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Speaker 1: We have a really big problem right now with the dollar.

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Speaker 2: We're able to print trillions of dollars, spend it into

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Speaker 2: the economy, and.

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Speaker 1: See debt to GDP go up.

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Speaker 2: If we don't figure out a way to strengthen our

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Speaker 2: financial position, we will get to a point where people

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Speaker 2: will not even want to use the dollar as a

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Speaker 2: medium of exchange. So what the United States needs to

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Speaker 2: do if they want to strengthen the dollar is to

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Speaker 2: take some of the money that they're printing and buy bitcoins.

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Speaker 2: In twenty nineteen, I bought my first home, a small

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Speaker 2: single family home, for one hundred bitcoin, and today I

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Speaker 2: look at the price of bitcoin and could have twelve

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Speaker 2: million additional dollars on my balance sheet. Instead, I have

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Speaker 2: a house that I'd be lucky to get five hundred

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Speaker 2: thousand dollars for. It makes sense when people understand where

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Speaker 2: we are and the adoption curve, you do not want

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Speaker 2: to be giving up ownership of your bitcoin. So what

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Speaker 2: we need are tools that allow people to unlock their

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Speaker 2: purchasing power without giving up ownership, which are financial tools

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Speaker 2: that allow you to bar against bitcoin. What does that

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Speaker 2: look like, Yeah, I think, so let's.

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Speaker 3: Jump into it.

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Speaker 1: CJ.

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Speaker 4: So I'm gonna start off with a big question here,

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Speaker 4: set you up, and then we'll dig into this. So

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Speaker 4: you've said that we're in the final stages of this

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Speaker 4: currencies life cycle and we're facing a debt death spiral.

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Speaker 4: But yet when I look around, we see the stock

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Speaker 4: market as a near all time high. The official narrative

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Speaker 4: is basically a very strong economy. So what would you

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Speaker 4: say the vast majority of people, even savvy investors, are

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Speaker 4: completely missing right now.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and that's a that's a great question mark. And

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Speaker 1: first of all, thanks for having me on. I'm not

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Speaker 1: sure you.

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Speaker 2: I know you don't remember because you're so popular, but

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Speaker 2: I actually met you at a Rebel Capitalist Live event

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Speaker 2: conference and it was really cool meet you. So it's

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Speaker 2: great to be on this side of the camera. It's

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Speaker 2: it's fun. But yeah, I think I think we are

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Speaker 2: in the middle of what would be considered a debt

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Speaker 2: death spiral and most investors are missing. Funny enough, the basics,

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Speaker 2: and the basics are come down to the difference between

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Speaker 2: money versus currency.

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Speaker 1: We don't get it taught in school.

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Speaker 2: If you go for accounting and finance, you'd think you'd

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Speaker 2: learn something like that, but you don't, So you really

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Speaker 2: have to do some deep digging into some alternative economics

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Speaker 2: before you figure out, oh wait a second, the dollar

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Speaker 2: is a currency, it's not a money. Okay, well, what's

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Speaker 2: the difference. A money is a store of value and

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Speaker 2: a currency is a medium of exchange. So a lot

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Speaker 2: of people look at bitcoin as being a competitor to

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Speaker 2: the dollar. A lot of people who misunderstand bitcoin investors

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Speaker 2: in the marketplace think bitcoin is trying to compete with

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Speaker 2: the dollar. I think they're complementary. And the dollar is global,

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Speaker 2: it's worldwide, it's the reserve asset. Why in the world

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Speaker 2: would you try to compete with a medium of exchange

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Speaker 2: technology that has already captured pretty much one hundred percent

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Speaker 2: of the global economy. It doesn't really make that much sense.

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Speaker 2: But what we know about the dollar is that it's

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Speaker 2: not a store of value. It's really bad store of

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Speaker 2: value because it can be issued at infinum and ever

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Speaker 2: since twenty twenty, we've seen that peak up dramatically, which

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Speaker 2: is waking people up to the fact that a money

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Speaker 2: is a store value, and to be a store value,

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Speaker 2: you can't increase the supply at ridiculous rates. Now we

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Speaker 2: have a natural money in gold, which through its cost

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Speaker 2: of production, limited its supply expansion. But with Bitcoin, we

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Speaker 2: have not just a natural money, we have an engineered money.

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Speaker 2: We have something that, through computer code, introduces the concept

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Speaker 2: of absolute digital scarcity. For the first time in human history,

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Speaker 2: we have a monetary asset that supply cannot be expanded.

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Speaker 2: That's a really hard pill to swallow, and it's really

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Speaker 2: hard to understand that the only way to get the

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Speaker 2: increase of supply and bitcoin, the only way to get

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Speaker 2: the circulating bitcoin to increase is to get the price

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Speaker 2: to go up.

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Speaker 1: So because of that, I believe that that was.

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Speaker 2: A strategic design, and therefore I call it engineered money.

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Speaker 2: So we have this savings technology that you can use

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Speaker 2: along with spending technology being the dollar, and some magic

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Speaker 2: happens when you do that. So I look forward to

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Speaker 2: getting into barring against bitcoin with dollars dollars being the

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Speaker 2: best way to spend your bitcoin without giving up ownership.

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Speaker 2: But the wild time we're moving into right now, and

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Speaker 2: I do think many are missing it.

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Speaker 4: So what you just said I think is then bitcoin

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Speaker 4: is this new engineered type of money that's solving a

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Speaker 4: different need or a different purpose than what the fiat

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Speaker 4: currency is doing.

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Speaker 3: But again, so is the FIA.

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Speaker 4: Currency at the end of the final stage of its

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Speaker 4: life cycle or it's sort of run the course and

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Speaker 4: now we need something else to complement it.

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Speaker 2: Well, I think that we were in a position to

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Speaker 2: where the currency itself could somewhat serve as a store

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Speaker 2: of value. So I do believe that if the currency

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Speaker 2: system wasn't abused, and the amount of dollars wasn't expanded

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Speaker 2: at the rapid rate that we see today at least

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Speaker 2: two trillion dollars in our ongoing deficit, then theoretically the

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Speaker 2: dollar could maintain its value. And if credit was not

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Speaker 2: extended at infinum and the supply of dollars declined, perhaps

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Speaker 2: a dollar could even gain value theoretically. So it has

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Speaker 2: the ability to actually function that way. But because we

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Speaker 2: have put ourselves in this position, because we have allowed

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Speaker 2: ourselves to conform to the idea that something is too

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Speaker 2: big to fail, we now find ourselves in this situation.

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Speaker 2: See with bitcoin, when we went through all of the

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Speaker 2: rehypothication scheme of version one of bitcoin lending, with Genesis

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Speaker 2: and FTX and block Fi and Celsius, and we had

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Speaker 2: this big rehypothecation period, and when it collapsed, we couldn't

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Speaker 2: print the bitcoin, so we failed. But that failure is

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Speaker 2: a critical part of the business cycle. And in the

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Speaker 2: traditional markets, we don't get that part of the business cycle.

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Speaker 2: We print over it because it's too big to fail.

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Speaker 2: And when you don't allow companies to fail, what you're

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Speaker 2: doing is you're creating zombie companies. And I think we've

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Speaker 2: gone so far now that these these zombie companies have

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Speaker 2: effect the economy, and we have a zombie economy, and

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Speaker 2: that's why we're able to print trillions of dollars, spend

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Speaker 2: it into the economy and still see debt to GDP

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Speaker 2: go up, still see our financial position become less and

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Speaker 2: less healthy. So we have a really big problem right

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Speaker 2: now with the dollar. And if we don't figure out

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Speaker 2: a way to strengthen our financial position, then yeah, we

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Speaker 2: are at the end.

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Speaker 1: Of our life cycle.

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Speaker 2: We will get to a point where people will not

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Speaker 2: even want to use the dollar as a medium of

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Speaker 2: exchange because if they don't spend it immediately, they're going

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Speaker 2: to be able to buy less and less stuff over time.

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Speaker 2: And we're seeing that ramp up since twenty twenty, and

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Speaker 2: people are paying attention, but we haven't gotten to that

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Speaker 2: hyper inflationary point. But the only difference between inflation and

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Speaker 2: hyper inflation is trust. So if we continue to abuse

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Speaker 2: the printer and abuse the trust of we the people,

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Speaker 2: then we will get to a point where dollars will

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Speaker 2: end up worthless on the street. And I don't want that,

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Speaker 2: and I don't think anybody in right mind really wants that.

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Speaker 4: So would you say that then because of this endless

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Speaker 4: money printing, the monetary debasement, which I agree they say

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Speaker 4: there's only two things and certain in life, death and taxes,

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Speaker 4: And I would also probably put money printing there, since

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Speaker 4: that is not scheduled to end anytime soon, and it's

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Speaker 4: pushing this to the final stages.

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Speaker 3: As you're saying.

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Speaker 4: Also, most people at this point know that they shouldn't

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Speaker 4: be trying to save their wealth in dollars. There with

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Speaker 4: that meme of Michael Saylor saying something about we have

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Speaker 4: a word for them, we call them poor. I think

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Speaker 4: it was something like that. I'm sure you thought, which

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Speaker 4: is why then, as I said, at the same time,

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Speaker 4: we see stocks making new all time highs. But I

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Speaker 4: think what you're saying, though, is that because the dollar

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Speaker 4: is being printed to infinity.

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Speaker 3: The debasement is continuing to go on.

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Speaker 4: If we continue down this path, nobody's going to want

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Speaker 4: to use it a loss of trust, hyperinflation. But then

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Speaker 4: are you saying that potentially bitcoin could help extend the

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Speaker 4: runway in the life of the dollar.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, absolutely, because what we're doing right now is we're

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Speaker 2: printing those dollars and we're investing them into the economy.

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Speaker 2: But we're printing a dollar with interest called a dollar

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Speaker 2: four principle being a dollar four cents being the interest,

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Speaker 2: and we're investing it. And the return on investment, depending

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Speaker 2: on the tax bracket of the vertical you're investing in,

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Speaker 2: is really maybe thirty to fifty percent. So we're investing

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Speaker 2: a dollar, we're only getting back thirty to fifty cents.

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Speaker 2: We need to get back more than a dollar four.

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Speaker 2: And because we're not getting back more than a dollar

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Speaker 2: four through that investment, the debt continues to grow, the

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Speaker 2: unfunded liabilities continue to grow, the debt to GDP continues

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Speaker 2: to grow. We become in a weaker and weaker position,

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Speaker 2: and I consider this a matter of national economic security.

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Speaker 2: If you look at El Salvador, they have some of

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Speaker 2: the best performing traditional bonds in the world. Number one

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Speaker 2: because Bukelly is cleaning up the country, but number two

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Speaker 2: because they put bitcoin on their balance sheet, and what

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Speaker 2: that does is it strengthens their financial position. So if

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Speaker 2: something were to go wrong, could tap into that twenty

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Speaker 2: four seven three sixty five liquid marketplace that bitcoin is

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Speaker 2: to fix that problem. So what the United States needs

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Speaker 2: to do if they want to, I think strengthen the dollar,

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Speaker 2: is to take some of the money that they're printing

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Speaker 2: and buy bitcoin. Because when you put bitcoin on the

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Speaker 2: balance sheet, if you take that dollar you invest it

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Speaker 2: into the economy, you're not getting back principle plus interest.

