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Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff to Blow Your Mind, a production of iHeartRadio.

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Speaker 2: Hey you, welcome to Stuff to Blow your Mind a

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Speaker 2: listener mail. My name is Robert Lamb.

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Speaker 3: And my name is Joe McCormick. And on listener Mail episodes,

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Speaker 3: we read back messages that come into the Stuff to

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Speaker 3: Blow your Mind email address. If you're a fan of

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Speaker 3: the show and you've never written in before, this is

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Speaker 3: a great time to try it. You can email us

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Speaker 3: at contact at stuff to Blow your Mind dot com.

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Speaker 3: All types of messages are welcome. We especially appreciate if

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Speaker 3: you have something interesting to add to a topic we've

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Speaker 3: talked about, maybe from your own experience or expertise, but

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Speaker 3: also if you want to ask us a question, if

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Speaker 3: you want to suggest a topic for the future, if

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Speaker 3: you want to suggest a movie for Weird House Cinema,

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Speaker 3: whatever it is, send it our way contact at stuff

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Speaker 3: to Blow your Mind dot com.

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Speaker 2: That's right, yeah, right in. We'd love to hear from you. No,

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Speaker 2: no message is to silly or too serious, you know,

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Speaker 2: just I guess the general rules apply that if you

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Speaker 2: if you want to be anonymous, give us a note

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Speaker 2: let us know. To that effect, you know, include information

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Speaker 2: about your pronouns if you like, and that's about it. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: we're always happy to hear from you. We also sometimes

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Speaker 2: read messages that are shared with us from our Discord server,

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Speaker 2: and if you would like to join that sort that server,

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Speaker 2: just email us and we'll shoot you the link and

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Speaker 2: we'll Yeah, that's basically how we do it. Now, we're

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Speaker 2: going to be talking about some listener mails that came

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Speaker 2: in regarding our dog Days and Death Stars series, in

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Speaker 2: which we talk about the dog days of Summer and

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Speaker 2: the the rise of serious and so forth. We talked

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Speaker 2: a fair amount in those episodes about the music of

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Speaker 2: Don Henley, particularly the Boys of Summer, and I've made

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Speaker 2: a few references to the Lena del Rey song Summertime Sadness,

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Speaker 2: and in difference this song, I didn't mention something that

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Speaker 2: has really stuck out to me subsequently in the lyrics

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Speaker 2: as I've re listened to this song and it is

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Speaker 2: a great song, and I think, you know, very emotionally

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Speaker 2: deep song. But there's this one little bit where she sings,

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Speaker 2: think I'll miss you forever like the stars, miss the

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Speaker 2: sun in the morning sky. Later is better than ever,

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Speaker 2: Even if you're gone. I'm gonna drive so stars missing

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Speaker 2: the Sun in the morning sky makes me think too

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Speaker 2: serious and maybe to mercury. But it certainly seems like

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Speaker 2: there might be a dash of dog star to the

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Speaker 2: lyrics here, don't you think.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, so that suggests the halliakal rising of Sirius, like

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Speaker 3: we talked about in the episodes, which means that in

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Speaker 3: the on the eastern horizon, that is the time when

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Speaker 3: Sirius kind of overtakes the Sun, when it starts to

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Speaker 3: appear just before dawn, and you can actually see it

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Speaker 3: in the in the darkness just before the sun rise

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Speaker 3: because the Sun is not you know, it's not hidden

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Speaker 3: behind the Sun's glare. And as the year goes on,

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Speaker 3: serious will climb up higher and hire it will rise

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Speaker 3: earlier and earlier before the sun. So it's kind of

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Speaker 3: like the dog star is running away from the Sun

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Speaker 3: and the Sun is chasing it and falling behind during

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Speaker 3: that time.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, So I don't know one way or another

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Speaker 2: for sure on this, but I think there's a chance

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Speaker 2: that there is an intentional connection here, an intentional reference

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Speaker 2: to Sirius. And if it's not intentional, I don't know,

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Speaker 2: maybe it just sort of leads in through the you

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Speaker 2: know the long standing culture of our associations with these

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Speaker 2: celestial objects.

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Speaker 3: Wait, I think I told you already, but I finally

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Speaker 3: looked up this song and listened to it because you've

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Speaker 3: been talking about it.

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Speaker 2: It's great.

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Speaker 3: I really like it. Yeah. I wasn't against the Lana

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Speaker 3: del Ray, but I just hadn't ever listened to much

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Speaker 3: of her. I knew that song Video Games from many

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Speaker 3: years ago, but that's the same album that this song

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Speaker 3: is on, and I thought it was really good.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, yeah, so solid track. Yeah, really good stuff.

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Speaker 3: Yeah. Well, since we're talking about music, should we go

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Speaker 3: ahead to this message about favorite bands?

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Speaker 2: Yes, yes, let's do this one. And I also went

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Speaker 2: ahead and shoehorned down a discord message on the same topic.

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Speaker 3: So in previous Listener Mail episodes, we had been chatting

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Speaker 3: back and forth with listeners and with each other about

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Speaker 3: the new album released this year by Boards of Canada

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Speaker 3: called Inferno, which ROB listened to about five hundred times

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Speaker 3: before I got a chance to. But I finally listened

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Speaker 3: to it, and I think it's great to really like

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Speaker 3: it that I cannot get that track out of my

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Speaker 3: head about I Love You, I.

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Speaker 2: Love the Lord, Oh Father and Son yes, that.

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Speaker 3: Just drives in there. Anyway, the samples in that are something,

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Speaker 3: something is really sticky about them. But it's a great

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Speaker 3: album start to finish.

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Speaker 2: I really like it.

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Speaker 3: But anyway, we were talking about how, of course Boards

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Speaker 3: of Canada, Rob, that is one of your favorite musical acts.

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Speaker 3: I love them too. But in response to one of

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Speaker 3: these messages from listeners, I noted that I was kind

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Speaker 3: of surprise that so many listeners seem to know what

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Speaker 3: your favorite bands are, not that we never talk about

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Speaker 3: personal taste on the podcast. Obviously, we do, especially with movies,

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Speaker 3: you know, since we do weird House cinema, I think

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Speaker 3: awareness of our taste in movies is kind of more expected.

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Speaker 3: That doesn't surprise me, but I guess I never know

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Speaker 3: what to expect about what listeners, what y'all out there

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Speaker 3: will notice and remember about stuff in other domains. And anyway,

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Speaker 3: after this, Rob challenged listeners to write in if they

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Speaker 3: had any guesses about my favorite music, and we got

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Speaker 3: some take up on this too. So this is from Ian.

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Speaker 3: Actually was Ian one of the people who wrote in

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Speaker 3: about you liking Boards of Canada. I think so, I

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Speaker 3: think so, yes, Ian says, high gents, so guessing my

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Speaker 3: favorite bands, Ian says, my immediate thoughts are Electric Wizard

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Speaker 3: and masted On. However, I feel like and here he

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Speaker 3: says Rob's taste, but I think he meant to say

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Speaker 3: Joe's tasting, so yeah, he says, However, I feel like

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Speaker 3: Joe's taste varies widely, so other listeners will have to

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Speaker 3: round out the list with other genres. As Joe seems

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Speaker 3: knowledgeable about time based guitar effects like delay of reverb,

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Speaker 3: chorus flanging, phasing, et cetera. I suspect his listening goes

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Speaker 3: beyond hard rock shoegaze, maybe Doctor Teeth and the Electric Mayhem.

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Speaker 3: Bonus points for recognizing those musical pioneers, Oh, I recognize.

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Speaker 3: Keep up the great work, and I hope it hasn't

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Speaker 3: been too creepy. Realizing that listeners often absorb personal facts

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Speaker 3: about the two of you as well as podcast content.

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Speaker 3: We don't mean to and don't worry. Most of us

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Speaker 3: are well adjusted and just really enjoy your work. Welcome

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Speaker 3: to celebrity life, cheers, Ian. I think celebrity might be

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Speaker 3: going a little far, but thank you. Ian.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, all right, and here's where I'm going to go

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Speaker 2: ahead and Chew in a quick discord message, so you

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Speaker 2: can respond to this one as well, Joe, this one

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Speaker 2: comes to us from Thorp. Will Thorqule says, just a

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Speaker 2: few thoughts on this week's listener mail episode favorite musician

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Speaker 2: or not. Joe mentions Rocky ericson often. Also Jack from

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Speaker 2: Mister Black Pedals would be a fan of Weird House

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Speaker 2: Cinema based on the content of his mailing list.

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Speaker 3: So I looked at this up. I'm not familiar, but

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Speaker 3: mister Black Pedals is a boutique pedal maker, guitar pedals.

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Speaker 3: I think this may be picking up on another thing

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Speaker 3: I said off handedly in a previous episode, which is

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Speaker 3: one of my consumer weaknesses, is boutique guitar pedals. I

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Speaker 3: always seeing those things. I'm like, ooh, I want that.

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Speaker 3: Oh it's three hundred dollars.

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Speaker 2: Guitar pedal advertisers, where are you? We're giving all stuff

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Speaker 2: away for free here please?

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Speaker 3: Yeah? Can we run ads for Earthquaker devices or something?

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Speaker 2: Yeah?

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Speaker 3: I would love that. But Ian I will say, yeah,

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Speaker 3: very good. Guesses. You are correct that I'm not only

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Speaker 3: a metal fan. I like stuff in basically every genre,

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Speaker 3: but within the metal zone. Electric Wizard absolutely, Bingo Mastadon.

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Speaker 3: I do love two, especially from the earlier days of

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Speaker 3: like Leviathan and Blood Mountain, so I like their more

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Speaker 3: recent stuff. Also, I would also add Boris one of

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Speaker 3: my favorite metal bands. I'm actually wearing one of their

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Speaker 3: shirts today. This is a Boris flood t shirt. And

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Speaker 3: I don't know if I really need to say this one.

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Speaker 3: In fact, I would have guessed this is what I

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Speaker 3: mentioned most often on the show. But Sabbath, of course.

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Speaker 1: Ye.

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Speaker 3: As for time based effects, yes, I do like a

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Speaker 3: lot of like verbed out psyde rock, you know, basically

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Speaker 3: everything that descends from the thirteenth floor elevators. That's definitely

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Speaker 3: my zone.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. I was definitely assuming Sabbath would be a major

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Speaker 2: guest for folks, and I suppose it goes without saying

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Speaker 2: that since we're almost always talking to each other on

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Speaker 2: this show, our musical references probably pop off more if

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Speaker 2: we both like or at least half familiarity with a

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Speaker 2: particular band. But then again, I was thinking about this.

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Speaker 2: We're more likely, I think, to make casual, almost easter

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Speaker 2: egg like references to bands if we both know them

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Speaker 2: in the same way. There were always referencing old Simpsons

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Speaker 2: episodes or certain weird house cinema movies from the past

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Speaker 2: without clearly stating something like this reminds me of the

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Speaker 2: moment in Treehouse of Horror, for when you know, we'll

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Speaker 2: just sort of throw it in and it can just

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Speaker 2: be lost. I suppose it's also if we're making a

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Speaker 2: major point, a major connection, such as like the Don

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Speaker 2: Henley thing, then yeah, we're more likely to really reference

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Speaker 2: like this album, this artist, this is what I think.

