Speaker 1: You are listening to the Dan Patrick Show on Fox
Speaker 1: Sports Radio. Albert Brier's senior NFL reporter for the Monday
Speaker 1: Morning Quarterback, joining us on the program. All Right, your
Speaker 1: unbiased perch last night watching this game with the taunting call,
Speaker 1: What did you make of that, Albert? I mean, I
Speaker 1: think it's ridiculous the way they're calling these. You know,
Speaker 1: I could Cassius Marsh have done a little bit more
Speaker 1: to prevent that situation for himself. I mean the flying
Speaker 1: leg kick and then just sort of stare down on
Speaker 1: the other sideline. I mean, you know, like I think
Speaker 1: if you're you know, Matt Naggie today, you're probably telling
Speaker 1: your players and a teaching point, Like I don't agree
Speaker 1: with the rule, but like if they're calling this, just
Speaker 1: you know, if you're going to celebrate, don't make eye
Speaker 1: contact with anything the opponent, you know what I mean? Like,
Speaker 1: so you know, I do. I think Cassius Marsh did
Speaker 1: everything he could to avoid it. No, but like you
Speaker 1: add it to kind of the the hip chat there,
Speaker 1: which I'm sure you've seen that and everything else. It
Speaker 1: just like it just feels like this is not being
Speaker 1: consistently enforced across the league. And it feels like and
Speaker 1: I go, look, going into the season, Dan, I really
Speaker 1: thought like this is going to take them two three,
Speaker 1: four weeks to work it out and to figure out
Speaker 1: where that line is. And here we are and it's
Speaker 1: week nine, and it still feels like people don't have
Speaker 1: a full understanding of what's going to get called and
Speaker 1: what isn't going to get called. Okay, but it felt
Speaker 1: like Tony Creenti, the official, Yeah, initiated some contact here
Speaker 1: with no it did. And plus he doesn't throw the
Speaker 1: flag where there is an obvious taunt, but then he
Speaker 1: throws it like right after they you know, nudge into
Speaker 1: one another, like now it's retaliation. Yes, it felt like
Speaker 1: he missed the taunting penalty and then almost waited and
Speaker 1: then through the flag after you know, they made contact
Speaker 1: with one another. Yeah, And if you're the league, the
Speaker 1: last thing you can do is have the have the
Speaker 1: idea out there that your officials are engaging in anything
Speaker 1: that becomes in any way personal at all with any
Speaker 1: player coach, right Like they're they're supposed to be the
Speaker 1: ones that are out there that are not emotional, that
Speaker 1: are looking at the game from a down the middle perspective.
Speaker 1: And aren't letting anything anybody says get to them, And yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean it. I don't know if there was some
Speaker 1: sort of altercation between Marsh and the official and Tony
Speaker 1: earlier in the game, or if like just Tony got
Speaker 1: his back up about like the flying leg kick and
Speaker 1: stare down, but like it did feel like there was
Speaker 1: something personal there because it absolutely looked intentional. And um, look,
Speaker 1: the league's had a lot of problems with officiating in
Speaker 1: the last couple of years, you know, and I think
Speaker 1: that there's a little bit more to al riveron, you know,
Speaker 1: winding up out than than met the eye. And um,
Speaker 1: it just it feels to me like this is something
Speaker 1: they can't just let it go, you know. When the
Speaker 1: NFL respond today, like they don't always respond right away,
Speaker 1: but they might get it out there. The way the
Speaker 1: NFL would respond in a situation like this normally, if
Speaker 1: it were a player, right is they would say we're
Speaker 1: looking into it, right like, so they would at least
Speaker 1: get it out there and let the public know this
Speaker 1: is something we're not like just brushing over, We're looking
Speaker 1: into it. And then usually with the players, the way
Speaker 1: it works is that by the end of the week,
Speaker 1: they've sent the FedEx out to the guy, and that
Speaker 1: at that point the news gets out of whatever happened
Speaker 1: to the player or coach, whoever was involved in it.
Speaker 1: And so like you would think that it would probably
Speaker 1: be the same process here where the NFL gets something
Speaker 1: out on Tony CURRENTI say, we're looking into this and
Speaker 1: we're talking to him about this, and then if there
Speaker 1: was going to be any sort of sanctions, I think
Speaker 1: they'd probably be later in the week after they talk
Speaker 1: to everybody. What happens to Mac Jones after the shoe
Speaker 1: string tackle leg twists? Yeah, So like yeah, I mean,
Speaker 1: you know what's funny is like he comes off as
Speaker 1: like he almost comes off as like Opie and his
Speaker 1: press conferences, you know, I mean, like you you hear
Speaker 1: him talk public and he just seems like, you're, like,
Speaker 1: I don't know any better way to put it there,
Speaker 1: Like he kind of like sounds like he's stone when
Speaker 1: he talks, you know what I mean. And so he
Speaker 1: seems very kind of like passive, but you hear all
Speaker 1: these legendary stories about how competitive he is, right like,
Speaker 1: and you know, I remember talking to some scouts in
Speaker 1: the spring about how you know, the Alabama people would
Speaker 1: tell him he would get into it with Nick Saban
Speaker 1: when he was running the scout team and like yell,
Speaker 1: like trash talk Nick Saban about the way his defense
Speaker 1: was playing against Mac, who was too his backup at
Speaker 1: the time. And so I think that this is probably
Speaker 1: like a combination of Mac not knowing exactly what had
Speaker 1: happened because he had just gotten hit there, and probably
Speaker 1: being a little bit overly competitive in the moment. That said,
Speaker 1: the fact that the defensive player was injured on this play, right,
Speaker 1: and the fact that he suffered an ankle injury. I
Speaker 1: think the NFL has to look at this and say,
Speaker 1: if the roles were reversed and a quarterback got hurt
Speaker 1: in a play like this, what would happen? Right. That's
