WEBVTT - Marriage, Divorce and Pre-Nups 0:00:03.200 --> 0:00:06.200 Hello, everyone, Thanks for tuning in to Cheeky's and Chill, 0:00:06.240 --> 0:00:08.799 your favorite podcast, and I just wanted to start off 0:00:08.840 --> 0:00:10.880 by saying, I know that there are a lot of 0:00:10.960 --> 0:00:13.440 other podcasts out there, so I really appreciate you guys 0:00:13.480 --> 0:00:15.200 choosing to listen to mine. 0:00:15.240 --> 0:00:18.720 I love you guys very much. Okay, so today's episode is. 0:00:18.680 --> 0:00:21.439 Going to be a really interesting one because we're going 0:00:21.480 --> 0:00:25.239 to be talking about marriage, divorce, and prenups, which I 0:00:25.280 --> 0:00:29.400 know are super controversial, and I'm bringing on a seasoned 0:00:29.440 --> 0:00:30.360 divorce attorney. 0:00:30.400 --> 0:00:31.760 Her name is Christina Royce. 0:00:32.280 --> 0:00:35.519 She's the Los Angeles co chair of the matrimonial and 0:00:35.640 --> 0:00:39.480 family practice at the law firm Blank Rome. She's also 0:00:39.560 --> 0:00:42.320 one of Hollywood's go to divorce lawyers, so you know 0:00:42.400 --> 0:00:45.319 she has seen it all. And just a REMINDERR, this 0:00:45.360 --> 0:00:47.680 is not legal advice and you should consult with a 0:00:47.760 --> 0:00:51.480 qualified professional if you have any questions related to this episode. 0:00:51.680 --> 0:00:54.360 So with that being said, Hi Christina, thank you so 0:00:54.440 --> 0:00:55.200 much for being here. 0:00:55.320 --> 0:00:57.040 I'm so excited to speak to you. How are you. 0:00:57.640 --> 0:00:58.800 I'm doing well? How are you? 0:00:59.120 --> 0:01:00.680 I'm good, I'm happy, a good day. 0:01:00.920 --> 0:01:03.639 I am so I have so many questions because I've 0:01:03.680 --> 0:01:08.520 been divorced before and I'm now remarried and thank goodness, 0:01:08.640 --> 0:01:11.479 happily married. But you just never know what can happen, 0:01:11.600 --> 0:01:16.280 you know. Okay, So what is the biggest misconception about 0:01:16.600 --> 0:01:17.559 divorce you think? 0:01:18.720 --> 0:01:20.679 Well, I think, you know, for I think for a 0:01:20.680 --> 0:01:23.600 lot of people, it could feel like really scary, and 0:01:23.640 --> 0:01:27.280 it can feel overwhelming, and it can feel like daunting, 0:01:27.400 --> 0:01:30.720 and they feel like it's like the end of their life. 0:01:31.520 --> 0:01:34.560 And I think that a lot of people realize that 0:01:34.640 --> 0:01:38.160 sometimes that marriage is not the right situation, and then 0:01:38.600 --> 0:01:42.760 later on they signed a real true happiness being outside 0:01:42.800 --> 0:01:46.240 of a bad relationship. Like, look, you got remarried. You know, 0:01:46.400 --> 0:01:50.880 you've found a different love in your life. But it's scary. 0:01:50.920 --> 0:01:53.360 It's a scary process to go through it. Right, there's 0:01:53.400 --> 0:01:55.320 a lot of unknowns relating to it. 0:01:55.920 --> 0:02:01.920 Yeah, I mean I feel like divorce can bring out 0:02:01.960 --> 0:02:02.919 the worst in people. 0:02:03.400 --> 0:02:04.480 That's definitely true. 0:02:04.680 --> 0:02:05.040 Right. 0:02:05.160 --> 0:02:07.200 I give a lot of people. I tell everybody, like 0:02:07.240 --> 0:02:10.160 put post its everywhere, like be your best self through 0:02:10.200 --> 0:02:12.960 this process. Be your best self through this process, because 0:02:12.960 --> 0:02:17.280 it's really hard. People get gas lit, they're nervous, they're 0:02:18.360 --> 0:02:22.640 financially scared. Right, it's really an overwhelming process. 