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Speaker 2: But yeah, just like passing references to Sabbath or Electric

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Speaker 2: Wizard or even Boards of Canada, like some of those

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Speaker 2: can maybe be almost invisible if you're not looking for them.

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Speaker 3: Just to let folks in on some of my thought

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Speaker 3: process in making this show, this is actually something I'm

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Speaker 3: constantly mentally balancing, and I'm never sure if we find

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Speaker 3: the right place to be here. It's balancing having a

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Speaker 3: natural conversation versus explaining things enough that people who are

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Speaker 3: not sort of in on the joke or know whatever, like,

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Speaker 3: can understand what you're talking about.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, and I mean not just with musical and

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Speaker 2: film references of course, but also like getting into the

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Speaker 2: scientific concepts that we cover, or historical references like how

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Speaker 2: how much do you explain? And like how do we

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Speaker 2: how are we imagining the intended listener? And how should

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Speaker 2: we be imagining the intended listener? Has there been drift

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Speaker 2: over the years, Yeah, concerning this, you know, it's at one.

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Speaker 2: It's like I catch myself thinking about it and then

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Speaker 2: just saying, don't think about that, just do the podcast.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, it's true, and I think I'm not consistent about it.

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Speaker 3: Like sometimes I just let the conversation flow and I

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Speaker 3: you know, references come out that are not fully explained

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Speaker 3: and we just let them go by, and that has

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Speaker 3: its own qualities, you know. I think that is more

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Speaker 3: listenable and more natural, but at the same time leaves

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Speaker 3: a lot of people wondering what you're talking about. So

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Speaker 3: I don't know, I don't know. I don't know how

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Speaker 3: to solve that. So we're just gonna, I guess, keep

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Speaker 3: going back and forth between them. But anyway, thank you, Ian,

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Speaker 3: and also thank you to Thorpwell your correct Rocky Erickson

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Speaker 3: of course one of my favorites, and I'm going to

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Speaker 3: check out mister black Pedals.

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Speaker 2: All right, I believe we have some more music related

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Speaker 2: listener mails here and the ones we're about to get

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Speaker 2: into are going to more directly concern our episodes about

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Speaker 2: the Dog Days and Death Stars and a lot of

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Speaker 2: Doc Hanley talk.

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Speaker 3: If we're gonna do this message from Scott, first, we

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Speaker 3: should probably mention that you already sort of retracted your

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Speaker 3: original comments recanted, yeah, be healed. But yeah, so I

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Speaker 3: don't know. I guess this will come up in the

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Speaker 3: in the email and then you can respond afterwards.

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Speaker 2: So yeah, yeah, because I really did have the experience

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Speaker 2: with certainly Boys of Summer, but also to a limited

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Speaker 2: extent with Summertime Sadness, where these are songs that I enjoyed,

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Speaker 2: had only thought to varying degrees about the lyric, but

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Speaker 2: then lyrics. Then, since we were talking about them on

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Speaker 2: the show, I listened to both tracks kind of over

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Speaker 2: and over again, did a lot more thinking about them,

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Speaker 2: and then, especially with Boys of Summer, made connections to

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Speaker 2: things that were either coming up in the in the

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Speaker 2: episode content itself, or I was reading about the origins

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Speaker 2: of the song. So Scott says, Hi, Rob and Joe

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Speaker 2: really enjoyed your wide ranging three part series on serious

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Speaker 2: and our human associations with it. But I need to

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Speaker 2: correct you on one point about the Don Henley song

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Speaker 2: The Boys of Summer, you noted it's sad, nostalgic mood,

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Speaker 2: pining for the lost days of summer and lost youth.

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Speaker 2: Lost youth as especially depicted in the music video all

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Speaker 2: connecting with the dog Days of Summer and a Dylan

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Speaker 2: Thomas poem about lost youth. But one of you also

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Speaker 2: described the song as creepy in the narrator's pursuit of

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Speaker 2: an ex girlfriend who is now dating other boys and

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Speaker 2: his promise that he'll still be there for her once

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Speaker 2: she's done with them, and I'll know. This is particularly

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Speaker 2: the point that I kind of went back on where

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Speaker 2: I used to have this read on it. And then

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Speaker 2: the more I thought about it more I listened to it,

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Speaker 2: I kind of like moved past that. But still it's

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Speaker 2: I think it's safe to assume others might have that

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Speaker 2: interpretation anyway, he continues, while Henley noted in the Bill

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Speaker 2: Domain article from Louder which you reference, that the song

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Speaker 2: is intentionally ambiguous. I think there's a very clear alternate, alternative,

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Speaker 2: rather interpretation. You've overlooked that the Missing Lover is actually

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Speaker 2: a metaphor for Eagles fans who loved the music he

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Speaker 2: made with that group, whom he hopes he can win

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Speaker 2: back after he's no longer with the Boys, the other

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Speaker 2: members of the band who produce summer type songs.

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Speaker 3: This is profound. You have shaken my understanding of the

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Speaker 3: boys of Summer. I did not have this in mind

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Speaker 3: at all, But I think you're really onto something here.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, I had never heard this or thought this either.

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Speaker 2: But this is a captivating hypothesis, he continues. There are

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Speaker 2: many clues to this in the lyrics. The you, the

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Speaker 2: narrator addresses, is listening to radio music. In the last verse,

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Speaker 2: he wonders if he should heed the voice inside his head,

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Speaker 2: saying that you shouldn't quote look back to those lost

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Speaker 2: years after seeing a Deadhead sticker on a Cadillac, The

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Speaker 2: Grateful Dead being another California band whose members and followers

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Speaker 2: have grown up and are driving fancier cars, but perhaps

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Speaker 2: are pining for the old days when they were roughing

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Speaker 2: life with a more carefree attitude and fewer resources, bootlegging

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Speaker 2: tapes instead of watching their investment portfolio. But the clincher

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Speaker 2: is when he wonders if the nights he remembers really happened,

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Speaker 2: where he can quote, remember how you made me crazy crazy?

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Speaker 2: Remember how I made you scream? An obvious reference to

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Speaker 2: evening concerts where the Eagles sang, among other songs, one

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Speaker 2: of these nights with the lyrics, one of these crazy, crazy,

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Speaker 2: crazy nights, while of the crowds screamed with excitement.

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Speaker 3: Scott, brilliant exegesis. I two thumbs up from me.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, great connections here, Scott. It is a complex hypothesis,

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Speaker 2: so I think I'm gonna gonna maybe take it a

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Speaker 2: little with a grain of salt. But I mean I

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Speaker 2: love overthinking about musical lyrics and and you know, as

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Speaker 2: well as the plots to be films. So I embraced this.

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Speaker 2: This is this is wonderful.

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Speaker 3: Okay, you want to hear another response to the Don

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Speaker 3: Henley bit.

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Speaker 2: Yes, I'm excited for this one because this is exactly

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Speaker 2: an email that I hope we would receive.

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Speaker 3: This is from Jeff. Subject line, don't take this as

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Speaker 3: an actual threat, a reference to the name of a song.

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Speaker 3: Subject line, Don Henley must die. Jeff says, good day,

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Speaker 3: esteemed cohorts. Since you guys singled it out, I have

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Speaker 3: to add that when the ataris made, a pretty faithful

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Speaker 3: cover of the Boys of Summer. They changed the line

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Speaker 3: from I saw a deadhead sticker on a Cadillac to

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Speaker 3: I saw a black flag sticker on a Cadillac. That song,

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Speaker 3: referring to the Ataris cover is like a Turduccan of nostalgia.

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Speaker 3: You can feel wistful about Henley noting the irony of

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Speaker 3: a deadhead now driving a Cadillac. The Ataris reflecting on

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Speaker 3: the classic eighties song from their youth and now remarking

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Speaker 3: on the irony of the sellout Cadillac driver yearning for

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Speaker 3: pre swol Henry Rollins and now seemingly impossibly. That cover

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Speaker 3: is twenty three years old, so adults are reminiscing about

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Speaker 3: the early two thousands pop punk of their youth. Wow.

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Speaker 3: So I looked up the music video for the Atari's cover,

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Speaker 3: and much like with the original Henley video, I mean

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Speaker 3: respect to them. It's a It's a solid cover in

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Speaker 3: that in that pop punk style I remember from when

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Speaker 3: I was in high school. But I have a critique

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Speaker 3: of the the mismatch between the themes and cinematography. Now

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Speaker 3: in the original Don Henley music video, I critiqued it

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Speaker 3: because I thought it didn't look hot enough that you know,

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Speaker 3: we were talking about the dog days of summer, and

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Speaker 3: the video is cool, but it is literally cool. It

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Speaker 3: looks like very like temperature wise cool and crisp, and

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Speaker 3: nobody's sweaty. Everybody's very dry this music video. I have

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Speaker 3: a critique, which is that there's no beach. They're singing

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Speaker 3: in this cool looking, breezy mountain meadow, Like where's all

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Speaker 3: the heat in these videos? People make like wet, sweaty

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Speaker 3: music videos. That was a whole thing in two thousand

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Speaker 3: and two, So I don't know, I'm kind of surprised,

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Speaker 3: Like I'm like, where's all the sweat?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I was familiar with this cover of of the song,

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Speaker 2: but I am struck by this reference to I pre

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Speaker 2: swoll Henry Rollins. I had no idea that he was

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Speaker 2: ever not Swoll, so that I mean I grew up.

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Speaker 2: My first associations with Henry Rollins are from like music

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Speaker 2: videos on MTV, where he was he was very much swow.

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Speaker 3: I hesitate to comment because I don't know enough about

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Speaker 3: Black Flag and Henry Rollins, but my impression is that

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Speaker 3: the getting really beefy was like later in the like

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Speaker 3: Rollins Rollins band after Black Flag.

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Speaker 2: Okay, that's where I come in.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, okay, yeah, because I don't know did Black Flag

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Speaker 3: when he was even have music videos or I'm not

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Speaker 3: sure yea. Anyway, So to continue with Jeff's message, he

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Speaker 3: has more. Jeff says, also, I'm obligated to mention a

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Speaker 3: weird house alum because he was in the Super Mario

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Speaker 3: Brothers movie Mojo Nixon's banger Don Henley Must Die, which

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Speaker 3: I don't know if i'd heard before, but I looked up.

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Speaker 3: This is great, Jeff says, hilarious, problematic, super catchy chorus.

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Speaker 3: Apparently Henley took it pretty well and even performed the

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Speaker 3: song with him on stage once. Well, that makes me

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Speaker 3: feel better about it.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, so this I was hoping someone would write in

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Speaker 2: about Don Henley Must Die, because even as we were

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Speaker 2: covering and talking about the Boys of Summer, I kept

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Speaker 2: earworming myself by remembering this Mojo Nixon song, which I

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Speaker 2: very much remember from from back in the day. It

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Speaker 2: is very catchy. It is problematic in that like he is,

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Speaker 2: even in jest, calling for the death of of this

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Speaker 2: this this person, this real live human being.

