WEBVTT - Can a Studio Make Movies for VR? 0:00:06.120 --> 0:00:09.480 Welcome to another episode of Strictly Business, the podcast that 0:00:09.520 --> 0:00:12.399 talks with some of the brightest minds working in media today. 0:00:12.720 --> 0:00:17.120 I'm Andrew Wallenstein. St X Entertainment is best known as 0:00:17.160 --> 0:00:20.640 the company behind recent movies like The Upside and Ugly Dolls, 0:00:21.280 --> 0:00:24.160 but theaters aren't the only place for their films. They've 0:00:24.200 --> 0:00:28.040 also got a division making them for virtual reality. We'll 0:00:28.080 --> 0:00:31.040 talk about the future of entertainment in VR with Rick 0:00:31.120 --> 0:00:34.640 Ray and Andy Vick of s t X Surreal, but 0:00:34.800 --> 0:00:37.360 that's not all. Stick around till the end of this 0:00:37.440 --> 0:00:41.640 podcast for a mystery bonus conversation about VR entertainment you 0:00:41.800 --> 0:00:47.519 won't want to miss. Thanks for coming in. I think 0:00:47.520 --> 0:00:52.000 we should start with describing what The Limit is because 0:00:52.280 --> 0:00:57.240 it's a virtual reality production, but not quite similar to 0:00:57.280 --> 0:01:01.200 a lot of what I've seen out there. The Limit 0:01:01.400 --> 0:01:05.080 is a virtual reality movie. That's how we talk about it. 0:01:05.080 --> 0:01:08.680 It is a cinematic experience. It is a lean back experience. 0:01:09.280 --> 0:01:11.080 A lot of people when they think of VR, they 0:01:11.080 --> 0:01:13.720 think of gaming, and there are certainly a lot of 0:01:13.760 --> 0:01:19.320 fantastic games in VR. Um As the VR division within 0:01:19.400 --> 0:01:24.360 a larger media company that's focused on creating premium scripted 0:01:24.360 --> 0:01:27.679 and unscripted entertainment are slant on. This is very much 0:01:27.920 --> 0:01:31.920 on the live action side, UM, and so our focus 0:01:32.000 --> 0:01:35.400 is on cinematic content in VR. Got it, And you've 0:01:35.400 --> 0:01:37.680 got quite a cast in this one. I mean, describe 0:01:37.720 --> 0:01:41.680 the story and kind of what's different in terms of 0:01:41.720 --> 0:01:44.840 the set up for this kind of production. Well, I 0:01:44.880 --> 0:01:47.280 think it's you know, really, what we're doing is we're 0:01:47.280 --> 0:01:50.120 putting people inside of an action movie. We're taking advantage 0:01:50.160 --> 0:01:53.320 of the field of view and the technology and handing 0:01:53.320 --> 0:01:57.000 those tools over to great filmmakers. And in this case, 0:01:57.080 --> 0:02:02.120 Robert Rodriguez joined UM and a Aventually it's a tale 0:02:02.160 --> 0:02:09.320 about a cooperative UM cyborg of course, right, because that's 0:02:09.360 --> 0:02:12.240 what you do when you work with Robert Rodriguez UM 0:02:12.360 --> 0:02:16.440 and you as the viewer, are basically a star in 0:02:16.600 --> 0:02:20.840 the movie. Michelle Rodriguez plays another agent of the same 0:02:20.919 --> 0:02:25.519 making and biology and technology, and she basically takes you 0:02:25.560 --> 0:02:28.799 through a story. Uh. It's set piece after set piece 0:02:28.880 --> 0:02:33.559 after set piece, high action, high octane UM basically revealing 0:02:33.560 --> 0:02:36.239 who you are as you moved through the story. Talk 0:02:36.320 --> 0:02:39.560 about your background because you were essentially a company that 0:02:39.639 --> 0:02:43.520 got acquired by st X, So describe that before and 0:02:43.560 --> 0:02:47.080 after sure. Um, so Rick and I have been working 0:02:47.120 --> 0:02:49.600 together for quite a while. We met at a company 0:02:49.639 --> 0:02:53.600 called Maker Studios. I was running creative development and Rick 0:02:53.720 --> 0:02:56.520 was running the entertainment vertical. We developed and package a 0:02:56.520 --> 0:02:59.560 lot of products there, RECU Piece, Rescu Piece, r I P. 0:03:00.520 --> 0:03:05.079 Really that's another pat Yeah that's next week. Um. But 0:03:05.120 --> 0:03:07.120 you know, so we met, we really hit it off. 0:03:07.919 --> 0:03:11.040 It's been a great partnership. And and what we saw 