WEBVTT - Book Club Kick-Off: Marvel Rivals Favs and Superman Lore Deep Dives 0:00:00.440 --> 0:00:05.760 Warning, Today's episode contains spoilers for slight spoilers for a 0:00:05.760 --> 0:00:11.040 bunch of different Superman stories from the DC Comics canon, 0:00:11.080 --> 0:00:16.760 which Rosie and I enjoy, and some different Marvel comics 0:00:16.800 --> 0:00:20.919 center around Marvel Rivals characters such as the very cute 0:00:20.960 --> 0:00:40.480 Jeff the Lantrop be warning. Hello, my name is Jason 0:00:40.479 --> 0:00:44.120 Concepcion and I'm Rosday Night, and welcome back to x 0:00:44.200 --> 0:00:46.880 Ray Vision of the podcast where we dive DPD favor shows. 0:00:46.560 --> 0:00:48.280 Movies, colleagues of pop culture, comedy. 0:00:48.080 --> 0:00:51.720 From our podcast where we're bringing you three episodes a week, 0:00:52.040 --> 0:00:56.760 every Tuesday, every Thursday, and Wednesday, or maybe a different. 0:00:56.520 --> 0:01:01.080 Day, maybe a different day, who knows. Today's episode, we 0:01:01.120 --> 0:01:04.120 are kicking off our very first book club this month. 0:01:04.120 --> 0:01:07.000 For book Club, we wanted to start with some recommendations 0:01:07.640 --> 0:01:11.240 featuring two big properties that you've all been asking us about, 0:01:11.720 --> 0:01:16.880 the Man of Steel, Superman and comics inspired by the 0:01:16.959 --> 0:01:21.280 new smash hit Hero Shooter Marvel Rivals. And then we 0:01:21.319 --> 0:01:23.800 are going to introduce you to what our first ever 0:01:23.920 --> 0:01:27.040 interactive book club book will be for next month, giving 0:01:27.080 --> 0:01:29.120 you plenty of time to find a copy for yourself 0:01:29.160 --> 0:01:31.920 from your local library, local comic shop. Then you can 0:01:32.200 --> 0:01:35.200 be ready to discuss it with us then, but first 0:01:35.520 --> 0:01:37.760 we're going to do some Superman Rex. Get ready for 0:01:37.760 --> 0:01:40.000 the Year of Superman. We're going to do some Marvel 0:01:40.080 --> 0:01:43.040 Rivals Rex. What should you read if you love Luna 0:01:43.040 --> 0:01:45.640 Snow or Jeff de Landshark, We're going to be here 0:01:45.680 --> 0:01:46.240 to tell. 0:01:46.120 --> 0:01:50.000 You, Okay, twenty twenty five is going to be your 0:01:50.080 --> 0:01:53.360 Superman Rose it feels like it. The Superman trailer is 0:01:53.400 --> 0:01:57.120 currently the most watched trailer in Warner Brothers history. It 0:01:57.280 --> 0:02:00.960 is currently the movie when you look at the Warner 0:02:01.000 --> 0:02:04.520 Brothers slate specifically and then the movie slate in general 0:02:04.600 --> 0:02:06.800 for twenty twenty five, it's kind of the movie that 0:02:06.920 --> 0:02:10.280 with the most riding on it. And I think the 0:02:10.320 --> 0:02:13.519 metrics we have right now, meaning the trailer, are pretty good. 0:02:13.560 --> 0:02:16.680 That said, a lot riding on this movie, and you 0:02:16.760 --> 0:02:19.440 might ask yourself coming into this. God, you know, I 0:02:19.520 --> 0:02:22.399 think I know Superman. I watched the I watched Man 0:02:22.400 --> 0:02:26.600 of Steel, I've watched the Justice League stuff, and I've 0:02:26.760 --> 0:02:30.400 maybe I've seen the eighties the Christa Reeves Superman things, 0:02:30.400 --> 0:02:32.880 and I know generally about Superman, but I kind of 0:02:32.919 --> 0:02:35.360 want to know a little bit more about Superman. I 0:02:35.400 --> 0:02:37.880 want to maybe hit up my comic shop and read 0:02:37.919 --> 0:02:38.440 some stuff. 0:02:38.880 --> 0:02:40.680 Well, we've got you you. 0:02:41.600 --> 0:02:47.160 Let's start with I think the pick that people who 0:02:47.639 --> 0:02:50.560 are fans of Superman, fans of comics would probably pick 0:02:50.760 --> 0:02:54.040 first when saying where do I start with Superman? 0:02:54.120 --> 0:02:56.040 And it is Grant Morrison and Frank. 