Speaker 1: So I had just come off of a world championship
Speaker 1: that made me the most decorated athlete male or female
Speaker 1: in history. So I thought I was in a really
Speaker 1: great place. But the conversations, even before I was pregnant
Speaker 1: or disclosed my pregnancy, they started off at seventy percent
Speaker 1: less than what I had been making.
Speaker 2: Welcome to She Pivots, the podcast where we talk with
Speaker 2: women who dared to pivot out of one career and
Speaker 2: into something new and explore how their personal lives impacted
Speaker 2: these decisions. I'm your host, Emily Tish Sussman. If you're
Speaker 2: a runner, there's no doubt you'll know this next guest today,
Speaker 2: I'm so excited to share my conversation with Alison Felix,
Speaker 2: the world's most decorated track and field athlete male or female.
Speaker 2: Over the course of her running career, she's competed in
Speaker 2: five Olympics and nine World Championships, winning a total of
Speaker 2: thirty medals between the two. But despite her record breaking success,
Speaker 2: she still experienced inequality in her career. When deciding to
Speaker 2: pursue motherhood, Alison soon realized that maternal protections were not
Speaker 2: going to be an option for her. After attempting to
Speaker 2: renegotiate her contract, her sponsored offered her a seventy percent
Speaker 2: pay cut, something that would never happen to a male athlete.
Speaker 2: Contemplating parenthood after all the medals, after all the records,
Speaker 2: after a decade of partnership, but inspired by the women
Speaker 2: around her, her teammates, her fellow cohorts, and other sports
Speaker 2: and of course, her daughter, Alison, decided to fight back.
Speaker 2: In her own words, she has said that advocacy has
Speaker 2: changed the game. After she called out the hypocrisy of
Speaker 2: many athletic companies who claimed to quote support women but
Speaker 2: never offered maternity protections, many major sponsors announced maternity protections
Speaker 2: and change their corporate policies, guaranteeing athletes pay and bonuses
Speaker 2: through and after pregnancy. After changing an entire industry for
Speaker 2: the better and making history, she left her sponsor and pivoted.
Speaker 2: Since then, she has launched her footwear brand Sache, with
Speaker 2: the goal of being designed for and built for women
Speaker 2: whose bodies change. Although Allison is an Olympian, her story
Speaker 2: is all too common for women across many industries. Beyond
Speaker 2: going head to head with her sponsor and winning, Alison's
Speaker 2: story delves into learning how to cope with disappointment and loss,
Speaker 2: how she advocates for others, and confronting the realities of motherhood. Enjoy.
Speaker 1: I am Alison Felix. I am an olympian and an entrepreneur.
Speaker 2: So I want to talk about the start of your
Speaker 2: running career. So your older brother, Wes was a successful
Speaker 2: So did that encourage you to get into it or
Speaker 2: you just separately felt it in you.
Speaker 1: And the typical little sister, Like I've ran after my
Speaker 1: brother all of my life, and so he was running
Speaker 1: and he was doing really well. But I was at
Speaker 1: a new school and I just didn't really have like
Speaker 1: my friend group yet. And so it was him and
Speaker 1: like my dad who were like, you should go out
Speaker 1: for the track team, like you'll meet people. And so
Speaker 1: I had no like ambition to like be an athlete.
Speaker 1: That was not a part of why I started running
Speaker 1: at all. It was just like, Okay, this will be
Speaker 1: a great way to like find friends. So I was
Speaker 1: encouraged by the fact that he was an athlete and
Speaker 1: he was doing well, so I thought maybe, but yeah,
Speaker 1: it was really just like I need friends, and it worked.
Speaker 1: I found my best friends, my best girlfriends. They were
Speaker 1: actually like all in my wedding, like where it's so
Speaker 1: close to this day. So it did. And then I
Speaker 1: also absolutely fell in love with the sport and found
Speaker 1: the thing that made me feel alive.
Speaker 2: It felt right, and so that was like the birth
Speaker 2: of all of that. Did you think that you were
Speaker 2: going to be the best runner in the world.
Speaker 1: I did not, So that was not my plan. And
Speaker 1: I didn't know anything. Like myself and my family, like
Speaker 1: we didn't have that background, so we didn't really know.
Speaker 1: It was just kind of, you know, I was doing well.
Speaker 1: I went to the state meet, and then as I
Speaker 1: got faster than people started to tell us. And the
Speaker 1: way that the Olympic Trials and everything worked is basically,
Speaker 1: if you run a qualifying time, then you know you
Speaker 1: can go. And so I started to run those times
Speaker 1: and then I was like, oh wow, I can I
Speaker 1: can go, and then it just kept going from there.
Speaker 2: So at what point did the running start to become
Speaker 2: serious for you? Like your career outpaced your brothers.
Speaker 1: So I went pro from high school and so I
Speaker 1: had a professional coach. I was a freshman at USC
Speaker 1: That was the biggest competition I had ever performed in,
Speaker 1: and it was it was all new.
Speaker 2: Going pro straight out of high school was nearly unheard of.
Speaker 2: Most athletes don't even make it to the collegiate level,
Speaker 2: and even fewer, less than two percent go pro.
Speaker 1: It all happened very quickly. I initially started as a
Speaker 1: freshman in high school and so that was my introduction.
Speaker 1: And by the end of my time in high school,
Speaker 1: it was very clear that this was a path that
Speaker 1: I could take. And early on I was like, oh, maybe,
Speaker 1: you know, I can go to college and you know,
Speaker 1: I'll get a scholarship. And then it was like, oh, no,
Speaker 1: you can be a professional athlete. And I wasn't. I
Speaker 1: didn't grow up in the sport. I didn't know any
Speaker 1: of that. And then it all became very real. You know,
Speaker 1: I could go to the Olympics and all of that.
Speaker 1: So started my freshman year and then my first year
Speaker 1: in college that's when I went to the Olympics. So
Speaker 1: it was a very fast process.
Speaker 3: The Olympic Trials and that is the women's two hundred meters.
