00:10:17,680 Speaker 1: That's great if you can afford to make that work. 181 00:10:18,040 --> 00:10:21,640 Speaker 1: It's an interesting way to push forward. But we've talked 182 00:10:21,640 --> 00:10:24,640 Speaker 1: about Netherlands on the show before. You know, only about 183 00:10:24,679 --> 00:10:27,120 Speaker 1: ten percent of all miles travel in the Netherlands, the 184 00:10:27,640 --> 00:10:32,040 Speaker 1: friendliest countries for bicycle is on bicycles. Fifty percent or 185 00:10:32,040 --> 00:10:35,680 Speaker 1: more is still on personal cars. So you know, growing 186 00:10:35,760 --> 00:10:38,360 Speaker 1: up in India, I have seen that as soon as 187 00:10:38,400 --> 00:10:40,480 Speaker 1: people are able to afford the first thing they want 188 00:10:40,640 --> 00:10:45,720 Speaker 1: is cars. There's just luxury or status or personal freedoms 189 00:10:45,720 --> 00:10:49,320 Speaker 1: that come with a car that people desire. So it 190 00:10:49,440 --> 00:10:52,000 Speaker 1: is important to try and tell the story of what 191 00:10:52,200 --> 00:10:55,440 Speaker 1: is happening to car markets in developing countries. And if 192 00:10:55,480 --> 00:10:58,480 Speaker 1: youps showing that you can leave frog, you can do 193 00:10:58,520 --> 00:11:01,800 Speaker 1: what you did with tele phone to mobile phones, you 194 00:11:01,840 --> 00:11:04,920 Speaker 1: know which I saw growing up in India, Like we 195 00:11:05,080 --> 00:11:08,000 Speaker 1: used to have a telephone and now for the last 196 00:11:08,080 --> 00:11:10,840 Speaker 1: fifteen years my parents have do not have a telephone 197 00:11:10,840 --> 00:11:14,280 Speaker 1: at home. It's just mobile phones and often more than one. 198 00:11:15,640 --> 00:11:19,080 Speaker 1: That's what is going to happen in Ethiopia if this 199 00:11:19,160 --> 00:11:21,480 Speaker 1: policy continues for your PC. 200 00:11:21,520 --> 00:11:24,840 Speaker 2: He spoke to an entrepreneur who's working in Addis Ababa. 201 00:11:24,920 --> 00:11:28,440 Speaker 2: His name is Yumas Sasaki. He's actually an unlikely figure, 202 00:11:28,440 --> 00:11:32,000 Speaker 2: a Japanese man who's moved out to Ethiopia. What's he doing. 203 00:11:32,480 --> 00:11:34,840 Speaker 1: I found a story fascinating and we'll hear more from 204 00:11:35,040 --> 00:11:39,360 Speaker 1: the interview. But typically if you go to a developing country, 205 00:11:39,640 --> 00:11:42,800 Speaker 1: you will see the main mode of transport is two wheelers. 206 00:11:43,640 --> 00:11:47,319 Speaker 1: But in Addis Ababa there used to be no two wheelers. 207 00:11:48,080 --> 00:11:51,960 Speaker 1: The government had essentially banned giving licenses for two wheelers. 208 00:11:52,480 --> 00:11:55,959 Speaker 1: And this Japanese man comes in and says, no, I'm 209 00:11:56,000 --> 00:11:58,240 Speaker 1: going to try and convince the government that they need 210 00:11:58,240 --> 00:12:00,680 Speaker 1: two wheelers, and not just two wheelers, they need electric 211 00:12:00,679 --> 00:12:03,920 Speaker 1: two wheelers. So let's have a listen to my interview 212 00:12:03,960 --> 00:12:07,199 Speaker 1: with Yuma Sasaki, the founder and CEO of Do Die. 213 00:12:07,640 --> 00:12:14,920 Speaker 1: Thank you, Accha, thank you Oscar. After the break, I 214 00:12:14,960 --> 00:12:17,800 Speaker 1: talked to Yuma Sasaki, founder of the electric two wheeler 215 00:12:17,880 --> 00:12:20,200 Speaker 1: startup Do Die. If you want to get in touch 216 00:12:20,240 --> 00:12:23,640 Speaker 1: with Zero with guest suggestions, feedback, or anything at all, 217 00:12:24,120 --> 00:12:26,800 Speaker 1: right to the show at Zero pod at Bloomberg dot net. 218 00:12:27,120 --> 00:12:29,840 Speaker 1: And while you're at it, writers review on Apple, podcast, 219 00:12:29,880 --> 00:12:46,400 Speaker 1: Spotify and YouTube. It helps new listeners find the show. Yuma, 220 00:12:46,520 --> 00:12:47,280 Speaker 1: welcome to Zero. 221 00:12:47,800 --> 00:12:51,360 Speaker 3: Thank you very much for having us and putting spotlighting 222 00:12:51,360 --> 00:12:52,040 Speaker 3: in Ethiopia. 