0:02:55.880 --> 0:03:01.320 Quietly super creator duos All Star Superman from two thousand 0:03:01.320 --> 0:03:03.560 and five and the else world stories and not a 0:03:03.600 --> 0:03:08.760 canon story, but a wonderful exploration of Superman at his 0:03:08.919 --> 0:03:09.639 most good. 0:03:11.400 --> 0:03:11.600 Yeah. 0:03:11.639 --> 0:03:18.640 I think originally it was going to basically be the 0:03:18.720 --> 0:03:21.679 kind of launch pad for the All Star imprint, right, 0:03:21.720 --> 0:03:23.840 and it was the second one after All Star Batman 0:03:23.880 --> 0:03:26.600 and Robert They've done other ones, and the idea was, Yeah, 0:03:26.600 --> 0:03:30.000 it was like, it's not a fully crazy else Worlds 0:03:30.440 --> 0:03:35.120 story like Batman, Dracula or whatever, but it is still 0:03:35.400 --> 0:03:40.200 unconfined by the ongoing continuity at the time. This is 0:03:41.200 --> 0:03:44.320 one of the books that James Gunn has directly said 0:03:44.440 --> 0:03:47.560 will be an influence. We've seen images of it in 0:03:47.640 --> 0:03:51.280 his production room, We've seen him post about it online. 0:03:51.600 --> 0:03:53.560 This is one of the books where when he posted 0:03:53.640 --> 0:03:58.080 about it, it ended up selling out off certain online 0:03:58.200 --> 0:04:01.080 order sites, which I just absolutely love when that happens. 0:04:01.440 --> 0:04:04.839 I think the reason that this is a very important 0:04:04.840 --> 0:04:10.119 influence on the story is not only is it kind 0:04:10.160 --> 0:04:13.440 of as the name may imply that it is, as 0:04:13.440 --> 0:04:17.520 always with Grant Morrison and Frank it is like a 0:04:17.640 --> 0:04:24.479 very sci fi space about this kind of aborted mission 0:04:24.920 --> 0:04:28.480 to the Sun that was kind of had some lex 0:04:28.600 --> 0:04:31.440 luthor fingers in the pie of why it might not 0:04:31.480 --> 0:04:35.960 have worked. And if you know where Superman's power comes from, 0:04:36.080 --> 0:04:39.280 you may understand that All Star Superman is kind of 0:04:39.320 --> 0:04:41.400 a pun on the idea of the sun and the 0:04:41.480 --> 0:04:45.320 yellow rays of the Sun that charged Superman. So it's 0:04:45.360 --> 0:04:47.599 a great sci fi story and it has a really 0:04:47.680 --> 0:04:52.040 cool high concept idea. But the real reason that people 0:04:53.120 --> 0:05:00.240 love this is that it is about Superman's humanity because 0:05:00.240 --> 0:05:02.960 he's put in a situation where he only has a 0:05:03.000 --> 0:05:06.320 certain amount of time left and he wants to spend 0:05:06.320 --> 0:05:08.680 time with Lois, so he has to reveal who he is, 0:05:08.800 --> 0:05:12.240 and he's very famously. I think the most famous page 0:05:12.240 --> 0:05:19.560 from this is Superman stopping a young teenager from jumping 0:05:19.560 --> 0:05:22.640 off the side of a building and kind of reassuring them, 0:05:23.000 --> 0:05:28.040 And I think that it's an unbelievable testament to Grant 0:05:28.080 --> 0:05:31.599 and Frank that that is what people take away from 0:05:31.600 --> 0:05:34.560 the book, because when you actually reread this book, as 0:05:34.600 --> 0:05:37.800 I was before this podcast, it's like bonkers. 0:05:38.240 --> 0:05:42.000 It is very insane. Here's the quick synopsis. Superman saves 0:05:42.080 --> 0:05:45.520 scientists who are on a mission to study the Sun. 0:05:46.160 --> 0:05:48.960 In the course of doing so, Superman has bombarded with 0:05:49.920 --> 0:05:52.839 the energy from the sun so that his powers go 0:05:53.000 --> 0:05:57.920 like fucking crazy. His strength already you know, beyond measure, 0:05:58.000 --> 0:06:03.520 becomes even more powerful. His powers grow to insane levels, 0:06:03.560 --> 0:06:08.560 but also his cells go into overdrive, and he's going 0:06:08.640 --> 0:06:09.440 to pass away. 0:06:09.839 --> 0:06:13.320 Essentially like what if Superman got cancer? Almost like what 0:06:13.440 --> 0:06:15.520 if he got some cancer? What if his and that 0:06:15.680 --> 0:06:17.640 kind of changes how he perceives. 