Speaker 3: It will be the final event on the track. A
Speaker 3: sprite star for the United States Allison Felix. She's only
Speaker 3: eighteen years old. She already has been on the cover
Speaker 3: Sports Illustrated. How about that at eighteen years.
Speaker 4: Old and Allison Feelix, it's been running with more confidence
Speaker 4: each round. Here, she is really rounding in the shape,
Speaker 4: one of the first female or male athlete to go
Speaker 4: straight from high school right into the pros.
Speaker 3: Howson Felix turns up the challenge and on the inside
Speaker 3: muna lead Felix wrings it Feelix with the whimfre You were.
Speaker 2: Saying, despite her success at such a young age, her
Speaker 2: parents still expected her to complete her college education.
Speaker 1: I come from a family of educators, so there was
Speaker 1: no chance that I was not going to school. Thankfully,
Speaker 1: you know, they worked out into the contract that you know,
Speaker 1: my schooling would be paid for and all of that.
Speaker 1: So that was a regular student. You know, I didn't
Speaker 1: compete collegiately, but I was trying to do both.
Speaker 2: Yeah, So how did you navigate that decision if you
Speaker 2: were the first US athlete to sign a professional contract
Speaker 2: instead of competing for the school. What was that decision like?
Speaker 2: What was that process like in making the decision? I mean,
Speaker 2: it was a really hard decision to make.
Speaker 1: It was one that I really like sat down with
Speaker 1: my family and we went back and forth, you know,
Speaker 1: the pros and the cons and it ultimately really came
Speaker 1: to the fact that I wanted to make the Olympic team.
Speaker 1: And it was that year.
Speaker 2: If you're wondering why she couldn't compete at both the
Speaker 2: collegiate level and as a pro well, until a recent
Speaker 2: Supreme Court ruling, college athletes were banned from earning any
Speaker 2: money from their sport, whether it be from sponsorship, races
Speaker 2: or otherwise.
Speaker 1: I basically made the decision that I think my best
Speaker 1: shot would be to go pro and be able to
Speaker 1: focus on the Olympic trials and making the team that way.
Speaker 1: So that's really what the decision came down to. But
Speaker 1: it was hard, especially that first year. I had a
Speaker 1: really challenging time competing. I was competing against women who
Speaker 1: were grown and this is what they had been doing,
Speaker 1: and so that was hard. It was hard just navigating
Speaker 1: being a professional athlete, being still a young woman and
Speaker 1: figuring out that whole world. And so it was a
Speaker 1: lot of trial and error in figuring out what worked.
Speaker 1: But the first year, the first couple of years, they
Speaker 1: were pretty rocky. It was also a little bit strange
Speaker 1: because all of my friends they were on the team
Speaker 1: and I thought I was going to be on the
Speaker 1: team until like I made this decision to go pro,
Speaker 1: So it was kind of navigating this new world. I
Speaker 1: was the first US athlete who had done this, so
Speaker 1: there wasn't like a path charted before me. So I
Speaker 1: was a lot of like just figuring it out and
Speaker 1: trying to be focused because my goal was to make
Speaker 1: that Olympic team, but also school was absolutely important to
Speaker 1: me as well. So I got some things wrong and
Speaker 1: found my way. You know, eventually, what.
Speaker 2: Do you feel like you got wrong? I think I thought.
Speaker 1: It was going to be almost like high school. You know,
Speaker 1: you go to class and then you go to practice
Speaker 1: and like everything's good. But it was like, school's really hard.
Speaker 1: I'm adjusting to being at college, and then all of
Speaker 1: my competitions are overseas, so I'm traveling. I'm letting professors know,
Speaker 1: like I have this and this, and they're like, what
Speaker 1: is that. That's not not the school team, so we
Speaker 1: can't really help you there. So it was like navigating
Speaker 1: how do I keep up with all of my classes,
Speaker 1: all of my exams and everything while still being on
Speaker 1: the st and traveling overseas and going to all these competitions.
Speaker 1: I think at the beginning, I attempted to, like, you know,
Speaker 1: be doing all the things, and it just it wasn't possible.
Speaker 1: I was training with my professional coach and I was
Speaker 1: the only athlete, so it was kind of an isolating
Speaker 1: experience because it was just so busy, so intense. It
Speaker 1: was near impossible to be living the traditional college experience.
Speaker 2: Do you remember there being a moment when you thought
Speaker 2: I can do this, I can be the.
Speaker 1: Best after the Olympics. So I went to the Olympics.
Speaker 1: They were in Athens, and I got a silver medal.
Speaker 1: That was the kind of the moment where I was like, oh,
Speaker 1: the fire is lit. I was really disappointed. Initially, I
Speaker 1: was like I felt so close to gold. And then
Speaker 1: my family like very quickly put everything in perspective to me,
Speaker 1: it's like you're eighteen years old, and they helped me realize.
Speaker 1: But I definitely would say that was the moment where
Speaker 1: I saw the greater potential and I also saw it
Speaker 1: was going to take a lot more work to get there.
Speaker 1: But that was the moment where I was like, this
Speaker 1: is I want to do and I got to keep
Speaker 1: going with this.
Speaker 2: So you've described having a really not just a professional
Speaker 2: mindset around it, but a pretty intense mindset around it,
Speaker 2: where you didn't really celebrate the winds, but the loss
Speaker 2: is really really stuck with you. I mean that sounds
Speaker 2: like a very serious competitive mindset. When did that switch?
Speaker 1: I feel like I experience that for the majority of
Speaker 1: the beginning of my career, probably until my third Olympics.
Speaker 1: I would say, I mean, I think that's naturally just
Speaker 1: who I am, where I'm super competitive, I'm super critical
Speaker 1: of myself and just really hard on myself, and I
Speaker 1: think it started to kind of shift after being in
Speaker 1: pursuit of a gold medal for a very long time.
Speaker 1: I think I started to just learn the process more
Speaker 1: and learn what was more important to me. I guess.
Speaker 1: So the first two Olympics I got silver medals, and
Speaker 1: then it was the third Olympics where things really came
Speaker 1: together for me and I finally got ultimately my individual
Speaker 1: gold medal.