223 00:12:52,480 --> 00:12:54,520 Speaker 1: Before you tell us the story of Dodi, tell us 224 00:12:54,520 --> 00:13:00,520 Speaker 1: about how a Japanese entrepreneur ended up in Ethiopia. When 225 00:13:00,559 --> 00:13:02,640 Speaker 1: did you first visit, what was the country like and 226 00:13:02,679 --> 00:13:04,680 Speaker 1: why do you feel like you wanted to work here? 227 00:13:05,480 --> 00:13:08,640 Speaker 3: I've been here in Ethiopia for three years. But this 228 00:13:08,800 --> 00:13:11,520 Speaker 3: is not the first time that I've been in Africa. 229 00:13:11,640 --> 00:13:15,959 Speaker 3: As you said, I'm originally from Japan. I was interested 230 00:13:16,000 --> 00:13:19,160 Speaker 3: in coming to Africa and then the first time I 231 00:13:19,280 --> 00:13:24,280 Speaker 3: worked in Western Africa about ten years ago, twenty sixteen, 232 00:13:24,800 --> 00:13:28,560 Speaker 3: and I spent two years working at a startup and 233 00:13:28,600 --> 00:13:33,000 Speaker 3: then I got convinced that Africa is the future. So 234 00:13:33,360 --> 00:13:36,280 Speaker 3: though I went back to Japan, I worked at uber, 235 00:13:37,200 --> 00:13:40,680 Speaker 3: I always had an interest and then tried to find 236 00:13:40,679 --> 00:13:44,600 Speaker 3: an opportunity to come back. And then I did research 237 00:13:44,880 --> 00:13:49,560 Speaker 3: and Ethiopia is the market or the country where a 238 00:13:49,600 --> 00:13:54,400 Speaker 3: lot of opportunity. While it's famous for difficult market to 239 00:13:54,400 --> 00:13:58,760 Speaker 3: do business. I decided to come to Ethiopia and then 240 00:13:58,920 --> 00:14:03,120 Speaker 3: decided to start with the immobility about three years ago 241 00:14:03,160 --> 00:14:05,400 Speaker 3: and then just moved in Ethiopia. 242 00:14:05,520 --> 00:14:08,400 Speaker 1: So why thepia do tell us what is it like 243 00:14:08,559 --> 00:14:09,280 Speaker 1: on the ground. 244 00:14:09,880 --> 00:14:13,640 Speaker 3: I always say three reasons because people are very surprised 245 00:14:13,640 --> 00:14:17,040 Speaker 3: that I chose Ethiopia. First reason is a big market. 246 00:14:17,440 --> 00:14:21,920 Speaker 3: So especially as a foreigner, being away from your country, 247 00:14:22,000 --> 00:14:26,800 Speaker 3: your culture, your food, everything that is comfortable, you want 248 00:14:26,840 --> 00:14:30,480 Speaker 3: to make sure that if you make it, the impact 249 00:14:31,280 --> 00:14:35,280 Speaker 3: is big. So to make a big impact when it succeeds, 250 00:14:35,720 --> 00:14:38,040 Speaker 3: it needs to be a big market. So I only 251 00:14:38,080 --> 00:14:42,400 Speaker 3: look at the three or four biggest markets in Africa first, 252 00:14:42,440 --> 00:14:45,080 Speaker 3: all in terms of the country, so I look at Nigeria, 253 00:14:45,520 --> 00:14:49,800 Speaker 3: d RC, Congo as well. That's first criteria and then 254 00:14:49,840 --> 00:14:55,600 Speaker 3: the second criteria, which is pretty contrariant, is choose difficult market. 255 00:14:56,000 --> 00:15:00,840 Speaker 3: When I say difficult market, difficult to start, how to survive. 256 00:15:01,000 --> 00:15:04,400 Speaker 3: Those are the good markets in my opinion, especially when 257 00:15:04,400 --> 00:15:08,000 Speaker 3: you are small, because easy market when I say easy, 258 00:15:08,280 --> 00:15:12,280 Speaker 3: easy to start, easy to start market usually most difficult 259 00:15:12,280 --> 00:15:15,600 Speaker 3: market to win because all the competition is there. To me, 260 00:15:15,760 --> 00:15:19,440 Speaker 3: like Kenya and Rwanda. If you are a small startup 261 00:15:19,560 --> 00:15:22,920 Speaker 3: and if you go too easy to start market where 262 00:15:23,360 --> 00:15:27,360 Speaker 3: very competitive, you cannot win at the end in my opinion, 263 00:15:27,520 --> 00:15:31,840 Speaker 3: so there's no point to go there. Whilst very difficult market, 264 00:15:32,080 --> 00:15:35,520 Speaker 3: also the competition is the least so you can focus 265 00:15:35,600 --> 00:15:38,800 Speaker 3: on building a good team and a product. Though the 266 00:15:38,960 --> 00:15:42,800 Speaker 3: chance that you can start and survive is law. When 267 00:15:42,840 --> 00:15:45,640 Speaker 3: you make it, you are the only one who stands there. 