Speaker 1: I'm Caroline High and I'm ad Love though, both of
Speaker 1: us in San Francisco. The final time this week, Busy Friday.
Speaker 1: This is Bloomberg Technology. The markets risk on Friday, the
Speaker 1: headlines flying left right in center, and I'll tell you
Speaker 1: there's one asset class that is not risk on today too.
Speaker 1: We'll dig into all of that. First coming up, Amazon
Speaker 1: puts construction of its second headquarters on hold following its
Speaker 1: biggest ever job cuts, and Apple's executive exodus continues. This
Speaker 1: time is the person in charge of I Cloud, I
Speaker 1: Message and FaceTime and Silvergate's struggle for survival. It's weighing
Speaker 1: on overall crypto sentiment. Bloomberg breaking the story that constructions
Speaker 1: being paused Carrow in Virginia on HQU two. That second
Speaker 1: phase of construction the three twenty two story towers really interesting.
Speaker 1: Let's get into the d Tell the person who broke
Speaker 1: the story one, Matt Day is with us, and just
Speaker 1: talk to us, Matt about the importance of this second
Speaker 1: phase of the construction, because it's actually the bigger part
Speaker 1: of the construction. Right, Yeah, that's right. They're just now
Speaker 1: wrapping up the construction of two twenty two story towers.
Speaker 1: That's the first phase. It's basically done. Amazon moves their
Speaker 1: eight thousand workers in the area into those fieldities this
Speaker 1: spring and summer. What's a issue here is a much
Speaker 1: larger three twenty two story towers. It's the part of
Speaker 1: the complex. It's going to have the helix, the sort
Speaker 1: of spiral poopamoji shaped building that's going to have a
Speaker 1: bunch of plants in it, big conference center, the centerpiece
Speaker 1: architecturally of the campus that Amazon hopes to build. All
Speaker 1: that's on pause right now, no digging for the foreseable future. Hey, Matt,
Speaker 1: I know that last April this was approved and sources
Speaker 1: of telling us that Amazon was ready to pull the trigger.
Speaker 1: They held off. They then considered getting shovels in the
Speaker 1: ground to start the year. What did Amazon tell you
Speaker 1: about this decision? Why they decided to hit the brakes?
Speaker 1: So they said some of the obvious things you'd think,
Speaker 1: you know, like listen, we're not sure what kind of
Speaker 1: hiring we're going to be doing in the next couple
Speaker 1: of years. They've had a hiring freezon since late last year.
Speaker 1: We don't know when that lifts. And there's also just
Speaker 1: a different vibe around Amazon today. Than there was when
Speaker 1: they announced this campus in the first place. You know,
Speaker 1: back then they were growing billiaps and bounds. They'd run
Speaker 1: out of space in Seattle. They were searching for really
Speaker 1: anywhere to put people all across the country. So twenty
Speaker 1: five thousand was not so ambitious a target then. It
Speaker 1: looks a lot more ambitious today. Just looking at pictures
Speaker 1: of that poop emojie as you called it, I thought
Speaker 1: it was a helix. I think we hadn't heard it
Speaker 1: called that officially yet, Matt, talk to us though about
Speaker 1: you know, the serious nature of this is that Arlington,
Speaker 1: Virginia is going to be worried. In particular, they think
Speaker 1: of the tax breaks well eight hundred million dollars worth
Speaker 1: given to Amazon to lure them to bring in what
Speaker 1: twenty five thousand workers, that's right. But the good news
Speaker 1: for Arlington anyways, they haven't handed anything over yet. You know,
Speaker 1: some of the tax breakes related to hotel occupancy fees
Speaker 1: I would get sent Amazon's way, But a lot of
Speaker 1: them were just job related, Like once they started put
Speaker 1: butts and seats and they hit certain targets, you know,
Speaker 1: then they'd get tax breaks on on the payroll taxes there,
Speaker 1: so that that money hasn't started changing hands yet. That's
Speaker 1: the good news for Arlington is if Amazon says they're
Speaker 1: committed to it, they still think that they're getting a
Speaker 1: pretty good deal winning if Amazon does complete the campus
Speaker 1: as they've planned. Bloomberg's Matt Day reporting out of Seattle.
Speaker 1: Good stuff, Thank you so much. Let's branch out a
Speaker 1: little bit and talk about tech more broadly. Denny Fish,
Speaker 1: portfolio manager at Janie Henderson, managing four billion dollars across
Speaker 1: funds in the tech space, leading technology research. It's interesting, Denny.
Speaker 1: I won't put you on the spot when it comes
Speaker 1: to Amazon specifically. I know you hold that stock in
Speaker 1: your funds, But as an example, Amazon kind of hitting
Speaker 1: the brakes on the real estate side, having already worked
Speaker 1: on the layoff side. What is that telling you about
Speaker 1: about the technology set right now? The prudence that it's
Speaker 1: kind of going through, well, it's it's definitely different than
Speaker 1: it was twelve months ago in terms of the general
Speaker 1: philosophy for the background, both in terms of in Amazon's
Speaker 1: case specifically, it's a company that overhired during the pandemic,
Speaker 1: put a lot of capital to work and logistics and fulfillment.
Speaker 1: You know, we're just talking about, you know, the headquarters
Speaker 1: being put on pause. And the challenge for Amazon is twofold.
Speaker 1: You have this highly profitable growth business, Amazon Web Services
Speaker 1: that's starting to slow. But more importantly for them, they're
Speaker 1: really a physical business with a digital front end. And
Speaker 1: as a result, there's only one way to get out
Speaker 1: of that situation when you overinvest, and you either have
Speaker 1: to significantly reduce your footprint, which is really hard for
Speaker 1: them to do because of the nature of what fulfillment
Speaker 1: and logistics represents. So they have to grow out of it,
Speaker 1: and they have to get efficiencies on a unit profitability basis,
Speaker 1: and that's what the company is grinding through right now.
