1 00:00:02,880 --> 00:00:08,080 Speaker 1: Chip, Hello, Hi, I'm back in town baby, Welcome home. 2 00:00:08,920 --> 00:00:11,000 Speaker 1: I had a really early flight today. I always think 3 00:00:11,000 --> 00:00:12,840 Speaker 1: it's really funny. It's like always the days I have 4 00:00:12,920 --> 00:00:15,560 Speaker 1: to record on the like the podcast, I don't sleep 5 00:00:15,600 --> 00:00:17,639 Speaker 1: well or something, and so then it's like half of brains. 6 00:00:17,720 --> 00:00:19,919 Speaker 1: The poor listeners, I mean, they get this version of 7 00:00:19,920 --> 00:00:23,160 Speaker 1: me that's like, sorry, guys. 8 00:00:22,720 --> 00:00:24,560 Speaker 2: I mean it could have been worse. You could have 9 00:00:24,640 --> 00:00:26,040 Speaker 2: landed and had to do this right away. 10 00:00:26,520 --> 00:00:28,240 Speaker 1: I actually think that might have been better. I was 11 00:00:28,280 --> 00:00:30,360 Speaker 1: a little more awake earlier. At this end of the day. 12 00:00:30,400 --> 00:00:32,240 Speaker 1: It's like I'm hitting that maybe I need a nap 13 00:00:32,360 --> 00:00:34,560 Speaker 1: or something. I don't know. We're going to power through though. 14 00:00:34,880 --> 00:00:35,360 Speaker 3: We got it. 15 00:00:35,400 --> 00:00:37,720 Speaker 1: We got it because you know what, it ties into 16 00:00:37,720 --> 00:00:40,800 Speaker 1: the topic a little bit, you guys. We have been yeah, 17 00:00:40,800 --> 00:00:45,440 Speaker 1: we've been noticing that our culture has a little bit 18 00:00:45,479 --> 00:00:49,080 Speaker 1: of an issue with admitting defeat and admitting that they 19 00:00:49,360 --> 00:00:52,520 Speaker 1: failed at some point in their life. And we were 20 00:00:52,560 --> 00:00:54,160 Speaker 1: talking about that Chip on our day of day. I 21 00:00:54,160 --> 00:00:56,120 Speaker 1: was like, this feels like a topic. This is like 22 00:00:56,160 --> 00:00:58,840 Speaker 1: a little bit of the edgy side of the growth 23 00:00:58,880 --> 00:01:03,959 Speaker 1: mindset to address this like perfectionism happening in our culture. 24 00:01:04,400 --> 00:01:07,319 Speaker 1: I'm so guilty of it. I think you are. We 25 00:01:07,520 --> 00:01:10,399 Speaker 1: talked about like everyone around us. It's like we only 26 00:01:10,440 --> 00:01:13,440 Speaker 1: want to present this best version of ourselves, which is 27 00:01:13,480 --> 00:01:17,000 Speaker 1: so not the human process like at all, Like it's 28 00:01:17,040 --> 00:01:19,080 Speaker 1: not at all what it means to be a human. 29 00:01:19,160 --> 00:01:22,160 Speaker 1: We all fuck up, we all fail, and yet we're 30 00:01:22,200 --> 00:01:24,240 Speaker 1: sitting here as these people who only want to talk 31 00:01:24,280 --> 00:01:26,040 Speaker 1: about success all the time. 32 00:01:26,760 --> 00:01:29,160 Speaker 2: You know what's funny too, is it's obviously a lot 33 00:01:29,200 --> 00:01:32,319 Speaker 2: easier to look back when you are successful and admit 34 00:01:32,360 --> 00:01:35,080 Speaker 2: your failures because of course, right some of the big names, 35 00:01:35,080 --> 00:01:37,480 Speaker 2: which we'll get into it to some examples, but like 36 00:01:38,160 --> 00:01:40,160 Speaker 2: that is such a part of their. 37 00:01:40,000 --> 00:01:43,200 Speaker 3: Story and it becomes like lore. 38 00:01:43,440 --> 00:01:45,399 Speaker 2: You know, it's what we talk about about them, Like 39 00:01:45,680 --> 00:01:48,760 Speaker 2: look what they overcame, and it's all about overcoming things. 40 00:01:48,760 --> 00:01:50,680 Speaker 3: And even like an example. 41 00:01:50,400 --> 00:01:55,080 Speaker 2: Like Lizzo who road to fame by pointing out what 42 00:01:55,160 --> 00:01:58,080 Speaker 2: she thought everyone would make fun of her for and 43 00:01:58,240 --> 00:02:01,680 Speaker 2: using it as an asset. That's a really great example 44 00:02:01,800 --> 00:02:05,320 Speaker 2: of sort of bucking the system. That is, everything has 45 00:02:05,360 --> 00:02:10,560 Speaker 2: to be perfect and beautifully engineered and filtered and whatever 46 00:02:10,639 --> 00:02:12,640 Speaker 2: you name it. However, you fix something so that you 47 00:02:12,680 --> 00:02:15,639 Speaker 2: give a perception of perfection, But I do think it's 48 00:02:15,639 --> 00:02:19,280 Speaker 2: funny that, like, why is it that until we succeed, 49 00:02:19,680 --> 00:02:23,560 Speaker 2: we are not able to recognize and admit and embrace 50 00:02:23,600 --> 00:02:26,480 Speaker 2: our failures. It's I know, personally, I'm fucking terrified. 51 00:02:26,520 --> 00:02:27,920 Speaker 1: I was just going to ask you, do you have 52 00:02:27,960 --> 00:02:30,000 Speaker 1: a certain instance you're thinking about in your life, because 53 00:02:30,000 --> 00:02:31,640 Speaker 1: I know I'm sitting here thinking about this for me, 54 00:02:31,720 --> 00:02:35,119 Speaker 1: and that is so true for me. Not on purpose, 55 00:02:35,360 --> 00:02:39,440 Speaker 1: but it's like I've just felt shame or scared or whatever, 56 00:02:39,600 --> 00:02:40,440 Speaker 1: So what's yours? 57 00:02:40,880 --> 00:02:44,200 Speaker 2: I mean, coming out as gay felt like admitting a failure. 58 00:02:44,480 --> 00:02:46,720 Speaker 2: My first job was at Atlantic Records, when I knew 59 00:02:46,720 --> 00:02:49,840 Speaker 2: I wanted to quit in my soul, I knew I 60 00:02:49,840 --> 00:02:52,720 Speaker 2: had to leave, but I was fucking scared because I 61 00:02:52,760 --> 00:02:56,080 Speaker 2: thought people would think I had failed. It took a 62 00:02:56,160 --> 00:03:00,400 Speaker 2: lot of like conversations with people I trusted and really 63 00:03:00,480 --> 00:03:04,320 Speaker 2: looking deep to realize I hadn't failed, I'd succeeded and 64 00:03:04,360 --> 00:03:06,880 Speaker 2: it was time for a new goal. I had gotten 65 00:03:06,919 --> 00:03:10,040 Speaker 2: everything I ever dreamt of, and I think like suddenly 66 00:03:10,080 --> 00:03:11,800 Speaker 2: there was like a door that I was opening that 67 00:03:11,919 --> 00:03:14,360 Speaker 2: was like a black hole because there wasn't another dream 68 00:03:14,360 --> 00:03:17,359 Speaker 2: on the other side. So to me, it translated as well, 69 00:03:17,400 --> 00:03:20,560 Speaker 2: you failed, you're not running Atlantic records, and I never 70 00:03:20,880 --> 00:03:22,560 Speaker 2: set out to do that. I set out to look 71 00:03:22,560 --> 00:03:26,240 Speaker 2: at Atlantic records. So I mean, that's an example. When 72 00:03:26,240 --> 00:03:28,399 Speaker 2: I was trying to think of examples earlier, I thought 73 00:03:28,440 --> 00:03:33,639 Speaker 2: to myself, is fear of failure equivalent to fear of success? 