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Speaker 1: Did the US government just guarantee to keep bitcoin legal? Well,

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Speaker 1: one of the main things I hear from people that

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Speaker 1: don't believe in bitcoin is that the government's just going

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Speaker 1: to make it illegal. But things that just happen might

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Speaker 1: actually tell you the opposites, which is why I am

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Speaker 1: about to have on Dennis Porter. Dennis Porter is the

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Speaker 1: co founder and chairman of Satoshi Action Fund. It's a

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Speaker 1: nonprofit educational organization dedicated to informing policy makers and regulators

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Speaker 1: in DC and around the country about bitcoin, about bitcoin mining,

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Speaker 1: the benefits, how it can be used as a tool

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Speaker 1: to support other public policy goals, and so much more.

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Speaker 1: If you want to know what's going on with politics

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Speaker 1: and what bills just got passed and potentially President Biden

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Speaker 1: might try to veto overturn, then you want to hear

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Speaker 1: this conversation. This is going to be an enlightening conversation

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Speaker 1: with someone who is in the trenches working with policy

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Speaker 1: makers lawmakers every day. Let's go ahead, just jump right

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Speaker 1: into the interview with Dennis Porter. All Right, Dennis Porter

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Speaker 1: the CEO and co founder of the Satoshi Action Fund,

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Speaker 1: President and founder of Satoshi Action Education for Bitcoin advocacy.

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Speaker 1: Dennis is regularly testifying in support of bitcoin and digital

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Speaker 1: asset policy, developing.

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Speaker 2: Really key, innovative.

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Speaker 1: First of its kind of policy across the United States,

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Speaker 1: advancing bitcoin, bitcoin mining, and the right to own digital assets.

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Speaker 2: Dennis, thanks so much for joining me today.

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Speaker 3: Market's an honored to be back on the show with

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Speaker 3: you and excited to chat about all things bitcoin and

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Speaker 3: digital assets.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Man, it's been a while and there has been a

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Speaker 1: lot of stuff going on, so I'm super excited to

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Speaker 1: catch up.

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Speaker 2: But the first question, let's just dive right into this. Dennis.

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Speaker 1: You know, one of the biggest things that I've heard

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Speaker 1: for the last whatever it is now seven eight years

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Speaker 1: I've been talking about bitcoin is like almost like the

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Speaker 1: single biggest thing is like the government's gonna make it illegal.

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Speaker 1: And so the first question I want to ask is

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Speaker 1: did it just become legalized?

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Speaker 3: I mean, that's probably a very good way to categorize

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Speaker 3: what is taking place in Washington, DC. Even myself, I'm

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Speaker 3: a little surprised by the amount of momentum that is

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Speaker 3: picked up here for what we should call rightfully called

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Speaker 3: digital asset policy in the United States. Although I care

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Speaker 3: predominantly about bitcoin, it is good to see digital asset

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Speaker 3: policy that will lift all boats. You know, rising tide

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Speaker 3: lifts all boats in a space. We're very fortunate to

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Speaker 3: see the progress we have now. That being said, right like,

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Speaker 3: we still have a lot of a lot of room

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Speaker 3: to go, so to speak, with regards to passing this

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Speaker 3: legislation into law. I mean, there's some major hurdles that

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Speaker 3: we got to overcome. I'm sure we can get into it.

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Speaker 3: But it's a very exciting time in the world of

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Speaker 3: bitcoin and digital asset policy, and I'm looking forward to

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Speaker 3: seeing the United States create these necessary regulatory guidelines we

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Speaker 3: need in order to really benefit from this technology.

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Speaker 1: You said a lot there that I'm ready to unpack into.

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Speaker 1: So first of all, do we need these regulations to

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Speaker 1: give us clear guidelines. We're going to come back to that.

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Speaker 2: But let's stop. Let's just stop or start with.

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Speaker 1: Did bitcoin just become legalized? So to the point that

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Speaker 1: you made, there's still a lot that has to be done.

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Speaker 1: So we had bills that just got passed by the House.

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Speaker 1: They still have to get through the Senate, I believe,

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Speaker 1: so that's probably a lot of the work show us

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Speaker 1: to be done. There's another bill that has gotten overturned

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Speaker 1: and now potentially the president could veto this. So I

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Speaker 1: want to kind of dig into a little bit of

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Speaker 1: the nuance. So I guess let's just start with at

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Speaker 1: the top. In your opinion, you've been doing this now

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Speaker 1: for a couple of years. You're deep in the belly

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Speaker 1: of the beast. Let's just call it that. In the

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Speaker 1: politics world, it seems like this has become very bipartisan.

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Speaker 1: The sides are opposite of each other, although these latest

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Speaker 1: bills seem to be I'm sorry, bipartisan. This latest bill

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Speaker 1: seems like everyone's kind of together, but there's some stuff

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Speaker 1: that seems more partisan where they're fighting. And so let's

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Speaker 1: just frame it up from a top level. So, you know,

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Speaker 1: at the Bitcoin conference last year, almost a year ago

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Speaker 1: right now, we saw presidential candidates, Vivid Gramaswami RFK, even

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Speaker 1: Tulsi Gabbard not a candidate but kind of a front

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Speaker 1: running political figure, all coming out in support of bitcoin

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Speaker 1: and digital assets.

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Speaker 2: Just maybe a week ago or so, Donald.

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Speaker 1: Trump sort of came out in support of digital assets

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Speaker 1: and crypt currencies and bitcoin, even accepting donations, and it

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Speaker 1: sort of maybe puts the opposition the Biden administration on

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Speaker 1: the opposite side of this, So.

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Speaker 2: Let me frame this up.

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Speaker 1: Tell me if I'm wrong, But it seems like the

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Speaker 1: Biden administration Elizabeth Warren, Gary Ginsler has been very, very

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Speaker 1: very against cryptocurrency, is very harsh on them. But the

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Speaker 1: tide seems to be turning. And now does Biden have

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Speaker 1: to do you think he has to take the opposite

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Speaker 1: side of Trump because they're competing, or do you think

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Speaker 1: Biden's going to be the Biden admin will be forced

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Speaker 1: to sort of capitulate and just realize that they're going

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Speaker 1: to lose voting base if they do that.

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Speaker 4: That's an absolutely great question.

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Speaker 3: As someone who's been fighting for a long time to

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Speaker 3: make sure that Democrats and progressives also see the value

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Speaker 3: of bitcoin and digital assets, I couldn't you know more,

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Speaker 3: disagree that, like the Biden administration needs to take this

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Speaker 3: opposite stance, although that is just very stereotypically what we

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Speaker 3: do see in politics, So I wouldn't be surprised if

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Speaker 3: it does happen. But I'm really excited about this opportunity

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Speaker 3: for both sides of the aisle to be fighting for

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Speaker 3: the bitcoin vote. I see it very much like the

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Speaker 3: same way as like, you know, who's best on the economy. Right,

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Speaker 3: it's not going to be like like, oh, I'm pro bitcoin,

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Speaker 3: your anti bitcoin. It is who's better on bitcoin? And

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Speaker 3: we're moving towards that world. We're not quite there yet,

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Speaker 3: So we could see the Biden administration take some missteps

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Speaker 3: on this issue. But predominantly I really see it as

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Speaker 3: as an Elizabeth Warren Gibby being given a mandate through

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Speaker 3: the elections. This is actually like a well known DC

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Speaker 3: secret that during the election process, when Biden was trying

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Speaker 3: to win that's what trying to win the office of

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Speaker 3: the presidency, he cut a deal with Elizabeth Warren to

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Speaker 3: let her to like manage him in this banking and.

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Speaker 4: Digital asset stuff. And obviously it's been very, very bad

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Speaker 4: for the administration.

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Speaker 3: So you know, we could see a pivot. There's to

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Speaker 3: a lot of people talking about that there could be

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Speaker 3: a pivot. And the reason why is because at the

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Speaker 3: end of the day, everybody's going to be pro bitcoin

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Speaker 3: and it's only a matter of time, and so both

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Speaker 3: Democrats and Republicans are fighting to be.

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Speaker 4: Number one on the issue.

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Speaker 1: All right, I want to take a break just real

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Speaker 1: quick and say that you know, as we're talking about

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Speaker 1: bitcoin and digital assets, The question really comes down to, like,

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Speaker 1: are you tired of the global elites robbing you blind

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Speaker 1: through all this money printing that's happening, And if so,

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Speaker 1: then you need to be holding your wealth outside of that,

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Speaker 1: and more importantly, you should be coming to the Bitcoin

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Speaker 1: Conference in Nashville. The twenty twenty four conference is happening

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Speaker 1: in July twenty fifth through twenty seventh. It's the largest bitcoin,

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Speaker 1: the largest fintech conference in the world. I've been going

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Speaker 1: every single year. It's an amazing event, and Bitcoin twenty

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Speaker 1: twenty four really stands as a beacon of monetary freedom

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Speaker 1: if you care about that. If you care about freedom,

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Speaker 1: all freedom sits at the freedom to transact, and really

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Speaker 1: the darkening macroeconomic backdrop that's happening needs the bitcoin more

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Speaker 1: than ever.

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Speaker 2: Now.

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Speaker 1: There's going to be top speakers there, companies, thought leaders

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Speaker 1: from across the industry. They're all going to be in

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Speaker 1: Nashville looking ahead for the future.

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Speaker 2: And I'm going to be there.

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Speaker 1: Lots of other people, my friends are going to be there,

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Speaker 1: and ticket prices keep going up, so the longer you wait,

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Speaker 1: the more you're going to pay. But I don't want

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Speaker 1: that to happen to you. I'd love for you to

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Speaker 1: come hang out, meet me, hang out with me and

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Speaker 1: all the other speakers there. And you can save ten

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Speaker 1: percent on your ticket by using code mark Moss at

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Speaker 1: check out. So get your tickets now. Like I said,

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Speaker 1: the price is just keep going up. Use Mark Moss

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Speaker 1: at check out to save ten percent on your tickets

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Speaker 1: and hit me up let me know if you're coming.

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Speaker 1: So I want to meet you. And also, while we're

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Speaker 1: talking about bitcoin, we're talking about laws being changed to

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Speaker 1: basically guarantee your rights of self custody. The whole piece

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Speaker 1: about bitcoin that's so revolutionary is that we can custody

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Speaker 1: our own digital asset, and so you should certainly do that.

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Speaker 1: But how I've been using this device, it's called a

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Speaker 1: Treasure hardware wallet. I've been using it for about seven

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Speaker 1: eight years now. It's been my go to device. Basically,

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Speaker 1: it's a little hardware device like this that hold your

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Speaker 1: private key and you plug it into your computer when

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Speaker 1: you want to send a transaction. I like Treasure because

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Speaker 1: it's open source. Unlike some of the security flaws you've

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Speaker 1: seen in other devices. I don't want to name them

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Speaker 1: right now, but it's open source, so you know, that

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Speaker 1: it's safe, it's the easiest to use, which we'll have

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Speaker 1: used it forever. They have new devices that make it

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Speaker 1: much easier than ever before. There's no excuse for you

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Speaker 1: not to secure your own bitcoin with the Treasure hardware

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Speaker 1: wallet or something else like that. And more importantly, when

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Speaker 1: you're holding your Treasure hardware wallet or any hardware wallet

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Speaker 1: for that matter, you need to back up your private keys. Now,

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Speaker 1: you want to make sure that you back up your

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Speaker 1: private keys and put them somewhere they don't get destroyed.

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Speaker 1: And they've come up with this new device where I

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Speaker 1: can put my private key on this metal device that

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Speaker 1: could withstand flat fire, flood or war, whatever it may be.

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Speaker 1: So check out Treasure what they're doing. You can save

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Speaker 1: ten percent on these things by using codemark moss. But

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Speaker 1: either way, make sure you secure.

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Speaker 2: Your own bitcoin.

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Speaker 1: I like how you frame that, how we should just

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Speaker 1: argue who's better on it, as opposed to trying to

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Speaker 1: take opposite sides of that. I just I you know,

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Speaker 1: there's the never trumpers, and no matter what he wants,

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Speaker 1: he wants to secure the border, they don't want to

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Speaker 1: secure them. It's like, unfortunately we're in this bipolar world.

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Speaker 1: Where we have to, but hopefully, hopefully you're right on that.

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Speaker 1: I find it odd that in the land of the free,

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Speaker 1: in the United States, any politician could run on a

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Speaker 1: platform to take away our freedom of choice.

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Speaker 2: I just find it hard. How could somebody run on

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Speaker 2: that platform? And it amazes me.

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Speaker 1: So I want to dig deeper into that. Let's start

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Speaker 1: on some of these specifics here. So a big news

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Speaker 1: for you and the Satoshia Action Fund was what happened

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Speaker 1: in Oklahoma. So Oklahoma took the I believe. I want

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Speaker 1: you to break this down for me, but it appears

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Speaker 1: that Oklahoma basically sort of put the rights in two

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Speaker 1: man to make sure that the Oklahoma citizens, I guess

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Speaker 1: at least have the right to have bitcoin, own it, custody,

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Speaker 1: et cetera.