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Speaker 2: If you invest it into bringing out natural resources, it's

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Speaker 2: going to take significant investment and time to actually see

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Speaker 2: any revenues from that. Now, I'm pretty sure nobody wants

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Speaker 2: to sell Alaska to Russia. So we're limited on how

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Speaker 2: we can monetize the asset side of our balance sheet,

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Speaker 2: and we're limited on what assets we can invest in

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Speaker 2: to amplify the performance of the assets side of our

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Speaker 2: balance sheet. And then here comes this magic internet money bitcoin,

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Speaker 2: but it's absolutely digitally scarce, and it's engineered money, and

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Speaker 2: it was strategically designed to store value over space and time,

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Speaker 2: and when we take that dollar and invest it into bitcoin,

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Speaker 2: yes there will be ups and downs, but in the

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Speaker 2: long run, one bitcoin's five year compounding annual growth rate

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Speaker 2: is over sixty percent. It's ten year compounding annual growth

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Speaker 2: rate is over eighty percent. Where the adoption rates are

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Speaker 2: following that of the Internet, and we're at the very

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Speaker 2: beginning of it. Everything here, all the signals are telling

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Speaker 2: us if we print some money and buy bitcoin, or

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Speaker 2: if we use budget neutral strategies to accumulate bitcoin and

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Speaker 2: we get it on the asset side of our balance sheet,

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Speaker 2: for the first time in a very long time, we

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Speaker 2: have a chance for the asset side of our country's

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Speaker 2: balance sheet to outgrow, or at least the growth of

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Speaker 2: the asset side to outpace the growth of the liability side.

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Speaker 2: Right because we have over one hundred trillion dollars of

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Speaker 2: unfunded liabilities over the next generation, we're going to have

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Speaker 2: to pay those bills, We're going to have to fulfill

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Speaker 2: those promises. We need an asset that can keep up

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Speaker 2: with the spending that we've promised to do. And if

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Speaker 2: we don't find that, the only option is dilution. So

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Speaker 2: it's a catch twenty two because you know, if the

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Speaker 2: FED lowers interest rates, and I know Pal's got his

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Speaker 2: Jackson Hole meeting this weekend, I'm sure he's going to

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Speaker 2: have a fun time paying back Trump for visiting him

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Speaker 2: on his Federal Reserve construction site. So I don't think

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Speaker 2: anything friendly is going to be coming from this meeting

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Speaker 2: this weekend. I think Pal's mission is probably to get

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Speaker 2: bitcoin back under one hundred thousand dollars. But if he

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Speaker 2: lowers interest rates, there's seven trillion dollars sitting in money

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Speaker 2: market funds right now, of which over three trillion of

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Speaker 2: those dollars is retail. So just like that, retail money

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Speaker 2: and corporate money left the banks when they were getting

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Speaker 2: no interest because the banks were holding those treasury bonds

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Speaker 2: because they were forced out the risk curve from ZERP.

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Speaker 2: When they move back out of the money funds, where

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Speaker 2: are they going to go. They're going to go into bitcoin,

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Speaker 2: real estate, stocks, and other goods and services. We're going

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Speaker 2: to get an influx of demand against a limited supply

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Speaker 2: of goods and services and hard assets, and prices are

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Speaker 2: going to go up. But what if he raises interest rates, Well,

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Speaker 2: then at the same time. If you raise interest rates,

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Speaker 2: the interest expense is going to go up. And when

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Speaker 2: the interest expense go up, you have to print that

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Speaker 2: money to service the debt. So no matter which way

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Speaker 2: he pulls this, we have to print money. But when

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Speaker 2: we print that money, if we take a little bit

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Speaker 2: of it and we put it in bitcoin and we

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Speaker 2: allow bitcoin to do what it was engineered to do,

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Speaker 2: we can actually salvage the dollar at least buy some

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Speaker 2: more time to fix the real problems, to address the

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Speaker 2: problems in a truthful way, and try to move forward

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Speaker 2: rather than just kick the can.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 4: So at the time of this recording, it is August twentieth,

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Speaker 4: twenty twenty five.

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Speaker 3: Just so yeah, everyone can understand what he's talking about

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Speaker 3: the upcoming meeting.

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Speaker 4: As of today, I looked earlier on the CME the

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Speaker 4: odds of a rate cut are now eighty five percent,

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Speaker 4: So by the time you're listening to it will probably

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Speaker 4: be on the side of that. So we'll see how

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Speaker 4: things shook out. But I think one way or another,

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Speaker 4: whether it's happens at this meeting or the next meeting

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Speaker 4: or not. Until Trump gets pal out and replaces him,

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Speaker 4: rates are coming down.

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Speaker 3: That is almost a certainty.

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Speaker 4: Every day we see headlines about inflation and dead and

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Speaker 4: diminishing control.

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Speaker 3: Over our own money.

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Speaker 4: That's why I always back to bitcoin because it's built

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Speaker 4: for generations, it's built for legacy. But protecting your bitcoin

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Speaker 4: legacy the right way is not always simple. It demands discipline, focus,

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Speaker 4: and the right partner. Now, that's why I personally use

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Speaker 4: Unchained Signature. It's a premium private client service for serious

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Speaker 4: bitcoin holders who want expert guidance, resilient custody, and enduring partnership.

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Speaker 4: Now Signature, you're paired with your own dedicated account manager,

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Speaker 4: someone who understands your goals helps you every step of

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Speaker 4: the way.

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Speaker 3: You're going to get white.

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Speaker 3: To exclusive events and features.

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Speaker 4: security as the world's biggest bitcoin custodians.

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Speaker 3: But for those who prefer to hold their own keys.

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Speaker 4: Now, I've been using and recommending Unchained for years. I

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Speaker 4: even got my parents to set up with them. So

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Speaker 4: if you want to get set up, check out Unchained

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Speaker 4: off your first year because your bitcoin isn't just for life,

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Speaker 4: it's for generations.

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Speaker 2: Well, let's remember they've tried to lower rates and the

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Speaker 2: market didn't necessarily agree with them. So I think one

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Speaker 2: of the biggest risks is the Fed comes out even

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Speaker 2: if Pal doesn't do it, and next May he gets

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Speaker 2: replaced by Trump's appointing, and you know that's going to

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Speaker 2: be a pro Trumper who's going to push rates down.

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Speaker 2: Even if they state the federal funds rate down, which

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Speaker 2: is the front end of the yield curve, it's really

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Speaker 2: going to be the free market on how they treat

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Speaker 2: the two year. So if the two year and the

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Speaker 2: ten year don't participate and don't get anchored down by

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Speaker 2: the stating of the front end of the yell curve,

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Speaker 2: lower all the rest of the interest rates, like your

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Speaker 2: mortgage rates are not going to follow down the federal

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Speaker 2: funds rate. It's an anchor rate, but it's an interbank

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Speaker 2: lending rate. The regular people are not banks, so we

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Speaker 2: don't have access to an inner bank lending rate. Now

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Speaker 2: it is an anchor rate, so everything's supposed to come

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Speaker 2: down because of the arbitrage opportunities that are created between

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Speaker 2: institutions and the products that they have access to at

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Speaker 2: the Federal Reserve, like the repo market. But that doesn't

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Speaker 2: mean just because they say the rate goes down that

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Speaker 2: the rate is going to come down. And if they

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Speaker 2: state the rate down and the rate doesn't come down,

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Speaker 2: they have a really big problem. I think that's why

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Speaker 2: they've been so hesitant. They'd tried the lower it a

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Speaker 2: couple times. The free market didn't agree. The free mark

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Speaker 2: is saying, look, you're diluting I'm lending you money. You're

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Speaker 2: giving me cash equivalent collateral while I'm holding this collateral.

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Speaker 2: You're printing two trillion more units of this collateral every

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Speaker 2: single year. The collateral is being diluted too fast. I

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Speaker 2: cannot lend you this money at a lower rate. I

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Speaker 2: am demanding this rate so that I can at least

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Speaker 2: break even. And I think at this point, real interest

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Speaker 2: rates are negative, So the cost of cash flow is

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Speaker 2: a negative real rate of return at this point, and

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Speaker 2: that dynamic I think, and I think sophisticated investors understand that.

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Speaker 2: But most investors do not understand that at all, which

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Speaker 2: is exactly why we see market prices where they are today.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, certainly, so, you know, I have a bitcoin savvy audience,

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Speaker 4: most of them, most of the people here are already

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Speaker 4: probably buying bitcoin, owning bitcoin, things like that. And to

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Speaker 4: the point that you're making, I mean, bitcoin's down a

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Speaker 4: little bit off of it's all time high from just

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Speaker 4: a couple of days ago at the time of this recording.

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Speaker 4: Maybe it'll come down a little bit more, maybe it won't.

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Speaker 4: We don't know what's going to happen the next couple

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Speaker 4: of days. But to the point that you're making, we

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Speaker 4: sort of know the direction it's going over the next

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Speaker 4: months and quarters and certainly years ahead as that endless

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Speaker 4: debasement kind of continues. Regardless of which way that works out.

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Speaker 4: Like you said, damned if you damn damned if you don't,

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Speaker 4: if rates come down or they don't, either way, more

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Speaker 4: money printing is coming on the back of that. Bitcoin

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Speaker 4: is the most sensitive asset to global liquidity, and so

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Speaker 4: of course it goes up the most. Now for a

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Speaker 4: lot of my audience who's already been listening to this

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Speaker 4: for a long time, they've been dollar cost averaging into

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Speaker 4: bitcoin for a long time. Maybe they've seen, hopefully they've

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Speaker 4: seen a lot of appreciation in that bitcoin stack.

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Speaker 3: I've seen that happen a lot, But a lot of

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Speaker 3: people end up in the dilemma. Jack Malers called it

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Speaker 3: the Hoddler's dilemma. So I bought bitcoin. I did what

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Speaker 3: I was supposed to do. I held like I was

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Speaker 3: supposed to.

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Speaker 4: I have a lot of wealth, supposedly on paper, but

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Speaker 4: my life hasn't gotten any improvement. Michael Saylor says, you

360
00:17:23,800 --> 00:17:27,720
Speaker 4: never sell your bitcoin, So how does a bitcoiner solve

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Speaker 4: that problem?

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Speaker 2: Yes, well, Mark, no one knows it better than not.

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Speaker 2: Welcome to our lives right Bitcoin since twenty thirteen, and

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00:17:36,680 --> 00:17:38,880
Speaker 2: the number on the screen keeps going up. But life

365
00:17:38,880 --> 00:17:41,919
Speaker 2: doesn't change until you can leverage that wealth, so you

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Speaker 2: can unlock that purchasing power. And that's exactly what we

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Speaker 2: do at People's Reserve. We're designing bitcoin power finance products

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Speaker 2: that enable the responsible savor of bitcoin to unlock the

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Speaker 2: purchasing power of their bitcoin without giving up ownership. And

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Speaker 2: the whole idea behind People's Reserve really started with it's

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Speaker 2: my own failure, my own mistake, and that was in

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Speaker 2: twenty nineteen. I bought my first home, a small single

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Speaker 2: family home, for one hundred bitcoin, and yes, yes, I

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Speaker 2: knew it was a bear market, but my wife was

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Speaker 2: pregnant and relative to my overall bitcoin savings, if I

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Speaker 2: didn't do it, she would kill me. So I had

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Speaker 2: to buy that house, you know. And today I look

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Speaker 2: at the price of bitcoin, and you know, I could

379
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Speaker 2: have twelve million additional dollars on my balance sheet. Instead,

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Speaker 2: I have a house that I'd be lucky to get

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Speaker 2: five hundred thousand dollars for. So it makes sense when

382
00:18:31,840 --> 00:18:34,719
Speaker 2: people understand where we are in the adoption curve. Right

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00:18:34,760 --> 00:18:36,720
Speaker 2: we talk about that S curve. At adoption, we are

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Speaker 2: at the bottom of the S curve. There's an ongoing

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Speaker 2: transfer of wealth and it is about to accelerate right now.

