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Speaker 1: Good morning, sworel and welcome to the Not Dames podcast

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Speaker 1: on the Athletic Network, presented by the NBA. That's game, babe,

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Speaker 1: I'm g Skeets, rolling with my Tapshaw hop boy, Trey Kirby. Hell, hey,

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Speaker 1: we got the international man of mystery taking it to

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Speaker 1: the Max Lee Ellis friend, and finally the man making

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Speaker 1: the magic happen. It's jd Hello, there is here. We

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Speaker 1: are no task, of course, he said. If you're not

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Speaker 1: talking about cars on this one, I want nothing to

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Speaker 1: do with it. So we don't have task. That's okay. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: we're talking a little hoops here. Were getting close to

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Speaker 1: the start of the NBA season. We'll put the fast

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Speaker 1: friends and all that car talk to the side, because

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Speaker 1: you guys know, and most of our listeners and watchers know,

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Speaker 1: NBA is going to be celebrating it's seventy fifth anniversary

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Speaker 1: this upcoming season by commemorating it as NBA seventy five

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Speaker 1: and naming a list of the league's seventy five greatest players.

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Speaker 1: The NBA says a panel of media, current and former players, coaches,

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Speaker 1: general managers, team executives they're going to select the club

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Speaker 1: and it will be announced soon in our town, Okay,

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Speaker 1: and will likely be celebrated during the twenty twenty two

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Speaker 1: All Star Game in Cleveland, seeing as the Forest City

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Speaker 1: also hosted the NBA All Star Weekend in nineteen ninety

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Speaker 1: seven when the league celebrated its fiftieth anniversary season. So

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Speaker 1: when we first learned to this news, one thing, if

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Speaker 1: you guys remember, we debated was how the NBA was

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Speaker 1: going to approach this. Would they just add twenty five

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Speaker 1: new names to the existing top fifty list, or would

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Speaker 1: they just start from scratch, so to speak, and come

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Speaker 1: up with an entirely new list of seven. I remember

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Speaker 1: ustibating it a little bit, and I was like, there's

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Speaker 1: no way they're just gonna take the Top fifty list,

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Speaker 1: rip it up, and then pick like a new seventy

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Speaker 1: five with of course a lot of names that were

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Speaker 1: on the Top fifty list. But I was like, that

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Speaker 1: seems weird, But that's what they're doing. That's right by

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Speaker 1: all reports, that's what's going on. They're not just gonna

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Speaker 1: add twenty five to it. There, So people are getting

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Speaker 1: bumped from this ley, Like you know, there's gonna be

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Speaker 1: a lot of Paul Azarin fans. I don't know somebody

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Speaker 1: that where's hell.

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Speaker 2: That's the thing, Like, if you were good enough twenty

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Speaker 2: five years ago and now you're not even good enough

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Speaker 2: for the top seventy five, people are gonna be offended

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Speaker 2: by that. Yeah, because because that like you won't necessarily

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Speaker 2: be in the top seventy five at all, then maybe

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Speaker 2: some guys will be caught.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, which in this.

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Speaker 2: Twitter world, is that really what the NBA wants? I mean,

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Speaker 2: they got away with it in ninety seven because Twitter

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Speaker 2: didn't exist. Now you're gonna see people saying, Lebron Jay

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Speaker 2: what he's lost the finals six times and he's not

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Speaker 2: in the top twenty five. And then you're gonna have

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Speaker 2: people who are just gonna point out that one guy

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Speaker 2: like Al Hohlft Al Holford one of the most consistent

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Speaker 2: players of all times, he deserves to be the gonna

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Speaker 2: be a man. It's gonna be chaos. But you know

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Speaker 2: what that's great for us podcasts, isn't it. This is

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Speaker 2: what we love. This gets everyone go, we can pump

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Speaker 2: a bit ten shows out of this.

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Speaker 1: That's true. I will say I was shocked that they

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Speaker 1: went with this sort of plan, like just to rip

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Speaker 1: up the top fifty and just do a fresh seventy five.

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Speaker 1: But it actually, the more I think about it, Trey,

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Speaker 1: it actually makes a lot of sense. In the Twitter world,

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Speaker 1: with maybe a younger audience fan base, they would probably

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Speaker 1: prefer us to have us debating, you know, fifty guys

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Speaker 1: from the last twenty five years that are like sort

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Speaker 1: of on the fringe and maybe make it. Maybe don't.

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Speaker 1: Then Let's be honest, a bunch of guys from the fifties, sixties,

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Speaker 1: maybe even seventies with some of the younger audience that

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Speaker 1: nobody even really knows all that much. Like there are

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Speaker 1: some legends that people of course know, but there are

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Speaker 1: some names on the original list where you're like, even me,

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Speaker 1: a sicko is like, well, what what did he really?

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Speaker 1: Do you know? Because it was so long ago.

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Speaker 3: Oh, Dolph Shes is on the list, I don't think

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Speaker 3: so what are we supposed to do those skeets be.

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Speaker 3: Comparing Dolph Shas to Steph Curry doesn't make sense. This

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Speaker 3: is for the new generation, that original fifty Greatest Players

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Speaker 3: list that's already in the Hall of Fame. You're already

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Speaker 3: one of the fiftiest grade fifty greatest. You don't have

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Speaker 3: to send back your leather jacket. You get to keep

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Speaker 3: that thing forever. So yeah, this is one hundred percent

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Speaker 3: for the new generation, because, like you're saying, the older generation,

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Speaker 3: they had their chance to argue about this back in

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Speaker 3: nineteen ninety seven. I'm sure there were people who were

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Speaker 3: upset that Dominique Wilkins and Bob McAdoo didn't make the list.

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Speaker 3: They had their time to argue about it, and now

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Speaker 3: we're getting our chance to argue about it again.

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Speaker 1: Well, you brought up the leather jackets. Let's slip in

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Speaker 1: this question we got from at Capacorro, who's always sending

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Speaker 1: in great questions. He said, you know, you said the

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Speaker 1: jackets for the NBAS fiftieth anniversary. They made those cool

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Speaker 1: leather jackets. So which piece of clothing should the NBA

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Speaker 1: meet to commemorate the diamond anniversary? He throws out, possibly

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Speaker 1: ninja style headbands, naice velvety track suits. Once your gut

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Speaker 1: there again, that's from at Kapacorro. That's a good question.

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Speaker 1: Lead to anything come to mind here or do you

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Speaker 1: just stick with what worked? You know, the jackets were fine,

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Speaker 1: and it sucked that some of the guys had been

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Speaker 1: playing in the Star Game and a lot of the

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Speaker 1: Jackets sweating it up.

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Speaker 2: But what do you think, Yeah, well, that's it. I'm

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Speaker 2: fine with some version of a jacket, just not at

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Speaker 2: the halftime mark of a game where people are just

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Speaker 2: sweaty and they put that on and it's kind of

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Speaker 2: gross to put something so heavy and so you know,

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Speaker 2: like the moisture is just going to stick to that,

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Speaker 2: it's going to stink afterwards as well. So why don't

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Speaker 2: we just do it either on the Friday before the

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Speaker 2: All Star weekend even the Saturday night where people can

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Speaker 2: come out dressed as they choose to be, dressed in

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Speaker 2: their own style, and then they get presented kind of

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Speaker 2: like a green jacket at the Masters. Ok, your this

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Speaker 2: is your thing here and you can actually wear this

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Speaker 2: and feel that it's not going to be something it's

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Speaker 2: kind of gross to put on and then even grosser

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Speaker 2: to take off later on. So I think that's probably

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Speaker 2: where they should go, that they should stop there.

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Speaker 1: Anyway, Trey, what do you think is something coming to mind?

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Speaker 3: Well, it's the Diamond anniversary. They got to do something

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Speaker 3: with diamonds. My first thought is that it should be rings,

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Speaker 3: but I don't know, if that kind of complicates things.

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Speaker 1: With you know, championship rings.

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Speaker 3: The next logical suggestion for something diamond based would be

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Speaker 3: like an iced out chain, you know, like Adam Silver

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Speaker 3: is Jay Z or Dame Dash giving Kanye.

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Speaker 1: West the Rockefeller chain. You know, that'd be pretty cool.

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Speaker 1: Like a diamond encrusted seventy five.

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Speaker 3: I could see something along those lines, but more than

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Speaker 3: likely it's going to be something classy, like I don't know,

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Speaker 3: a blazer with that seventy five patch on it or

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Speaker 3: something like that. Cause the jackets, the leather jackets are funny,

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Speaker 3: and it's pretty funny that for twenty five years they've

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Speaker 3: been they get brought up. You know, everybody still remembers

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Speaker 3: these guys wearing leather jackets sweating it up at halftime

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Speaker 3: of the All Star Break. So my guess is that,

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Speaker 3: similar to how draft fashion has progressed to the point

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Speaker 3: where nobody's doing anything super crazy, they're probably gonna go

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Speaker 3: with something that looks nice, unfortunately for us.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, the cool thing about the Jackets was the nice

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Speaker 1: little touch of having like the color of their prominent team.

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Speaker 1: Like I guess I forget if it was sort of

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Speaker 1: on the shoulders or at least on the arms, you know,

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Speaker 1: green for Celtics guys and red for the bulls like

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Speaker 1: Jordan and stuff like that. I liked that. I hope

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Speaker 1: there is that a little bit of that where you

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Speaker 1: can like whatever this item is that they get Viet

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Speaker 1: Ninja style headbands or jackets, like there's a little distinction

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Speaker 1: between sort of like you know, maybe the franchise that

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Speaker 1: you're predominantly linked with, you know what I mean, and

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Speaker 1: JD anything else that you'd like to see.

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Speaker 4: I think they should do a retro piece of clothing

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Speaker 4: twenty five years ago. So I'm thinking, like, didn't Michael

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Speaker 4: Jordan wear like a beret at one point? So absolutely

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Speaker 4: one about berets, you know, like a nice you know

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Speaker 4: the way the green Berets wear, you know, with the

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Speaker 4: sort of you know there, it's like almost militaristic. And

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Speaker 4: they could still have the color swatch for the teams, okah,

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Speaker 4: or even a kangle hat style with the you know,

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Speaker 4: Simla style, yeah, and diamond studded or something like that.

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Speaker 4: I don't know, I'm a hat guy, So there you go.

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Speaker 1: I guess. So lots of possibilities. That's a fun question

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Speaker 1: for everybody. Let us know in the YouTube comments tweet

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Speaker 1: at us at No dunk Sinc. If you had to

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Speaker 1: switch it up from the leather jackets, what would you

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Speaker 1: like to see them do to commemorate this top seventy

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Speaker 1: five list. I would say looking back at the fifty

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Speaker 1: greatest players in NBA history again named in ninety six,

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Speaker 1: like that ninety six ninety seven season, pretty good. Like

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Speaker 1: there are some like of course old timers that we

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Speaker 1: joked about that you're like, I don't know anything about him,

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Speaker 1: but overall it's obviously littered with like legends. And then

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Speaker 1: even at the time, you know, you at eleven of

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Speaker 1: the top fifty, we're still active. And that'll be fast

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Speaker 1: to me when they do their official Top seventy five

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Speaker 1: how many active players will be a part of that group,

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Speaker 1: because it's not like just so everybody knows listening, it's

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Speaker 1: not like they're taking the top fifty, like okay, Bill

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Speaker 1: Russell and Kareem and Oscar Robertson and Jerry West and

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Speaker 1: like now there's no way they're on the top seventy five,

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Speaker 1: Like they're still in play, like they're very likely they're

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Speaker 1: going to be on both lists. And then you'll have

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Speaker 1: a bunch of new names, of course, and some might

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Speaker 1: get dropped. But of the eleven, those of the fifty

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Speaker 1: excuse me, Of the eleven that we're still active, it

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Speaker 1: was Barkley Drexler, Patrick Ewing, Michael Jordan, Karl Malone, Shaquille O'Neal,

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Speaker 1: who was just twenty four years old, by far the

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Speaker 1: youngest selection at the time. They nailed it. Stern had

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Speaker 1: a crystal ball. He saw it. He's like, we're okay

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Speaker 1: taking check on this list. A Keim Elijauan, Robert Parrish

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Speaker 1: who was forty three, he was active still somehow, Scottie Pippen,

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Speaker 1: David Robinson, and John Stockton. I mean I basically named

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Speaker 1: the dream team. Yeah, like for the most part. Later

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Speaker 1: didn't make it. Yeah, you might make it. I mean

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Speaker 1: it is impressive.

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Speaker 3: Eleven active players, and every single one that they named

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Speaker 3: ended up going to the Hall of Fame. So when

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Speaker 3: you're adding right active players to this seventy five list,

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Speaker 3: you better be pretty confident they're getting into the Hall

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Speaker 3: of Fame at the end of their career, which I

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Speaker 3: assume will be the case for all these guys you

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Speaker 3: are going to pick, though I bet there will be

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Speaker 3: some bubble boys who are interesting interesting cases for sure.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, you're spot on there, like all eleven of those

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Speaker 1: guys that I just named, like they're all gonna be

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Speaker 1: on the top seventy five list like that. I mean,

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Speaker 1: I don't know. Maybe Robert Parrish, I guess lee.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, he.

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Speaker 1: Of those eleven, I think maybe he's the most likely.

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Speaker 1: I think.

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Speaker 2: I think that he was a part of the eighty

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Speaker 2: six Celtics, which is some considered the greatest team.

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Speaker 1: He saw me.

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Speaker 2: He won a championship. He won I think at least

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Speaker 2: two there with the Celtics. I know he picked up

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Speaker 2: one with the Bulls where he was into the bench guy.

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Speaker 2: But it's gonna be tough because Chief is well respected,

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Speaker 2: he's well loved, certainly by Celtics fans. He's got those

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Speaker 2: accolades where he was an important part of again one

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Speaker 2: of the greatest teams of all time, certainly one of

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Speaker 2: the great years there in the eighties there for the Celtics.

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Speaker 2: So was he sexy enough? Was he dominant enough? I

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Speaker 2: mean probably not? But again, it's a Celtic It's a legend.

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Speaker 2: I mean, but honestly, you can make this case about

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Speaker 2: whoever is going to get cut off if they weren't.

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Speaker 2: If they were good enough in nineteen ninety seven, and

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Speaker 2: you're saying, sorry, you're just not good enough anymore, that's

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Speaker 2: just gonna be insulting.

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Speaker 1: I think I agree with you. That's why I my

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Speaker 1: god says, a lot of the guys that run the

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Speaker 1: top fifty less are gonna be still on this top

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Speaker 1: seventy five.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I can't do it. Yeah, three or four, just

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Speaker 2: don't make it because if you're slashing you know, fifteen,

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Speaker 2: it's just gonna be. But that's what we weren't. Actually

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Speaker 2: we were. We were in the NBA to just say, yeah,

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Speaker 2: I don't know what we were thinking back there.

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Speaker 1: That guy's no good anymore. You just made me realize

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Speaker 1: we should have that should have been this podcast. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: just take that top fifty less, take out our red

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Speaker 1: marker and just start editing scratching nolator. Yeah, maybe for

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Speaker 1: the future here.

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Speaker 3: Okay, so it sounds like we got a February podcast

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Speaker 3: in the bank already, Skeets.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, you're right. We got to put that in

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Speaker 1: our slack channel so we don't forget there were though.

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Speaker 1: I said they did a pretty good job, and I

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Speaker 1: truly believe that. Of course, there were some notable emissions.

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Speaker 1: I think Trey already slipped in two of them. Dominique

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Speaker 1: Wilkins and Bob McAdoo are the ones that everyone's like.

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Speaker 1: In fact, I think when you were doing like your

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Speaker 1: automatic twelve when this news first broke a couple of

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Speaker 1: months ago, Lee, you assume both those guys were on

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Speaker 1: the top fifty list, because I know we got into

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Speaker 1: that and they weren't, and that's crazy. So Nick will

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Speaker 1: be in this top seventy five. You can lock it in.

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Speaker 1: Bob McAdoo, I sort of think so too. Maybe some

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Speaker 1: other names that might be in the mix, Bob Lanier,

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Speaker 1: Adrian Dantley, Bernard King, Alex English. I'll stop there. But

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Speaker 1: the point of that is, for the sake of us

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Speaker 1: going over twenty five new absolute locks to make the

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Speaker 1: NBA's seventy five Greatest Players in History list, I'm just

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Speaker 1: gonna like take them out of the equation. Okay. I

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Speaker 1: think Nik will be there. I think at least one

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Speaker 1: of the Bobs will be there, and and maybe one

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Speaker 1: of those scores, like I said, like a King or

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Speaker 1: an English or something like that. But for again this podcast,

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Speaker 1: we're just gonna gonna take him out of consideration, and

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Speaker 1: uh yeah. And the only thing.

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Speaker 2: I'll push back on that is with Nick is he

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Speaker 2: didn't really do anything after that, you know, So if

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Speaker 2: he wasn't good enough back then, well.

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Speaker 1: But he was the most glaring mission.

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Speaker 2: I'm just I mean, I don't we don't need to

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Speaker 2: get into hey, let's make a strong counterpoint for every guy.

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Speaker 2: But I'm just saying like it wasn't though. Nick then

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Speaker 2: went on to have credit here basically at the end

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Speaker 2: of his career, and so if they didn't think he

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Speaker 2: was good enough then and when you look at that

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Speaker 2: position that he played and the guys, you know, again

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Speaker 2: without the playoff success, I agree. I think he does

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Speaker 2: make it. I think they do put Niek in. But

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Speaker 2: I'm just like, man, he's he's gonna be on the

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Speaker 2: He's gonna be one of the latest last inclusions. I think.

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Speaker 2: I don't think he walks in there, but we'll.

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Speaker 1: See trade just quickly. What do you think would you

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Speaker 1: lock it in that Nick will be on the NBA

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Speaker 1: seventy five list? I would.

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Speaker 3: The guy's got a statue here in Atlanta, and I

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Speaker 3: think that the best player for every franchise in the

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Speaker 3: NBA should have their best player on the top seventy

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Speaker 3: five list. I think that's a good place to start.

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Speaker 3: So Dominique Wilkins the greatest talk of all time. I

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Speaker 3: guess there are people that are probably making the argument

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Speaker 3: for Bob Pettitt. You know, his name shows up every

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Speaker 3: once in a while, shout out to the Yannas performance

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Speaker 3: only topped by Bob Pettitt back in the day. But

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Speaker 3: I think Dominique Wilkins will one hundred percent be in.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I think so too. But again, we'll take him

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Speaker 1: out of the out of the mix here and we

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Speaker 1: get into these twenty five locks that I'm going to

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Speaker 1: present to you guys, and we'll debate them, and of course,

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Speaker 1: you know, we're gonna get to snubs. And I actually

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Speaker 1: did it like this.

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Speaker 2: Oh there's so what about a random what about this

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Speaker 2: guy that could be a whole punchcast itself?

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Speaker 1: Will name every guy that's next seventy five. Ye, we're

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Speaker 1: not doing the entire seventy five at least on this one.

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Speaker 1: I think that's just a little too much. So we

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Speaker 1: are going to do just twenty five absolute locks that'll

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Speaker 1: be in there. And I broke it into four distinct categories. Okay,

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Speaker 1: I went with guys that are retired that are locks

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Speaker 1: to make it. Okay, I got ten of them. I

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Speaker 1: then went with ten active players that I think are

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Speaker 1: locks to make it. And then I have a final five,

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Speaker 1: which I just call my final five selections that are

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Speaker 1: it's sort of like a little mix of retired and

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Speaker 1: maybe possibly still active players. And then the fourth category,

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Speaker 1: it's gonna be those juicy snubs that we can all

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Speaker 1: break down because there are. I mean, I sort of

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Speaker 1: had I'll say this before I go through my list

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Speaker 1: the first nineteen twenty guys. I was like, Okay, this

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Speaker 1: isn't that hard. And then you just get into the

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Speaker 1: final five spots, at least for this podcast, where it's like, wow,

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Speaker 1: five spots for you could convince me of twenty five guys,

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Speaker 1: and it's like, oh, who do you like more or

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Speaker 1: what's your case to make? And we'll get to that.

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Speaker 1: So let's go with the retired locks. I sort of

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Speaker 1: put them in order of like you know, stamp of approval.

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Speaker 1: But again, I got all ten of these guys, making

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Speaker 1: it so you don't have to go overboard about where

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Speaker 1: I have your particular favorite player my first lock. Retired

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Speaker 1: guy Tim Duncan Okay. Hall of Famer, two times MVP,

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Speaker 1: fifteen time All NBA and All Star and All Defensive,

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Speaker 1: five time champ and three time Finals MVP. I had

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Speaker 1: a lot of fun, of course, going through Basketball Reference,

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Speaker 1: oh yeah, and just looking at those accolades and even

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Speaker 1: you guys like Trey like going like fifteen, fifteen, fifty,

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Speaker 1: that's crazy. That's crazy. I mean, maybe it's even crazier

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Speaker 1: that he never won a Defensive Player of the Year

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Speaker 1: despite being on the All Defensive team fifteen times. It's

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Speaker 1: crazy anyway, that is did you I gotta know those

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Speaker 1: skeets when you were looking at this, were you taking

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Speaker 1: note of how many of these selections were FIRSTBA did

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Speaker 1: not tray, because no one does that. I'm convinced though

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Speaker 1: I actually did it for sure. It was like that's

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Speaker 1: too much. That's where I gotta scroll on basket at

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Speaker 1: the bottom, man, I know, like that's my that was

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Speaker 1: my whole point, though they don't even care enough to

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Speaker 1: put it right there at the top. Okay number two

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Speaker 1: retired Locke the late great Kobe Bryant, Hall of Famer,

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Speaker 1: one MVP, fifteen time All NBA, is well, eighteen time

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Speaker 1: All Star, twelve time All Defensive Team, five time champ,

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Speaker 1: two time finals MVP. Kobe in no brainer. Third, another

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Speaker 1: big guy, Kevin Garnett, Hall of Famer MVP, nine time

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Speaker 1: All NBA, fifteen time All Star, twelve time All Defensive

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Speaker 1: won a Defensive Player of the Year, and of course

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Speaker 1: he got his one championship there with the Celtics. Stick

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Speaker 1: with the big guys. International big guy Dirt Novitzky is

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Speaker 1: a no brainer MVP twelve time All NBA, fourteen time

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Speaker 1: All All Star, got the championship and he was Finals MVP.

