Speaker 1: The following. He's a production of Dallas Cowboys dot Com
Speaker 1: and the Dallas Cowboys Football Club. Boys. This is Mick
Speaker 1: Shot screaming live on Dallas Cowboys dot Com and the
Speaker 1: official Dallas Cowboys Half now Here are Bill Jones, Everson Walls,
Speaker 1: and Nicky Spagnola, and it is officially now Packers Week.
Speaker 1: Here inside the SWABC podcast studio at the Star in Frisco.
Speaker 1: This is Mick Shots, Bill Jones, Everson Walls, and the
Speaker 1: star of our show, Mickey Spagnola. He's the cheesehead. By time,
Speaker 1: somebody's figured that out. He's the cheese head expert guy.
Speaker 1: You gotta cheese head at home there, Mickey. You know
Speaker 1: he does. He doesn't. I'm surprised you didn't bring it.
Speaker 1: I'm surprised you didn't bring it yesterday. Yeah, they didn't
Speaker 1: have the didn't do the cheese. You think Lombardi would
Speaker 1: have put up with a cheese head. I don't. I
Speaker 1: don't think so. There are a football player. There was
Speaker 1: no football field out there today. I noticed, yes there is. Yes,
Speaker 1: there was no leaping in the stands either. By the ways,
Speaker 1: Brad Sham, I'm gonna save you. I'm gonna save your spine,
Speaker 1: I save you trying to turn around and familiar with
Speaker 1: the ice bowl, can you hear me? He stopped. I
Speaker 1: don't think so. We're more familiar with the Who knows
Speaker 1: if he was watching it back in sixty seven, I'm sure,
Speaker 1: I'm sure he was. Everybody did they have television back then?
Speaker 1: Black and white? They did nineteen inches if you were lucky.
Speaker 1: When when's first time you got a colored TV? Man,
Speaker 1: that's a good one. I would imagine the seventies, okay,
Speaker 1: and uh, you know, still the same cheap stuff because
Speaker 1: eventually you're gonna have to get the pliers to change
Speaker 1: the channel. Right, We hadn thing always blakes is cheap plastics,
Speaker 1: So you have to eventually get the pliers. Our knob
Speaker 1: and our TV broke, and you know we kind of
Speaker 1: fit on that that little screw there, Ye got the
Speaker 1: little in the middle, and uh, instead of getting a
Speaker 1: new TV. You remember the little kind of key thing
Speaker 1: that opened up coffee cans. We had to stick that
Speaker 1: in there and to turn it. That's right, all right?
Speaker 1: This suppliers, dude, what are you doing? Fit right in there?
Speaker 1: Right because there was a groove, right, we never had
Speaker 1: growing up a color TV. I don't think they had
Speaker 1: a couple of my parents until we bought them one
Speaker 1: for some occasion my sister. Wow. So this would have
Speaker 1: been like in early eighties. So when was the first
Speaker 1: time you saw the Green Bay Packers in green meeting
Speaker 1: in person? You couldn't see it on your black and
Speaker 1: white TV that they're actually wore green jersey. It was
Speaker 1: either at somebody else's house or maybe when I was
Speaker 1: in college, because the first hockey game I went to,
Speaker 1: and I'm used to watching hockey in black and white,
Speaker 1: and I walked into Chicago Stadium and it was like,
Speaker 1: oh wow, the blue lines blue and the red lines red,
Speaker 1: and look at those uniforms in color, you know, along
Speaker 1: those lines, because there was no first time in the
Speaker 1: paper either, Okay, along those lines. The first time that
Speaker 1: I saw how green the Boston Celtics uniforms are was
Speaker 1: probably at Reunion Area to see him alive in person. Okay,
Speaker 1: TV doesn't do it justice. And the other thing is
Speaker 1: how gold the Notre Dame helmets are. You have to
Speaker 1: see it in person to really appreciate just the most
Speaker 1: striking colors I've seen. It was cotton bowl, the green
Speaker 1: glass and in the highlights from the Bowl. Yeah Nelson
Speaker 1: at the Yeah, just I'm just just you know, it
Speaker 1: was always sunny, seems like in in the Cotton Bowl
Speaker 1: and what they called it sunny South Dallas. That's why
Speaker 1: they called it. So it's like to watch, you know,
Speaker 1: I just remember Don Meredith in Bob Hayes and just
Speaker 1: you know, it's like, wow, this is this is so
Speaker 1: colorful and and and it was the claudio was just amazing.
Speaker 1: That was probably the first time I saw a color
Speaker 1: uh in the NFL when I actually went to a game. Yeah,
Speaker 1: so you got you thought before you went to the
Speaker 1: game that people played in black and white, had no
Speaker 1: clue what it looked like. Everything. I guarantee you the
Speaker 1: Ice Bowl was gray. Okay, it was a gray day,
Speaker 1: all right. So, um, team is on the field. Yes,
Speaker 1: bring us up to speed with what we need to
Speaker 1: know as they are back to work here. I saw
Speaker 1: Zeke out there and he looked like he was getting ready.
Speaker 1: Had a helmet, so that's a step in the right direction.
Speaker 1: Looked like he was getting ready to do his rehab.
Speaker 1: McCarthy said that, you know, he said that Zeke came
Speaker 1: up to him before sometime in the morning whatever they
Speaker 1: were doing and said, yeah, coach, I'm ready to go,
Speaker 1: and he goes and that's what they all say. So
Speaker 1: I was glad he added that, but he said that,
Speaker 1: you know, we'll see where he's at. It felt like
Speaker 1: Malik Hooker and Sam Williams were ready to go, maybe
Speaker 1: not the whole thing, but at least limited, if not better.