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Speaker 3: Who have mentioned a lot of methods in the song.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, there's a lot of methodology and reasons that it

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Speaker 2: must be done, and he points out that that Don

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Speaker 2: Henley took it and stride. Yeah, like the basically the

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Speaker 2: stories and I don't remember the way or the exact

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Speaker 2: win on this, but Don Henley at one point appeared

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Speaker 2: on stage with Mojo Nixon and they sang the song together.

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Speaker 2: So I would, I would argue, very cool, way cooler

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Speaker 2: than Don Henley had to be about the song, I

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Speaker 2: have to say, and certainly cooler about it than Glenn

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Speaker 2: Fry was. There's a there's that story about how like

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Speaker 2: Glenn Fry came up to Jeff Bridges at some function

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Speaker 2: and was given him grief about the opinion of the

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Speaker 2: Eagles expressed by Jeff Lebowski and the big Lebowski about

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Speaker 2: the Eagles sucking and yeah, yeah.

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Speaker 3: Like he thought actors wrote their own lines.

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Speaker 2: I don't know. Yeah, it's just like unnecessarily like harping

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Speaker 2: on Jeff Bridges for something his character said, or at

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Speaker 2: least that's the story. I mean, who knows the truth

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Speaker 2: of any of this, but I have seen the footage

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Speaker 2: Henley and Nixon did did perform this song together, and yeah,

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Speaker 2: pretty cool moment.

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Speaker 3: Opening lyrics are He's a tortured artist. Used to be

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Speaker 3: in the Eagle. Now he whinds like a wounded be goal.

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Speaker 3: Oh and also the chorus does rhyme. One version of

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Speaker 3: the chorus does rhyme don Henley must die with don't

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Speaker 3: let him get back together with Glenn Fry.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and it's a very catchy song.

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Speaker 3: Let's see. Do we want to do the Jeff caveats

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Speaker 3: the rest of his message that it's a digression. I

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Speaker 3: guess we can mention a few things. He just includes

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Speaker 3: a few of his favorite covers, rock covers, dinosaur juniors,

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Speaker 3: just like Heaven. I'm a big Dinosaur junior fan. I

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Speaker 3: like that cover he includes no effects is go your

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Speaker 3: Own Way. That's a cover of Fleetwood Mac. Obviously. Do

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Speaker 3: we want to do the weird house digression about tron Aries?

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Speaker 2: We can? I think I'll just summarize to say that

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Speaker 2: that he had some thoughts about tron Aris and and

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Speaker 2: seemed on the whole entertained by it, and in what

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Speaker 2: he said is encourages me to watch it at some point.

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Speaker 2: I really love the Nine Inch Nails score s soundtrack

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Speaker 2: for this film. But that's just as deep as I

399
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Speaker 2: got into it. I have not seen it, but hey,

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Speaker 2: maybe i'll check it out. Now. You know, I enjoyed

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Speaker 2: the last Stron movie, So if I enjoyed that one,

402
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Speaker 2: surely I could find something to love in this one.

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Speaker 2: I don't know.

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Speaker 3: Does he say on the whole he was entertained by it.

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Speaker 3: I'd say it mixed. He has a lot of critiques.

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Speaker 2: I saw the glass half full on this one, okay.

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00:22:22,200 --> 00:22:24,840
Speaker 3: Anyway, He finishes by saying, thanks for bringing us all

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Speaker 3: the information we didn't know, we wanted to know, mostly

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Speaker 3: wanted to share the black Flag thing, Jeff, Thank you, Jeff.

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Speaker 2: All right, let's move on to some more. This one

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Speaker 2: relates to our series on the Thing before the Beginning,

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Speaker 2: where we talked about mythologies and religions old and fairly recent,

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Speaker 2: their contemplation of what comes before the creation, what exists

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Speaker 2: before the creation or the emergence of the universe. And

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Speaker 2: this one comes to us, Yeah from Sally Sali says,

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Speaker 2: dear stuff to blow your mind. While I was watching

417
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Speaker 2: one of your programs on Netflix about the universe expanding

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Speaker 2: and collapsing, I was suddenly reminded of a childhood memory.

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Speaker 2: As a young child, my brother told me that one

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Speaker 2: day the universe would reach an equilibrium, and when that happened,

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Speaker 2: it would freeze into place, and all life would cease

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Speaker 2: to exist and never happen again. I went to my

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Speaker 2: room and cried at the thought of all life being

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Speaker 2: wiped out. My mother heard me and came into my

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Speaker 2: room and asked me why I was crying. I explained

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Speaker 2: that my brother told me, and I explained what my

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Speaker 2: brother told me and how sad I was at life ceasing.

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Speaker 2: She laughed and said, look at your room. I guarantee

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Speaker 2: equilibrium won't ever happen. Since then, I have taken solace

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Speaker 2: in doing my part at promoting the continuation of life.

431
00:23:44,840 --> 00:23:46,680
Speaker 2: While I have you, I wish to tell you both,

432
00:23:46,840 --> 00:23:50,760
Speaker 2: Robin Joe, I greatly appreciate your perfectly paired soothing voices, you, gentlemen,

433
00:23:50,760 --> 00:23:53,280
Speaker 2: are my favorite voices to go to sweep. To Lest

434
00:23:53,359 --> 00:23:55,720
Speaker 2: you not understand what a true compliment that is, you

435
00:23:55,840 --> 00:23:59,520
Speaker 2: need only reference your own program about rumination. When one's

436
00:23:59,520 --> 00:24:02,280
Speaker 2: mind is locked into an infinite cycle, one is grateful

437
00:24:02,280 --> 00:24:04,560
Speaker 2: for anything to break the cycle and bring peace to

438
00:24:04,600 --> 00:24:07,600
Speaker 2: a troubled mind. I could easily comment on each of

439
00:24:07,640 --> 00:24:09,679
Speaker 2: your programs, but I will simply say I find your

440
00:24:09,720 --> 00:24:12,640
Speaker 2: programs highly enjoyable, and I am thankful I found you

441
00:24:12,880 --> 00:24:14,280
Speaker 2: have a great day, Sally.

442
00:24:15,080 --> 00:24:16,760
Speaker 3: Well, thank you so much for the kind word.

443
00:24:16,840 --> 00:24:17,159
Speaker 2: Sally.

444
00:24:17,200 --> 00:24:19,560
Speaker 3: I'm glad you're enjoying the show. And I like this

445
00:24:19,640 --> 00:24:22,600
Speaker 3: story about what your mom said. I think I'm reading

446
00:24:22,600 --> 00:24:25,520
Speaker 3: the implication right, is that your room was so messy

447
00:24:26,040 --> 00:24:30,240
Speaker 3: that we could just definitely conclude equilibrium would never occur

448
00:24:30,280 --> 00:24:31,000
Speaker 3: in the universe.

449
00:24:31,440 --> 00:24:33,720
Speaker 2: The messiness of this room will stave off the heat

450
00:24:33,800 --> 00:24:35,040
Speaker 2: death of the universe. I love it.

451
00:24:35,280 --> 00:24:37,840
Speaker 3: Yeah, And you know, I'd add that I think your

452
00:24:37,840 --> 00:24:41,439
Speaker 3: mom is making a good point, even if the so

453
00:24:41,640 --> 00:24:44,760
Speaker 3: what we sometimes call heat death or thermal equilibrium of

454
00:24:44,800 --> 00:24:49,480
Speaker 3: the universe is you know, most physicists I would say

455
00:24:49,600 --> 00:24:52,280
Speaker 3: is the most likely ultimate fate of the universe. Given

456
00:24:52,320 --> 00:24:54,919
Speaker 3: what we know today, the time it would take for

457
00:24:55,000 --> 00:24:57,720
Speaker 3: us to get there is not relevant to us at all.

458
00:24:57,800 --> 00:25:02,040
Speaker 3: Like the inheritors of human and civilization, even just a

459
00:25:02,119 --> 00:25:05,760
Speaker 3: million years from now, I think, will probably be so

460
00:25:06,000 --> 00:25:08,760
Speaker 3: different from us that we wouldn't even be able to

461
00:25:09,160 --> 00:25:13,400
Speaker 3: understand them or imagine what they're like. And that million

462
00:25:13,520 --> 00:25:18,520
Speaker 3: years is such a tiny fraction of the time until

463
00:25:18,600 --> 00:25:21,960
Speaker 3: the universe stops having usable energy that I think that's

464
00:25:21,960 --> 00:25:24,000
Speaker 3: supposed to be something like ten to one hundred ten

465
00:25:24,080 --> 00:25:26,840
Speaker 3: to the one hundredth power years from now. It's just

466
00:25:26,840 --> 00:25:30,040
Speaker 3: a ridiculous amount of time from now. So even if

467
00:25:30,080 --> 00:25:33,359
Speaker 3: that big freeze happens to matter and energy, it's not

468
00:25:33,400 --> 00:25:36,720
Speaker 3: going to happen to us. Whatever us exists then if

469
00:25:36,760 --> 00:25:41,320
Speaker 3: anything will be unimaginable to us now. So I would

470
00:25:41,359 --> 00:25:44,119
Speaker 3: agree with your mom's perspective that that's not really something

471
00:25:44,240 --> 00:25:47,119
Speaker 3: humans should be worried about because there's so much time

472
00:25:47,240 --> 00:25:50,600
Speaker 3: and possibility between now and then. Even though it is

473
00:25:51,040 --> 00:25:54,120
Speaker 3: technically finite, it is functionally infinite.

474
00:25:54,560 --> 00:25:56,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I mean, this is not what's going to

475
00:25:56,760 --> 00:25:59,480
Speaker 2: kill you. The quote warrants Yvonne, life will kill you, yeah,

476
00:25:59,520 --> 00:26:01,679
Speaker 2: and then you'll be dead. But the heat death of

477
00:26:01,680 --> 00:26:04,800
Speaker 2: the universe is not really something to worry about. But

478
00:26:05,359 --> 00:26:07,760
Speaker 2: these ideas can be concerning when your encounterment at a

479
00:26:07,800 --> 00:26:09,920
Speaker 2: young age. It reminds me of when I was young

480
00:26:10,000 --> 00:26:11,720
Speaker 2: and I was in church. This wasn't even in the

481
00:26:11,760 --> 00:26:16,520
Speaker 2: American South. This was up in Newfoundland, where the pastor

482
00:26:16,600 --> 00:26:18,879
Speaker 2: was given a sermon about how everyone was going to

483
00:26:18,960 --> 00:26:22,080
Speaker 2: have to fight in some ultimate apocalyptic battle between good

484
00:26:22,080 --> 00:26:24,400
Speaker 2: and evil, and you would have to fight on one

485
00:26:24,400 --> 00:26:26,120
Speaker 2: of the two sides. And I was like, and I

486
00:26:26,160 --> 00:26:27,720
Speaker 2: was upset when I went home because I was like,

487
00:26:27,760 --> 00:26:30,560
Speaker 2: I don't want to do that. That sounds awful, And

488
00:26:30,640 --> 00:26:33,800
Speaker 2: you know, my parents had to comfort me on the

489
00:26:33,840 --> 00:26:37,000
Speaker 2: fact that, yeah, don't worry about that. That's not really

490
00:26:37,000 --> 00:26:39,879
Speaker 2: something to worry about. It's going to be fine. Yeah.

