WEBVTT - Hanson 0:00:08.680 --> 0:00:13.079 Welcome, Welcome, Welcome back to the Bob Wefsets podcast. My 0:00:13.280 --> 0:00:18.240 guests today are Isaac, Zach and Taylor Handsome, collectively known 0:00:18.280 --> 0:00:24.680 as Handsome Gentlemen. You're leaving imminently for European tour. What 0:00:24.720 --> 0:00:27.280 does Hansen mean? What kind of audience do you have 0:00:27.320 --> 0:00:27.800 in Europe? 0:00:28.400 --> 0:00:30.680 Well, first of all, great to be on the podcast 0:00:30.680 --> 0:00:31.680 with you and. 0:00:31.760 --> 0:00:34.040 We, you know, very comparable around the world. 0:00:34.080 --> 0:00:36.480 You know, we play theaters some places, you know, big 0:00:36.520 --> 0:00:41.040 amphitheaters and most places around here. Yeah, I mean, historically 0:00:41.080 --> 0:00:43.160 it's about half of our audiences in the US, about 0:00:43.159 --> 0:00:47.680 half of our audience outside the US. The lucky thing, 0:00:47.760 --> 0:00:49.720 I mean, the gift a few bands have of having 0:00:49.760 --> 0:00:51.680 sort of a breakout early that hits a lot more 0:00:51.720 --> 0:00:54.440 places than your home. Yeah, but you got to work 0:00:54.480 --> 0:00:56.360 at it if you want to continue to be able 0:00:56.400 --> 0:00:57.840 to get to those places, you got to you know, 0:00:57.920 --> 0:00:58.840 get yourself out there. 0:00:59.120 --> 0:00:59.279 Yeah. 0:00:59.320 --> 0:01:03.640 It's always most impressive to me that the music speaks 0:01:03.640 --> 0:01:07.479 to people who have no English language other than the music. 0:01:07.480 --> 0:01:09.000 Of course, when you started with a song that is 0:01:09.040 --> 0:01:11.800 no word, everybody it's. 0:01:11.640 --> 0:01:18.319 The same chip. Maybe maybe that's the initial secret languge. Yeah, 0:01:18.319 --> 0:01:21.520 but this is mostly a Scandinavian tour. So it's kind 0:01:21.560 --> 0:01:25.240 of fun because you know, your your blood goes back 0:01:25.240 --> 0:01:26.280 to Scandinavia, so you. 0:01:26.240 --> 0:01:27.160 Get to feel like you're going home. 0:01:27.319 --> 0:01:30.520 We're basically the way we've identified where you're basically Danish, 0:01:30.640 --> 0:01:32.240 you know, not too far back. 0:01:33.720 --> 0:01:36.840 Okay, let's go back to something you said earlier. You 0:01:36.880 --> 0:01:39.760 said you got to work it. Yes, what is working it? 0:01:40.040 --> 0:01:40.320 Entail? 0:01:41.040 --> 0:01:42.840 Well, I mean so for for us, I mean for 0:01:42.880 --> 0:01:44.880 the hands, hands and stories. We started very very young. 0:01:44.959 --> 0:01:47.120 We were inspired by rock and roll, inspired by soul 0:01:47.240 --> 0:01:49.520 music and records, and we thought, hey, we can do this. 0:01:49.640 --> 0:01:51.560 You know these they're all teenagers, right, I mean, we 0:01:51.600 --> 0:01:53.760 don't need to wait. So we we got lucky, got 0:01:53.800 --> 0:01:56.760 turned down by everybody in the industry, finally got signed, 0:01:57.240 --> 0:01:59.800 had this breakout success on our first record, which is 0:01:59.880 --> 0:02:03.520 very very rare, but pretty quickly we just we knew 0:02:03.560 --> 0:02:06.960 that we were going to continue to have to really engage. 0:02:07.200 --> 0:02:09.400 This wasn't about just hits. It was about community and 0:02:09.400 --> 0:02:12.200 of a fan base. And so twenty years ago, on 0:02:12.200 --> 0:02:15.320 our third record, we left and started on label to 0:02:15.360 --> 0:02:17.400 build something that we knew, you know, it was more 0:02:17.400 --> 0:02:19.720 about the just the sustainability of what what do you 0:02:19.760 --> 0:02:21.800 want to do over the time. You can't have corporate 0:02:22.639 --> 0:02:26.280 corporate earnings every quarter determine what kind of album you make. 0:02:26.800 --> 0:02:29.160 And so working it means getting on the road. Working 0:02:29.480 --> 0:02:33.440 means communicating online with our online fan club community. You know. 0:02:33.480 --> 0:02:37.079 Working it means doing doing great work. I mean kind 0:02:37.120 --> 0:02:39.600 of not sitting sitting back and just kind of going, hey, 0:02:39.600 --> 0:02:41.000 this is going to keep coming to us. 0:02:41.200 --> 0:02:43.280 I would I would get a little bit more specific too, 0:02:43.320 --> 0:02:45.320 and I would say that working it looks like in 0:02:45.400 --> 0:02:48.079 twenty twenty two, you know, on that Red Green, Blue tour, 0:02:48.160 --> 0:02:50.919 when we went out, you know, doing one hundred shows 0:02:50.919 --> 0:02:53.320 in six months, you know, squeezing. 0:02:52.880 --> 0:02:54.920 All that in or around the five countries. 0:02:55.000 --> 0:02:57.919 Yeah, fifty shows outside the US, fifty shows in the US. 0:02:58.200 --> 0:03:00.960 And starting off, like as Ta said, back to the 0:03:01.040 --> 0:03:04.560 you know third record, when you know, when you're having 0:03:04.600 --> 0:03:07.760 to prove yourself again to people and keep the career alive, 0:03:07.840 --> 0:03:09.760 you say, well, it doesn't matter if people don't believe 0:03:09.800 --> 0:03:12.440 it is, will play wherever we have to play. And 0:03:12.520 --> 0:03:14.079 so you just go out and you say no, we're 0:03:14.080 --> 0:03:16.480 going to let the music prove itself and we're going 0:03:16.520 --> 0:03:18.960 to let the fans show up and luckily they've shown up, 0:03:18.960 --> 0:03:21.760 and luckily, for the most part, the music is still 0:03:22.320 --> 0:03:22.960 speaking to them. 0:03:23.880 --> 0:03:27.720 They're speaking more literally. I would say working it in 0:03:27.760 --> 0:03:31.160 the song sense. Everybody's listened to a song and got 0:03:31.360 --> 0:03:35.120 thirty or forty five seconds in and said you lost me, right, 0:03:35.200 --> 0:03:38.680 I think as a band, as somebody going on stage, 0:03:38.720 --> 0:03:44.040 as somebody meeting fans every night, working it means you're 0:03:44.120 --> 0:03:46.200 forty five seconds in and you're still coming up with 0:03:46.320 --> 0:03:48.840 new ways to connect people, new things to draw people. 0:03:49.160 --> 0:03:52.160 And it's not I hope the intro works and the 0:03:52.240 --> 0:03:52.720 rest will be. 0:03:52.760 --> 0:03:59.040 Okay, Okay, let's start with the Scandinavian tour. Why Scandinavia 0:03:59.320 --> 0:04:01.760 is opposed to any other place on the planet. 0:04:02.320 --> 0:04:06.040 Well, honestly, most mostly we've been we spend a lot 0:04:06.040 --> 0:04:08.520 more time in Latin America, a lot more time in Australia, 0:04:09.080 --> 0:04:13.040 a lot more time into States, and we're we're responding 0:04:13.080 --> 0:04:15.800 to specific interest at this point in our career where 0:04:15.800 --> 0:04:16.320 we're you know. 0:04:16.360 --> 0:04:17.960 Just a promoter reached out and said, I've got a 0:04:17.960 --> 0:04:19.640 group of shows, would you guys do it? And so 0:04:19.720 --> 0:04:20.839 we're going out and doing it. 0:04:20.960 --> 0:04:23.640 Well, it's rare to get to do multiple concerts, you know, 0:04:23.880 --> 0:04:27.039 in a community that's you know, smaller than you know, 0:04:27.640 --> 0:04:30.280 it's it's about Oklahoma population. I think some of these 0:04:30.279 --> 0:04:34.480 countries Doorway, it's you know, in Finland. But but it's 0:04:34.520 --> 0:04:36.960 it's a you know, sometimes it's responding. 0:04:36.560 --> 0:04:39.359 It's looking at something and you say, what would it 0:04:39.440 --> 0:04:41.760 mean if that was a new kind of home for us, 0:04:41.839 --> 0:04:43.720 if that was a place where we could grow that 0:04:43.760 --> 0:04:46.279 fan base. And so we're going to go be over there. 0:04:46.320 --> 0:04:49.080 We're going to go put the time into these fans 0:04:49.160 --> 0:04:54.240 and and build relationships and build experiences and see see 0:04:54.279 --> 0:04:55.680 what happens. 0:04:55.160 --> 0:05:00.159 Yeah, okay, so how many countries? How many dates? 0:05:00.560 --> 0:05:01.919 Oh wow, Well. 0:05:01.600 --> 0:05:04.679 With this particular one, it's actually mostly in Norway. 0:05:04.960 --> 0:05:08.960 Yeah, this is Finland and Norway. This this is sort 0:05:09.000 --> 0:05:11.880 of an interesting tour. This is an off year, I 0:05:11.920 --> 0:05:14.200 would say for us. By the end of the year, 0:05:15.120 --> 0:05:18.600 we'll have done about forty shows in the US and 0:05:18.640 --> 0:05:21.920 this is about twelve shows in. 0:05:21.960 --> 0:05:23.719 Norway that we'll do in Finland. 0:05:23.800 --> 0:05:28.000 Yeah, in Finland. So it's it's an interesting year because 0:05:28.040 --> 0:05:30.000 you have the album years and you have the non 0:05:30.040 --> 0:05:32.839 album years, and how do you continue to tell stories, 0:05:33.480 --> 0:05:35.919 connect with things from your past. You go like, we 0:05:36.000 --> 0:05:38.240 are a band of a generation, a band of a 0:05:38.279 --> 0:05:41.800 decade associated with nineties and two thousand, So how do 0:05:41.839 --> 0:05:44.800 you sort of use those kind of connections but also 0:05:45.000 --> 0:05:48.000 continue to invite people to new things. I would say 0:05:48.000 --> 0:05:49.440 it's a typical I see typical. 0:05:49.480 --> 0:05:51.880 When you do our last full sort of real world tour, 0:05:51.960 --> 0:05:56.400 it was twenty five countries, one hundred dates. Yeah, you know, 0:05:56.520 --> 0:06:00.279 and it's probably you know again, Latin American fans amazing, 0:06:00.360 --> 0:06:04.400 they have a reputation, but Australian fans and we've gotten 0:06:04.400 --> 0:06:06.400 to spend a good amount of time in Europe. But 0:06:06.520 --> 0:06:08.320 when you when you can reach new places, a lot 0:06:08.320 --> 0:06:11.080 of times, you know, you're like I was saying, Isaac 0:06:11.160 --> 0:06:13.120 was saying, you have to be strategic sometimes to say 0:06:13.120 --> 0:06:15.560 we're going to play some places we haven't played as much, 0:06:15.560 --> 0:06:17.320 so we can come back to those places. 0:06:17.360 --> 0:06:19.440 And that's the touring life, you know. 0:06:20.720 --> 0:06:23.800 Okay, let's just because this is happening, let's continue to 0:06:23.839 --> 0:06:30.640 focus on Scandinavia. So in Norway, other than the dates themselves, 0:06:31.120 --> 0:06:32.640 what promotion will you do? 0:06:35.120 --> 0:06:35.440 Well? 0:06:35.640 --> 0:06:38.680 This is kind of an off cycle, so we mostly 0:06:38.839 --> 0:06:41.000 in this particular case, we probably won't be doing an 0:06:41.000 --> 0:06:44.560 extraordinary amount of promotion. A lot of it's social media 0:06:44.640 --> 0:06:48.279 sharing and a global communication with fans. I mean, for instance, 0:06:48.360 --> 0:06:48.600 let me. 0:06:48.560 --> 0:06:51.960 Let me be very specific here, you're in Scandinavia. The 0:06:52.000 --> 0:06:54.800 promoter reached out, we could go and play the twelve 0:06:54.880 --> 0:06:57.880 odd dates, or will you say I want to do 0:06:57.920 --> 0:07:00.120 an in store I want to do the rate you 0:07:00.320 --> 0:07:01.919 I want to do all that other stuff, or is 0:07:01.960 --> 0:07:04.480 showing up at the gig basically all. 0:07:04.360 --> 0:07:09.400 You're gonna do well normally, normally, this Bob, you got 0:07:09.480 --> 0:07:11.640 us on this one. I mean, because it's not an 0:07:11.680 --> 0:07:14.800 album year. This is not an in store kind of thing. 0:07:14.880 --> 0:07:18.400 This is a see what happens, This is a you know, 0:07:18.440 --> 0:07:21.760 we're we're really in the process. Probably next year or 0:07:21.760 --> 0:07:23.920 the year after that will be the next really big 0:07:23.960 --> 0:07:27.520 push for an album. And so now, honestly, it's more 0:07:27.600 --> 0:07:32.560 like go to a fjord, get yourself inspired for what 0:07:32.760 --> 0:07:36.400 you want to put into the next project, and and 0:07:36.520 --> 0:07:39.200 plan for those next things. In any other year, it 0:07:39.240 --> 0:07:43.360 would be you'd go, how many stores can we show up? 0:07:43.360 --> 0:07:45.600 How many radio stations can we be in? I mean 0:07:46.000 --> 0:07:49.720 every morning, if there's an opportunity, that's the way we 0:07:49.800 --> 0:07:50.120 would be. 0:07:50.480 --> 0:07:54.640 Yeah, normally, you know, I will say specifically though, in 0:07:54.680 --> 0:07:58.720 the fall, we've got this Underneath Experience tour. This starts 0:07:58.720 --> 0:08:02.920 in September or actually beginning of October, and that's in 0:08:03.080 --> 0:08:06.600 twelve cities across the US, and that's two cities or 0:08:07.240 --> 0:08:10.120 two nights in every city, and it's an acoustic show 0:08:10.120 --> 0:08:13.080 and an electric show. And that is for this new 0:08:13.160 --> 0:08:16.880 project that we're putting out, which is a anniversary edition 0:08:17.080 --> 0:08:18.760 of the album Underneath. 0:08:18.760 --> 0:08:20.720 The twenty record we put out first. 0:08:21.440 --> 0:08:24.400 Calling it Underneath Complete, and we've added, you know, a 0:08:24.440 --> 0:08:28.400 bunch of demos and things that did not make the record, 0:08:28.440 --> 0:08:30.480 demos of songs that didn't make the record. We've also 0:08:30.560 --> 0:08:34.080 done a couple, yeah, a couple of new recordings. We've 0:08:34.080 --> 0:08:36.520 got a recording of the song Pink Moon by Nick Drake, 0:08:37.160 --> 0:08:40.319 and we have a new version of the first single 0:08:40.360 --> 0:08:42.080 off of Underneath. It's a song called Pay and Me 0:08:42.600 --> 0:08:45.160 and we call it the Moon that version because it's 0:08:45.200 --> 0:08:47.120 it's kind of inspired by Pink Moon. 0:08:47.360 --> 0:08:49.160 I wanted it just to pivot back to what you're 0:08:49.160 --> 0:08:51.360 asking to kind of break down, because you you have, 0:08:51.640 --> 0:08:54.080 you have been a voice of really digging into the 0:08:54.160 --> 0:08:56.280 industry that we're in versus most places. 0:08:56.280 --> 0:08:56.720 We talked to. 0:08:56.920 --> 0:08:59.360 You know, it's journalists that are just trying to tell 0:08:59.440 --> 0:09:02.400 any good tosty. We know, your your actual you know, 0:09:02.480 --> 0:09:05.720 passion or communication about this world we live in, you know, 0:09:06.200 --> 0:09:09.240 is oftentimes you know, discussing the stuff that might be 0:09:09.440 --> 0:09:11.840 you know, not common to the average fan. But we 0:09:11.920 --> 0:09:15.640 have historically been getting up early going to the radio station. 0:09:15.800 --> 0:09:18.160 We've like a crew killer. Like the crews, they're like, 0:09:18.240 --> 0:09:20.120 oh my god, what are you guys doing. You're doing 0:09:20.120 --> 0:09:21.120 a show and a radio. 0:09:21.440 --> 0:09:23.560 It would not be on common historically for us to 0:09:23.640 --> 0:09:25.960 let our crew sleep in and we're. 0:09:25.800 --> 0:09:28.280 Gonna do a morning radio after a late night tour. 0:09:28.400 --> 0:09:31.680 And and the other thing too is the relationship with 0:09:31.720 --> 0:09:34.320 the fans. One of things that we have today is 0:09:34.480 --> 0:09:36.920 that we're really grateful for that. We've worked on targement 0:09:36.960 --> 0:09:39.840 working is a fan club, a real, true engagement with 0:09:39.880 --> 0:09:43.560 fans online, and starting back twenty years ago, we set 0:09:43.600 --> 0:09:46.760 that up sort of before the world was waking up 0:09:46.800 --> 0:09:48.400 to the reality that we're all living in of this 0:09:48.440 --> 0:09:51.840 digital universe of community community. But we you know, the 0:09:51.880 --> 0:09:54.160 meet and greet time with the fan before each show. 0:09:54.280 --> 0:09:57.360 We select a specific fan before every show and sit 0:09:57.400 --> 0:10:00.800 down and have an interview with them and those kinds 0:10:00.800 --> 0:10:04.480 of things where you your day looks like frankly as 0:10:04.559 --> 0:10:08.240 much communication and connection with the audience that's there and 0:10:08.320 --> 0:10:10.240 to tell that story where every city you're. 0:10:10.080 --> 0:10:11.560 In as much as you can sweeze much as you 0:10:11.559 --> 0:10:12.079 can squeeze in. 0:10:13.520 --> 0:10:16.640 Okay, do you know how big the venues are in Norway? 0:10:17.760 --> 0:10:21.720 Well, these venues, these are festival gigs and they're all 0:10:22.120 --> 0:10:25.240 they're about five or six thousand. Yeah. 0:10:25.280 --> 0:10:26.839 I think the one in Oslo is a little bigger 0:10:26.840 --> 0:10:29.319 than that. It's more like twelve thousand something like that. 0:10:29.400 --> 0:10:34.240 But yeah, but yeah, okay, so this promoter reached out. 0:10:34.760 --> 0:10:38.400 Let's talk about outside the US. Is that normally how 0:10:38.440 --> 0:10:40.440 these tours come about for you guys? 0:10:40.480 --> 0:10:44.280 Not at all, No, I mean usually the way things 0:10:44.320 --> 0:10:47.680 come about for us is really setting a course for 0:10:48.040 --> 0:10:50.280 you know, your trajectory. I mean, like what we're doing 0:10:50.360 --> 0:10:53.080 like an album, you know, here's an album and being 0:10:53.080 --> 0:10:55.959 proactically engaged in how do we keep the communication and 0:10:56.000 --> 0:10:59.079 the excitement going with our audience and you build a 0:10:59.120 --> 0:11:02.439 relationship like you know, whether with spresureom for instance in Australia, 0:11:02.440 --> 0:11:04.280 where you know you have an audience a couple of 0:11:04.320 --> 0:11:07.280 years ago we did a symphony tour and this was like, okay, 0:11:07.320 --> 0:11:09.280 here's a we need a story. You're always trying to 0:11:09.280 --> 0:11:12.080 tell a story. I mean, this particular moment, this particular 0:11:12.080 --> 0:11:14.320 tour is is a little bit less that way, but 0:11:14.760 --> 0:11:17.200 the symphony tour is a great example. Okay, we know 0:11:17.280 --> 0:11:19.760 we had an anniversary like in twenty seventeen that was 0:11:19.960 --> 0:11:22.560 kind of a monumental like landmark for us. It's twenty 0:11:22.600 --> 0:11:24.560 five years as a band, and so you're a couple 0:11:24.559 --> 0:11:26.680 of years after that like, okay, so what's the next tour. 0:11:26.760 --> 0:11:29.200 We don't want to just show up, So we for 0:11:29.320 --> 0:11:31.000 years to want to do a symphony project, and we 0:11:31.040 --> 0:11:32.200 spent two and a half. 0:11:32.040 --> 0:11:34.600 Years building this show. 0:11:35.160 --> 0:11:37.240 And that was one of those things that Okay, now 0:11:37.280 --> 0:11:38.760 we're going to go to different kinds of venues. We're 0:11:38.760 --> 0:11:41.760 gonna go to seeded venues, and the seated venues was 0:11:41.880 --> 0:11:44.440 you know, another way almost it's almost like turning the soil, 0:11:44.600 --> 0:11:47.040 so to speak, because you know, hey, this may not 0:11:47.120 --> 0:11:49.280 be the show that's packed in sweaty and a big 0:11:49.360 --> 0:11:51.920 ga floor where there's a bunch of people jumping around, 0:11:52.280 --> 0:11:54.520 but this might be a show that's a symphony show. 0:11:54.559 --> 0:11:56.800 And now you're going to do two nights at Sydney 0:11:56.800 --> 0:11:59.720 Opera House, which which was so we're playing the last 0:11:59.720 --> 0:12:02.320 show that tour, or playing the Greek or in the 0:12:02.480 --> 0:12:05.319 la or playing rooms that allow somebody to say, you 0:12:05.360 --> 0:12:07.040 know what, I'm actually gonna bring my folks to this 0:12:07.080 --> 0:12:08.920 show and my kids and we're gonna sit and take 0:12:08.960 --> 0:12:12.520 in this different kind of a show. And in business wise, 0:12:12.559 --> 0:12:14.199 you're also being like, hey, this is a higher ticket, 0:12:14.280 --> 0:12:16.120 so this is not like the regular tour. 0:12:16.200 --> 0:12:19.480 So I think the because there's because you've got to 0:12:19.520 --> 0:12:22.920 pay for it's a higher ticket. 0:12:23.200 --> 0:12:25.439 That's why people don't do symphony projects because they're expensive. 0:12:25.440 --> 0:12:27.720 But so I think the answer would be you're always 0:12:27.760 --> 0:12:30.600 trying to tell a story and you're building a relationship 0:12:30.679 --> 0:12:34.240 with promoters and with partners. Because we started a label 0:12:34.240 --> 0:12:37.040 twenty years ago, we have also had a network of 0:12:37.080 --> 0:12:40.600 distributors or people that we have jvs withjoin ventures or 0:12:40.920 --> 0:12:44.800 licensing agreements with labels, so we're also keeping our dynamic 0:12:44.880 --> 0:12:45.240 with them. 0:12:45.320 --> 0:12:46.000 Now we have. 0:12:45.960 --> 0:12:49.160 Probably the most global net as one label that we've 0:12:49.160 --> 0:12:51.400 ever had, which is our relationship with the Orchard and 0:12:51.679 --> 0:12:55.600 utilizing their global system. But it's also so much different 0:12:55.600 --> 0:12:58.720 than it was because there's almost no physical so you're 0:12:58.720 --> 0:13:00.920 telling a story and you're trying to keep people engaged 0:13:00.960 --> 0:13:03.360 and keep it interesting, and that's what drives the touring 0:13:03.400 --> 0:13:04.080 cycle mostly. 0:13:04.440 --> 0:13:04.640 Yeah. 0:13:04.840 --> 0:13:08.200 Okay, if you're going to be touring outside the United States, 0:13:08.240 --> 0:13:09.680 do you have a foreign agent? 0:13:10.720 --> 0:13:13.440 Yeah, we have several agents around the world. We have 0:13:13.880 --> 0:13:17.360 an agent that's primarily focused in the US, and then 0:13:17.360 --> 0:13:21.920 we've got a few different agents around the world that 0:13:22.040 --> 0:13:25.679 focus on regions like South America, Europe, and Asia. 0:13:25.840 --> 0:13:29.600 Yeah, it's it's really just looking for the right relationships. 0:13:29.960 --> 0:13:33.720 UK and most of x US has been under one 0:13:34.080 --> 0:13:35.680 one umbrella. 0:13:35.200 --> 0:13:37.959 And origionally Agency Group now UTA Yeah. 0:13:37.840 --> 0:13:41.959 Yeah, yeah, and again I mean relationships, you know, not 0:13:41.960 --> 0:13:45.840 only with your fans, but with your partners is really 0:13:45.880 --> 0:13:48.080 really key. Of course, you have people that have infrastructure 0:13:48.120 --> 0:13:50.400 and different offerings. You know, when we started the label, 0:13:50.440 --> 0:13:53.280 it was Ada was our distributor as a label, and we. 0:13:53.120 --> 0:13:54.000 Were kind of a long time. 0:13:54.040 --> 0:13:57.000 They were great, But you find that it's not only 0:13:57.040 --> 0:13:59.160 what definite what the offering is. You know, a lot 0:13:59.160 --> 0:14:01.880 of touring agency have a very similar set of skills. 0:14:01.960 --> 0:14:04.000 You know, people that know how to book shows, they 0:14:04.000 --> 0:14:06.320 take their percentage. They go out there and the canvas, 0:14:06.480 --> 0:14:09.240 they get you a routing. But it's who understands and 0:14:09.280 --> 0:14:11.120 who kind of joins you and saying, hey, this is 0:14:11.120 --> 0:14:12.280 who we are, this is our audience. 0:14:12.360 --> 0:14:13.800 Well, who wants to do the work work? 0:14:13.880 --> 0:14:17.199 Dave Dave Shapiro, who is over there at Soundtown on Agency. 0:14:17.240 --> 0:14:20.240 He he he's been our agent for a very very 0:14:20.320 --> 0:14:24.080 long time in the US as an example, and probably 0:14:24.120 --> 0:14:28.800 our longest agent actually. Uh and so yeah, I mean 0:14:28.840 --> 0:14:31.040 you you just continue to try and do the work 0:14:31.120 --> 0:14:34.800 and to make sure that the relationship is productive and 0:14:34.800 --> 0:14:39.080 and you know sometimes sometimes you know, things run their 0:14:39.080 --> 0:14:42.120 course and sometimes things stay for a very long time. 0:14:42.320 --> 0:14:44.040 You just you can't always predict that stuff. 