0:06:18.279 --> 0:06:21.279 So he spends a lot of time saying goodbye to 0:06:21.320 --> 0:06:24.640 the people that he cares about and setting he hopes 0:06:24.640 --> 0:06:29.880 setting the world up to survive and thrive without his protection, 0:06:30.600 --> 0:06:32.599 and in doing so, you know, there's a lot of 0:06:32.600 --> 0:06:35.600 crazy twists and turns. It is a Grant Morrison story, 0:06:36.000 --> 0:06:38.520 but like really, what it is is an exploration of 0:06:38.640 --> 0:06:40.920 the soul of Superman and why he is such a 0:06:40.960 --> 0:06:45.920 good what makes him so good? His sincere and unique 0:06:46.080 --> 0:06:50.159 goodness and will to do something really good. And the 0:06:50.200 --> 0:06:52.000 reason why I think this is a great story for 0:06:52.040 --> 0:06:53.080 people to read is. 0:06:54.560 --> 0:06:56.040 It's a great Lex Luthor story. 0:06:56.520 --> 0:06:58.520 Yeah, it is. I think it's a I think the 0:06:58.600 --> 0:07:01.520 relationship between Lex and Superman here where Lex is a 0:07:01.560 --> 0:07:05.599 super scientist who wants to use his super science brain 0:07:05.920 --> 0:07:08.839 to take down Superman in this kind of extremely high 0:07:08.839 --> 0:07:14.000 concept way. But it also has moments of understanding and 0:07:14.080 --> 0:07:18.080 almost like awe from Luther towards Superman when he kind 0:07:18.120 --> 0:07:21.120 of sees what Superman's real vision for the world is. 0:07:21.800 --> 0:07:25.360 And also for me, this is very important because I 0:07:25.400 --> 0:07:29.240 have been theorizing this since well really since I went 0:07:29.280 --> 0:07:31.560 to the trailer launch and they kind of wouldn't really 0:07:31.600 --> 0:07:35.040 talk about Lois. I do think there is a world 0:07:35.280 --> 0:07:39.360 where Lois ends up with powers in this movie, because 0:07:39.400 --> 0:07:43.760 they're currently Lois is Superwoman. In this book, Lois takes 0:07:43.920 --> 0:07:51.960 a synthesized version of Superman's DNA and kind of becomes 0:07:50.880 --> 0:07:55.240 a superwoman, you know. So I think there's I think 0:07:55.320 --> 0:07:57.560 there's some interesting notes here. But yeah, it's a great 0:07:57.640 --> 0:08:01.120 Lex story too. It's interesting, I will say, and this 0:08:01.200 --> 0:08:02.920 is always what I say when I talk about this book. 0:08:03.040 --> 0:08:06.320 It's not my favorite art by Frank. Like Frank sometimes 0:08:06.360 --> 0:08:08.560 draws some of the stuff that I think is legitimately 0:08:08.880 --> 0:08:11.680 the best stuff you can get. The coloring on this 0:08:11.720 --> 0:08:14.760 one always kind of there's something about it that doesn't 0:08:15.080 --> 0:08:16.840 hit in the same way as some of his other 0:08:16.920 --> 0:08:19.000 work for me. But I do just think it's such 0:08:19.000 --> 0:08:22.080 a fantastic story, and I also think it's an incredible 0:08:22.120 --> 0:08:25.560 science fiction story. And I think sometimes we can forget 0:08:26.320 --> 0:08:30.040 that Superman at its heart is a story about an alien, 0:08:30.160 --> 0:08:32.560 a science fiction character. The end of this story is 0:08:32.600 --> 0:08:35.839 completely wild. I just yeah, I think this is such 0:08:35.880 --> 0:08:36.480 a great book. 0:08:37.679 --> 0:08:43.440 Next up is the classic two part story from the eighties, 0:08:44.080 --> 0:08:47.360 which appears in part one in Superman four to twenty 0:08:47.360 --> 0:08:50.000 three and then part two in Action Comics five eighty 0:08:50.000 --> 0:08:55.479 three called Whatever Happened to the Man of Tomorrow? 0:08:55.679 --> 0:08:57.640 Give us the quick synopsis, Rosie. 