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Speaker 1: Cool Zone Media. Hello, and welcome to Cool People Did

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Speaker 1: Cool Stuff that you didn't start at part five. I'm

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Speaker 1: your host, Margaret Kiljoy and with me today is my

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Speaker 1: guest Mia Wong.

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Speaker 2: Hello, Amya, how are you well? I can't hear out

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Speaker 2: of one ear, so things going great. We're about to

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Speaker 2: see whether you could podcast like this. My guess is yes. However,

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Speaker 2: if I say anything wrong, that's immediately. My excuse is

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Speaker 2: that I can't hear and this has destroyed my brain.

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Speaker 2: So we're doing the caveats beforehand.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, Well, fortunately we've taken our producer, Sophie's audio and

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Speaker 1: routed it through one part of the stereo channel and

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Speaker 1: my voice to the other part of the stereo channel.

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Speaker 1: Our producer is Sophie. Hi, Sophie, Hi, My dog just

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Speaker 1: sneeze seven times? Are you okay? Everyone is having a day?

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Speaker 1: Is what we have learned before recording.

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Speaker 2: You see seven times here, Andrew.

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Speaker 1: That's so many sneezing.

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Speaker 3: Oh most traumatic. I saw her. She went, why am

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Speaker 3: I doing this so many times? And I don't know.

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Speaker 1: Rentrow has started doing this thing that I'm very excited about.

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Speaker 1: Where he when I record, he used to hang out

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Speaker 1: on the futon behind me, but now he hangs out

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Speaker 1: at my feet. Oh, hi Rentrow, if you can hear me,

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Speaker 1: you're the best boy. And our audio engineer is Daniel

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Speaker 1: Hi Danel. Yeah. Our theme musical was written forced by

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Speaker 1: un woman. We are in deep. This is part five,

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Speaker 1: our first ever part five on cool people did cool stuff,

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Speaker 1: which is funny because we will get to a bunch

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Speaker 1: of cool people did a bunch of really cool stuff

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Speaker 1: finally this week. But first, either of you ever heard

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Speaker 1: of a song called roast Chicken?

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Speaker 2: No?

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Speaker 1: Okay, So my favorite Soviet era anarchists song, because I

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Speaker 1: have one of those, is this song called roast Chicken.

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Speaker 1: And I'm going to tell you a little bit about

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Speaker 1: it beforehand, and then Sovie's gonna hit play on it

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Speaker 1: in a little bit. There's a song called roast Chicken.

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Speaker 1: I first learned about it from a Bulgarian friend of

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Speaker 1: mine who grew up in Communist Bulgaria, and I was

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Speaker 1: learning to play accordion, and she was like, oh, you

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Speaker 1: have to learn how to play this song roast Chicken.

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Speaker 1: And I actually theoretically know how to play the song

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Speaker 1: on accordion, but it's been a very long time since

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Speaker 1: I made playing accordion, so I wouldn't hold it past

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Speaker 1: me right now, and I was like, hm, this song

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Speaker 1: seems familiar. It sounds like part of Go Go Bordello's

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Speaker 1: song Start Wearing Purple, and it is because it's part

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Speaker 1: of it. There is this song that comes from the

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Speaker 1: war communism era of the USSR. It's a children's song,

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Speaker 1: but it's the anarchist children's song. And all throughout the

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Speaker 1: Soviet era, whenever Soviets made movies about the Civil War

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Speaker 1: and they wanted to like talk trash about anarchists, the

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Speaker 1: anarchists would come in as like sailors on a boat

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Speaker 1: or on an armored train or whatever in the armored

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Speaker 1: train and be called anarchy or whatever, and they'd be

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Speaker 1: singing roast Chicken. And this song is amazing because this

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Speaker 1: the song that is meant to make fun of war communism,

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Speaker 1: but it became the song to make fun of the

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Speaker 1: anarchists were making fun of war communism. And I'll tell

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Speaker 1: you the lyrics after we listen to a little bit,

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Speaker 1: which we're gonna do now.

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Speaker 3: See Polo now.

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Speaker 2: Shooting me push old panes.

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Speaker 3: You, oh my Molly Iris.

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Speaker 2: So much, must.

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Speaker 3: See my shu yan you say yes, Si, I aquitely

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Speaker 3: give me son.

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Speaker 1: Okay, So this is my favorite Soviet era anarchist song.

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Speaker 1: This song is about exactly what you think it would

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Speaker 1: be about. The lyrics are I'm gonna paraphrase here. So

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Speaker 1: there's like this roast chicken, this steam chicken, and he's

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Speaker 1: walking down the street and the cops are like, hey,

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Speaker 1: you can't be walking down the street. Show me your passport.

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Speaker 1: Let's see some papers. And the Chicken's like, I don't

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Speaker 1: have any papers. I'm a fucking chicken. I'm a roast chicken.

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Speaker 1: Why would I have papers? And so they take the

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Speaker 1: chicken to jail. You know, that's the song Oh my god.

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Speaker 1: There's also versions where like the chicken is so scared

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Speaker 1: it poops its pants. The song rules and so that

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Speaker 1: particular version was Arcadie Severni, who is a Soviet era

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Speaker 1: a folk musician from primarily the sixties who got famous

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Speaker 1: Plaine prison songs, and that was like the way that

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Speaker 1: he played all of the band's Soviet songs, like he

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Speaker 1: has these he sings songs about like I'm an anarchist

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Speaker 1: time and anarchist or whatever, and he gets away with

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Speaker 1: it because he's like, oh, I'm just playing the prison songs.

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Speaker 3: Incredible.

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Speaker 1: So he's like outlaw folk. This is the outlaw folk

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Speaker 1: or outlaw country the rules of the Soviet Union, And

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Speaker 1: I don't know, I really like it.

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Speaker 3: It's so fun.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, if you ever want to see all, not all,

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Speaker 1: of most of the clips of this song, in all

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Speaker 1: the different Soviet things, there's one page that anthologizes them all.

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Speaker 1: And the way I always find it when I can't

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Speaker 1: remember as I type into Google roast Chicken Anarchists song,

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Speaker 1: because this song you've probably never run across this particular problem.

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Speaker 1: When you leave the Western language set, I forget the

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Speaker 1: name of the Roman alphabet. It becomes harder to find

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Speaker 1: things with Google. Yeah, Like, if you like just search

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Speaker 1: roast chicken song, you're not getting anything useful, But if

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Speaker 1: you search it in cyrillic, you get what you're looking for. Anyway,

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Speaker 1: that's my unrelated well what's related, But that's my aside

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Speaker 1: that I got really excited about. I realized I could

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Speaker 1: shoehorn into here. I was never good enough to sing it,

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Speaker 1: but I would play this song while busking a lot.

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Speaker 2: That's so cool.

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Speaker 1: So where we left off, we talked a lot about

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Speaker 1: the Civil War, last time, and the civil war is

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Speaker 1: now over. The Whites are defeated, the Whites being the

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Speaker 1: sort of bizarrest forces or the not the revolution forces.

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Speaker 1: I think by the end a lot of even more

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Speaker 1: like moderate socialists started joining the White Army because they

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Speaker 1: were like the Bolsheviks, they're terrible, you know.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, you get this a lot where it's like you

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Speaker 2: have these really weird constellations of groups because whose sole

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Speaker 2: uniting factor is the Bolsheviks. You're trying to kill us all.

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Speaker 2: And like that's the thing you see like repeated down

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Speaker 2: through history. You got all these really weird political coalitions

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Speaker 2: that are like, yeah, the Marxists are killing us all.

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Speaker 2: So you know, guess we're all in this boat now.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. Absolutely. And so the Black Army did the defeating

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Speaker 1: of the Army in Ukraine, but that Black Army has

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Speaker 1: now also been defeated, as have millions of people trying

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Speaker 1: to live the promise of the revolution down there. They've

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Speaker 1: been defeated, not necessarily all killed. That'll come a little later.

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Speaker 1: We're not going to talk about the famines and stuff

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Speaker 1: too much. All the while, the Bolsheviks are promising like, hey,

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Speaker 1: don't worry this war communism thing that's only for a while.

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Speaker 1: We're at war, and to some degree people believed them,

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Speaker 1: and that's kind of what they held onto this whole time.

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Speaker 1: People were like, well, we just got aside with the

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Speaker 1: Red Army and the grain, you know, them coming by

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Speaker 1: and stealing all the grain and stuff for so long.

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Speaker 1: We got to make sacrifices to defend the revolution. Everyone

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Speaker 1: knows that. And by sacrifices, when we're talking about the

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Speaker 1: Russian Civil War, we're somewhere in the six million to

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Speaker 1: twelve million people range of sacrifice, which makes it one

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Speaker 1: hell of a civil war.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it's extraordinarily bloody.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, compared to the February Revolution of thirteen hundred people

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Speaker 1: who don't The anti Bolshevik left continues to grow as

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Speaker 1: the Bolsheviks keeps showing themselves for what they really are.

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Speaker 1: Of course, the Bolshevik party itself was also growing because

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Speaker 1: they were the only game in town and it kept,

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Speaker 1: you know, killing everyone who didn't join it. Like I've

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Speaker 1: used several sources for example, throughout that I think I've

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Speaker 1: talked about where it was people who weren't Bolsheviks and

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Speaker 1: then suddenly they were Bolsheviks because it was kind of

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Speaker 1: join or die, and plenty of revolutionaries chose join when

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Speaker 1: offered join or die, and plenty of revolutionaries chose die

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Speaker 1: when given that same choice. All throughout the revolution in

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Speaker 1: the Civil War, revolutionaries are pouring into the country from

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Speaker 1: exile or being deported back to Russia, since one of

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Speaker 1: Russia's primary exports for decades at this point had been

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Speaker 1: hardened revolutionaries of every stripe. And it's honestly hard to

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Speaker 1: imagine just how great this betrayal must have felt, how

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Speaker 1: hopeful everyone was when they were turned home only to

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Speaker 1: find out what was happening. And I'm going to give

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Speaker 1: a couple examples of that, because they're kind of fun stories,

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Speaker 1: even if they don't end super great. People who listen

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Speaker 1: to my podcast are familiar with this arc. Take as

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Speaker 1: an example, the case of the staff of the newspaper

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Speaker 1: Golos Truda Russian for the Voice of Labor, because again,

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Speaker 1: anarchists have only two ideas of how to name newspapers.

