WEBVTT - S6, Part 2 | Ep 4: Epic Astroturfing 0:00:10.720 --> 0:00:14.280 So far this season, we've focused on the gas industry's 0:00:14.520 --> 0:00:20.279 most recent fight, electrification. Remember this is Sue Forrester, vice 0:00:20.320 --> 0:00:24.400 president of Advocacy and Outreach at the American Gas Association, 0:00:24.760 --> 0:00:28.560 a trade group for utilities, talking about the industry's recent 0:00:28.640 --> 0:00:33.320 strategy to stop the wave of local gas bands. 0:00:34.760 --> 0:00:37.760 So the idea behind choice is to really get ahead 0:00:38.120 --> 0:00:41.960 of the localities, the big cities and counties, and say 0:00:42.680 --> 0:00:45.479 we are allowing our customers the right to be hooked 0:00:45.560 --> 0:00:48.840 up to any kind of energy they would like. So again, 0:00:49.360 --> 0:00:52.960 preserving energy choice, because we're trying to beat counties and 0:00:53.000 --> 0:00:56.080 localities from passing bands that then force the hand of 0:00:56.200 --> 0:01:00.160 governors and state legislators to pass something nationwide. 0:01:00.640 --> 0:01:04.040 Today, an early precursor of that fight that should have 0:01:04.120 --> 0:01:07.560 been a preview for environmentalists of what they would be 0:01:07.760 --> 0:01:11.920 up against, a fight not about buildings, but about trucks. 0:01:12.400 --> 0:01:16.160 At the ports of Los Angeles and Long Beach five 0:01:16.360 --> 0:01:29.880 years ago. 0:01:23.720 --> 0:01:26.800 In twenty seventeen, the Los Angeles and Long Beach ports 0:01:27.280 --> 0:01:31.120 basically were aware that the pollution in the area was 0:01:31.200 --> 0:01:33.399 getting out of control and they had to do something 0:01:33.440 --> 0:01:33.880 about it. 0:01:34.440 --> 0:01:37.800 And in twenty twenty one, reporters from the Los Angeles 0:01:37.800 --> 0:01:41.679 Times and Floodlight and environmental news collaborative that partners with 0:01:41.800 --> 0:01:45.679 local outlets and The Guardian dug into how the ports 0:01:45.920 --> 0:01:47.000 made their decision. 0:01:47.760 --> 0:01:51.800 I'm Miranda Green. I'm an editor and investigative reporter at Floodlight. 0:01:52.760 --> 0:01:55.800 I'm Sammy Roth. They cover energy for the Los Angeles Times. 0:01:56.760 --> 0:01:59.520 The trucks coming and going from the ports were severely 0:01:59.520 --> 0:02:04.000 polluting the surrounding neighborhoods, creating a major air quality problem 0:02:04.160 --> 0:02:07.960 and related health problems for the people who lived there. 0:02:08.680 --> 0:02:11.639 So port officials set about trying to do something about it, 0:02:11.800 --> 0:02:14.680 and they came up with two potential solutions. 0:02:15.600 --> 0:02:20.720 One was to transition from diesel engine trucks to all 0:02:20.760 --> 0:02:24.240 electric vehicle trucks. The idea is that the technology would 0:02:24.240 --> 0:02:25.799 take a little bit longer to catch up, and it 0:02:25.880 --> 0:02:28.240 might be a longer timeline to be able to do so, 0:02:28.400 --> 0:02:31.320 but it would go from heavy polluting trucks to a 0:02:31.440 --> 0:02:33.760 much cleaner, obviously zero missions vehicle. 0:02:34.440 --> 0:02:40.720 So option one transition to electric vehicles and option two. 0:02:40.840 --> 0:02:42.640 And then the second idea was that there would be 0:02:42.680 --> 0:02:45.000 a bit of a transition, that they would transition to 0:02:45.639 --> 0:02:49.240 natural gas trucks instead, with the idea that eventually they 0:02:49.280 --> 0:02:52.280 would move towards electric vehicles when the technology was more 0:02:52.320 --> 0:02:53.760 readily available and cheaper. 