Speaker 1: I think the one guy, you know, and Zeke will
Speaker 1: see as it goes on. Zeke thinks he's playing on Sunday.
Speaker 1: I think the one guy they're a little worried about
Speaker 1: is Anthony Barr with that hamstring. And you know I
Speaker 1: found out, you know, before the bye that they worried
Speaker 1: about him just because of his age, thirty whatever soft tissue,
Speaker 1: So they were going to be real careful with that one.
Speaker 1: That they didn't extend his recent back record too. But
Speaker 1: he missed a lot of games last year with the Vikings. Right,
Speaker 1: who's his backup? Clark? Oh your boys thirty three and
Speaker 1: you know you're going to see a lot of Damon
Speaker 1: Clark and continue to see a lot of durn Bland too,
Speaker 1: by the way, because you know Lewis won't be there.
Speaker 1: He's been done very well. He's lift up to his
Speaker 1: preseason hype. Well, i'll tell you what you know. And
Speaker 1: somebody said, a how's he playing? I said, if you
Speaker 1: think about it, you know, he's a rookie. He's at
Speaker 1: and played any and all of a sudden he had
Speaker 1: to play in two games to start, and I don't
Speaker 1: think we got any arguments A pivot pivotal y pivot
Speaker 1: had broke up the one in the end, So if
Speaker 1: he would turn around, he'd be happier. Yeah, but it
Speaker 1: was he. I liked this, his sense of urgency as
Speaker 1: that ball was in the air, because how fast is
Speaker 1: he Well we can find that out. And his catchup
Speaker 1: speed on that ball he was and he's he was.
Speaker 1: It was digs like he's got he's got instincts, and
Speaker 1: that's that's a good thing, especially for that position, right
Speaker 1: to play as a rookie, to be in the slot.
Speaker 1: So yeah, but other than that, I think everybody else,
Speaker 1: you know, curse should be out there. Um. He said
Speaker 1: they had a couple of guys receivers look like they
Speaker 1: had the flu, but they were practice squad guys. Um,
Speaker 1: So you know I worry about by came at exactly
Speaker 1: the right time. You know what I worry about with
Speaker 1: these young guys is being uh believing the hype of
Speaker 1: the of the Packers, believing the hype of that that
Speaker 1: home field advantage, right that green Bay always has. And
Speaker 1: the Aaron Rodgers. You know, of course he's a great player.
Speaker 1: When I say myth, I mean just his reputation preceding him. Uh,
Speaker 1: don't let that yeah beat you, like intimidate you exactly
Speaker 1: go in, go in with with the mindset of respect,
Speaker 1: because you have to respect the game, right, you have
Speaker 1: to respect your opponent, but at the same time, you
Speaker 1: disrespect them because it's like you should not even be
Speaker 1: on the field with us. Eventually, that's what you want
Speaker 1: to try and show the Green Bay Packers if you're
Speaker 1: the Dallas Cowboys. Somebody asked McCarthy about you know, explained
Speaker 1: to them lambeau Field and the weather, and he goes,
Speaker 1: oh yeah, he goes, you know, we spent time on
Speaker 1: that and you know what cleats you should wear on
Speaker 1: that grass And and then he said, and by the way,
Speaker 1: you know, whatever the temperature was supposed to be at
Speaker 1: kickoff is I think it was the high thirties. Whoever
Speaker 1: he said that, I counted up on the roster, and
Speaker 1: he goes, they've got fewer guys from the north than
Speaker 1: we do. That like grew up in that kind of weather,
Speaker 1: he said, So they should be worried about these boys
Speaker 1: from the south coming in because they more of our
Speaker 1: guys have grown up in the North than they have.
Speaker 1: So right now in Green Bay, the temperature is fifty
Speaker 1: nine degrees. It is cloudy. It's supposed to be fine,
Speaker 1: and till Sunday it is. It's gets a cold front
Speaker 1: comes through on Saturday. It looks like because the high
Speaker 1: on Saturday is thirty seven with a low of twenty six,
Speaker 1: and on Sunday it's a high of thirty seven a
Speaker 1: low of twenty four. As long as it's a still day,
Speaker 1: as long as the wind, yeah, whipping around. I think
Speaker 1: I saw the precipitation was like one or two percent
Speaker 1: chance or something like that. When no wind, gus my
Speaker 1: little app has a partly cloudy day. That's good. That's
Speaker 1: Green Bay. You can't beat that, right, I mean, when
Speaker 1: you're talking football, you know you want it to be chilly,
Speaker 1: but you just it's the precipitation in the wind that
Speaker 1: just really messes up. Again for the first time, we're
Speaker 1: actually staying in Green Bay? Is Nate? Is Nate texting you?
Speaker 1: He is? Is he watching practice for us? Let us
Speaker 1: know who watching practice? Oh? No? Better turned down by it.
Speaker 1: Whatever whatever he was wearing he had he had like
Speaker 1: white socks coming out of his shoes and then he
Speaker 1: had some tights on. It looked like his his ankles
Speaker 1: were spatted up, ready to go practice, Nate, Nate, Okay,
Speaker 1: what is he doing? What is he doing? Is he
Speaker 1: spatted up? He looked like if you saw that, if
Speaker 1: you saw walking around, what the heck is he doing? Man?
Speaker 1: Did you like playing at lambeau Field? I only played
Speaker 1: there once and we want that good of a team?
Speaker 1: I think that was in eighty nine. I think it
Speaker 1: was the one in fifteen season? Uh, you know, very uneventful,
Speaker 1: you know, bet Fa I was playing our book? Is there? Yeah?