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Speaker 1: He's in. Okay, those were like you know, of course

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Speaker 1: these are as well, but maybe like the tiniest tier

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Speaker 1: down if you want to call it that. Dwayne Wade

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Speaker 1: is in. Eight time All NBA, thirteen time All Star,

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Speaker 1: three time All Defensive Team, three time champ, and one

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Speaker 1: finals m v P t K. I'll keep going here.

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Speaker 1: But you scoffed a little bit. He's in my top tier.

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Speaker 1: That's it. I got concerned. You were like that.

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Speaker 3: You didn't even have no, no, no, I've got Wade

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Speaker 3: ahead of Garnett and Dirk.

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Speaker 1: Personally, But yeah, I think he is an easy easy.

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Speaker 2: Lock, I will, I will just cited that you guys

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Speaker 2: are sort of saying anyway they are not putting them in.

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Speaker 2: No no, there's no no no.

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Speaker 1: But generally it'll be it'll be alphabetical, is what I

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Speaker 1: think they did.

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Speaker 3: Oh that's bad for Wade. Then he's going to be

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Speaker 3: one of the last guys right at the end, near

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Speaker 3: the end. I had a dominique though. That's true, that's true.

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Speaker 1: Okay, number six, we actually got a run of guards here.

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Speaker 1: I got Steve Nash as a retired Lock Hall of Famer,

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Speaker 1: two time MVP, seven time All NBA, eight time All Star,

385
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Speaker 1: greatest Canadian player ever. I think that counts for something in.

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Speaker 2: This It's not the Canadian National Hall of Times.

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Speaker 1: So Nash is in. Okay, no complaints there, Alan Iverson

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Speaker 1: he's also in. He's a retired Lock Hall of Famer.

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Speaker 1: He got one MVP, seven time All NBA, eleven time

390
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Speaker 1: All Star. Career average. Guess who was Allen Everson's career

391
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Speaker 1: average points.

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Speaker 3: Per game twenty four and a hunh, I'll go twenty

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Speaker 3: one and a half.

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Speaker 1: I was with you, guys. I thought it was round.

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Speaker 1: I'll be honest. What Lee said basically twenty seven points

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Speaker 1: per game. Incredible.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I would have just guessed that the end of

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Speaker 3: his career would have dragged it down a little bit,

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Speaker 3: But I guess the first two thirds of it were

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Speaker 3: so impressive that, yeah, the number stays high.

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Speaker 1: That's good. Guy is in number eight on my retired

402
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Speaker 1: locks list. Gary Payton, who I remember. There was the

403
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Speaker 1: tiniest bit of noise for him way back in ninety

404
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Speaker 1: six ninety seven, but that was like, you know, not

405
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Speaker 1: that he went out to play another Well, I guess

406
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Speaker 1: he did play another ten yearly decade. Yeah, so you know,

407
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Speaker 1: helped pad some stats and had some success, won a

408
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Speaker 1: championship too, you know, sort of, you know, with the

409
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Speaker 1: Miami Heat. Not that he was like a key contributor.

410
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Speaker 1: But I have Gary Payton in this in this bunch,

411
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Speaker 1: he's in the Hall of Fame. He's the nine to

412
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Speaker 1: nine to nine guy. I love this. He's the guy

413
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Speaker 1: that can go to a baseball game, eat nine hot dogs,

414
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Speaker 1: drink nine beers, and nine innings because he's a nine

415
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Speaker 1: time All NBA guy, nine time All Star, nine time

416
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Speaker 1: All Defensive Player, won a Defensive Player of the Year,

417
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Speaker 1: All Defensive Team. I should say with those nine selections

418
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Speaker 1: won DPOI and I said, there, he's a champion. So

419
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Speaker 1: I got a man lead. No no qualms with that, right, No.

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Speaker 2: When I did a back a couple of months ago,

421
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Speaker 2: I put him sort of up against Tracy McGrady because

422
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Speaker 2: you know, I think someone like and McGrady was maybe

423
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Speaker 2: more explosive in terms of scoring the ball, but Gary

424
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Speaker 2: Payton on both ends of the ball, particularly that DPO

425
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Speaker 2: WI Award where no non bigs were winning it back then,

426
00:21:11,000 --> 00:21:14,760
Speaker 2: really stands out. But yeah, Gary Payton very consistent player

427
00:21:14,760 --> 00:21:17,800
Speaker 2: as well. Basically from his second season until he retired,

428
00:21:17,840 --> 00:21:19,280
Speaker 2: you just knew what you were getting out of him.

429
00:21:19,320 --> 00:21:22,520
Speaker 2: So yeah, I think he's I think he is a lock,

430
00:21:22,600 --> 00:21:24,680
Speaker 2: and I think he did one the vote off against

431
00:21:24,720 --> 00:21:25,439
Speaker 2: Tracy McGrady.

432
00:21:25,560 --> 00:21:27,479
Speaker 1: He did that we put out there.

433
00:21:27,480 --> 00:21:29,680
Speaker 2: It was close, but you know, because again a lot

434
00:21:29,680 --> 00:21:31,520
Speaker 2: of this stuff comes down to do you look, you know,

435
00:21:31,560 --> 00:21:35,520
Speaker 2: statistically and give more weight to accolades or do you say, well,

436
00:21:35,560 --> 00:21:39,240
Speaker 2: for three or four years, maybe McGrady had a higher ceiling,

437
00:21:39,280 --> 00:21:42,520
Speaker 2: a higher peak than Gary Payton, but it was less sustained,

438
00:21:42,520 --> 00:21:44,960
Speaker 2: I mean, and again that comes down to, man, I

439
00:21:45,000 --> 00:21:47,359
Speaker 2: love Tracy McGrady more than I love Gary Payton. You know,

440
00:21:47,359 --> 00:21:50,520
Speaker 2: Tracy McGrady could score better than Gary Payton MC. Gary

441
00:21:50,520 --> 00:21:52,760
Speaker 2: Payton's a better DEFENSI player, So those sort of factors

442
00:21:52,760 --> 00:21:55,679
Speaker 2: come into it. But ultimately, I think Gary Payton is

443
00:21:55,680 --> 00:21:58,040
Speaker 2: in and I'll be shocked if he doesn't make it

444
00:21:58,880 --> 00:21:59,680
Speaker 2: to this new list.

445
00:22:00,200 --> 00:22:02,600
Speaker 3: Gary Payton was a bubble boy for me. Uh, this

446
00:22:02,760 --> 00:22:06,280
Speaker 3: is my first difference with the skit. You know, for me,

447
00:22:06,440 --> 00:22:10,320
Speaker 3: he was a possible last fiver in. But I've got

448
00:22:10,320 --> 00:22:12,600
Speaker 3: Gary Payton and Tracy McGrady coming up.

449
00:22:12,560 --> 00:22:17,439
Speaker 1: A little short on my personal twenty five. Okay, fair enough. Well,

450
00:22:17,560 --> 00:22:20,040
Speaker 1: I will say I just like have a lump in

451
00:22:20,119 --> 00:22:23,560
Speaker 1: my throat because I realized while you were talking there

452
00:22:23,600 --> 00:22:26,000
Speaker 1: lately about Gary Payton and bringing up McGrady, and I

453
00:22:26,040 --> 00:22:29,760
Speaker 1: was thinking of other scores that I'm like, oh, where

454
00:22:29,760 --> 00:22:33,240
Speaker 1: did I put Mellow? Where's Mellow? I'm searching for Mellow,

455
00:22:33,280 --> 00:22:35,800
Speaker 1: and I'm like, hold on, did I forget he's still

456
00:22:35,840 --> 00:22:38,159
Speaker 1: an active player? Yeah, And I'm like, go into my

457
00:22:38,240 --> 00:22:40,600
Speaker 1: active list, hold on, I have him in my final five. Anyway,

458
00:22:40,640 --> 00:22:42,560
Speaker 1: let's we'll tackle Mellow. When we get to Mellow, I'll

459
00:22:42,600 --> 00:22:43,680
Speaker 1: just continue to what I have.

460
00:22:43,920 --> 00:22:44,120
Speaker 2: Yeah.

461
00:22:44,240 --> 00:22:47,280
Speaker 1: Uh, I'm already sweating here because there's nothing more I

462
00:22:47,280 --> 00:22:52,800
Speaker 1: hate than like just forgetting somebody. Yeah, I got two

463
00:22:52,840 --> 00:22:57,359
Speaker 1: more retired locks, and Mellow's not retired, so he's still playing.

464
00:22:57,960 --> 00:23:01,520
Speaker 1: Paul Pierce. I I hate Paul Pierce. I'll just say

465
00:23:01,800 --> 00:23:03,880
Speaker 1: I'm not a fan of his, never have been, never

466
00:23:03,920 --> 00:23:06,840
Speaker 1: will be. But he's on my list. He's in. He's

467
00:23:06,880 --> 00:23:09,439
Speaker 1: going to make the NBA seventy five Hall of Famer,

468
00:23:09,560 --> 00:23:11,920
Speaker 1: four time All NBA, ten time All Star, won a

469
00:23:12,000 --> 00:23:15,480
Speaker 1: champion we all know, and was Finals MVP with the Celtics.

470
00:23:16,640 --> 00:23:19,400
Speaker 1: I don't I can't even make the case that he's

471
00:23:19,440 --> 00:23:22,680
Speaker 1: not a lock as I'm calling him to get in here. Yeah.

472
00:23:22,760 --> 00:23:24,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, maybe he's the only one who gets booed when

473
00:23:24,960 --> 00:23:29,520
Speaker 2: he goes up, because it is pretty universal that, you know,

474
00:23:29,640 --> 00:23:31,040
Speaker 2: not a lot of people like him.

475
00:23:31,080 --> 00:23:32,399
Speaker 1: Inside of Celtics fans.

476
00:23:32,480 --> 00:23:36,120
Speaker 2: Well yeah, even the Celtics fans because he bounced around

477
00:23:36,119 --> 00:23:37,560
Speaker 2: a little bit towards the end, and he was he's

478
00:23:37,600 --> 00:23:40,639
Speaker 2: an LA guy. He's from California. So I remember talking

479
00:23:40,680 --> 00:23:43,640
Speaker 2: to a very very big Celtics fan. He said even

480
00:23:43,720 --> 00:23:46,520
Speaker 2: in Boston, like they sort of there was that mutual

481
00:23:46,560 --> 00:23:48,760
Speaker 2: respect for each other, but he was not adored, he

482
00:23:48,800 --> 00:23:53,400
Speaker 2: wasn't absolutely loved by Celtics fans, but he does get

483
00:23:53,400 --> 00:23:54,919
Speaker 2: in there, and I think he does actually hold the

484
00:23:54,920 --> 00:23:57,879
Speaker 2: Celtics scoring record. I think he overtook Larry Bird if

485
00:23:57,920 --> 00:24:00,119
Speaker 2: I remember correctly. So he's, you know, to lead the

486
00:24:00,200 --> 00:24:03,720
Speaker 2: Celtics in scoring all time. That's a pretty big achievement.

487
00:24:04,000 --> 00:24:06,879
Speaker 2: And yeah, he got the Old Star selection. He was clutch.

488
00:24:06,920 --> 00:24:08,840
Speaker 2: You gotta give him credit as well. He was clutching

489
00:24:08,880 --> 00:24:12,760
Speaker 2: the playoffs, but the finals. In the finals, MVP pretty

490
00:24:12,840 --> 00:24:13,840
Speaker 2: much cemits his spot.

491
00:24:14,200 --> 00:24:17,360
Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm like you, Skeets. I was like, not Paul Pierce, Man,

492
00:24:17,480 --> 00:24:19,959
Speaker 3: not Paul Pierce. But then I saw that ten times

493
00:24:20,080 --> 00:24:23,600
Speaker 3: All Star and like, oh, that's basically a lock. Twenty

494
00:24:23,640 --> 00:24:26,280
Speaker 3: seven of the first fifty that went in were ten

495
00:24:26,320 --> 00:24:30,960
Speaker 3: time All Stars. Every ten time All Star is in

496
00:24:30,960 --> 00:24:33,200
Speaker 3: in NBA history. Every ten time All Star was either

497
00:24:33,280 --> 00:24:36,200
Speaker 3: on the list or is going to be on this

498
00:24:36,320 --> 00:24:39,000
Speaker 3: list for the seventy five Greatest. Another guy who is

499
00:24:39,040 --> 00:24:41,040
Speaker 3: going to come up who I don't know. I think

500
00:24:41,040 --> 00:24:42,639
Speaker 3: he's going to be a debate. Chris Bosh has a

501
00:24:42,800 --> 00:24:45,560
Speaker 3: ten All Star appearances as well. But Chris Bosh and

502
00:24:45,560 --> 00:24:48,240
Speaker 3: Paul Pierce were two that stuck out to me, Like, whoa, Yeah,

503
00:24:48,240 --> 00:24:50,159
Speaker 3: if you're a ten time All Star All Star, if

504
00:24:50,160 --> 00:24:52,119
Speaker 3: you're one of the biggest names in the sport and

505
00:24:52,160 --> 00:24:53,560
Speaker 3: one of the best players in the sport for an

506
00:24:53,680 --> 00:24:57,400
Speaker 3: entire decade, and you got titles and accolades, it's hard

507
00:24:57,440 --> 00:24:58,000
Speaker 3: to keep you out.

508
00:24:58,040 --> 00:25:02,680
Speaker 1: So yeah, Paul Pierce, I mean, yeah, well I'll see

509
00:25:02,680 --> 00:25:05,840
Speaker 1: it now. Spoiler, I don't have Bosh in this twenty five.

510
00:25:06,080 --> 00:25:07,639
Speaker 1: I think he might. He might be one of the

511
00:25:07,640 --> 00:25:10,560
Speaker 1: biggest snubs in the game. Yeah, this time around. The

512
00:25:10,640 --> 00:25:13,000
Speaker 1: weird thing with Blash. I think we've brought it up before. Well,

513
00:25:13,040 --> 00:25:15,240
Speaker 1: weird thing. You know, we're talking All Star selections. He's

514
00:25:15,240 --> 00:25:18,000
Speaker 1: got ten. TK said it, he's only got one All

515
00:25:18,160 --> 00:25:21,119
Speaker 1: NBA selection in his career, which is so weird that

516
00:25:21,200 --> 00:25:24,840
Speaker 1: he doesn't have like two or three. Yeah, it's just

517
00:25:25,200 --> 00:25:27,679
Speaker 1: that part's just on. But oh, look, titles.

518
00:25:27,960 --> 00:25:29,880
Speaker 2: I don't think it's offensive though, to say that Chris

519
00:25:29,880 --> 00:25:32,320
Speaker 2: Bosh isn't one of the top seventy five of all time.

520
00:25:32,400 --> 00:25:34,560
Speaker 2: We know he was a very very good player, an

521
00:25:34,560 --> 00:25:37,560
Speaker 2: excellent player, and he played his role fantastically well in Miami.

522
00:25:37,680 --> 00:25:41,199
Speaker 2: But I just don't think anything sort of prior to that,

523
00:25:41,240 --> 00:25:44,160
Speaker 2: certainly with the Raptors would have put him elevated him

524
00:25:44,600 --> 00:25:46,800
Speaker 2: into that league. I just don't think he was quite

525
00:25:46,880 --> 00:25:48,680
Speaker 2: that good. If you were maybe one hundred, one hundred

526
00:25:48,680 --> 00:25:50,439
Speaker 2: and twenty five. I think Chris Bosh is somewhere in

527
00:25:50,480 --> 00:25:53,800
Speaker 2: that mix. But I think people who follow the game

528
00:25:53,920 --> 00:25:57,800
Speaker 2: like us, you respect what Chris Bosh did, but don't

529
00:25:57,840 --> 00:25:59,640
Speaker 2: quite think he's top seventy five material.

530
00:25:59,680 --> 00:26:03,320
Speaker 1: For me. Yeah, well, okay, then my final retired lock here,

531
00:26:03,640 --> 00:26:07,320
Speaker 1: of course, is where it's like, uh eh, yeah, maybe

532
00:26:07,600 --> 00:26:11,360
Speaker 1: I went with Jason Kidd, Hall of Famer, six time

533
00:26:11,359 --> 00:26:14,359
Speaker 1: All NBA. He's got that mark that you wanted. TK.

534
00:26:14,480 --> 00:26:16,480
Speaker 1: He's a ten time All Star, he's a nine time

535
00:26:16,520 --> 00:26:19,440
Speaker 1: All Defensive Team Player two, and he got the championship

536
00:26:20,040 --> 00:26:23,200
Speaker 1: with Dirk Novisky and the Mavericks when he went back

537
00:26:23,680 --> 00:26:26,800
Speaker 1: to Dallas. TK, you know, did you have him in

538
00:26:26,840 --> 00:26:28,720
Speaker 1: the mix? He's a no brainer to you. What do

539
00:26:28,760 --> 00:26:29,520
Speaker 1: you think lock for me?

540
00:26:29,840 --> 00:26:33,200
Speaker 3: Ten time All Star, had an argument as the best

541
00:26:33,200 --> 00:26:35,760
Speaker 3: point guard in the game for a decade and kind

542
00:26:35,760 --> 00:26:39,240
Speaker 3: of a transformational player to playing fast. I mean, probably

543
00:26:39,280 --> 00:26:41,280
Speaker 3: the knock on Jason Kidd is that he bounced around

544
00:26:41,320 --> 00:26:42,840
Speaker 3: to a lot of teams, you know, but he had

545
00:26:42,880 --> 00:26:44,840
Speaker 3: success at every single one of those teams, and every

546
00:26:44,840 --> 00:26:47,520
Speaker 3: single one of those teams became Jason Kidd's team, and

547
00:26:47,560 --> 00:26:50,080
Speaker 3: he took a lot of those franchises to heights they

548
00:26:50,080 --> 00:26:51,960
Speaker 3: had never been to before, Like the Nets had number

549
00:26:52,000 --> 00:26:54,359
Speaker 3: gone to the finals. Yeah, until Jason Kid shows up

550
00:26:54,400 --> 00:26:56,160
Speaker 3: and they go back to back years. Obviously they didn't

551
00:26:56,160 --> 00:26:57,879
Speaker 3: do anything because they were going up against the Lakers,

552
00:26:57,880 --> 00:26:58,520
Speaker 3: but yeah.

553
00:26:58,520 --> 00:27:01,679
Speaker 1: Kid was a lock for me. Yeah, it's very I mean,

554
00:27:01,760 --> 00:27:03,919
Speaker 1: he really is comparable to like a Chris Poll in

555
00:27:03,920 --> 00:27:06,879
Speaker 1: that sense where just the impact that said that he

556
00:27:06,920 --> 00:27:09,680
Speaker 1: has on franchises and to take them to at least

557
00:27:09,760 --> 00:27:12,280
Speaker 1: higher heights, and he got the title. You know, he

558
00:27:12,320 --> 00:27:14,159
Speaker 1: wasn't the mean guy because of that. Of course that

559
00:27:14,280 --> 00:27:16,960
Speaker 1: was Direk, but he of course contributed, so yeah, you

560
00:27:17,000 --> 00:27:17,960
Speaker 1: have him in Yeah.

561
00:27:17,800 --> 00:27:20,720
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean the rebounding point guard. Of course, he

562
00:27:20,760 --> 00:27:22,360
Speaker 2: wasn't a great shooter of the ball, but he did

563
00:27:22,359 --> 00:27:24,879
Speaker 2: contribute in so many other ways and was so impactful

564
00:27:24,960 --> 00:27:27,359
Speaker 2: for those NETS teams that Trey Mention's got to the finals.

565
00:27:27,359 --> 00:27:30,199
Speaker 2: There the defense as well, and everywhere he went he

566
00:27:30,240 --> 00:27:32,439
Speaker 2: did automatically if Jason Kidd was on the team, it

567
00:27:32,480 --> 00:27:34,560
Speaker 2: was like, yeah, the team's better now with having him

568
00:27:34,560 --> 00:27:36,680
Speaker 2: on there. So, you know, a little bit of controversy

569
00:27:36,680 --> 00:27:39,879
Speaker 2: obviously followed his career. I wonder how much of that

570
00:27:39,920 --> 00:27:41,600
Speaker 2: will plan to it, not just off the court, but

571
00:27:41,640 --> 00:27:45,080
Speaker 2: on the court as well. But you know, ultimately he

572
00:27:45,160 --> 00:27:47,560
Speaker 2: has the accolades that should get him in there. And again,

573
00:27:47,640 --> 00:27:50,280
Speaker 2: that championship is almost like the deciding vot It's like, yeah,

574
00:27:50,280 --> 00:27:53,280
Speaker 2: he did get that as well. He just got helps.

575
00:27:52,640 --> 00:27:55,879
Speaker 2: It does and especially when it's not like he was

576
00:27:55,880 --> 00:27:57,800
Speaker 2: like just at the end of the bench or anything.

577
00:27:57,840 --> 00:27:59,720
Speaker 2: I mean, he was the starting point guard on that team.

