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Speaker 1: Hello, Welcome to the Bloomberg Business of Sports podcast, which

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Speaker 1: for some of the big old money issues in the

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Speaker 1: world of sports. I'm Michael barn I'm Scarlett Phil and

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Speaker 1: we have a lot to talk about in the world

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Speaker 1: of soccer. And I apologize because our next guest is

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Speaker 1: in the UK where they call it football, But okay,

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Speaker 1: we'll get on the bandwagon here in the US. Bloomberg

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Speaker 1: UK Business reporter David Hellier on the line. And there

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Speaker 1: are two big stories about Manchester United Manchester City. Uh.

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Speaker 1: Let's start first of all, David, thank you for being

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Speaker 1: here on the Bloomberg Business of Sports. Thanks for having me.

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Speaker 1: Let's let's start with the good news. I guess. Uh,

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Speaker 1: let's start with man You. Uh, let's what what what

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Speaker 1: is the latest on that? And uh are we looking

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Speaker 1: at the big time mechanics of the sale here? Yes? So,

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Speaker 1: I mean, I guess it's to say that Man United,

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Speaker 1: a lot of man United fans have been waiting for

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Speaker 1: for years and years. Um, it will be the beginning

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Speaker 1: of the end of the Glaciers family if if it's

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Speaker 1: indeed it turns out that way. UM, so far they're

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Speaker 1: really two front runners. One is Jim Rackliffe, who is

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Speaker 1: a well known British businessman. I mean, really unusual these

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Speaker 1: days for a British business and so we trying to

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Speaker 1: buy a football club. But he's according to Bloomberg's Wealthy Index,

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Speaker 1: he's worth thirteen and a half billion pounds, so he's

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Speaker 1: unusually wealthy for for British guy. Um And in the

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Speaker 1: other corner at the moment, are it's some sort of

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Speaker 1: form of Qatari bids um. We're we're We've reported that

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Speaker 1: it's linked to the Hemire kata um and it's it's

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Speaker 1: interesting but also a little bit controversial because her guitars

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Speaker 1: q s I Cata sports investments also her Parry surgeon

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Speaker 1: around in Paris. Yeah, yeah, I mean that's exactly right.

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Speaker 1: I mean, will the Guitaris even be allowed to participate

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Speaker 1: in this uh in this auction from men you simply

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Speaker 1: because of their interest in PSG. Nothing suggests they won't

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Speaker 1: be able to participate in the inn the auction because

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Speaker 1: as far as the Premier League is concerned, which is

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Speaker 1: you in order to sort of pass the test, as

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Speaker 1: it were, you need to get past the Premier League,

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Speaker 1: and the Premier League's rules are that you can't own

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Speaker 1: two clubs in the in the Premier League, and of

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Speaker 1: course PSG is not it's not in the Premier League

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Speaker 1: in the French League. The the sort of sticky situation

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Speaker 1: comes if stay doomed, buy it um and there's those

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Speaker 1: two clubs then qualified for the European which they normally do.

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Speaker 1: Although having said that Man United isn't in the Champions

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Speaker 1: League this season, it didn't get it didn't qualify UM.

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Speaker 1: So then it becomes an issue as to whether they

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Speaker 1: can you know, both enter the the Champions League. And

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Speaker 1: it could be that the owners amongst themselves could decide

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Speaker 1: that only one of them entered since the Champions League.

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Speaker 1: But you know, no owner would want that would want

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Speaker 1: to miss out. No, I mean that that interrupts the

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Speaker 1: game and what helps the team qualify UM. In terms

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Speaker 1: of price tag Men you of course was one of

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Speaker 1: the most or remains one of the biggest brands in

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Speaker 1: international sports. How much will the team sell for and

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Speaker 1: how much debt would be involved? UM, Well, I mean

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Speaker 1: the debt will depend on you know, it's the guitaris.

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Speaker 1: But we're I think we're assuming that they won't need

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Speaker 1: to raise as much debt. They could just pay cash

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Speaker 1: outright or whatever. But um, the person one of the

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Speaker 1: people I've been talking to is a relaxed fer them.