0:08:57.440 --> 0:08:59.440 Well, yeah, I mean this is crazy because this is 0:08:59.600 --> 0:09:02.720 alan more with Julie Schwartz, who was like a classic 0:09:03.480 --> 0:09:06.000 Batman and Superman editor at DC, came up with a 0:09:06.040 --> 0:09:08.520 lot of the characters that we know and love, and 0:09:08.679 --> 0:09:18.920 essentially the idea of the book is what if Superman 0:09:19.080 --> 0:09:21.800 didn't exist, like what it's kind of got when you 0:09:21.840 --> 0:09:25.839 start to read it, it's got that feeling of like, 0:09:28.720 --> 0:09:33.000 why isn't this the universe that we know and love? 0:09:33.280 --> 0:09:37.320 And then you realize, well, Superman did exist, but he disappeared. 0:09:37.720 --> 0:09:39.720 It's kind of like it's a wonderful life. 0:09:39.760 --> 0:09:41.679 It's a wonderful life, but it's kind of like. 0:09:42.040 --> 0:09:44.240 With Suan in the main role, but he doesn't come. 0:09:44.120 --> 0:09:47.839 Back, but it's he's gone, and then you sort of wonder, well, 0:09:47.880 --> 0:09:51.760 where is he? And then you there's all these kind 0:09:51.800 --> 0:09:55.520 of wild, like kind of bizarre moments. You get some 0:09:55.679 --> 0:10:02.040 really great stuff about Clark Kent and why he gave 0:10:02.160 --> 0:10:06.880 up being a reporter. And this is just a really interesting, 0:10:06.960 --> 0:10:12.920 almost like puzzle box kind of story. And I think 0:10:12.960 --> 0:10:18.200 that it showcases Alan Moore often would do these weird 0:10:18.800 --> 0:10:23.840 small stories in the DC universe, like he did a 0:10:23.880 --> 0:10:26.840 really famous short Green Lantern run that was very much 0:10:26.840 --> 0:10:34.560 in this same space and really interesting kind of big 0:10:34.640 --> 0:10:37.120 reveals at the end that will stick with you. So 0:10:37.200 --> 0:10:41.480 this really does feel more like a classical Superman story. 0:10:41.480 --> 0:10:45.080 You're learning about how he stopped toy Man and a 0:10:45.120 --> 0:10:48.640 prankster and oh he got but he did he stop them, 0:10:48.640 --> 0:10:51.000 are they going to reveal his secret identity? And it 0:10:51.080 --> 0:10:55.160 kind of leads to this moment of oh wait, this 0:10:55.240 --> 0:10:57.520 is actually what the story's been about, because the whole 0:10:57.559 --> 0:11:02.840 setup of the story is Lowess being viewed by somebody 0:11:02.840 --> 0:11:06.160 from the Daily Planet about her husband, about her new 0:11:06.160 --> 0:11:09.400 life with her non superpowered husband, Jordan. But there's kind 0:11:09.400 --> 0:11:11.600 of a great reveal at the end. This is another 0:11:11.679 --> 0:11:16.079 one that James Gunn has kind of pointed to. It's 0:11:16.120 --> 0:11:18.320 a good short one if you just want a story 0:11:18.400 --> 0:11:21.920 that kind of throws you into the world of Superman 0:11:21.960 --> 0:11:25.640 and gives you a lot of the law that Superman has, 0:11:25.840 --> 0:11:29.960 including stuff like Bizarro Bizarro World, the Fortress of Solitude. 0:11:30.160 --> 0:11:32.240 You know, you've got Jimmy Olsen, You've got Perry White, 0:11:32.240 --> 0:11:34.679 You've got Superman still crypto who knows going to be 0:11:34.760 --> 0:11:38.560 really important. So I think even super Girl, I think 0:11:38.559 --> 0:11:42.520 this is a great kind of wild Alan Moore take. 0:11:42.679 --> 0:11:45.480 But that still, like most of the books we're going 0:11:45.520 --> 0:11:50.640 to recommend, has at its heart a romance between Lois 0:11:50.720 --> 0:11:54.559 and Clark and Lewis and Superman and why that matters 0:11:54.880 --> 0:11:58.920 so much and what Superman would do to protect that 0:11:59.080 --> 0:12:01.960 and be allowed to have that as part of his 0:12:02.040 --> 0:12:04.560 life as well as being you know, a super world 0:12:04.600 --> 0:12:07.960 saving alien and these This is one of those crazy 0:12:08.000 --> 0:12:10.520 books too, where you have someone like Julie Schwartz, who 