578
00:27:59,760 --> 00:28:02,480
Speaker 2: So yeah, he's gonna get in and I'll be very

579
00:28:02,520 --> 00:28:03,760
Speaker 2: surprised if he doesn't make it.

580
00:28:04,040 --> 00:28:06,680
Speaker 1: Okay, let's get to the Act of Locks. This is

581
00:28:06,680 --> 00:28:09,280
Speaker 1: where it's really fun. I made it ten just because

582
00:28:10,720 --> 00:28:13,920
Speaker 1: maybe a little more debate, no debate with the first couple.

583
00:28:14,160 --> 00:28:18,960
Speaker 1: Lebron James is obviously on this celest these four time MVP,

584
00:28:19,400 --> 00:28:23,520
Speaker 1: seventeen time All NBA, seventeen time All Star. He's still playing.

585
00:28:23,560 --> 00:28:26,000
Speaker 1: He'll probably get a couple more of those. Six time

586
00:28:26,080 --> 00:28:28,879
Speaker 1: All Defensive Team never won a DP. A lie or

587
00:28:29,080 --> 00:28:32,080
Speaker 1: pissed him off. Four time champion and he's got four

588
00:28:32,160 --> 00:28:36,040
Speaker 1: finals MVP. Okay lebron in right behind him, right there

589
00:28:36,040 --> 00:28:40,440
Speaker 1: with him, Kevin Durant one MVP, nine time All NBA,

590
00:28:40,560 --> 00:28:43,800
Speaker 1: eleven time All Star. He's got the two titles, both

591
00:28:43,840 --> 00:28:48,200
Speaker 1: time finals MVP with the Warriors. And what's crazy with

592
00:28:48,240 --> 00:28:50,760
Speaker 1: these guys is they're not done. I mean not done

593
00:28:50,800 --> 00:28:54,120
Speaker 1: in the sense of like all NBA selections, all Star selections,

594
00:28:54,800 --> 00:28:58,560
Speaker 1: and then championships, impossible finals MVP with some of these guys.

595
00:28:59,160 --> 00:29:01,720
Speaker 3: Number three, crazy thing I think about Durant is that

596
00:29:01,800 --> 00:29:04,640
Speaker 3: he's been so good for so long that you forget

597
00:29:04,680 --> 00:29:07,560
Speaker 3: he won the scoring title four years in a row,

598
00:29:07,680 --> 00:29:10,880
Speaker 3: and like he was the youngest scoring title guy ever

599
00:29:11,040 --> 00:29:13,080
Speaker 3: for his first one, right, and he stacked him up

600
00:29:13,360 --> 00:29:15,520
Speaker 3: and then he kept getting better. But uh yeah, I

601
00:29:15,520 --> 00:29:18,320
Speaker 3: mean that at that point, at this point, that feels

602
00:29:18,360 --> 00:29:20,959
Speaker 3: so long ago now, remembering him being the best scorer

603
00:29:20,960 --> 00:29:22,960
Speaker 3: in the league on the Thunder. And obviously he's gone

604
00:29:22,960 --> 00:29:25,280
Speaker 3: to teams that are a lot better now and he's

605
00:29:25,320 --> 00:29:27,720
Speaker 3: more of a team player and he at least plays

606
00:29:27,720 --> 00:29:29,800
Speaker 3: in the team concept rather than knowing he has to

607
00:29:29,800 --> 00:29:32,400
Speaker 3: score forty every single night. But man, when it was

608
00:29:32,520 --> 00:29:35,360
Speaker 3: Katie just scoring all the time, You're like, this guy's

609
00:29:35,360 --> 00:29:36,920
Speaker 3: going to be one of the seventy five greatest.

610
00:29:36,920 --> 00:29:39,959
Speaker 1: That's yeah, and look he is. He's got the titles.

611
00:29:41,720 --> 00:29:44,480
Speaker 2: Anythink that well, only that he almost pulled off the

612
00:29:44,560 --> 00:29:47,240
Speaker 2: MVP as well this season if it wasn't for coronavirus.

613
00:29:47,280 --> 00:29:50,240
Speaker 2: And he did pick up what that hamstring injury as well,

614
00:29:50,280 --> 00:29:52,120
Speaker 2: so he missed some time. But when he was playing,

615
00:29:52,160 --> 00:29:54,400
Speaker 2: when he was on the court for the Nets, particularly early,

616
00:29:55,200 --> 00:29:57,719
Speaker 2: I mean, he was top three in the MVP candidacy

617
00:29:57,800 --> 00:29:59,840
Speaker 2: there for a while. So and that's the thing coming

618
00:29:59,880 --> 00:30:02,840
Speaker 2: on off the Achilles injury, Kevin Durant had just an

619
00:30:02,920 --> 00:30:05,960
Speaker 2: incredible season the last season there with the Nets. So

620
00:30:06,040 --> 00:30:08,640
Speaker 2: now that he's had he's played the Olympics for the USA,

621
00:30:08,720 --> 00:30:12,120
Speaker 2: he's probably gonna have a full training camp. So next season,

622
00:30:12,160 --> 00:30:15,280
Speaker 2: Kevin Durant, I mean he probably is in the at

623
00:30:15,520 --> 00:30:19,160
Speaker 2: worst top five for MVP voting full the season starts.

624
00:30:19,400 --> 00:30:22,720
Speaker 1: Yeah, probably number three on the active locks list. Here

625
00:30:22,840 --> 00:30:26,360
Speaker 1: Steph Curry, two time MVP, seven time All NBA, seven

626
00:30:26,360 --> 00:30:30,320
Speaker 1: time All Star, three time champion, doesn't have that finals

627
00:30:30,400 --> 00:30:33,240
Speaker 1: MVP points out but probably should have had the one

628
00:30:33,480 --> 00:30:35,880
Speaker 1: greatest shooter ever, though, is going to be on the

629
00:30:36,040 --> 00:30:38,880
Speaker 1: NBA's list of seventy five greatest players ever. You know,

630
00:30:38,960 --> 00:30:41,200
Speaker 1: when you're the greatest shooter in a sport where shooting's

631
00:30:41,200 --> 00:30:43,360
Speaker 1: pretty damn important, yeah, you're going to be in. So

632
00:30:43,640 --> 00:30:46,440
Speaker 1: he's a lock. Number four, Chris Paul already brought up

633
00:30:46,440 --> 00:30:50,720
Speaker 1: his name. No brainer, ten time All NBA, eleven time

634
00:30:50,760 --> 00:30:54,200
Speaker 1: All Star, nine time on the All Defensive Team. He's

635
00:30:54,240 --> 00:30:57,000
Speaker 1: got a career per of twenty four point nine despite

636
00:30:57,000 --> 00:31:01,040
Speaker 1: being you know, all a six feet here, and yeah, look,

637
00:31:01,160 --> 00:31:03,440
Speaker 1: he's one of the five or six greatest point guards

638
00:31:03,480 --> 00:31:06,360
Speaker 1: of all time. I would think pretty easily without having

639
00:31:06,400 --> 00:31:08,160
Speaker 1: a title. Even he got through the finals there with

640
00:31:08,240 --> 00:31:10,960
Speaker 1: the Suns, but might come up shorten that, But I

641
00:31:10,960 --> 00:31:13,680
Speaker 1: don't think that's enough to hold a guy like that

642
00:31:13,800 --> 00:31:15,480
Speaker 1: off NBA seventy five.

643
00:31:15,560 --> 00:31:18,240
Speaker 2: Leely luck him in. Chris Paul is an absolute certenter.

644
00:31:18,280 --> 00:31:21,240
Speaker 2: You're right, you can debate who is the sort of

645
00:31:21,240 --> 00:31:23,560
Speaker 2: top five to seven point guards, but Chris Paul has

646
00:31:23,680 --> 00:31:26,520
Speaker 2: got to be on anybody's list there, so he is

647
00:31:26,560 --> 00:31:29,840
Speaker 2: an absolute lock. And yeah, we talked just said before

648
00:31:29,880 --> 00:31:32,480
Speaker 2: a championship sort of symentry but in this case, Chris

649
00:31:32,520 --> 00:31:35,000
Speaker 2: Paul has done enough. He's got so many accolades there

650
00:31:35,200 --> 00:31:37,640
Speaker 2: that he's going to get in regardless of you know,

651
00:31:37,680 --> 00:31:39,440
Speaker 2: this is his first trip to the finals. Of course,

652
00:31:39,640 --> 00:31:40,960
Speaker 2: in the last season he's.

653
00:31:40,800 --> 00:31:45,680
Speaker 1: In at number five, going a little more younger, Ye honest,

654
00:31:46,480 --> 00:31:49,160
Speaker 1: he is now for sure. I think he probably would

655
00:31:49,160 --> 00:31:51,280
Speaker 1: have been without the title. But he you can just

656
00:31:52,200 --> 00:31:54,360
Speaker 1: like put it in ink that he's on the list,

657
00:31:54,760 --> 00:31:57,520
Speaker 1: two time MVP, five time All NBA, he's a five

658
00:31:57,560 --> 00:32:00,480
Speaker 1: time All Star, four time All Defensive Team's got Defensive

659
00:32:00,480 --> 00:32:02,400
Speaker 1: Player of the Year, he won Most Improved too, and

660
00:32:02,440 --> 00:32:05,480
Speaker 1: he's a champion a Finals MVP coming off of that.

661
00:32:06,120 --> 00:32:09,040
Speaker 1: He's one of only three players in NBA history to

662
00:32:09,080 --> 00:32:12,480
Speaker 1: win MVP and DPOY in the same season. That's Jordan

663
00:32:12,560 --> 00:32:16,880
Speaker 1: and Akeem. And now, be honest, yeah, he's I mean,

664
00:32:17,200 --> 00:32:19,400
Speaker 1: I guess he's a little older than Shaq was when

665
00:32:19,440 --> 00:32:22,240
Speaker 1: he made the Top fifty, but we've it's sort of

666
00:32:22,280 --> 00:32:26,400
Speaker 1: comparable and even more accolades and a title that Shaq

667
00:32:26,480 --> 00:32:28,040
Speaker 1: didn't have when he was with the Magic when he

668
00:32:28,080 --> 00:32:31,040
Speaker 1: was on Top fifty. So there's there's no possible way

669
00:32:31,080 --> 00:32:32,240
Speaker 1: he's not on this right TK.

670
00:32:32,640 --> 00:32:35,320
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think he was, like you're saying, likely a

671
00:32:35,400 --> 00:32:38,720
Speaker 3: lock before the Bucks won the championship in twenty one,

672
00:32:39,560 --> 00:32:42,960
Speaker 3: but now having the championship, having a fifty point closeout

673
00:32:43,000 --> 00:32:46,480
Speaker 3: game in the finals, like stamp him in that night, right,

674
00:32:46,480 --> 00:32:50,080
Speaker 3: They're like, Okay, yeah, here's your letter. See in February

675
00:32:50,120 --> 00:32:51,840
Speaker 3: at Cleveland. You're getting a jacket bud.

676
00:32:52,520 --> 00:32:54,880
Speaker 1: All right, now it gets a little more interesting with

677
00:32:54,920 --> 00:33:00,280
Speaker 1: these active players. I have Kawhi Leonard as as lock,

678
00:33:00,360 --> 00:33:03,160
Speaker 1: an active lock to make this list. Five time All NBA,

679
00:33:03,280 --> 00:33:06,520
Speaker 1: five time All Star, seven time All Defensive Team honors,

680
00:33:07,000 --> 00:33:10,440
Speaker 1: he won Defensive Player Year twice, and he's a two

681
00:33:10,440 --> 00:33:14,080
Speaker 1: time champ, one of them a Finals MVP. Excuse me,

682
00:33:14,200 --> 00:33:16,040
Speaker 1: both of the Finals MVP when he was with the

683
00:33:16,080 --> 00:33:18,880
Speaker 1: Spurs doing a great job on Lebron young Kawi was

684
00:33:18,920 --> 00:33:20,920
Speaker 1: and then of course with the Toronto Raptors and what

685
00:33:21,000 --> 00:33:23,280
Speaker 1: he did for that franchise. I mean, he's one of

686
00:33:23,320 --> 00:33:26,440
Speaker 1: the best two way players to ever play. I guess

687
00:33:26,480 --> 00:33:28,680
Speaker 1: the one knock is that he just hasn't appeared in

688
00:33:28,720 --> 00:33:32,120
Speaker 1: a ton of regular season games to help like tally

689
00:33:32,160 --> 00:33:34,760
Speaker 1: those counting stats, you know, to climb some of the

690
00:33:34,760 --> 00:33:37,760
Speaker 1: all time leader boards and to maybe even win regular

691
00:33:37,800 --> 00:33:40,080
Speaker 1: season MVPs. You know, that's one thing he doesn't have,

692
00:33:40,680 --> 00:33:43,280
Speaker 1: but it's still to me with what we've seen him,

693
00:33:43,280 --> 00:33:46,720
Speaker 1: of course do in playoff series and runs and has

694
00:33:46,760 --> 00:33:49,120
Speaker 1: accolades he's in lately.

695
00:33:49,840 --> 00:33:52,400
Speaker 2: Yes, I think if you would have maybe removed the

696
00:33:52,520 --> 00:33:56,520
Speaker 2: Raptors Championship and the Finals, MVP is in case against him,

697
00:33:56,560 --> 00:33:59,680
Speaker 2: perhaps because that Spurs team while he was Finals MVP

698
00:34:00,200 --> 00:34:03,600
Speaker 2: was a fantastic team laden with talent. But the two

699
00:34:04,080 --> 00:34:07,200
Speaker 2: Defensive Players of the Year awards show that he does

700
00:34:07,240 --> 00:34:11,440
Speaker 2: play both sides of the ball. Yeah, you know, his

701
00:34:11,560 --> 00:34:14,120
Speaker 2: personality is not.

702
00:34:14,360 --> 00:34:15,400
Speaker 1: Highlight real and flat.

703
00:34:15,440 --> 00:34:17,359
Speaker 2: Well, I mean, in terms of his players are highlight reel,

704
00:34:17,400 --> 00:34:21,440
Speaker 2: but he's not a flashy, loud, outspoken person. Not that

705
00:34:21,440 --> 00:34:24,279
Speaker 2: that should know there was Dolf's Ah no, no, I

706
00:34:24,320 --> 00:34:26,799
Speaker 2: mean that that shouldn't count. But I'm just sort of saying, like,

707
00:34:26,960 --> 00:34:29,000
Speaker 2: like Kawhi seems to be just the guy who goes

708
00:34:29,040 --> 00:34:32,640
Speaker 2: out there, works hard, bes the man gets the job done,

709
00:34:32,920 --> 00:34:35,760
Speaker 2: but he's got the two chairs sixty percent of the time. Yeah,

710
00:34:35,880 --> 00:34:38,960
Speaker 2: I mean that still a nik, Yeah, it is, it is,

711
00:34:39,000 --> 00:34:41,000
Speaker 2: because definitely when it's just like I'm just not playing,

712
00:34:41,000 --> 00:34:43,239
Speaker 2: you know, and then that that should be, you know,

713
00:34:43,320 --> 00:34:45,520
Speaker 2: a bit of a knock on him. But he's performed

714
00:34:45,520 --> 00:34:47,800
Speaker 2: in the finals. He's done, and he's got the Finals MVP.

715
00:34:48,000 --> 00:34:53,520
Speaker 2: So yeah, I just I yeah, A lock I mean probably.

716
00:34:53,560 --> 00:34:55,760
Speaker 1: I guess you've got to remember with the active players

717
00:34:55,760 --> 00:34:57,799
Speaker 1: that I'm naming here too, they're not done. I mean

718
00:34:57,880 --> 00:35:01,000
Speaker 1: you got to take that into consideration. You gotta add

719
00:35:01,000 --> 00:35:03,440
Speaker 1: some more stats and possibly more accolades and and and

720
00:35:03,520 --> 00:35:06,320
Speaker 1: in his case for sure more championships or finals MVP,

721
00:35:06,440 --> 00:35:08,719
Speaker 1: which isn't out out of the question, Trey, what do

722
00:35:08,760 --> 00:35:09,200
Speaker 1: you think though?

723
00:35:09,400 --> 00:35:12,000
Speaker 3: I'm doing a quick count here on Wikipedia, and it

724
00:35:12,040 --> 00:35:15,760
Speaker 3: looks to me that Kawhi is one of nine players

725
00:35:15,760 --> 00:35:20,000
Speaker 3: in NBA history with multiple finals MVPs. The other Kareem,

726
00:35:20,320 --> 00:35:25,280
Speaker 3: Tim Duncan, Kevin Durant, Lebron Magic Johnson, Michael Jordan, Shaq Hakeem,

727
00:35:25,320 --> 00:35:26,040
Speaker 3: and Willis Reid.

728
00:35:26,480 --> 00:35:29,040
Speaker 1: They're all in. Yeah, he's Kawhi. I'll see you there.

729
00:35:29,080 --> 00:35:33,160
Speaker 1: But okay, okay, lock in the terminator number seven on

730
00:35:33,239 --> 00:35:37,560
Speaker 1: the active list had to really rack my brains. This

731
00:35:37,560 --> 00:35:40,040
Speaker 1: guy still active. Yeah, he's active. He's still playing. What

732
00:35:40,160 --> 00:35:42,200
Speaker 1: a title? Not too long ago? Got his first one

733
00:35:42,280 --> 00:35:46,399
Speaker 1: Dwight Howard. Yeah. Yeah, eight time All NBA, eight time

734
00:35:46,440 --> 00:35:50,120
Speaker 1: All Star, five time All Defensive Team, three time Defensive

735
00:35:50,120 --> 00:35:52,439
Speaker 1: Player of the Year, back to back to back, first

736
00:35:52,440 --> 00:35:54,880
Speaker 1: ever do that, I believe. And he won that champion

737
00:35:54,920 --> 00:35:57,600
Speaker 1: there championship with the Lakers. He took the magic back

738
00:35:57,640 --> 00:36:00,920
Speaker 1: in what was that nine yep to gone the Lakers

739
00:36:01,040 --> 00:36:03,399
Speaker 1: and Kobe took him to the finals, lost that one,

740
00:36:03,440 --> 00:36:05,680
Speaker 1: but got one there with Lebron down in the bubble.

741
00:36:05,719 --> 00:36:07,920
Speaker 1: So he's got that championship. He really was, though, the

742
00:36:07,920 --> 00:36:10,680
Speaker 1: most dominant big man in the league for like half

743
00:36:10,719 --> 00:36:13,400
Speaker 1: a decade at the very least, if not more. And

744
00:36:13,440 --> 00:36:15,920
Speaker 1: he's top fifteen all time and rebounds and walks. I mean,

745
00:36:15,960 --> 00:36:17,520
Speaker 1: it's sort of what you want from a big guy. TK.

746
00:36:18,040 --> 00:36:18,360
Speaker 4: Yeah.

747
00:36:18,480 --> 00:36:21,800
Speaker 3: The only thing, the only thing, the problem with Dwight

748
00:36:21,880 --> 00:36:24,080
Speaker 3: is that we all saw the second half of his career,

749
00:36:24,280 --> 00:36:27,040
Speaker 3: and we all saw with the magic when he for

750
00:36:27,080 --> 00:36:29,760
Speaker 3: some reason started training with Hakeem Elijah On and decided

751
00:36:29,800 --> 00:36:32,160
Speaker 3: he wanted to shoot bank shots from fifteen feet away,

752
00:36:32,160 --> 00:36:33,600
Speaker 3: and like, those are the things that are hard to

753
00:36:33,600 --> 00:36:34,279
Speaker 3: get out of your head.

754
00:36:35,040 --> 00:36:36,680
Speaker 1: And you take for granted the fact.

755
00:36:36,440 --> 00:36:39,520
Speaker 3: That he was a dominant big man the most dominant

756
00:36:39,520 --> 00:36:42,239
Speaker 3: paint player in the league outside of Lebron on both

757
00:36:42,360 --> 00:36:43,040
Speaker 3: ends of the court.

758
00:36:43,239 --> 00:36:45,120
Speaker 1: For like you're saying, probably seven.

759
00:36:44,960 --> 00:36:48,680
Speaker 3: Or eight years really and you know, the title at

760
00:36:48,680 --> 00:36:51,360
Speaker 3: the end of his career and remaking himself into a

761
00:36:51,440 --> 00:36:53,840
Speaker 3: role player that everybody wanted him to be for such.

762
00:36:53,680 --> 00:36:57,240
Speaker 1: A long time. I think that's Cementsu's case at number

763
00:36:57,239 --> 00:37:02,280
Speaker 1: eight active locks go and Russell west Brook gotten MVP.

764
00:37:02,680 --> 00:37:05,560
Speaker 1: He's a nine time All NBA, nine time All Star.

765
00:37:06,560 --> 00:37:08,600
Speaker 1: Was a little shocked that he's never made an All

766
00:37:08,640 --> 00:37:10,600
Speaker 1: Defensive team. Now, I know Russ is not a great

767
00:37:10,719 --> 00:37:13,319
Speaker 1: defender now, but you sort of think back as a

768
00:37:13,400 --> 00:37:18,239
Speaker 1: younger Russ that just being all over the place that

769
00:37:19,120 --> 00:37:22,359
Speaker 1: it appears like he's playing defense and that maybe would

770
00:37:22,360 --> 00:37:24,279
Speaker 1: have like snuck him into one of those teams. But

771
00:37:24,320 --> 00:37:26,920
Speaker 1: he hasn't. He never made it. And again now, no,

772
00:37:27,080 --> 00:37:28,920
Speaker 1: he's not even close. He gets caught nap in a

773
00:37:28,960 --> 00:37:30,800
Speaker 1: whole lot of the time. Of course, hits the boards.