0:14:44.160 --> 0:14:47.400 But you need, yeah, you need. A very few things 0:14:47.480 --> 0:14:50.480 show up on your doorstep. I mean, here you are, 0:14:50.600 --> 0:14:52.480 here's a million. You know, very few things do. And 0:14:53.320 --> 0:14:56.200 while they do, you know, but you got to keep knocking. 0:15:03.480 --> 0:15:08.320 What about management? Management is looking at it right now. 0:15:09.880 --> 0:15:12.600 You know, we've had several different managers over the years, 0:15:13.840 --> 0:15:18.520 and I think it's what's most important. I think about 0:15:18.600 --> 0:15:21.920 who your team is is that just like your band 0:15:22.040 --> 0:15:25.200 is the same people, but they evolve and they acquire 0:15:25.240 --> 0:15:29.000 new skills and acquire new needs. You may be with 0:15:29.080 --> 0:15:32.000 someone that you like that is no longer the right person, 0:15:32.160 --> 0:15:35.480 or you may no longer be the right leadership for 0:15:35.560 --> 0:15:39.200 yourself anymore and need new ideas and need to bring 0:15:39.280 --> 0:15:44.040 people in. So right now and for about what is 0:15:44.080 --> 0:15:50.520 it seven? I mean our structure we have been self managed, 0:15:51.000 --> 0:15:54.000 and so we make the choices, and we have people 0:15:54.480 --> 0:15:58.160 who work for us who you you throw your ideas 0:15:58.160 --> 0:16:00.240 at and you go what do you think you know? 0:16:00.360 --> 0:16:03.960 And you get feedback like you might get from a manager. 0:16:04.280 --> 0:16:09.640 But I would say we are painfully independent. Sometimes they're 0:16:09.680 --> 0:16:15.400 on detriment and that's just become. I think the way 0:16:15.640 --> 0:16:18.760 we've realized, at least for this moment, that was what 0:16:18.920 --> 0:16:22.560 was going to keep us driving. We didn't want to 0:16:22.600 --> 0:16:26.520 be fighting other people's ideas. We wanted to create a 0:16:26.520 --> 0:16:31.240 ship and say everybody get on board that that is 0:16:31.520 --> 0:16:33.640 into this idea that wants to go to this place. 0:16:33.960 --> 0:16:35.720 I think another way to talk about it, too, sorry 0:16:35.800 --> 0:16:38.160 cut you off an is to say a lot of 0:16:38.160 --> 0:16:41.840 times the systems, the way manage the way banns, you know, 0:16:41.920 --> 0:16:44.560 architectures work is you have an artist and artists gets 0:16:44.600 --> 0:16:46.480 an agent for touring and to get a label for 0:16:46.840 --> 0:16:50.160 release is they get a manasure for general organizational management 0:16:50.240 --> 0:16:52.640 and soliciting and helping them build a career. And then 0:16:52.640 --> 0:16:54.680 you have publicity, and you have all these pieces and 0:16:54.680 --> 0:16:57.960 they're all valuable, but they tend to the artist tends 0:16:57.960 --> 0:16:59.760 to feel kind of like you're getting to be a 0:16:59.760 --> 0:17:03.320 part of somebody else's infrastructure, which which makes sense, you know, 0:17:03.360 --> 0:17:05.360 and a lot of cases artists really just they want 0:17:05.359 --> 0:17:07.440 to go in the studio, write a song, submit it, 0:17:07.600 --> 0:17:11.360 get somebody else's feedback. A lot ofis they're insecure generally naturally, 0:17:11.640 --> 0:17:13.639 and so they don't want to carry the office and 0:17:13.680 --> 0:17:17.879 the fulfillment for merchandising. And we've we have wonderful people 0:17:17.920 --> 0:17:20.320 in our team, but it's not structured in the same 0:17:20.320 --> 0:17:23.560 way the traditional management work. We have a great GM 0:17:23.600 --> 0:17:26.080 that runs operations and she's a really big part of 0:17:26.119 --> 0:17:27.639 a lot all the things we do. And we have 0:17:27.720 --> 0:17:30.560 a great publicist, and we have a great label partner. 0:17:30.640 --> 0:17:34.360 We have this it's a little more like an entrepreneurial 0:17:34.480 --> 0:17:37.360 sort of This is our our sort of HQ. It's 0:17:37.400 --> 0:17:41.280 all in sort of one umbrella. But it is interesting 0:17:41.320 --> 0:17:44.800 because you know, it causes constantly you're you're having to 0:17:44.800 --> 0:17:47.360 ask those questions. I mean, you're kind of always having 0:17:47.359 --> 0:17:48.160 to ask who. 0:17:48.119 --> 0:17:49.920 Else do we have? And what else do we need? 0:17:50.000 --> 0:17:52.000 And who else could be bringing things to the table, 0:17:52.480 --> 0:17:56.240 because you know, that's the process of a career is 0:17:56.600 --> 0:17:58.600 you know, is kind of how do you how do 0:17:58.640 --> 0:18:00.520 you keep telling a story? Like back to touring thing? 0:18:00.520 --> 0:18:02.439 How do you keep telling stories? Not just showing up 0:18:02.440 --> 0:18:03.880 and doing the same rints and repeat? 0:18:03.920 --> 0:18:04.160 You know? 0:18:05.240 --> 0:18:09.760 Okay, how many people are permanently on the hands and payroll? 0:18:11.240 --> 0:18:14.800 I think it's ten? Yeah, it's about ten, and then 0:18:15.600 --> 0:18:16.119 there are. 0:18:16.000 --> 0:18:18.119 That including the band. 0:18:18.840 --> 0:18:22.120 I guess it's not including. 0:18:21.720 --> 0:18:24.359 Okay, So what are those ten people do? How did 0:18:24.400 --> 0:18:25.600 the division? How does it work? 0:18:26.080 --> 0:18:29.439 Unfortunately, there's a lot more administration than you wish there was. 0:18:30.000 --> 0:18:32.840 You kind of wish it was ten ten creative people 0:18:32.920 --> 0:18:38.639 with cameras and videos. It's it's mostly admin. So within 0:18:38.680 --> 0:18:45.960 the fan club there's two over there, Within the label 0:18:46.240 --> 0:18:53.159 kind of marketing there's about three. There's several accountants for 0:18:54.119 --> 0:18:57.960 you know, keeping taxes and budgets and and it kind 0:18:57.960 --> 0:18:59.120 of goes like that. 0:18:59.240 --> 0:19:01.960 And then there's just mostly thesigning department. 0:19:02.840 --> 0:19:05.520 You're looking at the marketing department and the most of 0:19:05.560 --> 0:19:09.760 the creative and then there's a great designer that does 0:19:10.160 --> 0:19:15.000 a bunch of our design and content who still he's 0:19:15.080 --> 0:19:18.680 the greatest designer ever. He's very he's very multi capable. 0:19:19.200 --> 0:19:20.840 Is that a word? And you got interesting? But the 0:19:20.880 --> 0:19:23.480 other thing is okay, go ahead. 0:19:23.200 --> 0:19:26.640 Okay, how did you find these people? And did they 0:19:26.720 --> 0:19:28.160 all work in one location? 0:19:28.560 --> 0:19:32.320 Almost all are in in Oklahoma. You know the thing 0:19:32.359 --> 0:19:37.960 about finding people, it's it's like putting together a band. 0:19:38.200 --> 0:19:40.399 You can you can do it a lot of ways. 0:19:41.359 --> 0:19:44.560 Several of them are family. So our dad was an accountant, 0:19:44.600 --> 0:19:48.199 and so he very very quickly in our life, just 0:19:48.200 --> 0:19:51.040 just took on that role. It's funny he was ready 0:19:51.080 --> 0:19:53.280 to not do the other thing that wasn't that interesting. 0:19:53.280 --> 0:19:55.480 It's because of his art, is because of his it's 0:19:55.560 --> 0:19:57.359 because of his frustrating artist sidety. 0:19:57.480 --> 0:19:59.920 He will be in a terrifying to be your kids 0:20:00.000 --> 0:20:02.400 accountant and help them run their business and not. 0:20:02.480 --> 0:20:04.399 St well, I completely agree with that, but he's a 0:20:04.760 --> 0:20:05.920 But our dad is a CPA. 0:20:06.000 --> 0:20:08.840 He's a certified public account He's always been in that 0:20:08.960 --> 0:20:11.399 place for us. I would call him more of a 0:20:11.440 --> 0:20:16.080 business manager than simply an accountant, just sort of somebody 0:20:16.080 --> 0:20:19.640 there with no desire except for to help you be successful. 0:20:20.359 --> 0:20:23.960 And so he's been at that role. Our sister at 0:20:23.960 --> 0:20:26.480 fifteen was like, Hey, can I come on tour and 0:20:26.480 --> 0:20:29.440 sell T shirts? And then it was about a year 0:20:29.520 --> 0:20:32.600 later we're like, wow, you're still here. She's really good 0:20:32.640 --> 0:20:35.679 at it. Helps run a huge part of the online community. 0:20:36.600 --> 0:20:38.080 She's not fifteen anymore. No. 0:20:40.160 --> 0:20:45.280 A lot of cases, it's people that you discover through 0:20:46.280 --> 0:20:49.479 just we needed a tour manager, and then that person 0:20:49.560 --> 0:20:52.199 we're like, we like you, you want to stick around, 0:20:52.400 --> 0:20:55.800 You've got a desire to do more than that, and 0:20:55.880 --> 0:20:58.359 so I've you know, I think the thing about finding 0:20:58.400 --> 0:21:02.439 people is if you find good people, even good people 0:21:02.480 --> 0:21:06.719 with the wrong job will make that job work. And 0:21:06.760 --> 0:21:09.240 so it's it's more about just finding good people that 0:21:09.320 --> 0:21:12.600 work well together, that you like being around. Uh and 0:21:12.760 --> 0:21:15.280 talented people will will learn the new job or and 0:21:15.320 --> 0:21:17.040 I'll tell you what you're doing wrong. 0:21:19.920 --> 0:21:24.000 And crew is like that too, you know, like you 0:21:24.040 --> 0:21:26.280 find groups of people that you can really get along 0:21:26.320 --> 0:21:29.240 with well because you're on the submarine, as we jokingly 0:21:29.280 --> 0:21:31.960 call the bus as the submarine for you know, weeks 0:21:31.960 --> 0:21:36.920 and weeks on end sometimes months on and so Submarine. 0:21:37.080 --> 0:21:38.760 Yeah, I mean I think I think you know the 0:21:38.880 --> 0:21:42.400 right when it comes to touring. You know the right 0:21:42.520 --> 0:21:46.400 people oftentimes by the way they treat your equipment. Right. 0:21:46.840 --> 0:21:50.760 So half the times when you bring on a new guy, 0:21:51.160 --> 0:21:54.520 you go, who don't dinged up this guitar? What happened 0:21:54.560 --> 0:21:57.280 to that case? And you see it's it's they don't. Well, 0:21:57.280 --> 0:22:03.920 they're the accountant. That's the problem. Realize when they don't, 0:22:04.760 --> 0:22:07.040 when they treat it like they won't be there tomorrow, 0:22:07.760 --> 0:22:10.640 that's a sign that they don't want to be there tomorrow, 0:22:10.760 --> 0:22:13.840 and so you're looking for that in people who wants 0:22:13.840 --> 0:22:17.000 to be here. It's it's not a there's no guarantees 0:22:17.800 --> 0:22:20.280 and truth be told, it's not a I wouldn't call 0:22:20.400 --> 0:22:24.040 our business a growth business where people are coming in 0:22:24.160 --> 0:22:26.560 going okay, where am I going to be in ten years? 0:22:26.560 --> 0:22:28.840 What's the next position in the next pay grade? In 0:22:28.880 --> 0:22:32.040 the back end. It's not corporate, it's not like that. 0:22:33.040 --> 0:22:35.960 We always hope to grow, but it's more of a 0:22:36.000 --> 0:22:41.680 relationship business, not surprisingly, more familial. It is something like, hey, 0:22:41.720 --> 0:22:43.679 when you come in, we want to take care of you. 0:22:44.240 --> 0:22:47.280 We want to you know, whenever we win. We want 0:22:47.320 --> 0:22:47.840 you to win. 0:22:50.119 --> 0:22:52.399 Okay, how much do you pay your father to be 0:22:52.480 --> 0:22:53.520 the account. 0:22:54.600 --> 0:22:56.960 I think we have to probably probably draw the line 0:22:56.960 --> 0:23:00.439 at actual, actual dollars shared in. 0:23:00.440 --> 0:23:02.320 The well do you pay him a? 0:23:02.880 --> 0:23:05.560 Is he your only client? B? Do you pay him 0:23:05.600 --> 0:23:08.159 a percentage? See? Do you pay him a salary? 0:23:08.240 --> 0:23:08.400 Oh? 0:23:08.440 --> 0:23:10.680 No, we pay him a salary? And sorry, is comparable 0:23:10.680 --> 0:23:11.040 to ours? 0:23:11.400 --> 0:23:14.359 Yeah? And it's it's always been, I mean a little less. 0:23:14.359 --> 0:23:16.280 But there again, when you own your business, you know 0:23:16.400 --> 0:23:18.040 and the and part of the way we've designed the 0:23:18.080 --> 0:23:20.879 structure of things again is to say, well, hey, we're 0:23:21.000 --> 0:23:22.800 we know what labels do, and we know what artists do, 0:23:22.840 --> 0:23:25.800 and can let's be as strategic about how when we 0:23:26.119 --> 0:23:28.119 sell a record or sell a tour, we want that 0:23:28.160 --> 0:23:30.159 we want to step back and be like, what's the 0:23:30.200 --> 0:23:33.560 best way to use the success of that project. And 0:23:33.640 --> 0:23:36.480 so you know, your team, you need, you need people 0:23:36.480 --> 0:23:38.480 to feel you need you need a certain amount of 0:23:38.520 --> 0:23:40.639 people that are going to come on and cycles. You know, 0:23:40.680 --> 0:23:42.440 people that come on to help you do certain things. 0:23:42.640 --> 0:23:44.520 But then you need your core team just to feel 0:23:44.680 --> 0:23:47.800 safe and secure. And so salary's and benefits and the 0:23:47.840 --> 0:23:50.000 things you do as a team as are important for 0:23:50.040 --> 0:23:50.720 people to wake up. 0:23:50.720 --> 0:23:53.680 And we when we first got our first record deal, 0:23:54.000 --> 0:23:59.120 and this is the late nineties, everything was about percentages. 0:23:59.640 --> 0:24:05.600 Every but he wanted percentages, and everybody wanted you know, 0:24:05.840 --> 0:24:11.800 suns antuity, perpetuity. Everyone's percentages and perpetuity. 0:24:11.400 --> 0:24:15.680 And we were allergic to those two piece stories to value. 0:24:16.240 --> 0:24:20.640 So, you know, when there was nothing that could be guaranteed, 0:24:21.280 --> 0:24:23.919 we paid our data percentage because there was no label. 0:24:24.000 --> 0:24:27.119 We weren't independent, we were signed to something. You know, 0:24:27.160 --> 0:24:29.160 he quit his job to help us do our things 0:24:29.240 --> 0:24:30.800 and go, here's a percentage. You're going to be treated 0:24:30.840 --> 0:24:33.840 like a manager. But more and more, what we've tried 0:24:33.880 --> 0:24:40.080 to do is move things away from that kind of 0:24:40.680 --> 0:24:44.239 risk and that kind of relationship. We'd rather continue to 0:24:44.359 --> 0:24:51.080 create the sense of we're all here earning today, working today. 0:24:51.760 --> 0:24:54.560 As an artist, I think that's more important to think 0:24:54.600 --> 0:24:57.000 about where you are than kind of what you have 0:24:57.160 --> 0:25:00.800 in the bag. That's what keeps you hungry. And from 0:25:00.800 --> 0:25:03.720 a business point of view, I think we can't take 0:25:03.760 --> 0:25:08.720 as many risks when the percentages are all eaten up. 0:25:09.040 --> 0:25:11.320 Oh there's that guy from twenty years ago that's still 0:25:11.359 --> 0:25:13.920 making ten percent off of the thing well he earned 0:25:13.920 --> 0:25:15.800 it in perpetuity. Well, you've got to find a way 0:25:15.800 --> 0:25:17.960 to go like, hey, we can't one of the best 0:25:18.040 --> 0:25:21.840 things down by those kind of risks because we continue 0:25:21.880 --> 0:25:24.680 to have to earn it. It's there's no but this 0:25:24.800 --> 0:25:27.199 isn't toilet paper selling one of the bestop don't just 0:25:27.280 --> 0:25:30.720 buy it just because every day it happens. They you 0:25:30.840 --> 0:25:33.199 have to keep engaging people. I'm just going to say. 0:25:33.200 --> 0:25:35.399 One of the best things about being able to have 0:25:35.440 --> 0:25:38.400 that mindset is having assets, you know, being writers, being 0:25:38.400 --> 0:25:40.520 creators that created it in the first place. And some 0:25:40.560 --> 0:25:43.280 of the best counsel we got very early on was 0:25:43.480 --> 0:25:45.560 things like, don't sell your publishing, you know, and and 0:25:45.640 --> 0:25:46.560 even what is publishing? 0:25:46.560 --> 0:25:47.679 How does that work? You know? 0:25:47.800 --> 0:25:50.399 And thank you Bill Covin, Yeah, and thank you Jim Holming. 0:25:50.440 --> 0:25:54.960 Yeah exactly. They'll just pass and Jim are still going, 0:25:55.119 --> 0:25:55.320 you know. 0:25:55.400 --> 0:25:58.679 And I think learning how to have assets that have 0:25:58.840 --> 0:26:01.639 something to pay out over time. That isn't just I 0:26:01.680 --> 0:26:03.760 showed up and I worked, but building you know that, 0:26:03.800 --> 0:26:06.280 It's like having a good investment and something that's stock 0:26:06.359 --> 0:26:08.240 or bond, it's it's out there doing its thing. 0:26:08.280 --> 0:26:09.680 At some level. It exists. 0:26:09.720 --> 0:26:12.280 You made it, so that that's allowed us to think 0:26:12.320 --> 0:26:15.760 a little more about long term because you have a 0:26:15.800 --> 0:26:17.760 song that is maybe going to be in a film, 0:26:17.760 --> 0:26:19.480 maybe going to be played on the radio, maybe going 0:26:19.560 --> 0:26:21.960 to be you know, out there, you know, find it's made, 0:26:22.000 --> 0:26:25.520 maybe be covered by somebody. So and of course master 0:26:25.600 --> 0:26:28.480 ownership as a label wants you own master's that's also huge. 0:26:28.840 --> 0:26:30.960 But just that what Zach is talking about, having that 0:26:31.000 --> 0:26:33.639 mindset of like what is going forward and what is 0:26:33.680 --> 0:26:36.520 sustainable and resources, like that's a huge springboard. 0:26:36.520 --> 0:26:39.720 I think, Okay, do you have to work or is 0:26:39.760 --> 0:26:42.160 there enough money been earned over time that you don't 0:26:42.160 --> 0:26:43.960 have to work and you just love to work? 0:26:44.280 --> 0:26:47.439 The short answer is, the short answer is if you 0:26:47.520 --> 0:26:52.800 stop working, you'll die. I mean meaning no matter what, 0:26:52.960 --> 0:26:55.719 you should always be working because it keeps the joy. 0:26:55.880 --> 0:26:57.120 I think going in a. 0:26:57.080 --> 0:26:58.800 Lot of this is a brother This is where the 0:26:58.840 --> 0:27:02.320 brothers probably have slightly different answers. The short answer is 0:27:02.400 --> 0:27:06.439 we wouldn't have to work, yes, But the short answer 0:27:06.480 --> 0:27:10.560 is also some of us couldn't stop working, right uh. 0:27:10.800 --> 0:27:14.719 And I think, like for myself, I would probably if 0:27:14.720 --> 0:27:17.480 we said okay, band's over, we're stopping, I mean I'd 0:27:17.480 --> 0:27:20.480 be working tomorrow, but it'd be on some other thing 0:27:20.520 --> 0:27:23.439 that just simply drove you. You couldn't sit down and 0:27:23.440 --> 0:27:25.240 go I'm retired. I'm going to read books for the 0:27:25.280 --> 0:27:28.640 rest or just mentor people. I'm like that I need 0:27:28.680 --> 0:27:34.920 to physically mentally create something. But we it's been Our 0:27:34.960 --> 0:27:37.240 career has been good to us. We've had the right people, 0:27:38.600 --> 0:27:41.880 tell us good decisions. We haven't made as much money 0:27:41.920 --> 0:27:44.400 as people probably think we have, but I think all 0:27:44.400 --> 0:27:44.760 of us. 0:27:44.640 --> 0:27:47.720 We've tried to make because haven't always made it. 0:27:47.800 --> 0:27:50.639 Yes, we could, we could not work. We could not work. 0:27:51.359 --> 0:27:56.159 Okay, let's go back to the big hit on Mercury A. 0:27:56.160 --> 0:27:58.520 Are you still in a negative position or do you 0:27:58.560 --> 0:27:59.960 get royalties from Mercy? 0:28:00.520 --> 0:28:04.359 We got royalties, yeah, thankfully, Yes, it is all recouped. 0:28:05.640 --> 0:28:09.800 We had a big deficit because of the way our 0:28:10.080 --> 0:28:15.040 relationship with Island Jeff Sham sort of dissolved, dissolved, but yeah, 0:28:15.080 --> 0:28:17.760 we we are absolutely in the clear on that. Because 0:28:17.800 --> 0:28:21.159 Mercury Records they spent so much money on our third album, 0:28:21.720 --> 0:28:24.320 and to get out of that contract, we had to 0:28:24.400 --> 0:28:28.160 essentially say, okay, well it was kind of a weird situation. 0:28:29.320 --> 0:28:31.560 Wait, wait, you had to say okay, meaning. 0:28:31.280 --> 0:28:35.280 What meaning you let us go and we will let 0:28:35.400 --> 0:28:39.600 those records, those first two records and the Christmas album 0:28:40.120 --> 0:28:44.960 recoup that that huge deficit that you ran up against us. 0:28:45.240 --> 0:28:47.000 You remember how much that deficit was. 0:28:47.440 --> 0:28:49.280 We do, but we were not going to probably share 0:28:49.320 --> 0:28:50.880 that exactly it was. 0:28:50.960 --> 0:28:52.840 It was several undred thousand dollars. Let's just put it 0:28:52.840 --> 0:28:55.160 that way. I would but what I would put it, 0:28:55.240 --> 0:28:57.480 but I want to put would put against that though, 0:28:57.600 --> 0:29:00.760 is we did because of the pay or play clause. 0:29:01.400 --> 0:29:06.320 There was a degree to which that also they kind 0:29:06.320 --> 0:29:08.120 of owed us money as well. So it was kind 0:29:08.120 --> 0:29:10.400 of a back and forth where we said, listen, we're 0:29:10.400 --> 0:29:13.080 gonna let this be paid off by the royalties, but 0:29:13.320 --> 0:29:16.200 you still owe us some cash because you stiffed us 0:29:16.200 --> 0:29:18.080 on a bunch of things and we know it. And 0:29:18.120 --> 0:29:21.080 so it was kind of like a wee, you lose 0:29:21.120 --> 0:29:22.160 some kind of thing. 0:29:22.120 --> 0:29:24.120 The biggest gift. Wha, wha, wha. 0:29:24.240 --> 0:29:25.320 What did they stiff you on? 0:29:26.480 --> 0:29:26.920 Well? 0:29:27.520 --> 0:29:32.720 Well, they they there were definitely yeah, oh man, I 0:29:32.760 --> 0:29:34.960 mean there there were definitely some things that we probably 0:29:34.960 --> 0:29:37.520 could have audited them for. Let's just put it that way, 0:29:37.600 --> 0:29:40.680 because they were spending money, you know, recklessly and we 0:29:40.760 --> 0:29:45.280 knew it. But then they also, you know, six weeks 0:29:45.280 --> 0:29:48.160 into the release of the second record, we're like, yeah, 0:29:48.200 --> 0:29:51.640 your career is over, and we're like, what's so it 0:29:51.680 --> 0:29:54.719 was a it was a it was a contentious situation. 0:29:55.680 --> 0:29:56.880 Frame framing the overall. 0:29:57.000 --> 0:30:00.640 So, you know, the culture that we left, one of 0:30:00.640 --> 0:30:03.640 the reasons we chose to start a label is is 0:30:03.960 --> 0:30:07.680 this culture of, uh, you're with a corporation, which you're 0:30:07.680 --> 0:30:09.920 grateful that you have this big something behind you, which 0:30:09.960 --> 0:30:11.880 is great, we've got a major leal, but now you're 0:30:11.880 --> 0:30:14.080 with a corporation, it's not the corporation that signed you. 0:30:14.560 --> 0:30:17.040 And so here's Hanson. We've sold millions of records, we 0:30:17.120 --> 0:30:19.000 have fans all over the world. So were the kind 0:30:19.000 --> 0:30:21.080 of a's like someone holds an asset, but they really 0:30:21.120 --> 0:30:22.840 don't know what to do with it. And so the 0:30:22.840 --> 0:30:25.640 culture that we were in was kind of chase you know, 0:30:25.720 --> 0:30:27.920 the latest whatever the latest hit maker was, or that 0:30:28.080 --> 0:30:30.240 in the writer or the producer and kind of without 0:30:30.280 --> 0:30:32.440 really understanding what it is we're all trying to do 0:30:32.520 --> 0:30:35.040 for a career, and we were watching the budgets go 0:30:35.120 --> 0:30:36.240 up and up and up and up, and sort of 0:30:36.240 --> 0:30:37.920 just like we're never going to recoup any of this stuff, 0:30:37.960 --> 0:30:40.040 and you guys don't know why sort of what you're 0:30:40.120 --> 0:30:43.240 leading us towards, and so that that decision back to 0:30:43.280 --> 0:30:45.959 what we were talking about, is really just about I mean, 0:30:46.000 --> 0:30:48.480 the dollars are all way more than they should be 0:30:49.120 --> 0:30:51.280 in the major label world. They're just sort of spent rest, 0:30:51.520 --> 0:30:54.120 especially then we're talking about early two thousands, but our 0:30:54.200 --> 0:30:57.080 and late nineties, our decision was kind of predicated on 0:30:57.120 --> 0:30:59.680 that base level thinking of we got to change the 0:30:59.680 --> 0:31:02.320 way that is being considered everything is this like if 0:31:02.360 --> 0:31:05.120 we just you know, we're just waiting on one hit 0:31:05.160 --> 0:31:08.960 song or waiting on one particular like trend versus the 0:31:09.360 --> 0:31:12.000 heroes of ours, which of course had pop hits, but 0:31:12.040 --> 0:31:15.320 the heroes of ours as a career are Wow, here's 0:31:15.520 --> 0:31:17.760 where's you know we want to one day you know, 0:31:17.840 --> 0:31:21.239 fingers crossed only as as your your your icons. You know, 0:31:21.520 --> 0:31:24.360 it's the people that have had careers like the Sprigstines, 0:31:24.400 --> 0:31:26.560 like the Petties, like the U two's that have had 0:31:26.960 --> 0:31:30.280 you know, journeys forward, many of which I mean billy 0:31:30.360 --> 0:31:33.720 joels where you go look absolutely hit songs of course 0:31:33.760 --> 0:31:36.320 critical big labels, but in the end, it's still a 0:31:36.800 --> 0:31:39.400 it's a sense of a longer view of where you're 0:31:39.440 --> 0:31:41.960 going and being able to take that risk with the 0:31:42.080 --> 0:31:44.200 you know, joining the risk not being sort of just 0:31:44.680 --> 0:31:46.640 you know, the ship is turning and you're just hoping 0:31:46.720 --> 0:31:47.480 you don't tip over. 0:31:47.760 --> 0:31:48.920 So the so the challenges. 