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Speaker 3: Is that what happened.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, that is what happens.

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Speaker 3: For those that might be new to the work that

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Speaker 3: we do at Satoshi Action, we are a bitcoin digital

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Speaker 3: asset advocacy organization. We work to pass pro bitcoin bills

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Speaker 3: into law. After we go through the education process with lawmakers,

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Speaker 3: we help them understand the value of the technology, and

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Speaker 3: then we move and say, hey, now that you like

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Speaker 3: bitcoin as much as we do, here's some ideas for

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Speaker 3: how you can attract this new technology to your jurisdiction.

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Speaker 3: Last year we passed our two bills into law in

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Speaker 3: Montana and Arkansas called the Right to Mind Bill.

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Speaker 4: And this year we.

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Speaker 3: Took decided to say, hey, we got a couple of

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Speaker 3: on the board. Bitcoin is about to go on and run.

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Speaker 3: The sentiment is changing dramatically, and we should really take

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Speaker 3: advantage of that and try to expand the scope of

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Speaker 3: the policy. So now not only are we protecting bitcoin

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Speaker 3: mining with our legislation, we are also protecting the right

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Speaker 3: to self custody, the right to run a node, and

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Speaker 3: the right to buy, sell, and trade.

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Speaker 4: And use digital assets broadly.

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Speaker 3: And so the first state in the country to actually

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Speaker 3: enact that bill into law is Oklahoma. It did it

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Speaker 3: just a little over a week ago, so very excited

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Speaker 3: about that news.

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Speaker 4: But there are other states as well that are right behind.

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Speaker 3: We have Louisiana passing it in the House and the

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Speaker 3: Senate and we're just waiting for it to go to

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Speaker 3: the governor's desk now, so very very exciting things happening.

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Speaker 4: By the way, it's a.

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Speaker 3: Little bit of breaking news too, because that hasn't been

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Speaker 3: that hasn't been widely reported, so excited to share that

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Speaker 3: with your audience here today. But yes, the right to

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Speaker 3: self custody and use bitcoin is now protected in Oklahoma,

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Speaker 3: and real quickly because people oftentimes they say, well, why

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Speaker 3: do why should we care about state law when you

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Speaker 3: have the federal law going on? Is in federal law

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Speaker 3: sort of the ultimate sort of power in the USA,

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Speaker 3: And to some extent.

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Speaker 4: That is true.

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Speaker 3: But the most important thing to keep in mind is

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Speaker 3: that when you have a lack of federal action, state

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Speaker 3: law reigns supreme. But let's say, even for instance, the

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Speaker 3: federal law decides to come in and say, well, we're

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Speaker 3: going to ban self custody, if the state of Oklahoma

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Speaker 3: protects self custody, then it's on the otus is on

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Speaker 3: the federal government to come in and enforce that policy.

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Speaker 3: And just throughout history we have seen the federal government

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Speaker 3: is unwilling to enforce granular types of individual policies like

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Speaker 3: that where they'd have to come and knock on everybody's doors.

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Speaker 3: The really clear line example of this is the cannabis industry.

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Speaker 3: The cannabis industry is legalized in about seventy five percent

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Speaker 3: of the country, we do not see the federal government

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Speaker 3: coming and knocking on doors and taking out every individual

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Speaker 3: user and cannabis industry business participant.

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Speaker 4: They just aren't doing it. And so we're following that.

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Speaker 3: Same strategy, and so far it has worked for the

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Speaker 3: cannabis industry, and we believe that it will work.

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Speaker 4: For us as well.

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Speaker 3: Well.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, that's a really good example, a good analogy.

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Speaker 1: So the way that I see this bill and I

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Speaker 1: like it, and going back to I said, we'll come

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Speaker 1: back to do we need the government to give us

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Speaker 1: laws to give us clarity on this. And so you know,

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Speaker 1: I'm under the again, being an American, I'm under the

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Speaker 1: belief that we are free and we're free to do

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Speaker 1: whatever we want unless there's laws that tell us we

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Speaker 1: can't do those things. And so the Constitution is really

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Speaker 1: a set of laws that prohibits the government from taking

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Speaker 1: away our freedoms, encroaching our freedoms. And so rather than saying, hey,

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Speaker 1: please give us a law that tells us what we

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Speaker 1: can do with our digital assets as a slave mindset,

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Speaker 1: instead we pass laws that prevent the government from encroaching.

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Speaker 1: And that seems sort of what this Oklahoma bill is.

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Speaker 1: It's like Hey, we're putting a law into place that

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Speaker 1: guarantees your right to keep these freedoms and doesn't allow

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Speaker 1: the government to encroach it. Is that a way to

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Speaker 1: sort of look at this.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean absolutely, the work that we do, I

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Speaker 3: oftentimes tell people, you know, if you like the Constitution,

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Speaker 3: then you should like the bill that we passed in

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Speaker 3: a law in Oklahom. You should like the bills that

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Speaker 3: we passed in a law in Montana, in Arkansas, and

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Speaker 3: you should love the bills that we're going to pass

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Speaker 3: in the law in Louisiana and others coming up here

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Speaker 3: in the future. But at the end of the day,

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Speaker 3: like let's go to the heart of that question, like

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Speaker 3: why do we need regulations? Ultimately in the United States,

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Speaker 3: given the current dynamic that we're in, it is really

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Speaker 3: important to have clear rules of the road so that

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Speaker 3: people can know how to operate. I mean, think about it,

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Speaker 3: like quite literally, like the road right when we're all

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Speaker 3: driving around. If there was no speed limits, you'd have

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Speaker 3: just this like very wide range of different driving habits,

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Speaker 3: and that would be make driving on the road much

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Speaker 3: more difficult. And although it does, you know, in some

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Speaker 3: ways slightly restrict our freedoms to create regulations. What the

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Speaker 3: most important part for people to keep in mind is

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Speaker 3: it creates a super highway for good behavior, a super

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Speaker 3: highway for people to know, Okay, this is what I

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Speaker 3: can do, and I know that I can do it,

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Speaker 3: and I'm not going to mess with me, and I

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Speaker 3: can go as fast as I possibly can, and I

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Speaker 3: can you know, move fast and break things, so to speak.

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Speaker 3: Similar to the tech and right when we create regulatory

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Speaker 3: guidelance for the tech industry, we've seen a super highway

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Speaker 3: of good behavior. And obviously, of course we're trying to

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Speaker 3: limit that bad behavior, and we're trying to do it

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Speaker 3: in a way where we don't limit to the e

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Speaker 3: step that actually crushes innovation or crushes freedom. Obviously, on

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Speaker 3: the edges you're going to see a little bit of that.

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Speaker 3: But the most important part to keep in mind is

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Speaker 3: that it really does create this mega highway for people

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Speaker 3: to be able to go and pursue certain businesses that

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Speaker 3: they know for sure are going to last and be

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Speaker 3: here to stay for good in the United States.

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Speaker 1: Great, let's dig into a couple of specifics, because it's

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Speaker 1: been a busy week. There's a lot of stuff going

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Speaker 1: on So the first thing I want to talk about.

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Speaker 1: My opening question was did bitcoin just become legalized? Obviously

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Speaker 1: in Oklahoma you've already kind of covered that piece, but

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Speaker 1: there's a fit twenty one, right, And so this just

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Speaker 1: went through the House past. It hasn't gone through the

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Speaker 1: Senate yet, but it seems like this big watershed moment,

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Speaker 1: if you will, congressional validation for the crypto industry, digital

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Speaker 1: asset industry, if you will. And it seemed pretty by partisan.

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Speaker 1: It was like two seventy nine to one, thirty six

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Speaker 1: Democrats and Republicans together. Some say the odds in the

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Speaker 1: Senate remain low. Before I get into the details of that,

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Speaker 1: I mean, what's the word on the street, is the

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Speaker 1: odds of getting through the Senate low?

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Speaker 2: And if so, why, yeah?

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Speaker 3: Absolutely, I mean you'd sort of need to keep your

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Speaker 3: I think, perspectives and your expectations in check with regards

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Speaker 3: to this.

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Speaker 4: Thing going through the Senate. I think your right to

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Speaker 4: do that.

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Speaker 3: First of all, there's just there's no companion bill in

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Speaker 3: the Senate. Typically, what you will see if you have

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Speaker 3: a really really good effort going is you will see

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Speaker 3: a companion bill where there's a matching bill on the

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Speaker 3: opposite side and the other chamber. So if it's the House,

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Speaker 3: you have a companion bill in the Senate. If it's

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Speaker 3: going through the Senate, you have a companion bill in

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Speaker 3: the House. There is no companion bill right now. And

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Speaker 3: also there's just really no constraints on when the Senate

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Speaker 3: has to act, So the Senate could just sit around

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Speaker 3: and there's no there's no forcing mechanism to make them

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Speaker 3: actually take this bill and run it through their side.

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Speaker 3: And also, one really key thing to keep in mind

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Speaker 3: here is that you have the Lumbas and Jillibrand effort

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Speaker 3: right on the Senate side, and they have been working diligently.

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Speaker 3: I mean Senator Lummas has been putting in a significant

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Speaker 3: portion of her time. She's the ultimate bitcoin champion in Washington, DC.

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Speaker 3: And you know, typically when you've spent that much time

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Speaker 3: on a policy, you're not just going to be like, oh, yeah,

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Speaker 3: let's go with the other guy's policy, like you're going

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Speaker 3: to want some piece of the action. You're going to

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Speaker 3: want to feel like your work was included. And that's

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Speaker 3: Fit twenty one unfortunately, does not encompass all of the parts.

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Speaker 4: I think that Senator Lummas.

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Speaker 3: Would really want included in her bill. But but sticking

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Speaker 3: to the sticking to the odds here, you know, it's

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Speaker 3: not a it's a non zero chance, right like it's

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Speaker 3: it's not zero, but it's not also probably fifty percent

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Speaker 3: or higher that it's going to get through. And then again,

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Speaker 3: at the end of the day, you also have to be,

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Speaker 3: you know, considered that President Biden is in opposition to

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Speaker 3: this legislation. He did not announce that he was going

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Speaker 3: to veto it, but he did say that he would

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Speaker 3: be opposed to the legislation.

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Speaker 1: So some of the key points that I like, and

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Speaker 1: going back to did bitcoin get legalized? I mean, obviously

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Speaker 1: we talked about Oklahoma, but in this specifically, I put

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Speaker 1: out a pretty long tweet thread on this the other

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Speaker 1: day because I, along with a lot of other people,

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Speaker 1: seem to think that the probably the most likely attack

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Speaker 1: vector on bitcoin will be self custody, and of course

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Speaker 1: this is what Oklahoma law entrines that right to do that.

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Speaker 1: But in this bill specifically, there was a protection of

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Speaker 1: self custody and so basically protecting the rights of individuals

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Speaker 1: to use hardware, software, wallet, stora, digital assets, things like that,

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Speaker 1: and so that was sort of the like, Man, if

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Speaker 1: this goes through, it's basically legalizing bitcoin. The one thing

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Speaker 1: that it just seems insane if most people don't really

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Speaker 1: understand the way the world works. But because we're in

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Speaker 1: a debt based monetary system, everything in this world is debt,

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Speaker 1: and they've basically taken away our rights to own anything.

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Speaker 1: So things that you think you own legally technically you don't.

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Speaker 1: So like the money in your bank, you don't own

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Speaker 1: that money in the bank. It's owed to you. The

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Speaker 1: money's owed to you. That's why the bank tells what

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Speaker 1: you can do. The stocks that you own, your Apple, Tesla, etc.

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Speaker 1: You don't own those. Those are owed to you by

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Speaker 1: your broker. We used to have stock certificates, there were

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Speaker 1: bear instruments. No longer it's owed to you now, and

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Speaker 1: bitcoin is sort of this last bear instrument that we have,

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Speaker 1: and it seems like they don't want us to own

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Speaker 1: that either. They want us to have that ode to

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Speaker 1: us through some debt obligation. This would ensrine our rights

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Speaker 1: to do that. But I guess maybe that's why there's

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Speaker 1: opposition to this. I don't know what are your thoughts

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Speaker 1: or what are you hearing.

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Speaker 3: I mean, that's a fantastic way to think about it,

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Speaker 3: that we live in this society and in a world

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Speaker 3: where everything is given to a custodian for them to

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Speaker 3: hold on our behalf.

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Speaker 4: And I mean, we have very good custodial services here

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Speaker 4: in the United States. I won't complain.

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Speaker 3: I mean, if you go to other parts of the world,

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Speaker 3: there's just you know, there are parts of the world

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Speaker 3: where if you put your money into a bank account,

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Speaker 3: that money will get immediately taken out by the government.