Speaker 1: And then when you exacerbate that with a tough economic environment,
Speaker 1: it just makes it that much harder and that much
Speaker 1: longer to recoup and start to actually drive some leverage
Speaker 1: out of those investments that they've made. The other story
Speaker 1: of the week has been earnings, and I think about
Speaker 1: names like Dell and then contrast that with Broad Common.
Speaker 1: We're getting kind of really make signals about demand from
Speaker 1: corporate America, global corporates and the consumer kind of what's
Speaker 1: your tea leaves read of this week and what we're
Speaker 1: seeing from tech. You know, I would say broadly the
Speaker 1: entire earning season if we wanted to unpack that, and
Speaker 1: this was just a continuation of that, and that is
Speaker 1: that if we look across sectors, you know, semiconductors are
Speaker 1: always the leading indicators for global economic growth or global
Speaker 1: economic slowdowns, and we've seen a material slowdown there, most
Speaker 1: companies lowering expectations pretty materially for the year. But nonetheless
Speaker 1: the stocks have actually been responding all right, which is
Speaker 1: really encouraging because semiconductors are the first ones to actually
Speaker 1: start to discount the upturn as well when they're incredible
Speaker 1: businesses with great industry structure, but nonetheless that's where we're at,
Speaker 1: and they're highly economically sensitive. And then you have kind
Speaker 1: of the secular growth stories and software and internet and
Speaker 1: other sectors where things are still growing, but they're just
Speaker 1: not growing nearly as fast as the economy starts to
Speaker 1: take hold as well as there was just so much
Speaker 1: capital that came into the space over you know, a
Speaker 1: five to seven year period, and the market's really starting
Speaker 1: to discern now within these names on the unit economics,
Speaker 1: and you know, companies that have really good, strong, durable
Speaker 1: competitive positions, really durable unit economics, and those are the
Speaker 1: companies that are likely to perform as we get to
Speaker 1: the other side of this, you know, economic situation that
Speaker 1: we're in right now and strong balance sheets. And I
Speaker 1: just want to bring this particular point that was really
Speaker 1: driven home by g Sam a little bit earlier. Just
Speaker 1: take you listen to any tech is getting grouped in
Speaker 1: with growth quote unquote if you will. But there's a
Speaker 1: lot of quality. There's good balance sheet, there's a lot
Speaker 1: of cash, there's the ability to still do m and
Speaker 1: a strong activities. And so again we're really focused on
Speaker 1: there are some strong, solid micro stories and it's less hey,
Speaker 1: let's buy the index. All people sort of throwing babies
Speaker 1: out with bath waters, to use that awful phrase, but
Speaker 1: ultimately people tying everything up. Some great big babies in there.
Speaker 1: You're throwing those out? Yeah? Or have we now discerned
Speaker 1: that Microsoft, which I think is your largest holding, some
Speaker 1: other companies are of a different beast and actually perhaps
Speaker 1: don't see them as growth stocks in the way they
Speaker 1: used to. Well, I think it's twofold. There are a
Speaker 1: couple of dynamics that are going on. If we just
Speaker 1: think about what I call the gigacaps. Okay, so kind
Speaker 1: of think about feng Ma. You know, broadly speaking, we
Speaker 1: have started to see a lot more discernment in terms
Speaker 1: of the multiples we've seen where you know, Google's traded
Speaker 1: much lower in terms of its you know, expected earnings multiple.
Speaker 1: Microsoft and Apple have continued to hold their multiples, I think,
Speaker 1: just given the confidence in those business models over the
Speaker 1: longer term, and all of these companies are getting a
Speaker 1: lot more competitive with each other. You know, if we
Speaker 1: just think about the idea of AI and what we've
Speaker 1: seen with open AI and chat GPT and the potential
Speaker 1: implications to Google search business. But that's all upside for Microsoft,
Speaker 1: and so the market's trying to figure out what this
Speaker 1: is going to mean over the longer term. And then, yeah,
Speaker 1: I would say twenty twenty two, we just kind of
Speaker 1: threw everything out, you know it with the bathwater, and
Speaker 1: then early this year we've had this risk on rally,
Speaker 1: not you know, the last week and a half or so,
Speaker 1: which has been a little choppier, but coming into this
Speaker 1: year now like it's it's one of those classic early
Speaker 1: cycle potential rallies. I don't know if it's a bear
Speaker 1: market rally. I don't know if it's an early cycle rally,
Speaker 1: but it feels more like an early cycle rally because
Speaker 1: everything then rises and then what usually happens is you
Speaker 1: get six or nine months down the road. It's the
Speaker 1: companies that have the real financial performance that really start
Speaker 1: shining through, and that's where you start to generate your
Speaker 1: returns over a multi year basis. And tech Okay, you
Speaker 1: mentioned Chat Pizza, and one of the key megacaps that
Speaker 1: has outperformed so far this year is in Nvidia. I
Speaker 1: know it's holding of uls. All you making bets now
Speaker 1: on who is best place in the artificial intelligence race
Speaker 1: right now? Yeah, we are. You know, obviously, as you mentioned,
Speaker 1: Invidia's an obvious one for the moment because the fact
Speaker 1: of the matter is you can't deploy GPT without a
Speaker 1: ton of GPUs, right, I mean, it's just like that's
Speaker 1: that's what it is. And now is that going to persist?