Speaker 1: Still there? Yeah? Yeah? That the year copy. That was
Speaker 1: a year you had to play him twice, didn't you know?
Speaker 1: One of those years he ended up playing car would
Speaker 1: not have been there in eighty nine. So I was
Speaker 1: if I'm not it could be maybe maybe with the Giants,
Speaker 1: could be eighty No, it was not with the Giants,
Speaker 1: Are you never? I was definitely with the Cowboys, and
Speaker 1: we got a buzz kid. Okay, there was no doubt
Speaker 1: about it. It was one. It would be the eighty eight,
Speaker 1: eighty nine and is already coming in, says so eighty nine,
Speaker 1: and I was right. They ended up playing the Packers twice.
Speaker 1: Why didn't we play them twice in eighty nine? They
Speaker 1: started that with I forgot which teams because in ninety
Speaker 1: they ended up playing Tampa Bay twice. I don't even
Speaker 1: before expansion. We played them in the both in at
Speaker 1: Lambeau No, right, at Green Bay October eighth, and then
Speaker 1: closed the season at home against Green Bay. That was
Speaker 1: your last Oh, that was your last game? Right? I was?
Speaker 1: I was. That's when Jimmy had put me on the
Speaker 1: bench the second half of the season. That's why I
Speaker 1: didn't remember the second game. I was playing special teams.
Speaker 1: And then in in ninety one they played them in Milwaukee.
Speaker 1: I remember that distinctly. The magic Man was at quarterback
Speaker 1: for Green Bay. So in eighty nine you lost in
Speaker 1: green Bay thirty one thirteen, and on New Year or
Speaker 1: Christmas Eve you got beat twenty to ten. And the
Speaker 1: reason I remember that is it was freezing cold out
Speaker 1: and the pipes at Texas Stadium froze, like the bathrooms
Speaker 1: were inoperable because the pipes were frozen. I don't think
Speaker 1: I took a shot away after the game. I didn't
Speaker 1: know I did. It was in the locker room. It
Speaker 1: was for the fans, and I'll never forget. So that
Speaker 1: finished the season one in fifteen, right, and Frank luxA,
Speaker 1: my Cohart at the Dallas Times. Harold basically wrote, and
Speaker 1: what a fitting end to the season. It was so
Speaker 1: bad on the final game they couldn't even flush it
Speaker 1: down the toilet. That's fun. That's what are those like you? Go?
Speaker 1: Why did I think of that? Okay, so the Cowboys
Speaker 1: finished one in fifteen. Obviously in nineteen eighty nine, well
Speaker 1: I know. And of course, the Cowboys first round draft
Speaker 1: pick they had used on Steve Walsh. Otherwise they would
Speaker 1: have had the first pick in the draft two years
Speaker 1: in a row, and they would have had supplemental that's
Speaker 1: when they were supplemental draft draft, yes, right, yes, and
Speaker 1: they used their first round pick thinking, okay, well we
Speaker 1: won't have the first round pick again. And sure enough,
Speaker 1: and I think Walsh had had he led them to
Speaker 1: a championship, to the National Championship that previous year because
Speaker 1: Jimmy was was was hot for him. He had to
Speaker 1: have he had to hit him, and it was he
Speaker 1: was like de Nucci to me. You know, he was
Speaker 1: that guy that was a good Cottage quarterback. But that
Speaker 1: transferred to the pros. He wasn't ready his rookie. And
Speaker 1: as it turned out, they could have had the first
Speaker 1: pick in the draft all three years because they ended
Speaker 1: up trading for it in ninety one and took Russell Maryland. Okay,
Speaker 1: and so they did draft Emmett and we've talked about it.
Speaker 1: Emmett been trading up to seventeen to take him in
Speaker 1: the first round in nineteen ninety. So who do you
Speaker 1: think the Cowboys would have taken? Wow, that's always a
Speaker 1: good pick, that's always. Ah. It would have been the
Speaker 1: best defensive player they would Cortes Kennedy from Miami. Yes,
Speaker 1: they absolutely would have. Yeah, because they because they didn't
Speaker 1: like they didn't like um the running back Blair Thomas,
Speaker 1: who wound up with the Cowboys several years. Yeah, but
Speaker 1: the Jets took him number two. Here's all right, here's
Speaker 1: who went Oh, this is interesting, here's who went top
Speaker 1: five in that draft. And it's funny because I knew
Speaker 1: that they had taken they'd lost their first round pick
Speaker 1: on Walsh, and I don't recall ever going back and
Speaker 1: figuring out who it was it that they could have
Speaker 1: had with that pick. We talked about how great the
Speaker 1: Cowboys draft picks were with Jimmy, you know, when he
Speaker 1: came in and everything, but supplemental draft being the exception.
Speaker 1: But the supplemental Draft, they gave up their first round pick.
Speaker 1: The first pick in the draft in nineteen ninety was
Speaker 1: Jeff George. Obviously they wouldn't I don't think they would
Speaker 1: have taken it, and they weren't going to take Blurred.
Speaker 1: They could have done the same principle and they did
Speaker 1: with Steve Walsh though. Take the quarterback, all right. So
Speaker 1: the second pick was Blair Thomas. The third pick Seattle
Speaker 1: took Cortez Kennedy and obviously be in the Miami go
Speaker 1: any farther than that, But here's the enter. The fourth
Speaker 1: pick was Keith mccanis to Tampa Bay. The fifth pick,
Speaker 1: linebacker USC Junior say Out went to the Chargers. Yeah,
Speaker 1: he would. He would have taken Cortes Kennedy, no doubt,
Speaker 1: and especially with Jimmy's background and as a defensive line coach,
Speaker 1: and as it turned out, they were all hot and
Speaker 1: bothered by getting the linebacker I'm Baylor, James James Francis.