0:03:11.160 --> 0:03:14.840 coming was this new technology, right, and so the idea 0:03:14.919 --> 0:03:19.240 these headsets were coming out there was hardware, Google, HTC, Facebook, 0:03:19.280 --> 0:03:22.600 We're all really going headfirst into this and you know, 0:03:22.680 --> 0:03:25.880 investing billions of dollars, and so we knew that there 0:03:25.960 --> 0:03:28.400 was going to be a content issue, right and and 0:03:28.440 --> 0:03:31.919 so the you know, the idea content issue, meaning there's 0:03:31.919 --> 0:03:34.400 nothing to watch in these headsets. The only way for 0:03:34.480 --> 0:03:36.560 people to want to buy these things is if there's 0:03:36.600 --> 0:03:39.240 something fun to watch or interact with. And so we 0:03:39.320 --> 0:03:42.000 took it upon ourselves just to figure out how do 0:03:42.120 --> 0:03:46.280 we produce content. Obviously, we have more video production background 0:03:46.280 --> 0:03:48.760 that we do interactive, so we really focused on non 0:03:48.800 --> 0:03:52.360 interactive three sixty video. Um. This was just around the 0:03:52.360 --> 0:03:55.360 time that Facebook and Google were launching through sixty video 0:03:55.360 --> 0:03:59.240 products on their platforms, so they were really in need 0:03:59.520 --> 0:04:03.040 of touting what this new video product was. So we 0:04:03.160 --> 0:04:05.920 ended up working really closely with a bunch of a 0:04:05.960 --> 0:04:08.840 bunch of entertainment companies, but also really closely with Google 0:04:08.880 --> 0:04:11.920 and Facebook to help them develop their own content and 0:04:11.960 --> 0:04:14.480 even work with them to help develop their own camera systems. 0:04:14.880 --> 0:04:17.560 And we ended up producing over the course of you know, 0:04:17.640 --> 0:04:21.719 two years, we produced over a hundred VR experiences, primarily 0:04:21.760 --> 0:04:26.680 distributed on Facebook and YouTube, and you know, we built 0:04:26.800 --> 0:04:30.240 a pretty substantial production services company. We're making what other 0:04:30.400 --> 0:04:34.440 people wanted to make, right, We're really facilitating production UM. 0:04:34.480 --> 0:04:36.360 It was always our intention to figure out how to 0:04:36.400 --> 0:04:41.800 crack storytelling UM. And we were introduced to STX and 0:04:42.040 --> 0:04:44.960 it seemed like, you know, their aspirations of being more 0:04:45.000 --> 0:04:47.080 than just a movie studio were very clear from the 0:04:47.080 --> 0:04:50.720 get go UM, and they liked the idea of bringing 0:04:50.760 --> 0:04:53.479 in talent. Yes we're talking about a movie, but look 0:04:53.560 --> 0:04:55.520 what all the other things that we're doing, and plugging 0:04:55.520 --> 0:04:58.520 in these directors, actors, writers into other formats. And so 0:04:58.560 --> 0:05:01.159 I think we helped build void for them and get 0:05:01.200 --> 0:05:04.640 into a more innovative for thinking space. And now it's 0:05:04.640 --> 0:05:07.440 been about two and a half years since we've been there. 0:05:07.880 --> 0:05:11.200 I think what was really exciting for us was as 0:05:11.240 --> 0:05:16.159 an independent VR production company, we were really limited in 0:05:16.240 --> 0:05:18.359 the scope of what we could make and it was 0:05:18.480 --> 0:05:20.640 essentially the bulk of what we were doing was work 0:05:20.680 --> 0:05:24.479 for higher um and and so with st TX, it 0:05:24.560 --> 0:05:30.280 was really having the resources, having better access to talent, 0:05:31.080 --> 0:05:34.600 and and really just you know, having a seat at 0:05:34.600 --> 0:05:38.880 the table when it came to the core pillars of 0:05:38.920 --> 0:05:42.640 that media company. I think at other studios, the VR 0:05:42.720 --> 0:05:46.200 division might be in the basement or something. It's it's 0:05:46.200 --> 0:05:49.159 sort of like if it's even there, it's you know, 0:05:49.160 --> 0:05:53.599 it's an experimental part of the company, where it's it's 0:05:53.600 --> 0:05:57.880 really about the marketing assets that they could create versus 0:05:58.520 --> 0:06:02.520 