Speaker 1: You know, there's still the opportunity for companies to develop
Speaker 1: application specific processors that might be more efficient for certain
Speaker 1: types of models. So that's a risk. One of the
Speaker 1: most amazing parts of Nvidia's growth story over many years
Speaker 1: has been Kuda. It's software platform for developers that makes
Speaker 1: it easier to program against GPUs and sort of has
Speaker 1: allowed it to win the race. Is that going to
Speaker 1: be a competitive advantage in a world of generative AI
Speaker 1: and large, large language models. We're not quite sure on that,
Speaker 1: but for now there's probably no cleaner play than than
Speaker 1: in video. But as you start thinking across the ecosystem,
Speaker 1: you know, it's interesting. We just mentioned Microsoft for example.
Speaker 1: Anything they do with being is all upside, you know,
Speaker 1: And could they can potentially displace Google as the default
Speaker 1: on iOS? Could they What do you think they potentially could?
Speaker 1: It's clearly in their ambition and all things equal, Um,
Speaker 1: if you're Apple, you just want to provide a consistent
Speaker 1: user experience and you want to extract as much economic
Speaker 1: value as you can GPT GPU. I'll hit you in
Speaker 1: another acronym that Karen and I have been hearing every day. Fomo.
Speaker 1: That was comes you by me is what we're seeing
Speaker 1: in the market broadly. Fomo. You know, C three AI
Speaker 1: is a name another third percent today based on fundamentals,
Speaker 1: I think I think not, No, it's not and and
Speaker 1: so fomo is driving you know, so when I talked
Speaker 1: about that classic so we have two things. We've kind
Speaker 1: of had that classic early cycle behavior in terms of
Speaker 1: the market, and then we also have you know, the
Speaker 1: thematic artificial intelligent. It's kind of you know, investing environment
Speaker 1: and institution and retail investors get behind and it's easy
Speaker 1: to kind of throw some capital at some names like that.
Speaker 1: But and so the reality is like that is a
Speaker 1: lot of FOMO, right because the fundamentals haven't changed that much.
Speaker 1: There aren't a lot of pure ways to actually play
Speaker 1: artificial intelligence, and it's really going to be more of
Speaker 1: what can actually enhance the value of an existing business um,
Speaker 1: you know, where companies are well positioned on the infrastructure
Speaker 1: side to you know benefit from you know, the massive
Speaker 1: buildouts that we're going to actually have to see to
Speaker 1: support this. And and but we're also going to see
Speaker 1: a ton we always see this, a ton of speculation
Speaker 1: around the edges and sort of maybe some of the
Speaker 1: less proven. But you know, a company that has AI
Speaker 1: and it's you know, yeah, exactly, well let's go from
Speaker 1: AI to VR because ED was helping break great scoops
Speaker 1: on Meta today and ultimately this company is having to
Speaker 1: cut prices of its pretty expensive virtual reality headsets. That
Speaker 1: still there's a lot of hope, a lot of hype,
Speaker 1: perhaps not in the purchasing that many had anticipated, but
Speaker 1: you've been adding to your meta position. What was another
Speaker 1: back of that, Yeah, so it's it's it's interesting. It's
Speaker 1: not because of ARVR, to be clear. Yeah, yeah, it's
Speaker 1: not the metaver you know. The metaverse is like, it's
Speaker 1: this thing we've been talking about for many, many years,
Speaker 1: and it's going to evolve more slowly, right because you're
Speaker 1: gonna have a bunch of different metaverses, consumer, enterprise, different
Speaker 1: use cases. What's interesting about meta one is the stock
Speaker 1: got too darn cheap. Okay, the expectation was, you know,
Speaker 1: they had to do something to repair their stock price
Speaker 1: and get aggressive with their cost structure, and they did
Speaker 1: so that was part of the thesis. But there's another
Speaker 1: part of the thesis too, and that is about eighteen
Speaker 1: months ago, Apple effectively exercised its market power and you
Speaker 1: had two things you hadda yeah, yeah, yeah exactly, or
Speaker 1: reduced ad tracking right with IDFA and ATT and oh
Speaker 1: they're they're two more and that really hurt meta. It
Speaker 1: really inhibited their ability to drive return on AD spend
Speaker 1: because they lost the ability to retarget and measure consumers
Speaker 1: across the broader Internet. Now what's interesting is they are
Speaker 1: one of the largest buyers of GPUs right now on
Speaker 1: the planet. They're rear connecting their data centers and the
Speaker 1: reason they're doing it is they're all in on AI
Speaker 1: to drive better AD measurement. To the extent they're able
Speaker 1: to do that, they might actually widen their competitive advantage
Speaker 1: over time. And it's kind of like a maybe not
Speaker 1: quite as obvious way to think about a company that
Speaker 1: could benefit from AI, given how bad it's been hurt
Speaker 1: by Apples so far. Love that thesis. Come back, Denny.
Speaker 1: It's been a joy to actually here's that next to
Speaker 1: you up San Francisco. But hope you come back into
Speaker 1: the office. We thank you for making a special trip
Speaker 1: to Sidney. Jannis Henderson, portfolio manager, Denny Quish coming up
Speaker 1: another key Apple executive, just talking about that company. When
Speaker 1: they're leaving the company, will discuss why this has Bloomberg,
Speaker 1: the executive in charge of Apple's I Cloud, I message
Speaker 1: and FaceTime infrastructure, is leaving the company, according to sources,
Speaker 1: after five years in the role. Michael Abbott is stepping
Speaker 1: down as the company's cloud chief next month. It adds
Speaker 1: to the revolving door of executives at the company. Bloomberg
Speaker 1: Senior technology editor Nigg Turner is here with us the
Speaker 1: revolving door. I think that's part of the story, isn't it. Yes.