Speaker 1: They tried to trade up to get him, and Cincinnati, oh, no,
Speaker 1: whoever they needed to get whoever was before Cincinnati, they
Speaker 1: were trying to trade up with them. They couldn't do it.
Speaker 1: I think it was maybe Kansas City. And then after
Speaker 1: Cincinnati took James Francis, Jimmy called Cincinnati and wanted to
Speaker 1: trade with Cincinnati for James Francis, and they wouldn't do it,
Speaker 1: so they settled for Emmatt Smith, who would have been
Speaker 1: the next running back taken after Blair Thomas. So no
Speaker 1: running backs went after the second pick in the draft
Speaker 1: until Cowboys took Emmett at seventeen. And there were three
Speaker 1: Hall of Famers in that first round, Cortes Kennedy, Junior
Speaker 1: sale At, Emma c Emmett Smith. They could have had
Speaker 1: two if they hadn't have made the supplemental pick for them, right,
Speaker 1: they could have had Cortez Kennedy and Emmett Smith that draft. Yeah,
Speaker 1: so I wonder then and then would they have then
Speaker 1: done the Russell Maryland trade. No, No, they were like Kennedy.
Speaker 1: That's right. So is that in the book? Is there
Speaker 1: a chapter? If I wish now, we would have had
Speaker 1: this conversation yesterday and I could have asked Jimmy and
Speaker 1: confirmed who you would have taken, because I talked to
Speaker 1: Jimmy this morning and uh, well, let's hear about it.
Speaker 1: Well it was great. Well, let's hear about it when
Speaker 1: we come back here on mix shots in just a moment.
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Speaker 1: Cowboys on the practice field right now. The media availability
Speaker 1: window is right now for media to go look at
Speaker 1: what's happening out on the field. And so Mickey Spagnola
Speaker 1: took that opportunity to go look at what's happening on
Speaker 1: the field. And Mickey, what do you have to report
Speaker 1: from my speed watching? We only had what two minutes
Speaker 1: I've we've forgot and you know what, no one asked
Speaker 1: about him either. Noah Brown is missed the last game
Speaker 1: if we remember, and he is working with the rehab
Speaker 1: guys while they're prexing special teams. So we'll see where
Speaker 1: it goes from there. It's him and Zeke on the
Speaker 1: resistance chords together. But he had a helmet out there,
Speaker 1: looked like as helmet was off to the side, So
Speaker 1: we'll see what he ends up doing. But that was
Speaker 1: another guy that did not play in the in the
Speaker 1: Bears game. Tell you what, this is a game where
Speaker 1: we could use them. Yeah, talking about good coverage and
Speaker 1: good dbs talking, Well, they're okay, but you know, when
Speaker 1: you're on the road, you want to have someone that
Speaker 1: can silence the crowd as you move the chains, and
Speaker 1: I think he would. He would be a big target
Speaker 1: for deck and moving the chains this this this Sunday. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and then you know, if not him, then um, Talbot's
Speaker 1: got a step up. They'll need him and see just
Speaker 1: the big body though there's no replacing that. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: you're right. And that would have been James Washington if
Speaker 1: if he was ready to go. So anyway, there's that's
Speaker 1: what I saw real quickly. All right. Um, Jimmy Johnson.
Speaker 1: I had a chat with Jimmy and he's making the
Speaker 1: media rounds because he's got a book out that I
Speaker 1: think it's out Tuesday next Tuesday. Um, it's called Swagger,
Speaker 1: Swagger Swagger, Super Bowls, Brass, Balls and Footballs is the
Speaker 1: title of it. And uh, it was great talking to him.
Speaker 1: He's you know what that's coming from. The brass ones
Speaker 1: are coming from. Uh, well, specifically the ninety three NFC
Speaker 1: Championship game when he called in on Randy Galloway's radio
Speaker 1: show and said, we will win the game. You can
Speaker 1: put it in three inch headlines. We will win the game.
Speaker 1: And then they won the game. But Seaford, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: here you go, said, oh he's got some brass ones. Yeah.
Speaker 1: I think Seaford was scared when you heard that. Yeah,
Speaker 1: he knew, he knew. I think he knew at that moment. Oh, Lloyd,
Speaker 1: it's like, well, you lost to him at home. How
Speaker 1: are we going to beat him at their place after
Speaker 1: they won the Super Bowl. So anyway, he's making the
Speaker 1: rounds um selling his book and um, it's it's really
Speaker 1: I got my copy on Monday, and um it's very interesting,
Speaker 1: you know, you know, the football stuff and it's all
Speaker 1: that's all interesting going back to his Miami Days Cowboys
Speaker 1: days relationship with Jerry is. There's a chapter Me and Jerry.
Speaker 1: But the first chapter that I turned to, uh was
Speaker 1: about his son, Chad and his son, and he was
Speaker 1: very um, um, nate n yeah, go let dated. But anyway,
Speaker 1: he was talking about his son Chad and his battle
Speaker 1: with alcoholism and how he basically yeah, and this was
Speaker 1: in two thousand and nine, and how his calls it
Speaker 1: his ultimate victory, his greatest victory, and he basically had
Speaker 1: to go to his doorstep and got him help, and
Speaker 1: he had They've been trying to get him help, the
Speaker 1: whole family, ad and then finally they uh he and
Speaker 1: he is now running a treatment center I'm thinking Florida,
Speaker 1: and very successful with it. But that's where we were
Speaker 1: talking about yesterday, about how we evolved as people. We
Speaker 1: all have our own stories. Yeah, you know you never
Speaker 1: I never knew that about him, And just let you know,
Speaker 1: you can have a thought process about somebody, but they're
Speaker 1: going through their own stuff. You know, you might be
Speaker 1: angry about what you're going through, but they might not
Speaker 1: show it, but they're going through something as well. Because
Speaker 1: I never knew about that. Did he have a chapter
Speaker 1: on Nate Newton in there? Nate is talked about in
Speaker 1: the book Jimmy's book. You know, did you get a
Speaker 1: book Nate got endorsed? No? I don't. I don't need
Speaker 1: a book. I wish I would have brought the book.