the original content opportunity. And also how can we actually 0:06:02.720 --> 0:06:06.560 build a business around this new medium and utilize all 0:06:06.560 --> 0:06:08.719 the best, you know, facets of of what we have 0:06:08.800 --> 0:06:10.479 to offer as a studio. And so for us, that 0:06:10.520 --> 0:06:13.160 was a really strong proposition. Well, on the other hand, 0:06:13.200 --> 0:06:15.880 I can understand why other studios may treat this is 0:06:15.920 --> 0:06:19.680 a more let's call it marginal pursuit as I see it, 0:06:19.720 --> 0:06:22.400 and we could talk about it if you disagree, the 0:06:22.480 --> 0:06:26.800 market for VR entertainment is not quite there, even by 0:06:26.839 --> 0:06:31.000 the most i'd say charitable assessment. So any company like 0:06:31.200 --> 0:06:35.039 STX that put serious investment in this, there's risk that 0:06:35.080 --> 0:06:38.039 there's just not a market there for that content. Is 0:06:38.080 --> 0:06:41.400 that assessment off base? I think it's a it's a 0:06:41.440 --> 0:06:45.159 fair assessment. But you know, the level of investment that 0:06:45.240 --> 0:06:48.880 we're making is actually very responsible. I think what we're 0:06:48.920 --> 0:06:52.040 not doing is going out on day one and just 0:06:52.320 --> 0:06:54.360 spending a ton of money and hoping we're going to 0:06:54.440 --> 0:06:56.640 get our money back. We spend a lot of time 0:06:56.720 --> 0:07:01.760 early on UM developing thoughtful strategies and a business plan 0:07:01.880 --> 0:07:05.080 around this. We knew that we in in in pursuing 0:07:05.160 --> 0:07:09.359 original content, original VR movies. It wasn't going to be 0:07:10.120 --> 0:07:13.320 free content. We knew we had to monetize the content right, 0:07:13.360 --> 0:07:16.880 and so we had to really look at how how 0:07:16.920 --> 0:07:19.160 big is this market? How big is this market going 0:07:19.200 --> 0:07:21.840 to be in twelve months, twenty four months? How can 0:07:21.920 --> 0:07:25.000 we create a pipeline of content to sort of service 0:07:25.560 --> 0:07:31.560 the need for premium VA entertainment with recognizable talent while 0:07:31.600 --> 0:07:36.120 at the same time you know having UM, you know, 0:07:36.120 --> 0:07:41.360 knowing the caliber of talent that we're working with, you know, 0:07:41.480 --> 0:07:44.520 making it realistic for them to work with us. I mean, 0:07:44.520 --> 0:07:47.440 the nice thing about our our content is that it 0:07:47.560 --> 0:07:51.160 is short form, right, and so our shoot with Robert 0:07:51.280 --> 0:07:53.960 in Austin for the Limit was a week, and so 0:07:54.280 --> 0:07:58.800 the asks are smaller with talent, the overall timelines are shorter. 0:07:59.240 --> 0:08:03.480 And because you've developed this new format, the post production 0:08:03.520 --> 0:08:05.560 and some of the challenges and pitfalls and I think 0:08:05.560 --> 0:08:07.920 other companies are are are hitting up against we sort 0:08:07.920 --> 0:08:11.040 of found ways around that to help us save well. 0:08:11.080 --> 0:08:14.200 As you guys look around the landscape, whether it's from 0:08:14.320 --> 0:08:18.240 studios in the traditional sense or sort of a new 0:08:18.280 --> 0:08:23.120 wave of uh studios specialized in this space, are you 0:08:23.160 --> 0:08:28.640 seeing signs encouraging signs that the VR entertainment marketplace can 0:08:28.680 --> 0:08:33.880 get somewhere. Absolutely. I think it's still early. Like any technology. 