0:02:54.360 --> 0:02:56.760 In other words, back to the idea again of using 0:02:56.840 --> 0:02:59.720 gas as a bridge fuel and kicking the can on 0:02:59.720 --> 0:03:03.840 alletrification down the road to an indefinite date in the future. 0:03:04.639 --> 0:03:07.240 Natural gas is cleaner than diesel, It does not as 0:03:07.280 --> 0:03:10.000 emit as much, but it is still a midscarbon and 0:03:10.120 --> 0:03:14.480 is a lot dirtier than moving over to electric vehicles entirely. 0:03:15.400 --> 0:03:17.840 So one proposal would make the port a big new 0:03:17.880 --> 0:03:21.919 customer for companies selling natural gas for vehicles, and one 0:03:22.000 --> 0:03:26.280 would not. One would connect natural gas to clean air 0:03:26.440 --> 0:03:31.000 and environmental solutions in general, the other not so much. 0:03:32.840 --> 0:03:34.880 One of the groups that showed up to support the 0:03:35.040 --> 0:03:39.880 gas option was the California Natural Gas Vehicle Coalition, whose 0:03:39.920 --> 0:03:43.960 backers included SOCl GAS. As you can imagine, there was 0:03:43.960 --> 0:03:47.280 a lot at stake here for the gas industry to 0:03:47.400 --> 0:03:52.120 decide which route to take. The port's solicited public input. 0:03:52.640 --> 0:03:56.000 So they brought together community members in the area to 0:03:56.240 --> 0:03:59.040 speak about it, and they held many hearings. They did 0:03:59.080 --> 0:04:01.360 a lot of community of times. 0:04:02.320 --> 0:04:04.400 By this point in the season, after hearing about a 0:04:04.480 --> 0:04:08.240 number of different tactics used by the industry to promote 0:04:08.480 --> 0:04:12.440 gas use might have some inkling of what's coming. 0:04:13.280 --> 0:04:17.080 There were definitely strong rumors at the ports of la 0:04:17.080 --> 0:04:18.720 and Long Beach at the time when this was all 0:04:18.760 --> 0:04:21.800 going down in twenty seventeen that there were folks getting paid. 0:04:22.080 --> 0:04:25.560 It was something that was talked about pervasively among people 0:04:25.560 --> 0:04:28.040 involved with this that some people were getting paid to comment, 0:04:28.120 --> 0:04:30.279 but it was not something that could be proven easily, 0:04:30.320 --> 0:04:32.520 and so it's been several years, but we were able 0:04:32.560 --> 0:04:33.960 to come in and prove this. 0:04:35.040 --> 0:04:38.120 That's the story we're going to get into today. What 0:04:38.240 --> 0:04:41.840 was happening in a few years right before proposed gas 0:04:41.960 --> 0:04:46.000 bands ignited a war between environmentalists and the gas industry 0:04:46.680 --> 0:04:49.279 that's coming up after this quick break. 0:05:10.360 --> 0:05:14.320 I'm Michael Starn, local resident, So I'm concerned citizen of 0:05:14.360 --> 0:05:15.880 this area and we need. 0:05:15.800 --> 0:05:18.559 To start using near zero trucks there nineteen ninety percent 0:05:18.600 --> 0:05:21.680 cleaner irreliable today. I don't agree that we should wait 0:05:21.720 --> 0:05:23.599 for zero technologies in the future. 0:05:24.120 --> 0:05:26.279 When you just start using these near zero trucks that 0:05:26.279 --> 0:05:28.920 are nine nine percent cleaner and reliable today, I don't 0:05:28.960 --> 0:05:31.280 agree that we should wait for zero technologies in the 0:05:31.320 --> 0:05:34.240 future when we have ninety nine percent cleaner near zero today. 0:05:34.880 --> 0:05:37.920 I don't agree that we should wait phrazero technologies when 0:05:38.000 --> 0:05:40.279 we have trucks that are much cleaner today. 0:05:40.880 --> 0:05:41.000 Now. 0:05:41.040 --> 0:05:43.520 I came here to fight for cleaner but that renewable 0:05:43.600 --> 0:05:45.880 natural gas technology sounds pretty cool. 0:05:47.839 --> 0:05:51.239 This is the public comment period of just one port 0:05:51.320 --> 0:05:56.120 meeting in Los Angeles in August twenty seventeen. These folks 0:05:56.160 --> 0:06:00.600 spoke one after the other, all saying very similar things. 