Speaker 1: I could Jimmy see Jimmy Walls, you are so correct
Speaker 1: when you say how guys evolved. Jimmy couldn't be that
Speaker 1: guy he was back when he was with us, and
Speaker 1: when we was with him, he even admitted, I can't
Speaker 1: be that guy again. That guy was that guy there
Speaker 1: almost hated himself because how cold blood that he was
Speaker 1: and how single minded he was. So I mean, just
Speaker 1: think now he said, as big as victory is how
Speaker 1: he helped his son. But I remember him sitting in
Speaker 1: a meeting saying, my people in town, my mom and
Speaker 1: dad in town. But well, am I I'm overhill. I'll
Speaker 1: see them out of the game. I deal with that one.
Speaker 1: So for all of y'alls, with your mom's and your girl,
Speaker 1: I mean, he went off trying to show us the
Speaker 1: single mindedness you know, hate, you know, got rid of
Speaker 1: a great she would be a Hall of Famer guy
Speaker 1: because he was walking out the fields talking to a guy.
Speaker 1: I mean, it went. It went totally against his message. Yes,
Speaker 1: because his message had to be strong, right y'all the
Speaker 1: team that's born at one to fifteen seasons. Yeah, he
Speaker 1: had a vocal guy in the locker. Wasn't buying end too? Yes? Well,
Speaker 1: now let's be Let's be clear. Let's be clear. Jimmy
Speaker 1: Johnson is the only coach that ever made me a captain, right,
Speaker 1: that's Eddie Robinson, Tom Andrew, all of him. He's the
Speaker 1: only one. But he wanted me for a scapegoat. So
Speaker 1: that that to me is for if I was doing
Speaker 1: my work early on, and Nate will tell you, I
Speaker 1: was going, I was doing the work, going to the players,
Speaker 1: going to Jimmy, Hey, this is what's happening. Jimmy wasn't
Speaker 1: feeling none of that. His idea of a captain was
Speaker 1: not what our idea of a captain was, and that
Speaker 1: was clearly pointed out. I think after the Giants game, Yeah,
Speaker 1: I think I was our fourth game. I was you know,
Speaker 1: the guys were running hard. Man, it was it's a
Speaker 1: hundred something degrees outside, and so as a captain, my
Speaker 1: boy said, hey man, this I think Gogan came to them.
Speaker 1: Hey man, they died, they killing us out here. We
Speaker 1: won't be ready for the game. So like coach, they said,
Speaker 1: you tell him what do you think we should do?
Speaker 1: He goes, well, you know what, I was lightned up
Speaker 1: on practice. Where we lightened up on practice, and we
Speaker 1: promptly got our answers kicked by the Giants as if
Speaker 1: we were tired. So Jimmy looked at that and said,
Speaker 1: it's your fault. You know, I listened to you and
Speaker 1: basically that's what happened. So no, he ended I was
Speaker 1: done after that. I was done after that. He ended up.
Speaker 1: If you remember that Giants game, it was cold, it
Speaker 1: was up there. No, no, no, this was the first time. Okay, yeah,
Speaker 1: it was burning up one. The one at the end
Speaker 1: of the season was the one that, uh, you guys
Speaker 1: had the ball inside the ten yard line and on
Speaker 1: the five, on the five, on the five, and he
Speaker 1: got everybody five right, got everybody it got it got
Speaker 1: Wis it fired because the coach Bob Bob, Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: that's what brought Yeah. I wasn't playing at the time
Speaker 1: he got He called all the assistant coaches off the bus.
Speaker 1: I remember being out there because we were still doing
Speaker 1: interviews outside the stadium, and he chewed them all off.
Speaker 1: And then in the press conference he said we weren't
Speaker 1: strong enough. We got a strong curtain and he fired
Speaker 1: bombs would never ever happened to us, and we would
Speaker 1: not be on the one right and couldn't get in
Speaker 1: oh Man nothing and they had the ball as Nate said,
Speaker 1: we're down on the one. Yeah, coach, they running, I
Speaker 1: mean you can, you can literally like he had a head,
Speaker 1: said run it street and see what he's doing. And
Speaker 1: he wasn't gonna kick a field goal. As much as
Speaker 1: we argued, you still, I still know he's doing. He's
Speaker 1: trying to show us. He's trying to create a culture. Yeah,
Speaker 1: we're gonna run it. We're not doing the playoffs. It's
Speaker 1: gonna be our coaching from here on. It ended up
Speaker 1: being that, but it didn't start right there. You know,
Speaker 1: the first time I met him, Paul Palmer was just
Speaker 1: running back. Yeah. Right. The first time. The first time
Speaker 1: I met Jimmy was nineteen seventy eight. It was his
Speaker 1: first year at Oklahoma State. We were on the Big
Speaker 1: eight sky Riders tour and we go into Oklahoma's uh
Speaker 1: to still Water and this new guy here and he's
Speaker 1: chattering away and he was like the best interview of
Speaker 1: the whole bunch. Right, he was new, he was Jimmy,
Speaker 1: and I was thinking, you know what, this guy might
Speaker 1: have something I don't know. And then he turned Oklahoma
Speaker 1: State around, but he stayed his perfunctory five years and
Speaker 1: then left right, went to went to Miami, stayed five
Speaker 1: years and left. Came here, stayed five years and left. Yeah,
Speaker 1: but to say, it's a lot more to that, tell
Speaker 1: you man, he I mean the things he used to say.