774
00:37:30,800 --> 00:37:32,840
Speaker 1: If you want to count that as a very important

775
00:37:32,840 --> 00:37:35,120
Speaker 1: defensive thing, you got to end the possession, and I

776
00:37:35,200 --> 00:37:38,960
Speaker 1: believe that. But yeah, otherwise, locking down guys, No, anyway,

777
00:37:39,080 --> 00:37:40,960
Speaker 1: mister triple double, I've got him in there. He is

778
00:37:41,000 --> 00:37:44,080
Speaker 1: the only player in league history to have multiple scoring

779
00:37:44,120 --> 00:37:48,600
Speaker 1: titles and assist titles to his name. That's amazing. There

780
00:37:48,640 --> 00:37:51,279
Speaker 1: are other guys that have both but have only done

781
00:37:51,280 --> 00:37:54,600
Speaker 1: one of them once. He's done them multiple times. Only

782
00:37:54,640 --> 00:37:57,320
Speaker 1: two guards in NBA history, Jason Kidda and Oscar Robertson,

783
00:37:57,400 --> 00:38:02,240
Speaker 1: have more rebounds than Westbrook Lee. Always with Russ, whether

784
00:38:02,280 --> 00:38:04,560
Speaker 1: he's on this list ultimately or not, I think he

785
00:38:04,640 --> 00:38:07,680
Speaker 1: will be. There will be people that are opinionated about

786
00:38:07,719 --> 00:38:11,040
Speaker 1: it and say if he is there, he shouldn't be.

787
00:38:11,080 --> 00:38:11,719
Speaker 1: But what do you think?

788
00:38:12,719 --> 00:38:15,759
Speaker 2: Yeah, he's an interesting one. But the three years of

789
00:38:15,800 --> 00:38:20,719
Speaker 2: triple doubles is pretty hard to keep a guy off,

790
00:38:20,760 --> 00:38:22,719
Speaker 2: isn't it. I mean, if you're doing those stats, even

791
00:38:22,760 --> 00:38:24,680
Speaker 2: if he was patting his stats, which he was for

792
00:38:24,760 --> 00:38:26,800
Speaker 2: a bit of it, to just put up those numbers.

793
00:38:26,800 --> 00:38:28,840
Speaker 2: But he's got the MVP as well, which really I

794
00:38:28,840 --> 00:38:31,080
Speaker 2: think tipped him over the edge there being to the

795
00:38:31,080 --> 00:38:33,320
Speaker 2: finals when he was obviously very young with the Thunder.

796
00:38:33,680 --> 00:38:37,479
Speaker 2: Hasn't had really any playoff success, certainly since Kevin Durant left.

797
00:38:38,080 --> 00:38:39,680
Speaker 2: But for a guy who just goes out there and

798
00:38:39,719 --> 00:38:42,520
Speaker 2: plays his ass off every single night, that he plays

799
00:38:42,520 --> 00:38:44,520
Speaker 2: and has the stats to back. Is he actually now

800
00:38:44,600 --> 00:38:46,440
Speaker 2: four years of a triple double? I just remember with

801
00:38:46,440 --> 00:38:49,399
Speaker 2: the Wizards this season, I think he averaged one as well,

802
00:38:49,440 --> 00:38:52,320
Speaker 2: so I think it's actually four times and you mentioned

803
00:38:52,719 --> 00:38:56,960
Speaker 2: for guards rebounds third all time. Yeah, he gets in.

804
00:38:57,680 --> 00:38:59,759
Speaker 2: He sort of forces his way in there, you know,

805
00:39:00,080 --> 00:39:02,359
Speaker 2: bulled over his way through the toy exactly. That's how

806
00:39:02,440 --> 00:39:06,440
Speaker 2: Russell plays the game because he you know, he doesn't

807
00:39:08,360 --> 00:39:10,399
Speaker 2: You would love to have seen him drag a team

808
00:39:10,440 --> 00:39:12,800
Speaker 2: by himself to the finals. That would have been awesome

809
00:39:12,840 --> 00:39:14,840
Speaker 2: for him, but a little bit like Alan Oivs and

810
00:39:14,840 --> 00:39:16,960
Speaker 2: Alan Iivson only went to the finals one time and

811
00:39:17,040 --> 00:39:19,360
Speaker 2: outside of that didn't have a lot of playoff success.

812
00:39:19,680 --> 00:39:21,960
Speaker 2: But he sort of also forces his way in there

813
00:39:22,000 --> 00:39:24,000
Speaker 2: because of all those other things that he did on

814
00:39:24,040 --> 00:39:25,880
Speaker 2: the game for so long. He's impact on the game.

815
00:39:26,040 --> 00:39:28,160
Speaker 2: And I think Westbrook's in a similar ain there. So yeah,

816
00:39:28,160 --> 00:39:30,319
Speaker 2: I think, yeah, he gets in, He gets in.

817
00:39:30,520 --> 00:39:32,600
Speaker 1: Okay, Trey, you have him on your list.

818
00:39:33,080 --> 00:39:35,960
Speaker 3: I had him as a lock four years averaging a

819
00:39:35,960 --> 00:39:38,360
Speaker 3: triple double. That gets you in right there. Considering we

820
00:39:38,360 --> 00:39:40,680
Speaker 3: thought Lebron was going to be the only guy outside

821
00:39:40,760 --> 00:39:43,560
Speaker 3: like after Oscar Robertson, who even had a chance. Lebron

822
00:39:43,600 --> 00:39:46,680
Speaker 3: has never I mean maybe Lebron obviously he could, he

823
00:39:46,760 --> 00:39:48,840
Speaker 3: just never had the impetus to do it. But Westbrook

824
00:39:48,880 --> 00:39:50,360
Speaker 3: said I'm gonna do it, and I'm gonna do it

825
00:39:50,360 --> 00:39:53,560
Speaker 3: every single year. Then you mentioned Skeets multiple times leading

826
00:39:53,560 --> 00:39:55,319
Speaker 3: the league in assists, Like, I don't think you really

827
00:39:55,360 --> 00:39:57,960
Speaker 3: think about that with Rustbrook, because you think about all

828
00:39:58,000 --> 00:40:00,319
Speaker 3: three numbers together rather than just the assist number.

829
00:40:00,360 --> 00:40:03,480
Speaker 1: But that's pretty impressive as well. Yeah, and when this

830
00:40:03,560 --> 00:40:06,799
Speaker 1: list ultimately comes out, some people will be like, oh,

831
00:40:07,000 --> 00:40:08,839
Speaker 1: no way he should be on there, but I think

832
00:40:08,880 --> 00:40:12,560
Speaker 1: they'll be thinking of it like all these guys in

833
00:40:12,600 --> 00:40:15,479
Speaker 1: a close game, it's a tie game and there's twenty

834
00:40:15,520 --> 00:40:19,080
Speaker 1: seconds to go, Like I want him to take the shot,

835
00:40:19,120 --> 00:40:20,719
Speaker 1: but that's not really how you should look at it.

836
00:40:20,760 --> 00:40:22,440
Speaker 1: I mean, there's so much more you can do and

837
00:40:22,480 --> 00:40:25,640
Speaker 1: contribute to obviously a team sport, and I don't want

838
00:40:25,680 --> 00:40:29,560
Speaker 1: rust to be probably the guy taking you know, a

839
00:40:29,560 --> 00:40:32,560
Speaker 1: deep three with in a tie game with twenty seconds

840
00:40:32,640 --> 00:40:34,319
Speaker 1: left that I don't want to. I want him maybe

841
00:40:34,320 --> 00:40:35,799
Speaker 1: setting up a guy to do that. But that but

842
00:40:35,840 --> 00:40:38,399
Speaker 1: that's okay, is my point, because you can have such

843
00:40:38,400 --> 00:40:42,280
Speaker 1: an impact on the game, and also you know players

844
00:40:42,280 --> 00:40:43,759
Speaker 1: are going to be sort of voting on this, like

845
00:40:43,800 --> 00:40:48,560
Speaker 1: this blue ribbon panel. There is just no way legends

846
00:40:49,080 --> 00:40:51,439
Speaker 1: watching Russell Westbrook in the way he plays, how hard

847
00:40:51,440 --> 00:40:53,839
Speaker 1: he plays every night, are like ever going to leave

848
00:40:53,880 --> 00:40:55,960
Speaker 1: him off this Like it's sort of like iverson. I

849
00:40:55,960 --> 00:41:00,000
Speaker 1: think these guys sort of just play every single night, yeah,

850
00:41:00,280 --> 00:41:03,120
Speaker 1: harder than most, despite making you know, millions and millions

851
00:41:03,120 --> 00:41:05,439
Speaker 1: and millions of dollars. They truly do love the game.

852
00:41:05,719 --> 00:41:08,000
Speaker 1: They have some faults. They're both of them not the

853
00:41:08,040 --> 00:41:09,920
Speaker 1: greatest shooters in the world of or all time, but

854
00:41:10,160 --> 00:41:12,359
Speaker 1: they're great players. Okay, so he's in. I got two

855
00:41:12,440 --> 00:41:18,040
Speaker 1: left James Harden, former teammate of course of Westbrook. He's in.

856
00:41:19,280 --> 00:41:22,520
Speaker 1: He's got the MVP, has got a million. What second

857
00:41:22,560 --> 00:41:24,640
Speaker 1: place finishes for MVP? I forget what it is. Got

858
00:41:24,640 --> 00:41:27,799
Speaker 1: a couple of them. Three, three, yeah, seven time All NBA.

859
00:41:27,920 --> 00:41:29,759
Speaker 1: He's a nine time All Star, so very close to

860
00:41:29,800 --> 00:41:32,799
Speaker 1: that ten All Star mark. And he's a three time

861
00:41:32,840 --> 00:41:38,040
Speaker 1: scoring champ. I think he has one assist record for

862
00:41:38,120 --> 00:41:40,640
Speaker 1: one season at least. He ranks thirty third on the

863
00:41:40,680 --> 00:41:43,680
Speaker 1: all time scoring list. James Harden does forty second on

864
00:41:43,719 --> 00:41:47,359
Speaker 1: the all time assists lists. He's got years left in him.

865
00:41:47,400 --> 00:41:50,520
Speaker 1: I mean, he's I don't have those lists in front

866
00:41:50,520 --> 00:41:52,160
Speaker 1: of me, but you know he's gonna climb those. He

867
00:41:52,200 --> 00:41:54,399
Speaker 1: could be like flirting like top twenty five in both

868
00:41:54,440 --> 00:41:58,719
Speaker 1: of those categories, and he's good at He's probably gonna

869
00:41:58,800 --> 00:42:01,319
Speaker 1: hit three thousand and three points. I think it's in play.

870
00:42:01,760 --> 00:42:04,560
Speaker 1: Of course, depends how long he goes for You'll be

871
00:42:04,560 --> 00:42:07,120
Speaker 1: shocked if he doesn't finish top two or three all

872
00:42:07,200 --> 00:42:09,200
Speaker 1: time in three pointers. Meet like, he's going to pass

873
00:42:09,280 --> 00:42:12,320
Speaker 1: Realen and Reggie Miller, and ain't of those guys played

874
00:42:12,360 --> 00:42:14,360
Speaker 1: in a different era. If they were playing today, Reellen

875
00:42:14,360 --> 00:42:18,680
Speaker 1: would probably shoot fifteen three pointers a game. But Harden's

876
00:42:18,960 --> 00:42:21,560
Speaker 1: he like Westbrook, is polarizing to some people, but I

877
00:42:21,600 --> 00:42:24,120
Speaker 1: think he has to be included in this Lily. Yeah.

878
00:42:24,200 --> 00:42:27,040
Speaker 2: No, he's in for sure, in the same vein as Westbrook. There.

879
00:42:27,320 --> 00:42:29,359
Speaker 2: It's like, if you want to knock a guy and say, well,

880
00:42:29,360 --> 00:42:31,480
Speaker 2: he hasn't had the playoff success, then sure, there's the

881
00:42:31,600 --> 00:42:33,520
Speaker 2: argument for James Harden, though he has also been to

882
00:42:33,560 --> 00:42:35,520
Speaker 2: the finals. Though he's been to the conference finals, a

883
00:42:35,520 --> 00:42:38,160
Speaker 2: couple of times, certainly with the Rockets there, But in

884
00:42:38,280 --> 00:42:40,279
Speaker 2: terms of what the guy does day in, day out,

885
00:42:40,360 --> 00:42:43,160
Speaker 2: for eighty two games over multiple seasons, it must be

886
00:42:43,520 --> 00:42:47,640
Speaker 2: at least nine seasons now where he's been averaging twenty

887
00:42:47,719 --> 00:42:50,680
Speaker 2: five plus a game, putting up the threes, getting the assists,

888
00:42:50,920 --> 00:42:53,000
Speaker 2: just going out there and playing. You just got to

889
00:42:53,040 --> 00:42:55,560
Speaker 2: respect a guy who does that. So, yes, he's one

890
00:42:55,560 --> 00:42:57,279
Speaker 2: of those guys that a lot of people will say,

891
00:42:57,640 --> 00:43:00,920
Speaker 2: don't like watching him playing, don't want the hunting. But

892
00:43:00,960 --> 00:43:02,600
Speaker 2: you can't knock a guy who goes out there and

893
00:43:02,600 --> 00:43:05,520
Speaker 2: has averaged, you know, led the league in scoring. Did

894
00:43:05,600 --> 00:43:08,279
Speaker 2: you say only once? Actually, then three times three times,

895
00:43:08,320 --> 00:43:11,799
Speaker 2: scoring three times once ass So he's he's done it.

896
00:43:11,800 --> 00:43:14,000
Speaker 2: He's done enough of that body of work that he

897
00:43:14,080 --> 00:43:17,080
Speaker 2: deserves to get in. Even though obviously a finals, you know,

898
00:43:17,120 --> 00:43:20,240
Speaker 2: a championship and a finals MVP would would would clear

899
00:43:20,280 --> 00:43:22,399
Speaker 2: the way completely for him. But I can't see why

900
00:43:22,440 --> 00:43:23,399
Speaker 2: they would leave him off.

901
00:43:24,200 --> 00:43:29,000
Speaker 1: He's in. Okay, Well, here is this tenth active lock

902
00:43:29,400 --> 00:43:32,120
Speaker 1: is where I get into the dilemma of having forgotten

903
00:43:32,120 --> 00:43:36,920
Speaker 1: Carmelo Anthony still being an active player. I'm gonna put

904
00:43:37,000 --> 00:43:39,200
Speaker 1: him here and I'll bump the guy I had at

905
00:43:39,239 --> 00:43:42,600
Speaker 1: tenth that is still playing down probably to one of

906
00:43:42,640 --> 00:43:45,839
Speaker 1: my you know, final five selections there. So let's put

907
00:43:45,840 --> 00:43:51,439
Speaker 1: Carmelo here. Now, I think he's a little interesting. Does

908
00:43:51,440 --> 00:43:53,680
Speaker 1: he Does he fall into the vene of some of

909
00:43:53,680 --> 00:43:56,640
Speaker 1: those guys that missed out on top fifty, like the

910
00:43:56,680 --> 00:44:01,680
Speaker 1: Alex Englishers and the Adrian Dantley and Bernard Kings of

911
00:44:01,719 --> 00:44:06,319
Speaker 1: the bunch, like these really prominent scores. I don't think

912
00:44:06,400 --> 00:44:09,960
Speaker 1: he mellow will. I think he'll make this list the

913
00:44:10,000 --> 00:44:12,440
Speaker 1: top seventy five. And he's got in the top twenty

914
00:44:12,440 --> 00:44:15,440
Speaker 1: five for me here of new names. So let's put

915
00:44:15,520 --> 00:44:17,839
Speaker 1: him in and pull up his basketball reference page because

916
00:44:17,840 --> 00:44:19,360
Speaker 1: I didn't have it written down. But he is a

917
00:44:19,400 --> 00:44:21,839
Speaker 1: six time All NBA player and he's a ten time

918
00:44:21,880 --> 00:44:24,080
Speaker 1: All Star. Tray there it is. He's obviously got the

919
00:44:24,080 --> 00:44:28,440
Speaker 1: scoring title there back in twenty twelve thirteen with the Knicks.

920
00:44:28,480 --> 00:44:32,240
Speaker 1: I guess that was Mello Trey. No brainer.

921
00:44:32,760 --> 00:44:35,680
Speaker 3: Yep, he was my last Lock Skates, ten time all Star,

922
00:44:35,840 --> 00:44:38,360
Speaker 3: tenth all time on the scoring list.

923
00:44:38,239 --> 00:44:39,600
Speaker 1: In the NBA.

924
00:44:39,760 --> 00:44:42,719
Speaker 3: And to me, if you've got Dominique Wilkins going in,

925
00:44:42,719 --> 00:44:45,480
Speaker 3: you gotta have the Melo Anthony. They are very similar

926
00:44:45,560 --> 00:44:47,960
Speaker 3: cases to me, one of the most famous players in

927
00:44:48,000 --> 00:44:48,440
Speaker 3: the league.

928
00:44:49,000 --> 00:44:50,560
Speaker 1: Mello gets it done with jab.

929
00:44:50,320 --> 00:44:54,160
Speaker 3: Steps, Dominique got it done with dunks, but devastating scorer.

930
00:44:54,200 --> 00:44:56,200
Speaker 3: You're not necessarily getting a whole bunch back on the

931
00:44:56,239 --> 00:44:59,880
Speaker 3: other end, but a player well respected by his peers

932
00:45:00,120 --> 00:45:03,000
Speaker 3: a round forever, and similar to Dwight the way he's

933
00:45:03,000 --> 00:45:06,040
Speaker 3: remade his career starting with Portland as you know, a

934
00:45:06,040 --> 00:45:07,759
Speaker 3: catch and shoot raw guy. Maybe he'll be able to

935
00:45:07,800 --> 00:45:10,520
Speaker 3: pick up a championship with the Lakers. I think Mellow

936
00:45:10,640 --> 00:45:11,640
Speaker 3: is definitely.

937
00:45:11,239 --> 00:45:14,680
Speaker 2: In Okay, Lee, Yeah, Mellow needs about two and a

938
00:45:14,719 --> 00:45:17,880
Speaker 2: half thousand points to become the ninth player with thirty thousand,

939
00:45:18,000 --> 00:45:20,399
Speaker 2: and that alone I think gets him in there. You're

940
00:45:20,400 --> 00:45:22,560
Speaker 2: going to everyone else, of course, is in that in

941
00:45:22,600 --> 00:45:24,839
Speaker 2: the top fifty there or the tops. You know they'll

942
00:45:24,840 --> 00:45:26,960
Speaker 2: be in the top seventy five. Melow's got some work

943
00:45:27,000 --> 00:45:29,640
Speaker 2: to do, but you know, he the way that he's

944
00:45:29,640 --> 00:45:31,960
Speaker 2: sort of played these last season there with Portland, just

945
00:45:32,000 --> 00:45:35,120
Speaker 2: coming out hitting threes. If he stays healthy, I think

946
00:45:35,160 --> 00:45:37,040
Speaker 2: that's a goal that's within reach for him. So I

947
00:45:37,080 --> 00:45:38,279
Speaker 2: think he's going to do it. So I think in

948
00:45:38,320 --> 00:45:40,880
Speaker 2: this sense, not that he really needs that only to

949
00:45:40,920 --> 00:45:43,200
Speaker 2: get in, but I think you're not going to leave

950
00:45:43,200 --> 00:45:45,560
Speaker 2: a guy off who could potentially have thirty thousand points.

951
00:45:45,560 --> 00:45:47,520
Speaker 2: So he gets in the same sort of thing again

952
00:45:47,560 --> 00:45:50,919
Speaker 2: with Harden and Westbrook love to have seen a championship

953
00:45:51,200 --> 00:45:53,200
Speaker 2: or just an appearance in the finals. In fact, he's

954
00:45:53,200 --> 00:45:56,080
Speaker 2: never even been there. But even without it, he's done

955
00:45:56,160 --> 00:45:58,400
Speaker 2: enough I think through his body of work throughout his career.

956
00:45:58,920 --> 00:46:01,200
Speaker 1: And we have to get a phone of Lebron and

957
00:46:01,239 --> 00:46:06,040
Speaker 1: Mellow and Wade. They're maybe bosh, you know, wearing their

958
00:46:06,560 --> 00:46:09,640
Speaker 1: cool leather jackets. They gotta re you know, take a

959
00:46:09,680 --> 00:46:13,320
Speaker 1: photo at least because Mello's played like Lebron, what eighteen seasons,

960
00:46:13,360 --> 00:46:15,719
Speaker 1: he'll be going into his nineteenth year. We haven't heard,

961
00:46:15,880 --> 00:46:17,799
Speaker 1: you know, Mello hanging it up. So yeah, he's probably

962
00:46:17,840 --> 00:46:19,839
Speaker 1: got a couple left in them. So okay, he's in.