491
00:26:39,920 --> 00:26:42,879
Speaker 3: Well, thanks again, Sally. I really appreciate your message, and

492
00:26:42,880 --> 00:26:45,280
Speaker 3: maybe we should continue the theme of messages that have

493
00:26:45,359 --> 00:26:49,840
Speaker 3: something to do with the religious themes from the thing

494
00:26:49,880 --> 00:26:52,840
Speaker 3: before the beginning. This one also touches on our series

495
00:26:52,840 --> 00:26:56,439
Speaker 3: on HeLa Monsters and on some previous listener mail. So

496
00:26:56,520 --> 00:27:00,480
Speaker 3: this is going to be from Josh, and we should

497
00:27:00,480 --> 00:27:05,960
Speaker 3: note previous messages we've received from Josh. So Josh wrote

498
00:27:06,000 --> 00:27:09,080
Speaker 3: in in the past agreeing with and adding to our

499
00:27:09,119 --> 00:27:14,320
Speaker 3: discussion of the creation x materia interpretation of Genesis, the

500
00:27:14,400 --> 00:27:17,399
Speaker 3: idea that in the Genesis creation narrative in the Bible,

501
00:27:18,240 --> 00:27:21,879
Speaker 3: it's actually not saying God created the world from nothing.

502
00:27:21,960 --> 00:27:24,560
Speaker 3: It's probably best understood as saying there was a pre

503
00:27:24,640 --> 00:27:29,080
Speaker 3: existing universe and God sort of reordered and furnished it

504
00:27:29,119 --> 00:27:33,400
Speaker 3: with new things and new possibilities, and we were talking

505
00:27:33,440 --> 00:27:38,120
Speaker 3: about how this interpretation the creation x materia is favored

506
00:27:38,160 --> 00:27:40,240
Speaker 3: in the teachings of the Church of Jesus Christ of

507
00:27:40,320 --> 00:27:44,080
Speaker 3: Latter day Saints aka the Mormons. Josh, who is a

508
00:27:44,119 --> 00:27:47,719
Speaker 3: member of the church, wrote in and expressed appreciation that

509
00:27:47,720 --> 00:27:50,960
Speaker 3: we were accurate in our description of the LDS doctrines

510
00:27:51,000 --> 00:27:54,680
Speaker 3: and beliefs involved, added his own thoughts, and Josh wrote

511
00:27:54,720 --> 00:27:59,000
Speaker 3: back again concerning the part in the Heal a Monster

512
00:27:59,119 --> 00:28:03,080
Speaker 3: series where we talked about these old reports that you know,

513
00:28:03,320 --> 00:28:07,280
Speaker 3: there were these articles in Western newspapers from the eighteen eighties.

514
00:28:07,320 --> 00:28:09,920
Speaker 3: I think it was saying like, oh, yeah, Mormons collect

515
00:28:10,040 --> 00:28:14,040
Speaker 3: HeLa monsters, boil them, extract their oil, and use that

516
00:28:14,119 --> 00:28:18,920
Speaker 3: in their ceremonies. And after a significant amount of investigation,

517
00:28:19,119 --> 00:28:22,840
Speaker 3: I concluded that this is not true, This never actually happened.

518
00:28:22,880 --> 00:28:27,919
Speaker 3: I think this was just just libel against Mormons, written

519
00:28:27,920 --> 00:28:30,280
Speaker 3: by people who were pushing a kind of anti Mormon

520
00:28:30,320 --> 00:28:32,280
Speaker 3: agenda in these newspapers at the time.

521
00:28:32,680 --> 00:28:35,400
Speaker 2: Yeah, the same sort of thing that we've seen throughout

522
00:28:35,480 --> 00:28:39,640
Speaker 2: human history, when one religious group writes about another with

523
00:28:39,720 --> 00:28:40,560
Speaker 2: an axta grind.

524
00:28:40,800 --> 00:28:43,000
Speaker 3: Yeah, just making up stuff about them to make them

525
00:28:43,000 --> 00:28:46,920
Speaker 3: look bad, and so Josh wrote in about this as well.

526
00:28:52,000 --> 00:28:54,320
Speaker 3: Josh says, hi, again, I just finished part two of

527
00:28:54,360 --> 00:28:57,280
Speaker 3: the HeLa Monster series and thought i'd chime in again.

528
00:28:57,640 --> 00:29:00,440
Speaker 3: That was the first I've heard of the heel Monster

529
00:29:00,560 --> 00:29:04,479
Speaker 3: oil story. I was extremely entertained by the ladle that

530
00:29:04,600 --> 00:29:07,800
Speaker 3: was constructed like a spoon. God. I love that detail.

531
00:29:07,880 --> 00:29:10,360
Speaker 3: So yeah, one of these articles that really to me

532
00:29:10,480 --> 00:29:13,200
Speaker 3: had the ring of something somebody was just making up,

533
00:29:13,600 --> 00:29:16,040
Speaker 3: had this detail that they get the oil out of

534
00:29:16,080 --> 00:29:18,920
Speaker 3: the vats with a ladle, which is in construction much

535
00:29:19,040 --> 00:29:24,840
Speaker 3: like a spoon. Josh says, personally, I'd be more interested

536
00:29:24,880 --> 00:29:28,720
Speaker 3: in a ladele constructed like a fork. Anyway. I haven't

537
00:29:28,720 --> 00:29:31,280
Speaker 3: done any scientific research into this, but I know a

538
00:29:31,320 --> 00:29:34,080
Speaker 3: good amount of the latter day Saint history, including the

539
00:29:34,160 --> 00:29:37,960
Speaker 3: less favorable bits and the ceremonies that are carried out

540
00:29:37,960 --> 00:29:41,560
Speaker 3: in the temple. I actually used to officiate in some

541
00:29:41,720 --> 00:29:45,320
Speaker 3: of the ceremonies. The oil used inside and outside of

542
00:29:45,360 --> 00:29:49,000
Speaker 3: the temple has, to my knowledge, always been olive oil. Yeah,

543
00:29:49,040 --> 00:29:50,920
Speaker 3: that was what I found in my reading as well.

544
00:29:52,120 --> 00:29:56,000
Speaker 3: Josh says, I've also visited the Saint George Temple as

545
00:29:56,040 --> 00:29:58,640
Speaker 3: it happens. There is a baptistery in the basement, but

546
00:29:58,680 --> 00:30:01,640
Speaker 3: the font is filled with Is it HeLa monster oil?

547
00:30:01,800 --> 00:30:02,680
Speaker 2: No, it's water.

548
00:30:03,800 --> 00:30:06,959
Speaker 3: Bishops also don't have an official role in the temple,

549
00:30:07,080 --> 00:30:09,800
Speaker 3: so that detail was another red flag. Okay, yeah, so

550
00:30:09,840 --> 00:30:12,280
Speaker 3: it was saying bishops or the I think doing the

551
00:30:12,320 --> 00:30:15,560
Speaker 3: ones who are consecrating with the lizard oil. So that

552
00:30:15,600 --> 00:30:18,480
Speaker 3: also does not check out with Josh's experience. Anyway, I

553
00:30:18,520 --> 00:30:21,080
Speaker 3: thought i'd throw another email your way. I usually don't

554
00:30:21,080 --> 00:30:24,080
Speaker 3: have much expertise in the areas you're discussing, so it's

555
00:30:24,080 --> 00:30:25,840
Speaker 3: fun to be able to chime in when I can.

556
00:30:26,080 --> 00:30:29,280
Speaker 3: Keep up the good work. Josh. Well, thank you, Josh,

557
00:30:29,360 --> 00:30:32,680
Speaker 3: And as always, we love to hear feedback on episodes

558
00:30:32,720 --> 00:30:35,600
Speaker 3: if you have personal experience or expertise where you can

559
00:30:35,600 --> 00:30:37,760
Speaker 3: shed light on the things we talk about it. You know,

560
00:30:38,000 --> 00:30:40,480
Speaker 3: we as comes up on the show. Often we learn

561
00:30:40,480 --> 00:30:42,720
Speaker 3: about things by reading about them, so we love when

562
00:30:42,720 --> 00:30:45,640
Speaker 3: people can add things from their personal experience.

563
00:30:45,920 --> 00:30:56,080
Speaker 2: Absolutely. All right, let's see what do we have here next? Hmm, glancing, glancing? Okay,

564
00:30:56,720 --> 00:31:00,280
Speaker 2: all right, here's one from Andy, Andy right send with

565
00:31:00,320 --> 00:31:02,479
Speaker 2: the subject line all the usual things fans say and

566
00:31:02,560 --> 00:31:05,320
Speaker 2: a topic suggestion, Okay, as long as they are the

567
00:31:05,360 --> 00:31:10,960
Speaker 2: usual things, and Andy says, Hey, Robin Joe, first of all,

568
00:31:11,000 --> 00:31:13,320
Speaker 2: love the show. I'll start by making y'all cringe. I

569
00:31:13,360 --> 00:31:16,080
Speaker 2: actually discovered the show at the start of twenty twenty

570
00:31:16,160 --> 00:31:18,320
Speaker 2: four and spent the next year and a half listening

571
00:31:18,400 --> 00:31:21,479
Speaker 2: to every episode available on Spotify and have kept up

572
00:31:21,480 --> 00:31:23,680
Speaker 2: with this show since. Yes, all the way back to

573
00:31:23,720 --> 00:31:26,400
Speaker 2: twenty ten and the Stuff from the Science Lab days.

574
00:31:26,840 --> 00:31:29,640
Speaker 2: The show makes for great listening while running my route

575
00:31:29,720 --> 00:31:32,800
Speaker 2: every day. I will explain this for anyone who's not familiar.

576
00:31:33,160 --> 00:31:37,240
Speaker 2: This show began as a podcast called Stuff from the

577
00:31:37,280 --> 00:31:40,960
Speaker 2: Science Lab that I hosted with at the time my

578
00:31:41,240 --> 00:31:47,040
Speaker 2: science editor at HowStuffWorks dot com, Alison Loudermilk, who I

579
00:31:47,080 --> 00:31:49,880
Speaker 2: do still keep up with but and as far as

580
00:31:49,880 --> 00:31:52,280
Speaker 2: I know, she's doing great. But yeah, that's how it

581
00:31:52,280 --> 00:31:54,640
Speaker 2: started out, and then it became Stuff to Blow your mind.

582
00:31:54,840 --> 00:31:58,280
Speaker 2: Fast forward to today here we are. Yeah, some folks

583
00:31:58,280 --> 00:31:59,640
Speaker 2: do like to go back and listen to those all

584
00:31:59,680 --> 00:32:05,160
Speaker 2: that I do not. That was a long time ago,

585
00:32:05,320 --> 00:32:08,360
Speaker 2: when boy, we were just really hitting the ground running

586
00:32:08,360 --> 00:32:11,280
Speaker 2: and figuring out how this whole audio podcast thing worked

587
00:32:11,280 --> 00:32:12,320
Speaker 2: and was supposed to work.

