1 00:00:02,000 --> 00:00:05,479 Speaker 1: I'm Andrea Gunning and this is a Betrayal bonus episode. 2 00:00:06,360 --> 00:00:08,760 Speaker 1: We know a lot of you have been wondering about Ashley, 3 00:00:09,119 --> 00:00:11,639 Speaker 1: where she is now and how her divorce is going. 4 00:00:12,720 --> 00:00:25,640 Speaker 2: Well, we sat down with her to find out. 5 00:00:27,360 --> 00:00:31,240 Speaker 3: Just start saying Country Roads. 6 00:00:31,640 --> 00:00:34,040 Speaker 1: What you're hearing in the background is a TV crew 7 00:00:36,640 --> 00:00:40,080 Speaker 1: Take one Mark. I'll explain later, but right now we're 8 00:00:40,120 --> 00:00:44,479 Speaker 1: here to get an update from Ashley. I'm so excited 9 00:00:44,479 --> 00:00:47,360 Speaker 1: to be doing this in person. We haven't recorded in 10 00:00:47,400 --> 00:00:48,880 Speaker 1: person in like a year and a half. 11 00:00:49,320 --> 00:00:52,159 Speaker 4: Yeah, it's like a different lifetime for me. 12 00:00:52,840 --> 00:00:55,160 Speaker 1: So much has happened. But today I really want to 13 00:00:55,200 --> 00:00:58,600 Speaker 1: focus on the major updates in your life, and that 14 00:00:58,800 --> 00:01:01,720 Speaker 1: is the topic of tell me a little bit about 15 00:01:01,720 --> 00:01:02,240 Speaker 1: what's going on. 16 00:01:02,640 --> 00:01:06,759 Speaker 4: We've been in mediation for a little over two years now. 17 00:01:07,080 --> 00:01:10,399 Speaker 4: Because of how I was represented in the very beginning, 18 00:01:11,000 --> 00:01:14,880 Speaker 4: there were some things put into the divorce that put 19 00:01:14,880 --> 00:01:18,120 Speaker 4: me at a really big disadvantage now this late in 20 00:01:18,160 --> 00:01:18,559 Speaker 4: the game. 21 00:01:19,080 --> 00:01:20,920 Speaker 1: Wait, so, just as a point of clarity, you've gone 22 00:01:20,920 --> 00:01:24,600 Speaker 1: through two attorneys for this. So the first one you 23 00:01:24,600 --> 00:01:25,400 Speaker 1: weren't aligned. 24 00:01:25,840 --> 00:01:30,679 Speaker 4: No, no, we looked around and I found a new attorney, Laura. 25 00:01:31,000 --> 00:01:34,720 Speaker 4: She's been fabulous in her team. But what it looks 26 00:01:34,840 --> 00:01:39,480 Speaker 4: like to me, as long as Jason is fulfilling what 27 00:01:39,800 --> 00:01:42,440 Speaker 4: the criminal court said he had to fulfill, and he's 28 00:01:42,520 --> 00:01:48,120 Speaker 4: meeting all of those expectations and requirements to be rehabilitated 29 00:01:48,240 --> 00:01:51,600 Speaker 4: and to be able to integrate into society, then the 30 00:01:51,640 --> 00:01:55,600 Speaker 4: family law recognizes that as him no longer being a threat, 31 00:01:55,880 --> 00:01:59,480 Speaker 4: he can have unsupervised visits with our youngest daughter within 32 00:01:59,600 --> 00:02:00,600 Speaker 4: six month months. 33 00:02:00,960 --> 00:02:05,240 Speaker 1: So on the criminal side, he has stipulations of his probation. 34 00:02:05,760 --> 00:02:08,240 Speaker 4: I don't get to know all of that because of 35 00:02:08,360 --> 00:02:14,040 Speaker 4: hippoprivacy laws. Even as far as his psychosexual evaluation, I 36 00:02:14,080 --> 00:02:15,040 Speaker 4: don't get to see. 37 00:02:14,800 --> 00:02:17,000 Speaker 1: That, which is court mandated therapy. 38 00:02:17,240 --> 00:02:20,959 Speaker 4: Yes, court mandated therapy that he will graduate in August 39 00:02:21,120 --> 00:02:21,760 Speaker 4: of this year. 40 00:02:21,960 --> 00:02:22,240 Speaker 1: Wow. 41 00:02:22,760 --> 00:02:27,200 Speaker 4: Yeah. And so what they're wanting is just to go 42 00:02:27,280 --> 00:02:32,480 Speaker 4: by like regular family court, like every other weekend, half holidays, 43 00:02:32,720 --> 00:02:35,240 Speaker 4: things like that, like even sleepovers. 