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Speaker 1: It's either labor paper or it's like the blast, you know,

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Speaker 1: sometimes it's black and then object, Oh that's true, so

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Speaker 1: you black flag, black wave, black tide. Yeah, which doesn't

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Speaker 1: work as well as in the American context, but that

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Speaker 1: never stops people.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: So the Voice of Labor was started at nineteen eleven

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Speaker 1: in New York City by the Union of Russian Workers

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Speaker 1: in the United States and Canada. Speaking of how we

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Speaker 1: choose to name things historically, the Union of Russian Workers

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Speaker 1: of the United States and Canada, which was an anarchist organization. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: incredible stuff, guys, No notes, and this is an anarcho

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Speaker 1: synicalist labor organization started by political exiles who had fled

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Speaker 1: the nineteen oh five revolution. This union had helped new

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Speaker 1: exiles integrate into New York. They had set up English

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Speaker 1: classes for refugees, they'd put out books in Russian and generally,

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Speaker 1: we're just being cool. They had about ten thousand members

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Speaker 1: across the US and Canada, and of course a monthly newspaper.

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Speaker 1: How can you do anything without a newspaper. I swear

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Speaker 1: to God. The accidental subtext this podcast is just Margaret

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Speaker 1: talks about tuberculosis and old radical newspapers in nineteen seventeen,

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Speaker 1: give this general amnesty in Russia. So everyone involved in

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Speaker 1: the newspapers like, holy shit, here we go. It's the

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Speaker 1: fucking revolution. Let's get home and transform the entire fucking world.

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Speaker 1: The largest country in the world is having a revolution

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Speaker 1: and the anarchists are at the forefront among in a pluralistic,

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Speaker 1: great cool way. They're very excited. One of them goes

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Speaker 1: first and is like, yeah, yeah, yeah, come on over,

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Speaker 1: you know. And their journey itself was kind of epic

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Speaker 1: and beautiful, like nothing bad happened, but they did all

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Speaker 1: the anarchy stuff along the cultural stuff along the way.

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Speaker 1: They boarded a boat from Vancouver to Japan and then

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Speaker 1: went over to Siberia and then took a train to

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Speaker 1: Saint Petersburg.

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Speaker 2: Of course.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, in many such cases, yeah, now, yeah, the go

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Speaker 1: literally all the way around the world in order to

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Speaker 1: do this. And because they're anarchists, they can't go anywhere

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Speaker 1: without doing cultural events and printing a newspaper. So the

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Speaker 1: whole time they're on this ship out to Japan, they

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Speaker 1: organized lectures and put on plays for all the passengers

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Speaker 1: on board.

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Speaker 3: That's awesome.

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Speaker 1: And they put out a newspaper while they were on

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Speaker 1: the boat. Oh my god, it was called the Float.

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Speaker 3: Rules. I know, I know.

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Speaker 1: Did they like bring a printing press like they must?

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Speaker 1: I don't know enough about it. I get all of

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Speaker 1: the different time periods around this era, because like what

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Speaker 1: people would print with kept changing so quickly around this

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Speaker 1: era that I can't remember exactly what they would have

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Speaker 1: been using. But yeah, they must have brought a little

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Speaker 1: hand press or something like that.

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Speaker 3: Incredible.

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Speaker 1: Once they made it to Saint Petersburg, they started printing

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Speaker 1: The Voice of Labor again in Saint Petersburg, and they

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Speaker 1: tried and of course famously failed, to turn the revolutionary

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Speaker 1: tide away from authoritarianimism and Bolshevism. This is in between

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Speaker 1: the February and October revolutions. The most famous member of

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Speaker 1: this group was this Jewish anarchist guy named Volin. And

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Speaker 1: when I say famous, I mean in the context of

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Speaker 1: you and I have heard of Volin and yeah, I've

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Speaker 1: read his book The Unknown Revolution. Yeah yeah, yeah, famous

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Speaker 1: gifts context here, Yeah, well known in certain anarchist circles, think, yeah, yeah.

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Speaker 1: He had fled Russia in nineteen oh five. He was

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Speaker 1: a Jewish anarchist who fled Russia nineteen oh five and

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Speaker 1: became an anarchist while in exile. Actually I think he

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Speaker 1: started off I think in the SRS. And he is

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Speaker 1: most famous again famous guests quotes as the man that

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Speaker 1: is behind what is called synthesis anarchism, which is basically

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Speaker 1: the like, hey, all different kinds of anarchism are valid,

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Speaker 1: we should figure out how to create a unity and

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Speaker 1: diversity set of anarchist organizations in which syndicalist communists and

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Speaker 1: individualists and insurrectionary anarchists can all just coordinate and offer

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Speaker 1: one another solidarity and mutual daid. This of course made

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Speaker 1: everyone that oh yeah, no, totally for one hundred years,

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Speaker 1: but it's not the worst idea. My friend Brian is

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Speaker 1: always like, one day, Margaret, you're going to unite all

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Speaker 1: of the anarchist factions because they're all going to unite

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Speaker 1: in their anger against you for trying to unite them

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Speaker 1: all and stop all the infighting.

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Speaker 2: You know.

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Speaker 1: I think synthesis anarchism is great. It builds on the

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Speaker 1: anarchists without adjectives that Malatests and all these other people

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Speaker 1: were putting forward. And anyway, I like his ideas. I

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Speaker 1: haven't read The Unknown Revolution yet, to be clear. It's

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Speaker 1: on my shelf and I'm excited about.

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Speaker 3: It, but it's pretty good.

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Speaker 2: Slightly weird.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, that makes sense to me. It turns out there's

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Speaker 1: an awful lot of books you can read about the

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Speaker 1: Russian Revolution. Yeah, someone should do a really long podcast

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Speaker 1: series about the Russian Revolution.

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Speaker 2: Like yeah, wrong, cool, micy right sort revolutions. I was

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Speaker 2: talking to him well, like on Twitter about that show,

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Speaker 2: and I was like, Okay, you're gonna do the because

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Speaker 2: so there's like a bunch of other revolutions that happened

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Speaker 2: around that time, right, there's one in Italy, there's Germany.

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Speaker 2: There's something we talked about in the show. Its Argentina.

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Speaker 2: So I was like, okay, are you going to cover

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Speaker 2: the other ones? And he was like, We're going to

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Speaker 2: cover a lot of it, and then no, there was

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Speaker 2: simply too much Russian Revolution to get to any of

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Speaker 2: the other ones except Germany because Jermany is the one

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Speaker 2: that like most directly matters for Russia.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it's interesting to me because part of learning about

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Speaker 1: the Russian Revolution, and part of the reason I think

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Speaker 1: it's important enough to do this, you know, six part

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Speaker 1: series or whatever about it is how much it influences

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Speaker 1: everything else we've talked about on this show. You know,

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Speaker 1: everything is in the context of this until about World

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Speaker 1: War two, and then everything's in the context of World

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Speaker 1: War Two. It's still probably the most influential revolution since

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Speaker 1: like either the French or Haitian realm, there's a lot

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Speaker 1: of by a lot of I mean, historians who are

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Speaker 1: talking about this revolution have all said that this is

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Speaker 1: the most influential event of the twentieth century and like

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Speaker 1: single event, And I mean, is that a World War two?

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Speaker 1: You know?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, well, and you know, but the thing with World

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Speaker 2: War two is you can argue that like World War

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Speaker 2: two is a direct product of this.

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Speaker 1: Right totally, which yeah, and would have been real different

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Speaker 1: if our heroes of today had pulled some stuff off.

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Speaker 1: But yeah, so our guy Volin, he spends a lot,

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Speaker 1: a lot of time in Ukraine influencing things there, setting

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Speaker 1: up a synthesis organization called Nabot that's spread throughout Ukraine,

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Speaker 1: and later he's going to become the chairman of the

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Speaker 1: Military Revolutionary Council, the machnivist Ukrainian anarchist thing that we

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Speaker 1: talked about last time. And I think the reason he

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Speaker 1: ended up the Military Revolutionary Council chairman is because he

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Speaker 1: was like, he was not a pacifist, but he spent

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Speaker 1: his whole time doing that trying to curb the excessive

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Speaker 1: violence of the revolutionaries because there is no army that

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Speaker 1: is not committing war crimes, and that absolutely included the

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Speaker 1: anarchist army. You know, there is no ideology so pure

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Speaker 1: that it will prevent people from abusing power in different circumstances. However,

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Speaker 1: you can put a lot of work in to curb

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Speaker 1: that and keep that from happening. And it sounds like

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Speaker 1: that's why Volin was involved in sense idea. Yeah. Volin

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Speaker 1: was arrested on his sick bed by the Cheka and

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Speaker 1: only released basically because the Bolsheviks needed a cozy up

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Speaker 1: to the anarchists, you know, because we talked about last time.

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Speaker 1: The Bolsheviks were like, oh, we're resting all the anarchists,

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Speaker 1: and then all of a sudden they're fighting alongside the anarchists.

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Speaker 1: So they keep doing this back and forth, depending on

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Speaker 1: how much they need the anarchists.

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Speaker 2: Right.

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Speaker 1: The Bolsheviks actually tried to recruit him. They offered to

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Speaker 1: make him a commissar in Bolshevik Ukraine, and he was like, no,

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Speaker 1: that's not going to fucking happen. Yeah, So the Bolsheviks

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Speaker 1: arrested him again a little bit later. Once again, political

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Speaker 1: pressure got him released and deported. In nineteen twenty two,

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Speaker 1: and the anarchists take care of their own even though

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Speaker 1: a lot of syndicalists didn't like his theories because his

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Speaker 1: theories were Syndicalism is not the only correct belief structure.