Speaker 1: why I think they've got a problem on their hands,
Speaker 1: And that's why I think they probably have to find
Speaker 1: Mac Jones, because that would be a legal play. That
Speaker 1: would be a legal play if Brian Burns had the
Speaker 1: ball in his hands, but he didn't, and the twist
Speaker 1: at the end, I think he should certainly say Mac
Speaker 1: had enough time there while he was on the ground
Speaker 1: to figure out seeing people running past him that Brian
Speaker 1: Burns probably didn't have the ball Odell Beckham Junior. Does
Speaker 1: he find out where he's going today. I don't think
Speaker 1: he gets claimed today, and I could be wrong about that,
Speaker 1: but you know, for another team to claim him at
Speaker 1: this point, it's seven point two five million dollars. They
Speaker 1: have a settlement agreement with the Browns where he'll you know,
Speaker 1: like he gets termination pan. I don't get in the
Speaker 1: weeds in it, but he gives three million back to
Speaker 1: the Browns. If you know, if he winds up clearing waivers,
Speaker 1: I think he probably will not get claimed. I mean,
Speaker 1: there are a couple of teams in there that are
Speaker 1: on that list that have enough money to claim him
Speaker 1: that are sort of interesting to me. The one that
Speaker 1: you really look at a Seattle just because Pete Carroll's
Speaker 1: already addressed it publicly. You know, they've tried to show
Speaker 1: Russell Wilson like, we're all in for you to to
Speaker 1: make it happen with you right now. And I think
Speaker 1: the Seahawks have to reckon with the possibility too that
Speaker 1: this might be it for them with Russell Wilson right like,
Speaker 1: And so if this is it for them with Russell Wilson,
Speaker 1: what's the harm in going and you know, burning the
Speaker 1: cap space that you have on a player that's gonna
Speaker 1: be his best and so you know, then you kind
Speaker 1: of create a situation where it's like, okay, like we're
Speaker 1: making one great run with Russell Wilson here, and maybe
Speaker 1: there's a long term benefit where you wind up making
Speaker 1: a real run. You know, he's convinced that he wants
Speaker 1: to stay there longer than just the rest of this year. Okay,
Speaker 1: explain this to me that O'Dell Beckham Junior is not
Speaker 1: good for the Browns, but Odell Beckham Junior is good
Speaker 1: for Seattle. I think it has everything to do with
Speaker 1: the power of the quarterback. Okay, And I know the
Speaker 1: Browns firmly believe this. I believe it too. Baker Mayfield
Speaker 1: got better last year after Odell went down and Baker
Speaker 1: Mayfield playing really well on Sunday against the Bengals. They
Speaker 1: don't view that as a as as a as an
Speaker 1: accident either. Like Baker Mayfield's at his best when he
Speaker 1: can go out there and play point guard, right, and
Speaker 1: like when he can go out there and see the
Speaker 1: field and you and all five guys are live in
Speaker 1: the route and he doesn't have to look over every
Speaker 1: three or four plays to make sure that Odell Beckham's
Speaker 1: not losing his mind because he's not getting the ball.
Speaker 1: And that's bad for a young quarterback. Right Why is
Speaker 1: Russell Wilson going to be better for Odell beck Because
Speaker 1: it's the same thing as Tom Brady with Randy Moss.
Speaker 1: Like that was the problem with Randy Moss earlier in
Speaker 1: his career with young quarterbacks. Right then he got to
Speaker 1: New England and the quarterback was a bigger star than
Speaker 1: he is. And the quarterback being a bigger star than
Speaker 1: he is, I think made made a big difference because
Speaker 1: now it's like, I like Randy Moss could legitimately go
Speaker 1: into New England and say, I know this guy knows
Speaker 1: more than me. I know, this guy has been to
Speaker 1: the mountaintop. This guy's a bigger star than I am.
Speaker 1: So in this situation, it's on me to fit in
Speaker 1: with him, not the other way around. And I think
Speaker 1: Russell Wilson probably has that sort of like that has
Speaker 1: that sort of like I guess leverage is the right
Speaker 1: word in a relationship with his receivers, whereas a Baker
Speaker 1: Mayfield doesn't, you know, a Baker Mayfield. If Odell's not
Speaker 1: getting the ball and he's not happy, he's not going
Speaker 1: to point the finger at himself. If that happens with
Speaker 1: Russell Wilson, I think the dynamic is completely different. And
Speaker 1: that's why I think, like, you know, you even look
Speaker 1: at like when the Patriots got rid of Randy Moss,
Speaker 1: that was why, because it's sort of reverted to that
Speaker 1: and that I think that's what every team that's considering
Speaker 1: signing him or claiming him has to take into accounts
Speaker 1: what sort of effect it's going to have in your
Speaker 1: quarterback and whether or not your quarterback has the power
Speaker 1: to leverage the right the right sort of attitude out
Speaker 1: of Odell Beckham. How does Aaron Rodgers play against Seattle
Speaker 1: this weekend? I think he's like at his best when
Speaker 1: he's like an a few mode, right, And I think, like,
Speaker 1: I mean, no one, how does he get to the
Speaker 1: point where and he's allowed to play? How does he play?
Speaker 1: Do you think he's playing against Seattle? I do? Okay, yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean and look like like I will say this,
Speaker 1: I mean like this is like if he has symptoms whatever,
Speaker 1: I don't know about that, right, Like that's possible that,
Speaker 1: you know, like the timing doesn't like he has another
Speaker 1: positive test whatever, right like, so he's got to get
Speaker 1: through the protocols first. But I think if he clears
Speaker 1: on Saturday, then I think he's gonna play. And just
Speaker 1: having talked to Packers coaches about this over the last
Speaker 1: few days, I can tell you unequivocally if they one
Speaker 1: of them said to me, if there's anyone in the
Speaker 1: league who can play without practicing during the week, it's
Speaker 1: Aaron Rodgers. And so you know they're gonna get Aaron
Speaker 1: Rodgers ready to play, you know, over the next few days.