Speaker 1: He used coming to meet and I remember Troy just signed.
Speaker 1: And then after Troy signed, he signed his long contract.
Speaker 1: I just wanted it all y'all knew I signed a
Speaker 1: long contract to any of y'all, I'll be here. Wait
Speaker 1: where did this come from? He was wrong on that one. Yeah,
Speaker 1: but I'm just saying how he his single mindedness, right,
Speaker 1: you know? And he told me, he he said, uh, I
Speaker 1: will get rid of anybody I feel can't help this
Speaker 1: team win if if I see where, I will put
Speaker 1: up with you until I find me a player that
Speaker 1: I can replace you with. I mean, you know when
Speaker 1: you were talking about single minded um when they drafted
Speaker 1: in ninety two Robert Jones, first round pick, and I
Speaker 1: remember this, Robert brought his new wife to training camp
Speaker 1: in Austin. Jimmy was livid. He didn't want anybody distracted by.
Speaker 1: He was more worried about, you know, and say what
Speaker 1: you want taking care of his wife than football, and
Speaker 1: Jimmy chewed but out, I mean chewed him out, and
Speaker 1: it was like, you can't leave. This is what I
Speaker 1: don't remember. No, Robert was stern. He wasn't getting rid
Speaker 1: of his wife. Yeah, I'm not not telling the league
Speaker 1: camp new Man, and I respect Robert to this day.
Speaker 1: That's probably why he still got his wife. And I
Speaker 1: don't know Jeff Blake's sister, right, yeah, I tell you man. Uh.
Speaker 1: And see, Michael Irvin was his right hand man. I mean,
Speaker 1: Mike was the co signer. Yeah, Mike signed everything. He said, Mike, uh,
Speaker 1: what's up with this? He could all he could always
Speaker 1: find a reason why Jimmy was right. And I said
Speaker 1: to myself, I said, you know what, I'm gonna quit action, Mike,
Speaker 1: what's up with this? On that list, Michael probably didn't
Speaker 1: have the captain name on him then, but he was
Speaker 1: the captain. Oh. Man. I remember the first time offseason meeting,
Speaker 1: Jimmy's talking if you would call, Mike gets up and
Speaker 1: in the Jimmy yeah man starts talking. Also, well on
Speaker 1: my knees after practice, right, and Jimmy, you know, that's
Speaker 1: the only person that he relented to that was was
Speaker 1: Michael Levin. If Mike had something to say, he knew
Speaker 1: it was gonna co sign with Jimmy. And I'm gonna
Speaker 1: tell you, I'm like after after we started winning, and uh,
Speaker 1: coach Johns we had a roast, a roast, and so
Speaker 1: he invited all of a lot of the players down
Speaker 1: to his live town. He was friends Miss Joplin and
Speaker 1: all of them ever one or two speaker from there.
Speaker 1: You know, they probably was only two families anyway. Anyway, Yeah, anyway,
Speaker 1: I heard him in what's the great coach for the
Speaker 1: Philadelphia Defensive? At the table we all up there talking
Speaker 1: and uh, he was just the things Jimmy was telling
Speaker 1: him about us and how we practice and uh, yeah,
Speaker 1: I go out and find the biggest and strongest guy
Speaker 1: Nate Noon's and getting no rest in training camp. How
Speaker 1: they was gonna kill us and I'm looking at coach
Speaker 1: all right, all right, just Mike Irving, Well you remember everything.
Speaker 1: You remember when he made an example out of Mike
Speaker 1: when he was late for the plane that time nineteen
Speaker 1: ninety two and they were going to Detroit and Mike
Speaker 1: wasn't on the plane, and I think the flight coordinator
Speaker 1: came to Jimmy and he goes, uh, you know, we're
Speaker 1: all here, but Michael, and Jimmy said, what time were
Speaker 1: you're supposed to take off? He said two o'clock, she said,
Speaker 1: and he goes, well, what time is it now? It's
Speaker 1: two o one, let's go, and he left him behind.
Speaker 1: Mike had to find his own flight to Detroit, right,
Speaker 1: and he gets there and Jimmy perfunctory choose him out right,
Speaker 1: and he goes, Okay, you're suspended the first series of
Speaker 1: the game. But wait, it gets better that nor Turner
Speaker 1: finds out he suspended spending Mike the first series of
Speaker 1: the game. And he looked at jim and he goes,
Speaker 1: so if we kick off, is the first series on defense?
Speaker 1: Does that count? Yes? Yes, I let me tell you
Speaker 1: that same trip, Mike comes in. We all at getting
Speaker 1: ready to go to dinner. So Mike rushes in. Come.
Speaker 1: We all up coming the back elevated coach Johnson about
Speaker 1: four other players and he see mikey, you know, Mike
Speaker 1: come overhead hanging. That's just yeah, So you have a
Speaker 1: bike to everybody else left everybody so everybody runs off.
Speaker 1: I act like I double back, so I want to
Speaker 1: see what's gonna happened to bike is boy? You know
Speaker 1: what here? Boy? Right, they get rund the corner, Mike,
Speaker 1: you know, bid man, I wanted to come around the
Speaker 1: corner saying man, but I said okay, yeah, and then
Speaker 1: you know, so I waited to Mike, I said, Mike.
Speaker 1: He got on yeah man, yeah, Man, see Mike, myself, Mike, Mike,
Speaker 1: both sides were well. Didn't need to stop. Oh man.