74 00:03:33,919 --> 00:03:37,960 Speaker 1: Oh? That's deep, because I do think it is. They 75 00:03:38,000 --> 00:03:40,760 Speaker 1: do seem to be connected. I'm trying to go through 76 00:03:40,800 --> 00:03:42,720 Speaker 1: that in my mind right now, though I might need 77 00:03:42,720 --> 00:03:45,680 Speaker 1: a minute to process that one. The fear of success 78 00:03:45,800 --> 00:03:47,960 Speaker 1: is a weird one that I've been bouncing around in 79 00:03:48,000 --> 00:03:50,840 Speaker 1: my head too, because to me, I think what that 80 00:03:50,880 --> 00:03:53,720 Speaker 1: equates to is exposure. And like in the past couple 81 00:03:53,760 --> 00:03:56,920 Speaker 1: of years, I've wanted to retreat because of what I 82 00:03:57,000 --> 00:04:00,160 Speaker 1: deemed its failures in my life. Right and now it's 83 00:04:00,200 --> 00:04:03,440 Speaker 1: interesting because to your point that you said earlier, it's 84 00:04:03,480 --> 00:04:06,240 Speaker 1: like now that I'm like coming out of the Hayes 85 00:04:06,360 --> 00:04:08,600 Speaker 1: and finding my stride again and I have some new 86 00:04:08,640 --> 00:04:11,320 Speaker 1: ideas of new things I want to do, I'm going, oh, well, 87 00:04:11,520 --> 00:04:13,480 Speaker 1: that had to happen then, because I would have never 88 00:04:13,560 --> 00:04:14,640 Speaker 1: done it would be. 89 00:04:14,840 --> 00:04:16,760 Speaker 2: A totally different paths exactly. 90 00:04:17,240 --> 00:04:19,599 Speaker 1: But it's not until this point that you can always 91 00:04:19,600 --> 00:04:22,440 Speaker 1: see it, but I've done it both ways. Like over 92 00:04:22,480 --> 00:04:25,120 Speaker 1: a decade ago, I was engaged to be married and 93 00:04:25,160 --> 00:04:28,039 Speaker 1: that fell through three months before the wedding, and I 94 00:04:28,160 --> 00:04:31,359 Speaker 1: just completely shut down. I wouldn't really talk about it 95 00:04:31,400 --> 00:04:34,599 Speaker 1: with my friends. Obviously, everyone knew what happened. It happened 96 00:04:34,680 --> 00:04:37,719 Speaker 1: very publicly, but it was like I couldn't talk about 97 00:04:37,720 --> 00:04:40,559 Speaker 1: it because I was so ashamed of what it meant 98 00:04:40,839 --> 00:04:43,000 Speaker 1: or whatever what I thought it looked like for me 99 00:04:43,200 --> 00:04:46,440 Speaker 1: or meant for me. And then I've done the reverse 100 00:04:46,640 --> 00:04:49,240 Speaker 1: the last couple of years, where it's like I was 101 00:04:49,440 --> 00:04:52,120 Speaker 1: made into a villain on a reality TV show that 102 00:04:52,200 --> 00:04:55,640 Speaker 1: I didn't expect, and then COVID happened and I lost 103 00:04:55,640 --> 00:04:58,160 Speaker 1: some clients I wasn't expecting to lose, and it was 104 00:04:58,320 --> 00:05:02,960 Speaker 1: just like these things I really felt ashamed about. I 105 00:05:02,800 --> 00:05:06,320 Speaker 1: was I love to like over own responsibility. So like 106 00:05:06,800 --> 00:05:08,800 Speaker 1: maybe it was just like you said, time to move on. 107 00:05:09,320 --> 00:05:11,280 Speaker 1: Things just played out the way they were supposed to. 108 00:05:11,360 --> 00:05:12,840 Speaker 1: But I couldn't look at it that way. I just 109 00:05:12,880 --> 00:05:15,039 Speaker 1: looked at it as like I had fucked up something, 110 00:05:15,480 --> 00:05:17,839 Speaker 1: I had done something wrong, I had caused something to 111 00:05:17,920 --> 00:05:21,280 Speaker 1: happen blah blah blah blah blah. And in this case, 112 00:05:21,320 --> 00:05:23,279 Speaker 1: I tried to work through it by like talking about 113 00:05:23,320 --> 00:05:26,080 Speaker 1: it as much as I could. I guess I don't know, 114 00:05:26,160 --> 00:05:29,440 Speaker 1: but like either way, there's this like sense of exposure 115 00:05:29,480 --> 00:05:33,120 Speaker 1: that I think sends us into this shame spiral because 116 00:05:33,720 --> 00:05:37,440 Speaker 1: if we feel like we failed, we're just like, why 117 00:05:37,520 --> 00:05:40,240 Speaker 1: am I not enough? Because everyone else out there seems 118 00:05:40,279 --> 00:05:42,320 Speaker 1: to be so successful. 119 00:05:42,120 --> 00:05:44,520 Speaker 2: And it appears to be that no one else is 120 00:05:44,560 --> 00:05:46,680 Speaker 2: afraid of failure, right. 121 00:05:47,160 --> 00:05:49,920 Speaker 1: I also, let's just not talked about, is it right? 122 00:05:50,120 --> 00:05:50,320 Speaker 3: Right? 123 00:05:51,040 --> 00:05:53,680 Speaker 2: Something that's rooted in my fear of failure is my 124 00:05:53,880 --> 00:05:57,479 Speaker 2: people pleasing qualities because I feel like if I fail, 125 00:05:57,640 --> 00:06:02,320 Speaker 2: it affects so many other people, but I rarely give 126 00:06:02,400 --> 00:06:06,520 Speaker 2: myself the praise when I succeed that it positively impacts 127 00:06:06,520 --> 00:06:07,040 Speaker 2: other people. 128 00:06:07,480 --> 00:06:09,760 Speaker 3: So it's weird that I. 129 00:06:09,400 --> 00:06:13,520 Speaker 1: Like, yeah, because it's like each out yourself like a yeah, 130 00:06:13,680 --> 00:06:16,160 Speaker 1: that's like perfectionism one o one, isn't it. It's like 131 00:06:16,720 --> 00:06:20,800 Speaker 1: you literally expect yourself to be perfect and then when 132 00:06:20,800 --> 00:06:24,240 Speaker 1: you're a human, you shame the shit out of yourself. Yes, 133 00:06:25,320 --> 00:06:28,400 Speaker 1: you can't win for trying, But it's interesting because as 134 00:06:28,400 --> 00:06:30,920 Speaker 1: I was talking about like you know, talking about when 135 00:06:30,920 --> 00:06:33,080 Speaker 1: you're going through the failure. And I do think there's 136 00:06:33,120 --> 00:06:35,720 Speaker 1: something to like we need a certain capacity or a 137 00:06:35,800 --> 00:06:38,200 Speaker 1: certain level of healing within ourselves to be able to 138 00:06:38,200 --> 00:06:41,560 Speaker 1: discuss things openly because we're so sensitive and fraudulent, more 139 00:06:41,600 --> 00:06:44,840 Speaker 1: painful maybe, But it's almost as if to me, our 140 00:06:44,920 --> 00:06:50,279 Speaker 1: society has this like intolerance to failure. We can only 141 00:06:50,440 --> 00:06:54,000 Speaker 1: tolerate perfection or success, and that's really all that we applaud, 142 00:06:54,320 --> 00:06:56,880 Speaker 1: but we don't really applaud someone's journey. Like I was 143 00:06:56,920 --> 00:06:59,560 Speaker 1: telling you before the podcast, every time I have a 144 00:06:59,640 --> 00:07:02,240 Speaker 1: very accessful person on the podcast, the first thing I 145 00:07:02,279 --> 00:07:04,320 Speaker 1: want to know is what are all the fuck ups? 146 00:07:04,320 --> 00:07:06,360 Speaker 1: What are all the failures that you had to go 147 00:07:06,440 --> 00:07:10,320 Speaker 1: through before you got to this point? Because the realist 148 00:07:10,360 --> 00:07:13,520 Speaker 1: in me is like, I know, you didn't just start 149 00:07:13,640 --> 00:07:17,240 Speaker 1: Amazon as your first business, you know what I mean? Right, 150 00:07:17,480 --> 00:07:20,320 Speaker 1: That's a wild example, but it just feels like that 151 00:07:20,480 --> 00:07:24,240 Speaker 1: is what we expect. We talk about people who go 152 00:07:24,440 --> 00:07:26,680 Speaker 1: viral on TikTok and they have this amazing song and 153 00:07:26,680 --> 00:07:29,280 Speaker 1: they blow up really fast, and it's like all of 154 00:07:29,320 --> 00:07:31,000 Speaker 1: a sudden, they're the most successful thing. 