Speaker 1: And I think where this would have gotten interesting Dan
Speaker 1: is if Jordan Love had played really well against the Chiefs,
Speaker 1: maybe organizationally, then they might say, let's get a second
Speaker 1: look at him. You know, if they win that game,
Speaker 1: maybe they have a little more breathing room. Now let's
Speaker 1: take another look at what Jordan Loved looks like out here.
Speaker 1: We can gather some valuable information, and we can give
Speaker 1: Aaron the benefit of another week off. But I think
Speaker 1: based on the way the way Jordan Love played now,
Speaker 1: like kind of the urgency of the situation the Packers
Speaker 1: are facing, they're going to do everything they can to
Speaker 1: get him ready. I think he's going to start on Sunday,
Speaker 1: so long as he clears the protocols. Does this affect
Speaker 1: his status long term with the Packers in your opinion?
Speaker 1: I think yes. They're handling of this situation is going
Speaker 1: to be really important. Now. The league's investigating this, right,
Speaker 1: so they're requesting all the video and they're like trying
Speaker 1: to gather every piece of like every piece of information
Speaker 1: they can about the way this wine over the last
Speaker 1: three months. I think, you know, one of the interesting
Speaker 1: pieces of this is the press conference piece of it,
Speaker 1: where like the Packers, if you look at the way
Speaker 1: they handle the press conferences, right, you can tell what
Speaker 1: happened there, Like you don't need me to tell you.
Speaker 1: They put every other unvaccinated player on zoom. Every single
Speaker 1: their unvaccinated player was on zoom. Only Aaron Rodgers was
Speaker 1: going to the going to the podium without without a
Speaker 1: mask on. So the Packers can very easily say to
Speaker 1: the league, we told him, look like every other every one,
Speaker 1: every other one of our guys is up there, right,
Speaker 1: So how do they handle this now? Do they fall
Speaker 1: on the sword and say you can talk to Aaron
Speaker 1: we've got our players back, or do they say, look
Speaker 1: at the way we handle every other one of our players.
Speaker 1: I think that right there, because Aaron takes everything so personally.
Speaker 1: I think that right there is important because if Aaron
Speaker 1: feels like he's being thrown under the robust by the
Speaker 1: by the Packers, all that good will over the three
Speaker 1: last three months I think goes out the window. If
Speaker 1: the Packers fall on the sword here, maybe it helps them,
Speaker 1: right Like if the Packers show we have your back, like, hey, Aaron,
Speaker 1: look we traded for Randall Cobb. We went and got
Speaker 1: Whitney Merciless and Jalen Smith in the middle of the season,
Speaker 1: we're acting in a different way. We're winning with you,
Speaker 1: and now we have your back when you're in a
Speaker 1: really kind of tough spot. I think that could end
Speaker 1: going a long way. So I don't think it's like
Speaker 1: how like the on field piece goes. I think it's
Speaker 1: how the n NFL investing investigation goes. They could really
Speaker 1: wind up affecting where that relationship is when we get
Speaker 1: to February and March. Thank you, Albert, We appreciate your
Speaker 1: time as always. You got it, Dan, Thanks for listening
Speaker 1: to the Dan Patrick Show podcast. Be sure to catch
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Speaker 1: us live on the Peacock Act. Talking to Dean Blandino,
Speaker 1: Fox NFL and college football rules analysts kind enough to
Speaker 1: join us. All right, Dean, what do you take away
Speaker 1: from that play? Yeah, and certainly, look, this has been
Speaker 1: a point of emphasis. We've been talking about taunting. I
Speaker 1: always try to put myself in my old role, okay,
Speaker 1: but put yourself in the position of the official. And
Speaker 1: where Tony correnis standing, he sees Marsh kind of walked
Speaker 1: toward the bench. Maybe he thinks he's talking to Harving
Speaker 1: the punter, and it looks to him like taunting. It's
Speaker 1: been this point of emphasis, and he's going to throw
Speaker 1: his flag. Then you get the hip check, which I
Speaker 1: have a hard time explaining that. I just think we've
Speaker 1: gone too far with this. You know, Tony mentioned in
Speaker 1: in his pool report that he was posturing. Look to me,
Speaker 1: it looked like Marsh maybe maybe he might have said something.
Speaker 1: I mean, he's he's thirty yards away. This isn't right
Speaker 1: at the bench area where he's dawing getting up in
Speaker 1: somebody's face. I'd love to see more of him in
Speaker 1: somebody's face, especially in that situation where you're basically it's
Speaker 1: a first down for the Steelers that that's a tough one,
Speaker 1: and then you get the contact at the end, which
Speaker 1: is which is really difficult to explain. Do you think
Speaker 1: that the official tried to make contact with Cassius Marsh?
Speaker 1: You know, if you sit here and ask me, do
Speaker 1: I think he intentionally, I would say no. I would
Speaker 1: say absolutely, under no circumstances he trying to make make
Speaker 1: contact with Marsh. But you watch the video and it
Speaker 1: certainly looks like that way. I'm not in Tony's head.
Speaker 1: I don't know I would. I'd be shocked if that
Speaker 1: were the case. But you watch the video, and I'm
Speaker 1: not going to sit here and say some people won't
Speaker 1: think that. I don't think that's the case. But it's
Speaker 1: tough with the video the way the way it looked.
Speaker 1: I just didn't understand the timing of it. Dean, because
Speaker 1: if he did taunt Okay, there was ample time to
Speaker 1: throw the flag for taunting. The flag didn't really come
Speaker 1: out and go into the air until they made contact
Speaker 1: with each other. Yeah, and Tony was very clear that
Speaker 1: the contact had nothing to do with the flag. And
Speaker 1: you know, but if anything, it was Tony. Maybe he
Speaker 1: lost his balance, I don't know. It just didn't look good.
Speaker 1: But again, he's processing it, he's giving maybe he's giving
Speaker 1: marsh the opportunity. Okay, is he gonna keep walking toward
Speaker 1: the bench area. I'm going to give him a chance
Speaker 1: to walk way, you know, let it play out. It
Speaker 1: is a big situation in the game, and I guess
Speaker 1: he felt that it crossed the line and now he's
Speaker 1: going to throw the flag and then you get the contact.