0:12:10.640 --> 0:12:13.880 was in the era of Batman sixty six of some 0:12:13.920 --> 0:12:16.280 of the biggest Batman stuff, and you have Kurt Swan, 0:12:16.320 --> 0:12:19.440 who was an original Superman cover art it's very famous 0:12:19.440 --> 0:12:21.720 for being and he's still doing covers for this. So 0:12:21.760 --> 0:12:25.800 it's that kind of wild whole history of Superman that 0:12:25.840 --> 0:12:29.560 you could still get to the point of nineteen eighty 0:12:29.600 --> 0:12:31.520 six where you still had men who'd been working on 0:12:31.559 --> 0:12:36.240 the Silver Age and we're now here And it's basically 0:12:37.880 --> 0:12:44.040 in a way, it was Alan Moore's response to crisis 0:12:44.080 --> 0:12:47.680 getting rid of the Silver Age, right, kind of comics 0:12:47.720 --> 0:12:51.679 era before John Burn would do The Man of Steel. 0:12:51.920 --> 0:12:54.160 But yeah, this is a it's kind of wild. When 0:12:54.160 --> 0:12:56.200 I was rereading this, this really feels like you're just 0:12:56.280 --> 0:12:59.199 reading some comic issues, you know, it's not all star 0:12:59.320 --> 0:13:01.880 feels like a great novel when it's all put together, 0:13:02.000 --> 0:13:02.160 you know. 0:13:02.360 --> 0:13:04.520 Yeah, that's the thing about a lot of the stories, 0:13:04.520 --> 0:13:09.520 both at Marvel and DC that are have become classics 0:13:10.160 --> 0:13:12.880 when you look back at them. It's like one or 0:13:12.920 --> 0:13:16.480 two issues, three issues over there. You know, it's these 0:13:16.679 --> 0:13:23.440 very encapsulated storylines. It's it's quite interesting to look back 0:13:23.480 --> 0:13:26.920 and see how self contained a lot of stories used 0:13:26.960 --> 0:13:28.240 to be, and how much they used to do in 0:13:28.320 --> 0:13:31.360 just one or two issues like over you know, back 0:13:31.400 --> 0:13:34.480 to back issues, either on one line or jumping across titles. 0:13:34.960 --> 0:13:38.600 It's really very different from a lot of what we 0:13:38.800 --> 0:13:42.319 especially are er Jason, But like even readers today, they 0:13:42.360 --> 0:13:44.920 do a lot of what's called trade waiting, where it's 0:13:44.960 --> 0:13:49.160 like you're waiting to read the trade paperback. And with 0:13:49.400 --> 0:13:53.160 massive books like Saga, right people would be reading, they'll 0:13:53.200 --> 0:13:55.480 be waiting for the trades, waiting for the trades. So 0:13:55.559 --> 0:14:03.720 sometimes that feeling of a singular issue being the experience, Yeah, 0:14:03.800 --> 0:14:06.199 it's it's boom boom boom, and you need the end 0:14:06.240 --> 0:14:09.840 to have a cliffhanger. And a lot of bigger books 0:14:09.840 --> 0:14:11.720 now you'll read a six issue trade and it doesn't 0:14:11.760 --> 0:14:15.800 necessarily have that cliffhanger feeling or that kind of tightly 0:14:16.000 --> 0:14:20.480 packed old school feeling that this has. And it's really 0:14:20.640 --> 0:14:22.720 just a lot of fun. 0:14:23.040 --> 0:14:25.120 To miss that old school feeling me. 0:14:25.120 --> 0:14:29.240 Too, man. I will always respect and love a comic 0:14:29.920 --> 0:14:34.040 that make sure there's always a reason to read the 0:14:34.080 --> 0:14:36.920 next issue. That's why The Walking Dead was so popular. 0:14:37.080 --> 0:14:38.160 Every single week. 0:14:38.520 --> 0:14:40.640 I say, Days of Future Past, Days of Future Past. 0:14:40.640 --> 0:14:44.920 There's two issues of X mind blowing, and if that 0:14:45.160 --> 0:14:48.880 storyline had been pitched in the two thousands, they'd be like, Okay, 0:14:48.880 --> 0:14:51.080 well let's make it a crossover and blah blah blah. 0:14:51.120 --> 0:14:57.080 But it's just two like Killer Killer Killer issues. Next 0:14:57.160 --> 0:15:01.360 up is the four issue mini series by Jeff Lob 0:15:01.400 --> 0:15:01.880 and Timson. 