Speaker 1: But I gotta I gotta say about Mike. Man. You
Speaker 1: know when he got hurt, when he got injured, yeah,
Speaker 1: and I think it was ACL or whatever. Oh yeah.
Speaker 1: To see him come back, just the work that he
Speaker 1: put in, I will never forget that. I will never
Speaker 1: ever ever forget that. He's doing his rehab in the
Speaker 1: off season, right, and he lived in Carrollton. I lived
Speaker 1: in Carrollton. And I'm coming to the ranch one day
Speaker 1: and I see what I thought was like the biggest
Speaker 1: guy ever riding a bicycle, right, and the seat was
Speaker 1: way up as far as it will go. And he's
Speaker 1: writing down the medium on belt line and I'm looking
Speaker 1: and it's Mike. He's writing to the ranch from home,
Speaker 1: part of his rehab to try to get ready that
Speaker 1: ninety seat. I remember him with the weight best on
Speaker 1: and he was bounding off for two feet, I mean
Speaker 1: just as as far as he could go. I mean
Speaker 1: he just did it over and over and over again,
Speaker 1: and that was part of his rehab. I remember seeing
Speaker 1: him in the whirlpool and man, it was one of
Speaker 1: those days, you know how it is when ye, man,
Speaker 1: how did I get here? Like my knee messed up?
Speaker 1: And he was all mad. You just tell he just
Speaker 1: he was mad. I just remember having to talk with
Speaker 1: him and I had never seen him that down before.
Speaker 1: But but you gotta under stand Walls is he remember
Speaker 1: he's having a trench coach all the time because he
Speaker 1: had to read go back and in rebend that knee
Speaker 1: because it froze on it. He did, he had to
Speaker 1: froze what do you call it, scar tissue? Yeah, and
Speaker 1: I had to break it up. And I remember Jim
Speaker 1: Mora because he that was the brit He was the
Speaker 1: Brit back then. Jimma like we gonna get this leg right,
Speaker 1: Mike and Mike just sitting about the crime had on
Speaker 1: a trench because first his first month, Yeah, that was tough.
Speaker 1: I mean he had to be talked to. That's how impassionate.
Speaker 1: He was about like living up to the promise daddy.
Speaker 1: He promised his dad. His dad told him he looked
Speaker 1: at him. His dad was the preacher that preaching in Miami.
Speaker 1: I mean that worked in Miami, you know, own rules,
Speaker 1: laying brick, whatever he had to do to take care
Speaker 1: of eight hundred children like Mike hundred. So his dad
Speaker 1: to him, you are the one. You're the chosen one.
Speaker 1: And so when his dad passed, you know, because his
Speaker 1: dad spend the weekends driving from Miami up to Georgia
Speaker 1: to preach and come back home and work, and he
Speaker 1: told Mike you the one. So Mike felt all his
Speaker 1: weight on him. He did, and it was like his
Speaker 1: senior year in high school when he passed. Yeah, and
Speaker 1: so he kept that that that drive with him the
Speaker 1: whole time. Yeah, that fear of not not when I'm
Speaker 1: sure talking to somebody like yourself and myself where that
Speaker 1: probably helped him out a lot, because that is a
Speaker 1: lot of pressure. I know. I remember talking to him
Speaker 1: one time and after we finished talking, he said, thank you. Yeah,
Speaker 1: And it wasn't just about me, it was he just
Speaker 1: needed somebody to be the one that walking through that
Speaker 1: at that time. I mean he was sitting in that
Speaker 1: whirlpool man, or in that steam room man, and uh,
Speaker 1: he would look he was so dried up. I mean
Speaker 1: his body must have been there the same. Yeah, I
Speaker 1: was so dried up. Yeah, yeah, you know, but no,
Speaker 1: that was sometimes I went by there, and that's exactly
Speaker 1: physically he looked dried up. Said that. And then hell
Speaker 1: when they popped that scar tissue and him and Jim
Speaker 1: shot at gunt and that's when y'all saw all the results.
Speaker 1: I mean, he never stopped. He worked out like a
Speaker 1: beast before that, but after that crazy, I mean, he
Speaker 1: would party from Monday. He would also work out from
Speaker 1: Monday to third. You know what I'm saying, Hey, jam Jimmy,
Speaker 1: Jimmy shit, thank him for everything and this team together.
Speaker 1: And by the way, after he got left, he found
Speaker 1: that there was a phone number to the pilot. Yes,
Speaker 1: he did in the cop pick and if there was
Speaker 1: he was gonna be late, he'd call in and they
Speaker 1: would have him mechanical. And by the way, that trip
Speaker 1: to Detroit that he missed, the that Michael Irvin missed
Speaker 1: the flight. It was thirty years ago this week. Wow,
Speaker 1: wasn't really And I remember pick like thirty seven to
Speaker 1: three one thirty seven they won, they gain Cowboys won
Speaker 1: thirty seven. I tell you, I just remember some of
Speaker 1: his speeches. Coach John's used to have some of the
Speaker 1: things he used to say. And uh, I mean, I've
Speaker 1: to tell your story where we was in practice right
Speaker 1: when we're in Austin, and uh, this one of Jimmy
Speaker 1: Chipper your days. He comes out, Troy, Troy, how you
Speaker 1: doing the baby? Baby? How you doing you? How? How
Speaker 1: you feel good? Coach? Just let me know now I
Speaker 1: will feel kind of cut back for you. Hey, Hey,
Speaker 1: what's up? Man? How you lay our? Coach? Hand me
Speaker 1: a little tight? Well, you know you ain't doing seven
Speaker 1: little seven? You know, you know you know inside run
Speaker 1: you're not doing that, Mike, And that Mike was to judge.