Speaker 3: She now goes after history trying to be only the
Speaker 3: third woman to pull off the.
Speaker 1: Four hundred and two hundred doubles.
Speaker 3: Phoenix and Lambs line and Adamson.
Speaker 1: Phoenix gets her.
Speaker 3: Gold pray for Christ a second, it looked.
Speaker 1: Like ten Or was third success was like gold. That's
Speaker 1: the only way to like determine it. That's the only
Speaker 1: way that it measured up. And I just I went
Speaker 1: there a really difficult time after getting the second silver medal,
Speaker 1: and I was just like this, I don't know if
Speaker 1: this is ever gonna happen for me. And then after
Speaker 1: you know, going back the next four years and dedicating
Speaker 1: myself and giving everything I had, when it finally did
Speaker 1: come together, it didn't exactly feel like what I thought
Speaker 1: it would. I think I had like built it up
Speaker 1: to be this incredible thing. Like I thought everything was
Speaker 1: going to change. I thought my life was going to
Speaker 1: be different, and then it happened and kind of like
Speaker 1: nothing changed, and I went back to life and everything
Speaker 1: was the same, and it took me time to unpack it.
Speaker 1: But I think it was just the magic was along
Speaker 1: the way. It was the process. It was the growing,
Speaker 1: the stretching, becoming, all of that, and so it was
Speaker 1: less about the actual accomplishment but more about.
Speaker 2: The journey to get there. I really identify with that.
Speaker 2: I feel like I go at things so intensely that
Speaker 2: when I do something like I don't know how to
Speaker 2: describe it anyway other than I like ram my head
Speaker 2: into it. Yeah, And I feel like sometimes if I
Speaker 2: get to that thing that I immediately moved the goal post. Yeah,
Speaker 2: so that I'm always pushing myself. Maybe it's not very healthy, actually,
Speaker 2: but do you feel like as soon as you got
Speaker 2: that one goal, like you just moved the gold post
Speaker 2: to the next?
Speaker 4: Oh?
Speaker 1: Absolutely, yeah, And I agree with you. I don't think
Speaker 1: it's the healthiest thing. But I think when you're so
Speaker 1: focused on something, and I think that was also one
Speaker 1: of the things I learned, is like instead of being
Speaker 1: so focused on one specific goal, that I could measure
Speaker 1: success in different ways, and like there were successful things,
Speaker 1: and I think it is important to celebrate the winds
Speaker 1: along the way. But it was like I was stuck
Speaker 1: and I wouldn't allow myself to go there. And then
Speaker 1: finally I was like, there has to be a different way,
Speaker 1: And I think that's when I start to understand there's
Speaker 1: other measures of success.
Speaker 2: Okay, we have to go deeper in here, because I
Speaker 2: feel like this is the entire thesis of the show
Speaker 2: that I am in fact still personally struggling with. How
Speaker 2: does one find multiple ways to find success for themselves?
Speaker 2: But how did you find different ways to measure success.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean it came later in life, but I
Speaker 1: started to realize that it was never about the metals.
Speaker 1: I thought that it was. I thought I put so
Speaker 1: much focus and so much intensity on that, But it
Speaker 1: was on like having impact, understanding that my purpose in
Speaker 1: life is not just to like run fast. I have
Speaker 1: the ability to do so much more than that. And
Speaker 1: I think it was really uncovering that it was about impact.
Speaker 1: It was about creating some sense of change and doing
Speaker 1: something with a platform instead of just saying that I
Speaker 1: can get medals. And it was so much deeper than that.
Speaker 1: I think once I started to go through real life experiences,
Speaker 1: that's when it started to uncover. So it was definitely
Speaker 1: the decision to start a family and move into things
Speaker 1: that actually matter to me, because I got to a
Speaker 1: point in my career where it was like, Okay, I
Speaker 1: have the medals, like I have the accolades and the accomplishments,
Speaker 1: but I don't actually have what I've always wanted, and
Speaker 1: that was to become a mother and to have a family.
Speaker 1: So that was the moment where things really started to
Speaker 1: shift for me.
Speaker 2: After running professionally for so many years, She saw the
Speaker 2: struggle other female athletes faced preparing for and experiencing motherhood
Speaker 2: to starting a family was not a decision she made lightly.
Speaker 1: I love kids. I studied elementary education and college. My
Speaker 1: mom is an elementary school teacher, and so I grew
Speaker 1: up around kids, and that's something I always wanted. Since
Speaker 1: this sporting career was unexpected for me. It wasn't what
Speaker 1: I set out to do. I always felt like I
Speaker 1: had to wait. It wasn't really like somebody told me that.
Speaker 1: I don't think anybody ever, did you know, No one
Speaker 1: told me that. But it's what I saw, and I
Speaker 1: saw in my sport. I saw that women waited. I
Speaker 1: saw that the women who did have children, they really struggled.
Speaker 2: Some of our most famous female athletes have been vocal
Speaker 2: about their experience with motherhood. From Serena Williams.
Speaker 1: I somehow managed to win, but I was so emotionally
Speaker 1: spent and just like so emotionally drained that it was
Speaker 1: it was crazy, and.
Speaker 4: You know, and then like every night after that, I
Speaker 4: just was with her the whole time and was like,
Speaker 4: you're gonna be with me, and I just took a
Speaker 4: lot on.
Speaker 2: To Kim Kleister's also a tennis player and first mother
Speaker 2: to be number one in the world.
Speaker 5: Was it hard being a mom and a pro at
Speaker 5: the same time.
Speaker 2: I would write a story about my two thousand and
Speaker 2: nine US Open victory. The story would be emotional.
Speaker 1: It was a very emotional two weeks to.
Speaker 2: Beach Volleyball three time Olympic gold medalist Carrie Walsh.
Speaker 6: Great question. Actually, you know, before we had our first child,
Speaker 6: I was told not to do it because they're like,
Speaker 6: you know.
Speaker 2: You just want the Olympics. You're going to lose all
Speaker 2: these endorsements. People are going to forget about you. When
Speaker 2: you hold your baby.