0:31:48.920 --> 0:31:51.880 Everything Taylor is saying is true, right, but there are 0:31:51.920 --> 0:31:54.360 some other factors that you have to remember. So this 0:31:54.560 --> 0:31:57.800 is so when we started our label three cGy Records 0:31:57.800 --> 0:31:59.320 back in two thousand and three, two thousand and four, 0:32:00.680 --> 0:32:03.040 we were coming out of a record label merger that 0:32:03.120 --> 0:32:04.520 happened in nineteen ninety nine. 0:32:05.040 --> 0:32:08.080 It was the largest corporate merger in musicustry. 0:32:07.480 --> 0:32:11.920 At that time. I'm getting to that, but but specifically 0:32:11.960 --> 0:32:16.120 what happened was when we when that did second record 0:32:16.200 --> 0:32:19.720 didn't go well because the label was not they they 0:32:19.760 --> 0:32:22.479 saw a big like a big potential check, but they 0:32:22.480 --> 0:32:24.040 didn't know what to do with it. But then you 0:32:24.160 --> 0:32:27.280 come into that third record and they kind of they 0:32:27.480 --> 0:32:29.800 kind of said your career is over. On at the 0:32:29.800 --> 0:32:31.640 beginning of the second record, we're like, what the heck 0:32:31.680 --> 0:32:34.360 are you talking about? And that's a whole other conversation 0:32:34.440 --> 0:32:39.840 all together, but specifically in two thousand and one, two 0:32:39.840 --> 0:32:43.400 thousand and two, two thousand and three, huge numbers of 0:32:43.480 --> 0:32:45.959 friends of ours on a variety of different labels, but 0:32:46.000 --> 0:32:51.160 specifically in that label group, we're all stuck in this 0:32:51.320 --> 0:32:55.280 crazy scenario where they're making records multiple different times, like 0:32:55.320 --> 0:32:58.040 the same record over and over and over again, or 0:32:58.240 --> 0:33:01.360 different variations of the same record with different producers. I mean, like, 0:33:01.600 --> 0:33:04.280 we know a couple of people that made like basically 0:33:04.320 --> 0:33:07.280 the same record three times. Like, so this was the 0:33:07.760 --> 0:33:11.640 scenario they were in where they were and we were 0:33:11.720 --> 0:33:14.640 kind of faced in observing with a similar similar situation, 0:33:14.800 --> 0:33:17.480 not the same we didn't fall into that particular trap, 0:33:17.920 --> 0:33:20.760 but but a similar situation where labels were kind of 0:33:21.000 --> 0:33:23.320 in a sense willing to spend a ton of money, 0:33:24.240 --> 0:33:26.760 but they didn't seem to know where they wanted to 0:33:26.840 --> 0:33:29.400 go with it. And so so that's why. 0:33:29.320 --> 0:33:32.720 And it's ultimately your money. It's ultimately your money. Specifically, 0:33:32.800 --> 0:33:33.560 it's not a company. 0:33:33.720 --> 0:33:36.160 It's not a company, but it was specifically unique at 0:33:36.160 --> 0:33:38.440 that time, there were a large number of people that 0:33:38.440 --> 0:33:43.240 were going through that. That is particularly why we started 0:33:43.240 --> 0:33:45.120 a label and said, listen, we don't want to get 0:33:45.120 --> 0:33:47.880 stuck in a situation like that because, as the old 0:33:47.880 --> 0:33:53.560 phrase says, necessity is the mother of invention. The necessity 0:33:53.600 --> 0:33:56.960 for us was not getting stuck in a multi year 0:33:57.000 --> 0:34:00.720 process where we couldn't put out music because our fans 0:34:00.760 --> 0:34:02.920 are going, where the heck are you guys, Where the 0:34:02.920 --> 0:34:04.520 heck are you guys? Where the heck are you guys, 0:34:04.560 --> 0:34:06.920 And we're like, we're trapped. We can't get out, and 0:34:07.000 --> 0:34:10.960 so we so, you know, and that's also why, that's 0:34:11.000 --> 0:34:14.319 also why the unique scenario of our structure as a 0:34:14.360 --> 0:34:18.040 band and the way that we have employees and don't 0:34:18.080 --> 0:34:21.160 necessarily have management on a percentage in the traditional way, 0:34:22.160 --> 0:34:26.040 is because again, you know, necessity has some other invention. 0:34:26.160 --> 0:34:30.000 We've made some specific shifts feeling like we needed stability 0:34:30.360 --> 0:34:35.960 and consistency because, not surprisingly, the last twenty five years 0:34:35.960 --> 0:34:38.440 in the music business has been fairly tumultuous. You know, 0:34:38.440 --> 0:34:40.400 there's been a lot of ti are you're talking about. 0:34:41.040 --> 0:34:44.399 The artists that we admire and love had a much 0:34:44.440 --> 0:34:48.400 more stable record label kind of business in the sense 0:34:48.440 --> 0:34:50.960 that they were selling product, they were selling records, they 0:34:50.960 --> 0:34:53.520 were selling CDs. It was a consistent kind of we're 0:34:53.560 --> 0:34:57.200 selling a medium, you know, and then this these evolutions 0:34:57.200 --> 0:35:00.680 in the last twenty years or so have been unique upending. 0:35:08.040 --> 0:35:10.319 Okay, let's there's a lot of stuff here. Let's go 0:35:10.400 --> 0:35:13.640 to the publishing for a minute. How do you split 0:35:13.719 --> 0:35:15.600 up the publishing between us? 0:35:17.160 --> 0:35:20.440 Between the three of us, we made sort of a 0:35:20.640 --> 0:35:23.480 plan early on that it really didn't matter who wrote 0:35:23.480 --> 0:35:27.799 the songs if if it was being released under the 0:35:27.840 --> 0:35:29.759 name Hansen, it was going to be a third to 0:35:29.800 --> 0:35:30.359 third to third. 0:35:30.880 --> 0:35:33.439 Yeah, okay, so it's a third to third to third. 0:35:33.920 --> 0:35:36.440 You're gonna go on the road, You're gonna make a 0:35:36.480 --> 0:35:41.880 certain amount of money. Is that money distributed? You basically say, okay, 0:35:41.920 --> 0:35:44.160 here are the costs we pay off all the people 0:35:44.200 --> 0:35:48.000 on the payroll. There's x amount each get a third 0:35:48.160 --> 0:35:50.200 and you spend it, do whatever you want with it, 0:35:50.719 --> 0:35:54.359 or do you keep a certain amount in the coffers? 0:35:54.719 --> 0:35:57.520 And if you want money you have to ask your dad. Welcome, 0:35:57.600 --> 0:35:59.960 I have money, and let's put it on the try. 0:36:00.320 --> 0:36:01.960 Yeah I got it. The other person didn't. 0:36:02.080 --> 0:36:02.239 Yeah. 0:36:02.480 --> 0:36:06.160 Our business is a little bit corporate in the maybe 0:36:06.239 --> 0:36:10.360 unexpected sense. We pay ourselves a salary. So the band 0:36:10.520 --> 0:36:13.800 we own what would be considered a touring company and 0:36:13.880 --> 0:36:17.440 a merchandise company and a record label and a publishing company, 0:36:17.960 --> 0:36:21.240 and those companies have a hierarchy of what they pay. 0:36:22.440 --> 0:36:25.640 And then if we have good years, if we have 0:36:25.840 --> 0:36:28.759 years we go, wow, we did really well above then 0:36:29.239 --> 0:36:32.200 that gets into point where you do distributions. So really 0:36:32.400 --> 0:36:35.760 mostly the income from touring, the income from things flow 0:36:35.800 --> 0:36:38.719 into the companies. We set at the beginning of each 0:36:38.800 --> 0:36:41.600 year what the salary is for the guys who are 0:36:41.680 --> 0:36:46.960 running it, which would be us, and then if there 0:36:45.960 --> 0:36:51.319 are wins, that becomes distributions, that becomes bonuses things like that. 0:36:51.320 --> 0:36:52.800 That's a little bit, a little bit of a fusion. 0:36:52.960 --> 0:36:55.680 Okay, if you live in a neighborhood, there might be 0:36:55.719 --> 0:36:58.160 a guy who drives and asks and Martin. There another 0:36:58.320 --> 0:37:01.640 guy might drive a twenty year old Prius h Do 0:37:01.640 --> 0:37:03.560 you look at each other and say, well, man, he's 0:37:03.560 --> 0:37:07.279 spending a lot, he's too tight and he needs to 0:37:07.320 --> 0:37:07.839 spend more. 0:37:08.200 --> 0:37:09.080 It is. 0:37:10.840 --> 0:37:13.520 I don't even know if, because it is incredibly true 0:37:13.960 --> 0:37:17.960 that despite growing up in the same bedroom, you know, 0:37:18.160 --> 0:37:21.920 wearing oftentimes the same clothes, same brand, same everything, we 0:37:21.960 --> 0:37:24.520 don't spend our money the same way. We don't value 0:37:24.560 --> 0:37:27.200 the same kinds of things. And I think the best 0:37:27.239 --> 0:37:30.600 example of that I would have is in recent history. 0:37:30.800 --> 0:37:33.239 I just built a house that I've been wanting to 0:37:33.280 --> 0:37:38.359 build for seventeen years, have been married almost twenty I've 0:37:38.360 --> 0:37:40.960 been thinking about building this house for years and years. 0:37:41.000 --> 0:37:45.439 And I built a house and Taylor bought a bus. Right, 0:37:45.719 --> 0:37:49.160 they cost the same amount of money? Do they have 0:37:49.239 --> 0:37:52.799 the same resale value? Do they have the same bill? 0:37:53.160 --> 0:37:55.960 Zach's house actually wheels underneath his though it's weird. 0:37:56.280 --> 0:37:59.520 So he wants to go on an adventure, right, And 0:37:59.600 --> 0:38:02.759 I want and build a sanctuary, right And and you 0:38:03.200 --> 0:38:07.799 that's that's a hard thing because sometimes, you know, adventure 0:38:08.480 --> 0:38:11.840 wants to do things that have more risk, and sanctuary 0:38:11.920 --> 0:38:13.359 doesn't want to risk anything at all. 0:38:13.760 --> 0:38:15.960 And I, unfortunately spend money on convenience. 0:38:16.080 --> 0:38:19.480 Yeah, I think, No, I think is the most whoa whoa. 0:38:19.320 --> 0:38:22.800 Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa whoa. Why did you buy a bus, Taylor? 0:38:23.120 --> 0:38:24.919 And have you use the bus? 0:38:25.040 --> 0:38:27.760 Yeah? Cautless, I bought Well, I have seven children, first 0:38:27.760 --> 0:38:28.120 of all. 0:38:28.520 --> 0:38:31.520 And I mean there's in fact, it's a question of 0:38:31.520 --> 0:38:33.359 why didn't we buy a bus twenty years ago? 0:38:33.880 --> 0:38:36.200 Actually because actually the Bay probably should have bought a 0:38:36.200 --> 0:38:38.800 bus about twenty There's actually it's interesting I mean, we 0:38:38.840 --> 0:38:40.200 spent in the whole treery industry. 0:38:40.200 --> 0:38:42.080 People LEAs buses, which makes sense because they're new and 0:38:42.080 --> 0:38:44.279 they're up to date and stuff. But you know, there 0:38:44.280 --> 0:38:46.839 are the rock guys, you know there there's country guys, 0:38:46.880 --> 0:38:48.560 a lot of them as well. That too, were consistently 0:38:48.560 --> 0:38:50.600 than at buying bus. I remember thinking, like they bought 0:38:50.640 --> 0:38:54.120 the bus, why they're buy the bus particularly, I've really bought. 0:38:53.920 --> 0:38:54.600 It for my family. 0:38:54.640 --> 0:38:57.600 Firstly, my wife and I always she's always enjoyed were 0:38:57.760 --> 0:39:00.279 We feel like we sort of move best as a 0:39:00.360 --> 0:39:02.200 unit when we're kind of a little more mobile. It 0:39:02.239 --> 0:39:04.560 seems something about it just simplifies life a little bit. 0:39:04.640 --> 0:39:06.440 They both have itchy feet, that's the short answer. 0:39:06.520 --> 0:39:10.120 And and we have seven kids, so meet with tour, uh, 0:39:10.160 --> 0:39:12.160 you know, being able to have them also at least 0:39:12.200 --> 0:39:14.399 have the option to really be with and just kind 0:39:14.400 --> 0:39:16.640 of a little bit more on our own sort of 0:39:16.840 --> 0:39:18.760 you know itinerary so to speak. 0:39:19.200 --> 0:39:20.440 But but yeah, driven. 0:39:20.480 --> 0:39:22.840 Actually the year that Zach started building his house is 0:39:23.000 --> 0:39:25.440 just getting close to being done now, and that we 0:39:25.520 --> 0:39:26.759 started I bought a bus. 0:39:26.800 --> 0:39:27.719 It is a good comparison. 0:39:29.040 --> 0:39:31.759 I drove the bus on the tour that we were doing, 0:39:31.800 --> 0:39:33.960 so I would drive the bus, own bus driver. I 0:39:34.120 --> 0:39:37.680 drove the bus, did the show, crashed for a few hours, 0:39:37.719 --> 0:39:40.160 woke up and drove to the next city and loved it. 0:39:40.520 --> 0:39:42.840 Yeah. But and then you actually ended up saving the 0:39:42.880 --> 0:39:46.360 tour because we had like the last bust in the 0:39:46.480 --> 0:39:49.040 United States that I happened to have a bad axle. 0:39:49.160 --> 0:39:52.480 And right, Yeah, we had a bus accident. 0:39:52.800 --> 0:39:54.920 It's the only one have we There's never been another 0:39:54.960 --> 0:39:58.279 actual bus accident. We had a truck hit our main 0:39:58.360 --> 0:40:01.680 tour bus. And the thankfully just I mean just gift 0:40:01.719 --> 0:40:04.160 from God that I was had a bus and that 0:40:04.200 --> 0:40:06.640 we the last few shows. We in this particular case, 0:40:06.680 --> 0:40:08.600 we're pulling all of our equipment in a large trailer 0:40:08.640 --> 0:40:11.279 behind the main band bus and cooked it onto mine 0:40:11.280 --> 0:40:13.640 and you guys hopped on planes. We finished the tour. 0:40:13.920 --> 0:40:17.640 But last week it's it's a yeah, it's a great 0:40:17.960 --> 0:40:18.959 I love it. See. 0:40:19.000 --> 0:40:21.879 Okay, let's go are you're going to say that. 0:40:21.880 --> 0:40:27.960 Year I bought a new Forerunner, Yeah, after having won 0:40:28.480 --> 0:40:30.400 twenty years? 0:40:30.440 --> 0:40:34.640 Okay, Okay, let's go back to the management thing. 0:40:34.920 --> 0:40:39.000 Yeah, there are different types of managers. There are managers 0:40:39.040 --> 0:40:43.160 of focus on creative, managers of focus on touring other 0:40:43.280 --> 0:40:45.600 people who were dreaming up new ideas. 0:40:46.120 --> 0:40:47.560 Yeah, business. 0:40:47.560 --> 0:40:51.560 What roles do each of you play in the management operation? 0:40:53.880 --> 0:40:56.719 Well, first of all, give kudos to Rebecca Sarkar, who's 0:40:56.760 --> 0:41:00.319 our GM. She does all the logistical things day in 0:41:00.360 --> 0:41:02.640 and day as far as scheduling is concerned. You know 0:41:02.719 --> 0:41:04.319 she's going to be the one that goes, hey, guys, 0:41:04.320 --> 0:41:06.239 that's too much on the list. You guys know it. Right. 0:41:06.320 --> 0:41:08.239 Of course, we're always tending to actually put too much 0:41:08.239 --> 0:41:08.920 on the list anyway. 0:41:09.480 --> 0:41:13.640 So while we have very distinctly different personalities and needs 0:41:13.760 --> 0:41:17.160 and it fits well with our instruments, I think, and 0:41:17.239 --> 0:41:21.319 so I would describe it mostly that way. Taylor is 0:41:22.560 --> 0:41:27.640 like pianos, like composers, trying to dream up the biggest 0:41:27.800 --> 0:41:31.480 life changing thing possible, use all eighty eight keys. If 0:41:31.520 --> 0:41:35.560 it's not scary, it's not that interesting. And so he 0:41:36.000 --> 0:41:39.360 likes to go big. And and so Isaac I think 0:41:39.640 --> 0:41:42.440 is best when he is playing the role that a 0:41:42.600 --> 0:41:45.879 lead guitar should play, which is it's really the accompaniment. 0:41:46.000 --> 0:41:50.439 It's the embellishment, right, And so it's not always this way, 0:41:50.480 --> 0:41:52.760 but a lot of times it's a big Taylor idea, 0:41:53.320 --> 0:41:56.080 and it's an Isaac going, oh, that's really cool. That 0:41:56.080 --> 0:41:59.520 connects here, here, and here, and then I'm pretty much 0:41:59.560 --> 0:42:01.719 the one going like, hey, guys, we are not going 0:42:01.800 --> 0:42:07.320 to do that. That's expensive. That sounds way into. 0:42:07.280 --> 0:42:10.759 We've got to make it more efficient, like drilling down. 0:42:11.520 --> 0:42:13.920 That's an interesting description, Yeah, and I think there's a 0:42:13.920 --> 0:42:15.919 lot a lot of truth to that. And I think 0:42:16.520 --> 0:42:19.920 particularly we we found we found some really core business 0:42:19.960 --> 0:42:23.319 that people know, but things like merchandising and fulfillment and 0:42:23.360 --> 0:42:26.520 fan club you know, that's that's a whole world, you know, 0:42:26.760 --> 0:42:29.239 and that's you know, Zach particularly has always been an artist, 0:42:29.320 --> 0:42:32.880 so he's engaged. When you think about management, management is 0:42:32.960 --> 0:42:35.520 usually takes on the kind of infrastructure that is sort 0:42:35.520 --> 0:42:37.200 of the business, and a lot of artists don't carry 0:42:37.200 --> 0:42:39.880 as much of their office, so to speak, their home office, 0:42:40.040 --> 0:42:42.520 and so we we have some of the components of 0:42:42.560 --> 0:42:45.279 the overall business. It's all in our roof, and so 0:42:45.760 --> 0:42:47.480 there is a little bit of the bridge between that 0:42:47.560 --> 0:42:50.680 creative the band's job and who the manager is off 0:42:50.680 --> 0:42:54.200 and sort of grabbing and so our natural giftings kind 0:42:54.200 --> 0:42:56.120 of you know, connect to those things. 0:42:56.200 --> 0:42:59.680 I think I think because of being the artist, a 0:42:59.719 --> 0:43:05.759 lot of the creative stuff becomes assumed, becomes built in. 0:43:05.960 --> 0:43:08.680 It's like these days you expect all cars to have 0:43:08.719 --> 0:43:12.280 an automatic transmission and electric windows and an air conditioner. 0:43:13.560 --> 0:43:20.040 Our creative process is not the same as the administrative process, right, 0:43:20.480 --> 0:43:24.719 and so in that sense we almost I think there's 0:43:24.719 --> 0:43:26.040 some flipping on its head. 0:43:26.239 --> 0:43:26.319 Ye. 0:43:27.280 --> 0:43:29.400 You know, Isaac as a creator when it comes to 0:43:29.480 --> 0:43:32.719 the world, he's not having a good time unless he's 0:43:32.880 --> 0:43:35.800 not thinking about the rules at all. He just wants 0:43:35.840 --> 0:43:38.840 to feel it. And Taylor wants to get nitty gritty 0:43:38.960 --> 0:43:42.520 and stop everything until everything is done and in its place. 0:43:42.640 --> 0:43:46.320 I don't want to work on the next process because 0:43:47.280 --> 0:43:50.120 the first when it comes to as an administrator, he goes, 0:43:50.200 --> 0:43:52.600 it's not scary enough, it's not big enough. When it 0:43:52.640 --> 0:43:55.480 comes to the creative process, he goes, I haven't finished 0:43:56.040 --> 0:44:00.080 making it perfect and big. And I flipped to the 0:44:00.080 --> 0:44:02.280 other side and go, man, you gotta be more scared. 0:44:02.320 --> 0:44:04.560 You got to finish faster, you gotta go you gotta 0:44:04.600 --> 0:44:08.279 be crazier, because it's sort of the other side of 0:44:08.320 --> 0:44:12.520 that brain that that changes the way we work, and 0:44:12.560 --> 0:44:15.040 it can be hard to bring both those things together. 0:44:15.880 --> 0:44:18.640 Yeah, I think he's in really super interesting articulation, and 0:44:18.680 --> 0:44:21.160 I think again points to that being a band on 0:44:21.239 --> 0:44:24.560 creatives and having these, you know, the management function within 0:44:24.600 --> 0:44:27.759 your shop, the lines are a little different. I think 0:44:27.800 --> 0:44:29.800 I'm the old than the typical I guess, or the 0:44:30.360 --> 0:44:31.720 standard I think for our industry. 0:44:31.760 --> 0:44:34.759 Sorry, I think I'm the only one in the band 0:44:34.760 --> 0:44:37.240 that particular has an interest in actually being an engineer, 0:44:37.280 --> 0:44:40.200 like a recording engineer. Yeah, even though I think you 0:44:40.239 --> 0:44:42.799 guys are all capable of it in some capacity or another. 0:44:42.800 --> 0:44:45.040 I think I'm always been a technical like you really 0:44:45.080 --> 0:44:48.960 like to troubleshoot, I mean mixing engineering, recording like that's 0:44:49.040 --> 0:44:50.480 I think it's really fun for me. 0:44:51.160 --> 0:44:56.960 Okay, you guys finish each other sentences. I have two sisters. 0:44:57.400 --> 0:44:59.560 We don't get along all the time. Doesn't mean we're 0:44:59.600 --> 0:45:02.480 not fan we don't talk. Yeah, so am I seeing 0:45:02.520 --> 0:45:05.560 the moment of harmony? Is it always like this or 0:45:05.640 --> 0:45:08.719 you're arguing? You talking every day or you're not talk 0:45:08.800 --> 0:45:10.799 for a month. What's going on between the three of you? 0:45:11.640 --> 0:45:13.600 I think it's a mix. I mean we have we 0:45:13.680 --> 0:45:16.680 have some serious challenges. We have some deep conflicts of things, 0:45:16.680 --> 0:45:18.160 you know, and I think as you got older too, 0:45:18.600 --> 0:45:21.279 you know, you evolve, right, people have you start in 0:45:21.360 --> 0:45:23.799 the same bedroom, in the same bunk beds, and you have. 0:45:23.760 --> 0:45:25.200 A lot less responsibilities. 0:45:25.280 --> 0:45:28.040 But I would say for me, there's a deep there's 0:45:28.080 --> 0:45:30.440 a deep respect between us. Like I mean, even when 0:45:30.480 --> 0:45:32.520 we really disagree and we we have some things that 0:45:32.520 --> 0:45:34.120 we you know, like man, that's just not a priority 0:45:34.160 --> 0:45:37.040 for me. We have a deep respect that has been 0:45:37.120 --> 0:45:40.200 earned frankly over a lifetime, you know. And I like 0:45:40.239 --> 0:45:42.280 to say that, you know, it's. 0:45:42.160 --> 0:45:44.680 Like I can make fun of my brother, but you can't. 0:45:45.280 --> 0:45:47.000 You know. It's that it's that spirit. 0:45:47.040 --> 0:45:49.200 It's that like you know, the like the group of whatever, 0:45:49.239 --> 0:45:51.440 pick your ethnic core group of that came you know, 0:45:51.480 --> 0:45:53.239 into New York City. It's like these are my you know, 0:45:53.280 --> 0:45:55.439 these are my cousins, and these are my there's that hey, 0:45:55.440 --> 0:45:57.560 this is my people, these are my you know, my family. 0:45:57.640 --> 0:46:00.319 So there's a blood is thicker than water thing that 0:46:00.440 --> 0:46:03.359 I think has been true. But we have very very 0:46:03.400 --> 0:46:06.200 different I mean zachly describing the business side, I mean drummer, 0:46:06.480 --> 0:46:10.400 keyboard player, guitarist as our primary there's that's kind of 0:46:10.600 --> 0:46:13.360 that's kind of who we are, and even our personal 0:46:13.360 --> 0:46:15.399 lives and our business lives and our music. I mean, 0:46:15.840 --> 0:46:19.560 those relationships, those dynamics. You know, we do not agree 0:46:19.560 --> 0:46:21.200 on a lot of things. But I think that's partly 0:46:21.280 --> 0:46:23.279 why we can be somewhat of a unit, because we're 0:46:23.320 --> 0:46:26.080 not actually a lot of times in the same lane. 0:46:26.200 --> 0:46:27.000 I mean, is that fair? 0:46:27.080 --> 0:46:30.080 Well, where it gets complicated is that Zach plays guitar 0:46:30.280 --> 0:46:33.759 and keyboard too, and you play drums and keyboard and 0:46:33.760 --> 0:46:34.480 guitar too. 0:46:34.320 --> 0:46:35.280 And you play keyboard. 