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Speaker 3: So we are very fortunate to have good custodians here.

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Speaker 3: But at the end of the day, you're right, we

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Speaker 3: as Americans, we the people, should have the right to

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Speaker 3: hold our own assets and to be able to control

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Speaker 3: our own destinies. And that's why we put self custody

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Speaker 3: protections into the Oklahoma bill. That's why I love to

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Speaker 3: see that these self custody protections are also similar in

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Speaker 3: their effort to protect self custody in this fit twenty

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Speaker 3: one bill. And that's going to be big moving forward,

438
00:19:26,280 --> 00:19:28,640
Speaker 3: because that is, as you said, a big, big, big

439
00:19:28,680 --> 00:19:32,000
Speaker 3: attack vector potentially on bitcoin, because if you can't hold bitcoin,

440
00:19:32,200 --> 00:19:35,239
Speaker 3: if you can't truly engage with the technology, then you

441
00:19:35,280 --> 00:19:38,640
Speaker 3: are sort of cut off from being able to benefit

442
00:19:38,680 --> 00:19:42,439
Speaker 3: from the greatest opportunities that bitcoin has to offer with

443
00:19:42,440 --> 00:19:46,400
Speaker 3: regards to enhancing our freedom and our economic mobility. So yes,

444
00:19:46,520 --> 00:19:49,400
Speaker 3: absolutely couldn't agree with you more that. I'm probably most

445
00:19:49,440 --> 00:19:53,840
Speaker 3: excited about this part. I mean, because ultimately, like the

446
00:19:53,840 --> 00:19:56,040
Speaker 3: whole digital asted ecosystem is super pumped, like, oh, we're

447
00:19:56,040 --> 00:19:58,520
Speaker 3: going to have these great guidelines for what can the

448
00:19:58,560 --> 00:20:01,400
Speaker 3: SEC do, what can the cf They're going to create

449
00:20:01,480 --> 00:20:04,720
Speaker 3: this really big ninety day deadline where the SEC has

450
00:20:04,760 --> 00:20:07,720
Speaker 3: to respond to say that it's a security or not,

451
00:20:07,800 --> 00:20:09,440
Speaker 3: and that if it's not, it goes to the CFTC

452
00:20:09,480 --> 00:20:12,439
Speaker 3: instead of just like making these people wait forever an

453
00:20:12,440 --> 00:20:15,520
Speaker 3: eternity and doing regulation through enforcement. So that's big. But

454
00:20:15,600 --> 00:20:18,359
Speaker 3: like I'm a bitcoinner, I don't really like everyone's pretty

455
00:20:18,400 --> 00:20:20,560
Speaker 3: clear that bitcoin is a commodity, it's going to go

456
00:20:20,600 --> 00:20:24,720
Speaker 3: to the CFTC regardless of the lack of regulation on

457
00:20:24,760 --> 00:20:27,520
Speaker 3: the issue currently. I just don't feel concerned about my

458
00:20:27,600 --> 00:20:31,560
Speaker 3: bitcoin at this point. But things like self custody protections. Absolutely,

459
00:20:31,640 --> 00:20:33,720
Speaker 3: that's a huge one, and and I'm glad that not

460
00:20:33,760 --> 00:20:35,320
Speaker 3: only did you highlight it on your Twitter, I was

461
00:20:35,359 --> 00:20:37,720
Speaker 3: a great breakdown that you gave gave there, but they

462
00:20:37,760 --> 00:20:38,760
Speaker 3: we're highlighting it here.

463
00:20:38,600 --> 00:20:41,240
Speaker 1: As well now on the other side. So this is

464
00:20:41,240 --> 00:20:42,960
Speaker 1: just stuff that the House is doing, but we don't

465
00:20:42,960 --> 00:20:45,239
Speaker 1: know if the Senate's going to do it. There's no

466
00:20:45,800 --> 00:20:47,919
Speaker 1: companion bill to your point, and there's no deadline for

467
00:20:47,920 --> 00:20:50,159
Speaker 1: the Senate to move. But the Senate is doing something

468
00:20:50,240 --> 00:20:53,080
Speaker 1: on the other side. So in a resolution one oh nine,

469
00:20:53,160 --> 00:20:57,600
Speaker 1: the Senate's passed legislation to overturn a previous SEC accounting

470
00:20:57,680 --> 00:21:03,040
Speaker 1: rule SAB number one twenty one one, which basically prevents

471
00:21:03,320 --> 00:21:06,280
Speaker 1: regulated financial firm from custody in bitcoin. So it's still

472
00:21:06,320 --> 00:21:09,040
Speaker 1: sort of this custody piece and that was put in

473
00:21:09,080 --> 00:21:12,200
Speaker 1: place that said, hey, they can't custody it, and that's

474
00:21:12,240 --> 00:21:15,880
Speaker 1: like this big battleground. The Senate voted sort of bipartisan

475
00:21:15,960 --> 00:21:19,800
Speaker 1: to overturn that, which seems pretty positive again in favor

476
00:21:19,880 --> 00:21:22,040
Speaker 1: of custody, this time not self custody but by a

477
00:21:22,040 --> 00:21:25,800
Speaker 1: custodian a bank. This one seems to be a lot

478
00:21:25,840 --> 00:21:28,600
Speaker 1: of people think that the President might want to veto this.

479
00:21:29,000 --> 00:21:30,240
Speaker 1: What are you hearing on the street on that?

480
00:21:30,720 --> 00:21:33,720
Speaker 3: I mean, he said it himself, right, He commented, that

481
00:21:33,800 --> 00:21:38,360
Speaker 3: he would veto the staff accounting bulletin on twenty one.

482
00:21:39,720 --> 00:21:40,600
Speaker 4: For whatever reason.

483
00:21:40,880 --> 00:21:43,720
Speaker 3: And I think actually that was a very big mistake

484
00:21:43,800 --> 00:21:48,320
Speaker 3: on his part because you know, ultimately the digital asset

485
00:21:48,359 --> 00:21:52,200
Speaker 3: ecosystem is looking for these wins. They have not had

486
00:21:52,240 --> 00:21:55,080
Speaker 3: any wins in DC, and all of a sudden you

487
00:21:55,119 --> 00:21:58,840
Speaker 3: see some movement finally for the digital acid ecosystem in Washington,

488
00:21:58,920 --> 00:22:00,000
Speaker 3: d C. I mean, I have a lot of friends

489
00:22:00,040 --> 00:22:01,439
Speaker 3: that have been working there. I tell them, you're doing

490
00:22:01,480 --> 00:22:03,960
Speaker 3: the Lord's work right, because it's just like nothing is

491
00:22:04,000 --> 00:22:07,520
Speaker 3: going through in Washington DC, And all of a sudden

492
00:22:07,520 --> 00:22:09,640
Speaker 3: we see this movement and it's a lot of excitement.

493
00:22:09,760 --> 00:22:12,200
Speaker 3: It's there are much bigger things that we need to

494
00:22:12,240 --> 00:22:15,439
Speaker 3: do in Washington DC with regards to this issue. But

495
00:22:15,440 --> 00:22:17,800
Speaker 3: but the fact that there was something that moved forward

496
00:22:18,200 --> 00:22:20,480
Speaker 3: was so valuable to the people that work there. And

497
00:22:20,880 --> 00:22:22,800
Speaker 3: I'm telling you, man, I got friends that are just like,

498
00:22:22,800 --> 00:22:25,480
Speaker 3: what's the point of life in Washington TC. We're not

499
00:22:25,560 --> 00:22:28,040
Speaker 3: doing anything? And they were looking at the down the

500
00:22:28,040 --> 00:22:30,800
Speaker 3: barrel of you know, November twenty twenty four thinking, I mean,

501
00:22:30,800 --> 00:22:33,040
Speaker 3: we're about to go into election mode and not see

502
00:22:33,040 --> 00:22:34,760
Speaker 3: anything happen until the end of the year and then

503
00:22:34,960 --> 00:22:36,719
Speaker 3: new Congress has to come in. We got to restart

504
00:22:36,720 --> 00:22:39,080
Speaker 3: all these efforts. So for them to get this, this

505
00:22:39,080 --> 00:22:42,199
Speaker 3: this win, which from a regular perspective is small, but

506
00:22:42,240 --> 00:22:45,399
Speaker 3: from a from a momentum and from a from a

507
00:22:45,520 --> 00:22:49,280
Speaker 3: from an opportunity perspective, was huge for them to really

508
00:22:49,280 --> 00:22:51,480
Speaker 3: start to get wins on the board for all their efforts,

509
00:22:51,720 --> 00:22:53,560
Speaker 3: and for like the Biden administration to come in like

510
00:22:54,000 --> 00:22:56,640
Speaker 3: snatch what is It's not a big, like huge, massive,

511
00:22:57,160 --> 00:22:59,720
Speaker 3: like world changing victory, but it was a victory and.

512
00:22:59,720 --> 00:23:00,680
Speaker 4: It was historical.

513
00:23:00,960 --> 00:23:02,480
Speaker 3: So for them to try to say we're going to

514
00:23:02,560 --> 00:23:06,479
Speaker 3: come in and snatch this victory from you, even this

515
00:23:06,560 --> 00:23:09,480
Speaker 3: tiny little wind, we won't let you have really mobilized

516
00:23:09,800 --> 00:23:12,639
Speaker 3: those in the crypto space and the bitcoin space, and

517
00:23:12,720 --> 00:23:16,000
Speaker 3: I think that's why you're seeing the Trump administration capitalize

518
00:23:16,000 --> 00:23:18,760
Speaker 3: really on this issue and say we're going to start

519
00:23:19,480 --> 00:23:21,720
Speaker 3: making sure that we take care of this industry. I

520
00:23:21,760 --> 00:23:24,080
Speaker 3: don't know if he would have so strongly come out

521
00:23:24,080 --> 00:23:26,479
Speaker 3: in support of the space if it wasn't for that

522
00:23:26,560 --> 00:23:28,840
Speaker 3: move by the Biden administration, because it opened up a

523
00:23:28,880 --> 00:23:32,119
Speaker 3: door for the Trump administration to say, you know what,

524
00:23:32,440 --> 00:23:34,040
Speaker 3: we're going to take a different path on this, and

525
00:23:34,080 --> 00:23:37,680
Speaker 3: now you do see quite a bit of aggressive pushes

526
00:23:37,720 --> 00:23:40,480
Speaker 3: for people to support Trump and the Trump administration because

527
00:23:40,480 --> 00:23:44,160
Speaker 3: of this. So I don't know for sure if he's

528
00:23:44,160 --> 00:23:45,600
Speaker 3: actually going to come out and vito it. I think

529
00:23:45,640 --> 00:23:47,240
Speaker 3: it would be a huge mistake on his part. I

530
00:23:47,240 --> 00:23:51,240
Speaker 3: think it would absolutely galvanize what is a very.

531
00:23:51,119 --> 00:23:53,760
Speaker 4: Non partisan or bipartisan.

532
00:23:53,080 --> 00:23:56,080
Speaker 3: Voter base that is, at the end of the day,

533
00:23:56,359 --> 00:23:58,200
Speaker 3: like if you go after them, you're hurting not only

534
00:23:58,240 --> 00:24:00,600
Speaker 3: their wallet, but you're hurt you're actually going after a

535
00:24:00,640 --> 00:24:02,640
Speaker 3: lot of their core values on like what we think

536
00:24:02,680 --> 00:24:06,719
Speaker 3: America should be about, innovation, access to your finances. With

537
00:24:06,800 --> 00:24:08,919
Speaker 3: regards to bitcoin, you know, it's like the ability to

538
00:24:08,960 --> 00:24:11,560
Speaker 3: be able to custody your own asset and be able

539
00:24:11,560 --> 00:24:14,320
Speaker 3: to save for the future. There's obviously a million other

540
00:24:14,320 --> 00:24:17,600
Speaker 3: great things about bitcoin benefits that has to offer everything

541
00:24:17,640 --> 00:24:19,640
Speaker 3: from banking the end bank to financial inclusion.

542
00:24:19,720 --> 00:24:20,679
Speaker 4: It's like, if you're.

543
00:24:20,600 --> 00:24:23,159
Speaker 3: Against that, like, that's a pretty bad place to be

544
00:24:23,240 --> 00:24:25,199
Speaker 3: in because those voters are going to, like you know,

545
00:24:25,200 --> 00:24:26,720
Speaker 3: they're going to go to the mat to make sure

546
00:24:27,160 --> 00:24:29,240
Speaker 3: that they can protect their issues. So I've always said

547
00:24:29,280 --> 00:24:31,879
Speaker 3: that bitcoin and digital asset voters are some of the

548
00:24:31,920 --> 00:24:35,919
Speaker 3: most well entrenched and motivated voters if you if you

549
00:24:35,960 --> 00:24:37,840
Speaker 3: motivate them, and it looks like the Bide administration is

550
00:24:37,880 --> 00:24:40,960
Speaker 3: ready to ready to motivate them against his own party.