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Speaker 1: The most prominent German anarchis syndicalist who's come up a

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Speaker 1: bunch on this show before Rudolph Rocker put him up

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Speaker 1: in his own house, like gave him the attic room

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Speaker 1: and took care of him.

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Speaker 2: Oh that's really sweet.

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Speaker 3: I actually didn't know.

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Speaker 1: That, I know. And then there's like this also this

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Speaker 1: whole thing where like Volin helped escape Ukraine, and then

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Speaker 1: they like got into this huge fight because yeah, there's

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Speaker 1: no reason that you, dear listener should care about this,

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Speaker 1: but Makno wanted platformism, which was all anarchists have unity

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Speaker 1: of theory, where a synthesis anarchism is unity and diversity,

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Speaker 1: and so they were like arguing about that and then

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Speaker 1: they Uh, Makno's wife was like, could you just shut

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Speaker 1: the fuck up and be friends again? And they became

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Speaker 1: friends again because listen to women.

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Speaker 2: And it's funny too because I'm pretty sure unknown revolutions

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Speaker 2: written like in the part where they're feuding, so there's

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Speaker 2: just like a bunch of random like mackno slander in it.

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Speaker 1: I believe it. I believe it. There's so much from

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Speaker 1: this time period of people being like, I don't know

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Speaker 1: where the Magno is even really anarchists, and I'm like,

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Speaker 1: I'm not interested in gate keeping that.

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Speaker 2: They absolutely feud like anarchists.

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Speaker 1: So yeah, totally. Uh. Anyway, Volin from exile, he writes history.

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Speaker 1: He gets into arguments about anarchist theory. He describes Bolshevism

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Speaker 1: as red fascism, and if anyone would know that firsthand,

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Speaker 1: it's him. He lived in near poverty in France. He

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Speaker 1: had to go in hiding once more in nineteen forty

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Speaker 1: because it was not a good time to be Jewish

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Speaker 1: in Nazi occupied countries, and friends tried to get him

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Speaker 1: to go to Mexico and they were like, we'll get

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Speaker 1: you out, We'll get you to Mexico, and he left Paris,

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Speaker 1: but he was like, I am fucking staying in France.

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Speaker 1: We are going to kick out the fucking Nazis and

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Speaker 1: we're going to have a goddamn anarchist revolution, or I'm

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Speaker 1: going to cut damn by trine. And he died of

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Speaker 1: tuberculosis in Paris in nineteen forty five, cool guy Volin

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Speaker 1: back to his newspaper and the early days of the revolution. Actually,

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Speaker 1: you know, one of the things that I ran across

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Speaker 1: sometimes is some of these old papers actually had advertisements

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Speaker 1: in them. I don't know whether the Voice of Labor

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Speaker 1: had advertisements or not, but I'm aware that a lot

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Speaker 1: of radical newspapers throughout time have had advertisements, and keeping

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Speaker 1: in that tradition, we've decided to one time only allow

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Speaker 1: sponsors to go and give us money in exchange for

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Speaker 1: space for them to talk about things for a little while.

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Speaker 1: So that's what we're going to do, just in the

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Speaker 1: spirit of historical accuracy, and we're back in the early

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Speaker 1: days of the revolution. The Voice of Labor accurately saw

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Speaker 1: the writing on the wall. Immediately after the October Revolution.

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Speaker 1: They wrote, once their power is consolidated and legalized, the

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Speaker 1: Bolsheviks will begin to rearrange the life of the country

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Speaker 1: and of the people by governmental and dictorial methods imposed

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Speaker 1: by this center. Your soviets and your other local organizations

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Speaker 1: will become, little by little, simply executive organs of the

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Speaker 1: will of the central government, in place of healthy, constructive

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Speaker 1: work by the laboring masses in place of free unification.

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Speaker 1: From the bottom, we will see the installation of an

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Speaker 1: authoritarian and status apparatus, which will act from above and

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Speaker 1: set about wiping out everything that stands in its way

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Speaker 1: with an iron hand.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, that's pretty much exactly what happened.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and not even like it wasn't even just like, oh,

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Speaker 1: they're going to totally be authoritarian. It was like, this

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Speaker 1: is exactly the way they will do it and how

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Speaker 1: it will play out. A lot of people are like, oh, early,

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Speaker 1: people just didn't know how it was going to go.

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Speaker 1: Some people knew.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: By August nineteen eighteen, the Bolsheviks suppressed the Voice of Labor,

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Speaker 1: So these editors from New York they put out a

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Speaker 1: different paper, the Free Voice of Labor, and then they

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Speaker 1: got arrested again in nineteen twenty one. We'll talk more

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Speaker 1: about that later, about how the anarchist are crack down

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Speaker 1: on real hard after.

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Speaker 2: I'm so excited to do my version of this where

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Speaker 2: we have to put out free it could happen here,

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Speaker 2: and then freer it could happen here.

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Speaker 1: It might happen here.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, like the final one is the freest.

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Speaker 2: It already happened yeah, yeah, it.

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Speaker 1: Might happen here. We might pull we might pull out

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Speaker 1: of a tailspin. So famously, it's not like the USSR

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Speaker 1: was the only place it was hard to be a

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Speaker 1: leftist at this time. Well, okay, it's not the USSR.

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Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah, Russia whatever. Famously, the US was

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Speaker 1: not exactly tolerant of actual leftists either.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: The first Red Scare hit the anarchists particularly hard, especially,

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Speaker 1: and actually I didn't realize this. The main group as

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Speaker 1: far as I can tell by numbers that hit was

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Speaker 1: the Union of Russian Workers, this anarcho syndicalist union that

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Speaker 1: the newspaper folks have been working with, which kept going

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Speaker 1: after its newspaper edit. It turns out you can actually

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Speaker 1: have a movement without a newspaper, I know, shocking.

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Speaker 2: But every trotsky I simultaneously running in circles and streaming.

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Speaker 1: I know. On March twelfth, nineteen nineteen, its headquarters was

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Speaker 1: raided in New York and one hundred and sixty two

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Speaker 1: people were arrested. Jeez, and they only managed to get

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Speaker 1: criminal anarchy charges against two of them. New York still

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Speaker 1: has criminal anarchy.

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Speaker 2: On the books, oh my god.

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Speaker 1: And it's not criminal being an anarchist. It's like criminal

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Speaker 1: disorderly conduct or whatever. But it's every anarchist I know

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Speaker 1: he's gotten that charge is a little bit like.

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Speaker 2: Incredible.

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Speaker 1: The news was full of talk about how these Russian

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Speaker 1: agents were just waiting to throw the US, which is

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Speaker 1: I mean, well, I guess that's true, Like you know.

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Speaker 2: Well, I guess it depends on what you mean by

435
00:23:56,560 --> 00:24:00,000
Speaker 2: Russian agent. It's like, right, agent, who is Russian?

436
00:24:00,160 --> 00:24:02,640
Speaker 1: Totally? They're not agents of the Bolsheviks. They are Russian

437
00:24:02,640 --> 00:24:06,080
Speaker 1: revolutionaries who would also be imprisoned in Russia because that's

438
00:24:06,119 --> 00:24:09,600
Speaker 1: what happened to them in Russia. And so this led

439
00:24:09,640 --> 00:24:12,640
Speaker 1: to the justification of the Palmer raids in nineteen nineteen,

440
00:24:13,000 --> 00:24:16,760
Speaker 1: and this time the Union of Russian Workers was raided again,

441
00:24:16,840 --> 00:24:19,480
Speaker 1: and this time is really really violently. People were beaten

442
00:24:19,520 --> 00:24:22,359
Speaker 1: with clubs and blackjacks. Just people on the street are like,

443
00:24:22,440 --> 00:24:24,879
Speaker 1: why are all these bloody people pouring out of this building?

444
00:24:26,560 --> 00:24:29,760
Speaker 1: And on December twenty one, nineteen nineteen, two hundred and

445
00:24:29,840 --> 00:24:33,560
Speaker 1: forty nine anarchists were deported to Russia, including friends of

446
00:24:33,560 --> 00:24:36,119
Speaker 1: the pod Emma Goldman, the anarchist advocate of birth control

447
00:24:36,119 --> 00:24:39,080
Speaker 1: has come up time and time again and her sometimes lover,

448
00:24:39,240 --> 00:24:42,159
Speaker 1: Alexander Berkman, who had spent fourteen years in prison for

449
00:24:42,480 --> 00:24:47,240
Speaker 1: trying and failing to kill an industrialist during a strike. Unfortunately,

450
00:24:47,880 --> 00:24:51,840
Speaker 1: at first, these two are excited Russia was having a revolution.

451
00:24:52,119 --> 00:24:55,840
Speaker 1: They knew they were anarchists involved, and that that revolution

452
00:24:55,920 --> 00:24:58,320
Speaker 1: that was happening was the hope of the entire leftist world.

453
00:24:59,000 --> 00:25:01,880
Speaker 1: Berkman said that that he arrived in Russia was even

454
00:25:01,880 --> 00:25:04,280
Speaker 1: better than the day he walked free after fourteen years

455
00:25:04,280 --> 00:25:09,560
Speaker 1: in prison. They spent nineteen twenty traveling around the country

456
00:25:09,600 --> 00:25:11,840
Speaker 1: trying to put together a history of the revolution for

457
00:25:11,880 --> 00:25:14,159
Speaker 1: a museum. So they like hit the ground running and

458
00:25:14,160 --> 00:25:16,960
Speaker 1: they're like, oh, we gotta you know, the revolution's here.

459
00:25:17,000 --> 00:25:18,679
Speaker 1: We got to make sure to document it, you know,

460
00:25:18,880 --> 00:25:21,639
Speaker 1: because we love it. We love the revolution. And what

461
00:25:21,720 --> 00:25:24,880
Speaker 1: they found as they traveled around the country to see

462
00:25:24,920 --> 00:25:27,920
Speaker 1: the effects of the revolution was not the liberation of

463
00:25:27,960 --> 00:25:31,879
Speaker 1: the working class, but instead it's a miseration. Lenin met

464
00:25:31,920 --> 00:25:34,480
Speaker 1: with them personally and was like, Hey, don't worry. As

465
00:25:34,480 --> 00:25:35,960
Speaker 1: soon as the war is done, we'll go back to

466
00:25:36,000 --> 00:25:38,320
Speaker 1: free speech. I promise. It's me.