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Speaker 1: This is had the summersailed at sert As Capital and

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Speaker 1: he said that whoever vice money, I still have to

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Speaker 1: at least an excess of four billion pounds. Well let's

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Speaker 1: go from big time news about sales to what's turned

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Speaker 1: out to be a hot mess for Manchester City. They

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Speaker 1: are now facing an investigation into its finances by England's

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Speaker 1: Premier League and David. First of all, they could lose points,

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Speaker 1: they could be out of a chance for the title,

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Speaker 1: they could be out on trying to qualify for Europe's

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Speaker 1: Champions League. Um, yeah, exactly. I mean all those things

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Speaker 1: are postible. Um. I mean, of course Manage City we

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Speaker 1: were put to the time said you know we we

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Speaker 1: um we you know, we deny these charges are refusively

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Speaker 1: with the hundred and fifteen charges altogether, it's amazing. But

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Speaker 1: they said, you know, we look forward to this matter

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Speaker 1: being put to response before they the char just have

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Speaker 1: been around manages cities neck I suppose of for a

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Speaker 1: few years. U A for heard and the charges say,

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Speaker 1: um originally found them guilty and then man City went

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Speaker 1: to the appeal Court Court of Obliteration for Sport and

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Speaker 1: overturned the decision, mainly because there was a time bar

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Speaker 1: on on some of the charges, so they were more

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Speaker 1: than five years. Uh, you know, since the charges have

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Speaker 1: been heard. Um, I mean it's it's something. There's a

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Speaker 1: bit there's unprecedented in the Premier League. Since the Premier

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Speaker 1: League was formed just over thirty years ago. Um, there's

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Speaker 1: been one or two little instance about third party ownership

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Speaker 1: of players and things that nothing quite as seismic as this. Um.

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Speaker 1: And of course, you know Man City has said dominance

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Speaker 1: at the moment in the English game, they've won successive

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Speaker 1: titles and um, you know other trophies and and the

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Speaker 1: consequences of you know, possible consequences of them being punished

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Speaker 1: or huge. So David, you know, I'm just reading here

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Speaker 1: that Man City hired David Panic, the same attorney who

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Speaker 1: defended Prime Minister Boris Johnson and the so called party

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Speaker 1: Gate scandal, to defend the football club against these hundred

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Speaker 1: plus financial rule violations. Right. So my question is this

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Speaker 1: Panic is getting paid something like a left wing or

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Speaker 1: right or or some of the star media that he's

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Speaker 1: getting five hundred thousand dollars a week for defending the club.

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Speaker 1: Is that right? I don't know that's exactly right, but

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Speaker 1: he's certainly going to be well paid. And but if

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Speaker 1: they win this case, I mean there'd be would be

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Speaker 1: money well spent if they missed out on the Champis

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Speaker 1: League that's surround. When Chelsea won the Champis Leap, they

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Speaker 1: that they had a revenue of a hundred and twenty

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Speaker 1: million euros from that and since then that was two

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Speaker 1: years ago, that have gone up now. Um, but just

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Speaker 1: qualifying for the Champions Week is to e T ninety

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Speaker 1: million pounds um. So I think Panic will have learned

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Speaker 1: his money if he if he gets them off these charges.

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Speaker 1: M I love the signs that fans have put up

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Speaker 1: all over Manchester about Panic on the streets of London,

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Speaker 1: which yeah, which which refers to an old smith So yeah,

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Speaker 1: I think you which I remember? Yeah. I mean, it

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Speaker 1: doesn't feel it's just being a sports business correspondent in

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Speaker 1: London at the moment. It feels like, you know, there's

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Speaker 1: so many important decisions and being taken in either in

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Speaker 1: the law courts or um you know, or in or

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Speaker 1: in the offices of Goldman's tax. Does this change the

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Speaker 1: fan base at all? I mean they obviously are keeping

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Speaker 1: on top of all the headlines and uh, you know,

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Speaker 1: their allegiance doesn't change. But I just wonder, does it,

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Speaker 1: I don't know, at a level of citicism to to

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Speaker 1: train for your team. Yeah, I think so. I think

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Speaker 1: so because you know, I mean slightly I used to

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Speaker 1: as I said, you know something like this where I

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Speaker 1: mean you hear about the in Formula one and you

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Speaker 1: know other sports, but um, you know the potential a

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Speaker 1: team that's writing high and has been dominant of you know,

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Speaker 1: seven or eight years could suddenly be relegated because of

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Speaker 1: an accounting scandal. Um. I mean it has happened before.