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Speaker 2: You do not want to be giving up ownership of

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Speaker 2: your bitcoin. It is the most valuable asset on your

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Speaker 2: balance sheet by far, It has the greatest potential by far,

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00:18:54,280 --> 00:18:55,679
Speaker 2: and if you're in a position where you have to

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Speaker 2: give it up, that could.

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Speaker 1: Cause long term pain.

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Speaker 2: In my case, you know, I could have twelve million

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Speaker 2: additional dollars that I don't have access to now. Luckily

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Speaker 2: I was a responsible saver of bitcoin for a long

395
00:19:06,800 --> 00:19:09,080
Speaker 2: time and it made sense. But not everybody's in that position.

396
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Speaker 2: So what we need are tools that allow people to

397
00:19:13,880 --> 00:19:16,600
Speaker 2: unlock their purchasing power without giving up ownership, which are

398
00:19:16,640 --> 00:19:19,720
Speaker 2: financial tools that allow you to bar against bitcoin. But

399
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Speaker 2: the biggest thing, the biggest risk in this, and again

400
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Speaker 2: this is from another one of my failures. So it's

401
00:19:24,600 --> 00:19:26,239
Speaker 2: funny how in life we end up learning most from

402
00:19:26,280 --> 00:19:28,679
Speaker 2: our failures. You know, and I'm sure a lot of

403
00:19:28,680 --> 00:19:31,280
Speaker 2: your listeners may have been in a similar position. But

404
00:19:31,440 --> 00:19:34,920
Speaker 2: going into twenty twenty, going into what was COVID, we

405
00:19:34,920 --> 00:19:37,600
Speaker 2: were also going into the Having. So as someone who

406
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Speaker 2: had been part of two cycles, I figured this is

407
00:19:40,240 --> 00:19:43,160
Speaker 2: a no brainer. So of course I'm on bitmex. I'm

408
00:19:43,200 --> 00:19:45,080
Speaker 2: levered up, baby, We're going into the having.

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Speaker 3: Let's go lever up.

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Speaker 1: This is going to be fun.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, And then we have a liquidity crisis, right, and

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Speaker 2: then we have COVID and price falls from ten to five,

413
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Speaker 2: and I'm getting margin calls and I'm posting a little

414
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Speaker 2: bit of extra margin. I don't know how much lower

415
00:19:58,359 --> 00:20:00,680
Speaker 2: can go, you know, fifty percent in such times very

416
00:20:00,960 --> 00:20:03,920
Speaker 2: is a lot, right, Bitcoin's volatile, it'll bounce back up. Well,

417
00:20:03,920 --> 00:20:07,239
Speaker 2: no overnight went below thirty eight hundred dollars, liquidating forour

418
00:20:07,359 --> 00:20:11,240
Speaker 2: er bitcoin gone. So again another experience I had where

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Speaker 2: it's just a horrible experience to see bitcoin go from

420
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Speaker 2: ten thousand to blow thirty eight, lose a portion of

421
00:20:17,240 --> 00:20:20,120
Speaker 2: your bitcoin that you had leveraged and borrowed against, and

422
00:20:20,200 --> 00:20:23,040
Speaker 2: then a couple months later it's right back where it was,

423
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Speaker 2: right back at the ten thousand point dollar point. But

424
00:20:26,040 --> 00:20:29,120
Speaker 2: it gave me the idea of for our products at

425
00:20:29,119 --> 00:20:33,480
Speaker 2: People's Reserve, specifically our bitcoin powered mortgage product, that there

426
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Speaker 2: is the ability, there is the chance to eliminate liquidation risk.

427
00:20:37,720 --> 00:20:40,720
Speaker 2: So in that same COVID like scenario, if you came

428
00:20:40,720 --> 00:20:43,360
Speaker 2: to People's Reserve to get a bitcoin powered mortgage, what

429
00:20:43,400 --> 00:20:46,399
Speaker 2: we do is we cross collateralize the real estate with

430
00:20:46,520 --> 00:20:51,360
Speaker 2: the bitcoin, and by doing that we can eliminate liquidation risk.

431
00:20:51,440 --> 00:20:54,200
Speaker 2: So as the price of bitcoin goes down, every ten

432
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Speaker 2: percent it goes down, you your interest rate goes up

433
00:20:58,600 --> 00:21:01,800
Speaker 2: fifty basis points or half of one percent. So during

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Speaker 2: the COVID example, you go from ten thousand down to

435
00:21:04,000 --> 00:21:07,320
Speaker 2: five thousand, that's five deviations or fifty percent. That's two

436
00:21:07,359 --> 00:21:09,600
Speaker 2: and a half percent. So for a couple of months,

437
00:21:09,600 --> 00:21:11,320
Speaker 2: you would have paid an interest rate that was two

438
00:21:11,320 --> 00:21:13,919
Speaker 2: and a half percent higher than your starting rate. But

439
00:21:14,119 --> 00:21:17,800
Speaker 2: as bitcoin recovered and rebounded, for every ten percent price gain,

440
00:21:18,200 --> 00:21:20,199
Speaker 2: you get those points back. So by the time you

441
00:21:20,200 --> 00:21:23,160
Speaker 2: know two months later, your rate back at your original terms,

442
00:21:23,400 --> 00:21:24,240
Speaker 2: plus you.

443
00:21:24,240 --> 00:21:25,480
Speaker 1: Had no liquidation risk.

444
00:21:25,720 --> 00:21:28,119
Speaker 2: You bought your new home, and you can actually sleep

445
00:21:28,200 --> 00:21:29,720
Speaker 2: in your new home because you don't.

446
00:21:29,560 --> 00:21:31,000
Speaker 1: Have to worry about getting liquidated.

447
00:21:31,240 --> 00:21:33,199
Speaker 2: This is something that we're really excited to offer to

448
00:21:33,240 --> 00:21:34,680
Speaker 2: the marketplace and to innovate with.

449
00:21:35,840 --> 00:21:38,720
Speaker 4: So I have bitcoin, I've been holding bitcoin. I have

450
00:21:38,880 --> 00:21:40,919
Speaker 4: option A, which is to sell my bitcoin and buy

451
00:21:40,960 --> 00:21:46,639
Speaker 4: the house, which, by the way, you know, lost opportunity

452
00:21:46,640 --> 00:21:49,240
Speaker 4: costs is what it is. And to your point, you

453
00:21:49,240 --> 00:21:50,840
Speaker 4: could have had twelve million dollars study of half a

454
00:21:50,880 --> 00:21:54,359
Speaker 4: million dollar house. That being said, what you have is

455
00:21:54,400 --> 00:21:56,480
Speaker 4: you've had a house for your family for the last

456
00:21:56,480 --> 00:21:59,199
Speaker 4: however many years, and it's priceless. Right at the end

457
00:21:59,240 --> 00:22:00,919
Speaker 4: of the day, I just want to just lay this

458
00:22:00,960 --> 00:22:02,880
Speaker 4: out for everybody. At the end of the day, we

459
00:22:02,960 --> 00:22:06,359
Speaker 4: don't want money. We don't want money, we want the

460
00:22:06,400 --> 00:22:10,080
Speaker 4: goods and services that money buys us. And so if

461
00:22:10,080 --> 00:22:12,080
Speaker 4: you have a family, you got kids, you want to

462
00:22:12,080 --> 00:22:15,400
Speaker 4: support them. I mean, it's worth more than than the bitcoin.

463
00:22:16,680 --> 00:22:18,480
Speaker 4: The last last couple of years, I built the beach

464
00:22:18,520 --> 00:22:19,440
Speaker 4: house down in Mexico.

465
00:22:19,680 --> 00:22:21,879
Speaker 3: We've dreamed about it forever, my wife and my kids,

466
00:22:21,880 --> 00:22:22,399
Speaker 3: and my kids.

467
00:22:22,280 --> 00:22:25,200
Speaker 4: Are getting older, and we built the We built the house,

468
00:22:25,240 --> 00:22:26,359
Speaker 4: and I had to pay cash for the house, and

469
00:22:26,359 --> 00:22:29,040
Speaker 4: it was very expensive, and so many bitcorners are like,

470
00:22:29,080 --> 00:22:30,840
Speaker 4: why would you put all that cash into a house.

471
00:22:30,880 --> 00:22:32,560
Speaker 4: Don't you know how in five years how much that

472
00:22:32,560 --> 00:22:34,480
Speaker 4: bitcoin will be worth? And I'm like why, So one

473
00:22:34,520 --> 00:22:37,960
Speaker 4: day I can buy a beach house, right, So I

474
00:22:38,160 --> 00:22:40,280
Speaker 4: do just want to kind of put this into people's minds,

475
00:22:40,320 --> 00:22:42,760
Speaker 4: like we want money to get things.

476
00:22:43,119 --> 00:22:44,280
Speaker 3: It's a means, not an end.

477
00:22:44,720 --> 00:22:46,359
Speaker 4: But that being said, so let's talk about how this

478
00:22:46,400 --> 00:22:50,119
Speaker 4: works for you. So you, uh, we're in.

479
00:22:50,320 --> 00:22:51,560
Speaker 3: We're in. We're in this scenario.

480
00:22:51,560 --> 00:22:54,640
Speaker 4: Today, we have the bitcoin. We think that it could

481
00:22:54,720 --> 00:22:58,160
Speaker 4: run to five hundred thousand million dollars in the next

482
00:22:58,160 --> 00:23:00,280
Speaker 4: five years. I don't want to sell right now at

483
00:23:00,320 --> 00:23:02,960
Speaker 4: one hundred thousand, one hundred and ten twelve whatever it

484
00:23:03,040 --> 00:23:04,679
Speaker 4: is and then miss out on that but I want

485
00:23:04,720 --> 00:23:08,040
Speaker 4: to buy the house. Now you're saying that you could

486
00:23:08,040 --> 00:23:11,240
Speaker 4: give me a loan against the bitcoin to buy the house,

487
00:23:11,400 --> 00:23:13,600
Speaker 4: or you give me the house against the bitcoin.

488
00:23:14,600 --> 00:23:15,480
Speaker 3: But the interest rate is.

489
00:23:15,520 --> 00:23:18,760
Speaker 4: Variable based off of where the collateralization is, what the

490
00:23:18,760 --> 00:23:19,520
Speaker 4: loan to value is.

491
00:23:20,320 --> 00:23:23,800
Speaker 2: Yes, that's correct, and what we do is we don't

492
00:23:24,280 --> 00:23:28,159
Speaker 2: count the house is actually serving as collateral to. So

493
00:23:28,200 --> 00:23:31,440
Speaker 2: the loan is secured by the property and by the bitcoin,

494
00:23:31,840 --> 00:23:35,520
Speaker 2: and the rate is adjustable based on the value of bitcoin.

495
00:23:35,880 --> 00:23:37,440
Speaker 1: So if you.