44 00:02:35,480 --> 00:02:40,440 Speaker 1: I imagine not really having insight on how the processes 45 00:02:40,639 --> 00:02:43,880 Speaker 1: with therapy. You're really in the dark. It's a big 46 00:02:44,000 --> 00:02:46,040 Speaker 1: leap of faith to ask somebody to. 47 00:02:46,040 --> 00:02:49,480 Speaker 4: Take I don't have a choice, And to me, it 48 00:02:49,560 --> 00:02:53,760 Speaker 4: seems reckless that any court would allow this but he 49 00:02:53,840 --> 00:02:56,360 Speaker 4: has rights as a father, and there's nothing I can 50 00:02:56,400 --> 00:02:59,760 Speaker 4: do about it. Our court system is putting a ten 51 00:02:59,840 --> 00:03:04,440 Speaker 4: year year old in the position of possibly being a victim. 52 00:03:04,960 --> 00:03:05,880 Speaker 4: How terrible is that? 53 00:03:06,560 --> 00:03:08,799 Speaker 1: How are you emotionally dealing with all of this? 54 00:03:09,560 --> 00:03:12,480 Speaker 4: It pisses me off. It makes me angry. Like I've 55 00:03:12,480 --> 00:03:15,400 Speaker 4: said over and over and over to anyone that will listen. 56 00:03:15,440 --> 00:03:18,440 Speaker 4: As you know, I didn't get the chance to protect 57 00:03:18,440 --> 00:03:21,720 Speaker 4: a Veya. I didn't know I needed to. I know 58 00:03:21,840 --> 00:03:24,839 Speaker 4: I need to protect my youngest daughter. I don't get 59 00:03:24,840 --> 00:03:29,640 Speaker 4: that opportunity. So what I am doing is giving a 60 00:03:29,840 --> 00:03:33,000 Speaker 4: ten year old is much age appropriate information. I can 61 00:03:33,360 --> 00:03:36,480 Speaker 4: to make sure she's aware of her surroundings and she 62 00:03:36,640 --> 00:03:38,840 Speaker 4: knows what it would look like if something was weird, 63 00:03:39,120 --> 00:03:40,880 Speaker 4: and what would she need to do next. 64 00:03:41,440 --> 00:03:43,840 Speaker 1: Did you ever imagine having to have a conversation like 65 00:03:43,880 --> 00:03:45,920 Speaker 1: that with your kid about their own father. 66 00:03:46,760 --> 00:03:50,600 Speaker 4: No, I mean, she loves her father. He's so much 67 00:03:50,680 --> 00:03:53,120 Speaker 4: fun and they do all these really great things together. 68 00:03:53,760 --> 00:03:56,440 Speaker 4: For her to see that and then to hear like, 69 00:03:56,600 --> 00:03:59,640 Speaker 4: you need to be aware, you need to put your 70 00:03:59,680 --> 00:04:00,240 Speaker 4: guard up. 71 00:04:00,960 --> 00:04:02,800 Speaker 1: I can't believe you have to carry that, and I 72 00:04:02,800 --> 00:04:05,640 Speaker 1: can't believe a ten year old has to carry that responsibility. 73 00:04:06,240 --> 00:04:09,320 Speaker 4: Yeah, and I think her being so young now, that's 74 00:04:09,360 --> 00:04:12,720 Speaker 4: why it's so important to have some type of guardian 75 00:04:12,800 --> 00:04:16,760 Speaker 4: edlightem there to make sure that she's represented appropriately. 76 00:04:17,520 --> 00:04:19,080 Speaker 1: I don't think a lot of people know this, But 77 00:04:19,680 --> 00:04:22,800 Speaker 1: what is a guardian at lightem and why did you 78 00:04:23,760 --> 00:04:24,720 Speaker 1: decide to work with one. 79 00:04:24,960 --> 00:04:27,039 Speaker 4: What I was struggling with in the beginning when I 80 00:04:27,120 --> 00:04:31,680 Speaker 4: first hired my new lawyer was I want to do 81 00:04:31,760 --> 00:04:35,840 Speaker 4: what's best for my youngest daughter. So the guardian edl 82 00:04:35,839 --> 00:04:39,480 Speaker 4: item essentially comes in and acts as a lawyer for 83 00:04:39,800 --> 00:04:43,560 Speaker 4: my daughter. He looks at the facts, takes an account 84 00:04:43,920 --> 00:04:46,600 Speaker 4: what's safe for her, what's best for her mental health. 