Speaker 6: It's going to hurt your shoulder. Your hipster are going
Speaker 6: to be the same. Like people told me the craziest things,
Speaker 6: and it kind of like you're like, whoa, you know,
Speaker 6: I've never done this before, is that true? You know,
Speaker 6: usually sponsorship deals are two to four years and so,
Speaker 6: and I'm an Olympic athlete, so usually every four years
Speaker 6: my deals go away or you know, renew them. So
Speaker 6: I think I probably wasn't resigned after a couple of pregnancies,
Speaker 6: but new ones came in. You know, certain brands step
Speaker 6: up when the others leave, So that's just the psycho
Speaker 6: of life.
Speaker 1: I know, they struggled to reach their potential. They struggled
Speaker 1: to stay in the sport. And it wasn't because they
Speaker 1: weren't capable. You know, they absolutely were and they were
Speaker 1: doing it, but those weren't the stories that were being told.
Speaker 1: And so since those weren't the stories that were being
Speaker 1: told and I never saw it being celebrated, I just
Speaker 1: figured that, Okay, well I'm going to have to do
Speaker 1: I'm going to have to get all the metals, do
Speaker 1: all the things. Before I could even think of having
Speaker 1: a family. I also saw them struggle with their sponsorship,
Speaker 1: you know, I saw sponsorship being paused or women hiding pregnancy.
Speaker 1: So there was this whole other aspect where I was
Speaker 1: actually scared to start a family, and I thought that
Speaker 1: I wasn't sure if I would be able to continue
Speaker 1: on with my career, and so I felt like that's
Speaker 1: why I put it off so long, because I felt like,
Speaker 1: I love my career and I want to have both,
Speaker 1: but I don't know if that's possible.
Speaker 2: The myth of being able to do it all is
Speaker 2: so pervasive. As Alison talked about in her TED talk.
Speaker 1: Sports companies love to tell women that they can have
Speaker 1: it all, they can do it all, they can be
Speaker 1: it all. We've all seen those inspirational ads. I had teammates,
Speaker 1: I had friends. This is something that I had seen
Speaker 1: since I was like seventeen years old when I became
Speaker 1: a professional, and so yeah, I saw the struggle all
Speaker 1: over the place, and so it was, yeah, that was
Speaker 1: where the fear came from. One of my best friends
Speaker 1: that was a training partner of mine. She's about ten
Speaker 1: years older than me, and so I saw her complete process,
Speaker 1: and I saw her go through all of the things.
Speaker 1: I saw her come back from pregnancies, and I just
Speaker 1: saw how difficult it was. And so I think it
Speaker 1: was just those real experiences in my life that really
Speaker 1: scared me that I possibly may not be able to
Speaker 1: do both.
Speaker 2: Watching those around her struggle was just part of the problem.
Speaker 2: The athletes are paid and supported by their athletic or
Speaker 2: corporate sponsors think Nike, Adidas, Puma, and in order to
Speaker 2: get those top sponsors, you have to be a top
Speaker 2: performing athlete, something that might be a problem if you
Speaker 2: just had a baby.
Speaker 1: So the way that contracts work in track and field
Speaker 1: is their performance based, and so you have a contract
Speaker 1: in you go to like an Olympics or a World
Speaker 1: Championship and you get a medal, we have a world ranking,
Speaker 1: you get a bonus. And so if you go and
Speaker 1: you don't get a medal and you're not ranked, then
Speaker 1: you get a reduction. And so what was happening for
Speaker 1: women who became pregnant is that they were not able
Speaker 1: to keep their salaries because they would be reduced. They
Speaker 1: would have a baby and say the Olympics or World
Speaker 1: Championships was the next month or two three months later,
Speaker 1: they weren't able to compete, so they would be reduced
Speaker 1: and reduced many times, all the way to nothing. So
Speaker 1: it was this very real thing where women were just
Speaker 1: being pushed out of the sport because financially they couldn't
Speaker 1: continue on. Everything is pretty much performance based. There's not
Speaker 1: much security in it.
Speaker 2: So is that why you went to have a conversation
Speaker 2: with your sponsor as you were thinking about having a family,
Speaker 2: even before it was even a reality for you.
Speaker 1: So I had came off of a really, really great
Speaker 1: performance at this time, I had been to four Olympics,
Speaker 1: I had just come off of a World Championship that
Speaker 1: made me the most decorated athlete male or female in history.
Speaker 1: So I thought I was in a really great place.
Speaker 1: But the conversations, even before I was pregnant or disclosed
Speaker 1: my pregnancy, they started off at seventy percent less than
Speaker 1: what I had been making. So that just elevated my
Speaker 1: fear to a whole new level because I was like,
Speaker 1: if this is already here just based on I think,
Speaker 1: you know, whether it was based on my age or
Speaker 1: I think it was just kind of like they thought
Speaker 1: I was done, you know, And so that was really hard.
Speaker 1: And so then when I did decide to start a family,
Speaker 1: there was a lot of fear that even that seventy
Speaker 1: percent would go away, because initially I didn't have anything
Speaker 1: on paper. And so that's why I did decide to
Speaker 1: do what so many women have done before me and
Speaker 1: hide my pregnancy and wait until, you know, I felt like,
Speaker 1: least if I have something on paper and then I
Speaker 1: can go from there. And women having babies during child
Speaker 1: wearing years is something that should be celebrated, not punished.
Speaker 1: It should be a part of a normal, thriving professional
Speaker 1: athletic career, and women in all fields should never feel
Speaker 1: the need to hide a pregnancy at four am in
Speaker 1: the dark so that they won't be photographed doing that
Speaker 1: thing that they love. I just felt like if someone
Speaker 1: got wind of something, then that would be detrimental to
Speaker 1: everything that I was trying to do. And so initially
Speaker 1: the negotiations, you know, they were starting off at a
Speaker 1: really challenging place, and even after I did disclose my pregnancy,
Speaker 1: it became a thing whereas like the money was going
Speaker 1: to be what the money was, and I felt like
Speaker 1: I could handle that. It feels disrespectful, it's hard, but
Speaker 1: it just is what it is. And that's when I
Speaker 1: really turned my intention to asking for maternal protections. And
Speaker 1: so basically I was asking for time to recover from pregnancy,
Speaker 1: recover from giving birth before those performance reductions were put
Speaker 1: into play. And so that was something that was asking
Speaker 1: not just for myself but for everyone. And what came
Speaker 1: back to me was that I could have time, but
Speaker 1: they weren't ready to set that precedent for all women
Speaker 1: in that situation, and so that was what was just
Speaker 1: I wasn't able to handle.