496
00:23:37,400 --> 00:23:40,159
Speaker 2: Get into a scenario where you default on your payment,

497
00:23:40,200 --> 00:23:43,040
Speaker 2: because you can't get liquidated based on price volatility, but

498
00:23:43,119 --> 00:23:45,600
Speaker 2: if you default on your payment, the goal of us

499
00:23:45,640 --> 00:23:48,440
Speaker 2: would be instead of going through a foreclosure and eviction process,

500
00:23:48,480 --> 00:23:50,879
Speaker 2: which could add up to over a year and a

501
00:23:50,880 --> 00:23:53,359
Speaker 2: lot of costs from the lender side, we'd rather just

502
00:23:53,400 --> 00:23:56,080
Speaker 2: give you a call and say, hey, we've liquidated the

503
00:23:56,080 --> 00:23:59,520
Speaker 2: portion of your bitcoin to close your loan. Congratulations, you

504
00:23:59,560 --> 00:24:02,080
Speaker 2: now own your home free and clear. And what you

505
00:24:02,080 --> 00:24:05,360
Speaker 2: said earlier I absolutely agree with. I raised my family

506
00:24:05,600 --> 00:24:07,520
Speaker 2: in that home. I went from one kids to having

507
00:24:07,560 --> 00:24:09,120
Speaker 2: four kids in that home. So I have a lot

508
00:24:09,160 --> 00:24:11,800
Speaker 2: of great memories in that home, and I wouldn't trade

509
00:24:11,800 --> 00:24:15,200
Speaker 2: it for anything, So it is important for your listeners

510
00:24:15,200 --> 00:24:18,400
Speaker 2: to understand that. But at the same time, for those

511
00:24:18,400 --> 00:24:21,000
Speaker 2: who haven't been involved in the marketplace for a very

512
00:24:21,040 --> 00:24:24,720
Speaker 2: long time and are just now starting to experience the

513
00:24:24,720 --> 00:24:30,960
Speaker 2: benefit of bitcoin's price appreciation and getting the opportunity to

514
00:24:31,000 --> 00:24:35,119
Speaker 2: deploy that purchasing power using a product like this, I

515
00:24:35,119 --> 00:24:38,080
Speaker 2: think makes a lot of sense because we've taken all

516
00:24:38,080 --> 00:24:40,480
Speaker 2: the steps that we can to learn from the failures

517
00:24:40,600 --> 00:24:45,280
Speaker 2: of version one of bitcoin lending, So no rehypothication. We

518
00:24:45,400 --> 00:24:49,840
Speaker 2: actually have a self custody option. If you do custody

519
00:24:49,880 --> 00:24:52,440
Speaker 2: it with us, it's held in our fund, which serves

520
00:24:52,440 --> 00:24:55,159
Speaker 2: as a special purpose vehicle. So the bitcoin is not

521
00:24:55,240 --> 00:24:58,760
Speaker 2: on people's reserves balance sheet. It's separate, so there's no

522
00:24:58,800 --> 00:25:01,000
Speaker 2: way that we can hold it. There's no way that

523
00:25:01,040 --> 00:25:05,080
Speaker 2: we can leverage it or rehypothecate it. Just little things

524
00:25:05,160 --> 00:25:07,280
Speaker 2: like this that we've learned over time. A lot of

525
00:25:07,280 --> 00:25:11,160
Speaker 2: these fiat finance mechanics don't really work in bitcoin, but.

526
00:25:11,160 --> 00:25:12,000
Speaker 1: At people's reserve.

527
00:25:12,320 --> 00:25:14,840
Speaker 2: You know, I say that we're bitcoin maxis building for

528
00:25:14,880 --> 00:25:18,160
Speaker 2: Bitcoin maxis, which means we want to self custody our bitcoin.

529
00:25:18,440 --> 00:25:22,120
Speaker 2: We want proof of reserves, we want guarantees of no rehypothecation,

530
00:25:22,680 --> 00:25:27,000
Speaker 2: and we want low interest rates. It does not make

531
00:25:27,080 --> 00:25:30,639
Speaker 2: sense to me and to people's reserve that a bitcoiner

532
00:25:30,640 --> 00:25:32,840
Speaker 2: who holds the most pristine form of collateral in the

533
00:25:32,880 --> 00:25:37,400
Speaker 2: world and who and many times is over collateralized. Right,

534
00:25:37,440 --> 00:25:38,959
Speaker 2: Like in one of our loans, if you're gonna buy

535
00:25:38,960 --> 00:25:41,640
Speaker 2: a five hundred thousand dollars house, you have to put

536
00:25:41,720 --> 00:25:44,600
Speaker 2: up at minimum five hundred thousand dollars of bitcoin, While

537
00:25:44,640 --> 00:25:47,040
Speaker 2: with other lenders you'd like to shoot for a fifty

538
00:25:47,040 --> 00:25:49,200
Speaker 2: percent LTV, you're gonna put up a million dollars of

539
00:25:49,240 --> 00:25:50,960
Speaker 2: bitcoin to get that five hundred thousand.

540
00:25:51,000 --> 00:25:53,120
Speaker 4: So you're saying you might do one hundred percent LTV.

541
00:25:52,960 --> 00:25:56,560
Speaker 2: Loan, absolutely, because it's cross collateralized with the real estate.

542
00:25:56,960 --> 00:25:59,720
Speaker 2: So the value of the home is securitizing the loan

543
00:25:59,800 --> 00:26:01,520
Speaker 2: as well, and that gives them.

544
00:26:01,320 --> 00:26:04,000
Speaker 4: How would the rate be set and how does that vary?

545
00:26:04,160 --> 00:26:07,720
Speaker 4: Because typically you look at you know, nobody buys the house.

546
00:26:07,800 --> 00:26:09,640
Speaker 4: They don't buy five hundred thousand dollars house. They buy

547
00:26:09,640 --> 00:26:12,800
Speaker 4: a monthly payment, and that monthly payment is typically from

548
00:26:12,880 --> 00:26:16,680
Speaker 4: the credit worthiness of their monthly income. And so a

549
00:26:16,720 --> 00:26:19,520
Speaker 4: lot of times most people are probably maxing out what

550
00:26:19,560 --> 00:26:21,520
Speaker 4: they can afford on a monthly basis, so that if

551
00:26:21,560 --> 00:26:23,840
Speaker 4: that payment jumps a couple points, it could be detrimental.

552
00:26:24,359 --> 00:26:26,400
Speaker 4: So I'm curious, like, how do you set that rate

553
00:26:26,520 --> 00:26:28,480
Speaker 4: on the low end? And then is there caps on

554
00:26:28,520 --> 00:26:29,760
Speaker 4: how high or how low it can go?

555
00:26:30,640 --> 00:26:33,159
Speaker 2: Yeah, So we are a US based company, so the

556
00:26:33,320 --> 00:26:36,879
Speaker 2: usury rates are our caps. We cannot commit usury against

557
00:26:36,960 --> 00:26:41,760
Speaker 2: our borrowers. But our whole thesis is that bitcoin, as

558
00:26:41,800 --> 00:26:45,760
Speaker 2: pristine collateral, is the lowest risk collateral. So when you

559
00:26:45,840 --> 00:26:48,760
Speaker 2: work with us, we actually don't care about your credit score,

560
00:26:48,800 --> 00:26:51,040
Speaker 2: we don't care about your income. As long as you

561
00:26:51,040 --> 00:26:54,080
Speaker 2: can post the bitcoin, you can get the financing. Also

562
00:26:54,160 --> 00:26:57,560
Speaker 2: worked into our contract is a grace period, so if

563
00:26:57,600 --> 00:27:00,119
Speaker 2: you default on your payment, depending on what state you're in,

564
00:27:00,480 --> 00:27:02,760
Speaker 2: you have somewhere between ninety and one hundred and twenty

565
00:27:02,880 --> 00:27:06,080
Speaker 2: days to cure your default. So it's not an immediate liquidation.

566
00:27:06,119 --> 00:27:08,359
Speaker 2: It's not DeFi like a smart contract where it's like, oh,

567
00:27:08,440 --> 00:27:10,879
Speaker 2: this number was breached and boop, it automatically happened, then

568
00:27:10,880 --> 00:27:14,080
Speaker 2: you're done. No, it's a contractual agreement. It's a handshake.

569
00:27:14,119 --> 00:27:15,480
Speaker 2: We're going to look you in the eyes and shake

570
00:27:15,520 --> 00:27:17,359
Speaker 2: your hand and give you the best chance that you

571
00:27:17,440 --> 00:27:19,920
Speaker 2: can have to benefit. The other thing is is maybe

572
00:27:19,920 --> 00:27:21,960
Speaker 2: you lose your job. Maybe you have a good income,

573
00:27:21,960 --> 00:27:23,640
Speaker 2: but you lose your job, you're going through a tough period,

574
00:27:23,720 --> 00:27:26,520
Speaker 2: or you're relocating, you got to find a new job. Well,

575
00:27:26,600 --> 00:27:29,680
Speaker 2: you can pay your monthly payment from your bitcoin collateral,

576
00:27:30,040 --> 00:27:33,000
Speaker 2: and since you're initiating the loan with a one to

577
00:27:33,000 --> 00:27:36,120
Speaker 2: one ratio, you can pay quite a bit of payments.

578
00:27:36,119 --> 00:27:37,919
Speaker 2: You can make almost all of the payments as long

579
00:27:37,960 --> 00:27:41,399
Speaker 2: as the price of bitcoin stays stable without having to

580
00:27:41,440 --> 00:27:43,879
Speaker 2: produce any cashflow to make those payments, and that allows

581
00:27:43,920 --> 00:27:47,679
Speaker 2: bitcoin to compound its value over time and at the

582
00:27:47,760 --> 00:27:49,760
Speaker 2: end of it, even if you make from those payments,

583
00:27:50,080 --> 00:27:53,639
Speaker 2: with bitcoin's compounding annual growth rate being so high sixty

584
00:27:53,640 --> 00:27:56,480
Speaker 2: over sixty percent in a five year period, if even

585
00:27:56,560 --> 00:27:58,800
Speaker 2: that gets cut in half to thirty percent or even

586
00:27:58,800 --> 00:28:01,760
Speaker 2: more down the fifteen percent, the rate at which that

587
00:28:01,960 --> 00:28:04,600
Speaker 2: bitcoin equity will grow over the life of the loan

588
00:28:04,880 --> 00:28:07,359
Speaker 2: will allow you to make the payment from the collateral

589
00:28:07,600 --> 00:28:10,520
Speaker 2: and then still have leftovers at the end of the loan.

590
00:28:10,680 --> 00:28:12,840
Speaker 2: We would and recommend that that because the goal is

591
00:28:12,880 --> 00:28:14,359
Speaker 2: to hold as much bitcoin as you can, right, but

592
00:28:14,400 --> 00:28:16,040
Speaker 2: if you're in a tough spot, there's no reason the

593
00:28:16,080 --> 00:28:18,600
Speaker 2: default make a small payment from your existing collateral.

594
00:28:19,800 --> 00:28:21,760
Speaker 3: I love that. That's a good idea. What about where

595
00:28:21,760 --> 00:28:23,439
Speaker 3: does the rate get set? I mean, are you going out?

596
00:28:23,480 --> 00:28:25,040
Speaker 4: You talked earlier about the FED set in the rate

597
00:28:25,080 --> 00:28:27,680
Speaker 4: and then people market in that episode is at prime plus.

598
00:28:27,520 --> 00:28:28,280
Speaker 3: A couple points.

599
00:28:28,760 --> 00:28:31,640
Speaker 4: And then you said, you know it goes up if

600
00:28:31,720 --> 00:28:33,520
Speaker 4: I think you said if the LTV comes down, then

601
00:28:33,520 --> 00:28:35,600
Speaker 4: the rate goes up and it oscillates.

602
00:28:35,600 --> 00:28:38,800
Speaker 3: So where does it start? What are you measuring off of?

603
00:28:38,840 --> 00:28:40,160
Speaker 3: How high does it go, how to load does it go,

604
00:28:40,160 --> 00:28:40,560
Speaker 3: et cetera.

605
00:28:41,120 --> 00:28:42,680
Speaker 1: Yeah, and fantastic question.

606
00:28:42,720 --> 00:28:44,120
Speaker 2: And this is one of the things we're most excited

607
00:28:44,160 --> 00:28:46,840
Speaker 2: about because we're going to offer the best rates in

608
00:28:46,880 --> 00:28:52,200
Speaker 2: the industry. I believe Bitcoin Power Finance will redefine the

609
00:28:52,360 --> 00:28:56,800
Speaker 2: risk free rate and redefine the risk free borrower. It

610
00:28:56,880 --> 00:29:00,239
Speaker 2: is no longer going to be the entity who has

611
00:29:00,280 --> 00:29:02,680
Speaker 2: the power of the printer who is known as the

612
00:29:02,760 --> 00:29:05,000
Speaker 2: risk free borrower. Just because you can print more of

613
00:29:05,040 --> 00:29:08,080
Speaker 2: that collateral and pay it doesn't mean it's a pristine collateral.