588
00:32:13,080 --> 00:32:16,120
Speaker 3: Yeah, well, just to mention my own self focused cringe.

589
00:32:16,320 --> 00:32:20,120
Speaker 3: So you know, I didn't join the show until twenty fifteen,

590
00:32:20,240 --> 00:32:25,200
Speaker 3: but I do sometimes shudder with fear imagining going back

591
00:32:25,200 --> 00:32:27,560
Speaker 3: and listening to the earliest episodes I did and when

592
00:32:27,600 --> 00:32:30,640
Speaker 3: I didn't know what I was doing yet. I don't know.

593
00:32:32,040 --> 00:32:33,880
Speaker 3: I don't want to find out what I sounded like

594
00:32:33,960 --> 00:32:39,120
Speaker 3: back then, But imagining hearing myself figuring out podcasting while

595
00:32:39,200 --> 00:32:42,160
Speaker 3: doing it is not something that sounds super appealing to me.

596
00:32:42,280 --> 00:32:46,080
Speaker 3: But you know, I'm glad some listeners have been enjoying

597
00:32:46,320 --> 00:32:49,160
Speaker 3: we were doing our best then as we are now.

598
00:32:50,560 --> 00:32:52,560
Speaker 3: I hope, at least speaking for myself, I hope I've

599
00:32:52,560 --> 00:32:55,400
Speaker 3: been able to improve over the years that I was

600
00:32:55,440 --> 00:32:55,840
Speaker 3: doing this.

601
00:32:56,760 --> 00:32:59,000
Speaker 2: All right, Well, Andy continues and says, I think the

602
00:32:59,080 --> 00:33:01,520
Speaker 2: thing that blows mind most about what you guys do

603
00:33:01,640 --> 00:33:04,040
Speaker 2: is the way you take the most seemingly mundane topics,

604
00:33:04,040 --> 00:33:07,360
Speaker 2: such as spoons, and make such interesting episodes with them,

605
00:33:07,600 --> 00:33:11,600
Speaker 2: begging the question is there really anything truly mundane in

606
00:33:11,640 --> 00:33:12,320
Speaker 2: this world?

607
00:33:13,080 --> 00:33:14,800
Speaker 3: Well, I'm glad you like that, Andy. I'd say it's

608
00:33:14,800 --> 00:33:18,240
Speaker 3: a core part of our mission. You know, almost everything

609
00:33:18,360 --> 00:33:21,600
Speaker 3: that we take for granted and look at without having

610
00:33:21,640 --> 00:33:24,920
Speaker 3: a second thought about is pretty weird and amazing if

611
00:33:24,960 --> 00:33:28,800
Speaker 3: you dig deep enough on iteah, just because reality is

612
00:33:29,880 --> 00:33:32,400
Speaker 3: weirder than we remember to notice.

613
00:33:32,680 --> 00:33:34,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think the most important thing is to stay

614
00:33:34,560 --> 00:33:39,000
Speaker 2: curious about the world and about yourself. You know, this

615
00:33:39,080 --> 00:33:42,880
Speaker 2: is nothing new, This is like growth mindset stuff. But yeah,

616
00:33:42,920 --> 00:33:46,840
Speaker 2: I really do believe that curiosity and openness to learn

617
00:33:46,880 --> 00:33:49,520
Speaker 2: and to change is a fire inside you. It's a

618
00:33:49,520 --> 00:33:52,080
Speaker 2: fire that has to be nurtured. And if that fire

619
00:33:52,120 --> 00:33:55,640
Speaker 2: ever goes out, then then you're dead. You're dead before

620
00:33:55,680 --> 00:33:59,040
Speaker 2: your body dies. So keep it strong and feed it

621
00:33:59,120 --> 00:34:01,640
Speaker 2: whatever you need to feed it whatever. Wherever your interests

622
00:34:01,640 --> 00:34:05,040
Speaker 2: take you, follow those you know, and keep yourself open

623
00:34:05,040 --> 00:34:09,000
Speaker 2: to it. Yeah, all right, Andy has more to say,

624
00:34:09,000 --> 00:34:11,640
Speaker 2: though I haven't written in until now because I pretty

625
00:34:11,719 --> 00:34:13,839
Speaker 2: much never have anything to contribute. But I recently saw

626
00:34:13,840 --> 00:34:17,080
Speaker 2: a video on TikTok about a creature I think y'all

627
00:34:17,200 --> 00:34:21,320
Speaker 2: would really enjoy talking about if you haven't already, fifteen

628
00:34:21,320 --> 00:34:23,400
Speaker 2: plus years of episodes make it hard to remember what

629
00:34:23,520 --> 00:34:27,719
Speaker 2: all has been covered. That would be the Sea Spider Class.

630
00:34:28,080 --> 00:34:32,640
Speaker 2: Let's see pisce no gan Ganada. I didn't have a

631
00:34:32,719 --> 00:34:34,520
Speaker 2: chance to look this one up beforehand, so I'm just

632
00:34:34,800 --> 00:34:39,480
Speaker 2: completely guessing at it. Pison no gandada not a true spider,

633
00:34:39,640 --> 00:34:42,680
Speaker 2: but an arthropod more closely related to crabs, with a

634
00:34:42,719 --> 00:34:45,520
Speaker 2: body so small that some of its organs actually reside

635
00:34:45,560 --> 00:34:48,240
Speaker 2: in its legs. When I saw this animal, I thought

636
00:34:48,360 --> 00:34:52,400
Speaker 2: it was so fascinatingly creepy, and in instantly thought of

637
00:34:52,440 --> 00:34:53,440
Speaker 2: you crab lovers.

638
00:34:53,880 --> 00:34:56,880
Speaker 3: I think we've talked about sea spiders at least in passing.

639
00:34:56,920 --> 00:34:58,839
Speaker 3: I don't think we've done a whole series on them,

640
00:34:58,880 --> 00:35:02,520
Speaker 3: but I remember doing some kind of research tangent on

641
00:35:02,680 --> 00:35:06,200
Speaker 3: like sea spiders in Antarctic waters. Maybe we're talking about

642
00:35:06,200 --> 00:35:10,560
Speaker 3: something in like very cold south seas. I'm not sure,

643
00:35:10,600 --> 00:35:13,719
Speaker 3: but we've done a little bit about them, I think,

644
00:35:13,760 --> 00:35:16,759
Speaker 3: But yeah, it could could totally be worth a deeper dive.

645
00:35:17,040 --> 00:35:20,839
Speaker 2: I love it when animals put organs or in very

646
00:35:20,840 --> 00:35:24,000
Speaker 2: important body parts internal body pots into their arms and

647
00:35:24,040 --> 00:35:26,960
Speaker 2: legs totally. We've talked about a little bit about that

648
00:35:27,000 --> 00:35:30,720
Speaker 2: with spiders. We've talked about things sort of like brains

649
00:35:30,760 --> 00:35:33,239
Speaker 2: inside the limbs of say octopi.

650
00:35:33,719 --> 00:35:36,520
Speaker 3: With the ganglia, like you don't need to do all

651
00:35:36,560 --> 00:35:38,399
Speaker 3: the thinking in your head, spread it out a bit.

652
00:35:38,520 --> 00:35:41,360
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, and I believe on a monster fact I

653
00:35:41,600 --> 00:35:44,680
Speaker 2: about I talked once about the Marvel mutant mystique the

654
00:35:44,719 --> 00:35:46,879
Speaker 2: shape shifter. When I know you know this one from

655
00:35:46,920 --> 00:35:49,400
Speaker 2: the movies show, but in the comic books there's what.

656
00:35:49,440 --> 00:35:51,200
Speaker 2: At one point, she's a shape shifter. She can move

657
00:35:51,200 --> 00:35:53,880
Speaker 2: her body around, and she survives a gunshot to the

658
00:35:53,920 --> 00:35:56,279
Speaker 2: head by moving her brain down into her I think

659
00:35:56,280 --> 00:35:59,600
Speaker 2: her arm or something so that nothing crucial is hit

660
00:35:59,640 --> 00:36:02,879
Speaker 2: when she that gunshot, and then she just like moves

661
00:36:02,920 --> 00:36:04,399
Speaker 2: everything back into the right place later.

662
00:36:04,760 --> 00:36:07,720
Speaker 3: Smart. It's good thinking. Yeah.

663
00:36:07,760 --> 00:36:10,880
Speaker 2: Anyway, Andy pops it all off by saying thanks for

664
00:36:11,000 --> 00:36:14,160
Speaker 2: all the edutainment you guys provide every week. I know

665
00:36:14,239 --> 00:36:16,840
Speaker 2: that also makes you guys cringe, but it seems so appropriate.

666
00:36:16,920 --> 00:36:19,399
Speaker 2: Keep up the great work, and here's too many more

667
00:36:19,480 --> 00:36:20,800
Speaker 2: years of blowing people's minds.

668
00:36:21,280 --> 00:36:26,440
Speaker 3: Are you not edutained? Thank you, Andy. We appreciate you

669
00:36:26,480 --> 00:36:29,160
Speaker 3: writing in, We appreciate the kind words, and we appreciate

670
00:36:29,200 --> 00:36:40,759
Speaker 3: you listening. Let's see, Okay, I'm gonna do some ooh

671
00:36:40,800 --> 00:36:42,680
Speaker 3: a response to Palp facts. How about that?

672
00:36:42,920 --> 00:36:45,280
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, yeah, this was our where we were.

673
00:36:45,480 --> 00:36:48,880
Speaker 3: Doing some kind of fact checking or digging on statements

674
00:36:48,920 --> 00:36:53,399
Speaker 3: made by Emperor Palpatine in the Star Wars universe, and

675
00:36:53,800 --> 00:36:56,200
Speaker 3: one of the big segments we did there, I did

676
00:36:56,200 --> 00:37:00,400
Speaker 3: a deep dive on to what extent Emperor Palpatine is correct.

677
00:37:00,400 --> 00:37:04,239
Speaker 3: I guess this is before he's the Emperors. What is

678
00:37:04,280 --> 00:37:08,920
Speaker 3: Senator Palpatine correct when he says anger makes you stronger,

679
00:37:09,000 --> 00:37:11,680
Speaker 3: it gives you focus, makes you stronger. Is that true?

680
00:37:12,080 --> 00:37:14,440
Speaker 3: It is kind of half true. It does and it doesn't,

681
00:37:14,480 --> 00:37:18,200
Speaker 3: depending on what you need to do. So subject line

682
00:37:18,200 --> 00:37:22,000
Speaker 3: this is from Ian subject line anger and goal attainment.