551
00:24:41,400 --> 00:24:43,440
Speaker 1: Now, he could just sit on this too, right, I mean,

552
00:24:43,480 --> 00:24:44,560
Speaker 1: does he have to veto it right now?

553
00:24:44,640 --> 00:24:46,840
Speaker 2: Or is there a deadline? Is there a clock counting down?

554
00:24:47,000 --> 00:24:49,720
Speaker 3: There is a deadline, There was like a there is

555
00:24:49,760 --> 00:24:52,679
Speaker 3: like a technically a ten day deadline once there's like

556
00:24:52,720 --> 00:24:56,360
Speaker 3: there's a few nuances around when that deadline starts. But yeah,

557
00:24:56,359 --> 00:24:57,879
Speaker 3: there is there is a deadline when he have he

558
00:24:57,920 --> 00:24:59,600
Speaker 3: has to sign it or not sign it. If he

559
00:24:59,640 --> 00:25:02,840
Speaker 3: doesn't sign it, then it like becomes law automatically. There's

560
00:25:02,840 --> 00:25:05,720
Speaker 3: also weird rules around, like but if he isn't able

561
00:25:05,760 --> 00:25:08,960
Speaker 3: to make it back in time and like the clock

562
00:25:09,040 --> 00:25:13,240
Speaker 3: runs out on the session, then it's considered a pocket veto.

563
00:25:13,400 --> 00:25:15,320
Speaker 3: It's it's it's a little messy out there, but yeah,

564
00:25:15,320 --> 00:25:17,760
Speaker 3: there is some regulations or rules around when he has

565
00:25:17,800 --> 00:25:18,320
Speaker 3: to respond.

566
00:25:18,680 --> 00:25:21,280
Speaker 1: What I really what I really like is what you

567
00:25:21,280 --> 00:25:23,480
Speaker 1: said about the momentum. We see the tide shifting. The

568
00:25:23,480 --> 00:25:25,479
Speaker 1: tide is changing on this and so all of a sudden,

569
00:25:25,960 --> 00:25:29,280
Speaker 1: it went from like this Elizabeth Warren led, Gary Gensler led,

570
00:25:29,400 --> 00:25:31,720
Speaker 1: you know, attack on crypto. I mean she literally ran

571
00:25:31,760 --> 00:25:36,119
Speaker 1: on like an anti crypto campaign and started started really

572
00:25:36,160 --> 00:25:38,359
Speaker 1: cracking down choke point two point zero, all these things.

573
00:25:38,560 --> 00:25:40,240
Speaker 1: And now all of a sudden, like we're seeing the

574
00:25:40,320 --> 00:25:43,480
Speaker 1: exact opposite, Oklahoma taking the state, you know, other states

575
00:25:43,560 --> 00:25:45,840
Speaker 1: jumping in and trying those rights, and now these these

576
00:25:45,920 --> 00:25:48,320
Speaker 1: rules and laws, and then obviously Trump taking the other

577
00:25:48,359 --> 00:25:51,119
Speaker 1: side of it, Kennedy RFK taking the other side of

578
00:25:51,160 --> 00:25:54,040
Speaker 1: it as well, and it sort of forces Biden's hands like,

579
00:25:54,119 --> 00:25:56,200
Speaker 1: I mean, you're either going to come out and you're

580
00:25:56,280 --> 00:25:59,520
Speaker 1: against Americans having freedom to choose, or you're gonna have

581
00:25:59,520 --> 00:26:00,119
Speaker 1: to go along with it.

582
00:26:00,240 --> 00:26:01,680
Speaker 2: And so it's that momentum.

583
00:26:01,680 --> 00:26:03,480
Speaker 1: And even if it doesn't make it make it through

584
00:26:03,560 --> 00:26:07,040
Speaker 1: in this you know, specific case, it's the momentum. It's

585
00:26:07,040 --> 00:26:08,840
Speaker 1: the direction that we're going. And it seems to be

586
00:26:08,960 --> 00:26:12,040
Speaker 1: very bipartisan. It seems like a lot of the Democrats

587
00:26:12,080 --> 00:26:14,480
Speaker 1: are jumping ship. They don't want to go down with

588
00:26:14,520 --> 00:26:16,960
Speaker 1: the with the with the sinking ship of the Democrats

589
00:26:17,000 --> 00:26:20,120
Speaker 1: if they're going to be restrictive on on these digital

590
00:26:20,160 --> 00:26:20,760
Speaker 1: asset rights.

591
00:26:20,800 --> 00:26:22,160
Speaker 2: I mean, is that is that kind of your take

592
00:26:22,200 --> 00:26:22,399
Speaker 2: on it?

593
00:26:22,760 --> 00:26:24,480
Speaker 4: I mean, yes, absolutely.

594
00:26:24,800 --> 00:26:27,040
Speaker 3: I think that for a long time we have heard

595
00:26:27,480 --> 00:26:31,200
Speaker 3: that a number of Democrats in Congress are very supportive

596
00:26:31,320 --> 00:26:35,600
Speaker 3: of the broader digital asset ecosystem. Some like Center Loves,

597
00:26:35,680 --> 00:26:39,120
Speaker 3: of course, are are extremely pro bitcoin, champions of bitcoin

598
00:26:40,040 --> 00:26:43,080
Speaker 3: on the on the Republican side. But it's great to

599
00:26:43,119 --> 00:26:46,800
Speaker 3: finally see that they were given a moment to show

600
00:26:47,240 --> 00:26:50,679
Speaker 3: how supportive they are of the space. And it's a

601
00:26:50,840 --> 00:26:55,040
Speaker 3: it's a really big indicator of how many folks support

602
00:26:55,119 --> 00:26:58,159
Speaker 3: the bitcoin and digital asset ecosystem from the left.

603
00:26:57,920 --> 00:26:59,240
Speaker 4: And the right hand side of the aisle.

604
00:26:59,600 --> 00:27:02,080
Speaker 3: And they they were given this opportunity to really just

605
00:27:02,119 --> 00:27:05,320
Speaker 3: pick a side, and when it mattered right, it wasn't like, oh,

606
00:27:05,520 --> 00:27:08,520
Speaker 3: you know, maybe this isn't the right move. There was

607
00:27:08,600 --> 00:27:13,240
Speaker 3: so much broad support for this legislation that it forced

608
00:27:13,400 --> 00:27:15,880
Speaker 3: a lot of these Democrats that I think were quietly

609
00:27:15,880 --> 00:27:19,239
Speaker 3: supportive to break ranks from the party line that they

610
00:27:19,280 --> 00:27:21,879
Speaker 3: had been holding for some time. And so, yes, that

611
00:27:21,920 --> 00:27:26,359
Speaker 3: momentum is building quite significantly. We are a very proud

612
00:27:26,359 --> 00:27:29,000
Speaker 3: contributor to that momentum. I mean, again, one of the

613
00:27:29,119 --> 00:27:31,680
Speaker 3: very big parts about what we are trying to accomplish

614
00:27:31,720 --> 00:27:34,960
Speaker 3: at the state level is to create that political momentum.

615
00:27:35,320 --> 00:27:38,560
Speaker 3: There's a twenty fifteen Bloomberg study which highlights that when

616
00:27:38,560 --> 00:27:41,360
Speaker 3: you see a flurry of state action on an issue,

617
00:27:41,680 --> 00:27:43,600
Speaker 3: you tend to see in a very short period of

618
00:27:43,640 --> 00:27:47,480
Speaker 3: time federal action take place. And we have created a

619
00:27:47,480 --> 00:27:49,720
Speaker 3: flurry of action at the state level. We have introduced

620
00:27:49,800 --> 00:27:54,440
Speaker 3: legislation in over twenty different states, everything from these policies

621
00:27:54,480 --> 00:27:58,119
Speaker 3: which enable folks to be protected for self custody, to

622
00:27:58,280 --> 00:28:01,000
Speaker 3: be able to study the big coin ETF to see

623
00:28:01,040 --> 00:28:03,240
Speaker 3: if the state pensions want to buy the bitcoin ETF,

624
00:28:03,520 --> 00:28:07,040
Speaker 3: to protecting nodes, to protecting bitcoin mining. And that's in

625
00:28:07,119 --> 00:28:11,479
Speaker 3: over twenty states. That's a large portion of the United States.

626
00:28:11,480 --> 00:28:14,880
Speaker 3: There's a flurry of activity taking place, legislation even being

627
00:28:14,920 --> 00:28:17,639
Speaker 3: passed into law. When you see that type of flurry

628
00:28:17,680 --> 00:28:21,280
Speaker 3: of activity, you do see federal action happen more often

629
00:28:21,280 --> 00:28:23,919
Speaker 3: than not. We saw it with cannabis, We saw with

630
00:28:23,960 --> 00:28:26,400
Speaker 3: gay marriage, We saw it with women's suffrage, we saw

631
00:28:26,440 --> 00:28:29,000
Speaker 3: it with interracial marriage, and a number of other issues

632
00:28:29,160 --> 00:28:33,760
Speaker 3: where throughout history, when the states move, the Feds end

633
00:28:33,840 --> 00:28:38,040
Speaker 3: up following suit and acting alongside them. So very proud

634
00:28:38,200 --> 00:28:40,400
Speaker 3: that we've been able to contribute to that momentum. And

635
00:28:40,440 --> 00:28:43,520
Speaker 3: we think that's a big reason why people should be

636
00:28:43,560 --> 00:28:46,040
Speaker 3: working at the state level, because the laboratory of democracy

637
00:28:46,120 --> 00:28:48,560
Speaker 3: is a place where we can try out new ideas

638
00:28:48,880 --> 00:28:51,600
Speaker 3: and show that they work and then force the FEDS

639
00:28:51,640 --> 00:28:53,120
Speaker 3: to act in good behavior.

640
00:28:53,320 --> 00:28:55,480
Speaker 1: All right, hopefully you're enjoying this conversation with Dennis and

641
00:28:55,640 --> 00:28:58,840
Speaker 1: you understand that while we now are getting the protected

642
00:28:58,920 --> 00:29:01,360
Speaker 1: right to customer on coin and so you should certainly

643
00:29:01,400 --> 00:29:03,840
Speaker 1: do that. It's what's revolutionary about bitcoin. But how do

644
00:29:03,880 --> 00:29:05,840
Speaker 1: you do that? I like to use a hardware wallet

645
00:29:05,840 --> 00:29:07,880
Speaker 1: because I want to keep my private keys off the internet.

646
00:29:08,160 --> 00:29:09,640
Speaker 1: You don't want to use a wallet on your phone.

647
00:29:09,640 --> 00:29:11,360
Speaker 1: I've done that before I lost a lot of money,

648
00:29:11,440 --> 00:29:12,800
Speaker 1: So you want to keep them off the internet.

649
00:29:12,800 --> 00:29:15,320
Speaker 2: With a hardware wallet like this, it stores your private key.

650
00:29:15,320 --> 00:29:16,720
Speaker 1: You plug it into your computer when you want to

651
00:29:16,760 --> 00:29:18,720
Speaker 1: sign a transaction, and you unplug it and put it

652
00:29:18,760 --> 00:29:21,959
Speaker 1: back into your safe. I've used Treasure forever seven eight

653
00:29:22,000 --> 00:29:23,680
Speaker 1: years now. I've always used them because I think they're

654
00:29:23,720 --> 00:29:26,840
Speaker 1: the easiest to use. Their newest device is even easier.

655
00:29:26,840 --> 00:29:29,959
Speaker 1: It's got a digital display and they're open source, so

656
00:29:30,000 --> 00:29:32,600
Speaker 1: you know there's no back doors or rug poles waiting

657
00:29:32,640 --> 00:29:35,080
Speaker 1: for you. I highly recommend Treasure. And then you want

658
00:29:35,080 --> 00:29:37,200
Speaker 1: to back up your private key, and they came up

659
00:29:37,200 --> 00:29:38,960
Speaker 1: with this new device where I can inscribe my private

660
00:29:39,040 --> 00:29:41,760
Speaker 1: key on this piece of metal so it can withstand fires,

661
00:29:41,800 --> 00:29:44,440
Speaker 1: flood or anything. Because you want to back up your

662
00:29:44,440 --> 00:29:47,080
Speaker 1: private key, check out Treasure. I've always been using them,

663
00:29:47,080 --> 00:29:49,280
Speaker 1: I'm still using them today. You can save ten percent

664
00:29:49,400 --> 00:29:54,040
Speaker 1: by using codemark Moss. Again, your right to custody your

665
00:29:54,040 --> 00:29:56,520
Speaker 1: own bitcoin is now being entrined into law. You should

666
00:29:56,520 --> 00:29:59,080
Speaker 1: certainly do that and use a device like Treasure. Save

667
00:29:59,120 --> 00:30:02,120
Speaker 1: ten percent by u the code mark Moss. And while

668
00:30:02,120 --> 00:30:04,080
Speaker 1: we're talking about bitcoin, I also want to let you

669
00:30:04,120 --> 00:30:06,760
Speaker 1: know that the Bitcoin Conference in Nashville for twenty twenty

670
00:30:06,760 --> 00:30:09,160
Speaker 1: four is coming up. It's right around the corner. I'm

671
00:30:09,200 --> 00:30:11,000
Speaker 1: going to be there. I hope that you'll be there

672
00:30:11,040 --> 00:30:14,760
Speaker 1: as well. If you care about understanding bitcoin, digital assets, freedom,

673
00:30:14,880 --> 00:30:17,800
Speaker 1: understanding the problems in the world with frivolous money printing,

674
00:30:18,080 --> 00:30:20,960
Speaker 1: then you need to be in the Bitcoin Conference in Nashville.