614
00:29:08,480 --> 00:29:12,840
Speaker 2: So because of that, we are using multiple strategies, including

615
00:29:12,840 --> 00:29:16,120
Speaker 2: a fund LP strategy to where we are not partnered

616
00:29:17,360 --> 00:29:21,320
Speaker 2: with people who practice fractional reserves. So what that means

617
00:29:21,320 --> 00:29:23,760
Speaker 2: for us is that we do not have to marry

618
00:29:23,800 --> 00:29:26,680
Speaker 2: our business model to the traditional yield curve. And what

619
00:29:26,680 --> 00:29:30,240
Speaker 2: you see in traditional bitcoin lending is that the lender

620
00:29:30,280 --> 00:29:33,040
Speaker 2: will be partnered with a banking partner, they will have

621
00:29:33,080 --> 00:29:35,920
Speaker 2: a line of credit at a certain rate, and therefore,

622
00:29:36,000 --> 00:29:38,440
Speaker 2: in order for the business to be profitable, they will

623
00:29:38,440 --> 00:29:41,640
Speaker 2: have to arbitrage the difference between their borrow rate and

624
00:29:41,680 --> 00:29:44,760
Speaker 2: their customer's borrow rate. So if you're prime rate now

625
00:29:44,800 --> 00:29:47,040
Speaker 2: is seven and a half, if you're at prime plus

626
00:29:47,120 --> 00:29:49,960
Speaker 2: fifty basis points, because you have a good relationship and

627
00:29:49,960 --> 00:29:52,000
Speaker 2: you're at eight percent, you have to turn around to

628
00:29:52,040 --> 00:29:54,880
Speaker 2: the bitcoiner and say, I'll let you borrow at ten percent,

629
00:29:54,960 --> 00:29:57,479
Speaker 2: twelve percent, fifteen percent. In order to make any profit

630
00:29:57,960 --> 00:30:01,360
Speaker 2: with people's reserve. Our cost of capital is zero because

631
00:30:01,360 --> 00:30:04,360
Speaker 2: we've sourced it from LPs who understand that it's time

632
00:30:04,400 --> 00:30:07,760
Speaker 2: to get some diversification within your lending portfolio. Yes, you

633
00:30:07,760 --> 00:30:10,800
Speaker 2: can lend to the government for risk free borrowing. You're

634
00:30:10,800 --> 00:30:13,000
Speaker 2: going to get your capital back. Yes you can lend

635
00:30:13,040 --> 00:30:16,280
Speaker 2: to the municipalities to generate risk free cash flow. But

636
00:30:17,040 --> 00:30:20,640
Speaker 2: you have systemic risk, you need systemic diversification. You should

637
00:30:20,680 --> 00:30:23,280
Speaker 2: lend to bitcoiners. And the light bulbs going off because

638
00:30:23,280 --> 00:30:25,640
Speaker 2: of the abuse that we've seen since twenty twenty. Now

639
00:30:25,680 --> 00:30:28,640
Speaker 2: I say all that to say this, we don't want

640
00:30:28,640 --> 00:30:33,040
Speaker 2: to be as a longtime bitcoiner and free money maximalists.

641
00:30:34,040 --> 00:30:36,600
Speaker 2: You can't have free market money when there's a small

642
00:30:36,600 --> 00:30:39,080
Speaker 2: group of men who tell you the price of the money.

643
00:30:39,960 --> 00:30:42,640
Speaker 2: It goes against free market concepts. A free market money

644
00:30:42,680 --> 00:30:44,880
Speaker 2: means that you need free market price of money. And

645
00:30:44,880 --> 00:30:46,680
Speaker 2: the price of money is the interest rate. So the

646
00:30:46,680 --> 00:30:49,320
Speaker 2: interest rate should be determined by the supply of money,

647
00:30:49,320 --> 00:30:52,640
Speaker 2: the demand for loans, and the counterparty risk. That's how

648
00:30:52,640 --> 00:30:56,240
Speaker 2: you price money. Stating the rate and anchoring the rate

649
00:30:56,360 --> 00:31:01,520
Speaker 2: and doing federal Open market committee exercises and executions to

650
00:31:01,920 --> 00:31:03,600
Speaker 2: balance a rate or to force a rate like you

651
00:31:03,640 --> 00:31:06,240
Speaker 2: see what ye'l curve control in Japan is not free

652
00:31:06,320 --> 00:31:09,880
Speaker 2: market money. So at people's reserve the starting interest rate.

653
00:31:09,920 --> 00:31:11,720
Speaker 2: To finally answer your question, sorry about that, but to

654
00:31:11,760 --> 00:31:14,560
Speaker 2: finally answer your question, the starting interest rate a people

655
00:31:14,600 --> 00:31:16,920
Speaker 2: deserve is ten and a half percent and what we

656
00:31:16,960 --> 00:31:20,360
Speaker 2: allow you to do is either through the appreciation of

657
00:31:20,360 --> 00:31:23,680
Speaker 2: bitcoin going up in those ten percent increments.

658
00:31:23,520 --> 00:31:25,080
Speaker 1: Or by over collateralizing.

659
00:31:25,240 --> 00:31:27,840
Speaker 2: So if you borrow five hundred thousand, you can max

660
00:31:27,920 --> 00:31:30,719
Speaker 2: over collateralized by two hundred percent, which means you're going

661
00:31:30,760 --> 00:31:32,880
Speaker 2: to post one point five million dollars worth of bitcoin.

662
00:31:33,640 --> 00:31:36,920
Speaker 2: And we allow you to buy back percentage points, so

663
00:31:36,960 --> 00:31:39,280
Speaker 2: you can knock off a total of four percentage points

664
00:31:39,320 --> 00:31:41,600
Speaker 2: from that ten and a half percent starting rate, and

665
00:31:41,640 --> 00:31:43,680
Speaker 2: you can get a six and a half percent rate

666
00:31:43,880 --> 00:31:48,080
Speaker 2: with a bitcoin power mortgage. That's Prime minus one right now.

667
00:31:48,240 --> 00:31:51,360
Speaker 2: So that's the best rate in the bitcoin industry, and

668
00:31:51,560 --> 00:31:54,920
Speaker 2: it's a very competitive rate when you consider where the

669
00:31:54,960 --> 00:31:57,920
Speaker 2: trap fi market is. But mark that is at our

670
00:31:57,960 --> 00:32:01,239
Speaker 2: basic loyalty level. We have different loyalty levels through our

671
00:32:01,280 --> 00:32:04,200
Speaker 2: loyalty token, and if you qualify for our Diamond level,

672
00:32:04,400 --> 00:32:07,440
Speaker 2: which means you own ten percent in our loyalty token

673
00:32:07,520 --> 00:32:09,000
Speaker 2: of your loan value. So if you have a five

674
00:32:09,040 --> 00:32:11,280
Speaker 2: hundred thousand dollars loan to buy your home, you're going

675
00:32:11,360 --> 00:32:14,160
Speaker 2: to own fifty thousand dollars of our peering loyalty token.

676
00:32:14,400 --> 00:32:16,680
Speaker 2: Your starting rate is actually seven and a half percent,

677
00:32:17,040 --> 00:32:19,400
Speaker 2: and then if you over collateralize and knock off that

678
00:32:19,480 --> 00:32:22,280
Speaker 2: same four percentage points, you're going to borrow at three

679
00:32:22,280 --> 00:32:24,320
Speaker 2: and a half percent. That means you're going to have

680
00:32:24,440 --> 00:32:28,160
Speaker 2: access to the lowest cheapest cost of capital for any

681
00:32:28,200 --> 00:32:32,360
Speaker 2: home buyer in the world. You're actually accessing capital for

682
00:32:32,480 --> 00:32:35,680
Speaker 2: cheaper than the government. And we're able to beat that

683
00:32:35,800 --> 00:32:39,360
Speaker 2: sofa rate because we're not partnered.

684
00:32:39,160 --> 00:32:42,600
Speaker 1: With money printers. We have sourced our capital.

685
00:32:42,640 --> 00:32:46,200
Speaker 2: We have sourced through LPs who are looking through that diversification,

686
00:32:46,440 --> 00:32:49,440
Speaker 2: understand the cracks that we see within the system, and

687
00:32:49,520 --> 00:32:52,680
Speaker 2: they want systemic diversification. And the best part about it

688
00:32:52,720 --> 00:32:55,200
Speaker 2: is if something goes wrong in our product, you're not

689
00:32:55,240 --> 00:32:58,200
Speaker 2: getting back printed dollars and then rushing in to an

690
00:32:58,240 --> 00:33:00,880
Speaker 2: asset that you're going to buy a smaller home, crappier car,

691
00:33:01,240 --> 00:33:05,080
Speaker 2: less stock or equity. You're actually defaulting into bitcoin and

692
00:33:05,160 --> 00:33:07,120
Speaker 2: real estate, the two assets that you really want.

693
00:33:07,680 --> 00:33:08,360
Speaker 3: Yeah.

694
00:33:08,480 --> 00:33:11,080
Speaker 4: I was having a conversation with an investor buddy this morning,

695
00:33:11,120 --> 00:33:13,920
Speaker 4: and we were talking about this exact sort of conversation,

696
00:33:14,000 --> 00:33:15,960
Speaker 4: which is what is the free what is the free

697
00:33:16,000 --> 00:33:20,160
Speaker 4: market price of money right now? And he was trying

698
00:33:20,200 --> 00:33:22,360
Speaker 4: to explain to me how his home should be token eyes,

699
00:33:22,440 --> 00:33:24,360
Speaker 4: and real estate should be token eyes, and they get

700
00:33:24,360 --> 00:33:26,640
Speaker 4: greater liquidity and then loan pools and this that, and

701
00:33:27,080 --> 00:33:30,400
Speaker 4: I disagreed with that, but he's like, Mark, you don't understand, Like,

702
00:33:30,640 --> 00:33:32,040
Speaker 4: you know, I have this home on the beach and

703
00:33:32,040 --> 00:33:35,080
Speaker 4: it's worth millions of dollars, and you know I can't

704
00:33:35,120 --> 00:33:36,960
Speaker 4: get an equity line of credit because I run my

705
00:33:36,960 --> 00:33:37,440
Speaker 4: own business.

706
00:33:37,480 --> 00:33:39,120
Speaker 3: And da da da da, I said.

707
00:33:39,240 --> 00:33:42,520
Speaker 4: I said, look, there's hundreds of hard money lenders that

708
00:33:42,560 --> 00:33:45,280
Speaker 4: will give you a loan against the equity asset based loan.

709
00:33:45,720 --> 00:33:47,160
Speaker 3: I'm not going to pay those rates.

710
00:33:47,160 --> 00:33:48,640
Speaker 4: And you know what the loans are, and da da

711
00:33:48,720 --> 00:33:51,680
Speaker 4: da da, I said. I said, listen, that's the free

712
00:33:51,760 --> 00:33:54,480
Speaker 4: market rate of money. Though you have to understand, like

713
00:33:54,600 --> 00:33:58,240
Speaker 4: mortgages and auto loans are both basically manipulated or subsidized

714
00:33:58,280 --> 00:34:00,640
Speaker 4: by the government or the automakers, which is by the government, right,

715
00:34:00,680 --> 00:34:04,000
Speaker 4: So it's like auto loans and mortgages are basically subsidized.