85 00:04:46,839 --> 00:04:49,960 Speaker 4: He'll put in a suggestion and say I recommended this. 86 00:04:50,600 --> 00:04:52,400 Speaker 4: Do I feel like that was a good idea at 87 00:04:52,400 --> 00:04:57,000 Speaker 4: this point? No, I'm not saying guardian ed items aren't valuable, 88 00:04:57,040 --> 00:05:00,600 Speaker 4: because they absolutely are. But they can only ask as 89 00:05:00,640 --> 00:05:03,000 Speaker 4: far as the law will let them. And I didn't 90 00:05:03,040 --> 00:05:05,200 Speaker 4: realize that. I really thought there was going to be 91 00:05:05,240 --> 00:05:09,000 Speaker 4: more of like a human to human parent to parent 92 00:05:09,120 --> 00:05:11,599 Speaker 4: type of thing in there, and it's not. 93 00:05:12,320 --> 00:05:15,960 Speaker 1: I'm really sorry that you're navigating that. What's going on 94 00:05:16,000 --> 00:05:19,200 Speaker 1: with the house. What's going on with the financial aspect 95 00:05:19,240 --> 00:05:19,720 Speaker 1: of everything? 96 00:05:20,720 --> 00:05:22,720 Speaker 4: Early on in the divorce, there were things that were 97 00:05:22,800 --> 00:05:26,320 Speaker 4: drafted and agreed to that I just didn't know, things 98 00:05:26,400 --> 00:05:29,359 Speaker 4: like you pay your legal fees. I pay my legal fees. 99 00:05:30,080 --> 00:05:34,000 Speaker 4: The resource that I was using for my divorce was 100 00:05:34,320 --> 00:05:36,840 Speaker 4: a free service at that time. That seems like a 101 00:05:36,920 --> 00:05:40,360 Speaker 4: no brainer because my legal fees are nothing. Another thing 102 00:05:40,400 --> 00:05:44,440 Speaker 4: that's interesting is Jason had signed the deed of the 103 00:05:44,440 --> 00:05:47,839 Speaker 4: house over to me right after he was arrested. I 104 00:05:47,880 --> 00:05:50,520 Speaker 4: had been working on a refinance on the house, already 105 00:05:50,720 --> 00:05:53,040 Speaker 4: getting our credit where it needs to be, fixing his YadA, 106 00:05:53,080 --> 00:05:56,440 Speaker 4: YadA YadA. During that time, I had received and notice 107 00:05:57,120 --> 00:06:00,960 Speaker 4: that our home had a pending lean on it in 108 00:06:01,040 --> 00:06:05,839 Speaker 4: his name. I went to the gel and told Jason, 109 00:06:06,200 --> 00:06:08,839 Speaker 4: I'm going to lose this house if the mortgage stays 110 00:06:08,839 --> 00:06:11,000 Speaker 4: of the payment that it's at right now. I had 111 00:06:11,040 --> 00:06:13,760 Speaker 4: already at this point, taken out as much of my 112 00:06:13,800 --> 00:06:16,479 Speaker 4: four oh one K and my wroth IRA that I 113 00:06:16,560 --> 00:06:19,240 Speaker 4: could to pay off any debt that we had, his 114 00:06:19,279 --> 00:06:24,280 Speaker 4: medical bills, credit card bills, everything, tens of thousands of dollars. 115 00:06:24,600 --> 00:06:26,839 Speaker 1: So how is this coming to play in the divorce? 116 00:06:26,920 --> 00:06:29,000 Speaker 1: If you're on the DAED and it's your home now. 117 00:06:29,440 --> 00:06:34,080 Speaker 4: Because it's still marital asset. Okay, it doesn't matter whether 118 00:06:34,120 --> 00:06:38,880 Speaker 4: it's debt or income. Those are shared things. And so 119 00:06:39,320 --> 00:06:44,200 Speaker 4: he wants me to sell my home and in his words, 120 00:06:44,200 --> 00:06:46,440 Speaker 4: he wants a fresh start. Where am I going to 121 00:06:46,520 --> 00:06:50,360 Speaker 4: go when the homes around my area are going for 122 00:06:50,480 --> 00:06:53,320 Speaker 4: three times the amount? There's nowhere for me to go 123 00:06:53,960 --> 00:06:54,799 Speaker 4: with my children. 124 00:06:55,480 --> 00:06:58,679 Speaker 1: He's all this support to get his life back together 125 00:06:58,760 --> 00:07:01,360 Speaker 1: and on track. You've had to pick up yourself by 126 00:07:01,360 --> 00:07:04,159 Speaker 1: your own bootstraps, right since everything went. 127 00:07:04,040 --> 00:07:06,480 Speaker 4: Down right, And don't get me wrong, like my family's 128 00:07:06,520 --> 00:07:11,600 Speaker 4: been wonderful, I'm supposed to be established. It's not what 129 00:07:11,640 --> 00:07:13,680 Speaker 4: I was supposed to be doing. It's not what was 130 00:07:13,720 --> 00:07:16,360 Speaker 4: in my plan. None of this was a part of 131 00:07:16,640 --> 00:07:17,920 Speaker 4: what I was supposed. 