0:08:33.920 --> 0:08:36.120 I think in the next few years we'll we'll see 0:08:37.160 --> 0:08:39.720 a big boost in sales. And in fact, last year 0:08:40.120 --> 0:08:42.800 on the fourth quarter of the holiday season, you know, 0:08:42.840 --> 0:08:45.560 we're speaking with Oculus and they were feeling really good. 0:08:45.600 --> 0:08:47.760 They overshot what they thought they were going to sell 0:08:47.800 --> 0:08:51.040 in terms of units, and so I think, like a 0:08:51.080 --> 0:08:55.240 lot of technology, it takes longer than people think, but 0:08:55.320 --> 0:08:58.319 then when it arrives, it moves a lot faster. And 0:08:58.400 --> 0:09:01.120 so I think we're still in that phase where people 0:09:01.120 --> 0:09:05.120 are understanding what these things are there now all in 0:09:05.160 --> 0:09:08.920 all the top like gift lists right for holidays and 0:09:08.960 --> 0:09:13.720 purchases um, and so I think we're early, but it's 0:09:13.920 --> 0:09:16.600 definitely gaining a lot of momentum. And I think right 0:09:16.600 --> 0:09:21.120 now our approaches. You put on these headsets and you 0:09:21.160 --> 0:09:24.400 don't really recognize anything. Right. There's a lot of independent 0:09:25.080 --> 0:09:28.320 gaming companies, there's a lot of sort of experiential live 0:09:28.360 --> 0:09:33.119 action docuseries, and I think those are all important facets 0:09:33.200 --> 0:09:36.880 of this VR ecosystem. But the idea of a VR movie, 0:09:36.880 --> 0:09:40.000 a blockbuster VR movie, You put on your headset and 0:09:40.120 --> 0:09:43.280 you see Michelle Rodriguez's face, you see Norman Rita's face. 0:09:43.559 --> 0:09:47.840 These are people that are super fans right of The 0:09:47.920 --> 0:09:50.960 Walking Dead, or they love Avatar, they love Fast and Furious. 0:09:51.000 --> 0:09:53.520 All of a sudden, there's a confidence that we're giving 0:09:53.520 --> 0:09:55.920 these people that this is something that they should be 0:09:55.920 --> 0:09:58.760 watching and for a micro transaction, it's it's worth opening 0:09:58.800 --> 0:10:02.000 up the wild. They've always have already invested money and 0:10:02.120 --> 0:10:05.120 time into this tech and so now they really want 0:10:05.120 --> 0:10:08.280 to utilize it, and so they they mean the users 0:10:09.080 --> 0:10:12.640 and so um. You know, I think what we're trying 0:10:12.679 --> 0:10:15.240 to do is build a behavior, right, because we're building 0:10:15.240 --> 0:10:18.720 the market as we go. And if we create this 0:10:18.840 --> 0:10:22.160 behavior and be consistent with the output of content, all 0:10:22.160 --> 0:10:25.240 of a sudden, if someone knows that every two or 0:10:25.240 --> 0:10:27.240 three months a new VR film is going to come 0:10:27.240 --> 0:10:30.640 out with directors and actors that they love, that's gonna 0:10:30.760 --> 0:10:34.280 that's gonna start to snowball and turn into a real business. Well, 0:10:34.320 --> 0:10:37.000 how big are your ambitions here or should I say 0:10:37.720 --> 0:10:40.080 how being an upside do you think there is for 0:10:40.200 --> 0:10:43.600 VR entertainment? Could we see it side by side one 0:10:43.679 --> 0:10:48.040 day with film and television or do you have perhaps 0:10:48.160 --> 0:10:53.559 you know, smaller expectations. Well, I think we look at 0:10:53.559 --> 0:10:56.000 sort of the history of cinema, right, and we've sort 0:10:56.000 --> 0:10:58.600 of done done this and looked at a timeline, and 0:10:58.640 --> 0:11:03.040 it's really interesting when you see advancements that have really 0:11:03.640 --> 0:11:07.360 created a more immersive experience for the audience, and so 0:11:07.920 --> 0:11:12.400 you know, introduction of color, surround sound, computer graphics, three 0:11:12.480 --> 0:11:18.600 d um large format. What we're doing, we see at 0:11:18.600 --> 0:11:21.640 a high level is sort of an iteration on a 0:11:21.720 --> 0:11:24.600 process that's that's been taking place for a really long time, 0:11:24.880 --> 0:11:29.040 and so the potential for it is actually huge. And 0:11:29.040 --> 0:11:33.000 we're also thinking there are we're actively exploring this now, 0:11:33.040 --> 0:11:38.200 opportunities to bring these experiences inside of movie theaters. Right, 0:11:38.360 --> 0:11:42.440 And so, you know, this screen is a screen and 0:11:42.520 --> 0:11:45.720 a VR headset. For us, it is just another screen. 