Speaker 2: So she penned a blistering op ed that ran in
Speaker 2: The New York Times titled quote my own Nike pregnancy story.
Speaker 2: I've been one of Nike's most widely marketed athletes. If
Speaker 2: I can't secure maternity protections, who can welcome back?
Speaker 7: Alison Felix has won get a load of the nine Olympic.
Speaker 8: Medals, making her the most decorated female track and field
Speaker 8: star in US Olympic history. Well recently, Allison has gone
Speaker 8: through a private struggle in May, opening up in The
Speaker 8: New York Times about the difficulty some female athletes phase
Speaker 8: when it comes to maternity lead and their corporate sponsors.
Speaker 8: Allison is here to discuss this, and she's got a
Speaker 8: big announcement.
Speaker 2: Do you remember what you were feeling when you were
Speaker 2: sitting there waiting for it to publish, like you need
Speaker 2: for a send, and you were just like refreshing.
Speaker 1: Yes. I was talking to my brother and he's my
Speaker 1: business partner and he was my management team. He represented me,
Speaker 1: and so he was the one who was actually like
Speaker 1: doing all the negotiating and all the contracts and everything,
Speaker 1: and we were just like, okay, he was like, are
Speaker 1: you sure, Like I'm about to like we're about to
Speaker 1: do this, And it was just such a scary feeling,
Speaker 1: not knowing what was going to be on the other
Speaker 1: side of that. But during the whole process. I always
Speaker 1: talk about this, but he he really said something that
Speaker 1: I hold on to this day. He was like, you know,
Speaker 1: you can use your voice even if it shakes. And
Speaker 1: that just spoke to me because I was so scared
Speaker 1: and it was just such an unknown but I was like, no,
Speaker 1: I You're absolutely right, I can. So yeah, it was.
Speaker 1: It was definitely scary though I also at this time,
Speaker 1: so this spanned a long period of time, and so
Speaker 1: I actually ended up giving birth to my daughter during
Speaker 1: this time, and I had a very complicated traumatic birth
Speaker 1: experience as well. I suffered from free clamsia and so
Speaker 1: it was just a whole ordeal. And so came home
Speaker 1: from after being in the hospital with my daughter for
Speaker 1: about a month in the nick you and I got
Speaker 1: to this place where I couldn't let it happen any longer.
Speaker 2: Alison is not alone in this experience. Black women are
Speaker 2: three times more likely to die from a pregnancy related
Speaker 2: cause than white women. Black maternal mortality is real and
Speaker 2: is experienced by black and brown women every day. Her
Speaker 2: experience not only inspired her to speak out against Nike,
Speaker 2: but to fight to improve outcomes for black mothers by
Speaker 2: testifying in front of Congress about the issue.
Speaker 1: Good morning, Chairman Neil, ranking Member Brady, and members of
Speaker 1: the committee. My name is Alison Felix, and I am
Speaker 1: Cameron's mom. That is the title. I'm most proud of you,
Speaker 1: and now there are so many women who that's not
Speaker 1: the story. And so my eyes were opened and now
Speaker 1: you know, with a passion on my heart to just
Speaker 1: do more work in this area and raise awareness. And
Speaker 1: so some time has passed, but your leadership on this
Speaker 1: issue has remained constant. Having my daughter and going through
Speaker 1: this really hard experience and looking at her, I think
Speaker 1: that gave me the courage. And then also knowing that
Speaker 1: there's so many women who have suffered in silence really
Speaker 1: around this, that this was an opportunity to say that.
Speaker 1: You know, I'm going to come forward, and there's going
Speaker 1: to be consequences, but I think that'll it'll have impact.
Speaker 1: And it wasn't just me. There was one of my
Speaker 1: teammates of Licia Montano, she had spoke out before. There
Speaker 1: was other colleagues of mine. So I also was in
Speaker 1: a unique position because I was renegotiating my contract. So
Speaker 1: for many of these women, they had signed NDA's and
Speaker 1: they couldn't speak about this, and so I think that's
Speaker 1: really what pushed me. I think we all were kind
Speaker 1: of speaking out, and I decided to speak out after basically,
Speaker 1: you know, finding out that I would have the time
Speaker 1: but no one else would. And then it was about
Speaker 1: a couple weeks after we came out with that OpEd
Speaker 1: that Nike decided to change their policy and other companies
Speaker 1: stepped forward as well and said that they would offer
Speaker 1: protection for female athletes. So after we did that, now
Speaker 1: they offer eighteen months protection and things are different.
Speaker 2: Despite changing an entire profession with the stroke of her pen,
Speaker 2: Allison was still a professional athlete and needed to find
Speaker 2: a new sponsor before the next Olympics.
Speaker 1: And then all of a sudden there was a meeting
Speaker 1: request from Athleta and they're under the gap inc umbrella,
Speaker 1: and we didn't know what was going to come of it.
Speaker 1: They were just like, we've never sponsored an athlete before,
Speaker 1: but we just want to talk to you, like we've
Speaker 1: read the OpEd, and so I went into the meeting alone.
Speaker 1: I just, you know, I was just like, let's just
Speaker 1: see what this is. And it was just such a
Speaker 1: refreshing experience. Our values just aligned their mission aligned with
Speaker 1: where I was at in life and what I wanted
Speaker 1: to do. They were all about just having an impact
Speaker 1: on women and girls and creating change. Like everything that
Speaker 1: had been through and where I wanted to put my attention,
Speaker 1: That's what they're about. And I was just at that
Speaker 1: point there was so much value beyond financial value. I
Speaker 1: was just like, I want to have an impact on
Speaker 1: people's lives, and so it just organically happened in that way.