683
00:37:22,440 --> 00:37:25,520
Speaker 3: Dear Robin Joe. As always, I'm way behind on episode,

684
00:37:25,560 --> 00:37:27,880
Speaker 3: so apologies if someone has already written in about this,

685
00:37:27,960 --> 00:37:32,240
Speaker 3: but I'm listening to the Palpfacts episode where you discussed

686
00:37:32,320 --> 00:37:38,120
Speaker 3: anger as either increasing goal attainment through persistence or decreasing

687
00:37:38,160 --> 00:37:42,640
Speaker 3: it through clouding judgment, and the apparent contradiction there. Having

688
00:37:42,680 --> 00:37:45,240
Speaker 3: thought about it, I think these are actually two sides

689
00:37:45,280 --> 00:37:47,640
Speaker 3: of the same coin and can be a matter of

690
00:37:47,680 --> 00:37:52,839
Speaker 3: framing existing simultaneously in the same scenario. For instance, take

691
00:37:52,880 --> 00:37:55,960
Speaker 3: the situation where one is stuck on a difficult section

692
00:37:56,200 --> 00:37:59,239
Speaker 3: of a video game, beating their head against the wall

693
00:37:59,320 --> 00:38:04,399
Speaker 3: in frustrating It's certainly true that the anger can make

694
00:38:04,440 --> 00:38:07,879
Speaker 3: the player more persistent, which can help accomplish the goal

695
00:38:07,960 --> 00:38:11,919
Speaker 3: of beating that section of the game. Reframed in light

696
00:38:12,000 --> 00:38:15,520
Speaker 3: of the player's original goal when they started playing, however,

697
00:38:15,600 --> 00:38:19,120
Speaker 3: which is presumably to have fun playing the game, the

698
00:38:19,160 --> 00:38:22,960
Speaker 3: anger is counterproductive. It is clouding their judgment about whether

699
00:38:23,080 --> 00:38:26,600
Speaker 3: to keep playing, and the angrier they get, the farther

700
00:38:26,800 --> 00:38:30,880
Speaker 3: they are from accomplishing that goal. As someone who has

701
00:38:30,920 --> 00:38:34,880
Speaker 3: been playing video games since the eighties, recognizing that inflection

702
00:38:35,000 --> 00:38:38,680
Speaker 3: point is something I still struggle with Intellectually. I know

703
00:38:38,800 --> 00:38:41,080
Speaker 3: I'm doing this to have fun, and if I'm not

704
00:38:41,239 --> 00:38:44,719
Speaker 3: having fun, I should stop, but the frustration is powerful,

705
00:38:44,719 --> 00:38:47,839
Speaker 3: and actually stopping in that state is far easier said

706
00:38:47,880 --> 00:38:51,200
Speaker 3: than done. I try to monitor my enjoyment level and

707
00:38:51,360 --> 00:38:54,440
Speaker 3: drop games that I'm no longer enjoying, and while I've

708
00:38:54,440 --> 00:38:57,080
Speaker 3: gotten better at it over time, even now, I still

709
00:38:57,200 --> 00:39:01,000
Speaker 3: spite finish one from time to time. Access always for

710
00:39:01,040 --> 00:39:05,640
Speaker 3: the great show. Ian. Yeah, great thoughts, Ian, I think

711
00:39:05,640 --> 00:39:09,040
Speaker 3: you're exactly right. You know that can the scenario you're

712
00:39:09,080 --> 00:39:12,040
Speaker 3: describing can show both sides of that coin. I think

713
00:39:12,360 --> 00:39:15,160
Speaker 3: where anger kind of does and doesn't help us. It's

714
00:39:15,200 --> 00:39:18,600
Speaker 3: both productive and counterproductive and getting what we want. I

715
00:39:18,640 --> 00:39:22,879
Speaker 3: would complicate things though in saying that. I think there

716
00:39:22,920 --> 00:39:28,319
Speaker 3: are different ways that people get fulfillment from let's just

717
00:39:28,360 --> 00:39:31,080
Speaker 3: say tasks. I mean video games can be an example

718
00:39:31,080 --> 00:39:33,480
Speaker 3: of a kind of task, but you know, a project

719
00:39:34,040 --> 00:39:39,239
Speaker 3: or an accomplishment related activity. There are different ways that

720
00:39:39,400 --> 00:39:43,319
Speaker 3: can give people a positive feeling in return. I think

721
00:39:43,400 --> 00:39:46,120
Speaker 3: I'm probably more like you, where what I'm looking for

722
00:39:46,200 --> 00:39:47,840
Speaker 3: when I play a video game. I don't have a

723
00:39:47,840 --> 00:39:50,319
Speaker 3: lot of time for video games these days, but when

724
00:39:50,360 --> 00:39:52,920
Speaker 3: I do, I'm just trying to relax, Like I'm like,

725
00:39:53,000 --> 00:39:55,800
Speaker 3: I just want to get out, you know, wind down

726
00:39:55,880 --> 00:39:58,479
Speaker 3: and relax, And so playing like a really hard game

727
00:39:58,520 --> 00:40:01,040
Speaker 3: that requires a lot of skill is not what I'm

728
00:40:01,040 --> 00:40:03,719
Speaker 3: looking for at this point in my life. There are

729
00:40:03,800 --> 00:40:07,440
Speaker 3: other ways that people react relate to games, which I

730
00:40:07,440 --> 00:40:11,080
Speaker 3: think has more to do with kind of the sense

731
00:40:11,080 --> 00:40:16,520
Speaker 3: of accomplishment one gets from goal attainment and mastery, where

732
00:40:16,960 --> 00:40:19,160
Speaker 3: you know that's it. It's just a different kind of

733
00:40:19,239 --> 00:40:22,319
Speaker 3: positive feeling. And they might call that fun too, but

734
00:40:22,440 --> 00:40:26,239
Speaker 3: it's a type of fun that probably includes longer stretches

735
00:40:26,440 --> 00:40:32,480
Speaker 3: of frustration and thwarting along the way, and the sense

736
00:40:32,520 --> 00:40:34,839
Speaker 3: of fun you get from it is less what Ian

737
00:40:34,960 --> 00:40:38,000
Speaker 3: and I are looking for that kind of relaxation. It's

738
00:40:38,040 --> 00:40:41,600
Speaker 3: more like the feeling of accomplishment. And I don't know

739
00:40:41,640 --> 00:40:44,520
Speaker 3: if this's you know, dopamine or something like a goal

740
00:40:44,840 --> 00:40:47,560
Speaker 3: drive reward kind of scenario that you get when you

741
00:40:47,640 --> 00:40:49,320
Speaker 3: overcome something that's difficult.

742
00:40:50,120 --> 00:40:51,920
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, this is These are great points. And I

743
00:40:51,920 --> 00:40:55,480
Speaker 2: would also add that many but not all games, but

744
00:40:55,520 --> 00:40:57,720
Speaker 2: there are certainly a number of games out there today

745
00:40:57,960 --> 00:41:01,240
Speaker 2: where you also have to factor in various manipulation levels

746
00:41:01,239 --> 00:41:04,040
Speaker 2: on the part of the design. You know, things that

747
00:41:04,080 --> 00:41:06,880
Speaker 2: are in place to keep you playing, and sometimes that

748
00:41:06,920 --> 00:41:09,680
Speaker 2: can be you have me have the motivation where I

749
00:41:09,719 --> 00:41:11,919
Speaker 2: play this game because it's fine. I you know, maybe

750
00:41:11,960 --> 00:41:13,960
Speaker 2: I like a little puzzle, I like a little interaction.

751
00:41:14,480 --> 00:41:16,719
Speaker 2: But then you know, the people who make the game,

752
00:41:16,719 --> 00:41:18,120
Speaker 2: they're going to add a little extra to it, and

753
00:41:18,120 --> 00:41:20,600
Speaker 2: they're gonna ask, but wait, don't you want to like

754
00:41:20,800 --> 00:41:23,719
Speaker 2: hit your daily mark and win this reward. And then

755
00:41:23,760 --> 00:41:26,279
Speaker 2: it becomes this situation I find myself feeling this where

756
00:41:26,320 --> 00:41:29,120
Speaker 2: it's like I begin to feel like the five hundred

757
00:41:29,160 --> 00:41:32,799
Speaker 2: gold that I will get from hitting some milestone is

758
00:41:32,920 --> 00:41:37,000
Speaker 2: like money they took from me or owe me. Therefore,

759
00:41:37,280 --> 00:41:40,160
Speaker 2: I'm like, I have this vendetta to earn it, even

760
00:41:40,200 --> 00:41:44,080
Speaker 2: though it's it's it's completely useless, and I risk reaching

761
00:41:44,120 --> 00:41:47,040
Speaker 2: that point where the game becomes frustrating instead of fine,

762
00:41:47,040 --> 00:41:50,319
Speaker 2: it becomes you know, a true time suck, instead of

763
00:41:51,000 --> 00:41:53,640
Speaker 2: something that kind of like you know, greases the gears

764
00:41:53,680 --> 00:41:54,200
Speaker 2: of my day.

765
00:41:54,680 --> 00:41:57,239
Speaker 3: That actually reminds me of something that I don't really

766
00:41:57,280 --> 00:41:59,879
Speaker 3: have much direct experience with, but I've read a little

767
00:42:00,040 --> 00:42:02,960
Speaker 3: it about in the you know and how the games

768
00:42:03,080 --> 00:42:06,439
Speaker 3: industry games businesses these days, that there are i think

769
00:42:06,520 --> 00:42:12,080
Speaker 3: increasingly games where they add in like real world financial

770
00:42:12,120 --> 00:42:16,320
Speaker 3: transactions into the game, you call like micro transactions or something,

771
00:42:16,640 --> 00:42:20,200
Speaker 3: and that that in some cases, it has been alleged

772
00:42:20,360 --> 00:42:25,160
Speaker 3: that this leads to game developers being pressured to intentionally

773
00:42:25,239 --> 00:42:28,400
Speaker 3: make their games more frustrating or annoying so that you

774
00:42:28,480 --> 00:42:32,600
Speaker 3: can add in ways that real world financial transactions can

775
00:42:32,640 --> 00:42:35,120
Speaker 3: be used to bypass the parts of the game that

776
00:42:35,160 --> 00:42:39,759
Speaker 3: are intentionally unfun. So it's like here's your game, you know,

777
00:42:39,920 --> 00:42:43,319
Speaker 3: pay five bucks to turn off this feature that makes

778
00:42:43,360 --> 00:42:45,480
Speaker 3: the game really annoying, and bothers.

779
00:42:45,080 --> 00:42:48,839
Speaker 2: You Yeah, yeah, I mean it's it's real and it's there,

780
00:42:48,920 --> 00:42:50,759
Speaker 2: just like there's a creeping effect. I think in a

781
00:42:50,800 --> 00:42:52,319
Speaker 2: lot of these games, Like some of these games are

782
00:42:52,320 --> 00:42:56,239
Speaker 2: just all in on the you know, on the you know,

783
00:42:56,600 --> 00:42:59,880
Speaker 2: charging the player and you know, putting price tags on everything,

784
00:43:00,000 --> 00:43:02,080
Speaker 2: real world price tag than everything. And in other cases

785
00:43:02,120 --> 00:43:04,840
Speaker 2: it's like just no matter how fun and innocent the

786
00:43:04,880 --> 00:43:07,360
Speaker 2: game may be, you're going to have that. You know,

787
00:43:07,400 --> 00:43:09,600
Speaker 2: the corporate world is going to infringe on it. I mean,

788
00:43:09,600 --> 00:43:11,239
Speaker 2: it is going to be a business at the end

789
00:43:11,280 --> 00:43:13,200
Speaker 2: of the day, and that's going to change things.