0:11:45.760 --> 0:11:48.199 It happens to be a very big screen. But as 0:11:48.240 --> 0:11:51.959 a premium content studio, how can we fill that screen 0:11:52.400 --> 0:11:55.760 with the best quality content with the biggest and best 0:11:55.760 --> 0:11:57.400 talent that we can find. And we think if we 0:11:57.559 --> 0:11:59.439 if we can do that, and we can do it consistently, 0:11:59.800 --> 0:12:02.439 and we're grabbing market share now, we're going to hold 0:12:02.480 --> 0:12:07.360 onto that market share as we hit this um, you know, 0:12:07.400 --> 0:12:11.000 inflection point when it comes to the adoption of this technology. 0:12:11.240 --> 0:12:14.600 We think it has tremendous potential. Yeah, I mean it's 0:12:14.640 --> 0:12:17.440 it's I think distribution is the key word, right. There's 0:12:17.480 --> 0:12:20.080 there's people at home that have these headsets. More and 0:12:20.160 --> 0:12:23.880 more will buy them over time as they get higher resolution, 0:12:23.920 --> 0:12:27.200 they're lighter, they're smaller and more comfortable. Um. The other 0:12:27.240 --> 0:12:29.400 piece of it is out of home location base. We're 0:12:29.440 --> 0:12:32.240 talking before we started the podcast about Dreamscape. I think 0:12:32.280 --> 0:12:36.880 location based VR entertainment is growing rapidly um and people 0:12:36.880 --> 0:12:40.760 are realizing that while the home market grows, how do 0:12:40.840 --> 0:12:43.319 we get headsets out into the real world. So people 0:12:43.400 --> 0:12:46.840 understand that this technology exists and that's extremely powerful. So 0:12:46.880 --> 0:12:51.679 the idea of you know, first window at movie theaters 0:12:51.679 --> 0:12:55.120 where you go to a movie of traditional movie, you 0:12:55.240 --> 0:12:59.240 walk out and you realize that there is a VR 0:12:59.320 --> 0:13:01.600 movie theater now the screen next door to that, and 0:13:01.679 --> 0:13:05.840 so building that out we're actually selling tickets. That is 0:13:05.880 --> 0:13:08.280 a core part of our proposition because I think at 0:13:08.280 --> 0:13:10.760 this moment, the home is the home, and now we 0:13:10.800 --> 0:13:14.160 need to build this first window of location based distribution 0:13:14.200 --> 0:13:17.040 because that will really help grow this thing. Well, it's 0:13:17.080 --> 0:13:21.920 also kind of a chicken egg thing, isn't it, Where technology, 0:13:22.000 --> 0:13:27.000 on the one hand has to be there for content 0:13:27.160 --> 0:13:30.760 to flourish, but on the other hand, sometimes it's that 0:13:30.880 --> 0:13:34.760 big piece of hid content that can get the technology 0:13:34.800 --> 0:13:37.640 going and then get the audience go that house cards 0:13:37.640 --> 0:13:41.280 a moment exactly, or I would say I Love Lucy 0:13:41.400 --> 0:13:44.160 might be the better. Yeah, it's a really a new medium, 0:13:45.000 --> 0:13:47.679 whereas I don't feel like Netflix is a different medium 0:13:47.679 --> 0:13:50.320 than telligence, right, it lit up a platform. But you're right, 0:13:50.360 --> 0:13:52.720 it's not. It's not a different iteration of a format. 0:13:53.040 --> 0:13:57.560 I think, UM it is chicken or egg. I think 0:13:57.640 --> 0:14:00.640 time and time again, it has proven that it's not 0:14:00.920 --> 0:14:04.200 about the technology, it's about the utilization of the technology. 0:14:04.400 --> 0:14:06.960 And I think in our minds, these VR movies are 0:14:08.360 --> 0:14:14.200 a really strong first step into powerful narrative storytelling using 0:14:14.240 --> 0:14:17.000 these different tools, and it's just about getting it out 0:14:17.000 --> 0:14:19.720 there to the people. The great thing about VR movies 0:14:19.920 --> 0:14:23.120 as an example of a type of content in VR is, 0:14:23.320 --> 0:14:28.280 unlike gaming, we think that most people would be interested 0:14:28.400 --> 0:14:31.640 in watching a VR movie. It doesn't require, you know, 0:14:31.680 --> 0:14:34.480 expertise in gaming. It doesn't require having to sort of, 0:14:34.520 --> 0:14:36.800 you know, use a controller that maybe you're not familiar with. 0:14:36.840 --> 0:14:40.120 It's it's actually really accessible, and especially with our format, 0:14:40.160 --> 0:14:42.640 which is very much a lean back format. Just like 0:14:42.720 --> 0:14:46.040 you would sit on your couch and watch a TV show, 0:14:46.240 --> 0:14:48.520 you could sit on your couch and put a headset 0:14:48.560 --> 0:14:50.720 on and lean back and watch one of our movies. 