268 00:15:46,080 --> 00:15:49,280 Speaker 3: So that's the right market that I think. In Ethiopia, 269 00:15:49,760 --> 00:15:53,320 Speaker 3: among those big markets, one of the most difficult markets. 270 00:15:53,800 --> 00:15:57,160 Speaker 3: And then the third this is more personal. Again as 271 00:15:57,200 --> 00:16:00,520 Speaker 3: a foreigner or expect it's important that you really like 272 00:16:00,640 --> 00:16:04,600 Speaker 3: the people there because you work every day and the 273 00:16:04,720 --> 00:16:09,600 Speaker 3: work is very tough, and if you just fed up 274 00:16:09,640 --> 00:16:15,360 Speaker 3: with everything, tired of the people you're surrounded by, you 275 00:16:15,520 --> 00:16:19,240 Speaker 3: easily give up and then go back to your country, 276 00:16:19,280 --> 00:16:22,800 Speaker 3: which I see a lot in my experts. Friends. You know, 277 00:16:22,840 --> 00:16:24,880 Speaker 3: after two or three as you give up and then 278 00:16:24,960 --> 00:16:27,520 Speaker 3: you start complaining, or even when you are here, you 279 00:16:27,640 --> 00:16:31,360 Speaker 3: complaining by drinking with your friends from same country. 280 00:16:31,640 --> 00:16:31,800 Speaker 1: Right. 281 00:16:32,200 --> 00:16:35,680 Speaker 3: I didn't want to be there like that. Once I committed, 282 00:16:35,800 --> 00:16:38,600 Speaker 3: I need to make it and it will take five years, 283 00:16:38,640 --> 00:16:43,840 Speaker 3: seven years, ten years. So to make that commitment, I 284 00:16:43,880 --> 00:16:46,520 Speaker 3: really need to like the people. So I visited it 285 00:16:46,560 --> 00:16:48,800 Speaker 3: you'll be a couple of times and I got convinced 286 00:16:48,800 --> 00:16:51,880 Speaker 3: that the people are the ones that I want to 287 00:16:51,920 --> 00:16:55,320 Speaker 3: build the future together. So those three reasons big market, 288 00:16:55,920 --> 00:16:59,920 Speaker 3: difficult market, and great people to me, Yeah. 289 00:17:00,080 --> 00:17:03,360 Speaker 1: Well, let me explain the difficulty. It's not just about 290 00:17:03,400 --> 00:17:06,280 Speaker 1: business or being a developing country. Yes, it's one hundred 291 00:17:06,280 --> 00:17:09,200 Speaker 1: and thirty million people population in that country, so it's 292 00:17:09,200 --> 00:17:13,960 Speaker 1: a big market. Sure. But in twenty nineteen, the Ethiopian 293 00:17:14,000 --> 00:17:19,800 Speaker 1: government in Addis Ababa banned personal use of two wheelers, 294 00:17:20,600 --> 00:17:23,240 Speaker 1: and you wanted to start a company that was going 295 00:17:23,320 --> 00:17:28,119 Speaker 1: to make and sell electric two wheelers. So what were 296 00:17:28,160 --> 00:17:32,520 Speaker 1: you thinking that the government will suddenly think, you know, oh, 297 00:17:32,640 --> 00:17:35,280 Speaker 1: these electric two wheelers which we banned because there was 298 00:17:35,280 --> 00:17:37,720 Speaker 1: too much crime on the street, is not a problem anymore. 299 00:17:38,119 --> 00:17:40,720 Speaker 3: Yeah, So, first of all, what they banned is not 300 00:17:40,840 --> 00:17:45,760 Speaker 3: necessarily electric two wheelers. They banned two wheelers, including electric, 301 00:17:46,000 --> 00:17:51,920 Speaker 3: but few ln electric two wheelers. Yeah. So'm I worked 302 00:17:51,920 --> 00:17:57,240 Speaker 3: at Uba in Japan, and when you start a new 303 00:17:57,400 --> 00:18:01,080 Speaker 3: product for the market, new concept, of course, they are 304 00:18:01,119 --> 00:18:04,760 Speaker 3: back and forth. And then actually I get nervers when 305 00:18:04,800 --> 00:18:07,919 Speaker 3: there's no back and forth, because if everybody thinks it's 306 00:18:07,960 --> 00:18:10,440 Speaker 3: a good idea, you know, that means that it's too 307 00:18:10,480 --> 00:18:13,600 Speaker 3: good to be true and everybody