467
00:25:38,560 --> 00:25:42,080
Speaker 3: It's Lenin narrator. It's never right yet.

468
00:25:42,640 --> 00:25:45,760
Speaker 1: Either didn't mean it, or he meant it and then

469
00:25:45,880 --> 00:25:50,440
Speaker 1: just didn't bother to do it. I don't know. War

470
00:25:50,480 --> 00:25:54,520
Speaker 1: communism is tearing everyone up. Lenin wrote about it. The

471
00:25:54,680 --> 00:25:57,360
Speaker 1: essence of war communism was that we actually took from

472
00:25:57,359 --> 00:26:00,240
Speaker 1: the peasant all of his surpluses, and sometimes not only

473
00:26:00,240 --> 00:26:02,440
Speaker 1: the surpluses, but part of the grain the peasants needed

474
00:26:02,480 --> 00:26:07,760
Speaker 1: for food. So they're running around taking grain, horses, everything

475
00:26:07,800 --> 00:26:09,919
Speaker 1: they can get, and like, you know, they're not just taking,

476
00:26:10,280 --> 00:26:12,440
Speaker 1: they're also taking like the stuff people are supposed to

477
00:26:12,480 --> 00:26:14,600
Speaker 1: plant next time and things like that.

478
00:26:15,040 --> 00:26:18,240
Speaker 2: It is also deeply funny the main Bolshevik anti anarchist

479
00:26:18,280 --> 00:26:20,919
Speaker 2: lines that their bandits. It's like, okay, so one of

480
00:26:20,920 --> 00:26:23,600
Speaker 2: these two groups of people is running around the countryside

481
00:26:23,600 --> 00:26:26,120
Speaker 2: stealing stuff a gunpoint, and the other one is the anarchists.

482
00:26:27,040 --> 00:26:30,800
Speaker 1: I know, really, I know, because the anarchists are running

483
00:26:30,800 --> 00:26:32,800
Speaker 1: around stealing stuff a gunpoint from the rich. And the

484
00:26:32,840 --> 00:26:36,040
Speaker 1: reason that the anarchists are getting called bandits is because, yeah,

485
00:26:36,080 --> 00:26:38,920
Speaker 1: the Bolsheviks are mad at the anarchists for expropriating too

486
00:26:39,000 --> 00:26:41,520
Speaker 1: much and too early, because the Bolsheviks are trying not

487
00:26:41,600 --> 00:26:43,440
Speaker 1: to totally piss off the rich. But I think they're

488
00:26:43,440 --> 00:26:46,240
Speaker 1: expropriating too at this point. By now, I'm not actually

489
00:26:46,280 --> 00:26:51,880
Speaker 1: sure exactly when they start robin hood in also, but anyway,

490
00:26:52,840 --> 00:26:55,560
Speaker 1: so the peasants get really good at hiding grain. One

491
00:26:55,640 --> 00:26:58,240
Speaker 1: estimate says that a third of the food was successfully

492
00:26:58,280 --> 00:27:03,159
Speaker 1: hidden from the bulshit bandits. Yeah, and peasants also just

493
00:27:03,200 --> 00:27:06,959
Speaker 1: like they stopped growing more food than was personally needed

494
00:27:07,320 --> 00:27:10,159
Speaker 1: because they knew whatever they grew would gets stolen by

495
00:27:10,160 --> 00:27:13,480
Speaker 1: band Like, why work harder if there's nothing in it

496
00:27:13,520 --> 00:27:16,639
Speaker 1: for you, It's just all going to get stolen. Autocracy

497
00:27:17,000 --> 00:27:19,719
Speaker 1: meant that Russia only grew less than half of what

498
00:27:19,760 --> 00:27:21,719
Speaker 1: it grew before the war. And since one of the

499
00:27:21,760 --> 00:27:25,639
Speaker 1: primary justifications people have of war communism is oh, it

500
00:27:25,720 --> 00:27:28,760
Speaker 1: was necessary to get as much food as possible to

501
00:27:28,840 --> 00:27:33,560
Speaker 1: run this war. We needed strong authoritarian measures in order

502
00:27:33,600 --> 00:27:37,280
Speaker 1: to do it, here's how it backfired. Besides just morally

503
00:27:37,440 --> 00:27:40,920
Speaker 1: it backfired and that people suddenly didn't have any reason

504
00:27:40,960 --> 00:27:41,520
Speaker 1: to grow food.

505
00:27:42,240 --> 00:27:44,480
Speaker 2: Yeah, although it's funny because this discreens into just a

506
00:27:44,560 --> 00:27:48,560
Speaker 2: sort of self justifying loop, because then the argument is like, oh, well,

507
00:27:49,440 --> 00:27:51,719
Speaker 2: we need more authoritarianism to crack down and the peasants,

508
00:27:51,760 --> 00:27:55,639
Speaker 2: because the peasants are like the culocks are food hoarding.

509
00:27:55,680 --> 00:27:58,520
Speaker 2: It's like, well, yet they're food hoarding because they're going

510
00:27:58,560 --> 00:28:01,800
Speaker 2: to starve if because you keep taking all of their food,

511
00:28:02,320 --> 00:28:06,479
Speaker 2: so you know it's not actually working.

512
00:28:06,720 --> 00:28:10,000
Speaker 1: Yeah. So Goldman later would write a book called My

513
00:28:10,040 --> 00:28:14,640
Speaker 1: Disillusionment in Russia, and Berkman wrote the Bolshevik Myth. Basically,

514
00:28:14,680 --> 00:28:17,159
Speaker 1: by the end of nineteen twenty there's no more justification

515
00:28:17,240 --> 00:28:19,760
Speaker 1: available anymore for the Bolsheviks to people. You can only

516
00:28:19,800 --> 00:28:22,639
Speaker 1: promise people that war communism is temporary for so long.

517
00:28:24,160 --> 00:28:25,679
Speaker 1: And actually, one of the things that I don't think

518
00:28:25,720 --> 00:28:27,360
Speaker 1: I talked about too much last time. The Civil War

519
00:28:27,400 --> 00:28:29,639
Speaker 1: came in waves and the Green Army, the peasants who

520
00:28:29,680 --> 00:28:32,520
Speaker 1: were revolting. A lot of that came after the White

521
00:28:32,640 --> 00:28:34,520
Speaker 1: Armies were destroyed, and you had a lot of soldiers

522
00:28:34,560 --> 00:28:37,719
Speaker 1: going back home and seeing what was happening, and you

523
00:28:37,720 --> 00:28:42,080
Speaker 1: also just had like, well, your justification is done, you know,

524
00:28:43,360 --> 00:28:46,120
Speaker 1: And things eventually came to a head in March nineteen

525
00:28:46,160 --> 00:28:51,720
Speaker 1: twenty one or February, depending on how you count it. Yeah,

526
00:28:51,760 --> 00:28:55,480
Speaker 1: there's no such thing as the final leftist rebellion against Bolshevism,

527
00:28:55,560 --> 00:28:58,680
Speaker 1: because these rebellions cropped up from time to time and

528
00:28:58,720 --> 00:29:02,680
Speaker 1: will continue to wherever they're authoritarianism, and I suspect we'll

529
00:29:02,720 --> 00:29:05,200
Speaker 1: have to do more revolts against Bolshevism in our future,

530
00:29:05,640 --> 00:29:08,640
Speaker 1: although maybe people will just learn from the past and

531
00:29:08,680 --> 00:29:11,440
Speaker 1: then we won't have to. Bad stuff will still come,

532
00:29:11,440 --> 00:29:13,720
Speaker 1: but we could just have a different bad thing next time.

533
00:29:13,760 --> 00:29:14,400
Speaker 1: That would be great.

534
00:29:14,480 --> 00:29:17,120
Speaker 2: Okay, I figured out. I figured out how we neutralize

535
00:29:17,160 --> 00:29:19,480
Speaker 2: them preemptively. We have to start the argument over whether

536
00:29:19,560 --> 00:29:22,640
Speaker 2: Jucha is Bolshevism right now, and this will keep them

537
00:29:22,720 --> 00:29:24,960
Speaker 2: arguing with each other for so long that they will

538
00:29:24,960 --> 00:29:25,680
Speaker 2: not be able to.

539
00:29:25,640 --> 00:29:28,560
Speaker 1: Effectively do anything. Wait, who is Bolshevik?

540
00:29:29,120 --> 00:29:33,200
Speaker 2: Whether Jeucha? Which is the revolution? Well, okay, it's the

541
00:29:33,320 --> 00:29:35,640
Speaker 2: nominal ideology of North Korea.

542
00:29:36,840 --> 00:29:39,920
Speaker 1: Oh okay, okay, Yeah, No, that is a good idea.

543
00:29:39,960 --> 00:29:41,800
Speaker 1: Like we can get them too caught up arguing with

544
00:29:41,840 --> 00:29:44,600
Speaker 1: each other on at least that I know of, at

545
00:29:44,680 --> 00:29:45,680
Speaker 1: least three.

546
00:29:45,800 --> 00:29:47,760
Speaker 3: American communist parties to split over this.

547
00:29:48,120 --> 00:29:52,160
Speaker 1: So excellent, excellent.

548
00:29:52,160 --> 00:29:53,760
Speaker 3: Keep going, guys, keep doing this.