0:06:01.920 --> 0:06:05.440 A group called Climate Investigation Center did an analysis of 0:06:05.600 --> 0:06:08.000 comments and saw that there were a couple of dozen 0:06:08.040 --> 0:06:11.560 people who spoke at these meetings who seemingly were repeating 0:06:11.600 --> 0:06:13.760 the talking points of the gas industry. But you know, 0:06:13.839 --> 0:06:15.719 unclear how many of those may or may not have 0:06:15.760 --> 0:06:16.480 been getting paid. 0:06:17.279 --> 0:06:20.200 This is Sammy Roth from the Los Angeles Times again. 0:06:20.480 --> 0:06:24.120 He and reporters from Floodlight soon began finding a connection 0:06:24.279 --> 0:06:28.080 between all of those commenters making similar comments and a 0:06:28.160 --> 0:06:30.880 campaign services firm called Method. 0:06:31.720 --> 0:06:34.440 We did find some documents indicating that it looked like 0:06:34.440 --> 0:06:37.760 they were about nineteen or twenty people who this campaign 0:06:37.839 --> 0:06:40.320 firm Method had on a list organized to show up 0:06:40.360 --> 0:06:41.599 and talk at these meetings. 0:06:42.400 --> 0:06:45.600 That got the reporting team wondering if they could track 0:06:45.640 --> 0:06:48.240 some of these folks down, Could they get Method the 0:06:48.279 --> 0:06:51.520 campaign firm that had hired all these people to talk 0:06:51.560 --> 0:06:55.839 to them? Maybe, was the gas industry involved and did 0:06:55.839 --> 0:06:58.760 the paid commenters know about any of it. 0:06:59.480 --> 0:07:03.080 We were able to document that this campaign firm, Method 0:07:03.160 --> 0:07:06.920 Campaign Services, was getting paid by a company called Clean 0:07:07.040 --> 0:07:10.520 Energy Fuels, which is a natural gas vehicle fueling provider. 0:07:12.320 --> 0:07:15.680 Method declined to be interviewed and referred Sammy and Miranda 0:07:15.800 --> 0:07:19.880 to their client, Clean Energy Fuels, a company that supplies 0:07:20.000 --> 0:07:23.680 natural gas for vehicles. Clean Energy Fuels is also one 0:07:23.720 --> 0:07:27.120 of the backers of the California Natural Gas Vehicle Coalition, 0:07:27.400 --> 0:07:30.280 which had been vocal in its support of the ports 0:07:30.360 --> 0:07:35.120 opting for natural gas powered trucks. Greg Roche, Clean Energy's 0:07:35.200 --> 0:07:40.360 vice president for sustainability acknowledged that Method did community outreach 0:07:40.520 --> 0:07:43.720 as part of the gas industry campaign, but he said 0:07:43.760 --> 0:07:47.280 he didn't know anything about the firm paying local residents. 0:07:48.680 --> 0:07:50.880 We were able to talk with four or five different 0:07:50.880 --> 0:07:53.880 people who were actually on the receiving ends of these 0:07:53.920 --> 0:07:57.560 payments for Method, who lived in these communities around the ports, 0:07:57.600 --> 0:08:00.320 were showing up to these hearings commenting in fa favor 0:08:00.320 --> 0:08:04.120 of natural gas trucks and ultimately didn't realize that is 0:08:04.200 --> 0:08:06.120 firm that had hired them and was paying them to 0:08:06.160 --> 0:08:08.760 do this was an arm of the natural gas industry. 0:08:09.480 --> 0:08:12.760 Not only did these hired commenters not know that they 0:08:12.760 --> 0:08:15.960 were getting paid by the natural gas industry via a 0:08:16.120 --> 0:08:21.520 pass through campaign organization, many of them actually thought they 0:08:21.520 --> 0:08:26.320 were doing environmental work. Here's Miranda Green from Floodlight. 