155 00:07:31,680 --> 00:07:34,480 Speaker 2: But like, what most of the time The pitfall there 156 00:07:34,560 --> 00:07:37,960 Speaker 2: is that they're very quickly forgotten because they weren't ready 157 00:07:37,960 --> 00:07:44,560 Speaker 2: for the success, and the failure there becomes almost insurmountable. 158 00:07:44,960 --> 00:07:49,600 Speaker 2: Whereas when you're failing on my more micro levels, building 159 00:07:49,640 --> 00:07:54,280 Speaker 2: your story and learning your lessons and becoming more empathetic 160 00:07:54,520 --> 00:07:58,160 Speaker 2: to other people who are failing and just figuring out 161 00:07:58,240 --> 00:08:03,800 Speaker 2: how to navigate failure, which is inevitable, it then makes 162 00:08:04,040 --> 00:08:05,640 Speaker 2: success easier. 163 00:08:05,600 --> 00:08:08,440 Speaker 3: The closer you get to it. Wow, and success is 164 00:08:08,440 --> 00:08:09,240 Speaker 3: ever easy. 165 00:08:09,480 --> 00:08:13,160 Speaker 2: It's just it makes the path a little more navigate navigatable. 166 00:08:13,280 --> 00:08:16,080 Speaker 3: Is that a word can be reversible, let's say it traversal. 167 00:08:25,200 --> 00:08:27,640 Speaker 1: The TikTok thing is an interesting example because you did 168 00:08:27,720 --> 00:08:30,640 Speaker 1: this week on the Wednesday podcast and I was talking 169 00:08:30,680 --> 00:08:32,679 Speaker 1: about one of the artists I've been working with as 170 00:08:32,720 --> 00:08:35,440 Speaker 1: a new artist, and he's talking about the pressure from 171 00:08:35,679 --> 00:08:38,760 Speaker 1: labels to go get a viral TikTok kic, and I said, yeah, 172 00:08:38,960 --> 00:08:41,760 Speaker 1: that works. But like, I've also worked with people who 173 00:08:41,760 --> 00:08:45,480 Speaker 1: have had that and they have nowhere near the amount 174 00:08:45,600 --> 00:08:49,199 Speaker 1: of success long term or ultimately. As someone who has 175 00:08:49,280 --> 00:08:51,680 Speaker 1: come up through the trenches, who has had to make 176 00:08:51,720 --> 00:08:53,959 Speaker 1: their way playing in the bars on Broadway and all 177 00:08:54,000 --> 00:08:57,240 Speaker 1: that stuff because of experience, and what that really means 178 00:08:57,360 --> 00:09:00,000 Speaker 1: is because they failed in some way, shape or form, 179 00:09:00,200 --> 00:09:02,560 Speaker 1: and so then they had all of these times where 180 00:09:02,559 --> 00:09:06,079 Speaker 1: they were like, Okay, that worked, this didn't. This experience 181 00:09:06,160 --> 00:09:08,200 Speaker 1: was good, this one was bad. And then you pick 182 00:09:08,240 --> 00:09:11,960 Speaker 1: and choose, and you can craft your own career, your 183 00:09:12,000 --> 00:09:14,960 Speaker 1: own success, your own life, store, your own relationship, whatever 184 00:09:15,000 --> 00:09:18,800 Speaker 1: it is, because of the pluses and minuses, the wins 185 00:09:18,800 --> 00:09:21,360 Speaker 1: and the losses. Right, and in those situations where you 186 00:09:21,360 --> 00:09:23,920 Speaker 1: have the fast success, which I think is what our 187 00:09:23,960 --> 00:09:27,920 Speaker 1: culture wants right now, you really don't set yourself up 188 00:09:28,000 --> 00:09:31,520 Speaker 1: for the long term win or long term goals being fulfilled, 189 00:09:31,520 --> 00:09:34,600 Speaker 1: the long term success like maintaining right. 190 00:09:35,040 --> 00:09:38,160 Speaker 2: I think too, it's like I never set out with 191 00:09:38,240 --> 00:09:42,880 Speaker 2: a path other than a one single goal, so I 192 00:09:42,920 --> 00:09:46,600 Speaker 2: am not even equipped really to think about the steps 193 00:09:47,760 --> 00:09:49,760 Speaker 2: because what is that quote. I'm going to butcher it, 194 00:09:49,800 --> 00:09:52,160 Speaker 2: but it's basically like do one rung of the ladder 195 00:09:52,200 --> 00:09:55,239 Speaker 2: at a time, not the whole ladder or the staircase 196 00:09:55,320 --> 00:09:57,720 Speaker 2: or whatever it is. Because we are trained to think 197 00:09:57,760 --> 00:10:00,439 Speaker 2: that all these people that are in our little phone 198 00:10:00,600 --> 00:10:03,560 Speaker 2: that are suddenly rich and famous or successful or whatever, 199 00:10:03,960 --> 00:10:06,040 Speaker 2: did it really fast. So we want to be at 200 00:10:06,080 --> 00:10:09,760 Speaker 2: the top of the staircase immediately, but every step is 201 00:10:09,840 --> 00:10:12,760 Speaker 2: important and if you fall down, you just got to 202 00:10:12,760 --> 00:10:15,320 Speaker 2: get back up and do the next step. The path 203 00:10:15,440 --> 00:10:19,080 Speaker 2: to success is painted so clearly for us when we're children, 204 00:10:19,720 --> 00:10:23,400 Speaker 2: because we have no option but to succeed in learning 205 00:10:23,440 --> 00:10:26,200 Speaker 2: to walk, learning that the stove is hot, like learning 206 00:10:26,280 --> 00:10:28,520 Speaker 2: those things that you have to do the lost But isn't. 207 00:10:28,320 --> 00:10:30,640 Speaker 1: That Isn't that technically a failure? If you touch a 208 00:10:30,679 --> 00:10:33,320 Speaker 1: hot sew one hundred percent as an adult, I would 209 00:10:33,360 --> 00:10:35,000 Speaker 1: be like, oh my god, I should have known better 210 00:10:35,160 --> 00:10:37,160 Speaker 1: instead of like going, oh, that's hot. 211 00:10:38,000 --> 00:10:38,120 Speaker 3: Right. 212 00:10:38,200 --> 00:10:40,440 Speaker 1: It's just interesting how we talk to ourselves. But you 213 00:10:40,480 --> 00:10:42,040 Speaker 1: bring up a really good point, and we were talking 214 00:10:42,040 --> 00:10:44,480 Speaker 1: about this before the podcast too. There's a lot of really, 215 00:10:45,080 --> 00:10:48,960 Speaker 1: really hugely successful people that we can reference here, Oprah 216 00:10:49,000 --> 00:10:51,600 Speaker 1: Winfrey being one of them, who I'm a massive fan of. 217 00:10:52,200 --> 00:10:55,720 Speaker 1: But she had so many failings before she actually was 218 00:10:55,800 --> 00:10:59,000 Speaker 1: able to become the Oprah that we know today. I 219 00:10:59,040 --> 00:11:01,120 Speaker 1: know early in her career there was a lot of struggles, 220 00:11:01,120 --> 00:11:03,240 Speaker 1: Like she was fired from her first job as a 221 00:11:03,240 --> 00:11:06,760 Speaker 1: news anchor. The producers felt she was too emotionally invested 222 00:11:06,760 --> 00:11:08,559 Speaker 1: in stories I mean, tell me that's not a meat 223 00:11:08,600 --> 00:11:11,800 Speaker 1: situation or not, Like, but isn't that what you want 224 00:11:11,920 --> 00:11:15,679 Speaker 1: from a jo exactly? But you know, maybe they just 225 00:11:15,720 --> 00:11:19,520 Speaker 1: want someone to read the news and not be emotionally 226 00:11:19,720 --> 00:11:23,840 Speaker 1: connected to it, and she was. But after she got fired, 227 00:11:23,920 --> 00:11:26,720 Speaker 1: she bounced back and instead of giving up, she actually 228 00:11:26,760 --> 00:11:28,960 Speaker 1: found her calling through that. She was like, oh, I 229 00:11:29,000 --> 00:11:31,760 Speaker 1: am emotionally invested, and that's how she ended up in 230 00:11:31,840 --> 00:11:34,440 Speaker 1: daytime TV on the Oprah Show over Winfrey Show. Like 231 00:11:34,480 --> 00:11:36,880 Speaker 1: we know, she was like, Oh, this is teaching me 232 00:11:36,920 --> 00:11:39,960 Speaker 1: something about myself. I can't be a news anchor that 233 00:11:40,040 --> 00:11:42,880 Speaker 1: sits and reads the news without connecting to how tragic 234 00:11:42,920 --> 00:11:43,600 Speaker 1: that story is. 235 00:11:43,840 --> 00:11:46,040 Speaker 2: But I can't sit Yeah. 236 00:11:45,800 --> 00:11:49,160 Speaker 1: Yeah, I can sit with someone going through their story 237 00:11:49,200 --> 00:11:51,800 Speaker 1: and telling me the hardshits of it and emotionally connect 238 00:11:51,800 --> 00:11:54,360 Speaker 1: to them and actually have a really powerful conversation. And 239 00:11:54,400 --> 00:11:56,760 Speaker 1: there's a space for that too. So it was really 240 00:11:56,760 --> 00:11:59,400 Speaker 1: a teachable moment. Ah an aha moment. 