can start. So, first 308 00:18:13,640 --> 00:18:17,040 Speaker 3: of all, a good level of challenge, whether it's regulations 309 00:18:17,160 --> 00:18:21,119 Speaker 3: or technology side, I don't mind at all. Rather, I 310 00:18:21,200 --> 00:18:27,840 Speaker 3: prefer some level of blockers or difficulties, challenges that most 311 00:18:27,880 --> 00:18:31,280 Speaker 3: of people, most of average people decide not to go 312 00:18:32,280 --> 00:18:38,320 Speaker 3: two Why but why do I get conviction that it's 313 00:18:38,400 --> 00:18:41,680 Speaker 3: okay to start electric to wheellas in adis Ababa. It 314 00:18:41,760 --> 00:18:45,800 Speaker 3: is simple. If you look at a big picture addis Ababa. 315 00:18:46,240 --> 00:18:48,400 Speaker 3: You know, some people say seven mediums, some people say 316 00:18:48,400 --> 00:18:51,480 Speaker 3: ten medium. You know, different definition of addis Ababa, but 317 00:18:51,680 --> 00:18:56,800 Speaker 3: roughly a to ten medium metropolitan. So if you look 318 00:18:56,840 --> 00:18:59,880 Speaker 3: at the world and then look at metropolitan of eight 319 00:19:00,040 --> 00:19:03,720 Speaker 3: to ten medium population, there are three ways to me 320 00:19:04,280 --> 00:19:10,359 Speaker 3: only three ways that people move around relatively efficiently. One, 321 00:19:10,440 --> 00:19:14,000 Speaker 3: which is exception, is a US. People move around with 322 00:19:14,080 --> 00:19:17,400 Speaker 3: the cars. You know, it's the richest country. The land 323 00:19:17,560 --> 00:19:21,000 Speaker 3: is huge, so let's forget about that. Then. Other than that, 324 00:19:21,160 --> 00:19:26,480 Speaker 3: only two options. One is like Tokyo, Paris and London, 325 00:19:26,760 --> 00:19:31,280 Speaker 3: the majority move around with the relatively efficient metro for 326 00:19:31,359 --> 00:19:35,199 Speaker 3: ten millium population city. The other option is most of 327 00:19:35,240 --> 00:19:41,040 Speaker 3: the Southeast Asian cities like Bangkok, Jakarta, ho Chimin, where 328 00:19:41,119 --> 00:19:45,679 Speaker 3: eighty ninety percent of people moving around by two wheelers 329 00:19:46,000 --> 00:19:50,720 Speaker 3: motorbike because average people can't afford the cars. Also, the 330 00:19:50,800 --> 00:19:55,679 Speaker 3: road infrastructure is not enough to accommodate if everybody drives cars, 331 00:19:55,960 --> 00:20:01,640 Speaker 3: so people end up driving two wheelers. Which adis Ababa 332 00:20:02,320 --> 00:20:05,359 Speaker 3: of ten million population will go in the future. I 333 00:20:05,359 --> 00:20:08,040 Speaker 3: don't know whether it's one year or five years. But 334 00:20:08,440 --> 00:20:12,560 Speaker 3: at a certain point for majority of people moving around efficiently, 335 00:20:12,640 --> 00:20:15,520 Speaker 3: what's the right path? Then to me obvious that it's 336 00:20:15,520 --> 00:20:19,520 Speaker 3: going to be two wheelers. And then the other part. Okay, 337 00:20:19,680 --> 00:20:24,560 Speaker 3: in Southeast Asia mostly fuel two wheelers, but for Ethiopia, 338 00:20:24,640 --> 00:20:29,719 Speaker 3: fuel does make sense. No, fuel is very expensive importing 339 00:20:30,040 --> 00:20:35,440 Speaker 3: and put a pressure on the government finance, while electricity 340 00:20:35,560 --> 00:20:38,399 Speaker 3: is one of the cheapest and also abandoned that the 341 00:20:38,400 --> 00:20:42,960 Speaker 3: Ethiopia even selling sublus to neighboring countries. Okay, that means 342 00:20:43,000 --> 00:20:47,080 Speaker 3: at the high level macro level, electric two wheelers is 343 00:20:47,119 --> 00:20:50,240 Speaker 3: the future for Adis Ababa. The only thing that I 344 00:20:50,240 --> 00:20:52,440 Speaker 3: don't know is that three years, five years, seven years, 345 00:20:52,640 --> 00:20:54,360 Speaker 3: that's why I decided to go for it. 346 00:20:54,720 --> 00:20:57,639 Speaker 1: And what was it like to try and convince the 347 00:20:57,680 --> 00:21:01,040 Speaker 1: government to start to allow electric two whels or any 348 00:21:01,040 --> 00:21:04,359 Speaker 1: two wheelers again on the street. Because you clearly succeeded. 