790
00:43:13,520 --> 00:43:16,720
Speaker 3: Yeah, totally. And this by no means applies only to games.

791
00:43:16,760 --> 00:43:19,520
Speaker 3: I mean there is generally, I would say within the

792
00:43:21,040 --> 00:43:25,239
Speaker 3: digital businesses and digital media space, there is more of

793
00:43:25,280 --> 00:43:30,400
Speaker 3: a desire to shift away from discrete transactions where you

794
00:43:30,480 --> 00:43:32,799
Speaker 3: sell somebody a piece of content and now they have

795
00:43:32,920 --> 00:43:36,880
Speaker 3: it and that was one isolated transaction, more into trying

796
00:43:36,880 --> 00:43:40,319
Speaker 3: to cultivate ongoing financial relationships where you know, it's a

797
00:43:40,360 --> 00:43:44,280
Speaker 3: subscription model now and the consumer will be continually paying.

798
00:43:44,360 --> 00:43:47,920
Speaker 3: It creates ongoing revenue for the company instead of just

799
00:43:47,960 --> 00:43:51,600
Speaker 3: a one time sale. So everybody in the digital media

800
00:43:51,640 --> 00:43:54,680
Speaker 3: space is businesses are trying to find ways to turn

801
00:43:55,040 --> 00:43:57,640
Speaker 3: what was once a one time sale into an ongoing

802
00:43:57,680 --> 00:44:00,279
Speaker 3: financial relationship where they charge you over and over.

803
00:44:00,800 --> 00:44:04,600
Speaker 2: Yeah, and it's like both both versions stuck because either

804
00:44:05,800 --> 00:44:08,000
Speaker 2: just thinking back to games that I've liked, that I've

805
00:44:08,040 --> 00:44:10,479
Speaker 2: enjoyed or do enjoy playing on my phone, like there's

806
00:44:10,480 --> 00:44:13,520
Speaker 2: one really good one and clearly they didn't monetize it

807
00:44:13,640 --> 00:44:16,480
Speaker 2: enough it's no longer available, like, or they get changed

808
00:44:16,480 --> 00:44:18,719
Speaker 2: into some mode that was much more of a pain

809
00:44:18,800 --> 00:44:21,200
Speaker 2: to play and it's just gone. It's and it's not

810
00:44:21,239 --> 00:44:24,239
Speaker 2: coming back. And then you know, there's another one where

811
00:44:24,239 --> 00:44:26,560
Speaker 2: it's like, Okay, there are a number of annoying factors here,

812
00:44:26,600 --> 00:44:29,560
Speaker 2: but they seem to be making money and it's still going.

813
00:44:29,640 --> 00:44:32,200
Speaker 2: I can still play it and it's not too painful

814
00:44:32,239 --> 00:44:35,200
Speaker 2: to do so, so it's like, you know, I guess

815
00:44:35,239 --> 00:44:38,280
Speaker 2: you have to choose between these these extremes like evolution

816
00:44:38,440 --> 00:44:41,759
Speaker 2: or extinction, but sometimes they're really fun right before they

817
00:44:41,800 --> 00:44:43,200
Speaker 2: go go extinct. So I don't know.

818
00:44:43,680 --> 00:44:45,279
Speaker 3: All right, do you want to do some weird house

819
00:44:45,280 --> 00:44:46,080
Speaker 3: cinema messages?

820
00:44:46,760 --> 00:44:49,279
Speaker 2: Yeah, let's actually let's go ahead and call on sun

821
00:44:49,360 --> 00:44:51,360
Speaker 2: raw because this is one that I know you wanted

822
00:44:51,400 --> 00:44:54,240
Speaker 2: to read. I want to I want to hear it.

823
00:44:54,280 --> 00:44:56,520
Speaker 2: And we had intended to use it last time, and

824
00:44:56,560 --> 00:44:58,640
Speaker 2: we just had to double check something for this time.

825
00:44:58,920 --> 00:45:01,279
Speaker 3: Oh okay, so you want me read this one from Jan?

826
00:45:01,719 --> 00:45:01,919
Speaker 2: Yeah?

827
00:45:02,000 --> 00:45:05,759
Speaker 3: Yeah, okay, okay. So at the end of our episode

828
00:45:05,880 --> 00:45:08,759
Speaker 3: on the Sun Raw movie, Space is the Place, Rob

829
00:45:08,880 --> 00:45:11,520
Speaker 3: asked listeners to write in if they had ever seen

830
00:45:11,800 --> 00:45:15,240
Speaker 3: Sun Raw and the Solar Orchestra in concert. I added

831
00:45:15,280 --> 00:45:17,239
Speaker 3: that listeners should also write in if they had ever

832
00:45:17,280 --> 00:45:20,560
Speaker 3: been a member of the orchestra. We didn't quite get that,

833
00:45:20,920 --> 00:45:25,160
Speaker 3: but Jan wrote in to share a blog post that

834
00:45:25,200 --> 00:45:27,719
Speaker 3: they wrote called the Week I worked for Sun Raw.

835
00:45:27,920 --> 00:45:31,200
Speaker 3: So this is pretty awesome. This is I'm just and

836
00:45:31,200 --> 00:45:33,440
Speaker 3: I asked Jan for permission to read this blog post

837
00:45:33,440 --> 00:45:36,040
Speaker 3: on the show. Jan said yes, So this is the

838
00:45:36,080 --> 00:45:44,600
Speaker 3: blog post. It was some time between nineteen eighty and

839
00:45:44,719 --> 00:45:48,040
Speaker 3: nineteen eighty three, and I was between my two stints

840
00:45:48,080 --> 00:45:51,520
Speaker 3: at Massachusetts College of Art. I was thrilled to discover

841
00:45:51,600 --> 00:45:54,840
Speaker 3: that Sun Raw had a five day performance planned for

842
00:45:55,000 --> 00:45:58,680
Speaker 3: the Longwood Theater, the very stage where I had spent

843
00:45:58,800 --> 00:46:02,320
Speaker 3: many hours doing every job, from lighting to acting to producing.

844
00:46:03,080 --> 00:46:05,840
Speaker 3: Arriving very early the first day of the performance, I

845
00:46:05,880 --> 00:46:09,720
Speaker 3: found Sunraw and his orchestra alone in the theater without

846
00:46:09,719 --> 00:46:13,440
Speaker 3: a single representative of the college to be found. John

847
00:46:13,480 --> 00:46:16,799
Speaker 3: Gilmore and Marshall Allen were desperately searching for things like

848
00:46:16,960 --> 00:46:20,560
Speaker 3: light switches. Luckily for all involved, I knew the space.

849
00:46:20,840 --> 00:46:25,200
Speaker 3: Like whatever cliche inserted here, I made a few quick

850
00:46:25,200 --> 00:46:27,720
Speaker 3: phone calls to my pals and easily had a staff

851
00:46:27,800 --> 00:46:30,759
Speaker 3: willing to work for the comp for comp tickets. My

852
00:46:30,840 --> 00:46:34,120
Speaker 3: friends sold and took tickets and did lights gladly, and

853
00:46:34,239 --> 00:46:37,200
Speaker 3: I played supervisor. Not only did I get a front

854
00:46:37,280 --> 00:46:39,279
Speaker 3: row seed for three of the shows, I had to

855
00:46:39,400 --> 00:46:41,920
Speaker 3: work during two of the shows, but I was rewarded

856
00:46:41,960 --> 00:46:45,719
Speaker 3: with a private audience with Sunraw backstage. He gave me

857
00:46:45,800 --> 00:46:49,480
Speaker 3: his personal thanks and signed my freshly purchased Saturn Records

858
00:46:49,520 --> 00:46:54,000
Speaker 3: copy of I Pharaoh, first informing me that it was

859
00:46:54,040 --> 00:46:57,239
Speaker 3: their last copy of the album and then regaling me

860
00:46:57,400 --> 00:46:59,960
Speaker 3: with an epic vision of what I was to experience.

861
00:47:00,040 --> 00:47:02,799
Speaker 3: It's upon listening to the vinyl quote, you will be

862
00:47:02,880 --> 00:47:06,320
Speaker 3: transported to ancient times and see other worlds.

863
00:47:06,480 --> 00:47:07,000
Speaker 2: Oh wow.

864
00:47:07,200 --> 00:47:09,279
Speaker 3: To this day, I have no idea who could have

865
00:47:09,280 --> 00:47:13,000
Speaker 3: scheduled this astounding event and not showed up. But I

866
00:47:13,040 --> 00:47:17,719
Speaker 3: am quite grateful to them, and that's the end. So Jan,

867
00:47:17,880 --> 00:47:20,200
Speaker 3: thank you so much for sharing this. That is awesome.

868
00:47:20,280 --> 00:47:24,880
Speaker 3: I am really glad you were there to guide Sonraw

869
00:47:24,880 --> 00:47:29,479
Speaker 3: and the orchestra through the space of the theater. And yeah,

870
00:47:29,719 --> 00:47:32,319
Speaker 3: what a what a crazy scenario. Who could have just

871
00:47:32,480 --> 00:47:36,000
Speaker 3: like somebody just ghosted Sunraw just never showed up.

872
00:47:36,360 --> 00:47:39,160
Speaker 2: Yeah, weird, weird, but yeah, this I love it. This

873
00:47:39,239 --> 00:47:41,600
Speaker 2: is you know, it goes to show you Sometimes we

874
00:47:41,920 --> 00:47:43,560
Speaker 2: put the call out there, and you know, we don't

875
00:47:43,600 --> 00:47:46,280
Speaker 2: expect there to be someone out there with an experience

876
00:47:46,360 --> 00:47:48,360
Speaker 2: that lines up with what we just talked about, but

877
00:47:48,440 --> 00:47:59,279
Speaker 2: then in many cases there is. So I love it all.

878
00:47:59,400 --> 00:47:59,560
Speaker 3: Right.

879
00:47:59,640 --> 00:48:02,879
Speaker 2: This next one comes to us from Lee and this

880
00:48:02,920 --> 00:48:07,040
Speaker 2: is Oh, this is a Godzilla related message. I don't

881
00:48:07,040 --> 00:48:08,920
Speaker 2: know that it's really responding. It's not really responding to

882
00:48:08,960 --> 00:48:11,440
Speaker 2: a particular Godzilla movie that we cover in Weird House Cinema,

883
00:48:11,480 --> 00:48:14,799
Speaker 2: but we have covered more than one Godzilla film, and

884
00:48:14,840 --> 00:48:17,040
Speaker 2: we will come back to more Godzilla in the future.

885
00:48:17,200 --> 00:48:19,560
Speaker 3: I think the most recent one we did was Godzilla

886
00:48:19,640 --> 00:48:22,880
Speaker 3: versus Mecha Godzilla, right, that's right. Yeah. Oh, and I

887
00:48:22,920 --> 00:48:26,560
Speaker 3: should just add that since the last Godzilla Weird House

888
00:48:26,640 --> 00:48:32,120
Speaker 3: episode we did, I finally saw Godzilla minus one and beautiful, amazing.