241 00:11:59,200 --> 00:12:00,920 Speaker 2: If you want aha moment. 242 00:12:01,200 --> 00:12:03,280 Speaker 1: I think she used it in the way that we 243 00:12:03,559 --> 00:12:06,560 Speaker 1: see a lot of successful people do and we don't 244 00:12:06,600 --> 00:12:09,719 Speaker 1: know about, but in the way of oh, okay, this 245 00:12:09,800 --> 00:12:12,680 Speaker 1: didn't work there, But that is actually who I am, 246 00:12:13,280 --> 00:12:15,559 Speaker 1: and I'm gonna use it to my advantage. 247 00:12:16,040 --> 00:12:17,040 Speaker 3: I didn't know that about her. 248 00:12:17,840 --> 00:12:20,720 Speaker 1: Steve Jobs is another one. It says one of the 249 00:12:20,760 --> 00:12:24,280 Speaker 1: most famous failures in business history. Steve Jobs was fired 250 00:12:24,320 --> 00:12:28,120 Speaker 1: from Apple, which is hilarious, the company he co founded 251 00:12:28,120 --> 00:12:30,880 Speaker 1: in nineteen eighty five after a power struggle with the 252 00:12:30,880 --> 00:12:34,160 Speaker 1: board of directors and then CEO John Scully. Jobs was 253 00:12:34,240 --> 00:12:37,960 Speaker 1: ousted from his own company. How he bounced back. Instead 254 00:12:38,000 --> 00:12:40,599 Speaker 1: of letting the failure define him, Jobs went want to 255 00:12:40,640 --> 00:12:44,599 Speaker 1: found another company, Next and then bought Pixar, which revolutionized 256 00:12:44,920 --> 00:12:47,880 Speaker 1: the animation industry. Obviously like films like Toy Story and 257 00:12:47,920 --> 00:12:52,120 Speaker 1: things like that. Eventually Apple bought Next and then Jobs 258 00:12:52,160 --> 00:12:55,880 Speaker 1: returned to the company. So the failure led him to 259 00:12:55,960 --> 00:13:00,679 Speaker 1: then create the iPod, the iPhone, and MacBook Apple Like. 260 00:13:00,720 --> 00:13:03,800 Speaker 1: It really actually put Apple way more on the radar 261 00:13:03,840 --> 00:13:05,280 Speaker 1: than it ever was when he came out. 262 00:13:05,280 --> 00:13:07,200 Speaker 2: I mean, Apple was viewed as kind of a failing 263 00:13:07,240 --> 00:13:08,160 Speaker 2: company at that point. 264 00:13:08,559 --> 00:13:12,400 Speaker 1: Yeah, and says Jobs firing taught him humility and resilience. 265 00:13:12,480 --> 00:13:15,640 Speaker 1: It shaped the visionary leadership style he brought to his 266 00:13:15,720 --> 00:13:18,880 Speaker 1: return to Apple. His biggest failure was his springboard for 267 00:13:18,960 --> 00:13:24,520 Speaker 1: Apple's greatest successes. Wow, I know, isn't that crazy? So anyway, 268 00:13:24,640 --> 00:13:27,240 Speaker 1: I think like the reframe that we're talking about here 269 00:13:27,360 --> 00:13:30,360 Speaker 1: is like just we're asking the question, why are we 270 00:13:30,600 --> 00:13:34,600 Speaker 1: looking at failures as let's cancel them, let's get them 271 00:13:34,640 --> 00:13:37,120 Speaker 1: out of here. Not to like get back on my 272 00:13:37,160 --> 00:13:41,600 Speaker 1: soapbox about Will Smith, But that was obviously not a 273 00:13:41,640 --> 00:13:44,360 Speaker 1: great moment with him and Chris Rock. We've referenced this 274 00:13:44,400 --> 00:13:46,960 Speaker 1: a million times. If you guys haven't heard chipin has conversation, 275 00:13:47,040 --> 00:13:49,320 Speaker 1: I'm talking about when it was the Oscars, right, this 276 00:13:49,440 --> 00:13:52,440 Speaker 1: was two years ago. Now, I think and yeah, I said, 277 00:13:52,600 --> 00:13:54,480 Speaker 1: I think it's what he does with it. I think 278 00:13:54,520 --> 00:13:58,040 Speaker 1: that really what we should look at as the culture 279 00:13:58,200 --> 00:14:00,760 Speaker 1: is not that moment. That moment was too terrible, Yes, 280 00:14:01,200 --> 00:14:04,520 Speaker 1: but then he immediately apologized and went into work on himself. 281 00:14:04,679 --> 00:14:07,640 Speaker 1: So it's like, how is that moment going to help 282 00:14:07,679 --> 00:14:10,640 Speaker 1: him evolve as a human and do we don't even 283 00:14:10,679 --> 00:14:14,120 Speaker 1: know what with his life, with his career, what success 284 00:14:14,200 --> 00:14:19,120 Speaker 1: could come after such a public, humiliating failing. And that 285 00:14:19,320 --> 00:14:21,240 Speaker 1: to me is when you find your true leaders, your 286 00:14:21,280 --> 00:14:25,360 Speaker 1: true success stories, and probably some of the biggest transitions 287 00:14:25,360 --> 00:14:26,440 Speaker 1: in our culture. 288 00:14:26,040 --> 00:14:29,680 Speaker 2: And the deepest growth internally too. I mean, look, we 289 00:14:29,720 --> 00:14:32,680 Speaker 2: do live in a cancel culture and as a society, 290 00:14:32,720 --> 00:14:36,920 Speaker 2: we lack forgiveness, and to use the Will Smith example, 291 00:14:37,000 --> 00:14:40,920 Speaker 2: like we put these celebrities on these pedestals that they 292 00:14:40,960 --> 00:14:43,800 Speaker 2: don't deserve to be on because they're human beings. They 293 00:14:43,840 --> 00:14:46,840 Speaker 2: probably don't want to be on other than the benefits 294 00:14:46,840 --> 00:14:50,320 Speaker 2: of fame, right, And so when something like that happens, 295 00:14:50,920 --> 00:14:53,960 Speaker 2: our initial reaction is to write that person off, aka 296 00:14:54,160 --> 00:14:57,720 Speaker 2: cancel them, rather than to have empathy for them and 297 00:14:57,920 --> 00:15:01,160 Speaker 2: recognize that they are humans. The way that we look 298 00:15:01,160 --> 00:15:03,360 Speaker 2: at them is that we think that they're superhuman because 299 00:15:03,360 --> 00:15:07,200 Speaker 2: they're famous. And that's silly, right, Like Will Smith works 300 00:15:07,280 --> 00:15:11,320 Speaker 2: really hard at a job that's public, you know, like, yeah, yeah, 301 00:15:11,320 --> 00:15:14,240 Speaker 2: it's just a public job. And yeah it's cool that 302 00:15:14,280 --> 00:15:16,120 Speaker 2: he's famous. Yeah what I want my photo with him 303 00:15:16,120 --> 00:15:18,320 Speaker 2: and I saw him. Yeah, But like he's still a 304 00:15:18,320 --> 00:15:22,760 Speaker 2: fucking human being. And I guarantee you he was the 305 00:15:22,760 --> 00:15:24,120 Speaker 2: most embarrassed about it. 306 00:15:24,320 --> 00:15:26,800 Speaker 3: He was the one beating himself up more than anybody. 