0:15:01.960 --> 0:15:02.400 Oh. 0:15:02.480 --> 0:15:03.280 I love this book. 0:15:03.840 --> 0:15:07.400 It is great Superman for all seasons, with a really 0:15:07.480 --> 0:15:14.480 wonderful and original structure by which each season, like the 0:15:14.520 --> 0:15:22.479 seasons of the calendar Autumn, Winter, Spring, Summer, are narrated 0:15:22.560 --> 0:15:28.720 by someone with a special relationship to Superman, so Jonathan Kent, 0:15:28.840 --> 0:15:34.520 his dad, Lana Lang, Lex Luthor, and you know, it's 0:15:34.600 --> 0:15:37.560 like it's like a great coming of age story. 0:15:38.440 --> 0:15:39.400 It's just really good. 0:15:39.800 --> 0:15:41.560 I love this book. I have to say I was 0:15:41.760 --> 0:15:43.760 I was a late coming to this book. This book 0:15:43.840 --> 0:15:46.760 is from the nineties. I'm sure I did read it 0:15:46.800 --> 0:15:49.240 earlier than this, but a few years ago I got 0:15:49.240 --> 0:15:51.680 a hardcover version of this in the comic shop and 0:15:51.840 --> 0:15:58.000 was just totally blown away. It's got big Norman Rockwell vibes. 0:15:57.600 --> 0:16:03.200 Like it does, like this big vistas and like landscapes. 0:16:03.840 --> 0:16:10.160 It really feels like that corn fed Clark Kent Superman story. Also, interestingly, 0:16:10.600 --> 0:16:13.160 this was the book that Tim Sale and Jeff Lope 0:16:13.200 --> 0:16:15.840 did after Batman The Long Halloween, which we talked about 0:16:15.880 --> 0:16:17.760 a lot when it was with The Batman and also 0:16:17.840 --> 0:16:20.560 The Penguin, and this is just couldn't be more different. 0:16:20.680 --> 0:16:23.960 And I love that huge double page spreads with these 0:16:24.040 --> 0:16:29.880 kind of gorgeous massive skies Beyond Hanson was like the 0:16:29.920 --> 0:16:35.200 colorist and it was just unbelievable. And I loved the 0:16:35.320 --> 0:16:39.280 notion of what is it like to be in Superman's 0:16:39.320 --> 0:16:42.440 world rather than this story that's from the perspective of Superman. 0:16:42.720 --> 0:16:45.800 How does it feel to be Superman's dad? How does 0:16:45.840 --> 0:16:50.880 it feel to recall the first time that he flew 0:16:51.000 --> 0:16:55.840 and why it was and what does it mean to 0:16:55.920 --> 0:16:59.280 be the person who's in love with him? And the 0:16:59.400 --> 0:17:02.800 lowest and Clark stuff here is so great. Also talking 0:17:02.840 --> 0:17:06.879 about great Lex Luthor stories, the Lex Luthor segment is 0:17:08.080 --> 0:17:11.240 so good, and I love there's this moment where he 0:17:11.280 --> 0:17:14.640 talks about he's in control of Metropolis and he talks 0:17:14.640 --> 0:17:16.840 about it like a love story between a man and 0:17:16.880 --> 0:17:18.879 a city. I'm like, I feel like I could see 0:17:18.880 --> 0:17:22.760 that coming into the James Gunn space for me. 0:17:23.119 --> 0:17:27.439 Like with Lex in particular, he's such an iconic foil 0:17:27.560 --> 0:17:28.240 to Superman. 0:17:28.359 --> 0:17:29.800 But I also have, like. 0:17:31.920 --> 0:17:37.119 I have often felt reading silver Age stuff that, like, 0:17:38.359 --> 0:17:40.879 I'm like, why does he hate Superman so much? Like 0:17:41.040 --> 0:17:45.479 other than he's a megalomaniac. Yeah, Superman keeps fucking with 0:17:45.520 --> 0:17:49.720 his various schemes. But all the stories that we picked 0:17:49.760 --> 0:17:52.240 that have Lex in it, I think are really good. 0:17:52.560 --> 0:17:54.560 The Lex parts of it are great because it brings 0:17:54.600 --> 0:17:55.960 you into Lex's thinking. 