716
00:34:04,160 --> 00:34:06,720
Speaker 4: So hard money is the rate at the market.

717
00:34:07,280 --> 00:34:08,440
Speaker 3: And I said, I have this question.

718
00:34:08,480 --> 00:34:09,920
Speaker 4: You know, this question come up all the time with

719
00:34:09,960 --> 00:34:11,560
Speaker 4: people borrowing against bitcoin, where they're.

720
00:34:11,400 --> 00:34:13,799
Speaker 3: Like twelve percent, fifteen percent. Are you out of your mind.

721
00:34:13,840 --> 00:34:16,520
Speaker 4: But it's like, that's the cost of free market capital

722
00:34:16,640 --> 00:34:19,680
Speaker 4: right now. And I said, what the flip side Again,

723
00:34:19,719 --> 00:34:21,800
Speaker 4: he's a wealthy investor. I said, how much would you

724
00:34:21,880 --> 00:34:25,080
Speaker 4: loan me cash for? You're going to want minimum ten

725
00:34:25,160 --> 00:34:29,200
Speaker 4: or twelve percent? Right, And so I think I think

726
00:34:29,239 --> 00:34:31,319
Speaker 4: it is important for people to sort of understand that

727
00:34:32,000 --> 00:34:34,000
Speaker 4: we are in this world, as you said, where the

728
00:34:34,040 --> 00:34:36,680
Speaker 4: price of money is set by the government, and so

729
00:34:36,800 --> 00:34:42,160
Speaker 4: government backed subsidized push loans like autos and residential mortgages

730
00:34:42,360 --> 00:34:45,240
Speaker 4: sort of they're manipulated, and so it sort of distorts

731
00:34:45,280 --> 00:34:47,480
Speaker 4: our view of what the fair market price of money is.

732
00:34:48,200 --> 00:34:52,960
Speaker 2: But the existing hard money is tied to that yield curve,

733
00:34:53,400 --> 00:34:54,960
Speaker 2: and that's the problem.

734
00:34:54,600 --> 00:34:56,239
Speaker 3: Because it's tied to the yield curve.

735
00:34:56,280 --> 00:34:58,520
Speaker 4: But it's also based off of demand. So a lot

736
00:34:58,520 --> 00:35:01,040
Speaker 4: of hard money that's going out to asset back loans

737
00:35:01,160 --> 00:35:01,960
Speaker 4: is private money.

738
00:35:02,040 --> 00:35:03,480
Speaker 3: I used to be involved in that industry.

739
00:35:03,480 --> 00:35:06,680
Speaker 4: I was for it and risk and risk and risk certainly,

740
00:35:06,760 --> 00:35:08,759
Speaker 4: but it's also demand, like I want to get the

741
00:35:08,760 --> 00:35:09,879
Speaker 4: most the market will bear.

742
00:35:11,160 --> 00:35:12,759
Speaker 3: So hey, you'll you'll loan the.

743
00:35:12,719 --> 00:35:14,760
Speaker 4: Guy at twelve percent, all right, I'll give you eleven

744
00:35:14,760 --> 00:35:16,880
Speaker 4: point five I'll knock off a point, right, And so

745
00:35:16,920 --> 00:35:19,080
Speaker 4: it's it's whatever the market will bear, plus what I'm

746
00:35:19,120 --> 00:35:20,680
Speaker 4: willing to put it out there, the risk and willing

747
00:35:20,680 --> 00:35:21,560
Speaker 4: to take, et cetera.

748
00:35:22,960 --> 00:35:23,520
Speaker 1: Anyway.

749
00:35:23,640 --> 00:35:26,960
Speaker 2: And the advent of bitcoin as pristine collateral, I would

750
00:35:27,040 --> 00:35:30,279
Speaker 2: I would posit it is negative risk. And and and

751
00:35:30,520 --> 00:35:32,879
Speaker 2: so when you post bitcoin as collateral, because it has

752
00:35:33,160 --> 00:35:37,600
Speaker 2: because it's engineered money that was strategically designed to accumulate

753
00:35:37,680 --> 00:35:40,759
Speaker 2: value over time, when you post it as collateral, you

754
00:35:40,840 --> 00:35:42,000
Speaker 2: become de leveraged.

755
00:35:42,280 --> 00:35:42,440
Speaker 1: Right.

756
00:35:42,480 --> 00:35:44,839
Speaker 2: So when you when you buy your car and you

757
00:35:44,920 --> 00:35:47,759
Speaker 2: drive it off the lot, it loses value. And the

758
00:35:47,760 --> 00:35:49,440
Speaker 2: more you drive it, the more wear and tear it

759
00:35:49,480 --> 00:35:52,279
Speaker 2: loses value. This is why it needs to be subsidized,

760
00:35:52,400 --> 00:35:54,760
Speaker 2: much like a home, because there's a fifty.

761
00:35:54,560 --> 00:35:56,080
Speaker 4: Thousand dollars loan on the car, but the car is

762
00:35:56,120 --> 00:35:57,960
Speaker 4: only worth forty thousand now.

763
00:35:58,080 --> 00:36:01,040
Speaker 2: Yeah, and it becomes more and more risky alone over time.

764
00:36:01,400 --> 00:36:05,319
Speaker 2: The opposite is true with bitcoin, and that's only with

765
00:36:05,400 --> 00:36:10,600
Speaker 2: bitcoin over bitcoin, because of its engineer design, it auto

766
00:36:10,760 --> 00:36:14,920
Speaker 2: de leverages the borrower. It is the advent of negative risk.

767
00:36:15,160 --> 00:36:18,600
Speaker 2: You cannot plug negative risk into trap fi risk models.

768
00:36:18,640 --> 00:36:21,920
Speaker 2: It's like going into a power Excel sheet and putting

769
00:36:21,960 --> 00:36:24,480
Speaker 2: in the wrong information. All the error codes come up,

770
00:36:24,520 --> 00:36:27,359
Speaker 2: like you mess something up somewhere, something in some cell

771
00:36:27,480 --> 00:36:27,759
Speaker 2: is wrong.

772
00:36:27,800 --> 00:36:28,799
Speaker 1: I can't calculate this.

773
00:36:29,160 --> 00:36:31,399
Speaker 2: That's what happens when you try to plug negative risk

774
00:36:32,040 --> 00:36:34,920
Speaker 2: into trap fi credit models. Bitcoin is the advent of

775
00:36:35,000 --> 00:36:38,160
Speaker 2: negative risk, and therefore we're going to be able to

776
00:36:38,320 --> 00:36:41,880
Speaker 2: beat the interest rate in any marketplace because of.

777
00:36:41,760 --> 00:36:43,320
Speaker 1: The lack of risk.

778
00:36:43,800 --> 00:36:47,360
Speaker 2: Risk is the factor that has been mitigated through subsidies,

779
00:36:47,400 --> 00:36:50,279
Speaker 2: subsidies through the government. But in the free market, how

780
00:36:50,280 --> 00:36:53,799
Speaker 2: do you mitigate risk by the quality of the collateral?

781
00:36:54,840 --> 00:36:58,120
Speaker 4: Right now, I've heard you talk about sal pain in

782
00:36:58,120 --> 00:37:01,359
Speaker 4: a future based on how Finny's vision. How Finnie being

783
00:37:01,400 --> 00:37:03,560
Speaker 4: one of the originators, one of the first couple people

784
00:37:03,560 --> 00:37:06,360
Speaker 4: that help work on the Bitcoin protocol, we're entities like

785
00:37:06,400 --> 00:37:09,520
Speaker 4: micro Strategy become a central bank of the Internet economy.

786
00:37:11,000 --> 00:37:12,400
Speaker 3: Fast forward like ten years.

787
00:37:12,400 --> 00:37:13,080
Speaker 4: What does that mean?

788
00:37:13,080 --> 00:37:13,880
Speaker 3: What does that look like?

789
00:37:14,960 --> 00:37:19,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think that there's going to be two competing

790
00:37:19,080 --> 00:37:23,600
Speaker 2: systems as we transition into the future of finance. And

791
00:37:24,080 --> 00:37:26,680
Speaker 2: you know, one system will be the stated and anchored

792
00:37:26,719 --> 00:37:30,600
Speaker 2: system where the rate is controlled by central banks, and

793
00:37:30,640 --> 00:37:33,160
Speaker 2: the other system will be more of a free market system.

794
00:37:33,400 --> 00:37:35,879
Speaker 2: I like to call it the Internet economy, as you said,

795
00:37:35,920 --> 00:37:38,719
Speaker 2: because it's the only economy in the world that is

796
00:37:38,760 --> 00:37:39,360
Speaker 2: debt free.

797
00:37:39,600 --> 00:37:40,719
Speaker 1: It's the only economy in.

798
00:37:40,680 --> 00:37:43,600
Speaker 2: The world that can't be outcompeted by any one economy

799
00:37:43,600 --> 00:37:46,320
Speaker 2: because it's an aggregated economy of everybody, and it's the

800
00:37:46,320 --> 00:37:48,440
Speaker 2: only economy in the world that can't be controlled by

801
00:37:48,480 --> 00:37:52,200
Speaker 2: any one person or power. And because of that, this

802
00:37:52,239 --> 00:37:56,040
Speaker 2: is where decentralized finance has really flourished. And this is

803
00:37:56,040 --> 00:37:59,800
Speaker 2: why a lot of capital you see black rock rushing

804
00:37:59,840 --> 00:38:03,640
Speaker 2: in too, stable coins, you see stable coin legislation going through.

805
00:38:04,120 --> 00:38:07,600
Speaker 2: A lot of that is getting access to the opportunity

806
00:38:07,600 --> 00:38:09,879
Speaker 2: in DeFi where we actually have a free market rate.

807
00:38:10,080 --> 00:38:13,000
Speaker 2: When you look at funding rates within the Internet economy,

808
00:38:13,040 --> 00:38:16,120
Speaker 2: where people are using leverage just to make bets on bitcoin,

809
00:38:17,160 --> 00:38:20,720
Speaker 2: the annualized rate on that could be anywhere between depending

810
00:38:20,760 --> 00:38:23,000
Speaker 2: on how hot or cold the market is, between ten

811
00:38:23,080 --> 00:38:25,320
Speaker 2: and upwards of thirty and forty percent.

812
00:38:25,640 --> 00:38:26,359
Speaker 1: You can't get that.

813
00:38:26,360 --> 00:38:29,200
Speaker 2: Kind of rate of return in anything that you would

814
00:38:29,239 --> 00:38:32,480
Speaker 2: see in travify without significant risk. You can get that

815
00:38:32,520 --> 00:38:35,759
Speaker 2: with a delta neutral position in the Internet economy. So

816
00:38:36,120 --> 00:38:40,359
Speaker 2: what we're seeing here is a move from I bought

817
00:38:40,360 --> 00:38:42,799
Speaker 2: a cash equivalent, I bought a treasury I'm holding on

818
00:38:42,840 --> 00:38:46,000
Speaker 2: my balance sheet. I'm earning four percent. Yeah, but you

819
00:38:46,000 --> 00:38:49,120
Speaker 2: know what, Now I can create a liability in the

820
00:38:49,120 --> 00:38:52,000
Speaker 2: form of a stable coin. I can deploy that stable

821
00:38:52,040 --> 00:38:56,120
Speaker 2: coin into decentralized finance, and then I can compound my earnings.

822
00:38:56,160 --> 00:38:58,160
Speaker 2: I'm still getting paid the four and a half percent

823
00:38:58,239 --> 00:39:01,440
Speaker 2: on my cash equivalent, I'm earning an additional four or

824
00:39:01,480 --> 00:39:05,560
Speaker 2: five percent by providing stable coin liquidity in the Internet economy.