307 00:15:26,880 --> 00:15:30,680 Speaker 2: Yeah, So there was nothing that anyone could say that 308 00:15:30,720 --> 00:15:34,320 Speaker 2: would make him feel worse than he already felt. So 309 00:15:35,160 --> 00:15:38,360 Speaker 2: the job of other humans in that moment would be 310 00:15:38,400 --> 00:15:40,840 Speaker 2: to lift him up and hope that there's a learning 311 00:15:41,080 --> 00:15:43,680 Speaker 2: moment there and he comes out of it a better 312 00:15:43,760 --> 00:15:44,320 Speaker 2: human being. 313 00:15:45,040 --> 00:15:46,640 Speaker 1: This is kind of a little side note, but I've 314 00:15:46,640 --> 00:15:48,560 Speaker 1: been thinking about this a lot lately, Like I do 315 00:15:48,680 --> 00:15:52,440 Speaker 1: think there's something happening with celebrity in our world, and 316 00:15:52,480 --> 00:15:55,760 Speaker 1: I think we've gone through this intense moment of cancel culture. 317 00:15:56,120 --> 00:15:58,800 Speaker 1: But I think what my hope is moving forward is 318 00:15:58,840 --> 00:16:01,359 Speaker 1: that we look at it as we're describing it. Celebrity 319 00:16:01,480 --> 00:16:03,480 Speaker 1: is a public job. They make a lot of money, 320 00:16:03,600 --> 00:16:06,200 Speaker 1: They have access to some things that us regular folks 321 00:16:06,320 --> 00:16:09,680 Speaker 1: might not. However, at the end of the day, they 322 00:16:09,720 --> 00:16:13,640 Speaker 1: are just as human, if not more than any of us. 323 00:16:13,800 --> 00:16:16,960 Speaker 1: And I just hope that celebrity starts to be looked 324 00:16:16,960 --> 00:16:20,280 Speaker 1: at in a different way, and also with that hope 325 00:16:20,320 --> 00:16:22,800 Speaker 1: that failure starts to be looked at it a different way. 326 00:16:22,840 --> 00:16:26,760 Speaker 1: I was looking up the words failing forward because I 327 00:16:26,840 --> 00:16:30,000 Speaker 1: think we deem it as like you're falling back, Like 328 00:16:30,040 --> 00:16:31,680 Speaker 1: That's how it always has felt to me, is like, 329 00:16:32,080 --> 00:16:34,160 Speaker 1: oh my god, I was just getting up to where 330 00:16:34,160 --> 00:16:36,280 Speaker 1: I was like climbing upwards on the mountain, and then 331 00:16:36,280 --> 00:16:38,800 Speaker 1: it was like, damn, you know, you just slam down 332 00:16:38,880 --> 00:16:42,960 Speaker 1: and like everything falls apart, you lose everything kind of thing, 333 00:16:42,960 --> 00:16:46,480 Speaker 1: and it's like no, no, no, no, no, it's just a redirection. 334 00:16:46,840 --> 00:16:49,760 Speaker 1: Like it's terrible in the time, and it does involve 335 00:16:49,760 --> 00:16:52,800 Speaker 1: a lot of loss sometimes, but like even the downward 336 00:16:52,840 --> 00:16:54,920 Speaker 1: slope of it, you're always going to go back up 337 00:16:54,960 --> 00:16:57,680 Speaker 1: if you work at it or try Yeah, if you 338 00:16:57,960 --> 00:17:00,640 Speaker 1: use it for that. And so the concept of like 339 00:17:00,800 --> 00:17:04,000 Speaker 1: failing forward and just learning how to take the failure 340 00:17:04,320 --> 00:17:07,400 Speaker 1: like Oprah did, using it to evolve or just like pivot. 341 00:17:07,640 --> 00:17:09,960 Speaker 1: The five o'clock news is not going to be my thing, 342 00:17:10,000 --> 00:17:13,760 Speaker 1: but like she found her alignment in daytime TV and 343 00:17:13,800 --> 00:17:17,280 Speaker 1: now she's fucking Obrah Winfrey. It's like, right, no one 344 00:17:17,320 --> 00:17:18,879 Speaker 1: would know who she was if she stayed in the 345 00:17:18,960 --> 00:17:21,359 Speaker 1: Chicago News Network, you know what I mean? 346 00:17:21,520 --> 00:17:23,760 Speaker 2: Right, or went and got a job doing something else, 347 00:17:23,880 --> 00:17:28,040 Speaker 2: like working in the newspaper, because let that take TV. Yeah, yeah, 348 00:17:28,880 --> 00:17:30,680 Speaker 2: you know it's funny because in our business, I hear 349 00:17:30,720 --> 00:17:32,760 Speaker 2: it a lot like that guy hasn't done shit. 350 00:17:32,840 --> 00:17:34,520 Speaker 3: All he's done is fall up. 351 00:17:34,960 --> 00:17:36,320 Speaker 1: And let's fall up. 352 00:17:36,359 --> 00:17:38,760 Speaker 2: Mean, it's like there's someone that's like the CEO of 353 00:17:38,840 --> 00:17:41,520 Speaker 2: a company and there's like you can't point to any success, 354 00:17:41,960 --> 00:17:44,480 Speaker 2: which is interesting, Like I hadn't thought of it before 355 00:17:44,560 --> 00:17:48,240 Speaker 2: until you were just talking about failing forward. Yeah, the 356 00:17:48,280 --> 00:17:52,840 Speaker 2: people that fall up generally are willing to fail publicly, 357 00:17:53,400 --> 00:17:57,200 Speaker 2: so when we look at their careers, all we see 358 00:17:57,200 --> 00:18:00,639 Speaker 2: are the failures. But the resilience that it takes to 359 00:18:00,680 --> 00:18:03,639 Speaker 2: get back on the horse and keep fighting to a 360 00:18:03,680 --> 00:18:07,199 Speaker 2: position that you feel like you belong in is not 361 00:18:07,480 --> 00:18:10,919 Speaker 2: for everybody. Like Sadly, I just don't think, you know, 362 00:18:11,119 --> 00:18:14,320 Speaker 2: we're all as evolved as everyone else. You know, some 363 00:18:14,359 --> 00:18:17,320 Speaker 2: people are just aren't. They don't have the composition. 364 00:18:16,800 --> 00:18:18,600 Speaker 3: To keep fighting, like they give up. 365 00:18:18,920 --> 00:18:21,240 Speaker 2: Yeah, And I don't know, does that is that that 366 00:18:21,400 --> 00:18:24,320 Speaker 2: like something that could fuel drug addiction because you can't 367 00:18:24,320 --> 00:18:26,639 Speaker 2: connect with yourself, or alcoholism or whatever it is. 368 00:18:27,280 --> 00:18:28,560 Speaker 3: If success were. 369 00:18:28,560 --> 00:18:31,399 Speaker 2: A linear, straight line, we would all be successful. We 370 00:18:31,440 --> 00:18:33,440 Speaker 2: wouldn't even be having this conversation. We'd all be rich 371 00:18:33,480 --> 00:18:33,879 Speaker 2: and happy. 372 00:18:34,680 --> 00:18:37,000 Speaker 1: Didn't you think as a kid it was supposed to. 373 00:18:36,920 --> 00:18:41,680 Speaker 3: Be to go to college and then you're successful. 374 00:18:50,520 --> 00:18:53,119 Speaker 1: I still look at other adults who are successful and 375 00:18:53,160 --> 00:18:56,560 Speaker 1: I'm like, I just like look at their story and 376 00:18:56,600 --> 00:18:59,679 Speaker 1: I forget about anything that I would know of like, 377 00:18:59,720 --> 00:19:02,600 Speaker 1: there's people in our friend group even who I forget 378 00:19:02,640 --> 00:19:07,639 Speaker 1: about the quote unquote failings, But with mine, I'm like, oh, you. 379 00:19:07,720 --> 00:19:10,600 Speaker 2: Think they're on display and everyone's talking about them, and 380 00:19:10,840 --> 00:19:14,280 Speaker 2: what the truth is, nobody has time to worry about 381 00:19:14,280 --> 00:19:18,880 Speaker 2: your failures as a fuck. And that's not to say 382 00:19:18,920 --> 00:19:20,880 Speaker 2: you should not give a fuck about your failures, because 383 00:19:20,920 --> 00:19:26,000 Speaker 2: you should because there's stars that you're carrying from the battlefield, true, 384 00:19:26,119 --> 00:19:28,840 Speaker 2: and that they should be they should be what you 385 00:19:28,960 --> 00:19:31,800 Speaker 2: use to fuel yourself into success. 