Speaker 1: It just it's just not a great it's just not
Speaker 1: a good deal when we're sitting here talking about something
Speaker 1: like that, when we should be talking about, like you said,
Speaker 1: the Steelers, you know, trying to put the Bears away,
Speaker 1: the Bears with a great comeback and we end up
Speaker 1: having an exciting finish because you know what it would
Speaker 1: have happened if it was reverse dean oh ejection disqualification
Speaker 1: out of the game, no question. Yeah, I know that
Speaker 1: they're calling this and there's an emphasis for this. What
Speaker 1: was the ground swell that said, we've got to call these,
Speaker 1: We've got to really emphasize the taunting here. Yeah, and
Speaker 1: this is this has happened before at my time at
Speaker 1: the NFL. This came from the Coaches Subcommittee, which is
Speaker 1: a committee that works with the Competition Committee. It's made
Speaker 1: up of head coaches. You know, Andy Reid is the
Speaker 1: is the chair. There's coaches like Brian Flores and Mike
Speaker 1: Vrabel who's now Rabel's going to move to the Competition
Speaker 1: Comitty next year. And they had had had voiced some
Speaker 1: concern about the sportsmanship and a and a kind of
Speaker 1: a lack of sportsmanship and more of the in your
Speaker 1: face taunting type stuff that wasn't getting called. And so
Speaker 1: I can understand that if you feel like there's actions
Speaker 1: that are not being called that are fouls by by
Speaker 1: definition in the rule book and we want to clean
Speaker 1: that up, that's great and that's important, and we want
Speaker 1: to make sure right it's it's player safety number one,
Speaker 1: sportsmanship number two, and then competitive equity number three. But
Speaker 1: it feels like we've almost gone to a new standard
Speaker 1: for taunting that that that Now it's it's not so
Speaker 1: much cleaning up what we thought we were missing. Now
Speaker 1: it's like anything anything that could be directed at an
Speaker 1: opponent posturing. We're getting flags, and the flags are up significantly.
Speaker 1: It's not it's not like we have four or five
Speaker 1: flags a game. It's still less than one a game.
Speaker 1: But it just feels like the standard has changed, and
Speaker 1: I'm not sure If the Competition Committee is comfortable with that, great,
Speaker 1: then then they're not going to have to make any adjustments.
Speaker 1: But I'm not sure if they're going to be comfortable
Speaker 1: at the end of the year when they look at
Speaker 1: the whole picture. Yeah, I don't want to put more
Speaker 1: on the officials play, so I don't want them to adjudicate,
Speaker 1: you know, I got to read into what is intent here.
Speaker 1: I mean it's it's it's already tough if it's the
Speaker 1: toughest sport to officiate, and now we've added intent, and
Speaker 1: I just think I'm worried that we're going to get
Speaker 1: to a playoff game. Deem Like this is a standalone
Speaker 1: regular season game, that's why we're talking about it. If
Speaker 1: this is a wildcard game and you had a play
Speaker 1: like this in a moment like this, you know, that's
Speaker 1: how rules get changed. But this is you know, then
Speaker 1: there's a big deal with you know, implications money on it,
Speaker 1: from gambling. You know, there's just they I don't know.
Speaker 1: I think they need to deemphasize taunting. The officials get
Speaker 1: together here halfway point of the regular season. Let's let's
Speaker 1: hit a reset button here, like we've done with holding before,
Speaker 1: pass interference before, where we maybe you know, we slow it,
Speaker 1: we slow it down a little bit. That's certainly possible.
Speaker 1: And then the competition Competition committee has done that before,
Speaker 1: Like you mentioned withholding, we've seen that in previous years.
Speaker 1: And to get to give the officials, I think the
Speaker 1: officials have been really good over the years and understanding
Speaker 1: what is taunting and what is just the normal emotion,
Speaker 1: the normal the normal kind of back and forth that
Speaker 1: happens during the game. They've been really good at that.
Speaker 1: And this feels like, like you said, we've given them
Speaker 1: another thing on their plate. And now look they're being
Speaker 1: told on training tapes every week, these taunting plays are highlighted.
Speaker 1: These are calls we need to get there and it's
Speaker 1: hammered in. So if you have that some were telling you, hey,
Speaker 1: you got to get these taunting calls. You're gonna go
Speaker 1: out and you're gonna look for that stuff. And that's
Speaker 1: what I feel like it's happening to some extent. I
Speaker 1: feel like the officials are really good when you give
Speaker 1: them some discretion and say, hey, get the big ones,
Speaker 1: get the ones that's in your face, the obvious unsportsmanlike stuff,
Speaker 1: and the other stuff, the emotional stuff. Let's let the
Speaker 1: game keep, you know, let that continue in the game.
Speaker 1: Let's not have fifteen yard penalties impact games. We're talking
Speaker 1: to Dean Bland, you know, Fox NFL and college football
Speaker 1: rules analysts. But you can see the Steelers defense run
Speaker 1: sixty yards together collectively down to the end zone, slide
Speaker 1: into the end zone and take a snapshot. I can
Speaker 1: watch Lamar Jackson do a cartwheel into the end zone
Speaker 1: or a somersault. That's not taunting. I know and is.
Speaker 1: And this has been I remember talking to coaches Bill Belichick,
Speaker 1: and he had the same things that we're letting everybody
Speaker 1: run into the end zone and doing these celebrations, and
Speaker 1: then we're going to ask the players on the other
Speaker 1: side to kind of temper their emotions. And it's kind
Speaker 1: of you can't have it both ways. And again, the
Speaker 1: emotion is good. You know, the league is so cognizant
Speaker 1: of not they do not like. There are people at
Speaker 1: three forty five Park that do not like when they
Speaker 1: are called the no fund League. They don't like it.