825
00:39:05,880 --> 00:39:11,040
Speaker 2: And that Internet economy, that alternative system is growing and

826
00:39:11,080 --> 00:39:14,080
Speaker 2: it's flourishing, and the Genius Act and other things I

827
00:39:14,120 --> 00:39:16,839
Speaker 2: think are going to accelerate that growth that we see.

828
00:39:16,880 --> 00:39:20,120
Speaker 2: And micro strategy plays a big role, and I think

829
00:39:20,160 --> 00:39:22,719
Speaker 2: even people's reserve will play a big role in the

830
00:39:22,719 --> 00:39:27,400
Speaker 2: long term because we hold the reserve asset of the

831
00:39:27,440 --> 00:39:30,880
Speaker 2: Internet economy. The United States is the most important global

832
00:39:30,880 --> 00:39:34,840
Speaker 2: financial leader because it's their currency that is actually the

833
00:39:34,880 --> 00:39:38,279
Speaker 2: reserve currency of the world. Well, the reserve currency, or

834
00:39:38,280 --> 00:39:40,680
Speaker 2: I should say the reserve money. The reserve asset of

835
00:39:40,719 --> 00:39:44,040
Speaker 2: the Internet economy is bitcoin, and the entities that hold

836
00:39:44,080 --> 00:39:47,440
Speaker 2: bitcoin will be the futureal central banks, and I think

837
00:39:47,719 --> 00:39:50,440
Speaker 2: for most of your listeners, central banks as it should

838
00:39:50,600 --> 00:39:54,480
Speaker 2: probably has a derogatory meaning behind it. But in the future,

839
00:39:54,680 --> 00:39:57,840
Speaker 2: I think bitcoin bankers who are more free market oriented

840
00:39:58,400 --> 00:40:01,759
Speaker 2: maybe can salvage the reputation of what it means to

841
00:40:01,880 --> 00:40:05,280
Speaker 2: be somebody who's playing a role in discovering the price

842
00:40:05,280 --> 00:40:08,480
Speaker 2: of money. The rate at which people's reserve borrows from

843
00:40:08,600 --> 00:40:12,120
Speaker 2: micro strategy on an overnight basis will be the rate

844
00:40:12,520 --> 00:40:15,120
Speaker 2: that is equivalent to the current federal funds rate or

845
00:40:15,120 --> 00:40:17,760
Speaker 2: the front end of the yield curve. Then bitcoin powered

846
00:40:17,800 --> 00:40:21,120
Speaker 2: financial products like a five year bitcoin powered mortgage or

847
00:40:21,160 --> 00:40:23,320
Speaker 2: a five year bitcoin bond all the way out the

848
00:40:23,360 --> 00:40:26,000
Speaker 2: yeld curve to ten and twenty years, those will be

849
00:40:26,160 --> 00:40:28,840
Speaker 2: the instruments that the free market looks at to understand

850
00:40:28,880 --> 00:40:33,160
Speaker 2: the price of money in the free market internet economy. Meanwhile,

851
00:40:33,280 --> 00:40:34,759
Speaker 2: you're still going to have to wake up and check

852
00:40:34,800 --> 00:40:36,880
Speaker 2: the two year and the ten year to understand the

853
00:40:36,880 --> 00:40:40,680
Speaker 2: price of money in the traditional finance world. So we're

854
00:40:40,680 --> 00:40:43,360
Speaker 2: splitting into two worlds, and there's going to be different

855
00:40:43,480 --> 00:40:47,239
Speaker 2: entities who control the reserve assets of those worlds who

856
00:40:47,360 --> 00:40:52,880
Speaker 2: rise to the top and have extreme influence in the prices.

857
00:40:52,680 --> 00:40:55,520
Speaker 4: We're split into two worlds, but then at the same

858
00:40:55,520 --> 00:40:58,719
Speaker 4: time they're crossing and converging and overlapping at the same time.

859
00:40:58,800 --> 00:41:02,240
Speaker 4: So you mentioned Blackrock earlier. They've taken a US Treasury,

860
00:41:02,960 --> 00:41:05,280
Speaker 4: which is the bedrock of the global financial system today.

861
00:41:05,520 --> 00:41:08,120
Speaker 4: TRADFI taking the US Treasury put into a fund and

862
00:41:08,120 --> 00:41:12,440
Speaker 4: then tokenize the fund buildle and then those tokens of

863
00:41:12,480 --> 00:41:14,759
Speaker 4: that fund are now trading on crypto dot com and

864
00:41:14,840 --> 00:41:19,000
Speaker 4: dare a bit in the cryptoeconomy, so tokenize US treasuries.

865
00:41:19,080 --> 00:41:22,080
Speaker 4: But then on the other side you have micro Strategy,

866
00:41:22,120 --> 00:41:24,480
Speaker 4: which has now created the preferred chairs. The latest one

867
00:41:24,480 --> 00:41:28,319
Speaker 4: they've created, which is called stretch STRC, is basically a

868
00:41:28,360 --> 00:41:31,799
Speaker 4: stable coin. It's like a central bank stable coin that

869
00:41:31,880 --> 00:41:35,560
Speaker 4: they try to keep pegged around one hundred dollars par

870
00:41:36,160 --> 00:41:40,200
Speaker 4: and then they increase or decrease the rate to keep

871
00:41:40,239 --> 00:41:41,920
Speaker 4: the price stable, sort of like what.

872
00:41:41,880 --> 00:41:44,160
Speaker 3: The FED does, raising and lower in the rates to

873
00:41:44,200 --> 00:41:44,960
Speaker 3: keep the price stable.

874
00:41:45,000 --> 00:41:48,080
Speaker 4: So you have sort of like the bitcoin cryptoeconomy doing

875
00:41:48,080 --> 00:41:50,520
Speaker 4: this that's crossing the TRADFI and TRADFI crossing over, and

876
00:41:50,600 --> 00:41:53,239
Speaker 4: so it's pretty interesting to see sort of how these

877
00:41:54,000 --> 00:41:58,480
Speaker 4: separate systems parallel systems will eventually merge and we'll kind

878
00:41:58,480 --> 00:41:59,920
Speaker 4: of see that convergence happening there.

879
00:42:00,160 --> 00:42:03,279
Speaker 2: And I think you know what really drives that convergence

880
00:42:04,000 --> 00:42:07,440
Speaker 2: is the fact that you know, and I love Michael Sailor,

881
00:42:07,480 --> 00:42:10,920
Speaker 2: he's opened the Pandora's box to financial engineering. Even at

882
00:42:10,920 --> 00:42:13,440
Speaker 2: People's Reserve, we're building on top of his shoulders, and

883
00:42:13,760 --> 00:42:16,200
Speaker 2: you know, we've taken notes from a very long time

884
00:42:16,239 --> 00:42:19,800
Speaker 2: ago watching what he's done. But what it really boils

885
00:42:19,840 --> 00:42:25,480
Speaker 2: down to is problem solution. There's a real world problem,

886
00:42:25,560 --> 00:42:28,040
Speaker 2: and that problem is that real interest rates are negative.

887
00:42:28,400 --> 00:42:32,640
Speaker 2: So a nine percent rate backed by billions of dollars

888
00:42:32,680 --> 00:42:36,839
Speaker 2: of bitcoin equity is a really important tool because when

889
00:42:36,880 --> 00:42:38,800
Speaker 2: you can only get four and a half from the government,

890
00:42:38,880 --> 00:42:41,280
Speaker 2: or four from the government, or in the near future

891
00:42:41,560 --> 00:42:44,640
Speaker 2: one or two from the government, yet the rate of

892
00:42:44,960 --> 00:42:49,000
Speaker 2: inflation or the increase in prices is going up at six, seven,

893
00:42:49,080 --> 00:42:53,160
Speaker 2: even ten percent, you can't eat that negative return, right,

894
00:42:53,200 --> 00:42:55,600
Speaker 2: You can't have a real rate of negative return. That's

895
00:42:55,640 --> 00:43:00,080
Speaker 2: a big problem, especially for businesses. So you need a solution.

896
00:43:00,640 --> 00:43:03,080
Speaker 2: And what we're seeing right now, this is what all

897
00:43:03,200 --> 00:43:06,319
Speaker 2: engineering is. Engineering is creating a solution to a real

898
00:43:06,360 --> 00:43:09,680
Speaker 2: world problem, and because of the cracks within the traditional system,

899
00:43:10,040 --> 00:43:13,840
Speaker 2: these problems are becoming bigger and bigger, and bitcoin is

900
00:43:13,840 --> 00:43:16,600
Speaker 2: providing a way to solve that problem. And whether it's

901
00:43:16,600 --> 00:43:19,880
Speaker 2: micro strategy or people's reserve, we are taking bitcoin and

902
00:43:19,920 --> 00:43:23,080
Speaker 2: we are fusing it into financial tools in order to

903
00:43:23,160 --> 00:43:26,600
Speaker 2: solve these real world problems. And by solving people's problems,

904
00:43:26,719 --> 00:43:29,520
Speaker 2: you deliver value. And that's what bitcoin's all about. It's

905
00:43:29,520 --> 00:43:33,279
Speaker 2: about value delivery instead of a fiat mindset which is

906
00:43:33,320 --> 00:43:37,520
Speaker 2: based on value extraction. And these value extraction schemes have

907
00:43:37,640 --> 00:43:41,360
Speaker 2: created such big problems that we now need a foundational

908
00:43:41,440 --> 00:43:44,640
Speaker 2: layer built on equity rather than debt in order to

909
00:43:44,680 --> 00:43:47,640
Speaker 2: solve these problems. And as you said, it's very interesting

910
00:43:47,640 --> 00:43:50,360
Speaker 2: to see how fast these worlds are coming together. I

911
00:43:50,440 --> 00:43:54,280
Speaker 2: do not think investors anticipated that we would see bitcoin

912
00:43:54,360 --> 00:43:56,839
Speaker 2: working in tandem with the dollar to create cash flow

913
00:43:56,920 --> 00:44:00,800
Speaker 2: products to solve interest rate issues issues.

914
00:44:00,880 --> 00:44:01,680
Speaker 1: But here we are.

915
00:44:01,560 --> 00:44:04,320
Speaker 2: Today with brand new products the world has never seen

916
00:44:04,400 --> 00:44:06,719
Speaker 2: before that are now solving these problems.

917
00:44:07,520 --> 00:44:09,799
Speaker 4: Yeah, and it certainly makes me think about the quote

918
00:44:09,800 --> 00:44:12,279
Speaker 4: from Bill Gates saying, you know, most people underestimate or

919
00:44:12,360 --> 00:44:14,680
Speaker 4: overestimate what they can do in a year. But underestimate

920
00:44:14,680 --> 00:44:16,400
Speaker 4: what they can do in a decade. And to your point, like,

921
00:44:16,680 --> 00:44:20,000
Speaker 4: on one hand, these things seem to be moving extremely fast,

922
00:44:20,440 --> 00:44:22,560
Speaker 4: but then so many people are like, but bitcoin's down

923
00:44:22,560 --> 00:44:23,040
Speaker 4: this week.

924
00:44:23,520 --> 00:44:24,799
Speaker 3: It's like, stop.

925
00:44:24,560 --> 00:44:26,719
Speaker 4: Anticipating what's going to happen this week and think about

926
00:44:26,760 --> 00:44:28,839
Speaker 4: what's gonna happen over the next couple of years. I mean,

927
00:44:28,840 --> 00:44:31,000
Speaker 4: the entire world is literally shifting, but you kind of

928
00:44:31,000 --> 00:44:31,719
Speaker 4: have to zoom out.

929
00:44:31,600 --> 00:44:34,239
Speaker 3: A little bit to get a different perspective. Let's wrap

930
00:44:34,280 --> 00:44:34,480
Speaker 3: it up.