0:08:27.640 --> 0:08:30.320 They said that they were specifically told to just speak 0:08:30.360 --> 0:08:32.800 as if they were locals. One woman actually brought her 0:08:32.880 --> 0:08:36.199 children to the hearings and kind of use them as 0:08:36.240 --> 0:08:40.320 an example of why she didn't want diesel engine fuels 0:08:40.320 --> 0:08:43.960 in her community. And the other distinction here, of course, 0:08:44.080 --> 0:08:47.280 is that those individuals who were speaking and paid again, 0:08:47.880 --> 0:08:50.240 they thought that they were working as part of an 0:08:50.320 --> 0:08:54.040 environmental movement. Two people I spoke to they found the 0:08:54.120 --> 0:08:57.160 jobs that method through indeed dot com and they were 0:08:57.200 --> 0:09:02.800 actually advertised as environmental fellowship. So they had been told 0:09:02.920 --> 0:09:06.280 and you did believe that the transition to natural gas 0:09:06.320 --> 0:09:10.120 would be a better safer option than keeping the trucks 0:09:10.240 --> 0:09:13.319 with diesel engines. So they did think they were standing 0:09:13.400 --> 0:09:16.400 up for sustainability, but they didn't realize that they were 0:09:16.440 --> 0:09:18.880 pushing that narrative and saying that they were supporting that 0:09:19.080 --> 0:09:22.240 because the group they were working with was being paid 0:09:22.280 --> 0:09:23.679 by a gas industry. 0:09:26.480 --> 0:09:29.880 Here's one of the paid campaigners speaking during the public 0:09:29.880 --> 0:09:32.640 comment period at a port meeting about her and her 0:09:32.720 --> 0:09:33.960 children's asthma. 0:09:34.880 --> 0:09:38.240 I am a local resident, not certified with the proposal 0:09:38.360 --> 0:09:40.440 changes for the cap. The reason why I hit, why 0:09:40.520 --> 0:09:44.040 i'm here, I'm persung with that pollution. Myself and my 0:09:44.120 --> 0:09:47.760 son we suffer for severe allergies and asthma. I want 0:09:47.760 --> 0:09:51.160 to ask you to please make the changes we need 0:09:51.360 --> 0:09:55.120 near certain missions now. Please the community and myself. We 0:09:55.200 --> 0:09:57.679 can't wait a couple of years for now, because we're 0:09:57.679 --> 0:09:58.400 getting sick. 0:09:58.320 --> 0:10:01.920 Now the time. What component she mentions there was a 0:10:02.000 --> 0:10:06.000 key part of the industry's messaging natural gas vehicles would 0:10:06.040 --> 0:10:09.959 reduce air pollution now converting all the ports trucks to 0:10:10.040 --> 0:10:14.120 electric that would take at least two years. Here's clean 0:10:14.280 --> 0:10:18.240 energy fuels. Greg Roche weighing in at that August twenty 0:10:18.320 --> 0:10:21.880 seventeen port meeting. We heard audio from just a couple 0:10:21.960 --> 0:10:22.560 minutes ago. 0:10:23.400 --> 0:10:25.440 This is clearly a case where you can't let the 0:10:25.440 --> 0:10:27.560 perfect get in the way of the good. This will 0:10:27.600 --> 0:10:31.480 require a lot of leadership. But think of the significance 0:10:32.559 --> 0:10:36.880 A child born today can enter kindergarten in five years 0:10:37.600 --> 0:10:42.079 and breathe cleaner air thanks to bold action taken this year. 0:10:42.880 --> 0:10:46.960 While Roche was knowingly representing the company he works for, 0:10:47.160 --> 0:10:51.080 the local residents who were hired by Method and echoing 0:10:51.200 --> 0:10:53.880 some of these same messages were not. 0:10:54.760 --> 0:10:58.120 They thought they were doing something, you know, good for sustainability, 0:10:58.120 --> 0:11:00.160 which is an argument whether or not they were that 0:11:00.240 --> 0:11:03.199 they really didn't know about the natural gas industry involvement. 0:11:04.000 --> 0:11:07.200 You can make the argument too that environmental groups have 0:11:07.360 --> 0:11:10.640 paid advocates that work for environmental organizations who show up 0:11:10.640 --> 0:11:15.560 at these hearings and testify in favor of those environmental groups. 