0:02:23.000 --> 0:02:23.480 It is. 0:02:23.639 --> 0:02:25.840 I know my sister's going through it right now, and 0:02:26.240 --> 0:02:29.520 even when I want to give her advice, I don't 0:02:29.639 --> 0:02:31.600 even know what to say. I mean, because I feel 0:02:31.600 --> 0:02:34.360 like they have children together, so they should have the 0:02:34.400 --> 0:02:37.160 peace amongst themselves. But things are just getting so out 0:02:37.160 --> 0:02:40.400 of hand, and all you can do as a big 0:02:40.440 --> 0:02:42.799 sister is just step back and say, okay, like hopefully 0:02:43.040 --> 0:02:46.519 let the attorneys that the professionals do you know, guide 0:02:46.520 --> 0:02:49.359 you because it's difficult, Like they say, you know, you've 0:02:49.360 --> 0:02:51.040 been with this person for so many years, but you 0:02:51.040 --> 0:02:53.400 don't really know who they are until you're getting divorced. 0:02:53.440 --> 0:02:55.960 I mean, have you seen really that there could be 0:02:56.320 --> 0:02:59.960 a divorce that's like amicable, like really or does it 0:03:00.080 --> 0:03:04.480 always have a very like nasty ending to it. 0:03:05.040 --> 0:03:08.200 I would say that the majority of my cases have 0:03:08.280 --> 0:03:10.440 a more amicable approach to their divorce. 0:03:10.600 --> 0:03:11.280 Oh okay. 0:03:11.320 --> 0:03:14.400 I think they realize that they have kids together and 0:03:14.440 --> 0:03:16.840 are going to be in each other's lives. A lot 0:03:16.880 --> 0:03:18.800 of them realize that the marriage may not be the 0:03:18.919 --> 0:03:21.680 right you know, it may not be their right union. 0:03:22.160 --> 0:03:25.079 But for the most part, and I maybe it's kind 0:03:25.080 --> 0:03:27.040 of the clients that I get or the kind of 0:03:27.840 --> 0:03:30.400 approach I take. We really try to take a more 0:03:30.440 --> 0:03:34.360 amicable approach to the to the situation and work more collaboratively, 0:03:34.480 --> 0:03:38.080 which I think it reduces fear. You know, there's not 0:03:38.120 --> 0:03:41.360 a lot of surprises during the divorce case. We do 0:03:41.440 --> 0:03:44.920 things in an orderly fashion so everyone feels comfortable through 0:03:44.920 --> 0:03:47.800 the process. And I do think that that how we 0:03:47.880 --> 0:03:50.640 approach the divorce case really helps them launch later on 0:03:50.720 --> 0:03:51.880 as co parents. 0:03:52.360 --> 0:03:53.000 I love that. 0:03:53.360 --> 0:03:55.320 I love that and I appreciate that, and also I 0:03:55.360 --> 0:03:58.600 think it also saves the client money, right because it 0:03:58.640 --> 0:04:02.800 could get expensive, especially how expensive can a divorce be. 0:04:03.520 --> 0:04:06.440 It can be expensive. I mean, it depends on the issue. Sometimes. 0:04:06.480 --> 0:04:10.120 You know, I'm really good at I'm a big believer 0:04:10.200 --> 0:04:12.920 in throwing money to a situation. If it gets certainty, 0:04:13.040 --> 0:04:15.120 if it gets peace of mind, if it makes the 0:04:15.200 --> 0:04:18.479 kids situation better, if it makes like getting rid of 0:04:18.480 --> 0:04:21.880 the lawyers, if it means moving on, I think there's 0:04:22.040 --> 0:04:27.440 value to that. And you know, obviously with degrees, but 0:04:27.480 --> 0:04:31.280 I think there's value to paying money to the other 0:04:31.480 --> 0:04:33.760 side as opposed to paying all this money to the 0:04:33.839 --> 0:04:38.479 lawyers if you can get it done right. And there's 0:04:38.480 --> 0:04:40.960 some gray areas in the family law. So it's nice 0:04:40.960 --> 0:04:44.120 to just being able to like solve those differences by 0:04:44.720 --> 0:04:47.400 you know, with having some financial resources being paid. 0:04:48.000 --> 0:04:49.000 Yeah. 0:04:49.200 --> 0:04:50.880 So do you feel now that you you know, you 0:04:50.880 --> 0:04:54.200 said that you've been practicing for twenty plus years, do 0:04:54.279 --> 0:04:56.239 you feel that a divorce is on the rise. 0:04:57.120 --> 0:05:01.039 I think that I'll say this. I think my business 0:05:01.080 --> 0:05:04.240 is definitely recession proof. It depends, you know, when I 0:05:04.320 --> 0:05:07.960 think certain things are difficult. I think that really shines 