349 00:21:04,400 --> 00:21:07,360 Speaker 1: You have a business now, but what were the conversations 350 00:21:07,520 --> 00:21:09,800 Speaker 1: like and how long did it take for you to 351 00:21:09,880 --> 00:21:13,000 Speaker 1: convince the government to allow two wheelers to come back 352 00:21:13,000 --> 00:21:13,960 Speaker 1: on at a streets. 353 00:21:15,560 --> 00:21:20,080 Speaker 3: Basically two things, so one is job creation site and 354 00:21:20,119 --> 00:21:26,159 Speaker 3: then second bit is security safety or security concern that 355 00:21:26,280 --> 00:21:30,840 Speaker 3: government had about two wheelers. So first one is most important. 356 00:21:30,880 --> 00:21:36,080 Speaker 3: WI I think two wheelers not just for commuting, but 357 00:21:36,440 --> 00:21:40,520 Speaker 3: one bike is one job in the gig economy, and 358 00:21:40,560 --> 00:21:46,960 Speaker 3: it's important piece for e commerce that will grow or 359 00:21:47,040 --> 00:21:51,879 Speaker 3: that even the government wants it grow. So I they 360 00:21:51,920 --> 00:21:57,960 Speaker 3: basically convinced them that without the two wheelers, without electric 361 00:21:58,000 --> 00:22:01,680 Speaker 3: two wheelers, it's very difficult out for e commas to 362 00:22:01,720 --> 00:22:06,800 Speaker 3: grow fast enough and then create enough jobs. So that's 363 00:22:06,840 --> 00:22:09,640 Speaker 3: one part job creation and e commerce. The other side 364 00:22:09,800 --> 00:22:14,080 Speaker 3: is security. So you know, Addis Ababa is also has 365 00:22:14,119 --> 00:22:19,960 Speaker 3: a headquarter of African Union. It's very important politically important location. 366 00:22:20,040 --> 00:22:25,400 Speaker 3: It's a hub for Ethiopian airlines. They really care about security, 367 00:22:25,440 --> 00:22:29,440 Speaker 3: and then they don't. The government doesn't want random, you know, 368 00:22:29,520 --> 00:22:35,119 Speaker 3: one hundred thousand people driving crazy without any security measure. 369 00:22:35,240 --> 00:22:39,600 Speaker 3: So what we suggested we put GPS and we put 370 00:22:39,840 --> 00:22:44,800 Speaker 3: IoT where if necessary, government can have access to. And 371 00:22:44,880 --> 00:22:49,960 Speaker 3: of course we get consensus from our customers because customers 372 00:22:50,080 --> 00:22:53,919 Speaker 3: doesn't care much whether the government can have access or not. 373 00:22:54,080 --> 00:22:57,520 Speaker 3: Rather they care whether they have access to electric two 374 00:22:57,560 --> 00:23:02,040 Speaker 3: wheelers to make money by delivery. So those are the 375 00:23:02,040 --> 00:23:06,639 Speaker 3: two things that I try to explain over and over 376 00:23:07,000 --> 00:23:10,520 Speaker 3: again to a different government entity. That's the main reason. 377 00:23:10,560 --> 00:23:14,760 Speaker 3: So still to make it clear, electric two wheelers for 378 00:23:15,560 --> 00:23:19,480 Speaker 3: commuting is not allowed yet. It's mainly for dig workers 379 00:23:19,600 --> 00:23:20,639 Speaker 3: for commercial purpose. 380 00:23:21,280 --> 00:23:23,560 Speaker 1: So you're in this journey trying to convince the government 381 00:23:23,640 --> 00:23:27,080 Speaker 1: you succeed. You're building this business. And then while this 382 00:23:27,119 --> 00:23:30,800 Speaker 1: is happening, in January twenty twenty four, the government brings 383 00:23:30,800 --> 00:23:36,240 Speaker 1: in this ban on importing fossil fuel vehicles. What does 384 00:23:36,280 --> 00:23:40,119 Speaker 1: the electric vehicle market outside of two wheelers look like 385 00:23:40,320 --> 00:23:41,280 Speaker 1: in Addis today? 386 00:23:41,640 --> 00:23:46,000 Speaker 3: Totally changed in a positive way. I'll give you an example. 