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Speaker 1: It's happened in Scotland, super to the Glasgow Ranges. But

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Speaker 1: you know, the top of the Premier League it is,

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Speaker 1: it does. It does make some people's cylical. But I mean,

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Speaker 1: you know, the fans that are going to the games,

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Speaker 1: I mean they're still going in huge numbers and still

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Speaker 1: watching and huge numbers, and well think you make a

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Speaker 1: you make a great point about the fans, right and

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Speaker 1: it's all about the fans, and you know, I just

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Speaker 1: want to know, you know, turn back to men you

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Speaker 1: here as a fan. Let's I don't know if you're

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Speaker 1: a man You fan, but I'm sure you know many

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Speaker 1: of them. Um, who would you be rooting for? Would

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Speaker 1: you be rooting for Sergim Radcliffe to take over ownership

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Speaker 1: or would you be rooting for the Qataris? And the

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Speaker 1: reason I ask is this is actually good the Glazers

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Speaker 1: not to sell Well. My point is I think a

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Speaker 1: lot of of soccer fans, I'm sorry, football fans would

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Speaker 1: probably want the deepest pocket you know, suitor to win, right,

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Speaker 1: and that me very well be the you know, you

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Speaker 1: know cutter. But you know, at the same time, any

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Speaker 1: nationalistic fervor going on there in the UK regarding having

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Speaker 1: Radcliffe owned the team, I'm just curious. Yeah, I mean,

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Speaker 1: I mean it's a really difficult one because I think

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Speaker 1: it's not just the nationalistic thing. Jim Rackliff is you

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Speaker 1: know Manchester United fan? Um, and I remember was the

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Speaker 1: emir Yeah no, no, no, okay, So the Jim Raclos

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Speaker 1: it's not just that he's a fan. Actually he rather

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Speaker 1: unusually he comes from Manchester because a lot of them

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Speaker 1: that there's a joke about the MANU fans that they

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Speaker 1: all live in London or that you know that there

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Speaker 1: the tourists. But Raxis actually lived in Mainster. Remember him

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Speaker 1: telling me that he learned to count by counting the

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Speaker 1: chimneys in the outside his bedroom window. Um, he's a

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Speaker 1: Norse on a really working class so there's some lure

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Speaker 1: about him. But then there's a massive Scancis and I've

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Speaker 1: been talking to quite on the Many Sands and you know,

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Speaker 1: they're so worried that he would have to take on

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Speaker 1: debt to your point earlier, Um, you know, in substantial

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Speaker 1: amounts and that, and and it was a debt that

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Speaker 1: became the the baton are of the Glazers, you know.

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Speaker 1: It's the fact that they were castigated for paying for

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Speaker 1: the club of debt, for running the club with debt,

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Speaker 1: you know. And so they're very worry they're very worried

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Speaker 1: about that. And then they look at Chelsea, Us of

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Speaker 1: Roman and Branvich and Man City on the Shakemans review

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Speaker 1: a and they just look at it and they see

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Speaker 1: deep pockets means success. So it's almost like all the

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Speaker 1: other aspects of guitar and the human rights situation and

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Speaker 1: migrant labor, you know, all those things that the treatment

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Speaker 1: of women. You know, they don't really think of that much.

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Speaker 1: Although I didn't notice that one of the organizations today

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Speaker 1: Korfes Square I wrote to the USA saying that the

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Speaker 1: guitari bit should be annulled or whatever. Oh, this is

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Speaker 1: the best that we're going to see how this is

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Speaker 1: gonna turn out? My goodness. Uh, David Hellier and you

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Speaker 1: are just extraordinary Bloomberg UK Business reporter. Thank you so

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Speaker 1: much for your knowledge and dropping it on us on

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Speaker 1: the Bloomberg Business of Sports. Thank you, thank you, thank you.

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Speaker 1: This has been the Bloomberg Business of Sports podcast where

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Speaker 1: we explore some of the big money issues in the

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Speaker 1: world of sports. I'm Michael Barr. You can follow me

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Speaker 1: on Twitter at Big Bar Sports. I'm Scarlett Fou and

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Speaker 1: I'm on Twitter at Scarlett Film. I'm Damien sass Hour

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Speaker 1: and I'm on Twitter at the Sass Hour. Hey. By

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