0:46:35.400 --> 0:46:38.200 I played guitar, guitar most of the time, keyboards sometimes, 0:46:38.280 --> 0:46:41.080 But I particularly would love to just engineer and mix 0:46:41.440 --> 0:46:43.080 records and tell you guys what to do. 0:46:43.160 --> 0:46:46.200 So if they only listen to their big brother, if 0:46:46.200 --> 0:46:50.560 they only listen to when we talk about our relationships, right, 0:46:50.960 --> 0:46:54.520 the one relationship most people understand that is like this. 0:46:55.640 --> 0:46:59.200 There are not many working relationships that last from your 0:46:59.239 --> 0:47:01.720 youth to your old age. And we have the chance, 0:47:01.920 --> 0:47:05.000 if we want to, to probably still be doing this 0:47:05.520 --> 0:47:08.800 another thirty to forty years from now. 0:47:09.000 --> 0:47:10.120 Right, is terrifying. 0:47:10.239 --> 0:47:12.680 Right if you look at a band like Three Dog Night, right, 0:47:12.719 --> 0:47:14.840 those guys are you know, which we love and we 0:47:14.880 --> 0:47:17.920 just saw that Danny is in his eighties and he's 0:47:17.920 --> 0:47:20.160 still on stage, and you look at the Beach Boys, 0:47:20.200 --> 0:47:21.040 and you know. 0:47:21.280 --> 0:47:22.240 Doc guys are in their eighties. 0:47:22.320 --> 0:47:24.200 Doctor Love is in his eighties. 0:47:24.200 --> 0:47:26.239 Even the Doobies who were just with Michael McDonald and 0:47:26.239 --> 0:47:28.160 the Wonderful for such a great band in their seventies 0:47:28.200 --> 0:47:29.359 and they're still killing. 0:47:29.239 --> 0:47:30.640 So man, they were so good. 0:47:31.440 --> 0:47:37.240 I think it's about the ability to communicate that really 0:47:37.280 --> 0:47:39.560 makes the difference between the relationships that last and the 0:47:39.640 --> 0:47:42.839 relationships that fail. And that's true of marriages, and that's 0:47:42.840 --> 0:47:45.719 true of bands, that's true of business partners, and so 0:47:45.880 --> 0:47:48.919 you I think for us though, we are very far 0:47:48.960 --> 0:47:52.279 from perfect. Starting at a very young age, learning to 0:47:52.360 --> 0:47:56.920 express your feelings, learning to write into a story that 0:47:57.080 --> 0:48:00.160 is understandable, the thing you're going through, the way you 0:48:00.200 --> 0:48:02.759 feel about that girl, the person you want to punch 0:48:02.800 --> 0:48:06.080 in the face, whatever that feeling is, has been a 0:48:06.280 --> 0:48:10.600 hugely beneficial thing to our relationship as as brothers. And 0:48:10.640 --> 0:48:15.239 so sometimes the therapy session is taking place in the 0:48:15.239 --> 0:48:20.560 interview right sometimes, And sometimes the therapy session is taking 0:48:20.560 --> 0:48:23.560 place in the song that is on the record right Wow. 0:48:23.719 --> 0:48:28.600 Sometimes that a song a couple of years ago that 0:48:28.680 --> 0:48:32.200 I started called change right And at that moment, that 0:48:32.280 --> 0:48:36.560 song was probably written directly directly to Isaac and Tailor like, 0:48:36.880 --> 0:48:38.880 why don't you stop doing that stuff? 0:48:39.320 --> 0:48:43.360 I've been really seriously, please stop it. 0:48:43.719 --> 0:48:46.520 I would I would say it is the relationship with 0:48:46.600 --> 0:48:50.440 brothers is easy when we are doing the things we 0:48:50.520 --> 0:48:53.920 have trained ourselves to do so well, which is to 0:48:54.080 --> 0:48:58.640 be on stage playing those roles, playing those songs. And 0:48:58.680 --> 0:49:05.479 it's it's hard when it is just theoretical. It's hard 0:49:05.520 --> 0:49:10.240 when it is not about the dream and the story 0:49:10.440 --> 0:49:15.319 and it's just about people's perception and what we want 0:49:15.480 --> 0:49:18.640 to get done. And that's not unique. We're brothers. We fight, 0:49:18.840 --> 0:49:21.400 we have really hard times. My wife would say, I 0:49:21.800 --> 0:49:26.319 don't know how you are capable of going to the 0:49:26.440 --> 0:49:31.240 office and having a five hour argument and then going 0:49:31.360 --> 0:49:33.880 back to the office the next day. How have you 0:49:33.960 --> 0:49:37.000 not quit? And I go like, I just thought that 0:49:37.080 --> 0:49:41.760 life was about struggling together. You know, life is so 0:49:42.000 --> 0:49:45.400 often about struggling together. And that's written into our masochism, 0:49:46.200 --> 0:49:49.000 that's written into our music, that's written into you know, 0:49:49.280 --> 0:49:53.520 our beliefs in the world, like, struggle is not the enemy. Struggle, 0:49:53.719 --> 0:49:55.239 the question is what you're struggling for? 0:49:55.560 --> 0:49:59.919 Yeah, okay, how long might it be till you speak 0:50:00.080 --> 0:50:03.480 to one another or essentially connecting, you know, text message whatever, 0:50:03.880 --> 0:50:04.520 every day. 0:50:05.480 --> 0:50:07.920 I mean, it honestly depends on the season. I mean 0:50:07.960 --> 0:50:11.120 there are times like because we work creatively, and a 0:50:11.120 --> 0:50:13.799 lot of times there's seasons of tour where we're with 0:50:13.880 --> 0:50:17.520 each other every day constantly. But I would say there's 0:50:17.719 --> 0:50:20.439 there when there truly are breaks, you know, and we're 0:50:20.480 --> 0:50:23.880 not in a big project. It could easily be a 0:50:23.920 --> 0:50:26.799 week or so, as far as it unless it's the 0:50:26.880 --> 0:50:28.200 requirement because we run a business. 0:50:28.239 --> 0:50:30.360 I think I actually texted you all week while you 0:50:30.400 --> 0:50:32.400 were going with your family, not directly. 0:50:32.760 --> 0:50:34.440 It's a hard one to define. It's a hard one. 0:50:34.640 --> 0:50:37.600 There's a lot of there's a lot ofstical communications about 0:50:37.760 --> 0:50:40.760 you know, by choice versus by responsibility. 0:50:41.280 --> 0:50:45.359 Okay, so by choice never by responsibility all the time. 0:50:45.480 --> 0:50:52.600 Yeah, let me here. Here's here's the it's different entire Isaac. 0:50:53.040 --> 0:50:55.319 Isaac had to confine me. I just moved. I spent 0:50:55.400 --> 0:50:58.280 about two weeks moving from one house to a new house, 0:50:58.800 --> 0:51:00.960 and Isaac had to call me like, dude, are you 0:51:01.040 --> 0:51:04.719 moving all the furniture by yourself? I'm like, maybe, He's like, 0:51:05.080 --> 0:51:07.200 are you not going to call me? I've got two 0:51:07.239 --> 0:51:10.840 teenage sons that are six y three, that are strong, 0:51:10.960 --> 0:51:13.600 like are you gonna am? I gonna find you underneath 0:51:13.640 --> 0:51:17.920 an armoiir like like dead, like bro call me So 0:51:17.960 --> 0:51:20.080 I think, I think it's different for each of us, 0:51:20.360 --> 0:51:23.719 but we get such a saturation that I as a 0:51:23.760 --> 0:51:27.680 general rule, it's it's hard to find the difference between 0:51:27.880 --> 0:51:31.279 family and work. And it's been that way since I 0:51:31.360 --> 0:51:34.799 was literally six years old. Right six years old, we 0:51:34.880 --> 0:51:38.479 play our first concert as the Hanson Brothers, and that's 0:51:38.600 --> 0:51:42.279 us just singing a cappella. And since that day we 0:51:42.440 --> 0:51:46.200 have been called brothers by our family, the brothers. We 0:51:46.280 --> 0:51:49.640 have a fourth brother. He's not included in the brothers. 0:51:49.680 --> 0:51:53.680 There's an entity that is Hanson that exists within the family, 0:51:54.120 --> 0:51:57.760 and then there is something else, and it's not always clear. 0:51:57.880 --> 0:51:58.600 We don't. 0:52:00.440 --> 0:52:02.840 Since it's a reminder, it's important to a reminder. We 0:52:02.960 --> 0:52:07.400 also have wives and children and and talking about what 0:52:07.440 --> 0:52:09.879 he's saying, like the difference, you know, hard to draw 0:52:09.920 --> 0:52:12.120 a line. One of the things that I think in 0:52:12.160 --> 0:52:16.280 a good way has amplified and also increases the gap 0:52:16.320 --> 0:52:18.080 of Hey, I'm the challenge. You haven't heard from me 0:52:18.120 --> 0:52:21.840 for a while. I wonder, well, you're literally you're the 0:52:21.960 --> 0:52:24.479 dad of a whole crew. You're a dad of a crew, 0:52:24.600 --> 0:52:29.120 and that keeping that sort of other sort of fiefdom alive. 0:52:30.120 --> 0:52:32.360 In a band like this, which is so connected and 0:52:32.400 --> 0:52:34.880 so you know, integrated, you have to sort of be 0:52:35.280 --> 0:52:38.040 You really have to take you really have to seek 0:52:38.120 --> 0:52:41.160 that time because there are there's so many blurry lines 0:52:41.200 --> 0:52:42.000 like we even you know. 0:52:42.160 --> 0:52:47.480 The short answer is we have never gone had a 0:52:47.680 --> 0:52:52.160 period without some show to do, some business, meaning to 0:52:52.200 --> 0:52:55.840 have that was long enough to discover how long it 0:52:55.880 --> 0:52:59.600 would be before we text each other. Right, There's never 0:52:59.680 --> 0:53:04.640 been more than about maybe two weeks. In the last 0:53:05.440 --> 0:53:08.480 there was a two years where there wasn't a band 0:53:08.600 --> 0:53:09.239 thing to do. 0:53:17.000 --> 0:53:20.920 Okay, let's let's switch gears a little bit, one by one, Isaac, 0:53:22.760 --> 0:53:24.400 When did you meet your wife? 0:53:25.080 --> 0:53:27.880 So? I met my wife on September nineteenth, two thousand 0:53:27.880 --> 0:53:32.319 and three, at the New Orleans House of Blues. She 0:53:32.640 --> 0:53:37.000 was at one of our shows on our Underneath Acoustic tour. Right, 0:53:38.800 --> 0:53:41.839 I think it's on Decatur Avenue over there. I love 0:53:41.880 --> 0:53:46.400 New Orleans and anyway, she was there with two friends. 0:53:47.320 --> 0:53:50.720 One of her friends is very tall. She's a little 0:53:50.719 --> 0:53:52.879 an inch taller and has platinum blonde hair, and then 0:53:52.880 --> 0:53:55.080 my wife has kind of brunette blonde hair and is 0:53:55.560 --> 0:53:56.240 about an inch. 0:53:56.080 --> 0:53:57.520 Sure, trying to paint a picture for the. 0:53:58.360 --> 0:54:01.120 Yeah, exactly. And so I just they were kind of 0:54:01.239 --> 0:54:05.359 right about center in the in the crowd, and I 0:54:05.560 --> 0:54:08.799 noticed her and couldn't stop staring at her. And I 0:54:08.800 --> 0:54:13.160 think it was really awkward for her. According to her report. 0:54:13.120 --> 0:54:15.280 It was awkward for everyone. 0:54:15.920 --> 0:54:18.960 And and so yeah, I made sure she didn't leave. 0:54:19.000 --> 0:54:20.600 I had to go to a great effort to get 0:54:20.719 --> 0:54:22.080 to believe it or not, I had to go to 0:54:22.120 --> 0:54:25.080 great effort to get her attention, because I think she 0:54:25.120 --> 0:54:26.120 didn't want the attention. 0:54:26.760 --> 0:54:30.960 She's what exactly did you do and how did you connect? 0:54:31.400 --> 0:54:32.160 Oh? Well she was. 0:54:32.200 --> 0:54:35.239 So she's pretty much dead center in front of me 0:54:35.400 --> 0:54:38.360 at this particular, you know, set of shows, because I 0:54:38.400 --> 0:54:40.600 was in the center of the band set up. I 0:54:40.640 --> 0:54:42.680 was in the center of the stage and the acoustic tour, 0:54:43.080 --> 0:54:45.240 and so she was right in the center. She's probably 0:54:45.280 --> 0:54:50.680 about five six people back, and I basically just sang 0:54:50.880 --> 0:54:52.400 every single song straight at her. 0:54:52.520 --> 0:54:55.759 Yeah, didn't you practically call security on her? No? No, no, 0:54:55.800 --> 0:54:56.879 I did, I did. 0:54:57.239 --> 0:54:58.560 She was believe. 0:54:59.000 --> 0:55:02.480 Somebody get the bouncer she's already asked, can't leave the show, 0:55:02.600 --> 0:55:04.719 and you're gonna have to break your neck to get her? 0:55:04.800 --> 0:55:07.760 No, I I fold tilt, like, I threw a guitar 0:55:07.800 --> 0:55:10.959 pick at her, hit her with it, and I was like, yeah, 0:55:11.040 --> 0:55:14.160 you go over there, you know, And she was like huh. 0:55:14.200 --> 0:55:16.480 And then she started to leave and I panicked, and 0:55:16.520 --> 0:55:18.720 so I got one of the local security. 0:55:18.280 --> 0:55:20.759 People to go find you, go find her. 0:55:20.760 --> 0:55:23.479 I was like, see those two people the blonde plot 0:55:23.520 --> 0:55:26.160 and blind must meet them. Yeah, and so I kind 0:55:26.160 --> 0:55:28.920 of I'm a hopeless romantic and so uh and I 0:55:29.000 --> 0:55:33.480 was clearly hopeless stoppless that night. But anyway, it worked out. 0:55:33.320 --> 0:55:35.960 Which is so interesting because okay, who whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. 0:55:36.760 --> 0:55:41.360 You're obviously interested, You're smith, you have the security rainer in, 0:55:42.320 --> 0:55:45.279 You're now face to face. Is she into you? 0:55:45.880 --> 0:55:51.400 She she is enough to stick around, you know. I 0:55:51.440 --> 0:55:53.839 mean we spent all we spent like. 0:55:53.880 --> 0:55:56.680 Calm down, slow down, and answered the question. 0:55:57.360 --> 0:56:01.279 Yes. I mean the short answer is yes. I mean yeah, 0:56:01.320 --> 0:56:04.040 she she she'd take care of number. 0:56:04.520 --> 0:56:05.359 Yeah, I gave her. 0:56:05.719 --> 0:56:08.560 Okay, okay, but you're in a touring rock band. She 0:56:08.640 --> 0:56:12.360 lives in New Orleans, how do you sustain the relationship 0:56:12.719 --> 0:56:14.800 and keep it going to the point you get married? 0:56:15.160 --> 0:56:18.120 On the phone? Uh? And also I went to see her. 0:56:18.160 --> 0:56:20.200 She's actually originally from Panama City, Florida. 0:56:21.440 --> 0:56:23.000 Real quick, you just occurred to me, are you guys 0:56:23.000 --> 0:56:26.479 feel recording visuals on your side? I just no, okay, 0:56:26.840 --> 0:56:28.680 because he's read yeah, no, no. 0:56:28.520 --> 0:56:30.520 No, That's what the internet is for. 0:56:33.440 --> 0:56:35.960 So on the phone, you know, that's how you stay 0:56:36.000 --> 0:56:39.640 in touch. And I went to see her several different times, uh, 0:56:39.760 --> 0:56:43.040 right after we'd met. And then I, you know, I 0:56:43.200 --> 0:56:47.399 brought her out to shows, you know, uh, in New York, 0:56:47.480 --> 0:56:51.319 in Michigan, in different places, and you know, we'd stay 0:56:51.360 --> 0:56:53.880 in touch. In fact, actually, at one point over the 0:56:53.920 --> 0:56:55.920 course of a summer, she actually moved to Oklahoma for 0:56:55.960 --> 0:56:59.719 like three months because we just hadn't been around each other, 0:57:00.640 --> 0:57:02.040 and I was just like, well, we got to figure 0:57:02.040 --> 0:57:05.080 out if this works, you know. Interestingly enough, I accidentally 0:57:05.080 --> 0:57:06.000 broke up with her at. 0:57:05.880 --> 0:57:10.000 That particular, accidentally broke up with her. He's a mess. 0:57:10.160 --> 0:57:10.760 I'm a mess. 0:57:10.880 --> 0:57:13.160 He's a mess. It's a wonder that. 0:57:13.200 --> 0:57:15.879 She Oh, since everybody's talking about what do you mean 0:57:15.920 --> 0:57:17.120 you accidentally broke up? 0:57:17.920 --> 0:57:20.160 Well, I broke up with her a couple of times 0:57:20.160 --> 0:57:22.200 over the course of that three year period before we 0:57:22.240 --> 0:57:27.280 got married. Why because life is complicated and my wife 0:57:27.280 --> 0:57:31.640 is an introvert and I'm a severe extrovert, and so 0:57:32.280 --> 0:57:36.760 when we were on the phone together, it was it 0:57:36.800 --> 0:57:39.080 was always a little bit harder on the phone, but 0:57:39.120 --> 0:57:42.640 when she was with me, it was really easy and 0:57:42.680 --> 0:57:46.080 it was really fun, and so it just the difference. 0:57:45.800 --> 0:57:49.400 Was just really instance. I think you know exactly why 0:57:49.440 --> 0:57:53.080 by your meeting of her in the first place, which 0:57:53.120 --> 0:57:56.520 is she's standing in the center of the crowd. You 0:57:56.600 --> 0:58:00.360 are beaming at her with laser eyes, and she's going, 0:58:00.440 --> 0:58:03.240 who me, No, I'm not sure. This is a lot 0:58:03.280 --> 0:58:06.640 of attention, This is a lot of energy, right, Yeah, 0:58:07.360 --> 0:58:09.600 and yeah it works when it worked. 0:58:09.680 --> 0:58:12.360 Oh okay, okay, what was she doing? How old were 0:58:12.440 --> 0:58:14.560 you at the time? How old was she? And what 0:58:14.680 --> 0:58:16.120 was she doing in Panama City? 0:58:16.320 --> 0:58:19.200 Okay? So yeah, So she and her friends had come 0:58:19.240 --> 0:58:22.040 to New Orleans to see our show because her best 0:58:22.080 --> 0:58:25.440 friend was a big Hanson fan, and so they decided 0:58:25.600 --> 0:58:27.320 we're gonna have a girl's weekend and go to New Orleans. 0:58:27.320 --> 0:58:30.240 She is nineteen, her other friends are nineteen, so they 0:58:30.280 --> 0:58:32.560 go to the show and spent a few days in 0:58:32.680 --> 0:58:36.560 Orleans and I was twenty two. 0:58:37.360 --> 0:58:38.280 Yeah like that. 0:58:38.400 --> 0:58:41.480 Yeah, I tell okay, you're the oldest brother. 0:58:41.680 --> 0:58:42.600 Yeah. 0:58:42.720 --> 0:58:47.800 The band has this incredible success no one around the 0:58:47.840 --> 0:58:52.480 world in a way that no one is today. Yeah, 0:58:52.520 --> 0:58:55.360 to use the vernacular of rock and roll, did you 0:58:55.480 --> 0:58:56.520 take advantage of this? 0:58:58.160 --> 0:59:00.920 Well, we would have killed him, They would have They 0:59:00.960 --> 0:59:03.120 would have killed me. Yeah, No, I did not. I 0:59:03.160 --> 0:59:07.160 did not take advantage of it. Uh. You know, I 0:59:07.160 --> 0:59:09.640 have a really good relationship with my mom, and my 0:59:09.840 --> 0:59:12.720 mom made it very clear that she did not want 0:59:12.720 --> 0:59:18.560 her sons being reckless with their relationships and and with 0:59:18.560 --> 0:59:21.840 with women. She would basically imply something to the effect of, 0:59:22.120 --> 0:59:24.560 treat her like you would like you would treat me, 0:59:24.720 --> 0:59:27.280 and or like you would treat your sisters and uh 0:59:27.560 --> 0:59:35.040 and be respectful. So yeah, I was. I was respectful 0:59:35.040 --> 0:59:38.440 of the uh of the distance that was necessary. 0:59:40.120 --> 0:59:43.640 Okay, okay, how many children do you have now? 0:59:43.880 --> 0:59:46.400 My wife and have three kids. We have a seventeen 0:59:46.440 --> 0:59:49.000 year old, a sixteen year old, and a ten year old. 0:59:50.000 --> 0:59:50.960 And what are they up to? 0:59:51.840 --> 0:59:52.600 Uh? 0:59:52.640 --> 0:59:58.040 Well, my oldest son, Everett really loves guitar. God bless him. 0:59:59.080 --> 0:59:59.520 Poor guy. 1:00:00.000 --> 1:00:02.960 He plays very very well, and he does have he 1:00:03.000 --> 1:00:05.920 does have a songwriting skill and his kind of honing 1:00:05.960 --> 1:00:09.560 those skills. I think if he wants to put in 1:00:09.840 --> 1:00:12.320 enough work to really do it, there is definitely a 1:00:12.400 --> 1:00:14.960 chance that he could make a career in music if 1:00:15.000 --> 1:00:18.920 he's willing to work hard enough. My other son, Monroe, 1:00:20.320 --> 1:00:24.800 is sixteen years old, and he's again, both my sons 1:00:24.800 --> 1:00:29.000 are about sixty three and big kid, very athletic. He 1:00:29.960 --> 1:00:33.120 throws a baseball really hard. He throws like eighty two 1:00:33.280 --> 1:00:35.160 eighty three miles an hour, you know, and he's and 1:00:35.200 --> 1:00:39.600 he just turned sixteen, so yeah, yeah, and your daughter's 1:00:39.680 --> 1:00:44.000 just and your third child, My third child is her 1:00:44.080 --> 1:00:47.360 name is Odette, and she's ten, and she is a 1:00:47.600 --> 1:00:52.120 major extrovert and just loves people and sings whenever she 1:00:52.160 --> 1:00:55.360 wants to and is a lot of fun. But she's ten, 1:00:55.480 --> 1:00:58.120 so you know, figure aspiration. 1:00:58.200 --> 1:01:00.760 It's so funny. We're not allowed to say she's just ten. 1:01:00.880 --> 1:01:04.320 I mean, at ten years old, we had already been 1:01:04.480 --> 1:01:08.120 doing the band for four years and and I mean 1:01:08.560 --> 1:01:10.680 we almost had a record deal, we'd already had I think, 1:01:11.240 --> 1:01:15.400 what she's got to pick this thing? You're speaking to 1:01:15.480 --> 1:01:16.760 something that Everett says. 1:01:16.520 --> 1:01:18.360 To me and goes, dad, do you have any idea 1:01:18.360 --> 1:01:21.080 how much pressure it is to be your son at seventeen? 1:01:22.120 --> 1:01:26.440 That's okay, Let's let's switch to Taylor. Man, how did 1:01:26.440 --> 1:01:27.440 you meet your wife? 1:01:27.560 --> 1:01:29.880 Well, you're gonna sense a theme. I met my wife 1:01:29.880 --> 1:01:34.240 at a show as well, I guess technically, Well, so 1:01:34.280 --> 1:01:36.960 she and her friend. Again, there's a pair they were 1:01:37.000 --> 1:01:39.360 at We did a sohole series of promotion events to 1:01:39.360 --> 1:01:42.080 our second tour, and we told a series of marketing 1:01:42.080 --> 1:01:44.760 events with Macy's department stores, and her and her friend. 1:01:44.800 --> 1:01:47.840 Her friend was a local model, and they were both 1:01:47.880 --> 1:01:50.640 there and they we did a whole show like there's 1:01:50.640 --> 1:01:52.960 a little local modeling show with our event we did, 1:01:53.080 --> 1:01:56.680 and they came to the show, the actual concert we did. 1:01:56.720 --> 1:01:59.520 They're from Atlanta that night? 1:02:00.600 --> 1:02:02.919 Was it that night? That sex day? Then the next 1:02:02.960 --> 1:02:05.560 day and and this is two thousand, so I could. 1:02:05.400 --> 1:02:09.640 Say I was sixteen, she was sixteen, and she was 1:02:09.720 --> 1:02:13.680 you know, super super cute, and we met after the show, 1:02:14.440 --> 1:02:19.200 and basically I was so uninterested in dating or frankly, again, 1:02:19.560 --> 1:02:21.840 here we are with with with lots of female fans. 1:02:21.880 --> 1:02:24.280 Of course, I mean we're that does not go by 1:02:24.520 --> 1:02:28.320 missed by us, but in a way like now they 1:02:28.320 --> 1:02:31.000 think about it, it's kind of wild. I We're just 1:02:31.120 --> 1:02:33.880 still who we are, Like I was so focused on 1:02:34.320 --> 1:02:36.920 what we were trying to do and like basically beating 1:02:36.960 --> 1:02:40.200 the odds as a band. Like girls were, I mean beautiful. Frankly, 1:02:40.240 --> 1:02:42.080 we've seen a lot of beautiful girls. Like That's one 1:02:42.080 --> 1:02:43.480 of the great gifts of getting to do what we 1:02:43.520 --> 1:02:46.080 do is yes, we've seen a lot of beautiful girls, 1:02:45.120 --> 1:02:50.280 but no interest frankly really in you know, chasing and 1:02:50.440 --> 1:02:55.439 particularly and this met my wife names Natalie and Starr 1:02:55.520 --> 1:02:59.640 after the show, and she was just we just clicked immediately, 1:02:59.680 --> 1:03:03.040 I mean almost too Like I couldn't even try and 1:03:03.560 --> 1:03:05.680 you know, turn off the connection I had. It's like 1:03:05.720 --> 1:03:07.640 when you meet somebody and you immediately feel like you 1:03:08.080 --> 1:03:10.640 know them and you know and and we had the 1:03:10.680 --> 1:03:13.720 craziest and most rock and roll thing that happened immediately 1:03:13.760 --> 1:03:16.200 after the show. I can't still can't even believe this 1:03:16.240 --> 1:03:18.400 was happening. So we played the Tabernacle Theater that night 1:03:18.400 --> 1:03:21.320 in Atlanta, amazing theater. I love that place. And underneath 1:03:21.360 --> 1:03:25.040 in the club below us was was Mick Taylor from 1:03:25.080 --> 1:03:29.800 The Rolling Stones doing a solo show and somebody said, hey, 1:03:30.080 --> 1:03:32.240 Mick Taylor for the Rolling Stones is downstairs plane. 