675
00:30:21,000 --> 00:30:23,720
Speaker 1: It's July twenty fifth through twenty seventh. It's the largest

676
00:30:23,720 --> 00:30:26,760
Speaker 1: bitcoin fintech conference in the world, and it's really it's

677
00:30:26,800 --> 00:30:29,840
Speaker 1: a beacon of monetary freedom. It's a glimmer of hope

678
00:30:29,880 --> 00:30:33,600
Speaker 1: amongst the darkening macroeconomic backdrop. Like I said, I'm gonna

679
00:30:33,600 --> 00:30:35,560
Speaker 1: be there, lots of top speakers are going to be,

680
00:30:35,640 --> 00:30:37,120
Speaker 1: their companies are going to be their thought leaders are

681
00:30:37,160 --> 00:30:39,760
Speaker 1: going to be there. And ticket prices keep going up,

682
00:30:40,000 --> 00:30:41,520
Speaker 1: and so right now today is going to be the

683
00:30:41,560 --> 00:30:43,280
Speaker 1: cheapest you can get it. And I can save you

684
00:30:43,280 --> 00:30:45,600
Speaker 1: an extra ten percent if you use my code Mark

685
00:30:45,720 --> 00:30:48,320
Speaker 1: Moss at checkout. But like I said, ticket prices just

686
00:30:48,400 --> 00:30:51,120
Speaker 1: keep going up. So don't wait, get your tickets, save

687
00:30:51,200 --> 00:30:53,760
Speaker 1: ten percent with code Mark Moss and let me know.

688
00:30:53,840 --> 00:30:55,040
Speaker 1: Hit me up on social media if you're going to

689
00:30:55,080 --> 00:30:56,000
Speaker 1: be there, because I want to meet you.

690
00:30:56,360 --> 00:30:56,560
Speaker 2: Yeah.

691
00:30:56,600 --> 00:30:58,960
Speaker 1: I love that. That's something I'm going to spend a

692
00:30:58,960 --> 00:31:01,160
Speaker 1: second on that. The laboratory or of democracy. I've never

693
00:31:01,200 --> 00:31:02,640
Speaker 1: heard it a termed that way.

694
00:31:02,760 --> 00:31:03,360
Speaker 2: But I like that.

695
00:31:03,400 --> 00:31:06,600
Speaker 1: And that's when states can compete. We can find through competition,

696
00:31:06,680 --> 00:31:09,440
Speaker 1: we can find out better product service prices. Is what

697
00:31:09,480 --> 00:31:12,000
Speaker 1: I typically call competition, and it allows us to try

698
00:31:12,040 --> 00:31:14,440
Speaker 1: different things and see what works. And so to the

699
00:31:14,440 --> 00:31:15,880
Speaker 1: point that you're kind of making them at the end,

700
00:31:15,880 --> 00:31:18,200
Speaker 1: I might disagree a little bit. I mean, obviously, per

701
00:31:18,280 --> 00:31:20,720
Speaker 1: the Constitution, the states are supposed to have the rights.

702
00:31:20,760 --> 00:31:22,480
Speaker 1: The federal law is not really supposed to have much

703
00:31:22,520 --> 00:31:24,960
Speaker 1: power over us on a day to day basis. Unfortunately,

704
00:31:25,000 --> 00:31:27,719
Speaker 1: the federal law has been creeping, creeping, creeping, creeping, creeping,

705
00:31:27,720 --> 00:31:29,920
Speaker 1: and now is trying to sort of have control over

706
00:31:29,920 --> 00:31:31,960
Speaker 1: the United States. But we are We see many examples

707
00:31:32,000 --> 00:31:35,000
Speaker 1: where you know, basically right down the middle, red and

708
00:31:35,040 --> 00:31:37,680
Speaker 1: blue states are just dividing. You know, twenty six states

709
00:31:38,000 --> 00:31:42,240
Speaker 1: sign on to you know, whatever, whether it's supporting Trump,

710
00:31:42,800 --> 00:31:44,440
Speaker 1: whether it's actually The next point I want to talk

711
00:31:44,480 --> 00:31:47,040
Speaker 1: about is the CBDs for example. So lots of states

712
00:31:47,080 --> 00:31:49,800
Speaker 1: have come out and banned ESG investing, for example. And

713
00:31:49,840 --> 00:31:52,360
Speaker 1: now we have the CBDC going on. And so we

714
00:31:52,440 --> 00:31:56,640
Speaker 1: just saw the US House passed a bill banning.

715
00:31:56,760 --> 00:31:59,800
Speaker 2: A federal a federal or the Federal Reserve from issuing

716
00:31:59,800 --> 00:32:00,600
Speaker 2: as CBDC.

717
00:32:01,200 --> 00:32:03,920
Speaker 1: And again that seemed to be somewhat bipartisans Well, no,

718
00:32:04,000 --> 00:32:05,360
Speaker 1: that actually seemed to be very partisan.

719
00:32:05,400 --> 00:32:05,480
Speaker 3: Right.

720
00:32:05,520 --> 00:32:09,240
Speaker 1: We had two hundred and thirteen Republicans, only three Democrats

721
00:32:09,320 --> 00:32:11,520
Speaker 1: voted for it. One hundred and ninety two Democrats voted

722
00:32:11,560 --> 00:32:14,560
Speaker 1: against it, so that was extremely red and blue on

723
00:32:14,600 --> 00:32:17,000
Speaker 1: that one. Do you guys work on that, what's your

724
00:32:17,000 --> 00:32:17,479
Speaker 1: take on that?

725
00:32:18,040 --> 00:32:19,640
Speaker 3: I mean, yeah, we spent a lot of time on

726
00:32:19,720 --> 00:32:24,479
Speaker 3: cbdc's you know. Generally speaking, I'm very interested in seeing

727
00:32:25,160 --> 00:32:29,880
Speaker 3: a competition take place over what would be some form

728
00:32:30,080 --> 00:32:34,800
Speaker 3: of dollar stable coin. I don't really prefer the idea

729
00:32:34,920 --> 00:32:38,200
Speaker 3: of a central bank digital currency. I think that they

730
00:32:38,400 --> 00:32:43,920
Speaker 3: not only diminish quite dramatically at our privacy as individuals,

731
00:32:44,520 --> 00:32:46,840
Speaker 3: but they also just give more power to the FED,

732
00:32:47,280 --> 00:32:50,000
Speaker 3: and they take that power away from Congress and from

733
00:32:50,000 --> 00:32:53,880
Speaker 3: the people. And I would much rather see a world

734
00:32:53,920 --> 00:32:58,520
Speaker 3: where we have a US dollar back stable coins competing

735
00:32:59,040 --> 00:33:02,400
Speaker 3: and work to be able to provide great products for

736
00:33:02,480 --> 00:33:05,120
Speaker 3: the American people. And we do see that taking place,

737
00:33:05,600 --> 00:33:07,520
Speaker 3: and ultimately, I think that at the end of the day,

738
00:33:07,840 --> 00:33:10,719
Speaker 3: it's going to be a big win for the US.

739
00:33:11,080 --> 00:33:12,040
Speaker 4: Like you know, a lot of.

740
00:33:12,040 --> 00:33:13,920
Speaker 3: Us in some of us in the bitcoin space. I

741
00:33:13,960 --> 00:33:15,840
Speaker 3: wouldn't say I'm included in this group, but some of

742
00:33:15,880 --> 00:33:17,400
Speaker 3: us in the bitcoin space, you know, want to see

743
00:33:17,400 --> 00:33:21,440
Speaker 3: the dollar system move away. I think that that's that's

744
00:33:21,440 --> 00:33:23,280
Speaker 3: not going to happen anytime soon. We're going to see

745
00:33:23,280 --> 00:33:27,560
Speaker 3: a massive proliferation of stable coins across the world, especially

746
00:33:27,600 --> 00:33:29,480
Speaker 3: as stable coins become one of the number one buyers

747
00:33:29,520 --> 00:33:32,600
Speaker 3: of US treasuries. The United States likes that not only

748
00:33:32,600 --> 00:33:36,520
Speaker 3: are you getting dollars and in the hands of folks

749
00:33:36,520 --> 00:33:39,960
Speaker 3: across the world, you are also you know, those companies

750
00:33:39,960 --> 00:33:42,760
Speaker 3: that are buying that are offering these stable coins are turning.

751
00:33:42,600 --> 00:33:44,680
Speaker 4: Right around and buying US treasuries.

752
00:33:44,720 --> 00:33:47,959
Speaker 3: I mean, tether is like the twentieth largest national holder

753
00:33:48,080 --> 00:33:52,360
Speaker 3: of US treasuries, right behind Germany. That's pretty incredible, especially

754
00:33:52,400 --> 00:33:55,920
Speaker 3: in a time when interest rates are rising. The fact

755
00:33:55,960 --> 00:33:59,920
Speaker 3: that there is a marketplace coming in to buy these treasuries,

756
00:34:00,200 --> 00:34:03,040
Speaker 3: it's actually suppressing those interest rates and keeping interest rates

757
00:34:03,040 --> 00:34:03,960
Speaker 3: lower for Americans.

758
00:34:04,000 --> 00:34:06,120
Speaker 4: So it's really a win win for Americans.

759
00:34:06,160 --> 00:34:08,000
Speaker 3: I think, well, those of us that don't like the

760
00:34:08,000 --> 00:34:09,759
Speaker 3: Fiat system, obviously, you know, we want to see this

761
00:34:09,760 --> 00:34:11,759
Speaker 3: transition and we want to see the system get better.

762
00:34:12,160 --> 00:34:15,480
Speaker 4: I also think that the system does will get better.

763
00:34:15,560 --> 00:34:19,520
Speaker 3: I don't think we necessarily need to have a crash landing.

764
00:34:19,560 --> 00:34:24,279
Speaker 3: I think we can soft land this plane and harmonize

765
00:34:24,280 --> 00:34:25,160
Speaker 3: these two worlds.

766
00:34:25,400 --> 00:34:27,279
Speaker 4: I think that bitcoin ultimately can.

767
00:34:27,200 --> 00:34:31,160
Speaker 3: Become a really powerful tool to be able to show

768
00:34:31,200 --> 00:34:33,799
Speaker 3: what's going on in the economy. And at the end

769
00:34:33,800 --> 00:34:35,759
Speaker 3: of the day, I think it will help keep the

770
00:34:37,400 --> 00:34:41,480
Speaker 3: people or the industries or the institutions overseeing that fiat

771
00:34:41,480 --> 00:34:43,960
Speaker 3: system more responsible, right, because it's like a mirror that

772
00:34:43,960 --> 00:34:46,080
Speaker 3: you're looking at and it like it reflux every bad

773
00:34:46,360 --> 00:34:48,520
Speaker 3: move that you make. So at the end of the day,

774
00:34:48,520 --> 00:34:53,520
Speaker 3: I think bitcoin instills more monetary responsibility in governments. I

775
00:34:53,520 --> 00:34:56,800
Speaker 3: think that stable coins will proliferate and that those stable

776
00:34:56,800 --> 00:34:59,279
Speaker 3: coin issuers will buy you as treasuries, and that that

777
00:34:59,320 --> 00:35:02,560
Speaker 3: will help stay the US economy and really the world.

778
00:35:02,840 --> 00:35:04,839
Speaker 3: And then as more people this is my big pitch

779
00:35:04,840 --> 00:35:06,960
Speaker 3: to bitcoiners too, It's like, as more people are on

780
00:35:07,000 --> 00:35:09,440
Speaker 3: stable coins, they're gonna buy bitcoin. You wonder how I

781
00:35:09,480 --> 00:35:12,759
Speaker 3: know that because the largest buyers of bitcoin are all

782
00:35:12,880 --> 00:35:16,120
Speaker 3: the people who hold us scholars, like all the Americans.

783
00:35:15,760 --> 00:35:16,480
Speaker 4: Have all the bitcoin.