Speaker 1: And so they're trying to allow the celebrations, allow some
Speaker 1: of that emotion. And now you turn around and you
Speaker 1: get a play like this or an emphasis like this
Speaker 1: that seems to be trying to keep the emotions in check.
Speaker 1: It's tough. It's stuff when you tell players one thing
Speaker 1: in one area and then in another area, Hey, you
Speaker 1: got to turn around and just walk away. Don't do
Speaker 1: anything that's going to give the official an opportunity to
Speaker 1: throw the flag. How often do officials get together at
Speaker 1: halftime and maybe stress, over emphasize or de emphasize something
Speaker 1: that's happened in a game. Oh yeah, Halftime for the
Speaker 1: officials is no different than than the players. The coaches, Right,
Speaker 1: you make halftime adjustments as a coach, you know, with
Speaker 1: the players, officials will do that. They'll talk about how
Speaker 1: what's the tenor of the first half? Right? Is the
Speaker 1: game getting out of control? You know? Is the game
Speaker 1: under control that we're doing you know nothing, Really we
Speaker 1: have to adjust. So they'll have that conversation at halftime.
Speaker 1: Not that we're gon we're gonna change how we officiate
Speaker 1: the game and the standard right that should be consistent,
Speaker 1: but certainly if certain things have happened in the first
Speaker 1: half that we need to be careful about, we need
Speaker 1: to adjust to. They're going to have that conversation during halftime,
Speaker 1: and you know, so they can go out in the
Speaker 1: second half and make sure that everything stays, you know,
Speaker 1: stays under control. NFL do anything today, I don't know,
Speaker 1: you know. For me again, I think about myself in
Speaker 1: the same in my old spot, and I would have
Speaker 1: had a long conversation with Tony Cornie last night about
Speaker 1: that game, and that's never good. And so they're going
Speaker 1: to review everything. They're gonna go through it. I don't
Speaker 1: know what, you know, what's going to come out of that.
Speaker 1: I don't know if there's any further discipline or anything
Speaker 1: else from the game. But if you were in your
Speaker 1: old spot, Dean, and you're having a conversation with Tony
Speaker 1: Crenti after last night's game, what would you want to know?
Speaker 1: I want to know any and this, and I know
Speaker 1: I've known Tony Creni a long time and he's a
Speaker 1: great man. He's been a great official for a long time.
Speaker 1: I go, Tony, what the heck happened on that? Tony?
Speaker 1: Why why did you bump the player? What happened? To
Speaker 1: talk to me? Tell me what happened. I want to
Speaker 1: hear his perspective, right because I don't think he did
Speaker 1: it intentionally, But what happened? What was going through your mind?
Speaker 1: What was the thought process? You know? Why did you
Speaker 1: throw the flag? How did that all play out? Let's
Speaker 1: talk about the the low block that you called earlier
Speaker 1: in the game. Let's talk about any other issues, you know,
Speaker 1: any issues with the coaches. We're just going to go
Speaker 1: through it because I wouldn't want to make any decisions
Speaker 1: on anything at before talking to him, talking to the
Speaker 1: crew and getting their perspective, because this is a hard right,
Speaker 1: it's a hard job. Like you said, it's it's this
Speaker 1: is one of the toughest professions in in not just sports,
Speaker 1: and the evaluation, the scrutiny that they're under, it's so intense,
Speaker 1: and uh, and look, sometimes we mess it up. Sometimes
Speaker 1: we screwed up I screwed up when I was at
Speaker 1: the league office. Um, but there's a lot riding on
Speaker 1: these games, and you want to you want to make
Speaker 1: sure that that those you know, you limit those those
Speaker 1: times when they are when there are mess ups. Ever
Speaker 1: having a head coach call you to complain about an official, Yeah,
Speaker 1: all the time. I had a head coach call me
Speaker 1: on Monday to complain about an official. And I'm no
Speaker 1: longer at the league office. So it's uh, that happens
Speaker 1: all the time. And look, their coaches, head coaches understand
Speaker 1: for the most part, they understand. Officials are going to
Speaker 1: make mistakes, right, they know coaches make mistakes, players make mistakes,
Speaker 1: Officials make mistakes. What they don't tolerate, what they don't
Speaker 1: want is when it's poor communication. Right, if I can't
Speaker 1: get if I'm on the sideline, I can't get an
Speaker 1: answer from an official or a referee about something. If
Speaker 1: the communication is terists or it's it's it's disrespectful or
Speaker 1: anything like that, that's when coaches have a problem. And
Speaker 1: that's when it becomes about one official. It's not this
Speaker 1: official miss to hold that's going to happen. It's this
Speaker 1: official isn't communicating with me. This official didn't didn't give
Speaker 1: me the opportunity to, uh, you know, understand what was
Speaker 1: going on. And that happens quite a bit when coaches
Speaker 1: have that, you know, have that conversation. Do you think
Speaker 1: Ed hockey Lee will get enough credit for his arms
Speaker 1: and how jack they were in the fact that he had,
Speaker 1: you know, his his outfit enhanced that. I mean, he's
Speaker 1: the godfather of the party pump before a game. He
Speaker 1: is and that and I hope that's not Ed's legacy
Speaker 1: because I think as we talk about communication, Ed was
Speaker 1: excellent at communicated. There were referees over the years, Johnny Greer,
Speaker 1: Gene Sarato comes to mind, Ed Hockley that communicated with coaches.
Speaker 1: I never had an issue with a coach telling me
Speaker 1: that Ed Hockley didn't communicate. It might have said he's
Speaker 1: you know, asked about his tailor and if his tailor
Speaker 1: needed glasses because of the you know, the way the
Speaker 1: shirt was was cut. But Ed was great from a
Speaker 1: communication standpoint, and he really did a nice job in
Speaker 1: that area. Oh, nobody cares about communicating his legacy as
Speaker 1: the guns and you know that Deanden not at all
Speaker 1: levels now the college officially. Oh no, did Ed cut going?