963
00:46:20,440 --> 00:46:22,520
Speaker 1: I just had a brain fart there. I think I

964
00:46:23,000 --> 00:46:25,719
Speaker 1: kept doing the thing thinking Mellow was retired, but he's

965
00:46:25,719 --> 00:46:27,719
Speaker 1: still active and they got lost to them bunch. But

966
00:46:27,880 --> 00:46:29,560
Speaker 1: I'm glad I caught it on the fly here. Okay,

967
00:46:29,640 --> 00:46:34,160
Speaker 1: so that's twenty got five spots left. That's it. That's

968
00:46:34,200 --> 00:46:36,239
Speaker 1: all we're doing here. A lot of good players out

969
00:46:36,239 --> 00:46:39,319
Speaker 1: there there are. I'm happy you said that there are

970
00:46:39,320 --> 00:46:41,879
Speaker 1: a lot of great players. Just because we don't pick

971
00:46:42,640 --> 00:46:46,360
Speaker 1: a particular player for this final five is by no

972
00:46:46,480 --> 00:46:49,600
Speaker 1: means us saying he's not going to be on the

973
00:46:49,719 --> 00:46:52,360
Speaker 1: NBA seventy five list, Like there's gonna be. You know,

974
00:46:52,400 --> 00:46:54,359
Speaker 1: we're only doing twenty five. There's gonna be I think

975
00:46:54,400 --> 00:46:56,960
Speaker 1: a bunch of snubs names that we actually say that

976
00:46:57,040 --> 00:47:00,319
Speaker 1: we'll probably still get in. But that's a pot cast

977
00:47:00,360 --> 00:47:05,120
Speaker 1: for another day. So the one that uh Lee brought

978
00:47:05,200 --> 00:47:08,719
Speaker 1: up when he was doing is like automatic twelve that

979
00:47:08,760 --> 00:47:10,719
Speaker 1: caught us by surprise. I gotta be honest because you

980
00:47:10,719 --> 00:47:15,239
Speaker 1: only did twelve, like you said, Dennis Rodman, I'm with you, Lee.

981
00:47:15,280 --> 00:47:17,320
Speaker 1: I'm gonna pick him as one of my like final

982
00:47:17,360 --> 00:47:20,320
Speaker 1: selections here, just as h as. He's twenty five new names.

983
00:47:20,400 --> 00:47:22,160
Speaker 1: He's a Hall of Famer, he's a two time All NBA.

984
00:47:22,239 --> 00:47:24,719
Speaker 1: He's only a two time All Star. Yeah, this is

985
00:47:24,719 --> 00:47:27,880
Speaker 1: the weird thing about the worm. Eight time All defensive teams,

986
00:47:28,640 --> 00:47:31,520
Speaker 1: won two DPO wise, and he's a five time champion.

987
00:47:32,400 --> 00:47:34,920
Speaker 1: You know, he played an integral role on two of

988
00:47:34,960 --> 00:47:37,200
Speaker 1: the greatest teams in NBA history too, in the Bad

989
00:47:37,239 --> 00:47:41,800
Speaker 1: Boy Pistons and then MJ's Bowls. I mean, he's is

990
00:47:41,840 --> 00:47:44,239
Speaker 1: he the greatest rebounder the game has ever seen? He's

991
00:47:44,239 --> 00:47:47,680
Speaker 1: on the short list, so the worm is in. I'm

992
00:47:47,680 --> 00:47:49,239
Speaker 1: with you, Lee, I don't have him as high as

993
00:47:49,280 --> 00:47:51,560
Speaker 1: you did, like he is right away, but I do

994
00:47:51,680 --> 00:47:54,000
Speaker 1: in my twenty five to do so we know Lee agrees,

995
00:47:54,040 --> 00:47:56,359
Speaker 1: But what do you think, Trey. I should have him

996
00:47:56,400 --> 00:47:59,239
Speaker 1: on the list, but he didn't even make my short list.

997
00:47:59,280 --> 00:48:02,840
Speaker 1: Oh my white Honest, I think it's hard to be

998
00:48:02,880 --> 00:48:03,520
Speaker 1: the third guy.

999
00:48:03,680 --> 00:48:06,120
Speaker 3: And he was the third guy on both of these

1000
00:48:06,160 --> 00:48:09,960
Speaker 3: teams that he won championships with. He was the perfect

1001
00:48:10,040 --> 00:48:12,240
Speaker 3: third guy for both of those teams. You can probably

1002
00:48:12,280 --> 00:48:14,480
Speaker 3: ever say he was maybe fourth or fifth, to be

1003
00:48:14,560 --> 00:48:18,080
Speaker 3: quite honest, on the Pistons, But I don't know. Going

1004
00:48:18,120 --> 00:48:21,000
Speaker 3: back and looking through the first fifty Greatest Players, comparing

1005
00:48:21,080 --> 00:48:24,000
Speaker 3: that with the Defensive Player of the Year winners and

1006
00:48:24,040 --> 00:48:25,959
Speaker 3: who made it and who didn't, there wasn't a huge

1007
00:48:25,960 --> 00:48:29,160
Speaker 3: correlation from Defensive Player of the Year to making the

1008
00:48:29,200 --> 00:48:32,200
Speaker 3: fifty Greatest Players list because there were some you know,

1009
00:48:32,520 --> 00:48:35,000
Speaker 3: sort of random guys in NBA history who won it

1010
00:48:35,040 --> 00:48:37,360
Speaker 3: early on in the Awards infancy.

1011
00:48:37,880 --> 00:48:40,480
Speaker 1: So, yeah, Rodman is it's a tough call to me.

1012
00:48:40,560 --> 00:48:43,120
Speaker 3: He's a kind of similar to Robert Parrish, right, Like

1013
00:48:43,200 --> 00:48:45,880
Speaker 3: Robert Parrish was the third guy on those great Celtics teams.

1014
00:48:46,200 --> 00:48:48,080
Speaker 3: He did a lot of great stuff playing a long time.

1015
00:48:48,600 --> 00:48:51,560
Speaker 3: Rodman's stats are incredible, but he doesn't have a ton

1016
00:48:51,600 --> 00:48:53,920
Speaker 3: of accolades, like you're saying, aside from the defense and

1017
00:48:53,960 --> 00:48:56,759
Speaker 3: the rebounding titles, which are things that people don't care

1018
00:48:56,840 --> 00:49:03,160
Speaker 3: about quite as much. Rodman's a tough pitch to make too, right,

1019
00:49:03,320 --> 00:49:05,720
Speaker 3: like to have him hanging out there on the court

1020
00:49:05,760 --> 00:49:08,800
Speaker 3: with everybody else, especially with the way his post playing

1021
00:49:08,840 --> 00:49:09,960
Speaker 3: career has gone.

1022
00:49:10,560 --> 00:49:11,000
Speaker 1: I don't know.

1023
00:49:11,280 --> 00:49:13,560
Speaker 3: I probably I feel like I should have Rodman on

1024
00:49:13,600 --> 00:49:14,920
Speaker 3: my list, but I don't.

1025
00:49:15,320 --> 00:49:18,480
Speaker 1: Wow. Yeah, I mean him making the Hall of Fame

1026
00:49:18,560 --> 00:49:21,799
Speaker 1: sure helps his chances of getting in here, Lee, But

1027
00:49:22,719 --> 00:49:25,080
Speaker 1: we've heard from Trey he's a little skeptical or he

1028
00:49:25,080 --> 00:49:26,719
Speaker 1: does have him at least on his, like at least

1029
00:49:26,719 --> 00:49:28,960
Speaker 1: short list. What do you you do though, because you

1030
00:49:29,000 --> 00:49:30,319
Speaker 1: had him money needing shorter list.

1031
00:49:30,480 --> 00:49:33,160
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I think those three championships with the Bulls,

1032
00:49:33,160 --> 00:49:35,839
Speaker 2: he was just so important to that team winning. I mean,

1033
00:49:35,920 --> 00:49:40,200
Speaker 2: obviously Michael and Scotti were fantastic, but what Dennis did defensively, rebounding,

1034
00:49:40,440 --> 00:49:42,839
Speaker 2: and just out there on the court, he was as

1035
00:49:43,000 --> 00:49:46,680
Speaker 2: vital to that teams as you know, maybe anyone else.

1036
00:49:46,719 --> 00:49:49,280
Speaker 2: He just did such a different role. And it wasn't

1037
00:49:49,280 --> 00:49:51,200
Speaker 2: the scoring, it wasn't that sort of stuff, but he

1038
00:49:51,320 --> 00:49:53,680
Speaker 2: was so important to what they did. I think this

1039
00:49:53,760 --> 00:49:55,200
Speaker 2: is one where you look at the stats and the

1040
00:49:55,239 --> 00:49:58,279
Speaker 2: accolades and you go, you know, not huge there, but man,

1041
00:49:58,320 --> 00:50:00,759
Speaker 2: this guy was a good player. And you guys we

1042
00:50:00,880 --> 00:50:03,160
Speaker 2: used to work with Isaiah Thomas. Isaiah Thomas used to

1043
00:50:03,320 --> 00:50:06,680
Speaker 2: rave about just how good Dennis Rodne was a great athlete,

1044
00:50:06,719 --> 00:50:09,480
Speaker 2: great player, but not that person who lights up the

1045
00:50:09,480 --> 00:50:12,000
Speaker 2: box score. And I think that the fact that you know,

1046
00:50:12,080 --> 00:50:16,120
Speaker 2: Michael and Scotti also understood the role that he played,

1047
00:50:16,160 --> 00:50:18,399
Speaker 2: I think that does help. Again, when you are on

1048
00:50:18,840 --> 00:50:22,440
Speaker 2: the greatest team at the time, seventy two and ten

1049
00:50:22,520 --> 00:50:24,880
Speaker 2: Bulls and they go on to win the championship, obviously

1050
00:50:24,880 --> 00:50:26,600
Speaker 2: Michael's going to get in, Scotty's going to get in.

1051
00:50:27,040 --> 00:50:29,200
Speaker 2: I think Dennis gets in. I think he gets there.

1052
00:50:29,320 --> 00:50:32,880
Speaker 2: So it's going to be interesting to see though, do

1053
00:50:33,000 --> 00:50:34,960
Speaker 2: they look and just go, yeah, good player and a

1054
00:50:34,960 --> 00:50:37,440
Speaker 2: good team, but not as good as some of those

1055
00:50:37,440 --> 00:50:40,040
Speaker 2: other guys. But I also wonder if they do want

1056
00:50:40,080 --> 00:50:42,080
Speaker 2: to make sure they do include a couple of guys

1057
00:50:42,120 --> 00:50:46,279
Speaker 2: who were primarily defensive players, because because I think then

1058
00:50:46,280 --> 00:50:47,880
Speaker 2: you've got a case and I don't want to step

1059
00:50:47,880 --> 00:50:49,480
Speaker 2: on your list here in case you've got de kem

1060
00:50:49,560 --> 00:50:52,080
Speaker 2: Bay and Ben Wallace and those guys who are also

1061
00:50:52,160 --> 00:50:55,080
Speaker 2: in the Hall of Fame. But I think those guys

1062
00:50:55,120 --> 00:50:57,040
Speaker 2: have got a very very strong case as well. So

1063
00:50:57,920 --> 00:51:01,480
Speaker 2: I think Dennis is more about just how good a

1064
00:51:01,520 --> 00:51:04,680
Speaker 2: Plary was. Don't necessarily look at the box schools for him.

1065
00:51:04,800 --> 00:51:07,880
Speaker 1: No, you're right, I mean the kembe I don't have

1066
00:51:08,000 --> 00:51:11,319
Speaker 1: in the final five here. Again, I still think there's

1067
00:51:11,320 --> 00:51:13,520
Speaker 1: a great chance he makes the NBA seventy five list,

1068
00:51:13,600 --> 00:51:17,880
Speaker 1: but it's tough, like if Dennis Rodman makes it. Is

1069
00:51:17,920 --> 00:51:20,319
Speaker 1: there another spot for Draymond Green? No, I don't think

1070
00:51:20,360 --> 00:51:24,160
Speaker 1: Draymond Green' is gonna make it pretty similar accolades when

1071
00:51:24,200 --> 00:51:26,640
Speaker 1: you actually look at it and still playing. Still more

1072
00:51:26,640 --> 00:51:31,080
Speaker 1: to add possibly, but yeah, we'll see, we'll see. Will

1073
00:51:31,120 --> 00:51:34,040
Speaker 1: they try and sprinkle in like you said Lee, some

1074
00:51:34,080 --> 00:51:36,759
Speaker 1: of those specialists really what Rodman was and what he

1075
00:51:36,760 --> 00:51:39,239
Speaker 1: did defensively in rebounding and like a da kembe with

1076
00:51:39,280 --> 00:51:42,879
Speaker 1: blocking and rebounding, or will they lean towards like no, man,

1077
00:51:42,960 --> 00:51:46,960
Speaker 1: it's way more impressive to score like Tracy McGrady for example,

1078
00:51:47,120 --> 00:51:51,120
Speaker 1: over a long time, or like these guys. What about

1079
00:51:51,200 --> 00:51:53,319
Speaker 1: Ray Allen? I got Ray Allen as a selection here,

1080
00:51:54,160 --> 00:51:56,160
Speaker 1: Hall of famer, two time All NBA, that's it. But

1081
00:51:56,440 --> 00:51:59,440
Speaker 1: ten time All Star. Wow, that's sort of bosh like

1082
00:51:59,520 --> 00:52:02,800
Speaker 1: in the difference between all NBA selections and All Star selections.

1083
00:52:03,160 --> 00:52:06,960
Speaker 1: Two time champion, he played thirteen hundred games. He's the

1084
00:52:07,040 --> 00:52:10,359
Speaker 1: NBA's all time leader for now in three pointers made

1085
00:52:10,440 --> 00:52:13,840
Speaker 1: Kurry hot on his heels. I also think people forget,

1086
00:52:13,960 --> 00:52:16,719
Speaker 1: maybe like the younger generation, they do forget what type

1087
00:52:16,719 --> 00:52:19,560
Speaker 1: of player Ray Allen was in Milwaukee and Seattle, Like

1088
00:52:19,600 --> 00:52:23,759
Speaker 1: this guy was an elite, an elite attacker, not just

1089
00:52:23,800 --> 00:52:26,160
Speaker 1: a three point shooter. So I've gone him in here,

1090
00:52:26,160 --> 00:52:29,600
Speaker 1: and I know we can get into like if you like,

1091
00:52:29,600 --> 00:52:31,160
Speaker 1: if you're picking one, let me put it this way,

1092
00:52:31,280 --> 00:52:34,399
Speaker 1: Ray Allen or Reggie Miller. Where are you going, Trey?

1093
00:52:34,960 --> 00:52:37,000
Speaker 1: If you can only pick one, though maybe we'll get

1094
00:52:37,000 --> 00:52:38,800
Speaker 1: both of them in here. Who would you lead towards?

1095
00:52:38,880 --> 00:52:40,640
Speaker 1: I only picked one, and it was Ray Allen.

1096
00:52:40,680 --> 00:52:43,120
Speaker 3: He was a lock for me as the NBA's all

1097
00:52:43,160 --> 00:52:46,840
Speaker 3: time leading three point shooter until this next season is over. Basically,

1098
00:52:46,880 --> 00:52:50,799
Speaker 3: Steph Curry should pass him, assuming he stays healthy and

1099
00:52:51,000 --> 00:52:53,520
Speaker 3: hitting one of the greatest shots in NBA history to

1100
00:52:53,600 --> 00:52:56,880
Speaker 3: win a championship. He won championships with multiple teams. I

1101
00:52:56,960 --> 00:52:59,680
Speaker 3: know I'm kind of contradicting myself here because Ray Allen

1102
00:52:59,760 --> 00:53:02,120
Speaker 3: was the third guy on both of those teams, But

1103
00:53:02,200 --> 00:53:04,840
Speaker 3: like you're saying, he was the number one guy for

1104
00:53:04,960 --> 00:53:07,480
Speaker 3: Seattle and Milwaukee, and he was able to pile up

1105
00:53:07,520 --> 00:53:09,719
Speaker 3: those stats to the point where other players around the

1106
00:53:09,760 --> 00:53:12,160
Speaker 3: league were like, this guy is incredible. Put him on

1107
00:53:12,160 --> 00:53:13,960
Speaker 3: a really good team and we'll see what he can do.

1108
00:53:14,160 --> 00:53:17,520
Speaker 3: He did that. He was a He contributed defensively. You know,

1109
00:53:17,560 --> 00:53:18,759
Speaker 3: he wasn't just a sieve out there.

1110
00:53:18,800 --> 00:53:19,360
Speaker 1: He was fine.

1111
00:53:19,400 --> 00:53:21,800
Speaker 3: And if you're the best in league history at something,

1112
00:53:22,080 --> 00:53:23,120
Speaker 3: I'm willing to put you in.

1113
00:53:23,160 --> 00:53:25,439
Speaker 1: Which makes me think I'm a fool for having rod

1114
00:53:25,480 --> 00:53:28,640
Speaker 1: Man off my list. Put him on. Not looking good

1115
00:53:28,640 --> 00:53:31,960
Speaker 1: for my last guys here, Oh boy, they might get

1116
00:53:31,960 --> 00:53:34,839
Speaker 1: bombed here. I've been doing this live in the action.

1117
00:53:35,320 --> 00:53:37,040
Speaker 1: What do you think Lee, Reggie or Ray can only

1118
00:53:37,080 --> 00:53:37,440
Speaker 1: pick one?

1119
00:53:37,960 --> 00:53:40,600
Speaker 2: Yeah? Well, see when I did my debate, I had Ray.

1120
00:53:40,840 --> 00:53:43,759
Speaker 2: Excuse me, I had Reggie versus Camelo Anthony because they

1121
00:53:43,760 --> 00:53:46,120
Speaker 2: both had a ton of points, didn't have the championship.

1122
00:53:46,239 --> 00:53:48,880
Speaker 2: So now you're going Reggie versus Ray Allen, and I

1123
00:53:48,920 --> 00:53:51,439
Speaker 2: think they are very similar. But Ray does have those

1124
00:53:51,440 --> 00:53:54,640
Speaker 2: two championships, and he wasn't like just a bit player.

1125
00:53:54,640 --> 00:53:56,799
Speaker 2: He was huge for the Celtics in two thousand and eight,

1126
00:53:56,960 --> 00:53:58,920
Speaker 2: and of course not only just hitting that shot for

1127
00:53:58,920 --> 00:54:01,440
Speaker 2: the Miami Heat, he was still very important player on

1128
00:54:01,520 --> 00:54:04,160
Speaker 2: that team. So he's got he's kind of done that.

1129
00:54:04,239 --> 00:54:06,279
Speaker 2: He's kind of banked the numbers where he was there

1130
00:54:06,320 --> 00:54:09,000
Speaker 2: in Seattle and Milwaukee in his early career, and then

1131
00:54:09,040 --> 00:54:11,600
Speaker 2: he topped it off nicely by getting a couple of championships.

1132
00:54:11,600 --> 00:54:13,919
Speaker 2: And you know, one of those players who Lebron still

1133
00:54:13,960 --> 00:54:15,680
Speaker 2: wanted him to play after he retired. He was like,

1134
00:54:15,680 --> 00:54:17,640
Speaker 2: come and play again, and he's like, nah, I'm done.

1135
00:54:17,680 --> 00:54:20,279
Speaker 2: I'm done. But you know, he's done enough. He's got

1136
00:54:20,320 --> 00:54:23,000
Speaker 2: that record. He's probably you know in ten years, Ray

1137
00:54:23,040 --> 00:54:26,000
Speaker 2: Allen will probably be fiftieth on the three points, you know,

1138
00:54:26,120 --> 00:54:27,720
Speaker 2: because that's how quickly things changed.

1139
00:54:27,760 --> 00:54:30,200
Speaker 1: But yeah, a tough.

1140
00:54:30,040 --> 00:54:32,040
Speaker 2: One because it's like, you know, he was never a

1141
00:54:32,360 --> 00:54:35,040
Speaker 2: superstar as such. He was never like that, like, oh

1142
00:54:35,040 --> 00:54:37,120
Speaker 2: my god, this guy is like, you know, the the

1143
00:54:37,480 --> 00:54:40,399
Speaker 2: top three, top five in the league, very consistent though,

1144
00:54:40,800 --> 00:54:44,799
Speaker 2: you know, a great, great all round player. But yeah,

1145
00:54:44,840 --> 00:54:47,200
Speaker 2: I also think he does get in. I think he

1146
00:54:47,280 --> 00:54:49,160
Speaker 2: does well.

1147
00:54:49,160 --> 00:54:51,759
Speaker 1: Also putting Regie on my list, I just put them

1148
00:54:51,760 --> 00:54:54,200
Speaker 1: both like I was like, if I take one, I

1149
00:54:54,239 --> 00:54:57,200
Speaker 1: sort of have to tick the other. Yeah, Ryan's got

1150
00:54:57,440 --> 00:55:01,120
Speaker 1: twice as many All Star selections as Reggie. But Reggie

1151
00:55:01,200 --> 00:55:04,920
Speaker 1: was the greatest shooter of his era, and he was

1152
00:55:04,960 --> 00:55:08,320
Speaker 1: the NBA's king of three pointers made. He did that

1153
00:55:08,360 --> 00:55:10,120
Speaker 1: in ninety seven to ninety eight and he held that

1154
00:55:10,160 --> 00:55:12,640
Speaker 1: record for more than a decade. I mean, if anything,

1155
00:55:12,640 --> 00:55:14,520
Speaker 1: Reggie's going to get screwed here. If they had named

1156
00:55:14,560 --> 00:55:17,280
Speaker 1: like a top sixty list, like Reggie's like a no braider.

1157
00:55:17,280 --> 00:55:20,479
Speaker 1: He's in there. But because of this big window as

1158
00:55:20,560 --> 00:55:22,799
Speaker 1: potential that he's bumped, I think he ultimately gets in.

1159
00:55:22,840 --> 00:55:25,239
Speaker 1: But with our short list here of twenty five I

1160
00:55:25,520 --> 00:55:27,520
Speaker 1: still got him in. I think he's helped out too

1161
00:55:28,320 --> 00:55:33,200
Speaker 1: by him just having iconic moments that of course sticks

1162
00:55:33,200 --> 00:55:35,680
Speaker 1: with you. He saved the biggest games for the playoffs

1163
00:55:35,880 --> 00:55:38,680
Speaker 1: a lot of times in Madison Square Garden. He's helped

1164
00:55:38,680 --> 00:55:41,640
Speaker 1: out too, I would say by playing like the Dirk

1165
00:55:42,160 --> 00:55:45,319
Speaker 1: or the Duncan or the Kobe with one franchise all

1166
00:55:45,400 --> 00:55:48,520
Speaker 1: eighteen years in Indianapolis with the Pacers. So I got

1167
00:55:48,560 --> 00:55:49,879
Speaker 1: him in. So they're both in there.