Speaker 1: I mean, you know, it's not necessarily uncommon around the
Speaker 1: end of the year for certain number of Apple executives
Speaker 1: to leave. It feels like more than normal this year,
Speaker 1: especially between now and like the sort of the last
Speaker 1: few months of the year, you've had a lot of
Speaker 1: sort of VP level people in charge of everything from
Speaker 1: kind of industrial design, the chief privacy officer to the
Speaker 1: head of the website, you know, depart resart. So April
Speaker 1: is the time that he's going to be particularly leaving.
Speaker 1: Michael about nuts in large part because of when it
Speaker 1: shares best right. I'm interested though, on whether they're filling
Speaker 1: these roles that swichly in some cases, and in this case,
Speaker 1: they are having someone take over his duties, which is
Speaker 1: Jeff Robin, who's the guy who invented iTunes. So that's
Speaker 1: not a bad flax claim nice, you know. So in
Speaker 1: some other cases they're basically divvying up duties and giving
Speaker 1: them other people. There's not really going to be a
Speaker 1: chief privacy officer the way there was before, for instance,
Speaker 1: the industrial design person. They essentially giving those duties to
Speaker 1: different people, which is pretty big deal because that used
Speaker 1: to be Johnny I and right, you know the heart
Speaker 1: of Apple more real quick, We've only got about thirty seconds.
Speaker 1: But the serious thing is that services is important, right, well,
Speaker 1: so everything cloud related. That's been huge for them. I
Speaker 1: think there's been a bit attention over the years in
Speaker 1: terms of how much they rely on like Amazon and
Speaker 1: Google to do cloud versus doing it themselves. And so
Speaker 1: maybe that's something the new person will have to sort
Speaker 1: of sort out too, but they do basically a mix
Speaker 1: at the moment. Nick, fascinating, great story coming from Mark
Speaker 1: German and Nick turn a key team pays. We thank
Speaker 1: you so much for coming on explaining it all time.
Speaker 1: Now for talking tech, let's start with AI artificial intelligence
Speaker 1: startup Inflection AI seeking to raise as much as six
Speaker 1: hundred and seventy five million dollars that according to the
Speaker 1: Financial Times, citing sources. That's the company Carrow, founded by
Speaker 1: Mustapha Sulliman, one of Deep Minds founders, as well as
Speaker 1: LinkedIn creator Reid Hoffman, speaking of which Reid Hoffman has
Speaker 1: announced he'll step back from the Open Ai board and
Speaker 1: citing greater transparency because Graylock his firm is increasingly investing
Speaker 1: in companies using open ais APIs, Hoffman says this cou
Speaker 1: cause a conflict of interest. He's been a personal investor
Speaker 1: through his charities and on the board of open Ai
Speaker 1: since twenty fifteen. And finally, don't miss this one, Gwyneth
Speaker 1: Paltrow Kinship Ventures raising seventy five million dollars for its
Speaker 1: debut fund Axios reporting without citing where it got the information,
Speaker 1: act says the firm is looking to invest in early
Speaker 1: stage consumer goods and technology companies. Very on brand for
Speaker 1: one gwyn Poutrow Caroline, and interesting that she's doing it
Speaker 1: in line with Mujera we understand as well. Now MOS
Speaker 1: was coming from Beauty Khan and really focusing on the
Speaker 1: beauty side of investment, but also luckily having interacted a
Speaker 1: plenty with Mos in the previous times through women's networks,
Speaker 1: I know how focus she is on ensuring that women
Speaker 1: that diverse leadership and indeed people get a seat at
Speaker 1: the cap Table are able to invest in fast growing companies.
Speaker 1: So this is an interesting area that of course herself,
Speaker 1: Gwyneth paltrowa business lady Goop no Lesque getting into and
Speaker 1: also she moved on from acting to be an entrepreneur.
Speaker 1: And I think the idea is very much like, I've
Speaker 1: got some money to play with here to support entrepreneurs
Speaker 1: that I see myself. I'm, you know, Avench capitalists finding
Speaker 1: like minded people, similarly experienced people. Speaking of Avench capital
Speaker 1: I think we've got to go back to read Hoffman.
Speaker 1: This is really interesting. The basics are we are investing
Speaker 1: in all sorts of AI related startups. Those AI related
Speaker 1: startups are using GPT three point five. I can't be
Speaker 1: on the board anymore. That is a big piece of
Speaker 1: industry news, given everything that's happened so far this year. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I really think that we've been interviewing the likes of Neiva,
Speaker 1: for example, which in some ways as a competitor to
Speaker 1: the likes of open Ai by not only having a
Speaker 1: search engine that's built around these sort of large language models,
Speaker 1: but also being able to cite where the information is
Speaker 1: coming from. We've interviewed that CEO before and that's our
Speaker 1: relationships were certainly see such a screen looks. So I
Speaker 1: think this is an interesting area that there's gonna be
Speaker 1: a lot of investment being thrown into the AI space,
Speaker 1: and some will be competitors and some will be able
Speaker 1: to grow in tandem. Well very quick. We had some
Speaker 1: Motmedi his colleague on the show just a couple of
Speaker 1: weeks ago, right, and he makes the point I'm looking
Speaker 1: at enterprise companies how they can take existing tools because
Speaker 1: AI will improve every single company I think, is what
Speaker 1: he said. So this makes sense based on the activity
Speaker 1: that we're seeing out there. Welcome back to being my technology.
Speaker 1: I'm Parranghi and I made lovelow, both of us in
Speaker 1: San Francisco for the final time this week. I'm sad
Speaker 1: to say. Now, let's get to crypto markets. They're struggling
Speaker 1: to power through the implosion of silver Gate Capital, the
Speaker 1: bank one of the main banking providers for the crypto industry,
Speaker 1: which is why we're seeing sentiment drop in other crypto
Speaker 1: related assets, Bitcoin hitting a two week low. For more,
Speaker 1: Let's bring in Bloomberg's Uchi Yanguchi. So many headlines on
Speaker 1: the Bloomberg this Friday. What is the latest with silver Gate.