386 00:19:32,040 --> 00:19:33,280 Speaker 3: I mean, I think about it all the time. When 387 00:19:33,320 --> 00:19:34,960 Speaker 3: I'm driving through Nashville, I'm like, who. 388 00:19:34,840 --> 00:19:36,960 Speaker 2: The fuck are all these people that own these multimillion 389 00:19:36,960 --> 00:19:37,520 Speaker 2: dollar homes? 390 00:19:37,560 --> 00:19:39,200 Speaker 3: Where do they work? Who are they and how do 391 00:19:39,280 --> 00:19:39,719 Speaker 3: they do it? 392 00:19:40,119 --> 00:19:42,359 Speaker 2: Because I feel like I work my ass off and 393 00:19:42,400 --> 00:19:44,240 Speaker 2: I've got a nice house. But it doesn't mean that 394 00:19:44,280 --> 00:19:47,080 Speaker 2: I don't have envy and curiosity to like, what am 395 00:19:47,119 --> 00:19:49,760 Speaker 2: I not doing that's going to get me there? And 396 00:19:50,000 --> 00:19:53,639 Speaker 2: you know, some people just inherited their grandparents house. You know, 397 00:19:53,680 --> 00:19:56,600 Speaker 2: it's that simple, like they were lucky, they were born 398 00:19:56,640 --> 00:19:58,720 Speaker 2: in the right family. Some people worked really hard and 399 00:19:58,720 --> 00:20:01,560 Speaker 2: had a lot of failures, and the reason why you 400 00:20:01,600 --> 00:20:03,760 Speaker 2: can probably hear. I'm kind of excited about this topic 401 00:20:04,440 --> 00:20:06,880 Speaker 2: because I do think I need to embrace my failures more. 402 00:20:07,080 --> 00:20:10,000 Speaker 2: I have to be willing to fail more rather than 403 00:20:10,720 --> 00:20:13,800 Speaker 2: not take the risks that it takes to succeed, because 404 00:20:13,800 --> 00:20:16,760 Speaker 2: I'm worried about failing, because there is one certainty in 405 00:20:16,800 --> 00:20:19,680 Speaker 2: that if you don't fucking try, you never willin. 406 00:20:20,000 --> 00:20:22,160 Speaker 1: Well, you know what they say about your deathbed, right, 407 00:20:22,240 --> 00:20:24,639 Speaker 1: it's not the things that you've failed. I'm doing air 408 00:20:24,720 --> 00:20:26,919 Speaker 1: quotes right now, you guys, but like, it's not the 409 00:20:26,960 --> 00:20:29,600 Speaker 1: things that you failed at that you regret, It is 410 00:20:29,640 --> 00:20:32,919 Speaker 1: the things you didn't try, right. I think it's just 411 00:20:32,960 --> 00:20:35,840 Speaker 1: we're all so worried about what everyone thinks about us 412 00:20:35,880 --> 00:20:36,840 Speaker 1: too one percent. 413 00:20:37,040 --> 00:20:39,919 Speaker 2: And even though we're in a celebrities and when I 414 00:20:39,920 --> 00:20:42,399 Speaker 2: say we, I mean we as a collective human race. 415 00:20:43,600 --> 00:20:45,160 Speaker 3: Because our lives are now. 416 00:20:45,040 --> 00:20:46,920 Speaker 2: Public because of social media. 417 00:20:47,400 --> 00:20:49,240 Speaker 3: I do think that makes it worse. 418 00:20:49,560 --> 00:20:53,399 Speaker 1: Oh for sure, But are our lives really public? Do 419 00:20:53,440 --> 00:20:56,119 Speaker 1: you know what I mean? Over it all, I'm just like, 420 00:20:56,720 --> 00:20:59,639 Speaker 1: let's stop pretending like anything on social media is actually 421 00:20:59,640 --> 00:21:01,120 Speaker 1: the full story, unless like. 422 00:21:01,119 --> 00:21:03,040 Speaker 2: Posting the worst photos of ourselves. 423 00:21:04,000 --> 00:21:06,280 Speaker 1: I always post with no makeup one and stuff, in 424 00:21:06,359 --> 00:21:09,840 Speaker 1: stories because I'm like I need to normalize myself, Like 425 00:21:09,920 --> 00:21:12,560 Speaker 1: I don't want to be just in the pretty picture 426 00:21:12,600 --> 00:21:15,480 Speaker 1: all the time, Like all of it's just so unattainable 427 00:21:15,520 --> 00:21:19,200 Speaker 1: if we only show those pieces or just be honest about, hey, 428 00:21:19,200 --> 00:21:22,679 Speaker 1: I'm only showing those pieces, like I'm not trying to 429 00:21:22,720 --> 00:21:25,080 Speaker 1: show you guys the days that I'm crying and like 430 00:21:25,240 --> 00:21:28,120 Speaker 1: having a hard time or truthfully, like for me, most 431 00:21:28,119 --> 00:21:30,400 Speaker 1: of the time, the struggle for me with social media 432 00:21:30,480 --> 00:21:33,720 Speaker 1: is like it's fear. It's fear of being out there again, 433 00:21:33,760 --> 00:21:36,679 Speaker 1: like what you're saying, and it's like, wait, actually, I 434 00:21:36,800 --> 00:21:39,240 Speaker 1: need to look at everything that's happened in the last 435 00:21:39,600 --> 00:21:41,360 Speaker 1: decade or a couple of years or whatever you want 436 00:21:41,359 --> 00:21:43,760 Speaker 1: to say, and go, I've just been in a lot 437 00:21:43,760 --> 00:21:47,119 Speaker 1: of like gross, there's been a lot of like lessons. 438 00:21:47,119 --> 00:21:51,000 Speaker 1: There's been a lot of transitions, and it's been painful 439 00:21:51,119 --> 00:21:53,359 Speaker 1: some of it, but none of it has been not 440 00:21:53,560 --> 00:21:57,760 Speaker 1: for my highest good ultimately. So I'm about to adopt 441 00:21:57,760 --> 00:22:00,680 Speaker 1: this Oprah mentality and go, Okay, well it didn't work, 442 00:22:01,000 --> 00:22:04,040 Speaker 1: you know, in this situation, but like it actually did 443 00:22:04,080 --> 00:22:07,320 Speaker 1: bring me closer to myself and understanding who I am 444 00:22:07,560 --> 00:22:10,320 Speaker 1: versus like maybe who I thought I needed to be 445 00:22:10,480 --> 00:22:14,960 Speaker 1: or was trying to be or whatever, like adopting those 446 00:22:15,000 --> 00:22:18,280 Speaker 1: things as lessons to just get you on the right 447 00:22:18,280 --> 00:22:19,040 Speaker 1: past it, then you can do this. 448 00:22:19,160 --> 00:22:22,320 Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean that acknowledgment of what failure brought you 449 00:22:22,680 --> 00:22:25,480 Speaker 2: versus what it kept from you actually frees. 450 00:22:25,280 --> 00:22:26,919 Speaker 3: You to go get the thing that is attainable. 451 00:22:27,160 --> 00:22:29,639 Speaker 1: Exactly Why do we never think of that though? 452 00:22:29,680 --> 00:22:33,639 Speaker 2: I don't know, because shame is heavy. It's a really 453 00:22:33,680 --> 00:22:37,520 Speaker 2: heavy thing. And yeah, you know, it all then comes 454 00:22:37,520 --> 00:22:39,200 Speaker 2: down to our soul intentions. 