1:03:32.280 --> 1:03:35.000 We're like what, and so we just we rocked down there. 1:03:35.840 --> 1:03:36.480 Most of the crew. 1:03:36.600 --> 1:03:39.200 It was like a like a weird almost famous situation, 1:03:39.280 --> 1:03:42.400 like what is happening? So we immediately just we just clicked. 1:03:42.400 --> 1:03:45.840 And I joked that she totally played me early on 1:03:46.720 --> 1:03:49.960 because she was super super cute and and of course 1:03:50.520 --> 1:03:54.600 I was really not frankly interested in girlfriends or relationships. 1:03:54.640 --> 1:03:57.120 It was like band, a band, band. 1:03:56.960 --> 1:04:00.720 Or nothing, you know, And and she totally threw in. 1:04:00.840 --> 1:04:02.680 She knew that we loved rock and roll, in classic 1:04:02.760 --> 1:04:05.120 rock bands, and and she told me she like Steppin' 1:04:05.160 --> 1:04:07.080 Wolf and she went down like the sixties bands. 1:04:07.080 --> 1:04:09.760 I was like, man, this girl's amazing. Who is it? 1:04:09.960 --> 1:04:13.400 She's she's incredible. So we she'd done her homework. 1:04:13.440 --> 1:04:16.080 But you know, the thing is she she and I 1:04:16.080 --> 1:04:18.000 I would really say, I am just so blown away 1:04:18.040 --> 1:04:20.160 by like the life I've had now. You know, we 1:04:20.240 --> 1:04:23.520 got married before I was twenty two and a half years. 1:04:23.720 --> 1:04:27.520 You know, we were never together more than nine days 1:04:27.560 --> 1:04:30.640 prior to getting married. We got decided we got married, 1:04:30.680 --> 1:04:33.880 and the thing was we'd already lived so much life. 1:04:33.920 --> 1:04:36.160 We dated remotely, just like Ike when he was talking 1:04:36.160 --> 1:04:38.680 about you're living this remote life. You know, she's flying 1:04:38.720 --> 1:04:41.800 back and forth. You're teenagers, and it's does it. There's 1:04:41.800 --> 1:04:44.040 no comparison. I don't know anybody that I can even 1:04:44.080 --> 1:04:47.680 talk to about the relationship dynamic we had because it's 1:04:47.720 --> 1:04:51.480 so odd, but it worked because it for us, it 1:04:51.600 --> 1:04:53.960 was like we immediately had this And I don't know 1:04:54.000 --> 1:04:56.200 if proof for other things, but with Natalie and I, 1:04:56.240 --> 1:04:59.240 we just really immediately sort of were in friends. It 1:04:59.280 --> 1:05:00.920 was like you just kind of had a click and 1:05:00.960 --> 1:05:04.160 you just rolled easily together. And here I am, you know, 1:05:04.440 --> 1:05:06.720 twenty three years later with seven child. 1:05:06.800 --> 1:05:10.200 So you're you're you're married just before you're twenty years old? 1:05:10.360 --> 1:05:11.880 How long until you have a kid. 1:05:12.000 --> 1:05:15.760 Right out of the gate? And yeah, they're at that 1:05:15.840 --> 1:05:19.000 age when everything works, you know, it just all works. 1:05:19.760 --> 1:05:21.120 You know, how many kids do you have? 1:05:21.160 --> 1:05:21.320 Have? 1:05:21.360 --> 1:05:21.680 Seven? 1:05:23.360 --> 1:05:26.560 Is there any reason you have seven as opposed to 1:05:26.600 --> 1:05:27.760 two or eleven? Well? 1:05:27.800 --> 1:05:33.160 You know, science mostly No, I don't didn't take biology 1:05:33.200 --> 1:05:34.600 and homes you know. 1:05:34.800 --> 1:05:38.439 We just we always loved I would say this, Yes, 1:05:38.480 --> 1:05:40.800 obviously we could have you know, could have not had 1:05:40.880 --> 1:05:43.720 more children. We could have had one, two, three. You know, 1:05:43.800 --> 1:05:47.400 obviously everybody knows how that works. But I think we 1:05:47.520 --> 1:05:49.760 both found Natalie and I have both found that we 1:05:49.880 --> 1:05:54.000 really liked that, We really enjoyed it more than either 1:05:54.040 --> 1:05:55.800 one of us thought. She was one of those people 1:05:55.800 --> 1:05:58.200 that I think thought she would be like super career, 1:05:58.400 --> 1:06:02.000 like she's super nerdy, smart historian into that she likes, 1:06:02.920 --> 1:06:05.440 she's bookish, you know, and me here I am we're 1:06:05.440 --> 1:06:07.080 doing our thing working since I was nine. 1:06:07.880 --> 1:06:09.720 But we I think we both found we just really 1:06:09.840 --> 1:06:10.480 liked it. 1:06:10.520 --> 1:06:12.960 And my the accidental thing for me that that has 1:06:13.040 --> 1:06:16.400 now occurred in a big way is I also realized 1:06:16.520 --> 1:06:19.640 how much kind of the life we've led there's a 1:06:19.640 --> 1:06:22.080 lot of connectivity to the chaos of big familydom. 1:06:22.080 --> 1:06:22.880 You know, it's this sort of. 1:06:22.920 --> 1:06:24.200 Well a big family. 1:06:24.440 --> 1:06:25.280 We're part of a big family. 1:06:25.280 --> 1:06:27.080 We're three of you know, with the three oldest of seven, 1:06:27.200 --> 1:06:29.880 and so we just really started we enjoyed them and 1:06:30.080 --> 1:06:32.640 we thought five five was like a real line in 1:06:32.680 --> 1:06:35.040 the sand, like we were good. Five was an amazing group, 1:06:36.000 --> 1:06:38.920 and it just it was like we both felt like 1:06:39.000 --> 1:06:41.360 maybe there was a little more to this story, so 1:06:42.280 --> 1:06:42.520 that the. 1:06:42.520 --> 1:06:44.240 Bigger kids as a surprise. 1:06:44.960 --> 1:06:48.040 It's less of a surprise. Actually, Okay, it really wasn't 1:06:48.080 --> 1:06:48.600 it really was. 1:06:48.680 --> 1:06:51.480 It was the least surprise actually, of the over the 1:06:51.760 --> 1:06:53.640 kind of having kids was was number six. 1:06:53.680 --> 1:06:56.400 And I think, you know, it's interesting. 1:06:56.480 --> 1:06:58.440 I never would have sought thought if you go back 1:06:58.480 --> 1:07:01.040 to me as a teenager or young you know, younger 1:07:01.040 --> 1:07:03.400 than a teenager, even thinking oh yeah, I'm gonna have 1:07:03.440 --> 1:07:03.959 seven kids. 1:07:03.960 --> 1:07:05.080 But it's a blast. 1:07:05.480 --> 1:07:06.439 I would have never thought you would. 1:07:06.560 --> 1:07:09.920 Okay, it's a lot of fun. So you have seven kids? 1:07:09.960 --> 1:07:11.800 What are their ages and what are they up to? 1:07:12.600 --> 1:07:18.240 Twenty one? My oldest is biggest passion is piano and music. 1:07:19.160 --> 1:07:19.320 You know. 1:07:19.400 --> 1:07:22.800 My second is she's kind of a curator. She's like, 1:07:23.080 --> 1:07:27.480 she likes films, she likes fashion. She's you know right, 1:07:27.600 --> 1:07:30.000 she's probably not college bound, it's just not her things. 1:07:30.080 --> 1:07:32.960 She's kind of interned and worked on film and fashion 1:07:33.040 --> 1:07:36.000 things and styled a little bit. She's into photography, so 1:07:36.480 --> 1:07:40.240 she's our third is definitely a musician. He's a drummer 1:07:40.800 --> 1:07:42.440 or just kind of one of those kids that just 1:07:42.480 --> 1:07:44.640 picked stuff up and you go like, how did you 1:07:44.720 --> 1:07:47.240 when did you learn to do susophone? Like that kind 1:07:47.240 --> 1:07:49.560 of not actually susophone, but he's just one of those 1:07:49.600 --> 1:07:52.360 people that is musical like that. Zach has one like 1:07:52.400 --> 1:07:56.040 that that's just like figure stuff out. My fourth is 1:07:56.080 --> 1:08:00.440 also super creative. I realized I was not saying names. 1:08:00.480 --> 1:08:04.800 Ezra Penelope River is my three, and Vigo is our fourth. 1:08:05.560 --> 1:08:10.560 He's fifteen and just got his drivers permit today and 1:08:10.720 --> 1:08:13.800 super creative. Also always says I had a really pragmatic mind, 1:08:13.840 --> 1:08:16.160 like very ambitious, like always had. I was watching a 1:08:16.240 --> 1:08:19.240 video of him talking about building weather domes like when 1:08:19.240 --> 1:08:22.080 he was thirteen, Like he's just interested in stuff. 1:08:22.120 --> 1:08:23.920 He's ambitious and analytical. 1:08:24.040 --> 1:08:27.920 Yeah. And then my number five will Almina. We call 1:08:27.960 --> 1:08:28.360 her Willa. 1:08:28.760 --> 1:08:31.840 She's always been sort of a drama queen, like in 1:08:31.880 --> 1:08:35.599 the sense of liking drama, like acting comedy, like she's funny. 1:08:35.640 --> 1:08:37.639 She puts on little shows and she's super good. 1:08:37.720 --> 1:08:39.400 She create drama in your house. 1:08:40.240 --> 1:08:43.160 Yes to a degree, but she but she is actually 1:08:43.200 --> 1:08:46.080 really creative. She she makes like puppet shows and writes 1:08:46.120 --> 1:08:48.000 stories and always that's always been her. 1:08:48.400 --> 1:08:48.640 I mean. 1:08:48.720 --> 1:08:52.160 Then Indiana is our number six. Now my wife jokes 1:08:52.160 --> 1:08:54.320 that like I put it in order for him, like 1:08:54.360 --> 1:08:57.760 I ordered him, like by mail. Because he's this, you know, 1:08:57.960 --> 1:09:01.160 he just he's a high energy she too smart for 1:09:01.160 --> 1:09:04.680 his own good, ready up, ready for anything, super extroverted. 1:09:05.160 --> 1:09:09.479 And then our youngest, Willowmita is the golden child. Truly 1:09:09.560 --> 1:09:14.200 is spoiled for life. She she is adored by everyone 1:09:14.360 --> 1:09:16.760 to the point that like, man, you are so but 1:09:17.160 --> 1:09:19.519 truly she is actually incredibly her middle name is joy 1:09:19.640 --> 1:09:22.599 and she really is a like incredibly joyful human. I 1:09:22.640 --> 1:09:24.439 don't think that's just for being a seven child, it's 1:09:24.520 --> 1:09:28.360 just her personality. So yet to know because she's three. 1:09:28.479 --> 1:09:30.880 You know, we'll see what she does. But so, yeah, 1:09:31.080 --> 1:09:33.479 it's a big group of people, and we talk about 1:09:33.520 --> 1:09:36.360 this because there's twenty five or six cousins between all 1:09:36.400 --> 1:09:39.960 of us. Between all of us, it's amazing how you 1:09:39.960 --> 1:09:42.439 can have the same you know, pair of parents in 1:09:42.479 --> 1:09:45.040 these different clusters and you still have all these such 1:09:45.160 --> 1:09:49.040 completely different kids, like they have their own Like how 1:09:49.080 --> 1:09:50.360 did you get that combination? 1:09:50.520 --> 1:09:52.599 Like I'm not it still blows my mind. 1:10:00.360 --> 1:10:02.400 Okay, Zach, how'd you meet your wife? 1:10:02.720 --> 1:10:06.240 As third? So in Taylor's story, there was a model 1:10:07.479 --> 1:10:09.920 that brought his wife to our concert. My wife is 1:10:09.960 --> 1:10:13.720 the model, so basically I met her then I was 1:10:13.760 --> 1:10:18.160 about fourteen and I was dating another girl, but it 1:10:18.240 --> 1:10:21.800 was immediately clear that I'm like, I just need to 1:10:22.000 --> 1:10:24.759 know you. And about a year later we started dating, 1:10:25.200 --> 1:10:26.960 and about six months later I knew I was going 1:10:27.000 --> 1:10:30.040 to marry her. But at fifteen and a half, it's 1:10:30.360 --> 1:10:35.559 usually frowned upon to get married. And so she was 1:10:35.560 --> 1:10:38.439 in college, she finished her finest degree, went to school 1:10:39.120 --> 1:10:41.880 just on scholarships and things, and so we said, hey, 1:10:42.160 --> 1:10:44.519 you're just going to finish school. So at twenty we 1:10:44.560 --> 1:10:45.160 got married. 1:10:46.640 --> 1:10:50.160 We are the she was also how old was she twenty. 1:10:49.840 --> 1:10:52.720 Two twenty when we got married, so two years a 1:10:52.800 --> 1:10:56.120 little older, same age, went to high school with Taylor's wife. 1:10:56.160 --> 1:10:58.879 Actually interesting that all of our wives are basically exactly. 1:10:58.920 --> 1:11:01.639 This tells me the maturity life all of the brothers exactly. 1:11:02.600 --> 1:11:07.960 You know, we are probably like I said, like the most, 1:11:08.920 --> 1:11:12.120 I don't want anything from my kids. I just want 1:11:12.160 --> 1:11:16.000 him to love the act of caring for other people 1:11:16.080 --> 1:11:20.559 and and find something that inspires them and makes them, 1:11:20.920 --> 1:11:24.280 you know, have the opportunity to be with people. You 1:11:24.320 --> 1:11:27.559 do want them to be respectful. That's difficult, That's what 1:11:27.560 --> 1:11:30.599 I mean. And so we have we have five kids. 1:11:30.600 --> 1:11:36.280 We've been married eighteen years and Shepherd is sixteen, and 1:11:36.479 --> 1:11:38.840 I have no idea what he's going to do. What 1:11:38.960 --> 1:11:43.920 I do know is he's probably a genius. I just 1:11:44.000 --> 1:11:47.679 can't figure it out. He's incredibly kind. This dude. He's 1:11:47.760 --> 1:11:50.840 just like when he gets into something, it is unbelievable 1:11:51.680 --> 1:11:52.920 how much he knows about it. 1:11:53.320 --> 1:11:54.519 I wonder where he gets that from. 1:11:54.600 --> 1:11:59.320 Yeah, Junior, our thirteen year old daughter is we finally 1:11:59.320 --> 1:12:03.960 found an ath and the family. So she's way into athletics, 1:12:04.000 --> 1:12:10.400 and you know, they're all just awesome. Abraham's are third. 1:12:10.439 --> 1:12:12.680 He's the musician in the family. He ever decides he 1:12:12.720 --> 1:12:16.120 wants to. It's interesting to see because I see a 1:12:16.240 --> 1:12:20.080 very similar child to myself. You know, I never would 1:12:20.080 --> 1:12:22.479 have been in a band if if these guys didn't 1:12:22.520 --> 1:12:25.360 need help. That's sort of the story of the Hanson 1:12:25.400 --> 1:12:29.040 brothers is is Isaac and Taylor were actively singing and 1:12:29.040 --> 1:12:31.599 wanting to sing, and my mom came over and said, Zach, 1:12:31.920 --> 1:12:36.639 your brothers need your help, and so I came to sing. 1:12:36.920 --> 1:12:39.920 And he's sort of that way. Abraham is ten. He's 1:12:40.000 --> 1:12:43.599 named after Aba Boreol Junior and Able Boreoal Senior. Two 1:12:43.640 --> 1:12:48.120 amazing musicians we just love obviously the father of all 1:12:48.160 --> 1:12:57.040 the religions, Abraham's interesting to look at a guy he's 1:12:57.560 --> 1:13:00.559 about to turn eleven, and that's the age I was 1:13:00.600 --> 1:13:04.639 when I really probably people knew the band Umbop came out. 1:13:04.680 --> 1:13:07.720 I was eleven into twelve, And to look at him 1:13:07.720 --> 1:13:10.800 and go like, you've got all of that stuff that 1:13:10.840 --> 1:13:14.479 we were doing. I wonder when and what it will 1:13:14.479 --> 1:13:16.640 take for you decide you want to do something with it, 1:13:16.680 --> 1:13:19.760 because it's such a different thing. And then my younger two, 1:13:19.840 --> 1:13:25.280 Lucille and Quincy, are named for another amazing musician, Quincy Jones. 1:13:26.200 --> 1:13:29.120 You know, like who knows, they're just their kids. They're 1:13:29.320 --> 1:13:33.599 seven and three and beautiful and full of their own 1:13:33.600 --> 1:13:37.160 ideas and incredibly opinionated, just like their father. And I 1:13:37.600 --> 1:13:41.160 apologize to their mother every day. I'm so sorry. 1:13:41.640 --> 1:13:44.360 Well, I will say also to your younger three are 1:13:44.400 --> 1:13:47.400 definitely more extroverted than the older two. 1:13:47.400 --> 1:13:48.559 The older two are a little more. 1:13:48.400 --> 1:13:50.920 Shy and a little more to themselves. 1:13:50.960 --> 1:13:54.719 Not a surprise that the guy who spends his career 1:13:54.840 --> 1:13:58.719 behind a cage is more introvertied and has more introverted children. 1:13:58.760 --> 1:14:00.519 But I think you know, the main thing with all 1:14:00.520 --> 1:14:05.120 of it is really provide them every opportunity possible and then, 1:14:05.680 --> 1:14:09.320 if possible, teach them that life is not about getting 1:14:09.360 --> 1:14:11.519 what you want, but about what you want to work for. 1:14:12.040 --> 1:14:14.920 And you know that's really it, you know, I mean, 1:14:14.960 --> 1:14:20.240 it's the best lives are lived in some service to something, 1:14:20.400 --> 1:14:24.599 service to greater humanity, service to a greater craft, but 1:14:24.640 --> 1:14:28.840 certainly not service to your own needs, to your own wants. 1:14:28.920 --> 1:14:34.400 It's living for something bigger egos, a bit destructive. Yeah, 1:14:34.400 --> 1:14:35.519 and that's what we're trying to do. 1:14:35.800 --> 1:14:38.679 Okay, let's go back to the three of you. Tell 1:14:38.720 --> 1:14:42.240 me about your education. Did you go to school, did 1:14:42.280 --> 1:14:42.920 you graduate? 1:14:42.960 --> 1:14:45.280 What happened? It's full of a lot of holes and 1:14:45.320 --> 1:14:48.200 then a lot of specialization. That's what I would say. 1:14:47.840 --> 1:14:50.519 We are in Oklahoma. I don't know if this is 1:14:50.560 --> 1:14:53.599 still true. At the time, Oklahoma was the only state 1:14:53.680 --> 1:14:56.760 or one of the only states that has homeschooling in 1:14:56.800 --> 1:14:59.040 the state constitution, and so that's where we grew up. 1:14:59.320 --> 1:15:02.360 And so home was a big deal a lot for 1:15:02.479 --> 1:15:05.479 religious reasons, people who want to teach their kids the 1:15:05.479 --> 1:15:08.160 way they see the world, but also in our case, 1:15:08.160 --> 1:15:12.400 it really played a huge role in the freedom to 1:15:12.439 --> 1:15:16.479 take time out of regular school days and spend that 1:15:16.600 --> 1:15:19.760 doing things that wouldn't normally be allowed, like being in 1:15:19.840 --> 1:15:25.200 dance class and music classes, playing concerts in the afternoon, 1:15:25.320 --> 1:15:30.439 places where other kids were in school, practicing music. You know, 1:15:30.479 --> 1:15:33.280 our parents very quickly said, like, this is part of 1:15:33.320 --> 1:15:38.400 your education. They were fairly big into the arts. Our 1:15:38.439 --> 1:15:41.479 mom was a vocal major in college, went with a 1:15:41.479 --> 1:15:45.280 scholarship to North Texas State. So they loved plays, they 1:15:45.400 --> 1:15:48.120 loved drama. Our dad took dance in college and then 1:15:48.160 --> 1:15:51.439 decided to be instead of account and so it was 1:15:51.520 --> 1:15:55.280 like they saw it as valuable that we would sing 1:15:55.400 --> 1:15:58.000 and play. And well, if anyone who has multiple children 1:15:58.479 --> 1:16:03.320 knows that if your kids are doing something together without fighting, right, 1:16:03.640 --> 1:16:08.040 that's that's productive. You pretty much will move mountains just 1:16:08.200 --> 1:16:11.280 to let them do that together. And so that's what's working. 1:16:11.479 --> 1:16:11.559 Well. 1:16:11.560 --> 1:16:14.120 You definitely had some holes in our You guys stick more. 1:16:14.320 --> 1:16:17.120 You know, we did more science than you did, a 1:16:17.120 --> 1:16:18.160 lot more science. 1:16:18.400 --> 1:16:23.320 Science was almost non existent, certainly, plenty of literature, certainly, 1:16:23.360 --> 1:16:26.720 plenty of history, certainly, plenty of art related kind of 1:16:26.760 --> 1:16:28.599 going to the louver and stuff like that. 1:16:28.760 --> 1:16:31.760 Once we broke especially, we were traveling. 1:16:31.439 --> 1:16:33.519 Well and again we were I was sixteen, so is 1:16:33.520 --> 1:16:35.439 that couldn't even in high school yet, and we're going 1:16:35.600 --> 1:16:38.200 doing those things, you know, And I would have been 1:16:38.320 --> 1:16:40.680 I would have been a sophomore in high school when 1:16:40.680 --> 1:16:43.240 the first record broke, so you know, you're doing our 1:16:43.280 --> 1:16:48.200 mom was really good at shall we say, making school 1:16:48.280 --> 1:16:51.559 lessons out of life experiences, so she would be the 1:16:51.560 --> 1:16:53.400 one that would say, no, we got to take the weekend, 1:16:53.840 --> 1:16:57.280 you know, or take a day off and take the 1:16:57.320 --> 1:16:59.960 boys to this thing or that thing. They got to go, 1:17:00.680 --> 1:17:02.479 you know, to a play, they got to go see 1:17:02.479 --> 1:17:03.559 the louver. They gotta go see. 1:17:03.760 --> 1:17:06.519 But none of us have college degrees, and you know, 1:17:06.680 --> 1:17:09.160 whatever high school is, you know, very. 1:17:09.840 --> 1:17:14.360 I think I think technically want to officially have a 1:17:14.439 --> 1:17:15.280 high school diplomas. 1:17:15.280 --> 1:17:18.520 Because we were working so much. When I was about fifteen, 1:17:18.880 --> 1:17:22.280 we realized that I could get emancipated and that would 1:17:22.320 --> 1:17:26.760 allow me to work more than just short four to 1:17:26.840 --> 1:17:29.519 six hour days on movie sets. It's more about that 1:17:29.600 --> 1:17:33.400 supervised and and so you could actually work as an adult. 1:17:33.479 --> 1:17:38.400 So at sixteen, I graduated from high school and was emancipated, 1:17:38.479 --> 1:17:42.760 and so that was like a freedom suddenly. Education and 1:17:43.120 --> 1:17:46.680 time with school teachers at the tonight show didn't have 1:17:47.360 --> 1:17:49.200 You could choose to do what you want, and of course, 1:17:49.680 --> 1:17:51.840 you know you're already at this point that would have 1:17:51.880 --> 1:17:55.639 been working on our third album, not including Live Almos 1:17:55.720 --> 1:17:57.760 none teen Christmas albums. You know, we toured all over 1:17:57.760 --> 1:18:00.759 the world, and you kind of go, do you really 1:18:00.800 --> 1:18:03.040 need to be going to school or are you already 1:18:03.080 --> 1:18:06.880 in some weird form of business school because you're learning 1:18:06.960 --> 1:18:10.000 your business that you already have a business you're running. 1:18:10.400 --> 1:18:11.880 I will say this though, I think one of the 1:18:11.880 --> 1:18:16.799 things that I see a lot is so non traditional 1:18:16.840 --> 1:18:17.800 in our education paths. 1:18:17.800 --> 1:18:18.439 So what do I know? 1:18:18.520 --> 1:18:22.240 But it's just interesting because it seems like what happens 1:18:22.240 --> 1:18:24.519 a lot of times with many school pathways is people 1:18:24.560 --> 1:18:26.439 get told a curriculum and they finish the thing, and 1:18:26.439 --> 1:18:28.400 they have a thing that they finished with it go, 1:18:28.640 --> 1:18:31.559 I graduated X, Y, and Z. But learning to be 1:18:31.640 --> 1:18:35.280 a learner is not necessarily something that happens, you know, 1:18:35.680 --> 1:18:39.120 teaching keep training the idea of learning and so maybe 1:18:39.240 --> 1:18:42.280 purposeful but also somewhat accidental. Probably in the path we've 1:18:42.360 --> 1:18:48.640 led is that sense of creatively pursuing things, being curious 1:18:48.680 --> 1:18:52.439 and having a mind that's interested in driving your own education. 1:18:52.640 --> 1:18:56.640 Driving learning is something we we had by choice and 1:18:56.760 --> 1:18:58.800 by I think the nature of our existence as a 1:18:59.040 --> 1:19:02.280 touring band that broken traveled and and so that's interesting. 