1168
00:55:50,200 --> 00:55:53,080
Speaker 2: Twenty five points too for Reggie. Geez, you know, that's

1169
00:55:53,680 --> 00:55:56,560
Speaker 2: a lot. And fifteen trips to the playoffs. I remember

1170
00:55:56,600 --> 00:55:58,640
Speaker 2: looking at that when I was building mine. It's a lot.

1171
00:55:58,640 --> 00:56:02,000
Speaker 2: Reggie was a big time playoff performer. He has got

1172
00:56:02,040 --> 00:56:04,080
Speaker 2: those huge moments, and I think that sticks out. I

1173
00:56:04,080 --> 00:56:06,400
Speaker 2: think people are like, yeah, this guy didn't win the finals,

1174
00:56:06,400 --> 00:56:08,160
Speaker 2: he didn't win the championship and made it against the

1175
00:56:08,239 --> 00:56:11,040
Speaker 2: Lakers in two thousand there, but this guy certainly did

1176
00:56:11,080 --> 00:56:14,279
Speaker 2: step up his game in the playoffs and perform really well.

1177
00:56:14,320 --> 00:56:17,440
Speaker 2: And I also agree. I think the nineteen seasons with Indiana,

1178
00:56:17,600 --> 00:56:20,399
Speaker 2: I think it's like, yeah, you know, he's stuck true

1179
00:56:20,440 --> 00:56:23,439
Speaker 2: to that franchise and that probably just does help his case.

1180
00:56:23,480 --> 00:56:24,520
Speaker 2: It's like, yeah, you know.

1181
00:56:24,520 --> 00:56:24,959
Speaker 1: He's pretty.

1182
00:56:25,040 --> 00:56:28,040
Speaker 2: He's pretty well liked, I think amongst the NBA hierarchy

1183
00:56:28,040 --> 00:56:29,720
Speaker 2: there as well. Steph Curry said he was his favorite

1184
00:56:29,719 --> 00:56:32,160
Speaker 2: player as a kid. So does that help?

1185
00:56:34,680 --> 00:56:37,719
Speaker 1: Who knows? Who knows? He also would have won a

1186
00:56:37,800 --> 00:56:40,399
Speaker 1: championship if some guy in Detroit didn't throw a beer

1187
00:56:40,440 --> 00:56:43,000
Speaker 1: at run our test. We learned the males at the Palace.

1188
00:56:43,000 --> 00:56:46,120
Speaker 1: I'm only half joking. I mean, probably his best chance

1189
00:56:46,200 --> 00:56:48,600
Speaker 1: to get it done there and you get that title,

1190
00:56:48,640 --> 00:56:50,439
Speaker 1: and then I think you're like everybody's like, of course

1191
00:56:50,480 --> 00:56:53,359
Speaker 1: he's there, and without it is a little more on

1192
00:56:53,400 --> 00:56:55,560
Speaker 1: the bubble here. Andree, you said you didn't have him

1193
00:56:55,560 --> 00:56:56,520
Speaker 1: in our short list.

1194
00:56:56,560 --> 00:56:59,280
Speaker 3: Here, he was on my short list, but I didn't

1195
00:56:59,280 --> 00:57:00,799
Speaker 3: have him. And it kind of came down to Ray

1196
00:57:00,840 --> 00:57:03,680
Speaker 3: Allen versus Reggie Miller. For me, I went Ray because

1197
00:57:03,760 --> 00:57:06,960
Speaker 3: of you know, the playoff accomplishments, the championships, and he

1198
00:57:07,040 --> 00:57:11,359
Speaker 3: eventually did pass Reggie. Those guys they are the same

1199
00:57:11,440 --> 00:57:14,359
Speaker 3: generation to me, Reggie Miller in reality, even though Ray

1200
00:57:14,440 --> 00:57:16,600
Speaker 3: came a little bit later, you know, almost ten years

1201
00:57:16,680 --> 00:57:19,720
Speaker 3: later really, but they just still feel like the same

1202
00:57:19,800 --> 00:57:23,000
Speaker 3: generation to me. Where like the leading attempt guy is

1203
00:57:23,040 --> 00:57:25,080
Speaker 3: going to take five threes in a game. You're like, well,

1204
00:57:25,200 --> 00:57:27,920
Speaker 3: this guy's getting crazy from the three point line. Obviously

1205
00:57:27,960 --> 00:57:30,920
Speaker 3: things have changed since then, but they're both nineties two

1206
00:57:30,960 --> 00:57:33,680
Speaker 3: thousand guys. But I can certainly see the argument for

1207
00:57:33,720 --> 00:57:35,200
Speaker 3: Reggie if you just want to put him in as

1208
00:57:35,240 --> 00:57:37,400
Speaker 3: the best pacer ever, I think that's fair as well too.

1209
00:57:37,640 --> 00:57:40,439
Speaker 3: He was there forever. He's the reason people know about

1210
00:57:40,480 --> 00:57:43,240
Speaker 3: the pacers still to this day. Reggie Miller.

1211
00:57:45,040 --> 00:57:47,440
Speaker 1: Okay, so I only have two spots left out of

1212
00:57:47,440 --> 00:57:50,000
Speaker 1: my twenty five, and because I had to do some

1213
00:57:50,080 --> 00:57:53,040
Speaker 1: re shuffling there, getting mellow in the mix, I have

1214
00:57:53,160 --> 00:57:56,480
Speaker 1: three names. Okay, I have three names for two spots.

1215
00:57:56,560 --> 00:57:59,320
Speaker 1: Now what's interesting is one of them is retired and

1216
00:57:59,400 --> 00:58:02,240
Speaker 1: in the Hall of Fame, which you probably are like,

1217
00:58:02,280 --> 00:58:04,240
Speaker 1: come on, that's going to help your case, okay, And

1218
00:58:04,280 --> 00:58:08,640
Speaker 1: then two are active, Lee, can you guess the two

1219
00:58:08,760 --> 00:58:11,640
Speaker 1: active players I'm contemplating. And then and in fact, if

1220
00:58:11,680 --> 00:58:13,560
Speaker 1: you guys want to try and guess even oh no, no,

1221
00:58:13,600 --> 00:58:15,200
Speaker 1: just guess the two active players, because we'll just start

1222
00:58:15,280 --> 00:58:16,080
Speaker 1: naming a bunch of guys.

1223
00:58:16,240 --> 00:58:19,240
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm guessing it's more of an old Rish guy.

1224
00:58:20,440 --> 00:58:24,040
Speaker 1: Okay, well both one is under thirty and one I

1225
00:58:24,080 --> 00:58:28,760
Speaker 1: believe is thirty. Yeah. Yeah, So with both of these guys,

1226
00:58:28,800 --> 00:58:31,960
Speaker 1: I am I'm banking in, of course, them playing a

1227
00:58:31,960 --> 00:58:35,760
Speaker 1: lot more years and accumulating those stats and maybe getting

1228
00:58:35,760 --> 00:58:40,280
Speaker 1: a title in one guy's case or maybe another and another's.

1229
00:58:40,680 --> 00:58:46,720
Speaker 2: Okay, Okay, give me an Anthony Davis, right, Okay, my list?

1230
00:58:46,800 --> 00:58:49,240
Speaker 1: Yeah, okay. He's a four time All NBA, eight time

1231
00:58:49,280 --> 00:58:52,280
Speaker 1: All Star, already four time All Defensive Team honor, he's

1232
00:58:52,280 --> 00:58:56,560
Speaker 1: got the championship, and he's only twenty eight. Yeah, I mean, wow,

1233
00:58:57,240 --> 00:58:59,800
Speaker 1: I know, Lee. I actually did that too. I was like, wow,

1234
00:59:00,120 --> 00:59:03,840
Speaker 1: only twenty eight, jeez, he's got a whole decade. Yeah, possibly,

1235
00:59:03,880 --> 00:59:04,200
Speaker 1: I mean.

1236
00:59:04,120 --> 00:59:05,720
Speaker 2: I mean, it's injured a lot, but yeah, that's the

1237
00:59:05,720 --> 00:59:07,960
Speaker 2: thing that could be the thing that prevents him from

1238
00:59:08,000 --> 00:59:10,800
Speaker 2: getting in there. He has been injury prone throughout his career.

1239
00:59:10,880 --> 00:59:13,600
Speaker 1: They oh, by the way, I'm putting him in then,

1240
00:59:13,640 --> 00:59:16,040
Speaker 1: because I did have him as my tenth active lock.

1241
00:59:16,160 --> 00:59:18,640
Speaker 1: And then I was like, oh, mellow, so, and you

1242
00:59:18,640 --> 00:59:20,600
Speaker 1: know I hear Trey say, yeah, no brainer, Okay, I

1243
00:59:20,640 --> 00:59:23,280
Speaker 1: feel better about that he is in. Uh, can you

1244
00:59:23,360 --> 00:59:26,320
Speaker 1: name the other active player I was I was debating

1245
00:59:26,360 --> 00:59:27,480
Speaker 1: with this one Hall of Famer.

1246
00:59:28,120 --> 00:59:32,440
Speaker 2: Well, I'm wondering or the guard it's a god, you're not.

1247
00:59:32,440 --> 00:59:34,720
Speaker 1: Very good at this lead Tray saying it, Yeah, it's

1248
00:59:35,120 --> 00:59:39,280
Speaker 1: the easiest ones did research? Yeah, do we know the

1249
00:59:39,280 --> 00:59:39,800
Speaker 1: answer to that?

1250
00:59:41,600 --> 00:59:41,760
Speaker 2: Yeah?

1251
00:59:41,960 --> 00:59:45,960
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, Damian Littard, I have in consideration for

1252
00:59:46,000 --> 00:59:48,800
Speaker 1: the final spot of our top twenty five here or

1253
00:59:48,880 --> 00:59:50,880
Speaker 1: new twenty five. I guess we're calling it along with

1254
00:59:50,880 --> 00:59:54,840
Speaker 1: Tracey McGrady, those are the two I'm like down to

1255
00:59:54,880 --> 00:59:56,680
Speaker 1: the wire with. Is it lead? Do you want to

1256
00:59:56,720 --> 00:59:58,400
Speaker 1: do you want to sell me on one more than

1257
00:59:58,400 --> 00:59:59,520
Speaker 1: the other or what's your gut? Say?

1258
00:59:59,600 --> 01:00:01,640
Speaker 2: Well, if if I look at Tracy McGrady, I seem

1259
01:00:01,640 --> 01:00:04,400
Speaker 2: to recall his last good year was when he was

1260
01:00:04,440 --> 01:00:07,720
Speaker 2: twenty eight years old. He actually fell off after coming

1261
01:00:07,760 --> 01:00:10,120
Speaker 2: out of high school. He was great for like four

1262
01:00:10,240 --> 01:00:13,680
Speaker 2: years there. McGrady led the league in scoring twice, you

1263
01:00:13,720 --> 01:00:17,320
Speaker 2: know it was an absolute superstar. But outside of those

1264
01:00:17,400 --> 01:00:21,520
Speaker 2: years he was actually not that good, you know, you know.

1265
01:00:21,520 --> 01:00:23,480
Speaker 1: I mean he did average twenty points per game over

1266
01:00:23,520 --> 01:00:24,560
Speaker 1: a fifteen year career.

1267
01:00:24,640 --> 01:00:28,240
Speaker 2: Yeah, nothing, I think he averaged when he won the

1268
01:00:28,240 --> 01:00:31,840
Speaker 2: score in toitally average thirty one so he certainly and

1269
01:00:32,120 --> 01:00:34,680
Speaker 2: he was incredible at his best, but he sort of

1270
01:00:34,800 --> 01:00:36,800
Speaker 2: was He had that very sort of short peak and

1271
01:00:36,840 --> 01:00:39,400
Speaker 2: then sort of dropped off, whereas Lillard, I think, has

1272
01:00:39,440 --> 01:00:43,600
Speaker 2: been extremely consistent through his ten seasons there. Lillard, of

1273
01:00:43,640 --> 01:00:46,880
Speaker 2: course has only one Conference finals appearance, but he does

1274
01:00:46,960 --> 01:00:50,080
Speaker 2: have huge moments in the playoffs injury two series.

1275
01:00:50,120 --> 01:00:51,000
Speaker 1: I think that helps him.

1276
01:00:51,080 --> 01:00:52,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think it does too, because it's like those

1277
01:00:53,160 --> 01:00:59,800
Speaker 2: iconic moments. I will guess McGrady would have finished probably

1278
01:00:59,800 --> 01:01:02,280
Speaker 2: in the top three in MVP voting at least once,

1279
01:01:02,360 --> 01:01:06,360
Speaker 2: I think probably around two thousand and four, somewhere around there.

1280
01:01:08,440 --> 01:01:10,320
Speaker 2: I'm gonna go Lilard, though I think for the sort

1281
01:01:10,320 --> 01:01:13,520
Speaker 2: of elective, consistent body of work, he might just get

1282
01:01:13,560 --> 01:01:16,280
Speaker 2: in over over McGrady, even though I think Mcgrady's ceiling

1283
01:01:16,320 --> 01:01:19,880
Speaker 2: his peak seasons were probably probably better than Lillard's at

1284
01:01:19,880 --> 01:01:22,080
Speaker 2: this point, I'd have to sort of crunch the numbers

1285
01:01:22,080 --> 01:01:24,280
Speaker 2: a little bit, but I think Lillard's probably going to

1286
01:01:24,360 --> 01:01:27,400
Speaker 2: have a longer body of consistent work.

1287
01:01:27,400 --> 01:01:29,320
Speaker 1: Okay, that's that is a fair way to look at it.

1288
01:01:29,320 --> 01:01:30,920
Speaker 1: I'll just give you the accolades because I've done it

1289
01:01:30,960 --> 01:01:33,160
Speaker 1: with everybody else. McGrady, I said, Hall of Famer, seven

1290
01:01:33,160 --> 01:01:36,600
Speaker 1: time All NBA, seven time All Star, two time scoring champ,

1291
01:01:36,880 --> 01:01:39,080
Speaker 1: those big, big numbers he was putting up, like Lee said,

1292
01:01:39,160 --> 01:01:43,280
Speaker 1: and then Lillard still playing, six time All NBA, six

1293
01:01:43,320 --> 01:01:46,000
Speaker 1: time All Star, Rookie of the Year, you can check

1294
01:01:46,040 --> 01:01:49,720
Speaker 1: that in career average twenty five points per game. My god,

1295
01:01:49,840 --> 01:01:54,440
Speaker 1: for his career. Now he's thirty one, though you know,

1296
01:01:54,480 --> 01:01:57,280
Speaker 1: he's not like Anthony Davis twenty eight, not that he's old.

1297
01:01:57,400 --> 01:01:59,440
Speaker 1: He's got years left and he's obviously going to try

1298
01:01:59,480 --> 01:02:02,000
Speaker 1: and get that title and maybe he ultimately moves on

1299
01:02:02,040 --> 01:02:05,240
Speaker 1: to a super team. Who knows, but t k if

1300
01:02:05,240 --> 01:02:07,480
Speaker 1: you had to pick, and we'll get to snubs. So

1301
01:02:07,520 --> 01:02:09,040
Speaker 1: maybe you don't even have either of these guys in

1302
01:02:09,080 --> 01:02:10,640
Speaker 1: the running. But if you had to pick between te

1303
01:02:10,760 --> 01:02:12,120
Speaker 1: mackin and Dame, who do you go?

1304
01:02:12,760 --> 01:02:16,360
Speaker 3: These are both ultimately snubs for me, Tracy McGrady and

1305
01:02:16,440 --> 01:02:19,360
Speaker 3: Damian Lillard, And like you're saying, their cases are very similar.

1306
01:02:19,400 --> 01:02:21,920
Speaker 3: If I were choosing between the two of them, I

1307
01:02:22,040 --> 01:02:25,320
Speaker 3: think I would probably go with Lillard because to me,

1308
01:02:25,640 --> 01:02:27,880
Speaker 3: even though he's gonna be thirty two at the end

1309
01:02:27,880 --> 01:02:30,560
Speaker 3: of the next season, he seems to be getting better

1310
01:02:30,680 --> 01:02:32,680
Speaker 3: as his career goes on, like he's just getting more

1311
01:02:32,720 --> 01:02:35,680
Speaker 3: confident in his game. His range is extended to half court.

1312
01:02:35,960 --> 01:02:39,000
Speaker 3: At this point, he's seen every single coverage. I don't

1313
01:02:39,000 --> 01:02:41,439
Speaker 3: really I mean, he's got an outside chance of winning

1314
01:02:41,440 --> 01:02:43,800
Speaker 3: an MVP at some point still in his career, you know,

1315
01:02:43,880 --> 01:02:46,200
Speaker 3: if he has, if he ever just thirty for a

1316
01:02:46,240 --> 01:02:49,040
Speaker 3: season or something, which I think is possible, but it

1317
01:02:49,080 --> 01:02:52,360
Speaker 3: doesn't seem likely. But Tracy mcgrady's career is over, he

1318
01:02:52,400 --> 01:02:54,160
Speaker 3: has no chances at that. I think that by the

1319
01:02:54,240 --> 01:02:57,439
Speaker 3: time Lillard's career is over, with the way he has

1320
01:02:57,600 --> 01:03:01,200
Speaker 3: been building and building as he's gone further into his career,

1321
01:03:01,240 --> 01:03:03,120
Speaker 3: we don't know what's gonna happen with where he ends

1322
01:03:03,160 --> 01:03:06,360
Speaker 3: up playing basketball. Maybe he ends up on a super team,

1323
01:03:06,360 --> 01:03:09,560
Speaker 3: maybe he ends up picking a title later in his career.

1324
01:03:09,680 --> 01:03:12,280
Speaker 3: I think that by the time Lillard's career is done,

1325
01:03:12,280 --> 01:03:14,680
Speaker 3: he will have surpassed Tracy McGrady, and I think they'll

1326
01:03:14,720 --> 01:03:16,680
Speaker 3: he'll join McGrady in the Hall of Fame eventually.

1327
01:03:17,160 --> 01:03:20,160
Speaker 1: You guys have convinced me I will make Damiel Lillard

1328
01:03:20,200 --> 01:03:23,800
Speaker 1: my my final selection of my of my twenty five here,

1329
01:03:23,920 --> 01:03:27,000
Speaker 1: which means McGrady is probably the ultimate snub, and it does.

1330
01:03:27,080 --> 01:03:29,840
Speaker 1: It's just tough. I love what you guys are saying,

1331
01:03:29,880 --> 01:03:33,280
Speaker 1: and I'm with you with like what this where Dame

1332
01:03:33,320 --> 01:03:36,160
Speaker 1: could still go, especially winning championships, it's still in play.

1333
01:03:36,760 --> 01:03:39,240
Speaker 1: It's just tough not having a guy like McGrady who's

1334
01:03:39,280 --> 01:03:42,520
Speaker 1: in the Hall of Fame. And I will say to

1335
01:03:42,640 --> 01:03:45,720
Speaker 1: that people were like McGrady hall of Famer, you know,

1336
01:03:45,880 --> 01:03:48,240
Speaker 1: even that one was like, ugh, is that just a

1337
01:03:48,320 --> 01:03:51,240
Speaker 1: light class that year? That t Mac is, you know,

1338
01:03:51,240 --> 01:03:53,360
Speaker 1: sneaking in there. I'm sure you can. You can tell

1339
01:03:53,360 --> 01:03:55,560
Speaker 1: me that too. Obviously incredible player, but he will be

1340
01:03:55,640 --> 01:03:59,640
Speaker 1: my ultimate snub here. As we as we move to

1341
01:03:59,720 --> 01:04:01,280
Speaker 1: a bunch of other guys, and we got to find

1342
01:04:01,280 --> 01:04:03,520
Speaker 1: out who Trey actually had. But I'll go through mine

1343
01:04:04,680 --> 01:04:06,800
Speaker 1: just real quick here, so you guys know it was Duncan,

1344
01:04:06,920 --> 01:04:12,080
Speaker 1: Kobe KG, Dirk Wade, Nash Irison, Gary Payton, Paul Pierce,

1345
01:04:12,160 --> 01:04:15,560
Speaker 1: Jason Kidd. The active players were lebron K, d Curry,

1346
01:04:15,640 --> 01:04:21,120
Speaker 1: Chris Paul, Jannis, Kawhi, Dwight Howard, Russell Westbrook, James Harden

1347
01:04:21,320 --> 01:04:25,040
Speaker 1: and then Mellow Carmelo Anthony and then these final five,

1348
01:04:25,920 --> 01:04:28,800
Speaker 1: Dennis Rodman. I went with the two shooters Ray Allen

1349
01:04:28,840 --> 01:04:31,920
Speaker 1: and Reggie Miller. Anthony Davis TK really drove it home

1350
01:04:31,960 --> 01:04:35,080
Speaker 1: for me. Good, my gut was right. He's in just

1351
01:04:35,120 --> 01:04:36,760
Speaker 1: by still playing it only being twenty eight. And then

1352
01:04:36,800 --> 01:04:39,640
Speaker 1: Damian Lillard over t Mac. I'm very happy with that list.

1353
01:04:39,880 --> 01:04:42,680
Speaker 1: But Trey, who was this one name as we start

1354
01:04:42,760 --> 01:04:45,840
Speaker 1: the snubs section of the podcast that you had in that.