132 00:07:17,520 --> 00:07:21,120 Speaker 1: To be doing. If he was truly sorry and remorseful 133 00:07:21,200 --> 00:07:25,760 Speaker 1: for what he's done to you, avea your family, what 134 00:07:25,760 --> 00:07:26,760 Speaker 1: do you think that would look like? 135 00:07:27,960 --> 00:07:30,560 Speaker 4: What he could do if you cared about our well being? 136 00:07:30,640 --> 00:07:31,800 Speaker 4: He would just walk away. 137 00:07:32,480 --> 00:07:34,840 Speaker 1: Anything that comes your way I know you can handle. 138 00:07:36,520 --> 00:07:38,240 Speaker 1: Will you make sure to give me an update when 139 00:07:38,240 --> 00:07:41,400 Speaker 1: your divorce is finalized so we can tell the audience. 140 00:07:42,040 --> 00:07:45,680 Speaker 4: Absolutely, hopefully we're cheering. You can have a glass of 141 00:07:45,760 --> 00:07:47,880 Speaker 4: champagne where you're at, and I'll have one where I'm at. 142 00:07:48,560 --> 00:07:50,640 Speaker 1: I'll send you a bottle of boove done. 143 00:07:50,760 --> 00:07:51,600 Speaker 4: Okay, Okay. 144 00:07:52,880 --> 00:07:55,600 Speaker 1: I really hope we can send her an entire case 145 00:07:55,680 --> 00:07:58,800 Speaker 1: of champagne soon, and as soon as there are updates, 146 00:07:58,920 --> 00:08:02,080 Speaker 1: we'll keep you guys posted. In the meantime, we'll get 147 00:08:02,120 --> 00:08:16,320 Speaker 1: an update from Ashley's attorney, Laura next. I always have 148 00:08:16,360 --> 00:08:20,280 Speaker 1: to be reminded that family court and criminal court operate separately. 149 00:08:20,880 --> 00:08:23,480 Speaker 1: So Ashley and I wanted to sit down with her attorney, 150 00:08:23,520 --> 00:08:27,680 Speaker 1: Laura and understand how those two separate systems are impacting 151 00:08:27,720 --> 00:08:31,720 Speaker 1: Ashley and her divorce, specifically when it comes to custody. 152 00:08:32,480 --> 00:08:36,160 Speaker 4: Hi, Laura, Hi, so glad to have you. I wanted 153 00:08:36,200 --> 00:08:38,440 Speaker 4: to introduce you to Andrea. 154 00:08:39,040 --> 00:08:40,880 Speaker 1: Hi Laura, it's so nice to meet you. 155 00:08:41,360 --> 00:08:42,800 Speaker 3: Hi. Andrea, nice to meet you too. 156 00:08:43,440 --> 00:08:46,679 Speaker 4: So just to give you a little backstory, Andrea is 157 00:08:46,880 --> 00:08:50,840 Speaker 4: segal who did the podcast with me and been like 158 00:08:50,880 --> 00:08:57,040 Speaker 4: a huge part of just my overall journey through Jason's 159 00:08:57,080 --> 00:09:02,040 Speaker 4: criminal case and even with my divorce. So I wanted 160 00:09:02,040 --> 00:09:04,320 Speaker 4: to get you guys introduced. So we could have a 161 00:09:04,320 --> 00:09:07,040 Speaker 4: conversation about how our divorce is going. 162 00:09:07,480 --> 00:09:10,439 Speaker 1: Yeah, Lara, when Ashley first wrote in, I think the 163 00:09:10,480 --> 00:09:14,720 Speaker 1: subject line was my future ex husband and that was 164 00:09:14,720 --> 00:09:18,679 Speaker 1: two years ago and you're still working through the divorce. 165 00:09:19,080 --> 00:09:21,760 Speaker 1: But I just wanted to ask you questions about where 166 00:09:21,760 --> 00:09:24,200 Speaker 1: you guys are now and what you're currently working to 167 00:09:24,320 --> 00:09:28,040 Speaker 1: negotiate for Ashley's behalf sure, no problem. What are the 168 00:09:28,080 --> 00:09:30,840 Speaker 1: things that you guys have to navigate in terms of 169 00:09:30,880 --> 00:09:34,839 Speaker 1: custody and financials. Just give me a little bit of 170 00:09:34,880 --> 00:09:36,440 Speaker 1: a background of all the things that you guys have 171 00:09:36,480 --> 00:09:39,400 Speaker 1: to take into consideration, and why family court is different 172 00:09:39,400 --> 00:09:41,720 Speaker 1: than criminal court and why they're kind of treated separately. 