0:14:51.000 --> 0:14:54.200 So we think that from UH and an audience perspective, 0:14:54.240 --> 0:14:57.080 it's really easy to jump to jump into these and 0:14:57.160 --> 0:15:00.440 that's really going to help UM you know, our our 0:15:00.480 --> 0:15:02.840 our our our hope and and sort of everything that 0:15:03.000 --> 0:15:06.000 that we're working towards is that this this becomes a 0:15:06.280 --> 0:15:08.600 habit and it becomes a category of content that people 0:15:08.600 --> 0:15:10.760 associate with VR. Right now, that is not the case, 0:15:10.800 --> 0:15:12.920 and so a lot of the work we're doing, I mean, 0:15:12.920 --> 0:15:15.720 the reason we're here talking to you today is really 0:15:15.760 --> 0:15:18.720 to help spread the word that this type of content exists, 0:15:19.160 --> 0:15:23.040 and that from a discover ability standpoint, really helping the 0:15:23.160 --> 0:15:27.320 limit and our future projects really stand out. Well. You know, 0:15:27.360 --> 0:15:30.440 we talked about chicken and egg and how content potentially 0:15:30.520 --> 0:15:33.040 lead the way. But on the other side of the equation, 0:15:33.080 --> 0:15:36.720 the distribution, the technology side, the thing that you depend 0:15:36.760 --> 0:15:39.000 on to get your content out there. Do you think 0:15:39.040 --> 0:15:41.600 things need to happen on that front that will help 0:15:41.680 --> 0:15:45.240 the content things. You're looking out into the marketplace's future 0:15:45.240 --> 0:15:47.800 and saying this needs to happen, and then content is 0:15:47.800 --> 0:15:50.720 really going to start to catch fire for sure. I 0:15:50.760 --> 0:15:54.760 think in a perfect world, every major VR marketplace would 0:15:54.800 --> 0:16:00.880 have the capabilities to to to take our our VR 0:16:01.000 --> 0:16:04.160 movies and sort of display them to the viewer without 0:16:05.000 --> 0:16:08.240 them having to install a standalone app, right just like 0:16:08.560 --> 0:16:10.520 you know, Apple has iTunes built in. It's sort of 0:16:10.520 --> 0:16:13.520 it's built into the platform, and you're just they're presented 0:16:13.560 --> 0:16:16.840 with all of these options and you can purchase the rent, etcetera. 0:16:17.080 --> 0:16:19.760 What's next? What else are you guys doing? Is there 0:16:19.840 --> 0:16:25.080 a whole development slate? Uh, walk me through it. This 0:16:25.160 --> 0:16:28.600 is Rick. Yes, we are. We've been spending the last 0:16:28.720 --> 0:16:32.120 eighteen months actively developing projects. We have a slate right 0:16:32.120 --> 0:16:37.080 now of over fifteen VR movies in different stages. We're 0:16:37.160 --> 0:16:42.680 focusing on different genres, so certainly horror, thriller, action, sci fi, 0:16:42.720 --> 0:16:47.080 even comedy. Um, we're working with incredible filmmakers. Were really 0:16:47.080 --> 0:16:52.520 excited to soon announce more details about that slate. But 0:16:52.920 --> 0:16:55.360 we have been heads down working on this for a 0:16:55.400 --> 0:16:58.720 long time and we are very much excited to start 0:16:58.720 --> 0:17:01.800 bringing more of these things to life. In terms of 0:17:02.040 --> 0:17:04.280 the scale of production, and I know that we're talking 0:17:04.480 --> 0:17:08.600 short form, I'm just curious, budget wise, can you ballpark 0:17:08.680 --> 0:17:12.840 this is VR something that's you know, exponentially more expensive 0:17:12.880 --> 0:17:16.359 than a typical shoot, or maybe equipment prices are reasonable. 0:17:16.640 --> 0:17:20.760 Just curious to get a sense of that reality. It's 0:17:20.840 --> 0:17:24.360 not a hold on, let me let me start over. 0:17:24.800 --> 0:17:29.840 Um without getting into the specifics around our budgets. We 0:17:29.920 --> 0:17:34.560 are very responsible and how we're putting these together. I 0:17:34.560 --> 0:17:39.000 would say, you know, it's closer to the indie film world. 