0:05:08.000 --> 0:05:10.560 in whether a marriage is the strong marriage or something 0:05:10.600 --> 0:05:14.880 that maybe needs to move on. I think it's been 0:05:14.880 --> 0:05:18.039 pretty consistent, you know. I think there's times where a 0:05:18.040 --> 0:05:20.359 lot of people get divorced after their kids launch and 0:05:20.400 --> 0:05:22.560 go to college, because maybe that's an easier time for 0:05:22.600 --> 0:05:26.679 people to move on. I think there's times where people 0:05:26.680 --> 0:05:29.520 get married and are married only for short periods and 0:05:29.560 --> 0:05:31.720 it turned out it's not the right thing. Maybe they 0:05:31.720 --> 0:05:34.760 have different views about children or things like that. So 0:05:34.839 --> 0:05:36.279 I don't I can't tell you it's really on the 0:05:36.400 --> 0:05:36.960 rise or not. 0:05:37.200 --> 0:05:37.359 You know. 0:05:37.440 --> 0:05:40.599 I also look and here here's my situation, and we 0:05:40.640 --> 0:05:44.320 can talk about this that I've been married almost thirty years. 0:05:44.760 --> 0:05:47.800 I very much believe in the in the concept of 0:05:47.880 --> 0:05:51.400 marriage and the union of a marriage. I just look 0:05:51.400 --> 0:05:54.280 at it maybe a little differently. Look, I believe marriage 0:05:54.320 --> 0:05:57.480 really involves three different buckets, right. I think we need 0:05:57.480 --> 0:06:01.760 our sexual intimacy and need connect and sexually, I think 0:06:01.800 --> 0:06:04.479 we need to feel connected emotionally, right and have that 0:06:04.560 --> 0:06:07.520 emotional connection. But I also think there needs to be 0:06:07.800 --> 0:06:11.840 what I call financial intimacy, or I feel like people 0:06:11.880 --> 0:06:14.960 need to feel like they can have these conversations about 0:06:15.120 --> 0:06:19.920 finances that are sometimes difficult to have, Like, you know, 0:06:19.960 --> 0:06:21.720 there's a lot of people come to me and they 0:06:21.720 --> 0:06:23.880 don't know anything about like I don't know how much 0:06:23.920 --> 0:06:26.039 we make, I don't know how much is in the bank. 0:06:26.240 --> 0:06:29.159 I don't know what kind of like support I would get. 0:06:29.200 --> 0:06:31.440 I don't know what kind of circumstances we live. I 0:06:31.480 --> 0:06:33.440 know we live X, Y and Z, and we do 0:06:33.480 --> 0:06:35.839 all these things, and that's a really like that's a 0:06:35.920 --> 0:06:39.080 lack of partnership, right, And so I think having that 0:06:39.200 --> 0:06:42.120 financial intimacy means that we're we need to be more 0:06:42.160 --> 0:06:44.919 partners with one another as much as we need to 0:06:44.960 --> 0:06:48.359 have like the sexual intimacy and the emotional intimacy, but 0:06:48.400 --> 0:06:51.680 we need to have that connection financially. 0:06:52.560 --> 0:06:56.080 I agree, And that's something that I learned this time around, 0:06:56.440 --> 0:07:01.320 that it's not seeing it as yours in mine, it's ours. 0:07:01.400 --> 0:07:05.760 We're a team, and it just changes everything again. Also, 0:07:06.480 --> 0:07:08.680 couple's therapy has helped quite a bit, you know, because 0:07:08.680 --> 0:07:11.800 it's two different people coming together and we have to 0:07:11.880 --> 0:07:13.760 understand we're not going to think the same, we're not 0:07:13.800 --> 0:07:16.400 going to have always the same opinion, and we have 0:07:16.480 --> 0:07:18.000 to be okay with that. But how can we work 0:07:18.040 --> 0:07:20.560 through it? You know, especially that the financial part and 0:07:20.640 --> 0:07:24.200 aspect of marriage, it could be, like you said, very 0:07:24.680 --> 0:07:28.000 very uncomfortable sometimes conversation, but very necessary. 