Speaker 1: So we're really is still seeing the ripple effect from
Speaker 1: the collapse of FTX last November. As we know, FTX
Speaker 1: is a major client of Surrogate, and the Surrogate as
Speaker 1: a results suffered from a bank round last year. But
Speaker 1: then this week the bank said that they couldn't really
Speaker 1: file their annual filings on time. They said that this
Speaker 1: disclosed more losses for selling securities, and then they said
Speaker 1: they're evaluating if they can stay aflawed internally, and they
Speaker 1: also indicated risk of being investigated by the Department of Justice.
Speaker 1: So all of these really prompted exodus of all the
Speaker 1: keyp hunters of users on the silver Gate platform, which
Speaker 1: is one of the few and key payments platform for
Speaker 1: crypto companies to transfer US dollar between each other in
Speaker 1: real time. Quin mascalicxy Digital, Paxos Trust, all of these
Speaker 1: saying look card ties with silver Gate are being put
Speaker 1: on hold for the time being. Where then do we
Speaker 1: go for these sorts of ability to transfer, to be
Speaker 1: able to ensure that the pipes are still working, the
Speaker 1: infrastructure still there. That is the question that the industry
Speaker 1: players are trying to figure out. Another bank that's in
Speaker 1: this space is signature bank, but they already announced that
Speaker 1: they're actually planning to reduce the deposits from crypto companies
Speaker 1: and and so that's so there's not many options right
Speaker 1: now for crypto players to find a bank that's willing
Speaker 1: to take them out on and replace the role of surrogate.
Speaker 1: You tee more of a PSA for our audience, But
Speaker 1: some of the ratings agencies catching out ratings cut by
Speaker 1: Moodies at silver Gate not so sure, that's a surprise.
Speaker 1: Where do we go from here? You know, Caroline and
Speaker 1: I were talking actually earlier on a Twitter spaces about
Speaker 1: how we were talking at the end of last year
Speaker 1: the beginning of this year that Silvergate was in trouble.
Speaker 1: Why do they keep falling further and further. So we're
Speaker 1: seeing regulatory pressure from the DC as we know that
Speaker 1: after the bankruptcy of FTX, federal banking regulators all came
Speaker 1: out with warnings talking about the risk of serving cryptal
Speaker 1: companies for banks, and they're really trying to make sure
Speaker 1: that any contagious risk from the industry will not leak
Speaker 1: into the real world economy. So Silvergate is one part
Speaker 1: of that. We're seeing that the bank is now trying
Speaker 1: to figure out a solution about their pass going forward.
Speaker 1: Deposits from cryptal companies were the majority of their depositor base,
Speaker 1: and they're really unique in the sense that they're getting
Speaker 1: hit pretty hard because their depositors are fleeing the bank. Essentially,
Speaker 1: the problem a problems of centralized finance within the world
Speaker 1: of decentralized finance. Chang, we thank you so much in
Speaker 1: New York staying late. We appreciate it. Go have a
Speaker 1: wonderful weekend. Let'sting more into this though. We've got a
Speaker 1: perfect voice, Anastasia Bez, CEO of Cadaana. It's a scalable
Speaker 1: proof of work blockchain that actually spun off from JP
Speaker 1: Morgan's private project and associate infrastructures that your heart basically
Speaker 1: in terms of some of what you're trying to build
Speaker 1: a Cadana and support within the ecosystem. But just first
Speaker 1: and foremost take us to the interplay of centralized finance
Speaker 1: and traditional finance trying to interweave itself with decentralized finance.
Speaker 1: How much are people worried about some of the contagion
Speaker 1: risks within Signature bank can Indeed, I'm not Signature apologies,
Speaker 1: but Slivegate and what it ultimately means for the growth
Speaker 1: in the ecosystem. I thanks. I think that one of
Speaker 1: the big things is that we still have to interact
Speaker 1: with centralized thinking, especially you know, companies that are based
Speaker 1: in the US. So if you want to have these
Speaker 1: US companies, we need to have access to bank accounts
Speaker 1: and be able to do pay roll and healthcare and
Speaker 1: things like that. So it's it's one of those realities
Speaker 1: that in a decentralized world, we still have to be
Speaker 1: able to play and integrate with you know, banks. So
Speaker 1: I don't know quite where it's going, but it needs
Speaker 1: to be something that happens, otherwise we're not going to
Speaker 1: be able to have companies in the way that functions.
Speaker 1: As a case in point Anastasia, know we are talking
Speaker 1: about silver Gate, a lender, almost traditional lender, but lending
Speaker 1: to the crypto industry. As someone participating in that space.
Speaker 1: This is what we asked our audience. Okay, whether this
Speaker 1: is kind of it, the worst has happened, or if
Speaker 1: there's more to come, how do you go about running
Speaker 1: a business as COO? We asked, is the contagion spillover
Speaker 1: contained seventy percent of respondents said, no, are you kind
Speaker 1: of worried about the health of this industry right now?
Speaker 1: It's so hard to tell because I think that there
Speaker 1: keeps being moments where people say this is it, and
Speaker 1: then there's something new that comes out. So I think
Speaker 1: that there's sort of been a continuing ripple effect. But
Speaker 1: I think also, I mean, I'm at e Fenver right now,
Speaker 1: and there's a lot of optimism about the technology and
Speaker 1: what people are building and sort of tech infrastructure, and
Speaker 1: I'm seeing a lot of you know, collaboration and cooperation
Speaker 1: between you know, interchain projects where people are seeing the
Speaker 1: strength of one project and how that can work with another.