Speaker 1: You watch some of these games? I think there should
Speaker 1: be testing. I'm just saying that, you know, no accusations,
Speaker 1: but just the eye test here, Dean, see some guys
Speaker 1: a little bit jacked up here. Hey, thanks for joining
Speaker 1: us on short note. It's great to talk to you again. Budd.
Speaker 1: You got it, Dan Bank, thank you that. Dean Blandino,
Speaker 1: Fox NFL and college football rules analysts. Thanks for listening
Speaker 1: to The Dan Patrick Show podcast. Be sure to catch
Speaker 1: us live weekday morning nine until noon eastern six to
Speaker 1: nine Pacific on Fox Sports Radio, and you can find
Speaker 1: us on the iHeartRadio app at FSR or stream us
Speaker 1: live on the Peacock app. I'm George Reister, host of
Speaker 1: the Reister or Wrong Hidcast. This is the intersection where sports, business, society,
Speaker 1: and pop culture meet the truth, absolute fire on Monday's,
Speaker 1: Wednesdays and Fridays. Facts only. Make sure you check your
Speaker 1: feelings at the door, because nobs is allowed. We keep
Speaker 1: it one hundred. This is where real conversations happen. Listen
Speaker 1: to the Rights or Wrong podcasts on the iHeartRadio app,
Speaker 1: Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcasts. We say
Speaker 1: good morning, Good morning to Grant Hill, seven time NBA
Speaker 1: All Star and works for Turner's Sports covering the NBA
Speaker 1: and the NCAA. Two time NCAA champ. At Duke, Grant,
Speaker 1: how are you today, budd, Hey, damn, I'm doing How
Speaker 1: about you? I'm doing great. The story you'll tell about
Speaker 1: Mike Shushevski to your grandkids is what he had a
Speaker 1: difficult last name to spell. That's it. I don't know.
Speaker 1: Forgive me. It took me till my junior year to
Speaker 1: learn how to spell it. No, just you know, just
Speaker 1: an incredible coach, obviously one of the great coaches in UH.
Speaker 1: But is there one a story where you got yelled at,
Speaker 1: or that that he started crying, or something that stands
Speaker 1: out you don't want to say to your grandkids. He
Speaker 1: was a great coach, you got hey, you will not
Speaker 1: believe this. Here's the story. Yeah, I mean, look, I
Speaker 1: got yelled at frequently, particularly early on, um, you know,
Speaker 1: during my time. You know, I think Coach K set
Speaker 1: the tone for me in my four years there, Duke,
Speaker 1: in our very first meeting my freshman year, first day
Speaker 1: of first time, the entire team assembles together and he
Speaker 1: established the vision for that team in that year by
Speaker 1: putting the national champions on the board in the locker room,
Speaker 1: and I'm thinking to myself, I'm looking around the locker room.
Speaker 1: I'm like, like, this team is not good enough to
Speaker 1: beat UNLV. That's the first thing going through my mind.
Speaker 1: I mean, the team had lost three three seniors from
Speaker 1: a championship, from from a team the year before, you
Speaker 1: had a young roster. Vegas was so dominant in the
Speaker 1: finals against Duke the year before. Returned to everybody, but
Speaker 1: coach k said it in a way that by the
Speaker 1: end of that conversation I believe, and I think all
Speaker 1: of us in that locker room believe. Now, we didn't
Speaker 1: believe we were championship material at that moment, but if
Speaker 1: we followed his plan, if we bought in, if we
Speaker 1: played for one another, you know, if we embodied with Duke,
Speaker 1: basketball is all about that. I'm what is all said
Speaker 1: and done, we'd have a chance to be champions and
Speaker 1: we were. And so his ability to sell, his ability
Speaker 1: to get you to buy in is really his genius. Dan.
Speaker 1: And it's a farewell tour. Uh, It's gonna be strange.
Speaker 1: I don't know how it's gonna be for you. You know,
Speaker 1: you tune in and want to duke basketball and you
Speaker 1: know you're watching coach k but John Shire taken over,
Speaker 1: and um, it'll be interesting interesting to see. It'll be
Speaker 1: very interesting. You know. Obviously a lot of fanfare, farewell tour.
Speaker 1: I mean everywhere he goes, it'll be the last time,
Speaker 1: last time in Charlottesville, last time at Clemson, last time, uh,
Speaker 1: you know, going to to Carolina. And what's crazy is
Speaker 1: I would imagine some of these schools might even celebrate him,
Speaker 1: to honor him in some form of fast Can you
Speaker 1: imagine him getting honored in Chapel Hill. Oh, they're they're
Speaker 1: absolutely gonna honor and they're gonna be glad he's gone. Right,
Speaker 1: you might be right about that. You might be right
Speaker 1: even in Carolina probably. So we've spent a lot of
Speaker 1: time talking about the Steelers game with the Bears last night.
Speaker 1: And you know, I know you got a football background
Speaker 1: with your father, but it's just these runnings you have
Speaker 1: with officials, Like how many times would you feel like
Speaker 1: something was personal with an official or he was trying
Speaker 1: to get you or didn't like you. How often would
Speaker 1: that happen? You know, it didn't happen much. I mean,
Speaker 1: you know, you go back in the nineties and the NBA,
Speaker 1: you know, the officials, you could talk to them, you know,
Speaker 1: you could, you could have a discussion with them. You know,
Speaker 1: there was a respect they commanded. H yeah, they you know,
Speaker 1: you didn't always see eye to eye. Sometimes you got technicals.
Speaker 1: But um, you know, I think we've moved away from
Speaker 1: that in some respects in all sports, not just in
Speaker 1: the NBA, but in NFL and in various sports. And
Speaker 1: I think because of the TV coverage and the bands
Speaker 1: are back and forth the interactions, they've tried to limit that,
Speaker 1: and I think sometimes, you know, players need to be
Speaker 1: able to discuss things with official and in the moment,
Speaker 1: the heat of the battle. We've changed the rules significantly,
Speaker 1: But back in the day, yeah, look, I mean, you
Speaker 1: know there were times where you know, I messed up.