1:19:02.800 --> 1:19:05.280 There was always an interest in reading, There was always 1:19:05.280 --> 1:19:08.680 an interest in discovery. I mean it was never it 1:19:08.720 --> 1:19:12.280 was never about you know, get this, you know qualification clearly, 1:19:13.560 --> 1:19:16.880 but and I'm grateful for that. And that is something 1:19:16.880 --> 1:19:18.559 that when you do see it in your kids, and 1:19:18.600 --> 1:19:20.519 you don't always see it sometimes it's a real hard 1:19:20.520 --> 1:19:22.040 thing to do. But when you do see those glimmers 1:19:22.080 --> 1:19:26.519 of why you're interested in learning stuff, that that's an 1:19:26.880 --> 1:19:30.479 that feels like success because I know for me, learning 1:19:30.520 --> 1:19:36.719 never stops. I mean, you don't hit like life throws 1:19:36.760 --> 1:19:39.719 different requirements at you. And so it's it's the site 1:19:40.600 --> 1:19:41.640 learning always. 1:19:41.520 --> 1:19:44.000 See one of the things you see I think in 1:19:44.200 --> 1:19:46.800 us as an as a father, right, you start looking 1:19:46.840 --> 1:19:49.040 at kids and how they're educated, and you go, oh, right, 1:19:49.160 --> 1:19:55.000 we're all dyslexic pretty much. And it suddenly makes sense 1:19:55.120 --> 1:19:58.519 why music was such a natural draw, right. 1:19:58.920 --> 1:20:01.839 It because stilling sucks. 1:20:02.000 --> 1:20:05.840 That lets a brain so well that when you could 1:20:06.280 --> 1:20:10.040 you could combine the exercises of looking at a sheet 1:20:10.080 --> 1:20:14.320 of music, hearing it and and sort of performing it, 1:20:15.040 --> 1:20:20.160 understanding the relationships. Music fit so easily and naturally as 1:20:20.720 --> 1:20:25.760 a place to focus your education and your interest, whereas 1:20:26.040 --> 1:20:29.560 other sciences and other things like I was such a 1:20:29.680 --> 1:20:32.879 late reader, you know, I mean I was probably fifteen 1:20:32.960 --> 1:20:36.599 before I was reading at some high you know, grade 1:20:36.720 --> 1:20:39.719 level of a middle schooler. You know, it was such 1:20:39.800 --> 1:20:42.240 a hard thing for me. But music was so natural. 1:20:42.439 --> 1:20:44.000 Yeah, I mean I struggled similarly. 1:20:44.520 --> 1:20:48.400 Yeah, Okay, let me ask you. Everybody in the family, 1:20:48.680 --> 1:20:52.680 all seven kids, were they all homeschooled from day one? 1:20:53.120 --> 1:20:58.559 Yes, yeah, actually, well probably the person well the younger was, yeah, 1:20:58.560 --> 1:21:00.280 from day one, and then some of the younger ones 1:21:00.320 --> 1:21:01.400 have gone to college, you. 1:21:01.400 --> 1:21:05.280 Know, a high school, grade school. So the only thing 1:21:05.400 --> 1:21:10.320 that wasn't Isaac and Taylor, we we lived overseas because 1:21:10.360 --> 1:21:13.160 our dad worked for an oil company before the band, 1:21:13.720 --> 1:21:17.080 and so when we were living overseas, you guys were 1:21:17.160 --> 1:21:20.960 in sort of missionary schools, right, A lot of those. Yeah, 1:21:21.640 --> 1:21:24.400 I just mean it's a lot of like English, you know. 1:21:25.000 --> 1:21:28.000 Yeah, yeah, they were just yeah, they were just well 1:21:28.040 --> 1:21:31.920 they were mostly just schools oriented towards the either the 1:21:32.200 --> 1:21:35.400 drilling field that was that we were living on yeah, 1:21:35.960 --> 1:21:37.719 or or in that or in the one in Quito. 1:21:37.840 --> 1:21:38.040 It was. 1:21:38.120 --> 1:21:40.080 Yeah, it was more of like an international a little 1:21:40.080 --> 1:21:42.120 bit of actual structured school. Yeah. 1:21:42.760 --> 1:21:43.320 I enjoyed it. 1:21:43.520 --> 1:21:47.679 Okay, that's only what about your kids? Are they home school? 1:21:47.800 --> 1:21:49.920 Do they go to school, public, parochial? 1:21:50.360 --> 1:21:53.679 I mean, a man of us have done every I'll 1:21:53.720 --> 1:21:56.200 just speak from mine. We literally have done every version. 1:21:56.240 --> 1:22:01.240 We've done private, public, home co ops between multiple families. 1:22:01.280 --> 1:22:03.800 I mean we've done and it's been in seasons too. 1:22:04.120 --> 1:22:07.200 Some kids took really week well to certain things and 1:22:07.280 --> 1:22:10.960 they thrived in particular paths. Others didn't do particularly well, 1:22:11.120 --> 1:22:13.800 so yeah, or that was just not their their path. 1:22:13.880 --> 1:22:17.400 So we've done everything, honestly, Yeah, every version. 1:22:17.520 --> 1:22:21.160 Yeah, might have predominantly been in private school, but then 1:22:21.320 --> 1:22:25.880 they've also moved to in high school years have moved 1:22:25.880 --> 1:22:28.400 away from that to more of like a three day 1:22:28.439 --> 1:22:31.120 a week, which is more like a co op type thing. 1:22:31.680 --> 1:22:34.000 Yeah, my kids are in private school. You know, that's 1:22:34.120 --> 1:22:41.040 really honestly, it's such a our traveling relationship with our families, 1:22:41.720 --> 1:22:45.120 where you're gone multiple months at a time. It's you 1:22:45.240 --> 1:22:46.920 really look at your wife and you go say, hey, 1:22:47.680 --> 1:22:50.080 I will do everything I can, but I can't do 1:22:50.280 --> 1:22:53.640 much when I'm not here, right, and so you're going 1:22:53.720 --> 1:22:56.479 to have to be the the one that makes this 1:22:56.640 --> 1:23:00.920 decision and what's right. So, homeschooling is so family led. 1:23:01.000 --> 1:23:03.400 It's like when somebody says, you know, I'm joining the 1:23:03.439 --> 1:23:05.240 Boy Scouts. You go, no, no, no, your parents are 1:23:05.280 --> 1:23:08.560 joining the Boy Scouts because they run everything. Homeschooling is 1:23:08.720 --> 1:23:12.960 really if you have that energy, that desire and so 1:23:13.280 --> 1:23:16.280 so we've been in private schools and also I think 1:23:16.320 --> 1:23:21.519 it's really I'm not we're not Catholic, but Catholic schools. 1:23:22.040 --> 1:23:24.720 My kids have been in Catholic schools because there's such 1:23:24.760 --> 1:23:29.600 an emphasis on sort of traditional things away from screens, 1:23:30.520 --> 1:23:33.320 which I think is really valuable. I love screens, but 1:23:33.479 --> 1:23:35.400 I love the idea that they're actually learning how you 1:23:35.479 --> 1:23:40.599 write cursives. What a concept. 1:23:40.960 --> 1:23:44.719 Okay, let's go back. You mentioned religion. So when you're 1:23:44.800 --> 1:23:48.639 growing up, how much was religion's part of your lives? 1:23:49.280 --> 1:23:52.439 Well, mean, that's religion is a funny word. I mean 1:23:53.560 --> 1:23:59.599 our faith being Christians as the core of everything. I mean, 1:23:59.640 --> 1:24:01.320 it's not part of our lives. It sort of is 1:24:01.400 --> 1:24:05.840 your life because it's what you believe and so that 1:24:06.160 --> 1:24:10.320 that's played a huge role, I think partly in things 1:24:10.479 --> 1:24:14.360 like the Fear. You know, this business being in the 1:24:14.360 --> 1:24:17.519 public eye is all about capturing your fifteen minutes and 1:24:17.600 --> 1:24:21.000 how long you can hold on to it. But as Christians, 1:24:21.080 --> 1:24:23.080 you go like, I'm not at home onto this no 1:24:23.160 --> 1:24:25.080 matter what I do, Like I'm not even here for this, 1:24:25.800 --> 1:24:28.040 And so it allows you to like go of it, 1:24:28.200 --> 1:24:31.000 I think in a really positive way and see it 1:24:31.080 --> 1:24:34.160 for what it is. Our dad would say things like, hey, 1:24:35.600 --> 1:24:38.719 remember you might never meet this person again, so treat 1:24:38.800 --> 1:24:43.000 them like like this is your one moment to make 1:24:43.040 --> 1:24:46.000 an impact on them positively in their life. And I 1:24:46.040 --> 1:24:48.920 think that's a really Christian idea, you know, which is 1:24:49.040 --> 1:24:50.920 just sort of see the image of God and every 1:24:51.000 --> 1:24:53.800 person you meet, and so like it's it's been a 1:24:53.880 --> 1:24:56.000 huge thing. And and when you hear a song like 1:24:56.160 --> 1:24:59.960 Umbop or Where's the Love or weird, like, I see 1:25:00.000 --> 1:25:05.439 think that the messages behind our songs. We don't write 1:25:05.960 --> 1:25:09.240 Christian quote unquote music, but we write music as Christian men. 1:25:09.360 --> 1:25:13.360 And so it's all about seeing the value you have. 1:25:13.720 --> 1:25:17.360 It's all about turning away from the me into the 1:25:18.240 --> 1:25:20.960 the we that we're supposed to be. You know, I 1:25:21.200 --> 1:25:23.080 was born, as one of our songs, I was born 1:25:23.160 --> 1:25:26.160 to do, to go to be, saying every single person 1:25:26.360 --> 1:25:29.120 has a purpose in the world. I mean, I know 1:25:29.240 --> 1:25:31.559 what I think your purpose is. Hopefully you will find 1:25:31.720 --> 1:25:35.679 what you think your purpose is. And mostly our purpose 1:25:35.800 --> 1:25:39.599 is to be positive influence on every people we come across. 1:25:41.040 --> 1:25:43.439 It is interesting too, because it is at the center. 1:25:44.360 --> 1:25:47.680 If you have a guiding sort of purpose that is 1:25:47.800 --> 1:25:50.680 tied to a belief, it is going to be in 1:25:50.760 --> 1:25:51.280 all things. 1:25:51.439 --> 1:25:53.959 Otherwise it's not really what you say it is. It's 1:25:54.000 --> 1:25:57.560 not your believe so it's you know, it's something what 1:25:57.800 --> 1:25:59.040 you do, not what you say. 1:25:59.160 --> 1:26:01.080 It's at the center of It's just the way you 1:26:01.200 --> 1:26:03.720 go out the world and when you feel loved and 1:26:03.760 --> 1:26:05.879 when you feel that you you're not an accident. 1:26:06.040 --> 1:26:06.720 You know you're not. 1:26:07.040 --> 1:26:09.479 You know that everybody has a reason and everyone is 1:26:10.040 --> 1:26:12.720 you know, been coming from a place of a loving 1:26:12.760 --> 1:26:14.840 God that brought you here. There's a sense of that 1:26:15.120 --> 1:26:16.800 that kind of changes the way you go about things. 1:26:16.840 --> 1:26:19.120 It doesn't mean you know. It mostly means you know nothing. 1:26:19.479 --> 1:26:21.599 You know like you don't know a lot of things, 1:26:21.640 --> 1:26:24.719 but you start with this sense of feeling that sense 1:26:24.760 --> 1:26:27.400 of purpose, which I think the word purpose is a 1:26:28.000 --> 1:26:29.160 you know, it's a pretty big one. 1:26:29.800 --> 1:26:33.920 I've had the blessing of through this crazy life we've lived, 1:26:34.040 --> 1:26:39.000 you know, met some some very remarkable monks along the way. Yeah, 1:26:39.280 --> 1:26:43.000 And I think when you meet someone that has dedicated 1:26:43.040 --> 1:26:47.439 their life to the service of others and to kind 1:26:47.439 --> 1:26:50.479 of seeking to be self less and get rid of 1:26:50.680 --> 1:26:53.760 as much ego as possible, it's a hard one. 1:26:53.880 --> 1:26:54.679 It's a really. 1:26:54.640 --> 1:26:59.759 Inspiring thing to see. And when you see that, hopefully 1:26:59.800 --> 1:27:02.240 you want to emulate that. And we've and we've you know, 1:27:02.320 --> 1:27:05.080 you just try your best to kind of to do 1:27:05.320 --> 1:27:07.680 those kinds of things and be as as close as 1:27:07.760 --> 1:27:09.719 you can do those things if it all possible. 1:27:09.720 --> 1:27:11.280 I mean, you've ben wear it all day. You've been 1:27:11.320 --> 1:27:16.200 wearing all black for like twenty years. You work your 1:27:16.240 --> 1:27:17.720 right there, Father Isaac over here. 1:27:25.080 --> 1:27:30.360 Okay, you guys live in Oklahoma. Oklahoma. Let's put it 1:27:30.479 --> 1:27:34.040 this way. Too many people seems kind of off the grid. Yeah, 1:27:34.880 --> 1:27:38.400 today there is no flyover country. Everybody has the same 1:27:38.479 --> 1:27:42.160 cable TV, everybody has the same Internet. You guys have 1:27:42.240 --> 1:27:44.480 been all over the world. You still live in Oklahoma. 1:27:45.000 --> 1:27:48.040 What the people who are not from Oklahoma, not get 1:27:48.080 --> 1:27:48.960 about Oklahoma. 1:27:49.200 --> 1:27:52.600 Well, what I say to people about Oklahoma is you 1:27:52.720 --> 1:27:55.960 don't live here because of the mountains, which there are no, 1:27:56.680 --> 1:27:59.280 or the coastlines that are beautiful, because there are none. 1:27:59.400 --> 1:28:01.880 You live here because of the people, and you like 1:28:02.000 --> 1:28:05.120 the way people treat each other and the values of 1:28:05.240 --> 1:28:11.760 people here. We also like the pioneer spirit. Right, it's 1:28:11.880 --> 1:28:16.479 inevitable that that DNA of those who came for the 1:28:16.640 --> 1:28:20.680 land run right, these wildcatters who were coming out to 1:28:21.200 --> 1:28:25.560 chase oil, Like it's bred into the state and the 1:28:25.680 --> 1:28:29.439 people that have generationally stayed here. You know, our family 1:28:29.520 --> 1:28:35.240 came from Scandinavia through Kansas to Oklahoma. And I think 1:28:36.240 --> 1:28:41.560 there's that self confidence that leeds into a lot of 1:28:41.680 --> 1:28:46.000 interactions that says, sort of, you aren't making me, I'm 1:28:46.040 --> 1:28:49.200 making me. So I feel the confidence to just treat 1:28:49.280 --> 1:28:52.680 you the way like a person, like a good experience 1:28:52.800 --> 1:28:55.600 and value that. I think the actual state model is 1:28:55.680 --> 1:28:56.559 labor conquers all. 1:28:56.760 --> 1:28:56.960 Yeah. 1:28:58.400 --> 1:29:00.400 So if that doesn't tell you, it's like called the 1:29:00.479 --> 1:29:03.120 dust bowl. Guys, we didn't get the memo. We just 1:29:03.360 --> 1:29:04.080 kept farming. 1:29:04.439 --> 1:29:04.679 Yeah. 1:29:05.280 --> 1:29:08.599 I often have friends. I often have friends who come 1:29:08.640 --> 1:29:10.880 here from you know, various places. You know, you know 1:29:11.240 --> 1:29:15.280 New York, you know, California, you know, London, whatever, you know, 1:29:15.360 --> 1:29:17.760 and they'll go, people are so nice here, and I'm like, 1:29:18.439 --> 1:29:21.800 it's not, it's not nice. It's that because people are 1:29:22.720 --> 1:29:26.920 genuinely rough. It's really real around here. It's that people 1:29:26.960 --> 1:29:29.880 are genuine and there's a difference real. The genuineness is 1:29:29.920 --> 1:29:32.680 when they ask you a question, they actually mean it. 1:29:32.880 --> 1:29:34.200 They'd like to hear an answer. 1:29:34.160 --> 1:29:36.000 Right, you know, as opposed to you know, it's it's 1:29:36.080 --> 1:29:38.400 not it's not glad hating and and and so you know, 1:29:38.520 --> 1:29:39.719 I think that's refreshing. 1:29:39.760 --> 1:29:42.240 I think when we travel as ay, that's true. 1:29:42.360 --> 1:29:46.599 Yeah, as a whole, there's oh yes there are there are, 1:29:46.720 --> 1:29:48.200 of course, but as an as a. 1:29:48.439 --> 1:29:54.439 On average, the handsome career is probably most accurately defined 1:29:54.560 --> 1:29:57.639 by the idea that we have defined what success means, 1:29:58.439 --> 1:30:02.519 right and for in a world where the biggest star 1:30:03.479 --> 1:30:07.439 in music still wishes they were also a movie star, 1:30:07.640 --> 1:30:11.720 still wishes they were also an entrepreneur, still wishes We've 1:30:11.760 --> 1:30:14.479 said that's not what we're We're not going to do that. 1:30:14.720 --> 1:30:16.960 We're not going to play that game where if you're 1:30:17.000 --> 1:30:20.160 not the biggest, you're you're always the worst. And I 1:30:20.280 --> 1:30:24.040 think living in Oklahoma is about saying like, we know 1:30:24.120 --> 1:30:26.200 where we want to be from. We want that to 1:30:26.280 --> 1:30:29.760 bleed into the sound of our music, We want that 1:30:29.960 --> 1:30:31.840 to bleed into the way we treat people, in the 1:30:31.840 --> 1:30:34.760 way we build our business, and say like we're from 1:30:34.800 --> 1:30:38.880 a place. And this has some limitations, but it also 1:30:39.000 --> 1:30:41.320 sets you free, I think in a really cool way, 1:30:42.000 --> 1:30:46.439 where you say you know, knowing who you are is 1:30:46.640 --> 1:30:48.720 half the battle of getting to where you want to go. 1:30:49.560 --> 1:30:52.479 Also, our manager, our very first manager, was a deadhead 1:30:53.080 --> 1:30:56.840 and really ingrained I think very strongly in us, very 1:30:56.960 --> 1:31:01.280 valuably that community that can be unity, that fan community, 1:31:01.360 --> 1:31:03.720 and the connection with the audience, and the idea that 1:31:04.360 --> 1:31:06.680 when you go to a Hansoon show, for example, you're 1:31:06.720 --> 1:31:08.880 not going to see the same show twice. And that's 1:31:08.920 --> 1:31:11.720 on purpose, you know. And and he him trying to 1:31:11.800 --> 1:31:12.479 kind of instill in. 1:31:12.560 --> 1:31:15.280 Us, hey, change it every night, change it as much. 1:31:15.160 --> 1:31:17.800 As you can, make it interesting, make it cool, you know, 1:31:18.240 --> 1:31:20.920 do what and and so we just we did that 1:31:21.040 --> 1:31:23.360 kind of thing as much as we could. We continue 1:31:23.400 --> 1:31:25.160 to do that even more obviously because its got a 1:31:25.160 --> 1:31:27.800 lot more material to pull off of, you know, from 1:31:28.280 --> 1:31:31.679 the early days to now. But and and our audience 1:31:31.800 --> 1:31:35.320 knows that about us. And that's why you'll see groups 1:31:35.360 --> 1:31:39.920 of friends sometimes even groups of couples that will go 1:31:40.160 --> 1:31:42.200 to you know, a couple of shows in a row, 1:31:42.360 --> 1:31:43.400 or even five shows in. 1:31:43.400 --> 1:31:45.920 A row, because they're there for each other, for each other, 1:31:46.120 --> 1:31:46.840 and they're there for. 1:31:47.040 --> 1:31:49.320 The experience, because they know you're not going to do 1:31:49.439 --> 1:31:50.720 the same thing tomorrow night. 1:31:53.479 --> 1:31:58.600 Okay. The business has completely changed from when m umbop 1:31:58.680 --> 1:32:04.120 or embop or everyone how do you guys? Yeah, okay, 1:32:05.120 --> 1:32:06.800 when that was a giganta kit. 1:32:07.720 --> 1:32:09.360 So you make an album. 1:32:09.479 --> 1:32:13.320 Today, many people who rang the bell at the top 1:32:13.360 --> 1:32:16.439 of the business don't even make any new music because 1:32:16.479 --> 1:32:19.640 they feel it's so hard to be accepted, to get 1:32:19.680 --> 1:32:21.760 any traction. They'll just go on the road and play 1:32:21.840 --> 1:32:25.680 the old hips. What's the motivation to making a new 1:32:25.800 --> 1:32:29.080 album knowing no matter what you do, the audience is 1:32:29.200 --> 1:32:30.360 inherently limited. 1:32:30.960 --> 1:32:35.080 Well, so, first of all, you could start your podcast 1:32:35.240 --> 1:32:37.000 now and you could talk for an hour on this 1:32:37.040 --> 1:32:39.479 subject because obviously there's a million opinions about it and 1:32:39.640 --> 1:32:44.439 different takes on what's happened. But music is for one, 1:32:44.479 --> 1:32:46.639 I would say that it's not just about the business 1:32:46.680 --> 1:32:49.040 of music. Making music is not just for the business 1:32:49.080 --> 1:32:51.519 of music, and that's one really important thing. You're making 1:32:51.600 --> 1:32:54.559 music because you are music. You're you're a creator, you're 1:32:54.800 --> 1:32:57.120 an artist. So it's why as part of what helps 1:32:57.160 --> 1:32:59.920 you work through the universe, walk wake Up. Doesn't mean 1:32:59.960 --> 1:33:02.000 you have to make expensive albums, it doesn't mean that 1:33:02.080 --> 1:33:04.360 you can't play the hits. But the first reason is 1:33:04.400 --> 1:33:07.639 because that's who you are, and so and so part 1:33:07.640 --> 1:33:09.200 of the thing that we realize and was pointing to 1:33:09.240 --> 1:33:12.599 the community is that we recognize some here, some heroes 1:33:12.640 --> 1:33:15.040 we discovered like the Grateful Dead, who had these careers 1:33:15.120 --> 1:33:18.360 where they were creating a community. And so part of 1:33:18.400 --> 1:33:21.000 what we've realized is that we're making you're making things 1:33:21.000 --> 1:33:23.960 for yourself. Yes, you have to make a business. There 1:33:24.000 --> 1:33:25.680 has to be a you know, a tour and has 1:33:25.720 --> 1:33:27.720 to be in come, et cetera. But you're making things 1:33:27.760 --> 1:33:29.800 to tell that story and to take people with you. 1:33:30.240 --> 1:33:33.160 And so a fan is not just becoming a fan 1:33:33.240 --> 1:33:35.080 so they can hear the next pop song or their 1:33:35.400 --> 1:33:38.360 next hook. They're also there because they're you're sharing how 1:33:38.400 --> 1:33:40.559 you wrote it, you're sharing when you made it, You're 1:33:40.840 --> 1:33:43.120 you're sharing a clip of what happened in the studio. 1:33:43.160 --> 1:33:44.960 They're getting to connect with your journey. 1:33:45.320 --> 1:33:45.479 You know. 1:33:45.760 --> 1:33:48.839 We now for for many years have have a structure 1:33:48.840 --> 1:33:51.599 where we make a particular project of five to six 1:33:51.680 --> 1:33:54.600 songs every year just for our paid membership, which we 1:33:54.680 --> 1:33:57.160 did pre Patreon, pre the you know sort of membership. 1:33:57.360 --> 1:34:00.519 We've been doing that and because we realized it wasn't 1:34:00.640 --> 1:34:03.639 just about putting out a song, it was about making 1:34:03.720 --> 1:34:07.080 the relationship be ongoing. It'd be like having a restaurant 1:34:07.240 --> 1:34:10.320 that stopped making you know there, you know, stop having 1:34:10.439 --> 1:34:13.839 dinner service because they had the same you know recipes 1:34:13.880 --> 1:34:15.519 like okay, there's a certain amount of recipes are always 1:34:15.520 --> 1:34:17.679 going to be there. But the chef restaurants, the chef 1:34:17.720 --> 1:34:19.560 shows up and says, oh, the special this week is 1:34:19.640 --> 1:34:23.080 this because they're a chef, and so you're you're always 1:34:23.120 --> 1:34:24.720 going to go back to the restaurant for the things, 1:34:24.760 --> 1:34:26.840 you know, but you want to get the specials, and 1:34:26.880 --> 1:34:28.400 you want to get the ceacl stuff, and you want 1:34:28.439 --> 1:34:31.000 to feel like you're connected. And that's the difference between 1:34:31.040 --> 1:34:33.960 a chain restaurant and a chef restaurant is is there's 1:34:34.000 --> 1:34:36.559 a chef in house, and so we you're making things 1:34:36.600 --> 1:34:39.160 because that's your story and it's what fuels the energy 1:34:39.200 --> 1:34:41.439 of the relationship with your audience. And when we do 1:34:41.520 --> 1:34:43.680 an annual event, we do a fan essentially like a 1:34:43.800 --> 1:34:46.960 Trickies Convention for Hanson fans, which is this frightening idea, 1:34:47.080 --> 1:34:49.840 but it's fans converge sort of for our anniversary as 1:34:49.840 --> 1:34:51.920 a band on a day that years ago, the governor 1:34:51.920 --> 1:34:54.000 of the state of our you know, declared Hanson Day 1:34:54.000 --> 1:34:56.080 as a kind of a commemorative and our fans kept 1:34:56.160 --> 1:34:59.479 celebrating it. So it became a kind of a birthday 1:34:59.520 --> 1:35:01.320 for the band, a Hansom Day, and so we have. 1:35:01.439 --> 1:35:04.280 Happened also be our actual birthday because we started. 1:35:04.000 --> 1:35:07.280 Doing the same, and so we we kind of we've 1:35:07.360 --> 1:35:10.360 embraced to the point that we can the sort of hey, 1:35:10.439 --> 1:35:12.519 let's host the party and let's celebrate with fans, and 1:35:12.600 --> 1:35:15.879 we watch people converge and we see that they're connecting 1:35:15.960 --> 1:35:18.519 to something that is not just about a song. They're 1:35:18.560 --> 1:35:21.640 connecting to each other. They're feeling seen, they're feeling like 1:35:21.680 --> 1:35:23.960 they're kind of found their tribe. And their tribe is 1:35:24.360 --> 1:35:27.120 a Brazilian and a guy from Chicago and a girl 1:35:27.160 --> 1:35:29.280 from London. A girl from Sweden and a girl from 1:35:29.640 --> 1:35:32.439 Detroit and a girl from Tulsa all hanging out. And 1:35:33.160 --> 1:35:36.280 that connection is part of why you make your own 1:35:36.600 --> 1:35:39.080 next thing as a creator, because you're sort of you're 1:35:39.120 --> 1:35:41.800 giving people a theme, you're sharing what you're going through, 1:35:42.320 --> 1:35:44.679 and business wise, it's completely upside down. 1:35:45.240 --> 1:35:46.240 It's totally upside down. 1:35:46.320 --> 1:35:48.760 I don't I but I mean it's upside down in 1:35:48.840 --> 1:35:51.400 the sense that that what used to make people really 1:35:51.479 --> 1:35:55.160 made fortunes selling albums and CDs, that there was a 1:35:55.240 --> 1:35:57.400 wave in the you know where it's really making is 1:35:57.439 --> 1:36:00.599 a good business to sell physical music that it doesn't exist. 