Speaker 1: And so as much as there's sort of these these
Speaker 1: very real concerns, I also think that people are still
Speaker 1: innovating and building things that are pretty exciting. But you know,
Speaker 1: I mean, we want to do it, Relly. We want
Speaker 1: to build things that are resilient, and that means being
Speaker 1: resilient in the business world, not just in the tech world. Okay,
Speaker 1: so Anna Saysia, let's talk about what you're building. It's
Speaker 1: you know, a proof of work blockchain some would say
Speaker 1: equivalent to a bitcoin, but it's scalable as fast as
Speaker 1: the idea In particular, what are you hoping that Cadena
Speaker 1: can solve within the infrastructure needs. So one of the
Speaker 1: things is we are fast but also secure because we
Speaker 1: have a structure that has braided chain so that it
Speaker 1: refers to other parts of the chain. But really what
Speaker 1: we're trying to offer is for businesses to be able
Speaker 1: to build on top of us and be able to
Speaker 1: take that security and also the scalability without having to
Speaker 1: worry about, you know, as many of the security risks.
Speaker 1: And you know, we also have a smart contract language,
Speaker 1: so that's the programming language that people write different blockchain
Speaker 1: applications in called packed, and that has a lot of
Speaker 1: safety features to it. So that's something that we see
Speaker 1: being more accessible and easier for people to use as
Speaker 1: developers because of the way that it's structured, which hopefully
Speaker 1: means that people can build more viable businesses because you'll
Speaker 1: be able to it's human readable, so I can read
Speaker 1: one of the contracts and see what it says. You know,
Speaker 1: as a non engineer, that's really valuable to be able
Speaker 1: to understand what's happening, even though you know you want
Speaker 1: to get to a world where you don't have to
Speaker 1: look under the hood and you can trust with that,
Speaker 1: well said, I mean Cadena, as I sort of said
Speaker 1: at the beginning, was spun out of a private blockchain
Speaker 1: project being built within JP Morgan. The founders helping exercise
Speaker 1: really that first blockchain at JP Morgan. And therefore, I
Speaker 1: ask you, what is traditional companies appetite to continue to
Speaker 1: invest or to adopt within overall crypto space, whether it
Speaker 1: be building their own private blockchain so that be trying
Speaker 1: to harness the power of the technology. Were at the
Speaker 1: same side, they've got this worry about ultimately how much
Speaker 1: bad press the ecosystem gets. I think that companies are
Speaker 1: trying to balance that where there is some real innovation
Speaker 1: or people have this appetite for new things that might
Speaker 1: solve problems, but that they are trying to balance that
Speaker 1: with you know, being a little bit more conservative at
Speaker 1: large companies, and that's you know, it's a balance that
Speaker 1: they have to strike. But there is still interests. There's
Speaker 1: definitely still companies that are doing partnerships and you know,
Speaker 1: finding different ways to build in the space, you know,
Speaker 1: in ways that I think very real, whether that's you know,
Speaker 1: it's just a variety of different things. But I think
Speaker 1: that some of it where it's going to go is
Speaker 1: not partnerships that you understand like that are visible, but
Speaker 1: just under the hood, there's a blockchain technology doing something.
Speaker 1: I want to dig into blockchain technology. I know this
Speaker 1: is an area you care deeply about in tech literacy.
Speaker 1: So Caroline and I have been talking a lot about
Speaker 1: artificial intelligence. We've been experimenting with it, using it. You
Speaker 1: see everyone having a go, and I feel like with
Speaker 1: the crypto hysteria, hype, whatever you want to call it
Speaker 1: of the last two years, a lot of people miss
Speaker 1: the basics. Would you say that that's fair. I think
Speaker 1: that there's a huge need for education and a huge
Speaker 1: opportunity for education still in the crypto space, where there's
Speaker 1: a lot to learn and right now. I mean, I
Speaker 1: use this example, but I've talked to my mom about
Speaker 1: how she wants to do things in crypto and it
Speaker 1: just becomes this huge bureaucratic onboarding experience. And so I
Speaker 1: definitely agree that more education should happen, and it is happening.
Speaker 1: But I also I see more and more people understanding
Speaker 1: some of these things around, for example, self custody and
Speaker 1: what that means, whether you have children's on in exchange
Speaker 1: or you have custody of them yourself. I mean, that's
Speaker 1: like a really important education point. His two moms wanting
Speaker 1: to get into crypto and Astasia thanks so much, Anastasias
Speaker 1: of Cadena, Thank you so much for your time. Keep
Speaker 1: enjoying if Denver. Meanwhile, let's turn to the VC world
Speaker 1: now and some of that hype around AI. I caught
Speaker 1: up with Aldelue Dennis, general partner of an Initialized Capital,
Speaker 1: and Avanta Acatit COO of a Frame Brands as part
Speaker 1: of Bloomberg's International Women's Day event. I asked them how
Speaker 1: they cut through some of the noise, the hype, some
Speaker 1: of the warriors as well. Take a listen. I think
Speaker 1: if the answer is to actually have more diversity on
Speaker 1: your investing team, because there's a certain attraction that some
Speaker 1: people who are more interested in certain sectors, more interested
Speaker 1: in the heart any object will be attracted Tom. And meanwhile,
Speaker 1: they may ignore a very large sector such as family
Speaker 1: tech for example. Yes, that is a huge market that
Speaker 1: impacts you know, uh, you know, billions and billions of lives.