784
00:35:17,040 --> 00:35:19,640
Speaker 3: Why Because, at the end of the day, like the

785
00:35:19,719 --> 00:35:23,440
Speaker 3: dollar helps us to have a much more stable ability

786
00:35:23,440 --> 00:35:25,440
Speaker 3: to plan for the future and to be able to

787
00:35:25,480 --> 00:35:27,359
Speaker 3: pay for our groceries and pay for our rent. Yes,

788
00:35:27,400 --> 00:35:32,400
Speaker 3: inflation has been raging recently. It's diminishing. But compare that

789
00:35:32,440 --> 00:35:36,359
Speaker 3: to like people in Zimbabwe, Compare that to people in Venezuela.

790
00:35:36,440 --> 00:35:39,839
Speaker 3: Compare that to people across the world with local currencies

791
00:35:40,040 --> 00:35:43,680
Speaker 3: that just aren't operating at the way that they should be.

792
00:35:43,920 --> 00:35:46,399
Speaker 3: Moving to a dollar system for them will help them

793
00:35:46,440 --> 00:35:48,640
Speaker 3: transition in a better way towards bitcoin. I mean, I've

794
00:35:48,640 --> 00:35:50,720
Speaker 3: heard you hear all the time, people go into Africa,

795
00:35:51,520 --> 00:35:53,560
Speaker 3: people go into Latin America. You know, why don't we

796
00:35:53,600 --> 00:35:57,040
Speaker 3: see this large mass adoption of bitcoin because it's.

797
00:35:57,320 --> 00:35:59,799
Speaker 4: Not quite stable enough for people to like plan their

798
00:36:00,440 --> 00:36:02,759
Speaker 4: out and they're rent out. But I think the dollar is.

799
00:36:03,040 --> 00:36:06,480
Speaker 3: And then as people transition to a crypto stable coin dollar,

800
00:36:07,160 --> 00:36:09,839
Speaker 3: then from there they're also going to say, oh wow,

801
00:36:10,640 --> 00:36:12,520
Speaker 3: in their wallet where they're looking at all the exchange

802
00:36:12,600 --> 00:36:14,600
Speaker 3: rates of all the digital assets, a little at this

803
00:36:14,600 --> 00:36:15,279
Speaker 3: bitcoin thing.

804
00:36:16,120 --> 00:36:17,440
Speaker 4: You know what, I've actually been able to save a

805
00:36:17,480 --> 00:36:18,280
Speaker 4: little better recently.

806
00:36:18,480 --> 00:36:20,440
Speaker 3: I'm gonna take a little bit of my money and

807
00:36:20,440 --> 00:36:21,640
Speaker 3: I'm gonna put it in bitcoin.

808
00:36:21,800 --> 00:36:23,319
Speaker 4: People need to keep in mind. This is the last

809
00:36:23,320 --> 00:36:24,400
Speaker 4: point I like to make on this.

810
00:36:24,440 --> 00:36:27,640
Speaker 3: I think it's really important that the ability to save

811
00:36:27,640 --> 00:36:30,839
Speaker 3: for the future and to actually save in a bank

812
00:36:30,880 --> 00:36:32,759
Speaker 3: account that you know that's not gonna get pillaged. Is

813
00:36:32,800 --> 00:36:35,480
Speaker 3: like a Western privilege. A lot of parts of Africa,

814
00:36:35,480 --> 00:36:37,360
Speaker 3: a lot of parts of Latin America or the world.

815
00:36:37,320 --> 00:36:38,719
Speaker 4: Do not have this privilege.

816
00:36:38,760 --> 00:36:41,520
Speaker 3: They have unstable currencies, they can't save in, and even

817
00:36:41,560 --> 00:36:43,160
Speaker 3: if they do save in them, they put them in

818
00:36:43,200 --> 00:36:45,480
Speaker 3: a bank account, They're gonna get pillaged. If you want

819
00:36:45,480 --> 00:36:47,240
Speaker 3: to save for a house, and a lot of these places,

820
00:36:47,280 --> 00:36:49,520
Speaker 3: you have to buy like save in bricks. You have

821
00:36:49,520 --> 00:36:52,040
Speaker 3: to buy the bricks individually because you know that your

822
00:36:52,040 --> 00:36:54,120
Speaker 3: local currency is not going to maintain its value in

823
00:36:54,200 --> 00:36:55,840
Speaker 3: order to pay for that house in the future.

824
00:36:56,120 --> 00:36:57,960
Speaker 4: So I know it's a little.

825
00:36:58,600 --> 00:37:00,719
Speaker 3: I would say counterintuitive for some folks that want to

826
00:37:00,719 --> 00:37:02,360
Speaker 3: see bitcoin be successful.

827
00:37:02,600 --> 00:37:04,080
Speaker 4: But at the end of the day, I do really

828
00:37:04,120 --> 00:37:05,319
Speaker 4: believe that as we.

829
00:37:05,400 --> 00:37:07,640
Speaker 3: Move towards the bitcoin world, we will see a pliferation

830
00:37:07,680 --> 00:37:09,839
Speaker 3: of stable coins that really unlocks the ability for people

831
00:37:09,880 --> 00:37:11,440
Speaker 3: to buy even more bitcoin.

832
00:37:11,840 --> 00:37:13,280
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, no, I totally agree.

833
00:37:13,440 --> 00:37:15,920
Speaker 1: There's interim steps. So I try to remind people all

834
00:37:15,920 --> 00:37:17,560
Speaker 1: the time this is a process.

835
00:37:17,600 --> 00:37:18,440
Speaker 2: It's not an event.

836
00:37:18,920 --> 00:37:20,680
Speaker 1: So like we wake up one day and it happens,

837
00:37:20,719 --> 00:37:24,200
Speaker 1: is there's a process that happens. I think most nations,

838
00:37:24,280 --> 00:37:26,400
Speaker 1: especially the rise of the bricks, I mean China, Russia

839
00:37:26,400 --> 00:37:27,880
Speaker 1: as well. They're probably going to try and go back

840
00:37:27,920 --> 00:37:30,000
Speaker 1: to gold somewhere. In the meantime, I think that might

841
00:37:30,040 --> 00:37:33,000
Speaker 1: be an intermediary step as well. The people more decentralized

842
00:37:33,000 --> 00:37:34,879
Speaker 1: probably go to more of like a US dollar stable coin.

843
00:37:35,080 --> 00:37:35,759
Speaker 2: There's going to be.

844
00:37:35,840 --> 00:37:38,360
Speaker 1: Lots of things that are being tried and tested, and

845
00:37:38,400 --> 00:37:40,480
Speaker 1: there's a process that it's going to take us to

846
00:37:40,480 --> 00:37:42,640
Speaker 1: get there. But going back to the CBDC ban for

847
00:37:42,680 --> 00:37:45,680
Speaker 1: a second, they seem to be very partisan. It got

848
00:37:45,680 --> 00:37:47,279
Speaker 1: through the House, but this still has to get through

849
00:37:47,280 --> 00:37:48,879
Speaker 1: the Senate as well. Am I right on that.

850
00:37:49,000 --> 00:37:51,640
Speaker 3: The CBDC band, Yes, that passed to the House, and

851
00:37:51,680 --> 00:37:54,080
Speaker 3: it's probably has even less of a chance to get

852
00:37:54,080 --> 00:37:54,600
Speaker 3: to the Senate.

853
00:37:54,760 --> 00:37:56,719
Speaker 1: In regards to the CBDC just a little bit. I'm

854
00:37:56,800 --> 00:37:58,680
Speaker 1: just curious if you've dug into this a lot. I

855
00:37:58,680 --> 00:38:02,719
Speaker 1: know you've probably worked on it quite a bit in

856
00:38:02,760 --> 00:38:05,359
Speaker 1: today's world. I just saw Jordan's Peters and I took

857
00:38:05,360 --> 00:38:06,759
Speaker 1: my daughter to go see him a week ago.

858
00:38:07,000 --> 00:38:08,080
Speaker 2: Was amazing and they.

859
00:38:07,960 --> 00:38:10,200
Speaker 1: Talked about how at the end of a society where

860
00:38:10,200 --> 00:38:14,040
Speaker 1: we start to think that we're too smart, he references

861
00:38:14,080 --> 00:38:17,200
Speaker 1: the Tower of Babel. We can no longer understand each

862
00:38:17,200 --> 00:38:19,479
Speaker 1: other anymore. And he said, the story behind the Tower

863
00:38:19,520 --> 00:38:24,759
Speaker 1: of Babel is that they worshiped engineering. And when we

864
00:38:24,800 --> 00:38:27,000
Speaker 1: get so full of conceit, we can no longer understand

865
00:38:27,000 --> 00:38:30,160
Speaker 1: each other. And so today says like what's a woman?

866
00:38:30,360 --> 00:38:33,120
Speaker 1: We can't understand each other anymore. And so definitions have

867
00:38:33,200 --> 00:38:35,360
Speaker 1: gotten lost. And so going back.

868
00:38:35,200 --> 00:38:37,960
Speaker 2: To CBDC, like what is that?

869
00:38:38,320 --> 00:38:41,640
Speaker 1: So, for example, eighty or about ninety percent of all

870
00:38:41,680 --> 00:38:44,719
Speaker 1: dollar transactions are done digitally right now. Anyway, I don't

871
00:38:44,719 --> 00:38:46,319
Speaker 1: really carry a lot of cash, I hate, it's all

872
00:38:46,440 --> 00:38:49,640
Speaker 1: wire transfers, debit cards, et cetera. And so we're already

873
00:38:49,760 --> 00:38:53,000
Speaker 1: using a digital dollar. And so could they just not

874
00:38:53,239 --> 00:38:56,200
Speaker 1: call it a CBDC? Could they just keep calling it

875
00:38:56,239 --> 00:38:58,560
Speaker 1: a dollar? But since it's already digital dollars anyway, they

876
00:38:58,600 --> 00:39:01,120
Speaker 1: just kind of put the extra things in there. It

877
00:39:01,200 --> 00:39:03,000
Speaker 1: runs on a different set of rails. They don't really

878
00:39:03,040 --> 00:39:05,680
Speaker 1: tell us that. I mean, they can ban the word, right,

879
00:39:05,719 --> 00:39:08,480
Speaker 1: but like how intricate is the bill and like what

880
00:39:08,640 --> 00:39:11,200
Speaker 1: exactly is it actually trying to block?

881
00:39:11,840 --> 00:39:17,319
Speaker 3: I mean, I would say, ultimately, the major problem, I

882
00:39:17,360 --> 00:39:22,279
Speaker 3: think that a lot of lawmakers have with cbdc's is

883
00:39:22,320 --> 00:39:26,320
Speaker 3: that they are going to diminish the amount of privacy

884
00:39:26,320 --> 00:39:30,600
Speaker 3: that Americans have because it will create a payment system

885
00:39:30,680 --> 00:39:34,480
Speaker 3: where the FED has total like access to all the

886
00:39:34,560 --> 00:39:39,880
Speaker 3: data that's going on unmitigated right now. That's it's slightly different,

887
00:39:39,880 --> 00:39:42,479
Speaker 3: although it's not necessarily too much better, in the sense

888
00:39:42,520 --> 00:39:45,200
Speaker 3: that you know, there's a there's a bunch of different

889
00:39:45,200 --> 00:39:48,680
Speaker 3: companies that have your private information, and you know what

890
00:39:48,719 --> 00:39:51,320
Speaker 3: you're buying and what you're transacting on PayPal.

891
00:39:50,960 --> 00:39:54,040
Speaker 4: MasterCard, visa.

892
00:39:54,960 --> 00:39:57,920
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's it's it's decentralized so to speak. I mean,

893
00:39:57,960 --> 00:40:00,400
Speaker 3: of course they probably have backdoor access to a lot

894
00:40:00,400 --> 00:40:02,960
Speaker 3: of this information, and there's the third party doctrine which

895
00:40:03,040 --> 00:40:05,520
Speaker 3: enables them to anybody.

896
00:40:05,600 --> 00:40:07,279
Speaker 4: That's if you give your the third party.

897
00:40:07,280 --> 00:40:09,759
Speaker 3: Doctor basically says, if I give my information over to

898
00:40:09,800 --> 00:40:12,600
Speaker 3: a third party, that the government can ask that third

899
00:40:12,600 --> 00:40:13,160
Speaker 3: party for it.

900
00:40:13,160 --> 00:40:14,719
Speaker 4: It's not necessarily an invasion of prising.

901
00:40:14,719 --> 00:40:17,840
Speaker 3: And that's it in like a very simplified form, and

902
00:40:17,880 --> 00:40:20,439
Speaker 3: that's what allows the government to invade our privacy, which

903
00:40:20,480 --> 00:40:22,680
Speaker 3: I think is I think I'm obviously opposed to third

904
00:40:22,680 --> 00:40:26,120
Speaker 3: party doctrine, but the FED, it's like washing all that away,

905
00:40:26,320 --> 00:40:30,239
Speaker 3: just and streamlining the capture of your information and your data.