0:17:56.080 --> 0:17:57.320 I'll start somethings like that. 0:17:58.080 --> 0:18:01.399 Red Sun is another one that's like that. And I think, 0:18:01.600 --> 0:18:05.879 you know, like any great villain, any well written villain, 0:18:05.960 --> 0:18:08.439 you kind of understand where he's coming from. And I 0:18:08.480 --> 0:18:13.399 think this Lecks, even though he's piece of shit, you 0:18:13.480 --> 0:18:15.160 kind of understand where he's coming from. 0:18:15.400 --> 0:18:17.679 Yeah, I do think that's the case, and I do 0:18:17.760 --> 0:18:20.280 think that's what makes like such an interesting villain. And 0:18:20.840 --> 0:18:22.840 you know, if you are a fan of the TV 0:18:22.920 --> 0:18:26.440 show Smallville, which all of the cast of James gun 0:18:26.440 --> 0:18:30.600 Superman are for David Cornsweapt for Nicholas Holt, both of them. 0:18:30.960 --> 0:18:34.840 Smallville was really one of their first interactions with Superman. 0:18:35.520 --> 0:18:40.159 And this book is the influence that created Smallville, because 0:18:40.160 --> 0:18:43.280 then Jeff Low went on to produce Smallville, and this 0:18:43.480 --> 0:18:46.840 was kind of that vibe of like small town boy 0:18:47.000 --> 0:18:49.879 growing up, what does that look like? And I always 0:18:49.920 --> 0:18:54.320 thought that Smallville for all its you know, WB channels, 0:18:54.320 --> 0:18:57.760 c W stylings and whatever that must mean to other people. 0:18:58.000 --> 0:19:03.080 The relationship between Clark and Luther in that is so good, 0:19:03.280 --> 0:19:08.840 and yeah, friendship turned enemy turned kind of occasional. 0:19:09.080 --> 0:19:09.480 Ally. 0:19:10.200 --> 0:19:12.800 I just think that there's so much interesting stuff there 0:19:12.840 --> 0:19:15.440 and I really hope At the trailer launch, James Gunn 0:19:15.480 --> 0:19:19.160 talked a lot about it being a movie about three characters, 0:19:19.600 --> 0:19:24.240 you know, Lois Lane, Clark, Kent and Lex Luthor and 0:19:24.280 --> 0:19:26.879 how they kind of interact with the world. And I 0:19:26.880 --> 0:19:29.600 would just I think a story like this has a 0:19:29.640 --> 0:19:33.440 great set up for that. And yeah, I just I 0:19:33.920 --> 0:19:36.320 love this book. I think it's really beautiful. I think 0:19:36.320 --> 0:19:38.439 it should be easy for you guys to find a 0:19:38.480 --> 0:19:41.560 copy of this book. It's in most libraries. I'm sure 0:19:41.560 --> 0:19:44.520 that they're probably reprinting every Superman book right now, and yeah, 0:19:44.560 --> 0:19:49.000 this is another This is another classic James gunpick. He 0:19:49.080 --> 0:19:51.240 loves this one. He's got a lot of images from 0:19:51.240 --> 0:19:54.720 this in his post production pre production rooms. And also 0:19:55.240 --> 0:19:57.840 lettered by the iconic Richard Starkings, who's won like so 0:19:57.920 --> 0:20:00.760 many Eisner's for lettering you can't even keep count. So 0:20:00.800 --> 0:20:04.040 it's just pure talent and skill. I love that book. 0:20:05.320 --> 0:20:09.520 Next up is Forever Evil. Forever Evil is a New 0:20:09.600 --> 0:20:14.440 fifty two Senior era crossover mostly written by Jeff John's 0:20:14.560 --> 0:20:17.640 with others. Artists include David Finch, who's the main artist 0:20:17.680 --> 0:20:19.840 for like the main storyline. 0:20:19.400 --> 0:20:23.960 Every fifty two arts like a very iconic look, and. 0:20:24.200 --> 0:20:27.359 This story does branch out into other titles, but you 0:20:27.359 --> 0:20:32.359 can just like read the main crossover event Forever Evil. 0:20:32.720 --> 0:20:37.000 The setup being an evil version of the Justice League 0:20:37.600 --> 0:20:44.560 invades a universe and they fucking take over and get 0:20:44.720 --> 0:20:48.560 all the super villains to basically work for them. Only 0:20:48.680 --> 0:20:51.679 thing is Lex Luthor of this world is like fuck that, 0:20:51.720 --> 0:20:53.600 I don't want to work for these guys, so he 0:20:53.960 --> 0:20:58.800 basically it becomes like the leader of the resistance against 0:20:58.800 --> 0:20:59.960 this evil gl JL. 0:21:00.800 --> 0:21:03.240 And what's cool about this is it's. 0:21:03.119 --> 0:21:05.560 Just a great Lex Luthor. It's a great Lex Luthor story. 