1355
01:04:45,800 --> 01:04:49,120
Speaker 3: I didn't my biggest snub compared to you, This was

1356
01:04:49,200 --> 01:04:54,000
Speaker 3: a lock for me. Retired players Vince Carter.

1357
01:04:54,480 --> 01:05:00,000
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, he's on my list of course. Yeah. Yeah.

1358
01:05:01,160 --> 01:05:05,880
Speaker 3: The immensity of his career is just staggering. Like when

1359
01:05:05,880 --> 01:05:09,240
Speaker 3: you look at his basketball reference page, you've never seen

1360
01:05:09,320 --> 01:05:10,200
Speaker 3: so many numbers.

1361
01:05:10,240 --> 01:05:11,439
Speaker 1: The guy just played.

1362
01:05:11,120 --> 01:05:15,160
Speaker 3: Forever and ever, and you know, at this point we've

1363
01:05:15,160 --> 01:05:17,480
Speaker 3: almost forgotten the dunk contest, Like you watch it back,

1364
01:05:17,520 --> 01:05:18,920
Speaker 3: it feels so grainy.

1365
01:05:18,960 --> 01:05:21,680
Speaker 1: You're like, SD, no, thank you, I can barely see.

1366
01:05:22,600 --> 01:05:26,320
Speaker 3: But it's still one of the hallmark events in NBA history.

1367
01:05:26,840 --> 01:05:28,760
Speaker 3: Nobody likes the way he left the Raptors, but even

1368
01:05:28,840 --> 01:05:32,080
Speaker 3: Raptors fans have embraced him at this point, and he

1369
01:05:32,160 --> 01:05:34,840
Speaker 3: was just such a big contributor to basketball and he's

1370
01:05:34,880 --> 01:05:39,320
Speaker 3: basically played from I mean nineteen ninety seven. Wasn't Vince

1371
01:05:39,320 --> 01:05:41,000
Speaker 3: Carter drafted in nineteen ninety seven?

1372
01:05:41,920 --> 01:05:42,680
Speaker 2: Eight ninety eight?

1373
01:05:42,720 --> 01:05:43,800
Speaker 1: Yea, oh ninety eight.

1374
01:05:43,880 --> 01:05:47,040
Speaker 3: So there was one season in between the announcement of

1375
01:05:47,080 --> 01:05:50,120
Speaker 3: the fifty Greatest and when Vince Carter's career started, and

1376
01:05:50,160 --> 01:05:53,120
Speaker 3: then one season after it ended until the next one

1377
01:05:53,200 --> 01:05:53,800
Speaker 3: was announced.

1378
01:05:53,960 --> 01:05:54,680
Speaker 1: Like I don't know.

1379
01:05:54,760 --> 01:05:58,360
Speaker 3: He was a major player for basically the entire twenty

1380
01:05:58,400 --> 01:06:01,480
Speaker 3: five years of the NBA in between, So I had

1381
01:06:01,520 --> 01:06:04,360
Speaker 3: him as a lock, but honestly, like you could probably

1382
01:06:04,360 --> 01:06:06,640
Speaker 3: swamp Paul Pierce into the lock category.

1383
01:06:06,920 --> 01:06:08,680
Speaker 1: He was in my final five. But I did have

1384
01:06:08,760 --> 01:06:12,960
Speaker 1: Vince Carter on okay, so you didn't have Rodman ultimately

1385
01:06:12,960 --> 01:06:15,280
Speaker 1: on your thing. As we talked, Yeah, I upgraded him.

1386
01:06:15,320 --> 01:06:17,560
Speaker 1: I had some honestly, like when I'm.

1387
01:06:17,400 --> 01:06:20,560
Speaker 3: Looking at this side, some dumb choices here, I'm a

1388
01:06:20,640 --> 01:06:24,640
Speaker 3: little too forward thinking, Like I do have Luka Doncic

1389
01:06:24,680 --> 01:06:28,720
Speaker 3: as my very well player because he's gonna retire with

1390
01:06:28,760 --> 01:06:31,080
Speaker 3: an MVP, and you're gonna want him in your top

1391
01:06:31,120 --> 01:06:34,480
Speaker 3: seventy five with an MVP when he finally retires, especially

1392
01:06:34,680 --> 01:06:37,560
Speaker 3: like he's gonna have Vince Carter like Lebron like stats

1393
01:06:37,560 --> 01:06:39,240
Speaker 3: at the end of his career unless he gets tired

1394
01:06:39,280 --> 01:06:41,160
Speaker 3: of playing basketball since he's been playing since he was

1395
01:06:41,160 --> 01:06:42,360
Speaker 3: eleven years old or whatever.

1396
01:06:42,640 --> 01:06:45,920
Speaker 1: Yeah, when I was getting into the like the final

1397
01:06:46,160 --> 01:06:49,040
Speaker 1: couple of active guys that I was thinking of slipping

1398
01:06:49,080 --> 01:06:51,320
Speaker 1: in here to this, you know, top twenty five of

1399
01:06:51,360 --> 01:06:55,240
Speaker 1: the seventy five. Ultimately we're going with Ada and Lillard,

1400
01:06:55,680 --> 01:06:58,720
Speaker 1: but Luca was there. I'm with you, he was on

1401
01:06:58,760 --> 01:07:01,800
Speaker 1: the very short list. I mean, he's averaging twenty six

1402
01:07:01,840 --> 01:07:04,320
Speaker 1: eighting neat, but he's only played like he's twenty two.

1403
01:07:04,480 --> 01:07:06,880
Speaker 1: Like that is really like two years over the when

1404
01:07:06,920 --> 01:07:10,480
Speaker 1: Shack was named. But you're probably it's a safe bet,

1405
01:07:11,160 --> 01:07:14,360
Speaker 1: and then I think your kitch too. Yeah, is especially

1406
01:07:14,360 --> 01:07:16,240
Speaker 1: with the MVP and he's a three time All start,

1407
01:07:16,280 --> 01:07:18,840
Speaker 1: three time All NBA. Well sorry, we're you gonna say.

1408
01:07:18,920 --> 01:07:21,760
Speaker 2: Well, just that in terms of the international they get, yeahness,

1409
01:07:21,800 --> 01:07:23,520
Speaker 2: they get to be able to put him in because

1410
01:07:23,520 --> 01:07:27,240
Speaker 2: he has the two MVPs and the championship. I think

1411
01:07:27,320 --> 01:07:29,960
Speaker 2: it's a little early for Doncic, as great as he

1412
01:07:30,000 --> 01:07:33,000
Speaker 2: has been. I mean, he's got a very strong case.

1413
01:07:33,040 --> 01:07:36,440
Speaker 2: But it's like, if we're slipping in Doncic, then someone

1414
01:07:36,480 --> 01:07:39,439
Speaker 2: like Mellow probably does get bumped. And it's like we've

1415
01:07:39,480 --> 01:07:42,560
Speaker 2: seen this whole career through Mellow. Now Doncic is probably

1416
01:07:42,600 --> 01:07:45,080
Speaker 2: gonna have a better career than Mellow, but right Mellow's

1417
01:07:45,120 --> 01:07:47,560
Speaker 2: got that already on the board. Don Chic, we are

1418
01:07:47,600 --> 01:07:49,880
Speaker 2: sort of projecting that he will continue to grow and.

1419
01:07:50,200 --> 01:07:54,240
Speaker 1: Well donchets right now, let's be honest. It's basically, yeah,

1420
01:07:54,240 --> 01:07:57,040
Speaker 1: Grant Hill, young grand Hill. Well, yeah, and I start

1421
01:07:57,120 --> 01:07:59,120
Speaker 1: with the Bang rookie year and you did have grand

1422
01:07:59,200 --> 01:08:00,880
Speaker 1: Hill on that one artest by surprise.

1423
01:08:01,000 --> 01:08:04,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, And that was the thing. I think that when

1424
01:08:04,720 --> 01:08:08,840
Speaker 2: you look at the final numbers for Grant Hill, for example,

1425
01:08:09,520 --> 01:08:11,360
Speaker 2: he does miss out. But I think if you were

1426
01:08:11,400 --> 01:08:13,360
Speaker 2: to sort of go on the projection at the time,

1427
01:08:13,600 --> 01:08:16,599
Speaker 2: you know, and again pre injury, I think he's an

1428
01:08:16,920 --> 01:08:21,280
Speaker 2: absolute certainty for this list. So yeah, it's tough when

1429
01:08:21,280 --> 01:08:23,400
Speaker 2: you get to Dune it had three seasons, because you're like,

1430
01:08:23,479 --> 01:08:26,639
Speaker 2: oh man, we we do we should put him in there.

1431
01:08:26,680 --> 01:08:28,680
Speaker 2: But I think he's going to miss out. I just

1432
01:08:28,720 --> 01:08:29,640
Speaker 2: don't think he gets here.

1433
01:08:29,720 --> 01:08:31,680
Speaker 1: I can't wait to see what the actual voters do

1434
01:08:31,760 --> 01:08:34,479
Speaker 1: because and I just want to again clarify for what's

1435
01:08:34,520 --> 01:08:37,639
Speaker 1: probably the tenth time we've done our top twenty five.

1436
01:08:37,680 --> 01:08:40,040
Speaker 1: But all these names were saying, I truthfully believe a

1437
01:08:40,080 --> 01:08:43,240
Speaker 1: lot of them will still sneak into the actual seventy

1438
01:08:43,280 --> 01:08:46,559
Speaker 1: five list, But Luca and Yokic, I don't know. I

1439
01:08:46,560 --> 01:08:49,840
Speaker 1: don't know if the Blue Ribbon panel will we'll be

1440
01:08:49,880 --> 01:08:52,479
Speaker 1: able to go, all right, we're just betting on this,

1441
01:08:52,720 --> 01:08:55,240
Speaker 1: like we got it right with Shaq way back then,

1442
01:08:55,240 --> 01:08:58,519
Speaker 1: and let's try it again, Like, y honest, even you're

1443
01:08:58,520 --> 01:09:00,160
Speaker 1: almost at the point with Giannist can not even play

1444
01:09:00,200 --> 01:09:02,320
Speaker 1: another single game, and you're still gonna be like he was.

1445
01:09:02,760 --> 01:09:05,240
Speaker 1: That guy was pretty unique, you know, and won a

1446
01:09:05,320 --> 01:09:07,880
Speaker 1: title and was an MVP and defense player there, Like

1447
01:09:08,040 --> 01:09:11,880
Speaker 1: you're fine, but you'd beat I don't know, you be

1448
01:09:11,880 --> 01:09:14,679
Speaker 1: a little uneasier, like God, please stay healthy, that's all. Yeah,

1449
01:09:15,840 --> 01:09:18,080
Speaker 1: and you'll catch I think I think both of those guys. Yeah,

1450
01:09:18,160 --> 01:09:21,160
Speaker 1: the other I said, Draymond Green, I don't think he's

1451
01:09:21,160 --> 01:09:23,720
Speaker 1: going to make the official list. I think he's going

1452
01:09:23,760 --> 01:09:26,040
Speaker 1: to be a classic great snub that people are going

1453
01:09:26,120 --> 01:09:30,160
Speaker 1: to debate. Yeah, especially if fraud that makes it. Kyrie

1454
01:09:30,240 --> 01:09:34,559
Speaker 1: Irving is like, I'm so I can't wait to find

1455
01:09:34,560 --> 01:09:37,120
Speaker 1: out if he actually makes the NBA seventy five. I

1456
01:09:37,160 --> 01:09:39,400
Speaker 1: don't think he's going to, and I think that will

1457
01:09:39,439 --> 01:09:43,320
Speaker 1: be for a lot of fodder for sure. It's three

1458
01:09:43,320 --> 01:09:46,240
Speaker 1: time All NBA, seven time All Star Rookie of Year

1459
01:09:46,240 --> 01:09:49,439
Speaker 1: as well. He's got the championship average like twenty three

1460
01:09:49,439 --> 01:09:52,000
Speaker 1: points per game, so that in theory could just go up.

1461
01:09:52,040 --> 01:09:53,960
Speaker 1: So I just don't think he'll make it. Okay, So

1462
01:09:54,040 --> 01:09:57,479
Speaker 1: Grant Hill was one of the snubs. You know, Vince

1463
01:09:57,560 --> 01:10:01,200
Speaker 1: is a good one. Vince only made two All NBA

1464
01:10:01,280 --> 01:10:04,120
Speaker 1: teams too. I find that like shocking. I made a

1465
01:10:04,160 --> 01:10:06,800
Speaker 1: lot more All Star teams. Played forever. He's the greatest

1466
01:10:06,880 --> 01:10:08,920
Speaker 1: dunker ever too. If we're talking about Rodin and possibly

1467
01:10:08,960 --> 01:10:11,559
Speaker 1: be in the greatest rebound ever, I think I think.

1468
01:10:11,479 --> 01:10:14,439
Speaker 2: Vince gets in just because it's like, you just played forever, man, you.

1469
01:10:14,400 --> 01:10:17,639
Speaker 1: Deserve yeah, I mean if Robert Paris, yeah.

1470
01:10:17,680 --> 01:10:20,160
Speaker 2: And the problem, you know, Vince, We all felt with

1471
01:10:20,280 --> 01:10:22,000
Speaker 2: Vince that he left a little bit on the table.

1472
01:10:22,080 --> 01:10:24,040
Speaker 2: You know, it was like, man, you didn't really even

1473
01:10:24,040 --> 01:10:26,240
Speaker 2: get close to a championship. We felt that he could

1474
01:10:26,280 --> 01:10:28,920
Speaker 2: have done more, he could have performed better, but ultimately

1475
01:10:28,960 --> 01:10:31,400
Speaker 2: he just kept on turning up, and it's kind of like, yeah,

1476
01:10:31,520 --> 01:10:33,960
Speaker 2: all right, you're in. You're in because you have to

1477
01:10:34,000 --> 01:10:35,679
Speaker 2: make sometimes a bit of a case for a guy.

1478
01:10:35,680 --> 01:10:37,880
Speaker 2: And for Vince, I think it is just like longevity,

1479
01:10:38,479 --> 01:10:42,000
Speaker 2: you know, more than an endurance longevity. You know, he

1480
01:10:42,120 --> 01:10:43,640
Speaker 2: just loved the game so much. He was playing for

1481
01:10:43,680 --> 01:10:49,200
Speaker 2: the Kings and the for like three years.

1482
01:10:50,000 --> 01:10:54,120
Speaker 1: Everybody, okay, so some other some other big snubs, you know,

1483
01:10:54,200 --> 01:10:56,880
Speaker 1: big names that again I think are going to be

1484
01:10:56,920 --> 01:10:59,640
Speaker 1: there when the NBA seventy five list is announced, some

1485
01:10:59,680 --> 01:11:02,559
Speaker 1: hole of to Kembe Mtumble. You know you brought him

1486
01:11:02,640 --> 01:11:06,200
Speaker 1: up earlierly. A four time Defensive Player of the Year,

1487
01:11:06,400 --> 01:11:10,080
Speaker 1: an incredible player, three All NBA, eight All Stars, six

1488
01:11:10,120 --> 01:11:14,920
Speaker 1: All Defensive Teams. Pretty good. Alonzo Mourning is one we debatedly.

1489
01:11:15,040 --> 01:11:17,000
Speaker 1: I think way back in the day. I forget who

1490
01:11:17,000 --> 01:11:18,040
Speaker 1: you pitted him against.

1491
01:11:18,760 --> 01:11:20,760
Speaker 2: Well, that was the controversy. I had him actually against

1492
01:11:20,800 --> 01:11:24,200
Speaker 2: Steve Nash because I'll just rehash my argument here for

1493
01:11:24,240 --> 01:11:28,519
Speaker 2: Alonso Morning. For his career, he was He's a Hall

1494
01:11:28,520 --> 01:11:29,200
Speaker 2: of Famer already.

1495
01:11:29,280 --> 01:11:29,639
Speaker 1: That helps.

1496
01:11:29,680 --> 01:11:32,760
Speaker 2: Two time All NBA okay, not huge, seven time All Star,

1497
01:11:32,840 --> 01:11:35,120
Speaker 2: two time Defensive Player of the year, so he has that,

1498
01:11:35,479 --> 01:11:38,439
Speaker 2: and he finished second and third in MVP voting in

1499
01:11:38,520 --> 01:11:40,720
Speaker 2: consecutive years, and he was a ten year guy where

1500
01:11:40,720 --> 01:11:44,360
Speaker 2: he averaged twenty and ten and he got that championship

1501
01:11:44,360 --> 01:11:46,679
Speaker 2: at the end of his career. Yeah, his raw numbers though,

1502
01:11:46,720 --> 01:11:50,000
Speaker 2: only fourteen thousand points and seven thousand rebounds surprising. I

1503
01:11:50,040 --> 01:11:51,400
Speaker 2: thought there was a little bit more than that. But

1504
01:11:51,439 --> 01:11:53,320
Speaker 2: I think if you look at those first ten years

1505
01:11:53,320 --> 01:11:55,599
Speaker 2: of his career and then the injuries and the illness

1506
01:11:55,600 --> 01:11:58,640
Speaker 2: and the kidney transplant things like that, you know derailed him.

1507
01:11:58,680 --> 01:12:00,479
Speaker 2: But he did pick up that champion chip with the

1508
01:12:00,479 --> 01:12:03,400
Speaker 2: hate at the end. So I had him a lot

1509
01:12:03,439 --> 01:12:06,439
Speaker 2: higher than obviously you guys do. But I think he's

1510
01:12:06,439 --> 01:12:08,600
Speaker 2: got a strong case still. I think I wouldn't be

1511
01:12:08,640 --> 01:12:09,680
Speaker 2: surprised if he makes it.

1512
01:12:10,160 --> 01:12:12,639
Speaker 1: I think so, especially again, you're in the Hall of Fame.

1513
01:12:12,680 --> 01:12:16,120
Speaker 1: You're getting a little a little bump probably from these

1514
01:12:16,160 --> 01:12:19,720
Speaker 1: people that are picking it along with other bigs that

1515
01:12:19,760 --> 01:12:21,240
Speaker 1: are now in the Hall of Fame. Let's throw him

1516
01:12:21,280 --> 01:12:25,960
Speaker 1: out there. Chris Weber, Chris Bosh, who we've talked about

1517
01:12:25,960 --> 01:12:29,200
Speaker 1: a little bit, and I think Yo Ming is going

1518
01:12:29,280 --> 01:12:32,639
Speaker 1: to get some consideration. Definitely, spite playing under five hundred games,

1519
01:12:32,680 --> 01:12:36,120
Speaker 1: that's the huge knock. But five time All NBA and

1520
01:12:36,160 --> 01:12:38,639
Speaker 1: eight time All Star, and you know we've we've heard

1521
01:12:38,680 --> 01:12:42,240
Speaker 1: Shack talk glowingly about Yao Ming and how just dominant

1522
01:12:42,240 --> 01:12:44,920
Speaker 1: he actually was. So those are three big guys and

1523
01:12:45,080 --> 01:12:47,760
Speaker 1: uh one more big guy too, Pal Gasol, Well we'll

1524
01:12:47,760 --> 01:12:50,760
Speaker 1: get and deserve some consideration, Trey, what do you think? Yeah,

1525
01:12:50,840 --> 01:12:52,960
Speaker 1: Pow was a guy that was pretty high on my list.

1526
01:12:53,040 --> 01:12:55,160
Speaker 3: I ended up dropping him from my final five for

1527
01:12:55,360 --> 01:12:58,360
Speaker 3: Jolkich because Yokicic has the MVP and I just think

1528
01:12:58,360 --> 01:13:00,719
Speaker 3: he's going to continue to build on his career. Obviously

1529
01:13:00,760 --> 01:13:03,720
Speaker 3: he's still young here, and yeah, getting an MVP is

1530
01:13:03,760 --> 01:13:07,280
Speaker 3: pretty good. Outside of Bob McAdoo, all of the MVPs

1531
01:13:07,320 --> 01:13:10,840
Speaker 3: in league history made it to that original fifty list

1532
01:13:10,920 --> 01:13:13,080
Speaker 3: or they're gonna make it, except for one other guy,

1533
01:13:13,240 --> 01:13:14,120
Speaker 3: Derek Rose.

1534
01:13:14,920 --> 01:13:16,120
Speaker 1: I don't really think he.

1535
01:13:16,160 --> 01:13:18,640
Speaker 3: Has a case to make it except for having an

1536
01:13:18,720 --> 01:13:23,000
Speaker 3: MVP and the fact that Bill Walton did make this

1537
01:13:23,160 --> 01:13:27,000
Speaker 3: top fifty list. Bill Walton fewest points on the Top fifty,

1538
01:13:27,200 --> 01:13:30,640
Speaker 3: only six two and fifteen points, the only guy with

1539
01:13:30,800 --> 01:13:33,840
Speaker 3: less than four All Star appearances, two time All Star

1540
01:13:34,680 --> 01:13:38,639
Speaker 3: Bill Walton was obviously he was an injuried plague player,

1541
01:13:38,880 --> 01:13:41,320
Speaker 3: just like Derek Rose was. The thing though with Walton

1542
01:13:41,520 --> 01:13:45,000
Speaker 3: was he played on UCLA and he played for the Celtics,

1543
01:13:45,000 --> 01:13:48,240
Speaker 3: which are like two of the five most famous basketball

1544
01:13:48,280 --> 01:13:50,599
Speaker 3: teams of all time when team people knew like about

1545
01:13:50,640 --> 01:13:52,640
Speaker 3: ten basketball teams, So like, how are you going to

1546
01:13:52,680 --> 01:13:54,360
Speaker 3: keep him off? He was obviously one of the best

1547
01:13:54,360 --> 01:13:57,439
Speaker 3: guys out there. I don't know if Rose picks up

1548
01:13:57,479 --> 01:13:59,760
Speaker 3: a title, Like if Rose picks up a title, he

1549
01:13:59,800 --> 01:14:02,040
Speaker 3: could maybe have a little bit of a case there

1550
01:14:02,040 --> 01:14:04,639
Speaker 3: because it would be so similar to Bill Walton. It's

1551
01:14:04,640 --> 01:14:06,479
Speaker 3: the exact same case, except for there have been a

1552
01:14:06,479 --> 01:14:09,320
Speaker 3: whole bunch of really great players. Ultimately Rose, I didn't

1553
01:14:09,320 --> 01:14:12,000
Speaker 3: give that much consideration too, But there are just so

1554
01:14:12,080 --> 01:14:14,840
Speaker 3: many great guys like I couldn't believe I even put

1555
01:14:14,920 --> 01:14:17,280
Speaker 3: Rudy Gobert on my list, But he's there because you

1556
01:14:17,439 --> 01:14:19,639
Speaker 3: kind of got to consider him along the same lines

1557
01:14:19,640 --> 01:14:22,240
Speaker 3: of Dwight Howard and you know, a lines of Morning

1558
01:14:22,240 --> 01:14:24,599
Speaker 3: If you want to consider him, dekembe as well the

1559
01:14:24,600 --> 01:14:26,400
Speaker 3: best defender of his generation.