906
00:40:30,239 --> 00:40:32,120
Speaker 3: And I also the second point that I think that

907
00:40:32,280 --> 00:40:36,239
Speaker 3: lawmakers are most concerned about with CBDCs is that it

908
00:40:36,280 --> 00:40:40,760
Speaker 3: gives this granular control over money that we've never seen before,

909
00:40:42,120 --> 00:40:45,439
Speaker 3: and that would be a problem when you get someone

910
00:40:45,440 --> 00:40:47,560
Speaker 3: into power that you don't agree with.

911
00:40:47,520 --> 00:40:49,799
Speaker 4: Like as an example, I mean, we've had.

912
00:40:49,760 --> 00:40:53,400
Speaker 3: Administrations before who have threatened to kick people out of

913
00:40:53,440 --> 00:40:57,759
Speaker 3: the financial system. So the CBDCs would just blow that

914
00:40:57,920 --> 00:40:58,680
Speaker 3: power up.

915
00:40:58,640 --> 00:41:00,800
Speaker 2: And enable threaten What do you mean threatened?

916
00:41:00,800 --> 00:41:03,759
Speaker 1: My friend, doctor Joe Mercola had has been count shut down.

917
00:41:03,760 --> 00:41:05,440
Speaker 1: Everyone that worked for him has a count shut down,

918
00:41:05,440 --> 00:41:07,480
Speaker 1: and the people that work forms families got their count

919
00:41:07,520 --> 00:41:10,560
Speaker 1: shut down. This was just six months ago. This stuff

920
00:41:10,600 --> 00:41:14,600
Speaker 1: happens all the time. So it's really they're really trying

921
00:41:14,640 --> 00:41:20,279
Speaker 1: to protect people's privacy and freedom to transact, and not

922
00:41:20,320 --> 00:41:22,800
Speaker 1: specifically the word CBDC, I guess is what you're saying.

923
00:41:23,040 --> 00:41:25,040
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think that's the big that's the big message

924
00:41:25,040 --> 00:41:28,680
Speaker 3: here is protect people's right to transact, protect people's privacy,

925
00:41:29,239 --> 00:41:33,040
Speaker 3: and that cbdc's with dramatically tear down those those institutions.

926
00:41:33,560 --> 00:41:35,600
Speaker 1: All right, last topic, real quick. I know, we gotta

927
00:41:35,640 --> 00:41:38,160
Speaker 1: we got to wrap this up. But back to sort

928
00:41:38,160 --> 00:41:39,840
Speaker 1: of the comment that you made, and I'm agreeing with that,

929
00:41:39,920 --> 00:41:43,200
Speaker 1: we're seeing the tide shifting, right, We're seeing momentum swinging,

930
00:41:43,640 --> 00:41:46,840
Speaker 1: which again is ridiculous. Of course, we should have freedom

931
00:41:46,880 --> 00:41:49,200
Speaker 1: to transact as we see fit, but at least we're

932
00:41:49,200 --> 00:41:51,440
Speaker 1: starting to see that politically starting to swing back that

933
00:41:51,520 --> 00:41:54,040
Speaker 1: way we talked about sort of Elizabeth Warren and Gary

934
00:41:54,080 --> 00:41:58,319
Speaker 1: Ginsler have been seemingly very aggressive against our freedom to

935
00:41:58,320 --> 00:42:01,080
Speaker 1: transact with crypto and digital assets and bitcoin, et cetera,

936
00:42:01,680 --> 00:42:02,960
Speaker 1: and maybe some of that starting to.

937
00:42:02,960 --> 00:42:03,640
Speaker 2: Shift as well.

938
00:42:03,960 --> 00:42:08,600
Speaker 1: Do you think the yesterday's news of the Ethereum ETF

939
00:42:08,640 --> 00:42:12,520
Speaker 1: getting approved, the spot ETF being approved, is that like

940
00:42:12,600 --> 00:42:15,439
Speaker 1: Gary Ginsler realizing that he's lost the war and he's

941
00:42:15,440 --> 00:42:17,360
Speaker 1: just got to throw the talent. I mean, is this

942
00:42:17,560 --> 00:42:21,440
Speaker 1: like really a big signpost that like, hey Warren Ginsler,

943
00:42:21,440 --> 00:42:23,560
Speaker 1: get out of the way, like we're moving forward, or

944
00:42:23,560 --> 00:42:25,000
Speaker 1: what's your take on that and what does that mean

945
00:42:25,000 --> 00:42:26,600
Speaker 1: in the greater context of things.

946
00:42:26,760 --> 00:42:29,880
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think that's a big capitulation and in some

947
00:42:29,920 --> 00:42:32,520
Speaker 3: ways could be seen as an SEC pivot. Could where

948
00:42:32,560 --> 00:42:35,760
Speaker 3: that came from I think will will be really important

949
00:42:35,760 --> 00:42:37,520
Speaker 3: where that order came from, so to speak. I don't

950
00:42:37,520 --> 00:42:39,600
Speaker 3: know if that was a decision by Gary Gensler himself.

951
00:42:39,960 --> 00:42:42,120
Speaker 3: I don't know if that was something that was from

952
00:42:42,200 --> 00:42:44,759
Speaker 3: on high, the Biden administration or the Warren camp. But

953
00:42:44,840 --> 00:42:48,840
Speaker 3: ultimately that's a level of capitulation or pivoting on the issue.

954
00:42:48,920 --> 00:42:51,879
Speaker 3: Right we everyone was saying twenty five percent chance at

955
00:42:51,920 --> 00:42:55,000
Speaker 3: best of an etherey a METF getting through and not.

956
00:42:55,080 --> 00:42:57,080
Speaker 4: Someone listen, I'm not living my day.

957
00:42:57,120 --> 00:43:00,760
Speaker 3: Isn't getting ruined necessarily if an ETF to and get approved,

958
00:43:00,800 --> 00:43:02,640
Speaker 3: But it does. Again, I think the important message here

959
00:43:02,719 --> 00:43:06,600
Speaker 3: is it highlights how much things are changing and how

960
00:43:06,719 --> 00:43:10,160
Speaker 3: much the momentum has shifted to the side of the

961
00:43:10,200 --> 00:43:14,400
Speaker 3: broader digital acid ecosystem. So yeah, it's interesting to see

962
00:43:14,520 --> 00:43:17,400
Speaker 3: the way it's the way it's played out, don't I

963
00:43:17,480 --> 00:43:19,680
Speaker 3: can't tell you. You can't read minds. I don't think anybody

964
00:43:19,760 --> 00:43:22,000
Speaker 3: really knows yet. But ultimately it is a very positive

965
00:43:22,040 --> 00:43:24,600
Speaker 3: sign and in a momentum builder for the space to

966
00:43:24,640 --> 00:43:26,480
Speaker 3: see this, to see it get passed.

967
00:43:26,960 --> 00:43:29,600
Speaker 2: All right, all right, well, we got a couple minutes left.

968
00:43:29,640 --> 00:43:31,879
Speaker 1: If you want to just stay like obviously Stoshi Action

969
00:43:32,000 --> 00:43:34,279
Speaker 1: Fund is out there on the forefront. Do you want

970
00:43:34,320 --> 00:43:36,520
Speaker 1: to talk about anything like initiatives that you're working on,

971
00:43:36,600 --> 00:43:38,359
Speaker 1: like big things that are maybe in the works, things

972
00:43:38,360 --> 00:43:39,799
Speaker 1: that be paying attention to.

973
00:43:40,200 --> 00:43:40,839
Speaker 4: Absolutely.

974
00:43:40,920 --> 00:43:43,239
Speaker 3: You know, you mentioned d banking just a moment ago,

975
00:43:43,320 --> 00:43:45,360
Speaker 3: and that is an issue that we care deeply about

976
00:43:45,400 --> 00:43:49,240
Speaker 3: as ATOCI Action. We see folks in the bitcoin, bitcoin mining,

977
00:43:49,280 --> 00:43:52,239
Speaker 3: digital asset space being d banked at rates I mean,

978
00:43:52,280 --> 00:43:55,239
Speaker 3: I've never seen in my lifetime, I've never even heard

979
00:43:55,239 --> 00:43:58,160
Speaker 3: of historically, and we want to make sure that we

980
00:43:58,200 --> 00:44:00,640
Speaker 3: put an end to the banking. And there are three

981
00:44:00,719 --> 00:44:04,480
Speaker 3: major components to the powers that be in the banking world.

982
00:44:04,680 --> 00:44:07,920
Speaker 3: That is the OCC. It's the federal regulator for banks.

983
00:44:08,080 --> 00:44:09,840
Speaker 3: It's the FDIC. Those are the guys that do the

984
00:44:09,880 --> 00:44:12,279
Speaker 3: insurance frear bank account. And then there's the FED. They

985
00:44:12,280 --> 00:44:14,760
Speaker 3: have the FED Master accounts. We did a lot of research.

986
00:44:14,760 --> 00:44:16,840
Speaker 3: We put out a big paper on this. I encourage

987
00:44:16,840 --> 00:44:19,040
Speaker 3: people to go look it up on our websites atociaction

988
00:44:19,160 --> 00:44:22,560
Speaker 3: dot io under our policy section under debanking, and it

989
00:44:22,600 --> 00:44:27,080
Speaker 3: really highlights how the major point, the major choke point

990
00:44:27,320 --> 00:44:30,839
Speaker 3: for anyone is the FED Master account. Because the FED

991
00:44:30,920 --> 00:44:33,880
Speaker 3: has godlike power over who gets a fed Master account.

992
00:44:33,880 --> 00:44:36,080
Speaker 3: You don't need to look any further than Caitlyn Long

993
00:44:36,120 --> 00:44:39,040
Speaker 3: and Custodia to know that they were denied a fed

994
00:44:39,080 --> 00:44:41,600
Speaker 3: Master account. In my opinion, I think it was pretty

995
00:44:41,840 --> 00:44:44,759
Speaker 3: obvious it was done in a discriminatory fashion. And so

996
00:44:44,800 --> 00:44:47,680
Speaker 3: we put forward this paper saying this is the problem.

997
00:44:48,000 --> 00:44:50,560
Speaker 3: Fed Master accounts for the problem. How do we solve

998
00:44:50,640 --> 00:44:52,879
Speaker 3: this problem? And I believe that we solve it by

999
00:44:52,920 --> 00:44:57,400
Speaker 3: having states have their own fed Master accounts. And we're

1000
00:44:57,440 --> 00:44:59,360
Speaker 3: already all the pathways to showing that that can be

1001
00:44:59,360 --> 00:45:00,120
Speaker 3: truly success.

1002
00:45:01,320 --> 00:45:02,200
Speaker 4: The state of Texas.

1003
00:45:01,960 --> 00:45:04,920
Speaker 3: Already has its own fed Master account. North Dakota already

1004
00:45:04,920 --> 00:45:06,960
Speaker 3: has a state bank with its own fed Master account.

1005
00:45:07,080 --> 00:45:09,200
Speaker 3: So we don't even need to pass legislation to see

1006
00:45:09,200 --> 00:45:11,080
Speaker 3: if this thing will work. We really just need to

1007
00:45:11,480 --> 00:45:14,280
Speaker 3: take that, knowing that we have those fed Master accounts

1008
00:45:14,280 --> 00:45:17,319
Speaker 3: and say, okay, let's position this industry underneath that fed

1009
00:45:17,320 --> 00:45:20,080
Speaker 3: Master account and see what the federal government is going

1010
00:45:20,120 --> 00:45:22,040
Speaker 3: to try to come after the states, Because at the

1011
00:45:22,080 --> 00:45:23,799
Speaker 3: end of the day, if they try to come after

1012
00:45:23,880 --> 00:45:26,759
Speaker 3: state's powers to bank an industry and their own fed

1013
00:45:26,800 --> 00:45:29,080
Speaker 3: Master account, you are just like striking right at the

1014
00:45:29,080 --> 00:45:31,640
Speaker 3: heart of constitutional powers that are given to the states

1015
00:45:31,640 --> 00:45:33,640
Speaker 3: in the dual banking system. And if you do that,

1016
00:45:33,719 --> 00:45:36,960
Speaker 3: you are going to see the fastest tracked a banking

1017
00:45:37,920 --> 00:45:40,520
Speaker 3: lawsuit get to the Supreme Court in a matter of time.

1018
00:45:40,520 --> 00:45:42,600
Speaker 3: And I think with the current makeup that Supreme Court

1019
00:45:42,640 --> 00:45:46,160
Speaker 3: would definitely side that dual banking still exist in America,

1020
00:45:46,360 --> 00:45:49,360
Speaker 3: and if that happens, we essentially end debanking in the

1021
00:45:49,440 --> 00:45:50,440
Speaker 3: United States overnight.