173 00:09:42,160 --> 00:09:44,560 Speaker 3: So the way it works in Utah is similar to 174 00:09:44,600 --> 00:09:47,520 Speaker 3: most states where there are separate court systems for criminal 175 00:09:47,559 --> 00:09:52,720 Speaker 3: cases than civil cases. So family law, divorce cases, custody adoption, 176 00:09:52,840 --> 00:09:55,920 Speaker 3: they fall under the category of civil law, which means 177 00:09:55,920 --> 00:09:58,920 Speaker 3: that they're heard by a district court. Now that same 178 00:09:59,000 --> 00:10:02,720 Speaker 3: court can hear criminal cases, but they're entirely different cases. 179 00:10:02,960 --> 00:10:05,440 Speaker 3: They don't get linked together, and then they are just 180 00:10:05,480 --> 00:10:08,640 Speaker 3: different systems. They have different standards, they have different laws 181 00:10:08,679 --> 00:10:11,640 Speaker 3: that are applicable, and they don't cross so there's not 182 00:10:11,760 --> 00:10:14,200 Speaker 3: really a mechanism that you can join the two cases together. 183 00:10:15,120 --> 00:10:17,640 Speaker 3: Ashley's case is a little bit easier in that we 184 00:10:17,760 --> 00:10:20,440 Speaker 3: have a criminal conviction, we have criminal charges that he 185 00:10:20,520 --> 00:10:23,520 Speaker 3: served time for, and so that helps in terms of 186 00:10:23,520 --> 00:10:28,400 Speaker 3: the standards that we apply for determining custody. But unfortunately 187 00:10:28,760 --> 00:10:31,559 Speaker 3: it doesn't really translate over to the money side of it, 188 00:10:31,679 --> 00:10:33,559 Speaker 3: which is very frustrating in this case. 189 00:10:34,080 --> 00:10:35,840 Speaker 1: What are some of the hurdles that you guys have 190 00:10:35,920 --> 00:10:37,680 Speaker 1: faced in this divorce. 191 00:10:38,320 --> 00:10:41,600 Speaker 3: Ashley started this divorce off with a different law firm, 192 00:10:41,679 --> 00:10:43,720 Speaker 3: so by the time we came on the case, there 193 00:10:43,760 --> 00:10:45,720 Speaker 3: already were a lot of things in motion. There were 194 00:10:45,760 --> 00:10:47,640 Speaker 3: already a lot of things that we couldn't go back 195 00:10:47,640 --> 00:10:50,439 Speaker 3: and fix and change. So it's always an uphill battle 196 00:10:50,440 --> 00:10:54,200 Speaker 3: where certain things have already been decided. It's also been 197 00:10:54,240 --> 00:10:57,480 Speaker 3: a really difficult case because I think Jason and his attorney, 198 00:10:57,800 --> 00:11:02,360 Speaker 3: we're making representations to ash and to our firm that 199 00:11:02,559 --> 00:11:05,360 Speaker 3: Jason was agreeing to certain things. You know, for instance, 200 00:11:05,400 --> 00:11:07,520 Speaker 3: that Ashley could have the house without there being a 201 00:11:07,559 --> 00:11:09,480 Speaker 3: problem and all the equity in the house, and then 202 00:11:09,600 --> 00:11:11,440 Speaker 3: when it came right down to it and we were 203 00:11:11,520 --> 00:11:13,920 Speaker 3: drafting it up all of a sudden he had changed 204 00:11:13,920 --> 00:11:16,800 Speaker 3: his mind, and he's insisting that he be entitled to 205 00:11:16,840 --> 00:11:19,680 Speaker 3: half the equity. We have different strategies in place on 206 00:11:19,800 --> 00:11:21,960 Speaker 3: trying to figure out a way that she can keep 207 00:11:22,000 --> 00:11:24,160 Speaker 3: the house and pay him out a portion of his 208 00:11:24,160 --> 00:11:27,439 Speaker 3: equity or equity over time, or trade it for something else. 209 00:11:28,080 --> 00:11:30,560 Speaker 3: So I have confidence that she'll be able to stay 210 00:11:30,559 --> 00:11:32,480 Speaker 3: in the house. You know, that's our goal, to keep 211 00:11:32,520 --> 00:11:34,960 Speaker 3: some stability for her, instability for her kids. 212 00:11:35,360 --> 00:11:37,480 Speaker 1: What else are you guys pushing for in the divorce. 