Speaker 1: I was wrong. I shouldn't have yelled at you. I've
Speaker 1: even been tossed. I'm not proud of that back in
Speaker 1: the day. But you know, it certainly seems like we've
Speaker 1: changed and we don't permit the interaction between players and officials,
Speaker 1: and the rules sometimes going to be very very rigid
Speaker 1: and certainly that was you know, on display last night
Speaker 1: in that football game, which was very controversial down the strategy.
Speaker 1: I wonder how your career would have turned out if
Speaker 1: you were going to Duke now and you were a
Speaker 1: one and done, because you probably would have been a
Speaker 1: one and done. Coach k would have said, you know,
Speaker 1: what are you doing? Get out of here. How do
Speaker 1: you think your career would have been if you'd gone
Speaker 1: in as a freshman instead of after your senior year.
Speaker 1: It's a great question. Um, you know, I don't think
Speaker 1: I would have been as connected to Duke, and maybe
Speaker 1: just you know, you know college basketball, uh like you know,
Speaker 1: like I am now. I think, you know, the four
Speaker 1: years that we played in the early nineties, whether you
Speaker 1: liked Duke or you despise Duke, you know, you saw Duke,
Speaker 1: and people I think recall and remember those and still
Speaker 1: twenty five thirty years later, there's still documentaries and books
Speaker 1: and still you know, still in people's you know, memories
Speaker 1: of those teams in those years, and it's hard to
Speaker 1: sort of capture that just in one year. I think
Speaker 1: for some of these guys now, I think with the
Speaker 1: new name, image and likeness, I would have relied less
Speaker 1: on Janet and Calvin as a freshman, That's for sure.
Speaker 1: I would have, you know, instead of stretching twenty dollars
Speaker 1: for two weeks, I would have possibly had more to
Speaker 1: deal with. What do you think you would have made name,
Speaker 1: image and likeness your freshman year? Oh man, you know,
Speaker 1: I think. But the player I was as a freshman
Speaker 1: in today's environment with Duke and the and the hype
Speaker 1: and the social media, I'd say, at a minimum, and
Speaker 1: I'm going to be real con serv if I say
Speaker 1: six figures, okay, yeah, and what would later have gotten?
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, Late, look, I'm gonna tall you something. Later
Speaker 1: was so big. I mean it was like I was
Speaker 1: a bass player for you know, for you know, a
Speaker 1: pop star. I mean Late was larger than like. Late
Speaker 1: was one of People Magazine's sixty most beautiful people his
Speaker 1: senior year. I mean you you you know, I mean,
Speaker 1: come on now. The trash talking both ways was that
Speaker 1: was was unreal. But Laten was larger than life. Was
Speaker 1: was certainly a celebrity on campus. Everyone loved him. Uh
Speaker 1: sometimes we hated him. But he was certainly a star.
Speaker 1: And he would have yet seven figures, maybe eighth figures.
Speaker 1: I mean he was that big. I mean dad dad.
Speaker 1: He had Stephen King like Stephen King, which is kind
Speaker 1: of odd. But Stephen King would come down to dorm
Speaker 1: and hang out with Christian Laten. Wait, so the writer
Speaker 1: Stephen King, yes, would hang out with later. I mean
Speaker 1: one day, I remember going over to his apartment on
Speaker 1: the off day and I and like, Stephen King is
Speaker 1: in his like in his living room, you know. And
Speaker 1: this is like early his senior year, and so I
Speaker 1: mean like like that doesn't happen, you know, And it
Speaker 1: didn't happen much back then and doesn't happen now. But
Speaker 1: but you know, he was, you know, quite a player,
Speaker 1: delivered when it mattered most, and certainly was was big
Speaker 1: time back in the day. They would have made a
Speaker 1: lot of money. Maybe Stephen King was getting inspiration for
Speaker 1: somebody a bad guy in his book, like let me
Speaker 1: get somebody who's really feared and hated. Hey, Christian, can
Speaker 1: I come down and talk to you for a little while?
Speaker 1: You know, I no comment, no comment. He's Grant Hill
Speaker 1: joining us seven time NBA. You'll start two time NCAA
Speaker 1: champ at Duke. How would you cover Steph Curry? Wow? Uh?
Speaker 1: You know, sometimes the best defense is good offense, and
Speaker 1: I think, you know, wear him out on the other end,
Speaker 1: try to pick up two foulsh You know, how he
Speaker 1: has played this year, you know, after you know, being
Speaker 1: hurt two years ago, coming back, having a fantastic season,
Speaker 1: and now his play MVP discussion. What he did last
Speaker 1: night to my Atlanta Hawks. I mean just it was
Speaker 1: legendary and painful as a Hawk fan and owner to watch,
Speaker 1: but just beautiful in terms of his game. Back to
Speaker 1: that two thousand and fifteen, two thousand and sixteen form
Speaker 1: that we saw. You know, I thought he really took,
Speaker 1: really sacrificed his game for Kevin Durant, and rightfully so,
Speaker 1: Kevin Durant a great player, new environment. I think Steph
Speaker 1: Curry people don't appreciate how he went out of his way,
Speaker 1: I believe, to make Durant feel comfortable, and then he
Speaker 1: got hurt once Durant left. But he's back to that
Speaker 1: sort of pre Durant two thousand and fifteen form, and
Speaker 1: you know, Golden State fun and exciting to watch. And look,
Speaker 1: we all were saying in the preseason, if they can
Speaker 1: just hold it together in the Western Conference until Clay
Speaker 1: comes back. Wow, this team would be scary. But you
Speaker 1: know what this scary right now, and it's it's it's
Speaker 1: you know, it's unimaginable to think what they'll be once
Speaker 1: they get Klay Thompson back to form. But you know,
Speaker 1: when you see and JJ Reddick was as purer college
Speaker 1: shooter as I've ever seen. He was a wonderful you know,
Speaker 1: he made shots in the net, didn't move. But is
Speaker 1: anybody compared to Steph Curry that you remember that as
Speaker 1: far as that good a shooter. You know, I had
Speaker 1: the good fortune of playing with Steve Nash and Phoenix,
Speaker 1: and at the time I thought Steve Nash was the
Speaker 1: best shooting point guard in the history of the NBA historically,
Speaker 1: was a fifty, was a fifty forty, ninety, fifty percent
Speaker 1: from the field, forty percent from the three point line,
Speaker 1: ninety percent from the free throw line at the time,
Speaker 1: and we had not seen a point guard who shot
Speaker 1: the ball as well as feet now. He was also
Speaker 1: a great passer and was at times a reluctant shooter.