0:11:15.920 --> 0:11:17.800 But what we were seeing here is that we were 0:11:17.800 --> 0:11:22.160 seeing locals come up and not identify themselves as campaigners 0:11:22.160 --> 0:11:25.959 for METHOD campaigns or as being paid by clean energy fuels, 0:11:26.000 --> 0:11:29.600 but just identify themselves as being locals who care about 0:11:29.600 --> 0:11:32.800 the industry. And so that is kind of the distinction here. 0:11:32.960 --> 0:11:36.360 They're asked beforehand to fill out these forms that say 0:11:36.480 --> 0:11:38.600 who they are there with and who they are speaking 0:11:38.640 --> 0:11:41.400 on behalf. But many of the people that I spoke to, 0:11:41.520 --> 0:11:43.720 I spoke to five different individuals who said they were 0:11:43.720 --> 0:11:46.560 paid through different campaigns, four of which were through Method, 0:11:47.040 --> 0:11:49.720 and they said that they were specifically told to just 0:11:49.800 --> 0:11:51.559 speak as if they were locals. 0:11:52.120 --> 0:11:54.640 Remember the woman we heard just a minute ago, she 0:11:54.880 --> 0:11:57.240 did not say she was working for Method. 0:11:58.000 --> 0:11:59.160 I am a local resident. 0:12:00.160 --> 0:12:02.800 The way that Method operated when it did bring in 0:12:02.840 --> 0:12:05.240 these employees is, you know, it paid them twenty dollars 0:12:05.320 --> 0:12:07.920 an hour to show up and to work with them. 0:12:07.960 --> 0:12:10.720 And they kind of worked with Method in multiple ways. 0:12:10.760 --> 0:12:14.480 First they had them meet altogether and they trained them. 0:12:14.920 --> 0:12:17.040 The individuals I spoke to you said the training was 0:12:17.120 --> 0:12:19.880 kind of a public speaking training. Taught them how to 0:12:20.200 --> 0:12:23.000 give good sound bites. It told them specifically to use 0:12:23.080 --> 0:12:26.800 personal anecdotes to kind of make their point stronger, and 0:12:26.880 --> 0:12:29.160 they would get up kind of and do mock stages 0:12:29.280 --> 0:12:31.680 all together, kind of telling what their story would be 0:12:31.720 --> 0:12:33.960 when they did go to these hearings. You know, the 0:12:34.000 --> 0:12:36.920 individuals I spoke to you didn't say they were necessarily 0:12:36.960 --> 0:12:39.360 told what to say one way or the other. But 0:12:39.440 --> 0:12:42.920 it was openly spoken about how the transition to natural 0:12:43.160 --> 0:12:45.360 gas would happen quicker, it would be better for the 0:12:45.440 --> 0:12:47.520 environment than diesel, and so that was kind of the 0:12:47.640 --> 0:12:48.880 ongoing narrative. 0:12:50.000 --> 0:12:52.880 At a certain point, some of the campaigners did begin 0:12:52.920 --> 0:12:55.240 to pick up on who might be behind all of this. 0:12:55.920 --> 0:12:58.040 I spoke to a handful of people, and two of 0:12:58.080 --> 0:13:00.320 them have told me that they actually did find out 0:13:00.679 --> 0:13:03.199 or suspected that there was a natural gas or kind 0:13:03.200 --> 0:13:07.160 of a fossil fuel industry component backing Methods campaigns as 0:13:07.200 --> 0:13:09.760 they were still working for method They both found out 0:13:09.800 --> 0:13:13.560 because they saw logos on the pamphlets and logos on 0:13:13.600 --> 0:13:16.560 the tables that they were asked to stand at and 0:13:16.640 --> 0:13:19.880 to hand out that were connected to the gas industry. 0:13:20.400 --> 0:13:23.760 Miranda remembers speaking to one man who felt very weird 0:13:23.800 --> 0:13:26.640 about the job once he realized who is behind it, 0:13:26.840 --> 0:13:30.000 but his financial situation prevented him from quitting. 