0:07:28.200 --> 0:07:30.040 And look, there's a lot of people who I think 0:07:30.120 --> 0:07:32.600 I think there is a lot of people who get 0:07:32.640 --> 0:07:36.240 married later in life now, right, and they have already 0:07:36.240 --> 0:07:39.840 have established businesses or assets, and they may be coming 0:07:39.840 --> 0:07:42.560 into a marriage and not everything's going to be equal, right, 0:07:43.080 --> 0:07:45.520 and because they already built up there a lot of 0:07:45.560 --> 0:07:47.360 their net worth, and so they need to have those 0:07:47.400 --> 0:07:50.600 conversations that not everything that I own as of the 0:07:50.680 --> 0:07:53.520 data marriage becomes ours. Like maybe there's things that do 0:07:53.640 --> 0:07:56.600 become ours, and there's things that are mine because I 0:07:56.640 --> 0:08:00.000 either inherited assets or I really worked hard before marriage 0:08:00.160 --> 0:08:02.480 to get that. But those are the things that people 0:08:02.520 --> 0:08:06.160 need to have these conversations of. So so there's an understanding, 0:08:06.480 --> 0:08:08.960 right yeah. My husband gets mad at me because I say, 0:08:09.520 --> 0:08:11.800 your marriage is a lot like a business, right, Like 0:08:12.360 --> 0:08:14.280 you know, we wouldn't you and I wouldn't go into 0:08:14.280 --> 0:08:16.960 business together without saying, Okay, you know, what are you 0:08:17.040 --> 0:08:18.960 going to contribute to the business? What am I going 0:08:19.000 --> 0:08:20.800 to contribute to the business? How are we going to 0:08:20.840 --> 0:08:23.800 handle that? And like the same should be true with 0:08:23.840 --> 0:08:26.120 a marriage, like how are we going to handle all 0:08:26.160 --> 0:08:29.440 these finances? And I think there's a there's a business 0:08:29.480 --> 0:08:32.959 aspect of it. My husband's like, you're always a unromantic Chris. 0:08:35.520 --> 0:08:37.840 You know, it's so funny that you say that because 0:08:37.840 --> 0:08:40.120 I just watched I came across a video on social 0:08:40.160 --> 0:08:45.160 media last night about a man speaking about his marriage 0:08:45.240 --> 0:08:47.200 and he's he seems to be very successful man and 0:08:47.240 --> 0:08:49.440 he's been married for fifteen plus years and he said 0:08:49.480 --> 0:08:53.200 that his secret is approaching his marriage like his businesses, 0:08:53.480 --> 0:08:56.520 sitting down on a weekly basis and talking about Okay, 0:08:56.559 --> 0:08:58.280 what happened this weekend and what can you do? 0:08:58.360 --> 0:08:58.960 What will I do? 0:08:59.040 --> 0:09:01.160 And it's how would you go into a business meeting 0:09:01.200 --> 0:09:03.120 do that in your marriage, and I had never seen 0:09:03.160 --> 0:09:05.360 it like that, And now in this confirmation, now that 0:09:05.400 --> 0:09:07.640 you're saying it, I'm like, Okay, that makes sense. 0:09:08.400 --> 0:09:12.080 Yeah, there's definitely some truth to that. Yeah, you know, 0:09:12.160 --> 0:09:14.160 like you just have to have those but those are 0:09:14.280 --> 0:09:16.680 some of its hard conversations and it's not easy, you know. 0:09:17.240 --> 0:09:19.800 Yeah, And you have to be open and able and 0:09:19.840 --> 0:09:22.400 willing to have those uncomfortable conversations. And that's what I 0:09:22.960 --> 0:09:24.560 learned before. It was like, it should just be easy, 0:09:24.600 --> 0:09:27.880 it shouldn't be so hard. The thing is is communication 0:09:28.040 --> 0:09:30.160 is key. And I always tell you guys here on 0:09:30.200 --> 0:09:33.920 the pod communication, especially in your relationship, in any relationship, 0:09:34.280 --> 0:09:46.080 romantic business, et cetera. And Christina, do you have any 0:09:46.160 --> 0:09:48.679 tips or advice on how to reduce the chance of 0:09:48.679 --> 0:09:49.520 getting divorced? 