455 00:22:39,520 --> 00:22:42,399 Speaker 1: Maybe like who is this little man right now? I 456 00:22:42,440 --> 00:22:43,960 Speaker 1: am so in love with you right now? 457 00:22:44,320 --> 00:22:47,679 Speaker 2: Maybe what you were striving for wasn't realistic anyway, and 458 00:22:47,720 --> 00:22:50,600 Speaker 2: you were doing it because you thought that other people 459 00:22:50,720 --> 00:22:51,720 Speaker 2: expected you to have it. 460 00:22:52,040 --> 00:22:54,240 Speaker 1: I just don't think I was as connected to who 461 00:22:54,320 --> 00:22:57,240 Speaker 1: I am as a human as I feel now. But 462 00:22:57,320 --> 00:23:00,159 Speaker 1: I've had to go through some of those losses. I 463 00:23:00,200 --> 00:23:01,679 Speaker 1: don't know if you feel like this at all, but like, 464 00:23:01,960 --> 00:23:04,240 Speaker 1: some of those losses are the things that made me go, wait, 465 00:23:04,280 --> 00:23:06,600 Speaker 1: I don't even like that. I don't even think that way. 466 00:23:06,600 --> 00:23:08,440 Speaker 1: I don't even you know, It's like we just kind 467 00:23:08,440 --> 00:23:10,880 Speaker 1: of get going in the machine and you're just like, oh, 468 00:23:11,080 --> 00:23:14,199 Speaker 1: success will be over here. Oh you're being offered to 469 00:23:14,240 --> 00:23:16,040 Speaker 1: be on a TV show. Yeah, you better fucking do that. 470 00:23:16,080 --> 00:23:19,159 Speaker 1: It's TV, Like, it'll help your other business. That is 471 00:23:19,200 --> 00:23:22,199 Speaker 1: what we look at instead of going wait, like truly 472 00:23:22,280 --> 00:23:26,000 Speaker 1: sitting with things and like, when I really ask myself, 473 00:23:26,000 --> 00:23:28,359 Speaker 1: would I not do things the same exact way if 474 00:23:28,359 --> 00:23:31,240 Speaker 1: it was offered to me again at that time, I 475 00:23:31,280 --> 00:23:33,919 Speaker 1: would have That's not really a failure. It's like you 476 00:23:34,000 --> 00:23:36,120 Speaker 1: try something, Eah, it wasn't really the right thing. 477 00:23:36,080 --> 00:23:38,240 Speaker 2: Okay, and it was you know, it was fun while 478 00:23:38,240 --> 00:23:39,960 Speaker 2: it lasted, and some of it. 479 00:23:40,119 --> 00:23:40,879 Speaker 1: Yeah. 480 00:23:40,720 --> 00:23:43,160 Speaker 2: I think back to even my coming out and it's 481 00:23:43,240 --> 00:23:47,639 Speaker 2: like the struggle between admitting to myself that I was 482 00:23:47,680 --> 00:23:51,800 Speaker 2: gay and actually finally coming out to my family and friends. 483 00:23:52,800 --> 00:23:56,760 Speaker 2: The fear that you live in because you think your 484 00:23:56,840 --> 00:23:59,800 Speaker 2: life is going to be over in that moment, because 485 00:24:00,040 --> 00:24:03,480 Speaker 2: of the expectations that you're letting affect you from the. 486 00:24:03,440 --> 00:24:07,240 Speaker 1: External, like everyone's just gonna abandon everyone's. 487 00:24:07,040 --> 00:24:09,280 Speaker 2: Your family's gonna hate you, You're gonna be abandoned, You're 488 00:24:09,320 --> 00:24:12,439 Speaker 2: gonna get big up like no one's gonna love you, blah, 489 00:24:12,480 --> 00:24:15,840 Speaker 2: all the things. Yeah, but in reality, what it did 490 00:24:15,960 --> 00:24:18,080 Speaker 2: was It was the start of my life, Like I 491 00:24:18,160 --> 00:24:21,280 Speaker 2: got to be me and I'm still evolving in my 492 00:24:21,359 --> 00:24:24,320 Speaker 2: sexuality because i still carry some of that shame, of 493 00:24:24,400 --> 00:24:26,560 Speaker 2: course that I put on myself. 494 00:24:26,760 --> 00:24:27,119 Speaker 1: Yeah. 495 00:24:27,200 --> 00:24:30,960 Speaker 2: Yes, there are external factors because we're all fed the hate, 496 00:24:31,440 --> 00:24:33,359 Speaker 2: but I'm the only one who chose to believe it, 497 00:24:33,920 --> 00:24:36,879 Speaker 2: you know what I mean. Like for me, so I 498 00:24:36,920 --> 00:24:39,359 Speaker 2: look back and I'm like, every time I meet a 499 00:24:39,400 --> 00:24:42,560 Speaker 2: new person and I have to come out again to them, it. 500 00:24:42,600 --> 00:24:43,520 Speaker 3: Is so freeing. 501 00:24:44,359 --> 00:24:47,199 Speaker 2: Like there are times when it feels like inappropriate, but 502 00:24:47,280 --> 00:24:50,840 Speaker 2: like I would like say, oh, my ex boyfriend just casually. 503 00:24:50,880 --> 00:24:52,879 Speaker 2: I would say that now and ten years ago I 504 00:24:52,880 --> 00:24:53,720 Speaker 2: would have never said that. 505 00:24:54,040 --> 00:24:55,040 Speaker 3: Right to a new person. 506 00:24:55,400 --> 00:24:57,159 Speaker 2: Yeah, And it's really freeing to be able to be 507 00:24:57,280 --> 00:25:00,200 Speaker 2: that because it's like they're getting the most authentic version 508 00:25:00,240 --> 00:25:00,480 Speaker 2: of me. 509 00:25:00,920 --> 00:25:03,720 Speaker 3: Yeah, and that at one point felt like it was 510 00:25:03,760 --> 00:25:05,040 Speaker 3: going to be a huge failure. 511 00:25:05,720 --> 00:25:09,439 Speaker 1: That makes so much sense. It's actually also clicking for 512 00:25:09,560 --> 00:25:12,040 Speaker 1: me the thing about what you were tying together earlier, 513 00:25:12,080 --> 00:25:15,040 Speaker 1: the fear of failure, but also that being tied to 514 00:25:15,080 --> 00:25:17,879 Speaker 1: the fear of success. It just kind of hit me 515 00:25:17,920 --> 00:25:21,320 Speaker 1: as I was listening to you in terms of my story, 516 00:25:21,359 --> 00:25:25,280 Speaker 1: I guess, but like I do think that the last 517 00:25:25,359 --> 00:25:29,000 Speaker 1: couple of years, I have been so scared and like 518 00:25:29,040 --> 00:25:32,399 Speaker 1: you said, feeling like everyone's talking about it. Everyone see it, 519 00:25:32,440 --> 00:25:35,480 Speaker 1: saw the failure. Everyone's going to leave me, abandon me. 520 00:25:35,600 --> 00:25:37,760 Speaker 1: Like what you're saying that I just haven't wanted to 521 00:25:37,760 --> 00:25:39,639 Speaker 1: go out there, But you know what that's been doing 522 00:25:39,760 --> 00:25:42,639 Speaker 1: is keeping me from success, right like it, so it 523 00:25:42,720 --> 00:25:46,280 Speaker 1: becomes almost this fear of success because success equals exposure 524 00:25:46,400 --> 00:25:48,120 Speaker 1: or something, right, and you're like, if I. 525 00:25:48,160 --> 00:25:51,840 Speaker 2: Get unknown, if yeah, I feel like you've achieved success, 526 00:25:51,920 --> 00:25:52,640 Speaker 2: which you have. 527 00:25:53,400 --> 00:25:56,840 Speaker 1: I know it's ridiculous that we do this to ourselves, 528 00:25:56,920 --> 00:25:59,720 Speaker 1: but yes, but it is true. It's like, if you 529 00:25:59,800 --> 00:26:04,240 Speaker 1: have quote unquote success, it does make you more out there, 530 00:26:04,560 --> 00:26:06,920 Speaker 1: and so then what if it fails again? Then what 531 00:26:06,920 --> 00:26:07,439 Speaker 1: what does that mean? 532 00:26:07,480 --> 00:26:09,639 Speaker 2: Well, the more people that know you, the more exposure 533 00:26:09,680 --> 00:26:12,240 Speaker 2: you have, the more people want to see you fail, 534 00:26:12,280 --> 00:26:13,720 Speaker 2: the more people won't like you. 535 00:26:14,400 --> 00:26:16,520 Speaker 3: That I'm not saying like people who already liked you. 536 00:26:16,680 --> 00:26:19,560 Speaker 2: It's just opening up the population of who is even 537 00:26:19,600 --> 00:26:20,240 Speaker 2: aware of you. 538 00:26:20,720 --> 00:26:20,920 Speaker 1: Right. 