549
00:29:54,920 --> 00:29:59,440
Speaker 1: Yeah. So, the rebellious period of early nineteen twenty one

550
00:29:59,520 --> 00:30:01,920
Speaker 1: is sort of the final hurrah of what if the

551
00:30:01,920 --> 00:30:05,040
Speaker 1: Soviet Revolution actually empowered the Soviets and gave workers control

552
00:30:05,080 --> 00:30:08,960
Speaker 1: over their own lives. And we're going to start with

553
00:30:09,080 --> 00:30:12,280
Speaker 1: the symbolic death of hope for the working class, for emancipation,

554
00:30:13,840 --> 00:30:18,000
Speaker 1: the death of Peter Kropotkin, and now, interestingly, Peter Kurpakin

555
00:30:18,040 --> 00:30:20,360
Speaker 1: was not incredibly popular with the anarchists at this time,

556
00:30:20,440 --> 00:30:23,200
Speaker 1: but he was still respected. He wasn't particularly popular because

557
00:30:23,800 --> 00:30:26,840
Speaker 1: of stuff that people still want to hash out on

558
00:30:26,880 --> 00:30:29,360
Speaker 1: Twitter today and I don't care enough, which was that

559
00:30:29,440 --> 00:30:33,840
Speaker 1: he you know, famously did support the Allied fight in

560
00:30:33,880 --> 00:30:36,880
Speaker 1: World War One and wanted Russia to stay involved in

561
00:30:36,920 --> 00:30:38,960
Speaker 1: the war because he wanted the Allies to win, because

562
00:30:39,000 --> 00:30:44,320
Speaker 1: he thought that bourgeois democracy was a better system than

563
00:30:45,160 --> 00:30:50,080
Speaker 1: the German empire and monarchy. And it's one simplified way

564
00:30:50,120 --> 00:30:50,720
Speaker 1: of looking at it.

565
00:30:50,760 --> 00:30:51,240
Speaker 2: But whatever.

566
00:30:52,000 --> 00:30:56,400
Speaker 1: So Kerpakin had been living in exile in Canada. In

567
00:30:56,480 --> 00:31:00,000
Speaker 1: June nineteen seventeen, he returned to Russia, whereupon he refused

568
00:31:00,200 --> 00:31:04,000
Speaker 1: cabinet seat from the provisional government, but continued to advocate

569
00:31:04,080 --> 00:31:06,120
Speaker 1: that Russia continue in the war, which was not a

570
00:31:06,120 --> 00:31:08,959
Speaker 1: popular position. His reputation as a socialist is like not

571
00:31:09,000 --> 00:31:11,920
Speaker 1: super high right now, and there are two versions of

572
00:31:11,960 --> 00:31:14,320
Speaker 1: his last days in Russia. The official account written by

573
00:31:14,360 --> 00:31:18,120
Speaker 1: the victorious Bolsheviks has him welcomed in lovingly by Lenin,

574
00:31:18,200 --> 00:31:21,760
Speaker 1: with whom he was great friends. In this version of

575
00:31:21,800 --> 00:31:24,320
Speaker 1: the story, he decided the hustle and bustle of Moscow

576
00:31:24,400 --> 00:31:27,520
Speaker 1: was too much for him because he was kind of old,

577
00:31:27,560 --> 00:31:30,720
Speaker 1: so he moved to the countryside, to a town called Dimitrov.

578
00:31:31,880 --> 00:31:34,400
Speaker 1: It is true that Kropawkin was treated better than many

579
00:31:34,440 --> 00:31:38,800
Speaker 1: other anarchists by Lenin for whatever reason, and Kropakin leveraged

580
00:31:38,800 --> 00:31:41,200
Speaker 1: that as best as he could to get his fellow

581
00:31:41,280 --> 00:31:45,120
Speaker 1: socialists srs and anarchists alike out of Bolshevik jail, and

582
00:31:45,160 --> 00:31:47,360
Speaker 1: he kept trying to sell Lenin on a like don't

583
00:31:47,400 --> 00:31:52,640
Speaker 1: do this bro plan. But Kropawkin's friend Alexander Berkman paints

584
00:31:52,640 --> 00:31:56,240
Speaker 1: a different story than the one that Lenin paints. Quote

585
00:31:56,640 --> 00:32:00,000
Speaker 1: on two occasions were the Kropotkin apartments in Moscow requisite

586
00:32:00,320 --> 00:32:03,240
Speaker 1: and the family forced to seek other quarters. It was

587
00:32:03,240 --> 00:32:06,840
Speaker 1: after these experiences that the Kropowkins moved to Dimitrov, where

588
00:32:06,880 --> 00:32:11,040
Speaker 1: Old Peter became an involuntary exile. His only visitors were

589
00:32:11,040 --> 00:32:13,640
Speaker 1: peasants and workers of the village, and some members of

590
00:32:13,640 --> 00:32:16,920
Speaker 1: the intelligentsia, whose wont it was to come to him

591
00:32:16,960 --> 00:32:20,040
Speaker 1: with their troubles and misfortunes. He had always kept in

592
00:32:20,080 --> 00:32:23,000
Speaker 1: touch with the world through numerous publications, but in dmitrov

593
00:32:23,400 --> 00:32:26,120
Speaker 1: he had no access to these sources. His only channels

594
00:32:26,160 --> 00:32:30,080
Speaker 1: of information now were the two government papers. His comrades

595
00:32:30,120 --> 00:32:33,120
Speaker 1: from abroad, as well as the anarchists of Ukrainia, often

596
00:32:33,160 --> 00:32:37,080
Speaker 1: sent him food packages. Once he received some gifts from Makno,

597
00:32:37,560 --> 00:32:40,320
Speaker 1: at that time heralded by the Bolsheviki as the terror

598
00:32:40,360 --> 00:32:44,240
Speaker 1: of the counter revolution in southern Russia especially, did the

599
00:32:44,280 --> 00:32:47,880
Speaker 1: Kropawkins feel the lack of light? When I visited them

600
00:32:47,880 --> 00:32:50,440
Speaker 1: in nineteen twenty, They were considering themselves fortunate to be

601
00:32:50,520 --> 00:32:54,320
Speaker 1: able to have even one roomlet. Most of the time,

602
00:32:54,440 --> 00:32:57,120
Speaker 1: Kropotkin worked by the flicker of a tiny oil lamp

603
00:32:57,160 --> 00:33:00,440
Speaker 1: that nearly drove him blind. During the short hours of

604
00:33:00,440 --> 00:33:03,280
Speaker 1: the day, he would transcribe his notes on a typewriter,

605
00:33:03,720 --> 00:33:09,800
Speaker 1: slowly and painfully, pounding out every letter. That's really pleache,

606
00:33:10,000 --> 00:33:14,000
Speaker 1: I know, But the real reason that Kerpakin suffered wasn't

607
00:33:14,000 --> 00:33:16,640
Speaker 1: the lack of lamp oil. It was that hope was

608
00:33:16,720 --> 00:33:20,120
Speaker 1: draining away from him. At one point, the Bolsheviks said

609
00:33:20,120 --> 00:33:22,320
Speaker 1: that for every Bolshevik killed by the SRS, they would

610
00:33:22,360 --> 00:33:26,680
Speaker 1: execute ten imprisoned sars Jesus. So he tried to stop

611
00:33:26,720 --> 00:33:30,720
Speaker 1: that plan by writing Lenin and you know, putting his

612
00:33:30,840 --> 00:33:33,160
Speaker 1: leverage as much as he could. He also tried to

613
00:33:33,200 --> 00:33:35,960
Speaker 1: stop the no more private printing houses plan, and failed

614
00:33:36,000 --> 00:33:38,840
Speaker 1: at that one too, because at this point literally only

615
00:33:38,960 --> 00:33:44,800
Speaker 1: state run papers. He spent his last days despairing, drawing,

616
00:33:45,160 --> 00:33:50,360
Speaker 1: and playing piano. He caught pneumonia in January nineteen eighteen,

617
00:33:50,400 --> 00:33:52,320
Speaker 1: and all his friends rushed to be by his side,

618
00:33:52,600 --> 00:33:57,000
Speaker 1: but most arrived an hour late, and the Bolsheviks offered

619
00:33:57,040 --> 00:34:00,520
Speaker 1: him a state funeral, but the anarchists refused it. They

620
00:34:00,560 --> 00:34:03,400
Speaker 1: basically had to beg the Soviets to let them organize

621
00:34:03,400 --> 00:34:06,720
Speaker 1: the funeral themselves, getting special permission to print a pamphlet

622
00:34:06,800 --> 00:34:11,560
Speaker 1: commemorating the most influential anarchist thinker in history. As his

623
00:34:11,640 --> 00:34:14,160
Speaker 1: body left the village, the entire village came out to

624
00:34:14,160 --> 00:34:19,360
Speaker 1: pay its respects. In Moscow, twenty thousand anarchists marched with

625
00:34:19,440 --> 00:34:22,800
Speaker 1: him one last time. They marched with him five miles

626
00:34:22,840 --> 00:34:25,439
Speaker 1: to the graveyard in a mile long procession of red

627
00:34:25,480 --> 00:34:29,400
Speaker 1: and black banners, students and children at the front holding wreaths.

628
00:34:30,440 --> 00:34:33,239
Speaker 1: They passed the Tolstoy Museum and lowered their banners to

629
00:34:33,280 --> 00:34:35,680
Speaker 1: honor another one of the great Russian anarchists.

630
00:34:36,280 --> 00:34:37,680
Speaker 3: We're hitting all of them today.

631
00:34:38,600 --> 00:34:43,360
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, we've already had tuberculosis and Tolstoi. Oh I

632
00:34:43,360 --> 00:34:45,600
Speaker 1: think Volin organized with the industrial workers of the world,

633
00:34:45,640 --> 00:34:48,680
Speaker 1: but I can't remember. Wait, I know who did, and

634
00:34:48,719 --> 00:34:49,799
Speaker 1: we'll get to him real soon.

635
00:34:50,520 --> 00:34:52,600
Speaker 3: Very great bingo day for us.