1560
01:14:26,720 --> 01:14:27,920
Speaker 1: I don't have him making it.

1561
01:14:28,000 --> 01:14:30,120
Speaker 3: But if you're the best at something, when you're playing,

1562
01:14:30,160 --> 01:14:31,559
Speaker 3: you at least got to get on a list here.

1563
01:14:31,840 --> 01:14:35,600
Speaker 2: And again, I think they will have a certain delegation

1564
01:14:35,760 --> 01:14:38,439
Speaker 2: to just those defensive guys have, whether that's two or

1565
01:14:38,479 --> 01:14:40,679
Speaker 2: three or four. But they've almost got to say, listen,

1566
01:14:40,680 --> 01:14:43,280
Speaker 2: we can't just have only scores on here. We've got

1567
01:14:43,320 --> 01:14:46,280
Speaker 2: to recognize that as well. And Rudy's a three time

1568
01:14:46,720 --> 01:14:49,240
Speaker 2: DPO y man now, so you know he's got some

1569
01:14:49,640 --> 01:14:51,800
Speaker 2: He's got a strong case, and it is gonna I

1570
01:14:51,840 --> 01:14:55,639
Speaker 2: think Ben Wallace, to Kemba, Dwight, you know, Dwight's probably

1571
01:14:55,640 --> 01:14:57,240
Speaker 2: a little bit ahead of those guys because he was

1572
01:14:57,520 --> 01:15:00,519
Speaker 2: nearly the MVP when Rose won it, actually, and he

1573
01:15:00,600 --> 01:15:03,160
Speaker 2: was so dominant, whereas someone like to Kemba, as great

1574
01:15:03,160 --> 01:15:05,120
Speaker 2: as was defensive, you don't sort of automatically think of

1575
01:15:05,200 --> 01:15:08,439
Speaker 2: him as a particularly strong offensive players like Rudy Gobert,

1576
01:15:08,560 --> 01:15:12,080
Speaker 2: you know. So, yeah, that's gonna be interesting to see

1577
01:15:12,120 --> 01:15:15,160
Speaker 2: what the split is as is guys, you know, designated

1578
01:15:15,240 --> 01:15:19,280
Speaker 2: defense first guys versus offense guys, because like Ben Wallace

1579
01:15:19,320 --> 01:15:23,240
Speaker 2: too exactly, there has to be at least two or

1580
01:15:23,240 --> 01:15:24,720
Speaker 2: three of those guys on there. I just think there

1581
01:15:24,760 --> 01:15:25,120
Speaker 2: has to be.

1582
01:15:25,200 --> 01:15:28,479
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think they there will be, And I'll just

1583
01:15:28,520 --> 01:15:31,720
Speaker 1: throw two more names, two more Spurs that are going

1584
01:15:31,800 --> 01:15:34,000
Speaker 1: to get some consideration. Maybe they make the NBA seventy

1585
01:15:34,040 --> 01:15:39,200
Speaker 1: five list. Manu Ginobili, who definitely does not have like

1586
01:15:39,240 --> 01:15:41,759
Speaker 1: the accolades. He's only a two time All NBA player

1587
01:15:41,800 --> 01:15:45,000
Speaker 1: and All Star, that's it. But he's a four time champ,

1588
01:15:45,160 --> 01:15:48,040
Speaker 1: and you know, he's got a case that maybe he was.

1589
01:15:48,280 --> 01:15:50,280
Speaker 1: He's one of the greatest six man of all time,

1590
01:15:50,680 --> 01:15:53,840
Speaker 1: So put take that into consideration. Playing on a you know,

1591
01:15:54,240 --> 01:15:55,720
Speaker 1: a dynasty in the sense that they won a lot

1592
01:15:55,760 --> 01:15:58,280
Speaker 1: of championships, and then Tony Parker, four time All NBA,

1593
01:15:58,400 --> 01:16:00,360
Speaker 1: six time All Star, four time champ, and he's got

1594
01:16:00,360 --> 01:16:04,479
Speaker 1: the one Finals MVP with San Antonio. It feels rate

1595
01:16:04,600 --> 01:16:08,080
Speaker 1: not having them in the top twenty fives. But again, Leo,

1596
01:16:08,080 --> 01:16:10,480
Speaker 1: I think they'll be in the mix here for the realist.

1597
01:16:10,360 --> 01:16:12,639
Speaker 2: Yes, and man who should have had the Finals MVP

1598
01:16:12,720 --> 01:16:14,479
Speaker 2: in two thousand and five. That would have made his

1599
01:16:14,560 --> 01:16:17,040
Speaker 2: case even spicy because I think he was the best

1600
01:16:17,040 --> 01:16:20,040
Speaker 2: player on that team. But yeah, those two guys, because

1601
01:16:20,080 --> 01:16:22,920
Speaker 2: of what the Spurs did collectively over you know, when

1602
01:16:22,960 --> 01:16:25,080
Speaker 2: de Parker came in in ninety nine Manu in two

1603
01:16:25,120 --> 01:16:27,639
Speaker 2: thousand and one, two thousand and two. But they got

1604
01:16:27,880 --> 01:16:30,799
Speaker 2: five championships for Duncan and four for those other guys,

1605
01:16:31,000 --> 01:16:33,360
Speaker 2: and they were just there all the time, great players.

1606
01:16:33,360 --> 01:16:36,280
Speaker 2: They sacrificed their own numbers for the greater good in

1607
01:16:36,320 --> 01:16:39,240
Speaker 2: that sense, and that's why the individual numbers for both

1608
01:16:39,240 --> 01:16:41,320
Speaker 2: of those guys would be would be far lower than

1609
01:16:41,320 --> 01:16:43,080
Speaker 2: some of the other guys on the list. But you know,

1610
01:16:43,160 --> 01:16:46,439
Speaker 2: for me, I think Managenobli is easily one of the

1611
01:16:46,439 --> 01:16:49,439
Speaker 2: top fifty players we've ever seen. But that's my personal

1612
01:16:49,479 --> 01:16:51,920
Speaker 2: opinion because I just love watching him play and I

1613
01:16:51,960 --> 01:16:54,320
Speaker 2: thought he was great, But he played on a team

1614
01:16:54,320 --> 01:16:56,960
Speaker 2: where his role was a significantly reduced compared to where

1615
01:16:57,000 --> 01:16:58,600
Speaker 2: he could have gone if he was decided to be

1616
01:16:58,680 --> 01:17:00,479
Speaker 2: like I want to go to a team and the

1617
01:17:00,600 --> 01:17:01,679
Speaker 2: stop player on the teak.

1618
01:17:01,960 --> 01:17:06,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's It's like if Janobili had turned into James

1619
01:17:06,080 --> 01:17:08,280
Speaker 1: Harden was like, exactly what my own team, Let's see

1620
01:17:08,280 --> 01:17:09,679
Speaker 1: what I can do with my own team, he probably

1621
01:17:09,760 --> 01:17:12,800
Speaker 1: would have put up pretty gaudy numbers. I'm with you.

1622
01:17:13,439 --> 01:17:16,200
Speaker 1: Those are my snubs. Is there anyone else that you

1623
01:17:16,240 --> 01:17:20,759
Speaker 1: would like to mention as as a top twenty five

1624
01:17:20,960 --> 01:17:22,479
Speaker 1: lock snub for this list.

1625
01:17:23,240 --> 01:17:26,040
Speaker 3: I was trying my hardest to get Zion Williamson on

1626
01:17:26,080 --> 01:17:29,639
Speaker 3: this list. States when we do this again twenty five

1627
01:17:29,720 --> 01:17:31,439
Speaker 3: years from now, he's gonna be on the list.

1628
01:17:32,240 --> 01:17:33,479
Speaker 1: You heard it here first.

1629
01:17:34,160 --> 01:17:37,880
Speaker 3: But you know, one season of shack like numbers, I

1630
01:17:37,880 --> 01:17:40,600
Speaker 3: don't think quite surpasses some of these other guys. But

1631
01:17:40,600 --> 01:17:42,600
Speaker 3: I was, I was working my best to try and

1632
01:17:42,600 --> 01:17:44,360
Speaker 3: get him on there. And you mentioned Paal Gasol. That

1633
01:17:44,400 --> 01:17:47,240
Speaker 3: was a guy I wanted to include as well. But

1634
01:17:47,400 --> 01:17:49,599
Speaker 3: there are just so many great number ones that it's

1635
01:17:49,600 --> 01:17:52,240
Speaker 3: hard to go to the next level for sure.

1636
01:17:52,800 --> 01:17:54,800
Speaker 1: Lee anyone else you want to throw in the in

1637
01:17:54,800 --> 01:17:55,120
Speaker 1: the middle?

1638
01:17:55,240 --> 01:17:57,720
Speaker 2: Well, you mentioned Chris Webber, and I think he does

1639
01:17:57,760 --> 01:18:01,400
Speaker 2: have a pretty strong, consistent case. Obviously he struggled to

1640
01:18:01,400 --> 01:18:04,679
Speaker 2: get into the Hall of Fame there, but a twenty

1641
01:18:04,680 --> 01:18:08,559
Speaker 2: to ten guy throughout his career, and those Sacramento Kings

1642
01:18:08,560 --> 01:18:12,000
Speaker 2: teams are so good. Of course, Robert Hary is hitting

1643
01:18:12,000 --> 01:18:13,960
Speaker 2: that shot, and if he doesn't hit that shot, I

1644
01:18:13,960 --> 01:18:16,360
Speaker 2: think Chris Webber has a championship, but he doesn't, so

1645
01:18:17,280 --> 01:18:20,800
Speaker 2: you know, he's got a very strong case. But I

1646
01:18:20,880 --> 01:18:22,960
Speaker 2: just wonder if people overlook it because it was like

1647
01:18:23,000 --> 01:18:25,760
Speaker 2: he didn't quite get to the finals in the end

1648
01:18:25,760 --> 01:18:28,519
Speaker 2: when he should have great, great player when he came out.

1649
01:18:28,760 --> 01:18:30,640
Speaker 2: You know, I don't have all the accolades here, but

1650
01:18:30,680 --> 01:18:33,280
Speaker 2: I think he was like eight time All Star, you know,

1651
01:18:33,520 --> 01:18:36,519
Speaker 2: brilliant player at both ends of the floor, passer as well.

1652
01:18:37,560 --> 01:18:39,320
Speaker 2: But he just seems like he's going to be on

1653
01:18:39,360 --> 01:18:42,280
Speaker 2: the outside looking in. I think because of those other guys,

1654
01:18:43,200 --> 01:18:45,920
Speaker 2: the numbers that you mentioned earlier in the accolades, I

1655
01:18:45,920 --> 01:18:47,840
Speaker 2: think that just keeps him out. Like if he was

1656
01:18:47,880 --> 01:18:50,160
Speaker 2: going up against someone like Reggie Miller, for example, Let's

1657
01:18:50,160 --> 01:18:52,800
Speaker 2: say there's one spot between those two guys, I think

1658
01:18:52,840 --> 01:18:54,840
Speaker 2: Reggie beats him. I think he gets in over him.

1659
01:18:54,920 --> 01:18:57,639
Speaker 2: So I think Webber's going to be on the outside

1660
01:18:57,680 --> 01:18:58,000
Speaker 2: looking in.

1661
01:18:58,439 --> 01:19:01,439
Speaker 1: Yeah. I mean we've named like a good fifteen to

1662
01:19:01,479 --> 01:19:05,559
Speaker 1: twenty snubs, just the top twenty five, and well, I'll

1663
01:19:05,560 --> 01:19:07,240
Speaker 1: tell you they're not all going to be on the

1664
01:19:07,720 --> 01:19:10,160
Speaker 1: NBA seventy five. So a lot of these guys I

1665
01:19:10,160 --> 01:19:11,960
Speaker 1: think that we have listed over the Lott throw.

1666
01:19:11,800 --> 01:19:16,080
Speaker 3: You two more, the only two names that I have

1667
01:19:16,160 --> 01:19:18,800
Speaker 3: on any of my lists that haven't been mentioned yet.

1668
01:19:19,160 --> 01:19:23,520
Speaker 3: So I gotta tire him off Joel Embiid. Yeah, yeah,

1669
01:19:23,600 --> 01:19:26,320
Speaker 3: I mean he's gonna have assuming he stays healthy, he's

1670
01:19:26,320 --> 01:19:28,840
Speaker 3: gonna have some great counting stats. Wouldn't be surprising if

1671
01:19:28,880 --> 01:19:31,120
Speaker 3: he picks up an MVP or a Defensive Player of

1672
01:19:31,160 --> 01:19:34,200
Speaker 3: the Year at some point. Just a dominant player as

1673
01:19:34,240 --> 01:19:37,000
Speaker 3: we have seen. And Paul George, who has put together

1674
01:19:37,040 --> 01:19:40,400
Speaker 3: a nice career, doesn't have a lot of playoff success yet,

1675
01:19:40,479 --> 01:19:43,280
Speaker 3: but had a great postseason run with Kawhi Leonard going

1676
01:19:43,320 --> 01:19:46,720
Speaker 3: down during the twenty twenty one season, and stacked up

1677
01:19:46,720 --> 01:19:49,679
Speaker 3: a lot of accolades playing with Indiana before he started

1678
01:19:49,680 --> 01:19:51,880
Speaker 3: hopping around the league a little bit. I don't think

1679
01:19:51,920 --> 01:19:53,840
Speaker 3: either of those guys are really making the list, but

1680
01:19:54,840 --> 01:19:57,120
Speaker 3: maybe the next time they do it.

1681
01:19:57,360 --> 01:19:59,519
Speaker 1: The internet's going to have some fun if Paul George

1682
01:19:59,560 --> 01:20:03,120
Speaker 1: makes the five plus. So I hope it happens. Okay,

1683
01:20:03,400 --> 01:20:06,639
Speaker 1: we've named a lot of guys. Hopefully that was fun

1684
01:20:06,640 --> 01:20:09,479
Speaker 1: for you watching or listening. It was fun for us

1685
01:20:09,479 --> 01:20:13,000
Speaker 1: for sure. Let us know well who we missed or

1686
01:20:13,080 --> 01:20:16,120
Speaker 1: maybe some of the selections that we have again as locks,

1687
01:20:16,160 --> 01:20:19,000
Speaker 1: like the top twenty five locks, new locks for this

1688
01:20:19,200 --> 01:20:22,479
Speaker 1: ultimate list that's coming up here soon from the NBA

1689
01:20:22,680 --> 01:20:26,400
Speaker 1: seventy five. Let us know. Tweet at us at No

1690
01:20:26,479 --> 01:20:29,559
Speaker 1: Dunk Sink email, email in your thoughts No Dunks at

1691
01:20:29,560 --> 01:20:31,000
Speaker 1: the Athletic dot com, or you can leave them in

1692
01:20:31,040 --> 01:20:33,760
Speaker 1: the YouTube comments below. If you haven't already subscribed to

1693
01:20:33,800 --> 01:20:35,800
Speaker 1: No Dunks on YouTube, it helps us out. And if

1694
01:20:35,800 --> 01:20:38,240
Speaker 1: you're a fan on Apple Podcast, leave us that five

1695
01:20:38,280 --> 01:20:40,519
Speaker 1: star rating and review. All right, I like this, you know,

1696
01:20:40,560 --> 01:20:43,479
Speaker 1: I like the car talk. I'm loving the Fast and

1697
01:20:43,520 --> 01:20:45,360
Speaker 1: Furious franchise. But we're getting close to the start of

1698
01:20:45,400 --> 01:20:48,240
Speaker 1: the season, so this was nice to get the old

1699
01:20:48,280 --> 01:20:51,280
Speaker 1: basketball bring gears move in once again. Lee. I know

1700
01:20:51,320 --> 01:20:55,000
Speaker 1: you do this every day, but let's take a break.

1701
01:20:55,080 --> 01:20:57,000
Speaker 2: All right, Listen, just before we go, I'm just gonna

1702
01:20:57,080 --> 01:20:59,720
Speaker 2: leave this one with you. By Thompson's got a case.

1703
01:21:00,000 --> 01:21:04,680
Speaker 1: Oh there you're talking. You know why he's going to

1704
01:21:04,720 --> 01:21:06,440
Speaker 1: be He's going to be on the outside.

1705
01:21:06,120 --> 01:21:09,639
Speaker 2: Looking at five NBA All Star appearances, and he's got

1706
01:21:09,680 --> 01:21:15,599
Speaker 2: a defensive team as well, spot solid, three championships. The shooting,

1707
01:21:15,640 --> 01:21:18,519
Speaker 2: I mean, you know, Steph is going to be the one.

1708
01:21:18,520 --> 01:21:20,960
Speaker 2: But but and Clay's missed two seasons, so that sort

1709
01:21:20,960 --> 01:21:23,960
Speaker 2: of affects him for sure. But if Clay stays healthy,

1710
01:21:24,479 --> 01:21:27,759
Speaker 2: knowing that he just loves the game. He's got fifteen

1711
01:21:27,840 --> 01:21:30,680
Speaker 2: years left still to play in the game. He'll be

1712
01:21:30,680 --> 01:21:32,639
Speaker 2: shooting threes until he's forty five in the NBA.

1713
01:21:32,720 --> 01:21:33,280
Speaker 1: I can see it.

1714
01:21:33,400 --> 01:21:37,040
Speaker 2: So Klay Thompson still has a chance to hold that record.

1715
01:21:37,520 --> 01:21:39,439
Speaker 2: But also he's just been a part of that Warriors

1716
01:21:39,560 --> 01:21:42,559
Speaker 2: dynasty and that certainly is going to help his case.

1717
01:21:43,040 --> 01:21:45,320
Speaker 1: We'll see. As much as I love Klay Thompson, as

1718
01:21:45,360 --> 01:21:47,479
Speaker 1: much as everybody loves Clay Thompson, I think he's going

1719
01:21:47,560 --> 01:21:49,040
Speaker 1: to come up a little short. And I actually think

1720
01:21:49,920 --> 01:21:52,720
Speaker 1: he may have really been hurt his chances at least

1721
01:21:52,720 --> 01:21:55,559
Speaker 1: by being injured the last little while. Like he's he's

1722
01:21:55,560 --> 01:21:58,680
Speaker 1: out of mind a little bit, which sucks, but you're

1723
01:21:58,720 --> 01:22:01,559
Speaker 1: rightly he's it's gonna be. He'll probably finish number two

1724
01:22:01,600 --> 01:22:04,040
Speaker 1: all time of three pointers like when he retires and

1725
01:22:04,280 --> 01:22:06,680
Speaker 1: until other guys passes on and stuff like that. Okay, well,

1726
01:22:06,720 --> 01:22:08,920
Speaker 1: let us know who we missed in the comments and

1727
01:22:08,960 --> 01:22:10,559
Speaker 1: tweet at us and email in. That was a lot

1728
01:22:10,600 --> 01:22:13,200
Speaker 1: of fun. We will talk to you guys soon. Clipper bros.

1729
01:22:13,400 --> 01:22:15,960
Speaker 1: You heard it here first. Have a great time turn up.

1730
01:22:16,120 --> 01:22:17,400
Speaker 1: Love you guys. Awesome.

1731
01:22:18,280 --> 01:22:20,960
Speaker 3: Thanks for joining us, and remember, if you're making a

1732
01:22:21,000 --> 01:22:25,240
Speaker 3: list of the seventy five greatest NBA podcasts of all time,

1733
01:22:25,960 --> 01:22:29,840
Speaker 3: there's a clear number one.

1734
01:22:31,000 --> 01:22:33,880
Speaker 1: I was waiting for the jokes, for somebody to say,

1735
01:22:33,920 --> 01:22:37,519
Speaker 1: some other podcast, it's gonna be very funny. Embrace the day. People,

1736
01:22:38,479 --> 01:22:39,040
Speaker 1: you could.

1737
01:22:38,920 --> 01:22:42,240
Speaker 4: Stay every day.

1738
01:22:43,720 --> 01:22:45,040
Speaker 1: And dad be happy.

1739
01:22:45,280 --> 01:22:46,440
Speaker 3: Every maning.

1740
01:22:49,160 --> 01:22:52,240
Speaker 1: It's been so long that your fana.

1741
01:22:55,439 --> 01:22:55,960
Speaker 3: Already.

1742
01:22:57,400 --> 01:22:59,240
Speaker 1: It's gonna be grevy