539 00:26:21,119 --> 00:26:22,840 Speaker 2: You know, you can look at the Rolling Stones, one 540 00:26:22,840 --> 00:26:24,359 Speaker 2: of the biggest rock bands in the world, and I 541 00:26:24,359 --> 00:26:25,920 Speaker 2: could throw a rock and hit people that say I 542 00:26:25,960 --> 00:26:28,600 Speaker 2: fucking hate that band. I wish they'd die, you know, like, yeah, 543 00:26:28,640 --> 00:26:31,800 Speaker 2: they're nothing compared to the Beatles, and you know, there 544 00:26:31,800 --> 00:26:34,639 Speaker 2: are one of the most successful fucking bands of the 545 00:26:34,720 --> 00:26:38,000 Speaker 2: whole time, and you just you can't. 546 00:26:37,720 --> 00:26:39,640 Speaker 3: Listen to that. I saw a quote the other day 547 00:26:39,640 --> 00:26:40,520 Speaker 3: that says. 548 00:26:40,400 --> 00:26:43,560 Speaker 2: If you wouldn't ask them for advice, don't listen to 549 00:26:43,600 --> 00:26:44,240 Speaker 2: their criticism. 550 00:26:44,400 --> 00:26:45,359 Speaker 1: It's so true. 551 00:26:45,600 --> 00:26:46,920 Speaker 3: Boom, there you go. 552 00:26:47,040 --> 00:26:48,639 Speaker 1: Well, I was thinking about when I was prepping for 553 00:26:48,680 --> 00:26:51,240 Speaker 1: this podcast. I'm like, so much of the fear of 554 00:26:51,320 --> 00:26:55,240 Speaker 1: failure I think comes from the keyboard warriors or whatever 555 00:26:55,240 --> 00:26:57,720 Speaker 1: you want to call them, that are trolling you from 556 00:26:57,760 --> 00:27:01,040 Speaker 1: their fucking basement on their couch, right, and. 557 00:27:01,000 --> 00:27:02,439 Speaker 3: It's like just about failures. 558 00:27:02,600 --> 00:27:05,520 Speaker 1: Yes, it's like the Theodore Roosevelt quote about if you're 559 00:27:05,560 --> 00:27:09,960 Speaker 1: not in the arena, actually out there fighting doing the thing. 560 00:27:10,080 --> 00:27:12,320 Speaker 1: I mean, Brene Brown talks about this too. It's like, 561 00:27:12,720 --> 00:27:15,560 Speaker 1: unless you're in the arena, do not weigh in on 562 00:27:15,600 --> 00:27:17,920 Speaker 1: what I'm out here trying to do, right, And that 563 00:27:18,680 --> 00:27:20,560 Speaker 1: is the quote that I really kind of want to 564 00:27:20,640 --> 00:27:22,920 Speaker 1: leave this on and like really try to think about 565 00:27:22,960 --> 00:27:26,040 Speaker 1: moving forward and just ask ourselves these questions like Chip 566 00:27:26,040 --> 00:27:28,040 Speaker 1: and I are just sitting here. We're never coming to 567 00:27:28,080 --> 00:27:30,800 Speaker 1: you guys as these quote unquote experts. We're just sitting 568 00:27:30,800 --> 00:27:34,280 Speaker 1: here asking these questions like, wait, why, as a society 569 00:27:34,359 --> 00:27:39,040 Speaker 1: are we only focusing on these massive successes without looking 570 00:27:39,119 --> 00:27:42,679 Speaker 1: at the whole road and the whole journey, so that we, 571 00:27:42,960 --> 00:27:47,320 Speaker 1: as humans growing and evolving together cannot feel so much 572 00:27:47,320 --> 00:27:51,919 Speaker 1: shame about our you know, little setbacks or redirections or 573 00:27:51,960 --> 00:27:55,080 Speaker 1: things like that, like actually being honest with each other 574 00:27:55,119 --> 00:27:57,640 Speaker 1: about what the human experience is and what the human 575 00:27:57,720 --> 00:28:01,440 Speaker 1: journey looks like, and what the purpose says. You can't 576 00:28:01,480 --> 00:28:03,720 Speaker 1: take it with you, so is the purpose really Like 577 00:28:03,800 --> 00:28:05,879 Speaker 1: I'm sure, yes, it's great to have millions of dollars, 578 00:28:05,880 --> 00:28:09,760 Speaker 1: but like, probably not what your soul only intended to 579 00:28:09,800 --> 00:28:11,840 Speaker 1: do in this lifetime. 580 00:28:11,520 --> 00:28:13,840 Speaker 2: Right, I would venture to say it's much more valuable 581 00:28:13,840 --> 00:28:18,000 Speaker 2: to like be proud and happy with yourself. Yeah, And 582 00:28:18,560 --> 00:28:22,920 Speaker 2: you can be broke and poor and still have those 583 00:28:23,119 --> 00:28:25,959 Speaker 2: feelings for yourself even for trying. 584 00:28:26,000 --> 00:28:28,960 Speaker 3: I mean, it's shit. The road is paved with failure. 585 00:28:28,640 --> 00:28:31,360 Speaker 2: You know, Like, and a lot of people reach massive 586 00:28:31,359 --> 00:28:34,800 Speaker 2: success and then hit a roadblock and they fail again. 587 00:28:34,880 --> 00:28:39,640 Speaker 2: And whether or not they reachieve success is whatever. But 588 00:28:40,400 --> 00:28:43,040 Speaker 2: this has been a really freeing conversation for me because 589 00:28:43,080 --> 00:28:46,400 Speaker 2: it's a nice reminder, like too, I drown in my. 590 00:28:46,400 --> 00:28:47,600 Speaker 3: Fear of failure. I really do. 591 00:28:48,920 --> 00:28:51,200 Speaker 2: I could write a book on my successes if I 592 00:28:51,240 --> 00:28:51,720 Speaker 2: wanted to. 593 00:28:51,960 --> 00:28:54,520 Speaker 3: You know, if you don't even think about that. Yeah, 594 00:28:54,560 --> 00:28:55,320 Speaker 3: it's funny. 595 00:28:55,040 --> 00:28:57,280 Speaker 2: Because I'll be hanging with friends stone or whatever, and 596 00:28:57,320 --> 00:28:59,480 Speaker 2: like I'll tell a random story and. 597 00:28:59,400 --> 00:29:02,080 Speaker 3: The people are like, what is your life? Like, how 598 00:29:02,080 --> 00:29:03,720 Speaker 3: did that happen? How did you do that? 599 00:29:04,120 --> 00:29:06,600 Speaker 2: And I'm like, I had forgotten about it until you 600 00:29:06,600 --> 00:29:08,200 Speaker 2: said that and made me remember something. 601 00:29:08,360 --> 00:29:09,200 Speaker 3: Yeah, it's wild. 602 00:29:09,520 --> 00:29:11,200 Speaker 1: I'm curious what you guys have, Like, if you have 603 00:29:11,240 --> 00:29:13,680 Speaker 1: any failure stories that have really helped you to figure 604 00:29:13,720 --> 00:29:17,120 Speaker 1: out what your next direction is or what your success 605 00:29:17,200 --> 00:29:20,160 Speaker 1: story what you want it to look like, email us 606 00:29:20,160 --> 00:29:22,760 Speaker 1: at the edge at velvetedge dot com. You can also 607 00:29:22,840 --> 00:29:25,440 Speaker 1: leave us a voicemail. We haven't been really plugging the 608 00:29:25,520 --> 00:29:27,800 Speaker 1: voicemail as much, so we need to get the voicemail 609 00:29:27,840 --> 00:29:30,320 Speaker 1: back in action. But if you have a voicemail, I 610 00:29:30,320 --> 00:29:34,200 Speaker 1: would love to hear your failure stories that ended up 611 00:29:34,240 --> 00:29:37,760 Speaker 1: becoming successes because they changed you are or helped you 612 00:29:37,760 --> 00:29:40,160 Speaker 1: get on the right path. That is in the link 613 00:29:40,240 --> 00:29:43,560 Speaker 1: in my bio on Instagram at Velvet's Edge Chip. 614 00:29:43,840 --> 00:29:49,200 Speaker 3: I'm at chip doors. It's Chip dr scch. 615 00:29:48,240 --> 00:29:50,560 Speaker 1: And as you guys go into the weekend and you're 616 00:29:50,560 --> 00:29:52,280 Speaker 1: living on the edge, I was going to try to 617 00:29:52,280 --> 00:29:54,640 Speaker 1: get cute, but it don't have it in me. I 618 00:29:54,640 --> 00:29:56,120 Speaker 1: hope you always remembered. 619 00:29:55,760 --> 00:29:58,760 Speaker 3: Too not fail act casual. 620 00:30:00,120 --> 00:30:07,239 Speaker 1: Bye bye mm hm