0:09:49.800 --> 0:09:51.360 Well, I think it goes back to something what we're 0:09:51.400 --> 0:09:55.000 talking about. I think that it is really important that 0:09:55.040 --> 0:09:59.040 we get better at communicating, that we understand that. I 0:09:59.080 --> 0:10:01.439 think people come in with different needs, Like I may 0:10:01.520 --> 0:10:03.960 be much more of a sensitive person. My husband may 0:10:04.000 --> 0:10:06.920 be more of a reactive person. Like I have to 0:10:07.000 --> 0:10:09.199 understand that he can be like that and I can 0:10:09.240 --> 0:10:13.760 be different, Like we're genetically made up differently, right, And 0:10:13.840 --> 0:10:17.800 so I think having those communications and talking about it 0:10:17.840 --> 0:10:20.800 is important. I think it's really important not to be 0:10:20.920 --> 0:10:24.240 reactive to things and to be more responsive to things. 0:10:25.559 --> 0:10:28.079 I think therapy is a really helpful thing that if 0:10:28.080 --> 0:10:30.880 people need really help and guidance on how to communicate, 0:10:30.920 --> 0:10:35.840 I think that's helpful. I think sharing information, you know, 0:10:35.920 --> 0:10:40.240 even if someone comes and says, let's assume they came 0:10:40.280 --> 0:10:42.800 into the marriage with fifty million dollars, right, and they 0:10:42.840 --> 0:10:47.160 had all this money before marriage, it's sometimes important to 0:10:46.800 --> 0:10:49.240 share with the other side. Look, look, I came into 0:10:49.240 --> 0:10:51.800 this marriage with these these assets. This is what I 0:10:51.840 --> 0:10:54.280 came into. Like, that doesn't mean it's all going to 0:10:54.320 --> 0:10:57.240 be ours, and I want us to understand that, right, Like, 0:10:57.280 --> 0:11:00.480 that doesn't mean we can't do things and enjoy certain 0:11:00.520 --> 0:11:06.679 things together. But as there's more transparency and accountability and conversation, 0:11:06.920 --> 0:11:08.559 I think it really helps marriages. 0:11:09.040 --> 0:11:10.520 Yeah, I think you're right. 0:11:10.559 --> 0:11:12.440 I mean, in which brings me to my next question, 0:11:12.480 --> 0:11:16.640 which is about prenups. Do you believe do you recommend 0:11:16.720 --> 0:11:18.760 highly recommend prenups? 0:11:19.360 --> 0:11:21.760 So I hate the word prenup because I think everybody 0:11:21.760 --> 0:11:24.320 has such a bad connotation about it. I wish we'all 0:11:24.360 --> 0:11:27.280 called them partnership agreements because I think it as I stop, 0:11:27.520 --> 0:11:30.240 a softer way of like we're entering into a partnership 0:11:30.280 --> 0:11:34.240 with one another. Yeah. I think some are very necessary 0:11:34.400 --> 0:11:39.080 because there are some really gray areas when it comes 0:11:39.120 --> 0:11:42.800 to family law. And I think some people approach a 0:11:42.800 --> 0:11:44.840 marriage like a business and they want to make sure 0:11:44.880 --> 0:11:47.600 that if this business didn't work or this marriage didn't work, 0:11:47.640 --> 0:11:51.840 that there's clear understanding of what's ours and what's going 0:11:51.880 --> 0:11:54.800 to be shared and what's not ours. Right. So like, 0:11:55.160 --> 0:11:58.080 for example, if I were to get married, if the 0:11:58.120 --> 0:12:00.640 listim I was not married, and I got married to right, 0:12:00.880 --> 0:12:03.960 I have built twenty eight years of building my law 0:12:04.040 --> 0:12:08.680 practice right and building my reputation right. And then during 0:12:08.720 --> 0:12:12.440 the marriage, I don't want there to be messiness about 0:12:12.480 --> 0:12:15.800 whether the community got an interest in my law practice 0:12:15.920 --> 0:12:17.920 or not. You know, I've worked really hard to get 0:12:17.960 --> 0:12:20.120 to this point. Up to this point, So I may 0:12:20.160 --> 0:12:22.760 want an agreement that says, look, during the marriage or 0:12:22.760 --> 0:12:24.760 I may share all my income and all my income 0:12:24.760 --> 0:12:26.440 can be community, but I want to make sure my 0:12:26.520 --> 0:12:28.840 law practice will always be separate property and not and 0:12:28.880 --> 0:12:30.000 have clear rules on it. 0:12:30.120 --> 0:12:30.400 Right. 