Speaker 1: If Mike said he was tired, then we was gonna
Speaker 1: get at least thirty minutes of practice cut short. Other
Speaker 1: than that, it was still wide open. Mike. How you feel, miked, Coach,
Speaker 1: I'm ready to run. Oh, we're gonna have a great
Speaker 1: deal of practice. Now we gonna have a great right
Speaker 1: you get over to me, Nate, just get rid of
Speaker 1: to practice one day. You don't ask me how I
Speaker 1: was doing it, don't matter. Just get rid of whatever happens.
Speaker 1: We got three minutes left on the show, and we
Speaker 1: got a break still to time. Yeah, what about the play?
Speaker 1: What happened? Why don't I just read it? All right?
Speaker 1: And it's Wednesday? Right? Wait, wait before you do that,
Speaker 1: let's do it in the word of the day today.
Speaker 1: What's the word of the day? Mickey's used it twice
Speaker 1: and I hadn't look it up. Perfunctory, perfunctory, carried out,
Speaker 1: carried out with a minimum of effort or reflection. And
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Speaker 1: Back back to Mick shots Mackey is another perfunctory thing.
Speaker 1: So after you won the Super Bowl in ninety three,
Speaker 1: back to back, right, and he bout wore you guys
Speaker 1: out to win those five straight. At the end of
Speaker 1: the year, Jimmy was doing his radio show on Kara
Speaker 1: al D and he was getting paid, but the money
Speaker 1: went to Jerry went to the club. He wasn't getting
Speaker 1: the money, so they bought him a boat. Right, Okay,
Speaker 1: So he takes the boat and he disappears for two weeks.
Speaker 1: He takes it, he zips down to Florida. He comes
Speaker 1: back and I ran into him in the hallway by
Speaker 1: where you guys would eat lunch, and I said, well,
Speaker 1: where you been? Just like that? And he goes, well,
Speaker 1: for the first time since I took the job at
Speaker 1: Oklahoma State, I took a vacation. And I said, what'd
Speaker 1: you do? And he goes, well, I had the boat.
Speaker 1: I went to the water, and I said, I said
Speaker 1: to myself, oh no, he found out there's more life
Speaker 1: than football. And I'll be darned what two months later? Okay,
Speaker 1: we need to get to that chapter. Well, and we can.
Speaker 1: We are out of time, but just briefly say this
Speaker 1: all right after Jimmy and Jerry had the press conference
Speaker 1: the divorce, Okay, Jimmy writes in the book that his
Speaker 1: dad drove up from Port Arthur and met him at
Speaker 1: the house and he broke down crying. And the other
Speaker 1: thing the other chapter, that's great talking about when his
Speaker 1: mom died and I remember that to what changed his
Speaker 1: life was in front of his mom's casket. In nineteen
Speaker 1: ninety he was still the coach of the Miami Dolphins
Speaker 1: at that point. But what changed his life was in
Speaker 1: front of his mom's casket and he realized their family
Speaker 1: was kind of and then you fast forward. We talked
Speaker 1: about earlier about his son Chad, and he was very
Speaker 1: successful and then had battled severe alcoholism, and it was
Speaker 1: in two thousand and nine. Finally his ultimate victory was
Speaker 1: saving his son, who now runs a rehab center in Florida.
Speaker 1: You know, as old as he was, you could say
Speaker 1: that he actually grew up. He finally grew up. Yeah,
Speaker 1: he found out there was something more than football. Immatured
Speaker 1: in a different way of life. Different, that's right. We
Speaker 1: went We went to three sixty on Jimmy there at
Speaker 1: the beginning and where you go. You know, I adopted
Speaker 1: some of his ways. I did. Man, that straightforwards is
Speaker 1: something that I won't as long as it's not im moral,
Speaker 1: I'm going to get it. You know, I'm serious. I mean,
Speaker 1: but you've always worked for you, but it worked for you.
Speaker 1: You got ye three rings because of that, that mindset.
Speaker 1: So how are you going to change that? Yeah? Wow? Right,
Speaker 1: And it's it's lessons for all of us to learn.
Speaker 1: I mean, because there's so many people that they get
Speaker 1: or they are good at their job, single they love
Speaker 1: doing their job, but they got family, and they go
Speaker 1: so much into I gotta be successful and and you're
Speaker 1: you're justified by I'm supporting my family doing this, but
Speaker 1: you don't have the quality family exactly. That's right. Then
Speaker 1: you turn around. He got a second chance. A lot
Speaker 1: of people don't get that second chance. That my mother died,
Speaker 1: he saw his kids. He got to say a lot
Speaker 1: of people don't get the second chance. That's right because
Speaker 1: the world changing. Your kids be like, I don't want
Speaker 1: to deal with you. I'm telling a lot of coaches
Speaker 1: out there, but their parents, their family won't deal with them. Wow, Nate,
Speaker 1: thanks for stopping man. Good stuff. It's good. I just
Speaker 1: you know, good from everybody s coming to be Mike IRV.
Speaker 1: But I'm like, nah, anytime, any time you think your
Speaker 1: guys on your podcast will let you talk, you just
Speaker 1: come right on here. Well, you know, Jesse don't understand
Speaker 1: what the winning that we all been through. Jesse and
Speaker 1: Jesse he fourth and long he a long shop all
Speaker 1: right about boy? That does it for mixed shots And
Speaker 1: we will shout at you again tomorrow at noon. Go Cowboys.
Speaker 1: This has been a production of Dallas Cowboys dot Com
Speaker 1: and the Dallas Cowboys Football Club.