0:21:05.880 --> 0:21:10.080 It's from his perspective most of the time. You really 0:21:10.119 --> 0:21:13.440 get into his head and understand, like what he's thinking. 0:21:13.520 --> 0:21:14.879 He wears the Power Suit. 0:21:14.600 --> 0:21:16.359 Which I was like when Lex, I love the power 0:21:16.480 --> 0:21:18.400 get real active where he also. 0:21:18.240 --> 0:21:21.600 Me his team is like the Injustice League, which I 0:21:21.640 --> 0:21:24.560 just think is so fun, Like I love that he 0:21:24.600 --> 0:21:26.680 does that. Also, I think you make a great point. 0:21:26.800 --> 0:21:31.080 This is a story about Lex almost like it's him 0:21:31.200 --> 0:21:34.679 protecting what he loves, but he would never put it 0:21:34.680 --> 0:21:37.399 that way, Like he comes at it from this egotistical 0:21:37.480 --> 0:21:41.040 place of like I don't want to be working for you, 0:21:41.080 --> 0:21:43.200 I don't want to work for the crime Syndica. But 0:21:43.320 --> 0:21:48.000 really we get to see Lex in this space of uh, 0:21:48.119 --> 0:21:50.920 you know, an anti hero or kind of on the 0:21:51.000 --> 0:21:51.800 right side. 0:21:52.960 --> 0:21:53.919 And I love the story. 0:21:54.000 --> 0:21:55.960 I do love stories where Lex and Superman have to 0:21:56.080 --> 0:21:58.040 kind of team up. But I think the thing that 0:21:58.280 --> 0:22:01.560 you're absolutely right. The thing that's cool about this is, 0:22:02.000 --> 0:22:05.760 you know, to me, Lex at his most convincing is 0:22:05.800 --> 0:22:09.679 when he's like Superman is actually holding us back, like 0:22:09.760 --> 0:22:13.040 he's in Frutch, We're depending on it. He keeps saving 0:22:13.080 --> 0:22:16.800 our ass all the time, and we're not progressing, like 0:22:16.880 --> 0:22:20.720 as a society and as a species, we just depend 0:22:20.760 --> 0:22:24.400 on Superman to like do everything for us, and we're 0:22:24.440 --> 0:22:30.399 becoming infantalized by this guy. And in his way, he's 0:22:30.440 --> 0:22:34.160 like defending Earth, although he would not put it this way, 0:22:34.480 --> 0:22:37.639 he's like defending humanity from what he feels is like 0:22:37.800 --> 0:22:40.960 the uh, you know, this invasion of an alien force 0:22:41.040 --> 0:22:44.760 which is Superman and really in Forever Evil. That's he's 0:22:45.359 --> 0:22:49.680 just doing that a much more straightforward kind of way. 0:22:50.000 --> 0:22:53.000 Even though he's still a very bad guy and an 0:22:53.040 --> 0:22:56.159 evil guy, it's also just much more clear that the 0:22:56.160 --> 0:22:58.879 thing he's fighting against right now is bad, and so 0:23:00.240 --> 0:23:01.840 it's just an interesting story. 0:23:02.280 --> 0:23:04.760 This we also get, like soup, we also get Lex 0:23:04.840 --> 0:23:08.119 Luthor Batman team up in this, which I think is 0:23:08.480 --> 0:23:16.520 very quite under under explored under kind of exactly because 0:23:16.520 --> 0:23:20.320 they're very similar, Like if you actually very they're very 0:23:20.440 --> 0:23:23.920 very very similar. They're super smart, they're super rich, they're 0:23:23.920 --> 0:23:28.440 doing their own version of saving the world inverted commas, 0:23:28.480 --> 0:23:31.239 you know. So I think that I remember thinking that 0:23:31.359 --> 0:23:33.840 was like really cool. And if you also are just 0:23:34.000 --> 0:23:36.680 we've talked a lot about you know, emotion and and 0:23:36.880 --> 0:23:39.760 and these kind of coming of age stories and this 0:23:40.000 --> 0:23:42.960 kind of beautiful art and heartwarming moments, and we love 0:23:43.000 --> 0:23:44.680 all of that. But you know what, the New fifty 0:23:44.680 --> 0:23:48.320 two is really good for just crazy action and wild 0:23:48.480 --> 0:23:52.199 stories violent if you want to read a story that 0:23:52.280 --> 0:23:56.080 has like every kind of DC character in from Alman 0:23:56.240 --> 0:24:01.160