Speaker 1: But Steph has just taken it to a whole another
Speaker 1: level with his shooting, with his range, with the volume
Speaker 1: of shots that he takes really has you know, changed
Speaker 1: the game. You know, it's been a transformational guy. I
Speaker 1: think of, you know, you think of you know, got
Speaker 1: lou Al Fender way back in the day and how
Speaker 1: he changed the game and widened the lane, outlawed the dunk.
Speaker 1: Do you think of Michael Jordan during his heyday influence
Speaker 1: and how he changed the game? Also off the court culturally?
Speaker 1: But then Steph Curry just like kind of goofy, silly looking,
Speaker 1: you know, it looks like a kid out there has
Speaker 1: become the most dangerous player in the NBA, but also
Speaker 1: has really transformed and embrace and ushered in this new
Speaker 1: era of shooting from long range. But no one can
Speaker 1: replicate or duplicate what he's done, and I'm not sure
Speaker 1: we'll see a guy like him for quite some time.
Speaker 1: How concerned would you be if you're a Laker fan
Speaker 1: right now? Lebron's out for a month. The abdominal strain,
Speaker 1: Russell Westbrook doesn't seem like the right fit there. It's early,
Speaker 1: but is this going to be the same pattern that
Speaker 1: we see even when Lebron comes back? You know, I
Speaker 1: called that game last night the Lakers played against Charlotte
Speaker 1: and you know, they escaped with a win the Lakers
Speaker 1: there and over time, and it shouldn't have come to that.
Speaker 1: This team is still trying to figure itself out, as
Speaker 1: you said, you know, in times it looks a little disjointed.
Speaker 1: You know, the pieces you question, do they all fit now?
Speaker 1: In fairness, you have to get Lebron back and Trevor
Speaker 1: Ariza and Taylor Horton, Tucker and an assortment of Kendrick Nunn.
Speaker 1: So it's hard to fully evaluate this team and this
Speaker 1: roster right now. But you know, one the abdominal strain
Speaker 1: is something that Lebron has to be very very careful with.
Speaker 1: That's something that can linger for an entire season if
Speaker 1: you're not you know, not smart about how you treat it.
Speaker 1: But this team, you know, it's just it's it's a
Speaker 1: big question mark, you know. And the expectation in LA
Speaker 1: and expectation with any Lebron James team has to win
Speaker 1: a championship. But I'm not in love with this roster,
Speaker 1: you know, I'm not in love with the pieces and
Speaker 1: how they fit. Well. They still have time to figure
Speaker 1: it out, I will say, though, I'll give credit and
Speaker 1: I gotta give credit to him and how he played
Speaker 1: last night and how he's been all season. The one
Speaker 1: consistent theme has been Carmelo. Carmelo Anthony has really embraced
Speaker 1: this off the bench six man role, really shooting the
Speaker 1: ball efficiently from the field. Had like twenty nine points
Speaker 1: last night, sixty three pointers made. So he's been the
Speaker 1: one sort of shining, you know, bright spot for the
Speaker 1: team here. But I'm not sure I really you know,
Speaker 1: you know, the role players, the wing guys, the shooters,
Speaker 1: you know, the the ingredients necessary. I think the half
Speaker 1: success with Lebron, I'm not a big big fan of
Speaker 1: this roster. And in the Western Conference, you know, you
Speaker 1: get behind too far. It's a lot to make up for.
Speaker 1: They don't want to be in the spot they were
Speaker 1: in last year, playing in the play on playing game,
Speaker 1: but they very well could find themselves right back there
Speaker 1: at the end of the season. I know you're taking
Speaker 1: part in a new initiative Starts Strong. Tell the audience
Speaker 1: what that's about. Yeah, now, thank you, Dan, And you
Speaker 1: know I have partnered with Dendreon Pharmaceuticals to have a
Speaker 1: Start Strong campaign for prostate cancer patients, and so you know,
Speaker 1: it's interesting prostate cancer. You know, HiT's all men, but
Speaker 1: disproportionately impacts African American men. African American men are twice
Speaker 1: as likely to be diagnosed and two and a half
Speaker 1: times more likely to die from prostate cancer. So raising
Speaker 1: the awareness, getting people of color in the African American
Speaker 1: community to go to get checked, to get screened. If
Speaker 1: you find it early, it can be treated and and
Speaker 1: and sure and you can have, you know, go on
Speaker 1: with a successful life. But typically in our community, in
Speaker 1: the African American community, we don't like to go to
Speaker 1: the doctor. We don't like to go and get checked,
Speaker 1: and oftentimes we find out and it's too late. So
Speaker 1: this Starts Strong campaign is really just about game planning,
Speaker 1: you know, preparing as you would as a team in
Speaker 1: the NBA or the NFL with your health, taking ownership.
Speaker 1: As you know, Dan, I've had loads of injury issues
Speaker 1: throughout my career, but I understand the importance of taking ownership,
Speaker 1: taking control, and together with dangeron pharmaceuticals, we're encouraging all men,
Speaker 1: but particularly African American men to do the same. So
Speaker 1: you can go to a great website, so much information
Speaker 1: at www. Dot Starts Strong dot us. And I just
Speaker 1: appreciate Dan, you get me an opportunity to talk about it. Oh,
Speaker 1: it's great to see you, buddy. Thank you for joining us.
Speaker 1: Grant all right, thank you, Dan,