931
00:44:34,520 --> 00:44:35,800
Speaker 4: I got a big question for you to kind of

932
00:44:35,800 --> 00:44:37,920
Speaker 4: wrap this up. You've talked about like the fiat mindset

933
00:44:37,960 --> 00:44:42,319
Speaker 4: you just said that right now, and sort of how

934
00:44:42,400 --> 00:44:44,960
Speaker 4: bitcoin sort of has changed some of that thinking from

935
00:44:45,000 --> 00:44:47,360
Speaker 4: a fiat mindset, a debt based mindset, to an equity

936
00:44:47,360 --> 00:44:51,960
Speaker 4: based mindset. What would you say, beyond the finance and technology,

937
00:44:52,719 --> 00:44:56,279
Speaker 4: what's the single most profound change that occurs in a

938
00:44:56,280 --> 00:44:58,880
Speaker 4: person when they shift their unit of account from a

939
00:44:59,360 --> 00:45:01,920
Speaker 4: debt instrument to bitcoin an equity instrument.

940
00:45:03,000 --> 00:45:06,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's I love that question because they have that

941
00:45:06,719 --> 00:45:10,720
Speaker 2: famous saying you don't change bitcoin. Bitcoin changes you. Well,

942
00:45:11,200 --> 00:45:14,920
Speaker 2: governments don't change bitcoin. Bitcoin changes governments and business doesn't

943
00:45:14,960 --> 00:45:18,000
Speaker 2: change bitcoin. Bitcoin changes business, and that's what I'm most

944
00:45:18,040 --> 00:45:21,600
Speaker 2: excited about moving into the future because those changes are

945
00:45:21,640 --> 00:45:26,839
Speaker 2: based on an extraction mechanism versus a value delivery mechanism.

946
00:45:26,920 --> 00:45:29,640
Speaker 2: And I think the biggest change you see in bitcoiners

947
00:45:29,680 --> 00:45:32,680
Speaker 2: who have been responsible savers of it and benefactors of

948
00:45:32,760 --> 00:45:37,360
Speaker 2: increased purchasing power, is that once you remove the financial

949
00:45:37,400 --> 00:45:43,080
Speaker 2: stress that the current system exudes on almost everybody except

950
00:45:43,160 --> 00:45:47,600
Speaker 2: the very one percent who have a large, disproportionate amount

951
00:45:47,640 --> 00:45:52,839
Speaker 2: of the wealth, you're how do I say this, your

952
00:45:54,400 --> 00:45:58,880
Speaker 2: motivations change. I think a good example is here in Florida.

953
00:45:59,560 --> 00:46:01,600
Speaker 2: We have a big services industry. Right We have a

954
00:46:01,640 --> 00:46:03,680
Speaker 2: lot of vacationers who come here and we have a

955
00:46:03,680 --> 00:46:05,560
Speaker 2: big services industry. As a matter of fact, the whole

956
00:46:05,560 --> 00:46:09,279
Speaker 2: country has a big services industry. But I went out

957
00:46:09,280 --> 00:46:12,520
Speaker 2: to dinner the other night with my family and I

958
00:46:12,680 --> 00:46:15,319
Speaker 2: got bad service and it was just I was I

959
00:46:15,360 --> 00:46:16,719
Speaker 2: was thinking to myself and I was and I told

960
00:46:16,719 --> 00:46:17,960
Speaker 2: my wife on the way home, I'm like, you know,

961
00:46:18,600 --> 00:46:21,560
Speaker 2: you can't blame them because they're serving and they're they're

962
00:46:21,600 --> 00:46:24,480
Speaker 2: getting you know, they're making more money, but they're doing

963
00:46:24,560 --> 00:46:28,800
Speaker 2: less stuff. So these people are trapped within this inflationary

964
00:46:28,840 --> 00:46:33,160
Speaker 2: problem where the rate of dilution of the dollar is

965
00:46:33,239 --> 00:46:37,680
Speaker 2: so fast and the slowness of the increase in wages,

966
00:46:38,239 --> 00:46:41,000
Speaker 2: it creates frustration. And for any listener that's in that

967
00:46:41,040 --> 00:46:45,319
Speaker 2: situation right now, keep working hard, keep delivering value to

968
00:46:45,360 --> 00:46:47,800
Speaker 2: the economy, and do it with a smile on your face.

969
00:46:48,080 --> 00:46:52,760
Speaker 2: And save in bitcoin. Utilize bitcoin savings technology to get ahead,

970
00:46:52,800 --> 00:46:56,040
Speaker 2: because when that stress is released from you, when you

971
00:46:56,080 --> 00:46:59,080
Speaker 2: when you have financial freedom, how you look at the

972
00:46:59,080 --> 00:47:01,359
Speaker 2: person next to you, how you treat the person next

973
00:47:01,360 --> 00:47:04,920
Speaker 2: to you changes, and when it's like the butterfly effect,

974
00:47:05,120 --> 00:47:07,840
Speaker 2: if you do one thing nice thing for one person,

975
00:47:08,280 --> 00:47:10,319
Speaker 2: they might turn around do a nice thing for another person,

976
00:47:10,320 --> 00:47:12,400
Speaker 2: who might do a nice thing for another person, and

977
00:47:12,440 --> 00:47:15,600
Speaker 2: that nice thing might save that next person's life. But

978
00:47:15,760 --> 00:47:20,040
Speaker 2: in the FIAT world, you know who cares. I got

979
00:47:20,080 --> 00:47:22,040
Speaker 2: I got my own problems. I gotta worry about me

980
00:47:22,160 --> 00:47:24,480
Speaker 2: first before I can serve you. Right, you're here on

981
00:47:24,520 --> 00:47:27,000
Speaker 2: the airplane, put your own mask on first, before you

982
00:47:27,040 --> 00:47:28,680
Speaker 2: put your kids mask on, because if you don't put

983
00:47:28,719 --> 00:47:30,760
Speaker 2: your mask on, you might not be able to breathe,

984
00:47:30,760 --> 00:47:33,080
Speaker 2: and put their mask on and you both die. And

985
00:47:33,200 --> 00:47:36,759
Speaker 2: FIAT forces you to look at yourself first before you

986
00:47:36,800 --> 00:47:39,239
Speaker 2: look to others. But when you embrace bitcoin and you

987
00:47:39,280 --> 00:47:42,720
Speaker 2: have financial freedom, you're able to look at others first,

988
00:47:42,920 --> 00:47:46,000
Speaker 2: and you're able to serve others. And it's it's very

989
00:47:46,080 --> 00:47:48,920
Speaker 2: it's a Christian mindset, I believe you know, Jesus came

990
00:47:48,960 --> 00:47:51,280
Speaker 2: here as the king of kings and lord of lords.

991
00:47:51,560 --> 00:47:54,759
Speaker 2: But he washed his disciples feet and Peter said, Lord,

992
00:47:54,760 --> 00:47:56,160
Speaker 2: I'm not going to wash your feet. And he said,

993
00:47:56,160 --> 00:47:58,400
Speaker 2: if you don't wash my feet, if I don't, if

994
00:47:58,400 --> 00:48:00,239
Speaker 2: you don't let me wash your feet, you have no

995
00:48:00,280 --> 00:48:02,600
Speaker 2: part in my kingdom. And he said, then please go ahead.

996
00:48:02,920 --> 00:48:04,960
Speaker 2: But in this world we flip that upside down. We

997
00:48:05,040 --> 00:48:07,040
Speaker 2: want to be the served, we want to be the king,

998
00:48:07,080 --> 00:48:09,920
Speaker 2: we want to be in charge. And that's a fiat mindset.

999
00:48:09,960 --> 00:48:13,640
Speaker 2: Bitcoin comes in, gives you that financial freedom and says, wow,

1000
00:48:13,680 --> 00:48:16,360
Speaker 2: you know, life is great, this is amazing, this is

1001
00:48:16,400 --> 00:48:19,000
Speaker 2: a miracle. This is what we want. We want the

1002
00:48:19,120 --> 00:48:21,879
Speaker 2: goods and service and services in exchange for the money.

1003
00:48:21,880 --> 00:48:24,239
Speaker 2: We want the experiences, and we want to take these

1004
00:48:24,280 --> 00:48:28,040
Speaker 2: experiences and leverage them to bless others and give them

1005
00:48:28,040 --> 00:48:31,760
Speaker 2: good experiences. And that's really the most powerful thing about

1006
00:48:31,760 --> 00:48:33,440
Speaker 2: bitcoin and I think we're going to see it not

1007
00:48:33,520 --> 00:48:37,319
Speaker 2: only in personal and business and government, but it could

1008
00:48:37,360 --> 00:48:41,920
Speaker 2: change the whole dynamic of human relationship. That's how important

1009
00:48:41,960 --> 00:48:43,600
Speaker 2: money is at a foundational level.

1010
00:48:44,400 --> 00:48:48,640
Speaker 4: Wow, that's big and I see it as you said, right,

1011
00:48:49,120 --> 00:48:53,320
Speaker 4: it changes everything everyone and I love the biblical reference

1012
00:48:53,600 --> 00:48:57,400
Speaker 4: to serve and not be served. That's the purpose. But unfortunately,

1013
00:48:58,200 --> 00:49:00,560
Speaker 4: you know Maslow's hierarchy of needs. We care of those

1014
00:49:00,600 --> 00:49:03,719
Speaker 4: base layer of needs and bitcoin allows most people to

1015
00:49:03,760 --> 00:49:03,960
Speaker 4: do that.

1016
00:49:04,000 --> 00:49:05,080
Speaker 3: If you take advantage of it.

1017
00:49:05,360 --> 00:49:07,160
Speaker 4: You don't have to wait for the government to add

1018
00:49:07,200 --> 00:49:08,840
Speaker 4: a strategic Bitcoin reserve as.

1019
00:49:08,760 --> 00:49:10,240
Speaker 3: You kind of alluded to in the beginning.

1020
00:49:10,640 --> 00:49:14,040
Speaker 4: You can just adopt it as a reserve today and

1021
00:49:14,080 --> 00:49:15,759
Speaker 4: so you can take care of those base level needs,

1022
00:49:15,800 --> 00:49:18,200
Speaker 4: so then you can be more of a servant in

1023
00:49:18,239 --> 00:49:21,160
Speaker 4: a good way, not a bad way. Awesome, man, so

1024
00:49:21,200 --> 00:49:22,880
Speaker 4: much good stuff here. I appreciate taking the time to

1025
00:49:22,880 --> 00:49:25,520
Speaker 4: come talk to me today. What should people to be

1026
00:49:26,200 --> 00:49:28,360
Speaker 4: you know, watching following to kind of pay attention to

1027
00:49:28,400 --> 00:49:28,839
Speaker 4: what you're doing.

1028
00:49:29,360 --> 00:49:30,880
Speaker 1: Well, thank you so much for having me mark. It

1029
00:49:30,960 --> 00:49:32,040
Speaker 1: is an absolute pleasure.

1030
00:49:32,640 --> 00:49:34,480
Speaker 2: And you can just go to People's Reserve dot com

1031
00:49:34,520 --> 00:49:36,719
Speaker 2: to learn more about People's reserve. Of course, follow us

1032
00:49:36,760 --> 00:49:39,480
Speaker 2: on x at People's Reserve, and if you want my

1033
00:49:40,239 --> 00:49:44,280
Speaker 2: macro input, you can follow me on x at CJ. Constantino's.

1034
00:49:44,320 --> 00:49:46,440
Speaker 2: And thanks again for having me. It's been great.

1035
00:49:47,080 --> 00:49:47,960
Speaker 3: Yeah, thank you so much,