889
00:48:32,239 --> 00:48:34,200
Speaker 3: I loved it. I cried it was so good.

890
00:48:34,400 --> 00:48:36,319
Speaker 2: Oh wow, it's still on my watch list. I haven't

891
00:48:36,360 --> 00:48:37,520
Speaker 2: seen it yet, Rob.

892
00:48:37,560 --> 00:48:39,840
Speaker 3: I think you'll love it. It's it's excellent.

893
00:48:40,160 --> 00:48:42,759
Speaker 2: Okay, all right, well this is what Lee has to say.

894
00:48:42,800 --> 00:48:45,440
Speaker 2: Lie says Hi, Joe and Rob thought you to appreciate this.

895
00:48:45,600 --> 00:48:49,080
Speaker 2: I had trouble enjoying Godzilla after learning that the texture

896
00:48:49,120 --> 00:48:52,640
Speaker 2: of his skin is patterned after the keloid scars of

897
00:48:52,640 --> 00:48:55,920
Speaker 2: atomic bomb survivors. It seemed like such an ever present,

898
00:48:56,000 --> 00:48:59,680
Speaker 2: dark symbol literally covering the creature. However, I realized that

899
00:48:59,719 --> 00:49:02,320
Speaker 2: if got Godzilla can get past his own traumatic origins

900
00:49:02,360 --> 00:49:05,680
Speaker 2: to become a character who also experiences lighter themes and

901
00:49:05,719 --> 00:49:08,200
Speaker 2: even comedy than Who am I to let the visible

902
00:49:08,239 --> 00:49:12,399
Speaker 2: marks of his trauma limit his emotional range? In my mind, now,

903
00:49:12,440 --> 00:49:14,800
Speaker 2: I love Godzilla as a figure who bears the scars

904
00:49:14,840 --> 00:49:18,719
Speaker 2: of pot past trauma, but is not ultimately defined by

905
00:49:18,760 --> 00:49:21,600
Speaker 2: his traumatic origins. I hope this gives you the same

906
00:49:21,640 --> 00:49:25,320
Speaker 2: warmth of godzilla resilience that it gives me. Best, Lee,

907
00:49:25,800 --> 00:49:29,840
Speaker 2: that's beautiful, Thank you, Lee, Yeah, yeah, I love it. Okay.

908
00:49:29,880 --> 00:49:32,680
Speaker 3: One last weird house message. This is from Daniel's subject

909
00:49:32,719 --> 00:49:37,280
Speaker 3: to line weird House cinema recommendation Angel's Egg. Good evening.

910
00:49:37,480 --> 00:49:40,640
Speaker 3: I'm sat on a plane currently enjoying the episode on

911
00:49:40,800 --> 00:49:45,040
Speaker 3: the White Reindeer, and someone said it's a very dialogue

912
00:49:45,120 --> 00:49:48,480
Speaker 3: light film. Points that's true. Yeah, long stretches of silence,

913
00:49:49,320 --> 00:49:51,840
Speaker 3: Daniel says. I checked the run time prior to the episode,

914
00:49:51,880 --> 00:49:55,160
Speaker 3: and basically, for and basically for no other reason than

915
00:49:55,160 --> 00:49:58,600
Speaker 3: the lack of color and dialogue and the short run time,

916
00:49:59,040 --> 00:50:02,520
Speaker 3: my mind went to Angels Egg. I'm sure you all

917
00:50:02,560 --> 00:50:04,600
Speaker 3: have seen or at least heard of it before, but

918
00:50:04,680 --> 00:50:08,239
Speaker 3: I think it's fantastically weird and the artistry is exceptional.

919
00:50:08,680 --> 00:50:10,719
Speaker 3: If you haven't seen or heard of it, it's a

920
00:50:10,760 --> 00:50:15,239
Speaker 3: two character, beautifully animated film with heavy Christian theological elements.

921
00:50:15,520 --> 00:50:17,920
Speaker 3: I'd love to hear you all discuss it. Thanks for

922
00:50:17,960 --> 00:50:21,080
Speaker 3: the entertainment and education. Oh but you didn't slam the

923
00:50:21,080 --> 00:50:26,279
Speaker 3: words together, entertainment and education, Daniel, Thank you, Daniel. I

924
00:50:26,320 --> 00:50:29,440
Speaker 3: haven't seen it. I think it's come up when I've

925
00:50:29,480 --> 00:50:32,240
Speaker 3: been looking around for options to do on the show before,

926
00:50:32,239 --> 00:50:35,360
Speaker 3: but I've never gone deep reading about it, so I'm

927
00:50:35,440 --> 00:50:37,960
Speaker 3: only vaguely aware of it. By title and poster. That's

928
00:50:37,960 --> 00:50:38,399
Speaker 3: about it.

929
00:50:39,160 --> 00:50:42,799
Speaker 2: Yeah. Same. I've never seen it and honestly not particularly

930
00:50:42,960 --> 00:50:47,520
Speaker 2: familiar with it. So you never underestimate my ability to

931
00:50:48,040 --> 00:50:50,360
Speaker 2: not know about a given film. I know about a

932
00:50:50,400 --> 00:50:52,200
Speaker 2: lot of them, but there there's just too many of them.

933
00:50:52,200 --> 00:50:53,960
Speaker 2: There's not enough time to see them all. There's not

934
00:50:54,080 --> 00:50:57,279
Speaker 2: enough time to know of them all. But this I

935
00:50:57,280 --> 00:50:59,880
Speaker 2: did notice that this is from a writer and director

936
00:51:00,520 --> 00:51:04,600
Speaker 2: Mo rue Oshe who is the director most known to

937
00:51:04,640 --> 00:51:06,840
Speaker 2: me anyway as the director and writer of Ghost in

938
00:51:06,880 --> 00:51:09,439
Speaker 2: the Shell and its sequel, Ghost in the Shell Too,

939
00:51:10,120 --> 00:51:12,680
Speaker 2: among many other things. And I love both of those

940
00:51:12,719 --> 00:51:17,400
Speaker 2: movies and have considered looking at Ghost in the Shell

941
00:51:17,600 --> 00:51:20,040
Speaker 2: one or two on the show before. So I should

942
00:51:20,040 --> 00:51:22,879
Speaker 2: really check this out because again, enjoyed both of those films,

943
00:51:22,960 --> 00:51:25,120
Speaker 2: would love to check out more of his work.

944
00:51:26,120 --> 00:51:28,520
Speaker 3: Okay, do we need to wrap it up there for today.

945
00:51:28,840 --> 00:51:30,600
Speaker 3: We've got some more messages, but we might have to

946
00:51:30,600 --> 00:51:31,840
Speaker 3: save them for the next batch.

947
00:51:32,080 --> 00:51:34,440
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, I think we went on a bit too

948
00:51:34,520 --> 00:51:35,920
Speaker 2: long to get to some of these other ones, but

949
00:51:35,960 --> 00:51:39,160
Speaker 2: we'll save them. We'll come back to it maybe in

950
00:51:39,200 --> 00:51:42,240
Speaker 2: the next month, if not the month after. Basically whenever

951
00:51:42,320 --> 00:51:45,080
Speaker 2: we reach that point where like it is time, the

952
00:51:45,200 --> 00:51:48,359
Speaker 2: less listener mail is time, that's when we'll hit it.

953
00:51:48,880 --> 00:51:51,279
Speaker 2: In the meantime, we just say, yeah, keep it coming in,

954
00:51:51,480 --> 00:51:54,680
Speaker 2: keep writing in. We don't have time to read all

955
00:51:54,760 --> 00:51:57,400
Speaker 2: of these on listener mail, We don't have time to

956
00:51:57,440 --> 00:51:59,840
Speaker 2: respond personally to all of the mail that comes in.

957
00:52:00,080 --> 00:52:02,480
Speaker 2: We do read it all, and we do greatly appreciate it.

958
00:52:02,800 --> 00:52:05,319
Speaker 2: And just as we appreciate you spending any amount of

959
00:52:05,320 --> 00:52:09,480
Speaker 2: your time listening to our show and or watching our

960
00:52:09,520 --> 00:52:12,960
Speaker 2: show as it's available on Netflix. You know, we realize

961
00:52:13,000 --> 00:52:15,480
Speaker 2: there are a lot of options out there, and we're

962
00:52:15,520 --> 00:52:19,040
Speaker 2: humbled that you take time out of your day for us.

963
00:52:19,760 --> 00:52:21,600
Speaker 2: We'll just ask that, hey, as long as you are

964
00:52:21,680 --> 00:52:26,040
Speaker 2: listening and or watching to us wherever that happens to be, rate, review, subscribe.

965
00:52:26,719 --> 00:52:29,160
Speaker 2: If you're on Netflix, give us a couple of thumbs up,

966
00:52:29,400 --> 00:52:32,920
Speaker 2: and also as to be reminded about new episodes. All

967
00:52:33,000 --> 00:52:35,200
Speaker 2: these things help us out in the long run. If

968
00:52:35,239 --> 00:52:37,840
Speaker 2: you're on social media, look us up. We're stuff to

969
00:52:37,840 --> 00:52:40,879
Speaker 2: blow your mind on those. If you're on letterbox dot

970
00:52:40,920 --> 00:52:43,399
Speaker 2: com the film website that is, you know a great

971
00:52:43,400 --> 00:52:45,400
Speaker 2: way to track movies you've seen, movies you want to

972
00:52:45,440 --> 00:52:47,799
Speaker 2: see and so forth. We are a weird house on there,

973
00:52:47,800 --> 00:52:49,360
Speaker 2: and we have a nice list going of all the

974
00:52:49,360 --> 00:52:52,160
Speaker 2: films that we've covered over the years and sometimes look

975
00:52:52,200 --> 00:52:53,440
Speaker 2: ahead at what comes up next.

976
00:52:54,000 --> 00:52:57,560
Speaker 3: Huge thanks as always to our excellent audio producer JJ Posway.

977
00:52:57,840 --> 00:52:59,279
Speaker 3: If you would like to get in touch with us

978
00:52:59,320 --> 00:53:01,840
Speaker 3: with feedback on this episode or any other, to suggest

979
00:53:01,840 --> 00:53:04,719
Speaker 3: a topic for the future, or to send whatever kind

980
00:53:04,719 --> 00:53:07,040
Speaker 3: of message that may be featured on a future listener

981
00:53:07,080 --> 00:53:09,480
Speaker 3: mail episode like this one, you can write us at

982
00:53:09,560 --> 00:53:19,680
Speaker 3: contact at stuff to Blow your Mind dot com.

983
00:53:19,760 --> 00:53:22,719
Speaker 1: Stuff to Blow Your Mind is production of iHeartRadio. For

984
00:53:22,800 --> 00:53:25,600
Speaker 1: more podcasts from my Heart Radio, visit the iHeartRadio app,

985
00:53:25,760 --> 00:53:28,520
Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.