Speaker 1: And then it was such an incredible experience just right away.
Speaker 1: It was like there was all these things that we
Speaker 1: wanted to do together, all this work. I felt like
Speaker 1: I had a real seat at the table. They allowed
Speaker 1: me to see how business was done. I saw a
Speaker 1: business that was female led, and I just felt empowered
Speaker 1: being there. It was not this traditional sponsorship from a company,
Speaker 1: you know. It was like they wanted to celebrate me
Speaker 1: in all the different aspects of my life. They saw
Speaker 1: me as an athlete, they saw me as a mother.
Speaker 1: They respected the work that I wanted to do around
Speaker 1: advocating for women, and they found ways to support me.
Speaker 2: I think this is such a good takeaway for people
Speaker 2: that even though writing me at ed wasn't in your
Speaker 2: nature you say you weren't someone who generally rocks the boat.
Speaker 2: While it did close the door that you thought it
Speaker 2: would close, it created a significantly better opportunity.
Speaker 1: Yeah. I mean, how many times have we all been
Speaker 1: in a situation like that one door closes and it
Speaker 1: feels like the end of the world. The way that
Speaker 1: it made me feel, like the way that I did
Speaker 1: not feel valued and I felt just it was such
Speaker 1: a dark time where I was just like, well, maybe
Speaker 1: this is my worth, you know. But then it led
Speaker 1: to this thing where it's like, no, I went through
Speaker 1: a really dark period, but it took me absolutely to
Speaker 1: where I'm supposed to be and with who I'm supposed
Speaker 1: to be doing life with. And yeah, it's like going
Speaker 1: through a hardship to get like, on the other side
Speaker 1: of all that fear was so much freedom and so
Speaker 1: much purpose.
Speaker 2: Saying that it took you to a really dark place
Speaker 2: dark How.
Speaker 1: When I think about becoming a mother and what I
Speaker 1: had envisioned and imagined, my experience was vastly different from that.
Speaker 1: And I think because I was going through a time
Speaker 1: period where I was basically feeling as though I was
Speaker 1: being told that I was not valued, that I did
Speaker 1: not have work that I wasn't enough and so this
Speaker 1: time that I felt like should have been celebrated and
Speaker 1: should have been so special. I spent literally training in
Speaker 1: the dark. I spent wearing big, baggy clothing, barely ever
Speaker 1: leaving my home because I was scared that my employer
Speaker 1: would find out and that I would no longer be
Speaker 1: able to do my job. And I just think that's
Speaker 1: so absurd and so crazy and also very very dark.
Speaker 1: And I think also when you're bringing life into the world,
Speaker 1: that's not the situation that you want to be around.
Speaker 1: And so it was just hard to move forward. It
Speaker 1: was hard to go through. It wasn't what I expected
Speaker 1: or imagined. It was really difficult. I had this plan,
Speaker 1: like of course, I'm like a master planner, like putting
Speaker 1: all these things together, and then it's like, real life happens.
Speaker 1: It's like what were you thinking? So I had this
Speaker 1: and that like, Okay, I'm going to train and I'm
Speaker 1: going to come back in four weeks and it's going
Speaker 1: to be amazing, and then you know, I had the
Speaker 1: traumatic birth experience and I had emergency C section and
Speaker 1: like nothing when according to plan. So it was very
Speaker 1: humbling and it just also showed me what was important,
Speaker 1: because I thought what was important was like getting back
Speaker 1: to running and getting back to all of that, and
Speaker 1: then going through that experience where it was like life
Speaker 1: threatening and my child was fighting for her life. It
Speaker 1: just showed me that that was not what was important
Speaker 1: at all, and also forced me to give myself grace
Speaker 1: and coming back, like force me to not subscribe to
Speaker 1: other people's timelines or so things that I saw and
Speaker 1: comparing myself. It was just like, no, your path is
Speaker 1: going to be totally different, and really forced me in
Speaker 1: that lane and I didn't take into account all of
Speaker 1: the things that happened when you give birth and just
Speaker 1: when life happens, and that everyone's path is not the same.
Speaker 2: That you're probably still going to be wearing a diaper
Speaker 2: after a month.
Speaker 1: Okay, that's yeah, that's the reality. That's the real.
Speaker 2: That's the real to not instagram version.
Speaker 1: Yes, it was just like you said, it was devastating though,
Speaker 1: because it just made me feel like, well, what is
Speaker 1: wrong with me? Why can I not do this thing
Speaker 1: that everybody else seems to be doing. But then you
Speaker 1: realize that, like, okay, you get this picture perfect glimpse
Speaker 1: of someone's life, and then you start to talk to
Speaker 1: people and you start to realize, like, oh, they actually
Speaker 1: struggled as well, and this is absolutely normal.
Speaker 2: Then about a year after giving birth, she finally felt
Speaker 2: like herself again.
Speaker 1: Okay, I'm feeling like me again, and also like a
Speaker 1: different version of me. I think I was trying to
Speaker 1: get back to like who I was, and then realizing that, like,
Speaker 1: it's not who I was, it's just who I'm becoming
Speaker 1: and who I am now.
Speaker 2: I really relate to that. Feel like I still feel
Speaker 2: most myself when I'm driving professionally, if I'm like really driving,
Speaker 2: Like I don't as much feel like myself when I'm parenting,
Speaker 2: which I do much more of the time, and I'm
Speaker 2: probably not as good at as I am professionally. I
Speaker 2: feel like that is like the version of me I
Speaker 2: guess that I'm getting back to. But it's funny. Someone
Speaker 2: described this show or they were asking me to describe it,
Speaker 2: and I said, no, it's the wrong characterization. But they
Speaker 2: said that it was a show of resilience, and I
Speaker 2: was like, absolutely not, this is a show of being
Speaker 2: different and better.
Speaker 1: I love that.
Speaker 2: I feel like I really connect to what you're saying that, like,
Speaker 2: I'm not going to go back to who I was before.