0:13:30.360 --> 0:13:33.200 He was so desperate to get a wage that he 0:13:33.240 --> 0:13:35.520 didn't feel like you could stand up and walk away 0:13:35.520 --> 0:13:38.760 from working for the campaign, despite feeling really uncomfortable about that. 0:13:39.880 --> 0:13:43.320 Ultimately, the poor did opt for the gas plan. According 0:13:43.360 --> 0:13:46.440 to the La Times is Sammy Roth. Though port officials 0:13:46.480 --> 0:13:50.400 said they knew something might be up with the public comments. 0:13:50.600 --> 0:13:53.080 They basically acknowledged and said, yeah, you know, at the time, 0:13:53.160 --> 0:13:55.320 we were aware that there were these rumors that folks 0:13:55.400 --> 0:13:57.680 were getting paid, that there was something happening behind the 0:13:57.720 --> 0:14:01.200 scence here that we didn't know about. But interestingly, they 0:14:01.240 --> 0:14:04.120 also really defended their process despite that, and they said, no, 0:14:04.320 --> 0:14:06.440 you know, we don't feel like there was undue influence. 0:14:06.480 --> 0:14:09.840 We had this whole extended process of public input and 0:14:09.880 --> 0:14:12.320 comment over multiple years and had all of these different 0:14:12.320 --> 0:14:15.080 forms for people to weigh in, so, you know, so no, 0:14:15.240 --> 0:14:17.520 we don't think that this played a major role in 0:14:17.520 --> 0:14:20.240 influencing our decision in an undue way. At the same time, 0:14:20.320 --> 0:14:22.560 then you've got to asked, like, okay, but if the 0:14:22.560 --> 0:14:25.000 public comments you were hearing from weren't, you know, having 0:14:25.000 --> 0:14:27.160 that big an influence on your decision, you know, it 0:14:27.560 --> 0:14:30.080 makes you wonder a little bit. But they defended their process. 0:14:30.960 --> 0:14:33.720 Roth has been covering energy in southern California for more 0:14:33.760 --> 0:14:36.520 than a decade, and he's followed what's been happening with 0:14:36.560 --> 0:14:40.680 the gas industry in recent years with great interest. He 0:14:40.800 --> 0:14:43.360 covered what happened in San Luis Obispo the story we 0:14:43.400 --> 0:14:45.920 heard about in episode one, and he's been tracking all 0:14:45.960 --> 0:14:51.160 of SOCOW Gas's regulatory issues closely over the years. Despite 0:14:51.200 --> 0:14:54.400 all that, he says this story was eye opening for him. 0:14:54.760 --> 0:14:57.120 I think one thing that surprised me was the timeline, 0:14:57.160 --> 0:14:59.480 and these were events that were taking place back in 0:14:59.600 --> 0:15:02.760 twenty seventeen. There have been a lot of stories reported 0:15:02.960 --> 0:15:05.280 like this since then. I mean, there's the paid actor 0:15:05.360 --> 0:15:07.960 scandal with Energy in New Orleans is a big one 0:15:07.960 --> 0:15:09.000 that comes to mind. 0:15:09.760 --> 0:15:10.400 A good evening. 0:15:10.560 --> 0:15:13.160 Back in March, an actor told us that he was 0:15:13.240 --> 0:15:15.480 paid to wear a shirt the support of the proposed 0:15:15.560 --> 0:15:18.440 Energy power plant in New Orleans East, and last week 0:15:18.520 --> 0:15:22.080 the Lens issued report citing more actors were saying they 0:15:22.080 --> 0:15:24.800 were paid as well to attend the meeting in favor 0:15:24.840 --> 0:15:25.400 of the plant. 0:15:27.320 --> 0:15:30.200 You know these stories about Instagram influencers getting paid by 0:15:30.240 --> 0:15:33.360 the American Gas Association to post about how much they 0:15:33.440 --> 0:15:34.880 love cooking on gas stoves. 0:15:35.440 --> 0:15:42.880 Guess cooking with gas, cooking. 0:15:42.520 --> 0:15:44.360 With guess, we all cooked better. 0:15:44.360 --> 0:15:45.840 We have a cooking with guess. 