0:17:40.000 --> 0:17:43.679 And remember these are twenty minute movies, and so you know, 0:17:43.760 --> 0:17:47.199 for us, this is in our conversations with filmmakers early on, 0:17:47.280 --> 0:17:49.119 I think we really try and set the stage for 0:17:49.200 --> 0:17:51.600 what this is like. You know, we have to be 0:17:51.680 --> 0:17:54.320 real about where the market is today and where it's going. 0:17:54.600 --> 0:17:59.160 And this is very much a creative outlet, right. This 0:17:59.200 --> 0:18:02.880 is very much a ace too to create something that's 0:18:03.040 --> 0:18:05.680 very different from everything else that you're working on. That's 0:18:05.760 --> 0:18:09.240 sort of core to our our proposition to filmmakers. And 0:18:09.320 --> 0:18:11.879 I think what we find is that in pitching directors, 0:18:12.480 --> 0:18:15.840 um and and and talent across the board, there are 0:18:16.119 --> 0:18:20.720 definitely individuals out there that that pitch resonates right where 0:18:20.720 --> 0:18:24.200 it's it's it's they they want to get their hands 0:18:24.200 --> 0:18:27.720 into something new and innovate in a space where that 0:18:27.800 --> 0:18:30.880 hasn't been done before. I mean that was Robert Rodriguez 0:18:30.880 --> 0:18:34.600 a hundred percent. As soon as he learned that, you know, 0:18:34.640 --> 0:18:37.320 we have the ability to do this, he was all in. 0:18:37.640 --> 0:18:40.560 And so I think luckily we we've had the opportunity 0:18:40.680 --> 0:18:44.960 to meet with many creators that have that that share 0:18:45.000 --> 0:18:49.720 that same mentality. And I'm also curious, how do you 0:18:49.760 --> 0:18:52.800 get a director the caliber of Robert Rodriguez to do 0:18:52.880 --> 0:18:55.520 something like this. Did he come to you saying, hey, 0:18:55.560 --> 0:18:57.320 I want to do VR or do you come to 0:18:57.400 --> 0:19:00.320 him just curious to get a sense of the genesis. Sure, 0:19:00.359 --> 0:19:02.159 I think it speaks to what Rick saying. You know, 0:19:02.320 --> 0:19:05.120 we've met a lot of film directors. I'd say there 0:19:05.280 --> 0:19:09.320 is a fraction, not a small fraction. I'd say twenty. 0:19:10.119 --> 0:19:13.560 Those of those talent need to be doing something innovative. 0:19:13.680 --> 0:19:15.960 You know, Yes, they do their big studio movies, but 0:19:16.080 --> 0:19:19.880 in between time, they want to be pushing technology forward. 0:19:19.880 --> 0:19:22.440 They want to be pushing storytelling forward. So we flew 0:19:22.480 --> 0:19:25.480 down to Austin Um. It was while he was shooting 0:19:25.520 --> 0:19:28.920 shooting Alida, I think um And so we walked around 0:19:28.920 --> 0:19:31.679 the Alita set with him, We talked about VR. He 0:19:31.800 --> 0:19:35.359 brought up his son, Racer Max, who co wrote the 0:19:35.359 --> 0:19:38.399 script with him, who's really big into VR. And I 0:19:38.440 --> 0:19:42.720 think he saw this as an opportunity to yes, develop 0:19:42.840 --> 0:19:45.560 new storytelling techniques with new technology, but also speak to 0:19:45.600 --> 0:19:50.679 a younger audience. That you know is into this new stuff, right, 0:19:50.640 --> 0:19:52.760 and so I think, as as a storyteller, you want 0:19:52.760 --> 0:19:55.240 to stay relevant to all audiences, are as many people 0:19:55.280 --> 0:19:58.879 as possible. And so we were down there, he really 0:19:59.000 --> 0:20:00.960 understood what we were wanted to do pretty quickly. He 0:20:01.040 --> 0:20:06.080 understood the advantage of what our format was giving against 0:20:06.080 --> 0:20:09.359 a full three sixty video experience, and so he really 0:20:09.359 --> 0:20:13.159 blamed onto that. We said, you know, we want to 0:20:13.160 --> 0:20:16.080 make a twenty minute film. We really need stars in 0:20:16.119 --> 0:20:18.280 this because that's one of that's one of the promises 0:20:18.280 --> 0:20:20.560 to our audiences that we want to start, right, is like, 0:20:20.640 --> 0:20:24.239 let's get recognizable talent in signature roles um. And so 0:20:24.400 --> 0:20:26.000 you know, he shook his head and was like, okay, 