Speaker 2: I'm going to be different, but I have to know
Speaker 2: that I can be better, like the new version of me.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and that's something I feel like we don't think
Speaker 1: about before, that you can be better. You think like
Speaker 1: I just have to get back, but no, like this
Speaker 1: new version is better. You're just authentically being yourself. And
Speaker 1: to me, it's just been such a beautiful experience once
Speaker 1: kind of like realizing.
Speaker 2: That, and she did go back. She set her sights
Speaker 2: on her fifth Olympics, but still lacked a footwear sponsor.
Speaker 1: And so as a printer and the Olympics were approaching,
Speaker 1: I got to a point where I was just frustrated
Speaker 1: because it was just like, how is this possible that
Speaker 1: I don't have shoes to wear in the Olympics, I
Speaker 1: don't have a sponsor. So I was basically just talking
Speaker 1: to my brother about that. I was like venting to
Speaker 1: him about just how I'm so tired of like begging
Speaker 1: companies to see my value, to see my worth, Like
Speaker 1: how am I still at this point? And he was like, well,
Speaker 1: what if we just like did it ourselves and mind you,
Speaker 1: like we had just come through this like massive fight
Speaker 1: for maternal protections like that just feels very ambitious, I mean,
Speaker 1: like create a company. But the more that I heard
Speaker 1: him and I like sat on it, I was like, no,
Speaker 1: you're absolutely right. Here is an opportunity to create change,
Speaker 1: and an opportunity instead of asking somebody else to do it,
Speaker 1: we can do it ourselves. And so what we thought
Speaker 1: we were doing was creating shoes for me to wear
Speaker 1: in the Olympics, and we thought maybe other women would
Speaker 1: want to stand with me and want to support. And
Speaker 1: then after taking a deep dive into the industry, we
Speaker 1: learned that shoes haven't been made for women, and that sneakers,
Speaker 1: tennis shoes are made off of a lass that is
Speaker 1: a mold of a man's foot, and it's been a
Speaker 1: man's foot that's been used to make women's footwear. And
Speaker 1: I just thought that was crazy. And so it became
Speaker 1: this bigger purpose to say, our shoes are going to
Speaker 1: be created to fit the form of the female foot.
Speaker 1: Even bigger than creating shoes is that we're a company
Speaker 1: that sees women and knows they're worth and value and
Speaker 1: exists for that purpose. And so it's been an incredible
Speaker 1: just journey getting to that point and after creating the
Speaker 1: company and a lot of things happened in long time period,
Speaker 1: but we launched during Olympic trials and then at the Olympics.
Speaker 1: I did make it back to my fifth Olympics and
Speaker 1: I got to compete in shoes that our company made.
Speaker 5: Running strong of handed to Alison Felix, the veteran Well
Speaker 5: Felix bronze medal in her final open four hundred.
Speaker 2: In a quiet stadium in Tokyo, a year after the
Speaker 2: world shut down due to COVID, three years after she
Speaker 2: gave birth to her daughter, and two years after fighting
Speaker 2: back against Nike, she won an Olympic gold medal in
Speaker 2: her safe shoes.
Speaker 1: It was just truly a highlight and also like a
Speaker 1: full circle moment, you know, to get back to that point,
Speaker 1: to win a gold and a bronze medal in our
Speaker 1: shoes and to be a representation.
Speaker 6: You know.
Speaker 1: It was the first time that I got to a
Speaker 1: starting line and I wasn't only focused on the outcome
Speaker 1: of the race. It wasn't only focused on the medal
Speaker 1: or the time, but I was focused on like here
Speaker 1: I am as this representation to mothers and to women,
Speaker 1: and basically to anybody who had been told that they
Speaker 1: couldn't do something to overcome and to be able to
Speaker 1: look down and see these shoes was like the physical
Speaker 1: embodiment of all that. I love the idea of you know,
Speaker 1: once you get through that door, you know, it's about
Speaker 1: opening the door and extending a hand and bringing someone up.
Speaker 1: And there have been so many women on this journey
Speaker 1: who have done that for me, who have supported me,
Speaker 1: who have been mentors and just have been incredibly helpful,
Speaker 1: And I just I love the sisterhood of it all.
Speaker 2: So, I mean, you created a company, so this was
Speaker 2: not this was not your background. You know who we're
Speaker 2: going in prepared to do, and you've created some really
Speaker 2: interesting policies in the business model that are different.
Speaker 1: Yeah, we are for and by women. We are women
Speaker 1: product designers and engineers and a very diverse group. But
Speaker 1: I think when you have women at the table, you
Speaker 1: just do things in a more thoughtful way. And so
Speaker 1: we have a maternity returns policy where oftentimes when you
Speaker 1: become pregnant, your foot size changes, and oftentimes that can
Speaker 1: be a permanent change. So if you have a pair
Speaker 1: of our shoes in your foot size, change. We'll give
Speaker 1: you a new chew in your new size. And so
Speaker 1: it's just these ways to support women better and say
Speaker 1: that you don't have to choose and decide between being
Speaker 1: a mother and anything else. And also just that we
Speaker 1: want the world to be better for women and here's
Speaker 1: a way that we can do that. And I don't
Speaker 1: think that we can ask women to choose between the
Speaker 1: passionate work that they do and being parents. I don't
Speaker 1: believe in that, and so it is challenging, you know,
Speaker 1: I think you have to be creative and thoughtful with
Speaker 1: the way that you're doing things. But I think that
Speaker 1: as I think people want to spend their money places
Speaker 1: that are doing things in a thoughtful way. And I
Speaker 1: just think about the way that we've been able to
Speaker 1: support mom athletes and whether it's you know, through grants
Speaker 1: or through supporting some of the childcare work, Like, there
Speaker 1: are ways that we can do this and see women,
Speaker 1: you know, in a more holistic light.
Speaker 2: How do you have that conversations with investors that are
Speaker 2: so often coming in looking for like quick profit, you know,
Speaker 2: balance the books, Like what are those conversations like, especially
Speaker 2: when women at all only get two percent of VC funding.