1022
00:45:50,800 --> 00:45:52,680
Speaker 1: Now you talk about the FED Master account and that's,

1023
00:45:52,719 --> 00:45:54,520
Speaker 1: like you said, reference Kaitlyn Long who's been on the

1024
00:45:54,520 --> 00:45:56,279
Speaker 1: show a couple of times, and she's trying to get

1025
00:45:56,280 --> 00:45:58,600
Speaker 1: a bank through and they won't give her the ability

1026
00:45:58,640 --> 00:46:01,239
Speaker 1: or they won't pass they want license that to go through.

1027
00:46:01,400 --> 00:46:03,359
Speaker 1: But when you talk about the banking like Conductor Joe

1028
00:46:03,440 --> 00:46:06,960
Speaker 1: mccola's case, for example, it was the commercial bank that

1029
00:46:07,000 --> 00:46:10,000
Speaker 1: shuts a count down. So I mean, are you saying

1030
00:46:10,000 --> 00:46:11,719
Speaker 1: are you saying that came from the Fed? Like, hey,

1031
00:46:11,719 --> 00:46:13,480
Speaker 1: commercial banks shut his count down, But it seems like

1032
00:46:13,480 --> 00:46:15,279
Speaker 1: the decision was made at the lower level because he

1033
00:46:15,360 --> 00:46:16,400
Speaker 1: was able to get other banks.

1034
00:46:16,760 --> 00:46:19,160
Speaker 3: Listen, the banks are businesses. Why would a bank not

1035
00:46:19,239 --> 00:46:21,480
Speaker 3: want you to come do business with them? It's because

1036
00:46:21,520 --> 00:46:25,239
Speaker 3: the federal regulators are applying undue pressure on banks to

1037
00:46:25,560 --> 00:46:28,200
Speaker 3: debank those people that they don't politically agree with, that

1038
00:46:28,239 --> 00:46:30,200
Speaker 3: they don't align with, or that they don't they think

1039
00:46:30,280 --> 00:46:33,920
Speaker 3: is a competition to their banking system. Right, So the

1040
00:46:33,960 --> 00:46:36,239
Speaker 3: way this works is the FDIC says, hey, I'm going

1041
00:46:36,320 --> 00:46:37,080
Speaker 3: to raise your rates.

1042
00:46:37,160 --> 00:46:40,759
Speaker 4: If you bank this industry, you know, you better watch out.

1043
00:46:41,120 --> 00:46:43,719
Speaker 3: And then the banks themselves are like, well, we don't

1044
00:46:43,719 --> 00:46:45,440
Speaker 3: want to deal with that, or the FED or someone

1045
00:46:45,440 --> 00:46:47,319
Speaker 3: else in the regulatory space, like, we're going to audit

1046
00:46:47,360 --> 00:46:49,040
Speaker 3: you if you don't, if you don't get rid of

1047
00:46:49,040 --> 00:46:52,000
Speaker 3: these crypto people, see they're safe, that they're unsafe, they're

1048
00:46:52,040 --> 00:46:53,840
Speaker 3: not sound, So we're gonna have to audit you a

1049
00:46:53,840 --> 00:46:55,640
Speaker 3: little bit more and that's going to bring your costs up.

1050
00:46:55,920 --> 00:46:58,520
Speaker 4: So it's very pervasive the way that it's taking place.

1051
00:46:58,640 --> 00:47:00,680
Speaker 3: But at the end of the day, that will power

1052
00:47:00,800 --> 00:47:02,880
Speaker 3: at the FED Master accounts is the one that you

1053
00:47:02,920 --> 00:47:05,680
Speaker 3: hone in on because you can get away from the FDIIC. Right,

1054
00:47:05,719 --> 00:47:08,160
Speaker 3: you can say I don't want insurance at my bank.

1055
00:47:08,520 --> 00:47:11,440
Speaker 3: I'm going to just do a fully reserve back one

1056
00:47:12,360 --> 00:47:15,440
Speaker 3: and five percent like Kitlin Long. You can also In

1057
00:47:15,480 --> 00:47:17,840
Speaker 3: the case of the OCC which is the federal regulator

1058
00:47:17,920 --> 00:47:19,560
Speaker 3: for banks, you can say, well, I don't want to

1059
00:47:19,600 --> 00:47:20,360
Speaker 3: be federally regulated.

1060
00:47:20,360 --> 00:47:22,040
Speaker 4: I want to be regulated by my state. I'm going

1061
00:47:22,080 --> 00:47:23,080
Speaker 4: to be a state charter bank.

1062
00:47:23,160 --> 00:47:25,920
Speaker 3: So you can avoid those two regulators, but you cannot

1063
00:47:26,040 --> 00:47:29,520
Speaker 3: avoid the FED Master account. It is impossible. You have

1064
00:47:29,600 --> 00:47:30,760
Speaker 3: to have either ad.

1065
00:47:30,600 --> 00:47:32,799
Speaker 4: Direct access to a FED Master account or you have to.

1066
00:47:32,760 --> 00:47:36,160
Speaker 3: Bank with an intermediary bank where or your bank that

1067
00:47:36,160 --> 00:47:38,719
Speaker 3: you want to go to that say like offers crypto services,

1068
00:47:38,880 --> 00:47:40,759
Speaker 3: has to go to an intermatory bank and say, hey,

1069
00:47:40,880 --> 00:47:42,839
Speaker 3: you have a FED Master account, let me use your

1070
00:47:42,880 --> 00:47:45,320
Speaker 3: settlement process with the FED in order to ensure that

1071
00:47:45,360 --> 00:47:48,080
Speaker 3: I can not only bank these people, but still you know,

1072
00:47:48,120 --> 00:47:51,640
Speaker 3: get everything cleared out. But that is a situation where

1073
00:47:51,920 --> 00:47:53,920
Speaker 3: those even those intermediary banks are saying, we don't want

1074
00:47:53,920 --> 00:47:55,919
Speaker 3: to touch anything. We don't want to touch other banks

1075
00:47:55,960 --> 00:47:58,040
Speaker 3: that are crypt banking the crypto industry, because we're going

1076
00:47:58,080 --> 00:47:59,840
Speaker 3: to get pressure applied to us by that, you know,

1077
00:47:59,840 --> 00:48:02,520
Speaker 3: that federal banking mafia system that's been created over the

1078
00:48:03,239 --> 00:48:06,399
Speaker 3: decades and over the last hundred years. Really, so that's

1079
00:48:06,400 --> 00:48:09,160
Speaker 3: really where the problem is is that if you try

1080
00:48:09,200 --> 00:48:12,040
Speaker 3: to bank this space, then you're going to run into

1081
00:48:12,040 --> 00:48:14,520
Speaker 3: one of those problems. And even if you try to

1082
00:48:14,560 --> 00:48:17,880
Speaker 3: eliminate the two, the FDIC and OCC, you simply cannot

1083
00:48:18,320 --> 00:48:20,200
Speaker 3: eliminate that chow point the Federal Reserve.

1084
00:48:20,800 --> 00:48:22,680
Speaker 2: Good stuff, Dennis. I know we got to wrap this up.

1085
00:48:22,880 --> 00:48:24,680
Speaker 1: You're on your way to a nice little vocation, so

1086
00:48:24,680 --> 00:48:26,040
Speaker 1: I don't want to hold you back from that, but

1087
00:48:26,040 --> 00:48:27,480
Speaker 1: I do want to just kind of shout out just

1088
00:48:27,520 --> 00:48:29,400
Speaker 1: a little challenge just to the audience.

1089
00:48:29,840 --> 00:48:30,040
Speaker 2: Again.

1090
00:48:30,080 --> 00:48:32,560
Speaker 1: I was just seeing Jordan Peterson live last week with

1091
00:48:32,600 --> 00:48:35,600
Speaker 1: my daughter. He was amazing as always, and at the

1092
00:48:35,719 --> 00:48:38,759
Speaker 1: end he talked about how and really his message has

1093
00:48:38,760 --> 00:48:41,719
Speaker 1: always been that we should all take personal responsibility for ourselves,

1094
00:48:41,920 --> 00:48:44,360
Speaker 1: and that's always been his message, like pull yourself up

1095
00:48:44,400 --> 00:48:46,880
Speaker 1: from a bootstraps, wipe your face off, like take responsibility

1096
00:48:46,920 --> 00:48:50,120
Speaker 1: for yourself. And he talked about the difference of tyranny

1097
00:48:50,160 --> 00:48:52,560
Speaker 1: and slavery and how they're sort of opposite sides and

1098
00:48:52,640 --> 00:48:55,200
Speaker 1: the slave doesn't want to take personal responsibility for themselves,

1099
00:48:55,239 --> 00:48:57,279
Speaker 1: are just always being told what to do. And the

1100
00:48:57,360 --> 00:49:00,880
Speaker 1: problem is that he says that specifically in regards to

1101
00:49:00,920 --> 00:49:02,880
Speaker 1: the way the world is working in politics.

1102
00:49:02,480 --> 00:49:05,400
Speaker 2: And specific specificity, if.

1103
00:49:05,239 --> 00:49:08,440
Speaker 1: We don't step up and take personal responsibility for ourselves,

1104
00:49:08,719 --> 00:49:11,279
Speaker 1: and we don't step up and take personal responsibility for

1105
00:49:11,440 --> 00:49:15,239
Speaker 1: our our political system, our local politics, and maybe on

1106
00:49:15,239 --> 00:49:17,680
Speaker 1: a bigger level, if we don't step up and take

1107
00:49:17,719 --> 00:49:22,080
Speaker 1: responsibility for that, then the tyrants will So by abdicating

1108
00:49:22,120 --> 00:49:25,319
Speaker 1: our responsibility, that leaves a vacuum. The tyrants will come

1109
00:49:25,320 --> 00:49:28,160
Speaker 1: and pick that up. And so his challenge is be

1110
00:49:28,239 --> 00:49:30,640
Speaker 1: responsible not just for yourself, but for your community and

1111
00:49:30,680 --> 00:49:33,759
Speaker 1: for your and for the political system as well, if

1112
00:49:33,800 --> 00:49:36,279
Speaker 1: you care, and to be honest with you, Dennis, I

1113
00:49:36,320 --> 00:49:37,719
Speaker 1: heard him say this. This is the second time I

1114
00:49:37,719 --> 00:49:40,040
Speaker 1: heard him say this, and it's just like, oh, it's

1115
00:49:40,040 --> 00:49:42,560
Speaker 1: like man, it's like he's he's absolutely right. So I

1116
00:49:42,600 --> 00:49:45,680
Speaker 1: applaud what you're doing. And I recommend everybody go check

1117
00:49:45,680 --> 00:49:48,719
Speaker 1: out the Tushi Action Fund. If you can't, if you

1118
00:49:48,760 --> 00:49:50,640
Speaker 1: don't have the time, maybe you can at least support

1119
00:49:50,680 --> 00:49:52,680
Speaker 1: them in some way. Anything else you want to say

1120
00:49:52,719 --> 00:49:53,799
Speaker 1: in closing, Dennis.

1121
00:49:53,560 --> 00:49:56,319
Speaker 3: No, thank you again for having me on Mark, And yeah,

1122
00:49:56,560 --> 00:49:59,360
Speaker 3: I'll finish with a with a great Plato quote.

1123
00:49:59,760 --> 00:50:01,240
Speaker 4: You know, one of the.

1124
00:50:00,840 --> 00:50:05,080
Speaker 3: Penalties for refusing to participate in politics is that you

1125
00:50:05,280 --> 00:50:08,400
Speaker 3: end up being governed by your inferiors. So it's true.

1126
00:50:09,040 --> 00:50:10,480
Speaker 3: I know a lot of people don't want to engage

1127
00:50:10,480 --> 00:50:12,759
Speaker 3: in the political system. They don't like it, it's gross. But

1128
00:50:12,840 --> 00:50:15,399
Speaker 3: if you just say, hey, I'm going to abdicate that responsibility,

1129
00:50:15,440 --> 00:50:17,480
Speaker 3: I'm not going to get involved, somebody's going to get

1130
00:50:17,520 --> 00:50:19,360
Speaker 3: involved and they're going to end up making rules that

1131
00:50:19,400 --> 00:50:21,560
Speaker 3: you have to follow. So I always tell people, you know,

1132
00:50:21,600 --> 00:50:24,399
Speaker 3: if you want to make sure that America upholds its

1133
00:50:24,480 --> 00:50:26,439
Speaker 3: values and that we had the right direction, that there's

1134
00:50:26,440 --> 00:50:27,840
Speaker 3: no better way to do that than to get involved

1135
00:50:27,880 --> 00:50:28,760
Speaker 3: in the political process.

1136
00:50:29,880 --> 00:50:32,680
Speaker 2: Awesome, all right, Dennis. Always a pleasure. Thanks for joining

1137
00:50:32,680 --> 00:50:33,040
Speaker 2: me today.

1138
00:50:33,320 --> 00:50:33,919
Speaker 4: Thank you, Mark