1:36:00.680 --> 1:36:03.560 So it's really an advertisement for who you are and 1:36:03.640 --> 1:36:05.840 what you want people to connect with and be inspired 1:36:05.920 --> 1:36:07.040 by and get involved with. 1:36:07.800 --> 1:36:11.439 To even write a song is an exercise and being 1:36:11.479 --> 1:36:16.439 an entrepreneur, you have decided, despite the thousands and millions 1:36:16.479 --> 1:36:18.880 of songs in the world, that you have something to 1:36:19.000 --> 1:36:22.640 say that has a market that people need to hear, right, 1:36:22.840 --> 1:36:25.400 And so I think that's the reason why you keep 1:36:25.680 --> 1:36:32.160 making music. It is long, long, long term investment. You're saying, 1:36:32.840 --> 1:36:36.080 if I do something that is really good, and I 1:36:36.240 --> 1:36:39.640 say something that maybe really matters, and I throw it 1:36:39.680 --> 1:36:42.080 out into the world. It might not even be today 1:36:42.280 --> 1:36:45.120 or next year. It might be twenty years from now 1:36:45.400 --> 1:36:49.360 that it really matters. But if I continue to plant seeds, 1:36:50.320 --> 1:36:53.760 I will build this portfolio of for lack of a 1:36:53.840 --> 1:36:57.519 better word, truth, and people will find it when they 1:36:57.640 --> 1:37:01.200 need it. Now. Most things you do as a songwriter 1:37:02.040 --> 1:37:05.160 are not judged by whether they're as good as the other. 1:37:05.280 --> 1:37:08.240 They're judged by whether they're as successful as the other. 1:37:08.560 --> 1:37:10.880 But as a songwriter, you don't do that. You know 1:37:10.960 --> 1:37:13.760 that your best work is almost always the work that 1:37:13.840 --> 1:37:16.800 nobody knows about, and if you're one of those ones 1:37:16.840 --> 1:37:19.840 that's crazy enough to keep doing it, you live in 1:37:20.200 --> 1:37:25.160 this strange dichotomy of believing that the best work is 1:37:25.240 --> 1:37:27.920 the work you have never done yet, because you know 1:37:28.120 --> 1:37:31.320 how bad you were when you started, and you've been 1:37:31.360 --> 1:37:35.000 able to see your progression. Most people, you just don't 1:37:35.000 --> 1:37:37.880 get to see your progression as easily as the artist 1:37:38.280 --> 1:37:40.760 who gets to listen to that first song and go, wow, 1:37:40.920 --> 1:37:44.040 that was that's what I dis clear indication of yours. 1:37:44.120 --> 1:37:49.240 And so I think it's a hugely entrepreneurial spirit. When 1:37:49.320 --> 1:37:53.200 it's best, it is not self conscious at all, and 1:37:53.439 --> 1:37:56.800 we try our best not to be that, because if 1:37:56.840 --> 1:38:00.559 you were self conscious, you would stop. You would you say, 1:38:00.720 --> 1:38:02.880 there's no point in trying. It's going to fail again, 1:38:02.960 --> 1:38:06.760 because most things fail. Even on an album like Middle 1:38:06.800 --> 1:38:10.840 of Nowhere that sold eight million copies and was number 1:38:10.880 --> 1:38:14.479 one and had you know, had a bunch of top forties, 1:38:14.920 --> 1:38:19.880 it's remembered for one song. Yeah, there are twelve other 1:38:20.080 --> 1:38:23.559 really great songs, which and you could argue that well. 1:38:23.720 --> 1:38:25.760 And one of them was written by while in Man 1:38:25.880 --> 1:38:27.719 with Us, which is, you know, one of the greatest 1:38:27.760 --> 1:38:32.519 songwriting duos. It's a great song and it's probably a song. 1:38:32.760 --> 1:38:35.120 Oh no, no, it's certainly a better so in there, 1:38:35.439 --> 1:38:37.160 you know, and there Where's the Love? 1:38:37.280 --> 1:38:40.760 And you know, lyrics on that song are fantastic And 1:38:41.840 --> 1:38:47.639 so it's exercise in in believing in yourself and believing 1:38:47.720 --> 1:38:48.800 that you have more to give. 1:38:50.240 --> 1:38:53.160 Okay, tell me about this twenty year Is it a 1:38:53.240 --> 1:38:56.439 fan club where the people get five or so songs 1:38:56.439 --> 1:38:59.320 a year? How did that start? How many members are there? 1:38:59.400 --> 1:39:00.720 Do they pay? How does that work? 1:39:01.200 --> 1:39:03.639 So, I mean it started twenty years ago. It started 1:39:03.720 --> 1:39:05.200 actually as a magazine. 1:39:05.479 --> 1:39:07.880 Yeah, so it started it started as a magazine back 1:39:07.920 --> 1:39:11.240 in nineteen ninety eight. And it was called MO Middle 1:39:11.280 --> 1:39:16.439 of Everywhere, and so that had you know that we 1:39:16.760 --> 1:39:19.879 distributed around the world. That was complicated, as you can imagine, 1:39:19.920 --> 1:39:21.439 to kind of it was quarterly. 1:39:21.640 --> 1:39:23.240 It was quarterlyst example. 1:39:22.920 --> 1:39:24.560 I think we were inspired by you two, and we 1:39:24.600 --> 1:39:26.920 were inspired by a couple other bands. We had a 1:39:27.080 --> 1:39:30.280 touring sort of real real fan bases like they. 1:39:31.280 --> 1:39:35.560 Again, I think it had about twenty thousand paid subscribers 1:39:35.640 --> 1:39:39.960 to the magazine, which really felt like an amazingly huge number. 1:39:40.080 --> 1:39:43.439 Then it was a little more than that. Probably it was. 1:39:43.520 --> 1:39:46.160 More a little more than that, but either way, and 1:39:46.280 --> 1:39:49.120 then around and then that kind of number pretty much 1:39:49.160 --> 1:39:53.160 transferred over to Hanson dot net, which is what we 1:39:53.360 --> 1:39:55.840 currently have and have had for over twenty years. And 1:39:55.960 --> 1:39:59.400 that that initially started off as an internet service provider. 1:39:59.439 --> 1:40:01.960 We partnered with a company that provided dial up service 1:40:02.400 --> 1:40:04.960 and we built a community around that. And then and 1:40:05.040 --> 1:40:07.599 then a couple of years into that, we went independent. 1:40:07.920 --> 1:40:11.479 And so we started doing because we could, because we 1:40:11.560 --> 1:40:13.720 didn't have the label restrictions. We were like, Aha, we 1:40:13.800 --> 1:40:15.360 can finally do what we want to do, and so 1:40:15.520 --> 1:40:18.160 we just start We would put groups of songs together. 1:40:18.600 --> 1:40:21.680 In some cases it was demos that were kind of 1:40:21.760 --> 1:40:24.640 left from the record that we were working on. But 1:40:24.880 --> 1:40:30.080 then a handful of years into that, we started doing 1:40:30.160 --> 1:40:33.120 things like we would do songwriting retweets with other friends, 1:40:33.320 --> 1:40:36.000 and we would write and recordatos and things, and so 1:40:36.880 --> 1:40:38.800 you have extra content, and so we put some of 1:40:38.880 --> 1:40:40.000 those in a collection. 1:40:40.120 --> 1:40:44.120 And what we essentially were doing was a digital paywall site, 1:40:44.200 --> 1:40:48.080 you know, access to another second private side of a website, 1:40:48.360 --> 1:40:51.320 so that we could offer resources. We could offer Hey, 1:40:51.320 --> 1:40:53.040 if you are in a membership, we have your name, 1:40:53.080 --> 1:40:54.880 we have your information, we know you're a member, so 1:40:54.960 --> 1:40:56.400 we can give you a pre sale, we can give 1:40:56.400 --> 1:40:58.960 you access to meet and greets. And then we built 1:40:59.080 --> 1:41:02.040 bespoke a couple times now, but now the current engine 1:41:02.080 --> 1:41:06.240 is pretty powerful. A technology partnership with another company that'll 1:41:06.280 --> 1:41:10.000 just build a design custom you know e commerce and 1:41:10.320 --> 1:41:13.639 you know website that allows us to essentially a reward activity. 1:41:13.680 --> 1:41:16.320 It's like its own social media sort of community where 1:41:16.400 --> 1:41:19.719 people get points and tags and show activity in the community. 1:41:19.760 --> 1:41:22.640 It's it's really just a relationship that's deeper than I 1:41:22.760 --> 1:41:26.160 came to the site, and that through that pathway allows 1:41:26.240 --> 1:41:27.960 us to do to make things special like this tour, 1:41:28.000 --> 1:41:30.760 which just did or we just announced and it's coming 1:41:30.800 --> 1:41:32.960 this fall. You know, the whole room where you know, 1:41:33.040 --> 1:41:35.800 we're pre selling, giving special discounts to a fan club 1:41:35.840 --> 1:41:38.280 member so they can get to the two nights back 1:41:38.320 --> 1:41:41.280 to back for a lower discount products. They're getting it first, 1:41:41.720 --> 1:41:43.800 you know, they're getting the check ins at the shows to. 1:41:44.000 --> 1:41:46.040 Get first in line, you know, so they can come 1:41:46.080 --> 1:41:48.360 in first in GA shows. Yeah. The main thing about 1:41:48.720 --> 1:41:51.800 a handsout end is you know, when you become a 1:41:51.880 --> 1:41:53.920 fan of something, you realize that there's a group of 1:41:53.960 --> 1:41:58.640 people that that they want to invest more and if 1:41:58.760 --> 1:42:01.080 you can find a relationship where you can give them 1:42:01.120 --> 1:42:04.200 what they're wanting, then that can help you do more 1:42:04.360 --> 1:42:07.320 and more with less risk in the world. And so 1:42:07.560 --> 1:42:11.560 as a business model, you can take the dedicated thousands 1:42:12.000 --> 1:42:15.639 of fans and then turn that into sort of access 1:42:15.720 --> 1:42:19.240 to millions of people because they're your base, your passion base. 1:42:19.600 --> 1:42:20.880 Yeah, shows up. 1:42:21.080 --> 1:42:24.280 So how many people presently are members of Hanson dot 1:42:24.400 --> 1:42:25.519 net and how much do they pay? 1:42:26.080 --> 1:42:29.760 It fluctuate fluctuates between five and ten thousand. We all 1:42:29.800 --> 1:42:31.479 look at each other and how much do you want 1:42:31.479 --> 1:42:32.000 to share there? 1:42:32.240 --> 1:42:36.960 It's yeah, it's they pay fifty dollars a year and 1:42:37.000 --> 1:42:40.000 they have played forty until very recently we very reluctantly 1:42:40.120 --> 1:42:42.479 raised the price, but with inflation and things and just 1:42:42.600 --> 1:42:45.240 the change in service, we finally moved it up to fifty, 1:42:45.479 --> 1:42:48.160 which is still extremely you know, hopefully we feel it 1:42:48.160 --> 1:42:50.960 people feel like it's reasonable, but that you know, that 1:42:51.160 --> 1:42:54.080 membership you're you're trying to give people you know enough 1:42:54.160 --> 1:42:56.880 that it's like, yeah, I remember. And then one of 1:42:56.920 --> 1:42:58.720 the coolest things that we do, which I think is 1:42:59.040 --> 1:43:00.840 is also a really cool part of it, is there's 1:43:00.920 --> 1:43:04.639 other events and things that are only available after you've 1:43:04.640 --> 1:43:07.000 already become a member, Like we do a destination concert 1:43:07.040 --> 1:43:09.840 in Jamaica we've done for over ten years where it's 1:43:09.840 --> 1:43:12.960 a you know, like people do you know, cruises and stuff, 1:43:13.040 --> 1:43:15.559 but we we take over a whole resort and fans 1:43:15.640 --> 1:43:18.719 converge and they take their vacation. They spend an amazing 1:43:18.920 --> 1:43:22.320 several days with one another. But you can't even go 1:43:22.800 --> 1:43:25.880 to that event unless you're already first a member. So 1:43:26.040 --> 1:43:28.320 there's a sense of there's just a sense of it. 1:43:28.479 --> 1:43:30.599 It's also kind of a like, hey, I'm in at 1:43:30.640 --> 1:43:32.960 this level, you know, and business wise, you know, it's 1:43:33.000 --> 1:43:35.760 a reasonable you know, it contributes things that help keep 1:43:35.800 --> 1:43:38.320 the lights on, kept keep the music going, and keep 1:43:38.400 --> 1:43:41.080 the band operating. And also there's merchandising and things that 1:43:41.160 --> 1:43:42.360 are kind of in that world too. 1:43:45.080 --> 1:43:48.720 How many people come to your anniversary concert every year? 1:43:48.920 --> 1:43:52.080 A couple of thousand, couple thousands, Yeah, and it's and 1:43:52.240 --> 1:43:55.560 it's about you know. One of the things about that 1:43:55.760 --> 1:43:58.280 is it's a lot of people that are obviously not 1:43:58.439 --> 1:44:01.320 from here. So it's truly a like United Nations. 1:44:01.760 --> 1:44:04.200 Well, truthfully, probably be a lot more if we like 1:44:04.280 --> 1:44:06.960 did it in Boston, yeah, yeah, or like or like 1:44:07.240 --> 1:44:09.800 or like Dallas. You know, like if it wasn't it 1:44:09.920 --> 1:44:13.240 wasn't as uh, you know, if it wasn't in Tulsa, 1:44:13.360 --> 1:44:15.160 it would probably be even more because you know, you 1:44:15.280 --> 1:44:17.320 put it in a hub city and you'd be a 1:44:17.360 --> 1:44:20.599 lot easier. But but yeah, that's we do it here 1:44:20.720 --> 1:44:22.799 in Tulsa specifically because it's our hometown. 1:44:22.960 --> 1:44:26.479 Person. We've done it Kaye's Ballroom, which has been there 1:44:26.560 --> 1:44:28.880 for what one hundred and something years. 1:44:28.960 --> 1:44:31.360 Yeah, yeah, and then I've also done it at at 1:44:31.840 --> 1:44:33.800 Tulsa Theater, which was called Brady for a while. 1:44:34.240 --> 1:44:38.839 Yeah. And then it's broadcast to the whole online community. 1:44:38.960 --> 1:44:42.120 So all of the handston net members. Uh, and so 1:44:43.240 --> 1:44:46.839 live in person you have several thousand, and then online 1:44:46.880 --> 1:44:48.240 you have the whole community. 1:44:56.040 --> 1:45:01.240 Okay, So how accessible are you guys eyes? Do you 1:45:01.439 --> 1:45:05.120 participate only on hands and dot net? Are you on 1:45:05.520 --> 1:45:11.320 the big social media platforms TikTok, YouTube, Snapchat, Instagram and 1:45:11.439 --> 1:45:12.559 Instagram reels? 1:45:12.760 --> 1:45:16.519 Yeah, we do all the social media stuff probably, you know, 1:45:17.240 --> 1:45:21.240 we interestingly, because of our relationship with handsOn dot net, 1:45:21.280 --> 1:45:24.200 we probably have done that a little less historically, way 1:45:24.320 --> 1:45:28.360 less than we would have because we already have such 1:45:28.360 --> 1:45:32.000 a strong community. But that is that is continuing to evolve. 1:45:32.840 --> 1:45:35.519 But yeah, we're definitely accessible on all the social media 1:45:35.560 --> 1:45:37.400 platforms Facebook, and you can't. 1:45:37.600 --> 1:45:40.840 You can't be in this business without being accessible. Yeah, 1:45:42.160 --> 1:45:44.599 otherwise I don't know what business you're. 1:45:44.560 --> 1:45:47.280 In, right, Yeah, exactly at some some level. 1:45:47.439 --> 1:45:49.439 Now, we're not inviting you to a home concert at 1:45:49.479 --> 1:45:53.000 our house, So we're not coming to your living room 1:45:53.160 --> 1:45:55.640 literally unless there's a contest, okay, but we. 1:45:55.760 --> 1:45:58.840 All know in this business there are super fans. Yeah, 1:45:59.160 --> 1:46:01.880 if people come to make or if people come to 1:46:01.960 --> 1:46:04.280 the annual concert, are they going to get to meet you? 1:46:04.800 --> 1:46:06.360 To what degree? Are you friends? 1:46:06.439 --> 1:46:07.519 Well, we always do meet. 1:46:07.600 --> 1:46:10.000 I mean we do meet and greets. In almost every 1:46:10.080 --> 1:46:12.640 case with concerts, we have specific meet and greets. And 1:46:12.800 --> 1:46:14.640 one of the things we've really tried to do that 1:46:14.960 --> 1:46:18.519 we do not promise a meet except in specific areas 1:46:18.520 --> 1:46:20.639 where they get on a list, they raise their hand, 1:46:20.680 --> 1:46:23.519 they say, I'm going to be there. But we always 1:46:23.600 --> 1:46:25.680 make an effort to set up the opportunity to have 1:46:25.880 --> 1:46:28.160 a I came to see you. We we have a 1:46:28.400 --> 1:46:31.040 you know, take a photo. In fact, every concert we do, 1:46:31.520 --> 1:46:33.559 pretty much every public concert we've done since we started 1:46:33.600 --> 1:46:35.920 the label, we have something called Hanson dot Net Reporter, 1:46:36.040 --> 1:46:37.720 So we have a member of the fan club that 1:46:37.920 --> 1:46:40.080 already tells us, hey, I'm coming to the show. They 1:46:40.120 --> 1:46:43.120 get randomly selected and they then sit down just like 1:46:43.240 --> 1:46:45.960 this and have an interview with us to talk about 1:46:46.880 --> 1:46:49.639 So that's one of the ways. And and we've gotten 1:46:49.720 --> 1:46:52.160 We've done a lot of conversations. 1:46:51.680 --> 1:46:54.080 And I think we've met. This is an important thing. 1:46:54.560 --> 1:46:58.280 It's something that we've always said and and I don't know, 1:46:58.439 --> 1:47:03.000 you know, so many bands sell access right they go 1:47:03.320 --> 1:47:05.720 and for two hundred dollars or five hundred dollars more, 1:47:05.840 --> 1:47:07.840 you can come meet me for it a long three 1:47:07.920 --> 1:47:10.720 minutes and get a long hug and a and we 1:47:10.800 --> 1:47:13.360 have never sold mean greats. I mean there's been some 1:47:13.479 --> 1:47:16.760 cases where for a charity auction somebody gets to meet you. 1:47:16.920 --> 1:47:20.040 But and that's been important to us, I think, because 1:47:21.400 --> 1:47:26.280 as much as you know your fans, you're not friends. 1:47:27.120 --> 1:47:29.960 And that's I think the place where this gets gets 1:47:30.080 --> 1:47:34.599 dangerous sort of socially. This experience. You meet a lot 1:47:34.640 --> 1:47:36.599 of people who have been through a lot of things 1:47:36.720 --> 1:47:40.120 and your music has helped them through it, and you 1:47:40.280 --> 1:47:43.519 want to be connected, but you don't want to be false. 1:47:44.120 --> 1:47:45.840 You don't want to you don't want to for the 1:47:46.080 --> 1:47:50.800 for the right price, like cross that line into this 1:47:51.000 --> 1:47:54.120 sort of personal space where you go like we've shared something, 1:47:54.960 --> 1:47:59.320 but what it is is not for sale, and it's 1:47:59.360 --> 1:48:00.200 a part of thing. 1:48:00.240 --> 1:48:02.840 It's a part of you can maybe meet some one, 1:48:02.880 --> 1:48:05.479 but it's not like here's the price we'll ever live 1:48:05.600 --> 1:48:08.479 through enough, you know, God bless them. There are some 1:48:08.600 --> 1:48:12.439 crazy people. There are some dangerous people, and so you 1:48:12.680 --> 1:48:17.479 you have to know the difference, and so you can't 1:48:17.560 --> 1:48:20.120 you can't buy meeting us. But we're not hard to find, 1:48:21.560 --> 1:48:24.200 and there's a there's a good chance if you come 1:48:24.280 --> 1:48:26.360 to Back to the Island event Jamaica, if you come 1:48:26.439 --> 1:48:29.040 to Hanson Day and Toulsa, if you come to really 1:48:29.160 --> 1:48:32.840 any show on a tour that we're on and you 1:48:33.080 --> 1:48:35.680 stand by the bus after the show, there's a good 1:48:35.800 --> 1:48:38.920 chance somebody's gonna come talk to you and take a photo, 1:48:39.040 --> 1:48:45.880 because we care about those connections enough to never make 1:48:46.000 --> 1:48:48.840 them something that has a dollar sign in front of them. 1:48:49.080 --> 1:48:50.840 Yeah, okay. 1:48:50.920 --> 1:48:55.120 The lifeblood of the business is new fans, younger fans. 1:48:55.479 --> 1:48:56.880 How do you reach those people? 1:48:57.640 --> 1:49:01.040 How do we reach new fans. We have a breeding 1:49:01.320 --> 1:49:06.439 scheme where we are farming by our fans. We last 1:49:06.600 --> 1:49:09.880 long enough that our fans who were twelve bring their 1:49:10.280 --> 1:49:12.640 twelve year olds to the show. That's what we're working on. 1:49:13.400 --> 1:49:18.760 Reaching new fans. Man, what an impossible scheme, because the 1:49:18.840 --> 1:49:22.400 most likely thing is to do something that other popular 1:49:22.479 --> 1:49:26.400 people are doing, which sometimes serves you but most often 1:49:26.520 --> 1:49:31.000 makes you just a bad version of somebody else's genuine idea. 1:49:31.840 --> 1:49:35.839 I think our version of reaching new fans truly is lasting. 1:49:36.000 --> 1:49:40.879 It's really just to say still be here when somebody 1:49:40.960 --> 1:49:44.400 has an opportunity to find you. And we do really 1:49:44.479 --> 1:49:47.760 see the multi generational thing in our shows now where 1:49:47.880 --> 1:49:50.599 the mom who is twelve is now forty and she's 1:49:50.640 --> 1:49:53.600 got two or three kids and she's bringing some of 1:49:53.680 --> 1:49:55.200 them to the show or all of that. 1:49:55.560 --> 1:49:57.800 Well, And I would also say too, the coolest thing 1:49:57.880 --> 1:50:00.920 about streaming, although there are many problems with the streaming 1:50:01.000 --> 1:50:03.840 and the way that it financially is created a lot 1:50:03.960 --> 1:50:07.080 of issues with how do you even like earn a 1:50:07.160 --> 1:50:09.920 living as a musician and have a career. It's it's 1:50:10.000 --> 1:50:13.559 complicated because it was already hard. It was already hard 1:50:13.640 --> 1:50:16.000 to be, you know, an artist going out there and 1:50:16.080 --> 1:50:19.000 having any kind of success. It's it's definitely more challenging 1:50:19.040 --> 1:50:22.480 in a variety of ways through streaming. But the upside 1:50:22.760 --> 1:50:26.599 is that there is very low barrier barrier to entry, 1:50:27.120 --> 1:50:31.160 and so what you do start seeing, interestingly enough discovery 1:50:31.640 --> 1:50:35.080 is this continually like weird discovery. We'll be like, you know, 1:50:36.040 --> 1:50:38.680 what's that group of sixteen year olds doing here? And 1:50:38.760 --> 1:50:41.120 they'll walk up super excited to be like, we just 1:50:41.200 --> 1:50:45.160 discovered you last week and you're like what, like yeah, 1:50:45.560 --> 1:50:48.160 and it was so cool because we've heard some songs 1:50:48.280 --> 1:50:50.320 of you guys from like when you were kids, but 1:50:50.400 --> 1:50:52.280 then we heard all of your other stuff and you 1:50:52.360 --> 1:50:55.360 guys are like really like diverse and really different, and 1:50:55.439 --> 1:50:57.120 we just kind of had to see what the show 1:50:57.240 --> 1:50:57.640 was going to be. 1:50:57.720 --> 1:50:58.960 Like I would say something to you. 1:50:59.080 --> 1:51:00.840 You said the phrase that you know, new fans are 1:51:00.840 --> 1:51:03.840 the lifeblood of our industry or and I appreciate that, 1:51:03.960 --> 1:51:05.960 but I would have to differ on that. I think 1:51:06.040 --> 1:51:10.160 that connection is the lifeblood of our career in our industry, 1:51:10.280 --> 1:51:13.560 meaning real fans are the lifeblood. And back when we 1:51:14.040 --> 1:51:16.479 now live in a world where direct fan communication is 1:51:16.600 --> 1:51:18.599 just so prevalent, we all live it. I mean, here 1:51:18.640 --> 1:51:21.240 we are, we're literally sitting across this is like Star Trek. 1:51:21.320 --> 1:51:23.280 What's going on right now talking to each other on 1:51:23.320 --> 1:51:26.960 the screen. The world's forgotten that access to the pipeline 1:51:27.120 --> 1:51:29.559 was the way the music business was built. A label 1:51:29.600 --> 1:51:31.200 said I'm going to make you a record because it 1:51:31.320 --> 1:51:33.000 costs to go to a studio and has tape, and 1:51:33.000 --> 1:51:35.559 then we have to print CDs, print make records. 