0:12:30.520 --> 0:12:33.520 Yeah, So there's people who feel that way, and I 0:12:33.520 --> 0:12:36.200 think an agreement can really be helpful that way. I 0:12:36.240 --> 0:12:38.520 can also see there's a lot of times where I 0:12:38.559 --> 0:12:42.360 will get people to come to me that are part 0:12:42.360 --> 0:12:46.440 of a family enterprise. Like you know, their family has 0:12:46.440 --> 0:12:50.080 built these big businesses for generations and they want to 0:12:50.120 --> 0:12:54.000 make sure that those businesses stay separate property right, And 0:12:54.080 --> 0:12:57.280 so there's these things in agreements that we can protect 0:12:57.520 --> 0:13:00.600 on that. You know, in family law, we have what's 0:13:00.640 --> 0:13:04.000 called alimony. You know, if you get separated, there's alimony 0:13:04.160 --> 0:13:07.840 after a divorce. And California is very big on alimony. 0:13:07.840 --> 0:13:11.800 It's a high high state, Okay. And some people are like, look, 0:13:11.840 --> 0:13:15.000 I've been married before. I payin rat alimony to my 0:13:15.240 --> 0:13:16.960 ex wife. I don't want to have to be in 0:13:16.960 --> 0:13:19.440 a situation where I'm paying all this money again. And 0:13:19.440 --> 0:13:22.719 they may want limitations on that right, and they may 0:13:22.760 --> 0:13:25.480 want protections on that and those are things that are 0:13:25.480 --> 0:13:29.600 common in agreements. Similarly, I have also done a number 0:13:29.600 --> 0:13:35.240 of agreements where we are building more community for the 0:13:35.640 --> 0:13:38.200 parties than there would be. So there can be a 0:13:38.240 --> 0:13:42.160 big benefit to having an agreement. And so like, for example, 0:13:42.160 --> 0:13:44.200 I'll give you an example, let's assim come someone comes 0:13:44.200 --> 0:13:46.200 in and they're worth one hundred million dollars and they're 0:13:46.200 --> 0:13:48.640 a big trust fund kid, right, and they're not working 0:13:48.720 --> 0:13:51.199 during the marriage. They're just worth one hundred million dollars. Right. 0:13:51.240 --> 0:13:54.200 They a marriage. And we've done a lot of agreements 0:13:54.240 --> 0:13:56.880 where we've built some of that taken some of that money, 0:13:57.200 --> 0:14:00.000 and we've created more community or wealth from it. Right. 0:14:00.080 --> 0:14:04.040 And we've done more where we've can like build more 0:14:04.120 --> 0:14:06.840 partnerships during the marriage. And what we do is we 0:14:06.880 --> 0:14:09.720 call we transmute or we change the character of the money. 0:14:09.840 --> 0:14:12.360 So there's a lot of different things that we can 0:14:12.440 --> 0:14:15.520 do in the agreement. Some can be very beneficial to 0:14:15.600 --> 0:14:19.680 the other spouse, some can be less beneficial. I don't 0:14:19.680 --> 0:14:22.280 really get involved in my colleagues, don't get involved in 0:14:22.360 --> 0:14:25.560 agreements that are like so incided that it would be 0:14:25.600 --> 0:14:27.640 a disaster and divorce. I mean, I just won't get 0:14:27.680 --> 0:14:28.840 involved in those kinds of things. 0:14:28.920 --> 0:14:31.040 Yeah, I think I think just being fair and keeping 0:14:31.080 --> 0:14:33.360 that in mind, I think that is a huge thing. 0:14:33.440 --> 0:14:35.320 And I feel like I'm getting that sense from you, 0:14:35.360 --> 0:14:37.160 and I love that where you're just fair and you're like, hey, 0:14:37.200 --> 0:14:38.720 I want everything to just be peaceful. 