636
00:34:52,640 --> 00:34:57,319
Speaker 1: Yeah, totally. Tolstoyan's came out and played Chopin's Funeral March,

637
00:34:57,360 --> 00:35:01,040
Speaker 1: which is the like dun d dun d d du

638
00:35:01,120 --> 00:35:05,040
Speaker 1: dun dun dun song, which probably didn't seem cliche at

639
00:35:05,080 --> 00:35:07,400
Speaker 1: the time. Actually, while I was reading this, I like

640
00:35:07,440 --> 00:35:09,320
Speaker 1: listened to a bunch of versions of It's really beautiful,

641
00:35:09,360 --> 00:35:11,799
Speaker 1: and like I got real like this is the part

642
00:35:11,800 --> 00:35:15,720
Speaker 1: where I cried while writing. Okay, seven of his friends

643
00:35:16,200 --> 00:35:19,239
Speaker 1: were released from jail for the day to attend, and

644
00:35:19,280 --> 00:35:21,920
Speaker 1: there was supposed to be like twenty more, but then

645
00:35:21,920 --> 00:35:24,040
Speaker 1: the Bolsheviks were like, well, they refused, and it was

646
00:35:24,080 --> 00:35:26,839
Speaker 1: that like the anarchists had been like lied to about

647
00:35:26,880 --> 00:35:28,880
Speaker 1: what was involved or whatever, and they were like, we

648
00:35:28,920 --> 00:35:32,720
Speaker 1: don't trust you. So seven of his friends were released

649
00:35:32,719 --> 00:35:36,920
Speaker 1: from jail, and anarchist later turned Bolshevik victor Surge described

650
00:35:37,120 --> 00:35:43,480
Speaker 1: what happened. Aaron Baron, who organized with IWW, there's my connection, okay.

651
00:35:44,040 --> 00:35:47,920
Speaker 1: Aaron barn arrested in the Ukraine due to return that

652
00:35:47,960 --> 00:35:50,360
Speaker 1: evening to a prison from which he would never again emerge.

653
00:35:50,760 --> 00:35:54,799
Speaker 1: Lifted as emaciated, bearded, gold spectacled profile to cry relentless

654
00:35:54,840 --> 00:35:58,360
Speaker 1: protests against the new despotism, the butchers at work in

655
00:35:58,400 --> 00:36:02,880
Speaker 1: their cellars, the dishonor shed upon socialism, the official violence

656
00:36:02,920 --> 00:36:07,360
Speaker 1: that was trampling the revolution underfoot. Fearless and impetuous, he

657
00:36:07,440 --> 00:36:12,920
Speaker 1: seemed to be sowing the seeds of new tempests. Aaron's wife, Fanya,

658
00:36:13,120 --> 00:36:15,440
Speaker 1: who was also in prison, will be executed before the

659
00:36:15,520 --> 00:36:18,120
Speaker 1: year is out. Aaron himself will live in the prison

660
00:36:18,160 --> 00:36:22,680
Speaker 1: system before his execution. In nineteen thirty seven. This was

661
00:36:22,719 --> 00:36:25,600
Speaker 1: the last anarchist demonstration of any size in Russia until

662
00:36:25,640 --> 00:36:29,480
Speaker 1: the Soviet Union collapsed almost seventy years later. By the

663
00:36:29,560 --> 00:36:32,480
Speaker 1: end of that year, Kerpawkin's writings were banned by the

664
00:36:32,520 --> 00:36:38,719
Speaker 1: Bolshevik government and the movement. He'd given his life to

665
00:36:39,080 --> 00:36:43,480
Speaker 1: gave it one last push, one last try, much like

666
00:36:43,520 --> 00:36:45,440
Speaker 1: how we have one last push to sell you on

667
00:36:45,560 --> 00:36:48,759
Speaker 1: advertisements unless you're one of those weirdos who lifts in's

668
00:36:48,840 --> 00:37:01,120
Speaker 1: after the end, but year's ads and we're back.

669
00:37:01,719 --> 00:37:03,800
Speaker 3: That might be the bleakest ad pivot of full time.

670
00:37:04,480 --> 00:37:06,759
Speaker 1: Thank you, thank you, as I described the thing that

671
00:37:06,800 --> 00:37:09,480
Speaker 1: had me crying and as the end of I mean,

672
00:37:09,480 --> 00:37:11,120
Speaker 1: it's not the end of the anarchist movement. We're still

673
00:37:11,120 --> 00:37:14,759
Speaker 1: in it, but it is a thing that signaled a

674
00:37:14,800 --> 00:37:21,319
Speaker 1: thing metaphorically symbolically whatever people kept doing uprisings, and this

675
00:37:21,480 --> 00:37:24,719
Speaker 1: next batch, like all of the other cool uprisings that

676
00:37:24,719 --> 00:37:28,279
Speaker 1: had happened, started with uprisings in Saint Petersburg. So the

677
00:37:28,360 --> 00:37:30,560
Speaker 1: nineteen oh five revolution had started. This how the nineteen

678
00:37:30,600 --> 00:37:33,920
Speaker 1: seventeen revolution had started. Okay, I've actually heard that it

679
00:37:34,000 --> 00:37:35,520
Speaker 1: kind of started in Moscow. But the thing that kind

680
00:37:35,560 --> 00:37:37,160
Speaker 1: of immediately kicked off what we're going to talk about

681
00:37:37,160 --> 00:37:40,080
Speaker 1: happened in Saint Petersburg. It started with friend of the

682
00:37:40,080 --> 00:37:43,719
Speaker 1: Pod general strikes and bread riots. Bread rations had been

683
00:37:43,760 --> 00:37:46,280
Speaker 1: reduced by a third over the course of ten days,

684
00:37:46,680 --> 00:37:50,360
Speaker 1: which tends not to make people happy, especially when party

685
00:37:50,360 --> 00:37:54,000
Speaker 1: members continue to eat well enough. It's the same shit

686
00:37:54,040 --> 00:37:57,040
Speaker 1: that had led to previous revolutions, watching the wealthy eat

687
00:37:57,080 --> 00:38:00,440
Speaker 1: while you starve. Only these wealthy were instead the like

688
00:38:01,200 --> 00:38:05,360
Speaker 1: party bureaucrats, many of whom were the czarist officers from

689
00:38:05,400 --> 00:38:09,759
Speaker 1: before the old aristocracy. Yep. And one of the ways

690
00:38:09,760 --> 00:38:13,200
Speaker 1: that this uprising happened was like one factory and had

691
00:38:13,200 --> 00:38:15,880
Speaker 1: all these things set aside, like winter clothes and shoes

692
00:38:15,880 --> 00:38:17,920
Speaker 1: that were supposed to go be a reserved for Bolsheviks,

693
00:38:17,960 --> 00:38:20,799
Speaker 1: and they just started giving them to everyone. That was

694
00:38:21,480 --> 00:38:25,200
Speaker 1: the uprising. That was the thing that the socialists had

695
00:38:25,400 --> 00:38:27,920
Speaker 1: the communists had to crush. Okay, one thing that came

696
00:38:27,960 --> 00:38:32,600
Speaker 1: out of me reading this. People are always like, magpie,

697
00:38:33,120 --> 00:38:35,359
Speaker 1: what's an anarchist, what's the socialist, what's a communist? What's

698
00:38:35,400 --> 00:38:37,759
Speaker 1: the difference between them? I actually do get this question.

699
00:38:37,800 --> 00:38:40,640
Speaker 1: It sounds like I'm joking, but and it's hard to

700
00:38:40,680 --> 00:38:43,000
Speaker 1: answer because it depends on the context of when people

701
00:38:43,000 --> 00:38:47,640
Speaker 1: were talking. But here when we are talking about it

702
00:38:47,680 --> 00:38:49,400
Speaker 1: in Russia, and this is one of the things that

703
00:38:49,440 --> 00:38:53,840
Speaker 1: has filtered down through the ages. The communists mean the

704
00:38:53,840 --> 00:38:57,600
Speaker 1: Bolsheviks right now because they have changed their name to

705
00:38:58,239 --> 00:39:03,799
Speaker 1: the Communist Party, the socialists by and large means the socialists,

706
00:39:03,840 --> 00:39:08,000
Speaker 1: the SRS, the Socialist revolutionaries, and the anarchists means the anarchists,

707
00:39:08,600 --> 00:39:13,200
Speaker 1: and all of them are socialists, and most of the

708
00:39:13,239 --> 00:39:16,040
Speaker 1: anarchists and all of the communists are communists in terms

709
00:39:16,080 --> 00:39:20,920
Speaker 1: of what they actually believe ideologically. But I kind of

710
00:39:20,960 --> 00:39:22,520
Speaker 1: went through when I wrote all this to make sure

711
00:39:22,520 --> 00:39:25,440
Speaker 1: I just wrote Bolsheviks and not communists throughout. But a

712
00:39:25,440 --> 00:39:26,799
Speaker 1: lot of the sources of the time are going to

713
00:39:26,800 --> 00:39:29,920
Speaker 1: start calling all these people communists, and that's what they

714
00:39:29,920 --> 00:39:31,759
Speaker 1: mean by it, as they mean people who are part

715
00:39:31,760 --> 00:39:34,480
Speaker 1: of the Bolshevik Party, which is now the Communist Party.

716
00:39:35,200 --> 00:39:38,160
Speaker 1: One Damama just to do a like I don't whenever

717
00:39:38,160 --> 00:39:40,239
Speaker 1: I try and explain, like, here's the difference between the three,

718
00:39:40,320 --> 00:39:42,520
Speaker 1: it's like, well, it really depends on what you're talking about.

719
00:39:42,560 --> 00:39:47,000
Speaker 1: And I know that this is annoying and messy. The

720
00:39:47,120 --> 00:39:50,400
Speaker 1: general aim of these uprisings was to end war communism.