0:15:46.000 --> 0:15:48.080 Yes, it's so hot, it's not on, when it's off. 0:15:48.120 --> 0:15:49.360 It's the only way to cook. 0:15:49.560 --> 0:15:51.400 That's what I was taught. 0:15:51.440 --> 0:15:53.000 But this is all stuff that's kind of, you know, 0:15:53.040 --> 0:15:55.120 felt like it's more at the vanguard just the last 0:15:55.120 --> 0:15:56.160 couple of years. 0:15:57.120 --> 0:16:00.440 This story shows that the gas industry was testing out 0:16:00.600 --> 0:16:04.000 some of the defensive tactics it would ultimately use to 0:16:04.040 --> 0:16:07.200 fight electrification in a much bigger way for a few 0:16:07.280 --> 0:16:09.840 years before that fight really kicked off. 0:16:10.120 --> 0:16:12.840 And to see essentially the same type of attitudes and 0:16:12.880 --> 0:16:16.200 tactics of the gas industry of seeing electrification as the 0:16:16.240 --> 0:16:20.160 significant threat to their business model, of realizing that they 0:16:20.200 --> 0:16:22.760 needed to frame themselves as we're the clean fuel, We're 0:16:22.800 --> 0:16:24.880 the option that's going to get us beyond the even 0:16:24.920 --> 0:16:28.120 dirtier stuff. It isn't exactly a new phenomenon, I mean 0:16:28.240 --> 0:16:30.520 not the twenty seventeen was that long ago. But I 0:16:30.600 --> 0:16:33.320 was a little surprised to see essentially the same type 0:16:33.320 --> 0:16:35.440 of debate and same type of tactic that we're seeing 0:16:35.440 --> 0:16:37.160 today back at that point. 0:16:37.840 --> 0:16:42.080 That same old frame bridge fuel cleaner than coal, no 0:16:42.200 --> 0:16:45.320 need to rush the move to electrification. It's having a 0:16:45.400 --> 0:16:49.800 major resurgence right now, especially as the industry uses Russia's 0:16:49.880 --> 0:16:56.560 recent invasion of Ukraine to justify pushing electrification off even longer. Instead, 0:16:56.600 --> 0:17:00.640 they're pushing to build out new gas infrastructure that they'll 0:17:00.680 --> 0:17:05.120 be fighting to keep for decades to come. That's our story. 0:17:05.560 --> 0:17:14.120 Next time Drilled is an original critical frequency production. Our 0:17:14.160 --> 0:17:20.200 producer is Jules Bradley. Our editor is Jude Joffy. Block Mixing, mastering, 0:17:20.359 --> 0:17:24.400 sound design and original music for this season is by 0:17:24.440 --> 0:17:28.480 Peter Duff. Our artwork is drawn by Matt Fleming. Our 0:17:28.520 --> 0:17:32.320 fact checker is wood am Yan. Special thanks for this 0:17:32.440 --> 0:17:37.159 episode to Floodlights, Miranda Green and The Los Angeles Times 0:17:37.240 --> 0:17:40.800 is Sammy Roth. Will drop links to their reporting in 0:17:40.880 --> 0:17:43.680 the show notes and more information on where you can 0:17:43.720 --> 0:17:46.600 follow all of their other great work. Don't forget to 0:17:46.640 --> 0:17:50.320 follow us on Twitter at we are Drilled. You can 0:17:50.359 --> 0:17:54.600 also find online content related to all of our episodes 0:17:54.680 --> 0:17:58.400 online at Drilled podcast dot com, where you can also 0:17:58.440 --> 0:18:01.840 sign up for our weekly newsletter, and you can support 0:18:01.920 --> 0:18:06.600 us via Patreon at Patreon dot com slash drilled Big. 0:18:06.640 --> 0:18:14.000 Thanks to our latest Patreon supporters Blake Michael Murray, JJB, 0:18:14.600 --> 0:18:21.920 Carly Anderson, Meredith Ward, new Hot, Javid Lourien, Meghan Eisen, 0:18:22.680 --> 0:18:31.640 Dev Blackburn, Bernardo, Amanda Nash, Elon Lennox Kindall and Cameron Russell. 0:18:32.320 --> 0:18:35.000 Thank you so much. We really appreciate the support. That's 0:18:35.080 --> 0:18:37.320 it for this time. Thanks for listening, and we'll see 0:18:37.320 --> 0:18:37.920 you next week.