0:14:39.000 --> 0:14:40.720 There's no need to argue and. 0:14:40.720 --> 0:14:43.000 Take away the gray area, like let's have it clean 0:14:43.080 --> 0:14:45.400 and simple. And you know, I'm not somebody if like, 0:14:45.760 --> 0:14:48.280 you know, you have to understand, if you're forty years 0:14:48.320 --> 0:14:50.800 old and you're marrying a sixty year old who's already 0:14:50.920 --> 0:14:54.800 established themselves and already gone through a divorce, they may 0:14:54.880 --> 0:14:59.600 want something really simple, easy and clean. They may not 0:14:59.760 --> 0:15:06.200 want another big, protracted divorce case. And you're forty years old. 0:15:06.280 --> 0:15:08.240 That's something you have to understand with the person that 0:15:08.280 --> 0:15:11.320 you're marrying at that point, right, And that makes sense. 0:15:11.960 --> 0:15:15.040 I agree, I completely agree, because I just feel the 0:15:15.680 --> 0:15:20.400 partnership agreements, you know, definitely bring a peace of mind. 0:15:20.640 --> 0:15:23.360 I mean, for me, I have one, and he had 0:15:23.360 --> 0:15:26.240 no issue. He said, that's totally fine. I get it, 0:15:26.280 --> 0:15:28.400 didn't give me any issues. I made sure he got 0:15:28.400 --> 0:15:30.880 his own attorney because obviously he had to. But I 0:15:30.920 --> 0:15:34.520 wanted him to understand everything. And we are building together 0:15:34.960 --> 0:15:38.120 and we have that very clear. In my past, I 0:15:38.360 --> 0:15:41.120 did have, you know, someone that wasn't very happy about 0:15:41.160 --> 0:15:42.920 that and felt like, oh, you don't trust me, and 0:15:42.960 --> 0:15:45.280 why you know, what do you think I would take 0:15:45.320 --> 0:15:47.160 something from you? And it's like, no, it's not that 0:15:47.240 --> 0:15:51.080 it's just I learned from my mother, you know. She 0:15:51.320 --> 0:15:53.600 was one that said, you you want to go into 0:15:53.640 --> 0:15:56.120 a marriage with peace of mind and know that this 0:15:56.200 --> 0:15:58.760 person is with you for the right reasons. And I 0:15:58.840 --> 0:16:00.960 understood it right away, but there are some people that don't. 0:16:01.200 --> 0:16:03.440 And also Christina, and if you could tell us a little 0:16:03.480 --> 0:16:05.360 bit more about postnups. 0:16:05.880 --> 0:16:08.720 So, post ups are agreements done during the marriage where 0:16:08.720 --> 0:16:11.280 you're not getting divorced and you still want to stay married, 0:16:11.720 --> 0:16:14.400 but you want to change the law or change what 0:16:14.440 --> 0:16:17.360 your prenup is. Right. So there's times where people will 0:16:17.520 --> 0:16:19.840 enter into a prenup and then they're like, you know, 0:16:19.880 --> 0:16:22.200 over time, we've done this, or we've done this, or 0:16:22.200 --> 0:16:23.920 we want to change this, and they can enter into 0:16:23.960 --> 0:16:28.480 post nuptial agreements to modify it. There are times where 0:16:28.520 --> 0:16:32.000 people enter in post nups because they sometimes don't like 0:16:32.120 --> 0:16:35.440 how the marriage is feeling and they want more certainty 0:16:35.800 --> 0:16:39.000 with respect to their finances. So I had a really 0:16:39.040 --> 0:16:43.760 interesting case one time where the wife wanted very conservative investments. 0:16:43.800 --> 0:16:46.600 She was more conservative, she was more fear based, she 0:16:46.760 --> 0:16:49.640 was more scared, and a husband was like as risky 0:16:49.680 --> 0:16:53.040 investments as you can imagine, Like I want to invest 0:16:53.120 --> 0:16:57.520 in like coffees in Brazil, right, And so what we 0:16:57.640 --> 0:17:00.840 did was we created a post up because this they 0:17:00.880 --> 0:17:03.560 loved each other and they wanted to like stay married, 0:17:03.600 --> 0:17:08.560 but they had these like fights about their investment decisions, right, 0:17:08.960 --> 0:17:12.400 And so what we did was we created a pot 0:17:12.440 --> 0:17:15.720 of community, a pot of separate for him, a pot 0:17:15.760 --> 0:17:18.840 of separate for her. She was going to keep hers in. 0:17:19.119 --> 0:17:21.439 You know, I don't want treasuries and you know, do 0:17:21.520 --> 0:17:25.239 something really easy. He could do