Speaker 1: That has as much potential and so for me personally,
Speaker 1: spending time on an industry like crypto or CHATSBT, there's
Speaker 1: plenty or AI. I mean, there's plenty of investors who
Speaker 1: are going to follow that, and I think the value
Speaker 1: is had in finding large markets that are underserved. Yeah,
Speaker 1: which I think also Starry is also going back to
Speaker 1: even like the old tech adages of problem solution, like
Speaker 1: we need to actually solve problems for people as opposed
Speaker 1: to like as opposed to kind of getting caught up
Speaker 1: in the hype. What about some of the ethics around that? Yes, hum,
Speaker 1: when it comes to bias and how are you thinking, Oh,
Speaker 1: I'm frightened. Yes, because AI is only as good as
Speaker 1: what you put into it, and it's humans have bias
Speaker 1: and so they bias is going to be rolled into it.
Speaker 1: And actually often when I talk about bias, when in
Speaker 1: building structures and orgs, I think biases like gravity, it's
Speaker 1: something that you can you can't see, It's like it
Speaker 1: just exists, and you have to figure out how if
Speaker 1: you want to be able to fly, you want to
Speaker 1: defy gravity, you need to build a whole bunch of things.
Speaker 1: You need to build a plane that is intentional towards
Speaker 1: being able to do that. And so if you want
Speaker 1: to be able to try and remove bias from things.
Speaker 1: You have to build a whole bunch of stuff and
Speaker 1: be intentional on drawing that out. And I think especially
Speaker 1: as hype is building, people are not being as not
Speaker 1: slowing down just to be as intentional about it, which
Speaker 1: is worrisome. Also, lujenis general partner Initialized Capital and Avanta
Speaker 1: Ratgi their COO of a famous brams and ed the
Speaker 1: reason Avanta's point of view is so important when it
Speaker 1: comes to bias when it comes to building new businesses
Speaker 1: is she is a proud trans woman of color and
Speaker 1: she was very happy to go there to this vulnerable
Speaker 1: space with us of what it was like being a
Speaker 1: man in the room to them being a woman in
Speaker 1: the room when trying to discuss the building of businesses.
Speaker 1: She now is all about trying to create new brands
Speaker 1: that serve a diverse population to have that bias stripped
Speaker 1: out from the very beginning. If anyone is going to
Speaker 1: be attuned to what AI She's also helps build virtual worlds,
Speaker 1: for example, in the world of fashion, she's going to
Speaker 1: be attuned to what's some of the ethics that we
Speaker 1: need in place ahead of it. What I took from
Speaker 1: that is why the Bloomberg New Voices initiatives. So important
Speaker 1: is to bring the people that are actually having the
Speaker 1: conversation into the room together. But two really core tenets
Speaker 1: of venture capital and founders. What is a problem that
Speaker 1: we're trying to solve and what's the technological solution? And
Speaker 1: then how do you build a company? And they just
Speaker 1: cut through the noise as you said, Ai Crypto. No,
Speaker 1: actually it's a problem solution, make a company to solve it.
Speaker 1: I think that's terrific. And Alses I mean, background is phenomenal,
Speaker 1: having been GC over at the Founders found but then
Speaker 1: has gone on to work on She's written personal checks
Speaker 1: to space sex. She has had real success in some
Speaker 1: of the companies which is built and invested in within
Speaker 1: We've got to remember initialized eighty percent led by women.
Speaker 1: The New Voices scheme so loud and proud about it
Speaker 1: here at Bloomberg. If you want to get media trained,
Speaker 1: come in and understand a little bit more right And
Speaker 1: if you know someone out there in the industry, come
Speaker 1: to us, tell us about them and then we will
Speaker 1: talk to them. Now coming up a new TikTok trend
Speaker 1: about the rising costs of dating, racking up millions of views.
Speaker 1: That's next. This is Bloomberg. Democratic Representative Rocana has represented
Speaker 1: Silicon Valley since twenty seventeen. Now he's working to look
Speaker 1: broaden the US technology focus of San Francisco. Kanna was
Speaker 1: a key player in the passage of the Chipsack to
Speaker 1: jump start semiconductor production in the ninety teenth States. Now
Speaker 1: he has a two trillion dollar pitch tree vitalize US
Speaker 1: manufacturing in what he calls economic patriotism. Is how he's
Speaker 1: framing it, a new economic patriotism. It simply means that
Speaker 1: the private sector can work with universities, community colleges, labor,
Speaker 1: the government to have a common purpose of investing in
Speaker 1: America's production capability. What I think we need to do
Speaker 1: is look at regions that have been decimated, be investrialized,
Speaker 1: say what are their assets? How can we have a
Speaker 1: moon shot there? How can we have place based policy
Speaker 1: for economic revitalization. What some of your proudest accomplishments so far?
Speaker 1: It was early the chips in Shigne Tech that I
Speaker 1: helped draft, led to two Intel factories coming to Ohio,
Speaker 1: led to microd being in Upstate New York with almost
Speaker 1: one hundred billion dollar investment. I believe for us to
Speaker 1: have the next generation of manufacturing, we need new technology,
Speaker 1: We need immigrants, we need a educated workforce, we need
Speaker 1: the skill trades and vocational education, and we need government financing.
Speaker 1: And this can be a common national purpose, the economic
Speaker 1: revitalization of the country. I've said we need a chip
Speaker 1: SAT every year for many different industries. This can't be
Speaker 1: a one off. Now, both parties recognize that the gutting
Speaker 1: of factory towns was a huge mistake. The offshoring of
Speaker 1: production was a huge mistake. The economic disparity is polarizing America.
Speaker 1: I've called for a two trillion dollar investment over ten years.
Speaker 1: The chip sacked was about fifty billion. We need to
Speaker 1: have the same urgency, the same scale to build this
Speaker 1: production base. It is a difficult argument to convince people
Speaker 1: on this spending. I have not gotten people to buy
Speaker 1: into the two trillion dollar investment. I did the bill
Speaker 1: with Marco Rubio. He's good with twenty billion investment, which
Speaker 1: is a start, but I will continue to make it
Speaker 1: that we have to go big and bold on this
Speaker 1: great report coming from our colleague Kalas Shader, and it
Speaker 1: is notable that we're trying to see this focus in California.