721
00:39:50,600 --> 00:39:54,080
Speaker 1: In the city. It was like, we want better bread

722
00:39:54,160 --> 00:39:56,800
Speaker 1: rations in the countryside. A lot of it was about

723
00:39:56,800 --> 00:40:00,400
Speaker 1: the return to free labor, the ability for small perducers

724
00:40:00,400 --> 00:40:02,080
Speaker 1: to buy and sell without using the state as it

725
00:40:02,120 --> 00:40:05,279
Speaker 1: go between, which will actually we're going to kind of

726
00:40:05,280 --> 00:40:09,400
Speaker 1: win this one. We'll talk about that. These uprisings are

727
00:40:09,400 --> 00:40:12,080
Speaker 1: put down, but not easily. The Red Army showed up

728
00:40:12,120 --> 00:40:15,920
Speaker 1: in forced and proclaimed martial law. The Checha arrested thousands

729
00:40:15,960 --> 00:40:20,879
Speaker 1: of people, including sr's anarchists and Mensheviks. Even within the Bolsheviks,

730
00:40:21,040 --> 00:40:23,800
Speaker 1: they're starting to be resistance to this centralization of power.

731
00:40:24,080 --> 00:40:26,920
Speaker 1: You have two different opposition groups. You have the workers

732
00:40:26,960 --> 00:40:31,560
Speaker 1: Opposition faction and the group of Democratic Centralism, which ironically

733
00:40:31,960 --> 00:40:35,680
Speaker 1: advocated for decentralization. Yeah, because words.

734
00:40:35,400 --> 00:40:41,279
Speaker 2: Are random, Yeah, this is the thing with Like, this

735
00:40:41,360 --> 00:40:43,799
Speaker 2: is the thing especially inside of this Like if you're

736
00:40:43,800 --> 00:40:46,399
Speaker 2: trying to figure out Soviet factions, like the names are

737
00:40:46,440 --> 00:40:52,200
Speaker 2: not going to tell you anything, like, yeah, it's a disaster.

738
00:40:53,800 --> 00:40:56,439
Speaker 1: Yeah. Fortunately, you don't have to remember those two again.

739
00:40:56,600 --> 00:40:58,600
Speaker 1: I'm not going to bring them up again in this script.

740
00:40:58,760 --> 00:41:02,160
Speaker 1: If you are like trying to be a historian of

741
00:41:02,200 --> 00:41:04,919
Speaker 1: the Russian Civil War and how things went badly, you're

742
00:41:04,920 --> 00:41:07,480
Speaker 1: gonna have to remember them. But for now, just understand

743
00:41:07,760 --> 00:41:10,239
Speaker 1: what does matter is to understand that not all of

744
00:41:10,280 --> 00:41:12,680
Speaker 1: the Bolsheviks approve of what's happening.

745
00:41:12,800 --> 00:41:14,360
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, I guess I could mention so I

746
00:41:14,400 --> 00:41:17,560
Speaker 2: know a bit about the workers opposition. They're kind of

747
00:41:17,600 --> 00:41:22,080
Speaker 2: like the last off ramp if you're a Bolshevik, for like,

748
00:41:22,680 --> 00:41:25,000
Speaker 2: if you're a Bolshevik who like genuinely believes in like

749
00:41:25,080 --> 00:41:27,600
Speaker 2: the power of the Soviets, like this is your last

750
00:41:28,280 --> 00:41:32,960
Speaker 2: like thing and everyone else going forward from that, Like

751
00:41:33,000 --> 00:41:35,800
Speaker 2: there are going to be people who like, like Trotsky

752
00:41:35,920 --> 00:41:37,640
Speaker 2: is going to make this pivot where he starts talking

753
00:41:37,640 --> 00:41:40,120
Speaker 2: about democracy and it's like, well, no, like this is

754
00:41:40,160 --> 00:41:43,239
Speaker 2: all your fault, like specifically right, And it's like that

755
00:41:43,239 --> 00:41:46,719
Speaker 2: these are sort of the last people who are like

756
00:41:47,680 --> 00:41:50,919
Speaker 2: even in some sense committed to what the Bolsheviks were,

757
00:41:51,080 --> 00:41:54,040
Speaker 2: like saying that they believed in like early nineteen seventeen.

758
00:41:54,640 --> 00:41:56,680
Speaker 1: That makes sense to me, and that's actually gonna be

759
00:41:56,680 --> 00:41:58,640
Speaker 1: a big part of the crunch Dat rebellion. People are like,

760
00:41:59,080 --> 00:42:01,480
Speaker 1: there's this over simplified thing where people are like, oh,

761
00:42:01,480 --> 00:42:04,920
Speaker 1: the Cronschat rebellion was the anarchist versus the Bolsheviks. The

762
00:42:05,000 --> 00:42:08,640
Speaker 1: Kronschat rebellion was political pluralism versus the Bolsheviks, And that

763
00:42:08,719 --> 00:42:12,000
Speaker 1: means it was the Bolsheviks versus the Bolsheviks. To some

764
00:42:12,040 --> 00:42:14,040
Speaker 1: degree too. There's several hundred of them. We'll talk about

765
00:42:14,080 --> 00:42:17,680
Speaker 1: them more later, although they didn't stay Bolsheviks see the

766
00:42:17,719 --> 00:42:25,000
Speaker 1: off ramp part anyway, So the worker uprisings set fire

767
00:42:25,040 --> 00:42:29,160
Speaker 1: to the imaginations and the can infuses eh of perhaps

768
00:42:29,200 --> 00:42:32,480
Speaker 1: the single most powerful military faction of the Red Army,

769
00:42:32,600 --> 00:42:37,440
Speaker 1: the Sailors of Kronstadt, which we'll talk about Wednesday, because yeah, baby,

770
00:42:37,719 --> 00:42:41,839
Speaker 1: five parts context to one part Kronstat. I believed in

771
00:42:41,880 --> 00:42:45,120
Speaker 1: me and I have done it incredible.

772
00:42:47,480 --> 00:42:49,120
Speaker 2: When I first heard this episode, I was like, that's

773
00:42:49,120 --> 00:42:53,359
Speaker 2: a really six episodes about Cronstat. That's a really granular

774
00:42:53,520 --> 00:42:55,719
Speaker 2: look like. And then I was like, it's probably gonna

775
00:42:55,760 --> 00:42:58,200
Speaker 2: be a lot of context. But even I didn't expect

776
00:42:58,200 --> 00:43:01,759
Speaker 2: it's gonna be five episodes of text in one cross step.

777
00:43:02,120 --> 00:43:06,840
Speaker 1: I thought we'd at least get to yeah, yeah, Well,

778
00:43:08,080 --> 00:43:12,440
Speaker 1: I continue to believe I think that this research. I

779
00:43:12,520 --> 00:43:15,920
Speaker 1: knew the broad strokes of most of this, right, and

780
00:43:15,960 --> 00:43:18,719
Speaker 1: I knew the more granular of a bunch of specific

781
00:43:18,800 --> 00:43:22,520
Speaker 1: anarchy things like Cronchdad and Ukraine and a little bit

782
00:43:22,520 --> 00:43:27,640
Speaker 1: about Siberia and some other stuff, right. But I actually

783
00:43:27,719 --> 00:43:33,000
Speaker 1: think that reading about the Russian Revolution more broadly and

784
00:43:33,080 --> 00:43:38,920
Speaker 1: learning about it has influenced my thinking about revolution and

785
00:43:39,080 --> 00:43:45,120
Speaker 1: history probably more than any other single thing that I've

786
00:43:45,239 --> 00:43:48,520
Speaker 1: researched for this show. And maybe it's because like a

787
00:43:48,560 --> 00:43:50,359
Speaker 1: lot of the things I've researched for the show are

788
00:43:50,400 --> 00:43:54,839
Speaker 1: things that I already knew more about, right, But this

789
00:43:54,960 --> 00:44:00,319
Speaker 1: is just such a like big complicated thing that like

790
00:44:01,280 --> 00:44:04,520
Speaker 1: it's really really worth understanding. I don't know how to

791
00:44:05,160 --> 00:44:10,000
Speaker 1: put it other than that, but I think that it influences,

792
00:44:10,560 --> 00:44:12,200
Speaker 1: you know, like my friends are like, how are you

793
00:44:12,239 --> 00:44:15,560
Speaker 1: doing this week? And I'm like, I'm kind of fucked.

794
00:44:15,640 --> 00:44:18,160
Speaker 1: I'm like lost in thought in a really intense way,

795
00:44:18,239 --> 00:44:20,960
Speaker 1: thinking about things that happened one hundred years ago. Like

796
00:44:21,040 --> 00:44:25,400
Speaker 1: I I got lost in this story more than most

797
00:44:25,400 --> 00:44:27,960
Speaker 1: of the times, and not because some other stories I

798
00:44:28,000 --> 00:44:32,080
Speaker 1: see myself in more easily, right, Like I don't I mean,

799
00:44:32,120 --> 00:44:33,440
Speaker 1: I know i'd be an anarchist, but I don't know

800
00:44:33,480 --> 00:44:37,399
Speaker 1: where I'd be positioned within this story. Whereas like when

801
00:44:37,400 --> 00:44:40,880
Speaker 1: I you know, read about like late sixties radical movements,

802
00:44:40,880 --> 00:44:42,879
Speaker 1: it's real easy for me to position myself or even

803
00:44:42,880 --> 00:44:45,879
Speaker 1: like you know, a lot of nineteenth century stuff, it's

804
00:44:45,880 --> 00:44:51,680
Speaker 1: really easy. This one's like messier. But I really am

805
00:44:53,160 --> 00:44:55,360
Speaker 1: I don't know, I wish I had my epiphanies, but

806
00:44:55,400 --> 00:44:58,000
Speaker 1: all I have is the story so far. The epiphanies

807
00:44:58,040 --> 00:45:02,120
Speaker 1: will come later. Any grand epiphanies for us, I.

808
00:45:02,040 --> 00:45:04,480
Speaker 3: Mean, I don't know.

809
00:45:04,640 --> 00:45:07,720
Speaker 2: I it's been I think I said this at the beginning,

810
00:45:07,760 --> 00:45:10,879
Speaker 2: It's been a really long time since I've been in

811
00:45:10,920 --> 00:45:16,200
Speaker 2: the Russia trenches in terms of like really granularly going

812
00:45:16,239 --> 00:45:17,000
Speaker 2: through this revolution.