whatever he wanted. We 0:17:25.280 --> 0:17:27.720 had our community that was still paying all the community 0:17:27.760 --> 0:17:30.680 bills in their community lifestyles. And it was a situation 0:17:30.800 --> 0:17:34.600 that we looked at the marriage both from me. They 0:17:34.760 --> 0:17:37.040 loved each other and wanted to stay married, and they 0:17:37.160 --> 0:17:40.640 had a you know, strong romantic relationship, but we looked 0:17:40.640 --> 0:17:42.960 at it from a business standpoint. What made sense for 0:17:43.160 --> 0:17:46.360 them both financially, And it cut out all this fighting 0:17:46.920 --> 0:17:50.639 because now she's like, if everything goes to Helen and 0:17:50.680 --> 0:17:53.160 Hadden Basket for him, that's on him, right, I don't 0:17:53.160 --> 0:17:55.639 have to worry about that. And if something happened to me, 0:17:55.680 --> 0:17:57.280 I have my little pot of money and I'm going 0:17:57.359 --> 0:17:59.240 to be safe and I'm going to be secure with it. 0:17:59.800 --> 0:18:01.320 So it works for them. 0:18:01.400 --> 0:18:01.600 Yeah. 0:18:01.680 --> 0:18:05.560 Right, and again I go back to as mad as 0:18:05.560 --> 0:18:07.439 my husband can get it. If there's still a business 0:18:07.520 --> 0:18:08.240 aspect of. 0:18:08.160 --> 0:18:10.480 This, definitely, no, not now I could. 0:18:10.520 --> 0:18:12.800 I see it completely and like it makes so much sense, 0:18:12.800 --> 0:18:15.760 and I agree. I think that whatever's going to give 0:18:16.240 --> 0:18:18.359 the other person a peace of mind and in that 0:18:18.400 --> 0:18:20.520 way they'll be able. She's now, she's like, Okay, well 0:18:20.560 --> 0:18:22.800 he has X amount of money in his little pot 0:18:23.119 --> 0:18:25.080 and I'll do He could do as he pleases, and 0:18:25.080 --> 0:18:26.960 I'm still gonna be able to love him totally. 0:18:27.480 --> 0:18:29.280 And she didn't have to be freaking out at night 0:18:29.359 --> 0:18:30.440 and roorring and. 0:18:30.680 --> 0:18:34.840 Holding resentment r Yeah. Now, A cool question in regards 0:18:34.880 --> 0:18:36.719 to it to the post up? Do you have to 0:18:36.840 --> 0:18:40.080 have a prenup in order to have a post up 0:18:40.160 --> 0:18:41.960 or con For instance, you could be married for ten 0:18:42.040 --> 0:18:43.760 years and just say you know what, I want a 0:18:43.800 --> 0:18:44.360 post up? Now? 0:18:44.359 --> 0:18:44.919 Can you do that? 0:18:45.560 --> 0:18:48.440 Yeah? Now, it takes two people to agree to it, 0:18:48.640 --> 0:18:52.000 just like a pre nup, but you can absolutely do it. 0:18:58.640 --> 0:18:58.920 Okay. 0:18:59.040 --> 0:19:01.040 Is there anything else that you think that we should 0:19:01.080 --> 0:19:02.680 talk about that we did in touch. 0:19:02.480 --> 0:19:04.360 That would be interesting for the listeners? 0:19:04.840 --> 0:19:07.239 I mean I think, look, I'm a big believer that 0:19:07.480 --> 0:19:11.720 also even before marriage, I think people should be educated 0:19:11.760 --> 0:19:13.800 about what the law is in the state that you 0:19:13.920 --> 0:19:17.399 have right. So to me, again this goes into like 0:19:17.440 --> 0:19:20.520 a marriage has so many rights and obligations and so 0:19:20.640 --> 0:19:26.040 many responsibilities, and I think before people enter into marriage, 0:19:26.040 --> 0:19:28.560 it's really important for people to at least even talk 0:19:28.600 --> 0:19:31.480 to a family lawyer and just understand like what happens 0:19:31.520 --> 0:19:34.640 in a marriage. Right. We're not taught that in school. Right. 0:19:34.680 --> 0:19:39.440 There's no books like what to expect when you're expecting, right, So, 0:19:39.440 --> 0:19:41.840 so you know, you don't have your like pediatrician that 0:19:41.840 --> 0:19:44.159 you're talking to like my baby's doing X, Y and Z, 0:19:44.359 --> 0:19:45.120 what does this mean? 0:19:45.359 --> 0:19:45.600