0:20:26.000 --> 0:20:27.280 I get it. And so we got on a plane 0:20:27.280 --> 0:20:30.040 and we came back to l a UM and within 0:20:30.080 --> 0:20:33.960 a couple of weeks we had a script and UM, 0:20:34.160 --> 0:20:37.240 Michelle Rodriguez wanted to be in it. And so obviously 0:20:37.240 --> 0:20:40.000 that came through Robert and he has his close collaborators 0:20:40.000 --> 0:20:42.240 that are in his orbit on a regular basis and 0:20:42.680 --> 0:20:44.439 he can go to them and trust them, and a 0:20:44.440 --> 0:20:46.359 lot of those people just like him, they want to 0:20:46.359 --> 0:20:49.920 be doing cool new stuff. UM and from there, we 0:20:50.320 --> 0:20:52.480 you know, from there, we just it went forward. We 0:20:52.600 --> 0:20:54.320 ended up doing a test shoot to make sure that 0:20:54.359 --> 0:20:56.480 we could Robert could get all those shots that he 0:20:56.520 --> 0:20:58.879 wanted to and start to develop this film language with 0:20:58.880 --> 0:21:01.679 our camera system, and then we shot at at the 0:21:01.720 --> 0:21:06.320 top of two. One last question. You guys were embedded 0:21:06.359 --> 0:21:10.680 at a so called traditional Hollywood company at st X. 0:21:11.240 --> 0:21:13.879 When you look out at the future of VR, do 0:21:13.960 --> 0:21:17.199 you see Hollywood position to continue the track record it 0:21:17.280 --> 0:21:20.399 has built up in film and television or do you 0:21:20.600 --> 0:21:23.400 think maybe it's not an either or that we're going 0:21:23.480 --> 0:21:26.760 to see sort of a new Hollywood emerge in terms 0:21:26.800 --> 0:21:30.760 of VR production. Well, I think I think it's gonna 0:21:30.800 --> 0:21:32.200 live next to it. Right. It's just like when we 0:21:32.280 --> 0:21:34.200 were at Maker Studios. I think a lot of people 0:21:34.200 --> 0:21:36.680 when digital was coming up and short form was really 0:21:36.680 --> 0:21:38.439 big and there was a lot of funding going into it, 0:21:38.480 --> 0:21:41.119 people were staying our TV's dad, look at the you know, 0:21:41.119 --> 0:21:43.440 look at the ratings that are plummeting. Digital is gonna 0:21:43.480 --> 0:21:45.680 take over short form and that was never going to 0:21:45.720 --> 0:21:48.040 be the case, right, I think short forms sitting next 0:21:48.119 --> 0:21:51.119 to sits next to TV, which sits next to film 0:21:51.240 --> 0:21:53.600 six to six, next to theater and so I think 0:21:53.680 --> 0:21:56.719 VR is just another iteration of telling stories. I think 0:21:56.760 --> 0:22:00.440 it will be complementary. I think, you know, now, we're 0:22:00.440 --> 0:22:03.880 working with established directors that have a voice. I think 0:22:03.880 --> 0:22:07.480 the Kubricks and the Spielberg's of VR are probably twelve 0:22:07.520 --> 0:22:11.600 years old, and they're growing up watching VR and playing VR, 0:22:11.720 --> 0:22:14.520 and they're gonna have They're gonna have a take that 0:22:14.800 --> 0:22:17.600 is completely different and doesn't even exist today. So I 0:22:17.640 --> 0:22:21.919 think while we're waiting for those for those superstars to 0:22:21.960 --> 0:22:25.000 go to college and study UM or not go to 0:22:25.040 --> 0:22:27.399 college and start making these things out of high school, 0:22:27.600 --> 0:22:31.600 I think we're leaning on the people who can evoke 0:22:31.680 --> 0:22:34.480 the most emotion and tell the best stories, and I 0:22:34.520 --> 0:22:37.040 think it will just be a balance moving forward. Well, 0:22:37.080 --> 0:22:39.800 I'm looking forward to seeing how that future unfolds, and 0:22:39.800 --> 0:22:41.359 I'm sure you guys will be in the thick of it. 0:22:41.600 --> 0:22:43.960 Best of luck and thanks for coming in, Thanks for 0:22:44.000 --> 0:22:49.119 having us, Thank you, and now a special bonus segment 0:22:49.200 --> 0:22:52.640 to this podcast episode. A recurring theme in my interview 0:22:52.640 --> 0:22:55.239 with the STX Surreal guys was how VR is a 0:22:55.280 --> 0:22:57.879 medium that will come of age with a younger generation. 0:22:58.600 --> 0:23:01.040