813
00:45:17,280 --> 00:45:18,080
Speaker 3: But I think.

814
00:45:19,960 --> 00:45:24,520
Speaker 2: I think there's the sort of like pop left conception

815
00:45:25,000 --> 00:45:29,719
Speaker 2: of what the Russian Civil War was. It has a

816
00:45:29,719 --> 00:45:36,560
Speaker 2: lot of triumphalism in it that really really just completely

817
00:45:36,680 --> 00:45:43,920
Speaker 2: ignores how unbelievably bloody it was and how you know,

818
00:45:43,960 --> 00:45:45,600
Speaker 2: and how many And this is the thing that like,

819
00:45:46,719 --> 00:45:48,360
Speaker 2: you know, you can see this in like the Culture

820
00:45:48,360 --> 00:45:50,280
Speaker 2: Revolution too, of like the parts of it that don't

821
00:45:50,400 --> 00:45:54,279
Speaker 2: that have just vanished, which is that like almost I

822
00:45:54,320 --> 00:45:56,880
Speaker 2: mean not almost all, but enormous numbers of the people

823
00:45:57,160 --> 00:46:01,040
Speaker 2: who are being killed by the bulsh or other communis.

824
00:46:01,120 --> 00:46:02,680
Speaker 2: This is the same thing in the Cultural Revolution. It's

825
00:46:02,719 --> 00:46:04,400
Speaker 2: like like the vast but and this is you know,

826
00:46:04,880 --> 00:46:06,920
Speaker 2: I've talked about on other shows, like the vast majority

827
00:46:06,920 --> 00:46:09,719
Speaker 2: of people who get killed in the Culture Revolution are

828
00:46:09,880 --> 00:46:11,680
Speaker 2: killed by the rebel factions, they're killed by the government.

829
00:46:13,600 --> 00:46:17,200
Speaker 2: It's it's this process of you know, and and I

830
00:46:17,480 --> 00:46:18,880
Speaker 2: guess in some sense, like I think you can make

831
00:46:18,880 --> 00:46:22,320
Speaker 2: this argument that the vulture of revolution like really ends

832
00:46:22,440 --> 00:46:25,200
Speaker 2: in the great terror of the purges, because like, from

833
00:46:25,239 --> 00:46:27,280
Speaker 2: a macro perspective, what it is is it's this process

834
00:46:27,320 --> 00:46:31,800
Speaker 2: of every single person who made the revolution just systematically

835
00:46:31,840 --> 00:46:33,920
Speaker 2: being fed into a meet writer and killed.

836
00:46:35,120 --> 00:46:42,560
Speaker 4: And that's a apocalyptically bleak although oddly karmac h everyone

837
00:46:42,560 --> 00:46:44,280
Speaker 4: who's going to be involved in putting down the crunch

838
00:46:44,360 --> 00:46:45,160
Speaker 4: at revolution.

839
00:46:45,440 --> 00:46:50,160
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, I mean that's the Yeah, all all those

840
00:46:50,200 --> 00:46:53,759
Speaker 2: people have d nineteen thirty six, nineteen thirty seven next

841
00:46:53,760 --> 00:46:55,239
Speaker 2: to their names.

842
00:46:56,080 --> 00:46:57,640
Speaker 1: Yeah, we're going to talk a bit more about that

843
00:46:58,000 --> 00:47:01,000
Speaker 1: the next one too. But yeah, that is a there's

844
00:47:01,000 --> 00:47:04,719
Speaker 1: this thing where people want to say it all went

845
00:47:04,840 --> 00:47:09,120
Speaker 1: wrong when Stalin got in charge, you know, and clearly

846
00:47:09,480 --> 00:47:14,319
Speaker 1: Stalin is one of history's great monsters. It's almost like, hey,

847
00:47:14,320 --> 00:47:16,040
Speaker 1: what was the first behind the bastards? Was that the

848
00:47:16,080 --> 00:47:21,239
Speaker 1: Stalin one? Was it Hitler's sex life or was it Hitler? No?

849
00:47:21,680 --> 00:47:24,480
Speaker 2: I think it was about Carl May, the author who

850
00:47:24,640 --> 00:47:25,440
Speaker 2: I's obsessed with.

851
00:47:26,000 --> 00:47:28,040
Speaker 1: That I could be wrong, because that was nine hundred

852
00:47:28,080 --> 00:47:32,200
Speaker 1: and fifty two thousand years ago. Yeah, the earliest ones

853
00:47:32,280 --> 00:47:36,400
Speaker 1: I remember is the Carl May and then Hitler's Drinking Buddies.

854
00:47:36,440 --> 00:47:40,920
Speaker 1: I mean Stalin's Drinking Buddies. But I didn't start listening

855
00:47:40,960 --> 00:47:43,480
Speaker 1: at the beginning. I just like went back, which is

856
00:47:43,520 --> 00:47:46,280
Speaker 1: what you all should do, is go back and listen

857
00:47:46,320 --> 00:47:48,759
Speaker 1: to all the because you're not going to get to

858
00:47:48,760 --> 00:47:51,840
Speaker 1: hear part six until Wednesday, and so you have almost

859
00:47:52,080 --> 00:47:54,320
Speaker 1: twenty four hours maybe forty eight if you listened to

860
00:47:54,400 --> 00:47:58,880
Speaker 1: this early enough to go and listen to every episode

861
00:47:59,040 --> 00:48:00,480
Speaker 1: of Cool People to Cool Stuff.

862
00:48:01,760 --> 00:48:03,799
Speaker 2: I feel like, well we can, we can. You can

863
00:48:03,840 --> 00:48:08,160
Speaker 2: accelerate it to okay, okay, you play one in each

864
00:48:08,239 --> 00:48:11,720
Speaker 2: ear and you move it up to like ten times speed.

865
00:48:12,640 --> 00:48:14,880
Speaker 1: Well you can't do that.

866
00:48:14,160 --> 00:48:16,080
Speaker 3: That's true. I only go, well one, I can.

867
00:48:16,120 --> 00:48:23,360
Speaker 1: I can listen to that. That's not always fun. Yeah,

868
00:48:23,520 --> 00:48:26,040
Speaker 1: people were like Oscar, I could read both sides of

869
00:48:26,080 --> 00:48:29,319
Speaker 1: the page at once. I'm like, I don't believe you.

870
00:48:30,360 --> 00:48:34,200
Speaker 1: But that said, I watch YouTube at about two x speed.

871
00:48:34,719 --> 00:48:36,640
Speaker 1: I listen to podcasts at one x speed because I'm

872
00:48:36,640 --> 00:48:38,560
Speaker 1: doing something else when I'm listening to a podcast, shout

873
00:48:38,600 --> 00:48:40,680
Speaker 1: out to everyone who right now is walking their dog

874
00:48:40,840 --> 00:48:45,800
Speaker 1: or cleaning or driving a car. But YouTube, if I

875
00:48:45,840 --> 00:48:47,560
Speaker 1: have to like sit down and watch a thing, it's

876
00:48:47,560 --> 00:48:49,319
Speaker 1: got to be at least one point five or two

877
00:48:49,480 --> 00:48:56,560
Speaker 1: x speed, so I understand people who listen at high speed. Anyway,

878
00:48:57,719 --> 00:48:58,760
Speaker 1: You got anything you want to plug?

879
00:48:59,560 --> 00:49:02,440
Speaker 2: Yeah, I have a podcast that I'm one of the

880
00:49:02,480 --> 00:49:05,520
Speaker 2: people on. It's called dicodapp and here it's about the

881
00:49:05,560 --> 00:49:08,160
Speaker 2: present day and how bad it is and how you

882
00:49:08,160 --> 00:49:10,719
Speaker 2: can make it less bad. And you can find it

883
00:49:11,239 --> 00:49:15,239
Speaker 2: wherever there's podcast. I guess you can't find it on SoundCloud.

884
00:49:14,880 --> 00:49:18,880
Speaker 1: Unless you pirate it and then upload it and put

885
00:49:19,320 --> 00:49:20,719
Speaker 1: relaxing beats behind it.

886
00:49:21,040 --> 00:49:21,480
Speaker 3: Yeah.

887
00:49:22,080 --> 00:49:24,080
Speaker 2: Legally, I don't know if I could advocate that, but

888
00:49:24,200 --> 00:49:28,439
Speaker 2: you know, oh, okay, don't do that. Yeah, you can't

889
00:49:28,440 --> 00:49:31,640
Speaker 2: do that. It's in fact impossible technologically. No one has

890
00:49:31,640 --> 00:49:32,320
Speaker 2: ever overcome this.

891
00:49:33,880 --> 00:49:38,800
Speaker 1: No, all right, well, if you want to. I actually

892
00:49:38,800 --> 00:49:42,120
Speaker 1: wrote about a bunch of Russia revolutions stuff on my

893
00:49:42,200 --> 00:49:44,080
Speaker 1: substock a couple of weeks ago. By the time you

894
00:49:44,120 --> 00:49:46,520
Speaker 1: all hear this, it's called the Lost Promise of the Soviets.

895
00:49:46,800 --> 00:49:48,440
Speaker 1: If you're like, man, that's not enough. I need to

896
00:49:48,440 --> 00:49:51,400
Speaker 1: hear Margaret go over it again and talk about it

897
00:49:51,440 --> 00:49:54,840
Speaker 1: differently and more emotionally. Well, that's where you can do

898
00:49:54,880 --> 00:50:05,200
Speaker 1: it and see everyone else on Wednesday. Cool People Who

899
00:50:05,239 --> 00:50:07,800
Speaker 1: Did Cool Stuff is a production of cool Zone Media.

900
00:50:08,120 --> 00:50:11,000
Speaker 3: For more podcasts from cool Zone Media, visit our website

901
00:50:11,080 --> 00:50:14,799
Speaker 3: Foolzonemedia dot com, or check us out on the iHeartRadio app,

902
00:50:14,800 --> 00:50:17,640
Speaker 3: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.