387 00:23:46,040 --> 00:23:50,000 Speaker 3: There's a right share service in Ethiopia. It's called the 388 00:23:50,080 --> 00:23:53,199 Speaker 3: right When I came to Ethiopia three years ago, one 389 00:23:53,320 --> 00:23:56,879 Speaker 3: hundred percent when you call right share, one hundred percent 390 00:23:57,080 --> 00:24:01,520 Speaker 3: fuel cuts for the fuel CAUs now seventy to eighty 391 00:24:01,560 --> 00:24:05,960 Speaker 3: percent chance that it's electric. So that tells how much 392 00:24:06,040 --> 00:24:10,320 Speaker 3: changed that? Yeah, how much impact that has on the 393 00:24:10,440 --> 00:24:14,879 Speaker 3: electric mobility. Seeing, at least in Addis Ababa and also 394 00:24:15,400 --> 00:24:18,119 Speaker 3: from Japan and Japan, roughly one hundred and fifty thousand 395 00:24:18,520 --> 00:24:23,840 Speaker 3: electric cars fo one hundred and twenty millium populations in 396 00:24:24,080 --> 00:24:28,159 Speaker 3: just two years. Idiopia surpassed that from zero so you 397 00:24:28,200 --> 00:24:33,560 Speaker 3: can see the level of change for electric mobility. 398 00:24:33,880 --> 00:24:37,800 Speaker 1: And Fasika Taisi, who's the reporter in Addis Ababa who 399 00:24:37,800 --> 00:24:40,480 Speaker 1: works at Bloomberg and wrote the story with me, also 400 00:24:40,520 --> 00:24:43,760 Speaker 1: told us about how there are these huge lines at 401 00:24:43,800 --> 00:24:46,199 Speaker 1: gas stations to try and get fuel and you have 402 00:24:46,240 --> 00:24:49,960 Speaker 1: to wait hours sometimes to even get fuel even if 403 00:24:49,960 --> 00:24:53,000 Speaker 1: you can afford to pay what is pretty expensive energy. 404 00:24:53,119 --> 00:24:57,000 Speaker 3: Right, that's correct, and also those are this is one 405 00:24:57,040 --> 00:25:01,000 Speaker 3: of the things that I witnessed three years ago. Okay, 406 00:25:01,040 --> 00:25:04,359 Speaker 3: two wheelers didn't have a spotlight, but it's going to 407 00:25:04,359 --> 00:25:07,920 Speaker 3: be important for gig economies. But at the same time 408 00:25:08,040 --> 00:25:13,040 Speaker 3: it should be electric not fuel. Again, that was way 409 00:25:13,119 --> 00:25:17,880 Speaker 3: before the regulation change came. I never imagined that actually 410 00:25:17,920 --> 00:25:24,680 Speaker 3: regulation change or shift to electric mobility would come that first. Yeah, 411 00:25:24,680 --> 00:25:29,119 Speaker 3: but looks like a high level government and what I 412 00:25:29,240 --> 00:25:31,680 Speaker 3: had seen aligned luckily. 413 00:25:32,000 --> 00:25:34,320 Speaker 1: Now let's talk about your business. So how many years 414 00:25:34,320 --> 00:25:38,800 Speaker 1: ago did you start do and what's the journey being Like. 415 00:25:39,040 --> 00:25:42,080 Speaker 3: In Ethiopia, you need a business license to start business. 416 00:25:42,119 --> 00:25:46,520 Speaker 3: A business license exactly three years ago. I got and 417 00:25:47,520 --> 00:25:51,280 Speaker 3: started hiring first five people like literally three years ago, 418 00:25:51,680 --> 00:25:56,280 Speaker 3: and then spent six months to yeah, prepare the factory 419 00:25:57,320 --> 00:26:02,560 Speaker 3: and order first container and then we started assembling and 420 00:26:02,560 --> 00:26:06,480 Speaker 3: then start selling. Yeah, and then we're now selling two 421 00:26:06,480 --> 00:26:07,800 Speaker 3: and a half years roughly. 422 00:26:08,200 --> 00:26:11,840 Speaker 1: That's pretty rapid. I mean for difficulty of doing business 423 00:26:12,000 --> 00:26:14,760 Speaker 1: in our country like that, that's pretty good to turn around. 424 00:26:15,359 --> 00:26:18,480 Speaker 1: How did you assemble these vehicles? So where are you 425 00:26:18,480 --> 00:26:21,920 Speaker 1: getting your parts from? What does assembly look like? Did 426 00:26:21,960 --> 00:26:24,119 Speaker 1: you have skilled workers to do it? So? 427 00:26:25,000 --> 00:26:28,320 Speaker 3: First of all, the parts are we designed in a 428 00:26:28,400 --> 00:26:33,320 Speaker 3: different team, different country, including a Japan and Singapore. We 429 00:26:33,400 --> 00:26:39,000 Speaker 3: have a Singaporean responsible for hardware, and we have a 430 00:26:39,000 --> 00:26:44,960 Speaker 3: partner in Germany. But yeah, majority, significant majority of parts 431 00:26:45,200 --> 00:26:51,080 