213 00:11:37,960 --> 00:11:40,160 Speaker 3: The other area that I think is the biggest area 214 00:11:40,160 --> 00:11:42,800 Speaker 3: of contention is whether or not he's going to at 215 00:11:42,800 --> 00:11:46,319 Speaker 3: some point be allowed unsupervised visits. He's been pretty insistent 216 00:11:46,520 --> 00:11:49,960 Speaker 3: that he thinks that should happen relatively soon and that 217 00:11:50,120 --> 00:11:54,280 Speaker 3: he's not a risk, and now is using a not 218 00:11:54,480 --> 00:11:57,240 Speaker 3: surprising tactic of saying that this was like a one 219 00:11:57,280 --> 00:12:00,240 Speaker 3: off thing that's never going to happen again because of 220 00:12:00,280 --> 00:12:03,319 Speaker 3: some interaction of some medication he was on at the time, 221 00:12:04,120 --> 00:12:07,120 Speaker 3: which is relatively common in cases that we're dealing with. 222 00:12:07,280 --> 00:12:10,520 Speaker 3: There tends to be blame, oftentimes placed on something else 223 00:12:10,600 --> 00:12:13,560 Speaker 3: or someone else. It's unfortunate because I think there's been 224 00:12:13,600 --> 00:12:17,480 Speaker 3: a perceptible shift in his attitude where now he's trying 225 00:12:17,520 --> 00:12:21,679 Speaker 3: to place blame and not take responsibility and accountability, and 226 00:12:21,840 --> 00:12:24,400 Speaker 3: part of that has been him pushing for unsupervised visits. 227 00:12:24,520 --> 00:12:26,439 Speaker 3: So I think our goal is to try to keep 228 00:12:26,480 --> 00:12:29,280 Speaker 3: visit supervised for as long as possible, and then if 229 00:12:29,280 --> 00:12:32,560 Speaker 3: we transition to unsupervised visits, to make sure that those 230 00:12:32,640 --> 00:12:33,480 Speaker 3: visits are safe. 231 00:12:33,520 --> 00:12:37,120 Speaker 1: Moving forward, you guys are going to trial, but you 232 00:12:37,200 --> 00:12:38,960 Speaker 1: may not have to go to a full blown trial. 233 00:12:39,000 --> 00:12:39,880 Speaker 1: What's the difference. 234 00:12:40,360 --> 00:12:42,360 Speaker 3: There's all sorts of issues that have to get resolved 235 00:12:42,360 --> 00:12:44,640 Speaker 3: to get a divorce, so like custody and parent time, 236 00:12:44,679 --> 00:12:48,920 Speaker 3: and dividing retirement accounts and dividing house equity in this case, 237 00:12:48,960 --> 00:12:51,000 Speaker 3: some of those things we either have agreements on or 238 00:12:51,000 --> 00:12:53,480 Speaker 3: we're pretty close to agreements on. So if we can 239 00:12:53,520 --> 00:12:57,040 Speaker 3: avoid trial, that's always ideal because trials are really expensive 240 00:12:57,200 --> 00:13:01,560 Speaker 3: and just really in a sense, they cause victims or 241 00:13:01,559 --> 00:13:05,040 Speaker 3: individuals to relive trauma. In my view, you know, after 242 00:13:05,080 --> 00:13:07,760 Speaker 3: doing a family a lot for twenty years, trials almost 243 00:13:08,240 --> 00:13:11,280 Speaker 3: always make it more difficult for people to move on 244 00:13:11,400 --> 00:13:15,560 Speaker 3: with their lives, just because it's so conflictual and doesn't 245 00:13:15,600 --> 00:13:18,240 Speaker 3: really allow for healing to occur. So if we can 246 00:13:18,280 --> 00:13:21,360 Speaker 3: get items settled where the parties come to an agreement, 247 00:13:21,600 --> 00:13:24,360 Speaker 3: everyone feels better about it, and people are more likely 248 00:13:24,400 --> 00:13:27,600 Speaker 3: to follow orders that they agree on than orders that 249 00:13:27,640 --> 00:13:28,800 Speaker 3: a court just dictates. 