1:51:35.560 --> 1:51:36.400 We've got to distribute it. 1:51:36.479 --> 1:51:38.000 We've got to get a radio station, we got to 1:51:38.000 --> 1:51:39.639 get TV, we got to get a magazine to write 1:51:39.640 --> 1:51:43.000 an article. Now we can talk, and so the relationship 1:51:43.040 --> 1:51:46.560 with that passion base we now live that everyone lives that, 1:51:46.720 --> 1:51:49.320 but we saw it early, and so I think I 1:51:49.400 --> 1:51:53.160 think the lifeblood is real connection to fans, real connection 1:51:53.240 --> 1:51:56.240 which means one that goes deeper, because first of all, 1:51:56.320 --> 1:51:59.200 once you get a person, they say that, I'm not 1:51:59.280 --> 1:52:01.840 going to list number, but we know that dramatically after 1:52:02.000 --> 1:52:05.320 college age in life, most people dramatically drop the new 1:52:05.479 --> 1:52:08.160 music or the new arts they're discovering. College is kind 1:52:08.160 --> 1:52:11.200 of the end of their like important, which is hard. 1:52:11.360 --> 1:52:13.880 So if you do reach somebody earlier in their life, 1:52:13.880 --> 1:52:16.240 they tend to become that they have a chance to 1:52:16.320 --> 1:52:18.240 be with you through the ride. Like how many people 1:52:18.320 --> 1:52:20.200 that came through high school and said James Taylor was 1:52:20.240 --> 1:52:22.479 my thing. That's always their thing. Our parents three Dog Night, 1:52:22.840 --> 1:52:26.000 you know. And so I think that connection is huge. 1:52:26.560 --> 1:52:29.000 And as far as the new fans go, I would 1:52:29.080 --> 1:52:33.639 say that adding to what's been said already, that new 1:52:33.720 --> 1:52:37.280 fans are are just like the first ones. New fans 1:52:37.360 --> 1:52:39.360 you find the same way you find any fan. You 1:52:39.680 --> 1:52:41.920 have a piece of thing, you content, you have something 1:52:41.960 --> 1:52:44.320 you believe in, and you lob it out into the world. 1:52:44.720 --> 1:52:46.839 And the people that sit around and say, my audience 1:52:47.000 --> 1:52:49.320 is really people from this age that have this color 1:52:49.360 --> 1:52:53.160 hair they is, they're fooling themselves. You only know what 1:52:53.400 --> 1:52:56.280 you believe in, and you only know what you can share, 1:52:56.479 --> 1:52:58.880 and then you hope that you find others that go, 1:52:59.720 --> 1:53:01.920 you know what, I dig that. I want to listen 1:53:01.920 --> 1:53:03.760 to that in the car. I want to I want to, 1:53:03.920 --> 1:53:05.599 you know, turn it up on the radio. I want 1:53:05.640 --> 1:53:07.800 to go work out to that song. I want to 1:53:07.840 --> 1:53:09.920 share that on the night that I get married. And 1:53:10.520 --> 1:53:13.400 whatever times the music finds its way that you do 1:53:13.520 --> 1:53:17.040 not control it. And so I think you can only 1:53:17.160 --> 1:53:20.920 continue to cast you know, things into the universe and 1:53:21.200 --> 1:53:23.680 hope that it finds people that feel the way you 1:53:23.840 --> 1:53:27.080 do a little bit. And that's my that's my story. 1:53:27.080 --> 1:53:27.760 I'm sticking to it. 1:53:28.960 --> 1:53:32.840 I will say one specific thing though about that. It's 1:53:34.560 --> 1:53:38.799 it's interesting because I lost the train of thought. 1:53:40.160 --> 1:53:42.080 To say that. Yeah, let me then I'll say something. 1:53:43.000 --> 1:53:45.559 What Taylor's talking about is the fact that the most 1:53:45.640 --> 1:53:50.720 important relationships are are created through the advocates, and like, 1:53:51.000 --> 1:53:53.479 there's a reason why people on social media know that 1:53:53.720 --> 1:53:56.439 someone with ten thousand followers is more likely to create 1:53:57.280 --> 1:54:01.280 more purchases than somebody with two million followers, because the 1:54:01.400 --> 1:54:04.679 ten thousand people following that guy really feel deeply connected 1:54:04.680 --> 1:54:07.439 to them. So when they when they have that connection, 1:54:07.600 --> 1:54:11.439 they go, oh, oh, this is a personal recommendation from somebody. 1:54:11.479 --> 1:54:16.040 And so what when you say create strong connections with people? 1:54:16.520 --> 1:54:19.240 That goes back to the idea of you know, every 1:54:19.280 --> 1:54:23.080 time you meet someone, being genuine, the stories in your songs, 1:54:23.160 --> 1:54:25.559 being connected to who you are as a person. Right, 1:54:26.320 --> 1:54:30.880 if everything is rooted in this deep reality and you 1:54:30.960 --> 1:54:34.040 know some sort of the truth of the world as 1:54:34.160 --> 1:54:39.800 you live it, then hopefully that translates into deeper connections, 1:54:39.960 --> 1:54:44.440 which translates into people who want to share the importance 1:54:44.520 --> 1:54:48.160 of those connections. And it's not about being a splash. 1:54:48.600 --> 1:54:51.480 It's not about just just getting attention from as many 1:54:51.560 --> 1:54:56.360 eyes as possible, but creating good connections. I think what 1:54:56.440 --> 1:54:57.720 you're trying to say is, can. 1:54:57.640 --> 1:54:59.880 You remember I remember what came back to? 1:55:00.160 --> 1:55:02.000 Yeah, it's about having respect. 1:55:02.000 --> 1:55:04.120 I think what you were talking about, Zach is it's 1:55:04.120 --> 1:55:06.200 about having respect for the audience because it's not it's 1:55:06.240 --> 1:55:08.680 not calculated. You're not like you're just saying like, look, 1:55:08.680 --> 1:55:10.480 I'm gonna be myself and I'm gonna be honest with 1:55:10.560 --> 1:55:14.720 people as much as I possibly can. The thing that 1:55:15.200 --> 1:55:17.600 you asked a little while ago. Why even make new music, 1:55:18.760 --> 1:55:21.680 Why even make new music? Well, for one, maybe to 1:55:21.720 --> 1:55:24.040 connect with new fans. That is certainly part of it. 1:55:24.680 --> 1:55:26.560 It's certainly part of it. You never know what will 1:55:26.640 --> 1:55:30.960 catch people. But also it's for your fans who have 1:55:31.000 --> 1:55:33.080 been around for a long time as well, because you 1:55:33.240 --> 1:55:37.200 don't want them to think that there's nothing new of 1:55:37.440 --> 1:55:40.720 value for them to engage in. You want to give 1:55:40.760 --> 1:55:44.160 them a new story and a new experience. And you know, 1:55:44.520 --> 1:55:46.360 some of the best stuff we've ever done we did 1:55:46.480 --> 1:55:50.480 last year, you know, and that's really cool. Some of 1:55:50.520 --> 1:55:52.600 the best stuff we did, you know, in our life 1:55:52.720 --> 1:55:56.160 was in twenty eighteen on that String Theory Orchestra tour. Yes, 1:55:56.320 --> 1:55:58.879 one of the most one of the coolest, most emotionally 1:55:59.080 --> 1:56:01.440 satisfying things I've ever done, you know. 1:56:01.680 --> 1:56:02.760 So that's why you do it. 1:56:03.200 --> 1:56:06.400 And I know for a fact that the audience comes 1:56:06.480 --> 1:56:09.360 up after the show over and over and over again 1:56:09.760 --> 1:56:13.800 and says a combination of that was deeply impactful to me. 1:56:14.560 --> 1:56:17.640 Thank you for doing that. It really took this music 1:56:17.720 --> 1:56:20.240 that I loved to another level in a new place, 1:56:20.360 --> 1:56:22.200 and I'm so grateful that you took that risk. 1:56:22.960 --> 1:56:24.480 Oh, or how about this Oh. 1:56:24.600 --> 1:56:26.560 Yeah, I brought my kid for the first time because 1:56:26.600 --> 1:56:28.560 I knew it was an orchestra show and they could 1:56:28.720 --> 1:56:31.920 sit down and watch and that was deeply impactful for them, 1:56:31.960 --> 1:56:34.200 and I know it'll last with them forever, you know. 1:56:34.520 --> 1:56:35.720 So those are the reasons why. 1:56:35.680 --> 1:56:36.320 You do that stuff. 1:56:37.640 --> 1:56:44.560 Okay, you went independent before almost any of the major 1:56:44.680 --> 1:56:49.800 label acts that it had success had Today everybody is 1:56:49.880 --> 1:56:53.880 on that page, but you were early. So you talked 1:56:53.880 --> 1:56:57.920 about the frustration with Island def Jam, You talked about 1:56:58.120 --> 1:57:03.960 getting the financial stuff. Then you start with your own isp, 1:57:04.680 --> 1:57:09.080 your own label. There's this incredible sense of freedom, but 1:57:10.880 --> 1:57:15.240 you do reach a lot fewer people at the beginning. Yeah, well, 1:57:15.400 --> 1:57:17.240 how did you handle that emotionally? 1:57:17.360 --> 1:57:20.960 Well? So, I think what we had experienced with our 1:57:21.040 --> 1:57:25.600 Island def Gen relationship was that we had been locked right, 1:57:25.840 --> 1:57:29.680 we'd been locked up, and really any number of people 1:57:30.720 --> 1:57:34.960 was better than no people at all. What we also 1:57:35.120 --> 1:57:40.520 saw was that we could be with the greatest label, 1:57:40.600 --> 1:57:43.280 the biggest label, with the biggest budget, but it was 1:57:43.360 --> 1:57:46.160 the wrong people. They wouldn't spend the money in the 1:57:46.280 --> 1:57:49.280 right places and they would leave before the job was done. 1:57:50.840 --> 1:57:53.200 And so you know, that's that was our experience. Six 1:57:53.280 --> 1:57:55.960 weeks into our second album, it had sold almost a 1:57:56.000 --> 1:58:00.200 million copies and they said, hey, it's not working. We're 1:58:00.240 --> 1:58:02.680 looking around going we sold a million companies, we're platinum, 1:58:03.120 --> 1:58:05.959 Like that's supposed to be the sign of efper echelon 1:58:06.160 --> 1:58:09.560 artists and you're pulling the money in and so what 1:58:09.760 --> 1:58:15.280 more was It is a sacrifice. It is an unfortunate 1:58:15.440 --> 1:58:21.360 reality that money talks, but money is not a guarantee. 1:58:22.040 --> 1:58:26.320 The only thing you can really count on are your 1:58:26.600 --> 1:58:31.080 advocates and your effort. And so you put in the effort, 1:58:31.720 --> 1:58:35.839 You put that energy into the people that you believe 1:58:36.000 --> 1:58:40.360 will be there in the hard times, and that's probably 1:58:40.400 --> 1:58:42.880 about as good as you can do. I think. I 1:58:42.960 --> 1:58:46.760 think now today it's interesting to look at labels and 1:58:47.080 --> 1:58:50.280 ask questions about what is the best strategy. It might 1:58:50.360 --> 1:58:54.680 be that our independent strategy today is missing some things 1:58:55.560 --> 1:58:58.200 and we need to rethink, you know, to be the 1:58:58.280 --> 1:59:03.440 best business model. But fundamentally, it's it's really about that 1:59:04.440 --> 1:59:10.200 long view and that sustainability that says we need to 1:59:10.280 --> 1:59:13.920 bet on the fan base that has been neglected, because 1:59:13.920 --> 1:59:15.720 they're the ones who are going to tell their friends, 1:59:16.080 --> 1:59:19.160 who are going to create more fans faster than we can. 1:59:20.920 --> 1:59:24.280 And as you grow into being an older band, you 1:59:24.360 --> 1:59:28.120 know that has fans that have careers that are music 1:59:28.200 --> 1:59:33.080 supervisors and executives like you go those fans, if they 1:59:33.200 --> 1:59:36.240 so choose, they can they can put your record wherever 1:59:36.360 --> 1:59:39.879 it needs to be by their fandom, not by your dollars. 1:59:40.720 --> 1:59:44.400 So you don't have to reach everyone. You have to 1:59:44.480 --> 1:59:48.560 reach the people who who want to talk, who want 1:59:48.600 --> 1:59:52.000 to buy, who want to engage, and and you know, 1:59:52.640 --> 1:59:55.160 you see that over and over and over again, especially 1:59:55.280 --> 2:00:01.640 now with the way algorithms throttle things. Numbers are are 2:00:01.800 --> 2:00:06.280 not the whole story, no, and so better to have 2:00:06.880 --> 2:00:11.040 a great career than a fantastic opportunity. 2:00:11.400 --> 2:00:15.120 Yeah, well, you're right. I think it's worth diving into 2:00:15.160 --> 2:00:18.360 one particular detail about that though, too, which is we realized, 2:00:18.480 --> 2:00:21.000 especially at that second record, where you get a whole 2:00:21.040 --> 2:00:24.040 group of new people who we knew from the get go, 2:00:24.480 --> 2:00:26.600 From the moment that record was getting released, we're like, 2:00:26.760 --> 2:00:30.200 cross our fingers, this could be a total shit show. 2:00:31.120 --> 2:00:34.560 And you know, and sure enough it was, because six 2:00:34.640 --> 2:00:36.640 weeks into the release of that record, they basically told 2:00:36.760 --> 2:00:38.680 our career was over and we need to do solo records. 2:00:38.720 --> 2:00:41.320 And they didn't believe in the band anymore, and you're like, wait, what, 2:00:41.560 --> 2:00:43.760 hold on, what are you talking about. But anyway, you 2:00:43.880 --> 2:00:47.000 get to the third record after you're kind of getting stuck, 2:00:47.080 --> 2:00:49.720 as you said, trapped in this process with this label 2:00:49.800 --> 2:00:53.360 you knew had no interest in really, you know, expanding 2:00:53.400 --> 2:01:00.320 your career, and basically everybody leaves the agent, the manager, everybody, right, 2:01:00.440 --> 2:01:05.160 all the people, everything, for various different reasons, some of 2:01:05.240 --> 2:01:08.360 which were perfectly reasonable and amicable and some were which 2:01:08.720 --> 2:01:09.840 were complicated. 2:01:10.080 --> 2:01:12.840 Yeah, we had a no agent, we had to find 2:01:12.880 --> 2:01:15.200 a new manager, we had to get out of our 2:01:15.240 --> 2:01:18.920 record label, and it was completely rebuilt from the end 2:01:18.960 --> 2:01:21.840 of two thousand and three, which was a time when 2:01:22.040 --> 2:01:23.600 almost no one was independent. 2:01:24.720 --> 2:01:30.040 But specifically we were told we had no fans left. Yes, 2:01:30.200 --> 2:01:33.960 and so the promoters didn't believe in you and all 2:01:34.040 --> 2:01:38.320 these kind of things. And we went and we said, fine, 2:01:39.120 --> 2:01:42.040 we'll get in a van, we'll do an unplugged tour. 2:01:42.200 --> 2:01:46.280 We don't care. And so you go from well, we 2:01:46.560 --> 2:01:48.480 knew the truth, we knew the truth. And so you 2:01:48.600 --> 2:01:51.760 go from doing one show that's one hundred and fifty 2:01:51.840 --> 2:01:55.480 cap in Chicago and we're like crap, But oh well, 2:01:55.760 --> 2:01:58.360 here we go to at the end of that year 2:01:59.320 --> 2:02:02.360 having a show at the House of Blues in Chicago. 2:02:02.520 --> 2:02:07.400 In Chicago, and so you're like, aha, see, and it's 2:02:07.480 --> 2:02:09.640 not that it's perfect again, it's not that you're reaching 2:02:09.680 --> 2:02:11.880 a gazillion people every single time. And yeah, we played 2:02:11.880 --> 2:02:14.440 the Chicago Theater. We played bigger rooms and smaller rooms 2:02:14.480 --> 2:02:17.040 along the way here and there, you know, on a cycle. 2:02:17.360 --> 2:02:18.880 But the same would be true of like, you know, 2:02:18.920 --> 2:02:21.600 playing the Middle East in Boston, and now we regularly 2:02:21.760 --> 2:02:23.880 sell out in the House of Blues and in Boston. 2:02:24.880 --> 2:02:27.640 Also, it's just the flubris of the industry that that 2:02:27.800 --> 2:02:29.760 was not seeing the thing that we saw. 2:02:30.120 --> 2:02:33.080 It's just fickleness and it's just and it's okay, it's okay. 2:02:33.200 --> 2:02:36.320 But we just couldn't be trapped in that scenario and 2:02:36.360 --> 2:02:38.680 so we had to take risks. We had to take risks, 2:02:38.800 --> 2:02:41.600 and luckily we had had enough success that we could 2:02:41.640 --> 2:02:44.160 better on ourselves and say, yeah, we might lose a 2:02:44.200 --> 2:02:44.840 lot of money. 2:02:45.320 --> 2:02:49.200 In the documentary about that about that album, the third 2:02:49.240 --> 2:02:53.200 album when we went independent, the album Underneath Uh, basically 2:02:53.400 --> 2:02:56.120 at the point we we signed on to work with 2:02:56.240 --> 2:02:59.880 Tenth Street, Alan Kovac who is You know. The great 2:03:00.000 --> 2:03:02.560 thing about Alan, especially at that point in our career, 2:03:02.840 --> 2:03:06.880 is Alan had no fear. He often had no friends 2:03:06.960 --> 2:03:10.280 because of his lack of fear. But he was a 2:03:10.320 --> 2:03:13.280 bulldog and he said, let's just do it ourselves. And 2:03:13.600 --> 2:03:20.480 our natural independent spirit, combined with Alan's sort of satiable confidence, 2:03:21.920 --> 2:03:24.160 said okay, fine, let's do it. He was also the 2:03:24.200 --> 2:03:26.600 only person that could have gotten us off island. And 2:03:26.960 --> 2:03:32.600 I think willing to go pick go, see us sit 2:03:32.720 --> 2:03:38.040 there and and go what do we have to lose? 2:03:38.800 --> 2:03:41.640 And everybody sits a lot of money. 2:03:42.960 --> 2:03:46.480 We're here today. For those people who know you from 2:03:46.640 --> 2:03:50.160 your hit days, what are one or two songs you 2:03:50.200 --> 2:03:53.560 would recommend they check out to find out where you 2:03:53.680 --> 2:03:57.160 are today, to turn them on, turn them back on. 2:03:57.520 --> 2:04:01.080 That's such a mue question, I mean, For one, as 2:04:01.160 --> 2:04:03.680 much as I hate to say this, I do think 2:04:03.760 --> 2:04:07.120 that the every Middle of Everywhere album, which we put 2:04:07.120 --> 2:04:09.280 out in twenty seventeen is a really good starting place 2:04:09.320 --> 2:04:12.320 because it touches on singles as well as non singles. 2:04:12.840 --> 2:04:14.120 Yea, but which is. 2:04:14.200 --> 2:04:16.160 Basically we put out a project called Red Green Blue 2:04:17.120 --> 2:04:20.280 two years ago, and the record was divided into three sections, 2:04:20.360 --> 2:04:22.680 one where each of us particularly penned or wrote the 2:04:22.760 --> 2:04:24.560 songs and sort of led the creative like this is 2:04:24.600 --> 2:04:25.840 the approach I want to take, like. 2:04:25.920 --> 2:04:27.760 Three, So I would. 2:04:27.960 --> 2:04:29.840 I would pick you know, I would listen to the 2:04:29.920 --> 2:04:33.240 song write you a song from Isaac's or child at 2:04:33.320 --> 2:04:37.680 Heart for myself or Don't Let Me Down, which each 2:04:37.720 --> 2:04:39.520 of these are from a section of the album. So 2:04:39.680 --> 2:04:41.680 write you a song, Child at Heart, Don't Let Me Down? 2:04:42.560 --> 2:04:44.720 I would go there, And I would also I would. 2:04:44.960 --> 2:04:46.960 We reference the Symphony Project a couple times because I 2:04:47.000 --> 2:04:50.120 think it speaks to something. The Symphony Project, called String Theory, 2:04:50.240 --> 2:04:52.640 tells a story and it opens up a different way 2:04:52.680 --> 2:04:54.320 of looking at how we write songs, which is, we 2:04:54.480 --> 2:04:57.000 roughly love pop songs, but we've always sort of heard 2:04:57.000 --> 2:04:59.440 a symphony in our heads, literally and figuratively at least, 2:04:59.480 --> 2:05:01.760 I feel that, and that project allowed us to paint 2:05:01.760 --> 2:05:04.080 a different picture in bigger strokes. So it starts with 2:05:04.160 --> 2:05:06.400 a song called Reachion for the Sky, and it says 2:05:06.480 --> 2:05:09.120 something about what we are and what a note we 2:05:09.320 --> 2:05:13.800 believe matters, which is the sense of believing and in aspiration, 2:05:13.920 --> 2:05:17.280 believing in purpose, believing in aspiring to things, and. 2:05:17.360 --> 2:05:21.520 Believing that you're you know, you have a value in 2:05:21.600 --> 2:05:23.000 the world and a thing that. 2:05:23.040 --> 2:05:25.000 You bigger than what people see, you know. 2:05:25.360 --> 2:05:27.760 And even just just to connect to that point, what 2:05:28.000 --> 2:05:29.880 was it being described about the reason to go into 2:05:29.880 --> 2:05:31.760 Bennett And it was I was saying there were some 2:05:31.840 --> 2:05:34.400 hubers from the industry, you know, about themselves, and not 2:05:34.520 --> 2:05:37.000 saying what I was really pointing to. And part is 2:05:37.440 --> 2:05:41.320 we saw what was happening online in communicating. We saw 2:05:41.360 --> 2:05:43.520 the communities. We'd built that fan club already while this 2:05:43.720 --> 2:05:45.880 was happening, and so we literally knew that there was 2:05:45.880 --> 2:05:47.920 a certain amount of people that had that had a voice. 2:05:48.360 --> 2:05:50.560 And so when we go back to the songs of 2:05:50.760 --> 2:05:54.000 what songs matter, we were feeling even in the high 2:05:54.040 --> 2:05:57.080 and low times, we could see the songs that people 2:05:57.720 --> 2:05:59.840 uh you know, wrote about on forum, or the or 2:05:59.840 --> 2:06:03.560 the lyrics people tattooed on their arms, or the non singles, 2:06:03.760 --> 2:06:05.360 you know, the song that you just put on there, 2:06:05.360 --> 2:06:06.840 and then you're like, that's where that A lot of 2:06:06.880 --> 2:06:10.280 people just seem to want to say that. So you're 2:06:10.400 --> 2:06:12.720 you're listening as much as you are making things. I 2:06:12.760 --> 2:06:15.640 think in this business, if you're successful, I think because 2:06:16.120 --> 2:06:18.400 you say things you think people are gonna care about 2:06:18.400 --> 2:06:20.400 the songs. We just you know, said, hey, try these songs. 2:06:20.560 --> 2:06:23.040 But the truth is we don't know what rabbit hole. 2:06:23.320 --> 2:06:25.640 The next fan is gonna go down and they're gonna 2:06:25.680 --> 2:06:28.360 tell us, They're gonna tell us switch ones. 2:06:28.520 --> 2:06:31.800 You know, if people like really modern music, though, I 2:06:31.840 --> 2:06:34.120 will say I was Born and Nothing like a love 2:06:34.200 --> 2:06:37.000 song if you're more inclined towards kind of more modern, 2:06:37.240 --> 2:06:39.840 more poppy kind of songs. Although those songs that you 2:06:39.960 --> 2:06:40.400 ran from. 2:06:40.400 --> 2:06:42.400 Yeah, I was Born and nothing love song, for sure 2:06:42.520 --> 2:06:43.240 tell you something. 2:06:43.160 --> 2:06:44.960 Very Nothing like a love song is very dancy. I 2:06:45.080 --> 2:06:47.160 was Born is very kind of how would you describe? 2:06:47.160 --> 2:06:50.000 It's like acoustic on the floor. 2:06:50.560 --> 2:06:53.440 Yeah, feels very accessible day Like. What makes us such 2:06:53.480 --> 2:06:55.920 a unique band is that we have three lead singers 2:06:55.960 --> 2:06:59.160 and three lead writers, and so there's a lot of variation. 2:06:59.320 --> 2:07:02.040 I think our album Against the World, which was two 2:07:02.080 --> 2:07:07.480 albums ago, best encapsulates simply the variety and the scope 2:07:07.600 --> 2:07:10.800 that you will enjoy if you decide to be a 2:07:10.880 --> 2:07:11.400 Hanson fan. 2:07:12.600 --> 2:07:13.879 It's most like a live show. 2:07:13.720 --> 2:07:14.040 In a way. 2:07:16.240 --> 2:07:19.920 Okay, gentlemen, you may not be educated, but you're all 2:07:20.160 --> 2:07:25.160 very intelligent. And I mean that honestly. And very insightful, 2:07:25.360 --> 2:07:28.080 very worldly. I certainly you know there's a lot of 2:07:28.200 --> 2:07:30.640 questions we didn't talk about. You know, none of you 2:07:30.760 --> 2:07:33.960 were divorced in a world where divorce is prevalent, but 2:07:34.120 --> 2:07:37.480 I'll save that for another time. In any event, I 2:07:37.600 --> 2:07:40.040 want to wish you luck and thank you for taking 2:07:40.160 --> 2:07:41.320 this time with my audience. 2:07:41.360 --> 2:07:43.320 Thank you, thank you for giving us the opportunity to 2:07:43.360 --> 2:07:44.000 talk to you, Chastra. 2:07:45.120 --> 2:07:47.760 Until next time. This is Bob Leftstacks