Speaker 1: Of yes, technology has been the heartbeat center, particularly from
Speaker 1: a revenue perspective of anything about taxes. But they have
Speaker 1: to diversify. And you think about California, I also think
Speaker 1: of the ports. I also think of infrastructure. I also
Speaker 1: think of rebuilding, and I think of a global supply chain.
Speaker 1: There's up in arms. It's a really good point. How
Speaker 1: much time have I spent down at the Port of
Speaker 1: Los Angeles in the last two years. But you know
Speaker 1: when I talked to founders and I talked to vcs whatever,
Speaker 1: that they kind of want to protect the brain trust
Speaker 1: coming out of the universities here. There's also a societal
Speaker 1: discussion around living in San Francisco, the Bay Area, how
Speaker 1: difficult it can be. But the conclusion they will come
Speaker 1: to is we need to invest a bit more money.
Speaker 1: Money talks, doesn't it all right? Let's pivot to a
Speaker 1: new trend gaining traction. Guess where TikTok dating spreeze. It's
Speaker 1: beginning to make sense why dating apps are testing those
Speaker 1: premium subscriptions, some of them upwards of five hundred dollars
Speaker 1: per month. TikTokers are racking up millions of views, breaking
Speaker 1: down the high cost of dating. Some went on twenty
Speaker 1: eight dates in twenty eight days to show how inflation
Speaker 1: has impacted their love life. Yes, I did say that.
Speaker 1: One event went on twenty eight bind date dates to
Speaker 1: raise money for charity. Now Here to explain Bloomberg's misser
Speaker 1: Lena A Kufapulu, missy, what is this all about? Well ed?
Speaker 1: If you're looking at for examples about how TikTok is
Speaker 1: changing the quests for love, we have one for you.
Speaker 1: You mentioned it. One thirty one year old girl in
Speaker 1: New York City decided in the month of February to
Speaker 1: go on twenty eight dates in twenty eight days, and
Speaker 1: of course, naturally she chronicled all of those days on
Speaker 1: her social media platforms. She gained thousands of followers in
Speaker 1: the process, and all of them as she was doing that.
Speaker 1: She told it in an interview at Bloomberg that they
Speaker 1: were asking the same question how much is this costing you?
Speaker 1: And who is doing the pain? Which I think is
Speaker 1: a key question for a lot of people looking for
Speaker 1: love right now. In most cases, was it shed, did
Speaker 1: they break it down, did they joint me pay? What
Speaker 1: was the up? And they come out out of all
Speaker 1: of this well, Caroline, I think the answer to that
Speaker 1: is it depends on who you ask. It's definitely a
Speaker 1: question that a lot of people are passionate about different cultures,
Speaker 1: and different people have different opinions about it. So we
Speaker 1: spoke to one etiquette expert who basically said the weight
Speaker 1: of the cost should fall on whoever is doing the asking,
Speaker 1: And so if you're not able to afford a day
Speaker 1: you're asking someone out on, then maybe think of other alternative,
Speaker 1: cheaper dates that you can go to, because they really
Speaker 1: can wrap up in the hundreds of dollars per the
Speaker 1: TikTok's that we saw this one year thirty one year
Speaker 1: old post on her profile. And so really, if you're
Speaker 1: asking someone out and Caroline, make sure you're the one pay.
Speaker 1: And when they're doing the TikTok aft, is they using
Speaker 1: the bold glamor filter that therefore makes you look nothing
Speaker 1: like you actually do in real life too, So that's
Speaker 1: the key question for all of it. Bloomberg's Israeliane Egokofa,
Speaker 1: who thank you so much for joining us now Netflix.
Speaker 1: It's going viral on several fronts. Let's start with one
Speaker 1: of the Murdock murders in case you missed it, This week,
Speaker 1: a jury convicted Alec Murdock, a prominent South Carolina lawyer,
Speaker 1: of murdering his wife and son back in June twenty
Speaker 1: twenty one, as he was sentenced to life in prison.
Speaker 1: Now here's the other kind of unnursing part about all
Speaker 1: of this. Murdoch was convicted just days after a doctor
Speaker 1: series on the matter was released on Murdflix. And this
Speaker 1: is where sort of art starts to reflect what's happening
Speaker 1: in the here and the now. Yes, from a long
Speaker 1: time we've wondered when streaming companies will sort of getting
Speaker 1: into news or real time events, and it is they are,
Speaker 1: but it's also kind of not new. And my mind
Speaker 1: goes to Tiger King and bear with me, but remember
Speaker 1: the sort of media hype around it, and then the question,
Speaker 1: So that that Doctor series raised about some of the characters.
Speaker 1: Tiger King was a massive one for Netflix. You see
Speaker 1: it there on the screen and it induced follow ones,
Speaker 1: and that's not it. They're also thinking about a really
Speaker 1: old school, old fashioned concept live television and also timing
Speaker 1: of releases. For example, we're going to get Chris Rock.
Speaker 1: He's going to be coming with his stand up comedy
Speaker 1: routine to Netflix exactly the week before the Academy Awards
Speaker 1: the Oscars, which of course was so famed for the slap,
Speaker 1: and they're doing it live. Who would have thought it? Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's what March fourth that it's coming? Yeah, a week
Speaker 1: the Oscars next week. Meanwhile, that doesn't for this edition
Speaker 1: of Bloombog Technology, don't forget a lot to recap incredible
Speaker 1: week the two of us together. Check out the podcast Apple, Spotify, iHeart,
Speaker 1: wherever you get your podcast