250 00:13:29,480 --> 00:13:32,280 Speaker 1: Do you feel like you guys are close to coming 251 00:13:32,360 --> 00:13:33,880 Speaker 1: to a middle ground to avoid trial. 252 00:13:34,040 --> 00:13:36,199 Speaker 3: I would give it ninety percent odds that we agree 253 00:13:36,240 --> 00:13:39,120 Speaker 3: without going to trial. In terms of the timing, who 254 00:13:39,160 --> 00:13:41,160 Speaker 3: knows when that's going to happen. My guests would be 255 00:13:41,200 --> 00:13:42,640 Speaker 3: at some point during the summer. 256 00:13:43,400 --> 00:13:45,600 Speaker 4: I don't know if personally you've dealt with cases that 257 00:13:45,640 --> 00:13:48,320 Speaker 4: are similar to mine in nature as far as, like, 258 00:13:48,760 --> 00:13:51,960 Speaker 4: you know, his criminal case really doesn't have any say 259 00:13:51,960 --> 00:13:55,480 Speaker 4: in like what happens financially and and divorce. Is that 260 00:13:55,600 --> 00:13:56,840 Speaker 4: usually pretty common? 261 00:13:57,000 --> 00:13:59,679 Speaker 3: Yeah, I think there is a lot of surprise that 262 00:13:59,720 --> 00:14:03,040 Speaker 3: people have. They just kind of assume that courts are 263 00:14:03,080 --> 00:14:08,200 Speaker 3: about creating fairness and about creating sort of equal situations. 264 00:14:08,280 --> 00:14:11,640 Speaker 3: And to be clear, courts do have a lot of discretion, 265 00:14:11,880 --> 00:14:15,240 Speaker 3: so they can award things differently than fifty to fifty, 266 00:14:16,040 --> 00:14:18,920 Speaker 3: but the majority of the time it's just equal, regardless 267 00:14:18,960 --> 00:14:21,400 Speaker 3: of the reasons for the divorce or who was that 268 00:14:21,600 --> 00:14:25,200 Speaker 3: fault or who had criminal charges like it just really 269 00:14:25,240 --> 00:14:28,520 Speaker 3: doesn't impact the money part of it, and it feels 270 00:14:28,720 --> 00:14:32,880 Speaker 3: very frustrating and not fair because it's not. And Ashley's 271 00:14:32,920 --> 00:14:36,200 Speaker 3: done just an amazing job in terms of really pulling 272 00:14:36,200 --> 00:14:39,440 Speaker 3: herself up and fighting to support her family and keep 273 00:14:39,480 --> 00:14:43,120 Speaker 3: them stable through this entire process. There's a lot of 274 00:14:43,160 --> 00:14:45,640 Speaker 3: women and a lot of victims of crimes that aren't 275 00:14:45,680 --> 00:14:48,080 Speaker 3: able to do that, and I really respect that, and 276 00:14:48,120 --> 00:14:50,080 Speaker 3: I think you've done a great job in that regard. 277 00:14:50,600 --> 00:14:53,840 Speaker 4: Well, I appreciate it. I said this to you and 278 00:14:53,880 --> 00:14:56,320 Speaker 4: one of your colleagues not too long ago, but I 279 00:14:56,440 --> 00:14:59,120 Speaker 4: told you that you guys should wear capes because you 280 00:14:59,120 --> 00:15:00,240 Speaker 4: guys are superhero. 281 00:15:01,200 --> 00:15:05,440 Speaker 1: I'll be patiently waiting to see how everything gets resolved. So, Laura, 282 00:15:05,480 --> 00:15:08,080 Speaker 1: thanks for joining us today. I really appreciate it. 283 00:15:08,320 --> 00:15:10,160 Speaker 3: Yeah, thank you both of you, And thanks you guys 284 00:15:10,200 --> 00:15:13,240 Speaker 3: for being so supportive of Ashley and helping to have 285 00:15:13,360 --> 00:15:15,560 Speaker 3: her story be heard. I think it's so important, So 286 00:15:15,760 --> 00:15:16,520 Speaker 3: thanks everybody. 287 00:15:17,880 --> 00:15:22,160 Speaker 1: It's complicated, and thankfully Ashley now has someone truly fighting 288 00:15:22,160 --> 00:15:24,920 Speaker 1: for her. I wanted to thank all of you our 289 00:15:24,920 --> 00:15:28,640 Speaker 1: Betrayal listeners as we prepare to launch another season of Betrayal, 290 00:15:29,040 --> 00:15:33,560 Speaker 1: and in addition, we have big updates for the Betrayal community. First, 291 00:15:33,800 --> 00:15:36,920 Speaker 1: we're thrilled to announce what's coming your way. In season 292 00:15:36,960 --> 00:15:41,400 Speaker 1: three of Betrayal, when Stacy laid eyes on doctor Justin Rutherford, 293 00:15:41,520 --> 00:15:43,880 Speaker 1: she was sure that she was looking at her soulmate. 