Speaker 1: Yeah, absolutely, it was really important for us to find
Speaker 1: the right investors and for that reason, I think they
Speaker 1: have to understand, they have to get it and it's
Speaker 1: not going to be for everybody. And obviously, yes, we
Speaker 1: want to scale the business quickly as well, and we
Speaker 1: want to do all those things, but we want to
Speaker 1: do it in the right way and we want to
Speaker 1: make sure we're having impact. And so for us, for
Speaker 1: our lead investor, their female led they invest in companies
Speaker 1: with purpose and mission and so making sure that they
Speaker 1: connect with what we're trying to do. I mean that's
Speaker 1: really at the heart of it all. And GAP actually
Speaker 1: invested in our company as well, and so really finding
Speaker 1: the right partners that understand. I mean, I think our
Speaker 1: outlook has to be on the big picture. We're a
Speaker 1: company that is mission driven and so the purpose is
Speaker 1: so much bigger than Yes, obviously we want to be successful,
Speaker 1: we want to sell shoes. We do, but I define
Speaker 1: success as also having that impact. It's not going to
Speaker 1: be enough just to be successful on paper. I need
Speaker 1: that to also happen in the form of change, and
Speaker 1: so that's what it's all about, and it has to
Speaker 1: be authentic, it has to be genuine and so we
Speaker 1: start from within our company. We start from the way
Speaker 1: that we build our teams. We start from the initiatives
Speaker 1: and the campaigns and the things that we're involved with
Speaker 1: in that so I think it sometimes it may take longer,
Speaker 1: but I think it's important to do things the right way.
Speaker 1: And that's where we're really uncompromising.
Speaker 2: Where do you want to take it?
Speaker 1: I want to keep building, you know, I want to
Speaker 1: have more impact. I'm really excited. We have performance footwear
Speaker 1: coming next year and that's my baby, you know, That's
Speaker 1: what I want to bring to women. And so I
Speaker 1: guess when I think about the future, I mean I
Speaker 1: would love to see more shoes, you know, just a
Speaker 1: sea of shoes, and not so that we'll be just successful,
Speaker 1: but so that we'll have that impact and just that
Speaker 1: power of the collective of women wanting to stand together
Speaker 1: and wanting to stand for change.
Speaker 2: She's still changing. After her twenty year running career, she
Speaker 2: decided to announce her retirement twenty two.
Speaker 7: Alison Felix, who owns more Olympic medals than any US
Speaker 7: track and field athlete in history, says she will retire
Speaker 7: after the twenty twenty two season. Her last competition likely
Speaker 7: will be the World Championships in July, and in Instagram post,
Speaker 7: Felix said, this season is not about.
Speaker 1: Time on the clock.
Speaker 7: It is simply about joy.
Speaker 1: And I was kind of trying to juggle both, you know,
Speaker 1: this company and competing. And so I went to my
Speaker 1: last World Championships and I felt like I had given
Speaker 1: all I had to give, and so now I'm really
Speaker 1: excited to just be walking in this new space and
Speaker 1: still doing something different.
Speaker 2: During that last race, did you know that it would
Speaker 2: be your last?
Speaker 1: I did. It was very special in that way because
Speaker 1: I think a lot of athletes they don't get to
Speaker 1: know when it's their last. I actually got to put
Speaker 1: together this kind of final race. It was a race
Speaker 1: in my hometown, Los Angeles. We made it in partnership
Speaker 1: with Athleta. We created kind of this We call it
Speaker 1: the Race for Change, and it was to support mom
Speaker 1: athletes and to raise funds to be able to provide childcare,
Speaker 1: you know, at more events. And so it was this
Speaker 1: very special, full circle moment where I had all my family,
Speaker 1: all my friends, just people who have been on this
Speaker 1: journey with me since the very beginning. So this very
Speaker 1: special moment to kind of close it all out.
Speaker 2: So I asked this question of all of my guests,
Speaker 2: what do you think that something at the time you
Speaker 2: saw is a real low point, but now you look
Speaker 2: back in retrospect, it may have actually been a positive.
Speaker 1: Oh. Absolutely. For me, it was the whole moment of
Speaker 1: where I walked away from Nike, you know, the moment
Speaker 1: where I felt like I was losing so much and
Speaker 1: such an uncertain time, and I think I'm absolutely where
Speaker 1: I'm supposed to be now. And it was something really
Speaker 1: hard to go through, absolutely, but it brought me to
Speaker 1: purpose and to meaning into more than I could have
Speaker 1: ever imagined.
Speaker 2: Well, Allison, thank you so much for joining us.
Speaker 1: Yeah, thank you for such thoughtful questions.
Speaker 2: Alison continues to run Stage and is growing the company
Speaker 2: quarter by quarter. Last spring, she raised eight million dollars
Speaker 2: for her Series A round, laying the groundwork to continue
Speaker 2: to expand Stage into more products and markets. She still
Speaker 2: runs the company alongside her brother Wes, and is dedicated
Speaker 2: to creating a more equitable future for women. Alison changed
Speaker 2: the game. She created a pathway for more female athletes
Speaker 2: to receive fair compensation and protections, and her advocacy journey
Speaker 2: is far from over. I'm sure we'll see her pivot again.
Speaker 2: Thanks for listening. Thanks for listening to this episode of
Speaker 2: she Pivots, where I talk with women about how their
Speaker 2: experiences and significant personal events led to their pivot and
Speaker 2: eventually their success. Be sure to follow us on Instagram
Speaker 2: at she pivots the podcast and leave a rating in
Speaker 2: comment if you enjoyed this episode to help others learn
Speaker 2: about it. A special thank you to our partner Marie
Speaker 2: Claire and the team that made this episode possible. Talk
Speaker 2: to you next week. She Pivots is hosted by me
Speaker 2: Emily Tish Sussman, produced by Emily eda Veloshik, with sound
Speaker 2: editing and mixing from Nina Pollock, and research and planning
Speaker 2: from Christine Dickinson and Hannah Cousins.
Speaker 1: I endorse che Pivots.