Speaker 3: coming from China, including batteries, and we import in c 432 00:26:51,280 --> 00:26:53,760 Speaker 3: KD which is basically one hundred and fifty to two 433 00:26:53,840 --> 00:26:59,240 Speaker 3: hundred parts, and we assemble in Ethiopia. So skill the workers. Yeah, 434 00:26:59,280 --> 00:27:03,240 Speaker 3: it's actually difficult. So two things. One is difficult, but 435 00:27:03,800 --> 00:27:09,440 Speaker 3: electric two wheeler assembling is significantly easier than fuel bike assembling, 436 00:27:09,480 --> 00:27:12,560 Speaker 3: which is very helpful for us to build a team 437 00:27:12,760 --> 00:27:18,919 Speaker 3: and operations. Two, I would say et Theiopians in general 438 00:27:19,040 --> 00:27:25,320 Speaker 3: pretty good at learning the process and doing things, and 439 00:27:25,320 --> 00:27:29,719 Speaker 3: then they don't deviate much from what they're supposed to do, 440 00:27:30,480 --> 00:27:32,480 Speaker 3: which really helps for manufacturing. 441 00:27:32,800 --> 00:27:35,359 Speaker 1: Tell me how have you succeeded, like how many units 442 00:27:35,359 --> 00:27:37,640 Speaker 1: have you sold? What does the market look like now 443 00:27:37,680 --> 00:27:38,160 Speaker 1: for you? 444 00:27:38,359 --> 00:27:41,440 Speaker 3: Yeah, I never used the word succeeded, but yeah, thank 445 00:27:41,480 --> 00:27:45,360 Speaker 3: you very much. Yeah, we sold about one eight hundred 446 00:27:45,720 --> 00:27:50,240 Speaker 3: bikes as of now and about ninety five percent market 447 00:27:50,280 --> 00:27:55,520 Speaker 3: share in Addis Ababa. What we sold is called fixed 448 00:27:55,520 --> 00:28:00,440 Speaker 3: battery bike, so battery is inside the bike and customer 449 00:28:00,480 --> 00:28:04,280 Speaker 3: patches together with the battery and then they charge by themselves. 450 00:28:04,800 --> 00:28:08,240 Speaker 3: They can charge at home. And we are starting now 451 00:28:08,760 --> 00:28:14,240 Speaker 3: what's called a battery swapping, So customer purchased the vehicle 452 00:28:14,400 --> 00:28:19,560 Speaker 3: bike without battery and we provide batteries swapping savice. So 453 00:28:19,600 --> 00:28:23,560 Speaker 3: we basically have hundreds of stations in Addis Ababah and 454 00:28:23,680 --> 00:28:26,680 Speaker 3: we are waiting with the charged batteries. So when customer 455 00:28:26,800 --> 00:28:30,040 Speaker 3: comes to one of our stations, just like atm or 456 00:28:30,119 --> 00:28:33,200 Speaker 3: gas station, they spend two three minutes and then they 457 00:28:33,240 --> 00:28:35,280 Speaker 3: go back because what we need to do is just 458 00:28:35,359 --> 00:28:39,040 Speaker 3: swap the batteries. They are depleted batteries and our charged 459 00:28:39,080 --> 00:28:42,360 Speaker 3: batteries at the station. We just started. 460 00:28:43,320 --> 00:28:48,080 Speaker 1: And what is your goal in the years to come, 461 00:28:48,560 --> 00:28:51,040 Speaker 1: is it to just grow in Ethiopia. Is it to 462 00:28:51,120 --> 00:28:54,040 Speaker 1: grow across other markets. 463 00:28:53,880 --> 00:28:57,920 Speaker 3: It's very fancy if you say that you go all Africa. 464 00:28:58,280 --> 00:29:02,560 Speaker 3: But we I just say honestly, focus on solving the 465 00:29:02,640 --> 00:29:06,360 Speaker 3: problem in Adisababa first and I don't want to rush 466 00:29:06,440 --> 00:29:11,920 Speaker 3: in an expansion. So next two years focus on Addis Ababa. 467 00:29:13,200 --> 00:29:20,040 Speaker 3: This year we want to create the reliable battery swapping network, 468 00:29:20,160 --> 00:29:24,040 Speaker 3: meaning one hundred or two hundred stations everywhere with a 469 00:29:24,160 --> 00:29:29,080 Speaker 3: three thousand use us. That's our goal. Once you get 470 00:29:29,160 --> 00:29:32,800 Speaker 3: three thousand to make it. Thirty thousand is relatively easier 471 00:29:32,880 --> 00:29:37,280 Speaker 3: than zero to three thousand, right, So that's our focus 472 00:29:37,320 --> 00:29:40,760 Speaker 3: for this year, zero to three thousand for battery swapping 473 00:29:42,080 --> 00:29:45,960 