294 00:15:44,520 --> 00:15:47,680 Speaker 1: They fell in love and life was perfect. But this 295 00:15:47,800 --> 00:15:53,000 Speaker 1: family doctor, beloved father, and treasured husband had dark secrets. 296 00:15:53,600 --> 00:15:55,600 Speaker 1: The man who had sworn an oath to do no 297 00:15:55,720 --> 00:15:59,960 Speaker 1: harm would go to great links, using any means necessary 298 00:16:00,480 --> 00:16:04,920 Speaker 1: to save himself. Listen to Betrayal Season three on iHeartRadio 299 00:16:05,080 --> 00:16:08,880 Speaker 1: or wherever you get your podcasts on May twenty third. Second, 300 00:16:09,000 --> 00:16:12,520 Speaker 1: the response from the first two seasons has been overwhelming. 301 00:16:12,920 --> 00:16:15,560 Speaker 1: Many of you have shared your stories of betrayal and deception. 302 00:16:16,120 --> 00:16:19,560 Speaker 1: After reading thousands of your comments, messages, and emails, we're 303 00:16:19,560 --> 00:16:23,920 Speaker 1: pleased to announce the launch of Betrayal's weekly series about 304 00:16:23,920 --> 00:16:26,680 Speaker 1: the people we trust the most and the deceptions that 305 00:16:26,760 --> 00:16:32,040 Speaker 1: change everything. This new series debuts end of July. Lastly, 306 00:16:32,400 --> 00:16:36,360 Speaker 1: because of your overwhelming support, Betrayal Season one became the 307 00:16:36,480 --> 00:16:39,840 Speaker 1: number one podcast in the world and was turned into 308 00:16:39,840 --> 00:16:44,320 Speaker 1: an ABC News Studios and Hulu docuseries. We are excited 309 00:16:44,360 --> 00:16:47,040 Speaker 1: to share that Ashley's story has also been turned into 310 00:16:47,080 --> 00:16:50,320 Speaker 1: a docu series that, like season one, is a must watch. 311 00:16:51,240 --> 00:16:56,400 Speaker 1: Stream Betrayal season two this summer on Hulu. If you 312 00:16:56,440 --> 00:16:59,320 Speaker 1: want to contact the Betrayal team, email us at Betrayal 313 00:16:59,360 --> 00:17:03,600 Speaker 1: pod at GA. To report a case of child sexual exploitation, 314 00:17:04,119 --> 00:17:07,159 Speaker 1: call the National Center for Missing and Exploited Children's cyber 315 00:17:07,240 --> 00:17:11,320 Speaker 1: tipline at one eight hundred the Lost. If you or 316 00:17:11,320 --> 00:17:13,560 Speaker 1: someone you know was worried about their sexual thoughts and 317 00:17:13,560 --> 00:17:17,200 Speaker 1: feelings towards children, reach out to Stop It now dot org. 318 00:17:18,280 --> 00:17:21,080 Speaker 1: Betrayal is a production of Glass Podcasts, a division of 319 00:17:21,119 --> 00:17:24,960 Speaker 1: Glass Entertainment Group, in partnership with iHeart Podcasts. The show 320 00:17:25,000 --> 00:17:28,280 Speaker 1: was executive produced by Nancy Glass and Jennifer Fason, hosted 321 00:17:28,320 --> 00:17:31,520 Speaker 1: and produced by me Andrea Gunning, written and produced by 322 00:17:31,600 --> 00:17:35,360 Speaker 1: Carrie Hartman, and also produced by Ben Fetterman and associate 323 00:17:35,400 --> 00:17:39,840 Speaker 1: producer Christin Melcurie. Our iHeart team is Ali Perry and 324 00:17:39,960 --> 00:17:45,399 Speaker 1: Jessica Crimecheck. Audio editing and mixing by Nico Aaruca and 325 00:17:45,480 --> 00:17:50,680 Speaker 1: Matt Dolvecchio. Betrayal's theme composed by Oliver Bains. Music library 326 00:17:50,760 --> 00:17:54,880 Speaker 1: provided by My Music. For more podcasts from iHeart, visit 327 00:17:54,960 --> 00:17:58,880 Speaker 1: the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, wherever you get your podcasts.