Speaker 3: and then next from next year just scale up. And 474 00:29:46,040 --> 00:29:51,040 Speaker 3: at the same time we are building everything is software based, 475 00:29:51,200 --> 00:29:56,120 Speaker 3: so customers drivers needs to software to swap battery using 476 00:29:56,200 --> 00:30:00,960 Speaker 3: QR code and payment also our software, so that with 477 00:30:01,160 --> 00:30:05,640 Speaker 3: the software, we want to expand to other markets once 478 00:30:05,720 --> 00:30:09,520 Speaker 3: we solve the problem in Adis Ababa in two years time. 479 00:30:10,040 --> 00:30:12,520 Speaker 1: And what about money? How much money have you raised? 480 00:30:12,520 --> 00:30:14,000 Speaker 1: Has it been easy or difficult? 481 00:30:14,680 --> 00:30:18,800 Speaker 3: We raised so far seven million dollars in until the 482 00:30:18,800 --> 00:30:22,520 Speaker 3: previous round and actually we are closing this round. I 483 00:30:22,560 --> 00:30:25,680 Speaker 3: cannot share the exact numbers, but we are closing the 484 00:30:26,400 --> 00:30:29,920 Speaker 3: round more than ten million dollars next month. In March. 485 00:30:29,960 --> 00:30:31,040 Speaker 3: We will make it public. 486 00:30:31,240 --> 00:30:33,040 Speaker 1: And it's not been difficult raising funding. 487 00:30:33,800 --> 00:30:38,240 Speaker 3: Of course, it's difficult, always difficult, difficult, But in a 488 00:30:38,280 --> 00:30:42,320 Speaker 3: way it's similar to what I mentioned earlier about like 489 00:30:42,440 --> 00:30:46,400 Speaker 3: Kenya and Rwanda. Imagine that if you're Kenyan startups, it's 490 00:30:46,520 --> 00:30:49,240 Speaker 3: easy in a way that you don't have to convince 491 00:30:49,320 --> 00:30:53,840 Speaker 3: investors to invest startup in Kenya. You just need to 492 00:30:53,920 --> 00:31:00,840 Speaker 3: convince them to invest in you rather than not your Competitorsopia. Opposite, 493 00:31:01,200 --> 00:31:04,680 Speaker 3: once you convince them to invest in Ethiopia, it's automatically 494 00:31:04,800 --> 00:31:09,160 Speaker 3: us because we are the we are the immobility sector. 495 00:31:09,240 --> 00:31:12,480 Speaker 3: We got the ninety five percent market share. Also all 496 00:31:12,600 --> 00:31:17,520 Speaker 3: sector startups, we are the biggest now so but convincing 497 00:31:17,760 --> 00:31:21,200 Speaker 3: them to invest in startups in Ethiopia is of course 498 00:31:21,360 --> 00:31:22,080 Speaker 3: very difficult. 499 00:31:22,560 --> 00:31:24,960 Speaker 1: Yeah, it's been great talking to you Uma. Thank you 500 00:31:25,040 --> 00:31:28,240 Speaker 1: also for allowing our photographer to come to your factory. 501 00:31:29,040 --> 00:31:31,760 Speaker 1: I hope listeners will go and check out the story 502 00:31:31,760 --> 00:31:35,479 Speaker 1: that we've written about Ethiopia and its electric vehicle journey, 503 00:31:35,880 --> 00:31:40,200 Speaker 1: which features some of your photos, and I look forward 504 00:31:40,240 --> 00:31:43,240 Speaker 1: to meeting you in addis when I come for Cop 505 00:31:43,240 --> 00:31:44,280 Speaker 1: thirty two hopefully. 506 00:31:44,880 --> 00:31:45,280 Speaker 3: Thank you. 507 00:31:51,760 --> 00:31:54,239 Speaker 1: And thank you for listening to Zero. Now for the 508 00:31:54,240 --> 00:32:05,600 Speaker 1: sound of the week. That is the sound of a 509 00:32:05,640 --> 00:32:09,680 Speaker 1: non electric moped engine, a sound that one day may 510 00:32:09,720 --> 00:32:14,160 Speaker 1: go extinct if entrepreneurs like Yuma Sasaki succeed. If you 511 00:32:14,240 --> 00:32:16,440 Speaker 1: like this episode, please take a moment to rate and 512 00:32:16,440 --> 00:32:19,920 Speaker 1: review the show on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, and YouTube. This 513 00:32:20,000 --> 00:32:22,880 Speaker 1: episode was produced by Oscar boyd Our. Theme music is 514 00:32:22,880 --> 00:32:27,280 Speaker 1: composed by wonder Lee. Special thanks to Fasika Tadasi, Samarsati, 515 00:32:27,720 --> 00:32:31,960 Speaker 1: Laura Milan and Sharon chen i'm Akshatrati back soon.